Front Kicks.

[sammy3170]

Originally posted by arnisador
Uechi-ryu karate, which is essentially a Southern kung fu style, uses the knuckles of the toes in its front kick. That is, the toes are curled down and the kick hits with the bent joints on the top of the toes. Some kung fu styles kick with the ends (tips) of the toes. Most karate styles however use the ball of the foot for the front kick (as well as the heel, which tends to be slightly more emphasized in Okinawan systems). Isshin-ryu and other systems also have a "fish kick" that uses the top of the foot to strike the groin; in one version the toes are pointed up (as for a ball of the foot front kick) after impact and used to rake back across the groin after the initial hit as the foot is retracted. The fish kick however is not the principal front kick of the system, whereas the Uechi toe-knuckle kick is.

Are there are any other karate styles that front kick with something other than the ball and/or heel of the foot?

There isnt a whole lot of give in your toes when you kick with the top knuckles. I just wonder why you'd risk breaking your toes when the same if not better results can be aquired from the ball or even the end of the toes with shoes on. Just curious but wouldnt bending your toes like that be similar to dipping your head when charging or tackling someone in gridiron (hey im australian, football is aussie rules). This is a big no no and i know Dennis Byrd broke his neck doing this so just by feeling the position i reckon my toes would break.

Just some thoughts
Cheers
Sammy

 

[arnisador]

There isnt a whole lot of give in your toes when you kick with the top knuckles. I just wonder why you'd risk breaking your toes when the same if not better results can be aquired from the ball or even the end of the toes with shoes on.

I too think it seems like a prescription for broken toes...but then, when they're splayed out while kicking with the ball of the foot, there's risk too! I don't know what the shoe situation was like when the art was developed (probably in the 1800s in Southern China, as Pangai-noon).

 

[bignick]

My judo and jujutsu's karate instructor's style highly emphasized kicking with the toes. He could put a hole through a kerosene can using his toes. Can't remember exactly what style it was though. Might have been Shorin-ryu or Hakkoryu karate

 

[uechidrew]

Hello everyone, I am an Uechi practitioner and I had to chime in to clear up some misconseptions some are having about our style of kicking. We do not use the top knuckle of our toes to kick, good way to break your toes. Instead it is a different style of front toe kick, the stricking surface is the tip of the big toe. The toes are raised similar to a ball joint kick but instead of pointing the toes straight up in the air the top joint bends forward tightening your foot. The kick is delivered just like any other front snap kick and uses the tip of the big toe to penetrate the target. It takes some time to condition the muscles in your feet as well as the stricking surface.

Here is a link with a pretty good description of th Okinawan toe kick, the Uechi toe kick is shown kicking a tire, great conditioning tool!

http://fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=407

 

[CMS]

A thrusting front kick can be done using the heel.

 

[TimoS]

Are there are any other karate styles that front kick with something other than the ball and/or heel of the foot?

We have a kick, tatesokutogeri, that is a bit like a cross between maegeri and sokutogeri, i.e. you kick to your front but with the side of your foot. The direction is usually a bit downwards. Good kick to push your opponent away from you

 

[TimoS]

Oh, forgot to mention about tatesokutogeri that I don't know how unique the kick is, but as I understand it, and one or two other kicks are taken from Tauramuso ryu jujutsu.

Which reminds me, I forgot to mention our other front kick, also originally (?) from Tauramuso ryu: komawashigeri. This is, as the name implies, a short range mawashigeri, where you don't turn your hips for the kick, i.e. when the opponent is too close to you to use the regular mawashigeri.

Unfortunately there is no good video material available of either of these kicks (or if there is, it's not online to the best of my knowledge)

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

Shifu Khu Chen Yong, who is one of my sensei's Jujutsu student, but actually a Kuntao master on his own, has very unusual front kick. It uses the foot knife (the side of the foot) like a sidekick, but delivered to the front.

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

We have a kick, tatesokutogeri, that is a bit like a cross between maegeri and sokutogeri, i.e. you kick to your front but with the side of your foot. The direction is usually a bit downwards. Good kick to push your opponent away from you

Ahh... the kick that Khu Chen Yong are doing is just like that. Its primarily use is to break the knee. So, you trap opponent's hand using Kuntao hand movement, and simultaneously apply this kick to his knee.

 

[TimoS]

Its primarily use is to break the knee.

Yep, it can be quite effectively used for that also

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

In Seieikan, thus far, I've practiced two types of front kicks. The front snap kick uses the ball of the foot with toes pulled back. I also practice a thrusting kick using as much of the sole of the kicking foot as I can land on my oppponent.

 

[arnisador]

I also practice a thrusting kick using as much of the sole of the kicking foot as I can land on my oppponent.

Not a heel thrust, then, but more like a Thai push kick? Or is it a strike, but with the whole bottom of the foot?

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Not a heel thrust, then, but more like a Thai push kick? Or is it a strike, but with the whole bottom of the foot?

Push kick is probably more accurate. The impetus seems to be not necessarily to strike or score (though I could) but to separate.

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

Push kick is probably more accurate. The impetus seems to be not necessarily to strike or score (though I could) but to separate.

Oh, yes that one. Tae Kwon Do has that one kick too. If your opponent is a clincher or likes to get in close so he/she won't get kicked, you use this kick to push them away from you and follow up with a nice ap-chagi to the body protector. For best score use the other foot, so your technique will looks a little bit like karate's nidan geri a'la kata Kusanku or Chinto.

 

[Em MacIntosh]

I only ever use my front snap kick as a groin shot so I almost never use it in sparring except maybe as a "jab" to guage distance. In the street, I have shoes or boots on (maybe steel toed) and I don't worry too much about the striking surface used. My front thrust kick is awkward and uses the heel as the striking surface. I like to use it to step into a punch (MY punch, not theirs...) and it essentially becomes just a big offensive, aggressive, stepping-punch. I prefer a narrow 45 degree stance to having my shoulders square, so I tend to be a side-kicker (and I like to place those in the pelvic bone between both hips). I usually use my front kick to put my foot up on a fence to stretch or tie my shoes.

 

[chinto]

I knew a Uechi-ryu stylist who practiced a toe kick that was done by placing the index toe on top of the big toe. The striking surface was the re-enforced big toes tip. He was able to position this very quickly, a trick I've never been able to duplicate. He also used this for soft and muscle tissue. He greatly enjoyed certain targets on the inside thigh.

-Sauzin

well we use the big toe on certain targets on the inside of the thigh too. there are times when my style uses the toe to hit softer targets. other wise the front snap is normaly done with the ball of the foot.

 

[Em MacIntosh]

How do you guys get your toes tough enough to use as a striking surface? I guess it's like a spear hand, some people really can do it. Impressive.

 

[MMAfighter]

ouch.....i don't have anythign agaisnt karate or kung fu but why would you kick with the knuckles of your toes curled down?? wouldn't that mean easier broken toes?? i understand to the groin but anywhere else seems too risky....

 

[Em MacIntosh]

What he said...

 

[TimoS]

How do you guys get your toes tough enough to use as a striking surface? I guess it's like a spear hand, some people really can do it. Impressive.

Have you seen this video?