From the past-Black Flag wing chun.

[ShortBridge]

Backyards, garages, and basements have a long history of producing terrible martial artists. Typically, those are the hobbyists.

YouTube has all the proof you need. This website has plenty of examples. Some of the worst stuff I've ever seen.

YouTube is proof of exactly nothing.

Whack jobs are more likely to go on YouTube and "prove that the world is flat" than astrophysicists are to go on and prove that it is not.

Thinking more about this: Let's say Niel deGrass Tyson goes on YouTube and explains something that he and the top minds in his field have gone deep into. There aren't 100s of NdT's, but there might be 1,000s YouTube whack jobs...So, I guess that proves that he's wrong?

And back to the original subject, Black Flag Wing Chun was HIGHLY COMMERCIAL and heavily promoted...and we all just agreed that it wasn't what it claimed to be. So we seemed to agree in this case that commercial and highly self-promoted didn't equal better...then you came along and claimed that it does?

YouTube is proof of absolutely nothing. The belief that it is has literally picked apart hundreds of years of progress in a variety of fields, including martial arts.

Defend your thesis. Better yet, go touch hands with as many people as you can, and form valid opinions about what is good and what isn't.

 

[wckf92]

Geez...didn't think my comment would stir so much conversation!

This website has plenty of examples. Some of the worst stuff I've ever seen.

Are you going to provide examples of how it's done right in your opinion?

 

[Callen]

Defend your thesis. Better yet, go touch hands with as many people as you can, and form valid opinions about what is good and what isn't.

We need more of this, IMO. Training with others in person is the martial arts standard for assessing qualitative results. Basing opinions on observation through the internet alone is an unreliable way to substantiate claims.

 

[Callen]

Backyards, garages, and basements have a long history of producing terrible martial artists. Typically, those are the hobbyists.

YouTube has all the proof you need. This website has plenty of examples. Some of the worst stuff I've ever seen.

I'll stand by my original statement. Your opinions above are sweeping generalizations in the context of Chinese martial arts and VT in particular.

 

[Glaeken]

Geez...didn't think my comment would stir so much conversation!

Are you going to provide examples of how it's done right in your opinion?

That should be the job of Wing Chun students here.

 

[Glaeken]

I'll stand by my original statement. Your opinions above are sweeping generalizations in the context of Chinese martial arts and VT in particular.

Not really. The idea that all the best Wing Chun is hidden away in garages, basements, and backyards is just another way of saying it doesn't really exist.

If it did, it should be easy to find quality Wing Chun instruction. But it's not.

 

[Glaeken]

YouTube is proof of absolutely nothing. The belief that it is has literally picked apart hundreds of years of progress in a variety of fields, including martial arts.

YouTube is a collection of millions of videos, and there are good videos out there, even of Wing Chun.

But a lot of it is garbage, and much of the garbage is filmed in people's backyards, their basements, and their garages.

Never in actual combat. Rarely, maybe.

 

[wckf92]

That should be the job of Wing Chun students here.

Oh ok. So you are not a student?

 

[Glaeken]

Yes, but the inverse is often true. Just because a school isn't a commercial operation does Not mean it is bad.

It's more a matter of critical thinking. Something a lot of TMA students put on hold when they agree to enter some den, and learn killing hands.

 

[Glaeken]

Oh ok. So you are not a student?

I know all I need to know about Wing Chun and other TMA to know the claim that it's hidden away and secret is a lot of hot air. Romanticism.

 

[Callen]

Not really. The idea that all the best Wing Chun is hidden away in garages, basements, and backyards is just another way of saying it doesn't really exist.

If it did, it should be easy to find quality Wing Chun instruction. But it's not.

Again, all of that is your opinion; and you are still generalizing.

I thought you said "quality Wing Chun" was subjective? In terms of effective Wing Chun, it is actually very simple to find. Gary Lam, for example, teaches publicly out of his backyard, you're welcome to stop by.

Out of curiosity, are you a Wing Chun practitioner?

 

[Glaeken]

form valid opinions about what is good and what isn't.

Are you the arbiter of valid opinions here?

Tell me what you think about this one.

 

[Glaeken]

. Gary Lam, for example, teaches publicly out of his backyard, you're welcome to stop by.

Which successful Wing Chun fighters has he trained?

At least one would be sufficient, in my book.

 

[Glaeken]

you are still generalizing.

Right, because we're talking about Wing Chun, specifically Black Flag.

If you want me to get specific, I can.

Backyard wrestling, backyard Wing Chun. Equally vapid.

 

[wckf92]

Had to look that up! haha

 

[ShortBridge]

Well, you thumbs downed my post, so I guess that means I lost this argument.

Disappointing, I really wanted to make something of myself. Maybe I should watch more TV and spend more time on the internet.

 

[Glaeken]

Well, you thumbs downed my post, so I guess that means I lost this argument.

Disappointing, I really wanted to make something of myself. Maybe I should watch more TV and spend more time on the internet.

I thumbs downed it because you were wrong.

 

[Glaeken]

Had to look that up! haha

View attachment 30846

Seriously, that's what I think when I watch Gary Lam.

Sorry, I'll pass. This is not what I consider exciting, thought provoking, erudite Wing Chun.

This man is not qualified to teach hand to hand fighting. Essays, lectures, and whiteboarda are no replacement.

 

[Callen]

Right, because we're talking about Wing Chun, specifically Black Flag.

If you want me to get specific, I can.

I don't know what else to say here. Your opinion, "Backyards, garages, and basements have a long history of producing terrible martial artists. Typically, those are the hobbyists", is an extreme generalization.

I know all I need to know about Wing Chun and other TMA to know the claim that it's hidden away and secret is a lot of hot air. Romanticism.

So you're not a student then... I find that amusing. Pure gold.

 

[wckf92]

Seriously, that's what I think when I watch Gary Lam.

Sorry, I'll pass.

So are there any Wing Chun branches/lineages/instructors that you feel are good quality?