Fort Hood: Terrorism or Shooting Spree?

[Makalakumu]

Maybe he was one of those "deep operatives" that placed the demo charges in the twin towers. Now the "Project MKULTRA" programming went haywire causing him to go "postal". The gvt. Cabal sent in the "cleaner" ( the DOD cop) to fix their mess but they were unable to complete the job. Perhaps they are swapping the Maj. with a body double in the hospital as we speak.

:hmm:

Maybe...

I'll reserve my judgment on what I think happened for now.

At the very least, the article details all of the places in which Maj. Hasan could have been nabbed and stopped. In the end, it's amazing this guy was ever able to get this far. The question, if one accepts that this is either terrorism or a shooting spree, is why we have so many stupid people are still serving in the military.

Seriously, he said this to a colonol, "Muslims should rise up against American “aggressors.” And he said this to his military doctors, "We love death more then you love life.” I can only shake my head and say, WTF because I physically believe that it is physically impossible to have one's head shoved that far in the posterior.

I believe the people who serve in our military are smart and capable individuals, therefore there has to be more to this. If I was in the military, I would be very careful about saying anything against the government, the president, or the wars. I sense a massive crackdown coming.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

You're incorrect, it wasn't admittedly publically but it was privately. It's been known but unproven for a long time who was responsible.

That's my point, exactly. The IRA, which normally took credit for the bombings they did, didn't take credit (officially) for this one. So therefore, it was not a terrorist attack. Right?

If it was a terrorist attack, then I submit that the argument that it's not a terrorist attack unless some terrorist group takes credit for it goes right out the window.

Please note the date of bombings 21st November 1974 and spare a thought for those victims.

Absolutely. I had not realized the date.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I don't know why else people are judging Nidal and Sodini so differently when it appears they had similar motivations for their terrorist shooting sprees.

Really? Let's see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Collier_Township_shooting

On a website registered in his name, Sodini chronicled over a nine-month period his rejections by women and his severe sexual frustration.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Hood_shooting

Once while presenting what was supposed to be a medical lecture to other psychiatrists, Hasan instead talked about Islam, and stated that non-believers would be sent to hell, decapitated, set on fire, and have burning oil poured down their throats. One Muslim psychiatrist in the audience raised his hand, and said he was also a Muslim and did not believe Hasan's claims. According to Associated Press, Hasan's lecture also "justified suicide bombings."

According to National Public Radio (NPR), officials at Walter Reed repeatedly expressed concern about Hasan's behavior during the entire six years he was there. During that time period, Hasan's supervisors repeatedly gave him poor evaluations, and warned him that he was doing substandard work. During the spring of 2008, and some other times afterward, several key officials met to discuss what to do about Hasan. According to NPR, attendees of these meetings reportedly included the Walter Reed chief of psychiatry, the chairman of the USUHS Psychiatry Department at USUHS, two assistant chairs of the USUHS Psychiatry Department (one of whom was the director of Hasan's psychiatry fellowship), another psychiatrist, and the director of the Walter Reed psychiatric residency program. According to NPR, both fellow students and faculty were strongly troubled by Hasan's behavior, which they described as "disconnected," "aloof," "paranoid," "belligerent," and "schizoid."

Hasan has expressed admiration for the teachings of Anwar al-Awlaki, who was the Dar al-Hijrah mosque's imam in 2002-02, and was investigated by the FBI after intelligence agencies intercepted 18 emails between him and al-Awkali, who was under surveillance, between December 2008 and June 2009. In one of the emails Hasan wrote al-Awlaki: "I can't wait to join you" in the afterlife. "It sounds like code words," said Lt. Col. Tony Shaffer, a military analyst at the Center for Advanced Defense Studies. "That he's actually either offering himself up or that he's already crossed that line in his own mind." Hasan also asked al-Awlaki when jihad is appropriate, and whether it is permissible if innocents are killed in a suicide attack.

So Sodini was frustrated by his inability to get a date, and took it out on a bunch of people in a gymnasium by shooting them. Hasan was deeply religious, considered radical Islam, including suicide bombing, justified. He taught courses in which he sympathized with and justified terrorist attacks, and asked a religious leader when it would be permissible to commit jihad and if it was OK to kill innocents in a suicide attack.

Those sound the same to you? Wow.

Shouting "Allah Akbar" is not espousing a terrorist agenda. It is a very common phrase he has likely uttered countless times, in all sorts of situations. What else should he have said?

Shouting "Allahu Akbar" is indeed not espousing a terrorist statement. It is, however, the last words of many terrorist suicide bombers. The kind who, let's see - do what Hasan did, think the way he thinks, plan to do what he planned to do, and then carried out actions very much like his. But somehow they're terrorists and he isn't.

Maybe they were both terrorists then? That doesn't matter to me so much, and I'm not sure why you asked if you already knew the answer ("horrible about using the word correctly?"). At any rate, they both killed people in a similar manner, with apparently similar motivations. What really matters to me is justice.

Sodini is not a terrorist. And Hasan, to me, is. Why is that important? It is important to me that we drop this PC charade that pretends that radical Islam is not a problem. It's dangerous and I'm tired of it.

McVeigh and Nichols were terrorists - domestic terrorists. no one disputes it as far as I know. So why isn't Hasan a terrorist? Because we don't want to risk offending anyone. Well, screw that noise. Seriously.

 

[crushing]

Of course the two articles you picked out aren't the same. A report on NPR soon after the terrorist shooting spree discussed how the single aging balding Hasan was looking for a wife but was constantly rejected or frustrated that the women he was interested in weren't "Muslim enough" for him. Sodini surely wasn't nearly picky about religion, so they aren't the same.

Who really knows what the real story is as it changes over time? The first reports from witness say he used an M-16 rifle (the same witnesses that heard "Allah Akbar!"?), now the media is saying he use a "cop killer" pistol. Sure didn't take the the media long to start the appeals to anti-gun emotionalism with such buzzwords.

Also, I don't give a damn about being PC.

 

[Tez3]

I don't think it's so much about being PC that people want to believe it's a shooting spree, it's about safety and security.
If this guy was a terrorist it means everyone has to now keep looking over their shoulders, that you can longer trust anyone and the enemy is not just at the door he's in our sittingrooms. It means no one is safe. If however he was a 'lone' killer acting through beliefs of his own or because he was tipped over the edge of sanity by something it makes it easier to cope with, there's been shootings before and everyone can pick themselves up and start over, it means that this was a one off and things can go back to more or less normal.
You can't blame people for wanting it to be a lone incident because if it weren't it means terror everyday and the nagging fear that will destroy lives. People will wonder who they can trust and who is waiting to kill them, that is a very hard way to live so people aren't being PC when they say it must be a spree shooting, they are doing what they think they have to to carry on. They may well be fooling themselves but it's human nature, they can't help it.

 

[TKDHomeSchooler]

Thanks for the link Bill, I was out most of the day yesterday.

Tez3, we already have to look over our shoulders because our Government isn't doing all it can to curb this crap from coming back home.

Our President is stalling on making a decision for Afghanistan. Iraq, IMO, will be back to scum in a few short years and our borders are still open to whomever wants to just waltz in here and kill us all.

Did you know that Mexican cartel members were wooing school kids in ElPaso recently? Yes, it is that friggin easy to get in to our country.

Stock up on your ammo, it will come back home to us at some point.

 

[Tez3]

Thanks for the link Bill, I was out most of the day yesterday.

Tez3, we already have to look over our shoulders because our Government isn't doing all it can to curb this crap from coming back home.

Our President is stalling on making a decision for Afghanistan. Iraq, IMO, will be back to scum in a few short years and our borders are still open to whomever wants to just waltz in here and kill us all.

Did you know that Mexican cartel members were wooing school kids in ElPaso recently? Yes, it is that friggin easy to get in to our country.

Stock up on your ammo, it will come back home to us at some point.

It could be argued you know that America brought this to its own door by it's foreign policy and it's actions in the Middle East so it's maybe a bit simplistic to blame one particular man who is President at the moment. It's a bigger thing than party politics.

You've slightly missed my point as well in that this horror wasn't perpetuated by a 'foreigner' who had got into your country, it was done by someone born there, a citizen. Looking at our situation most of the Muslim bombers here were British citizens, many born here, went to school here and lived their lives as we do until they were radicalised by terrorists, that's the fear...that our own turn against us and we have to watch over our shoulders for people we thought were 'us' not 'them'. In many ways an outside terrorist is easier to cope with mentally, they are simply 'the enemy'.

 

[TKDHomeSchooler]

Tez3, I agree this issue they have with us is not new. Our last President, whom I voted for, also left our borders unprotected. He also took some of our civil liberties with his Patriot Act.

I did miss your point. I blame it on posting without caffeine, lol. It is more frightening when it is one of our own, meaning an American. Timothy Mcveigh, the DC snipers, and this guy, plus others in the past (all the way back to the UT sniper in the 60's or 70's, I forget).

 

[Tez3]

Tez3, I agree this issue they have with us is not new. Our last President, whom I voted for, also left our borders unprotected. He also took some of our civil liberties with his Patriot Act.

I did miss your point. I blame it on posting without caffeine, lol. It is more frightening when it is one of our own, meaning an American. Timothy Mcveigh, the DC snipers, and this guy, plus others in the past (all the way back to the UT sniper in the 60's or 70's, I forget).

Good grief! posting without caffeine, tricky!

In many ways it's easier to accept that this is a mad man, someone who is off his trolley. To shoot down and kill colleagues, patients even, people he was sworn to protect and care for not just work with requires someone to be either completely mad or completely evil in our eyes. To be able to be ruthless enough to do it for idealogical reasons is not something we want to think about.
Don't blame people for wanting to put this down to him being insane, the alternative is a very hard thing to face. Of course if there's people who have missed the warning signs that he was about to blow as it were it's also human nature for them to want to find excuses and cover up, no one wants to be blamed for not preventing this, the media too scent stories to keep their ratings up.

On the subject of whether a terrorist attack is one or not, in the IRA bombing of Birmingham, there was sufficent forensic evidence which proved it to be an IRA attack, bombmakers each have unique signatures and it was a signature of a known bomber. Catching that bomber however is easier said than done but the hunt hasn't finished and it's still an ongoing case. An IRA killer has just been charged for an murder committed over 30 years ago. I shall be in court when it comes to trial.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/8355648.stm