For All The Taekwondo Bashers The Real Truth On Taekwondo From My View

[Flying Crane]

Yeah that's not a formal Taekwondo kick. I would say that's more capoera than TKD, if anything.

Capoeira uses a kick that is kind of, sort of, similar to that, but I’ve never seen anything quite like that in capoeira. I have seen similar things in other systems as well.

I guess I wonder, what does it matter? Lots of things can work. Similar things can be found within many different systems. Very very few things are truly unique to one method.

 

[Flying Crane]

How many tornado or double roundhouse or axe kick knockouts?

Imagine if a grappling coach in MMA didn't take anything from Jiujitsu specifically... What would we say about the practicality of Jiujitsu then?

Why would we need to say anything about the practicality of juijistsu then?

 

[Flying Crane]

Deep stances in TKD? Anyway, you can do that at home all day in your time off, if you believe there is any utility to that. To spend 40% of your dojang time on blocks that aren't used in application is a hard thing to swallow. If most schools had pattern training separate classes, most wouldn't show up, at least according to the assistant instructor where I trained. It is not beloved, it isn't applied, and you can do it at home.

You keep listing percentages. Where do you get those numbers? How do we know they are accurate in any way?

 

[Flying Crane]

I don't remember which one but I did visit such a school. Never joined.

I’ve never seen such a thing. You may have seen a school teaching Modern Wushu, which was developed by the Chinese Government in the 1950s as a performance and competition cultural art form. It relies on acrobatic forms and is similar to a kung-fu inspired gymnastics routine. The method is based on the older kung fu methods but was altered for aesthetics and performance and is not meant to be a valid fighting method. Modern Wushu folks tend to be excellent athletes, but are not training for combat, unless they do something else like Sanda, in the side.

So yes, Modern Wushu has acrobatics. I’ve never seen acrobatics in a traditional kung fu school.

 

[Acronym]

I will say this, though I wish to stress it's only my limited observations, the Kickboxers I've seen from across the globe hitting the bag, posting clips for feedbacks, tend to be clearly worse kickers than non Mcdojo TKDOIns..

Even in cases where their experiences are decades, they kick worse in terms of form - things that you can do something about and is not down to genetics. So in that sense I don't think doing TaeKwonDo would be a waste of time. There is some benefit to forms that TMA instills, but that doesn't mean you need all the blocks and katas/tuls/pomsae..

and the level kickboxers kick is good enough anyway, clearly.

 

[Flying Crane]

I will say this, though I wish to stress it's only my limited observations, the Kickboxers I've seen from across the globe hitting the bag, posting clips for feedbacks, tend to be clearly worse kickers than non Mcdojo TKDOIns..

Even in cases where their experiences are decades, they kick worse in terms of form - things that you can do something about and is not down to genetics. So in that sense I don't think doing TaeKwonDo would be a waste of time. There is some benefit to forms that TMA instills, but that doesn't mean you need all the blocks and katas/tuls/pomsae..

and the level kickboxers kick is good enough anyway, clearly.

Why don’t you just find a method and a teacher who can teach you in a way that engages you, and makes sense to you, and you can relate to? Don’t worry about the rest, or what other people are doing. It is irrelevant to you.

Not every method is a good fit for every person. It is important to find the right approach to training, that makes sense to you. If not, you just get frustrated with the training. Sounds to me like that is where you are. You need to find something that is better for you.

 

[Acronym]

So yes, Modern Wushu has acrobatics. I’ve never seen acrobatics in a traditional kung fu school.

Never said it was traditional kung fu. I was gonna guess that it was Wushu but I don't know that for a fact. There is actually a wushu school next to the one I go to and it might be the same one that I visited as a kid.

 

[Flying Crane]

Never said it was traditional kung fu. I was gonna guess that it was Wushu but I don't know that for a fact. There is actually a wushu school next to the one I go to and it might be the same one that I visited as a kid.

Well, it makes a difference because they are not the same thing. I would suggest you be certain of what you are looking at before you make claims about it, especially if those claims are accusations.

 

[Acronym]

Why don’t you just find a method and a teacher who can teach you in a way that engages you, and makes sense to you, and you can relate to? Don’t worry about the rest, or what other people are doing. It is irrelevant to you.
.

It's very hard to find a TKD school that doesn't do patterns but if there was one, I'd take it. I'm not going to get yelled at for stances that aren't used in sparring. It's just a waste of my time and money.

 

[Acronym]

Well, it makes a difference because they are not the same thing. I would suggest you be certain of what you are looking at before you make claims about it, especially if those claims are accusations.

Wushu is a form of kung fu. I am certain of it. There's a reason I didn't join.

 

[Flying Crane]

It's very hard to find a TKD school that doesn't do patterns but if there was one, I'd take it. I'm not going to get yelled at for stances that aren't used in sparring. It's just a waste of my time and money.

Maybe TKD isn’t the right path for you. That isn’t a dig at you nor a negative judgement on TKD. It just might be the wrong approach for you.

 

[Flying Crane]

Wushu is a form of kung fu. I am certain of it. There's a reason I didn't join.

It is a very specific alteration that intentionally deviates from the traditional fighting methods of China. It is a performance art.

I also didn’t join, even though my first Sifu is also a coach for Modern Wushu. I told him I was only interested in the traditional fighting methods.

 

[Steve]

If it was a Kosen Judo school, I wouldn't be able to, no.. Do you know what that is?

I am familiar with the Kosen Judo rule set and the history of it. I guess, I'm just genuinely surprised that you couldn't tell the difference between one school and another. For what it's worth, I think I could. In fact, I think I could tell the difference between an American BJJ school and a Brazilian BJJ school without anyone saying a word. Different culture.

 

[Steve]

running up the wall and kicking? Yeah, I don't recall ever being taught that in TKD. I would chalk that one up for some of the Kung Fu styles in which you actually do stuff like that.

Just for fun:

Here's a tutorial

Here's one of the little guys learning how:

 

[skribs]

[TKD training is not characterized by deep stances.

It has been at both schools I've trained extensively at. What's your authoritative source that TKD training is not characterized by deep stances?

You can't spar against yourself.

I didn't say sparring. I said physical training. That means pushups, situps, jumping rope, or any other training that you might do at a martial arts school that's more related to building muscles than training technique and sparring.

Most martial arts schools will include some sort of conditioning in their training. Should they stop doing so, because you can do that at home? Please, do me a favor, walk into any boxing gym where you see someone doing situps and go up to the owner and tell him "you're wasting people's time by having them do situps, they can do that at home!" See how well he responds to this idea.

I was not quoted

Do you see anyone else bashing the art? Who else do you think he was talking to?

You mentioned that the stances are good for muscle building, to which I replied that you can practice them at home just as well.

And how are students supposed to know the details of these stances to get the most use out of them without being instructed? That's the whole point of class. To learn things. Then you go home and practice them. If you know the forms well enough to practice them without instruction, then one of two things has happened:

1. You are a prodigy. In which case your experience is not true of everyone else, and most other people do need the class.
2. You are lying to yourself about your own abilities. You really have no understanding of the forms, the stances, or their purpose, and instead of accepting that fact, you choose to spew your ignorance for all of us to see. I'm going to guess this is the more likely possibility, based on your flippant attitude towards them.

You may personally not like forms. That's your prerogative. A lot of great martial arts don't have forms. But what you're doing is telling everyone else that they shouldn't do forms, either. Or they just do them at home because you don't think it's worth the class time. This is where your problem is. You're telling everyone else how to train, based on your own (very misguided) opinions. Who made you the arbiter of the arts?

 

[skribs]

Just for fun:

Here's a tutorial

Here's one of the little guys learning how:

It's almost like (gasp in surprise) different schools teach different things! And having been to a single school doesn't tell you everything about the art!

 

[Acronym]

I am familiar with the Kosen Judo rule set and the history of it. I guess, I'm just genuinely surprised that you couldn't tell the difference between one school and another. For what it's worth, I think I could. In fact, I think I could tell the difference between an American BJJ school and a Brazilian BJJ school without anyone saying a word. Different culture.

Assuming the GI's don't give it away, how would you be able to differentiate a Kosen Judo school from a BJJ one?

 

[Acronym]

It's almost like (gasp in surprise) different schools teach different things! And having been to a single school doesn't tell you everything about the art!

Pettis said himself it was a performance kick for breaking he did in TKD. How many students join demo teams or dabble in acrobatics? 1%? 0.5?

 

[Acronym]

It has been at both schools I've trained extensively at.

You would have to elaborate what you mean then and name the stances.

 

[Headhunter]

[
There are a lot of people who can't use a heavy bag at home due to space. Not everybody is a middle class citizen with a bro garage and a heavy bag

Then they can shadow box