First Technique?

[Doc]

Originally posted by pete
... you mention the "commercial art"... was there a point in the development of the Kenpo System that the system was changed in order to become more marketable? Is this the new system, or EPAK, as opposed to the old Chinese Kenpo system?

What Parker called "Chinese Kenpo" didn't really change, but circumstances caused him to split off a branch of a more commercial marketable product. This is Parker's latest and last version of his Kenpo Business.

That doesn't mean the Chinese Kenpo didn't continue to exist. In fact Parker continued to evolve his personal execution and teaching of the science until he passed, and it evolved along side and with different interpretations of his commercial arts as well. Don't confuse what Parker did with what he sold. That's why the "newbies" can't move like Parker or get the same effect. He didn't teach them his art, he taught them their art.

Different students learned different things at different times. Most evolved into the commercial art as a business oportunity to make a living. But many who were around before the "motion based" commercial kenpo was created still teach from that era.

All of the diverse Kenpo of Parker Lineage still exists in one form or another. So much so, the word "Kenpo" has become as generic as "karate." You never know what it is until you get on the floor.

 

[WhiteTiger]

The first technique I learned was Kimono Grab.

The first I teach as part of the Tracy system are:

Attacking Circle - Teaches clock positions
Japanese Sword
Chinese Sword
Delayed Sword
KNEE OF VENGEANCE
TWISTING TALON (AB)
RETURNING DRAGON
BREAKING THE SWORD
KENPO SHIELD
EVASION

 

[jfarnsworth]

Originally posted by Michael Billings
Essentially another technique against a right kick, but working with the lead hand to the inside of the leg instead of the outside.

I personally like this technique, and very well I might add. It has many practical applications & I might add also it is a good sparring technique. Anyone that really knows me personally knows I don't much care for the cat. completion thing however in this instance for yellow; look at the box. Delayed Sword, Sword of Destruction, Deflecting Hammer, & Intellectual Departure. I know I'm not telling you anything new the inside downward block has to go somewhere sometime.

 

[rmcrobertson]

I'm not sure what's so tricky about Intellectual Departure--which, like the more-official ten yellow techniques where I work out, is largely based on taking advantaage of the usual rection to an attack--cringing away from it. I mean, the left steps back, the right hand comes in to cover the groin: isn't that the essence of the technique? Why would this be harder than Delayed Sword (left foot steps back, right hand goes in front of the face), Alt. Maces (left foot steps back, right hand hammers down), Sword of Destruction (left foot steps back, right hand sweeps outward), and so forth?

Personally, I suspect that Defl. Hammer is simply easier to appreciate at first--it's easier for a beginner to believe in...

 

[Michael Billings]

The way I learned it you are:

1. Staying in the "Hot" zone, instead of "Warm" zone, (not that, that is necessarily more difficult)

2. As I learned the deflection, you used the radial side of the arm, and that can give you a good little ding, as compared to Deflecting Hammer, where you use the ulnar side of the arm.

3. I learned a lifting heel kick, from the reverse bow (neither of which is a yellow belt basic)

4. Residual torque is a difficult concept to teach when explaining where you get the power from the lifting kick. Of course you can bypass this by teaching a back kick, but I like the concept of residual torque, by rotating into the reverse bow until the hips force the lifting kick and add impetus.

However, the way we do it sparring, using it as part of a universal block, or by itself, is a little easier when they have done the technique and we have a shared frame of reference.

Oss,
-Michael

 

[MisterMike]

Originally posted by Michael Billings
The way I learned it you are:

1. Staying in the "Hot" zone, instead of "Warm" zone, (not that, that is necessarily more difficult)

2. As I learned the deflection, you used the radial side of the arm, and that can give you a good little ding, as compared to Deflecting Hammer, where you use the ulnar side of the arm.

3. I learned a lifting heel kick, from the reverse bow (neither of which is a yellow belt basic)

4. Residual torque is a difficult concept to teach when explaining where you get the power from the lifting kick. Of course you can bypass this by teaching a back kick, but I like the concept of residual torque, by rotating into the reverse bow until the hips force the lifting kick and add impetus.

However, the way we do it sparring, using it as part of a universal block, or by itself, is a little easier when they have done the technique and we have a shared frame of reference.

Oss,
-Michael

I use the back kick to send them back, getting me out of the "hot zone." I save the lifting heel kick for Circle of Doom. :asian:

 

[Michael Billings]

... I use the back kick also.

The way I teach it is primarily a function of Range.

-Michael

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by Trident
marshallbd -

The Yellow Belt chart in EPAK is as follows:

Please stay away from generalities. Your list is only correct for some who studied the commercial art later. Some of those techniques didn't even exist until relatively recently.

 

[gman]

Doc, I am wondering why you call it "comercial art" (And no I'm not trying to start anything just asking a question as someone new to the art). Based on what you've said that leads me to believe that there is no such thing as EPAK. Only partial forms of Kenpo based on which "senior" you learn from. Once again, let me say that I'm not tring to start any problems just asking a question. Nor am I putting down any "senior or organization. I hope that covers it for all the thin skinned people out there. (sheez)

 

[Michael Billings]

See here for some of it:

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7399&perpage=15&pagenumber=4

Or just search for threads where he has replied until you find one that has the explanation at a level you seek.

-Michael

 

[Doc]

Originally posted by gman
Doc, I am wondering why you call it "comercial art" (And no I'm not trying to start anything just asking a question as someone new to the art). Based on what you've said that leads me to believe that there is no such thing as EPAK. Only partial forms of Kenpo based on which "senior" you learn from. Once again, let me say that I'm not tring to start any problems just asking a question. Nor am I putting down any "senior or organization. I hope that covers it for all the thin skinned people out there. (sheez)

Well sir, fortunately I'm not thin skinned. When I say "commercial art," I mean for the most part the "motion based" off shoot of Parker's other teachings that has proliferated into commercial success in schools around the world. This arts inception came about around the early seventies for various reasons. The viability of this art, probably more than others, is predicated on the competency of the instructor because of its conceptual nature. The instructors knowledge and experience is paramount in teaching because of the interpretive nature of the general curriculum which lacks specific codified application instructions. Although there are many who teach this art in a "non-commercial" environment, it is still the "commercial interpretation" of Parker's teaching by his own design. Whether or not you "charge" or "make money" is not what makes the art "commercial" relatively speaking.

Other Parker teachings and interpretations (such as my own SubLevel Four Kenpo Concepts) continued to evolve independently of other Parker ideas over the years. Some are from the fifties and continue with what Parker was doing then which is closer to what he learned in Hawaii under Chow. Others are from the early sixties, (like myself) who are based more in the early Chinese Kenpo that Parker began under various Chinese Masters and never abandoned. It all depends on what, when, where, and how long. All still exist today in many different forms and the efficacy of any of them is, as always, predicated on the knowledge and skill of the instructor first and foremost.

Parker never taught just "one thing" but continued to grow and evolve continuiously as students came in and out of his life at various times, taking with them what they learned at that "snapshot" in Parker's life. Many were taught different "flavors" at Ed Parker's descretion, but clearly the most common is his "commercialy" successful vehicle, which by his design, proliferated and became "the" Kenpo of recent practitioners. It is not THE Kenpo but A Kenpo. There are some really knowledgeable and good instructors of that interpretation, but not near as many as there should be. Usually the best ones are those that are well educated with considerable lif experience that allows them to interpret what for many is very complex information.

"American Kenpo" has become generic like "karate." - you never know what you're getting until you get involved.

 

[superdave]

This article re-enforces what Doc has already posted.


see here

 

[masherdong]

Delayed Sword is the first technique taught.

 

[Kenpobuff]

Our first technique is "Wrap around A". A technique against a right shoulder grab from 3:00.

 

[parkerkarate]

The first technique I was taught was Grip Of Death.
But I think the first technique in the old system was Delayed Sword (I think I spelt it right).
I learned that technique and Sword of Destruction a while after Grip of Death

 

[Seabrook]

The first technique I was taught was Grip Of Death.
But I think the first technique in the old system was Delayed Sword (I think I spelt it right).
I learned that technique and Sword of Destruction a while after Grip of Death

What do you mean by the "old system"?

Jamie Seabrook
www.seabrook.gotkenpo.com

 

[parkerkarate]

The old system where there was 32 techniques in most belt levels. Now atleast in the WKKA there are only about 15.

 

[Sam]

"Kimono Grab?" Boy you guys are "old." For the newbies, "kimono grab" became "Lone Kimono" once the commercial art began to take off.

I'm a tracy's girl, and started waaaay back in september of '04. (yeah, 7 months ago) We still call it Kimono grab. But then again you may have been reffering to EPAK, as that was what all the 'commercial art' talk was about.

At my studio, for some reason, we don't do yellow belt. We go right to orange. And the first technique I learned was "wedge".