"Every cop should learn BJj" Do you agree?

[lklawson]

I think 25-50 years away is a huge stretch.

More like 5-10, if that long.



In response to the relevant portion of both posts - there exists not an analogue firearm that is 100% reliable right now, so using 100% as an absolute requirement is simply never possible.


As to processing speed, a simple ID check of the type required can happen (with existing tech) faster than you can pull a trigger anyway, so speed is really not the limiting factor.

Also your second message refers to "technology on the market" - I was never intending to mean introduction next Tuesday...


Of course, the one absolutely guaranteed way to stop all unlawful shootings is to uninvent firearms

Because of both my hobbies (martial arts, including firearms) and my profession (IT contractor for DoD with a special emphasis on security) with expertise in both areas, I've been watching the press for and development of this technology since it was little more than a twinkle in the eye. I keep a finger on the pulse of the different technologies proposed and developed for this theory (there are many). It is my expert opinion that 10 years is not only a pipe dream but is similar to the way that "25 years" is always the number when researchers talk about sustainable energy positive fusion.

Very honestly, 25-50 years is optimistic and kinda depends on breakthroughs that are still theoretical in sensing technology, battery technology, and processing. Take processing, for instance. Yeah, the capability to process exists, but not in the size required or with the required durability. There are at least two research paths I know of which could potentially get it where it needs to be, but one of them seems to be hitting a wall. It's sort of related to the collapse of Moore's Law.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[pdg]

Because of both my hobbies (martial arts, including firearms) and my profession (IT contractor for DoD with a special emphasis on security) with expertise in both areas, I've been watching the press for and development of this technology since it was little more than a twinkle in the eye. I keep a finger on the pulse of the different technologies proposed and developed for this theory (there are many). It is my expert opinion that 10 years is not only a pipe dream but is similar to the way that "25 years" is always the number when researchers talk about sustainable energy positive fusion.

Very honestly, 25-50 years is optimistic and kinda depends on breakthroughs that are still theoretical in sensing technology, battery technology, and processing. Take processing, for instance. Yeah, the capability to process exists, but not in the size required or with the required durability. There are at least two research paths I know of which could potentially get it where it needs to be, but one of them seems to be hitting a wall. It's sort of related to the collapse of Moore's Law.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

At least you're looking at it intelligently...

For the amount of processing and electrical power required I really don't think it's very far off at all.

Obviously, we can debate this all day, but neither of us can truly claim to be right.

All we can do is wait - either I'll be proved right in under a decade, you'll be proved right in 25-50 years, or we'll both be proved wrong in 10-25 years

 

[lklawson]

All we can do is wait - either I'll be proved right in under a decade, you'll be proved right in 25-50 years, or we'll both be proved wrong in 10-25 years

Hard to argue that.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[CB Jones]

At least you're looking at it intelligently...

For the amount of processing and electrical power required I really don't think it's very far off at all.

Obviously, we can debate this all day, but neither of us can truly claim to be right.

All we can do is wait - either I'll be proved right in under a decade, you'll be proved right in 25-50 years, or we'll both be proved wrong in 10-25 years

I agree with @lklawson

The problems with it:

Money.....hell many agencies make officers provide their own firearms

 

[lklawson]

I agree with @lklawson

The problems with it:

Money.....hell many agencies make officers provide their own firearms

Yeah, I know.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[CB Jones]

Yeah, I know.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

I know one rural sheriffs office that probably close to a third of their deputies carry Hi-Points.

 

[JR 137]

I agree with @lklawson

The problems with it:

Money.....hell many agencies make officers provide their own firearms

I thought only mall cops had to provide their own firearms

 

[lklawson]

I know one rural sheriffs office that probably close to a third of their deputies carry Hi-Points.

Not a bad gun. I like them. Actually own one. Good for a inexpensive night stand gun and range plinker. Wouldn't be among my top 10 choices for a duty weapon.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Dirty Dog]

In response to the relevant portion of both posts - there exists not an analogue firearm that is 100% reliable right now, so using 100% as an absolute requirement is simply never possible.

I can, and do, put thousands of rounds through individual handguns without a single failure. Not a one. Zero. Zilch.
My EDC gun has, as an estimate, something like 10,000 rounds through it without a failure.
That's close enough to 100% for me.
On the other hand, the biometric systems on the drug boxes at work (which I personally access 20-30 times a shift, easily) fail with remarkable regularity. At least 20% of the time, I have to give it the finger at least twice before it will open. And that's ignoring how long it takes.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I thought only mall cops had to provide their own firearms

One of our kids is a cop in a city of about 110,000, which has long been known to be the most violent city in Colorado.
His department expects officers to provide their own firearms.

 

[JR 137]

Perhaps a stupid question to all the LEOs and anyone else in the know...

If you have to provide your own firearm, can you choose what you carry, are you given a list of a few you must use, or do you have to buy something specific?

What about ammo? Buy that too?

It wouldn’t be surprising for police buy their own firearm in a 3rd world country. Here in the US? Outrageous IMO. Shouldn’t they petition Trump? He’s claimed many times to take care of the military and veterans.

Edit - this is NOT political. I’m neither bashing nor praising the president. I’d say shouldn’t they petition WHOEVER is sitting in the Oval Office. I’d have said Clinton if she was president.

 

[TMA17]

 

[lklawson]

Perhaps a stupid question to all the LEOs and anyone else in the know...

If you have to provide your own firearm, can you choose what you carry, are you given a list of a few you must use, or do you have to buy something specific?

What about ammo? Buy that too?

Depends on the PD. Some have very specific guidelines, some have less to none.

It wouldn’t be surprising for police buy their own firearm in a 3rd world country. Here in the US? Outrageous IMO.

It's actually very common.

Shouldn’t they petition Trump? He’s claimed many times to take care of the military and veterans.

In general, the Feds have little, and should have little IMO, say in how State and Local PD's run their biz. Outside of some things which it seems that most people generally think they want the feds to meddle in, such as anti-corruption, it just doesn't seem wise to me to have some fed setting standards. OTOH, it is a long standing tradition for the feds to give grants for equipment & training and offer free/reduced price military equipment. The whole "militarization of the police" thing when they get armored vehicles, surplus M4's, &tc.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[CB Jones]

Perhaps a stupid question to all the LEOs and anyone else in the know...

If you have to provide your own firearm, can you choose what you carry, are you given a list of a few you must use, or do you have to buy something specific?

What about ammo? Buy that too?

Depends on the agency.

The agency I work for provides a duty weapon, a backup weapon, and all ammo. But there is a list of allowed firearms and ammo you can buy if want to carry something different.

Some agencies do not issue but you are required to carry something from their allowed list.

Some agencies allow you to carry whatever you want.

To my knowledge all agencies provide ammo.

 

[Buka]

We got into a knock down, drag out last night with a big, strong Texas boy. I had his legs figure foured, while five other cops were trying to get his hands out from under his chest to cuff him. He was cranked on something, impervious to any pain that might be used to get him to comply. As someone told me years ago, these situations sometime look like five monkeys trying to screw a football.

It was a nine minute battle, right under a security camera. Nine minutes is a long time. While it was going on this thread actually popped into my head. I came to the conclusion that everything you've learned can help in these kind of situations. But I think that training against non compliant partners helps more than anything else.

 

[pdg]

Nine minutes is a long time.

In that sort of situation, 9 minutes must be approaching an eternity...

 

[drop bear]

I think there is too much space in that double bicep control.

It means if you loose initiative for a second you can get popped.

 

[drop bear]

He was resisting the whole time.

I read the response. But can't find it to quote in context.

If I am going to start hitting a guy I like to do it from a position he can't fight back from.

So that if he goes from. "You can't have my arm" to "I am going to unscrew your head" he is less able to.

Position before submission.

So for me it is not really him resisting as more when he cracked the sads and wanted to make a real fight of it.

Which if you hit a guy you need to be prepared for a response.

So that I am not really relying on striking to comply the guy out of desperation.
(In that I hit him or he gets up)

I strike from a safe position. I can do it all day until he gives the arm.

About 50seconds in. He is not in danger just pops away until the guy moves the arm.

 

[ballen0351]

Shouldn’t they petition Trump? He’s claimed many times to take care of the military and veterans.

Edit - this is NOT political. I’m neither bashing nor praising the president. I’d say shouldn’t they petition WHOEVER is sitting in the Oval Office. I’d have said Clinton if she was president.

There are programs out there where the feds loan PDs weapons. There are a few small PDs where I live that are on that program. They get the guns (Glocks and M16s) and once a year they must send the feds an invoice with pictures of each gun and its serial number to prove they still have it. I've never worked for a dept on that program so I dont know all the details but a friend of mines does and he was telling me about it.

 

[ballen0351]

I read the response. But can't find it to quote in context.

If I am going to start hitting a guy I like to do it from a position he can't fight back from.

So that if he goes from. "You can't have my arm" to "I am going to unscrew your head" he is less able to.

Position before submission.

So for me it is not really him resisting as more when he cracked the sads and wanted to make a real fight of it.

Which if you hit a guy you need to be prepared for a response.

So that I am not really relying on striking to comply the guy out of desperation.
(In that I hit him or he gets up)

I strike from a safe position. I can do it all day until he gives the arm.

I'm not in disagreement with you. I'm simply saying "IF" striking is the route you choose to take then dont half *** it. Just like if some type of grappling technique is the route you choose then dont half *** it.
As my career comes to an end in 2 weeks I look back over the last two decades and in the early years I relied heavy on strikes mainly because I was young and strong and because that's how I was taught back then. there were less cameras and social media wasnt a real big thing. As I got older and actually trained in some grappling skills and with the influx of cameras and World Star I tend to default more towards grappling now. I think both will work as long as you know what your doing and do it 100% not half assed