Dr. Laura sez Men cheating is all Women's fault

[Archangel M]

Absolutely. There's no justification for infidelity. I was actually trying to make the point that it's ridiculous that "Dr Laura" can't talk about "unfulfilled needs" without making the victims the culprits. She had to blame them.

Why do we have to assign "blame" to everybody involved? Why can't we talk about wisdom without adding judgment? Why are women either completely helpless, or completely responsible? Can't we talk about what women can do to prevent cheating without condemning the women who didn't do it? And why does the idea that some women may have given their husbands opportunity to cheat automatically mean that no men are responsible?

That's insulting to both men and women! That's saying that women hold sole responsibility (and therefore, blame) for the health of the marriage, and men have no self-control whatsoever!

But in this society of hyper-insecurity, you can't just say "what could have been done to prevent this" without somebody else using it as a springboard for rating, popularity, or as a platform for their own agenda!

Rape, robbery, school shootings, infidelity, cheating, traffic accidents, whatever! It's all fair game when it comes to playing the "blame game" and absolving others of all responsibility. Victims get further traumatized, nobody actually learns how to prevent victimization, guilty actions are justified (which is especially horrific considering the nature of most sexual crimes already establish the feelings of guilt in the victim), and barracuda-like newscasters, politicians, and lobbyists use these people like pawns to raise their own popularity.

:tantrum:
*rant over*

My opinion as well.

Just better put.

 

[CoryKS]

It seems to me that there are actually two issues here.

The first is compatibility, or the lack thereof. And yes, the woman can absolutely contribute to that. Either partner, really.

The second is fidelity, or what steps the frustrated party takes when the couple is no longer compatible. The responsibility for this, I believe, rests on the person who takes unilateral action to alleviate his/her frustrations, whether the action is to cheat or file for divorce.

So while I would agree that the woman can be to blame for the cause - the incombatibility - it does not follow that she is to blame for the effect - the infidelity. That was the decision of the man.

I see where Schlessinger was trying to go with this, but I think she lumped this all into one big category and got it wrong. The fact that she had to make exceptions to her sweeping statement later should have been the hint that she needs to spend more time refining her theory.

 

[shesulsa]

It seems to me that there are actually two issues here.

The first is compatibility, or the lack thereof. And yes, the woman can absolutely contribute to that. Either partner, really.

The second is fidelity, or what steps the frustrated party takes when the couple is no longer compatible. The responsibility for this, I believe, rests on the person who takes unilateral action to alleviate his/her frustrations, whether the action is to cheat or file for divorce.

So while I would agree that the woman can be to blame for the cause - the incombatibility - it does not follow that she is to blame for the effect - the infidelity. That was the decision of the man.

I see where Schlessinger was trying to go with this, but I think she lumped this all into one big category and got it wrong. The fact that she had to make exceptions to her sweeping statement later should have been the hint that she needs to spend more time refining her theory.

But ... again ... and I've been on both sides of this ... is *incompatibility* the fault of one person? And who's really? The one who wants it less? Or the one who wants it more? And does it depend on the reasonability of frequency and how it compares to socially acceptable sexual "guidelines?"

Sexuality and intimacy between couples is an entity unto itself. What one couple defines as a great sex life would bore another couple to tears.

What if the governor's wife wants it eight times a week and would get freaky with him in the limo, a theater, restraunt and men's room? Is that enough? What if he needs to be hurt for sexual arousal? What if he needs to be told he's the most powerful man in the world and women are ball-busters who only feed on the efforts of man? Is it her fault because she's not willing to give him "the affection and attention he needs?"

Sexual incompatibility is not necessarily the fault of one person or another, it's an indication of two people who cannot agree on how to come together - pun intended.

It takes two to tango, two to screw it up.

 

[CoryKS]

But ... again ... and I've been on both sides of this ... is *incompatibility* the fault of one person? And who's really? The one who wants it less? Or the one who wants it more? And does it depend on the reasonability of frequency and how it compares to socially acceptable sexual "guidelines?"

Depends on the situation, and it certainly doesn't depend on "socially acceptable guidelines". It depends on whether both partners are satisfied with what they have. Compatibility means mutual satisfaction. A fetishist, for example, is not going to be compatible with somebody who is revolted by his/her particular fetish. So he/she would seek out someone with similar tastes. But people change. Say two years down the road one of them decides that they're no longer interested in something that was integral to their sex life. The other partner's options are: 1) find a compromise, if any; 2) accept a less- or non-satisfying sex life; 3) divorce and find someone more compatible; or 4) cheat.

What if the governor's wife wants it eight times a week and would get freaky with him in the limo, a theater, restraunt and men's room? Is that enough? What if he needs to be hurt for sexual arousal? What if he needs to be told he's the most powerful man in the world and women are ball-busters who only feed on the efforts of man? Is it her fault because she's not willing to give him "the affection and attention he needs?"

If these were things that they agreed upon as part of the relationship, then yes. If these were things she was willing to do but decided later for whatever reason that she couldn't continue, well, I suppose that's her perogative but it still generates incompatibility. And if the situation was reversed - if there were things that he was willing to do that he later backed off on, the incompatibility was generated by him. I'm uncomfortable with using the term "fault" because it implies judgement and I recognize that people do change, but it doesn't change the reality that based on one's decisions the couple is no longer compatible.

Sexual incompatibility is not necessarily the fault of one person or another, it's an indication of two people who cannot agree on how to come together - pun intended.

It takes two to tango, two to screw it up.

I disagree - it takes two to tango, but it only takes one to screw it up. Just like it takes two people to keep the peace, but only one to start a fight. But you're right - it's not necessarily the fault of one person or another. Could be one, the other, or both. Again, it depends on the situation.

 

[newGuy12]

It goes to show that it is easier to maintain a stable life if you are not coupled with another person. That makes things very difficult. It is the harder way to live. It may have many advantages to being single, but surely those "good things" come at a price -- it takes effort to make sure that the two people stay in agreement!

 

[little_miss_fracus]

Gee this is an awful lot of talk about a woman whose husband cheated on her with a whore. He did cheat on her with a whore, right? And some doctor says its the wife's fault?

I know i'm a kid and have a lot to learn but this seems to be pretty darn clear to me.

 

[Sukerkin]

With no disrespect intended, Fracus, wait a while. Life only seems simple when you're young. Compexity is directly proportional to duration .

 

[CoryKS]

I know i'm a kid and have a lot to learn therefore this seems to be pretty darn clear to me.

Fixed that for you.

 

[little_miss_fracus]

Fixed that for you.

Uh ... okay. So ... there are some folks here who type very correct English and some who spell well and know their grammar well but type the way they talk.

Are you guys expecting me to type like an English major all the time?

 

[Sukerkin]

I can't answer of Cory but I think he was making the same point as myself, just with a little more brevity.

He's still online so why not ask him? It's part of what the PM system can be used for after all - I've often used it to chat about something that came up in a thread but wasn't directly pertinent to it.

 

[tellner]

As the late RAH said, one of the signs of being a grownup is being an adult about your adultery.

 

[CoryKS]

Uh ... okay. So ... there are some folks here who type very correct English and some who spell well and know their grammar well but type the way they talk.

Are you guys expecting me to type like an English major all the time?

Sukerkin is correct. I wasn't correct your grammar, simply pointing out that life is a bit more complicated than it may first appear. It's okay, we've all been there.

 

[newGuy12]

Gee this is an awful lot of talk about a woman whose husband cheated on her with a whore. He did cheat on her with a whore, right? And some doctor says its the wife's fault?

I know i'm a kid and have a lot to learn but this seems to be pretty darn clear to me.

Hahaha! No, you have more sense than this radio personality! That's right! Ha! You just make sure that you get that forward roll down!

As far as this "cheating" business, that is a chance that everyone takes if they choose to get married, it is not an easy thing to do, to maintain a commitment like that! I cannot speak with personal experience, but have had many friends whose marriage has run afoul!

 

[shesulsa]

Gee this is an awful lot of talk about a woman whose husband cheated on her with a whore. He did cheat on her with a whore, right? And some doctor says its the wife's fault?

I know i'm a kid and have a lot to learn but this seems to be pretty darn clear to me.

artyon:
You're a pretty smart kid, that's why it's so clear.

 

[Bigshadow]

incompatibility is not necessarily the fault of one person or another, it's an indication of two people who cannot agree on how to come together - pun intended.

Incompatibility is indeed what it is. In reality it isn't a blaming issue, one doesn't do that to the other out of malice. People are what they are. People cannot change what they are at their core (or at least very easily). Sometimes it is better to cut your losses and go.

 

[shesulsa]

Further, sexuality develops and changes as we get older so a previously compatible couple can become incompatible later on. Not one person's fault, just the way that it is, generally.

 

[Bigshadow]

Further, sexuality develops and changes as we get older so a previously compatible couple can become incompatible later on. Not one person's fault, just the way that it is, generally.

Yes, but when it is that way from day one, it takes awhile for the other to realize they cannot change who they are. Again, not one person's fault.

 

[BrandiJo]

if you go into a relationship thinking that you will change the other person, you are setting your self up to fail. People rarely change, it does happen sometimes but to steak your marital happiness on it is nuts. Now if the people are married and happy and something changes down the road thats different. From my (limited) understanding there is almost always a reason for the change, if you can figure that out then you can have a better understanding of what to do. Like call the relationship off or seek counseling. Even if one person does a drastic change i still do not understand how that is giving the other person permission to get another person on the side. I could stop having sex with my husband tmrw and still be mad as all get out if i find out he is cheating on me, BECAUSE until a legal decree breaks the marriage decree we still vowed to be with only each other. Instead of getting a girlfriend, he can talk to me (ie blame me), he can offer me help (cus im screwed up and with holding sex), he can get really drunk and forget what sex is, he can go to counsling to find out what may be the deeper issue ( and blame me there) or he can file for divorce, but he cannot get a girl friend and say its my fault because i didn't do something right. Granted in America we really really like to play the blame game and not take responisbility for our own actions but when your pecker lands in someone who isnt your wife or girlfriend (willingly) i have a really really hard time understand how anyone forced you to do it.

 

[Sukerkin]

Granted in America we really really like to play the blame game and not take responisbility for our own actions but when your pecker lands in someone who isnt your wife or girlfriend (willingly) i have a really really hard time understand how anyone forced you to do it.

That quote is one of those statements that it's very difficult to come up with a counter-argument for. It expresses the outcome so simply, it's a bit like a perfect sphere, there's nothing to gain purchase on.

 

[newGuy12]

it's a bit like a perfect sphere, there's nothing to gain purchase on.

:ultracool