CMC style

[marlon]

Also, very importantly , l am attracted to his emphasis on fighting. Taiji as a practical martial art is not always taught.

Respectfully,
Marlon

 

[Xue Sheng]

Taiji as a practical martial art is not always taught.

Respectfully,
Marlon

This is true, but be careful; you can find CMC schools that do not teach the martial art as well.

However you are more likely to find an alleged Yang style school teaching Tai chi light than just about any other style, but then there are more of them out there.

If you find a true Chen or Yang school you WILL get martial arts but and school for school you are more likely to find martial arts at more Chen Schools than Yang. As for Wu and Hao styles I am not sure. Sun I am also not sure but I am guessing with Sun that there are so few schools of it likely it is still taught as a martial art. Zhaobao is even rarer and more likely to be taught as a real martial art. However I have seen 1 school that teaches Sun Light, Chen light and Zhaobao light as well (form ONLY).

But with any style of Tai Chi school you need to be careful if you are looking for one that teaches real Tai Chi martial arts.

However I do feel that if you really want CMC Tai Chi and you train with William CC Chen or one of his students you are on the right path.

Good luck
XS

 

[grappling_mandala]

or there is "The Essence and Applications of Taijiquan" by Yang Chengfu himself and published in 1934 it has been translated by Louis Swaim in 2005 and published by North Atlantic Books ISBN 1-55643-545-2

Interestingly enough this last book was probably "ghost written" by Cheng Man Ching and based on an earlier book byTung Ying Chieh (Taijiquan shiyongfa) written in 1931.

If you look closely at that book you will find that fair maiden works shuttles has at least one of it's negatives reversed, and for some reason the grasp sparrows tail sequence is lacking parts. It is curious that the later part of this work that was "edited" by CMC closely resembles "in format" the CMC 37 posture form. I agree that Essense and Applications was probably "ghost written".

I am still curious about why CMC didn't open his lead hip w/ single whip or shoulder stroke, etc. His hips are closed in these postures. I've experimented w/ both approaches and have chosen to follow Yang Cheng Fu's examples because it feels better to me to open the lead hip instead of close it.

 

[grappling_mandala]

Do you practice this style?

Marlon

Yes

 

[East Winds]

grappling madala,

Yes, intersting points you raise!! The single whip/open hips by Yang Cheng-fu, allows the back hand to be over the back leg and the front hand to be over the front leg. Very important for stablity and strength. Try it with the hips closed and get someone to push on your right (hook) hand then try it with the hip open and back hand over back leg. The difference will be apparent immediately. And of course one of the important points about Traditional Yang is that if the leading hand and leading leg are on the same side (as in Single Whip or Fan through Back etc.) the hips should be open. If the leading hand and leading legs are opposites (as in Brush and Push) the hips should be closed. I have no idea why CMC felt the need to change so many thing from what YCF taught. Thats a whole new thread

Very best wishes

 

[grappling_mandala]

one of the important points about Traditional Yang is that if the leading hand and leading leg are on the same side (as in Single Whip or Fan through Back etc.) the hips should be open. If the leading hand and leading legs are opposites (as in Brush and Push) the hips should be closed.

Excellent points. Still trying to find info on why CMC changed that aspect in his own interpretation of the art as well.

 

[wuchi]

Originally posted by grappling_mandala

I am still curious about why CMC didn't open his lead hip w/ single whip or shoulder stroke, etc. His hips are closed in these postures. I've experimented w/ both approaches and have chosen to follow Yang Cheng Fu's examples because it feels better to me to open the lead hip instead of close it.

I have three books "The Essence and Applications of Taijiquan" by Yang Chengfu, "Cheng Tzu's 13 Tai Chi Treatises on Tai Chi Chuan" by CMC, "Cheng's New Method of Tai Chi Self-Cultivation" by CMC in front of me.

Comparisons:
(1) Single Whip - in the "13 Treatises" the picture of CMC is almost a 100% match to that of YCF, in "Cheng's New Method..." the posture is higher. In both CMC's books the lead hip was in an open position in my opinion.

(2) Shoulder Stroke - there were no photos in YCF's book with this post. Again in this position the lead hip is in an open position in both CMC's books in my opinion.

Personally I have done them with open lead hip position as far as I can remember. One must admit in his latter book his posture is much higher. His circles are a lot smaller plus his robe; it becomes harder for one to see and at a higher level of tai chi one shifts the attention more toward the open and close of the energy and how it changes inside rather than rely purely on the physical posture alone.

 

[East Winds]

wuchi,

"at a higher level of tai chi one shifts the attention more toward the open and close of the energy and how it changes inside rather than rely purely on the physical posture alone."

Absolutely agree, however the external posture is merely a physical manifestation of what is happening internally.....or at least it SHOULD be.

It is interesting to comapre the postures of Chengfu and CMC and it is quite apparent that CMC changed the postures quite considerably. Certainly more so than Fu Zhong Wen, Chen Wei Ming and Dong Ying Chieh, all inner door students of Chengfu.

Very best wishes

 

[marlon]

found this

I find the first 2 very informativr and helpful...but my opinion is very uniformed. What do you see?

Respectfully,
Marlon

 

[marlon]

I have three books "The Essence and Applications of Taijiquan" by Yang Chengfu, "Cheng Tzu's 13 Tai Chi Treatises on Tai Chi Chuan" by CMC, "Cheng's New Method of Tai Chi Self-Cultivation" by CMC in front of me.

Comparisons:
(1) Single Whip - in the "13 Treatises" the picture of CMC is almost a 100% match to that of YCF, in "Cheng's New Method..." the posture is higher. In both CMC's books the lead hip was in an open position in my opinion.


From what i saw of the37 form it seems his posture is first a match of YCF's then it shifts. He he doing 2 different postures where in the others do only one?

Marlon