Chinese v. Japanese bowing

[Gyakuto]

Video, have none. I will see if I can find reference though I doubt that will exist. Like I said, made up. Just stuck around

Nothing on Youtube ?

And yes, I prefer it to be that we respect the opponent to say that they could be a potential threat. Way I was taught.

In old school swordsmanship if you’re in (reasonable) range of an attack, you simply don’t bow! Why would you in a combat situation?

 

[Bujingodai]

I haven't had anything on youtube, since the beginning of Youtube I don't think. Certainly nothing I'd keep up there. Nothing on bowing either.
I don't think myself as being that much a practitioner.

It's just the way I was taught. The way I have always done and the rationale. Yes like in Kenjutsu (I believe) you would not step over someones weapon for the fact you are basically saying this is how much I don't respect your ability or you as a threat.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Nothing on Youtube ?
We don’t bow, we salute. Are you asking for a video of salutations?

 

[Gyakuto]

Just something I can look at to get a better understanding.

 

[opr1945]

North China Bow v. South China Bow (early in video)

 

[opr1945]

Tae Kwon Do Bow

 

[opr1945]

Mistakes

 

[opr1945]

down v. up...

 

[opr1945]

more complex longer .......

Where I go we do not do this. do You?

 

[Gyakuto]

North China Bow v. South China Bow (early in video)

Didn’t really see it demonstrated…

 

[Gyakuto]

Tae Kwon Do Bow

Couldn’t see his foot position!

 

[Gyakuto]

down v. up...

Interesting that they are observing swordsmanship movements such as left knee goes down first and left hand goes forward before the right (so the right hand is free to take one’s sword). One peculiar thing she does (a common mistake) is moving her right foot in a little arc as she brings it forward and backward. It should just go straight forward and back when being tucked under the body.

 

[Gyakuto]

more complex longer .......

Where I go we do not do this. do You?

This is the fuller way of doing things. He is, however very rigid…stiff in his performance!

 

[Gyakuto]

One point that my teacher has made is that reiho is essentially just like shaking hands is in the West. When preparing to shake hands we wouldn’t stand to attention in front of our recipient and pause for a second or two whilst looking at them, laser-like, in the eyes, stiffly raising our right hands to a angle parallel to the ground, lever forward from the shoulder/elbow maintains the angle, grasp their hand for a second and shake up and down two and a half times, pause, disengage hands and snap it down to your thigh etc. Similarly, the procedures of Japanese reiho should be precise but carried out at quite a natural pace…hustling through it slightly and not pausing for dramatic effect and a gaze into the distance. There’s a fine line between looking hasty and looking natural which, ironically, needs to be practised!

 

[opr1945]

is all this bowing commom in all Aikido training facilities (Dojo's?) or only some? Is it common in other forms of Japanese Martial Arts also?

 

[O'Malley]

EDIT: We've had a few people on MT that have a distinct aversion to bowing or showing any kind of respect during what they consider transactional training - they pay, they get taught, end of formality. I get it, but as a US Marine veteran myself, it doesn't bother me to bow and render respect.

This makes no sense. In most contexts, being a paying customer does not exempt you from following the rules of the house, nor from showing respect and courtesy.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

This makes no sense. In most contexts, being a paying customer does not exempt you from following the rules of the house, nor from showing respect and courtesy.

I believe the rationale was that they were there to learn martial arts, not traditional customs. But I can't make their argument for them; I'm in agreement with you.

 

[Gyakuto]

I believe the rationale was that they were there to learn martial arts, not traditional customs. But I can't make their argument for them; I'm in agreement with you.

It’s a bit of a modern and shortsighted consumerist attitude toward ‘service providers’. “Just do the job I’ve paid you for and teach me how to kick butt!“ In adopting this attitude such a person is missing out on things far more profound than pulverised bottoms, in my opinion.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

It’s a bit of a modern and shortsighted consumerist attitude toward ‘service providers’. “Just do the job I’ve paid you for and teach me how to kick butt!“ In adopting this attitude such a person is missing out on things far more profound than pulverised bottoms, in my opinion.

I'm in violent agreement with you. But that's the difference between a tea ceremony and a cuppa.

 

[isshinryuronin]

When I started karate (Okinawan), we began and ended class in seiza kneeling position, a short meditation to clear our minds, then bow towards the shomen (which was just a picture of founder Shimabuku on the wall) to show respect to all those who came before, then a mutual bow to the instructor. A year or two later this was simply done from a standing position. No attention was paid to foot angles or other prescriptions. Karate bowing as a whole was rather basic. (An exception was lima lama style (Polyniesian), whose formal salutation was practically a kata in itself.)

On the other end of the spectrum was iaido with its more formal, lengthy and technical execution. To me this is fitting as it seems to reflect the seriousness and emphasis of that art. From a practical standpoint, one must be in a proper frame of mind before swinging a deadly weapon around in proximity to others in class. I don't know about other traditional weapon arts.

I suspect most other arts' bowing lay somewhere in between these two examples. The important thing in TMA is the recognition and showing of respect and humility to those with whom you train, acknowledgement of those from whom the art descended, and the ideals the art represents. As long as the bow (or other action) reflects these things in the mind of the one doing it, mission accomplished.