Ashamed of top two news stories for 10/18/05 11:00 PM News

[Flatlander]

hmm... I wonder if robbery with a toy gun counts as "armed" robbery. ???

In Canada it is. The standard is that the victim has reason to believe there is a weapon involved. If the weapon used turns out to be a toy, or an unloaded gun, or a rubber knife rather than a real one, this is of no consequence.

I believe there was a child shot in my city for brandishing a toy weapon in a dark alley. This was deemed to be a justified shoot, if memory serves me correctly....

 

[Tgace]

Thats generally the standard in most of the US as well. In my state there is a statute that raises the felony level if its discovered that the firearm was capable of firing a shot. I have also come across pellet guns that were indistinguishable from a real firearm until you actually got your hands on it.

 

[Flatlander]

Actually, after thinking about it the standard more likely requires that "a reasonable person" rather than "the victim" believes or would believe the weapon to be real or otherwise pose a danger.

 

[Thesemindz]

In Canada it is. The standard is that the victim has reason to believe there is a weapon involved. If the weapon used turns out to be a toy, or an unloaded gun, or a rubber knife rather than a real one, this is of no consequence.

I believe there was a child shot in my city for brandishing a toy weapon in a dark alley. This was deemed to be a justified shoot, if memory serves me correctly....

When I was in college they taught us that in order for it to be considered armed robbery the victim had to be informed and believe his assailant was armed. Toy gun, rubber knife, concealed finger, if the victim believed the criminal when he said he had a gun, then it was armed robbery. The victim couldn't just assume a weapon when one wasn't introduced to the scene, but if the criminal introduced one, whether physically or by implication or threat of force, and the victim believed the weapon was real, it was armed robbery.

The basic idea, as we were taught, was that the onus was on the law breaker not to break the law, and if he did, then he certaintly wasn't going to be given the benefit of the doubt.

In one case they taught us about, an elderly man suffered a heart attack when armed at gun point by a toy gun he thought was real, and the assailants were charged with his murder as a result of their armed robbery. The gun was fake, but his belief in it was decided to have caused his heart attack and death, and that made the criminals culpable.


-Rob

 

[arnisador]

My impression has been that toy guns often look so realistic these days that it's generally considered reasonable to treat them as such.

Are there known cases of criminals painting a red ring on real guns to make them seem like toys?

 

[ginshun]

She should be glad that her son is still alive.

 

[modarnis]

hmm... I wonder if robbery with a toy gun counts as "armed" robbery. ???

Many states, Connecticut included, treat facsimile firearms the same, since the victim, or the police may not be able to tell the difference easily when its pointed at them. Robbery, burglary, kidnapping here facsimile=real. Some laws, like assault with a firearm, require that the device is operable/fireable