Against striker, kicker, wrestler, knife, stick, chain, multiple opponents

[Juany118]

Oh you aren't trying to get them in a line and keep em there, people don't work that way, however in a real world environment you can often get them to be getting in each other's way as they maneuver around the rest of the stuff in the environment as well as each other. So you are trying to make them less effective not eliminate their threat all together. In a wide open space it will definitely be more problematic. However as odd as it sounds the more people there are the easier it is to get them getting in each other's way, especially in tight quarters, but of course you still have multiple attackers with "open shots" as well. The only time I have done more than 3-1 in training though wasn't "to win" it was basically a big time pressure test to help make sure you don't just "give up"

Let me add one additional thing, my school may have an advantage over others. For some training we go to the other side of the Complex where my Sifu has his consultant business and we'll bring down extra folding tables, chairs, sometimes even make cubicles with what we can (putting smaller folding mats on their sides and such)

 

[Istvan]

Oh you aren't trying to get them in a line and keep em there, people don't work that way, however in a real world environment you can often get them to be getting in each other's way as they maneuver around the rest of the stuff in the environment as well as each other. So you are trying to make them less effective not eliminate their threat all together. In a wide open space it will definitely be more problematic. However as odd as it sounds the more people there are the easier it is to get them getting in each other's way, especially in tight quarters, but of course you still have multiple attackers with "open shots" as well. The only time I have done more than 3-1 in training though wasn't "to win" it was basically a big time pressure test to help make sure you don't just "give up"

Ooh, yes testing out theories in a closed environment are the best.
Regardless we fail or not, we can have a pretty realistic view what we can and can`t do in a given situation. Specially good if someone make video as we can analyse back again and again our mistakes.

Can I ask Juanny what art are you practising? (or did when this test happened)?

 

[Juany118]

Ooh, yes testing out theories in a closed environment are the best.
Regardless we fail or not, we can have a pretty realistic view what we can and can`t do in a given situation. Specially good if someone make video as we can analyse back again and again our mistakes.

Can I ask Juanny what art are you practising? (or did when this test happened)?

Well I did it for the first time many moons ago in the Police Academy. We now do such testing, though usually only when we have a black sash or red sash (Guro) testing. Currently I go to a school that teaches Wing Chun and Inosanto Kali in parallel.

We also do one, in Kali while knife fighting that is total chaos. You will have 4 people out there, they start against one person but then you all randomly switch targets so you can have 3 on 1, 2 on 1 with the fourth attacking one of the "2". Now that's fun . This one we do more regularly to get people to have their head on a swivel as well as to move well. If you don't move your feet during that, you get skewered by someone.

 

[Istvan]

Well I did it for the first time many moons ago in the Police Academy. We now do such testing, though usually only when we have a black sash or red sash (Guro) testing. Currently I go to a school that teaches Wing Chun and Inosanto Kali in parallel.

We also do one, in Kali while knife fighting that is total chaos. You will have 4 people out there, they start against one person but then you all randomly switch targets so you can have 3 on 1, 2 on 1 with the fourth attacking one of the "2". Now that's fun . This one we do more regularly to get people to have their head on a swivel as well as to move well. If you don't move your feet during that, you get skewered by someone.

that`s for sure,
more free move with legs the more chance you have to attack, defende or escape

 

[Danny T]

Does this ever actually work?

I am trying to think if I have ever been able to out maneuver three guys into a line in a fight.

Just seems ambitious.

He said: "Try to maneuver so you don't have all three able to attack you at once, make them get in each other's way."

Training wise...I agree with Juany.

In reality if you have the space, time, and maneuverability to do such... you should be getting away.

 

[Headhunter]

Thing is though like has been said are the guys who are attacking kick boxers or wrestlers or grapplers if they're not then the exercise is kind of pointless. Plus no boxer is going to attack the same way same with kick boxers you say they're kickers but they know the exact same punches as boxing

 

[Touch Of Death]

Hi Guys,

I wish to examine and get your thoughts on certain topics 1-7.
In Our Systema we ask students to practise and show their work of the following: (as part of their exam)

1. work against one striker (e.g. boxer type)
2. work against one kicker (e.g. kick boxer, taekwondo guy)
3. work against wrestler (e.g. turkish wrestling, judo, BJJ, Sambo )
4. work against attacker with knife (thrusts and cuts)
5. work against attacker with stick (e.g. a longer stick like boom stick
6. work against attacker with chain (not against face in our practise)
7 work against multiple opponents ( start with 2 and pressure tests 1 to 3 person)

We all understand that no one will choose purely one of the 7 to attack with but lets assume that. We also know no 100% right or wrong answer as everything depends on the slit second judgement in the given situation. (and depending on other factors like, your weight, height, strength, speed, flexibility skills, mind set etc etc)
However never late to widen our understanding and put new `tools` into our toolbox.

Please give your examples to Do`s and Don`ts on each items with their NUMBERS if you can, it will be easier to separate who talk about what topics.
If the forum rules allows and you have a good supporting video example please share with your thoughts and explanation.


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teaching and exam methodology taken from Systema Talanov
www.rmasystema.co.uk

My answer to all these questions is, Boot To The Head!

 

[Touch Of Death]

My answer to all these questions is, Boot To The Head!

Especially practical, if you carry your work boots in a pillow case.

 

[drop bear]

JUANY118 SAID: ↑
Try to maneuver so you don't have all three able to attack you at once, make them get in each other's way.




I agree with Juany118 view. He said `try` to maneuver, defender should try their best but outcome hugely depend on the majority (attacker) if they organised and skilled. Chance are very slim if it`s not zero)

Yes it seems ambitious anything more than 1-1
In fact is that by principle 3-4 or 10 almost doesn`t matter at the end.
What i tried to understand here who see a fight with multiple opponent as a 1-1 fight multiple times (like Wing Tsun) and who see as 1-10 same time.

Lets assume our hero able to get stand on his feet all time in this fight.
If he at the middle of the attackers is a good option?
or it`s better, if he able to move and slip out from the middle and always on the move try the less amount of people to reach him in a given time?
Of course also assume he has endless space (like middle of the road) so he can move around without being pushed into corner.
Can he neutralise a bike, car, shopping trolley etc between him and attackers?
Can he find an object to attack back? Or its only make attackers more angry and they will do the same?

I did hold a toilet against 4 guys once. They were bashing some dude. So I threw him in the toilet and just held the doorway.