# confused about training



## 2looselatrek (Apr 6, 2003)

I am relatively new to martial arts and was a bit confused as to which path I should take. I have the option to train at a pekiti tirsia school or a JKD school. From what I gather, both have similar techniques and uses of weapons. I really enjoy knife fighting. What are the major differences between the two?


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## pesilat (Apr 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by 2looselatrek _
> *I am relatively new to martial arts and was a bit confused as to which path I should take. I have the option to train at a pekiti tirsia school or a JKD school. From what I gather, both have similar techniques and uses of weapons. I really enjoy knife fighting. What are the major differences between the two? *



I'd say go for the Pekiti Tirsia school.

The reason I say this stems from no bias toward either art. They're both good.

However, most JKD schools that teach weapons have only a surface depth of weapons knowledge (there are exceptions). Pekiti Tirsia is, flat out, a weapon based system. And it's one of the best knife systems I've seen.

From what you've said, the Pekiti Tirsia will suit you better.

However, what I'd recommend is to visit both schools. View (and/or participate) in a class or two. Talk to the instructors. Then go with the instructor/school/class that you like better. That you really enjoy.

My logic in saying this:

It doesn't matter much if the material you're getting is awesome or not. If you don't enjoy the people and the atmosphere, you won't likely stick around anyway.

But, if you check them both out and like both of them, then go with the Pekiti Tirsia because (at least IMO), it'll be more in line with what you say you're looking for.

Mike


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## 2looselatrek (Apr 6, 2003)

Thanks for the quick reply Mike! 
Just one more question, if pekiti tirsia is heavily weapons based, how effective would a practioner be without any weapons?


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## Master of Blades (Apr 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by 2looselatrek _
> *Thanks for the quick reply Mike!
> Just one more question, if pekiti tirsia is heavily weapons based, how effective would a practioner be without any weapons? *




Most of them time with most FMA anything you do with a knife can be done empty handed with a slight change in technique :asian:


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## pesilat (Apr 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by 2looselatrek _
> *Thanks for the quick reply Mike!
> Just one more question, if pekiti tirsia is heavily weapons based, how effective would a practioner be without any weapons? *



LOL. Yeah, it's a common misconception about the Filipino arts that since they are "weapon" systems that they don't have any empty hands.

The reality of it, though, is that the empty hands are built on the weapon work and they are incredible. I would match the empty hands of the Filipino arts against any other empty hand system out there.

Mike


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## Rich Parsons (Apr 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by pesilat _
> *LOL. Yeah, it's a common misconception about the Filipino arts that since they are "weapon" systems that they don't have any empty hands.
> 
> The reality of it, though, is that the empty hands are built on the weapon work and they are incredible. I would match the empty hands of the Filipino arts against any other empty hand system out there.
> ...



Agreed
:asian:


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## arnisador (Apr 6, 2003)

Both are excellent systems. If the knife truly interests you, pekiti tersia is truly the way to go--you'd have trouble picking an art more closely associated with the knife than it and Sayoc Kali. Although the FMA focus on weapons, they--like JKD--believe it builds certain attributes and movements that are useful for empty-hand self-defense. Yes, you'll learn how to defend yourself with or without weapons either way.

If you're looking for practical self-defense that includes the knife, either system will give you what you want. As suggested, _check out both instructors and schools_! There are good and bad instructors in every system, and even if both are good, one might simply "feel" better to you than another.

There's a parallel discussion of this in the JKD forum:
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7220


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## lhommedieu (Apr 6, 2003)

Funny that this would come up.  I trained with a good JKD instructor for a couple of years as a beginning marial arts student.  What I was really interested in though, was the Filipino martial arts part of JKD, so I switched to Pekiti Tirsia and trained in that art for a couple of years.  Later I learned another Filipino martial art, which I continue to train and teach.  I still keep my hand in Pekiti Tirsia, however, as it is an excellent system.

If you are interested in Filipino martial arts,  Pekiti Tirsia will provide more in-depth coverage than what is typically taught in a JKD school to beginners.  Of course, this also depends on the school and the instructor.  It has been my experience that JKD teachers with a lot of experience in Filipino martial arts will generally train in more than one system of FMA.

With respect to the empty-hands curriculum of Pekiti Tirsia, it is extensive and sophisticated.  As you can see from the following description, (taken from Billy McGrath's Pekiti Tirsia website at http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/docs/overview.html), the empty hand techniques are based primarily on weapons techniques.

The general categories are: 


1. Entry techniques and nerve hits - attacks that bridge the gap, coming mainly from knife-to-knife and single stick techniques. 

2. Parry drills - coming from knife and stick drills. 

3. Traps - coming from sword and dagger techniques. 

4. Fist, foot, and joint breaking - coming from knife and single stick. 

5. Locks, throws, takedowns - mainly coming from hand vs. knife. 

6. Leg work - [kicks, stomps, leg traps, and "foot clearing" - parrying kicks with the lower leg ] - leg attacks and counters to kicks coming from knife vs. emptyhand counters and the older "silat" techniques of the Majapahit Empire period. 

7. Ground work- wrestling and strangulation from hand vs. knife. 

Best,

Steve Lamade


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## 2looselatrek (Apr 6, 2003)

Sweet!
Thanks for all the great advice and info guys!


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