# awareness training. how do you know it works?



## drop bear (Mar 31, 2014)

You don't know what you don't know. So if you are doing awareness training but are not ever being ambushed. How do you know your awareness is providing any actual results?

Actually let's add de escalation into that as well. If nobody really wants to fight you how do you know that works?


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## MJS (Mar 31, 2014)

drop bear said:


> You don't know what you don't know. So if you are doing awareness training but are not ever being ambushed. How do you know your awareness is providing any actual results?
> 
> Actually let's add de escalation into that as well. If nobody really wants to fight you how do you know that works?



Nice topic!   Well, let's start with the first question.  IMO, I would say that the simple fact that I haven't been ambushed is proof itself, that whatever I'm doing, is working.  The bad guys want an easy target.  They're less likely to attack/ambush someone who is aware vs. someone who is pre-occupied with other things.  Don't mistake that for being paranoid.  Knowing what's going on around you, as well as being confident with your body language, is a pretty good deterrent.

As for the next part...I've talked my way out of more situations than I've been in physically.  Apparently I'm doing something right.   Having some good verbal skills, as well as being confident (not to be confused with being cocky) certainly goes a long way, IMHO.  

Do these things always work?  No, of course not.


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## drop bear (Mar 31, 2014)

MJS said:


> Nice topic!   Well, let's start with the first question.  IMO, I would say that the simple fact that I haven't been ambushed is proof itself, that whatever I'm doing, is working.  The bad guys want an easy target.  They're less likely to attack/ambush someone who is aware vs. someone who is pre-occupied with other things.  Don't mistake that for being paranoid.  Knowing what's going on around you, as well as being confident with your body language, is a pretty good deterrent.
> 
> As for the next part...I've talked my way out of more situations than I've been in physically.  Apparently I'm doing something right.   Having some good verbal skills, as well as being confident (not to be confused with being cocky) certainly goes a long way, IMHO.
> 
> Do these things always work?  No, of course not.




It is possible nobody has tried to ambush you though. I think there is a bit of that going on in life anyway.


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## drop bear (Mar 31, 2014)

Also where does this training originate from?


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## jezr74 (Mar 31, 2014)

What sort of things do you learn in awareness training. Can only think of scene from MIB.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## MJS (Mar 31, 2014)

drop bear said:


> It is possible nobody has tried to ambush you though. I think there is a bit of that going on in life anyway.



Yes, that is possible.  



drop bear said:


> Also where does this training originate from?



Sadly, things like this, among others, are often neglected in many dojos around.  I got the majority of this from people who worked in fields in which being aware was part of the job.  I also worked for the DOC here in Ct. for a short time.  If you're not aware in a setting like that, well....


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## MJS (Mar 31, 2014)

jezr74 said:


> What sort of things do you learn in awareness training. Can only think of scene from MIB.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



There are no secrets.  It's all common sense.  Learning to recognize potential threats, being aware of your surroundings, ie: you pull into a parking lot/garage, scan the area as you're driving in, and keep doing it while you're walking to your destination.  Again, this isn't to be confused with being paranoid.


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## Transk53 (Mar 31, 2014)

MJS said:


> There are no secrets.  It's all common sense.  Learning to recognize potential threats, being aware of your surroundings, ie: you pull into a parking lot/garage, scan the area as you're driving in, and keep doing it while you're walking to your destination.  Again, this isn't to be confused with being paranoid.



I believe also that situational awareness is purely intrinsic. You cannot train it, just hone what is there. Yes also common sense is a big part. You would have to be a little silly not to walk down a dark alley and find, or feel, that something is not amiss. Agree, Paranoia no, alertness yes.


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## tshadowchaser (Mar 31, 2014)

I know it works because students old and new have come back to me and told me of situations that they avoided because of what they had been taught. 
 One that always comes to mind  was a law enforcement officer who approached a person on the ground  saw something he had been taught to look out for backed off till others arrived then found out the person had a gun concealed and in his hand under his body.
another  a woman I had instructed saw something in a mall parking lot that did not look correct. She went back in and talked to the mall security , they investigated only to find someone had been mugged/robbed at the location she told them about


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## pgsmith (Mar 31, 2014)

I feel that any awareness training must include in-depth study of the work of Jacques Clouseau. Here's an excellent example ... Ambush Training


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## jezr74 (Mar 31, 2014)

Are you talking about instructing your students to follow maybe a process in situations? 

Trying to understand the training side, as apposed to someone being naive and not very "street smart" for lack of better words. Or is that exactly what you mean by training. Enforcing in your classes the need to check your surroundings before making a decision to say stop for the person lying on the side of the road, with a potential ambush from the men in the bushes?


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## drop bear (Apr 1, 2014)

MJS said:


> Yes, that is possible.
> 
> 
> 
> Sadly, things like this, among others, are often neglected in many dojos around.  I got the majority of this from people who worked in fields in which being aware was part of the job.  I also worked for the DOC here in Ct. for a short time.  If you're not aware in a setting like that, well....




See I would have suggested that as a bit better. As I am not sure where your local martial arts instructor would get the knowledge from.


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## drop bear (Apr 1, 2014)

Transk53 said:


> I believe also that situational awareness is purely intrinsic. You cannot train it, just hone what is there. Yes also common sense is a big part. You would have to be a little silly not to walk down a dark alley and find, or feel, that something is not amiss. Agree, Paranoia no, alertness yes.




Disagree with that. One of my many and varied jobs is to find people smoking where they shouldn't. I am vary aware of tell tales.
But that took a lot of having to look for those tell tales.

Same with a threat. 

But as far as a system of teaching it would equal difficult. I could teach what works for me but it would still just be a theory until the guy I taught had been ambushed a few times.


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## drop bear (Apr 1, 2014)

jezr74 said:


> Are you talking about instructing your students to follow maybe a process in situations?
> 
> Trying to understand the training side, as apposed to someone being naive and not very "street smart" for lack of better words. Or is that exactly what you mean by training. Enforcing in your classes the need to check your surroundings before making a decision to say stop for the person lying on the side of the road, with a potential ambush from the men in the bushes?




Yeah pretty much. People mentioned awareness and de escalation as important self defence. And I was wondering how you devise a proven system.


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## RTKDCMB (Apr 1, 2014)

drop bear said:


> And I was wondering how you devise a proven system.



You can't actually devise a proven system because you can only prove a system after it has been devised.


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## Transk53 (Apr 1, 2014)

drop bear said:


> Disagree with that. One of my many and varied jobs is to find people smoking where they shouldn't. I am vary aware of tell tales.
> But that took a lot of having to look for those tell tales.
> 
> Same with a threat.
> ...



Oh, I must have misinterpreted what you meant. I was looking at it from a different perspective.


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## MJS (Apr 1, 2014)

Transk53 said:


> I believe also that situational awareness is purely intrinsic. You cannot train it, just hone what is there. Yes also common sense is a big part. You would have to be a little silly not to walk down a dark alley and find, or feel, that something is not amiss. Agree, Paranoia no, alertness yes.



Agreed!  Sometimes that little 'voice' in your head, is worth listening to.


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## MJS (Apr 1, 2014)

tshadowchaser said:


> I know it works because students old and new have come back to me and told me of situations that they avoided because of what they had been taught.
> One that always comes to mind  was a law enforcement officer who approached a person on the ground  saw something he had been taught to look out for backed off till others arrived then found out the person had a gun concealed and in his hand under his body.
> another  a woman I had instructed saw something in a mall parking lot that did not look correct. She went back in and talked to the mall security , they investigated only to find someone had been mugged/robbed at the location she told them about



Success stories are always good to hear!   Knowing what to look for, what to/not to do, etc, are important.  It's really amazing how many people I see, when I'm out, that are totally clueless.


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## MJS (Apr 1, 2014)

jezr74 said:


> Are you talking about instructing your students to follow maybe a process in situations?
> 
> Trying to understand the training side, as apposed to someone being naive and not very "street smart" for lack of better words. Or is that exactly what you mean by training. Enforcing in your classes the need to check your surroundings before making a decision to say stop for the person lying on the side of the road, with a potential ambush from the men in the bushes?



Well, this is where some good scenario training comes into play.  Of course, as it's been said in other threads, it's key to ensure that this training is done correctly, otherwise, the drill is pointless.  I mentioned common sense in my earlier post. Sadly, that's lacking in some people, and it's obvious, just by their actions.  Of course, knowing what to look for, how to carry yourself, etc, are things that can be taught/drilled with people.  

None of this is to say that by doing this or that, that we won't be attacked.  I'm simply saying, that by taking certain steps, we can make ourselves less of a target.  Think about it...an unlocked car door, an unlocked house door, a person who's not paying attention...all very easy targets.  I'm not saying that by locking your front door, that it couldn't be kicked in...of course it could, but that's more work, more noise, etc.  Someone who isn't distracted by their cell phone conversation, and is aware, walking with a confident demeanor, will probably be less of a target.


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## MJS (Apr 1, 2014)

drop bear said:


> See I would have suggested that as a bit better. As I am not sure where your local martial arts instructor would get the knowledge from.



Well, that's the problem...many don't take the time to drill certain things.  This could range from them not wanting to, not feeling it's important, or just not knowing what to do. But like anything, sources to learn from, are out there.


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## drop bear (Apr 1, 2014)

RTKDCMB said:


> You can't actually devise a proven system because you can only prove a system after it has been devised.




Chicken and the egg.

You devise a system on proof. Then prove the system. Then use that proof to devise that system again.


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## drop bear (Apr 1, 2014)

MJS said:


> Well, that's the problem...many don't take the time to drill certain things.  This could range from them not wanting to, not feeling it's important, or just not knowing what to do. But like anything, sources to learn from, are out there.




Not all of them legitimate. Where did the instructor get his drills from?

You can drill yellow bamboo and make it work.


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## RTKDCMB (Apr 2, 2014)

MJS said:


> Agreed!  Sometimes that little 'voice' in your head, is worth listening to.



That depends on what it is saying.


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## drop bear (Apr 2, 2014)

RTKDCMB said:


> That depends on what it is saying.



I would suggest you average scam pretty much disproves the voice in your head theory.

Trying to find some videos of scammers. I know there were some guys re creating them.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=14ixs2WkR9g


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## K-man (Apr 3, 2014)

drop bear said:


> You can drill yellow bamboo and make it work.


A hundred bucks says you can't.


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## drop bear (Apr 3, 2014)

K-man said:


> A hundred bucks says you can't.




As a drill.

Not working in real life.


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## MJS (Apr 3, 2014)

drop bear said:


> Not all of them legitimate. Where did the instructor get his drills from?
> 
> You can drill yellow bamboo and make it work.



That is true.  As I said, there are many sources to gain this info from.


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## MJS (Apr 3, 2014)

RTKDCMB said:


> That depends on what it is saying.



LOL, that is true.  All the more reason to exercise good common sense, in the event the little voice isn't saying the smartest thing.


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## RTKDCMB (Apr 4, 2014)

MJS said:


> LOL, that is true.  All the more reason to exercise good common sense, in the event the little voice isn't saying the smartest thing.



The trick is getting all the other voices in my head to shut up.


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