# New guy looking for advice from those 30 and over



## hemi (May 28, 2005)

Well I may be asking too much of myself, or maybe I am just crazy. I am 32 about six foot tall and around 170lbs. In my younger years 16-19 I took some TKD classes. A lot of the time I would forgo the normal class and show up for sparring. The instructor required sparring when he was testing the students for advancement and I fought just about everyone that was testing. 



I was never great but I had good form and my kicks were fast and accurate. I was at an acceptable level to me. Now at 32, I just started going to an American kenpo school. I will skip the why I picked kenpo and try and stay more on topic with my question. But I do want to add that after a month, I love this style and hope to stay with it 100%. 



In class when we practice our kicks I think mine are about as good as anyone else in the class. I am in phase one of the training so the highest belts in the class are advanced orange. But I seem to compare myself to how I was back at age 16-19. My kicks had a lot more snap and the form was to me much cleaner.

I hate that I can kick out fine but on bringing my leg back and getting into a neutral bow I am slow and sloppy. 



Sometimes I feel like maybe I missed the boat starting over at 32. When I do something like delayed sword, or captured twigs I can do the moves but I am sloppy and unrefined looking. Then when I watch the instructor do the same moves it looks smooth as glass. I know that with 18 years teaching and no telling how many years training to reach the level of 5th Dan some of that can be expected. And maybe I am too hard on myself but am I crazy to think I will ever get back to at least the level I was at ages 16-19?



Have or do any of you that are my age or older feel this way? Did I wait to long to get back into martial arts? I want to reach the level of black belt, but only if I can reach the level of perfection that I associate with that level of rank. Case and point, I dont want to wear the belt if I look like a joke on the mat. 



Any idea how I can work to improve my speed, form, and accuracy? I do have a wave master to work with. I stretch everyday for at least 20 min. 



Anyway thanks to all who read and respond to this. I may be just over thinking my situation and putting to much into improving to quickly. Any advise from those that are going or have gone through this would be very appreciated and respected. 



Phil


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## thesensei (May 28, 2005)

Congratulations on getting back into it - and for picking a great style as well!  I have not yet reached the age of 32, but I have worked with several people in that bracket.  My advice is - just practice!  You sound as though you're in pretty good shape, so it probably won't take as long for you as it does for others.  Concentrate on doing it right.  Don't worry about speed right now - focus on form and accuracy.  Do each technique many times slowly.  As you perfect the basics and the movement, the speed will follow.  One thing that I have used with much success is performing the techniques with tension.  Tense all the muscles in your body while you do it slowly.  This helps your muscle memory.  Keep at it, and good luck!

Salute,
JB


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## Ceicei (May 28, 2005)

Well, you're in good company. I started in '85 and then had an 8 year break. I returned back in 2003.  I am now 38.

I remember my movements were better when I was younger.  I was frustrated that I didn't move the way I "should". My instructor reminded me that with the training lag, it takes time for the body physically to catch up with the mind mentally, especially with certain motions like kicks and punches. When I become more fit and proficient, things will get better.  He is right. 

Just keep on practicing; you will eventually and surely become more smooth and adept.

- Ceicei


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## BuckO (May 28, 2005)

I am 37 and have been doing kenpo for 12 years with time away for personal / family issues about 7-8 actual training years. I have trained with Tracys as well as Epak. I have studied under 2nd gen kenpoists. I have work with martial artists from different styles, boxers, kick boxers. I also study under a special forces vietnam combat vet.

 A perfect high kick or whatever is a different kind of traing then what most kenpo schools/ Instructers teach. It is helpful to be able to kick well in kenpo but kenpo is supposed to be about self defense techniques. It takes a long time to perfect those techniques I have not done it yet. I Am as strong and fast as i was at 25 ( i may look a bit fatter) I have to work harder at it now, but this is not a ******** movie where flying around, looking good and dramatic techniques are the rule. I am Real.
 Welcome back, Dont leave again

 Love BuckO
  TIMING IS EVERYTHING


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## arnisador (May 28, 2005)

Sounds like a great time for this advice: "Go slower to go faster." Practice slowly to improve your form and build muscle memory!


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## Gemini (May 28, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> I may be just over thinking my situation and putting to much into improving to quickly.


  Guess what, dude. You're not that old. 

 Yes, you're overthinking it. You need to relax. Getting over anxious may only promote the possibility of injuring yourself unnecessarily. And don't compare yourself with the teenage version of yourself. You're not him. Your actually better. Give yourself the time to prove it.

  Best of luck in your training!

   Regards,


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## hammer (May 29, 2005)

2004 hemi,

I commend you, on your decision to commence your study of Kenpo, If I can share with you, my thoughts, 

The past is the past, It may seem frustrating that while once a strong, flexible, talented youth, we where able to do many things that we are unable to do now. Sad but true, Yet the mistake is living in the past and making comparisons, It is a new beginning.

As with all learning activities, acquiring skill is a process of time and the effort that is applied to the time spent, as you are aware, there is only one Jackie Chan, one Jet li. "As to there is only one of you unique"

Im sure that if you are present focused, patient and committed you will be able to achieve your goals, and more than likely exceed them,


Best of luck!


Cheers


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## MJS (May 29, 2005)

2004hemi
[font=Arial said:
			
		

> I was never great but I had good form and my kicks were fast and accurate. I was at an acceptable level to me. Now at 32, I just started going to an American kenpo school. I will skip the why I picked kenpo and try and stay more on topic with my question. But I do want to add that after a month, I love this style and hope to stay with it 100%. [/font]



Congrats. on finding a new style!!  



> In class when we practice our kicks I think mine are about as good as anyone else in the class. I am in phase one of the training so the highest belts in the class are advanced orange. But I seem to compare myself to how I was back at age 16-19. My kicks had a lot more snap and the form was to me much cleaner.
> 
> I hate that I can kick out fine but on bringing my leg back and getting into a neutral bow I am slow and sloppy.



Its good to have goals that you want to set your standards by.  As we age, we're probably going to slightly slower than we used to.  Arnisador made a very good point...go slower to get faster!!  Take your time, get the proper form and you'll see improvements.  It won't happen overnight, but keep up the hard work.



> Sometimes I feel like maybe I missed the boat starting over at 32. When I do something like delayed sword, or captured twigs I can do the moves but I am sloppy and unrefined looking. Then when I watch the instructor do the same moves it looks smooth as glass. I know that with 18 years teaching and no telling how many years training to reach the level of 5th Dan some of that can be expected. And maybe I am too hard on myself but am I crazy to think I will ever get back to at least the level I was at ages 16-19?



You're never too old to start.  As for the moves, kicks, etc....keep in mind that while many arts have the same kicks and punches, the way they're applied are probably going to be different.  Again, take your time and work on form.



> Have or do any of you that are my age or older feel this way? Did I wait to long to get back into martial arts? I want to reach the level of black belt, but only if I can reach the level of perfection that I associate with that level of rank. Case and point, I dont want to wear the belt if I look like a joke on the mat.



As I said before, its good to have goal and even to have a rolemodel in the class, but don't let that goal overwhelm your training.  We are all unique in our own special way, so while we may see someone that we want to be exactly like, the fact remains that we may never be like that person due to a size difference, different build, etc.  Keep training hard, get used to the basics, take it slow and before you know it, it'll be second nature.



> Any idea how I can work to improve my speed, form, and accuracy? I do have a wave master to work with. I stretch everyday for at least 20 min.



Practice, practice, and more practice!!!  



> Anyway thanks to all who read and respond to this. I may be just over thinking my situation and putting to much into improving to quickly. Any advise from those that are going or have gone through this would be very appreciated and respected.
> 
> 
> 
> Phil



Good luck on your new journey!  

Mike


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## Brother John (May 29, 2005)

Work daily.
Pay attention to detail, especially with the very basics.
Be patient and keep in mind that you are in this for the long haul. 
Keep your goal of Black Belt and beyond, but do the best to be your best at each and every stage....
ENJOY the process.

Your Brother
John


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## 47MartialMan (May 29, 2005)

Hey-congrats on your returned martial art journey. Youre in a good style and stick with it.


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## shesulsa (May 29, 2005)

I started up again at 30something.  Practice a lot, and you need to know it's going to take years to get some speed back up.  But it's something you'll have to train on incessantly.  You can do it!


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## hemi (May 29, 2005)

I wanted to say thank you to everyone that took the time to respond. I also wanted to say thank yall for the sound advice and words of encouragement getting back into martial arts and in particular Kenpo. 



I can see that I will need to be patient with myself, not to the point that I am slacking off in my training. But I need to be willing to accept that it will take time for me to reach the level I once was. 



As far as kenpo goes I can see how I may become, if not already a pest to my instructor. He teaches things relevant to my level of experience in training. But I have a tendency to want to learn more and more.  From what I can tell so far (only a month into my training) this style has a lot of flexibility in its application as I get more advanced in training. I can not wait to see what I will be learning at the advanced levels of training after 1st Dan.


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## 47MartialMan (May 29, 2005)

2004 Hemi....I guess you are a Moparian?


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## Gemini (May 29, 2005)

47MartialMan said:
			
		

> 2004 Hemi....I guess you are a Moparian?


  I assumed so also, but being a Stang guy, I figured I give him the benefit of the doubt anyway.


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## hemi (May 29, 2005)

Yes I pretty much love all things MO/PAR from the old 68-69 GTX/ Road Runner, Charger to my 2004 Hemi Ram 1500. (Just to be clear I dont have a 68-69 GTX, Road runner or charger) I would have to thing long and hard about giving my first born in trade for one


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## 47MartialMan (May 29, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Yes I pretty much love all things MO/PAR from the old 68-69 GTX/ Road Runner, Charger to my 2004 Hemi Ram 1500. (Just to be clear I dont have a 68-69 GTX, Road runner or charger) I would have to thing long and hard about giving my first born in trade for one


Well I am a die-hard Moparian.

I started as a Chevelle/Camaro man (Hand-me downs from my older brother.)

One of my uncles was crew mechanic when dragracing was extremely popular...the old "Big Daddy Days"

Needless to say he was a MoparMan. Thus he turned me on to them.

My first Mopar was a Challenger, but it got stolen.

My second was a '72 Charger, that my girlfriend (now wife) found in a newspaper.

I am currenty restoring a 70 Charger 500...all original with original rare documents (thus I am also on a Charger forum and other such)

And yes Gemni, I have a "stang"-'66 also being restored..but will be sold to finish financing the Charger resto.


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## MA-Caver (May 29, 2005)

The others gave good advice. At 43 I will only say this. Quit worrying about what you COULD do then and worry about what you CAN do now. The difference of 15+ years makes a big difference of course but nothing that can't be changed... except what you're doing NOW.
Practice hard but don't kill yourself... you'll get back into form soon enough.  :asian:


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## Gemini (May 29, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> I would have to thing long and hard about giving my first born in trade for one


 A good friend of mine in sitting with a '69 GTX stripped down in his garage. He has 2 HEMI blocks for it. I keep asking him to get it on the road, but he just won't. I've told him I'll buy it from him but he won't give me a price. errrrrr.

 Actually, I love all the old muscle. Classics are classics, eh? Challenger was always my favorite. Well, next to a '69 BOSS 429 Mach 1 anyway.


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## 47MartialMan (May 29, 2005)

Gemini said:
			
		

> A good friend of mine in sitting with a '69 GTX stripped down in his garage. He has 2 HEMI blocks for it. I keep asking him to get it on the road, but he just won't. I've told him I'll buy it from him but he won't give me a price. errrrrr.
> 
> Actually, I love all the old muscle. Classics are classics, eh? Challenger was always my favorite. Well, next to a '69 BOSS 429 Mach 1 anyway.


Because people rather have things rot than to see someone else accomplish something that they should have.

Which, in a indirect way, brings us to martial art schools that have instructors self-appoint ranks to acomplish recognition over the other competition. Thus having students resign.

And these resigned students, return decades later, concerned if their age or physique can handle martial arts over again,


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## BuckO (May 31, 2005)

I sounded real cocky with that last post.  I should have said at the end I try to keep it real. 

:idunno: :mp5:


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## 47MartialMan (May 31, 2005)

Well as far as age goes, in the 30's one tends to practice more efficiently.


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## dianhsuhe (May 31, 2005)

Congrats on coming back to the arts... It sounds like you have quite a thirst for knowledge, which is good just don't force it. The journey of mastering a martial art is about YOU, try to avoid comparing yourself to others in class. (It will be hard I know) There will always be folks better of and worse off than you in the dojo- just give 100% on every move of every technique.

When I started the martial arts there were a couple guys who started at about the same time, I was always comparing their movements and progress to mine instead of keeping both eyes on my goals, I am sure it retarded my progress because I became competitive with them. Coincidentally the guy with the most potential fizzled out at black belt and me and the other guy are still plodding along...

I too had a lay-off of about 3 years and I have been back for about a month and a half, I feel sluggish, slow, and out of shape but I just focus on each new class and each new technique- My fellow instructors run circles around me but I am determined to be better than ever and I am pushing 35

Best of luck and keep us posted!
james


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## BuckO (Jun 1, 2005)

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5:


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## 47MartialMan (Jun 1, 2005)

dianhsuhe said:
			
		

> 1.)The journey of mastering a martial art is about YOU, try to avoid comparing yourself to others in class. (It will be hard I know) There will always be folks better of and worse off than you in the dojo- just give 100% on every move of every technique.
> 
> 2.) When I started the martial arts there were a couple guys who started at about the same time, I was always comparing their movements and progress to mine instead of keeping both eyes on my goals, I am sure it retarded my progress because I became competitive with them. Coincidentally the guy with the most potential fizzled out at black belt and me and the other guy are still plodding along...
> 
> ...


1.) My journey nevered ceased, after nearly 40 years, I am still not a master.

2.) Strange how that works. So the goal for some is the "Almighty Black Belt"

3.) Been there-a long break (I think there is another thread on this). 35!-a young buck. Let them run circles, they will tire quicker.


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## kenpo tiger (Jun 3, 2005)

You're still a kid. I'm into year 5 of kenpo, and I'm 52. (I started martial arts at age 44 -- did tkd for two years in my late 40s.)

About kicks in tkd vs. kenpo kicks.  If you haven't already realized it, kicks are very much secondary in kenpo.  As with most of what we kenpoists do, they are useful only if the proper target presents itself, and are kept low, usually to the legs or body (head only if the guy's going down or is down already.)  TKD is a sport art and, as such, has flashier and higher kicks which get you points in tournament sparring and competition, but are pretty vulnerable manoeuvers otherwise -- especially if you're fighting one of us.:ultracool 

BuckO (one of my kenpo brothers) happens to throw a mean kick, despite his older and fatter comment about himself (he actually looks pretty good for being all of 37.  Ancient, dude.) and can still reach someone's head on a good day with that side kick of his.

The kenpo seniors will tell you that you adapt your training as your body ages.

Don't sweat how you look on the mat.  Can you get the techs off efficiently?  That's what really matters.

As to having black belt as your goal:  it's nice to want the brass ring, but remember to 'enjoy the ride.'  KT:asian:


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## Gary Crawford (Jun 3, 2005)

2004hemi, I am only speculating,but I find most adults who start training after age 25 or so almost always have the same problems. Most of them try so hard that they are too tense for the speed to work and do not breath well when exicuting strikes. Just in case this is your problem,work on relaxing more on the initiation of your strikes/kicks and you may discover that you are faster than you think.


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## Pale Rider (Jun 3, 2005)

As most of the people here had already stated... you are not that "old".  I turn 37 in a few days and have been in the martial arts now since 1987.  I got my Chodan in 1991, and then because of instructor difficulties - I had to find another instructor which I did after moving to Michigan and finally got my Eedan in 2003.  So I know about how hard it is starting over.

The biggest thing that I have found being in my latter 30's is that it takes twice as much practice just to be half as good as you could have been (or were) when you were younger...

Just be persistant, and practice... you will do fine.


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## bluenosekenpo (Jun 5, 2005)

hi there, started kenpo, now in jkd/jiujitsu/fma all after 40! earned me an inguinal hernia, broken fingers and toes, damaged cartilage, etc.. lesson learned? train within your physical capabilities(for me that means no high kicks to the head,giving or receiving).

previous posters have provided good info, here are things that work for me(again know your limitations and capabilities).

break down the kick or strike into parts. for example, the snap kick. practice movement of chambering the leg and focus on doing it as fast as possible(don't kick,just chamber), then extending the leg into the snap(don't return it to the ground!snap-rechamber-snap-rechamber),finally return your fully extended kick to the ground as fast as possible(i like to stomp back into position,but be careful as this can hurt).

now put the 3 movements together and practice in front of a mirror and focus on form and body mechanics, don't telegraph your strike. this has helped me build speed and power. hope this helps.


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## hemi (Jun 5, 2005)

First I wanted to say thanks to everyone for the awesome advice and encouragement. I can see there are many very knowledgeable people here at Martial talk. After reading the suggestions and experiences of others here and talking to my instructor I have started to see myself in a somewhat different light. I can see it will not be easy to get to the level I hope to but then again anything worth having/doing never is. 



Another thing I wanted to ask, I hope this is not wrong to ask this under this thread but I see a lot very experienced ( time and rank in a style) people left suggestions so I wanted to ask if this is normal or something that you grow out of as you progress in a style.



I was watching a sparring class at my school, keep in mind its an American Kenpo school and being such they tend not to do high kicks to the head. But I noticed when most of the students were sparring they would do just that, mostly high kicks. Also everyone that was sparring was orange or advanced orange belts thats all that showed up. Is this something that you see a lot? It seems to me like they forget their training and go for broke when sparring. I am just a white belt but I could see from the side line the kicks were ineffective and left them open during and after the kick. Just in case your wondering why I was not out there fighting. I was a little short till payday I plan to order my pads this week it was killing me to just watch I wanted out there so bad.


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## searcher (Jun 5, 2005)

I am 31 right now and I am kicking with cleaner technique right now than when I was in my teens.   I think that you can easily get the speed and technique back with a lot of practise.   If you want an example of an older martial artist that can kick very fast look at Hee Il Cho.   He is in his 60's and can still kick very fast.   Don't think about it very much and you will be fine.


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## lulflo (Jun 5, 2005)

"As far as kenpo goes I can see how I may become, if not already a pest to my instructor. He teaches things relevant to my level of experience in training. But I have a tendency to want to learn more and more..."



My teacher asks me point blank, "Have you mastered the techniques you already have"? That usually gets me thinking a little harder about what I am doing with what I learn. 

I feel like I already have more information from five years of training than I can ever master in my lifetime. Point here is to relax and work on what you have as often as you can and when more is given to you, it is because you are ready for more, believe me, I am an advocate of the theory 'don't know until you ask', but I also know that my teacher appreciates it even more when I don't ask, and seems to give me more because of it. 

By the way, only 29 now, but thought you wouldn't mind - close enough 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Good luck

Larry


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## Jonathan Randall (Jun 8, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Well I may be asking too much of myself, or maybe I am just crazy. I am 32 about six foot tall and around 170lbs. In my younger years 16-19 I took some TKD classes.
> 
> 
> And maybe I am too hard on myself but am I crazy to think I will ever get back to at least the level I was at ages 16-19?


Easy question. You have far surpassed what you could do at 16-19. Your ability to walk away from or talk yourself out of a fight is probably %500 of what it was fifteen years ago. Also, and ask any real expert, self-defence is more a function of avoidance and escape and failing that, basic combatives, rather than formal MA techniques. Practice a quick, explosive palm-heel strike and a few low line kicks and I promise you, your self-defence ability at 32 will far surpass your ability at 16.

True, you don't have the flexibility that you had at 16 but you have more WISDOM and discipline than you did then. I'm a "little" older than 32 but my self-defence ability far exceeds my ability at 19 when I could do a TKD jump spinning crescent kick for breakfast, attend a Judo class for lunch and a boxing class for dinner.


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## skyguy (Sep 19, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Have or do any of you that are my age or older feel this way? Did I wait to long to get back into martial arts? I want to reach the level of black belt, but only if I can reach the level of perfection that I associate with that level of rank. Case and point, I dont want to wear the belt if I look like a joke on the mat.
> Phil


  Did you wait too long? I sure hope not! 
 I'm 40 years old, in pretty good physical condition, and I'm just starting in martial arts. I see no reason why I cant earn a black belt
  if I'm a good student, stay dedicated, and dont allow frustration and impatience to derail my progress.


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## Grenadier (Sep 19, 2005)

I'm also in my mid-30's, and had taken some time off between jobs.  When I first came back to the martial arts, I couldn't make it through a single advanced class without feeling completely winded, and the next mornings, I'd wake up with muscle soreness that can only be described as burning.  There would even be a few times during the first month or two, that I would have to stop to catch my breath.   Things didn't help when I strained a hip flexor in that first month, trying to do too much.  I almost quit at that time.  

It took me about 3-4 months of continual training, before I felt I was starting to get back into shape.  I'd make it through the classes without having to stop, but would still feel winded at the end.  The hip flexor still hurt like the blazes, and sitting down was a real pain in the butt, literally, but at least it didn't feel like it was going to snap apart.  

It took about 6 months, before I felt that I was in fighting shape again, being able to make it through a class without feeling winded.  The hip still ached, but the strength was back.  

It's now been 18 months, or so, and I can finally say that I'm back to where I was before I had left my last school (and before taking a hiatus).  I can now make it through three classes in a row without getting winded, and the hip has finally healed to the point where it only gets stiff (no more firey pain).  

In some ways, the hip flexor problem helped me come back to the basics, since I couldn't kick in the same way I used to, during those first few months.  At that time, I simply focused on low kicks with that right leg, and concentrated on re-learning the basic mechanics, step by step.  During these low kicking sessions, I was able to correct some flaws that I had previously not seen, and now that I'm pretty much close to 100% again, am thankful that I had this opportunity.  

It never hurts to go back to the basics, no matter how old you are.


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## searcher (Sep 19, 2005)

I think you will do just fine.   I started at a much younger age, but and now in your age group.   My father started when he was 38 and he did just fine.   I have had several students that started in their late 30's and have made it to BB.   The key to remember is that you are not a teen anymore.   Don't try to keep up with the young testerone-pumping guys in class.   You will need to pace yourself, but also push yourself.   You are still young enough to excell and do very well.  

This may sound very cliche' but you anly need to compete with yourself.   In one year ask yourself if you are better than you were last year.   If you can answer yes then you are doing what you need to do.


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## lonecoyote (Sep 20, 2005)

I feel like recovery time is longer between those once in a while super tough workouts, and I have to be more careful of a trick knee, back injury, etc. but I think that these minuses can be pluses, I may not go as hard as I used to but I go a lot smarter than I used to. I take care of my body more, listen to it more, rest it when it needs to rest, stretch it when it needs to stretch, and push it when it needs to be pushed, instead of just pounding it day after day. Some of this may require you going to the beat of a different drummer during workouts, check with your instructor in private and let him know if you need to go a little slower. Try being the only guy above 35, heck the only guy above 23 in a submission grappling class.


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## OnlyAnEgg (Sep 20, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Sometimes I feel like maybe I missed the boat starting over at 32. When I do something like delayed sword, or captured twigs I can do the moves but I am sloppy and unrefined looking. Then when I watch the instructor do the same moves it looks smooth as glass. I know that with 18 years teaching and no telling how many years training to reach the level of 5th Dan some of that can be expected. And maybe I am too hard on myself but am I crazy to think I will ever get back to at least the level I was at ages 16-19?




I started MA at 42 and found that, after daily practice, I was moving quicker than I thought I could. Maybe not as quick as the younger students and certainly not as fast as Samnabim. I was quick for me. It took consistant practice. Whatever you do, though, don't stop, if this is what you want. I did and it was hard to start back up.






			
				2004hemi said:
			
		

> I want to reach the level of black belt, but only if I can reach the level of perfection that I associate with that level of rank. Case and point, I dont want to wear the belt if I look like a joke on the mat.


If you have an honorable Sensei, you will earn your black belt.






			
				2004hemi said:
			
		

> Any idea how I can work to improve my speed, form, and accuracy? I do have a wave master to work with. I stretch everyday for at least 20 min.


I'm beginning a weight regimen that was recommended to me by my brother. He'd done weight training for some time while in the Navy. Per his suggestion, I will be doing reps of low weight. Like 5lbs. I'm told it will increase speed without bulking me up.

I hope this helps.

Good Luck

egg


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## Navarre (Oct 4, 2005)

I started martial arts when I was 15 and I am going on 38 now. My original style is karate and we worked very hard physically. We would sometimes go for 3 hours daily at a level that had me in incredible physical condition.

However, in the last 5 years I have gotten away from my training.  I have allowed outside factors to influence me in a negative way, which is quite unlike everything I have trained to believe.  It has had a terrible effect on me, physically and spiritually.  This is compounded by the fact that I have one of the country's most serious cases of scoliosis and may struggle to walk within the next 15 years.

In making the most of my life and combatting my progressive illness, I have become aware of how vital the martial arts are to my life.  I have tried to reenter my training several times but have become dismayed at how slow and weak I now am and how much it hurts sometimes.

But I have internalized several vital lessons along the way.  Training for the true martial artist is something you do all the time, not just on the dojo floor.  It is a way of perceiving the world, and yourself.  Once I readjusted my perception to view myself as I can truly become, not as I was at 16 or the grand vision of my "ultimate" self, then I found I can focus my will toward my training and not towards my negative emotions.

Train as hard as you can. Train daily.  Train when you are in the dojo and train just as hard mentally when you are sitting still.  Train in the way that works best for you now, not then.  Train, train, train.

I also firmly believe that it is vital to surround yourself in an environment that engenders positive thinking.  If you have found a good school then you have a great start.  Hopefully you also have people in your life, perhaps a wife, who encourages and supports your journey.

This is, incidentally, my very first post.  The need for a positive world about me is why I joined this forum.  Thank you for giving me a place to start here.  I wish you, not luck, but wisdom and perseverance toward the success I know you will find.


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## arnisador (Oct 4, 2005)

Good luck to you! Please, don't get dismayed. The only battle is to improve yourself, after all.


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## Shodan (Oct 4, 2005)

I am happy you started this thread because it has made me feel a bit better about my current situation and some things that were getting me down about it.

  I am a female and have been doing martial arts since I was 13 and am now 32.  I've had my breaks here and there- two major ones were for the births of both my kids.  Another was a year of rehab. after I blew my right knee out on my second degree brown belt test and required reconstructive surgery.  My main art has always been American Kenpo (EPAK).

  I recently started going to a new studio so that I can train 4 nights a week instead of two.  I still go two nights to Kenpo, but wanted to add something, so I picked up two nights at this new place that does incorporate some Kenpo into their material, but a lot of things are new.  Their workout level is also a lot higher than my current Kenpo class........more cardio-oriented- which has been great (and more like I used to do in my teens)- but at my current fitness level, it is very hard for me and I've been really sore after every class!!  

  Being the newbie at this new studio has not been easy for me- I am wearing a white belt again for two nights a week, as well I should since the material varies quite a bit from what I am used to.  I'm the only one with an old injury AND am one of the two oldest people there (at 32!!)- weird for me cuz I am used to working out with a lot of adults in Kenpo and this place is primarily teens with a ton of energy.  I am always the last one finished with some of the speed/jumping drills and the respect level is waaaaaaayyy different than I am used to.  Most of these kids don't know that I have a black belt in my other system and worked a long time to earn it.......a few have asked if I trained before, but a lot of them are pretty anti-social with me and hang out in their little groups chatting.  It's weird to me- the lack of adults there.

  I got down about all this for awhile, but have thought about it more and am okay with all of it now.  I have to remember it will take me awhile to get back into shape.  I just had a baby 7 months ago, so am still recovering from that and being out of shape.  As I get more in shape, I am sure my knee will hurt less and I won't be so achy after each class.  My approach now is more- one day at a time......I'll just keep working at my own personal goal to the best of my ability.

  I am guilty of trying to push myself too hard and then getting injured, so I am really trying to pace myself and only do what I can safely do.

  Try not to compare yourself to the others that are younger and have more energy than we used to.  Keep your eyes on your own goal and work towards that goal daily.  Review your material often and keep notes, they are very important in your journey and you will really value them as you learn more and more material and review for tests- or if you ever have to take time off, you can have those notes to study in your time away from the dojo.  Keep us posted on your progress and best of luck to you in your new system.  Kenpo is awesome!!

  :asian:  :karate:


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## Gin-Gin (Oct 4, 2005)

Navarre said:
			
		

> Training for the true martial artist is something you do all the time, not just on the dojo floor.  It is a way of perceiving the world, and yourself.  Once I readjusted my perception to view myself as I can truly become, not as I was at 16 or the grand vision of my "ultimate" self, then I found I can focus my will toward my training and not towards my negative emotions. Train as hard as you can. Train daily.  Train when you are in the dojo and train just as hard mentally when you are sitting still.  Train in the way that works best for you now, not then.  Train, train, train. I also firmly believe that it is vital to surround yourself in an environment that engenders positive thinking.  If you have found a good school then you have a great start.  Hopefully you also have people in your life, perhaps a wife, who encourages and supports your journey.
> 
> This is, incidentally, my very first post.  The need for a positive world about me is why I joined this forum.  Thank you for giving me a place to start here.  I wish you, not luck, but wisdom and perseverance toward the success I know you will find.


Hi Navarre, & welcome to MartialTalk! :wavey: Btw, good post!





			
				Shodan said:
			
		

> Try not to compare yourself to the others that are younger and have more energy than we used to. Keep your eyes on your own goal and work towards that goal daily. Review your material often and keep notes, they are very important in your journey and you will really value them as you learn more and more material and review for tests- or if you ever have to take time off, you can have those notes to study in your time away from the dojo. Keep us posted on your progress and best of luck to you in your new system. Kenpo is awesome!!


Absolutely--well said, Shodan!


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## mantis (Oct 4, 2005)

dude.. the guy is ONLY 32
you guys make sound like he 72..
32 is still young, he has enough energy..
good luck on stretching tho!
haha


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## Flying Crane (Oct 4, 2005)

mantis said:
			
		

> dude.. the guy is ONLY 32
> you guys make sound like he 72..
> 32 is still young, he has enough energy..
> good luck on stretching tho!
> haha


right on.  32 is young.  If you have been inactive for several years it may take time and dilligence to regain your limberness and get your body moving again, but i'd be willing to bet that if you are dedicated, you could expect to be involved in the martial arts in some way or another, for about, oh, say, the next 50 - 60 years or so.


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## mantis (Oct 4, 2005)

Flying Crane said:
			
		

> right on. 32 is young. If you have been inactive for several years it may take time and dilligence to regain your limberness and get your body moving again, but i'd be willing to bet that if you are dedicated, you could expect to be involved in the martial arts in some way or another, for about, oh, say, the next 50 - 60 years or so.


 we have a 70 year old gentelman in our kung fu class. he's doing quite well. he stretches, he has good balance, and he hits hard too.. he's like purple belt now!
 if he can do it, the 32 can do it too


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## hemi (Oct 4, 2005)

Wow a lot has changed since I started this thread. I guess I was kind of vague in the first post in that I am not overweight (almost the opposite) and Im not in horrible shape. I dont think I could up and run two miles but I do walk about three a day in my job. I think I would be in much better shape if I would just make my self quit smoking. I have always been very active and still do most of what I could in my younger days. I do still try to work out with my bow flex a few days a week.   Looking back at how I felt when I started and posted this thread I was in a frame of mind that maybe I would not be able to get limber and that I would not have time to reach my potential as a MA. But now that I have been back in the game so to speak for about six months now and can see the improvement I have made so far I have a lot more confidence that I can get to a level that I would like to reach. 



It also helps a lot to see that a lot of other members here started MA when they were older than I am and many have been at it for a long time but they are older than I am and still going strong. To be 70 and still able to work out in Kung Fu my hats off to that gentleman


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## arnisador (Oct 5, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> But now that I have been back in the game so to speak for about six months now and can see the improvement I have made so far I have a lot more confidence that I can get to a level that I would like to reach.


 That's great! It's a personal journey. It sounds like it's a good one for you!

 Some day you'll turn that confidence toward the smoking issue. It'll happen!


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## arnisador (Oct 5, 2005)

Shodan said:
			
		

> Try not to compare yourself to the others that are younger and have more energy than we used to. Keep your eyes on your own goal and work towards that goal daily.


 What a nice, upbeat post! I'm glad a change of pace in training has been good for you, and I like this attitude! Good luck!


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## Grenadier (Oct 5, 2005)

mantis said:
			
		

> we have a 70 year old gentelman in our kung fu class. he's doing quite well. he stretches, he has good balance, and he hits hard too.. he's like purple belt now!
> if he can do it, the 32 can do it too


I'll also add that we have a 73 year old gentleman in our karate class, who passed his black belt test in February.  I love the smile he gets on his face when people say "I don't know...  I'm too old for this stuff."


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## arnisador (Oct 5, 2005)

I spoke last night with a 43 year old who started BJJ earlier this year and has lost 24 pounds. He's going to try a tournament soon! I thought it was great.


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## guromkb (Oct 5, 2005)

As much as I admire BJJ I can't even think of grappling at my age and with my injuries. I have 3 hurniated discs that are awaiting surgery in my lower back and a reconstructed right knee....so I would say BJJ is definately out for me. Car wrecks and football and wrestling and life in general has shelved me to a degree when it comes to grappling.JUMPING OUT OF PERFECTLY GOOD AIRPLANES HAVE DEFINATELY TAKEN THERE TOLL.

Mike


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## arnisador (Oct 28, 2005)

One has to choose the right art for oneself. I am doing Ok with the BJJ but occasionally bow out of something that would overstress my knees, which bear some damage from wrestling.


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## Shaman (Oct 31, 2005)

I would not get too caught up in form.  Several of my friends have/had perfect form, but I beat them everytime sparring. I guess my mentality is different coming from Freestyle Wrestling (15+ years). It was about the result and not how pretty you looked doing it.


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## bcbernam777 (Oct 31, 2005)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Well I may be asking too much of myself, or maybe I am just crazy. I am 32 about six foot tall and around 170lbs. In my younger years 16-19 I took some TKD classes. A lot of the time I would forgo the normal class and show up for sparring. The instructor required sparring when he was testing the students for advancement and I fought just about everyone that was testing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Dont be impatient, allow yourself to be retrained, and relax, your consternation is the source of your lack of progress


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## bluemtn (Nov 1, 2005)

Remember, you're just getting back into the swing of things.  From what I've seen of Kenpo, you don't have very many fancy kicks you have to worry about so much.  The flexibility will eventually come back decently.  The kid's can naturally get their feet up high with very little stretching- so don't worry about it too much.  As long as you are kicking with the right part of the foot and aiming right, I don't think the instructor will mind too much.


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## hapkidoisme (Dec 25, 2005)

i started hapkido weighin in at 250 and power lighting never stretched never kicked never any martial art training at all,  my master saw that i lost weight got faster and practiced and practiced allot

     and as the years went on my training and my technique got smoother,  faster,  powerful striking,  grappling,  all of it got better over the years,  i am 34 goin on 35 in march and i can kick as high and as fast as some of the high school kids with no mind to the past injuries i had suffered in teh past

     so i am guess i am sayin don`t get furstrated, get practicing and your skill will improve   if you get discourgaed you will fail,  don`t  look at the other students  make it a challenge for your self,  then you will succed


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## Never to Old (Apr 17, 2006)

I started Hapkido in November 05 just befor my 46 birthday, best thing I ever did.  Not there to compete with the younger ones just there to enjoy.  Hell just about to go for my blue belt, not the most flexable person I've met and may never be anywere near as supple as the younger ones.  But I recon with plenty of practice I'lll be flexable enougth to continue grading.  I am definately fitter and more flexable then when I started.  I ask lots of questions of my fellow students and instructors and I learn lots from them all the time.


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## chempo2 (Apr 17, 2006)

I started American Kempo at 50. I realize that my instructor doesn't push me like some of the young men and women, but he pushes my comfort level so that I'll strive to improve. I look back on the past 3 years and I can see a difference in my abilities. I try not to compare my self to younger stronger quicker people, I look at my own personal progress.


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## Hand Sword (Apr 17, 2006)

All I can say, as I'm geeting back into again, after many years, Is hang in there. You will get frustrated because you have the memory of what you used to do, and the physical of reality of what is now. They won't match up for a while, but, hang in there! Take baby steps, and slowly build up up. You will back peddle occasionally, and start to doubt yourself, or say ""Is this really worth it?", Yes, it is! Hang in there!


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## Hand Sword (Apr 26, 2006)

Did I mention to just hang in there? Sorry to repeat, but, it's definitely a mind set that we need to keep driving home. I didn't think so either, but, I find myself saying it over and over, looking for little victories everywhere.


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## annie (Apr 29, 2006)

Phil your not alone!  I am 31- just began training about a year ago- going for my blue belt test in 3 weeks and am entered in my first tournament next weekend. And I can tell you I am not the oldest in my class.  One  of my good friends at 37 has just begun this journey 2 months ago. Yes he gets frustrated but he's never had so much fun and won't give up. More than half of our adult beg-int class is in the "over 30" crowd.  I have to say we have the most supportive group.  I tend to have the " i suck at this" answer alot.  But then my sensei always pipes in  with " you suck when I say you suck"  Well I have yet to hear that out of his mouth yet and I don't expect I ever will.    This has been the greatest adventure I have taken I don't intend to ever give up-  I see that Black belt in my future as well as teaching little dragons classes.
Never give up-  That will be your biggest regret


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## hemi (Apr 29, 2006)

annie said:
			
		

> Phil your not alone! I am 31- just began training about a year ago- going for my blue belt test in 3 weeks and am entered in my first tournament next weekend. And I can tell you I am not the oldest in my class. One of my good friends at 37 has just begun this journey 2 months ago. Yes he gets frustrated but he's never had so much fun and won't give up. More than half of our adult beg-int class is in the "over 30" crowd. I have to say we have the most supportive group. I tend to have the " i suck at this" answer alot. But then my sensei always pipes in with " you suck when I say you suck" Well I have yet to hear that out of his mouth yet and I don't expect I ever will. This has been the greatest adventure I have taken I don't intend to ever give up- I see that Black belt in my future as well as teaching little dragons classes.
> Never give up- That will be your biggest regret


 
Annie, Good luck on your blue belt test. I would have tested for purple last Monday but I opted out of testing. I just didnt feel I was ready since I didnt have long form 1 down. 

Looking back at when I started this thread on 5-28-05 its like I am in a different world after a year of training. I am so addicted to Kenpo that by not testing this week I had to miss class for the week. I am having Kenpo withdraws now. 

I also think that my kicks have improved a bunch still a long way from where I hope to get but better than they were day one of training. 

A lot of people have posted that are several years my senior and just starting out or have been going 100% for some time now. I have to say my hats off to yall. I think it is great and wish you all the best in your training. 

And for those that posted that are not yet my age I say you have my respect. I wish I had the ability to attend a school, the discipline to get started and stay with training and most of all I wish I had started sooner. But my walk is barley started and God willing I will be training for many years to come.


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## szlevi (May 5, 2006)

Hey, let me pipe in here... same age bracket here (34)... only did judo in my teens (IIRC orange was the last one) and some loose boxing stuff during my twenties (all in Europe) - I'm trying to figure out what  would be the best to start with... I like Japanese folks but that not necessarily means I'd love, say, any Japanese or Okinawan style. 
WEll, I'm mainly interested in 'empty hand' styles, that's for sure. I only know my goals so far: first and foremost I'd like to get into much better shape (~4 ys ago I was smoking 2 packs per day then I stoped smoking one day another - and picked up about 30 lbs since then ), secondly pursue not only knowledge - hey, my jabs are still pretty cool  - but also a bit change my lifestyle but not during a 20 ys period but rather a year or so... this last one probably means even though I appreciate the well-rounded traditional approach, I would rather like to see some achievement - ie belt advancement - well, rather yearly than one per decade (sarcasm intended )... of course, I'd like to avoid any "franchise-dojo" and their "black belt under 5 years" crap too.
Any idea in which direction should I start looking around?:idunno:


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## Tony (May 11, 2006)

Well my friend started Taekwondo when he was 31 and though not very flexible he is very aggressive and seems to have learnt alot! He is also going for his black belt soon so just keep practicing! Practice, practice, Practice! You could also ask your instructor or the higher levels for assistance. I know some of them may be younger than you but don't be too proud to ask them as they probably have a lot of knowledge.


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## Touch Of Death (May 11, 2006)

2004hemi said:
			
		

> Well I may be asking too much of myself, or maybe I am just crazy. I am 32 about six foot tall and around 170lbs. In my younger years 16-19 I took some TKD classes. A lot of the time I would forgo the normal class and show up for sparring. The instructor required sparring when he was testing the students for advancement and I fought just about everyone that was testing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Think of kicks as insterts to your base motion.
Sean


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## matt.m (May 23, 2006)

Dude I am in your club, the 30 and over.  However my story is a little different. I wear two leg braces all the time.  So I tell you this, take your time and slow down.  Slow and steady wins the race.  

My kicking is limited from the aspect that I cannot do back leg kicking on any side or round kick, my knees cant really take the torque.  However that doesn't let me get down or anything.  Work diligently, work steady and do not give up or quit.

-Matt


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## hapki68 (May 30, 2006)

2004Hemi,

I started taking martial arts about 7 months ago (hapkido) partially because I'm getting older.  (I'm 37.  That doesn't mean I'm old... but I'm certainly not as energetic or flexible as the guys in my class in their early 20s.)  

I decided that I had had enough of the gym and that as I get older I need a more overall body work out.  I like how hapkido combines cardio, muscle building and yoga. 

As I understand it (although I don't yet know how to do it), we should be using our opponent's weakness more than our own strength.  If we have to rely on our muscles, we may as well take up boxing.

It goes against western thinking (which favors power over wisdom), but age should make you and me better at this stuff, although it may not look or feel like it at first.  

I'm a thin guy (5 11, 150) so I'm used to bigger guys muscling me.  Although I share your concerns, I'm hoping that the martial arts will teach me how to counteract strength and youth. 

Hapki68


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## Karateguy4000 (Jun 20, 2006)

Dear Phil 

  That is good that you start back. Yes you are being to heard on your slfe  Phil the only way your going to get good at this Style is do it every day. Do you Kicks like 20 times a day. you well see your slfe geting batter.. it take time to get good. I have been in TKD For 7 years im a 2th dan.  Do not try to be some one elso find what work best for you phil. If you try to be like some one elso you well not get any good..Find what work best for you and work on that. if you have good kicks work on them and so on.. Your welly naver to old to do martial arts.. if you can walk and you can do it.. 



 Dwayne


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