# The ability to defend



## MasterArtMason (Oct 20, 2017)

Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.

I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about. 

Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?


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## oftheherd1 (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?



I would think it would be a person's ability to defend themselves.  That seems to indicate they have already proven themselves.

I also think you could make up plenty of arguments for and against any of your positions.  For example, if it is only a core belief that is untested, it may not be correct that the person can defend themselves.

Or, the art or system means nothing if the person doesn't learn it properly.

Many things go in to self defense.  There have been long threads on that.  Do you have an opinion?


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 20, 2017)

All of the above. The will to defend (and to do damage as needed) goes a long way. Adding skill will increase a person's chance of success. Confidence (that core belief) also increases their chances (decreases chance of attack, increases chances of strong defense if well founded).

What carries the most weight probably varies. If someone has an abundance of physical ability (not skill, just their base athleticism) and willingness to be violent in defending themselves, that will be the most important factor for that person. For someone with less of those things, developed skill will matter more.

In that latter case, the style they study (and how they study it) starts to matter a lot more.


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## Paul_D (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.


You've answered your own question there.  It can't be the art or the system, as you yourself have students who would survive and others you're not worried about, but they all train the same system.


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## Martial D (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?



I remember many years ago I was walking with a guy I knew from a boxing club we both went to and his girlfriend. As I recall we were headed to my place to knock a couple back.

This dude was a big boy and talked a big game. Not the best boxer but not the worst either. He believed in his ability to fight, and carried himself with confidence.

So anyway we walked past this pub and there were 4 guys outside smoking. They started making some comments about buddies girl, and of course buddy starts beaking back at them. Next thing you know they had come out to the street, and things got up close and personal. Wed already had a couple drinks, and things quickly escalated. 

I just remember one guy swung at me and missed, I swing back and connected, sending the guy stumbling over a curb. Another one grabbed me, and next thing I remember I was on my back, wrestling with a rather large dude. I remember looking sideways to see my companion doing his best Carl Lewis impression, as his girl was calling him a p#ssy and other colorful adjectives. 

I managed to get to my feet but not before eating a few kicks to the ribs from one of them, and once I did I managed to connect with a pretty sweet left hook to the guy I was wrestling, causing enough of a gap to beat a hasty retreat from the 3 angry men in front of me. (The fourth had chased after the guy I was with)

The moral? You have no idea how you will react to a situation until it happens, much less how others will.


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## Dirty Dog (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?



A belief in your ability to defend yourself is pretty much irrelevant. The WILL to do so is far more important.


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## KenpoMaster805 (Oct 20, 2017)

I believe that is great that you are able to defent your self


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## jobo (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?


what's wrong with the person who you worry about? If they have all the skills, some people are not fighters by nature, I'm not sure you can train that into them, but they should be able to throw a good punch or kick if someone jumps on them


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## lklawson (Oct 20, 2017)

Both.

A person must have valid, "workable," skills and ability but must also have a mindset to effectively apply under conditions which might be termed "self defense."


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## lklawson (Oct 20, 2017)

jobo said:


> what's wrong with the person who you worry about? If they have all the skills, some people are not fighters by nature, I'm not sure you can train that into them, but they should be able to throw a good punch or kick


Everyone is a fighter by nature.  Nature is what programs them thus.  That said, many people are trained out of it by society and/or upbringing, by emotionally scarring experiences which reinforce fear and inaction, or occasionally by chemical imbalances which cause or foster clinical anxiety.

But if humanity was not "survival oriented" by nature, it would have passed from the earth soon after created.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk


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## jobo (Oct 20, 2017)

lklawson said:


> Both.
> 
> A person must have valid, "workable," skills and ability but must also have a mindset to effectively apply under conditions which might be termed "self defense."


i think the term sd is to passive, it may be self defence in law, as they attacked you first, but after that its a fight, were you attack. I think that where a lot fall down, they can block and return fine, but when it gets down and dirty they don't have the stomach for it


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## lklawson (Oct 20, 2017)

jobo said:


> i think the term sd is to passive, it may be self defence in law, as they attacked you first, but after that its a fight, were you attack. I think that where a lot fall down, they can block and return fine, but when it gets down and dirty they don't have the stomach for it


The firearms-for-self-defense community is heavily into this concept, where it is usually referred to as "mind set."  The short-hand for this part of mind set is basically "the will to survive at any cost."

Once the fight is engaged, keep fighting until the threat is passed or you can escape.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk


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## jobo (Oct 20, 2017)

lklawson said:


> Everyone is a fighter by nature.  Nature is what programs them thus.  That said, many people are trained out of it by society and/or upbringing, by emotionally scarring experiences which reinforce fear and inaction, or occasionally by chemical imbalances which cause or foster clinical anxiety.
> 
> But if humanity was not "survival oriented" by nature, it would have passed from the earth soon after created.
> 
> ...


no i don't think so, some people are not only able to fight but enjoy it. That not for everyone, I've seen people beaten half unconscious get up , break a bottle and go back for another go, you have to near kill them before they will give it up, others are holding their hands up after one good punch on the nose


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## jobo (Oct 20, 2017)

lklawson said:


> The firearms-for-self-defense community is heavily into this concept, where it is usually referred to as "mind set."  The short-hand for this part of mind set is basically "the will to survive at any cost."
> 
> Once the fight is engaged, keep fighting until the threat is passed or you can escape.
> 
> ...


I'm talking about the bit, where you have trouble stopping before you kick them to death as opposed to defending till they get bored, run out of gas, or someone breaks it up


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## lklawson (Oct 20, 2017)

jobo said:


> I'm talking about the bit, where you have trouble stopping before you kick them to death as opposed to defending till they get bored, run out of gas, or someone breaks it up


I am too and we disagree.  The research I've seen (and my experience) is that once people get started, they get often into a loop.  It all falls down onto the primitive "lizard brain," what I call Robo Droid.  Robo Droid is the "fight or flight [or freeze]" part of the brain that is what's left when adrenaline dump turns off the prefrontal cortex.  Typically if Robo Droid isn't "programmed' do do stuff it will just run a "default" program, which for some people is "do nothing and stand there." That's the "freeze."   It often takes specific training to get get a fight response, and then it take specific (repetitive) training to get certain other responses.  

The thing is, when Robo Droid runs its program it doesn't necessarily have an exit condition.  Further "programming" (such as those who have a violent upbringing) can program Robo Droid so that there is no exit condition.

The work of Dave Grossman is especially useful here.  I highly recommend it to you.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk


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## Danny T (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?


There are art forms that have absolutely nothing to do with having self defense or fighting skills even though the art is based on fighting actions. 
Many persons have successful defended themselves in situations simply because of their sheer will to fight back and passion to live or passion to protect their love ones but have no real fight skill. 
Most martial arts are good when well trained and practiced for fighting skills. (some not so much) 
Ones desire to use violence will depend on the person, culture, belief systems, passions, and environment.
On one's core belief in themselves to defend themselves...there are a lot in the martial artist who have a large false sense of security. They truly believe they have fighting skills when they don't. They are in as much trouble as those who have skills but don't believe in them or don't believe in themselves. (Have seen a lot of both) 
What carries the most weight is the person who believes in themselves, who has tremendous passion for life or a love one, and is truly willing to do whatever is necessary to protect them.


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## hoshin1600 (Oct 20, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system


to simplify i would combine style and system and call them a "body of knowledge" or  "skill set"




MasterArtMason said:


> he core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend


a core belief or confidence is inert.  it is not a factor in the ability to defend one's self.

the major factor is training methodology.   as others have said its not really confidence, some call it heart some call it "gameness" .  there is a point where the _fight _ turns to _flight_. that point is different for everyone and is related to the amount of both mental and physical stress and duress a person can deal with.  with a proper training methodology you can increase this tipping point when the mind wants to turn to flight.   you can think of a stress scale from 1 to 10.   10 being the highest stress level and as you train in stress inoculation you can increase the level you can handle.  there is a lot more to training methods but the basic point is _how _ you train is more important then the body of knowledge in which you train.  and if you dont naturally have a high tolerance for violence you can train it.


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## drop bear (Oct 20, 2017)

The difference between being a martial artist and a fighter.


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## jobo (Oct 20, 2017)

hoshin1600 said:


> to simplify i would combine style and system and call them a "body of knowledge" or  "skill set"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


of course a core belief is important, if you don't believe you can robustly defend yourself, then you almost certainly cant, as with almost everything else in life, belief doesn't mean you can, but a lack of belief almost certainly means you cant.

I've had three indecent recently, where someone has been trying to physically intimidate me, once they realise that I'm not at all scared of them, i mean really not scared, to the point that you can't fake it, then they backed down very quickly.

they didn't know if i could fight or not, what they did know was i believe i could take them out and that was enough


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## MasterArtMason (Oct 20, 2017)

oftheherd1 said:


> I would think it would be a person's ability to defend themselves.  That seems to indicate they have already proven themselves.
> 
> I also think you could make up plenty of arguments for and against any of your positions.  For example, if it is only a core belief that is untested, it may not be correct that the person can defend themselves.
> 
> ...




It has never been an issue for me personally. So I really don't have an opinion. That is why I am asking. I have just seen so many instances of different responses to attack that it is something of interest to me.


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## MasterArtMason (Oct 20, 2017)

lklawson said:


> The work of Dave Grossman is especially useful here.  I highly recommend it to you.
> 
> Peace favor your sword,
> Kirk



I am not familiar with him. Available on Amazon?


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## MasterArtMason (Oct 20, 2017)

jobo said:


> what's wrong with the person who you worry about? If they have all the skills, some people are not fighters by nature, I'm not sure you can train that into them, but they should be able to throw a good punch or kick if someone jumps on them



I have had people, especially women either be a ball of fire, or fall apart totally at any kind of stress scenario. The ones who fell apart had always had something happen to them (assault rape etc). The fireballs were a mix of situations.


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## lklawson (Oct 23, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> I am not familiar with him. Available on Amazon?


He has some commercially written books, yes.  Some Papers too.  And some stuff which is probably locked in a metal filing cabinet in the Pentagon and marked "Secret" for no good reason.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk


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## JowGaWolf (Oct 23, 2017)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?


Training to fight is not the same as training to do a technique.  They are 2 separate things and requires 2 separate forms of training.  Grappling systems are as close as you'll get to training how fight and training technique all at the same time.

Some people are less intuitive when it comes to fighting so you have explain and train things that come natural to most.  I knew a guy that didn't have the natural response to put his hands up to deflect a ball that was thrown at him.  He also didn't have the natural response to get out of the way.


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## JowGaWolf (Oct 23, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> All of the above. The will to defend (and to do damage as needed) goes a long way. Adding skill will increase a person's chance of success. Confidence (that core belief) also increases their chances (decreases chance of attack, increases chances of strong defense if well founded).
> 
> What carries the most weight probably varies. If someone has an abundance of physical ability (not skill, just their base athleticism) and willingness to be violent in defending themselves, that will be the most important factor for that person. For someone with less of those things, developed skill will matter more.
> 
> In that latter case, the style they study (and how they study it) starts to matter a lot more.


You touched on something that is very important; "The will to defend." Some people have it and others don't.  We see it in animals as well.  Some will fight back while others will do nothing at all to protect themselves. One would assume that everyone has the will to defend, but that isn't always the case.


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> Some people are less intuitive when it comes to fighting so you have explain and train things that come natural to most. I knew a guy that didn't have the natural response to put his hands up to deflect a ball that was thrown at him. He also didn't have the natural response to get out of the way.


This is worth remembering when we're talking about what it takes for someone to be trained. That answer is different by individual. What is easy, pre-developed, and/or natural to some, is entirely foreign and difficult to others.


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> You touched on something that is very important; "The will to defend." Some people have it and others don't.  We see it in animals as well.  Some will fight back while others will do nothing at all to protect themselves. One would assume that everyone has the will to defend, but that isn't always the case.


And I think in most cases (not all, I think) we could call it a "threshold to defend". Some people will defend as soon as they feel threatened. Some as soon as it gets physical. Some only when it goes "too far" for them (which may be too late).


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## CB Jones (Oct 23, 2017)

lklawson said:


> He has some commercially written books, yes.  Some Papers too.  And some stuff which is probably locked in a metal filing cabinet in the Pentagon and marked "Secret" for no good reason.
> 
> Peace favor your sword,
> Kirk



I like Dave Grossman's books.....but his seminars and lectures are where he really shines.


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## drop bear (Oct 23, 2017)

jobo said:


> no i don't think so, some people are not only able to fight but enjoy it. That not for everyone, I've seen people beaten half unconscious get up , break a bottle and go back for another go, you have to near kill them before they will give it up, others are holding their hands up after one good punch on the nose



A lot of that can be experience. If a broken nose is past their previous experience they can start to panic.


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 23, 2017)

drop bear said:


> A lot of that can be experience. If a broken nose is past their previous experience they can start to panic.


Agreed. This is easy to see even with non-violent injuries. Most folks will respond relative to what they've experienced and/or observed in the past. Someone who has never had much more than bumps will react much worse to, say, a bad sprain or a minor break. Someone who has had breaks before is less likely to freak out over it. No guarantees of course, but some likelihood.


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## drop bear (Oct 23, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> Agreed. This is easy to see even with non-violent injuries. Most folks will respond relative to what they've experienced and/or observed in the past. Someone who has never had much more than bumps will react much worse to, say, a bad sprain or a minor break. Someone who has had breaks before is less likely to freak out over it. No guarantees of course, but some likelihood.



Easiest example is knee ride in BJJ Until they realise they won't actually die you can use it as a submission


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 23, 2017)

drop bear said:


> Easiest example is knee ride in BJJ Until they realise they won't actually die you can use it as a submission


Yeah. Man, I hate those when someone with skill does them. Or, in place of the skill, and extra 50 pounds will do.


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## JR 137 (Oct 23, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> Agreed. This is easy to see even with non-violent injuries. Most folks will respond relative to what they've experienced and/or observed in the past. Someone who has never had much more than bumps will react much worse to, say, a bad sprain or a minor break. Someone who has had breaks before is less likely to freak out over it. No guarantees of course, but some likelihood.


I saw this all the time with rookies in college athletics.  You’d get some hotshot high school guy coming in thinking he’s tough.  Then he gets hit by an upperclassman.  And he’s on the ground thinking he’s dying.  By their second season, they’ve outgrown a lot of that.

Or you’d have the hotshot freshman thinking he’s tough.  He’s had his share of bumps and bruises.  Then he sprains an ankle.  I evaluate it and tell him it’s a sprain, put some compression on it, give him some ice, and maybe one crutch.  Then he walks into the training room the next day in a walking boot with a note from a physician saying he’s got a sprained ankle and is out for 6-8 weeks.  And the upperclassmen laugh and shake their heads and mutter “stupid rookie.”  Then they do the same next season.  The problem isn’t they’ve never been hurt before, the problem is they’ve never actually been injured.

MA is the same way.  Get hit bare knuckle in the stomach your first time, and you’re on the ground, clutching your stomach and can barely breathe.  After a few times you realize how much you can actually take and keep going.  You develop this, I don’t know, pride?  You get sick of peeling yourself off the floor.  And you develop a mental toughness that makes you keep going.

Or you quit and tell your friends the dojo wasn’t tough enough or realistic enough, or you didn’t have time anymore 

Wrestling taught me to suck it up and keep working towards a pin.  Bare knuckle karate reinforced the concept of keep going.  Now that I’m 41, I don’t need that lesson anymore


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## Kababayan (Oct 23, 2017)

One factor is a person's natural fight or flight tendency. A person may not know if they are a fighter or a flighter until they are in a situation (hopefully never.)


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## Rayrob (Oct 24, 2017)

I’ve been in more “situations” than was really good for me and I have found righteous indignation all the motivation I need, lol.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Paul_D (Oct 29, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> and extra 50 pounds will do.


£50, sounds expensive


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## Gerry Seymour (Oct 29, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> £50, sounds expensive


If it'll get some big bloke's knee off me, I'll pay.


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## Danny T (Oct 29, 2017)

JR 137 said:


> I saw this all the time with rookies in college athletics.  You’d get some hotshot high school guy coming in thinking he’s tough.  Then he gets hit by an upperclassman.  And he’s on the ground thinking he’s dying.  By their second season, they’ve outgrown a lot of that.
> 
> Or you’d have the hotshot freshman thinking he’s tough.  He’s had his share of bumps and bruises.  Then he sprains an ankle.  I evaluate it and tell him it’s a sprain, put some compression on it, give him some ice, and maybe one crutch.  Then he walks into the training room the next day in a walking boot with a note from a physician saying he’s got a sprained ankle and is out for 6-8 weeks.  And the upperclassmen laugh and shake their heads and mutter “stupid rookie.”  Then they do the same next season.  The problem isn’t they’ve never been hurt before, the problem is they’ve never actually been injured.
> 
> ...


Yeap...I say it often. Many don' know the difference between being uncomfortable and being in pain.


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## Isaiah90 (Jul 24, 2018)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?



It's the self defense system for these reasons. 

1. *Fighting vs. attacking* - Most schools teach students how to fight rather than defend against attacks. They're not really seeing what their enemies are doing. They're just imagining what they suspect they'd do. There's a difference between actual fighting and self defense. Fighting is engaging in mutual combat. Attacking is when someone hurts you without consent. It's more aggressive and without rules. You can learn, practice, hone your punching or kicking skills. It won't do you any good if you don't take measures to see an attack coming. As soon as you get hit the first time, you're going to get hit the second time then the third time and the fourth time. You're going to keep getting hit until either you're incapacitated or somehow manage to create distance and defend yourself. 

2. *Realistic vs. unrealistic training *- The problem with most systems is they don't train realistically. They give off the impression that you're going to be the one who survives a violent confrontation and your attacker is going to submit to your will. That's fantasy. The reality is no attacker is going to simply let you do some flashy technique. You'll be dealing with a living, breathing person who can fight back. Attackers come in all shapes and sizes. Some are very aggressive and others are more strategic. It's almost impossible to have a technique or training method that's going to solve all of your problems in self defense. Think of all the variables in combat and compare that to martial arts training. You're training to deal with one specific variable like a straight punch and ignoring all the others. 

3.* Incomplete training* - The other major issue with most systems is the incomplete training. The focus is mainly on hand-to-hand combat, melee weapons, multiple attackers maybe, list goes on. That's not effective self defense. True self defense gives you the skills to foresee or prevent conflict and end it as quickly as possible. You should have skills in verbal self defense, verbal de-escalation, conflict resolution, situational awareness, situational assessment, hand to hand combat, all kinds of weapons, multiple attackers, legal self defense, list goes on. 

The wrong systems instill the wrong mindset and training in it's practitioners. Combat is not just about punching or kicking. That's why i don't like self defense nowadays. It's become a sport rather than a method of self-preservation and survival.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jul 24, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> It's the self defense system for these reasons.
> 
> 1. *Fighting vs. attacking* - Most schools teach students how to fight rather than defend against attacks. They're not really seeing what their enemies are doing. They're just imagining what they suspect they'd do. There's a difference between actual fighting and self defense. Fighting is engaging in mutual combat. Attacking is when someone hurts you without consent. It's more aggressive and without rules. You can learn, practice, hone your punching or kicking skills. It won't do you any good if you don't take measures to see an attack coming. As soon as you get hit the first time, you're going to get hit the second time then the third time and the fourth time. You're going to keep getting hit until either you're incapacitated or somehow manage to create distance and defend yourself.
> 
> ...


Its very impressive to me that you know what most systems that exist do. I dont think i even know what most schools in my main style do. Or even the namea of most of the kenpo/kempo schools, never mind their systems. That must have taken you a lot of research and study.


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## Isaiah90 (Jul 24, 2018)

kempodisciple said:


> Its very impressive to me that you know what most systems that exist do. I dont think i even know what most schools in my main style do. Or even the namea of most of the kenpo/kempo schools, never mind their systems. That must have taken you a lot of research and study.



lol yea it did. That's the conclusions i came to. They might have varying degrees of differences in training methods. They might have different techniques, philosophies, etc. Overall, it's the same old formula for teaching self defense.


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## Headhunter (Jul 24, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> lol yea it did. That's the conclusions i came to. They might have varying degrees of differences in training methods. They might have different techniques, philosophies, etc. Overall, it's the same old formula for teaching self defense.


No...just no


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## pgsmith (Jul 24, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> lol yea it did. That's the conclusions i came to. They might have varying degrees of differences in training methods. They might have different techniques, philosophies, etc. Overall, it's the same old formula for teaching self defense.



  Obviously, since you're asking people to give you money, you must be a self defense expert with impressive credentials that allow you to understand self defense better than anyone else. Care to share those credentials, or are we expected to just take your word that you know what you're talking about?


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## Headhunter (Jul 24, 2018)

pgsmith said:


> Obviously, since you're asking people to give you money, you must be a self defense expert with impressive credentials that allow you to understand self defense better than anyone else. Care to share those credentials, or are we expected to just take your word that you know what you're talking about?


I believe it's the second option lol


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## FriedRice (Jul 24, 2018)

MasterArtMason said:


> Question and opinion. Is it the art form the person takes, the self defense system or the core belief the person has about themselves and their ability to defend that has the real impact.
> 
> I have had students with beautiful technique, power, balance and execution who would not survive an attack, and others with much less skill I would never worry about.
> 
> Yes there is a combination here, but what carries the most weight in your opinion?



The best test is to put on safety gear and spar for knockouts to really find out where one stands. Start with no strikes to the head. Then later, allow strikes to the head.


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## Isaiah90 (Jul 24, 2018)

pgsmith said:


> Obviously, since you're asking people to give you money, you must be a self defense expert with impressive credentials that allow you to understand self defense better than anyone else. Care to share those credentials, or are we expected to just take your word that you know what you're talking about?



Let's see. 

I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then. 

I taught several students in self defense. They live in areas like Michigan, Israel, and the Middle east. I'm about to get more in areas like Chicago and possibly Texas. 

I sparred with people before. Check my channel to hear some stories. 

Pretty good resume. Subscribe to my channel if you like it.


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## Isaiah90 (Jul 24, 2018)

pgsmith said:


> Obviously, since you're asking people to give you money, you must be a self defense expert with impressive credentials that allow you to understand self defense better than anyone else. Care to share those credentials, or are we expected to just take your word that you know what you're talking about?



Let's see. 

I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then. 

I taught several students in self defense. They live in areas like Michigan, Israel, and the Middle east. I'm about to get more in areas like Chicago and possibly Texas. 

I sparred with people before. Check my channel to hear some stories. 

Pretty good resume. Subscribe to my channel if you like it.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 24, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> Let's see.
> 
> I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then.
> 
> ...


None of that is high marks. It doesn't mean you can't teach well, but put it in perspective. I got my black belt in my primary art 10 years before you started training (and more than 10 years after I started in that art). And there are folks here who got their first BB before I started my MA journey. I've probably taught self-defense to a couple hundred people, and that's a small number. Some of the folks here have years of security, door work, and law-enforcement experience where they put their MA skills to use.

I consider myself a MA lightweight next to some of the folks here, so I'm not talking myself up. And remember that none of this means you can't offer a good product/service. But know where you are in your journey, and don't let yourself become convinced you've found answers others have missed. I've yet to find anyone who knew something a bunch of other people didn't also know.


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## frank raud (Jul 24, 2018)

Let's see. 

I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then. 

"I've trained in JKD, Wing Chun, boxing, weapon disarms, BJJ, and various skills for 8 years. I've sparred to make sure my methods work."

Are you a better instructor than you are at basic math?


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## pgsmith (Jul 24, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> Let's see.
> 
> I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then.
> 
> ...



That's pretty much what I thought from your earlier posts. It's good to have confidence in yourself and your abilities. However, it is equally important to be realistic about your knowledge and abilities, and this is where you need to improve yourself, in my opinion. What your self-described "pretty good resume" tells me, is that you've played around with various martial arts for a few years. Since you didn't list any instructors, I am assuming that most of your training has come from videos and seminars, with maybe a few visits to a couple of dojo combined with some sparring with your friends. This means that you have learned just enough to get your feet wet, but you've not learned enough to realize how very much more there is under the surface.

  The reality is that you are quite inexperienced, so it's not unusual for you to see what others are doing from a one dimensional viewpoint. The problem that I see is that since you don't understand what is happening below the surface, you are mistakenly thinking that others are not understanding what they're doing rather than *you* not understanding what they're doing. Not trying to put you down or anything, just trying to empty your cup a little as you seem to have it over filled.


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## Headhunter (Jul 25, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> Let's see.
> 
> I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then.
> 
> ...


Wow 5 years that's really impressive obviously with that huge amount of training of course you're an expert ....I hope you can sense the sarcasm.
5 years is barely any time at all when it comes to martial art development. I've got gis that have been in use triple the time you've been training.

You sparred with people before? Um yeah so has pretty much every martial art student and no I won't check out your channel because I'm sure it's full of the same nonsense your posting on here.

Pretty good resume? Well if you say so I'm not talking down on your skills as I don't know you but just reading that doesn't make me think wow this guys a guy I really want to learn off


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jul 25, 2018)

Isaiah90 said:


> Let's see.
> 
> I started practicing martial arts since 2013 and improving since then.
> 
> ...


Its not just that these guys are older tham you, so they have more experience then you. Im the same age as you and have been training for 15 more years than you. I still dont consider myself all that experienced...


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