# was the instructor trying injure me?



## jeff_78632 (May 5, 2019)

was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up. 

i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss

whats your thoughts.


----------



## Tony Dismukes (May 5, 2019)

You shouldn’t be injured though the Thai pads. It can hurt a bit at first, especially if the pads are worn out and your partner is a strong kicker, but it won’t actually damage you and your body will adapt. I expect that your instructor knows the difference between discomfort and injury.


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf (May 5, 2019)

I'm seconding what Tony said. You may not like the feeling, but it probably went away after a bit of not holding the pads. Some level of pain is to be expected, that's part of body conditioning.

If you get some serious bruises from it, or it's still hurting the next day, I would talk to your instructor about it before/after class.


----------



## Headhunter (May 6, 2019)

No he's right. It's a pad why should the guy lighten up his training that's the point of pads so you can kick 100%. The instructor did nothing wrong


----------



## Dirty Dog (May 6, 2019)

Are you really operating under the delusion that you can train any sort of martial art without getting bruises?
The instructor is right. Suck it up, Buttercup.


----------



## drop bear (May 6, 2019)

Tony Dismukes said:


> You shouldn’t be injured though the Thai pads. It can hurt a bit at first, especially if the pads are worn out and your partner is a strong kicker, but it won’t actually damage you and your body will adapt. I expect that your instructor knows the difference between discomfort and injury.



You can be if a guy can really murder a kick.


----------



## marques (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


That’s hard to tell if he thinks you can absorb more than you think you can, or if actually he does not want you there.

I would give the benefit of doubt; you (or your instructor) may change opinion. But I also quit at first injury (bruises and muscles hurting are fine, not articulations or concussions).


----------



## Buka (May 6, 2019)

Welcome to Martial Talk, Jeff.

Might I suggest a man bun. Instructors dig that.


----------



## Deleted member 39746 (May 6, 2019)

Buka said:


> Might I suggest a man bun.



What about a buzzcut?  Certain ones might like that better.    

I really dont know the scope for bruises as a injury, but shouldn't they lower the force if asked to, to some extent or make a effort to?


----------



## Headhunter (May 6, 2019)

Rat said:


> What about a buzzcut?  Certain ones might like that better.
> 
> I really dont know the scope for bruises as a injury, but shouldn't they lower the force if asked to, to some extent or make a effort to?


No because they're doing pad work..not sparring. Pads are there to be hit at 100% why should that guy not get proper workout. Plus if he can't even deal with holding pads how's he going to handle getting kicked. You've got to toughen up that's the learning curve


----------



## Dirty Dog (May 6, 2019)

Rat said:


> What about a buzzcut?  Certain ones might like that better.
> 
> I really dont know the scope for bruises as a injury, but shouldn't they lower the force if asked to, to some extent or make a effort to?



Absolutely not. The whole point of pad work is to develop the ability to strike with power. Not a little power. All the power.


----------



## Yokozuna514 (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


No, the instructor was not trying to hurt you.  More than likely he was trying to show you what you are in for if you train in that class/school.   Your body will adapt to the work if you put the time and energy into your training but you need to decide if this is the right place for you.


----------



## Danny T (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


1st off...how long have you been training or holding pads?
What about the person kicking?

I never have beginners hold for good kickers who are kicking 'hard'. 
Why? 
1.  They don't know how to hold or feed the pads correctly and someone is going to get hurt. More often it's the kicker. So I have beginners hold for seasoned kickers as a warm up so the seasoned kicker can help the beginner while learning the timing on holding for kicks and no one gets hurt. 
2.  They aren't tempered to hold for 'hard' kickers. A few bruises on the arms isn't the problem. Bone bruises to arms and ribs will prevent one from wanting to train. Tempering is a process and happens over time. 
3.  Improper feeding or holding of the pads can jack up a beginner's shoulders and not having the timing to be in the proper position can again cause injury to either the holder or the kicker.

Hold for others in your level and grow from there.


----------



## jobo (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


yes he was trying to injure you, not badly and possibly in his mind for your own good,  I have the same issue of fellow students complaining of pain if I hit a pad at full force, so generally I dont, I've also been on the receiving end of blows that cause mild pain even through a pad. which I then return when it's their turn to hold and then some of them complain . it seems the modern world  that people complain ,! perhaps he doesn't like you as your soft and bringing his class into disrepute 


you either need to find a class that has a lighter touch,  theres a lot  of them about and really MT  is the very wrong choice for you. or you nneed to toughen uyou how are you going to take a kick with no pad if you cant stand the pain with a pad


----------



## Martial D (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


 
Sounds like you need more practice holding the pads.


----------



## Gerry Seymour (May 6, 2019)

Rat said:


> What about a buzzcut?  Certain ones might like that better.
> 
> I really dont know the scope for bruises as a injury, but shouldn't they lower the force if asked to, to some extent or make a effort to?


Maybe. Maybe not. Sometimes people aren't used to discomfort (which doesn't usually signal injury), and will ask to back off because it doesn't feel good. But many things require discomfort, including body conditioning.


----------



## Martial D (May 6, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> Maybe. Maybe not. Sometimes people aren't used to discomfort (which doesn't usually signal injury), and will ask to back off because it doesn't feel good. But many things require discomfort, including body conditioning.


I firmly believe if something isn't sore after training, you need to train harder. Sometimes it sore muscles, sometimes it's bruising.

There are several people I train with(one of which is a 5 foot nothing girl) that can(and do) leave bruises on my ribs with round kicks THROUGH the thick as heck heavy duty kickshield.

It is what it is.


----------



## Jaeimseu (May 6, 2019)

I believe there’s a lot of gray area here. For kicking paddle targets power shouldn’t be an issue. Accuracy is the key to not hurting a training partner. For kicking shields or Thai pads, I believe the size and experience of the kicker and holder is important. Abusing a partner who isn’t comfortable with the level of contact is a dick move, IMO. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Headhunter (May 6, 2019)

Jaeimseu said:


> I believe there’s a lot of gray area here. For kicking paddle targets power shouldn’t be an issue. Accuracy is the key to not hurting a training partner. For kicking shields or Thai pads, I believe the size and experience of the kicker and holder is important. Abusing a partner who isn’t comfortable with the level of contact is a dick move, IMO.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If it was sparring I'd agree but it's pads it's all about kicking your hardest that's the point of pad work. Yeah Thai pads suck and can hurt your arms. I've had heavyweight Muay Thai fighters kicking them with me holding and I'm a welterweight so yeah it sucks but it's not going to injure you just got to learn to take it


----------



## Headhunter (May 6, 2019)

Martial D said:


> I firmly believe if something isn't sore after training, you need to train harder. Sometimes it sore muscles, sometimes it's bruising.
> 
> There are several people I train with(one of which is a 5 foot nothing girl) that can(and do) leave bruises on my ribs with round kicks THROUGH the thick as heck heavy duty kickshield.
> 
> It is what it is.


Yep. For sparring yeah you pull your shots a little but pads hell no. If you start hitting pads lightly then you spar not as heavy you're never getting used to throwing full power shots and if you're a fighter that's bad news.  I've come away with bruises from training. Whatever they're bruises they'll heal who cares


----------



## drop bear (May 6, 2019)

Headhunter said:


> Yep. For sparring yeah you pull your shots a little but pads hell no. If you start hitting pads lightly then you spar not as heavy you're never getting used to throwing full power shots and if you're a fighter that's bad news.  I've come away with bruises from training. Whatever they're bruises they'll heal who cares



I think most people do pads wrong anyway. Which is why people then hit slow and doughy.

You are trying to get fast crisp impact. You are not trying to knock the pad back.


----------



## dvcochran (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.


Jeff, I hope you jump back into this thread. Welcome to the forum. I agree with the general theme that pad work is intended for the striker too practice full power. Maybe the instructor is a jerk, I have no clue. You either need to have a conversation with them or someone in class you trust to see if you are doing something wrong with how you are holding the pad. I have seen more than a few people cause themselves bruises by being really aggressive with how they hold the target. You need to learn how to hold a good solid target but shed the power when possible. I have also seen worn Thai pads that are equal to no pad at all. I remember many times going through the stack of pads looking for the ones that were not flat in the middle. I prefer DOUBLE paddle targets over Thai pads for body work if I trust my partner not to miss too much. I feel they hold up much better and absorb the contact better.  
Remember, it isn't ballet class. I couldn't resist.


----------



## jeff_78632 (May 6, 2019)

finding out now i prefer bjj to mt. i find the people in bjj more reserve and peaceful than MT crowd. bjj also more safer. might end up doing judo at rec centre. way cheaper than these mma schools. 
i got big bruise on back of my forearm. next time going pick a smaller person as partner. i got few more weeks and my contract is fiished


----------



## Tony Dismukes (May 6, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> finding out now i prefer bjj to mt. i find the people in bjj more reserve and peaceful than MT crowd. bjj also more safer. might end up doing judo at rec centre. way cheaper than these mma schools.
> i got big bruise on back of my forearm. next time going pick a smaller person as partner. i got few more weeks and my contract is fiished


I hate to break it to you, but you will get bruised in BJJ as well.


----------



## drop bear (May 6, 2019)

Tony Dismukes said:


> I hate to break it to you, but you will get bruised in BJJ as well.



Back of the forearm also means he is holding pads wrong.


----------



## Jaeimseu (May 7, 2019)

Headhunter said:


> If it was sparring I'd agree but it's pads it's all about kicking your hardest that's the point of pad work. Yeah Thai pads suck and can hurt your arms. I've had heavyweight Muay Thai fighters kicking them with me holding and I'm a welterweight so yeah it sucks but it's not going to injure you just got to learn to take it



I tend to see everything through a school owner’s lense. Also, I’m not typically training “fighters.” I don’t want students quitting over stuff like this in their first few months. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Headhunter (May 7, 2019)

Tony Dismukes said:


> I hate to break it to you, but you will get bruised in BJJ as well.


Yeah I've currently got bruised ribs because a guy about 10 stone heavier than me mounted me and dropped his weight right on me


----------



## Headhunter (May 7, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> finding out now i prefer bjj to mt. i find the people in bjj more reserve and peaceful than MT crowd. bjj also more safer. might end up doing judo at rec centre. way cheaper than these mma schools.
> i got big bruise on back of my forearm. next time going pick a smaller person as partner. i got few more weeks and my contract is fiished


Lol bjj is definetley not safer. Maybe when it comes to concussions there's less but even then you can still get concussed in bjj. When your in that tight with someone it's easy for a knee or elbow to hit your head. Plus your getting your limbs yanked so it's easy to get injured on your arms, legs, neck etc, you can also get choked unconscious if your not careful. 

If you don't like bruises you won't like bjj. I've had more bruises and injuries from bjj than Muay Thai. 

You got a bruise? Okay you got a bruise so what? Trust me you're going to get a lot worse in bjj


----------



## MetalBoar (May 7, 2019)

Headhunter said:


> Lol bjj is definetley not safer. Maybe when it comes to concussions there's less but even then you can still get concussed in bjj. When your in that tight with someone it's easy for a knee or elbow to hit your head. Plus your getting your limbs yanked so it's easy to get injured on your arms, legs, neck etc, you can also get choked unconscious if your not careful.
> 
> If you don't like bruises you won't like bjj. I've had more bruises and injuries from bjj than Muay Thai.
> 
> You got a bruise? Okay you got a bruise so what? Trust me you're going to get a lot worse in bjj


Yeah, I'm not even so sure there are fewer concussions in BJJ. I know a friend of mine who picked up BJJ after years of Muay Thai and boxing said that he felt BJJ was riskier in that regard than Muay Thai. Not that he thought it was particularly unsafe nor that it would keep him from doing BJJ, just that he felt that it was something to pay attention to in his training.


----------



## Deleted member 39746 (May 7, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> Maybe. Maybe not. Sometimes people aren't used to discomfort (which doesn't usually signal injury), and will ask to back off because it doesn't feel good. But many things require discomfort, including body conditioning.



Maybe so, but if you cause someone to have a dead arm and thus to stop for 5 minuets, thats 5 minuets of pad work you don't get, despite the issue of its not your body and all that. 

Should really be a break in period for pad work and only go a comfortable speed for both parties, they don't have to stand there and go through it and would ironically be paying to go through it.       Some people can tolerate it more and all that and they might not be in the mood to get a dead arm through pad work that day and so on.  

Still seems two fold a respect point and a training period point.  Not undermining some actual pain being inflicted via holding a pad, but if its your first day kind of steep to hold one for a the equal of a black belt for 30 minuets with little in the respect of breaks per say.


----------



## Headhunter (May 7, 2019)

Rat said:


> Maybe so, but if you cause someone to have a dead arm and thus to stop for 5 minuets, thats 5 minuets of pad work you don't get, despite the issue of its not your body and all that.
> 
> Should really be a break in period for pad work and only go a comfortable speed for both parties, they don't have to stand there and go through it and would ironically be paying to go through it.       Some people can tolerate it more and all that and they might not be in the mood to get a dead arm through pad work that day and so on.
> 
> Still seems two fold a respect point and a training period point.  Not undermining some actual pain being inflicted via holding a pad, but if its your first day kind of steep to hold one for a the equal of a black belt for 30 minuets with little in the respect of breaks per say.


No one holds pads for 30 minutes non stop.....that never happens the very most is about 10 minutes if your doing 5 continuous rounds maybe and even then you get a 1 minute break in between.

Also why would you need a 5 minute break for a dead arm? A minute would be enough to shake it off and carry on


----------



## Headhunter (May 7, 2019)

MetalBoar said:


> Yeah, I'm not even so sure there are fewer concussions in BJJ. I know a friend of mine who picked up BJJ after years of Muay Thai and boxing said that he felt BJJ was riskier in that regard than Muay Thai. Not that he thought it was particularly unsafe nor that it would keep him from doing BJJ, just that he felt that it was something to pay attention to in his training.


Depends on the gym. If a Muay Thai gym spars daily they're more likely to pick up concusion than a bjj school that focuses on drills more than rolling. But yeah most Muay Thai gyms mix up the sparring with pads and bag work and drills.

I know an Mma fighter who had to pull out w match because he got concussion. Not from Mma sparring but from bjj rolling where he took a knee to the need off a guy on the bottom


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf (May 7, 2019)

I'm confused by this thread in general, both the OP and some of the responses. Why would you expect not to experience any pain when learning to fight?


----------



## Headhunter (May 7, 2019)

kempodisciple said:


> I'm confused by this thread in general, both the OP and some of the responses. Why would you expect not to experience any pain when learning to fight?


Not not just martial arts. You'll get pain from doing any type of sport. Football, tennis, golf or whatever there'll be some sort of pain. Tiger woods has made major knee surgery, had shoulder injuries amongst other stuff so of course your going to get a few knocks in martial arts but as long as it's not putting you in hospital or a position you can't go to work then who cares


----------



## W.Bridges (May 23, 2019)

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="Demetri Gets Scared of Kreese - Cobra Kai Season 2 Funny Scene - YouTube" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


----------



## thanson02 (May 25, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> was doing a kick boxing class and the student i was paired up with had a strong roundhouse kick, i was holding thai pads for him. i told the student to kick lighter and he did as it was hurting my arms, but instructor came along and edged him to kick harder even when student said yea he cant handle the kick . i could take it for 6 kicks but after that my arms started to really hurt. i evaded one kick as it was too hard and instructor said you need toughen up.
> 
> i think instructor was trying in injure me. my arm is bruised also got feeling instructor doesnt like me as he didnt come along and give me pointers in my technique but he did with other studentss
> 
> whats your thoughts.



There are a lot of reasons why an instructor would not come by and give you pointers in a class.  Sometimes it is because he gets swamped with other students.  It also depends on how big your class is.  Maybe the lesson for you in that class is that it is hard to be in a fight if you are not able to take a hit.  I am not saying that to be mean, but you will get hit when you fight and that is just a reality of what we do.  Whether you realize it or not, he was actually being kind.  At least he was using pads and not having you kick a tree with rope wrapped around it (yup, that is a conditioning drill with some arts).

If there was bruising, use standard first aid methods for handling bruises, and accept that you will have this happen again.  If anything, make the conditioning to take a hit a challenge to step up to.  Eventually the bruising will stop and those kicks will not seem bad at all.


----------



## JR 137 (May 25, 2019)

I’m going to play devil’s advocate for a minute here...

New students should be taught how to properly hold pads. It shouldn’t be “here hold this” and let more advanced students tee off on you. 

And the person hitting the pads should know if the guy doesn’t know what he’s doing, then he shouldn’t be teeing off on the pads either.

Just like everything else, there’s a progression. 

But yeah, expect bumps and bruises. Expect that people are going to occasionally hurt you, within reason. Expect you’re going to hurt others, within reason. To quote the great Sensei Kreese: This is a dojo, not a knitting class.


----------



## JP3 (May 25, 2019)

Buka said:


> Welcome to Martial Talk, Jeff.
> 
> Might I suggest a man bun. Instructors dig that.


----------



## JP3 (May 25, 2019)

Buka I was going to suggest a pink gi… I didn't even think of the man bun. excellent.

We used to call snowflakes twinkies. Similar concept, different generation's word..


----------



## Buka (May 25, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> I’m going to play devil’s advocate for a minute here...
> 
> New students should be taught how to properly hold pads. It shouldn’t be “here hold this” and let more advanced students tee off on you.
> 
> ...



Those are important points. New students should be taught everything that has to do with training, especially holding pads or assisting anyone in anything. These things should be taught with the same care and detail as anything else - rules, principles, techniques, whatever. 

I also believe students should be taught to help and support each other, to lift each other up, to have each other's back. 

And sparring....I'm always the first person each and every one of my students spars with. I want to show them the rules and make sure they know them. I want to show them the difference in power with every technique, the etiquettes involved, the differences between bag work, air work, shield work and sparring.

If we don't show them ourselves, who's going to show them? Other white belts?


----------



## JR 137 (May 25, 2019)

Buka said:


> Those are important points. New students should be taught everything that has to do with training, especially holding pads or assisting anyone in anything. These things should be taught with the same care and detail as anything else - rules, principles, techniques, whatever.
> 
> I also believe students should be taught to help and support each other, to lift each other up, to have each other's back.
> 
> ...


I think some instructors think they’ll just figure it out on their own, unfortunately. Holding pads isn’t rocket science, but I’ve seen white belts hold them for advanced ranks who weren’t exactly holding much back. And it was never good. And you typically don’t want the smallest guy holding the pads for the heaviest hitters either. I was at my former teacher’s dojo a little over a year ago for a seminar. We were working on punching and somehow I ended up paired with a 90 lb woman. I was taking it easy, but she still struggled a bit. I looked at the guy running it and he looked at me and immediately paired me up with a few people my size. Problem solved. That’s how it’s supposed to work. You really don’t get much out of hitting pads when the holder has no clue or just physically shouldn’t be holding them for you. And the holder gets less out of it.

But yeah... expect a lot of bumps and bruises along the way. Battle wounds every now and then are a good thing.


----------



## JP3 (May 26, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> I think some instructors think they’ll just figure it out on their own, unfortunately. Holding pads isn’t rocket science, but I’ve seen white belts hold them for advanced ranks who weren’t exactly holding much back. And it was never good. And you typically don’t want the smallest guy holding the pads for the heaviest hitters either. I was at my former teacher’s dojo a little over a year ago for a seminar. We were working on punching and somehow I ended up paired with a 90 lb woman. I was taking it easy, but she still struggled a bit. I looked at the guy running it and he looked at me and immediately paired me up with a few people my size. Problem solved. That’s how it’s supposed to work. You really don’t get much out of hitting pads when the holder has no clue or just physically shouldn’t be holding them for you. And the holder gets less out of it.
> 
> But yeah... expect a lot of bumps and bruises along the way. Battle wounds every now and then are a good thing.


Battle wounds, or training stress, damage and injuries are part and parcel of the training, wouldn't you guys/gals all say?  I think that maybe the usual discussion about what is expected of the student, and the similar lecture about what is expected to happen TO the student in the O/P … went missing.  Maybe that's why the disconnect in the perception?


----------



## Flying Crane (May 26, 2019)

JP3 said:


> Battle wounds, or training stress, damage and injuries are part and parcel of the training, wouldn't you guys/gals all say?  I think that maybe the usual discussion about what is expected of the student, and the similar lecture about what is expected to happen TO the student in the O/P … went missing.  Maybe that's why the disconnect in the perception?


Yeah, kinda, and within reason.

But the old stories of “the night ain’t over until there is blood on the floor” is stupid, plain and simple.  There is nothing intelligent about that approach to training.


----------



## JP3 (May 26, 2019)

Flying Crane said:


> Yeah, kinda, and within reason.
> 
> But the old stories of “the night ain’t over until there is blood on the floor” is stupid, plain and simple.  There is nothing intelligent about that approach to training.


----------



## JP3 (May 26, 2019)

Yep. I hardly ever have blood on the floor when we leave class anymore.

As a matter of fact, the last time we did... it was mine.

I was working through an application of one of the kata techniques off of a wrist grab, so that the female students in class could actually visualize the... bridge? I guess I'll call it a bridge between the principle-based practice of technique vs. an application of such technique in a fast, high-power SD situation.  Long story short (the long version is hilarious) I got the concept in her head, told her I was coming to take her lunch money and she wasn't going to do a damn thing about it if she didn't eexecute the technique right .. and I dropped on her like a house with tentacles....

… and she threw me into a nearby wall... face-first. It was awesome!  Split the skin ofmy nose right down the middle of the bridge, vertically.  Super cool, actually. I didn't even feel the skin split... though I certainly felt the wall. They had to tell me.


----------



## Danny T (May 26, 2019)

jeff_78632 said:


> finding out now i prefer bjj to mt. i find the people in bjj more reserve and peaceful than MT crowd. bjj also more safer. might end up doing judo at rec centre. way cheaper than these mma schools.
> i got big bruise on back of my forearm. next time going pick a smaller person as partner. i got few more weeks and my contract is fiished





Tony Dismukes said:


> I hate to break it to you, but you will get bruised in BJJ as well.


If BJJ is more reserve and peaceful I'm doing something wrong.
Have had more black eyes, sorer ribs and shoulders, and cuts on my face than I've every had from Muay Thai.


----------



## Buka (May 26, 2019)

I don't like "blood on the floor" dojos. But I must admit that having visited a few as a young Karateka, totally by accident mind you, that I am a better Martial Artist, a better teacher, and quite frankly a better man for it. Please don't mistake any of that for me approving of this kind of dojo, for I honestly do not. I think my experiences were more representative of a particular time in America's martial history than anything else.

I want to get back to this later. E-mailed a long time Mrtial buddy for the names and stats involved because I forget them. He wants me to call him because he says it's way too long to write back. I could almost hear him laughing through his e-mail.


----------



## drop bear (May 26, 2019)

JP3 said:


> Yep. I hardly ever have blood on the floor when we leave class anymore.
> 
> As a matter of fact, the last time we did... it was mine.
> 
> ...



Last time for us was Saturday.


----------



## Gerry Seymour (May 26, 2019)

JP3 said:


> like a house with tentacles....


I don’t have any idea what that means, but it’s my new favorite phrase.


----------



## Gerry Seymour (May 26, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Last time for us was Saturday.


The last time I had actual blood in the floor was mine, too. Years ago, I decided to go to class a few hours after giving blood. It turns out those IV needle sites need more time to heal.


----------



## Buka (May 26, 2019)

To me “blood on the floor” dojo’s are not literal. Any place that has contact fighting is going to have some blood, because it”s contact fighting. Duh.

The term, as least as we used the concept on the East coast, was more of an attitude that a few dojo’s had. Some of which boarded on criminal. Unsurprising, at least to me, some of the people involved in running them are still in prison. Or dead.


----------



## kickboxingtalk (May 31, 2019)

Hi,

It’s part and parcel of body conditioning. Plus helps to deal with the ‘shock’ of getting hurt as with most martial arts it’s to be expected.

Best Regards
Jay


----------

