# Question on Forms Origin



## YounWha (Dec 5, 2007)

Here are the forms we are using in our system:
Can you tell me where they originated?
(spelling may be off)

Koryo 
Batsai
Chulgi Form 1
Chulgi Form 2
No-pe (Nope'?)
Sip Soo
Youn Bi (Yoon Bi)
Chulgi Form 3
Pyung-Won
Sip Jin
Kong San Kun
Du-Tae
38-So
Hun-Kwon
Han-Soo
Il-Yu
Palgi-Kwon
Youn Wha Jang
Keum-Gang-Jang

I know some of these are NOT Korean...

Thanks


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## Chizikunbo (Dec 5, 2007)

YounWha said:


> Here are the forms we are using in our system:
> Can you tell me where they originated?
> (spelling may be off)



Koryo - Created by World Tae Kwon Do Federation (WTF)

Batsai - This form is know as Bassai or Bal Sae, or even Pal Che as well in the Korean arts, in Japanese it is called Passai, or Bassai.

Chulgi Form 1 - This form is know traditionally as Naihanchi, it is the first in a series of three, and it originates probably 900 years ago, in the city of FooChow in Fukien Province, China. It is based on white crane fist. The form was originally one form, and was later broken down into three forms by Yasutsune Itosu (in Korean "Idos")
Chulgi Form 2 - See above

No-pe (Nope'?) - This form is also known as Rohai (in Japanese), it come from Okinawa. It translates as "White Heron"

Sip Soo - This form is translated as "10 Hands" it also comes in its modern form from Okinawa, where it is known as Jutte, it is based on Tiger/Crane fist style, from China.

Youn Bi (Yoon Bi)- Another one from Okinawa, Japanese name is Wanshu, other Korean spelling is commonly Wangshu...

Chulgi Form 3 - See other Chulgi info

Pyung-Won - Created by WTF

Sip Jin - Created by WTF

Kong San Kun - This is another traditional form, originally from Okinawa, where is is known as Kusanku. It is said to be based on the fighting techniques of Kong San Kun (Kusanku) who was a Chinese emissary, living on Okinawa.

Du-Tae - ???

38-So - I am getting "Sam Ship Pal So", I am guessing the name refers to the lesser form as "Sam Ship Pal", the greater would be "Dae", but I could be wrong on the translation, So may also be a different romanization of BO which would then mean "step", so 38 Steps. Possibly you are referring to Ee Ship Sa Bo (24 Steps, Japanese: Niseishi) or Oh Ship Sa Bo (54 Steps, Japanese: Gojushiho), both of those are traditional Okinawan forms that also made there way to China, the style of Oh Ship Sa Bo is said to be that resembling a drunkard, to deceive an opponent.

Hun-Kwon - Created by WTF?

Han-Soo - Created by WTF

Il-Yu - Created by WTF, I have usually seen this one as "Il Yo" which symbolizes the unification of Korea, it is the last form in the WTF syllabus, and the floor pattern traces a manji, which is a symbol of the Buddhist heart, and compassion/unity.

Palgi-Kwon - Never heard of this one either, the translation I am getting is PAL KI KWON or 8 Fist? Possibly you are referring to "Ship Pal Ki Kwon" which would be 18 Fist, and that is a traditional style from Korea/China.

Youn Wha Jang - Created by WTF

Keum-Gang-Jang - Created by WTF

Hope That Helps ;-)
--josh


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## Master K (Dec 6, 2007)

Kukkiwon Forms (Associated with the WTF)
----------------------------------------
Koryo
Pyung-Won
Sip Jin
Du-Tae --- Possibly Jitae?
Hun-Kwon --- Probably Chun Kwon
Han-Soo
Il-Yu
Keum-Gang-Jang  --- Probably Keumgang


Okinawan/Japanese Forms
----------------------------------------
Batsai - Common Korean Names: Passai, Bassai, & Palche
Chulgi Form 1 - Common Korean Name: Naihanji Chodan
Chulgi Form 2 - Common Korean Name: Naihanji Edan
No-pe (Nope'?) - Common Korean Names: Lo Hai, Ro Hai
Sip Soo - Common Korean Names: Sip Soo, Ship Soo
Youn Bi (Yoon Bi) - Common Korean Name: Wang Shu
Chulgi Form 3 - Common Korean Name: Naihanji Samdan
Kong San Kun - Common Korean Name: Kong San Koon

Forms of Unknown Origin
----------------------------------------
38-So
Palgi-Kwon
Youn Wha Jang

Please list out the first few beginning movements of the three forms of unknown origin so I can assist with identifying them.  

I should also mention that I find it interesting that one black belt Kukkiwon form is missing from your curriculum.


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## YounWha (Dec 6, 2007)

Forms of Unknown Origin
----------------------------------------
38-So
Palgi-Kwon
Youn Wha Jang

I couldn't tell ya since I am not that high yet.  But I do know that
Palgi-Kwon - according to *rmclain* here is a chuan-fa form - from Yoon, Byung In's style.

Someone presented the idea to me that Youn Wha translation and spelling may be a little off.  I was told Youn Wha translates to "water lily" by my instructor (master).  Now if you change the word a bit to Yeon Hwa - that translation means "lotus flower" which is a type of water lily.
Maybe all this time the original students of GMH (1970-80's) was trying to spell what GMH was saying wrong.  Just an idea that I am going to research.

Ideas on that?


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## YounWha (Dec 6, 2007)

Master K said:


> I should also mention that I find it interesting that one black belt Kukkiwon form is missing from your curriculum.


 
Which one?


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## YounWha (Dec 7, 2007)

Update:

Du-Tae and Hun-Kwon were misspelled.

They are Ji-Tae & Chun Kwon...success !


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## Chizikunbo (Dec 7, 2007)

I believe Chun Kwon is maybe Cheon Won? Which is a WTF TKD form. Ji-Tae is one of the older Tang Soo Do style hyung, and that is actually the Japanaese/Okinawan pronunciation which is more properly "Chinte"...the Korean version would be "Choong Soo" it translates as "Extraordinary Hand" or "Rare Hand"...

best wishes,
--josh


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## rmclain (Dec 7, 2007)

Ji-tae (Jee Tae) was also the name of a form created by the KTA in 1967 along with Koryo, Tae Baek, etc.  Ji-tae is a 5th Dan to 6th Dan form requirement for WTF Black Belts. 

R. McLain





Chizikunbo said:


> I believe Chun Kwon is maybe Cheon Won? Which is a WTF TKD form. Ji-Tae is one of the older Tang Soo Do style hyung, and that is actually the Japanaese/Okinawan pronunciation which is more properly "Chinte"...the Korean version would be "Choong Soo" it translates as "Extraordinary Hand" or "Rare Hand"...
> 
> best wishes,
> --josh


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