# MartialTalk Need Your Help....



## Bob Hubbard

MartialTalk.com is facing a serious cash flow problem. 

The cost of our hosting has risen beyond what I can comfortably support myself. Each month we see over 2,500 daily visitors. As a result, we are using more and more server resources. This has forced me to upgrade the hosting account to a higher, and more expensive, level of service. As a result, we are now at a crossroads. If we are to continue to grow and expand, we need to find a way to support this growth financially. 

Ive thought long and hard about all the options available. 

-We can stop our growth here: Cease adding new features, stop allowing new members to sign up, and so on. That goes against what we all want.

-We can switch to a paid-membership system. I believe this would only hurt us, and therefore, this option is out. MartialTalk will remain free.

-We can find new sources of income. Ive always tried to cover the costs of running this site through sponsorships. Unfortunately, weve grown faster than weve added new sponsors.

The short of it is, we need to raise some funding fast or the long-term future of MartialTalk is at risk. I believe that most of you enjoy this site and appreciate the work that goes into it by myself, our staff, and most importantly, your fellow members.

I dont believe in something for nothing and I'm not looking for donations. I definitely dont like having to ask for help. Im asking every member who cares about this site, who wants to ensure it continues on for years to come, to find a way to help out. To meet this goal, I ask that you please consider taking out a 1 year subscription to MartialTalk Magazine. Its only $12 per year, and all the money goes right back into keeping MartialTalk up, running and growing. Please, check out our free first issue right now.

If you have a school or organization, please consider sponsoring a forum. It's great visibility for you and it helps us keep growing.

I hate to ask for help. But, we need it. Please, if you enjoy this site, and if you want to see it continue to grow and expand, we need your support. MartialTalk simply cannot continue at this level of service without additional funds. A MartialTalk Magazine subscription is an inexpensive way to help, and it brings you great content from and about some of the leaders of the arts. Please consider subscribing today!

Thank you.

Bob Hubbard
Owner & Administrator, MartialTalk.com


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## MA-Caver

I see nothing wrong with your request for funds to keep MartialTalk.com up and running. When it is possible I'll subscribe. 
I would also put out a feeler to the sponsors (many are probably members here) about an increase in their fees...if only by a few dollars. 
Likewise a call to all members to get their schools sponsoring the discussion board. Also what about simple contributions? Aye getting sticky here but create a poll and see what the other members think.


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## oldnewbie

Subscribe? Consider it done.


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## Michael Billings

... but it is hard to plan a monthly budget that way.  

For a one-time capital outlay, like a new processor, let' set up a "Get MT more memory fund" or "Get MT dual processor fund".  Seeing a goal and it being time limited often gets more donations than an open ended "we need money" plea.

If you can subscribe, then do.  I have a couple of accounts and sites hosted at MartialTalk, as another way of donating to the forum.  Those who pay for web hosting, as I did, may want to consider hosting at MT.  Bob gives great rates and the service cannot be beat!

-MB


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## Cruentus

For the record, I still vote for a paid membership...like something under 10 bucks a year.

Then again...we;ve talked over this one over the phone already Bob, and i do see your point! :asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

I'm considering a 'contributing member' idea, and will be adding that option soon.  I'm waiting on the release of the new version of the forum software which has the ability built in.  (I'd have to do some serious tinkering at this time to make it really work).

Thank you for the support.  It is very gratefully appreciated!

:asian:


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## pknox

I get paid in two weeks, and will be subscribing on that day.  Don't worry about asking for $$ - what you provide here is special, and I don't see a problem with paying for it.


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## gman

I will be subscribing to the magazine. That's very reasonable, you could get a couple more bucks too. Good luck.


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## Michelle

I will subscribe too...but what about an idea like the USN does with it's "Good Cause Auction".   It's a thread where members specficially donate things (usually knives due to the forum genre, but also things like training tapes, books, and even seminar slots or free training time) and then other members bid on the items... the proceeds go to keeping the site running and the upgrades necessary, etc.  

It works out nicely as the buyer gets something they want for a good price and the money keeps the forum that we love going...

Just a thought.

Michelle


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## Jay Bell

Hrm...how about an "auction" type of setup.  People wanting to get rid of old martial art books, videos and the like...and a percentage could go to MT?


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## Elfan

What about the Amazon.com partner program?  That may generate some additional revenue.


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## Bob Hubbard

I've been running the Amazon.com thing for a few months now...so far, haven't made a dime out of it.

The auction stuffs being considered, though I'm not ready to roll it out yet...still alot of work to do on it...  But definately keep the ideas coming.


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## Klondike93

> Please consider subscribing today




Done, all you had to do was ask.


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## arnisador

We really appreciate it!

-Arnisador
-MT Admin-


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## cdhall

> _Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz _
> *I dont believe in something for nothing and I'm not looking for donations. I definitely dont like having to ask for help. *



Don't ask for donations if you don't want to. But since Pay Pal is a bit expensive(right?) and you have the ability to run Credit Card transactions then you need a 

*VIRTUAL TIP JAR*
%think%

Just put a button somewhere up with the others to take "Tips."

No good Bartender would be without one.  I am so impressed with this idea that I put the bold tag on it.  I mean they are rewards for doing a good job and MT certainly qualifies there.  If you like, start the experiment in the cafe thread at first.

Also, if you want to do an auction, just do auctions on eBay if you like.  Start a thread here and link to each item as it goes up for auction.  They can be donated from members or you can go get something wholesale and auction it off.

I'll subscribe to the magazine, but honestly, I'd rather just give you $12 because I'm not likely going to read the magazine faithfully.

I think a Video Vault could be worth $12/yr though.  But I'm not sure what could/would/should go in it.


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## Bob Hubbard

A "TipJar" would be an idea.  I'd need to look into it more as my current processing really makes anything under $5 not worth the effort.

I appreciate the support.  So far, we've had 5 signups, with a few more promises to do so shortly.


I was asked what exactly is the problem.  This will be a little technical, but I'll try n do it in english so everyone can follow. (I sometime speak 'geek' too much I think.  )

martialtalk is 1 of about 200 websites on this server. It is using up over 70% of the resources though. In most cases, a site at MT's level is on a server all by itself.  To do that, where MT can run 'free' and not worry as much, will cost more than I can afford. I've had additional hardware installed in the existing server to balance things out a bit, but long term, we need to move MT off this box into its own home.  That will cost about $200/month, which I just dont have.

The alternative is to reduce some of the services we have to help cut back the load to a more 'server friendly' level.  That would mean removing Avatars, Signatures, Private Messagine, Searching, Smilies and more.  I don't want to do that cuz, I think those features are part of what makes this place fun.

If we can get 200 total new subscribers, that will fund us to either beef up this box so we have no worries, or move MT to its own home.  300 subscribers would allow a nice buffer for additional growth.  A plus is the site would be faster as its got everything to itself.

Another person asked "Bob, don't you own the server and arent you already giving MT the space"? 
Yes.  I own the hosting company, and have been donating the space.  MT has outgrown all of our regular plans and has been in the 'get your own box' stage for a while. I don't have the cashflow to afford that myself on my own.

I'm waiting on the release of the new forum software.  Once thats ready, I'll also be rolling out a 'premium' membership which will have some nice perks.  Regular memberships (what is currently there) will continue to be free.

Thank you for the support folks.  It is well apreciated.


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## pknox

Kaith -

Any idea when the new software will be rolling out?


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## cdhall

I think Mr. Billings said it.

Put up a "Total Board" and countdown from 300 new members.

Then maybe start a Telethon thread to get the 300 people to sign up.

It will be more effective than asking for 300 to just do it.  Like in a Nike commercial or something.

This is 300 magazine subscribers, right?  I'll be there shortly myself.


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## Bob Hubbard

pknox - New software is currently at Beta 7, we're expecting the first release candidate this month.  If they follow usual form, I expect the full release by New Years.  


Doug - I'll look into it.  Good Idea.


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## Elfan

Antiwar.com recently had a fund drive. They had big giant annoying thing on top of the page with one of those "we are this close to are goal" theometers.  Their goal was $30000 and they said the annoying crap at the top of the page was going to last untill they reached that goal.  I was like "great, that thing is going to be up forever."

It was gone in two days.


Antiwar.com and MT are *very* differnt sites but I wanted to share that story.


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## cdhall

I just thought of this.

Sell, for $1 or $3 or whatever, 1 html page that anyone can buy to upload a more detailed biography such as an enhanced version of our profiles, but with a photo and a small video clip.

This way people can direct each other to these pages and say "look" I look like this, I move like this, my bio says this.

It could
a. Make everyone more personable/relatable
b. Play to egos of people who want to put up a clip of how great they are
c. Serve as an ad for a system/style/school
d. Be a really cool gallery/reference/*Who's Who on Martial Talk* particularly if the video clips are mostly of favorite techniques
e. Generate more money if you charge $1 or whatever to allow the uploading/changing of an additional video clip or clips
f. Turn into a Contest/online tournament (done before I know) if you have us all submit 1 clip of a technique.  Then we can vote on that clip and it can be featured on the Hall of Fame Homepage or something.  Like a *Clip of the Month*.  Maybe someone would turn in a clip so cool that it would win several months in a row.

But clips must be kept small and short to make this work.

I can help you think of ways to do this for $5 instead if that is the credit card/ecommerce minimum threshold.  
%think%

P.S. You could charge $12/yr for this "page" and allow quarterly updates of the clips or something.  Maybe you could also sell 3 video updates for $5.  Just more ideas.  Never say die!


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## TallAdam85

i would be willing to pay up to 20 a year sorry but I am broke


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## Bob Hubbard

Ok...I looked into the Auction software, and the 'Classified Ad' software...so far, the freebies I've found well, stink....and the better ones cost some $$.  I'll keep looking...worse case, I'll 'roll our own' but it'll take time.

We're sort of caught in a catch 22... There is a lot of cool things we can do, but the more we do, the more server space/resources we use, which mean we need more $ to operate at full speed. 

Right now, we have had 6 new subscribers sign up.  We're hoping to hit 300 by months end.

Thank you again for the support!
:asian:


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## Zujitsuka

I'll support whatever you guys do.  This is my favorite forum.

Sincerely,


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## Bob Hubbard

The Tally so far:  
8 new subscribers (292 to go)
1 new advertiser
5 inquries on sponsorships.

Thank you for your support.

Can we hit 300 subscribers by the end of Oct?  
Can we hit $1,000 by November?


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## Michael Billings

I was visiting that "other" forum, where so many of our ex-kenpo guys went.  They just ask for $10 donations on the home page.  Very up front about it.  You want us here?  You have to help keep us running.

On MartialTalk you could do that ... or for $2 more, get a magazine and support your favorite forum???  What to do, what to do?  

*SUBSCRIBE!*

And thanks mucho (now why do I want to say Mojo now? - must be the Prof. Joe Lansdale book I just read.)

Peace - Out!
-MB


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## Bob Hubbard

Just some food for thought...
Alot of folks don't realize the costs in running a forum. Theres a ton of freebies out there, cheaper less featureful software, lower quality hosting, etc.

MT operating costs this year: Aprox $1600 
(Includes software fees, advertising, and an 'estimate' for hosting)

Expected costs for 2004 : Aprox $3,000 (due to increased hardware requirements.)
Add an additional $1,200 if we start doing real advertising in something like BlackBelt or Inside Kung Fu.

300 subscribers = $3,600.  Not enough for me to retire on, but enough to keep us running at full speed through most of 2004.

Our target goal is $5,000.  We're currently at $96.


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## Bob Hubbard

The Tally so far: 
9 new subscribers (291 to go)
1 new advertiser on schools page.
5 inquries on sponsorships, 1 new one.


Goal: $5,000
Reached: $208


Anyone wanting to send a check or money order for under $12:
send to
Bob Hubbard
PO Box 1372
Buffalo NY 14220

and make it payable to _Robert Hubbard_

Please make sure you include a note saying its for MartialTalk, and include your user name.  

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

Just a short note:
I'll be off line until Monday, so processing of subscriptions will be delayed until then.


Tally as of this AM:
9 new subscribers (291 to go)
1 new advertiser on schools page.
5 inquries on sponsorships, 1 new one.

Goal: $5,000
Reached: $208

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

Ok, I just got back from the successful WMAA camp in DE.  Met a lot of great folks there. 

I brought with me some hard copys of the current issues and sold out.  Was definately a good thing.  


Current tally:

Tally as of this message:
15 new subscribers (285 to go)
$13 profit on paper-issues
1 new advertiser on schools page.
5 inquries on sponsorships, 1 new one.

Goal: $5,000
Reached: $293

I should have all the new subscriptions processed shortly. Thank you for the patience and the support!

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

Current tally:

Tally as of this message:
16 new subscribers (284 to go)
$13 profit on paper-issues
1 new advertiser on schools page.  Typhoon Filipino School of Martial Arts
5 inquries on sponsorships, 2 new ones.
New Knife Forum Sponsor: Tribal Blade Fighting Arts 
Another forum spot being finalized.

Goal: $5,000
Reached: $385 (note: this is invoiced, not fully received yet)

:asian:


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## Fightfan00

NO PROBLEM FELLAS!Anything to help this great site!


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## Bob Hubbard

Just an update, no change since the last update. 

Site traffics been rising and again putting some strain on the server.  Without the funding to either expand the current server, or move MT to its own server I'm going to be forced to begin scaling back features. 

Just a reminder:
E-Zine subscriptions are only $12.  
You can get a dual subscription to both MT Magazine and The Martialist for $20

Advertisements on the schools directory start at $20/year,
with forum sponsorships at $80 per year.

See http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/adrates.htm for full advertising rates.

You can also send less than $12 by check or money order:
Bob Hubbard
PO Box 1372
Buffalo, NY 14220

Please be certain to note your MT username somewhere so I can give you credit.

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

In order to conserve server resources, we've had to shut down the chat room.  The chat room, though not heavily used ate up a lot of server resources (mysql querries for the techies).  At our current income level, we can not afford another server upgrade to support our requirements, nor can we afford to move to our own box which would allow us to add additional features.

To date, we've raised less than $500.


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## Bob Hubbard

Ok, I was just informed of an error on the e-zines subscription sign up form. If you've tried subscribing in the last few days and gotten a "page not found" error, please try again. It should be working correctly now. If you got that, the subscription did not go through.

I apologize for the inconvenience.




__________________


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## Ceicei

You mentioned you were looking into PayPal.  If it's a go, let me know when you have it all set up and I'll send some $$ to MartialTalk. 

- Ceicei


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## Bob Hubbard

PayPal Links:

Donation Page: http://martialtalk.com/donate.htm

Magazine Subscription page: http://martialtalk.com/magazine/paypal.htm

Please be certain to include your MT username.

Thank you!

:asian:


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## warder

Im a reader more than a poster, but when Kaith called I answered. And its a great deal. You get a subscription to Martial Talk Mag as well ans to The Martialist. Its a great deal. Until I subscribed, I was an avid reader of the free content of both magazines. Now I have full priveleges to all the articles. Its worth the money.  I cant recomenned them enough, and for the price, everyone wins. You will enjoy the articles and it will keep martialtalk alive. 
Frederick Warder


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## pknox

What the man said!


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## Bob Hubbard

Current tally:

Tally as of this message:
19 new subscribers (281 to go)
$13 profit on paper-issues
3 new advertisers
2 donations through Paypal

Goal: $5,000
Reached: $447.57 (note: this is invoiced, not fully received yet)


Note: We have a joint promotion with "The Martialist" ezine.  You can get 1 year subscriptions to -both- for only $18. 
See http://www.martialtalk.com/magazine/specialoffer.htm for more information.

:asian:


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## Michael Billings

PayPal'ed for the EZine a few minutes ago.  Misssed the Martialist special.  Darn, it looks like an awfully good deal.

-Michael


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## Bob Hubbard

Do a Donation for the $6 difference, make sure theres a comment there indicating its for the special, -AND- PM me here (so I can match everything up.) and I'll take care of the rest. 

Thanks!


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## Michael Billings

Done deal.  I donated and subscribed ... does it get any better?
-Michael


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## Michael Billings

I really enjoyed my new subscription.  I was going to donate anyway, but since I got MartialTalk and the Martialist at such a good deal, I decided I might as well get something for my $$'s.

How about it guys?  Donate or subscribe, you get what you give, or what goes around comes around.

-Michael


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## Rob Broad

As I stated here and other places before email accounts at $10/year could be a great boon for MT.  If you only get 10% of your members to buy 1 you will be up a couple grand.


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## Michael Billings

$10 is what some people spend on lunch.  Come on, let's get the chatroom back and a dedicated server or new processor.  One time kinda thing for the server.  I do not know how much for the bandwidth annually running in, but the subscriptions could pay for that.

Make it a Merry Christmas for all of us here at MartialTalk <<I hate asking for money>> that is why I subscribed first, bought webspace here for *Kenpo-Texas.com*, when I have other space free, and encouraged my Association to host here.  I want to support an on-line community I like.  Think about it guys, it is what we make it.

Merry-Merry,
-Michael


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## Michael Billings

* GIVE A MARTIALTALK MAGAZINE SUBSCRIPTION FOR:**
 CHRISTMAS, HANUKKAH, KWANZA, OR MID-WINTER SOLSTICE *

How about for a birthday gift, or to say "Thank you" to someone who taught a seminar for you ... or maybe to your "Most Improved Student", etc.  Let's get creative.



> *CLICK HERE TO SUBSCRIBE*



And I hope everyone has a safe, fun, holiday season.


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## Bob Hubbard

Just to update ya, so far, the total stands at $768.46

Thank you to everyone who has donated, subscribed, advertised and otherwise supported MT.

:asian:


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## MisterMike

I've been poking around but couldn't find it...is ther a listing of the sponsor fees to put a banner on a forum link?

TIA,
Mike


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## Bob Hubbard

Its at the bottom of the page.
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/adrates.htm




Hey, check out the MartialTalk Magazine forum... Early Christmas present for everyone, the December issue of MT mag is now available free. 

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard

2004 Update so far...

Donations and subscriptions have slowed to a trickle.
In order to help cover the growing cost of hosting this this site, we have rolled out a new "Supporting Membership".

This supporting membership features increased features, and a growing number of 'supporting member only' add-ins.  At only $18US per year, it is a great way to help keep MartialTalk thriving. As a bonus, it includes a free 1 year subscription to MT Magazine (a $12 annual value).

You can still donate a few bucks here n there.  When it totals $18, you'll be upgraded to the supporting membership.

Magazine subscribers - send a $6 donation and you'll also get the supporting membership.

Sponsors and advertisers are automatically designated Supporting Members.


Your support is needed, and greatly apreciated!
In the next few weeks we are planning on moving to a new, faster, more powerful server, made possible in part due to MartialTalk Members help.

Lets keep this baby growing!

Thank you!


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