# Is my yellow belt certificate from 98 still valid?



## Acronym (Sep 29, 2020)

I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.

I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.

Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Sep 29, 2020)

Maybe, i think they generally assess it on how much you remmeber if you get back to doing it after a peroid of stoppage.


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## Acronym (Sep 29, 2020)

Rat said:


> Maybe, i think they generally assess it on how much you remmeber if you get back to doing it after a peroid of stoppage.



I don't remember anything but I do hold a red/brown belt in TKD with katas derived from Shotokan.


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## wab25 (Sep 29, 2020)

Who cares about what rank you had when you were 10? Especially a rank where you don't remember anything you learned while earning it.

To be honest, I don't care what rank most people are. If you have skill or knowledge, or preferably both... thats what I care about. After that, I care about your ability to share that skill or knowledge. I don't really care what color thing you use to hold your pants up or who gave it to you. You either have the goods or you don't. They are not included with your belt.

One of the other things I don't personally care for... is folks "pulling rank" on each other. If thats your thing, why are you not part of the military? If you are not military, you just look kind of silly "pulling your rank" in front of people. I tend to find people to train with who can look beyond the belt or rank... at maybe the art.

But, if that will add to your resume... sure. I think its still valid. Most places go by once a rank, always that rank. So in a few years you can be 5th degree black belt, grand master in TKD and yellow belt in shotokan, when you were age 10.


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## dancingalone (Sep 29, 2020)

Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.



Sure I think the school will honor your certificate if you re-enroll and start you out at yellow if that is your question.  Good luck!


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## jobo (Sep 29, 2020)

Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.


depends what you mean by valid, it wasnt valid in the first place, just a meaningless bit of paper

if you mean will the school honour it,, maybe, but id be ashamed to ask, but if wearing yellow belt is important to you , go for it, they can only laugh at your vanity


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## KOKarate (Sep 29, 2020)

I mean yeah probably but if you turn up wearing a high rank and remember absolutely nothing and the white belts know more than you then you’ll look a bit silly. If you are looking to restart anything just go in wearing a white belt and let them give you what they think you deserve. Better to be a high standard white belt than a awful higher belt


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## dvcochran (Sep 29, 2020)

Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.


So you are wondering if the certificate(s) you earned when you were 11 years old are still valid? My answer(s) would be Yes in the concept that you did earn them at one time. No, that you should use them as leverage to start back at a higher rank solely in lieu of a piece of paper. Many schools will let you wear the highest rank belt you earned and you would stay at that rank until you get up to speed on the curriculum. I have seen this be good for some bad for others. For most it works better to have the standard belt progression as goals to aim for. Markers for both student and instructor to know where a person it in their training. In a big(ger) school people wearing a belt that they are not ready for creates problems. 
You have asked in and around this question endlessly. I would not expect my TKD red belt to carry much weight at a new Shotokan school.  

C'mon man/woman, just go work out.


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## wab25 (Sep 29, 2020)

dvcochran said:


> I would not expect my TKD red belt to carry much weight at a new Shotokan school.


I would not expect my black belt to carry much weight around the dojo either... but after COVID shut our dojo down since March, my black belt is carrying more weight than I ever expected.


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## Acronym (Sep 30, 2020)

They want me in 9-4 kyu and the sparring group.

I'm gonna give it a go in january


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## drop bear (Sep 30, 2020)

From memory a yellow in shotokan is about 6 months in anyway. I am not sure starting from scratch is that big a set back.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Sep 30, 2020)

wab25 said:


> Who cares about what rank you had when you were 10? Especially a rank where you don't remember anything you learned while earning it.
> 
> To be honest, I don't care what rank most people are. If you have skill or knowledge, or preferably both... thats what I care about. After that, I care about your ability to share that skill or knowledge. I don't really care what color thing you use to hold your pants up or who gave it to you. You either have the goods or you don't. They are not included with your belt.
> 
> ...



it matterns in terms of qulifications, if no experiary date is listed or told to you, then its still apt.   (until it expires)    If you give it up for 5 years and remmeber the content they might give you a new cert and reinstate your belt  if a expiary date exists.    Maybe for all your belts, or up to the belt you remmeber. 


In regards to cert, its you stating i know the content up to X level.   that can aid in employment in related sectors or as a advisor to lowers.   Not the end all be all, but  it means you know their belts currcilem as you are higher so can help them to some degree. 

In regards to employment, either as a MA teacher or secuirty job. (to mean either private or public)  Doesnt eman your ****, just means you know this curccilem to suffcient degree to get the next belt. 

I might know my maths GCSE, but they would still give me a test on maths ability if i needed one as its expired now.   If i know it, no issue.


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## wab25 (Sep 30, 2020)

Rat said:


> it matterns in terms of qulifications, if no experiary date is listed or told to you, then its still apt. (until it expires) If you give it up for 5 years and remmeber the content they might give you a new cert and reinstate your belt if a expiary date exists.


My belts don't have an expiration date on them. I looked, front and back. Sorry, but I do not know of any martial art whose ranks have expiration dates. Does anyone know of an art or organization that gives rank with an expiration date? 



Rat said:


> In regards to cert, its you stating i know the content up to X level. that can aid in employment in related sectors or as a advisor to lowers. Not the end all be all, but it means you know their belts currcilem as you are higher so can help them to some degree.


Knowing the first 6 months of the curriculum for 10 year old kids... wouldn't help out with employment much. Most of the time the instructors teaching the kids are masters or grandmasters or senseis... most of them know the adult curriculum to a very high level. But sure, add it to your resume. It won't hurt.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Sep 30, 2020)

wab25 said:


> My belts don't have an expiration date on them. I looked, front and back. Sorry, but I do not know of any martial art whose ranks have expiration dates. Does anyone know of an art or organization that gives rank with an expiration date?



All intents and purposes it can and might, thats your certificate of authenticity.   All qualfiications have a effective expiary datte, some have a posted date.



wab25 said:


> Knowing the first 6 months of the curriculum for 10 year old kids... wouldn't help out with employment much. Most of the time the instructors teaching the kids are masters or grandmasters or senseis... most of them know the adult curriculum to a very high level. But sure, add it to your resume. It won't hurt.



Never said that would for the most part. It would help if he wanted to teach children MA, or teach his MA(to children).   Its effectively worthless though.   if you had a black belt in say X persons karate, and went to work as a security gaurd, it would more than definately help you, especially if X persons karate was respected in the area or generally respected as a good place to learn that.     Actually any degree of belt above white would probbly aid to varying amounts, and a certificate of, evidence of partisicaption, and when you went (or if still active) and competency in it. (for the sake of the argument, there is no licesning requirment imposed by the government)

I also before writing this one, thought you were the OP.  So i got halfway through the last post i did and went "wait a second, hes no the person i thought he was"


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## dvcochran (Sep 30, 2020)

wab25 said:


> My belts don't have an expiration date on them. I looked, front and back. Sorry, but I do not know of any martial art whose ranks have expiration dates. Does anyone know of an art or organization that gives rank with an expiration date?


I agree I have never seen someone's certificate with an expiration date. However, the math analogy summed up the point very well. 
I use a lot of algebra and a good bit of calculus in my work. But I don't know that I could pass an upper level graduate school test without a little brush up and practice. Like a bicycle, you never fully forget how to ride but most people are rather wobbly on the seat after a long break from riding. All that is being said is than no one should expect to pick up right where they left off. 



wab25 said:


> Knowing the first 6 months of the curriculum for 10 year old kids... wouldn't help out with employment much. Most of the time the instructors teaching the kids are masters or grandmasters or senseis... most of them know the adult curriculum to a very high level. But sure, add it to your resume. It won't hurt.



Most kids are taught by assistant instructors of lower rank and often by color belts. In most schools not a bad thing. Kids do test on the same curriculum most of the time but it is totally unrealistic to expect to hold kids to the same standards as adults. Gross skills, yes. But there will always be things kids just have not developed yet, in both the physical and mental/emotional realms. Conversely, there are tweeners that will far exceed adults in physical skills and even a few in mental/emotional skills.  
Heck, there would be few kids practicing any MA's and fewer promoting through the ranks if they had to perform exactly as adults do.


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## Flying Crane (Sep 30, 2020)

This thread...Jeezuz...just....Jeezuz...


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## Deleted member 39746 (Sep 30, 2020)

I just thought about this and seems important to my point to put in:

Qualifications become null with work expereince.  If you needed a maths qual for this job 10 years ago and have worked it for 10 years, you working the job takes precidence and makes related qualifications redundent,as you have direct work experience and evidence. 

Eg if i worked in networking for 10 years and needed a network cert that expired 2 years after i got my job, the 10 years would let me into any networking job pretty much.   The other reasons are N/A to my point and topic currently.


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## Flying Crane (Sep 30, 2020)

I don’t imagine a yellow belt cert will get you a job anywhere.


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## Graywalker (Sep 30, 2020)

It depends, mostly on the instructor. Example, I trained in a system while in Oklahoma, called Mong Su Dom and received an orange belt rank and was told it was for life.
The original system I trained in as a teenager in Washington, I received a brown. Then at 35, I returned and although the instructor remembered me, he required that I start at white, due to the changes in the system over the years.


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## elder999 (Sep 30, 2020)

Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.



Sure it's valid.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 30, 2020)

Flying Crane said:


> I don’t imagine a yellow belt cert will get you a job anywhere.


True, that being said though, I've actually included my years of training and rank on my resumé. I reckon it's a valuable thing to list, in terms of reference to life skills or character. BUT, I wouldn't expect them to see it with wide eyes and instantly go... "YOU'RE HIRED!" XD


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## dvcochran (Oct 1, 2020)

_Simon_ said:


> True, that being said though, I've actually included my years of training and rank on my resumé. I reckon it's a valuable thing to list, in terms of reference to life skills or character. BUT, I wouldn't expect them to see it with wide eyes and instantly go... "YOU'RE HIRED!" XD


It has been some time since I had to keep up my resume but I remember figuring out that it was a negative to list/mention I was an owner/instructor. It was 'okay' to say I taught a MA but when owner/instructor is/was seen on a resume, the time drain was factored in as a deterrent.


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## Flying Crane (Oct 1, 2020)

_Simon_ said:


> True, that being said though, I've actually included my years of training and rank on my resumé. I reckon it's a valuable thing to list, in terms of reference to life skills or character. BUT, I wouldn't expect them to see it with wide eyes and instantly go... "YOU'RE HIRED!" XD


I think it can be appropriate depending on the circumstances.

However, it’s most likely to be appropriate if one is trying to get employment where martial arts is somehow relevant.  A teaching position, for example, or listing Training history on your website if you open your own school.  Perhaps it would be relevant if you are trying to get work in security or law enforcement.

In my opinion, rank below brown belt level is maybe not worth listing on a resume.  A total beginner level like yellow belt, I would not list, other than perhaps to mention some “experience” in a particular method, if it is in addition to another method in which you have more significant experience and a higher ranking.

By way of example, I’ve seen websites where the teacher lists every experience that they have ever had in martial arts.  It reads very oddly when they do that.  I’ve seen things that will list high black belt rankings in three or four systems, including one or two that they clearly founded themselves and gave themselves high rank in.  So things in the fifth to tenth degree black belt range. And several of them.

And then they list “yellow belt in Tae Kwon Do” and “blue stripe in XYZ karate” and “seminar with Master JoeBlow in 1994”.  Often a whole list of short seminars with a bunch of different people.

In my opinion, none of these things represent any depth of training and I don’t think anyone who has a solid background in martial arts is going to be fooled by it.  If you really feel they are relevant and important, then perhaps list them with a short statement like “ongoing training and exploration in various other martial disciplines as a way of updating my martial education”.

But listing every yellow belt and every seminar on the resume, I think isn’t helpful.  It actually reads oddly and screams “resume padding!”

Edit: so to get back to the OP, he is asking if his yellow belt certificate is still valid from over 20 years ago, having not continued training in that particular system.  Instead, he trained in another system, earning red/brown belt level. That second ranking is what is relevant.  The yellow belt, while technically may not have expired, simply isn’t relevant anymore.  Let it go. His training in that system was superficial, and he did it for a very short time as a young child making it even less likely to retain anything from that training, likely no more than a few months, well under a half year would be my guess.


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## _Simon_ (Oct 2, 2020)

dvcochran said:


> It has been some time since I had to keep up my resume but I remember figuring out that it was a negative to list/mention I was an owner/instructor. It was 'okay' to say I taught a MA but when owner/instructor is/was seen on a resume, the time drain was factored in as a deterrent.



Ah wow... that's very interesting... I would think that would be a major asset when viewed from the perspective of skillset, responsibility, leadership etc, but I could also see in terms of time and availability...


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## _Simon_ (Oct 2, 2020)

Flying Crane said:


> I think it can be appropriate depending on the circumstances.
> 
> However, it’s most likely to be appropriate if one is trying to get employment where martial arts is somehow relevant.  A teaching position, for example, or listing Training history on your website if you open your own school.  Perhaps it would be relevant if you are trying to get work in security or law enforcement.
> 
> ...



Yeah definitely. I guess I would see it as displaying characteristics of discipline, hard work, commitment, patience etc rather than the content of the rank being relevant to the potential job. That's the only reason I list it. But of course that certainly does apply with jobs that require those particular skills.

Yeah agreed, putting any ol rank on there doesn't make sense. And to be honest if the employer doesn't know the MA or system or what it TAKES to attain the rank, then it may make very little sense to them anyway. But ah well, I put it anyway as I feel it's warranted and significant ;P.

Yeah I've seen those haha, listing every single rank and seminar they've been to. I can see how it may display that they are open to learning and looking outside the box of their system like you said, but sometimes unnecessary to list absolutely everything.


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## dvcochran (Oct 2, 2020)

_Simon_ said:


> Ah wow... that's very interesting... I would think that would be a major asset when viewed from the perspective of skillset, responsibility, leadership etc, but I could also see in terms of time and availability...


I think that is the gist of it. My background/resume is technical so I guess as long as it is listed as a hobby or activity it would be fine. Pushing anything that may be seen as a time consumer could be seen as a problem by the employer I suppose.


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## stanly stud (Dec 31, 2020)

wab25 said:


> Who cares about what rank you had when you were 10? Especially a rank where you don't remember anything you learned while earning it.
> 
> To be honest, I don't care what rank most people are. If you have skill or knowledge, or preferably both... thats what I care about. After that, I care about your ability to share that skill or knowledge. I don't really care what color thing you use to hold your pants up or who gave it to you. You either have the goods or you don't. They are not included with your belt.
> 
> ...


agree with this. I have seen some really crap black belts in my time. I tried shotokan years back but i found wado ryu was more interesting. In the shotokan group i saw two guys doing if i remember correctly a Blue belt test. one guy was watching the other guy next to him as he clearly never knew the kata. he was still given the belt as there was a "inner circle" or jerk circle in the club. pathetic so i prefer FMA & WT. none of that bollocks. you can do it or you can´t.


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## gspell68 (Jan 2, 2022)

A yellow belt shouldn’t matter to you anyhow if you’re in it for the long haul and you’ll likely jump it anyhow.
I went straight from a white belt to orange after three months in Shotokan as a teenager.
I moved and joined Seibukan after five years of Shotokan training.
After three or four months, the instructor tossed me a green belt.
Within nine months to a year I was a brown belt, but I don’t recollect testing for it, either.


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## Unkogami (Jan 4, 2022)

The whole belt thing is just nonsense.


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## Steve (Jan 4, 2022)

I think it's totally valid, and I encourage you to mention it to anyone who will listen.  It will undoubtedly impress everyone and make them want to help you however they can, including jobs, potential promotions, etc.  Heck, they may just want to give you free money. 

Some suggestions for maximizing visibility:  

Put it in your resume.
If you take a picture of it with your phone, you can actually show it to everyone.  
Have a t-shirt made, so that people can see it and ask you about it when you wear the shirt.
Use it as your avatar on social media.
Consider changing your middle name to badass, so that when people see your certificate and say, 'Think you're a badass?"  You can say, "Actually, Badass is my... middle name."
Also, I give bad advice.  But I'm sure it's still valid.


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## J. Pickard (Jan 12, 2022)

Nope, it expired. You need to purchase a new one. I have the best deals on them, they are only $19.99 and for an extra $10/month you can upgrade to the lifetime subscription where you get a new certificate every 3 months so that they never expire. But wait, there's more! Act now and get a bonus Soke certificate with a 5 year lifetime 3 mile warranty for only $100! That's right, you can be a Supreme Super Great Grand Master and 10th degree black belt for only $100! So call now! 1-888-BELTMIL 

In all seriousness though, the belt doesn't matter. Just go train to learn and learn to train. If your instructor thinks you are ready to be any specific belt rank they will let you know.


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## J. Pickard (Jan 12, 2022)

Flying Crane said:


> I don’t imagine a yellow belt cert will get you a job anywhere.


It might if it's a yellow belt certificate in Lean Manufacturing Six Sigma.


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## dvcochran (Jan 12, 2022)

J. Pickard said:


> It might if it's a yellow belt certificate in Lean Manufacturing Six Sigma.


Haha! I am a SS green belt.


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## Holmejr (Jan 12, 2022)

Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.


Yes, but only if your original GI still fits you…


Acronym said:


> I was born in 89. What do you you guys think? I still have it. Same chief instructor and school.
> 
> I'm a red/brown belt in TaekwonDo as well.
> 
> Note that I have never done Shotokan-type free sparring, although I do have experience drilling that type of controlled striking. But that comes later anyway.


Yes, but only if your original GI still fits you…


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