# Kung Fu San Soo



## Tames D (Nov 4, 2007)




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## seasoned (Nov 14, 2007)

Sweet


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## San Soo Sifu (Dec 11, 2007)

My Playlist on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/profile_play_list?user=SanSooSifu


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## Tames D (Dec 11, 2007)

Thanks. Very nice.


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## kidswarrior (Dec 12, 2007)

Thanks *Q-G* and *Sifu*. I love this Art.


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## Xue Sheng (Dec 13, 2007)

Although I do not train it I rather like what I have seen

Thanks for ALL the videos


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## kidswarrior (Dec 13, 2007)

Xue Sheng said:


> Although I do not train it I rather like what I have seen
> 
> Thanks for ALL the videos


Xue Sheng, wanted to ask you a CMA question in line with KFSS. Have been studying some arcane dvd's and books on Shuai Chiao (and Kuai Chiao), and am seeing some overlap. Do you have any thoughts? And really, guess I'm asking both XS and anyone on the thread for insights and opinions. :asian:


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## Xue Sheng (Dec 14, 2007)

kidswarrior said:


> Xue Sheng, wanted to ask you a CMA question in line with KFSS. Have been studying some arcane dvd's and books on Shuai Chiao (and Kuai Chiao), and am seeing some overlap. Do you have any thoughts? And really, guess I'm asking both XS and anyone on the thread for insights and opinions. :asian:


 
Not uncommon, just about all CMA styles have Qinna to varying degrees in them and many also have Shuaijiao (Shuai Chiao) to varying degrees in them too. Remember Shuaijiao is rather old (oldest living CMA) so it has had a long time to influence a lot of CMA styles.

Sanda is considerably newer than it appears that San Soo is and Sanda is made up of a lot of basic and quite effective moves from various CMA styles. I see all sorts of overlap between Sanda and just about every other CMA I have ever trained. I was rather surprised and the similarities between Taiji and Sanda and Xingyi and Sanda as well and Sanda is big on Shuaijiao and Qinna too.

And if I understand San Soo, and it is likely I do not since I do not train San soo so I am not sure how correct I am here  so please correct me if I am wrong, from what I have read about it the source is said to be monks that traveled around Southern China that were getting the living daylight beat out of them so it was imperative that they develop something to fight with. And also from what I have read, and the videos supplied in this post, it looks like San Soo is not as much a defensive fighting art and it is an offensive fighting art (like Xingyiquan deference is offence). If this is true that would point to the fact that they would want something pretty basic, effective that was also quick to learn so you would not go for styles that were big on form and go more for the basic things and basic stuff from things like Shuaijiao, Qinna and straight forward kicks and punches from any CMA. To be honest I like what I have seen and read about San Soo


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## Tames D (Dec 14, 2007)

Xue Sheng said:


> Not uncommon, just about all CMA styles have Qinna to varying degrees in them and many also have Shuaijiao (Shuai Chiao) to varying degrees in them too. Remember Shuaijiao is rather old (oldest living CMA) so it has had a long time to influence a lot of CMA styles.
> 
> Sanda is considerably newer than it appears that San Soo is and Sanda is made up of a lot of basic and quite effective moves from various CMA styles. I see all sorts of overlap between Sanda and just about every other CMA I have ever trained. I was rather surprised and the similarities between Taiji and Sanda and Xingyi and Sanda as well and Sanda is big on Shuaijiao and Qinna too.
> 
> And if I understand San Soo, and it is likely I do not since I do not train San soo so I am not sure how correct I am here  so please correct me if I am wrong, from what I have read about it the source is said to be monks that traveled around Southern China that were getting the living daylight beat out of them so it was imperative that they develop something to fight with. And also from what I have read, and the videos supplied in this post, it looks like San Soo is not as much a defensive fighting art and it is an offensive fighting art (like Xingyiquan deference is offence). If this is true that would point to the fact that they would want something pretty basic, effective that was also quick to learn so you would not go for styles that were big on form and go more for the basic things and basic stuff from things like Shuaijiao, Qinna and straight forward kicks and punches from any CMA. To be honest I like what I have seen and read about San Soo


You are correct Xue. The Monks were constantly being beaten and robbed of their valuables when they traveled, so they were forced to develop/learn an effective way to fight although they were peaceful people.

San Soo is primarily an offensive fighting system. Jimmy Woo use to tell me that the best defense is a great offense. San Soo is pretty much a down and dirty fighting system. It's not very flashy but it's very effective.


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## kidswarrior (Dec 14, 2007)

Xue Sheng said:


> Not uncommon, just about all CMA styles have Qinna to varying degrees in them and many also have Shuaijiao (Shuai Chiao) to varying degrees in them too. Remember Shuaijiao is rather old (oldest living CMA) so it has had a long time to influence a lot of CMA styles.
> 
> Sanda is considerably newer than it appears that San Soo is and Sanda is made up of a lot of basic and quite effective moves from various CMA styles. I see all sorts of overlap between Sanda and just about every other CMA I have ever trained. I was rather surprised and the similarities between Taiji and Sanda and Xingyi and Sanda as well and Sanda is big on Shuaijiao and Qinna too.
> 
> And if I understand San Soo, and it is likely I do not since I do not train San soo so I am not sure how correct I am here  so please correct me if I am wrong, from what I have read about it the source is said to be monks that traveled around Southern China that were getting the living daylight beat out of them so it was imperative that they develop something to fight with. And also from what I have read, and the videos supplied in this post, it looks like San Soo is not as much a defensive fighting art and it is an offensive fighting art (like Xingyiquan deference is offence). If this is true that would point to the fact that they would want something pretty basic, effective that was also quick to learn so you would not go for styles that were big on form and go more for the basic things and basic stuff from things like Shuaijiao, Qinna and straight forward kicks and punches from any CMA. To be honest I like what I have seen and read about San Soo


Thanks for the thoughtful reply, XS. As always, your CMA background's insightful and helps me quite a bit to fill the gaps in my own limited CMA understanding. 

QUI-GON's answer to a couple of your questions is more eloquent and cogent than any I could write, especially since he knew and trained with Jimmy Woo, but it speaks for me, too: 



			
				QUI-GON said:
			
		

> You are correct Xue. The Monks were constantly being beaten and robbed of their valuables when they traveled, so they were forced to develop/learn an effective way to fight although they were peaceful people.
> 
> San Soo is primarily an offensive fighting system. Jimmy Woo use to tell me that the best defense is a great offense. San Soo is pretty much a down and dirty fighting system. It's not very flashy but it's very effective.



Thanks to you both for helping me flesh out my knowledge of San Soo and where it fits in CMA overall.


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## Xue Sheng (Dec 15, 2007)

QUI-GON said:


> You are correct Xue. The Monks were constantly being beaten and robbed of their valuables when they traveled, so they were forced to develop/learn an effective way to fight although they were peaceful people.
> 
> San Soo is primarily an offensive fighting system. Jimmy Woo use to tell me that the best defense is a great offense. San Soo is pretty much a down and dirty fighting system. It's not very flashy but it's very effective.


 
Thank you


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## kidswarrior (Dec 15, 2007)

QUI-GON said:


> Jimmy Woo use to tell me....


Braggart! :boing1: :highfive:


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## Tames D (Dec 15, 2007)

kidswarrior said:


> Braggart! :boing1: :highfive:


Hey, I use that line (Jimmy use to tell me...) alot. It makes me appear more important than I really am 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I need all the help I can get brother.


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## JadeDragon3 (Jan 14, 2008)

Tell me about San Soo Kung Fu, not to familiar with it. What kind of techniques does it use? Does it use long range strikes or short range? low kicks or high kicks or both? Any animal techniques like snake, crane, etc...?


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## Doc_Jude (Jan 15, 2008)

... & to think that someone recently said that KFSS was just "kenpo rather than  CMA (Chinese Martial Arts)"... 
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57927&page=3

Great Vids. Thank you


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## Xue Sheng (Jan 15, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> ... & to think that someone recently said that KFSS was just "kenpo rather than CMA (Chinese Martial Arts)"...
> http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57927&page=3
> 
> Great Vids. Thank you


 
Nice use of link to inflame irritate and upset there doc


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## Doc_Jude (Jan 15, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> Nice use of link to inflame irritate and upset there doc



Yes. you're right   :disgust:










(Hey, I got KFSS in my lineage, I gotta defend... plus, I don't really like Internet BS-ers. When someone pads their Martial Arts Resume with "4 years" of expertise in a certain art, you don't expect for them to have, in reality, a minor kyu rank)


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks for the video links.

Let's all return the topic of the video's in question.  Thanks!


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## xiongnu_luohan (Jan 18, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> Yes. you're right   :disgust:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



feel free to respond in the other thread if you have something to say. I've already made my points perfectly clear. it's not *my* opinion. it's the opinion of almost everyone in the cma community that san soo was not, is not, and will not ever be part of cma because it has no real lineage and no connection to china.

note to moderator: I lost my passwords and lost access to the e-mail account from which my user name(xiongnu_lohan) was created. Thus I have created another profile.


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## Tames D (Jan 18, 2008)

xiongnu_luohan said:


> feel free to respond in the other thread if you have something to say. I've already made my points perfectly clear. it's not *my* opinion. *it's the opinion of almost everyone in the cma community that san soo was not, is not, and will not ever be part of cma because it has no real lineage and no connection to china.*
> 
> note to moderator: I lost my passwords and lost access to the e-mail account from which my user name(xiongnu_lohan) was created. Thus I have created another profile.


 
This would be news to Chin Siu Dek (Jimmy Woo). But of course he's dead so why would he give a ****? You really should talk about **** you know something about.


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## Doc_Jude (Jan 19, 2008)

QUI-GON said:


> This would be news to Chin Siu Dek (Jimmy Woo). But of course he's dead so why would he give a ****? You really should talk about **** you know something about.



Don't worry. The closest he'll get to San Soo is judging someone's videos... and this board, of course.


> it's not *my* opinion. it's the opinion of almost everyone in the cma community that san soo was not, is not, and will not ever be part of cma because it has no real lineage and no connection to china.


What a ridiculously absurd blanket statement. 

*Here is an old vid* of my teacher's teacher Papak Guru Rudy Terlinden. You old time San Soo folks may have heard of him, he spend a bit of time training with GM Jimmy Woo. His Silat has alot of those San Soo power strikes and the low line kicks. One of his students is first, Guru Rudy shows up about 1:00
You know, I think many people have disparaging things to say about Kung Fu San Soo because many San Soo folks wear a Japanese-style Budogi as opposed to CMA style uniforms. Though, I've seen some old San Soo folks working out hard & wearing traditional Chinese uniforms and I thought,"Wow, that's some really good looking Kung Fu combat!"


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## kidswarrior (Jan 19, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> Don't worry. The closest he'll get to San Soo is judging someone's videos... and this board, of course.
> 
> What a ridiculously absurd blanket statement.
> 
> ...


You might have a point. I've been in classes where senior guys were wearing shorts and sleeveless T Shirts, and thought, Wow, when I work out with that one, or that one, I'd better have my game face on. (I always wear long pants even if with a T shirt, cuz those rug burns... Oh, man ).

Why do we need to trash talk someone else's art? To me the only question is whether I'm secure in the effectiveness of my art, and happy in my practice of it.

Working with outcast teens for a living, I see and combat this all day every day. The one with confidence problems will stir things up for others (try to bring them down), just to make himself feel better. Nothing infuriates me at work more than an instigator. 

Have gone OT for a moment because I feel a little responsible for this thread. Please excuse the interruption from the kfss video theme.


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## Xue Sheng (Jan 19, 2008)

kidswarrior said:


> Why do we need to trash talk someone else's art? To me the only question is whether I'm secure in the effectiveness of my art, and happy in my practice of it.


 
Exactly.

Does the art you train work for you? If so who cares what anyone else thinks
.
As to what is worn to work out/train; I have been in CMA for quite awhile now and I have rarely seen anyone actually workout or train in a gi or a Kung Fu uniform they are for show and demonstration only. Tee-shirts, sweats, street cloths, shorts Gi pants or Kung fu pants but not the jacket, I have pretty much seen it all and again it is all about what works for you.

My first sifu required us to get one silk kung fu uniform but it was PURELY for show, we never EVER trained in them. My second Sifu never required any specific uniform for anything and my Wing Chun sifu's only requirement was no street shoes in the training hall.

My sanda sifu requires that I train a WHOLE lot more (but that is another story) other than that no uniform, last Friday I trained in jeans and a sweatshirt, got a lecture and then went back to work.
As to putting down and/or trash talking another art, what it the sense of that it accomplishes nothing and generally make me somewhat suspicious of the one doing the trash talking.

I have seen San Soo on video and I have read the posts on MT and talk with a few of its practitioners here on MT and from what I have seen I like from the posts I have read the practitioners take San Soo seriously and from those I have talked to they seem like good people. Whether it comes from China, Japan, India, Chicago or East Slavonia I dont really care. I like what I see and I read that is all I know.


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## kidswarrior (Jan 19, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> last Friday I trained in jeans and a sweatshirt, got a lecture and then went back to work.


 Priceless.


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## Xue Sheng (Jun 24, 2008)

I was going to make another post but since this is already about San Soo I thought I would ask here.

Many CMA styles focus on the dantian to either direct energy, to store energy, to use energy.

Does San Soo focus on the dantian and if so for what?


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## kidswarrior (Jun 24, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> I was going to make another post but since this is already about San Soo I thought I would ask here.
> 
> Many CMA styles focus on the dantian to either direct energy, to store energy, to use energy.
> 
> Does San Soo focus on the dantian and if so for what?


Not to my knowledge. Have to say, though, San Soo varies somewhat among first gen masters. 

The art prides itself on being built on mechanically sound principles, and I've never heard *chi* even mentioned, let alone the dantian. But then, that's just my experience so take it with a grain of salt.


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## Xue Sheng (Jun 24, 2008)

kidswarrior said:


> Not to my knowledge. Have to say, though, San Soo varies somewhat among first gen masters.
> 
> The art prides itself on being built on mechanically sound principles, and I've never heard *chi* even mentioned, let alone the dantian. But then, that's just my experience so take it with a grain of salt.


 

I was just wondering because Sanda claims no Qi training either but does talk about the Dantian and its use similar to Xingyiquan and I have seen some similarities between Sanda and San soo.

Thanks


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## Tames D (Jun 24, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> I was going to make another post but since this is already about San Soo I thought I would ask here.
> 
> Many CMA styles focus on the dantian to either direct energy, to store energy, to use energy.
> 
> Does San Soo focus on the dantian and if so for what?


Hasn't been my experience. I'm not saying that it isn't taught/practiced in some San Soo locations but my experience with Chi/Ki has only been from outside sources.


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## Josh Oakley (Jul 9, 2008)

QUI-GON said:


> Hey, I use that line (Jimmy use to tell me...) alot. It makes me appear more important than I really am
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Is this Dave Hopkins?

I was in your studio once if it is. I used to train under Paul Schroeder.


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## Josh Oakley (Jul 9, 2008)

kidswarrior said:


> Not to my knowledge. Have to say, though, San Soo varies somewhat among first gen masters.
> 
> The art prides itself on being built on mechanically sound principles, and I've never heard *chi* even mentioned, let alone the dantian. But then, that's just my experience so take it with a grain of salt.


 
I did, by Paul Schroeder and Weston Vermillion, but only in passing, and more in a general sense.


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## Tames D (Jul 9, 2008)

Josh Oakley said:


> Is this Dave Hopkins?
> 
> I was in your studio once if it is. I used to train under Paul Schroeder.


 
No, I'm just a San Soo Vagabond. Dave is a very sucessful studio owner in Riverside. Great guy and top notch fighter.


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## pathfinder4x4 (Aug 19, 2008)

This looks loke a very interesting and effective style...anyone know of any Kung Fu San Soo schools in the Las Vegas area?


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## kidswarrior (Aug 19, 2008)

Try these:

*NEVADA*

* Henderson  *
     Master Eric Drobney  
702-564-9663 (_*Also Las Vegas*_)

[FONT=Arial,Geneva,Helvetica,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]H[/FONT]
_*[FONT=Arial,Geneva,Helvetica,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]Las Vegas[/FONT]*_
[FONT=Arial,Geneva,Helvetica,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]Chris McCune 702-564-9663[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial,Geneva,Helvetica,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]Best wishes,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Geneva,Helvetica,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]Mark
[/FONT]

​


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## naneek (Aug 30, 2008)

wow impressive demo, liked that first take down nice to watch but i wouldnt like to try that on the street!!!


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