# Post Your Best 'No True Scotsman (*Insert MA Style here)



## MadMartigan (Jul 5, 2021)

So after reading the 'no true scotsman' phrase several places on this site; I finally looked up what it meant. For reference:






This gave me the idea. Let's hear your best martial arts related 'no true' saying. It could be about your own MA, or a funny outsider observation. 

* Note: This is the humor section and this thread is not where we delve into the inaccuracies of these sayings. Let's lighten up a bit.

To start us off (with a shot close to home):

No *True* ITF Taekwondo-('ist, 'er) would ever finish a pattern without unintelligibly screaming the name of said pattern (even though anyone listening has no idea what they said).


----------



## Blindside (Jul 6, 2021)

D Hall said:


> No *True* ITF Taekwondo-('ist, 'er) would ever finish a pattern without unintelligibly screaming the name of said pattern (even though anyone listening has no idea what they said).



I could actually hear "cccchhooooooown jeeeee!!!!!" while reading this and I don't even do TKD.


----------



## MadMartigan (Jul 7, 2021)

No true TMA Instructor would ever risk their legendary reputation by sparring with their own students.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 8, 2021)

D Hall said:


> No true TMA Instructor would ever risk their legendary reputation by sparring with their own students.


But if an instructor always defeat his students in sparring, his student's confidence could be destroyed for a long time.

A: Dear sir! I really don't want to spar/wrestle with you.
B: Why?
A: Everything that you have taught me won't work on you.
B: ...

What will you do if your students refuse to spar/wrestle with you?


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jul 8, 2021)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> But if an instructor always defeat his students in sparring, his student's confidence could be destroyed for a long time.
> 
> A: Dear sir! I really don't want to spar/wrestle with you.
> B: Why?
> ...


D Hall was being sarcastic.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 8, 2021)

Monkey Turned Wolf said:


> D Hall was being sarcastic.


An old CMA saying said, "If you teach someone, you don't fight him. If you fight someone, you don't teach him." There is some truth in it.

If you teach me how to beat you up, your mother must drop your head on the ground when you were a baby.


----------



## MadMartigan (Jul 8, 2021)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> An old CMA saying said, "If you teach someone, you don't fight him. If you fight someone, you don't teach him." There is some truth in it.
> 
> If you teach me how to beat you up, your mother must drop your head on the ground when you were a baby.


While a departure from the intent of this particular thread; I'll join in.

There is a logic to the above saying; and it's understandable from a certain point of view. 

My opinion of a teacher's role just happens to be a polar opposite. My goal as a teacher is to bring as many students as possible to a place where they surpase me. The greatest compliment I could receive is having a student become better than I ever was.

This doesn't mean I don't try to stay ahead of the curve... but that I will never hold any knowledge back. Someone else's gain is not my loss.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 8, 2021)

D Hall said:


> My opinion of a teacher's role just happens to be a polar opposite. My goal as a teacher is to bring as many students as possible to a place where they surpase me. The greatest compliment I could receive is having a student become better than I ever was.
> 
> This doesn't mean I don't try to stay ahead of the curve... but that I will never hold any knowledge back. Someone else's gain is not my loss.


I would like to see my students who can be better than me. The only issue is they don't spend enough time in their "ability" training. No matter how great their technique may be, their "ability" can restrict their limitation.

My teacher used to say, "whatever that I have taught you, it won't work on me." After my teacher had passes away, I also told my students the same thing.

May be the sparring game and wrestling game are different.

- In sparring game, it's very common that a 20 years old student who can beat up his 40 years old teacher in the ring.
- In wrestling game, it will be very difficult for a 20 year old student to take down a 40 years old teacher on the mat.


----------



## Gerry Seymour (Jul 9, 2021)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> But if an instructor always defeat his students in sparring, his student's confidence could be destroyed for a long time.
> 
> A: Dear sir! I really don't want to spar/wrestle with you.
> B: Why?
> ...


They wouldn't. That is a trust issue, and trust is based on how you've conducted yourself with them. I only shut students down in sparring when it will serve a learning purpose. Mostly I go lighter than them so I can see what they are doing well (and not). And I change my approach a bit for those who are more confident.

I've never had a student who didn't want to spar with me, except folks with a trauma in their past (for whom the sparring can be a trigger).


----------



## Gerry Seymour (Jul 9, 2021)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> An old CMA saying said, "If you teach someone, you don't fight him. If you fight someone, you don't teach him." There is some truth in it.
> 
> If you teach me how to beat you up, your mother must drop your head on the ground when you were a baby.


I disagree. If I have a student who is capable of being better than me in an area, I want to push them to do so. I'll spar with any student. If I have one who wants to spar harder (and is safe to do so with), I'm willing. If they win, that's cool. I've had a few students over they years who were able to make me work hard in one area or another. If I had one who was better than me in an area, I'd be quite willing to lose to them. I don't need to seem invincible, and none of my students come to me for my unbeatable approach. If someone is better than me in an area and still wants to learn from me, that's all I need. Just means I have someone I can learn from along the way (which, frankly, I do with most of my students who have prior training or experience).


----------



## Gerry Seymour (Jul 9, 2021)

D Hall said:


> While a departure from the intent of this particular thread; I'll join in.
> 
> There is a logic to the above saying; and it's understandable from a certain point of view.
> 
> ...


I haven't had a student pass me in any area yet, but I think that's mostly because I've not had a student stay with me long enough (places I teach keep closing down or changing policies, and I go start over).


----------



## RavenDarkfellow (Jul 10, 2021)

"No true martial artist would train in multiple styles without first mastering his base style!"

This is an argument in which I had been engaged countless times from the late 90's on through the early 2000's.  Now, with the popularity of MMA, most people see the points I was making way back then.  Of course, it's not like it was all my idea-- most of my early martial knowledge came straight from reading Bruce Lee, especially the Tao of Jeet Kune Do.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 10, 2021)

gpseymour said:


> I haven't had a student pass me in any area yet, but I think that's mostly because I've not had a student stay with me long enough.


I also had this issue when I taught the UT Austin informal class. Every semester I would have 50 new students. Most of them won't come back after one semester. I had seen a lot of bean sprouts growing and I didn't see many tree growing.

If I kept teaching the beginner material, the old students won't like it. If I taught the intermediate, or advance material, the new students could not catch up.


----------



## MadMartigan (Jul 11, 2021)

No true 10th Planet guy would ever train in a Gi.


----------



## Diagen (Jul 14, 2021)

No true martial artist loses supernatural awareness of his surroundings. Even during sex and sleep!
No true martial artist grows weak, slow and frail with age!


----------

