# Wing Chun at a job interview



## jimbo123 (May 8, 2014)

I have a job interview coming up where for 5 minutes I have to talk/demonstrate something I am passionate about.

My wing chun is not brilliant but I wanted to talk about it. Could someone give me tips?

I was going to talk about:
- Some types of punches/kicks and why they're effective for close quarter combat
- Tan/sau punch, attack/defense

Not sure what else to do in short space of time. Any tips?


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## OzPaul (May 8, 2014)

What kind of job interview is it?


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## jimbo123 (May 8, 2014)

Customer service

it's not really a sales role but sometimes I'd have to sway customers to becoming a member


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## OzPaul (May 8, 2014)

Sounds good, do the SLT quickly for them and as you said some punches, kicks etc


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## jimbo123 (May 8, 2014)

Honestly, I was hoping to avoid SLT. I know how important it is but think it's boring to outsiders.


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## jezr74 (May 8, 2014)

I'd work out what you like or passionate about more in line with the nature of the job. Work out the qualities they are looking for, and what you enjoy that can reflect and enforce those qualities.

Sent from my Surface Pro 2 using Tapatalk


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## wingchun100 (May 8, 2014)

Interviewers have asked me what I was passionate about outside of work and I would talk about wing chun and how it could relate to a job. I focused on how it taught me to be patient, humble and direct. I think they took "direct" to mean "blunt," which they also equate with "rude," because I didn't get those jobs where I brought up wing chun! LOL


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## yak sao (May 8, 2014)

I think non MA people fall into 2 categories.
Those that are impressed with what we do and those that see us as a bunch of flakes.

I would stay away from any kind of physical demo. If you bring it up at all, I would focus on the aspects of self discipline, physical fitness, focus, that sort of thing. These are positive things to bring to any job interview. If your interviewer falls into the latter camp, you haven't hurt yourself.


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## Steve (May 8, 2014)

As a person who has hired/interviewed a lot of candidates, I can share what I'd like.  It looks like there is a lot of good advice in this thread, so far.  

The idea isn't to teach the interviewer about Wing Chun.  The goal for you is to demonstrate the traits and values you might bring to the company.  I would not (unless asked) do ANY kind of physical demonstration.  I would also avoid anything technical, and definitely use layman's terms.  Don't say, "I like chi sau." (and then spend 3 minutes explaining what that is.  If you confuse the interviewer, that's not good.

What I would think about are the things about Wing Chun that you believe represent the traits you believe will serve you well in the position for which you are applying.  Zero in on the aspects of it that make you into the best version of yourself possible.  

Also, while I've never asked a question like this in an interviewer, I'd guess that the idea is to gauge your level of enthusiasm or passion, and your ability to communicate your passion in a clear and effective manner.  You've mentioned that, while not a sales position, you will be influencing potential customers.  If you can't get your interviewer to feel some of your enthusiasm about a personal passion, then how can you successfully share enthusiasm about their product or service?


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## geezer (May 8, 2014)

yak sao said:


> I think non MA people fall into 2 categories.
> Those that are impressed with what we do and those that see us as a bunch of flakes.



Very true. And you never know which group your interviewer falls into. If you _must_ talk about your Wing Chun,  I'd make it brief and touch on the kind of things Yak mentioned, and avoid any reference to the combative or self-defense aspects.

Personally, I've learned the hard way to reserve talking about my interest in martial arts to just those people who share the passion. Like you guys.


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## mook jong man (May 8, 2014)

Depends what type of job it is , if it is an environment where it's a bit of a testosterone fest.
You could be setting yourself up for problems in the future.

I worked in a factory once that produced kitchen parts , countertops , cupboards etc.
Basically a lot of heavy lifting work involved , tends to draw a certain type of person.

Well the person who interviewed me saw my instructor certificates in my resume , and word got out to the factory floor.
From that time on , I had various names such as Bruce Lee , "That karate guy" , things of that ilk.
I took it in good humor , but having people continuously coming up to you and throwing faux punches and asking what you would do against that , got old real quick.

In hind sight I would not have told them anything about my martial arts.


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## wingchun100 (May 8, 2014)

mook jong man said:


> Depends what type of job it is , if it is an environment where it's a bit of a testosterone fest.
> You could be setting yourself up for problems in the future.
> 
> I worked in a factory once that produced kitchen parts , countertops , cupboards etc.
> ...



Oh that is the WORST. And then if you don't bother countering, they laugh and say, "Yeah I thought that ***** doesn't work." It's enough to make you want to show them it does!


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## jimbo123 (May 8, 2014)

Thanks for everybodys insights.

I'm actually a bit nervous about this interview and talking for 5 mins. That's why I thought of doing those moves and talking in-between.

mook jong man: it's an animal charity organization. I get what you mean about it becoming an in-joke though.

steve: what I might talk about is how wing chun benefits my personal life. It's a massive massive stress relief for me. They keep us so busy in class that I don't have time to think about daily stresses. Also I like when I'm guard to guard and I have to slowly chip away their defenses. It's like doing an impossible task broken into small chunks. It also gets me out of my comfort zone when talking to people.

However, here is what the interviewer told me:

"Your first task will be for you to present for a maximum of 5 minutes to the panel on a topic

you are passionate about (no powerpoint allowed) and try and convince us to also be


passionate about it. We will then move into a standard interview."


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## Steve (May 8, 2014)

jimbo123 said:


> Thanks for everybodys insights.
> 
> I'm actually a bit nervous about this interview and talking for 5 mins. That's why I thought of doing those moves and talking in-between.
> 
> ...


If you're going to present for five minutes on wing chun, my advice is to prepare an organized presentation.  Remember, your presentation isn't about wing chun.  Your presentation is about you.  Tell stories.    

If I were doing this, about Wing Chun, I'd start with why I was drawn to a martial art in general.  In other words, what makes a martial art better for you than, say a typical gym membership?  "I can still remember the first time I saw a bruce lee movie.  I was 8 and my big brother took me to see the Big Boss.  That was back in 1977.  He was almost like a super hero to me.  And then, in the early 80's, I was determined to become a ninja.  Well, that didn't work out, but ever since then, the martial arts have always held for me a kind of mystique.  So, when I began really looking into getting into shape, I decided to look into learning a martial art.  

I tried several before finding Wing Chun.  Etc, etc...."

Then, I'd speak for a few minutes on Wing Chun and what makes it so exciting for me.    

I'd finish with my own personal journey in the art, try to make it a little funny, but emphasize the tangible benefits I've experienced physically and mentally.  

The key, really, is to remember that the presentation is about you, not Wing Chun.  Keep it positive and focus less on Wing Chun and more (entirely) on conveying a positive, interesting and professional image of yourself.

Good luck.


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## mograph (May 8, 2014)

All good points.

But consider this: in this job, you'll have to be able to persuade people to like the thing you're passionate about. You're fighting an uphill battle if it's something "niche," like Wing Chun. Really, how many average people have heard of it? How many average people are into martial arts? How many people might be turned off by the idea of combat? You don't want to make this harder than it has to be, so I wouldn't recommend WC as a topic, no matter how great we think it is. And it is great.

With WC as a topic, although there's a fitness angle, the "obscure, Chinese and martial"  (to them) angle might work against the fitness appeal. It would stand out. And trust me, in  North America, people aren't interested in Chinese topics unless they've  already investigated them. Or they're Chinese. You get polite interest  only or glassy eyes. And then there's Mook's angle on being known as the martial guy, of course. 

You need to be able to connect with the customers. You need to speak their language. You need to be someone who can connect with anybody (or just about anybody). You're going to have to be ready, once you get the job, to talk to customers about the weather, sports, kids, cooking, fitness ... all sorts of stuff that might interest the customer ... to get on their good side. _I recommend you pick a topic that you can talk passionately about and convince someone else to like because they already like something about it._ (Note my choice of words: it doesn't have to be the thing you're _most_ passionate about.) 

If I were interviewing you, I'd gauge your skills on how well you sold me on your topic. To do that, you'd have to consider me as an average person, but one who also has interests that align with the company. There's a clue, actually. That person likes what the company likes.

So. What else you got?


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## wingchun100 (May 8, 2014)

mograph said:


> All good points.
> 
> But consider this: in this job, you'll have to be able to persuade people to like the thing you're passionate about. You're fighting an uphill battle if it's something "niche," like Wing Chun. Really, how many average people have heard of it? How many average people are into martial arts? How many people might be turned off by the idea of combat? You don't want to make this harder than it has to be, so I wouldn't recommend WC as a topic, no matter how great we think it is. And it is great.
> 
> ...



You're right. Even with the heavy exposure given to wing chun by the IP MAN movies, you are still more likely to find someone who hasn't heard of it. Sad how most people don't actively try to be more worldly. As for me...man, I can't learn ENOUGH about different cultures. But then again, not everyone believes in learning something new every day.


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## donnaTKD (May 8, 2014)

you're going to animal charity right ?????  so do you have a pet like a cat or a budgie or if you're like me then you'd have a dog and 4 tarantulas  

if so you could bring that in say how the fact that your MA helps to keep you calm and destresses your home environment and your work environment - a relaxed chilled out atmosphere always brings people in for a closer look no matter what.  if you go into that room tense as hell then you'll have blown it before you start anything.

remember you go in confident - YOU HAVE TO RELATE WHAT YOU ARE SAYING TO THE TOPIC THAT THEY ARE SELLING - in this case it's a post potentially dealing with animals - you have to quiet, confident and give an air of authority to what you are saying so make sure you know exactly what it is that you're saying cos otherwise it'll just get pulled apart - literally.

you say you like different cultures and learning about them and stuff so you could actually bring in the fact that different cultures respect animals in certain ways like the elephant in india is practically a workhorse for that nation and is held in GOD like status for those people - just an idea.

best of luck 

donna


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## wingchun100 (May 8, 2014)

donnaTKD said:


> you're going to animal charity right ?????  so do you have a pet like a cat or a budgie or if you're like me then you'd have a dog and 4 tarantulas
> 
> if so you could bring that in say how the fact that your MA helps to keep you calm and destresses your home environment and your work environment - a relaxed chilled out atmosphere always brings people in for a closer look no matter what.  if you go into that room tense as hell then you'll have blown it before you start anything.
> 
> ...



Donna,

Different cultures was me...the OP is the one with the interview. LOL


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## donnaTKD (May 8, 2014)

sorry i read the whole thread before posting must have got lost in my sawdust somewhere sorry but it's way past bedtime 

donna


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## Carol (May 8, 2014)

Steve said:


> If you're going to present for five minutes on wing chun, my advice is to prepare an organized presentation.  Remember, your presentation isn't about wing chun.  Your presentation is about you.  Tell stories.
> 
> If I were doing this, about Wing Chun, I'd start with why I was drawn to a martial art in general.  In other words, what makes a martial art better for you than, say a typical gym membership?  "I can still remember the first time I saw a bruce lee movie.  I was 8 and my big brother took me to see the Big Boss.  That was back in 1977.  He was almost like a super hero to me.  And then, in the early 80's, I was determined to become a ninja.  Well, that didn't work out, but ever since then, the martial arts have always held for me a kind of mystique.  So, when I began really looking into getting into shape, I decided to look into learning a martial art.
> 
> ...



Exactly what Steve said in both of his posts.  This is an assessment of your ability to present, and communicate, under pressure.


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## mograph (May 8, 2014)

Carol said:


> Exactly what Steve said in both of his posts.  This is an assessment of your ability to present, and communicate, under pressure.


... and persuade, no?


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## jks9199 (May 8, 2014)

jezr74 said:


> I'd work out what you like or passionate about more in line with the nature of the job. Work out the qualities they are looking for, and what you enjoy that can reflect and enforce those qualities.
> 
> Sent from my Surface Pro 2 using Tapatalk


I agree.  Unless you're applying for a job that involves martial arts, I'd use a different topic.  Not only is the demonstration hard to make interesting to an outsider, it's possibly going to turn off the interviewer.


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## jimbo123 (May 10, 2014)

Well thanks for everyone's help. The goal was to make them interested in something. My plan was to give information about wing chun and then how it's benefitted me.

Here was the structure of my presentation in bullet points

1. A few years ago my metabolism started slowing down and I was getting unfit. I hate football and always wanted to learn martial arts

2. Not strength based, it built up my cardiovascular health and because there's not many high kicks no need to learn stretching! (The stretching comment made them laugh)

3. Talked about how it's improved my reflexes. Before if someone tried to slap me, I would get hit or block and get hit anyway. It's taught me to react appropriately and that taught me about the importance of regular training

4. Talked about the close quarter nature of wing chun with example of punching

5. It taught me to respect others. When I get hit I don't take it personally, when I hit other people I apologize if I injure them too much

6. It taught me perseverance. I've seen so many times a tiny person defeat a much larger person in wing chun. Sometimes I train against someone and at first they seem unstoppable until I slowly chip away their defences.

Their questions:

1) I'm lazy about exercising, why should I learn wing chun?
My Answer) I was exactly the same and so were some of my classmates. Ultimately, no one can force you to do it but I recommend you go and at least see a class in action. I did the same and then was tempted to join in and haven't looked back.

2) Why should I learn wing chun instead of boxing, karate or tae kwon doe?
My Answer) No martial art is the best other wise we would all be doing that one. Each one has special qualities. Wing chun is special because a lot of self defence scenarios put you in a small space and that's when people panic. I'm not an expert of Tae Kwon Doe but it involves lots of high kicks and that might not be great in small spaces.


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## geezer (May 10, 2014)

jimbo123 said:


> Well thanks for everyone's help. The goal was to make them interested in something. My plan was to give information about wing chun and then how it's benefitted me.
> 
> Here was the structure of my presentation in bullet points ...



Yada yada yada... _So did you get the job?_




Anyway, here's a rubric for grading your presentation:

D - F:  You didn't get the job.

C:  You get it on a provisional basis, and the whole time your co-workers tease you with pantomimed "karate-chops" and bad Bruce Lee immitations.

B - A: You get the job straight away and it works out well for you.

A+: You get the job _and one or more of your interviewers or co-workers joins your Wing Chun class!_


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## jimbo123 (May 11, 2014)

I haven't found out yet. They're still interviewing people


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## Steve (May 11, 2014)

Good luck, buddy.  Hey, one question I didn't ask and should have.  Are you in the USA or somewhere else?  Just curious.


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## donnaTKD (May 11, 2014)

am pretty sure he's in the US.


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## mograph (May 11, 2014)

It sounds as if you were well-prepared. Good luck!


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## donnaTKD (May 12, 2014)

am hoping that after all this he does get it


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## wingchun100 (May 12, 2014)

I'd be interested to hear the outcome myself, not to mention if anyone asks him any further about wing chun!


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## jimbo123 (May 12, 2014)

donnaTKD said:


> am pretty sure he's in the US.


Nah I'm from London.

Well one comment the interviewer said as he was smiling was "remind me not to mess with you"


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## yak sao (May 12, 2014)

wingchun100 said:


> I'd be interested to hear the outcome myself, not to mention if anyone asks him any further about wing chun!




If he gets the job, we'll all start doing wing chun at job intervierws


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## wingchun100 (May 12, 2014)

yak sao said:


> If he gets the job, we'll all start doing wing chun at job intervierws



I tried here when they interviewed me for a supervisor position. I said it has given me patience and showed me that you should never think you do anything "good enough," that you should always keep trying to improve or you will stagnate. Needless to say, I am not a supervisor. :-(


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## donnaTKD (May 12, 2014)

yeah but you're not english and therefore by definition an "eccentric" lol


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## jimbo123 (May 13, 2014)

I didn't get the job 

They said they thought the wing chun presentation was very interesting and they could tell I was passionate about it but I was 'telling' them rather than convincing them.

Also the role involves some sales and they thought I wasn't strong enough in that regards.

Oh well, wish me luck I have another interview tomorrow! They didn't ask me to do a presentation for this one so just a bog standard interview!


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## donnaTKD (May 13, 2014)

bad luck 

hope that you go in there and sell yourself properly to them


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## Steve (May 13, 2014)

First, I'm very sorry you didn't get the job.  But, it sounds like you've already got another iron in the fire.  Good luck!  

Have you ever worked in sales or in retail?  When you say, "telling" vs "convincing" I immediately thought of the difference between a feature and a benefit.  In sales, the concept of features vs benefits is fundamental.  The idea is that features don't sell a product.  Benefits do.  The key difference boils down to relating the benefit to your customer.

So, in the case of your interview, this is what I was hinting at when I said that the presentation isn't about WC.  Rather, it's about you.  Every time you're trying to influence an outcome, whether it's to sell a product, sell yourself (ie, get a job) or to sway someone's opinion, you have to relate to what that person wants or needs.  For example, fuel economy in a car is a feature.  That is not a selling point.  Instead of saying, "This car is fuel efficient" (feature), focus on the benefit, "The fuel efficiency of this car *will save you money every month. (benefit)*"  It's a subtle distinction, but is fundamental and absolutely critical to understand.

Presuming that the feedback you received is on the mark, and that you can stand to do more selling (or influencing or convincing or whatever you want to call it) and less 'telling,' a useful exercise for you might be to bullet out your own strengths.  What are your "features?"  What do you bring to the table to a prospective employer?  Just bullet these items out.  Then, for each one, think about how that "feature" translates into a tangible benefit to the employer. 

I hope this helps.

Edit:  Just want to add, if you google "features vs benefits" you'll get a lot of tips on this very basic sales concept.


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## wingchun100 (May 13, 2014)

Steve said:


> First, I'm very sorry you didn't get the job.  But, it sounds like you've already got another iron in the fire.  Good luck!
> 
> Have you ever worked in sales or in retail?  When you say, "telling" vs "convincing" I immediately thought of the difference between a feature and a benefit.  In sales, the concept of features vs benefits is fundamental.  The idea is that features don't sell a product.  Benefits do.  The key difference boils down to relating the benefit to your customer.
> 
> ...



I work a home-based business job selling fitness supplements. This will actually be a big help for me too!


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## Steve (May 13, 2014)

wingchun100 said:


> I work a home-based business job selling fitness supplements. This will actually be a big help for me too!


Terrific.  I'm glad it helped!


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## jks9199 (May 13, 2014)

Sorry to hear you didn't get the job.  I am, however, glad to hear that they gave you feedback, and that you seem to have taken it positively so that your next interview is more successful.  

Good luck!


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## mograph (May 13, 2014)

Sorry you didn't get the job. 

The dominant models of persuasion are what they call dual-process (Elaboration Likelihood Model and Heuristic-Systematic Model). One process is logical, the other isn't. Along the lines of what Steve (very correctly) said, describing features is part of the logical process. Even describing benefits can be logical if there are no emotions or self-image thoughts attached to those benefits. Logical benefits would be "it saves you money."
On the other side is the not-logical process, where people are persuaded by good-looking people and appeals that boost their self-image. Illogical benefits would be "it makes you look cool."

According to the models, when we have the _motivation_ and ability to carefully examine something, we can be persuaded by logic. However, at other times, maybe after seeing twenty job applicants, we're persuaded by appeals that are not very logical because we lack the motivation to pay close attention and evaluate critically. We should not assume that people have the motivation and ability to look  into something that doesn't already make them feel good or serve their  purpose: that would take work on their part.

It's the salesperson's job to find out what the audience is interested in and know whether that audience really wants to hear his/her message.

Selling jobs are about persuasion. 
We have to know our audience.
We have to know what it wants.


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## jimbo123 (May 14, 2014)

Wow Steve that's an amazing way to look at it. I'll bear that in mind in the future.


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## mograph (May 15, 2014)

Now ... if my response was not very persuasive, we might want to ask ... why not?


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