# Favorite Weapon



## white mantis (May 21, 2004)

Hi everyone, I am new to this forum and I've been studying 7 Star Praying Mantis kung fu for 1 year and 1 month and I was wondering whats yalls favorite kung fu weapon.


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## Cruentus (May 21, 2004)

white mantis said:
			
		

> Hi everyone, I am new to this forum and I've been studying 7 Star Praying Mantis kung fu for 1 year and 1 month and I was wondering whats yalls favorite kung fu weapon.



I am not a kung fu stylest, but an old friend of mine did Kung Fu.

I admired the chain whip and the 3-sectional staff, which I can play with in a limited manner.


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## ShaolinWolf (May 21, 2004)

Well, so far I like the Bo staff the best. Then the chucks.Then the short stick. 


As weapons I want to learn, the Kamas, the Sais, the 3-sectional staff...And of course, the sword...and possibly the cane. Other weapons I'm interested in learning is the chain whip and the rope dart.


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## Michael Billings (May 21, 2004)

white mantis - On behalf of the Admin/Mod Team, WELCOME to MartialTalk!!! 

 I assume you are talking about Martial Arts weapons excluding the obvious handguns, Rocket Launchers and sub-machine guns?

 Traditional weapons - Saber or Two-Headed Spear
 Non-Traditional - Kenpo Double Sticks
 Practical - Spyderco, Kinetic Opening Folder [Bram Frankin blade]

 -Michael


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## 7starmantis (May 21, 2004)

white mantis said:
			
		

> Hi everyone, I am new to this forum and I've been studying 7 Star Praying Mantis kung fu for 1 year and 1 month and I was wondering whats yalls favorite kung fu weapon.


Welcome to the Boards! There is some very good discussion here, although the CMA section is not as active as I would like it to be!! Its also good to see other 7 star people here, may I ask who you study under?

I guess my favorite weapon as of now is probably still the staff, or maybe the broadsword. Its hard to pick a favorite, I'm really also enjoying the flute and cern sau do.

7sm


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## white mantis (May 21, 2004)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Welcome to the Boards! There is some very good discussion here, although the CMA section is not as active as I would like it to be!! Its also good to see other 7 star people here, may I ask who you study under?
> 
> I guess my favorite weapon as of now is probably still the staff, or maybe the broadsword. Its hard to pick a favorite, I'm really also enjoying the flute and cern sau do.
> 
> 7sm


Awsome, I have just started learning the staff.

The sifu I study under is sifu steve cottrell.:asian:


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## 7starmantis (May 21, 2004)

white mantis said:
			
		

> Awsome, I have just started learning the staff.
> 
> The sifu I study under is sifu steve cottrell.:asian:


Ah, I know of Sifu Cotrell very well. You guys aren't far from us then, I'm in Tyler TX. Welcome to the boards again.

7sm


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## RHD (May 21, 2004)

Tiger Fork.

Mike


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## Gentle Fist (May 21, 2004)

mine is still the bo staff, they are laying around everywhere...


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## 7starmantis (May 22, 2004)

RHD said:
			
		

> Tiger Fork.
> 
> Mike


I figured you would say a nice old hung gar weapon! I really like watching someone who can actually use it well. 

7sm


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## RHD (May 22, 2004)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> I figured you would say a nice old hung gar weapon! I really like watching someone who can actually use it well.
> 
> 7sm



Ha ha...haven't played with one for years, but seemed to have a real affinity for it when I did.
Mike


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## Eldritch Knight (May 22, 2004)

Double butterfly knives.

I'd really like to learn the chain whip and the rope dart, though


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## tshadowchaser (May 22, 2004)

the broadsword  I just like the feel of it and the way it flows.
 I'm trying to learn the 3 section staff but from all the bumps and brusies I have to admit that I have a loooooong way to go


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## rompida (May 22, 2004)

I'd have to say my favorite CMA weapon is also the broadsword.  Double broadswords, to be exact.  What can I say?  No, they're not exactly practical.  But flashy and smooth as can be.  Something about it just appeals to me.  I also like the 3-sectional staff as well.  Its a weapon that will definitely keep you "honest".


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## Michael Billings (May 22, 2004)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Ah, I know of Sifu Cotrell very well. You guys aren't far from us then, I'm in Tyler TX. Welcome to the boards again.
> 
> 7sm


 And I will be in Tyler, for the 1st time in my life, Thursday this week (work).  Leaving Friday am for Dallas.  Where are you located in Tyler?

 -Michael


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## RevelationX (May 22, 2004)

1) *Eyebrow staff - *Preferably wax wood or rattan. As stated before, a similar weapon (in shape and/or energy) is readily available in many day-to-day situations. It also serves as a foundation for understanding the energy and internal structure of many other CMA weapons.

2) *Tai Chi Sword -* Forged or Combat Steel blade. 26" overall length for double wield, 28" overall length for single. No more than 1.5 lbs (double) - 2.0 lbs (single) each sword. 

3) *Double Butterfly Knives* - Forged or Combat Steel Blades. This weapon choice complements traditional Wing Chun theory like no other weapon. And since Wing Chun is my primary art, this choice becomes an obvious one.

These choices are my top 3. There are others, but I feel that mastery of weapons in CMA requires a focus of a few key weapons, as opposed to getting lost in the abundance of weapons that CMA presents throughout the history of the Arts through various styles, lineage's, and time periods.

I made these specific choices for a few reasons. First, each weapon has a distinctive fighting range. The staff being for long-range fighting application, the Tai Chi sword for medium-range fighting application, and finally the Butterfly Knives for short-range fighting application.

The second reason is the level of lethal intent each weapon emulates in most situations. For example, the staff is rarely used to kill. It speaks more of a protective and subduing energy, rather than the alternative. Not to say that it cannot be used as such, however, the spirit of the weapon itself does not promote that extreme level by nature of its design.

The Tai Chi sword is by far the opposite. Although, its many sword forms are beautiful, fluid, and attractive to the eye. Its applications are almost always deadly. Such is the nature of any _true_ sword. I relate the Tai Chi sword easily to its equally efficient counterpart, the Japanese Katana. The difference lies not in their intent (each one is equally deadly), but in the different environments that sired their creation. 

The Japanese sword was designed to cut through heavily armored opponents on the battlefield, while the Tai Chi sword was meant to slice and stab an opponent with little or no armor during small skirmishes and back alley confrontations. Of course there are exceptions for each, however, their fighting spirit remains constant. And since we now live in a time where armor is rare, my choice drifted toward the CMA style of sword play. I doubt I would ever have to use such a weapon in combat in today's world, however, the choice for training a weapon of lethal intent falls to that of the Tai Chi Sword.

The Butterfly Knives (sometimes referred to as "swords") are not in my opinion a "sword" at all due to the nature of combat as well as the range in which they are used. Their nature is to "Chop" rather than stabbing or slicing. Now, while you _may_ still slice or stab, it rarely is represented in the energy and application of the weapon. The "chopping" energy during close combat is what I see as a balance between the subduing energy of the staff and the lethal energy of the sword. While you can choose to utilize the energy for lethal combat, you have the *option *to choose the level of intent by its application.

For instance, I am fighting multiple opponents in close quarters, and I must take each one out as quickly and effectively as possible _without_ the intention killing, even though I am afraid for my own life. The staff would suffer in this instance because the fighting range is too close, and you must take each enemy down with one stroke. Not impossible, but not likely with the staff. 

With the knives "chopping" energy, your targets can easily be the non-lethal parts of the body (i.e. the extremities (legs, hands. and arms), the back, the shoulders and trapezius muscles, etc.), so as to debilitate your opponent as quickly as possible (to increase your chances of survival) while not _intending _to end another human life. The weapon, however, also leaves a lethal option open if it must ascend to that level. The spirit of the weapon allows for this balance to present itself better than that of the pure lethal intent of the Tai Chi sword. Yes, the sword may be used to injure you opponent, but it still pales in comparison to the effectiveness of the Knives due to their inherent balance of the energy held within, which in turn gives the balance of spirit and intent during their application.

I have many other reasons for my choices, however, they are on a more personal level, so I will refrain from listing those reasons, for the level of subjectivity may cause many disagreements regarding the nature of weapons in combat. I hope that I have put it clear enough to words, so that the reader understands fully my reasons and logic for choosing my focus weapons for my martial training.

In closing, each artist must choose the weapon that speaks to his/her soul, specific fighting art, and particular body type. They do not have to be as systematic, or as inclusive as my choices. However, they do have to be the one(s) for _you_. Choose wisely. And, Good Luck with your training.

Thank You.


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## 7starmantis (May 22, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> And I will be in Tyler, for the 1st time in my life, Thursday this week (work). Leaving Friday am for Dallas. Where are you located in Tyler?
> 
> -Michael


Ah welcome to the Rose City then. I live in South Tyler but my school is on east 5th street down from Tyler Junior college. Our main classes take place thursday evening at 6:30, you should drop by and check one out if you have time. Tyler Kung Fu & Fitness is the name.

7sm


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## Michael Billings (May 22, 2004)

Excellent post RevelationX.  In Hung-Gar we called the eyebrow staff a Monkey Stick.  

 I divide Chinese weapons into two broad catagories, Flexible and Rigid.  Then by range, with some fitting into both (e.g. the 3-Sectional Staff, etc.); and subdivide again by edged and non-edged weapons, whether for slicing or stabbing.  Weapons thrown, blown (darts, powders, liquids, etc.), or shot  mechanically fall into their own specialized catagory unless multi functional.

 Thoughts?

 -Michael


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## Michael Billings (May 22, 2004)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Ah welcome to the Rose City then. I live in South Tyler but my school is on east 5th street down from Tyler Junior college. Our main classes take place thursday evening at 6:30, you should drop by and check one out if you have time. Tyler Kung Fu & Fitness is the name.
> 
> 7sm


 Thanks, I will drop by if I can find it.  I will be visiting the Parole Office in Tyler, then staying at a local bed & breakfast before heading out the next morning.  Thanks for the invite.

 -Michael


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## RubyMoon (May 22, 2004)

I currently have a fascination with the three-section staff.  I've wanted to learn this weapon for many years, ever since I saw my first Sifu whip the thing around so expertly.  Now I finally have my chance.  I am very priveledged to have the opportunity to learn a two-person form, three-section staff vs. spear.  It is challenging, exciting, and practical.  The techniques I am learning seem to come much more quickly with a partner than they would without, since I really have to block those spear thrusts and slashes!  If one of us doesn't perform a technique properly, someone could get hurt.  Needless to say, we are highly motivated to learn and perform our techniques with great precision.  

The other weapon I am currently training in is the single broadsword (darn dao).  This is an elegant weapon I have always wanted to learn.  I have almost completed the first form, and it is starting to really get fun now that my techniques are becoming smoother and more spontaneous.  

Of course the staff has always been a good standard weapon to fall back on.  I began my study of the staff over 15 years ago with my first sifu.  Soon I will begin a new form with my new sifu, as soon as I complete my broadsword form.  I am looking forward to this.   

The weapon I am by far best at, however, is not even found in traditional kung fu:  the sticks.  Over the course of my training, I have picked up a fair amount of Arnis, along with some related arts such as Serrada.  I really took to the sticks easily, and have actually been in a situation where I used them in self-defense against a single stick-wielding attacker (it was the heavy end of a pool cue, in fact).  I am by no means an expert at these arts, but I have absorbed the basics and continue to practice.  I would love the opportunity to really study the filippino stick-fighting arts in earnest, but alas...I can find no schools near my location in west central Florida.  (If anybody knows of any, please let me know!)  

I recently purchased a really cool new toy that combines two of my weapon interests into one.  It's one of those "convert-a-staff" things.  It is made of an alluminum alloy.  When assembled, it is a six foot staff, approximately the same weight as a hardwood staff.  With a few twists, however, the sections seperate into three 24" sections connected by chains.  As a three-section staff, it is a just a tad on the heavy side, and that aluminum hurts like the dickens when you screw up.  On the whole, however...I think this thing is wicked cool.  :ultracool


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## RevelationX (May 22, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> Excellent post RevelationX. In Hung-Gar we called the eyebrow staff a Monkey Stick.
> 
> I divide Chinese weapons into two broad catagories, Flexible and Rigid. Then by range, with some fitting into both (e.g. the 3-Sectional Staff, etc.); and subdivide again by edged and non-edged weapons, whether for slicing or stabbing. Weapons thrown, blown (darts, powders, liquids, etc.), or shot mechanically fall into their own specialized catagory unless multi functional.
> 
> ...


Thank You for your kind words.:asian: 

While, I will agree with that method of classification for the organization of weapons on a surface and structural level. I have found personally that the "greater" or more profound differences lie in the internal energy (found in each weapon respectively), and each weapon's "fighting spirit," (sometimes seen as the weapons "intent" : i.e. to kill, maim, debilitate, torture, bleed, crush, etc.) Of course this method is deeper, more abstract, and more subjective, however, it is only _one_ other approach to classification of weapons. 

I find that one system, one level of depth, or one "way" of interpreting the energy and classification of weapons is more closely related to the individuals mental make-up (abstract or logical thinking), as well as their martial background (internal or external). Neither, is the "right" or better way. Each approach is just another option for an individual to find what "speaks" to him/her directly, so that his/her understanding of the martial applications become deeper and allow for greater mastery and skill to develop within.

Take Care. :boing2:


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## Michael Billings (May 22, 2004)

RevelationX, understood.  I was dealing with them as you would a novice or newbie to the boards, from a functional, structural, external level only.  Any weapon can reflect the nature (spirit) of the wielder, however, not every weapon's nature is condusive to every user.

 I know this sound ambiguous and maybe intellectually snotty, which was not my intent.  The easy way of saying this, is a very experienced teacher, well versed an trained, can pick up any weapon and make it his or hers.  Not every student however, is comfortable with some of the weapons they are asked to learn.  

 I think the more damaging externally, the weapon is, the more graphic the degree of physical destruction it causes, may, because of the weapon's nature and function, be too destructive for some to feel comfortable with.  It is when you get up close and personal, or when you can easily imagine the damage caused by your weapons, that your practice moves from the beautiful, graceful, powerful, explosive martial dance, into a much more uncomfortable arena for most.  This should not deter us from learning all that we can, but our arts are "Martial", or War-Like.  

 -Michael


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## Rich Parsons (May 22, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> RevelationX, understood.  I was dealing with them as you would a novice or newbie to the boards, from a functional, structural, external level only.  Any weapon can reflect the nature (spirit) of the wielder, however, not every weapon's nature is condusive to every user.
> 
> I know this sound ambiguous and maybe intellectually snotty, which was not my intent.  The easy way of saying this, is a very experienced teacher, well versed an trained, can pick up any weapon and make it his or hers.  Not every student however, is comfortable with some of the weapons they are asked to learn.
> 
> ...



Micheal,

I think I understand your words. And I agree 

Good Post
 :asian:


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## RevelationX (May 23, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> RevelationX, understood. I was dealing with them as you would a novice or newbie to the boards, from a functional, structural, external level only. Any weapon can reflect the nature (spirit) of the wielder, however, not every weapon's nature is condusive to every user.
> 
> I know this sound ambiguous and maybe intellectually snotty, which was not my intent. The easy way of saying this, is a very experienced teacher, well versed an trained, can pick up any weapon and make it his or hers. Not every student however, is comfortable with some of the weapons they are asked to learn.
> 
> ...


Very nice post, Michael. I believe your words hold much truth regarding the reflection of spirit or intent of the wielder regardless of the weapon. However, I also believe that the inherent spirit (or nature) of each weapon plays a very important role in how it harmonizes with each person's inner spirit or intent. True, any person (well versed in the Arts) should be able to pick up any weapon, and be able to apply it to some degree based on previous experiences, combat theory, or understanding of internal energy (conscious or subconscious). The weapon is an extension of your own body and serves as a tool to for the user to emit his intent, extend his spirit, as well as to manipulate his internal energy for its use in combat. 

That being said, My opinion is that some Artists will not be able to master some weapons as easily, or to the same level of "mastery" as other weapons. I believe one of the determining factors lies directly in the nature, level, and quality of the user's spirit. For the user's spirit to harmonize and connect with a deeper level of understanding (so as to make that specific weapon _truly,_ a "part" of him or her), the weapon must "speak" to the individuals soul. 

What I mean by this is that the weapons intent must match or harmonize with the user's intent. It must harmonize with the user every time he trains so that nothing is lost, and every training session provides new insights and understandings unique to that particular weapon. 

If you do not have that "melding" or "forging" of intents between man and weapon every time the user picks it up, the training will take much longer than it would if the forging did not happen. Not only would it take longer, the level of understanding would not reach as deeply. Somewhat like learning a new language, you can learn the words and the proper order, but if you are not so inclined, the "feeling" and depth of the translation is lost. However, if the language is similar to your own, (lets say it is also Latin based) then you may soon come to understand the "feel" and "intent" of the language based on what you already hold internally. And this allows the connection to come more easily and at a more rapid pace. The same holds true within the arts.

That is not to say that it is not possible for any user to master any weapon. There are no limitations to what knowledge one can aquire while spending our few years on this ball of dirt. I would say that the advantages of searching and then finding a weapon or weapons that compliments you internally and externally will allow for more gains per time and energy spent than any other way of choosing. 

Also, we all know when something "fits." We are more inclined to stay with, and work harder towards something we have an affinity with than something we do not. Very much the reason why I believe the truth of the reasons you gave for some students attraction or repulsion to a specific weapon. I have just tried to elaborate on why I agree with you. 

Although this post is purely subjective, I hope the core of what I say is reaching you so that you may better understand my viewpoint of this expansive and broad subject. It is unfortunate that the subject is so abstract and deep. It is almost trying to define "love" or "justice." It seems we are on a very common ground and are saying nearly the same things, the words used are just a little different. I am enjoying this discussion and I am looking forward to what you, or anyone else has to say about the subject.

I also enjoy the challenge of trying to represent our individual abstract ideas in such a limited medium. 

Thank you all for the Honor. :asian:


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## RevelationX (May 23, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> I know this sound ambiguous and maybe intellectually snotty, which was not my intent. The easy way of saying this, is a very experienced teacher, well versed an trained, can pick up any weapon and make it his or hers. Not every student however, is comfortable with some of the weapons they are asked to learn.
> 
> -Michael


I do not believe it sounds snotty at all. It is your view and I honor it. You words are respectful, thoughtful, and valid. I appreciate your time and effort spent in this discussion and I appreciate your viewpoints concerning this subject. I am enjoying this very much, and I am looking forward to future discussions concerning this subject, as well as others. Thank You. :asian: 

- Charles


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## Tony (May 25, 2004)

I really like using the staff but I would  love to start using a rope dart! its looks so cool especially when you see Jet Li use it in his films and I don't see why it can't be used for practical purposes. A belt could surely be used as a weapon aswell as keys and pens.


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## Randy Strausbaugh (May 26, 2004)

Personally, I favor the jian.  If found in a self defense situation, I'll probably be unarmed, so practicality is not an issue for me.  I've found that the jian improves my Taijiquan practice due to the added focus necessitated by blade use.  There's also something about the "feel" of it that causes me to favor it over the dao (I realize that "feel" is rather an odd term, but it's the best description I can come up with for the experience at this time).


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## Yasuki (May 26, 2004)

I'd have to say that I like jappanese styles more.


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## Yasuki (May 26, 2004)

Well as far as kung fu I'd say hook swords, other than that nunchaku, and my four winds.


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## Flatlander (May 29, 2004)

The straight hickory police baton.  Love it.


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## Shogun (May 29, 2004)

Well I don't do Chinese MA, but, I am in love with the Kwan Dao. I have a naginata, and they are similar, but.........Kwan Dao, all the way.


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## white mantis (May 30, 2004)

Shogun said:
			
		

> Well I don't do Chinese MA, but, I am in love with the Kwan Dao. I have a naginata, and they are similar, but.........Kwan Dao, all the way.


Ah, yes the legendary weapon named after General Kwan It's one of my fav's aswell.:asian:


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## KungFuWarrior (Jun 5, 2004)

I would have to say that my favorite weapon would have to be the bo staff because its so readily available, broom handles, pipes, ect.  I also like the whip chain and the rope dart.


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## 7starmantis (Jun 5, 2004)

I guess the rope dart and chain whip are favorites here! Seems like lots of people like them. Those weapons are ones that will bite back if you do not do them correctly!! OUCH

7sm


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## Dronak (Jun 7, 2004)

Well, I don't have a whole lot of MA experience.  And even though we were being pushed hard and fast in the classes I took, for the most part we only worked with two weapons -- staff and broadsword.  I think in some special classes, a few people got to work with sear and straight sword, but I'm not certain.  I kind of like the staff, I think because it's so simple (a long piece of wood), and fortunately that was the weapon form I was able to learn.  But I've seen other weapons in catalogs and instructional videos and stuff and I expect that some of them would be pretty cool weapons.


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