# American Tang Soo Do



## TallAdam85 (Oct 19, 2004)

Lately I have been think :uhohh: I realy Enjoy Training In Tang Soo Do! But there is a few things about the old school tang soo do is that a lot of schools is they called all the moves in Korean. Why most of the time people never go to Korea and if they do how is just a few words going to help them plus most people over there speak English. But I am grateful that Korea invent Tang Soo Do But what have they done for it lately. Right Now most of the best fighters are from America. So that's why I deiced to be American Tang Soo Do, I am still going to do all the forms and stuff just try to more things to help. But think if we did not evolve  we would die out like the dinosaur.

just my view


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## NoSword (Nov 4, 2004)

TallAdam85 said:
			
		

> Lately I have been think :uhohh: I realy Enjoy Training In Tang Soo Do! But there is a few things about the old school tang soo do is that a lot of schools is they called all the moves in Korean. Why most of the time people never go to Korea and if they do how is just a few words going to help them plus most people over there speak English. But I am grateful that Korea invent Tang Soo Do But what have they done for it lately. Right Now most of the best fighters are from America. So that's why I deiced to be American Tang Soo Do, I am still going to do all the forms and stuff just try to more things to help. But think if we did not evolve  we would die out like the dinosaur.
> 
> just my view



I'm not sure I understood what you mean, could you please clarify?


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## Vanilla Heath-Bar Crunch (Nov 5, 2004)

*Are you KIDDING?*

This is the most articulate that I have ever seen Adam!


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## NoSword (Nov 5, 2004)

Well, I understand some parts of his post (I think) and it seems that one thing that he brought up could be something that might make for an interesting discussion, but I wanted to make sure I understand the entire post before I comment on it


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## Miles (Jan 8, 2005)

If I understand the question, the reason why many schools use Japanese/Chinese/Korean terminology is to show respect to the home of their art.  It also comes in handy when you are in an international seminar or tournament and everyone uses the same terminology while training.

Miles


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## jfarnsworth (Jan 8, 2005)

That's exactly right  . We should all be on the same page as far as terminology. That's why I prefer to speak english and teach in english terms. When my TKD instructor became independent all the Korean talk was gone. Yipee!


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## Miles (Jan 9, 2005)

jfarnsworth said:
			
		

> That's exactly right  . We should all be on the same page as far as terminology. That's why I prefer to speak english and teach in english terms. When my TKD instructor became independent all the Korean talk was gone. Yipee!


:>)  Actually, you did a little verbal Hapkido to my point.

Even in English, there are many names for basic techniques: round kick=roundhouse kick=wheel kick.  See what I mean?

Miles


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## shesulsa (Jan 9, 2005)

Good point.  What I call a "wing lock" someone else calls a "come-along."

Ah well, semantics.


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## jfarnsworth (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, well, at least I could understand what you were talking about.


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## MichiganTKD (Jan 10, 2005)

To a certain extent he is right. Except for tradition, there is no real need to use all-Korean phrases while teaching in America, unless you focus on Olympic sparring and will need to know the terms because Korean is the language of international WTF sparring. Once I got past the grammar that sounded like George Bush on pot, I understood what he meant.
Our Grandmaster uses the Korean phrases he is familiar with, while my American born Instructor uses English. It often depends on who your Instructor is. Some of the Korean ones use Korean because they haven't mastered English yet.


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## TallAdam85 (Jan 23, 2005)

sorry i been away my pc was in the shop and i was in the middle of a move sorry i did not get to reply.

But no i study tang soo do 
Enjoy Tang Soo Do
But I live in Michigan Not Asia So Why not work on a move instead of learning a word? Just like belts people get there name done in korean letter who knows if it is your name or there saying something about your moma very few thats who. I just feel it is time for tang soo do to break way and get better. Look at the cave man if they did not find fire they would  still be in a cave eatting raw meat am i right. why not the same with martial arts. Like japan arts all came from china. They up graded and made it better right? That's all i am saying we should do. Korea was the base but America is where it is now right. Like Grand Master June Red Said " If your so Tradiotal Ride a hourse instead of driving a car."

also i am sorry for the grammer and spelling errors also this my views and everyone has a veiw and there all just views


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## Knifehand (Feb 6, 2005)

I've been in Tang Soo Do Moo Duk Kwan for five months now. My instructor doesn't call moves in korean, but i've been told that i will have to know them eventually. Like Ha Dan Mahk Kee is a low block,  E Dan Ahp Cha Gi is a jump front kick. but for the level i am at, Yellow belt, he calls them in english and then lets us know what it is in korean. 

Kicho Hyung Il bu and Kicho Hyung Ee Bu are korean and they aren't referred to in my dojang as basic form number 1 and basic form number 2. 

Personally, i feel it is necessary to learn the orginal names of the moves. it takes discipline and study to learn and pronounce the terms. Granted i am still learning, i think it is a nice touch.


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## kid (Feb 7, 2005)

Also you have to remember not everything translates perfectly into English.  My instructor  still uses korean, its difficult at first but soon thats just how you remember it.  i think that it is a good thing to remember where and what moves are called. and also Martial arts is not only for your body but for your mind.


cause kid said so


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## Knifehand (Feb 7, 2005)

kid said:
			
		

> Also you have to remember not everything translates perfectly into English. My instructor still uses korean, its difficult at first but soon thats just how you remember it. i think that it is a good thing to remember where and what moves are called. and also Martial arts is not only for your body but for your mind.
> 
> 
> cause kid said so


Tonight in my adult class (14+ any belt rank) my instructor was calling moves in Korean.I was the lowest belt there, Sometimes i knew what they were and a majority of the time i didn't. Only after he called the strikes and moved onto the kicks, i realized that he was calling movements for my rank. Kwon Do Kong Kyuck, Soo Do Kong Kyuck, Pal Koop Kong Kyuck... so on and so forth. It helps work that attention to detail.


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## kid (Feb 8, 2005)

well it sounds like you will start to get them soon.  now i need to start to understand them.  i think it's harder if you learned them once already but called something eles and that messes with your head.


Cause kid said so


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## AmericanTangSooDo (Mar 11, 2010)

TallAdam85 said:


> Lately I have been think :uhohh: I realy Enjoy Training In Tang Soo Do! But there is a few things about the old school tang soo do is that a lot of schools is they called all the moves in Korean. Why most of the time people never go to Korea and if they do how is just a few words going to help them plus most people over there speak English. But I am grateful that Korea invent Tang Soo Do But what have they done for it lately. Right Now most of the best fighters are from America. So that's why I deiced to be American Tang Soo Do, I am still going to do all the forms and stuff just try to more things to help. But think if we did not evolve  we would die out like the dinosaur.
> 
> just my view



I know this post is several years old, but I have to tell you that there's already a style called *American Tang Soo Do*. Its also known as the *Chuck Norris System* (pre-Chun Kuk Do circa 1990).

American Tang Soo Do is a name that many who trace their lineage back to Norris use. We still use the Korean names for the forms and about a handful of commands in Korean, but that its. All kicks, blocks, punches, etc. are all spoken in English.


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## Muwubu16858 (Mar 16, 2010)

As my 60 year old Korean teacher told me, "If teaching in Korea, I teach in Korean, but I'm teaching in America, so I do in English!" The only time period he would teach completely in krean, and most of what he would say I hadn't the slightest clue, was when I was partnered with his son for private teaching when I was 16 and 17. Then he wouldnt speak a word of english, but would later tell me after class. In class, I would follow along without question.


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## GINGERNINJA (Apr 15, 2010)

I to find it hard to understand the all the Korean terms , my master was Korean but he  did not speak much English so we had to communicate in Malay to begin with ( that was almost as hard as training ) but after a while I could understand his English a lot more and his English improved a lot , apart from every now again master  would have to ask a Chinese student to explain in English something that was asked in Malay to translate from Korean !!  I once asked my master why Tang Soo Do was taught in Korean to English speaking students , ( as already mentioned in another post ) master told me that is because when Tang Soo Do was first taught to the westerners  most Korean instructors did not know much English , and it became the way things where taught , I dont know if this was deliberate action , a sort of safe guard for the Korean language and culture ( from what I have been told and read , the Japanese outlawed the Korean language during their occupation there ) so with Tang Soo Do spreading it wings across the globe ( if history repeated itself ) the language would always have a safe haven in the form of Tang Soo Do practitioners  (after thought ! could of also been a way to make sure that new schools had an Korean instructor on site ) 
  Yes it does take a little effort to learn the Korean terms , and this effort is added to by the pronunciation  of the terms from instructor to instructor , when i trained with an English instructor and he was using Korean terms I really could not understand what he was saying ,  I can understand my master talking Korean but it took some re-education on my part to understand an English guy talking Korean , 
  I think learning Korean terms is a worth while effort just out of respect for the home land of the martial art which we love ,
  And the brain needs a work out just as much as your body !


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## Ryun Ma (May 12, 2010)

I think keeping Korean Terminology is very important in terms of tradition, for traveling purposes(those who choose to do a training stint in Korea), for seminars under Korean Masters and GMs, and for the simple fact of...it is what it is, it's Korean Art so I try to do things "the Korean way" as best I can.

And for the matter of "Americanizing things to make them better", it scares me because that's the way that we've been doing things...learning and making our own and doing our own thing without looking back. Rarely has an American influence on something made things better, in fact most Japanese, Korean, and Chinese Masters look at what we've done and how we perform and practice and they shake their heads because we have it all wrong, we've watered it down. It's unfortunate, but I do think the Martial Arts world is at a turning point most Instructors are starting to get it and seek the influence of others from Korea and those who have traveled there and learned. It's not strictly a Tang Soo Do thing, I study Kempo as well and have been very involved with well respected Masters adn GMs from Japan and China who have guided us and tried to help us back on to 'the path' so to speak. It's a beautifully thing once the pieces come together and you see what you are really doing and you get the how, the why, the when, the where, and the what but a lot are often to ignorant, stubborn, or stuck in our ways to be open to such thoughts. Admitingly, I was stubborn at first but now I am dead set on the path and have amazing mentors and peers to aid in the journey.


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## MasterPistella (May 12, 2010)

I agree with Ryun Ma. It's not that we are "improving" as much as changing it. Mostly not for the better. Now I've only been in the martial arts for a few years, but I used to teach at the PE dept for a university in Pittsburgh. There were a couple of students who came from other TSD schools (one didn't speak English) & because we used the Korean, it was the one class she never had a problem with. That's the reason we use it. So we are all the same. Yes, there are some schools who choose not to use Korean & that's fine. But I disagree with that helping. My GM is planning a trip to Korea in August. There are people going from Chili, Greece, Italy, & Spain. Most don't speak much English, but the training will still go easily since they all know the terms in Korean.

I also disagree with Japan "up grading" the Chinese arts. They changed them definately, but I wouldn't say they improved on them. They created their own thing & that is fantastic. Just like Chuck Norris didn't improve TSD by the changes he made. He made his own distinct art out of it. 

Yes, we must all grow & improve & if deleting the Korean terms is how you plan to grow, great. I just wanted to show the real reason why we use it.

Just my $0.02
MP


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## Manny (May 13, 2010)

My first two sambunims (TKD) gave and give all the comands in korean with his translation in spanish, I leraned the comendas in korean so when I give class in the new dojang I atend the boys does not understand me at all, cause I teach teh way I am use to, and need to say the comand and the translation for a better understanding.

Manny


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## VNoble21532 (Aug 16, 2010)

OK- Let's take this a step further... How many of you hate when an American instructor teaches with a Korean accent??

V. Noble

ps. Maybe this should be a new thread, but I don't know how to do that.


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## Tim37200 (Sep 10, 2010)

My head instructor uses a TINY accent/inflection, but his first teacher was Korean, so it's OK by me.  It sounds cool when he says stuff!
When I teach I don't like to do that just because it's not me.

And I think using Korean terminology is an important facet of TSD training, as unique as Forms and Breaking, etc.  One of the Masters of my school who used to teach the Dan classes would keep giving us sets of three moves, adding on, adding on, etc, etc.  We got up to 27 move combos once.  It was awesome because you always think there is no way you can remember all of those moves, but you do!


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## smhall89 (Feb 4, 2011)

You have to realize when it comes to TSD and the different phrases, it is connecting back to the Korean roots. My Grandmaster taught originally in Korea and firmly believes in how he was taught in Korea so he brings those teachings into his lessons. Also just because the art is originated over 2,000 years ago, TSD actually has a lot of influence from other styles. TSD was originally called by the Korean name Soo Bahk Do(now moo duk kwan) which is thought to be where it originated. However, that was very early in history. Lee Won Kuk is the one that is said to bring the art back in Korea. At the time Korea was under Japanese control. So Japanese were in charge of actually teaching this style. So its roots became a melting pot of Japanese, Chinese and Korean influence. So if you are concerned about it needing an "upgrade", in my opinion it already has enough influence to be a great art. Not to mention TSD and TKD (since they are very similar) are known for there kicks as some of the most powerful and devastating.


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