# what other self defense books are good once I finish the one I'm reading



## AsianMartialArtsAreBest (Jul 9, 2014)

Hi, I decided to read A Bouncer's Guide to Barroom Brawling, by Peyton Quinn. For those of you who have heard of it which books would you recommend I read next for self defense? Are there any that you specifically recommend? :boing1: This is my first self defense book and I really like it.


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## Transk53 (Jul 9, 2014)

AsianMartialArtsAreBest said:


> Hi, I decided to read A Bouncer's Guide to Barroom Brawling, by Peyton Quinn. For those of you who have heard of it which books would you recommend I read next for self defense? Are there any that you specifically recommend? :boing1: This is my first self defense book and I really like it.



Mmm, may have to get that myself. Bar room brawling


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## Chris Parker (Jul 9, 2014)

AsianMartialArtsAreBest said:


> Hi, I decided to read A Bouncer's Guide to Barroom Brawling, by Peyton Quinn. For those of you who have heard of it which books would you recommend I read next for self defense? Are there any that you specifically recommend? :boing1: This is my first self defense book and I really like it.



Meditations on Violence, Rory Miller. Should be read by anyone with an interest in this field, as it can clear up a hell of a lot of misunderstandings&#8230; including the idea that "Asian martial arts are best"&#8230; and that's coming from someone who focuses on traditional Japanese systems&#8230;


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## Danny T (Jul 9, 2014)

The 'The Gift of Fear' by Gavin DeBecker


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## Buka (Jul 9, 2014)

On Combat - Dave Grossman
Anything by Rory Miller


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## Blindside (Jul 9, 2014)

Strong on Defense by Sanford Strong


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## ST1Doppelganger (Jul 9, 2014)

I've read the gift of fear already but will have to look in to these other titles. Are they instructional or just more of an informative read?


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 9, 2014)

The Gift of Fear,  Meditations on Violence are both really good reads!


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## KydeX (Jul 9, 2014)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> The Gift of Fear,  Meditations on Violence are both really good reads!



Ordered


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## jks9199 (Jul 9, 2014)

What are you looking for in your reading?  Are you trying to understand violence, or find practical techniques?  

*On Killing* (Grossman) will give you insight into what's going on physically and emotionally in a violent encounter, and has a lot of good information.  He may overmake his case, and I agree with the advice of several folks to look at some of his sources directly.

*Meditations on Violence* and *Facing Violence* (Miller) have solid information about what goes on in a real violent encounter, rather than a movie script.  They also distinguish between predatory violence and social violence -- which is something that very few people do.

Marc MacYoung is releasing a new book, *In the Name of Self Defense*, (available in some formats now, more coming soon, check Amazon, etc.) which I've read excerpts of.  Lots of really good information, and it doesn't assume some knowledge.

One thing that many writers miss, that both Rory and Marc don't, is the legal aspects of self defense.  I question how successfully you to defended yourself -- if you get yourself locked up for 20 to life afterwards...


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 9, 2014)

MA is for doing. It's not for reading. If you can do this, you don't need to read any self defense books. You will let others to worry about how to defend against you.


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## Chris Parker (Jul 9, 2014)

That has got to be one of the worst replies to such a topic I've ever read, John. It's completely ignorant of the realities, the request of the OP (who's now listed as 'guest'&#8230, what self defence actually is, as well as what real-world violence actually is.

You have a tendency to see everything as black and white&#8230; and, as a result, almost always give bad advice or show poor understanding. I'd blame it on language, but you're in California&#8230; and you've lived there most of your life, if not all of it, yeah?


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 9, 2014)

What's the difference between a scholar and a MAist?

When a 

- scholar takes a 10 questions test, he starts from Q1 and works to Q10. When he has problem with Q6, he can skip it. work on Q7 first. After he has finished Q10, he can then go back to Q6.  
- knife is stabbing toward a MAist's chest, he has only 1/4 second to react whether he will be alive or dead. 

MA is not how much that you know in your head. MA is how much that you can do on your body. Unless you have developed some "door guarding" skill to defend your life, to read some books won't be able to help you in the long run.

I was taught this way. I will suggest my next generation this way too. MA is for doing. It's not for reading or talking.


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## jks9199 (Jul 9, 2014)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> What's the difference between a scholar and a MAist?
> 
> When a
> 
> ...



But... the question here wasn't "what book about martial arts should I read next?" -- it was "what book about self defense do you recommend?"  They're not at all the same question.  Note the points I hit on in my reply earlier: reality of violent encounters (social and predatory), legal concerns.  Those are seldom part of a martial art curriculum.  The physical skills are fine -- but the practical skills of recognizing a situation that's developing, avoiding the fight when practical, and dealing with the legal consequences of a violent encounter are very different.  How many martial arts pay lip service to the idea of "using violence as a last resort" or "there is no first strike in karate"... but never really actually teach anything about recognizing a developing dangerous situation or deconflicting in an encounter?  How many address the idea of reasonableness in the use of force?

There's nothing wrong with these omissions -- if you're teaching and preserving a martial art.  But they're necessary topics for self defense.


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## Chris Parker (Jul 9, 2014)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> What's the difference between a scholar and a MAist?
> 
> When a
> 
> ...



Which completely ignores the context, the question, and really, any acknowledgement that other people have other values, John.


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## MJS (Jul 10, 2014)

I agree with the Grossman, Miller, MacYoung books.  Very good stuff!


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## Tony Dismukes (Jul 10, 2014)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> What's the difference between a scholar and a MAist?
> 
> When a
> 
> ...



If a knife is stabbing towards your chest and you have only 1/4 second to react, then it is too late to practice 1000 reps of your favorite evasion/disarm technique so that you can develop reliable skill.  You have to do that in the years beforehand, right? I'm certain you understand that much.

Likewise, if a situation is about to develop where someone is about to try stabbing you with a knife, then it is too late to go out and study the circumstances that lead to real world deadly assaults, learn how to recognize and avoid or defuse those circumstances ahead of time, discover how people use knives in real assaults, find out the legalities of options for self-defense in your neck of the woods, and prepare a game plan for how to handle a potential assault without going to prison or the morgue. You have to do all of that ahead of time as well.  Much of that information is going to be more available in books than from your martial arts instructor.

If you rely only on your physical skills and no mental preparation to fend off that knife attack then there are a few likely options:

You will end up dead or seriously injured. Unarmed defenses against a knife attack are last-ditch, low-percentage techniques - especially since someone who actually wants to kill you with a knife will probably not let you see the knife beforehand.

You will end up in jail, even if you do prevail in the physical confrontation, because you have no plan for dealing with the legalities or the aftermath of the fight.

Reading books on self-defense is not about being able to spout scholarly theories. It's about understanding and preparing for the 95% of self-defense that doesn't involve fighting.


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## billc (Jul 11, 2014)

Without Conscience: The Disturbing World of the Psychopaths Among Us - Kindle edition by Robert D. Hare. Health, Fitness & Dieting Kindle eBooks @ Amazon.com.

Also look into books by Massad ayoob...

"The Truth about Self-protection"

http://www.amazon.com/The-Truth-Abo...&qid=1405114186&sr=8-16&keywords=massad+ayoob

Check out his lectures on Stand Your Ground laws and other issues involved in Self-defense...though talking mainly about self defense from a firearm perspective his legal discussions are for all types of self-defense...especially if you injure or kill your attacker...he will give specific steps as to what you do immediately after a self-defense encounter...what to say to the police, how to make sure the police know what the important evidence is and who the witnesses are...

Theses things aren't always covered in a martial arts class...


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## Kong Soo Do (Jul 26, 2014)

AsianMartialArtsAreBest said:


> Hi, I decided to read A Bouncer's Guide to Barroom Brawling, by Peyton Quinn. For those of you who have heard of it which books would you recommend I read next for self defense? Are there any that you specifically recommend? :boing1: This is my first self defense book and I really like it.



There are several that I've read that I've found useful from the perspective of self-defense;

Fighter's Fact Book by Loren W. Christensen
View attachment $fighters-fact-book.jpg

Fighter's Fact Book 2 by Loren W. Christensen and various authors
View attachment $fighters2.jpg

Get Tough by Major W.E. Fairbairn


Kill or Get Killed by Col. Rex Applegate
View attachment $9781581605587_p0_v4_s260x420_JPG_cf.jpg


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## cloud dancing (Sep 5, 2014)

i AGAIN DOUBLE DOWN ON GIFT OF FEAR/by Gavin De Becker and his other book
PROTECTING THE GIFT/advisor to Secret service/U.S.Marshal's office/FBI and Criminologist 
extraoridaire.understanding the mind of the criminal is half the Battle
Learning to trust your own instincts with practise is the other half.
What fool denies there is KNOWLEDGE IN BOOKS ????
As Ssun Tszu said " know your enemy and KNOW your-self and in all battles you willbe undefeated !!"
I study with Prem Rawat/multiple dvds on youtube explaining why attack happen and
how the mind can be your servant or your worst ENEMY     .RAJA YOGA/TAI-CHI./42 YEARS NOW
Light shines-darkness leaves.   I SPY


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## Paul_D (Oct 1, 2014)

No list is complete without Dead or Alive: The Definitive Self Protection Handbook by Geoff Thompson.

I have used the skills I learnt from this book numerous times to diffuse or take charge of situations before they have escalated, and even my wife has used the skills to stop a situation in it's tracks when she was begin sized up as a potential victim.

It's covers pretty much most things, how the sorts of people we want to  avoid operate and how they select victims (And therefore what lessons are learned on how to avoid them), what will happen to you  physically before during and after a situation (adrenalin dump for  example), it covers how to deal with eye contact challengers, it has  interviews with muggers etc.


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## Tez3 (Oct 1, 2014)

Paul_D said:


> No list is complete without Dead or Alive: The Definitive Self Protection Handbook by Geoff Thompson.
> 
> I have used the skills I learnt from this book numerous times to diffuse or take charge of situations before they have escalated, and even my wife has used the skills to stop a situation in it's tracks when she was begin sized up as a potential victim.
> 
> It's covers pretty much most things, how the sorts of people we want to  avoid operate and how they select victims (And therefore what lessons are learned on how to avoid them), what will happen to you  physically before during and after a situation (adrenalin dump for  example), it covers how to deal with eye contact challengers, it has  interviews with muggers etc.



Damn! You got there before me lol. Geoff Thompson's books are always a good read.

On the subject of reading v martial arts, that's just silly. Reading helps round out a person, you cannot be training MA all the time anyway. Reading about other peoples experiences even if you can't or don't use anything from that book cannot ever be wrong. Sometimes you can read something and thing 'no that's just wrong' or it can be a light bulb moment. So read away.


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## RTKDCMB (Oct 1, 2014)

Deadly Karate blows - The medical implications by Brian Adams (not the singer).


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## ShortBridge (Feb 9, 2015)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> ...
> 
> I was taught this way. I will suggest my next generation this way too. MA is for doing. It's not for reading or talking.



I can appreciate that you were taught that way and from a standpoint of learning a system (forms, techniques, etc) I agree with you.

I suggest that you read Strong on Defense and Meditations on Violence. They may not be what you think. Personal safety is something different than knowing a martial art. They are complimentary, not redundant or contradictory. 

I would also put those two books at the top of this list along with The Gift of Fear (but for different reasons and maybe different people). Lawrence Kane is also a fine author on this subject (and a do'er).


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## jks9199 (Feb 9, 2015)

I've been reading another book I'd recommend for self defense reading, though it's aimed more at the military or cops.  Lots of the material is still applicable with some tweaking to civilian self defense.  The book is Left of Bang.  It focuses on some of the material used in the USMC Combat Hunter Program to profile developing dangerous situations.


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## EddieCyrax (Feb 10, 2015)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> What's the difference between a scholar and a MAist?
> 
> When a
> 
> ...



Why would one train the body thousands of hours and ignore the mind......Training both are of equal importance....   just me $0.02


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## Kung Fu Wang (Feb 10, 2015)

EddieCyrax said:


> Why would one train the body thousands of hours and ignore the mind......Training both are of equal importance....   just me $0.02


It's not the mind. It's the "speed". The "speed" is important for MA but it may not be that important for scholar.


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## EddieCyrax (Feb 10, 2015)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> It's not the mind. It's the "speed". The "speed" is important for MA but it may not be that important for scholar.



Why not both?  I train for speed/strength/technique/etc, yet also read extensively.  The physical skills only apply if the non-physical fails.  Even then without fully understanding the legal ramifications of a physical confrontation one could find themselves on the wrong side of the bars.

Recognize in the USA, a plea of "Self Defense" is an admission of breaking the law.  It is a claim that you were justified in breaking the law that 12 individuals, that you never met and were no where near the conflict, get to score you on.


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## ShortBridge (Feb 10, 2015)

EddieCyrax said:


> ...
> 
> Recognize in the USA, a plea of "Self Defense" is an admission of breaking the law.  It is a claim that you were justified in breaking the law that 12 individuals, that you never met and were no where near the conflict, get to score you on.



This in itself is an interesting and complex topic. "Scaling Force" by Lawrence Kane and Rory Miller covers it pretty well.


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## BMhadoken (Feb 15, 2015)

> Marc MacYoung is releasing a new book, *In the Name of Self Defense*, (available in some formats now, more coming soon, check Amazon, etc.) which I've read excerpts of



It's on Amazon ebook, I'm reading it now. It's very long and beefy (about an hour a day for 2 weeks and I'm still not done), but it is *loaded *with good information.

He touches some of Rorys classifications of violence but advises you just read those books. Most of the book is about dealing with the legal system, what legally is and is not self defense in the US, and how to conduct yourself in the lead up to a violent confrontation in a way that legitimizes your SD claim (and coincidently helps you avoid most of those headaches to begin with.) I'd definitely recommend it as required reading for anyone training for self defense.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Feb 15, 2015)

Yes, *In The Name Of Self Defense* by Marc MacYoung is a must read.


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## Tames D (Feb 15, 2015)

'Real World Self Defense' by Jerry Vancook is a good book.

'Defending Against an Attack in a Movie Theater' by P.W. Herman is a book I haven't read but hear is good. It may be out of print.


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## Zero (Feb 20, 2015)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> MA is for doing. It's not for reading. If you can do this, you don't need to read any self defense books. You will let others to worry about how to defend against you.


For all the reasons Chris has said, this is misleading on so many levels and not sure how helpful to new comers to fighting, martial arts or simply wanting informative material....That said, I can't help but love it and the pic so aptly used.  
*MA is for doing* - love it. hehe!
"*My Self Defence is letting others worry about me*"

And I guess in some weird, warped merger of comic book lore and reality that there is some truth in the statement that if you do happen to be like Drudge Dredd (there are a few real humans out there close to him, I have known one myself) and can put your gauntleted fist through some bad dudes head like that. Well then, who needs to waste their time reading on MA - you "are" MA.


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## BMhadoken (Feb 20, 2015)

If you can put your fist through someones head you should seriously consider making sure that doing so isn't going to saddle you with 15 to life.

Books aren't for learning about martial arts. That's what your training is for. The books fill the holes in your training.


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