# Darn Cops



## ballen0351 (Nov 26, 2014)

Darn Cops might not be the exact words I hear ofter but I tried to keep it family friendly.  Ive been in Law enforcement since 2001.  Over that time Ive seen and done alot.  Ive been in several different units from Patrol, K9, Narcotics, street crimes unit, ect.  I say this not to brag but to put things in perspective.  Now I dont hide this fact of what I do for a living.  My family, my friends, even the strangers my son like to tell about his daddy, all know Im a cop.
     I often get to hear the "Bad cop" stories about what they saw this cop do or that cop do.  Or how this cop did them wrong.  I often get told how to properly do my job because Im apparently doing it wrong.  It goes so far that under the cover of social media these brave soles even make threats againts my life, and the lives of my family. I hear it from soccer moms and school officals about the "cop with nothing better to do" then give them a ticket or lock their hisband up for having two beers.  I hear it from family members and friends who forget or dont care what I do for a living.
     Im writing this today because Ive had several people ask me or more appropralty tell me how the police should have handled the Michael Brown situation. 
     You have basically two vocal sides to this tragic story.  Going by social media posts and responses it appears the divide is both racial and age related.  Im here to say in my opinion BOTH sides ar wrong, and both sides are right. 
     The story has been put out by the media as Unarmed black kid was gunned down by a white police officer.  Yes I guess thats kinda true.  OR the headline could have been 6'4 300 pound robber shot by police officer duing struggle.  Also true.  In my opinon the headline was someplace in the middle.
     Now before anyone claims "I dont know what its like."  Let me tell you I DO know what its like.  I know what its like for people to judge me only by the clothing I have on.  I know what its like to be looked at like a peice of dirt in certain areas only because of my clothes.  I know what its like to have people look at me and spit on the ground in disgust  at the mere sight of me. Ive had parents yell at small children for waving at me.  So DONT lecture me about discrimination because Ive felt it.  When I worked undercover I walked into a department stores to buy clothes and had security following me around and store clerks refuse to help me.  I even had one tell me "You cant afford anyhting in this store Walmart is down the street."  I dont say this to downplay the discimination other feel or see but only to say Ive felt it. 
     Now I said above that BOTH sides are at fault here.  Ill lay out my opinion for both ides so please be patient.  First Ill take on the Michael Brown and more importantly the Protesters.  Ill lay into my law enforcement brothers and sisters as well just wait.
First and formost Mike Brown should not be the poster child for police brutality.  Like or not the FACTs show Michael Brown played a role in his own death.  He wasnt targeted for race, he wasnt shot because of his race, he wasnt innocently walking along the street minding his own business.  The facts just dont support that view.  He wasnt surrending with his hands up begging for his life.  I partially blame the media for this since the very first story I heard when this happened was Brown was laying on the ground giving up and the officer walked over and shot him in the head.  Then they changed the story to Brown was giving up with his hands up when the officer shot.  Again the evidence didnt match.  So making him the poster child for this is just wrong. If we are going to get real and make a change for the better w first need to admit our own fault.  I stated above of the behavior I see in certain areas and neighborhoods I work.  On the flip side I can walk around other areas and have people come out of their houses and offer my bottle of water or food and thank me for my service and thank me for being there.  I joke and say they have with all 5 fingers.  Now Im the same person wearing the same uniform in the same city yet Im treated totally different.  So is it me that needs to change or is it the community.  I hear all the time about police brutiality and out of control cops who just going around abusing people.  Now usually the people telling me about how bad I am have never been beat themselves, and Ive never beat them or their firends, and they have never actually witnessed these "beatings".  So when I ask where they get this information they point me to some random youtube clip taken out of context and with little background on what actually happened.  But they know we are all bad because of this video clip.  I interact with people all day long.  durign a 12 hour shift I can speak to dozens if not hundreds of different people some of these people are not very nice and dont like me very much.  If I were out of control why are all these people not left in bloody messes?  So perhaps part of the propblem is this media exaggeration and learned bias.  The facts just dont support the narrative.  You say you dont want me to judge you by the color of your skin or the area you live well I ask you to give me the same treatment and dont judge me by the clothes I wear or the method I choose to feed my kids.  Its gotten so bad Im considering giving up law enforcement all together because I dont want my wife and kids attending my funeral because some guy who doesnt know me decides he wants to kill a cop and picks me because Im there.  He doenst know me and has never delt with me but he has decided Im the representitive of all that he sees wrong with the Govt. I have started thinking of other jobs I can do to provide for my family because I cant imagine my kids growing up without me all because of the clothes I wear to work.
     Now Ill take on the other side of the situation the police or propolice side.  Ill probably take some heat for this from my firends in blue but again we need to get real on both sides.  The truth be known people hate us partially because of the way we act towards them.  Now I know in these areas that they dislike me that I need to keep my guard up a little higher then I would in other areas.  So I already go into these areas slightly on edge.  However Ive seen officers go into these areas and just be down right rude to people and then get pissed because people are not responding the best way.  Ive had long conversations with people in these areas who have started off hating me and in the end appoligise to me for things they said to me because they assumed I was "just another cop."  I have stood back and watched the interaction between offciers and residents of these communities and I can honestly say if some cop came into my neighborhood acting like that Id be pissed too.  Ive heard the excuses from cops "Well you have to show them whos the boss." or "You cant show weakness."  I too in my younger years believed the same thing.  Now I think when did kindness become weakness?  It turns into a chicken or egg situation.  Did the cops start treating people poorly so they started treating the cops bad or did the reverse happen.  Now Ive never personally witnessed anyone use excessive force or brutalize anyone and I wouldnt stand for it.  But I have witnessed cops just being all around jerks.  Now sometimes people deserve to be treated like a jerk but not everyone falls into that catagory.  Ive seen people stopped and asked for ID for no reason just because the officer needed a stat.  Or officer knock on doors of people just released from jail so we can "make sure they know we know where they are" in case they mess up again.  Well if that were me Id be upset Ive done my time now leave me alone.  These are more policy issues then officer issues.
     I hope that in the end something good will come from all this but it looks like it wont.  Stores are being burned, cops and citizens will get hurt, cops will be wearing body cameras and then people will complain when these cameras are used against them in courts.  Both sides need to get real and try to understand the others position.  Both sides need to look in their own closets and clean them up.  Its not a training issue its not a camera issue its a get real issue.  If a cop messes up we as cops need to say NO thats not acceptble.  If someone from your community is messing up you need to say NO thats not acceptable.  We as need parents to teach kids right from wrong and not expect the police to do it for us.  Yes Ive been called to houses because a kid wont do his homework, or go to school, or clean his room.  The police need to put ourselves in others shoes and try to see where they are coming from.  Same can be said for others.  Maybe I wrote you that speeding ticket because 2 hours ago I was picking a dead child out of the road that was walking to school and was hit by a speeder. Maybe I arrested your husband for drunk driving to save his life or an innocent family he would have hit 5 min down the road.  Maybe if officers remember why we took this job to help others.  Maybe if civilians remember we are here to help you not hurt you. 
     Michael Brown and Darren Wilson came togother that day and the result was tragic for all sides.  One man lost his life, one mans life was forever changed.  Neither sould be the poster children for the cause.  I dont know how to fix this but Ill keep praying.  Ill keep talking to little kids to show police are not evil.
     In the end remember Im a police officer as a job but Im also a man, a husband, a father, a son, a brother I make mistakes, I bleed, I cry, I hurt, I worry, and I TRY to do the best I can.


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## ballen0351 (Nov 26, 2014)

Sorry It so long I was going to post it to my facebook but It turned out to be too long


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## Steve (Nov 26, 2014)

Good post.  Being a cop is a job, and just as in any job there are people who are good at it and people who are bad at it.  But the stakes are pretty high in your chosen profession. 

As with most issues like this, I agree that there are failures on all sides of the situation.  It's complicated, and because it's complicated, figuring out what the "right" thing to do becomes difficult.  There are a lot of people, I believe, who want to do the "right" thing, but because the issue is so emotional and so complex, and because there is so little trust, even good intentions appear to be misguided.


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## Elbowgrease (Nov 26, 2014)

It's a rough job, and no one is perfect. On one hand it's just a job, but on the other hand it's (in my opinion) a job that kind of requires one to put other people first. It's not really for the guy in the uniform, it's for all the people the guy in the uniform is protecting. Both my parents were cops, most of my family spent time in the military. I tried one and have thought about the other quite a bit. Personally, I can't square with the reality of either situation. The first time I'd be required to do something that I didn't agree with, it would be over (and was over with the one of those two things I tried...). 
All anyone can do is what they think is the right thing at any given moment and hope for the best. 
I've voluntarily remained ignorant of every part of the Ferguson thing. There is no way that I can ever know what really happened, and nothing I can do to actually right the wrong, whatever it was. If I allow it to take up space in my brain I'll spend too much time and energy battling a brick wall. 
Keep your head up man.


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## ballen0351 (Nov 26, 2014)

Steve said:


> Good post.  Being a cop is a job, and just as in any job there are people who are good at it and people who are bad at it.  But the stakes are pretty high in your chosen profession.
> 
> As with most issues like this, I agree that there are failures on all sides of the situation.  It's complicated, and because it's complicated, figuring out what the "right" thing to do becomes difficult.  There are a lot of people, I believe, who want to do the "right" thing, but because the issue is so emotional and so complex, and because there is so little trust, even good intentions appear to be misguided.


I think thats it.  People as so quick to say what the other side needs to do bu tnot what they are willing to do themselves.
The communities are quick to tell the police what they need to do (Body cameras, more training ect) but balk when asked what they are willing to do.  Police are quick to point out the faults in the community but get defensive when the community points back.  
Police and the community they serve are in a kind of relationship  Both sides seem to forget that.  We need the community and the community needs us.  I know if my wife and I have problems I cant tell her all the crap I dont like about her behavior and expect things to get better if Im not willing to change all the crappy things Im doing as well. 

 I dont know Im just kinda bummed out today at all this I read things on internet and see comments by both sides and it makes me sad.  I see poor jokes about the community like "Not a single work boot was stolen last night" on one side and " we need to hunt down cops families and start killing their kids" on the other side and Im just   like how did we get here and how do we fix it.


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 26, 2014)

Good post, I have been thinking about what is going on Ferguson and what went on in Ferguson and I can’t get my head around it. I was not there, don’t know what went on but I am not sure in the state I live it justified the use of deadly physical force, but not being there, I cannot be a judge of that. I also hear the voice of a friend of mine who lost a son in Chicago to a shooting and that too is making me think. (I will not get into that in an open post because I am pretty sure it would derail this). I also do not see how destroying private property and local businesses is going to solve anything.

Several years ago when I was uniformed security for a local hospital, our uniforms were pretty much the same as the local sheriff’s office. One morning when I was dressed to go to a funeral I walked into a store and noticed something. There was a distinct difference in the way I was being treated dressed in a suite as compared to how I dressed at work and how I normally dressed (more like a biker with short hair in those days). And it amazed me and how great the differences were based solely on the way I dressed.

You have a rough job, sometimes made rougher by those who do the same job you do and sometimes by those who do not want to see anything beyond the badge. And then times just by the nature of what you do. I once told a LEO friend  of mine his job was 95% boredom and 5% sheer terror…. Now that was just picking random numbers out of the sky but that cannot be a great way to spend the day


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## granfire (Nov 28, 2014)

ballen0351 said:


> Darn Cops might not be the exact words I hear ofter but I tried to keep it family friendly.  Ive been in Law enforcement since 2001.  Over that time Ive seen and done alot.  Ive been in several different units from Patrol, K9, Narcotics, street crimes unit, ect.  I say this not to brag but to put things in perspective.  Now I dont hide this fact of what I do for a living.  My family, my friends, even the strangers my son like to tell about his daddy, all know Im a cop.
> I often get to hear the "Bad cop" stories about what they saw this cop do or that cop do.  Or how this cop did them wrong.  I often get told how to properly do my job because Im apparently doing it wrong.  It goes so far that under the cover of social media these brave soles even make threats againts my life, and the lives of my family. I hear it from soccer moms and school officals about the "cop with nothing better to do" then give them a ticket or lock their hisband up for having two beers.  I hear it from family members and friends who forget or dont care what I do for a living.
> Im writing this today because Ive had several people ask me or more appropralty tell me how the police should have handled the Michael Brown situation.
> You have basically two vocal sides to this tragic story.  Going by social media posts and responses it appears the divide is both racial and age related.  Im here to say in my opinion BOTH sides ar wrong, and both sides are right.
> ...



(crap, I feel like a complete noob navigating this new layout....)

May I cut and paste this to insert it into a discussion about attitude toward cops?


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## ballen0351 (Nov 28, 2014)

granfire said:


> (crap, I feel like a complete noob navigating this new layout....)
> 
> May I cut and paste this to insert it into a discussion about attitude toward cops?


Yep


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## granfire (Nov 28, 2014)

Thanks.
Cos that is some powerful stuff (and there are some jerks in this world...sheesh...)


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## Buka (Nov 29, 2014)

All jobs have their challenges. But being a cop might be the toughest gig there is. You deal with people at their worst, violence, extremely high emotions and exactly 16 and one half tons of bull sheet on a daily basis.

But the coffee is usually good.


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## donald1 (Nov 29, 2014)

i didnt read the whole story but atleast more than half. i hardly get on faceboob but when i do i usualy read some of the messages and always see one or usually more false or posdibly one sided stories like that. stories like the mike brown, and hees not the only one. theres been many others in the past and will likley be in the future. hearing people insult someone because there an officer is childis and shameful. these people need to gwt a life and quite bugging those who are trying to help


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## ballen0351 (Nov 29, 2014)

Buka said:


> All jobs have their challenges. But being a cop might be the toughest gig there is. You deal with people at their worst, violence, extremely high emotions and exactly 16 and one half tons of bull sheet on a daily basis.
> 
> But the coffee is usually good.


Coffee someone say COffee


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## ballen0351 (Dec 20, 2014)

So many emotions I'm me right now.  Rage, sadness, hopelessness, RIP NYPD


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## Brian R. VanCise (Dec 20, 2014)

Tragic!  So very sad.  Thoughts and prayers to the families!!!

2nd NYC cop killed in ambush shooting


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## ballen0351 (Dec 21, 2014)

Daddy are going to get killed?  I don't want you to go to work anymore.  

Not a conversation I wanted to have with my 5 year old at 430 this Morning while getting dressed for work.


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## Tez3 (Dec 21, 2014)

Being off duty doesn't help, we had a policeman killed and two colleagues injured by a group of men this week. It's thought they were recognised as police and set on.
Liverpool police arrest man over murder of off-duty officer UK news The Guardian


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## jezr74 (Dec 21, 2014)

Terrible news. So sad for the families.

@ballen0351, it must be stressful enough this time of year, than to have to leave a family each morning knowing they are concerned and worried for you.


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## Buka (Dec 21, 2014)

I didn't have tv on yesterday at all. I didn't happen to go into this thread again yesterday. I'm hearing the news about the loss of two brothers right now, right here for the first time. Jesus f'k Christ.


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## ballen0351 (Dec 21, 2014)

So 3 Officers were murdered last night.
Florida Cop Shot Killed in Tarpon Springs Shooting - NBC News


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## tshadowchaser (Dec 21, 2014)

tragic


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## Elbowgrease (Dec 21, 2014)

Hats off.


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## Brian King (Dec 22, 2014)

No words to express my sadness. Prayers and thanks to the officers and their families - those that serve, continue to serve or ever have served.


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## arnisador (Dec 23, 2014)

How awful. Attacking police bc they're police is an assault on the very system--on the notion of a civilized society.


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## Carol (Dec 23, 2014)

Is there a plausible way to have more of a conversation about these matters in our own communities?


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## Rich Parsons (Dec 23, 2014)

arnisador said:


> How awful. Attacking police bc they're police is an assault on the very system--on the notion of a civilized society.



I agree the assaults on the officers are horrible and everything against a civilized society. Two wrongs do not make a right. 




Steve said:


> Good post.  Being a cop is a job, and just as in any job there are people who are good at it and people who are bad at it.  But the stakes are pretty high in your chosen profession.
> 
> As with most issues like this, I agree that there are failures on all sides of the situation.  It's complicated, and because it's complicated, figuring out what the "right" thing to do becomes difficult.  There are a lot of people, I believe, who want to do the "right" thing, but because the issue is so emotional and so complex, and because there is so little trust, even good intentions appear to be misguided.



It is complicated. I just know if the Police in general would admit that that yes that situation over there was bad. It should not have happened (** once the data and details are know *). This goes a long way to show that officers do not want the bad officers within their brotherhood. 



Carol said:


> Is there a plausible way to have more of a conversation about these matters in our own communities?



It is difficult. One of the local officers who was known for some of the worst beatings of teenagers and adults over 18. He is now Chief. 
He still supports the his officers making stops for driving non white and for being young. It is hard to go to the local sheriff department with this as they do not want to get involved. The local FBI say talk to a DA and press chargers. So, you have to go and get your own data, and proof. Which is not for everyone as they may not have the time to follow around specific officers and or may not want to get beat up again just to make a point, especially when the officers claim you hit them and was resisting arrest. 

If another department would investigate and send in undercover officers similar to the OP here mentioned to see what these other officers are doing then departments could be cleaned up. 


That being said, stalking and shooting / assassinating an officer is not the right course of action. It. Is. Not.


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