# How Exotic is Your Art



## geezer (Sep 9, 2008)

I remember reading about a Chinese Kung-fu student and writer in Hong Kong in the 80s. He wrote some fictionalized stories about legendary figures in the Chinese martial arts. And, being a romantic to the core, he more than half believed the stories he wrote. Consequently, when looking for a Sifu, he always sought out the least known and most unlikely masters with obscure lineages. He secretly hoped to happen upon one of those unkown mystical savants of the martial arts who would reveal great secrets to him. The unfortunate reality was that he just ended up spending a lot of money to get second-rate training. As the person telling this story put it, "There's a reason why certain systems have become well known. They are usually the ones that work!" Apparently, seeking a system just because it was rare and exotic was not the best way to find a practical fighting art.

On the other hand, I have to admit that when I came first to Shaolin, then to Wing Chun (and later WT) in the 70's, they still had an exotic air. Fortunately, WC/WT also turned out to be very practical..."the real deal". How many of you were drawn to your art because it seemed rare and exotic? Did it live up to your expectations? And, how do you feel about WC/WT now that it is becoming so well known?


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## yak sao (Sep 9, 2008)

I started Shaolin in 1981. I had always wanted to do "karate" but didn't know the first thing about it. There was a TKD school in my town (just like every town I guess) and there were some guys teaching Shaolin in a school gym. Chinese martial arts sounded more mysterious to me so that's the one I went with and stayed with it for 14 years or so.
As time went on I read a lot about martial arts and Wing Chun sounded like something I would be very interested in.
There were constantly articles in IKF about Leung Ting vs William Cheung or WT vs WC. I dabbled a bit with WC but the teacher was teaching more of a hybrid than pure WC then I had the opportunity to study WT and I've been doing that since '95.
And I think that one of the things that drew me to WT was its renegade image.


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## brocklee (Sep 10, 2008)

The move "Dragon" is what informed me of WC and it's still one of my favorite movies.  It's a pretty mystical movie, if that counts


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## theletch1 (Sep 10, 2008)

If you step outside the walls of your school or the electronic walls of this (or other MA sites) all arts are pretty exotic.  Familiarity breeds contempt, they say.  While it isn't contempt that we're breeding over our time in the arts it IS familiarity and that tends to make what we do seem normal compared to how others see it.  I've studied my art for long enough to see it as an ordinary part of life.  When I discuss it with non-MAists they'll ask "Oh, you study karate?"  When I attempt to explain that it isn't karate but Nihon Goshin Aikido that I study they get that "Wow.  That's some crazy stuff" look.  Not having studied CMA at all I still see a bit of mysticism in all of it and  less in Japanese arts.... because that's where my familiarity lies.

Now, if the question is "How exotic is your art to other martial artists" I'd have to say that the umbrella style "Aikido" is not at all but the specific style of Nihon Goshin is fairly exotic.


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## Flying Crane (Sep 10, 2008)

honestly, I always kind of got a kick out of doing things that most people are not doing, and once upon a time that included martial arts of any kind.  Now, martial arts in general are becoming so common among the masses that nobody raises an eyebrow anymore.

Anyway, I first got started in the early/mid 1980s in kenpo, in an area where everyone else was doing tae kwon do and little else.  So we were the odd guys out.  Nobody knew what we were doing.  Made it difficult to compete in kata in local tournaments, tho, but I liked the obscurity.

Later, in the very early 1990s, I stumbled into capoeira and trained like a starving fiend for several years.  In those days, not even other martial artists knew what it was.  Most had never even heard of it.  Now it's becoming a lot more mainstream, getting exposure thru movies and having techniques borrowed by performance styles like XMA.  I'm disappointed in this.  I liked it better when it was obscure, because even many of the capoeira schools are sort of getting commercial and are focusing more on the acrobatic "wow" factor that pleases the crowd, rather than developing the art.  It's becoming much more of a performance art.

For about the last decade or so I've been training in Tibetan White Crane kung fu.  It's still pretty rare, and it is unusual compared to most other styles that I've seen.  Sifu feels that it's a dying art, most teachers have given up on teaching it much because they feel most students aren't willing to put in the work required to really understand it.  I do my best, and he has been willing to teach me what he knows of it, but he studied it a long time ago and has admitedly forgot a good deal.  I keep prodding him to see if he can remember stuff, but I feel fortunate to have learned as much as I have.  I do like the fact that it is fairly unknown, but it's tough because I don't really have training partners to work with.  Every now and again someone shows up wanting to learn, so sifu turns them over to me.  I work them thru some drills and basics, and after a couple classes they don't usually come back.  I've got one kid now who disappeared for a while, but now he's back.  Maybe he'll stick with it.  We'll see...

Anyway, the bottom line for me is that I kind of appreciate training in things that are not openly available to the general public.  It's an interesting position to be in.


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## geezer (Sep 10, 2008)

Flying Crane said:


> ...it's tough because I don't really have training partners to work with. Every now and again someone shows up wanting to learn, so sifu turns them over to me. I work them thru some drills and basics, and after a couple classes they don't usually come back. I've got one kid now who disappeared for a while, but now he's back. Maybe he'll stick with it. We'll see...
> 
> Anyway, the bottom line for me is that I kind of appreciate training in things that are not openly available to the general public...


 
Boy, do I hear ya! And by comparison, the arts I study (WT and Eskrima) are almost commonplace...well then again, not really. And, I agree about appreciating having the opportunity to learn something a rare.


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## KamonGuy2 (Sep 11, 2008)

brocklee said:


> The move "Dragon" is what informed me of WC and it's still one of my favorite movies. It's a pretty mystical movie, if that counts


 
Are you talking about Dragon : A Bruce Lee Story? 
Because, whilst it is a great movie, it is full of inaccuracies.
'Say you'll do better... Tell me you'll make a big noise in America so I can hear it over here....'


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## martyg (Sep 11, 2008)

Kamon Guy said:


> Are you talking about Dragon : A Bruce Lee Story?
> Because, whilst it is a great movie, it is full of inaccuracies.
> 'Say you'll do better... Tell me you'll make a big noise in America so I can hear it over here....'




LOL, about the only thing accurate in that movie is there was a guy named Bruce Lee.


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## martyg (Sep 11, 2008)

geezer said:


> The unfortunate reality was that he just ended up spending a lot of money to get second-rate training.....On the other hand, I have to admit that when I came first to Shaolin,





yak sao said:


> I started Shaolin in 1981.




Unfortunately, that's the case with a lot of the stuff branded as "Shaolin" as well.  Most arts branding themselves as such, are not actually.  Adam Hsu, in the Sword Polisher's Record, had a good discussion on the matter.  What actual art from Shaolin (i.e. the actual Shaolin) did you guys study or were told you were studying?


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## yak sao (Sep 11, 2008)

I agree with what you're saying about the Shaolin thing......it was actually some kind of kun tao hybrid thingy I've come to find out over the years.
It's just easier to say Shaolin. While it wasn't authentic, it was good training that got me in shape and gave me a good foundation and ultimatly led me to WT.


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## geezer (Sep 11, 2008)

martyg said:


> Unfortunately, that's the case with a lot of the stuff branded as "Shaolin" as well. *Most arts branding themselves as such, are not actually.* Adam Hsu, in the Sword Polisher's Record, had a good discussion on the matter. What actual art from Shaolin (i.e. the actual Shaolin) did you guys study or were told you were studying?


 
That's exactly right...and although my "Shi-fu" was sincere, I believe that better than half of what he had learned was a phoney mish-mash of 5-Animal Style,  Northern Long Fist and Kempo. So I was lucky that I moved away and "fell into" Wing Chun. But  to this day my real dissatisfaction with Shaolin is with it's complexity. After experiencing the elegant simplicity and directness of WC and WT, the old Shaolin systems seem impractically complex. If indeed, Wing Chun/Tsun evolved from Shaolin roots, I truly feel it was a great improvement as a practical fighting system.


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## martyg (Sep 11, 2008)

geezer said:


> mish-mash of 5-Animal Style,  Northern Long Fist and Kempo.



Its funny you say that, most of what I've seen over the years advertising itself as "Chinese" martial arts and/or descended from "Shaolin" usually winds up looking like generic kenpo.


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## Sukerkin (Sep 11, 2008)

I don't know if it counts as exotic or not because, as *Letch* said, it's 'normal' to me but I always get a blank look and something akin to "Huh?" whenever the subject of my art comes up.  You'd be surprised how 'unknown' iai is.


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## martyg (Sep 11, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> I don't know if it counts as exotic or not because, as *Letch* said, it's 'normal' to me but I always get a blank look and something akin to "Huh?" whenever the subject of my art comes up.  You'd be surprised how 'unknown' iai is.




Gotta be better than everyone associating your art with an 80's band who's known for "Everybody Wang Chun tonight".


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## Sukerkin (Sep 11, 2008)

.  I hate to show my ignorance but which band would that be?


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## martyg (Sep 11, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> .  I hate to show my ignorance but which band would that be?




Wang Chung -


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## KamonGuy2 (Sep 12, 2008)

The worst thing is when I mention my Sifu and my work colleagues turn round and say 'Sea Food??'

Aaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!! 

Better than making Hee-yaaaa noises though!


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## martyg (Sep 12, 2008)

Kamon Guy said:


> The worst thing is when I mention my Sifu and my work colleagues turn round and say 'Sea Food??'
> 
> Aaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!
> 
> Better than making Hee-yaaaa noises though!




Haha, forgot about the Sea Food one, I've had that happen as well.

How about that one relative or business associate that always has to give you pokes at your stomach to try and catch you and says "See, I could have got ya!"

Sure Aunt Marge, let me just lay you out next time to show you what your pokes really do to me.


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## kwaichang (Sep 12, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> . I hate to show my ignorance but which band would that be?


 
check out their info at:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wang_Chung_(band)


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## Sukerkin (Sep 12, 2008)

Aye, I'm dimly familiar with the name - it has unpleasant Disco connotations in my memory :shudders:.

The kindly posted Wiki link above claims to have no knowledge of Wang Chung for me, I'm sad to report.


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