# really awesome event that im participating in.



## TSDTexan (Sep 21, 2018)

Yesterday,
I traveled about 400 miles with 12 others from my local dojo (in Oregon) to Boise Idaho.

The Hanshi 10° Dan of our organisation comes to the USA 2x a year and conducts a special training for 4 days.

Yesterday, i got to meet him and shake his hand for the first time. This gentleman, trained directly under Kanken Toyama from the 1940s up until Toyama's death in the 60's.

He is (to look at him) a very old, and frail man. stick figure thin, from surviving stomach cancer.
But his energy, and eyes were very alive and full of life.

When he shook my hand, i was stunned, because he almost crushed my hand. it was on the verge of being painful. it was like shaking hands with a bear.

Not at all what i was expecting.

He is at death's door... and all he wants to do is share karate with his people. I am not the sentimental type... but this is hitting me in the feels.

fixing to head to another training session.but I wanted to post this


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## Mitlov (Sep 21, 2018)

Would love to hear more once all the training sessions are done


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## _Simon_ (Sep 22, 2018)

Ah that sounds amazing, yeah would love to hear how it goes!

And I love the name "Doshin kan". Doshin, way of the heart?


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## TSDTexan (Sep 22, 2018)

update.

At class today, Bo kata training stopped mid way, during the first session. And different dojos were called to line up., from a role call list, in sequence of rank, while everyone else was lined up along the walls.

one dojo, lined up, then individuals were called forward, and promoted, and then they stepped back into the line up shoulder to shoulder facing shomen.

out of 30-40 folk, 3-5 individuals would get promoted.

Hanshi, had a list of everyone, and the list included date of last promotion. But I noticed that he wasn't promoting just by time in rank.

i had observed that during the training he would stop certain people and have them announce there name to the class. But the individuals he had been asking this of.... had been demonstrating excellent form, tempo, coordination...

He picked individuals that were textbook examples, on point.. His eyes were like a hawk. and it was like he was watching everybody.

i made a few mistakes, and i was certain that they had not gone unnoticed. But i didn't dwell on it.
Just refocused, and doubled my effort and intensity.

So, when my dojo was called out...  I told myself "dont expect a promotion, and its just a belt, so no big deal" The student to my right was called forward, and obtained his Nikyu (2nd brown) which puts him two belts from getting shodan.

He is an outstanding karateka, and at that high school age were you have so much energy.

so he stepped forward, got his brown belt. and stepped back. after a long wait, he called the next name. and i realized he was talking to me.

So i stepped forward and said "Hai".
he looks at my face, then at his paperwork, then at the yellow belt i am wearing.

And he asks.... "aren't you a white belt?"

i look down at my belt  and calmly said: "No, I am a yellow belt (rokukyu)."

So Hanshi, looks to his left where his Shihan/Assistant is standing, and they confere for what felt like a minute or two.

Which felt like a really long time because about 150 pairs of eyes are looking at you.

Then they called my school instructor forward, and talked for another 30 seconds or so.

i just stayed relaxed, and tried to smile.

after they finished the huddle... My teacher returned to heading up the line. and Hanshi called my name again. "Gokyu", He then announced.

I said "arigato gasiemas" and stepped back into line".

Confused and happy. Its been a year, of hard work, since the last promotion.

In the Dojo photo, Hanshi is front center, My Shihan is to the right of him. and I am in the rear between them.


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## TSDTexan (Sep 22, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> Ah that sounds amazing, yeah would love to hear how it goes!
> 
> And I love the name "Doshin kan". Doshin, way of the heart?


the heart way.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 22, 2018)

Awesome, love that name, sounds like a style I'd get into! 

Congrats on the promotion, well done! Would have been an awkward few minutes of waiting there haha but that's fantastic mate.

And look how happy the Hanshi is


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## TSDTexan (Sep 23, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> Awesome, love that name, sounds like a style I'd get into!
> 
> Congrats on the promotion, well done! Would have been an awkward few minutes of waiting there haha but that's fantastic mate.
> 
> And look how happy the Hanshi is


the dude is always genuinely happy. its amazing.


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## dancingalone (Sep 23, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> update.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Congratulations on the multiple promotions.  Sounds like he recognized your hard work and advanced technique.


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## TSDTexan (Sep 23, 2018)

dancingalone said:


> Congratulations on the multiple promotions.  Sounds like he recognized your hard work and advanced technique.



Its been challenging, having to retrain just about every technique. having decades of muscle memory to replace with new alternates, can be hard.

So my advanced technique may not look as crisp as someone who was "pure" Doshinkan. But I am not that bad. 

But i was paid a few compliments, by higher ranks.
I suspect that they wouldn't have offered them if knew the whole back story.

Five more belts, and i get to be a shodan (again).
But I really am enjoying the climb through the kyu ranks.

The amazing thing is there are a lot of high level kata that are not gated by ranks. Its more about if you can catch it, its yours. A lot of low kyus just fumble along on the count, doing their best. But the better students capture the kata.

There is an informal doctrine that you should be able to catch a kata by the third time that you perform it.

Hanshi, made it a point to lecture us, that in  Doshinkan nothing is secret, hidden or forbidden.
Everything is taught openly. There are no inner circles that get to learn the stuff, that others don't get to. So pay attention.


So if you have somebody demonstrating a high level kata.... and you watch carefully you can make it yours regardless of rank.

which is pretty kool imo.


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## JR 137 (Sep 24, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> So if you have somebody demonstrating a high level kata.... and you watch carefully you can make it yours regardless of rank.
> 
> which is pretty kool imo.


I like that mentality. At least on paper. 

A little backstory...
I was getting ready to test for nidan when I got an offer for a graduate assistantship about 5 hours away. Long story short, life got in the way and almost 15 years later I started training again in a very similar style. Interesting thing is I remembered practically all my material; I just needed to polish it up a bit. Stuff like sometimes I’d have the wrong foot forward, I’d skip a step, etc. I started over at white belt, and have tested for every rank, minus two very early on (9th kyu and 7th kyu). I’ve been offered to test for 1st kyu in a few weeks.

Getting back to my point:
I see the higher ranks doing kata I know that are above my current rank. I’ve seen this since day one. Rather than spending any significant time working on the kata that I’m not responsible for, I work on the ones that I am responsible for (we’re responsible for everything below our current grade too). Very early on in my return, I was doing higher grade kata in and out of class simply because I was only responsible for 3-4 very basic kata. After that, I rarely did kata outside my rank. Why? What’s the point in doing something more advanced when I can still improve on what I’m currently supposed to be doing?

I think taking time away from your current stuff to work on stuff above your grade short changes your current stuff. Why spend a lot of time doing a kata that’s got a ton of complex stuff when you haven’t nearly mastered the basic stances and turns of lower level stuff?

If I was a teacher and I saw, say a 5th kyu, copying a shodan doing a shodan kata or the like, I wouldn’t be able to not say “improve what you’re supposed to know before you start trying to learn stuff above your rank.” It wouldn’t be because the higher stuff is sacred or I’d be trying to withhold information, it would be because I’d want the student to be the best he/she can possibly be at what they should know before they move on. I wouldn’t want a boxing student to start throwing insane punching combos before their jab was truly functional and effective. I wouldn’t want them trying to learn a crazy footwork drill if they’re still tripping over their own feet when they do basic forward, backward, and side stepping.

The advanced stuff is more fun. People don’t sign up with dreams of repeating the basics over and over again. The sign up to one day do the stuff Bruce Lee did. They sign up to one day do what Mike Tyson did. That stuff will come in due time. And if all one is really interested in is doing some flashy advanced kata such as perhaps Unsu, then skip the lessons altogether, watch it on YouTube, and keep practicing it to your heart’s content. After a while, it’ll probably look good to the untrained eye if you’re athletic enough. But it’ll be like practicing a single sentence that you don’t know the meaning of in a foreign language - your accent will be way off, you’ll have no idea what it means, and you’ll have no idea what’s being said and how to respond if someone says something back to you.

I guess what I’m getting at is what’s the rush, and why try stuff over your head if you haven’t relatively perfected stuff at your level. There’s no point to n me practicing Seiunchin at this point in my training. Tsuki-No kata can still use a good amount of work. It’s “good enough” right now, but good enough isn’t good enough for me.


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## pdg (Sep 24, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> I like that mentality. At least on paper.
> 
> A little backstory...
> I was getting ready to test for nidan when I got an offer for a graduate assistantship about 5 hours away. Long story short, life got in the way and almost 15 years later I started training again in a very similar style. Interesting thing is I remembered practically all my material; I just needed to polish it up a bit. Stuff like sometimes I’d have the wrong foot forward, I’d skip a step, etc. I started over at white belt, and have tested for every rank, minus two very early on (9th kyu and 7th kyu). I’ve been offered to test for 1st kyu in a few weeks.
> ...



Got to agree with that myself.

Even if I'm not quite so strict - sort of...

There's a few complex moves in higher grade patterns that I practice a little - if I get that far I'll have to do them at least reasonably, and given my age now I'll have an easier time learning now rather than in another 5+ years.

There's also a few things that aren't part of the syllabus any more but are interesting to me, so I'll fiddle with them occasionally too.

Also, sometimes I'll play with 'converting' kata from other arts by doing them roughly using tkd techniques.

But, none of that is instead of my current level (and below) stuff, it's a sporadic and occasional extra for entertainment purposes. I don't feel it detracts from my concentration on that.


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## dancingalone (Sep 24, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> The amazing thing is there are a lot of high level kata that are not gated by ranks. Its more about if you can catch it, its yours. A lot of low kyus just fumble along on the count, doing their best. But the better students capture the kata.
> 
> There is an informal doctrine that you should be able to catch a kata by the third time that you perform it.
> 
> ...



Well, yes, I agree.  Advanced movement is really basic movement performed with different timing, speed, and power.  They don't change radically just because they are contained in an "advanced" kata.  Not sure if Kusanku and the Pinan forms are found in Doshinkan (they are in TSD as you likely know), but they are a good example of the same content being in both the basic and advanced forms - just performed differently.


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## TSDTexan (Sep 24, 2018)

dancingalone said:


> Well, yes, I agree.  Advanced movement is really basic movement performed with different timing, speed, and power.  They don't change radically just because they are contained in an "advanced" kata.  Not sure if Kusanku and the Pinan forms are found in Doshinkan (they are in TSD as you likely know), but they are a good example of the same content being in both the basic and advanced forms - just performed differently.



Doshinkan has the pinans, and kusanku.
The pinans are the low kyu kata. 10th, 9th, and 8th kyus should already know the pinans.


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## TSDTexan (Sep 24, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> I like that mentality. At least on paper.
> 
> A little backstory...
> I was getting ready to test for nidan when I got an offer for a graduate assistantship about 5 hours away. Long story short, life got in the way and almost 15 years later I started training again in a very similar style. Interesting thing is I remembered practically all my material; I just needed to polish it up a bit. Stuff like sometimes I’d have the wrong foot forward, I’d skip a step, etc. I started over at white belt, and have tested for every rank, minus two very early on (9th kyu and 7th kyu). I’ve been offered to test for 1st kyu in a few weeks.
> ...



The interesting thing is at a special training, we only do about 1 low level kata. the rest of the kata are high level kata.

The hanshi has the class line up with two rows of shihan in the center, from shomen to the back of the class.

At this training, there were about 15 shihan. Then the kyu ranks line up to the outside on either side. we had about 18 kyu ranks, only two were brown belts. then then black belts 1st-4th lined up.
outside the kyu ranks, and on the very outside we had Renshi, and Godan or higher.

so for kyus we had Shihans and 8th dans right next to us on one side, and lower Bbs on the other.

Now we did Unsu... "Cloud Hands" kata 10 or 12 times. the first 5 or so with a very slow cadence
i saw white belts struggling for a bit. but after the seventh iteration, it was at the normal tempo for that kata. and because we train with "notice, think and do". method... the white belts had seen their mistakes and were performing the correct moment.

By the 10th or 12th iteration they had a grip on the kata. they could own it.... and then it would become, for then, a kata to begin to polish, and put back on the shelf.

In the 4 days of the special training. We had 6 sessions that were 3 to 5 hours in length. lets call it 24 hours average.

we did two bo kata, Tan Ru, and To Ru.
we did 5 kata. and one of them, Kasatsu, we did as part of our warm ups. (only doing them twice in the four days.)

Ananko
Ananku
Seidenko   (we only did this for one day)
Unsu

So in a session, we may do many sets of Ananko, alternating with sets of Unsu.

So we spent a very large amount of time working on a limited set of kata. This was an intensive training.
The only higher intensive is the 7 day long "summer training" in Germany. usually 500 or more people go to that.


i had struck up a number of freindships with people there. There was one whitebelt there who, like me, this was his first special training. I asked him are you learning anything?

He said i learned a new kata today. i said which one.
he said "Unsu".
 I asked him if he would want to show me?
He said he would do it best, if, i did the count and he focused on the movements. His Japanese counting made him nervous.
i said sure.

So, i counted and he did the Kata.
And he was not highly polished, but each technique, and movement/stance was there at the right time.


So, this approach works, but this isnt intended as a replacement for your regular training throughout the week at a dojo.

the amount of very high level instructors at the special trainings is off the charts. but then... Hanshi only comes to the US twice a year... and if your an 8th Dan Shihan, this will be the only person higher up then you who can teach you....

its also gathering of others at your level who you can review other stuff with outside of the sessions.

there were a lot of renshi, and other BBs that came to the house we rented, and they were doing sai, tonfa, and nunchaku kata review in the backyard.


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## JR 137 (Sep 24, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> The interesting thing is at a special training, we only do about 1 low level kata. the rest of the kata are high level kata.
> 
> The hanshi has the class line up with two rows of shihan in the center, from shomen to the back of the class.
> 
> ...


Quite an interesting approach to teaching/learning. I don’t see the harm in doing that in the setting at all. I think it’s pretty cool.

But day in and day out in the dojo, I just don’t know. Again, I’d rather a white belt work on really understanding and sharpening up Taikyoku 1 (that’s our white belt kata) than copying Unsu. But I’m not a karate teacher and I don’t run my own organization, so it’s all good.

And I’m jealous you guys do Unsu, especially allowing the lower ranks to do it. That’s the kata I always wanted to learn. It was a sandan kata in my previous organization. It’s not in my current organization’s syllabus, so I won’t ever learn it.

I’ve contemplated watching Kanazawa’s version of it on YouTube and copying it several times. But I’ve always had something better to do, like improve what I already know. And I know no matter how hard I tried, I’d probably never do the kata as well as I could if I was formally taught it.

But maybe one of these days


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## TSDTexan (Sep 24, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> Quite an interesting approach to teaching/learning. I don’t see the harm in doing that in the setting at all. I think it’s pretty cool.
> 
> But day in and day out in the dojo, I just don’t know. Again, I’d rather a white belt work on really understanding and sharpening up Taikyoku 1 (that’s our white belt kata) than copying Unsu. But I’m not a karate teacher and I don’t run my own organization, so it’s all good.
> 
> ...



our unsu isnt very close to mainstream (shotokan)

we don't do the sweeping neko ashi datchi in the opening with the ippon-ztuki. instead, from the outreached arms / hachiji datchi, the right leg sweeps forward with an Ashi barrai then out to drop into sanchin dachi.

the hands take a ippon-ztuki form but the arms cross low, and end the same position as sanchin. (elbows a fist width from the body) each arm face-ing out from the body (about 45° away from centerline)

the first three movements forward are almso exactly like doing sanchin kata:
chamber, step,  strike-return
chamber, step,  strike-return
chamber, step,  strike-return

but the step always has an ashi-barrai before settling into sanchin dachi.
and instead seiken punches, its the single finger strike.

The tempo suddenly changes right here... its not the slow measure of sanchin anymore, but fast quick.
then the four direction strikes follow, but unlike the shotokan version, we dont drop to the ground to do the alternating horizontal mawashi geri, afterwards.

not having those two kicks makes our unsu a little bit easier to learn. we still have the leaping sacrifice kick that end on our hands and knees in the reverse direction.

that is challenging. and it takes a lot of practice.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 24, 2018)

Wow, that is alot of training @TSDTexan! Sounds amazing, would jump at the chance to do that. Our training camps were always over 2 days or so, and maybe 10.5 hours or so?



pdg said:


> There's also a few things that aren't part of the syllabus any more but are interesting to me, so I'll fiddle with them occasionally too.
> 
> Also, sometimes I'll play with 'converting' kata from other arts by doing them roughly using tkd techniques.



That is... so darn cool! Would be really fun and educational to do, and may help understand techniques in your current art even better, as you're applying what you know in a different form and sequence.



JR 137 said:


> And I’m jealous you guys do Unsu, especially allowing the lower ranks to do it. That’s the kata I always wanted to learn. It was a sandan kata in my previous organization. It’s not in my current organization’s syllabus, so I won’t ever learn it.
> 
> I’ve contemplated watching Kanazawa’s version of it on YouTube and copying it several times. But I’ve always had something better to do, like improve what I already know. And I know no matter how hard I tried, I’d probably never do the kata as well as I could if I was formally taught it.
> 
> But maybe one of these days



Do iiiiiiiiiit


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## JR 137 (Sep 24, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> Wow, that is alot of training @TSDTexan! Sounds amazing, would jump at the chance to do that. Our training camps were always over 2 days or so, and maybe 10.5 hours or so?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Maybe one of these days when I’m really bored and don’t have anything that needs a lot of work


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## TSDTexan (Sep 24, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> Maybe one of these days when I’m really bored and don’t have anything that needs a lot of work



just work on it for 10 minutes per week and limit your self to two new movements.

week 1. ten minutes of rei, opening movement.
week 2. ten minutes of rei, opening movement, movement 1, movement 2
week 3. rei, op, m1, m2, m3, m4
week 4 ", " , " , ", ", ", m5, m6

No rush, just ten minutes, plug it in wherever you want.

You will enjoy it. And this will help you grow in an area that you have always wanted to.

Alternatively, you can always ask your teacher for permission to take some private lessons to learn this Kata. He may decide to have you learn it and share it with others (off the books) since it is not in the curriculum.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 25, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> just work on it for 10 minutes per week and limit your self to two new movements.
> 
> week 1. ten minutes of rei, opening movement.
> week 2. ten minutes of rei, opening movement, movement 1, movement 2
> ...



100% agree! I think private training and branching off learning things you always wanted to is so beneficial... of course having a teacher is ideal, but like in the thread I brought up awhile ago about learning higher up kata from other styles, if your foundation is good, it can be really eye opening, educational and motivating too.

I like the 10 minute idea too! As 10 minutes a week is so easy to slot in, and as it's dedicated to that, there would be enough improvement over time.

And I wonder if many teachers will teach specific things privately, there are kata I've always wanted to learn and thought about doing this... that's a great idea!


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## pdg (Sep 25, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> That is... so darn cool! Would be really fun and educational to do, and may help understand techniques in your current art even better, as you're applying what you know in a different form and sequence.



I find it interesting, it's not a huge investment but it causes a bit of thinking - like would X move fit or flow better here, which stance or technique is closest there.

Not being 'restricted' by actually studying the art and being expected to perform the kata to book means I can tweak or change it to fit me, instead of trying to make me fit it.

It's probably not something I'd bring up in class though...



TSDTexan said:


> just work on it for 10 minutes per week and limit your self to two new movements.



On a personal level, I can't work well like that, it frustrates me...

I do better going from a written description at first (and if there isn't one available or it needs tweaking because it's a 'foreign' art, I'll do my own), then running through the whole thing, maybe video myself doing it - then look at where the mistakes happen 

And with stuff I'm importing - sometimes the mistakes aren't an issue at all.

If I can't get something to feel right, or flow right, I can change it or ditch it if I don't feel like fixing it.

It's also happened that I'll start one that seems interesting, then find I don't actually like it, so it gets shelved.


Sometimes it takes 10 minutes a time, sometimes an hour - but I never set a timeframe or schedule for it.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 25, 2018)

pdg said:


> I find it interesting, it's not a huge investment but it causes a bit of thinking - like would X move fit or flow better here, which stance or technique is closest there.
> 
> Not being 'restricted' by actually studying the art and being expected to perform the kata to book means I can tweak or change it to fit me, instead of trying to make me fit it.
> 
> It's probably not something I'd bring up in class though...



Ah yep makes sense, allows for alot of freedom and interpretation to suit you, would be a great exercise I reckon


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## JR 137 (Sep 25, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> just work on it for 10 minutes per week and limit your self to two new movements.
> 
> week 1. ten minutes of rei, opening movement.
> week 2. ten minutes of rei, opening movement, movement 1, movement 2
> ...





_Simon_ said:


> 100% agree! I think private training and branching off learning things you always wanted to is so beneficial... of course having a teacher is ideal, but like in the thread I brought up awhile ago about learning higher up kata from other styles, if your foundation is good, it can be really eye opening, educational and motivating too.
> 
> I like the 10 minute idea too! As 10 minutes a week is so easy to slot in, and as it's dedicated to that, there would be enough improvement over time.
> 
> And I wonder if many teachers will teach specific things privately, there are kata I've always wanted to learn and thought about doing this... that's a great idea!


I don’t know why I just thought of this now... I could ask my former sensei. He’s about an hour away. I didn’t go back to his dojo when I restarted because he closed his dojo near me so he could focus on the dojo closer to his house. He’s a great guy and we had a great relationship. I still keep in touch with him, and I attended a seminar at his dojo back in February or March.

I don’t think he or his current right-hand guy would mind spending an hour or 3 on a Saturday afternoon after class. His top guy and I tested for shodan together back in ‘99. He’s still with my former sensei and never left. We were pretty good friends too. I’d offer to pay either one of them, but the type of guys they are, they’d probably refuse money. I’d probably have to slip some money and a thank you note into their bag when they weren’t looking 

I couldn’t do the 10 minutes here and there. Once I start, I can’t stop until I get it down. I wish I could, but that’s not how my brain ever worked.

No permission needed from my current teacher. We do whatever we want outside the dojo. Only permission needed is if we’re using the dojo and/or organization’s name. If I asked my current teacher, he’d most likely have this look on his face like “why do you need my permission to do anything outside my doors.” Our curriculum is pretty tight, so I doubt he’d have me teach anyone it. There might be one or two who would be interested to see it and maybe run through it once or twice after class, but that’s about it. I don’t think my teacher or his next in line guy would mind seeing me demo it after class. Regardless of all that, it would be for my sole amusement. I’d be happy to share it, but realistically that’s really the extent it would be.

One of these days when I’m comfortable with where I’m at in my own curriculum and get the itch to branch out away from it. I don’t have a strong sense of urgency to learn it right now. It’s one of those things I’ve always wanted to do and eventually will do, one way or another. I’m not ready to go too far out of my way for it yet. It’s just not that important right now.


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## _Simon_ (Sep 25, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> I don’t know why I just thought of this now... I could ask my former sensei. He’s about an hour away. I didn’t go back to his dojo when I restarted because he closed his dojo near me so he could focus on the dojo closer to his house. He’s a great guy and we had a great relationship. I still keep in touch with him, and I attended a seminar at his dojo back in February or March.
> 
> I don’t think he or his current right-hand guy would mind spending an hour or 3 on a Saturday afternoon after class. His top guy and I tested for shodan together back in ‘99. He’s still with my former sensei and never left. We were pretty good friends too. I’d offer to pay either one of them, but the type of guys they are, they’d probably refuse money. I’d probably have to slip some money and a thank you note into their bag when they weren’t looking
> 
> ...


Yeah that's a great idea, he'd probably love teaching it to an old student for sure. Now if I could find someone around to teach me Kururunfa...


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## pdg (Sep 25, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> I couldn’t do the 10 minutes here and there. Once I start, I can’t stop until I get it down. I wish I could, but that’s not how my brain ever worked.



I completely get where you're coming from with that one


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## JR 137 (Sep 25, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> Yeah that's a great idea, he'd probably love teaching it to an old student for sure. Now if I could find someone around to teach me Kururunfa...


Honestly, I don’t know if he still has it in his syllabus. He started making changes after leaving his organization. He recently joined Taira Masaji’s Goju Ryu Kenkyukai. He can keep whatever kata he wants, but he’s eliminated a lot of the Shotokan kata and does Goju kata pretty much exclusively, except for the Pinan series and Naihanchi.

First time I saw Unsu was him doing it after class. Me and another guy were taking pictures for some advertising stuff he was working on. We both said “that’s the coolest kata we’ve ever seen.” It said it was one of his favorite kata, along with Kanku and Saiha.

Either him or the other guy would most likely be happy to revisit it if they don’t do it anymore.

I doubt I could walk into a random dojo and ask to just learn Unsu privately. Actually, I can ask, but I highly doubt anyone I don’t know would be willing. You know how sacred these things can be


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## TSDTexan (Sep 25, 2018)

JR 137 said:


> Honestly, I don’t know if he still has it in his syllabus. He started making changes after leaving his organization. He recently joined Taira Masaji’s Goju Ryu Kenkyukai. He can keep whatever kata he wants, but he’s eliminated a lot of the Shotokan kata and does Goju kata pretty much exclusively, except for the Pinan series and Naihanchi.
> 
> First time I saw Unsu was him doing it after class. Me and another guy were taking pictures for some advertising stuff he was working on. We both said “that’s the coolest kata we’ve ever seen.” It said it was one of his favorite kata, along with Kanku and Saiha.
> 
> ...



i used to think that way... but i worked up the courage after I was spending most of my time doing small classes, and private instructions. One day, an Uechi Ryu practitioner called me, and asked if he could learn a few specific forms, that he had seen and loved. He was a sandan, i think.

He said there were just 8 forms in his system. And he was hungry for more kata, just to learn.
I said no cost, just teach me Uechi Sanchin.
(i never told him that i never had charged for TSD instruction) But the tone was that he wanted to pay for it.

 So, i figured i could avoid taking money by trading knowledge. I should have asked for another Uechi kata. But i really only desired Uechi Sanchin.

We met on Saturday mornings, and then went to Denny's and talked martial arts history and politics.

He was one of the fastest to learn a kata, i had ever met. Great guy.
After that...

I saw that it was viable. And I discreetly made inquiries to pick up things i specific wanted to learn. I think out of 20 attempts, I was only told "no, we don't do that here" once.

I think there is a lot more latitude in a private instruction, because you won't have regular students feeling that its unfair that this outsider, or beginner gets to learn X, but i have to wait.


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## MetalBoar (Sep 25, 2018)

After my Hapkido school closed I did a lot of informal garage and meetup type training in whatever art was around and looked good. I found that in that setting at least, a lot of people would teach more or less whatever you were interested in. The only part that could be hard was finding them and getting a foot in the door in the first place. It was usually pretty easy as long as you are friendly and respectful. I'm sure it also helps a lot if you've got a solid background in something as well and have something to offer besides just money.

The only real downside was that I've been through a lot of instruction that didn't last as long as I'd like because when it's completely informal there's no guarantee that you'll get more than a handful (or even one) of training sessions. Of course my luck in more formal settings in this regard has been poor since about 2000 too...


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## _Simon_ (Sep 25, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> i used to think that way... but i worked up the courage after I was spending most of my time doing small classes, and private instructions. One day, an Uechi Ryu practitioner called me, and asked if he could learn a few specific forms, that he had seen and loved. He was a sandan, i think.
> 
> He said there were just 8 forms in his system. And he was hungry for more kata, just to learn.
> I said no cost, just teach me Uechi Sanchin.
> ...


That's really cool, trading knowledge for knowledge is so badass


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## TSDTexan (Sep 29, 2018)

_Simon_ said:


> Ah that sounds amazing, yeah would love to hear how it goes!
> 
> And I love the name "Doshin kan". Doshin, way of the heart?


 Turns out, i was wrong. the correct translation is "The heart of the way".


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## _Simon_ (Sep 29, 2018)

TSDTexan said:


> Turns out, i was wrong. the correct translation is "The heart of the way".


Ah right nice


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