# Different strokes for different folks



## theletch1 (Jul 3, 2008)

In another thread in this sub right now is a discussion of what aikido is to you.  I wanted to start this thread to alleviate some of the thread drift there and allow folks to discuss how their form of aikido differs from others.  Note that I didn't say how their style is BETTER than others.  As aikido-ka I think we have a great understanding of allowing energy to flow around us and with us instead of against us... both physically and in verbal discourse.  Let's keep it informative and polite as most all of the threads in this sub are.


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## Yari (Jul 4, 2008)

I have two primarly styles: Nishio and Kobayashi. But I practice Jujitsu and arnis too. So what I see in one style influcens the other way around. My aikido is influenced by jujitsu, and visaversa.

Somem of the tings I get from AIkido (and arnis) is flow work, and that of learning to feel techniques, and flow with the possiblities present. Other times my Aikido has to have techniques that work better / or differently.

/Yari


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## theletch1 (Jul 4, 2008)

It's great to have multiple arts in your arsenal and when they complement each other like that it's a true bonus.

Nihon Goshin Aikido is my primary art and it has stayed fairly close to it's DRAJJ roots.  Our circles tend to be a little smaller than other styles and we don't concern ourselves so much with the safety of an attacker as with our own safety. The spirituality that many expect to find in aikido is not in NGA.  We do tend to attract folks that have a less aggressive mindset than some of the more hard styles of MA, though.  My former style was kempo and it certainly flavors my aikido as far as my atemi, my finishing moves (if needed) and my readiness to go to the ground if needed (my old kempo school did a good bit of bjj).  Add the USMC h2h training to the mix and *MY* aikido is a little different from anyone elses.


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## amir (Jul 7, 2008)

Well, as I explained in the previous thread, I practice Korindo Aikido, which to my best understanding, is actually a seperate M.A. related to Ueshiba Aikido.
Korindo Aikido had a different founder - Minoro Hirai sensei, who did not consider himself to be a follower \ student of Ueshiba though they were in contact, and who had a very significant personal contact to the coining of the name Aikido (he was the head of the Dai-Nihon-Butokukai comittee who decided on the name, and the head of the department so named in that organization).
The Korindo Aikido technical roots are not in Daito-Ryu, rather in other Ju-Jutsu styles which Minoro Hirai sensei and his senior students had learned ( he chose not to limit the style to his own teachings, and encouraged some other senior teachers who were with him to teach elements from other Ju-Jutsu styles). We believe the main technical source to be Takanouchi-ryu, a Koryu Ju-Jutsu style which was vrey common in Hirai sensei  birth perfecture, though I could not prove that. 

The Korindo Aikido style is rather special in several elements: 
A. 3d rotational waist movement as a basis, and not just 2d rotation as is common in most styles. This also results in very small circles for power generation.
B. Korindo Aikido practice has 3 founding pillars: Tai-Sabaki, Kata, and Randori, and each is practiced and taught seperatly. 
Hirai Sensei developed 8 forms of Tai-Sabaki steps as a way of teaching movement from the center and the waist movement described above.
The Kata part is all the techniques trained in a cooperative manner.
And the Randori is free-play, just like in Judo randori (but not like Judo Shiai), to the best of my knowledge, Hirai too (like Jigoro Kano) studied a Koryu style which had this type of training.
C. Very developed weapons work. Hirai Sensei was a teacher of Nito (two swords fighting) before he opened his own school. He was well versed in multiple Samurai weapons, and also encouraged others in the style to spread their knowledge in weapons he did not study himself. Hence Korindo standard weaponary includes almost all the Samurai weapons (I must admit I did not get to study them all, and neither did my teacher).
D. Practical self defense concept. Korindo Aikido was developed as an innovative M.A. keeping it practical, though sophisticated and difficult to learn. In this it differs from Ueshiba Aikido which to my learning is a revelation of combining existing M.A. (DRAJJ) with a philosophical concept taken from the Omotokyu.
Hence, one places keeping self safe first, and not the aggressor (though one learns multiple optional responces allowing to scale the response to the threat).


Amir



Amir


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## Jenna (Jul 9, 2008)

Hey you guys  I like the title of the thread and will always think it is wonderful to hear of Aikido's many limbs as you all have explained here. I think there is a camaraderie between aikidoka, even when our styles are frequently dissimilar.  

Me, I have practiced primarily within the Aikikai style and but also enjoy a handful of Tomiki and have gone a bit with NGA guys and still have this damn mark on my **** to show for it, ha! And but now I practice a kind of Aikido mongrel and but he is quite an amenable animal, really!  We still practise within the Aikikai though have added extras.  We work in our own small egalitarian group and dojo without a sensei.  We use props and live stuff (BB guns and other silly and frankly, dangerous things) and do as much simulation of "real" situations and real weapons as we can conceive of.  

A few years back I had noticed myself slipping into that less energetic mode of Aikido which I am sure you will know what I mean?  And so over the last while I have tended to train greatly for speed and muscle tone and have done much more bodyweight training and circuits and skipping rope - my dad once upon a time ran a boxing gym so skipping rope is my fav for speed and stamina and coordination.

And the last sire in my Aikido mongrel's bloodline is maybe a bit leftfield?  I do not know if you think this is stupid but I also enjoy a competitive game of chess and weird as it might seem, I think this has also added something to my Aikido??  I do not know how this works neurologically and but I do believe the 'several moves ahead' mandate of the board game has made some synaptic connections in my Aikido brain??  Anyways, sorry, I need to cut down this coca leaf tea maybe.    Hope to hear more
Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna


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## Brian King (Jul 11, 2008)

Pardon me for interrupting yet another Aikido thread but I have a question/observation/opinion.

I have heard in many conversations people make generalizations on how their Aikido/Hapkido is different from that Aikido/Hapkido. Smaller/larger circles, tighter spirals, resistance, weapons work included or not. I know that not all Aikido is the same, even amongst the same organizations and dojos but after training with many different Aikido-ka I truly believe that the techniques are more similar than dissimilar amongst the higher levels of almost all the different Aikido organizations. I would be interested in a discussion on how the methodology of training, how the philosophy and how the traditions differ between your style of Aikido and perhaps the other style(s) of Aikido. What it is about your particular style that appeals to you?

Regards
Brian King


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## theletch1 (Jul 11, 2008)

Excellent question, Brian and one that suits this thread very well.  What appeals to me about my particular style of aikido is the "real world" approach that is taken in the methodology of the curriculum.  We bill our art as a self defense art.  As a matter of fact on many of our dojo you will see a placard somewhere that says "Where self defense is a science, not a sideline".  As I mentioned in my previous post we don't include the concentration on the spiritual side of aikido that you'll find in the Ueshiba sub-styles.  Our founder simply didn't follow that path through his life.  I'm an old Marine and have a history with other "hard" styles of MA and have always enjoyed that aspect of the martial arts.  I suppose, in a nutshell, it's the rough and tumble mentality that comes with NGA that appeals to me.  I'm sure that I'll be adding more to this as I have a little more time to think about it.


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## morph4me (Jul 11, 2008)

theletch1 said:


> Excellent question, Brian and one that suits this thread very well. What appeals to me about my particular style of aikido is the "real world" approach that is taken in the methodology of the curriculum. We bill our art as a self defense art. As a matter of fact on many of our dojo you will see a placard somewhere that says "Where self defense is a science, not a sideline". As I mentioned in my previous post we don't include the concentration on the spiritual side of aikido that you'll find in the Ueshiba sub-styles. Our founder simply didn't follow that path through his life. I'm an old Marine and have a history with other "hard" styles of MA and have always enjoyed that aspect of the martial arts. I suppose, in a nutshell, it's the rough and tumble mentality that comes with NGA that appeals to me. I'm sure that I'll be adding more to this as I have a little more time to think about it.


 
Actually Jeff and I have similar backgrounds, we're both former marines, we both studied hard styles before we found NGA and we were both drawn to it because of the self defense focus of the art. 

We learn our techniques from a static position, uke's job when we learn is not to resist and not to help, he basically stands there, takes the appropriate grip and waits until nage moves him. Once the mechanics of the technique is learned this way, we move on to teaching how it's applied against an actual attack. When training with other aikidoka, defense is done from a stance with one foot forward, which tells uke what side to attack with, in NGA we defend from a neutral stance and uke attacks with whatever side he chooses. When we do our randori or a self defense line, uke throws whatever attack he choose, these include kicks, jabs, any grip, backhands, straight attacks, uppercuts, overhands, roundhouse, hooks etc. When working with aikidoka from other styles, I only see 3 types of attacks staights, overhands, and chops. 

I've also noticed that in NGA our falls tend to be harder than other aikido styles. These are just some of the differences I've observed, but I techniques are basically the same, with some slight variations in application.  We also practice various punches, kicks, elbow strikes that I'm not sure are practiced in other aikido styles, but they may be.


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## morph4me (Jul 11, 2008)

> 3d rotational waist movement as a basis, and not just 2d rotation as is common in most styles. This also results in very small circles for power generation


 
Amir, I know how difficult it is to explain a technique in writing, but using kotegaesh as an example, could you explain what you mean by this?


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## amir (Jul 13, 2008)

morph4me said:


> Amir, I know how difficult it is to explain a technique in writing, but using kotegaesh as an example, could you explain what you mean by this?


 
Sorry, but I am sure it would be almost impossible to explain. I doubt even a video would have helped. Some things are easy to show with contact, and almost impossible without. 
The idea is your inner hip movement is rotational, not only as a circle on the 2d plain you stand upon, but as a ball enclosing all the 3 directions such as the orthogonal circle (up, forward, down backwards). Your hip does not just drop, rather you have a constant rotation in this plain as well.

Tried to start writing an explanation of technique, it was becoming too long and I hardly started, too many details :/. The main point is "simply" the directions of power created internally when pushing \ pulling.




> I know that not all Aikido is the same, even amongst the same organizations and dojos but after training with many different Aikido-ka I truly believe that the techniques are more similar than dissimilar amongst the higher levels of almost all the different Aikido organizations



If you look at the gross level, all is very similar, but so are Judo and Jujutsu practitioners doing the same techniques. However, an Art is defined by the details, and not on the gross side (children paint, yet are not painting artists). The same holds for M.A.  Most Japanese M.A. have almost te same techniques, yet each has a unique flavor. 




> would be interested in a discussion on how the methodology of training, how the philosophy and how the traditions differ between your style of Aikido and perhaps the other style(s) of Aikido



Our methodology is defined in 3 terms:  Tai-Sabaki, Kate, Randori
Each can and is trained in a variety of manners:  a Kate may include two or more attackers so long as the roles are well defined, a Randori may be free play of two with counters and all techniques allowed or multiple attackers against one.
I do not like to talk of Philosophy, a friend blamed me that when I talk of practical responses, it already sounds like philosophy 
Our approach is rather practical, having visited Japan, I find it to be a combination of a knowledgeable teacher (advanced in 3 different M.A.) who believes in practicality combined with the Korindo Aikido M.A. characteristics mentioned above.


Amir


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## Yari (Jul 14, 2008)

Brian said:


> Pardon me for interrupting yet another Aikido thread but I have a question/observation/opinion.
> ......... What it is about your particular style that appeals to you?
> 
> Regards
> Brian King


 
Well, good question.... let me think.... ;-)

I love that it has a basis for everbody to do it there own way. To emphesize on the part that you need to work on.

The things I feel Nishio style gives me is a more atemi related style that many other Aikido styles. I gives me an "edge" ;-) I also has "smaller circles " giving the understanding of how and when to use the different aspects of movement.

/Yari


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## citom (Jul 18, 2008)

Yari said:


> The things I feel Nishio style gives me is a more atemi related style that many other Aikido styles. I gives me an "edge" ;-) I also has "smaller circles " giving the understanding of how and when to use the different aspects of movement.
> 
> /Yari



Plus we get to do fun things to each other with the bokken and jo... and other fun things by ourselves with the iaito..


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## theletch1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I just viewed several videos on youtube about Nishio style.  I truly enjoy the way you guys add in your atemi.  The instructor (Nishio sensei) stopped several times during the demonstration of technique to show how and where you could (if you needed to) add in your atemi.  Great stuff.


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