# Macho vs. Century



## Azulx (Jan 19, 2016)

Macho sparring gear is a bit more pricey than Century's. Is the extra couple dollars per item (approx. $10 per gear set) worth it? Is the quality of the foam dipped padding better? or is it all the same?


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## FriedRice (Jan 20, 2016)

You picked, probably, the 2 crappiest manufacturers of safety gear.  Shinguards should cost $40-50.  Gloves $50-70.  Headgear $50-100.  And this is for decent quality equipment. Bringing that Macho or Century crap into, say Muay Thai...and you're going to wreck yourself or the other guy you're sparring.


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## jks9199 (Jan 20, 2016)

Macho and Century both make good equipment,  WHEN USED FOR WHAT IT IS DESIGNED TO DO.  Foam dipped safety gear is not a substitute for "real" boxing, MMA , or the like gear, and it's not supposed to be.  Personally,  I like Macho a little more.  I think it's a bit better made.  Century used to offer a little wider selection, and a wider range of gear, but I haven't checked the catalogs for a while.  If you need or want heavier stuff, I like Ringside. 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## WaterGal (Jan 20, 2016)

The Macho headgear seems to be made of thicker foam than the Century one, for whatever that's worth. They're probably both a decent choice for people looking to do some light-to-medium-contact sparring a couple times a month.


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## Andrew Green (Jan 20, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> You picked, probably, the 2 crappiest manufacturers of safety gear.  Shinguards should cost $40-50.  Gloves $50-70.  Headgear $50-100.  And this is for decent quality equipment. Bringing that Macho or Century crap into, say Muay Thai...and you're going to wreck yourself or the other guy you're sparring.



Foam dipped gear was not meant for Muay Thai... Century's Creed line of gear would work fine in that environment though.


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## Buka (Jan 20, 2016)

I haven't bought either brand in over twenty years so I don't know the quality of what they're making now. But remember, the gear is meant to protect you. Your hands, your feet, your head, shins etc. You should try them all on while keeping that in mind.

If you're buying leather, headgear or gloves, you shouldn't let your buddies wear your gear, even when they forget theirs and whine. People's sweat have slightly different chemical components and blends rot leather quicker. What might have lasted you fifteen years might very well break down in seven or eight. (or get just plain nasty) And nothing is better than a pair of well broken in gloves or headgear molded to you over years of work.

And good gear lasts longer and works better than cheap gear.


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## Danny T (Jan 20, 2016)

Buka said:


> I haven't bought either brand in over twenty years so I don't know the quality of what they're making now. But remember, the gear is meant to protect you. Your hands, your feet, your head, shins etc.


Actually some of the gear is to protect you and some is to protect the opponent or training partner. Headgear is to protect your head, hand pads protect both, shinguards and foot pads protect the opponent or training partner. If you need to protect your feet when kicking then you shouldn't be kicking with your foot.


Buka said:


> You should try them all on while keeping that in mind.


[/QUOTE]
[/QUOTE]
[/QUOTE]
[/QUOTE]
All equipment should fit well, be comfortable and stay in place.


Buka said:


> Buka said:
> 
> 
> > And good gear lasts longer and works better than cheap gear.
> ...


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## FriedRice (Jan 20, 2016)

The best gear for the price is by Title. I buy new gloves every 1.5 to 2 years....due to them wearing out and hurting my joints, plus they will all stink bad.

If you want to get mildly serious and up, you don't get junk like Century and Macho. People can get mad during sparring, spike the power level and jack you up....and now you're injured and a bunch of "sorry's" won't help. One dumbass grabbed my head and slammed the back (of my head)  against the concrete wall of a warehouse/gym during hard sparring while we were in the clinch. I threw a pull powered elbow right towards his face (w/no elbow pad) but missed and the bell rang. He avoided me after that....I was wrecking him that's why he just went "street" all of the sudden and did that. This was when we both were training for our first fight. I was lucky I had headgear on.


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## Azulx (Jan 20, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> If you want to get mildly serious and up, you don't get junk like Century and Macho. People can get mad during sparring, spike the power level and jack you up....and now you're injured and a bunch of "sorry's" won't help. One dumbass grabbed my head and slammed the back (of my head) against the concrete wall of a warehouse/gym during hard sparring while we were in the clinch. I threw a pull powered elbow right towards his face (w/no elbow pad) but missed and the bell rang. He avoided me after that....I was wrecking him that's why he just went "street" all of the sudden and did that. This was when we both were training for our first fight. I was lucky I had headgear on.



Jesus... I would never grab someone and smash their head against a wall in my class, no matter how intense the match got. I respect and actually care for the well being of my fellow classmates. If anyone did that at our school they would never be allowed to return.

 So, I believe the mistake I made was not stating what style I train in. I train in Taekwon-do (non-Olympic) , we can punch to head. We are not allowed to clinch, knee, elbow, choke slam, headbutt, or ram someone's head into a wall. All our strikes have to come from either the hands, feet, or shins. We can only strike above the belt, and no spine or back of the head.We all use the foam dipped gear, so I was trying to see if either  one was better, or if anyone had a suggestion, for better quality foam dipped gear that wasn't Macho or Century.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Azulx said:


> Jesus... I would never grab someone and smash their head against a wall in my class, no matter how intense the match got. I respect and actually care for the well being of my fellow classmates. If anyone did that at our school they would never be allowed to return.
> 
> So, I believe the mistake I made was not stating what style I train in. I train in Taekwon-do (non-Olympic) , we can punch to head. We are not allowed to clinch, knee, elbow, choke slam, headbutt, or ram someone's head into a wall. All our strikes have to come from either the hands, feet, or shins. We can only strike above the belt, and no spine or back of the head.We all use the foam dipped gear, so I was trying to see if either  one was better, or if anyone had a suggestion, for better quality foam dipped gear that wasn't Macho or Century.



Well smashing the back of my head into a solid concrete wall is not allowed in any gym, but it happened. That's the point of wearing decent to good gear, and not that Macho/Century crap...people can get mad and do **** to you. I didn't snitch on him, I just wanted to spar him again and wouldn't give an F if I got thrown out for something.  We switch partners every round and he kept avoiding me by immediately pairing up with someone else. But that was a long time ago and we are cool now. He has no chance against me now neither and I'm not holding any grudges.  My 1st headgear was $50, 2nd $50 but the 3rd was $90 and it's much better than the $50 ones. 

And those Macho gloves are pure junk. You get good at punching by going full power on the heavy bag. But if you mess up, and everyone will, good boxing gloves will help save your hands and wrists. Why would you wear children's toys to protect your hands?


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## elder999 (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> . Why would you wear children's toys to protect your hands?



Why would you use boxing gloves on a heavy bag?


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

elder999 said:


> Why would you use boxing gloves on a heavy bag?



Probably because I hit really hard.


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## Danny T (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> The best gear for the price is by Title. I buy new gloves every 1.5 to 2 years....due to them wearing out and hurting my joints, plus they will all stink bad.
> 
> If you want to get mildly serious and up, you don't get junk like Century and Macho. People can get mad during sparring, spike the power level and jack you up....and now you're injured and a bunch of "sorry's" won't help. One dumbass grabbed my head and slammed the back (of my head)  against the concrete wall of a warehouse/gym during hard sparring while we were in the clinch. I threw a pull powered elbow right towards his face (w/no elbow pad) but missed and the bell rang. He avoided me after that....I was wrecking him that's why he just went "street" all of the sudden and did that. This was when we both were training for our first fight. I was lucky I had headgear on.


Title has good entry and intermediate level equipment. Heavy hitters and people who train hard 3 times a week will not get 1 1/2 to 2 years unless using Title's expensive Black Line equipment. With Title we get about 6 - 8 months our fighters 2 - 3 months. And this is with their platinum line. We use Twins, Rev Gear, and Ringside for most of our adult equipment. They last our student approx 1 1/2 - 2 years and our fighters about 8 months.

As to Century and Macho equipment they are not for boxing or muay thai. You have already been told that. The equipment is for for a completely different type of training.


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## Danny T (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Probably because I hit really hard.


A boxing glove on the heavy bag won't last very long if you are a hard hitter. A training glove will last a bit longer. But if you want a long lasting glove for heavy bag work you should be using a 'Bag Glove'.


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## elder999 (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Probably because I hit really hard.




























Now see, if you'd said so that you could train with the weight of boxing gloves, I would have accepted that....you *don't* use boxing gloves "to protect your hands," hitting the heavy bag.


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## WaterGal (Jan 21, 2016)

Azulx said:


> So, I believe the mistake I made was not stating what style I train in. I train in Taekwon-do (non-Olympic) , we can punch to head. We are not allowed to clinch, knee, elbow, choke slam, headbutt, or ram someone's head into a wall. All our strikes have to come from either the hands, feet, or shins. We can only strike above the belt, and no spine or back of the head.We all use the foam dipped gear, so I was trying to see if either  one was better, or if anyone had a suggestion, for better quality foam dipped gear that wasn't Macho or Century.



I haven't used the foam-dipped hand and foot protectors since I was a teenager, so I'm not sure about what company is good or bad for those, but honestly..... if you guys aren't hitting really hard or trying to compete in high-level sports competitions, I don't think it really matters that much.  Either should protect you reasonably well for that kind of sparring and probably hold up for at least a couple years.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Danny T said:


> Title has good entry and intermediate level equipment. Heavy hitters and people who train hard 3 times a week will not get 1 1/2 to 2 years unless using Title's expensive Black Line equipment. With Title we get about 6 - 8 months our fighters 2 - 3 months. And this is with their platinum line. We use Twins, Rev Gear, and Ringside for most of our adult equipment. They last our student approx 1 1/2 - 2 years and our fighters about 8 months.
> 
> As to Century and Macho equipment they are not for boxing or muay thai. You have already been told that. The equipment is for for a completely different type of training.



I advised him to go with Title because he's cheap and wanted to buy Macho or Century.  So now you're advocating even more expensive gear that's around 2x or more that of the entry level, Title equipment? How does this make any sense?  I know how they spar in TKD, I started out in TKD and **** can happen and it becomes a war until the instructor stops it.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

elder999 said:


> Now see, if you'd said so that you could train with the weight of boxing gloves, I would have accepted that....you *don't* use boxing gloves "to protect your hands," hitting the heavy bag.



you obviously don't hit very hard, but that's ok, we all have to start somewhere.


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## elder999 (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> you obviously don't hit very hard, but that's ok, we all have to start somewhere.





















































Please note at 2:15




"the *bag gloves*"
(I suppose you hit harder than bernard Hopkins, though...., )

You will see a lot of _professional_  boxers using "boxing gloves" as bag gloves, ,not so much  for protection, but because it's the tool they use in the ring.

You'll also see it a lot in classes in places like LA Boxing, (where they don't really "box," they work the heavy-bag planted, not actively moving and using footwork-staying stationary, the most common *mistake* for working the heavy bag) where they'll wear the boxing gloves for most of the "class."


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

elder999 said:


>



what's wrong now?


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## Danny T (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I advised him to go with Title because he's cheap and wanted to buy Macho or Century.  So now you're advocating even more expensive gear that's around 2x or more that of the entry level, Title equipment? How does this make any sense?  I know how they spar in TKD, I started out in TKD and **** can happen and it becomes a war until the instructor stops it.


 No in the original post it was asked if the extra dollars is worth it. There is a particular type of equipment he is asking about.
You stated Title and I agree it is good beginner to intermediate level equipment for the price.
You stated you buy new gloves every 1.5 to 2 years....due to them wearing out. And then later stated you are a hard hitter.
My comment is if one is a serious practitioner who trains hard and punches hard then the Title will not last the amount of time you suggested 'unless' purchasing the higher end lines. 
Sorry if you miss understood.
He is using 'foam dipped' equipment for his sparring as everyone else he is sparring with. He stated that. 
You brought up punching on the heavy bag. Foam dipped equipment Is Not For Heavy Bag Work. My comments were about that.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Danny T said:


> No in the original post it was asked if the extra dollars is worth it. There is a particular type of equipment he is asking about.
> You stated Title and I agree it is good beginner to intermediate level equipment for the price.
> You stated you buy new gloves every 1.5 to 2 years....due to them wearing out. And then later stated you are a hard hitter.
> My comment is if one is a serious practitioner who trains hard and punches hard then the Title will not last the amount of time you suggested 'unless' purchasing the higher end lines.
> ...



Sure they will. There are pro fighters who use Title gloves way longer than 1 year.   Revgear, Twins, etc...they all have lower end just like Title does. I have a pair of Fairtex gloves that I hate and it sits in the closet, used about 5x.  2 pairs of Revgear that were ok, but both started tearing at the palm, and were leather. None of my some 8 or so Title gloves have ripped like that. 

My comment was also about hitting the heavy bag, because he should also be hitting it...even if they don't have one at his TKD gym, which would be pretty lousy if it didn't.  Those open palm, Macho gear gloves are like toys. He'd be doing himself and other TKD's there a favor if he got decent gloves, and maybe start a trend for them to all buy decent gloves.


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## Andrew Green (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> He'd be doing himself and other TKD's there a favor if he got decent gloves, and maybe start a trend for them to all buy decent gloves.



Not really, tournaments are going to specify the gear required.  The schools insurance policy might as well.  Dipped foam might not be meant for heavy contact, and is terrible for heavy contact.  But you should always wear the gear required by the place you are training.  

Best bet? buy it through your school if they carry it.  If not ask your instructor what they recommend and from where.  

But don't get a piece of gear designed for a different sort of activity without checking if it's ok with the people in charge of your classes (and tournaments if applicable) first.


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## Danny T (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Sure they will. There are pro fighters who use Title gloves way longer than 1 year.   Revgear, Twins, etc...they all have lower end just like Title does. I have a pair of Fairtex gloves that I hate and it sits in the closet, used about 5x.  2 pairs of Revgear that were ok, but both started tearing at the palm, and were leather. None of my some 8 or so Title gloves have ripped like that.
> 
> My comment was also about hitting the heavy bag, because he should also be hitting it...even if they don't have one at his TKD gym, which would be pretty lousy if it didn't.  Those open palm, Macho gear gloves are like toys. He'd be doing himself and other TKD's there a favor if he got decent gloves, and maybe start a trend for them to all buy decent gloves.


Here are 2 different Title gloves that were purchased approx. two weeks apart. The red pair is a pair of leather boxing gloves used as training and heavy bag gloves. The are mushy and the padding has broken down. The black are a pair of platinum bag gloves and are in much better condition. They are 4 months old.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Danny T said:


> Here are 2 different Title gloves that were purchased approx. two weeks apart. The red pair is a pair of leather boxing gloves used as training and heavy bag gloves. The are mushy and the padding has broken down. The black are a pair of platinum bag gloves and are in much better condition. They are 4 months old.



Yea, that's why you shouldn't be cleaning them with bleach. I'm calling BS on the red ones being 4 months old and you put that much damage on them by yourself. I'd like to drop in and train with you whenever I'm in LA and see you in action for myself, deal?


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> Not really, tournaments are going to specify the gear required.  The schools insurance policy might as well.  Dipped foam might not be meant for heavy contact, and is terrible for heavy contact.  But you should always wear the gear required by the place you are training.
> 
> Best bet? buy it through your school if they carry it.  If not ask your instructor what they recommend and from where.
> 
> But don't get a piece of gear designed for a different sort of activity without checking if it's ok with the people in charge of your classes (and tournaments if applicable) first.




That sounds true about certain tourneys' requirements. The Kung-Fu ones I've seen, they let you wear either.  While if the gym makes you buy their own, then I call red flag on them fleecing students. Better gear is just going to be better for everyone.  Instructors who recommends junky Macho gear, are still wrong.


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## Danny T (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Yea, that's why you shouldn't be cleaning them with bleach. I'm calling BS on the red ones being 4 months old and you put that much damage on them by yourself. I'd like to drop in and train with you whenever I'm in LA and see you in action for myself, deal?


1. These are not mine but two of my fighters who purchased them about two weeks apart. 
2. I keep the Title gloves like the red in stock and they simply don't last with our heavy hitters. We stock the other brands for them because they hold up longer.
3. You are very welcome to come in any time.


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## elder999 (Jan 21, 2016)

Danny T said:


> .
> 3. You are very welcome to come in any time.



Oh ****, oh dear...


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## Azulx (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I advised him to go with Title because he's cheap and wanted to buy Macho or Century. So now you're advocating even more expensive gear that's around 2x or more that of the entry level, Title equipment? How does this make any sense? I know how they spar in TKD, I started out in TKD and **** can happen and it becomes a war until the instructor stops it.



So like I stated, we use foam dipped gear. That has nothing to do with me being cheap, it is just what we use. We don't have any professional fighters in our school. All our matches are proctored by an instructor, so we won't have people loosing their heads and trying anything dangerous on our students. We don't use full power strikes, so I don't think we need professional grade equipment.

I also stated that I was looking to see if there was a difference in quality between Macho and Century, because those are the only foam dipped sparring gear manufacturers I know. I also asked if anyone knew any other FOAM DIPPED gear manufactures besides the two, as we only use foam dipped gear. I never said anything about hitting the bag , or would they work on a bag. As I know foam dipped gear is not meant for a heavy bag, but I appreciate you expanding my knowledge on what gloves I should get to hit a heavy bag. 

I also see you state that you hit 'really' hard, and that your fists of fury need top of the line gloves, because you'll shred through gloves like no other. If I ever get my punches to be hadouken strengthed like yours. I will definitely need some more gear advice.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Well smashing the back of my head into a solid concrete wall is not allowed in any gym, but it happened. That's the point of wearing decent to good gear, and not that Macho/Century crap...people can get mad and do **** to you. I didn't snitch on him, I just wanted to spar him again and wouldn't give an F if I got thrown out for something.



Honestly, if you're partner smashes your head against concrete because he's angry that you're beating him, your instructor doesnt notice it at all, and you're concerned about "snitching", unless you're claiming to practice some sort of jailhouse rock there are serious issues with your gym way more important than what gloves you're wearing.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Azulx said:


> I also see you state that you hit 'really' hard, and that your fists of fury need top of the line gloves, because you'll shred through gloves like no other. If I ever get my punches to be hadouken strengthed like yours. I will definitely need some more gear advice.



I was giving you sound advice, so I'm not sure why you're getting all bitchy like this.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> Honestly, if you're partner smashes your head against concrete because he's angry that you're beating him, your instructor doesnt notice it at all, and you're concerned about "snitching", unless you're claiming to practice some sort of jailhouse rock there are serious issues with your gym way more important than what gloves you're wearing.



Everyone was sparring, including the instructors who were preparing us for our 1st fight and a few of them were also fighting. This was many years ago and i don't remember the exact detail. Crap happens. It doesn't happen all the time or even often. If anything, it only happened ONCE, over a span of almost 10 years with something questionable like this.  What was I going to do, go tell on the guy? That's just weak. He didn't do it again the next class I saw him and we were cool ever since then. And the main point being, I was lucky I had headgear on, because I remember it really rocked my head. And it was only the velcro straps of the headgear that protected me too, because there's no real padding back there.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Danny T said:


> 1. These are not mine but two of my fighters who purchased them about two weeks apart.
> 2. I keep the Title gloves like the red in stock and they simply don't last with our heavy hitters. We stock the other brands for them because they hold up longer.
> 3. You are very welcome to come in any time.



I just thought that you meant that you did that to both gloves in 4 months.


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## Andrew Green (Jan 21, 2016)

You got to use the right glove for the right task


FriedRice said:


> That sounds true about certain tourneys' requirements. The Kung-Fu ones I've seen, they let you wear either.  While if the gym makes you buy their own, then I call red flag on them fleecing students. Better gear is just going to be better for everyone.  Instructors who recommends junky Macho gear, are still wrong.



No, there a school.  They have every right to demand certain standards for equipment used by there students.  Some use branded gear as well as branded uniforms, in which case you got to buy it from the school.  You don't join a hockey team and demand to wear your own jersey and colours.  They can make whatever uniform and equipment requirements they want.

People buying gear elsewhere just means the school gets less in equipment sales and will have to make up that difference in some other way (ex higher tuition)


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## Azulx (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I was giving you sound advice, so I'm not sure why you're getting all bitchy like this.



I was merely joking, thank you for your advice


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## jks9199 (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> The best gear for the price is by Title. I buy new gloves every 1.5 to 2 years....due to them wearing out and hurting my joints, plus they will all stink bad.
> 
> If you want to get mildly serious and up, you don't get junk like Century and Macho. People can get mad during sparring, spike the power level and jack you up....and now you're injured and a bunch of "sorry's" won't help. One dumbass grabbed my head and slammed the back (of my head)  against the concrete wall of a warehouse/gym during hard sparring while we were in the clinch. I threw a pull powered elbow right towards his face (w/no elbow pad) but missed and the bell rang. He avoided me after that....I was wrecking him that's why he just went "street" all of the sudden and did that. This was when we both were training for our first fight. I was lucky I had headgear on.


There isn't much on the market that will protect you against malicious or majorly careless actions.  The foam dipped gear is designed to provide protection for controlled contact, light to medium sparring.  Not full contact or heavy contact.  The head gear is intended to protect from accidental, moderate head contact and falls, not to be an alternative to boxing headgear.  You wouldn't use label wrestling headgear as "crap" because it doesn't provide significant protection against blows to the head -- or a baseball umpire's chest protector as useless since it won't stop a bullet like my body armor can, would you?  Different gear, different purposes -- but if you use them for what they're intended for -- they're fine.

And neither would provide significant protection against a full powered elbow properly delivered, if it lands.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 21, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I was giving you sound advice, so I'm not sure why you're getting all bitchy like this.


OP: I need foam padded sparring gear for my class since that's what my school uses. Should I go with Macho or Century?
Sound advice: Personally I haven't seen a difference between the two, so save the 10 bucks and go Century(or advising one if there is a difference).
Your advice: Both of those suck. Who cares if you're a TKD practitioner, which normally doesn't do a lot of heavy bag work? You need top-line fighting equipment in case you start doing some serious bag work all of a sudden. Plus what if one of your fellow students decides to randomly go crazy and smash your head into a wall? What will you do then? Wait...your instructor doesn't want you to get those because literally no one in your classes spar with them and it's not the gloves that the school uses? Clearly it's a huge red flag and the instructor is wrong, so just ignore what he says and try to get everyone to wear different gear.
I normally try to ignore it when people here are being this ridiculous, but there's a serious issue if you believe that what you gave was actually sound, useful or relevant in any way.


Azulx said:


> I was merely joking, thank you for your advice


Please don't thank him for that advice. All that does is validate the advice to himself.


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## jks9199 (Jan 21, 2016)

Azulx said:


> Jesus... I would never grab someone and smash their head against a wall in my class, no matter how intense the match got. I respect and actually care for the well being of my fellow classmates. If anyone did that at our school they would never be allowed to return.
> 
> So, I believe the mistake I made was not stating what style I train in. I train in Taekwon-do (non-Olympic) , we can punch to head. We are not allowed to clinch, knee, elbow, choke slam, headbutt, or ram someone's head into a wall. All our strikes have to come from either the hands, feet, or shins. We can only strike above the belt, and no spine or back of the head.We all use the foam dipped gear, so I was trying to see if either  one was better, or if anyone had a suggestion, for better quality foam dipped gear that wasn't Macho or Century.


There are a few other manufacturers out there, though I don't recall their names off the top of my head.  Your school may recommend or require specific gear.  Sometimes this is do to organization/association rules, other times it's because they sell a particular product...


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## Azulx (Jan 21, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> Sound adviceersonally I haven't seen a difference between the two, so save the 10 bucks and go Century (or advising one if there is a difference).
> Your advice: Both of those suck. Who cares if you're a TKD practitioner, which normally doesn't do a lot of heavy bag work? You need top-line fighting equipment in case you start doing some serious bag work all of a sudden. Plus what if one of your fellow students decides to randomly go crazy and smash your head into a wall? What will you do then? Wait...your instructor doesn't want you to get those because literally no one in your classes spar with them and it's not the gloves that the school uses? Clearly it's a huge red flag and the instructor is wrong, so just ignore what he says and try to get everyone to wear different gear.
> I normally try to ignore it when people here are being this ridiculous, but there's a serious issue if you believe that what you gave was actually sound, useful or relevant in any way.



I didn't want to be an a-hole, but you literally posted everything I was thinking when reading his posts. My question wasn't answered at all , I just got a lecture on how foam dipped gear sucked for heavy bag work, a sociopath trying to paralyze me, and if I somehow found myself teleporting into a Muay Thai/boxing ring, or a UFC cage with my foam dipped gear on.


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## jks9199 (Jan 21, 2016)

elder999 said:


> Why would you use boxing gloves on a heavy bag?





FriedRice said:


> Probably because I hit really hard.



H'mm...  Seems to me that I've heard of something specially designed to let you pound on a heavy bag and protect your hands...


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> You got to use the right glove for the right task
> 
> 
> No, there a school.  They have every right to demand certain standards for equipment used by there students.  Some use branded gear as well as branded uniforms, in which case you got to buy it from the school.  You don't join a hockey team and demand to wear your own jersey and colours.  They can make whatever uniform and equipment requirements they want.
> ...



I can understand making money as a business, but I think they should upgrade their equipment standards to something that's at least decent. Buying specific uniform is one thing, but decent gear meant to protect students is different.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

jks9199 said:


> There isn't much on the market that will protect you against malicious or majorly careless actions.



True, but I was protected from that ONE time incident b/c I had good headgear on. And the nature of sparring, things can happen, such as the spiking of allowed power levels. This is not just at MMA gyms, but TMA ones too. People can get mad, and they crack heads.



> The foam dipped gear is designed to provide protection for controlled contact, light to medium sparring.  Not full contact or heavy contact.  The head gear is intended to protect from accidental, moderate head contact and falls, not to be an alternative to boxing headgear.



Yes I understand this, but how is buying better, not a wiser choice should accidents happen? How is better gear, that's not that much more expensive, bad?



> You wouldn't use label wrestling headgear as "crap" because it doesn't provide significant protection against blows to the head -- or a baseball umpire's chest protector as useless since it won't stop a bullet, would you?  Different gear, different purposes -- but if you use them for what they're intended for -- they're fine.



Now you're making a straw-man argument. There's no striking in wrestling, while TKD and MMA shares the similar aspects of striking.

Also,   when I was sparring vs. Wushu and Wing Chun schools, some people had Boxing type headgear with the full face mask. Some had Boxing gloves. Another Kung-Fu school had only, Boxing gloves, even though they were the cheap kind for $12.


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## FriedRice (Jan 21, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> OP: I need foam padded sparring gear for my class since that's what my school uses. Should I go with Macho or Century?
> Sound adviceersonally I haven't seen a difference between the two, so save the 10 bucks and go Century (or advising one if there is a difference).
> Your advice: Both of those suck. Who cares if you're a TKD practitioner, which normally doesn't do a lot of heavy bag work? You need top-line fighting equipment in case you start doing some serious bag work all of a sudden. Plus what if one of your fellow students decides to randomly go crazy and smash your head into a wall? What will you do then? Wait...your instructor doesn't want you to get those because literally no one in your classes spar with them and it's not the gloves that the school uses? Clearly it's a huge red flag and the instructor is wrong, so just ignore what he says and try to get everyone to wear different gear.
> I normally try to ignore it when people here are being this ridiculous, but there's a serious issue if you believe that what you gave was actually sound, useful or relevant in any way.
> ...



I already told you that I started with TKD. In some schools, there are people who will hit hard. Those Macho and Century are crap. He'll get his head cracked, and he'll wonder why. The main reason that the school sells that junk is the wholesale cost is low and the markup is profitable vs. the real gear where after a decent markup, it's very high. And noobs don't understand the value of decent gear to protect them and would cry at the price.


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## Andrew Green (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I can understand making money as a business, but I think they should upgrade their equipment standards to something that's at least decent. Buying specific uniform is one thing, but decent gear meant to protect students is different.



From the type of sparring done with it, it is decent. It's also widely used, accepted by insurance companies, etc

If you are doing non contact sparring it's fine. If you join a kickboxing program that wants foam gear something is really, really wrong.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> I already told you that I started with TKD. In some schools, there are people who will hit hard. Those Macho and Century are crap. He'll get his head cracked, and he'll wonder why. The main reason that the school sells that junk is the wholesale cost is low and the markup is profitable vs. the real gear where after a decent markup, it's very high. And noobs don't understand the value of decent gear to protect them and would cry at the price.


As I think I've stated twice now, if people are trying to crack his head open, even if it's out of "anger cause I wrecked him too hard" there is a much bigger problem than his sparring gear. From what he's stated, there's nothing to imply that there are people who will go all out in sparring, contactwise, and he actually implies the opposite.
He never stated the school sells it directly. The only thing close to that, was someone suggesting that he go and ask his instructor if they do, and if not if the instructor recommends one over the other. Nothing in there to suggest their trying to scam money at all.
He wasn't crying about the price at all, something that's been said to you multiple times. He was comparing foam padded gear, and wanted to know if there was anything special about macho that made it more expensive than ceentury.


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## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

> As I think I've stated twice now, if people are trying to crack his head open, even if it's out of "anger cause I wrecked him too hard" there is a much bigger problem than his sparring gear.



You probably just don't have enough experience in different and many gyms then. And you didn't
even understand what I said. Do you think that I said that this happens on a regular basis?



> From what he's stated, there's nothing to imply that there are people who will go all out in sparring, contactwise, and he actually implies the opposite.



Are you serious? He's a noob WHITE BELT who doesn't even have his sparring gear yet. How would he know any of this?



> He never stated the school sells it directly. The only thing close to that, was someone suggesting that he go and ask his instructor if they do, and if not if the instructor recommends one over the other. Nothing in there to suggest their trying to scam money at all.



I wasn't responding specifically to him but to either you or some other guy who said something about the school selling the gear. 



> He wasn't crying about the price at all, something that's been said to you multiple times. He was comparing foam padded gear, and wanted to know if there was anything special about macho that made it more expensive than ceentury.



They're both lousy.


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

I wear no gloves on the heavy bag. It strengthens your knuckles and fist, idk why people feel the need to wear them on the heavy bag to be honest. The bag is made to be hit and doesn't need to be protected from being hit.


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## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> From the type of sparring done with it, it is decent. It's also widely used, accepted by insurance companies, etc
> 
> If you are doing non contact sparring it's fine. If you join a kickboxing program that wants foam gear something is really, really wrong.



My point was, I'd rather spend an extra $50 in case someone makes a mistake or don't have good control or gets mad or one of the guy who wants to go harder or all the above. He's a noob, so let him get his first concussion and find out the hard way. Or did you think that nobody in TKD classes ever got hit hard or dropped before?

People in Kickboxing, Muay Thai, etc. also starts out as noobs and when we let them spar in the beginning, it's ALWAYS light sparring. But we don't tell them to go out and buy the crappiest gear possible to save money and risk getting injured. Most people in Muay Thai classes don't even fight, only about 10% actually fights....and we still don't tell them to buy junk gear. Even for drills, you'd want decent gear, not the crappiest.


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## elder999 (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> My point was, I'd rather spend an extra $50 in case someone makes a mistake or don't have good control or gets mad or one of the guy who wants to go harder or all the above. He's a noob, so let him get his first concussion and find out the hard way. Or did you think that nobody in TKD classes ever got hit hard or dropped before?
> 
> People in Kickboxing, Muay Thai, etc. also starts out as noobs and when we let them spar in the beginning, it's ALWAYS light sparring. But we don't tell them to go out and buy the crappiest gear possible to save money and risk getting injured. Most people in Muay Thai classes don't even fight, only about 10% actually fights....and we still don't tell them to buy junk gear. Even for drills, you'd want decent gear, not the crappiest.



That's not what you said....and, for muay thai, the gear asked about would not be appropriate. For other classes, it's what would be required. (Not mine, where we spar bareknuckle, full-contact, mind you, but that's just us....) Having worn boxing gloves, though-*a lot*- I can say that they're almost  no good for grabbing, and only marginal for delivering knife-hands or ridge-hands: all tools that karate sparring or TKD sparring might use. So the earlier analogy of using a wrestler's headgear for head protection in sparring stands: wrestler's earguards are to prevent cauliflower ear, not concussions from strikes, and Century and Macho sparring gear are meant to provide moderate protection against contact in limited sparring situations, not for muay thai or boxing.

Now, about that heavy bag.........


----------



## Azulx (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Are you serious? He's a noob WHITE BELT who doesn't even have his sparring gear yet. How would he know any of this?



So everyone who uses foam dipped sparring gear is a noob in your eyes? For one I am not a white belt, and like I have stated several times, my inquiry was on the difference between the quality of Macho and Century. I am 100% aware that foam dipped gear is not proffesional grade equipment and bag equipment, I didn't need your expertise to figure that out. My question was geared to see if there is better quality foam dipped gear, as we ONLY use foam dipped gear. Then you stated that since our instructor doesn't let us just bring whatever gear we wanted he must be scamming us. That is not the case, foam dipped is jus the preffered gear. If proffesional gear was the preffered gear , we would buy proffessional gear through the instructor, but that isn't the case. Unfortunately, I think that time your friend smahed your head into the wall may have removed your ability to answer a question, ecause all you have done is bashing on this thread, and not answered the question.


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## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

Azulx said:


> So everyone who uses foam dipped sparring gear is a noob in your eyes?



Well you're certainly a noob since you don't even have sparring gear yet.



> For one I am not a white belt,



Then what belt are you?



> and like I have stated several times, my inquiry was on the difference between the quality of Macho and Century. I am 100% aware that foam dipped gear is not proffesional grade equipment and bag equipment,



Neither was what I suggested that you buy, pro grade neither.



> I didn't need your expertise to figure that out.



I don't believe you.



> My question was geared to see if there is better quality foam dipped gear, as we ONLY use foam dipped gear. Then you stated that since our instructor doesn't let us just bring whatever gear we wanted he must be scamming us.



I wasn't talking to you. Not everything on the thread is about you.



> That is not the case, foam dipped is jus the preffered gear. If proffesional gear was the preffered gear , we would buy proffessional gear through the instructor, but that isn't the case. Unfortunately, I think that time your friend smahed your head into the wall may have removed your ability to answer a question, ecause all you have done is bashing on this thread, and not answered the question.



Well no you're just crying because you don't like my answers.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

elder999 said:


> That's not what you said....



What did I say then, prove this.



> and, for muay thai, the gear asked about would not be appropriate. For other classes, it's what would be required.



Obviously, the argument was about why couldn't people buy better gear for better protection?



> (Not mine, where we spar bareknuckle, full-contact, mind you, but that's just us....)
> 
> Having worn boxing gloves, though-a lot- I can say that they're almost  no good for grabbing, and only marginal for delivering knife-hands or ridge-hands: all tools that karate sparring or TKD sparring might use. So the earlier analogy of using a wrestler's headgear for head protection in sparring stands: wrestler's earguards are to prevent cauliflower ear, not concussions from strikes, and Century and Macho sparring gear are meant to provide moderate protection against contact in limited sparring situations, not for muay thai or boxing.
> 
> Now, about that heavy bag.........


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I wear no gloves on the heavy bag. It strengthens your knuckles and fist, idk why people feel the need to wear them on the heavy bag to be honest. The bag is made to be hit and doesn't need to be protected from being hit.



Can you post a quick video of how hard you can hit your heavy bag, bear knuckles? Thanks.


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## Azulx (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Well you're certainly a noob since you don't even have sparring gear yet.



I do have sparring gear it's century branded foam dipped. 



FriedRice said:


> Then what belt are you?



Blue w/ a red stripe



FriedRice said:


> Neither was what I suggested that you buy, pro grade neither.




I wouldn't buy gear appropriate for Muay Thai, Boxing, or MMA training, because I don't practice either of those three. 



FriedRice said:


> Well no you're just crying because you don't like my answers.



You never actually answered my question, you just stated your opinion on other gears, and bashed the gear I was talking about as a whole. You are the only one in this thread who didn't understand the question. I didn't ask how foam dipped gear compared non foam dipped gear, I asked what is the better foam gear out of the 2 I mentioned, then if there was a better foam gear manufacture besides the two. I never mentioned anything about using it for a heavy bag, or muay thai, you only assumed that I thought it was for those two.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> You probably just don't have enough experience in different and many gyms then.


I've been to enough. All of the ones I go to/have gone to have a "no ego" attitude..if it doesn't have that attitude or people there have a short temper/are super macho, I leave and dont train there.


> And you didn't even understand what I said. Do you think that I said that this happens on a regular basis?


If it happens at all that's more than enough.


> Are you serious? He's a noob WHITE BELT who doesn't even have his sparring gear yet. How would he know any of this?


First, he never said he's a white belt..it's entirely possible he trained in a different system that uses other gloves and he now has to transition, or that he's been at that place for a while, but they have a certain amount of time they have to train before their allowed to spar (i disagree with this thinking, but it happens a lot). In either case, he'd have an idea of what kind of atmosphere the place has, and the instructor can tell him how hard they spar.


> I wasn't responding specifically to him but to either you or some other guy who said something about the school selling the gear.


It wasn't to me, and once again the guy never stated that the school does sell them. He just said to check with the instructor in case they do, or in case the instructor has a recommendation, nothing about the instructor making money off it.


> They're both lousy.


How do you still not realize that this does not answer the equation. I'll try to simplify the conversation for you.
OP: I need a or b, which ones better?
You: C.
OP: C's not an option here.
You: Well, do C anyway, maybe people will follow you.
OP: But...I can't here. I can only do A or B.
You: Do C. A and B are lousy.

If you still can't understand, I'm done with this thread because either you will never realize what's wrong, or you realized a while ago and figured trolling to make yourself purposefully seem like an idiot and an a-hole is better than accidentally being an idiot and an a-hole.


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## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

Azulx said:


> I do have sparring gear it's century branded foam dipped.



So now you're just looking to get the adult size now, that's why you asked about Macho vs. Century?



> I wouldn't buy gear appropriate for Muay Thai, Boxing, or MMA training, because I don't practice either of those three.



The same gear for MT, etc. works just the same and better for your tippy tappy sparring.



> You never actually answered my question, you just stated your opinion on other gears, and bashed the gear I was talking about as a whole. You are the only one in this thread who didn't understand the question. I didn't ask how foam dipped gear compared non foam dipped gear, I asked what is the better foam gear out of the 2 I mentioned, then if there was a better foam gear manufacture besides the two. I never mentioned anything about using it for a heavy bag, or muay thai, you only assumed that I thought it was for those two.



I already told you that they're bad news compared to much better gear you can buy for an extra $50. If you don't like this answer, then just move on and ignore me. I'm discussing this with more experienced people who do make good arguments that I'm interested in hearing.


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## FriedRice (Jan 22, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> I've been to enough. All of the ones I go to/have gone to have a "no ego" attitude..if it doesn't have that attitude or people there have a short temper/are super macho, I leave and dont train there.



Well if you've been to many schools than you should know that they all have this "no ego" attitude. Real life is rarely Karate Kid I's "Kobra Kai". And if you've sparred enough, you'd know that crap happens.



> If it happens at all that's more than enough.



Well you're way too pessimistic. I like to look for the good in people and give them more chances. 



> First, he never said he's a white belt..it's entirely possible he trained in a different system that uses other gloves and he now has to transition, or that he's been at that place for a while, but they have a certain amount of time they have to train before their allowed to spar (i disagree with this thinking, but it happens a lot). In either case, he'd have an idea of what kind of atmosphere the place has, and the instructor can tell him how hard they spar.
> 
> It wasn't to me, and once again the guy never stated that the school does sell them. He just said to check with the instructor in case they do, or in case the instructor has a recommendation, nothing about the instructor making money off it.
> 
> ...



I wasn't completely talking to him exclusively, in this thread.


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Can you post a quick video of how hard you can hit your heavy bag, bear knuckles? Thanks.



Why do you want a video for? Anyway I can give the video, its just going to have to wait because the bag is at the gym and today is not a gym day but a rest day.


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## jks9199 (Jan 22, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I wear no gloves on the heavy bag. It strengthens your knuckles and fist, idk why people feel the need to wear them on the heavy bag to be honest. The bag is made to be hit and doesn't need to be protected from being hit.


Depending on what I'm working on... I'll wear a standard pair of leather or cotton work gloves, just to protect the skin on my hands a bit.  Especially since my heavy bag is canvas...  Other times, I'll use bag gloves.  I might use an old pair of boxing gloves if I were to be training for a fight, because I want to build the endurance for the fight.  But not because "I punch hard."


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

jks9199 said:


> Depending on what I'm working on... I'll wear a standard pair of leather or cotton work gloves, just to protect the skin on my hands a bit.  Especially since my heavy bag is canvas...  Other times, I'll use bag gloves.  I might use an old pair of boxing gloves if I were to be training for a fight, because I want to build the endurance for the fight.  But not because "I punch hard."



Even with the canvas bag I still wore no gloves but this was my old personal one. It strengthened and toughened my skin at the cost of some blood on the bag. 

This is why I wouldn't do that at a gyms bag and for a canvas bag I wore some hand wraps. I can understand wearing gloves for endurance, the extra weight helps with that.


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## elder999 (Jan 22, 2016)

FriedRice said:


>





FriedRice said:


> Y*ou picked, probably, the 2 crappiest manufacturers of safety gear. * Shinguards should cost $40-50.  Gloves $50-70.  Headgear $50-100.  And this is for decent quality equipment. *Bringing that Macho or Century crap into, say Muay Thai...and you're going to wreck yourself or the other guy you're sparrin*g.



_What's wrong now?   _


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

elder999 said:


> _What's wrong now?   _



Looks like they are going at it pretty hard without gear. I guess that pops his mma spars harder than TMA bubble.


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## Drose427 (Jan 22, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Looks like they are going at it pretty hard without gear. I guess that pops his mma spars harder than TMA bubble.



And apparently with more respect..


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

Drose427 said:


> And apparently with more respect..



Mma athletes respect each other. At least the professional ones do. Mma is a good sport that I have respect for but sadly it's fanbase tends to be full of buffoons who think it is the best **** ever and everything else just sucks in comparison.

Then go around with an enormous chip on their shoulders.


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## Dinkydoo (Jan 22, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Looks like they are going at it pretty hard without gear. I guess that pops his mma spars harder than TMA bubble.


To be fair, this isn't sparring, this is a full contact Kyokushin competition. And if we're talking about TMA sparring, these guys tend to spar much harder than the typical TMA club. Not saying there aren't other styles out there that train like this, but it's unfortunately quite rare to find in the UK. 

Regardless, 

I'm not sure why the emphasis on MartialTalk these days is primarily around debating hard sparring. Personally speaking, I did quite a lot of hard sparring at an old club and the gains I made during that time were minimal - I got a few black eyes though. Sparring hard every session actually caused me to resent and fear that part of class, which is less than ideal for a learning environment. I now train at a place that has some pretty high level fighters training there, yet what I see mostly from them is technical sparring, with the odd hard contact session thrown in once every couple of weeks or so. Even then, the hard sparring doesn't resemble that boxing club someone posted a link to earlier; rarely is anyone sacrificing technique just to throw hard and brawl with their training partner.


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## elder999 (Jan 22, 2016)

Dinkydoo said:


> To be fair, this isn't sparring, this is a full contact Kyokushin competition. And if we're talking about TMA sparring, these guys tend to spar much harder than the typical TMA club. Not saying there aren't other styles out there that train like this, but it's unfortunately quite rare to find in the UK.
> 
> Regardless,
> 
> I'm not sure why the emphasis on MartialTalk these days is primarily around debating hard sparring. Personally speaking, I did quite a lot of hard sparring at an old club and the gains I made during that time were minimal - I got a few black eyes though. Sparring hard every session actually caused me to resent and fear that part of class, which is less than ideal for a learning environment. I now train at a place that has some pretty high level fighters training there, yet what I see mostly from them is technical sparring, with the odd hard contact session thrown in once every couple of weeks or so. Even then, the hard sparring doesn't resemble that boxing club someone posted a link to earlier; rarely is anyone sacrificing technique just to throw hard and brawl with their training partner.



I'm one  of "these guys," and have been since I was 13 years old....43 years ago....we do have varying degrees of sparring in class, but are strong believers in full-contact. Some clubs use protection - similar to the "crappiest products out there"- Macho and Century, if not, for all I know, those very products, for sparring in class..... as a kid, and young adult, we didn't spar hard every session, or even spar every session-once or twice a week, we had classes that focused entirely on fundamentals, drills and kata....


Hell, sometimes it was just kata-go figure.


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## Dinkydoo (Jan 22, 2016)

elder999 said:


> I'm one  of "these guys," and have been since I was 13 years old....43 years ago....we do have varying degrees of sparring in class, but are strong believers in full-contact. Some clubs use protection - similar to the "crappiest products out there"- Macho and Century, if not, for all I know, those very products, for sparring in class..... as a kid, and young adult, we didn't spar hard every session, or even spar every session-once or twice a week, we had classes that focused entirely on fundamentals, drills and kata....
> 
> 
> Hell, sometimes it was just kata-go figure.




For the avoidance of doubt, the second part of my previous post was not supposed to be in relation to the kyokushin video I commented on initially.

I have a lot of respect for kyokushin because somehow, despite many other traditional styles failing to do so, they appear to maintain what seems to be a healthy mixture of technique, compliant and resistant partner work within their syllabus - from school to school. 

My comments were aimed at those who believe the type of boxing sparring posted earlier should be part of your regular curriculum. Once a week training balls to the wall like that is going to result in some injuries, in my opinion.


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## hoshin1600 (Jan 22, 2016)

"Are you serious? He's a noob WHITE BELT who doesn't even have his sparring gear yet"

Um....I started training in 1978 and I don't have any sparing equipment,,,does that make me a noob?  
Friedrice....you should keep in mind that to many of us here you might be a noob too.
Your comments seem very limited in knowledge to me.
I get your point, foam gear is not for contact but for the majority of schools out there, it's what they use and not because they are trying to make a buck.


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## drop bear (Jan 22, 2016)

Danny T said:


> A boxing glove on the heavy bag won't last very long if you are a hard hitter. A training glove will last a bit longer. But if you want a long lasting glove for heavy bag work you should be using a 'Bag Glove'.



I have had no issue with boxing gloves on a bag. A good pair will last a poor pair will desintigrate.  A bag wont really mean tje difference.


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## Ironbear24 (Jan 22, 2016)

drop bear said:


> I have had no issue with boxing gloves on a bag. A good pair will last a poor pair will desintigrate.  A bag wont really mean tje difference.


Or just not use gloves and allow your fists and form to improve.


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 22, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Or just not use gloves and allow your fists and form to improve.


This is a different debate in and of itself. Whether it's good/'cost-effective' to cause the microfractions that harden your fists. I used to be all for it, and would do it myself, but over the past year or so I've noticed that a lot of members on both side of my family over 50 have arthritis. I don't know if there's been any evidence for a correlation b/w microfractions and arthritis, but it would not surprise me if there is, so I stopped doing that. I train open hand strikes a lot more now, and am perfectly willing to accept that I might have to use open handed strikes in SD, and gloves in the dojo in order to possibly help delay arthritis.


----------



## drop bear (Jan 23, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Or just not use gloves and allow your fists and form to improve.


Sagittal Band Tear "Boxer's Knuckle"

My hands dont have an issue bare knucle punching a guy in the head occasionally. They do have an issue with repeated heavy bag work.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 23, 2016)

elder999 said:


> _What's wrong now?   _




What's the big deal? No punches to the face. MMA is everything here, plus full elbows and knees to the face. In the full mount, raining full elbows down at an angle is way, way worse.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 23, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Looks like they are going at it pretty hard without gear. I guess that pops his mma spars harder than TMA bubble.



You've never seen MMA fights before? Full elbows, knees  and kicks to the face. 

They're not even punching to the face here in Kyokushin.  What's the big deal?


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 23, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> You've never seen MMA fights before? Full elbows, knees  and kicks to the face.
> 
> They're not even punching to the face here in Kyokushin.  What's the big deal?



In mma they have gear. Punches to the face are allowed here with gear on. There are different types of karate tournaments. Two most common are no gear and no punches to the face, you can still kicks though to the face.

Gear on = anything aside from hitting the neck. If you want to believe mma is the best go ahead, no one will really care if you wish to have that opinion. But when you act like it is doing something that is so unique and special, that is where you are simply wrong.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 23, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> "Are you serious? He's a noob WHITE BELT who doesn't even have his sparring gear yet"
> 
> Um....I started training in 1978 and I don't have any sparing equipment,,,does that make me a noob?
> Friedrice....you should keep in mind that to many of us here you might be a noob too.
> ...



Depends. You could have started training in 1978 and stopped 2 months later then picked back up  years later, then quit after a few months again....etc.  If you kept training since 1978, up until now and never had any sparring gear, then maybe you're just a kata master and fighting wasn't for you. So you'd be a noob at fighting probably but great at doing forms.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 23, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> In mma they have gear.



Again, have you seen an MMA fight before? What gear are you talking about that are on the elbows, knees, and feet when they throw full elbows, knees and kicks to the body, head and right in the face? Then you get to clinch and throw a 100 knees to someone's face if you wanted. Gets even worse when you full mount someone on the ground and start  raining elbows to the face.  

How is your Kyokushin video, where not even head punches are allowed, come even close to the brutality of average MMA?



> Punches to the face are allowed here with gear on.



Then why won't they put on gloves so they can punch to the face? This was why Karatekas started Kickboxing in like the 1980's....because Kyokushin was too soft for them.



> There are different types of karate tournaments. Two most common are no gear and no punches to the face, you can still kicks though to the face.



Yea and can you knee and elbow to the face like in MMA? 



> Gear on = anything aside from hitting the neck. If you want to believe mma is the best go ahead, no one will really care if you wish to have that opinion. But when you act like it is doing something that is so unique and special, that is where you are simply wrong.



MMA is way more brutal. If you wanted to get overly excited over a Kyukoshin video, then go ahead, just don't try to talk about MMA when you don't have a full understanding of it.


----------



## drop bear (Jan 23, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> What's the big deal? No punches to the face. MMA is everything here, plus full elbows and knees to the face. In the full mount, raining full elbows down at an angle is way, way worse.



Honestly they each have their dangers.


----------



## drop bear (Jan 23, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Looks like they are going at it pretty hard without gear. I guess that pops his mma spars harder than TMA bubble.



Tma should Spar hard. And should compete. They become better fighters that way.

Hence kyokkushin.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 23, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Then why won't they put on gloves so they can punch to the face? This was why Karatekas started Kickboxing in like the 1980's....because Kyokushin was too soft for them.



Check your history, you're off by a bit.  1974 the PKA was formed, kickboxing was already in play by then.



> MMA is way more brutal. If you wanted to get overly excited over a Kyukoshin video, then go ahead, just don't try to talk about MMA when you don't have a full understanding of it.



Can I?  I've trained and corned amateur and pro fighters.

Neither are really more brutal, just different.  Kyokushin is rough, the goal is to knock your opponent down and in a fairly short time period.  It's fast and furious, you can't clinch or takedown if you get in trouble.  The feeling out period isn't there.  Not to mention the truly crazy crap like the 100 man kumite.  

MMA has the most inclusive ruleset perhaps, but that doesn't mean other arts aren't as brutal.


----------



## drop bear (Jan 23, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> Check your history, you're off by a bit.  1974 the PKA was formed, kickboxing was already in play by then.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The other issue with kyokkushin is it is a rulset that leans towards throwing big kicks. These equally expose you to risk and deal high damage. So it is a high risk high reward style fight.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 23, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> In mma they have gear. Punches to the face are allowed here with gear on. There are different types of karate tournaments. Two most common are no gear and no punches to the face, you can still kicks though to the face.



Gloves and wraps are to protect the fighters hands more then anything, and to keep it looking more civilized from less cuts.

Back when gloves weren't used fighters often came out with broken hands, so a lot started wearing them before they where required so that they could hit harder without wrecking their hand on someones skull.  

Kinda the same reason pre-Marquis of Queensbury rules boxing looked a bit different, modern fighters train with gloves as hand protection so they can hit harder without breaking their hands.  That and your face would look pretty rough and get you some interesting looks at work the next day without them in sparring


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 23, 2016)

drop bear said:


> The other issue with kyokkushin is it is a rulset that leans towards throwing big kicks. These equally expose you to risk and deal high damage. So it is a high risk high reward style fight.



It's a painful ruleset


----------



## Drose427 (Jan 23, 2016)

drop bear said:


> The other issue with kyokkushin is it is a rulset that leans towards throwing big kicks. These equally expose you to risk and deal high damage. So it is a high risk high reward style fight.



This is true but it also forces you to learn proper set up and angles,

which is something even high level MMA fighters miss out on.

Just about every UFC has a handful of non-MT kicks that are thrown just all around poorly with zero set up, and in just about every UFC someone pays for it

Rule sets like kyokushin force you to learn those things, so when you step into other formats its already ingrained


----------



## Danny T (Jan 23, 2016)

Drose427 said:


> This is true but it also forces you to learn proper set up and angles,
> 
> which is something even high level MMA fighters miss out on.
> 
> ...


Agreed.
I know of several pro mma fighters who also compete in kyokushin tournaments because it makes their full contact skills better. I have a Dutch style Muay Thai pro who comes in to train with us a couple times a month and to do some sparring who claims it takes him longer to recover from a kyokushin tournament than any Glory tournament he has every participated in. Know some who only fought once or twice and quit because they found it tougher on their bodies than mma. 
For one they have to engage. They can not run as a part of their defense and can not just cover up as a defense, they have to engage. And because there is no punching to the head the body takes a lot more hits so there is a great accumulation of damage on the body. MMA is a tough sport but don't discount Kyokushin.


----------



## drop bear (Jan 23, 2016)

Drose427 said:


> This is true but it also forces you to learn proper set up and angles,
> 
> which is something even high level MMA fighters miss out on.
> 
> ...



Yeah.  I have sparred kk. I like pitting myself against different styles just to play with their mechanics.  I find it help to understand mine. 

It is like looking at different patterns.


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 23, 2016)

drop bear said:


> Yeah.  I have sparred kk. I like pitting myself against different styles just to play with their mechanics.  I find it help to understand mine.
> 
> It is like looking at different patterns.



That is a sign of a good mma fighter. Someone who understands what the term mixed martial arts means. To train in a different  variations of martial arts and respect them for their strengths rather than look down on them and consider them all inferior.


----------



## elder999 (Jan 23, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> What's the big deal? No punches to the face. MMA is everything here, plus full elbows and knees to the face. In the full mount, raining full elbows down at an angle is way, way worse.


There is just no reasoning with some people at all......


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 23, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Again, have you seen an MMA fight before? What gear are you talking about that are on the elbows, knees, and feet when they throw full elbows, knees and kicks to the body, head and right in the face? Then you get to clinch and throw a 100 knees to someone's face if you wanted. Gets even worse when you full mount someone on the ground and start  raining elbows to the face.
> 
> How is your Kyokushin video, where not even head punches are allowed, come even close to the brutality of average MMA?
> 
> ...



Yes you can elbow and throw knees and do you have any source in your claim that karatekas did kick boxing because kyokyushin was too soft? Or is that just more ********? I understand mma very well and have beaten people in sparring mathces who think they are all bad because they took 2 months of lessons from a random mma class.

There is nothing that is exclusive to mma that you won't find in literally any other martial art, karate tournaments allow all strikes aside from neck strikes. Mma does the same thing. The only real difference is the lack of head gear in mma and even then gloves are worn anyway and. As I said before gloves on = hits to the head ok, gloves off = Punch to the head not ok. Mma is the same thing, gloves are worn and they are mandatory.

It is very clear you have a bias for mma because you have a big boner for it. In your eyes mma has zero flaws and is invincible compared to everything else even though you obviously know little to nothing about what's beyond your octagonal box.

Oh and when anyone disagrees with you, then they are simply just a noob and never been in a fight before. Pretty much this is your train of thought. How old are you? My guess is 16. Must be awesome to know everything in your short time on this planet.


----------



## Tez3 (Jan 24, 2016)

What many people forget is that MMA is TMA, there's nothing new in MMA. The 'newness' is arguably that it's all the martial arts being done in the same fight. I say arguably because many will say that it's been done before.
I love MMA as much as I love TMA because when you come down to it it's part and parcel of the same thing ...martial arts. The majority of real MMA people as with TMA people are respectful and humble, always willing to learn more, to expand their knowledge, it's such a shame that the fanboys spoil it and cause divisions where there needs  be none.
I hope the OP isn't going to be put off after spending a few days here and a less than pleasant reception, this isn't how the majority of people here are.


----------



## Azulx (Jan 24, 2016)

Tez3 said:


> I hope the OP isn't going to be put off after spending a few days here and a less than pleasant reception, this isn't how the majority of people here are.



I do not judge an entire group of people by the actions of one buffoon. For every example of immaturity and buffoonery Fried Rice exhibited, there were 10 times more responses with actual useful information. Anyone who calls people noobs, and says they "wreck" people, has to be around the age of 15, or his MA experience came from the UFC video game. He also stated that his "friend" smashed his head into a concrete wall, that could explain things as well.


----------



## Tez3 (Jan 24, 2016)

Azulx said:


> I do not judge an entire group of people by the actions of one buffoon. For every example of immaturity and buffoonery Fried Rice exhibited, there were 10 times more responses with actual useful information. Anyone who calls people noobs, and says they "wreck" people, has to be around the age of 15, or his MA experience came from the UFC video game. He also stated that his "friend" smashed his head into a concrete wall, that could explain things as well.



I'm so pleased you see it like that, this is a good place with some very knowledgeable people who are also pretty cool, we have a laugh here too, some silly fun posts as well as the serious stuff, please stick around, you will add to this place for sure.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Yes you can elbow and throw knees



You are ignorant of Kyokushin rules. There's no elbow nor knees to the head. Or did you want to show me where they allow this. Here are 2 organizations banning such techniques.

kyokushin kumite rules
Sosai Masutatsu Oyama - Kyokushin Karate Tournament Rules



> and do you have any source in your claim that karatekas did kick boxing because kyokyushin was too soft?



Karatekas told me. They didn't have the internet back then to talk about it. But obviously, Kickboxers punched to the face and that's what the Karatekas wanted.



> Or is that just more ********? I understand mma very well



I don't think you do since you think that Kyokushin is anywhere close to the brutality of MMA.

[/QUOTE] and have beaten people in sparring mathces who think they are all bad because they took 2 months of lessons from a random mma class.  [/QUOTE]

You just admit beating some guy with only 2 months of MMA training. What's so great about this?



> There is nothing that is exclusive to mma that you won't find in literally any other martial art, karate tournaments allow all strikes aside from neck strikes.  Mma does the same thing.



Show me 5 videos of any other Martial Art tournament where they allow someone to get repeated elbows to the face while they're downed to the ground.



> The only real difference is the lack of head gear in mma and even then gloves are worn anyway and.



Are there gloves on elbows and knees when they are landing repeatedly into a guy's head? MMA only wear thin gloves, a cup and mouthguard compared to most other MA tournament that wears a ton of safety gear, resembling a full dogbite suit and motorcycle helmet.



> As I said before gloves on = hits to the head ok, gloves off = Punch to the head not ok. Mma is the same thing, gloves are worn and they are mandatory.



Then show me some videos of Kyokushin fights where punches to the head with gloves are allowed and where ELBOWS & KNEES to the head are allowed.



> It is very clear you have a bias for mma because you have a big boner for it. In your eyes mma has zero flaws and is invincible compared to everything else even though you obviously know little to nothing about what's beyond your octagonal box.



You just made this up. I only argue that MMA is way more realistic and way more brutal than all TMA tournaments.



> Oh and when anyone disagrees with you, then they are simply just a noob and never been in a fight before. Pretty much this is your train of thought. How old are you? My guess is 16. Must be awesome to know everything in your short time on this planet.



Incorrect. It's when they disagree and make strange statements like you did, such as saying that prizefighters such as Mayweather and Pacquaio were holding back their full power because it was only a tournament.....for $180,000,000 and $120,000,000 split + worldwide fame and glory... And I wish I was 16. Being young is way better than being old, decaying and closer to death.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

elder999 said:


> There is just no reasoning with some people at all......


 
I feel the same way


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Azulx said:


> I do not judge an entire group of people by the actions of one buffoon. For every example of immaturity and buffoonery Fried Rice exhibited, there were 10 times more responses with actual useful information. Anyone who calls people noobs, and says they "wreck" people, has to be around the age of 15, or his MA experience came from the UFC video game. He also stated that his "friend" smashed his head into a concrete wall, that could explain things as well.



What a big list of complaints


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 24, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> You are ignorant of Kyokushin rules. There's no elbow nor knees to the head. Or did you want to show me where they allow this. Here are 2 organizations banning such techniques.
> 
> kyokushin kumite rules
> Sosai Masutatsu Oyama - Kyokushin Karate Tournament Rules
> ...


 and have beaten people in sparring mathces who think they are all bad because they took 2 months of lessons from a random mma class.  [/QUOTE]

You just admit beating some guy with only 2 months of MMA training. What's so great about this?



Show me 5 videos of any other Martial Art tournament where they allow someone to get repeated elbows to the face while they're downed to the ground.



Are there gloves on elbows and knees when they are landing repeatedly into a guy's head? MMA only wear thin gloves, a cup and mouthguard compared to most other MA tournament that wears a ton of safety gear, resembling a full dogbite suit and motorcycle helmet.



Then show me some videos of Kyokushin fights where punches to the head with gloves are allowed and where ELBOWS & KNEES to the head are allowed.



You just made this up. I only argue that MMA is way more realistic and way more brutal than all TMA tournaments.



Incorrect. It's when they disagree and make strange statements like you did, such as saying that prizefighters such as Mayweather and Pacquaio were holding back their full power because it was only a tournament.....for $180,000,000 and $120,000,000 split + worldwide fame and glory... And I wish I was 16. Being young is way better than being old, decaying and closer to death.[/QUOTE]

Ok so people you know have done it. Well the the thing is your word holds no value to me so that claim holds no water.

Sounds to me like you never heard of Muay Thai. Which is believe it or not a traditional martial art and has existed long before UFC. They use elbows and knees very often.


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> You just admit beating some guy with only 2 months of MMA training. What's so great about this?



I'm not saying it to brag about it. I'm saying it because I am making a point. The point is you sound exactly word for word like these people who think mma is the best **** ever and everything else just sucks when compared to it. 

They go around acting like they are the best and have the biggest chip on their shoulders while at the same time being disrespectful to every more traditional martial artist out there.

You are giving mma which is a great sport a bad name by promoting this type of behavior.


----------



## Tez3 (Jan 24, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> What a big list of complaints




_Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength._


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I'm not saying it to brag about it. I'm saying it because I am making a point. The point is you sound exactly word for word like these people who think mma is the best **** ever and everything else just sucks when compared to it.



To be fair, that comes from all sides, not just MMA fans.  MMA Fans are perhaps the worst though, actual practitioners are a little more in line with the loud mouths in other styles


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 24, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> To be fair, that comes from all sides, not just MMA fans.  MMA Fans are perhaps the worst though, actual practitioners are a little more in line with the loud mouths in other styles



I never see anyone going around proclaiming x style is the best and you are a moron for doing anything different. I only see this from UFC fanboys.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I never see anyone going around proclaiming x style is the best and you are a moron for doing anything different. I only see this from UFC fanboys.



"Sparring is for sport, we train for real life and the stuff we do is to brutal for sparring"

"TKD is just watered down karate for kids"

"Shotokan is just watered down version of Okinawa Karate for kids"

"Wearing gloves gives you a false sense of safety, we train bareknuckle"

"Real fights are brutal and use improvised weapons and are rarely one-on-one, anyone that doesn't train for this is lying to themselves"

"Boxing is a real sport, MMA is just guys rolling around on the ground"

"Violence is not the martial way, Aikido teaches peace"

"Pressure points can be used to subdue or control an opponent, sometimes without even touching them.  Any style that teaches nothing but blunt force is missing the real secrets"

Never heard any comments along those lines?


----------



## Ironbear24 (Jan 24, 2016)

Ok sure. I'll admit that is often said, but nowhere near as often as "mma is best martial art because it is the most brutal and bloody compared to everything else."



Andrew Green said:


> "Wearing gloves gives you a false sense of safety, we train bareknuckle"



I have actually said this myself. In fact someone on the forum said they don't believe I can hit a heavy bag hard with a "bear fist" so I am going to upload a video to prove them I can.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> Ok sure. I'll admit that is often said, but nowhere near as often as "mma is best martial art because it is the most brutal and bloody compared to everything else."



That is usually not practitioners, but fans.  Fans in professional sports should never be taken seriously, it's entertainment.  It should be taken as seriously as a fan proclaiming a football team sucks and they could be a better coach then the one at the game.



> I have actually said this myself. In fact someone on the forum said they don't believe I can hit a heavy bag hard with a "bear fist" so I am going to upload a video to prove them I can.



Please, please do it wearing a bear paw on your hand if that's what was asked for and not a "bare" fist 

Beyond that people are gullible, and believe weird things. I've heard people that claim to be martial artists claim far stranger things them a person can't hit a bag bare fisted.  

I might agree that a person probably shouldn't do it regularly for long periods of time, and perhaps the banana phone led to a claim like that turning into it being impossible?


----------



## jks9199 (Jan 24, 2016)

The "my art is best" line, in whatever variant is common.  Maybe stated a little more eloquently sometimes in the more traditional clubs, but it's still the same line.  That said, what I have seen as more common among BJJ and MMA (and most especially among BJJ-based MMA folks) is the near derision aimed at anything else.  There's a particular subset that seems to refuse to accept that just maybe some tried and tested training methods that have endured for centuries might still have some merit.  But it is only a small subset.  By no means is it all...  

Something else I've noticed is a tendency on the internet to lock horns, and lock in a position... and refuse to back off of it.  

But, guys and gals, I'm not exactly sure what any of this has to do with whether Macho or Century has better products...  assuming you're going to use them for light to medium contact sparring.  As I've said, I like Macho better.  I think they use a better quality foam, and thicker vinyl cladding.  I also like that their Dyna line has closed finger spaces.  But I haven't had to buy either in a while, so things may have changed a bit.  I've also simply found Macho an easier company to deal with in my own experiences.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Tez3 said:


> _Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength._



You're just biased.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I never see anyone going around proclaiming x style is the best and you are a moron for doing anything different. I only see this from UFC fanboys.



Are you at all familiar with the Asian culture that created most of the Martial Arts? It's very much about which style is the best and that's what the UFC was mainly about when it was first created.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Ironbear24 said:


> I'm not saying it to brag about it. I'm saying it because I am making a point. The point is you sound exactly word for word like these people who think mma is the best **** ever and everything else just sucks when compared to it.
> 
> They go around acting like they are the best and have the biggest chip on their shoulders while at the same time being disrespectful to every more traditional martial artist out there.
> 
> You are giving mma which is a great sport a bad name by promoting this type of behavior.




Bragging? I should hope that you're not bragging about beating someone who only had 2 months of MMA training. 

And show me where I said that everything else sucks? You're making things up again.


----------



## FriedRice (Jan 24, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> "Sparring is for sport, we train for real life and the stuff we do is to brutal for sparring"
> 
> "TKD is just watered down karate for kids"
> 
> ...





OMG  did IronBear24 say all of this?


----------



## hoshin1600 (Jan 24, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Are you at all familiar with the Asian culture that created most of the Martial Arts? It's very much about which style is the best and that's what the UFC was mainly about when it was first created.


actually the first UFC contests were about the Gracies promoting their art.  it was almost a fixed fight, that Royce was going to win.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

FriedRice said:


> Are you at all familiar with the Asian culture that created most of the Martial Arts? It's very much about which style is the best and that's what the UFC was mainly about when it was first created.




Are you?  Or are you familiar with Kung Fu movies?


----------



## hoshin1600 (Jan 24, 2016)

just a comment on that bare knuckle bag punching_.    _canvas is very rough on the skin. there are softer bags out there with a different material.  the heavier the bag the more its going to damage your skin.  your supposed to be hitting the lower 3rd of the bag.  so when you say you hit a bag with no wrap or glove i will question you on these three things, are you using a pro boxer brand canvas bag, heavier than 80 pounds and are you hitting the lower third of the bag???  if no then it doesn't impress me, if yes then it doesn't impress me, your going to end up with messed up looking hands as you get older.


----------



## Hanzou (Jan 24, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> actually the first UFC contests were about the Gracies promoting their art.  it was almost a fixed fight, that Royce was going to win.



LoL! People actually still believe this?

The Gracies had no guarantees that they were going to win. Royce could have gotten beaten by any of the guys he fought. He was simply the better martial artist.

Everyone who was involved in the first UFCs have stated plainly that nothing was fixed or pre-planned. If they were truly trying to swing the tourney in their favor, it would have been Rickson out there, and Ken Shamrock wouldn't have been on the roster.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> just a comment on that bare knuckle bag punching_.    _canvas is very rough on the skin. there are softer bags out there with a different material.  the heavier the bag the more its going to damage your skin.  your supposed to be hitting the lower 3rd of the bag.  so when you say you hit a bag with no wrap or glove i will question you on these three things, are you using a pro boxer brand canvas bag, heavier than 80 pounds and are you hitting the lower third of the bag???  if no then it doesn't impress me, if yes then it doesn't impress me, your going to end up with messed up looking hands as you get older.



Try telling that to a Thai fighter...

Some bags maybe, but not all.  Not even in pro boxing gyms.


----------



## hoshin1600 (Jan 24, 2016)

telling what to a thai fighter?  not sure what your objecting to in my post.


----------



## Azulx (Jan 24, 2016)

jks9199 said:


> But, guys and gals, I'm not exactly sure what any of this has to do with whether Macho or Century has better products... assuming you're going to use them for light to medium contact sparring. As I've said, I like Macho better. I think they use a better quality foam, and thicker vinyl cladding. I also like that their Dyna line has closed finger spaces. But I haven't had to buy either in a while, so things may have changed a bit. I've also simply found Macho an easier company to deal with in my own experiences.



Thank You. We have never done business with Macho, but you aren't the first person to mention about the better foam and vinyl material. I may have to talk to my instructor about trying Macho, instead of Century for a set. This would allow to see if we should make the transfer from manufacturers.


----------



## Buka (Jan 24, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> actually the first UFC contests were about the Gracies promoting their art.  it was almost a fixed fight, that Royce was going to win.



My brother....read _Is This Legal? by _Art Davie. I have first person knowledge of this. It's spot on.

And it's a great read. No foolin'.


----------



## Andrew Green (Jan 24, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> telling what to a thai fighter?  not sure what your objecting to in my post.



To only hit the bottom third of the bag


----------



## drop bear (Jan 25, 2016)

There is a difference between surviving an impact and surviving multiple impacts. I have seen boxers do a round bare knuckle on the bag. But if they have to do ten rounds every day they seem to suffer from cumulative wear.

I have also seen muay Thai guys fight bare knuckle and fight with mma gloves and it does not seem to effect them much


----------



## crazydiamond (Jan 25, 2016)

My school sells 1)Title and Revgear for adults 2) Century foam gear for the kids.

I did buy my daughter a pair or Revgear gloves however.

For myself I like ringside, title and revgear. I try to buy the real leather items from these sources.  These companies can have some nice sales and clearance from time to time. I got a leather pair of bag gloves for 12 bucks once so I don't wear down my boxing gloves hitting the bag at home, plus I like the thinner weight.


----------



## jks9199 (Jan 25, 2016)

Azulx said:


> Thank You. We have never done business with Macho, but you aren't the first person to mention about the better foam and vinyl material. I may have to talk to my instructor about trying Macho, instead of Century for a set. This would allow to see if we should make the transfer from manufacturers.


They do wholesale accounts, which can reduce the cost a fair degree, as well. 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## Azulx (Jan 25, 2016)

jks9199 said:


> They do wholesale accounts, which can reduce the cost a fair degree, as well.



Yeah, we have wholesale on both of them.Just trying to decide who to stick with.


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## hoshin1600 (Jan 25, 2016)

Andrew Green said:


> To only hit the bottom third of the bag


you are mis-interpreting what i was saying.  if you look at a boxing gym the bags are hung higher than many people do. there are no kicks in boxing.  the physical make up of an Everlast bag is shredded fabric with bags of sand at the bottom.  so what i was saying is that a heavier bag means more sand and if you are hitting the bottom third rather than the top of the bag where there are no sand bags, then you are hitting a more dense and harder section of the heavy bag and thus will do more damage to your hand.
geeezze   i figured all this would be self evident to people that hit bags all the time. i didnt think i would have to spell it all out.


----------



## Tez3 (Jan 25, 2016)

hoshin1600 said:


> you are mis-interpreting what i was saying.  if you look at a boxing gym the bags are hung higher than many people do. there are no kicks in boxing.  the physical make up of an Everlast bag is shredded fabric with bags of sand at the bottom.  so what i was saying is that a heavier bag means more sand and if you are hitting the bottom third rather than the top of the bag where there are no sand bags, then you are hitting a more dense and harder section of the heavy bag and thus will do more damage to your hand.
> geeezze   i figured all this would be self evident to people that hit bags all the time. i didnt think i would have to spell it all out.



Well the reason you have to explain it to people is that most people...as you said...don't hang their bags as boxers do and wouldn't know. Your post has answered itself.


----------



## Tong Po (Jan 30, 2016)

Azulx,

In my opinion I have always had better luck with Macho gear. It just seems to hold up a little better and kinda fit better. There is also Pro Force Lightning which is a brand that is sold by Asian World of Martial Arts (awma.com) it's basically the lowest quality of the three and geared more for entry level.

I understand that you only use foam dipped and our school is basically the same.  However if it's allowed you can check out gloves from such brands as Top Ten Karate, Hayabusa, etc that aren't exactly foam dipped but are a step up in quality and last much longer.  These are still geared towards the point fighter type style of sparring and not a kickboxing/Thai boxing/MMA style. Ringstar kicks which are like a padded sneaker were in vogue for awhile too. I'm just getting back into things after a 5 year hiatus so I'm not sure of everything else that might be out there.

Hope it helps!


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## drop bear (Jan 31, 2016)

Shoot boxing gloves look similar but are made better.


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