# Damn knee - or how to get Xue to listen to you if you are an MD



## Xue Sheng (Jan 29, 2010)

My Knee&#8230;. Still

Well here is the deal and this is why I pick doctors that know how to talk to me

What I was told after talking about what I had been doing and getting my knee checked and drained&#8230; again

Shut-up, sit down, elevate it ice it and don&#8217;t lift stuff or crawl under desks or do anything else if you want it to get better&#8230; and do this for 1 or better yet 2 weeks and even after that DO NOT resume my normal activities for another week or two. I have re-injured it, at least once and I am on the edge of giving myself a trick knee and if I want a trick knee or to have to get stuff that is a bit more invasive that draining done then keep on doing what I have been doing and call him again when I can&#8217;t walk.

He was a bit annoyed with me and it is the &#8220;Shut-up and sit down&#8221; bits I tend to appreciate and listen to from a doc so I do believe I will listen.

Although I thought I was since I was not training.. who knew moving desks, chairs, kitchen sets, ping pong tables was a problem&#8230; who knew that my work were I have had to crawl under desks and on the floor to set up PCs or lifting PCs and servers was a problem&#8230; apparently not me&#8230;. Actually&#8230; I did&#8230; but stuff needed to get done so I did it and in a few of those case if I didn&#8217;t my wife would have and she would have hurt herself so I figured better me than her.

Oh well&#8230; unless I want to get a beating from my MD the next time I go see him I guess I will be spending the next couple of weeks with my leg elevated with a cold knee&#8230;. I can at least walk without the cane or crutches but only when necessary&#8230;.. this will not be easy.

I guess it is a good time to buy those 3 Xingyiquan books I have been wanting to by.

Edit:

These are the books 

1) XingYi Linked Fist by Li Cunyi
2) Henan Orthodox Xing Yi Chuan by Pei Xi Rong & Li Ying-Ang
3) XingYi Zha Shi Chui & Ba Shi Chuan by Jiang Rong-Jiao

And I just found this one so I guess it is 4 books... 

4) The Science of Internal Strength by Zhang Nai Qi


----------



## Drac (Jan 29, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> Oh well unless I want to get a beating from my MD the next time I go see him I guess I will be spending the next couple of weeks with my leg elevated with a cold knee. I can at least walk without the cane or crutches but only when necessary.. this will not be easy.


 
Finding an MD that will listen and not surgar coat everything is a wonderful and rare thing..When I injuried by back last year my Doctor gave me a real good speech.." Listen, this is NOT going to go away..You are not 20, 30, or 40 anymore, you will have to be careful or you could make it worse..Do you really want back surgery??? Trust me you dont..


----------



## Xue Sheng (Jan 29, 2010)

Yup that is what I need from an MD

This is the same doc I had for my back years ago, he was the 3rd for my back,  and the one I stuck with because he told me pretty much the same thing. Keep doing what you are doing and spend a life not walking or in surgery.. and you dont want surgery. Listen to what he was telling me and I will get better... not 100% but better.

I just can't figure out why he took it so easy on me last time... he must have forgotten what I was like :EG:


----------



## Brian R. VanCise (Jan 29, 2010)

Hey Xue a little break will do you good and if you have some excellent reading then it will make the time go very quickly!  I hate injuries but as I get older they seem to be more plentiful.   Still if we listen to our bodies and our doctor's advice maybe when we are really old we will still be training!!!


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 10, 2010)

Man I had to check this post to see how long it has been since I was told to sit down and shut up. I was certain it had bee about 3 weeks.. but much to my surprise it has not been quite 2 weeks yet.

Well so far I am behavingpretty much.... :uhohh:... as long as I don't include some of the light exercises I did this morning since I was convinced it was about 3 weeks.

I am however a bit afraid that I will get use to this doing nothing and continue to do so even after the knee is better. But then since I had convinced myself that it just HAD to be 3 weeks by now and I was all set to go to my basement and start working on forms againmaybe I dont need to be afraid of that after all

Well this sucks :disgust:  not quite 2 weeks so no forms tonight I guess

Well it looks like it is more cold knee time for me :disgust:


----------



## terryl965 (Feb 10, 2010)

Xue sometimes we need to relize we are not young anymore and it takes alot longer to heal, so listen to your DR. and stay off the knee for as long as it takes.


----------



## Touch Of Death (Feb 10, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> My Knee. Still
> 
> Well here is the deal and this is why I pick doctors that know how to talk to me
> 
> ...


Do you feel tension in your lead leg when stepping through?
Sean


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 10, 2010)

terryl965 said:


> Xue sometimes we need to relize we are not young anymore and it takes alot longer to heal, so listen to your DR. and stay off the knee for as long as it takes.


 
I'm being good :angel: ... for a change



Touch Of Death said:


> Do you feel tension in your lead leg when stepping through?
> Sean


 
Actually I felt pain if I tried to move. I could hold the posture but I could not get out of it. But then it got so I could not bend it without a WHOLE lot of tension. Hence it got drained.

Currently I am doing nothing so I do not know how it will feel if I do the form. All I can say is at the moment I have a bit of discomfort just below the knee cap on the outside edge of the knee... butit bends easily and I can walk on it with no problems... time for more ice


----------



## grydth (Feb 10, 2010)

At last year's physical, I got the admonition to be a lot more active or expect to become completely inactive a lot sooner than I'd like. A good part of that activity has been MA workouts..... and at last visit with exercise and meds, my blood pressure was down 42 on top and 30 on bottom, back in the normal range. Thanks to that doctor I feel like a new person.

Of course, there are exceptions. Years back my mother asked me to talk with dad about his hearing loss; she thought he was too tough to admit he was getting older and needed a hearing aid. The conversation in his workshop went this way....

Me: "Mom's concerned your hearing may be going a little bit."
Dad just grunted.
Me " Maybe you should at least have the hearing tests..."
Dad just grunted.
Me "Mom's worried.... she says you can't hear when she's yelling for you"
Dad just smiled. Big smile.

True story.


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

first let me say this about trees... I hate them... I hate them all 

ARRRRRGH!!!! :tantrum:
Damn tree limb the size of a small tree fell in my front yard and I had to cut it up to move it. And in the process the damn thing shifted and one of the smaller branches on the limb (about 3 inches in diameter) shifted and whacked me RIGHT in the knee...:flammad: nooooooooooo it couldn't hit the good knee it just HAD to hit the one that I have been having trouble with, that was actually getting a WHOLE lot better and today...yup it is swelling up again...never...I mean absolutely NEVER trust a tree.

When I get better...and I will... I am going to renew my tree beating efforts and pound the living daylights out of EVERY SINGLE TREE I SEE. :disgust:

DAMN!! Not even when I am being good can I get this stupid thing better.


----------



## Brian R. VanCise (Feb 16, 2010)

Xue I am with you in that I feel every tree needs a good beating.


----------



## Brian R. VanCise (Feb 16, 2010)

In the mean time rest that knee up!


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> In the mean time rest that knee up!


 
That's what I was TRYING to do.. but the trees...they just won't let me


----------



## terryl965 (Feb 16, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> That's what I was TRYING to do.. but the trees...they just won't let me


 

You and those damm tree's just let them be OK then...


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

terryl965 said:


> You and those damm tree's just let them be OK then...


 
I would like too...but they taunt me so :EG:


----------



## Dirty Dog (Feb 16, 2010)

One of the things I learned years ago is not to talk medical to patients. Use plain and simple English and examples they can relate to. I don't tell a smoker with bronchitis that if they persist they'll develop COPD. I tell them "If you won't stop smoking, you need to get used to feeling like this, because this is what your breathing will be like on a *good* day. And lugging your oxygen around all the time makes it really difficult to carry your grandchild." "If you won't wear your seatbelt, at least sign your organ donor card." "You don't think you need a helmet? See, we are pretty good at lots of things. If you break your arm, we can probably fix it. If you break your leg, we can probably fix it. If you break your brain... you're getting coloring books for christmas for the rest of your life. Hopefully you will be able to color, and not just sit there drooling on them."

Xue, your knee may well never heal fully. When it's healed as well as it's going to, you need to protect it. You ought to wear a knee brace. Not one of the cheapy ones, but a *good* one. And you may find it necessary to modify techniques and kata slightly to prevent reinjury. 

I'm in the same boat. I'll never do as well as others in forms. Because my left eye is just a piece of plastic, I modify left foot forward stances and techniques slightly so as to be able to see my opponent. I do this knowing that my scores on belt tests will always suffer for it. But I don't train for scores. I train for life.


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

Dirty Dog said:


> One of the things I learned years ago is not to talk medical to patients. Use plain and simple English and examples they can relate to. I don't tell a smoker with bronchitis that if they persist they'll develop COPD. I tell them "If you won't stop smoking, you need to get used to feeling like this, because this is what your breathing will be like on a *good* day. And lugging your oxygen around all the time makes it really difficult to carry your grandchild." "If you won't wear your seatbelt, at least sign your organ donor card." "You don't think you need a helmet? See, we are pretty good at lots of things. If you break your arm, we can probably fix it. If you break your leg, we can probably fix it. If you break your brain... you're getting coloring books for christmas for the rest of your life. Hopefully you will be able to color, and not just sit there drooling on them."


 
But what does this have to do with trees being out to get me 



Dirty Dog said:


> Xue, your knee may well never heal fully. When it's healed as well as it's going to, you need to protect it. You ought to wear a knee brace. Not one of the cheapy ones, but a *good* one. And you may find it necessary to modify techniques and kata slightly to prevent reinjury.


 
I asked my MD about a brace and he told me no. But it could be as good as it gets...time will tell


----------



## Dirty Dog (Feb 16, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> But what does this have to do with trees being out to get me


 
 Nothing. Maybe you were a (bad) druid in another life? Or a logger?



Xue Sheng said:


> I asked my MD about a brace and he told me no. But it could be as good as it gets...time will tell


 
Good. That means it's likely he's found no evidence of injury to the tendons and ligaments in the knee. Soft tissue injuries heal more completely.


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

Dirty Dog said:


> Nothing. Maybe you were a (bad) druid in another life? Or a logger?


 
Actually I worked on a tree farm in this life...and they started it by jumping me (fell on me).... of course all the trees I cut down before that don't count 



Dirty Dog said:


> Good. That means it's likely he's found no evidence of injury to the tendons and ligaments in the knee. Soft tissue injuries heal more completely.


 
Thanks.

I am hoping it recovers... however he has had to drain it twice so far and form the way it feels at the moment we may be going for #3. But based on my last visit I could be in for a beating 

My plans tonight for my knee...ice...lots and lots of ice...


----------



## Flea (Feb 16, 2010)

Drac said:


> Finding an MD that will listen and not surgar coat everything is a wonderful and rare thing..



Funny, I'm just the opposite.  When I look for a new doctor I give them a rather snarky interview, including "_You_ work for _me_.  You give advice and *I *make the decisions."  If they flinch at that, I'm out the door.

Of course, there is a lot of arrogance in this particular specialty.  You can't afford to give an inch or they grab all the ground they can get.  Learned that the hard way.

Best of wishes for your knee, Xue, and I'm glad you like your doctor.


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 16, 2010)

Flea said:


> Funny, I'm just the opposite. When I look for a new doctor I give them a rather snarky interview, including "_You_ work for _me_. You give advice and *I *make the decisions." If they flinch at that, I'm out the door.


 
Don't get me wrong I am of the opinion that they work for me since I am paying them and I make the final decisions, I am not going there to be ordered around, lied to or placated. I tend to like the guys that I go to for medical stuff because they are rather blunt and very honest (one is even an MAist). 


It is just every now and then I need to be told exactly what I am doing wrong... basically I need to be told I am being an idiot and if I don't want to listen then why show up and waste my money and both mine and the doctors time without that every now and then I have a tendency not to listen and go about my usual routine thinking I can work through this. I truly like that attitude from a doctor. I like blunt honesty not sugar coated crap. That is what I am talking about


----------



## teekin (Feb 21, 2010)

Dirty Dog said:


> One of the things I learned years ago is not to talk medical to patients. Use plain and simple English and examples they can relate to. I don't tell a smoker with bronchitis that if they persist they'll develop COPD. I tell them "If you won't stop smoking, you need to get used to feeling like this, because this is what your breathing will be like on a *good* day. And lugging your oxygen around all the time makes it really difficult to carry your grandchild." "If you won't wear your seatbelt, at least sign your organ donor card." "*You don't think you need a helmet? See, we are pretty good at lots of things. If you break your arm, we can probably fix it. If you break your leg, we can probably fix it. If you break your brain... you're getting coloring books for christmas for the rest of your life. Hopefully you will be able to color, and not just sit there drooling on them."*
> 
> Xue, your knee may well never heal fully. When it's healed as well as it's going to, you need to protect it. You ought to wear a knee brace. Not one of the cheapy ones, but a *good* one. And you may find it necessary to modify techniques and kata slightly to prevent reinjury.
> 
> I'm in the same boat. I'll never do as well as others in forms. Because my left eye is just a piece of plastic, I modify left foot forward stances and techniques slightly so as to be able to see my opponent. I do this knowing that my scores on belt tests will always suffer for it. But I don't train for scores. I train for life.


 
I like you! Will you be my Friend?:angel:
lori


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 21, 2010)

Based on some thinking and Dirty Dog's post I have decided I need a second opinion. My MD, for 20 years, has been spot on in every single diagnosis, and he may be here as well, but I am thinking that it is possible that he is not. Nothing against him or his knowledge and skill it is just he like everyone else is human and can make a mistake from time to time.

Also after much self pity and feeling sorry for myself due to my complete lack of ability to train like I want due t my damn knee and the associated weight gain I am experiencing I have finally figured out some sort of training that will not hurt me.

I am going to be training zhan zhuang until I feel my knee is strong enough to handle Ba Duan Jin. If and when I get to the point that ba duan jin is not a problem I will then get back to Santi Shi and I will throw in Chen style Chan Si Gong 

And if after the second opinion and the above training all goes well then I will decide how to proceed in my training

As for other training all I appear to be able to do, that does not effect this knee are full sit-ups. I can't do bent knee so full sit-ups it is. And I will likely get back into some dumbbell work. I said I would do that before but somewhere between the first knee draining, reinjury and the second knee draining I let it get to me, got a bit depressed and stopped


----------



## Blade96 (Feb 21, 2010)

probably a little off topic but i just wanted to say I like the dr strangelove reference in your topic title :angel:


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 26, 2010)

Blade96 said:


> probably a little off topic but i just wanted to say I like the dr strangelove reference in your topic title :angel:


 
Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb

:uhoh: Dr Strangelove reference. :idea: aaaa YEAH that was EXACTLY what I was doing 


OK now for the truth; I assure you it was purely accidental and I had not thought about DR Strangelove at all. But DAMN I wished I had


----------



## Xue Sheng (Feb 26, 2010)

Well the knee is inflated again, 3 hours of work removing 16 inches of snow and a 4' x 3' x 16' snowplow made wall is apparently not good for the knee, but I had no choice.

However I am going to a specialist next week and see what he has to say.

I have been giving my training future serious thought and I may have to go to things less demanding on the knees by the time this is done or I could be able to resume my chosen styles Taijiquan and Xingyiquan, I am not sure at this point. 

I am beginning to wonder if someone isn't trying to tell me something however. I have on a direct line between my office and my house a JKD school and a gym that trains boxers. And I was looking for something more on Qigong and a Taoist popped up that is having a seminar near me soon. And he teaches regular classes not that far from me (4 hours away). 

I would however miss ICMA, but this is not certain yet but then I will know more next week.


----------



## Blade96 (Mar 4, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb
> 
> :uhoh: Dr Strangelove reference. :idea: aaaa YEAH that was EXACTLY what I was doing
> 
> ...



Hahah, good call =]

btw my ex bf years ago dressed up as dr strangelove for halloween and i know of the movie through my studying the cold war so saw your title and was like, Hah! cool. :angel:

You should get a snow blower or something.

Hope the knee gets better btw.


----------



## Xue Sheng (Mar 4, 2010)

Blade96 said:


> Hahah, good call =]
> 
> You should get a snow blower or something.


 
That was with a snowblower 

Damn, I'm old 


As for the knee, I am going for an MRI and the MD thinks it may be as simple as a Cortisone shot (ouch)....BUT it could also be the Meniscus


----------

