# Video clips from Wing Tsung Kung Fu, Finland



## Saku (May 13, 2006)

What do you think about this Wing Tsung Kung Fu? 

http://www.youtube.com/results?search=wing+tsung&search_type=search_videos


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## terryl965 (May 13, 2006)

Looks pretty interesting.
Terry


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## yipman_sifu (May 13, 2006)

Wing Tsung?!!! Was it a Leung Ting lineage?. It seems like that but why the name has another derivative?!.


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## Saku (May 29, 2006)

Yes, it was a Leung Ting lineage.
We are not in the same organization, that´s why the name is different.


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## Kensai (May 29, 2006)

Cool. Soundtrack was waaay cool too. :mp5:


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## White Fox (May 29, 2006)

Thanks Saku,

Very Cool!!


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## pstarr (May 30, 2006)

Very nicely put together- Interesting.


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## bcbernam777 (May 30, 2006)

I know you are not going to like this much, but this was a poor demonstration on Wing Chun.

1) not demonstration of leverage and SLT energy which is a must for allof the hands of Wing Chun

2) A lot of Chasing hands

3) impropper use of the purpose of Chi Sau

4) An obvious misunderstanding of the purpose of the lop Sau

If you wanted my honest opinion you have it


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## fightingfat (May 31, 2006)

I thought it looked great! Really effective!


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## Saku (May 31, 2006)

Hello BCBERNAM777.

Could you, please, show me or show us some of your videos where I or we can see what do you mean with -_impropper use of the purpose of Chi Sau_ and _An obvious misunderstanding of the purpose of the lop Sau_? I mean videos where  you do the proper use of the purpose of Chi sau and the understanding that you have about the purpose of Lop Sau?
Thank you.


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## bcbernam777 (May 31, 2006)

Saku said:
			
		

> Hello BCBERNAM777.
> 
> Could you, please, show me or show us some of your videos where I or we can see what do you mean with -_impropper use of the purpose of Chi Sau_ and _An obvious misunderstanding of the purpose of the lop Sau_? I mean videos where you do the proper use of the purpose of Chi sau and the understanding that you have about the purpose of Lop Sau?
> Thank you.


 
as soon as i get a video camera i would love to.

Before I do, I have to preface by saying that the purpose of the Chi Sau is not to chase hands or how to even find oportunities to hit, the true purpose of Chis Sau is for the proper development of the SLT energy, to test the level of your stance, as the proper biomechanical development of the stance is key to the development of effective and workable Wing Chun, because this level of development is primaraly missing from many practioners understanding of the Chis Sau, they never truely develop the full power of Wing Chun. In addition to this the Lop Sau is to further develop and refine the energy in harmoney with the principles outlined in the Chum Kui. I will show you videos as soon as I can, but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau is to be felt rather than shown.


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## fightingfat (Jun 1, 2006)

bcbernam777 said:
			
		

> I have to preface by saying that the purpose of the Chi Sau is not to chase hands or how to even find oportunities to hit, the true purpose of Chis Sau is for the proper development of the SLT energy, to test the level of your stance, as the proper biomechanical development of the stance is key to the development of effective and workable Wing Chun, because this level of development is primaraly missing from many practioners understanding of the Chis Sau, they never truely develop the full power of Wing Chun. In addition to this the Lop Sau is to further develop and refine the energy in harmoney with the principles outlined in the Chum Kui. I will show you videos as soon as I can, but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau is to be felt rather than shown.


 
In your opinion, right?


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## bcbernam777 (Jun 1, 2006)

fightingfat said:
			
		

> In your opinion, right?



No, in my Sifu's opinion, and seeing as he learnt under Yip Man, I do believe I will listen to his opinion. Also my opinion based on personal experiance, which has only confirmed the validity of Sifu's teachings.


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## Saku (Jun 1, 2006)

We agree that one of the purpose of Chi sao is to conect muscular chains, as I think you have called *proper biomechanical development*, from the power of your oponent to the floor. This muscular conections make your stance to have the correct balance and forward energy. 

As you have said *but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau is to be felt rather than shown.* Then how you can see the energy that we are using?


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## bcbernam777 (Jun 1, 2006)

Saku said:
			
		

> We agree that one of the purpose of Chi sao is to conect muscular chains, as I think you have called *proper biomechanical development*, from the power of your oponent to the floor. This muscular conections make your stance to have the correct balance and forward energy.
> 
> As you have said *but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau is to be felt rather than shown.* Then how you can see the energy that we are using?



because i can see by the way the hands (arms, techniques) are being used, as well as how the stance is being applied through the movements of the upper body after my training with Sifu i can tell the difference by sight, but not everyone can do this


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## Saku (Jun 1, 2006)

Let me to make clear something. First you say &#8211;&#8220;I will show you videos as soon as I can, but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau *is to be felt rather than shown.&#8221;*

And later you say &#8211;&#8220;*because i can see* by the way the hands (arms, techniques) are being used, as well as how the stance is being applied through the movements of the upper body after my training with Sifu *i can tell the difference by sight*, *but not everyone can do this&#8230;* uhmm! it sounds interesting!

So&#8230;if you show your videos we cannot to see because _have to be felt rather than show_, but you can see it by sight&#8230; and, of course,   not everybody can do this...ok...:asian:


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## fightingfat (Jun 1, 2006)

bcbernam777 said:
			
		

> No, in my Sifu's opinion, and seeing as he learnt under Yip Man, I do believe I will listen to his opinion. Also my opinion based on personal experiance, which has only confirmed the validity of Sifu's teachings.


 
So there's only one opinion that counts? Only one way to learn? Only one lineage that's valid? Only one school of Wing Chun that works?

Ever been to the World VTAA meet up?


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## bcbernam777 (Jun 1, 2006)

fightingfat said:
			
		

> So there's only one opinion that counts? Only one way to learn? Only one lineage that's valid? Only one school of Wing Chun that works?
> 
> Ever been to the World VTAA meet up?


 
Until I meet a teacher who can best my Sifu or who infact can best Sifus senior students then I will listen to them, until then Sifus opinion is the only one that matters to me in terms of Wing Chun, there are a lot of people who think they know Wing Chun, I have spoken to many of them, when I touch hands with them, they dont really know all that much, I am not saying that Sifus way is the only way, indeed there are many ways in wing chun, but I am not interested in many ways if they are not effective, for me, everything I do has to be effective, or it is not worth my time, whether it is Wing Chun, Business, Leadership etc, any area of life has to be effective or it is a waste of time, and when I apply the peretto principle to Wing Chun it says to me that that real results in effective Wing Chun only come from a small percentage of people, if you dispute it that is fine, I am not saying it to offend anyone, I am simply saying it because it is a verifiable fact.

Quote *"Let me to make clear something. First you say I will show you videos as soon as I can, but you need to understood that both Chi sau and Lop Sau is to be felt rather than shown.

And later you say because i can see by the way the hands (arms, techniques) are being used, as well as how the stance is being applied through the movements of the upper body after my training with Sifu i can tell the difference by sight, but not everyone can do this uhmm! it sounds interesting!

**Soif you show your videos we cannot to see because have to be felt rather than show, but you can see it by sight and, of course,  not everybody can do this...ok...:asian:* "



If you have the right training and can determine by eyesight effective use of the Chi Sau then good for you, however if you have not been trained sufficiently then you will have to taste it. So in other words when I send a video it is up to your level of training as to whether or not you are able to determine what is happening, or if you dont have that level of trainin, it may just simply look to you like any other chi sau.


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## Saku (Jun 2, 2006)

Ok. Let´s see some video of the Wing Chun you are practicing and later we can continue with this conversation.


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## iljjlm (Jul 14, 2006)

Hey bcbernam777, is your sifu William Cheung? If he is you are right he is awesome. I went to a seminar he was teaching. He is also my grandmaster.


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## ed-swckf (Jul 14, 2006)

iljjlm said:
			
		

> Hey bcbernam777, is your sifu William Cheung? If he is you are right he is awesome. I went to a seminar he was teaching. He is also my grandmaster.


 
No, he is a student of Fung Ping Boi (Dereck Fung)


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