# Dealing with Martial Brothers



## foolbae1228 (May 9, 2005)

Farang-

I have a martial brother that is a real pain in the ***. He keeps digging himself into a hole and soon he won't be able to see daylight. He was the first person I met when I moved up to a small town, so we were pretty close. We would basically live in each other's house, and we could tell he was calling just by hearing the phone ring...we were buds. Two years down the road, his grandparents (his real parents are screw-ups) are having issues so he lives with us for 6 months, which is when things started to spiral out of control. He was caught smoking and stealing from a teacher, and his grades (which he was able to pull from a 32% to a 75%) started to drop, and he moved back with his grandparents. A few more months down the road, he goes to juvey because he was caught too many times sneaking out of his house. After a week in jail, he goes back and swears that this was his life-changing moment...and I believed him.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Not 2 months later, he is back for 3 days for ditching school to smoke, which broke his probation. Again, he says that juvey wasn't great and swears, again, that he will never go back...and I believed him. Then, as of last February, he goes and steals $100 from a car that he broke into, which gave him 3 weeks in jail.

Now, this is where I am asking for advice...

When he was living with me, I took him into the dojang, where he was a promising student and made it to yellow sash before he left. He was granted a two-month scholarship from an organization that I don't really know about, but he hasn't used them. Technically, this kid is my martial brother. I've tried to help him, but now I just want nothing to do with him. Is this the martial way? Should I try to bring him back and help him out of his hole, or do I just let him be and let him do whatever he wants to destroy his life. If I were to help him, what would I do. My idea wouldn't be appropriate
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




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HHHEEELLLPPP!!!!

Farang-
Ryan


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## terryl965 (May 9, 2005)

you are in a tough spot if you turn your back on him you have to be able to live with that everyday. If you try to help and sounds like you are you need to relize you can only help those that are willing to help themselfs. Your kindness will be your own weakness in this manner, no one man can change the world but if one man does not try the world can never change. Look inside your heart and the answer is there.

Good Luck


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## foolbae1228 (May 9, 2005)

terryl965 said:
			
		

> you are in a tough spot if you turn your back on him you have to be able to live with that everyday. If you try to help and sounds like you are you need to relize you can only help those that are willing to help themselfs. Your kindness will be your own weakness in this manner, no one man can change the world but if one man does not try the world can never change. Look inside your heart and the answer is there.
> 
> Good Luck


You've summarized my feelings completely. I've been going over this since all this started, and I still can't find an answer. What then?

FARANG!!
Ryan


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## shesulsa (May 9, 2005)

You're in tough spot and one of the things that makes it so tough is that your friend is a legal minor (I assume you are also-?).

 This guy needs new friends, busy hands ... and a mentor.  You might be able to get him in with you and a group of friends you hang with to keep him busy and away from undesirable friends.  To have busy hands means he needs something productive to occupy his time - a hobby or a sport.  Too bad he won't stay in martial arts, but then ... if he's headed down this path it might be better that he not stay in.

 What you also can't provide him with is mentoring ... or ... a father figure or role model.  He needs an older man (not grampa) that can provide him with an example of structure, responsibility.  He needs structure and consistency - especially in his living situation and his guardians.  He is a soul almost lost striving to hang on ... and struggling.

 You didn't mention whether or not he attends the same school as you.  You mentioned that he lived with you for a while - where does he live now?  Are your parents open to adopting him?


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## shesulsa (May 9, 2005)

You also have to really be careful of how much you extend to him.  But if he was doing very well when living with you - I wonder if he would do well if that were a permanent situation....


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## foolbae1228 (May 9, 2005)

shesulsa said:
			
		

> You also have to really be careful of how much you extend to him. But if he was doing very well when living with you - I wonder if he would do well if that were a permanent situation....


He did go to the same school as I did, but I have since been homeschooled. He's back living with his grandparents now, under house arrest for the last stunt he pulled off.

My parents, even myself, are not open to adopting him. He burned bridges when he lived with us, and we were scorched. I've tried making my instructor a role-model for him, and even my dad when he was living with us. But, as we extended our hand, he spat in our face.

With the friends, the ones that I hang out with prodominately since he moved out, won't get along with him and vis versa, and I don't want to make it unenjoyable for my other friends too. This is my battle between him and I. 

Is there anything else that I can try?

Farang-
Ryan


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## The Kai (May 9, 2005)

Having lived through a worse senerio I can tell you he will take you downwith him.  Offer to help but also make him get help to....There are things working inside him that he should be having some talk time with a professional.  Let hgim in your house?  Soooner or later things will disappear or get broken and not replaced


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## zac_duncan (May 9, 2005)

I had a friend like this some years ago. He too trained at my school for a while, so I've been in this situation.

Firstly, you should recognize that this person is not your responsibility. That said, trying to be a possitive influence is a good thing. While doing that though, remember that trust once given and mis-used must be earned back. Trying to be a good friend and to helping to guide this person is a good thing, but allowing yourself to be taken advantage of is not. 

For my part, when I was in this situation, I routinely tried to help my friend out, all while being screwed over in return. It wound up culminating in a slight altercation which wound up with me putting my foot through my front door rather than through him. He left me alone after that, and as I understand it has started to straighten his life out. 


My basic take on this was that this was a person who couldn't be helped. At least not until he decided that there really was a problem. If your friend has not realized this, then nothing you can do can help him.


-zac


BTW - Your art section states that you study Daito-ryu. I believe that you've made a mistake. While it's true that hwarangdo is based on hapkido which is probably based on daito-ryu, hapkido is no longer daito-ryu. It is hapkido. The idea that they're the same is a somewhat prevalent misconception in HKD circles, but in truth, they're very different arts now. Think of that next time you throw a roundhouse kick.


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## foolbae1228 (May 9, 2005)

Todd and Zac, thanks for your input. 

I guess all I can do is wait. I can knock on the door all I want, but it's him that needs to open the door.

Farang-
Ryan


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## shesulsa (May 9, 2005)

If he burned bridges with you and your family and whatnot, then you must let him go.  Just stop talking to him, hanging with him.  Wish him well and pray / meditate for him.

 Sometimes all you can do is all you can do and it sounds to me like you and others around you have done all everyone can do.  

 Best wishes, Ryan. :asian:


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## Jonathan Randall (May 25, 2005)

You're prime responsibility, which I believe you have fulfilled, is to be a role model. His problems are likely deeply rooted and a simple "heart to heart" talk is not going to fix them. Be careful that he does not take you down. When I was in H.S. I went shopping with a friend who started shoplifting - to my absolute horror and dismay. Guess what? We were BOTH detained. It is true and honourable to consider your responsibility to this friend but it is also important to consider your responsibility to yourself, your FAMILY and your other friends. Advice? Keep a distance but hold out the possibility for further contact and friendship to him if and when he gets his act together. Best of luck and your concern does you credit.


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## Gemini (May 25, 2005)

Kai brought up a very good point. If you don't change the relationship, he will bring you down. Not the other way around. Watching people you care about self destruct is tough. Unfortunately, it's something most of us go through at some point.

Understand, though maybe your friend, he is not your responsibility. He's HIS responsibility. If he needs help, offer it, but only on your terms. If he asks for help, oblige him, but only on your terms. Hold your ground with him. Ultimately, whether he accepts things as they truly are or not, is his decision to make. You can't do it for him. He can decide to bring himself back in line or realize his actions will severe the friendship altogether.

Be content in the knowledge that you were willing to do more for him than most. In the end we all get what we deserve. If he can't see it, you cannot hold yourself responsible.

Best wishes to you.


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## Drac (May 25, 2005)

Man I've been there too..Former friend got hooked on "speed" to the point that he needed a couple of "beauties" just to wake up..Lost his job and his marrage went down the tubes..I had to step away, I didn't need him to drag me down too as he did some others that attemped to help..It wasn't easy and it bothered me for a long time, but it had to be done...


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## searcher (May 25, 2005)

I would agree with you needing to distance yourself from him.   I also agree with you needing to be a role model, but at a distance.   Let him see you live a good life and he might come around.   You just need to be prepared for his downfall.   This may sound self-centered, but you need to think of yourself and your family first.


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## foolbae1228 (Jun 14, 2005)

Gemini said:
			
		

> Kai brought up a very good point. If you don't change the relationship, he will bring you down. Not the other way around. Watching people you care about self destruct is tough. Unfortunately, it's something most of us go through at some point.
> 
> Understand, though maybe your friend, he is not your responsibility. He's HIS responsibility. If he needs help, offer it, but only on your terms. If he asks for help, oblige him, but only on your terms. Hold your ground with him. Ultimately, whether he accepts things as they truly are or not, is his decision to make. You can't do it for him. He can decide to bring himself back in line or realize his actions will severe the friendship altogether.
> 
> ...


Farang-

I've been thinking about it, but how will I know when he is truely asking for my help? He's called a couple times since I made this thread, but I have just ignored him. I started thinking, "Is he calling for help and I'm blowing him off? Or is he still his old self and just wanting to get out of his house for a while?"

How will I know? Should I start talking to him, but not hanging out with him until I know for sure? Should I just ignore him completely? I want second opinions before I do something to help and/or hurt me.

Farang-
Ryan


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## Ceicei (Jun 15, 2005)

Keep the line of communication open, but don't go out to hang, or you might very well be "hung".

 - Ceicei


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## Gemini (Jun 15, 2005)

Ceicei said:
			
		

> Keep the line of communication open, but don't go out to hang, or you might very well be "hung".
> 
> - Ceicei


Absolutely. You can still talk to him and keep your finger on the pulse, so to speak. YOU control how far that will be determined on what you're getting from him.


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