# Something I realised



## CuongNhuka (Jul 25, 2009)

I noticed this because of a thread on another forum. That thread was about the best weapon to protect your home with, and it got me thinking about the various self defense schools that teach defense agianst armed attacks, rape attempts, and maybe car jacking. But, how many teach some kind of defense involving your home? 
Thinking off the top of my head, I come up with the idea of a 'layered defense'. A lock, security system (both being used), a dog that'll bark (or bite), putting up security hedges, and so on. Simple, but when I find an add for a self defense school, they hardly ever mention home security. 
And lets go further, why not how to protect you identity? Or Cyber Security? And few of those schools offer classes in first aid. I've never run into a self defense school that dealt with maintianing a road side kit.

Why do so few self defense schools touch on these things?


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## Andy Moynihan (Jul 25, 2009)

Because only up until the last decade or so, most people outside the law enforcement community just didn't have the first clue.

The things you list are all considered "standard" on the list for anyone who knows what the hell they're talking about where "self defense" is concerned, but up till very recently only the "top 1%" ever made the distinction between "self defense" and "martial arts".  They're distant cousins, not identical twins.


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## Bikewr (Jul 25, 2009)

You make a good point.   Outside the martial-arts field, some folks like Masaad Ayoob have been incorporating the legalities of defense into their training; again something that few MA schools address.

Such information should indeed be part of any realistic "self-defense" course.

Unfortunately, it would be hard to find an instructor fluent in all these different aspects of security.


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## jks9199 (Jul 25, 2009)

A lot also depends on the goal of training.  In the US, martial arts and personal self defense have been about being able to handle combat, often one-on-one personal combat and attacks.  In the last couple of decades, the popular focus has shifted heavily into "family activity", children's programs, and competition.

Like so many areas of life, we've drawn an artificial distinction between physical security issues, personal security issues, and other areas like legal defenses.


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## Deaf Smith (Jul 25, 2009)

Most martial arts are just that, arts. And thus they almost never get involved in topics other than technique and general philosophy. They admonish not to get involved in fights and that's about it.

Reality based schools, which are rather a new concept, go deep into the legalities as well as scenarios using actual case studies. Their techniques do not have the finesse of a martial arts school, but what they lack they make up for in practicality.

Haply more and more schools are starting to see there are people who do want plain self defense and not the 'do' that normally goes with it. Special classes just for SD. The only trouble is this: They cannot pontificate on the law least they get charged with *practicing law without a license*.

And that is the hard part. You need a school that teachs that, like LFI-1.

Deaf


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## Bill Mattocks (Jul 25, 2009)

IMHO, there probably are no classes in such things because most people have no interest in them, even martial artists and (forgive me) survivalists.

My wife and I have plans and have practiced our room-clearing techniques in our home.  We are both armed at home and know how to avoid shooting each other, her mom, the dogs, etc if someone comes in at night who should not be there.

We have locks, central monitored alarm system (get a discount on homeowner's insurance for that, BTW), two big-*** dogs, and pre-planned and tested escape routes OUT of our house if we have to bail due to overwhelming force or simply natural disaster.

We have bottled water, food, and survival equipment in the house, the vehicles, and cached elsewhere.  We have maps, GPS, mobile phones, and pre-planned rally points hundreds of miles from our home in the event of natural disaster or civil disorder in case we get seperated.

Most people don't even know how to get our of their own home through a 2nd floor window if they had to - we've practiced doing it (the neighbors are firmly convinced we're nuts, who cares).

I do not understand why people train to defend themselves and then don't take responsibility for their lives and family in ways other than using their fists and feet and perhaps a firearm.  Self-defense is about survival, and survival involves more than just warding off a mugger.

I've mentioned this before, here and other places.  No one seems interested, so I go my own way and do my own thing.


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## Carol (Jul 25, 2009)

At least in the northeast, most gun clubs should be able to provide a person with the name of a defense attorney experienced with personal protection issues.  

You don't have to be a member of the club to get the referral, just call 'em up and ask.  I've found MA and NH attorneys this way, as did a friend in upstate NY.  I suspect most other gun clubs would do the same.


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## MJS (Jul 25, 2009)

CuongNhuka said:


> I noticed this because of a thread on another forum. That thread was about the best weapon to protect your home with, and it got me thinking about the various self defense schools that teach defense agianst armed attacks, rape attempts, and maybe car jacking. But, how many teach some kind of defense involving your home?
> Thinking off the top of my head, I come up with the idea of a 'layered defense'. A lock, security system (both being used), a dog that'll bark (or bite), putting up security hedges, and so on. Simple, but when I find an add for a self defense school, they hardly ever mention home security.
> And lets go further, why not how to protect you identity? Or Cyber Security? And few of those schools offer classes in first aid. I've never run into a self defense school that dealt with maintianing a road side kit.
> 
> Why do so few self defense schools touch on these things?


 
I can only echo what Andy said.  IMO, 99.99% of this stuff is simply common sense, but as it was said, at the time, only certain people were thinking about this stuff.  Seems that nowadays, most MA schools cater to what the masses want....a place to hang out, make new friends, etc.  The material ends up watered down, because people are not interested in the sd aspect, so why bother teaching the things you mention if nobody is interested?


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## Carol (Jul 26, 2009)

Many schools focus on training children, and most of those schools also encourage kids to do well in school and put excellent effort in to their studies.  

Crime, drugs, and poverty tend to be more prevalent in areas where the people are lacking in education for whatever reason.   Pursuing a higher education often brings a better chance for a person to support themselves in a way that isn't as physically demanding or dangerous.   That is a good form of self defense, is it not?


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## Franc0 (Jul 26, 2009)

CuongNhuka said:


> I noticed this because of a thread on another forum. That thread was about the best weapon to protect your home with, and it got me thinking about the various self defense schools that teach defense agianst armed attacks, rape attempts, and maybe car jacking. But, how many teach some kind of defense involving your home?
> Thinking off the top of my head, I come up with the idea of a 'layered defense'. A lock, security system (both being used), a dog that'll bark (or bite), putting up security hedges, and so on. Simple, but when I find an add for a self defense school, they hardly ever mention home security.
> And lets go further, why not how to protect you identity? Or Cyber Security? And few of those schools offer classes in first aid. I've never run into a self defense school that dealt with maintianing a road side kit.
> 
> Why do so few self defense schools touch on these things?


 
I have two jobs. 1st and foremost I teach martial arts/combatives to local LEO's, corrections officers & security types. Never once has any of these students asked for "home security tips or training". Never noticed the need for it. But...
My second, part time job is as a Security Consultant, which normally has my consulting directed towards corporate/entertainment applications, i.e. nightclubs, film locations, special events etc. Once in awhile the CEO's or whatever bigwig that hired me ends up asking for help with their home security. Starting at alarm systems, 1st Aid and going all the way up to personal firearms training customised to their home design, none were interested in training at my studio for more extensive training.
For some reason, the two types of training individuals just never mixed. My guess is the latter were just lazy rich types who wanted to buy the quick fix, while the long time H2H students were the opposite.


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## DergaSmash (Jul 26, 2009)

I think a big reason for not touching on these subjects is liability. We live in a soceity where suing people and organizations is common. Many people I am sure do not want to risk that kind of heat. Nearly half of my classroom training for my concealed carry permit was about how to minimize liability and protect my myself and my assets even if I used my weapon legally.


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## sgtmac_46 (Jul 26, 2009)

CuongNhuka said:


> I noticed this because of a thread on another forum. That thread was about the best weapon to protect your home with, and it got me thinking about the various self defense schools that teach defense agianst armed attacks, rape attempts, and maybe car jacking. But, how many teach some kind of defense involving your home?
> Thinking off the top of my head, I come up with the idea of a 'layered defense'. A lock, security system (both being used), a dog that'll bark (or bite), putting up security hedges, and so on. Simple, but when I find an add for a self defense school, they hardly ever mention home security.
> And lets go further, why not how to protect you identity? Or Cyber Security? And few of those schools offer classes in first aid. I've never run into a self defense school that dealt with maintianing a road side kit.
> 
> Why do so few self defense schools touch on these things?


  Because most schools are martial arts schools, and they focus is a more narrow subject matter of physical combatives.

The issue of general personal security is a larger one, and beyond the scope of the average martial arts school........though it could fit well in to a specific personal security program.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jul 26, 2009)

Gunsite is well-regarded.

http://www.gunsite.com/classes_specialty.html

There are a number of schools (real ones, not the ones for wannabes) dedicated to executive protection training (bodyguarding) that teach shoot-don't shoot scenarios if that's the kind of advice and training you're looking for.

A must-read book is _"In the Gravest Extreme,"_ by Masaad Ayoob.

However, if you're interested in some interesting fiction that has a lot of wisdom in it for those who have a mind to follow it, I recommend "Unintended Consequences" by John Ross.

Wikipedia: Unintended Consequences

Self-defense is more than shoot-don't shoot.  It's about protecting your life, even from natural disasters and things of that nature.  If you can't escape a burning building, it doesn't matter how high you can kick or how fast your punch is, or how accurately you shoot.  And if you think you can escape a burning building without planning, training, practice...tell me how well you can learn MA from a book or video.  Right.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 26, 2009)

The NRA has a home protection course that usually coincides with getting your CPL here in Michigan and in other places around the country.  Some martial systems do cover this type of material but leave the actual law part to qualified attorney's!  

As for personal home defense I think common sense brings to the front that you may want to have escape plans, dog's, alarm systems, bushes around windows, a plan in place for a break in, fire, etc.


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## Flea (Jul 26, 2009)

CuongNhuka,

I wanted to thank you for starting this thread.  My city had two big natural disasters last year, one of which made world headlines.  I was very lucky both times to have my home completely intact as many of my neighbors had to double up with family and friends.  My momma raised me right as a seasoned camper so I wasn't too worried.  With every hotel room booked in the 7 surrounding counties, I probably should have been.

I'd been meaning to put together an emergency kit, but for nearly a year it's taken a back burner to other things.  Thanks to your reminder today I've photocopied a long list of emergency documents like contact info, insurance, and my pets' vaccination certificates.  Since I love camping so much that's taken care of itself with all my equipment already compiled in my truck bed.  In a way it's been kind of fun because it's helped me get a handle on the larger picture of my file cabinet, pantry, and camping gear.  I have a lot of weeding-out to do, which will also help me in my upcoming move.  It's interesting how one thing can lead to the next.

It's a little outside the scope of this thread, but here's the guideline I'm using in compiling my own kit:

http://www.ready.gov/america/getakit/

Any other suggestions are welcome.


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## shesulsa (Jul 26, 2009)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> As for personal home defense I think common sense brings to the front that you may want to have escape plans, dog's, alarm systems, bushes around windows, a plan in place for a break in, fire, etc.



Alas, it seems, however, that common sense just ain't so common for some reason.

Part of this could be geographical. I find myself constantly in awe of the number of people who leave their homes unlocked so their kids can get in and out when the parents aren't around or get in when they return at 1am, etcetera.  Or the back door is left unlocked/open. The comings and goings of the family members in these particular clans are such common knowledge it's scary to me for them, and yet when they return to find themselves robbed, it's a BIG mystery.

:idunno:

My daughter swears I'm paranoid ... yet I grew up in Los Angeles where rapists would lie in wait around the corner of a home for the alone woman to open her front door, attack her and push her back inside, securing the home for his crime; killers would hide in the very full mall parking lots waiting for their victims to do the same with their car doors or trunks.  She has grown up in the Pac NW where the news anchor has to remind you about what a Crime of Opportunity is. Good thing they do ... for me it was how I grew up. It has been very difficult to leave the front door open for the kids while I'm inside working. :S

Dowels in the windowframes *wow* the prospective tenants for our rentals. "What a terrific idea!" :shrug:

Deadbolt on the garage door. "Uh ... who's gonna break into the garage?"

Security screen door. "Why would anyone need that?" - we always find it propped open.

I think, unfortunately, that it takes a serious incident or scare to inoculate the typical citizen into appropriate awareness for home defense.

To my mind, self defense involves home defense, car defense, boat defense ... wherever you are, there are gaps in safety that simple awareness can mostly cover.  The alert citizen is the more rare victim. So ... dont' be a victim. be a Lert.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jul 26, 2009)

Flea said:


> CuongNhuka,
> 
> I wanted to thank you for starting this thread.  My city had two big natural disasters last year, one of which made world headlines.  I was very lucky both times to have my home completely intact as many of my neighbors had to double up with family and friends.  My momma raised me right as a seasoned camper so I wasn't too worried.  With every hotel room booked in the 7 surrounding counties, I probably should have been.
> 
> Any other suggestions are welcome.



Here's a horror story that sends a message...

Dying Cadets Kept Log

I used to live in Denver.  This story never stopped haunting me.  Two young Air Force Cadets, highschool sweethearts, were trapped in six feet of snow in Sherman County, Kansas, on leave from the Air Force Academy.  They wrote a log and love letters to each other, and then died of carbon monoxide poisoning.  It did not have to be that way.

Make an emergency kit.  Keep it in the car.  Always!

A lot of people don't know this -  but by law, even disconnected, otherwise-useless cell phones have to be able to call 911.  Yeah, if you've got an old cell phone laying around, keep it in the car and charged up.  Even if you have no service on it, if it can connect to a cellular network, it should be able to dial 911.

http://firstaid.about.com/od/callingforhelp/bb/cell911.htm



> Wireless carriers are required to complete 911 calls, even when the phone is not activated. Any phone that turns on and can receive a signal is capable of making a 911 call.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jul 26, 2009)

shesulsa said:


> To my mind, self defense involves home defense, car defense, boat defense ... wherever you are, there are gaps in safety that simple awareness can mostly cover.  The alert citizen is the more rare victim. So ... dont' be a victim. be a Lert.



Absolutely!  I even turn off or otherwise disable the dome light in my vehicles. I know where everything is and can find it in the dark.  No one else needs to.  Open the car door at night and you're a silhouette.  Someone argued with me once that the dome light could also hide someone who was crouching in the back seat.  Not in my car, unless they are Herve Villachez.


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## Flea (Jul 26, 2009)

Thanks Bill.



> Make an emergency kit.  Keep it in the car.  Always!



Now let me pose this question to you.  I spent some time today copying important documents that I'd need in an emergency - my health insurance and driver's license cards, medical info, condo and car insurance, and so forth.  In short, an ID theft gold mine if my car ever got stolen.  I plan to keep a copy in the house too if I don't have access to the car, but I'm a little afraid to keep one in the car too.  Any thoughts?


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## Bill Mattocks (Jul 26, 2009)

Flea said:


> Now let me pose this question to you.  I spent some time today copying important documents that I'd need in an emergency - my health insurance and driver's license cards, medical info, condo and car insurance, and so forth.  In short, an ID theft gold mine if my car ever got stolen.  I plan to keep a copy in the house too if I don't have access to the car, but I'm a little afraid to keep one in the car too.  Any thoughts?



Cars are full of potential hidey-holes.  For documents, not much better than the inside of the upholstery along the back of the driver's or front seat passenger's seat.  The upholstery is usually held on to the seat frame with rings or clips down low in the back, especially if they're not 'folding forward' type seats.  It's easy to get a file folder inserted between the seat cover and the upholstery material and won't be found by anyone except border patrol (they know that one quite well).

For the typical modern sedan, the back seat is generally removable, which most people don't know.  The bottom of the seat is hollow, you can see the springs and all if you turn it upside down.  Good places there.

Under floor mats works, but documents can bet ruined if people get in with muddy/wet/snowy boots and such.  However, floor mats themselves can be customized by a good upholsterer to have a zipper size and a pita pocket inside.  Have the documents plastic sealed and they won't make wrinkly-noises once inside.  Can't store too many documents that way because they get bulky.  But for onesy-twosy, they're fine.

The headliner is good if you can gain access, but these days most can't be easily modified - older cars were fine.

For things that do not have to be hidden, nothing beats military-surplus ammo cans.  Some are gasketed and have force-hinge hasps that ensure they are waterproof.  Great for things you don't want to buggies to eat, like emergency food, gorp, bandages, that sort of thing.  Of course, ammo too.  Bungie cords will keep it from rattling around in the back of a trunk.

Back in the 80's, I was friends with lots of survivalists.  I thought most of 'em were a tad wacky, but they had come up with some great methods and concepts.  They had a brief resurgence in '99 with the Y2K scare, but otherwise, they've mostly gotten awfully quiet.  I suspect they're due for another pop to the surface again soon.

I also recommend a magazine called "The Backwoodsman."

http://www.backwoodsmanmag.com/

It deals with a lot of what survivalists and 'modern day' frontiersmen and re-enactors are insterested in, but on the cheap - like making your own knives, black powder weapons, how to make cloth, tan leather, that sort of thing - emphasis on DIY and cheap, cheap, cheap.  I find about 30-70% of it useful to me, but the parts that are useful are really great.  You can find it on newstands.


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## still learning (Jul 27, 2009)

Hello, In Hawaii we have a neighorhood watch programs and the Police officer will come to your home and will give you advice on some things you can do to protect your home

You may want to look into those programs...Many security alarm companies will be glad to survey your home too?

A friend down the street heard someone walking into his house....took his shot gun and crank it...next thing he heard was "running footsteps going out the front door"

Prevention is always better than the cures....prepare yourself always...

Best weapons in the house? .....is a Jet .....(Jet Li)


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## BLACK LION (Jul 28, 2009)

Self defense for the most part is bound by its own terminology. 

Someone who taught self preservation or survival awareness would be far less confined within its terminology simply becuase of how broad the spectrum of preservation and survival is. 

Self defense is rather narrow and conceivably restricted especially under law and order IMO. Take away law and take away order and what does self defense become...  Survival


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