# Who's Who In Kosho Ryu



## mitose

Kosho Gakkusei said:


> I was at a seminar where Hanshi was asked about this guy.  Apparently, a number of years ago.  Richard Buchan invited Hanshi Juchnik to Canada to teach a seminar on Kosho Ryu.  Shortly after, Buchan declared himself to be the Hanshi of Kosho Ryu and a 9th Dan in Kosho Ryu Kempo.  Ironicly there is no Dan grade beyond 7th in Kosho Ryu.  Juchnik Hanshi is only a 7th Dan.  I believe Pat Kelly Sensei is a 6th Dan as is Uncle Larry & possibly Mike Brown Sensei.  Juchnik Hanshi does not view himself as the Grand Master of Kosho Ryu either.
> 
> _Don Flatt


who gave Juchnik his title?


----------



## KenpoDave

mitose said:


> who gave Juchnik his title?


 
I believe that it was Wally Jay and Thomas Young who signed off on his last promotion.


----------



## mitose

KenpoDave said:


> I believe that it was Wally Jay and Thomas Young who signed off on his last promotion.


wasn't thomas young just a shodan in kosho-ryu?


----------



## kosho

*wasn't thomas young just a shodan in kosho-ryu?*

With this said. Most of the Great Teachers of the past are all self Promoted. Chow, Got his Shodan from Young Sensei. so who made him a 10 degree then??? And so on. Parker was seen as a 10th degree
but if chow never self promoted then parker is only a 1st degree and so on. any one who is in kempo/kenpo under and this is just a few names of top teachers. are and can only be up to 1st degree black belts. all of the people named are top shelf teachers and a lot of the student that came from these men are also top teachers so this is something that can go back and forth over.

*G>M> William K.S. Chow*

*Master Sensei*
Ray Arquilla
_Iron Dragon Kosho Shorei Kenpo Karate_

*Hanshi*
Bruce Juchnik
_Kosho Ryu Kempo_

*Hanshi*
Thomas Young

*Senior Grandmaster*
Edmund K. Parker
*Professor*
Walter Godin

*Sijo*
Adriano Emperado

*Grandmaster*
Al Tracy
*Grandmaster*
Rick Alemany

*Professor*
Eugene Sedeño

*Great*
*Grandmaster*
Thomas Mitose
_Kosho Ryu Kenpo Karate_

_Kosho_


----------



## KenpoDave

mitose said:


> wasn't thomas young just a shodan in kosho-ryu?


 
I don't know what he ended up being.  He was left in charge of the Official Self Defense Club when Mitose left Hawaii, so he was the ranking Kosho guy there.  I am not sure Wally Jay has any ranking in Kosho Ryu, but his connection with John Chow Hoon and Okazaki places him in a category that Juchnik apparently thought important.

Perhaps "signed off on" was not the right phrase.  How about "recognized?"


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

mitose said:


> who gave Juchnik his title?


 
When Great Grandmster James Mitose awarded Bruce Juchnik with Menkyo Kaiden (full mastery of the MA) and Inka Shomei (spiritual authority/approval in zen buddhism), in Late 1979, arguably, Juchnik had the power to choose his title and organize the system as he saw/sees fit.

With this certification from Mitose, Juchnik could have declared himself the Soke of Kosho Ryu upon Mitose's demise but chose not to.  Rather, the original intent was to have Thomas Mitose study with Bruce and assume the role of Great Grandmaster, hence why Bruce chose the Hanshi (root master) title instead.  Unfortunately, Tom only studied with Bruce for a short time and decided to go on his own.  I think Bruce is still hopeful that Tom would return to complete his training.

When choosing a grading system Juchnik Hanshi chose the more conventional modern Kyu/Dan system rather than the older Shoden, Chuden, & Okuden.  My guess is that the modern system was chosen because the system is now primarily taught in the US and that Mitose Himself used a Kyu/Dan grading system.  The higest grade chosen was 7th Dan as Juchnik made honorary titles (Shihan, Kyoshi, Renshi, Hanshi) seperate from martial rank.

In Kosho Shorei Ryu, the title of Hanshi is also given to any of Mitose's original Black Belts who get involved in the Kai.  Such as Thomas Young Hanshi & Paul Yamaguchi Hanshi.

I hope this helps.

_Don Flatt


----------



## mitose

Kosho Gakkusei said:


> When Great Grandmster James Mitose awarded Bruce Juchnik with Menkyo Kaiden (full mastery of the MA) and Inka Shomei (spiritual authority/approval in zen buddhism), in Late 1979, arguably, Juchnik had the power to choose his title and organize the system as he saw/sees fit.
> 
> With this certification from Mitose, Juchnik could have declared himself the Soke of Kosho Ryu upon Mitose's demise but chose not to.  Rather, the original intent was to have Thomas Mitose study with Bruce and assume the role of Great Grandmaster, hence why Bruce chose the Hanshi (root master) title instead.  Unfortunately, Tom only studied with Bruce for a short time and decided to go on his own.  I think Bruce is still hopeful that Tom would return to complete his training.
> 
> When choosing a grading system Juchnik Hanshi chose the more conventional modern Kyu/Dan system rather than the older Shoden, Chuden, & Okuden.  My guess is that the modern system was chosen because the system is now primarily taught in the US and that Mitose Himself used a Kyu/Dan grading system.  The higest grade chosen was 7th Dan as Juchnik made honorary titles (Shihan, Kyoshi, Renshi, Hanshi) seperate from martial rank.
> 
> In Kosho Shorei Ryu, the title of Hanshi is also given to any of Mitose's original Black Belts who get involved in the Kai.  Such as Thomas Young Hanshi & Paul Yamaguchi Hanshi.
> 
> I hope this helps.
> 
> _Don Flatt


that question was supposed to be a joke.My grandpa didn't sign his certificate,so he has a forgery and we all know who signed it
In short all who has a certificate from Bruce stops there,it's worthless
in the Kosho world...just read my grandpa's Will............


----------



## kosho

*that question was supposed to be a joke.My grandpa didn't sign his certificate,so he has a forgery and we all know who signed it
In short all who has a certificate from Bruce stops there,it's worthless
in the Kosho world...just read my grandpa's Will............*

A cert: or a paper does not make the person the man.
Its the Info that person has. Hanshi juchnik has a ton of Info in a lot of areas and systems of martial arts.

instead of attacking him, you should thank him for spreading your family art. And if what I am teaching is not kosho ryu kempo then Bruce Juchnik
Hanshi is great at faking a Martial art. and so are the others out there.
I have my Flag in the Juchnik camp until I see and feel different. Hanshi Juchnik is the Man.
Kosho


----------



## mitose

kosho said:


> *that question was supposed to be a joke.My grandpa didn't sign his certificate,so he has a forgery and we all know who signed it
> In short all who has a certificate from Bruce stops there,it's worthless
> in the Kosho world...just read my grandpa's Will............*
> 
> A cert: or a paper does not make the person the man.
> Its the Info that person has. Hanshi juchnik has a ton of Info in a lot of areas and systems of martial arts.
> 
> instead of attacking him, you should thank him for spreading your family art. And if what I am teaching is not kosho ryu kempo then Bruce Juchnik
> Hanshi is great at faking a Martial art. and so are the others out there.
> I have my Flag in the Juchnik camp until I see and feel different. Hanshi Juchnik is the Man.
> Kosho


I am not attacking him.But the things he says are very dishonest.
I tried to contact him but no response.Spreading my families art?
sure if what he was teaching and saying was true.
You can fly your flag in his camp because you don't know any other way


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

mitose said:


> I am not attacking him.*But* ...


 
Don't you know that when you use the word "but" it negates what is said before it?  In essence your statement reflects that you are attacking him and seeking to justify it.

It seems to me as though you are attacking him and he's not even here to defend himself.

If you disagree with Bruce Juchnik and think he's dishonest why don't you demonstrate what your families art is about? The attitude and tone your taking is not impressing me and trying to assert yourself as a martial god does even less to impress.

Live at a higher level, show some class and prove that you're the real deal by your humility and knowledge.  That would be better than coming onto a message board and screaming, "LIAR!! LIAR!!!"  People won't listen to you based on that.  Earn our respect, share some insight.  Post some videos.  If you're the real deal it'll show and we'll all benefit.

People who just try to claim they're something great and fail to back it up just drift into obscurity.  So don't waste time trying to tear someone down become great by building others up.

Repectfully,

_Don Flatt


----------



## mitose

Kosho Gakkusei said:


> Don't you know that when you use the word "but" it negates what is said before it?  In essence your statement reflects that you are attacking him and seeking to justify it.
> 
> It seems to me as though you are attacking him and he's not even here to defend himself.
> 
> If you disagree with Bruce Juchnik and think he's dishonest why don't you demonstrate what your families art is about? The attitude and tone your taking is not impressing me and trying to assert yourself as a martial god does even less to impress.
> 
> Live at a higher level, show some class and prove that you're the real deal by your humility and knowledge.  That would be better than coming onto a message board and screaming, "LIAR!! LIAR!!!"  People won't listen to you based on that.  Earn our respect, share some insight.  Post some videos.  If you're the real deal it'll show and we'll all benefit.
> 
> People who just try to claim they're something great and fail to back it up just drift into obscurity.  So don't waste time trying to tear someone down become great by building others up.
> 
> Repectfully,
> 
> _Don Flatt


I am not trying to earn respect here.
When you are out here,look me up and we can get together and talk face to face and get a work out in.Listen to what we have to say.....
you get all the stuff third party as so do I.
Just tired of getting disrespected by the seeds Bruce planted.To me thats being dishonest.
maybe someone should lock this thread


----------



## kosho

Well,
         Maybe are paths will cross and I look forward to meeting you some day. I will tell you one thing. sence meeting John Evans, Bruce Juchnik, Pat kelly and many others in the Kia, My mind has opened as far as Martial arts go. 

I am a better teacher and student for this. I do have a open mind and will never close any doors that I see as helpful.

Best to you,

Kosho


----------



## swong

I was there when James Mitose refused to sign the Certificates that Bruce Jucknik and Arnold Golub presented to him. " Soke " means the inheritor of a system thru a direct bloodline. Bloodline not blood transfusion!
I still see the look of anger and frustration on their faces as they walked out of the prison, holding their manilla Envelope containing the certificates they were unsuccessful at having signed. James Mitose at the time was already frail, could barely see and He could barely speak English. What is it that Juchnik was learning from this weary soul? It is a crime to use and abuse the Elderly..........
You are absolutely correct when stating that a Certificate does not make the person the Man...........What does matter is what knowledge is held by the claimer and who is doing the claiming.


----------



## Bay Area's Best

Who's the real Kosho Ryu practitioners?


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

swong said:


> What is it that Juchnik was learning from this weary soul? It is a crime to use and abuse the Elderly..........


 
How about attacking/accusing someone behind their back?

You still haven't answered my questions on the Kosho Ryu? thread.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=857091#post857091

_Don Flatt


----------



## KenpoDave

Kosho Gakkusei said:


> How about attacking/accusing someone behind their back?
> 
> You still haven't answered my questions on the Kosho Ryu? thread.
> 
> http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=857091#post857091
> 
> _Don Flatt


 
I would surmise that this is Jeff Wong, a friend of Thomas Mitose's since the '60s.


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

mitose said:


> I am not trying to earn respect here.


 
Then why are you here?  If you don't want to cultivate mutual respect, how are we supposed to have a mature dialog??

In that case, it seems that the only reason you've entered our community is to badmouth another Martial Artist over a lineage dispute. The events in question are over 30 years old.  There's no reason you can't make your counter claims in a mature and respectful manner.

This online community is not about "Fraud Busting".  There are other online forums that cater to the lowest common denominator and thrive on bad-mouthing arts and artists.  This community is about the cultivation of the arts by civil interchange among martial artists.  There's alot of great representatives of their respective arts on this site and some high ranking artists who put their knowledge to productive use in the community.

You've come here with a well known name but a name will only get you so far on your name.  We all await some substance from you.  All you've said about your Grandfather's Art is that it's hard hitting.  If that's all you think it is then I highly doubt you know your Grandfather's art.  I say that based on what I've read in your Grandfather's books not based on my studies under Bruce Juchnik.  Hitting hard doesn't impress me.  I know and work with some guys who hit real hard and they have no training.  If there's more to that to your art then tell/show us.  There are plenty of people who'd be interested in hearing/seeing what you have to share in that case.

So, we all await some substance but if all you have to share is slander then you and your students should take it somewhere else.

_Don Flatt


----------



## swong

As previously stated my name is S. Wong. I did not say that I was taught by James Mitose. I have been training under his Son, Thomas Mitose, Soke since 1969.
I did know his father "James Mitose" and visited him in Prison very often and accompanied "Soke" to Los Angeles for training under his father. I was there when James Mitose refused to sign the certificates for Bruce and Arnie.
Who am I ? Do you mean my Credits and Credentials in Martial Arts? or was that meant sarcastically?

I have been training since 1969. I am Listed in The Encyclopedia of Martial Arts among the Top 5 Women Fights in the Nation. I have trained with and as long as The greats of Martial Arts Skip Mullens, Joe Lewis, Benny Urquidez, John Nativida, Frank Ramirez, Phil Cornin, Bill Wallace, Al Dacoscos to name a few. I have competed against and beaten great women fighters such as Janice Miller, Marion Bermudas, Mary Starks, Karen Shepard, Malia Dacoscos and so on.... I started my traing in San Francisco and presently train and teach in Sacramento and Concord Ca.

In reference to having to show you something of substance regarding Mitose's Art.......That is a bit disrespectful. James Mitose is who Bruce Jucknik is Representing after all. 

As far as asking Who I am on the same page Who are you?

I have noticed in your dialog you find it necessary to talk down to people as if everyone else is ignorant on every subject.

I have to say that as long as I have known and studied under "Soke" he has always remained in the background. While his students are traveling and competing around the world and always taking home the Trophies he remains in the background ...quietly. He has always said that we are not to exploit the Art for Monetary Gain.........We are to keep the Art close to our Heart....
Knowledge of the Art is what gives us power....
Sokes mother, James Mitose's wife told Sokes daughter,  This Art is your Grandpa's it remains your secret. In other words  ONLY THE MITOSE FAMILY 
REALLY KNOWS AND THEY WEREN'T TALKING UNTIL NOW...... 
Soon you will be amazed at what is being brought out to the public...............


----------



## swong

You made a comment as to your surmising I may be Jeff Wong.
I have known Shichidan Jeff Wong for many years. He is a Pillar in the Association of Mitose's International Kosho-Ryu Kenpo Association.

BUT YOU HAVE THE WRONG WONG!.......I am a WOMAN.


----------



## swong

Hi Koshojim,
Are you the Koshojim who trained with Schichidan Tony Bowles?


----------



## Danjo

swong said:


> ONLY THE MITOSE FAMILY
> REALLY KNOWS AND THEY WEREN'T TALKING UNTIL NOW......
> Soon you will be amazed at what is being brought out to the public...............


 
How will it be brought out exactly? Books, dvds?


----------



## Benjp

kosho said:


> Hello,
> Just surfing at work today and came across this person.
> I will ask Hanshi Juchnik this??? when i talk with him tonight.
> But just wondering if any of you out there today ever heard of this person? I got this off the web???
> 
> 
> Kosho[/SIZE]



I believe this is him on youtube http://www.youtube.com/user/OfficialKoshoRyu

Here's an introductory video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3otIQz0A8U

Ben


----------



## KenpoDave

swong said:


> You made a comment as to your surmising I may be Jeff Wong.
> I have known Shichidan Jeff Wong for many years. He is a Pillar in the Association of Mitose's International Kosho-Ryu Kenpo Association.
> 
> BUT YOU HAVE THE WRONG WONG!.......I am a WOMAN.


 
Sorry, you must be Sharon.


----------



## swong

Kenpo Dave,

Are you referring to Sharon Spremich? 
Before I answer your this one of your many questions answer one for me.
Why is it that you seem to be so interested in who I am? And why haven't I heard back from Don Flatt. I have been told that the word got out. That Questions  have been circulating regarding Bruce Juchnik that He would prefer that no further contact be made. I have been told that The more questions that are asked by The Juchnik Camp result in the answers to many questions that have gone unanswered and are finally being spoken.  
And why haven't we been invited to the next Gathering?


----------



## mitose

First off ,Who are you? 
Why must you ask such a question
don't you know who is who?
I guess I'm going to show you :jediduel:
or maybe you will show me




see you Monday "D" you still got it :mst:
glad your on our side brother :soapbox:


----------



## kosho

*Here is where the who's who of Kosho will be.*

*This is on Both Hanshi web pages and anyone can go.*

The Gathering was created as a venue for martial artists from all disciplines to share their knowledge and experience.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Many Martial Arts events focus on the teachers and masters. The Gathering is focused on exposing the students to many styles of the martial arts in order to promote unity. It is a unique opportunity for students of all ranks and styles to train with some of the greatest Martial Artists of our time.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]When you are at the Gathering, focus on the similarities, 
train hard, and most importantly, enjoy.[/FONT]​
*[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Gathering 2007[/FONT]*

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]​[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]10/13/07, 10/14/07
Reno NV​
Kosho​[/FONT]


​


----------



## KenpoDave

swong said:


> Kenpo Dave,
> 
> Are you referring to Sharon Spremich?


 
I am referring to the Sharon mentioned in this paragraph taken from www.kosho-ryu.com:

*M.I.K.K.A. Members Workshop/Members Tournament*
     On May 19th, 2007 we will be having a M.I.K.K.A. Members Workshop/Members Tournament. At this Years event we will be honored with teachings from the very experienced and knowledgeable Shichidan Jeff Wong and his World Champion Wushu Students!! Shichidan Wong has been a part of our family since the early 1960's. We have been calling him Mr. Wong for so long that we (Debbie, Liz and Mark) cannot seem to break the habit. Hanshi and Mr.Wong go back to the beginning of their Martial Arts Days. Their names were always mentioned in the same sentence.Their Karate-Kung-Fu schools climbed and reached the top together in the Tournament Circuit. Producing Champions in all Divisions. *His wife of 30 years, Sharon* , is one of the Best Known female fighters of all time! She is the Power Puncher that all women competitors feared and all "smart" men respected. It has been our Priviledge to know them and to have them as a part of The Mitose Family.



> Before I answer your this one of your many questions answer one for me.
> Why is it that you seem to be so interested in who I am?


 
I have only asked one.  As one who is interested in the history of Kosho-ryu, to have someone appear on a forum that knew James Mitose and has been training with his son for 28 years is a name I would want to know.



> And why haven't I heard back from Don Flatt. I have been told that the word got out.


 
I don't know Don, you'll have to ask him.



> That Questions have been circulating regarding Bruce Juchnik that He would prefer that no further contact be made. I have been told that The more questions that are asked by The Juchnik Camp result in the answers to many questions that have gone unanswered and are finally being spoken.


 
Don't know him.  I'm not in the Juchnik Camp, I'm in the Tracy Camp.



> And why haven't we been invited to the next Gathering?


 
Which Gathering?  There are several.  If you are speaking of Bruce Juchnik's, I don't know.  Speakman's?  I don't know.  Tracy's?  I don't know but I can find out.


----------



## swong

Kenpo Dave,
Sorry, for confusing you with someone from the Juchnik Camp.
I thought you were another Juchnik follower being a smart ***.
On the other hand I was being a smart *** when I asked about not being invited to the Juchnik Gathering. "Soke" was invited to "The Gathering of the Eagles" but had prior commitments and could not attend.
Glad to know that you are interested enough in The History of Kosho-Ryu to visit The Mitose Website.

You can also post to "MITOSE" that is Hanshi Mark, Soke's son.


----------



## Bay Area's Best

Can somebody tell me who Hanshi Richard Buchan is? And how come I can't find him on the Mitose family tree? On his sight he says he's a Kosho Master and all?


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

Sorry about the delay.  I have been unable to post for a few days.





swong said:


> As previously stated my name is S. Wong. I did not say that I was taught by James Mitose. I have been training under his Son, Thomas Mitose, Soke since 1969.


Ok.  I've checked all the posts you've made so far and I don't see anywhere you stating your name is S. Wong.  People's user id's are a nickname/handle for the site and don't always correspond to their real name.  Hence, why many people, myself included, sign their names to their posts.  This also the reason for a profile.  I didn't realize we were supposed to gather that "swong" stands for "S. Wong."  What does the "S." stand for?  I wanted to know who was making the claims you were.  You have to admit they're very bold claims and shouldn't be made anonymously.


swong said:


> I did know his father "James Mitose" and visited him in Prison very often and accompanied "Soke" to Los Angeles for training under his father. I was there when James Mitose refused to sign the certificates for Bruce and Arnie.


It's very surprising that no one else has heard of you being there before now.  Training under Thomas, well that makes some more sense.  It said in your profile that you've studied Kosho Ryu since 1969.  I'd find that surprising since James Mitose testified in court that from 1954 to 1973 when he took Terry Lee as a student that he had not taught Kempo to anyone.


swong said:


> Who am I ? Do you mean my Credits and Credentials in Martial Arts? or was that meant sarcastically?
> 
> I have been training since 1969. I am Listed in The Encyclopedia of Martial Arts among the Top 5 Women Fights in the Nation. I have trained with and as long as The greats of Martial Arts Skip Mullens, Joe Lewis, Benny Urquidez, John Nativida, Frank Ramirez, Phil Cornin, Bill Wallace, Al Dacoscos to name a few. I have competed against and beaten great women fighters such as Janice Miller, Marion Bermudas, Mary Starks, Karen Shepard, Malia Dacoscos and so on.... I started my traing in San Francisco and presently train and teach in Sacramento and Concord Ca.


My questioning who you are was not meant to be sarcastic.  I wanted to know who I was talking to.  You seem almost insulted because I did not know who you are.  I appologize.  Your credentials are impressive.


swong said:


> In reference to having to show you something of substance regarding Mitose's Art.......That is a bit disrespectful. James Mitose is who Bruce Jucknik is Representing after all.


I meant no disrespect.  I genuinely would like to hear what Mark and Thomas have to say the family art is all about but if all Mark wants to do is talk bad about Bruce Juchnik behind his back then I'm not interested.  Wouldn't coming to a public forum and throwing all kinds of insults and accusations around behind someone's back be considered disrespectful?  That's called slander.  How does that reflect the teachings of James Mitose?


swong said:


> As far as asking Who I am on the same page Who are you?
> 
> I have noticed in your dialog you find it necessary to talk down to people as if everyone else is ignorant on every subject.


I am just a humble student.  No major accomplishments.  I love to study the martial arts.  I always like to learn more and share what I learn with others.  I'm sorry if it seems that I've talked down to anyone.  That has never been my intent.


swong said:


> Soon you will be amazed at what is being brought out to the public...............


I look forward to it.

As I've said before, I really think it would be much more productive for Tom & Mark Mitose as well as those under them to come here and share their knowledge and communicate what their veiw of Kosho Ryu is rather than degrade to the old lineage debate.  Since, it seems that the debate is what they're really after I'll thow them a few bones.

1.  Since James Mitose testified in court that he did not teach anyone Martial Arts from 1954 to 1973 with the exception of Terry Lee.  And Since Thomas Mitose also stated in an interview in a 1982 Kosho Shorei news letter that he never studied with his father.  How can he change his claim recently?

2.  In regards to the blood line.  Do we still follow the bloodline in the event a Master has no children?  What about cases where a Master has decided for some reason to not teach the art to his children?  In the case of James Mitose, which bloodline do we follow?  Thomas was the 4th of Nine children(that we know about) that James fathered.  Thomas was the 2nd son born to James' 2nd wife in Hawai.  James had 2 others in Japan by his 1st wife.  James had 2 with his 3rd wife in California and 3 illegitimately with his neighbor.  James was not a fighter but a lover.

Have fun guys!

_Don Flatt


----------



## swong

Flatt,

I am well aware of James Mitose's Love of the women. The Mitose family is well aware of the these facts although yours are not entirely accurate. I have been present for many of the reuniting of the brothers and sisters of James Mitose. Some went very well and some were bitter towards James.
All in all you are not telling me or the Mitose Clan anything new.

What The Mitose Family has chosen to keep to themselves for all these years is their business. You stated that you are just a humble student with no major accomplishments, yet you have the balls to question Mitose's BLOODLINE.........Bottomline Thomas Mitose is the only child from James Mitose that chose to carry on with the family art.
By the way where do you come off plastering on a forum, Mitose's private business. Talk about disrespect..................
In that case Juchnik is living with a friend because he is homeless, is being monitored for Alcoholism and I won't go into details but has suffered his share of problems with women leaving him penniless..... You mentioned slander. It is not slander when you are speaking facts.
By the way the answer to question Number #2. I know that is a Lie, I personally accompanied "Soke Thomas Mitose along with others to Los Angeles, Ca. for Soke's training. I at this time cannot go into details because 
I have not yet received permission to discuss these issues on this forum.

BUT I CAN SAY THAT KOSHO-RYU FOLLOWERS AS WELL AS ALL OF KENPO
ARE IN FOR A GREAT SURPRISE VERY SOON!!!


----------



## Blindside

swong said:


> BUT I CAN SAY THAT KOSHO-RYU FOLLOWERS AS WELL AS ALL OF KENPO
> ARE IN FOR A GREAT SURPRISE VERY SOON!!!


 
I think the only thing in kenpo that would suprise me is if all the politics and in-fighting and the "my kenpo is the real deal" attitudes went away. 

Lamont


----------



## jks9199

Blindside said:


> I think the only thing in kenpo that would suprise me is if all the politics and in-fighting and the "my kenpo is the real deal" attitudes went away.
> 
> Lamont


I know that I'm sick of this thread with the bickering and name calling...

Folks, 
Ain't nobody gonna know the truth that isn't already aware of it.  This sort of bickering is just going to convince outsiders like me that NONE of you know how to play nice with each other...  which suggests to me that your style is doomed to stagnate as nobody shares any knowledge.


----------



## MJS

_*ATTENTION ALL USERS:

*_*Please, keep the conversation polite and respectful.

-Mike Slosek
-MT Asst. Admin-*


----------



## Kosho Gakkusei

Personally I agree with those that have stated the bickering and name calling is useless.  I appologize for throwing fuel on the fire in my last post.  I guess I was a bit frustrated as I was seeking to elevate the debate for several posts prior to that.  I will post no further on this matter.  I'm going back to the other forum areas where people are actually interested in discussing their arts and other people's in a civil manner.


swong said:


> By the way where do you come off plastering on a forum, Mitose's private business. Talk about disrespect..................


Is it just me or is this the pot calling the kettle black.


swong said:


> In that case Juchnik is living with a friend because he is homeless, is being monitored for Alcoholism and I won't go into details but has suffered his share of problems with women leaving him penniless..... You mentioned slander. It is not slander when you are speaking facts.





swong said:


> What is it that Juchnik was learning from this weary soul? It is a crime to use and abuse the Elderly..........





swong said:


> Sorry, for confusing you with someone from the Juchnik Camp.
> I thought you were another Juchnik follower being a smart ***.





swong said:


> THIS GUY BRUCE JUCHNIK SAYS HE THE 22ND DESCENDANT OF KOSHO RYU. THE ONLY THING HE IS, IS THE 22ND DESCENDANT OF HOW TO TEACH SELF DEFENCE WITH A SHOT GLASS IN HIS HAND.





swong said:


> I know the entire "Jucknik Story" Where is he living? What Happened to his schools? What happened to his offices in Orangevale and Penryn?
> Why does he continue to evade the Mitose's calls and my own? How come he is selling all of his Parents and Grandparents personal belongings on "EBAY?"


By the way, I didn't feel it was my place before but regarding the above slanderous statements about Bruce Juchnik- you don't have the facts straight.

_Don Flatt


----------



## Mr.NGMA

We support you and Soke Mitose, Hanshi Mark, KyoshI Debbie. 
I have been friends with them for many years.


----------



## Mr.NGMA

Rick Buchan had both Juchnik and Mitose for seminars. He earned no rank from Mitose. He claims that the Kosho Ryu Crest is public domain and that anyone can use it. I'm not sure about his 30 years experience, but I know he achieved a black belt in 1994 along with Ken Relf, a personal friend of the Mitoses.


----------



## kosho

Rick Buchan had both Juchnik and Mitose for seminars. He earned no rank from Mitose. He claims that the Kosho Ryu Crest is public domain and that anyone can use it. I'm not sure about his 30 years experience, but I know he achieved a black belt in 1994 along with Ken Relf, a personal friend of the Mitoses.

Thank you for the Infomation. On this person.

Kosho


----------



## marlon

at the unity seminar on of GM Mitose's students did a form, with very impressive skill i will add.  I would like to know the name of the form, if it is taught in any other styles and perhaps a little of what it teaches.

Respectfully,
Marlon
www.shaolinkempo.ca


----------



## dianhsuhe

Howdy Marlon,

  I do not know much about this topic or who might have done the demo. but I have seen and competed against Sifu Tim Bowles (Tony Bowles son?) and he was AWESOME.  He and Rodney Alo (Related to Ron Alo I think) were always the guys to beat in the "Kenpo" or "Kenpo / Polynesian" forms divisions.

  I know this is pretty far from the thread topic but I was motivated thinking about Sifu Tim's forms.

Jamey


----------



## John Bishop

dianhsuhe said:


> Howdy Marlon,
> 
> I do not know much about this topic or who might have done the demo. but I have seen and competed against Sifu Tim Bowles (Tony Bowles son?) and he was AWESOME.  He and Rodney Alo (Related to Ron Alo I think) were always the guys to beat in the "Kenpo" or "Kenpo / Polynesian" forms divisions.
> 
> I know this is pretty far from the thread topic but I was motivated thinking about Sifu Tim's forms.
> 
> Jamey



Probably the 2 best forms competitors in Kosho Ryu are Tim Bowles and Bill Tolentino.  Tim's a captain in the USMC and was in Okinawa, last I heard.  Bill's in No. Cal.
Rodney Alo is a Kajukenbo stylist, under Allen Abad.  The late Ron Alo was his father.


----------



## dianhsuhe

Thank you Sigung for the clarification.  I knew Rodney Alo Sensei was Kaju since he would do what I consider a "hard-style" form, win, then go change into his Kung-Fu uniform and do a soft style form and win that also- 

I knew I was in trouble when I was coming up through the ranks and they were winning in BB divisions until one day I ended up in the same division...

Kara-Ho has a few individuals in the mid-west that are outstanding in forms competitions but locally we don't get out to tournaments very often. (My excuse anyway)

See ya-
Jamey


----------



## mitose

John Bishop said:


> Probably the 2 best forms competitors in Kosho Ryu are Tim Bowles and Bill Tolentino.  Tim's a captain in the USMC and was in Okinawa, last I heard.  Bill's in No. Cal.
> Rodney Alo is a Kajukenbo stylist, under Allen Abad.  The late Ron Alo was his father.


It was Ken Torres aka Mark Mitose's little brother from another mother lol.
He's one of the best we have out there,though retired he often still enters
He won over in Spain last year.Tim is back down south showing his badass skyline R34 which I hope to take a ride in soon and Bill is still teaching and having fun being a grandpa


----------



## curious1

I would like to thank my big brother Mark for thinking so highly of me. I really do believe anyone who really understands what a form/Kata is for; can project the focus and intensity that others will notice. Practicing a Kata excuse my French; half ***, will only be cheating them out of the benefits of its whole intension. Put your heart into it. Understand all the intricate moves and techniques and what they are meant for. 
  Marlon it was my honor meeting you, just working with you on techniques I can feel the strength and responsiveness that you posses, and thank you for your kind words.

  (Just to set the record straight. Mark really isn't my brother inside joke) 

7 down 8 up

 Ken Torres


----------



## Attitude

KenpoDave said:


> I don't know what he ended up being.  He was left in charge of the Official Self Defense Club when Mitose left Hawaii, so he was the ranking Kosho guy there.  I am not sure Wally Jay has any ranking in Kosho Ryu, but his connection with John Chow Hoon and Okazaki places him in a category that Juchnik apparently thought important.
> 
> Perhaps "signed off on" was not the right phrase.  How about "recognized?"



Relevant and Motivational Links for those searching:





Discussion between Nimr Hassan (Terry Lee) and Bruce Juchnick

Kosho Ryu Timeline
Genshichi Kosho - 19th descendant Headmaster and Inheritor of Kosho Ryu





Professor Scott Merrill, student of Professor John Chow-Hoon

Page 2133 of the translation of Mitose's Trial
"I learned Kempo in a large temple in a mountain named Akenkai." -- Note the translation 'Akenkai'






Mt Kinkai
Mt. Kinkai, Nagasaki, Kyushu, Japan

Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region
Hidden Christian sites in the Nagasaki Region

Introduction to the Hidden Christian | Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region
Introduction to the Hidden Christian "_Kakure Kirishitan_"

History of Christianity in Japan
Christians in Kyushu: A History





Kosho Ryu Kempo - Take Over the World
Motivational reminder of the purpose behind the arts.


----------



## Attitude

Attitude said:


> Relevant and Motivational Links for those searching:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Discussion between Nimr Hassan (Terry Lee) and Bruce Juchnick
> 
> Kosho Ryu Timeline
> Genshichi Kosho - 19th descendant Headmaster and Inheritor of Kosho Ryu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Professor Scott Merrill, student of Professor John Chow-Hoon
> 
> Page 2133 of the translation of Mitose's Trial
> "I learned Kempo in a large temple in a mountain named Akenkai." -- Note the translation 'Akenkai'
> 
> View attachment 22158
> 
> Mt Kinkai
> Mt. Kinkai, Nagasaki, Kyushu, Japan
> 
> Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region
> Hidden Christian sites in the Nagasaki Region
> 
> Introduction to the Hidden Christian | Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region
> Introduction to the Hidden Christian "_Kakure Kirishitan_"
> 
> History of Christianity in Japan
> Christians in Kyushu: A History
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kosho Ryu Kempo - Take Over the World
> Motivational reminder of the purpose behind the arts.


----------



## Attitude

Attitude said:


>


----------



## Attitude

Attitude said:


>


----------

