# Respect- Given Or Earned?



## D.Cobb

Ok here's the question. 

Do you believe that respect, should be given, or earned?

Some people say that respect should be earned, but then tell me I should respect them automatically.

What makes them so special?

Others say that respect is a given. That it is up to you to keep it, by your actions, words and deeds.

I am wondering what you guys and gals have to say on this subject.

--Dave

:asian:


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## James Kovacich

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *Ok here's the question.
> 
> Do you believe that respect, should be given, or earned?
> 
> Some people say that respect should be earned, but then tell me I should respect them automatically.
> 
> What makes them so special?
> 
> Others say that respect is a given. That it is up to you to keep it, by your actions, words and deeds.
> 
> I am wondering what you guys and gals have to say on this subject.
> 
> --Dave
> 
> :asian: *



Both. From me to you, you've earned my respect "overtime". If I didn't know and you walked into my class then a "mutual" respect is called for as well as a student to sensei respect.

In any case, respect can be lost for a number of reasons.

:asian:


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## stickarts

I also say Both!
I think you should approach others with respect, however, if you are trying to teach someone or lead someone, you should expect that you will have to earn their respect to function in that role.


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## Nightingale

if someone has earned a black belt, they have earned my respect as a martial artist.


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## Jay Bell

> if someone has earned a black belt, they have earned my respect as a martial artist.



How so?  Isn't a martial artist a human being?  How is a black belt reason for handing respect to someone?

I've known some shadey black belts in my life...they never did anything to deserve my respect.

<playing devil's advocate>


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## theletch1

> I've known some shadey black belts in my life...they never did anything to deserve my respect.



Kinda hard to play devil's advocate with this one given that so many threads here deal with shadey blackbelts but I'm sure someone will take the bait.

As for the respect, my initial response was to say earned.  But, then I began reading here and have to agree with the "both" answer.  I suppose I always looked at the first meeting of people as a matter of common decency rather than respect but it does indeed fall into that catagory.  Respect is so much more easily lost than regained.  

The respect that is initially given is, IMO, a little different than the respect that is earned over time.  Respect given is often given to a position of authority rather than to an individual.  Respect earned is given to who the individual truly is.  

While in the military we used to use the phrase "You respect the rank not the man." to reconcile having to follow someone who was so obviously not deserving of respect as an individual.  The same goes for the dojo...with a caveat.  We had no choice in the matter in the military.  We have a choice in the dojo.  If you are at a school in which you have lost your respect for your instructor then you must decide for yourself whether or not you can continue to learn from someone you cannot respect.  In my case, I left.  I am firm believer in balancing mind, body and SPIRIT within the martial arts and must be able to see that my instructor has reached a certain level of balance to keep my respect and I cannot train with someone I cannot respect.


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## Bob Hubbard

Rank can be bought.  (cost of a black belt is only $3+S/H)

Respect can't be.  Not in the true sense.

I believe it has to be earned.  

I think theres a difference though in treating someone in a respectful manner and having respect for them.  Its grey, but its a levels thing.  It can go from simply saying 'please' and 'thankyou' or holding a door, all the way up to 'hero worship'.

I respect that my instructor will respect me and not cripple me or cause me harm for example.  When one of the grandmasters visit, I will be respectful due to their reputation, however I need to interact with them a while before they earn my respect at the higher levels.  

Hope that makes sense.


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## RCastillo

I go with both.:asian:


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## Disco

theletch1 is right on the money with the Military analogy.

But let me take it just a small step further and just deal with the dojo/dojang. When most people get involved with the martial arts, they come with some predetermined expectations and what I like to call "The Eastern Mystic Mindset". They automatically regard the instructor with a higher level of respect. Even more so if that person is of oriental extraction. Unlike the military, where it dosen't take very long to find out if the new LT. is a jerk, the instructor student relationship takes for the most part a good bit longer. I know in my case it took several years and gaining an understanding of the politics that underscores the martial arts in general. To my discredit, I considered myself old school. I gave my loyality and respect freely because I had the EMM. But then again, I started my journey back in the early 60's before the overall degradation of the arts that we now have. When I continued with the journey in the 80's, that's when this came about. Just so you don't think it took me over 20 years to catch on. I'm married with children, but I'm not Al Bundy.  

So yes, like the military you respect the rank but you should initially respect the person, just for their accomplishments in the arts. Only time can prove if the initial respect/honor is justified.
:asian:


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## ob2c

Respect is both given automatically and earned, but it is not an all or nothing proposition. Respect is given or lost in degrees, and may co-exist with disrespect in the same individual. I could respect a ma's skill and rank, but have seriouse questions abut his character. You may be accorded some ammount of respect upon meeting someone, especially in a structured environment like a ma school. You gain more respect from them as you are willing to help juniors and learn from seniors, and as you step on the mat and take the hits. But you could loose respect by berating people or trying to hurt someone. It's not an absolute, either initially or as you get to know someone.


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## stickarts

Some great posts!


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## clapping_tiger

I say both also. But in my opinion the respect that is earned runs much deeper that the type that is given. I try to respect everyone I meet, but that respect can disappear pretty fast. But my friends, family, coworkers, and my instructor and fellow students have earned a different type of respect. This is what I think true respect is, the type that is earned. The automatic "fellow human being" respect doesn't mean as much, even though I feel everyone should be shown respect untill they show they do not deserve it.


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## A.R.K.

> if someone has earned a black belt, they have earned my respect as a martial artist.



Would this be BB's that took 5 or more years to be earned, or ones that were earned in 2 years?

Would this be BB's in ALL styles/systems/disciplines?

Would this be the BB earned in a McDojo, but he/she doesn't know the difference yet works very hard.

Would this be the student who earned a BB then quit 15 years ago because that was there goal?

Would this be the BB that is helpful & humble or the one that is the self-appointed guardian of all that is holy in the MA's?

Not bustin your chops   But it was an open statement that I felt needed closer attention.

:asian:


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## Rich Parsons

Respect Given or Earned?

Short Answer: Both.

Long Answer:

When I meet someone new I give them the basi respect of meetnig someone new.

When, I come across people who are older than me (* i.e. 60+ *) I give them respect for their age and the life they have lived. If I learn after that, that they do not deserve my respect then I do not offer it. These are generalities.

When I meet a lady, I offer my respect. (* note if she steps onto the mats though, then she is either a student or a teacher, and has my respect as either, not just as a women. *)

In general I offer it in a limited manner until you prove yourself to me. Who am I to have anyone prove themselves to me? I am the one who is either going to or not going to offer his respect. There are those I do not respect yet I am forced to work with them and can do this.

Have a nice day


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## LostGrrlDies

It *always* depends on the situation.

A great professor once said, "It depends." He made sure that if we learned nothing else under his instruction that we would always know, "it depends." Hence, now when asked a question it is my favorite initial response. 

It depends. Blahblahblah.

It depends. Yaddayaddayadda.

It depends. blabyaddablah.

Quite annoying to my friends, if you could imagine. Of course I only do it to mess with them, so they stop asking me so many silly questions.


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## gojukylie

I guess everybody will think differently on this one. I would have to say in my opinion, that respect has always got to be earned. No matter what belt, as mentioned above. 

There is a difference between respect and courtesy. Respect is something that you have for somebody who has earned your trust or you admire for certain reasons. Courtesy may be just that in your dojo rules, bowing is a regulation for senior students and you comply. It may be that one of these senior students whom you know personally, may have a nature you know is of bad intent. Because they are your senior, does that mean your bow out of respect or courtesy. That is the difference.

Being on the other end of the topic, I believe it is more important to earn respect from others. In a work situation I have seen many new people come in, do their thing, without regard for others and within a few weeks they become uncomfortable and leave. They don't understand that the respect they desire comes from listening to others and slowly, with patience and good nature, their respect will be earned. They leave and start all over again none the wiser. It is the same in the Dojo.

I like to think of it as repainting a house. You can grab a brush and start painting over the old stuff and get it done in a few hours, or you can sand back the old stuff, prep the surface and slowly and neatly repaint the house. It takes so much longer but the finish is worth the viewing.  Respect works the same way. Respect has a  balance. The deeper you earn it, the longer it remains. The quicker you find it the sooner you lose it. :asian:


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## cali_tkdbruin

> _Originally posted by nightingale8472 _
> *if someone has earned a black belt, they have earned my respect as a martial artist. *



I beg to differ nightingale, I respect your opinion, but I have to disagree.

There are plenty of BLACKs who are arrogant Assh____s who don't deserve any type of respect. Just because they earned their BLACK some think that they're all knowing Yodas. IMHO, a person needs to earn respect, and not expect it because of their rank or standing. 

I evaluate the person first,  and see how they comport themselves. I don't give a rat's *** about their rank, or standing.
I must be American huh? It's not someone's standing or rank that I respect, it's the person I respect... :asian:


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## Seigi

As Human Beings we should have respect for all, no matter if they are a martial artist or a stranger, with the understanding that it can be lost due to the lack of respect from the other individual.

Also, Rank does not automatically earn respect, Just like i stated above, Show it, if it's not returned (no matter the rank) then it is lost.


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## Nightingale

> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> *I beg to differ nightingale, I respect your opinion, but I have to disagree.
> 
> There are plenty of BLACKs who are arrogant Assh____s who don't deserve any type of respect. Just because they earned their BLACK some think that they're all knowing Yodas. IMHO, a person needs to earn respect, and not expect it because of their rank or standing.
> 
> I evaluate the person first,  and see how they comport themselves. I don't give a rat's *** about their rank, or standing.
> I must be American huh? It's not someone's standing or rank that I respect, it's the person I respect... :asian: *



I said that if they'd earned a black belt, they had my respect AS A MARTIAL ARTIST.  

Respect for them as a human being is automatic.

Respect for them as a person/individual... now THAT one takes a long time to earn...

I can respect someone for their martial arts skills and hold a low opinion of their moral character, and vice versa.


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## Senfeng

I believe that respect should always be given automatically; especially if you've never met the person before.  I also believ that it CAN be earned or increased, but can also be lost.


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## cali_tkdbruin

> _Originally posted by Senfeng _
> *I believe that respect should always be given automatically; especially if you've never met the person before.  I also believ that it CAN be earned or increased, but can also be lost. *



I don't know sportsfans, at least I will agree that we're not on the same page on this topic.

Respect is earned, not automatically given IMHO... :asian:


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## Senfeng

> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> *I don't know sportsfans, at least I will agree that we're not on the same page on this topic.
> 
> Respect is earned, not automatically given IMHO... :asian: *


Well... its what I believe.   All I'm saying is that I tend to give everyone the benefit of the doubt before casting judgement on them.  They may do something to increase or decrease that level of respect by their actions.


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## Rich Parsons

> _Originally posted by LostGrrlDies _
> *It always depends on the situation.
> 
> A great professor once said, "It depends." He made sure that if we learned nothing else under his instruction that we would always know, "it depends." Hence, now when asked a question it is my favorite initial response.
> 
> It depends. Blahblahblah.
> 
> It depends. Yaddayaddayadda.
> 
> It depends. blabyaddablah.
> 
> Quite annoying to my friends, if you could imagine. Of course I only do it to mess with them, so they stop asking me so many silly questions. *



I agree it always depends upon the situation


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## Ender

> _Originally posted by Rich Parsons _
> *Respect Given or Earned?
> 
> Short Answer: Both.
> 
> Long Answer:
> 
> When I meet someone new I give them the basi respect of meetnig someone new.
> 
> When, I come across people who are older than me (* i.e. 60+ *) I give them respect for their age and the life they have lived. If I learn after that, that they do not deserve my respect then I do not offer it. These are generalities.
> 
> When I meet a lady, I offer my respect. (* note if she steps onto the mats though, then she is either a student or a teacher, and has my respect as either, not just as a women. *)
> 
> In general I offer it in a limited manner until you prove yourself to me. Who am I to have anyone prove themselves to me? I am the one who is either going to or not going to offer his respect. There are those I do not respect yet I am forced to work with them and can do this.
> 
> Have a nice day *



Excellent. an Initial and basic respect is given, and dimishes or grows after some time.


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## Lunumbra

I always try to be courteous to all people when I first meet them. From there, I evaluate them from my POV. I try to give folks a second chance, if they do something that I find offensive, I don't base a judgement of them on one incident. But I DO REMEMBER . . . if the negatives start to stack up . . .  

Lunumbra


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## DAC..florida

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *Ok here's the question.
> 
> Do you believe that respect, should be given, or earned?
> 
> Some people say that respect should be earned, but then tell me I should respect them automatically.
> 
> What makes them so special?
> 
> Others say that respect is a given. That it is up to you to keep it, by your actions, words and deeds.
> 
> I am wondering what you guys and gals have to say on this subject.
> 
> --Dave
> 
> :asian: *



Respect is given and you must earn the right to keep it!:asian:


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## gojukylie

I agree with the principle behind your comments but I must genuinley say that I am 'Courteous' to all people, including strangers. From there if I get to know them, then they may earn their respect. I try not to confuse coutesy with respect.


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## Nightingale

> _Originally posted by DAC..florida _
> *Respect is given and you must earn the right to keep it!:asian: *




That's it exactly!!!!!!!

Well said!

:asian:


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## KennethKu

> _Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz _
> *Rank can be bought.  (cost of a black belt is only $3+S/H)*


* 

Got mine for $2.50. It was on sale.  

Seriously, I don't respect any belt or rank or anything, any more than I would respect the person himself/herself.  

The only thing that count is the character of the person and content of his/her conduct.  I would (and I have) spit on a blackbelt or a master anyday, and I would bestow the highest respect to the lowest rank and file anyday.  The underlying factor is what kind of a person he/she is, nor his/her rank or belt or status.*


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## KennethKu

> _Originally posted by nightingale8472 _
> *I said that if they'd earned a black belt, they had my respect AS A MARTIAL ARTIST.
> 
> Respect for them as a human being is automatic.
> 
> Respect for them as a person/individual... now THAT one takes a long time to earn...
> 
> I can respect someone for their martial arts skills and hold a low opinion of their moral character, and vice versa. *



If the guy is a scum ball, I wouldn't walk over the street to piss on him if he is on fire, no matter what his martial art skill is or is not.


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## IsshinryuKarateGirl

In my dojo, the respect comes from both ways.  You are always told to respect the person's rank, so some respect comes from that.  But other respect you have to earn.  I myself have definately had to earn a lot of respect, as a student and a female in the MA.


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## tshadowchaser

> _Originally posted by IssinryuKarateGirl _
> *In my dojo, the respect comes from both ways.  You are always told to respect the person's rank, so some respect comes from that.  But other respect you have to earn.  *



Great answere. It should be both ways. A person should be respcted because of their accomplishments but should also earn that respect by what they do


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## LostGrrlDies

i am a 24 yo white belt. so as you can all see there are quite a few black belts younger than myself. i do not respect all of the black belts in my school on the same level. Some of them share the same rank and age but not the same discipline. I am more than willing to learn from a 16 yo. However, that 16 yo has to be willing to teach me. Some are, some arent. You can imagine which do and dont receive my respect. :shrug:


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## James Kovacich

> _Originally posted by LostGrrlDies _
> *i am a 24 yo white belt. so as you can all see there are quite a few black belts younger than myself. i do not respect all of the black belts in my school on the same level. Some of them share the same rank and age but not the same discipline. I am more than willing to learn from a 16 yo. However, that 16 yo has to be willing to teach me. Some are, some arent. You can imagine which do and dont receive my respect. :shrug: *



Its a difficult situation sometimes. At 16, they may not "understand" teaching. Earning a belt does make a teacher.

:asian:


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## cali_tkdbruin

> _Originally posted by KennethKu _
> *Got mine for $2.50. It was on sale.
> 
> Seriously, I don't respect any belt or rank or anything, any more than I would respect the person himself/herself.
> 
> The only thing that count is the character of the person and content of his/her conduct.  I would (and I have) spit on a blackbelt or a master anyday, and I would bestow the highest respect to the lowest rank and file anyday.  The underlying factor is what kind of a person he/she is, nor his/her rank or belt or status. *



Thank you, you and I are on the same page on this issue. It's the person his or herself who should be respected, and not their over-hyped rank.. :asian:


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## theletch1

Respect, like love is a human concept that has as many slight variations on definition as the people that espouse the concept.  Websters has a definition for both words but I don't think anyone would say that that definition is EXACTLY what they would call respect or love.  Do I love my parents? sure.  Do I love my wife? Certainly.  Do I love a good cup of coffee? Indeed. But none of these "loves" are the same.  To put respect in the same light... Do I respect the person on the street that I've just met, yes.  Do I respect the martial arts instructor who has proven to me that they are as dedicated to teaching as I am to learning? Certainly.  Do I respect the bear that I walked up on in the woods last fall? Oh, yeah.  But again, they are each completely different degrees of respect.

I know that the above paragraph doesn't do a lot to explain my answer on the first page of the thread but perhaps it will give just a little insight to my own thoughts during my answer.


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## Michael Billings

has an excellent answer, and the clarification helped.  Very insightful.  

I agree in theory and practice.  A nice distinction and comparison.

-MB


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> *IMHO, a person needs to earn respect, and not expect it because of their rank or standing. *





> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> * It's not someone's standing or rank that I respect, it's the person I respect... :asian: *



So do you give them respect or do they have to earn it?
I'm not really talking about their rank just the person as a person.

--Dave
:asian:


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by DAC..florida _
> *Respect is given and you must earn the right to keep it!:asian: *



I like this answer. This is what I try to do, but I'm still learning how to do it.

--Dave

:asian:


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by IsshinryuKarateGirl _
> *In my dojo, the respect comes from both ways.  You are always told to respect the person's rank, so some respect comes from that.  But other respect you have to earn.  I myself have definately had to earn a lot of respect, as a student and a female in the MA. *



Do you feel you have to earn it, or do you feel that you deserve respect?

Are there times, where you feel you don't deserve respect?
If so, why?

What about people outside the MA? Do you give them your respect or must they earn it?

If they have to earn your respect, do you expect theirs, or must you earn it?

Do you see where I'm going with this line of questioning?

--Dave

:asian:


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## D.Cobb

Thanks people for making this a very interesting thread.

I suppose I should shed some light on the why I asked the original question....

Up until a few years ago, I was a very arrogant person. I was also very aggressive and ready to fight, most times with out a reason.

I used to argue that you had to earn my respect. I would however expect yours........
Do you see where I'm going with this, or indeed where I'm coming from?
I would treat you like dirt until you earnt my respect, and then fight you or turn  you away if you did the same to me....

Kind of screwy, huh?

--Dave

:asian:


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> *I don't know sportsfans, at least I will agree that we're not on the same page on this topic.
> 
> Respect is earned, not automatically given IMHO... :asian: *



So if I need to earn yours, what did you do to get mine?

--Dave

:asian:


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## theletch1

> Kind of screwy, huh



Kinda human, actually.  I think if we are honest with ourselves at the least, most of us would have to admit to having the "I know I'm worthy of your respect, but you gotta prove your worthy of mine." mindset at some point in our lives.  I know I have and am certain that no matter how much I work on it there will be other occasions where I will find myself thinking the same way.  It's not a constant mindset but one that I find just pops up once in a while.


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## IsshinryuKarateGirl

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *Do you feel you have to earn it, or do you feel that you deserve respect?
> 
> Are there times, where you feel you don't deserve respect?
> If so, why?
> 
> What about people outside the MA? Do you give them your respect or must they earn it?
> 
> If they have to earn your respect, do you expect theirs, or must you earn it?
> 
> Do you see where I'm going with this line of questioning?
> 
> --Dave
> 
> :asian: *



Well, I feel that respect is something you have to earn.  People outside the MAs defiantely have to earn my respect.  My basic viewpoint is this:  "If you respect me, I respect you."  There are certain instances where this viewpoint doesn't apply, but there aren't too many.


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## TallAdam85

i feel if they give me respect i give them respect
but i think you can also earn more respect from people and get more respect toward them.


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## Nightingale

the problem is...

if everyone walked around with the attitude of

"I offer respect to those who offer it to me..."

what would happen is that nobody would do the initial offer, and therefore, nobody would get any respect at all!


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## cali_tkdbruin

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *So do you give them respect or do they have to earn it?
> I'm not really talking about their rank just the person as a person.
> 
> --Dave
> :asian: *



Yes, I do respect the person as a person primarily, and also their accomplishments.



> *So if I need to earn yours, what did you do to get mine?*




Treat you and others the way I would expect to be treated.  It sounds trivial right? But it is true IMHO. Just because I may have a high ranking, it  doesn't necessarily give me the right to be an asswipe, and to be condescending or denegrating to others does it?

BTW, this is a good topic for discussion... :asian:


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by nightingale8472 _
> *the problem is...
> 
> if everyone walked around with the attitude of
> 
> "I offer respect to those who offer it to me..."
> 
> what would happen is that nobody would do the initial offer, and therefore, nobody would get any respect at all! *



Yeah, that's the point I was trying to make, but I must have had a big brain cramp, because the words just came out wrong....

--Dave
:asian:


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by cali_tkdbruin _
> *Yes, I do respect the person as a person primarily, and also their accomplishments.
> 
> *
> 
> *Treat you and others the way I would expect to be treated.  It sounds trivial right? But it is true IMHO. Just because I may have a high ranking, it  doesn't necessarily give me the right to be an asswipe, and to be condescending or denegrating to others does it?*



And therein lies the original question, or maybe it is the answer, I'm none too sure at this stage, you treat me and others as you would like to be treated...... *with RESPECT* .

So now we see that respect is given. Of course, if I treat you disrespectfully, then I am going to lose yours. But initially I am thinking we all in effect give it, with the option to remove it at our own discretion. Where some might say respect has to be earned, I think maybe we should be saying, *the right to keep my respect has to be earned.* 



> *BTW, this is a good topic for discussion... :asian:*


 Thanks, it is certainly providing food for thought.

--Dave

:asian:


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## James Kovacich

> _Originally posted by nightingale8472 _
> *the problem is...
> 
> if everyone walked around with the attitude of
> 
> "I offer respect to those who offer it to me..."
> 
> what would happen is that nobody would do the initial offer, and therefore, nobody would get any respect at all! *



There it is there!

We were brought up in the arts "GIVING" respect without any thoughts about it. A few people I train with still are that way as I try hard to be too. But some people today just don't have a clue!

:asian:


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## Rick Tsubota

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *Ok here's the question.
> 
> Do you believe that respect, should be given, or earned?
> 
> Some people say that respect should be earned, but then tell me I should respect them automatically.
> 
> What makes them so special?
> 
> Others say that respect is a given. That it is up to you to keep it, by your actions, words and deeds.
> 
> I am wondering what you guys and gals have to say on this subject.
> 
> --Dave
> 
> :asian: *




Respect is given only after it is earned..........not before.
(My opinion)


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## D.Cobb

> _Originally posted by Rick Tsubota _
> *Respect is given only after it is earned..........not before.
> (My opinion) *




Ok, I can see where you are coming from, but my question now is this, would you expect me to show you respect from the moment we meet, or would you understand if I turned away. Would you say, "that's ok. I have to earn his respect." or would you be really pissed off and say, "Well if you won't show me respect, then I won't show you any!"?

--Dave

:asian:


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## arnisador

Thread moved.

-Arnisador
-MT Admin-


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## Mudo Warrior

Obviously as an act of courtesy we show other martial artist of all ranks respect.  Or I should say we treat them in a respectful way.  However, until we see some type of action from them that is as deep as it goes.  I would also say that a person could earn my respect for different reasons.  He/she may have great technique or be an outstanding fighter.  Then he/she may not have very good technique or may not be a good fighter but still this person might be a very kind and helpful person.  This too is worthy of my respect as a martial artist, is it not?  I beleive that at first we treat all people respectfully as a common courtesy, but true respect must be earned.


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## inbuninbu

Let's make a distinction between respect and admiration. I respect all people just for being human, but on top of that there are people who I admire because of what they have done or who they are. And this doesnt necessarily have anything to do with rank or station (whether in society or the martial arts class). For example, there is a red belt at my school who could do with learning a bit more control, she is very aggressive and quite imploite at times. Then there is a guy my own rank who I watched fall over several times during his most recent grading. I admire/respect him so much more. 

I admire people for exhibiting qualities such as indomitably spirit, perseverance and self-sacrifice. I admire a person who is living their life in a fashion that incorporates integrity, effort and honesty in its very centre. I absolutely cannot respect people who are blatantly hypocritical, extremely lazy and never work towards anything or people who have committed a gross error in terms of loyalty (I have an anachronistic "samurai" view of the absolute loyalty to friends and "masters").

I think different things make different people respect others for different reasons.


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## Hapkidomom

This question is a good one.  My two kids train in Hapkido and have worked their tails off to achieve their blue belt rank.  I have a serious problem with two particular students at the school - another blue belt - who rides on the coat tails of my kids.  He deliberately pairs up with my kids during testing and forces them to do their technique demonstrations first so he can mimick their moves.  My kids make him look good and, so far, their instructor has not caught on.  During their recent belt testing, the instructor presented him with his belt first so, according to his whippersnapper, he is higher ranked, races to the front of the blue belts and is now telling the other students he deserves their respect since he is the "senior" blue belt????????  Their instructor who boasts of how observative he is, has yet to observe this display.  Should this kid be given respect because he earned his belt on the hard work of others?  Should this kid be given respect because he was handed his belt first, despite the fact that he was tested and passed at the same time as three others?  

We also have a junior black belt (first Dan) at the school who has been attending the school for almost 10 years.  This little gent has the same attitude - that he deserves respect because he is a black belt.  He attends class regularly and is sloppy.  This kid's mom drops him off after school and uses the dojang as a babysitter.  While I can understand that there is nothing at home for this kid, I don't agree with this black belt superiority complex and feel that the instructor should play a major role in structuring this kid's attitude since he is at the school so much.  I have no respect whatsoever for anyone with attitude or who plays head games just because they have a black belt.

Traditional martial arts were based on humility, hard work, compassion for others, dedication, etc.  What has happened to the foundation that martial arts was based on?

I say, show me what martial arts is truly about and you will have my respect.


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## jdubakki

my opinion is that respect is earned. in first meeting someone i try to give acceptance not respect. or mabey it is a different type of respect i respect them for being there. later on this respect/acceptance turns to a respect for them as a person

just my rambling


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## TigerWoman

Respect is consideration or regard toward a fellow human being.  Everyone should be given respect.  Basic respect is shown with patience and tolerance. More respect is shown with recognition, appreciation and maybe friendship.  The highest level of respect is too honor, esteem, pay deference to, often with affection.  What level of respect would a MA instructor have?  A teacher who adheres to a set of moral, mental, and physical standards deserves a higher level of respect.  A teacher earns this high respect because of his/her attaining these goals.  

However, this respect is not permanent and can be lost quickly.  Because to be a good instructor, he/she must maintain if not improve. But we know all know even teachers make mistakes.  Respect can be regained just as quickly with humility and changed ways.  Most everyone wants to be forgiven.  Does everyone feel they are sorry, truly sorry and mean it?  Only God knows what is in their heart if they cannot have humility and say I'm sorry.  It is not very difficult to forgive someone when they are truly sorrowful at hurting you. In fact, it is easy to forgive then. But why should an instructor or any of us apologize for our mistakes?  Because, the more someone is hurt in this world, the more they are distrustful.  Distrust leads to wanting their own way or thinking only of themselves.  They disregard thinking of others, how they may be hurt from their actions and more of this way of thinking is then propagated in a never ending circle. 

 A good instructor should be open to different and especially overwhelming opposition to his viewpoint.  Each instructor should ask themselves, could I be wrong, should I make amends?  A teacher is watched by both students and parents alike and they are learning whatever is taught, intentional or not.  

Having humility could be the difference between high respect (earned) and the base level of respect granted any human being.  Would you give respect to a bum on the street?  You cannot judge his circumstances why he/she got there.  But for the grace of God go I. It could be you. If that person was shown respect that he is worth something, he might gain courage to become better. 

Respect and humility are closely related. After all, is it not easy to admire and respect someone more when there is humility in the presence of strength?

This was part of what was written for my 2nd dan test for a required paper by my instructor who is a 5th Dan, specifically with him in mind.  He asked for a paper "What are the requirements for becoming a good instructor? He had no comment on my paper at the end.  He has yet to apologize to me for a series of mistakes, though I have forgiven him and have to continue to forgive him.  I respect him as well as anyone and while in class I bow to him as martial arts courtesy, but not as a teacher who I can honor or trust.  He professes humility but shows none. This is not just my viewpoint in my school - many have left.


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## arnisandyz

Some very good posts!  Let me just add the element of self-respect. Self-respect is definatley earned, you can't just say 'I repect myself!" if there are things you have done that you know are wrong, you will have to live with it. Once a person achieves a level of self-respect they are likely to be more understanding of others.

"In my day, we didn't have self-esteem, we had self-respect, and no more of it than we had earned"

"The capacity for getting along with our neighbor depends to a large extent on the capacity for getting along with ourselves. The self-respecting individual will try to be as tolerant of his neighbor's shortcomings as he is of his own."

"To free us from the expectations of others, to give us back to ourselves--there lies the great, singular power of self-respect."


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## Kevin Walker

Hi Guys,

My opinion is that Respect is earned, common courtesy is given.


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## Flatlander

How ironic is this?:rofl:


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## TigerWoman

So true--double meaning as in a cat chasing its tail...

When its earned its given.  When its given, its earned to be given back.

Further, when its lost, it has to be re-earned. 

A little respect given will result in a little respect back.

But humility shown, as a I'm sorry, HEARTFELT, not just words, will go a long way in getting respect back.

But some people have no clue. They just demand respect because they are the MASTER and it doesn't matter what they have done or continue doing.
TW


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## kenpo tiger

One can respect someone's _rank_ for the knowledge it symbolizes.  

One cannot respect someone of higher rank _just because_ of that rank.  

The person must demonstrate that he/she is worthy of respect as _a person_ through her/his actions and how he/she treats her/his fellow human beings.

You can be incredibly knowledgeable of your art and still be an idiot.  I've had some as instructors.  Great martial artists - lousy human beings.

No one is entitled to anything without earning it.:asian: KT


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## Feisty Mouse

When I first meet someone with a particular rank - or even meeting a new person for the first time - I will treat them with respect.  After that, however, they can lose that respect through their words/actions/intent.  

And someone who I didn't have a high opinion of can certainly earn new respect, given their behavior.  

I start out assuming the best in people (which sometimes leads to massive disappointment), respecting a high rank and the work it entailed to get there, and go from there.


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## lvwhitebir

Feisty Mouse,  I agree completely!  Respect them because they are a human being.  They can lose your respect, but some level of respect should be present when you first meet someone.  IMO, respect, courtesy, and generosity all go together.

WhiteBirch


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## lvwhitebir

kenpo tiger said:
			
		

> No one is entitled to anything without earning it.



I disagree.  Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness come to mind.  I believe I'm entitled to some level of respect simply because I'm a person.  The definition of respect that I teach my students is "to treat someone or something as if it's valuable."  You can then "respect your elders" or "respect your property."

Giving something without it being earned is always harder to do and makes you the better person (IMO).

WhiteBirch


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## Trent

As related in the post above, there is a minimum amount of respect due to anyone simply because they exist as a person.  Beyond that, you have to earn it.  I would consider it as a certain amount of respect is accorded to all; through your actions you can increase it or reduce it.  When I use the word "all," I mean _all_.   No one gets more respect simply due to their rank, occupation or societally agreed upon authority status. No one gets less either.

It's an easy thing when you are a generally respectful person.  Of course, I expect the same of others.


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## DeLamar.J

D.Cobb said:
			
		

> Ok here's the question.
> 
> Do you believe that respect, should be given, or earned?
> 
> Some people say that respect should be earned, but then tell me I should respect them automatically.
> 
> What makes them so special?
> 
> Others say that respect is a given. That it is up to you to keep it, by your actions, words and deeds.
> 
> I am wondering what you guys and gals have to say on this subject.
> 
> --Dave
> 
> :asian:


I respect everyone I meet, but those who I feel have earned respect get a special kind of respect from me.


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## lvwhitebir

Trent said:
			
		

> there is a minimum amount of respect due to anyone simply because they exist as a person.  Beyond that, you have to earn it.



I agree to a point.  There are various levels of respect, from treating them like a human to treating them like a god.

My question is then how do you "earn it?"

Can you respect a person more than another because of their "station", either job or ability?  Can you respect someone more even if you've never met them?  For example, do you respect a police officer more than your 16-year-old neighbor?  What about soldiers in the armed forces?  What have they done to specifically "earn" someone's respect?

If this is true, can you respect a person who has spent more than 20 years in the martial arts *more* than the white belt next to you, both of whom you just met?

Do you respect a person more because they are famous?

WhiteBirch


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## Adept

lvwhitebir said:
			
		

> I believe I'm entitled to some level of respect simply because I'm a person.


 I disagree strongly. Simply being an intelligent bipedal life form should not automaticaly entitle anyone to anything. 

 With regards to the topic - Respect can only ever be given. It can never be earned. Sometimes you can do things which make it more likely to be given, but you can never force someone to give it to you.


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