# MartialTalk Policy updates and changes



## Bob Hubbard (May 26, 2003)

*MartialTalk Policy updates and changes:*

In the past few weeks several things have happened on this board that have caused concerns among both the staff and our members. These concerns cover a wide range of things. This is our attempt to address them.

First, a point of history.

MartialTalk.com was originally setup in August of 2001 to serve as a discussion forum for a regional web portal. It was never in my wildest dreams that it would be as popular as it is, and go truly world wide. In fact, it has long since outgrown and absorbed its parent site.

MartialTalk is for the friendly discussion of martial arts. The key here is this exact phase. My mental image of MartialTalk is a big living room, everyone relaxing with a cool beverage, chatting about their arts, swapping stories, news, techniques and info.

It is not a place to puff your chest, flex your muscles, get on the soapbox and rabble rouse. Nor is it the place to expose your dirty laundry, spread rumors and lies, stab in the back, and run smear campaigns.

It is not the place for egos, attitudes and agendas. 

We have seen the following problems over the recent few weeks flare up greatly. It is our growing concern that left unchecked, these issues will seriously damage, possibly destroy all the hard work we have all put into this site.


*1: Off Topic posts, and major thread drift.*
We have specific forums for specific areas. Please, use them. As our post count climbs higher, it is harder and harder for our staff to keep up with policing everything. We need your active- help. Please post on topic to each thread. If it starts to drift, help steer it back on track by a: -politely- bringing up the original topic and b: starting a new thread for the tangent.


*2: Fraud Busting.*
Every art has its frauds, fakers, and plain misguided folks. Some of them are obvious, some are not. The purpose of MartialTalk is not- to be the place thats the master list of who is legit and who is not. We have -one- forum target at the Bad Budo idea. If you have specific information on such things, post it there. The constant jumping from forum to forum and thread to thread of this desire by several well meaning folks to cleanse the arts and others who constantly feel the need to defend from attacks that often times arent even there is causing us to lock down an excessive number of threads. This cannot be allowed to continue.

Effective immediately, fraud busting outside of the realm of the Bad Budo forum will result in administrative actions against those involved when it disrupts the smooth operation of this forum. If you have concerns about someones rank/status it is to be handled via PM or email. You may post the results of that research in the Bad Budo forum if warranted. Educated martial artists will see the fraud for what he/she is and should just ignore them. This board was set up for friendly discussion of martial arts, not as a soapbox for people's personal crusades.

If you have questions, concerns, etc about someone or their 'qualifications', post it in the 'Bad Budo' forum and address it there -within our guidelines-. Interrogator type posts will not be tolerated any further. Post your questions, and give the others time to answer. The non-responsivness of an individual should be enough. 


*3: Lack of respect or tolerance for differing opinions.*
Frankly, we are tired of the arguments about gender, race, nationality, etc. We are tired of those supposedly educated, experienced, trained martial artists, who tend to regress to school yard bully mentalities and tactics.

Effective immediately, we will begin removing those members who disrupt the smooth operation of this forum. If you cannot follow our rules, if you cannot leave your attitude at the door, we do not want you here. 

There is a difference between a debate and an argument. We welcome debate, as long as it is within our posted guidelines. Take your argument and flames elsewhere. 

The harassment of members, the hiding behind the youre not an XXX so you wouldnt understand, the you master sucks, etc. stuff will stop. Now. I dont care if he thinks hes a Sith-Lord and you know he is nuts. It will cease, immediately.


*4: Adult Content / profanity*
Recently, many posts have skirted the line on mature content. Let me be very specific. If its of a sexual nature it is probably too far. If you cant say it with out cursing like a truck driver, it is probably too far. If you have to reedit your post as its got lots of *** in it, its too far, and if you change all the *** stuff so that your words mostly show up, you will be booted. Circumventing the filters is a suspendable offense, and will be more strongly enforced in the future. We have at least a 5-10% membership under the age of 14. 


*5: The General forum is not the everything goes here forum.*
If it does not involve martial arts, it goes in the locker room, unless it is a joke, in which case it goes in the humor forum. If you need help, post it in the support forum, not buried 50 posts deep in a thread wondering why we don't reply.



We are working to find ways to resolve the issues that have been brought to our attention. This will take time, and it will require the assistance of our members. 1500 members, 10 mods. Theres a lot more members than staff.


This forum and its features is here for your use and enjoyment. It is up to you on how you behave here. You can treat it as a prized resource, or a toilet. Those who do the latter will rapidly be removed.


My staff and I are your hosts. You are all our guests. We expect you to behave as such. We will remove at our discretion any and all those who we feel are not behaving by our rules. This will be done regardless of rank, title, previous contribution or political alignment. If you cannot follow our rules, the door is there. Dont let it hit you in the *** on your way out. We will honor ALL- remove my account requests immediately from this point on. No saves, no pauses. If you are suspended and whine, you will be banned. It is fair to ask why, but once told, take it like a grown up.

Before someone say this is singling out anyone in particular, it is not.


Any questions?


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## J-kid (May 26, 2003)

I for one injoy this forum and believe you are doing a great job.

I understand that you need rules to control the forum and keep it a friendly place to discuss martial arts.

Just dont end up going power crazy.


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## Master of Blades (May 26, 2003)

Now thats what I'm talking about! Damn, you guys have an answer for everything!


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## D_Brady (May 26, 2003)

Once again thanks for disrupting your time and life just to give us a place to visit.

 I can't imagin what goes on behind the scenes to keep this going again thanks.


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## Bob Hubbard (May 26, 2003)

Lots of hair pulling, thrown objects, and shouting. 

We want to make sure that MT is still around a year from now, with most of the same folks on board.  We're going to get a little stricter on enforcement of existing rules.

People are going to do what they are going to do.  We just clairified what is allowed, and how it is allowed.

Hopefully, after a brief 'settling in' period, we can relax again.  I myself hate having to 'drop the hammer' on folks.

:asian:


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## jukado1 (May 26, 2003)

for those that don't understand the need for some guidelines, go over to adcc and check out their forum board, see if you can find much martial arts of mma fight talk, then see if you can appreaceate what you have.   train hard, train smart.


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## Bob Hubbard (May 26, 2003)

1 of the other changes we have done recently, was to require members to disclose, at least to the admins, their full real name and location.

Now, some things can of course not be 100% verified.  However, if you say you are in Hamburg Germany, yet all of your posts come from Boise, Idaho, USA, well....theres a problem there.

New signups who fail to fill out the information in full are not validated, and the accounts are removed.  We tried sending a 'You missed something' email, but very few of those people provided the missing information.  So, we placed additional notices into the signup system, and just delete em if they aint complete.

As an example, guy signed up said his name was 'bob' and he was from 'bob'.   Now, I'm sure theres a town somewhere called 'bob', but darned if I know where it is.  Also, I only know of one 'bob' who needs no last name, but I doubt the uber-subgenius would signup here.  So, -delete-. 

We also have been enforcing the 'valid email address' policy, and are actively weeding the members list of abandoned accounts.  Another pruning will occur on July 1st, and notices will be going out to those folks who have not been back this year.  If you haven't visited with the past 6 months, your account will be deleted.  You can always sign up again. 


We are advertizing on Google and its affiliates at the moment, and a postcard mailing is going out starting Tuesday to 400 schools and instructors in New York State at a cost of $124.  This card is promoting MT and its webhosting capabilities, as well as use for marketing your school.  We are looking into magazine advertizing for the forum also. This all needs money to back it up. I encourage everyone who wants to see this place grow and expand to consider a sponsorship, be it a forum, a premium spot, or just listing your school.  If 10 people take out annual textcard spots on the schools page, it is = to 1000 postcards mailed out inviting more people to participate.


We are constantly striving to improve MT, and value all member feedback.

Thank you for your support and contributions.
:asian:


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## Gary5000 (Apr 29, 2004)

When will they come to Utah?


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 29, 2004)

The responce to the mailing wasn't too great, and the costs were more than the budget could handle.


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## Gary5000 (Apr 29, 2004)

Darn............................................................


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## RCastillo (Apr 29, 2004)

I blame all the IKKO people, they've run almost everybody off! :miffer:


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## Seig (Apr 29, 2004)

RCastillo said:
			
		

> I blame all the IKKO people, they've run almost everybody off! :miffer:


ahem, I saw that.


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## RCastillo (Apr 30, 2004)

Seig said:
			
		

> ahem, I saw that.



Just making sure you guys haven't forgotten about me! :uhyeah:


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## rschoon (May 2, 2004)

Kaith Rustaz said:
			
		

> *MartialTalk Policy updates and changes:*
> 
> 
> MartialTalk is for the friendly discussion of martial arts. The key here is this exact phase. My mental image of MartialTalk is a big living room, everyone relaxing with a cool beverage, chatting about their arts, swapping stories, news, techniques and info.
> ...




All I can say is thanks!!
This site is a great tool and doesnt need to be trashed!


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## Goldendragon7 (May 2, 2004)

RCastillo said:
			
		

> Just making sure you guys haven't forgotten about me! :uhyeah:



No, but if you dont stop the "off target" posting and *insults* we might!

 %-}


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## Cobra (May 16, 2004)

Kaith Rustaz said:
			
		

> *MartialTalk Policy updates and changes:*
> 
> In the past few weeks several things have happened on this board that have caused concerns among both the staff and our members. These concerns cover a wide range of things. This is our attempt to address them.
> 
> ...


The whole of Spira is rooting for us. Let us not let them down, ya!

And to think, that you never came floating out of the sky that one day.


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## 47MartialMan (Mar 5, 2005)

But what about a belief or opinion like:

I odnt believe in Chi......just an example...not my actual opinion

And what about ppposting a thread, not of personal opinion to read, respectively what others have to dsay about?

Like a "devils adovocate" or "suppose this"....


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 5, 2005)

As long as they don't violate our rules, tis fine.


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## 47MartialMan (Mar 5, 2005)

In those examples-do they?


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## Flatlander (Mar 6, 2005)

No.


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## 47MartialMan (Mar 6, 2005)

I happily take warning or criticism for whatever I post.


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## Melissa426 (Mar 7, 2005)

I just got edited for referring to unpopular politicians by the vernacular of the word for "anus."  
I don't pretend to not know that I was skirting the rules.

I have done it before and nothing happened. Is it because it just didn't get noticed?

And while the policy states cursing/profanity is prohibited, who draws the line?
Kaith?
Moderators?
Someone who reports my posts?

Thanks for your answers!


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## shesulsa (Mar 7, 2005)

Melissa, your prior mishap probably just got missed.  It can be hard to catch every little thing, but ... we try. :ultracool

 I sent you a PM about this.  For the record, all staff try to catch the circumvention of profanity as it is against the rules. The profanity filter here is designed to catch as much as reasonably possible and does not penalize the user.  So we ask users to let the filter do its job rather than try to work around it.

 If you have anymore questions, please feel free to ask away.

 Thanks again for your continued membership!

 Georgia Ketchmark
 MT Moderator


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 7, 2005)

Hi Melissa,
  We do get asked that a bit.   The short version is, we make the call based on what standards we want to maintain. When we come across a posible violation, we look at it in context and make a judgement call.  Basically, if you need to use it (profanity), just type it out and let the filter do it's thing.  We don't actually filter alot, just alot of variations of a few.

Thank you,
Bob

Heres the blurb from the forum rules:



> *Profanity and other "forbidden" terms.*
> MartialTalk strives to be a comfortable place for everyone, regardless of race, religion, age, gender, sexuality or nationality. To meet that goal, we maintain a list of 'banned' words and phrases. This list includes popular profanities, slurs and several phrases termed "hate speech". While we can not hope to cover them all, we do try to cover the most common ones and their variants within the English language.
> 
> While we acknowledge that standard "netiquette" is to self-censor by replacing some of the letters with other characters, we ask that you do not do that here. If you must use a term, please type it out in its entirety and allow our filter to do its job.
> ...


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## 47MartialMan (Mar 7, 2005)

And is there a designated place to place a public apology?


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 7, 2005)

Not really.  If someone feels it is needed for anything, best place would probably be the same forum the problem occured in. 

Then again, I do wonder if an official "sorry" forum would get more traffic than the Announcement forum?  hmmm......


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## Michael Billings (Mar 7, 2005)

No. Just deal with it in-thread, or send a PM to the involved person. You can always note in-thread that you are dealing with this via email or PM.

  -Michael

 PS - sorry Bob, posting at the same time - MB


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## 47MartialMan (Mar 7, 2005)

Believe me when I state-I truely do not intend to offend.


Geez-This ryhmes!


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## donald (Nov 24, 2006)

I have, and do enjoy this site. I hope you are able to keep it user friendly, for all.

1stJohn1:9


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## Dr Rubin Frank Rhode (May 18, 2008)

Dear Bob Hubbard Sensei
Thank you so much for the martialtalk.com website. It is great for us in South Africa toshare with so many Fellow Martial Artist globally. May your site go from strength to strength, and continue to promote the world of Martial Arts. Once again,thank you so much.

Yours in the Spirit of Budo/Wushu
Dr Rubin Frank Rhode, Sensei (Godan)


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## Sniped5050 (Sep 23, 2011)

Thanks for providing an organized forum for information and round table discussions. your forum provides an area where new comers such as myself can grow and have multiple sources for useful information as opposed to limited opinions. I am sure many, if not all appriciate your hard work as I do.


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## Josh Oakley (Dec 21, 2011)

I think this is a good thing happening. Thanks Bob, for keeping things friendly!


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## DennisBreene (Jul 14, 2012)

I've found that this site privides an enormous variety of styles and opinions to explore. I also use it as a great place to relax.  Thanks for keeping the standards high. As an old school practitioner I believe in the tenets of humility, dedication, and respect. I don't need to waste my time on one upsmanship and egos.
Dennis


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## Manseau (May 31, 2013)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Thank you for your support and contributions.
> :asian:


Bob, I recently painted my self in a corner in one of the discussion forums. I appreciated being given enough rope to rectify my own stupidity without having been shown the door. I like the people on this site and they seem to be a good bunch. When I have repaired the damage I've done to myself, I'll repost my personal info in the settings. Thanks for a great site and your efforts to keep it that way. I'll make every effort to do my part.  Regards, David


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## Carol (May 31, 2013)

Manseau said:


> Bob, I recently painted my self in a corner in one of the discussion forums. I appreciated being given enough rope to rectify my own stupidity without having been shown the door. I like the people on this site and they seem to be a good bunch. When I have repaired the damage I've done to myself, I'll repost my personal info in the settings. Thanks for a great site and your efforts to keep it that way. I'll make every effort to do my part.  Regards, David



David, many posters here have gotten caught up in a controversial subject and gotten a bit carried away, but very few have had the courage to apologize.  As someone who has been here for quite awhile, I think that says more about your true colors than anything else.  Personally, I'm very glad you joined us here and I hope you keep posting! :asian:


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## jks9199 (May 31, 2013)

Additionally...  You're required to provide a real name and real location.  You are NOT required to make that information public.  If you look at my profile, you'll see my first name only, and a region.  You can't see the full name and location that I provided.  That's always an option for any user...  If you look at your profile, you'll see two slots for Real Name.  One says "REQ Real Name"; the other says "Real Name".  That second one is the one that shows publicly; it can say anything from your full legal name to whatever...  or nothing at all.  Same thing with the Location.


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