# TOP 10 Heavyweights of all time!



## Dragon Fist (Dec 9, 2004)

Who are on the top 10 Heavyweight Boxers on your list?

Here is mine.

Joe Louis
Muhammad Ali
Evander Holyfield
George Foreman
Larry Holmes
Mike Tyson
Lennox Lewis
Joe Frazier
Rocky Marciano
Jack Johnson


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## The Kai (Dec 9, 2004)

Great list


Mike Tyson Though?
Maybe put at #11
Todd


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 9, 2004)

The Kai said:
			
		

> Great list
> 
> 
> Mike Tyson Though?
> ...


Who would you put in his place?


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## Zujitsuka (Dec 9, 2004)

I like Joe Frazier and George Foreman, but one of them would have to give up a spot for Jack Dempsey.


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## The Kai (Dec 9, 2004)

Zujitsuka said:
			
		

> I like Joe Frazier and George Foreman, but one of them would have to give up a spot for Jack Dempsey.


I think Dempsey was a middle weight- If so dump Tyson.  Not for the antics today, but back in the day who didi he fight?
Ali had Frazier
Foreman had ali
dempsey had tunney


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## punisher73 (Dec 9, 2004)

Dempsey fought in the heavyweight division, but his weight would have put him in a lower weight class by todays standards.  I want to say he fought around 185 or so, but my book is at home (Ring of pure fire, very good book on Dempsey and his boxing strategy along with his bio).


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## Zujitsuka (Dec 9, 2004)

Yeah, Dempsey was small compared to today's heavyweights.  Marciano would have been considere a light heavy or a cruiser as well.

In regards to Kai's comments about Tyson, I agree that he didn't have an arch nemesis like Ali-Frazier or Dempsey-Tunney, but he was so incredibly dominant during his reign.  Man he was incredible when he was training under Cus D'Amato (honorable mentions to Teddy Atlas, and Kevin Rooney).


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 9, 2004)

Zujitsuka said:
			
		

> Yeah, Dempsey was small compared to today's heavyweights. Marciano would have been considere a light heavy or a cruiser as well.
> 
> In regards to Kai's comments about Tyson, I agree that he didn't have an arch nemesis like Ali-Frazier or Dempsey-Tunney, but he was so incredibly dominant during his reign. Man he was incredible when he was training under Cus D'Amato (honorable mentions to Teddy Atlas, and Kevin Rooney).


Now that was the Tyson I put on my list. The one that struck fear into his opponents.


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## punisher73 (Dec 10, 2004)

That is Tyson's downfall, he used to be so dominate and then went to prison (actually it was a juvenile home in Indiana) and wasn't his old self.  Then he had the disaster of biting and other clown antics that he is now remembered for.

I still think "Mike Tyson's Punch Out" for nintendo was one of the funnest boxing games.


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## GAB (Dec 10, 2004)

Hi all, 
I think because George Foreman came back and fought different generations of fighters he has to go real close to the top of the list.
Larry Holmes also for his longivity...
The original top ten here is pretty good, reverse Lennox and Tyson.
I think we have to take the top ten and break it into various catagories.

Regards, Gary


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 10, 2004)

punisher73 said:
			
		

> That is Tyson's downfall, he used to be so dominate and then went to prison (actually it was a juvenile home in Indiana) and wasn't his old self. Then he had the disaster of biting and other clown antics that he is now remembered for.
> 
> I still think "Mike Tyson's Punch Out" for nintendo was one of the funnest boxing games.


I agree, too bad he snapped. 

Mike Tyson's Punch Out, wasn't that such a fun game, I mean the sounds effects, the jumping up and down, it was hilarious.


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 10, 2004)

GAB said:
			
		

> reverse Lennox and Tyson.


Yes Lennox Lewis did beat Mike Tyson, but Tyson was already way past his prime, and so was Evander Holyfield for that matter. If Holyfield didn't get a draw in the first fight, the judges would have given him the second fight. I allot of boxing analyst think he won that one.


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 13, 2004)

What did you guys think of Vitali Klitschko.

did anyone see his fight Saturday with Danny Williams?

I read that he totally dominated the fight.


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## The Kai (Dec 13, 2004)

Even back in the day who did tyson fight that was good, or not over the hill.  True he dominated, but look at his competition

Todd


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 13, 2004)

The Kai said:
			
		

> Even back in the day who did tyson fight that was good, or not over the hill. True he dominated, but look at his competition
> 
> Todd


Would you say that Lennox Lewis's list of opponents was better than Mike Tyson's?


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## The Kai (Dec 13, 2004)

Slightly

Tyson never had a tough fight untill Buster Douglas, even if ol' Buster was'nt that good.
Lewis, though the hvyweight division has declined for several years had to get up to the top
Todd


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 13, 2004)

What do you guys think of Vitali Klitschko? He seems to fight in the old school way, like back when it was still bare knuckles. He seems awkward, but he somehow gets the job done. When I went to Thailand two years ago for vacation, I saw a picture of him doing Muay Thai. Can anyone confirm this?


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## Dan Anderson (Dec 13, 2004)

Ali behind Joe Louis?  Never in a million years.  Joe couldn't think on his feet and Ali could.  Ali would have kept him off balance with his jab and when Joe dropped his own left lead, Ali would've kept popping him with his straight right.  Yes, Joe would have caught him with something sooner or later but so had Frazier and Foreman and he didn't drop from one punch (Frazier's was in the 15th round).  Ali would've spanked Louis.

Yours,
Dan Anderson


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 13, 2004)

Dan Anderson said:
			
		

> Ali behind Joe Louis? Never in a million years. Joe couldn't think on his feet and Ali could. Ali would have kept him off balance with his jab and when Joe dropped his own left lead, Ali would've kept popping him with his straight right. Yes, Joe would have caught him with something sooner or later but so had Frazier and Foreman and he didn't drop from one punch (Frazier's was in the 15th round). Ali would've spanked Louis.
> 
> Yours,
> Dan Anderson


Hi Dan, I agree with you that Ali would have spanked Louis, but my original list was made based on the boxers era. I would have to agree that most of the guys on that list would have given the brown bomber more than he could have handled.


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## Kenpodoc (Dec 18, 2004)

Dragon Fist said:
			
		

> Who are on the top 10 Heavyweight Boxers on your list?
> 
> Here is mine.
> 
> ...


Jack Johnson should be higher on the list and Foreman and Frazier would have wiped the floor with Holyfield. Lennox Lewis has just not been dominating I doubt he belongs on this list. This might irritate people but I suspect Sonny Liston would have cleaned Tyson's clock. 

Jeff


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## calmone (Dec 18, 2004)

there are a couple of heavyweights ya'll have missed

Gentlemen Jim Corbett he should be #4 or #5
and 
John L. Sullivan who should be #1


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## Kenpodoc (Dec 19, 2004)

calmone said:
			
		

> there are a couple of heavyweights ya'll have missed
> 
> Gentlemen Jim Corbett he should be #4 or #5
> and
> John L. Sullivan who should be #1


Good point.  

Jeff


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## Ender (Dec 19, 2004)

I think you have to include Santa Claus in the list somewhere....or Buddha


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## GAB (Dec 19, 2004)

Kenpodoc said:
			
		

> Jack Johnson should be higher on the list and Foreman and Frazier would have wiped the floor with Holyfield. Lennox Lewis has just not been dominating I doubt he belongs on this list. This might irritate people but I suspect Sonny Liston would have cleaned Tyson's clock.
> 
> Jeff


Hi,
I agree with you about Sonny Liston being tough. 

I don't think anyone will agree about Holyfield, he is a real warrior 'no one' would wipe the floor with him. 
He fought hard and is one of the true champions of all time.

Regards, Gary


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 20, 2004)

GAB said:
			
		

> Hi,
> I agree with you about Sonny Liston being tough.
> 
> I don't think anyone will agree about Holyfield, he is a real warrior 'no one' would wipe the floor with him.
> ...


I totally agree with you Gary, in his prime, Holyfield would have beat most of the guys on my top ten lists. He's all heart, doesn't quit, can take a punch, and is an excellent technician in the ring.
"Real Deal"


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## clapping_tiger (Dec 20, 2004)

Dragon Fist said:
			
		

> Who are on the top 10 Heavyweight Boxers on your list?
> 
> Here is mine.
> 
> ...



Pretty good list for the most part, but I am afraid Marciano should at least be in the top 5. After all he is the only undefeated heavyweight champion in history, and started out at an older age. You can say that he did not meet tough opponents, but he beat the pants off of a young Archie Moore, and an old Archie Moore gave Clay/Ali quite a run for his money in Ali's Prime. The rest of the list I agree with for the most part, some I would only move up or down one peg. I would have the top #1 spot as a tie between Dempsey, Marciano. Dump Holmes and Lewis. Although in my opinion they are great fighters, they are not in the top 10 of all time. Bob Fitzsimmions should be in there somewhere in the bottom 5, not only was he a middleweight and won the heavyweight tittle, but he is also one of the rare few to win tittles in 3 different weight classes. Middleweight, Heavyweight, and Light Heavyweight (all without gaining or losing weight to fight in those divisions) and his carrer took place in the late 1890's and early 1900's. Quite a feat for those days.




> John L. Sullivan who should be #1


I don't agree, the only reason The Great John L is listed as the first modern day Heavyweight champion is because he was champ during the transition to the Queensbury rules. But if you notice he lost shortly there after (To Corbett). He was a tough bar room brawler who fought during a time that you could do just about anything to win a fight. Once you change over the the modern boxing rules, his ability to fight strictly with punches was truly shown. He was a great fighter, but not a boxer by modern definition. But that is what makes topics like this fun, because we all have our own opinions on who or what makes a legendary fighter.


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## Deflecting_the_Storm (Dec 20, 2004)

Lennox Lewis is not even close to any of those fighters even though he beat mike tyson, he was never the great champion mike tyson was. If you put Lennox Lewis on that list you might as well put Vitali Klitschko on the list as well. He lost to Lennox Lewis because of a cut but all that saw it know that Lewis was going to lose, and thats why he retired. Lennox Lewis was a grey champion during an era of grey heavyweights. All of the greats from the last area are old and the upcoming ones "Chris Byrd, Klitschko Bros, Kirk Johnson" he ran from. So in my book he is nothing. He is just as good as Buster Douglas. A guy who happen to just throw the righ punch at the wrong time for Tyson. And noone had Roy Jones on the list. He may not be a True heavyweight, but he did do something noone else has done. Win 5 belts in different weight classes. And even Emanuel Steward said to Lennox Lewis on HBO during a interview that if he was to fight Roy Jones he would lose. So if you put Lewis on there than put Jones on there too.


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## GAB (Dec 20, 2004)

Deflecting_the_Storm said:
			
		

> Lennox Lewis is not even close to any of those fighters even though he beat mike tyson, he was never the great champion mike tyson was. If you put Lennox Lewis on that list you might as well put Vitali Klitschko on the list as well. He lost to Lennox Lewis because of a cut but all that saw it know that Lewis was going to lose, and thats why he retired. Lennox Lewis was a grey champion during an era of grey heavyweights. All of the greats from the last area are old and the upcoming ones "Chris Byrd, Klitschko Bros, Kirk Johnson" he ran from. So in my book he is nothing. He is just as good as Buster Douglas. A guy who happen to just throw the righ punch at the wrong time for Tyson. And noone had Roy Jones on the list. He may not be a True heavyweight, but he did do something noone else has done. Win 5 belts in different weight classes. And even Emanuel Steward said to Lennox Lewis on HBO during a interview that if he was to fight Roy Jones he would lose. So if you put Lewis on there than put Jones on there too.


Hi, 
I think the time has come to add an extra weight class in the top weight class.

I have lost respect for what Emanuel Stewart has to say. 
He does not do the job he is paid for. Look what happened to the younger Klitschko, for their size they don't breath right. 

They run out of air because they are not trained in collecting air the proper way. That is the trainer and managers fault.

People in martial arts who have any rank at all know the proper way to breath, why don't the Boxers and Trainers know???

Since Roy Jones was knocked out twice since his (ES) statement that should say something.

Regards, Gary


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## clapping_tiger (Dec 20, 2004)

Deflecting_the_Storm said:
			
		

> Lennox Lewis is not even close to any of those fighters even though he beat mike tyson, he was never the great champion mike tyson was. If you put Lennox Lewis on that list you might as well put Vitali Klitschko on the list as well. He lost to Lennox Lewis because of a cut but all that saw it know that Lewis was going to lose, and thats why he retired. Lennox Lewis was a grey champion during an era of grey heavyweights. All of the greats from the last area are old and the upcoming ones "Chris Byrd, Klitschko Bros, Kirk Johnson" he ran from. So in my book he is nothing. He is just as good as Buster Douglas. A guy who happen to just throw the righ punch at the wrong time for Tyson. And noone had Roy Jones on the list. He may not be a True heavyweight, but he did do something noone else has done. Win 5 belts in different weight classes. And even Emanuel Steward said to Lennox Lewis on HBO during a interview that if he was to fight Roy Jones he would lose. So if you put Lewis on there than put Jones on there too.


I agree. There are a lot of great fighters out there. Anyone who can make it into the top 10 contenders is a great fighter, same holds true for anyone who has won any type of championship. But they cannot be put into the greatest of all time catagory. There is a big differance. The greatest of all times are legends in their sport.


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## clapping_tiger (Dec 20, 2004)

GAB said:
			
		

> Hi,
> I think the time has come to add an extra weight class in the top weight class.
> 
> I have lost respect for what Emanuel Stewart has to say.
> ...



Yeah, I don't know how they train today, but I think trainers did a better job in the old days. Now championship matches are only 12 rounds, they used to be 15. And before that, fights could last all day with rounds reaching the 100's. I am not exactly clear on how they defined a round, I know it was different than today, but still. Can you imagine a fight lasting 6 hours?


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 21, 2004)

Okay guys, the fighters on my top ten, who would beat whom and why?


Joe Louis
Muhammad Ali
Evander Holyfield
George Foreman
Larry Holmes
Mike Tyson
Joe Frazier
Rocky Marciano
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
I know a couple of guys out there didn't think that Lennox Lewis should even be on this list, and after further thinking about it, I agree with them. So now I will replace him with Jack Dempsey. The others below him will move up one.


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## ppko (Dec 21, 2004)

Dragon Fist said:
			
		

> Okay guys, the fighters on my top ten, who would beat whom and why?
> 
> Joe Louis
> Muhammad Ali
> ...


Muhammad Ali hands down over anyone he was to smart a fighter (especially pre- draft).


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## Dragon Fist (Dec 22, 2004)

A lot of people are gonna think I'm crazy, but I think Holyfield (in his prime) would find a way to beat all these guys on the list.


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