# answer plzzz



## HooT (Mar 30, 2009)

is ninjutsu sorta the same as wing chun?  as in strikes counter moves etc?




i also posted this over in their forum


----------



## paulus (Mar 30, 2009)

HooT said:


> is ninjutsu sorta the same as wing chun?


No, it's very different. For one, we don't get to wear cool black unforms.


----------



## KamonGuy2 (Mar 30, 2009)

Ninjitsu has some very similar moves and similar concepts

Wing chun is better though lol


----------



## dnovice (Mar 30, 2009)

HooT said:


> is ninjutsu sorta the same as wing chun? as in strikes counter moves etc?


Huh????:whip1:

go on youtube. Search for ninjutsu... watch. Search for WC and watch... ... ... ;-)


----------



## CuongNhuka (Mar 30, 2009)

"The novice looks for whats differnit, the master looks for what is similar" - Sensei/Sifu Wes.

If you can find places were Nin Jitsu and Wing Chun are similar (either in a technical aspect or a conceptual one), then you must be a master, in some regard.


----------



## bs10927 (Mar 30, 2009)

when i think of ninjutsu, I think of Ashida Kim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F3tJHuZDIo&feature=related

http://www.ashidakim.com/


----------



## HooT (Mar 30, 2009)

CuongNhuka said:


> "The novice looks for whats *differnit*, the master looks for what is similar" - Sensei/Sifu Wes.
> 
> If you can find places were Nin Jitsu and Wing Chun are similar (either in a technical aspect or a conceptual one), then you must be a master, in some regard.



you mean different right?


----------



## CuongNhuka (Mar 30, 2009)

HooT said:


> you mean different right?


 
So I cann't spell.... message remains the same.


----------



## naneek (Mar 30, 2009)

i guess all martial arts have some similarities but i never heard that WC and ninjutsu might be similar before you brought it up.i really know nothing of ninjutsu and only a little about wing chun to be honest


----------



## HooT (Mar 30, 2009)

CuongNhuka said:


> "The novice looks for whats differnit, the master looks for what is similar" - Sensei/Sifu Wes.
> 
> If you can find places were Nin Jitsu and Wing Chun are similar (either in a technical aspect or a conceptual one), then you must be a master, in some regard.




Ashida Kim looks more of a scam than the Nigeria Lotto!?!?!?!?!?


----------



## CuongNhuka (Mar 31, 2009)

HooT said:


> Ashida Kim looks more of a scam than the Nigeria Lotto!?!?!?!?!?


 
OK. I wasn't the one who mentioned that, but ok.


----------



## mook jong man (Mar 31, 2009)

I don't think that Ninjutsu and Wing Chun share much in common other than the fact they are both martial arts .

 I see much more similarities to Wing Chun in things like the FMA's , Silat , and Krav Maga in my opinion.
Although it would be cool to hide in a river underwater breathing through a reed.


----------



## profesormental (Mar 31, 2009)

Greetings.

The thing is that it depends what you call Ninjutsu...

Ninjutsu has different components. The hand to hand (taijutsu) component is very similar to koryu jujutsu. Simple grab, hit, throw, lock strategy. That is another story...

The weapons are in the spirit of kobudo.

There are many branches and flavors of ninjutsu. I share my Academy with a Ninjutsu group. Very nice, hard working peoples.

All in all, Wing Chun training is very different. Yet in the end, it all boils down to the individual instructor and the training environment that they have.

That is most important.

Why do you ask, Mr. HooT?

Juan M. Mercado


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

From your other thread, for completions sake (quoting myself, by the way).

Hi,

We'll go into a little detail so you have an idea of why you are getting the answers you are. To begin with, the similarities:

Wing Chun is said to have been developed by a nun named Ng Mui, who fled the Shaolin Temple after it was razed. She eventually taught her skills to a young woman named Wing Chun, and named her personnal style after her young student.

Withing Ninjutsu, the Gyokko Ryu is said to have been originally based on the martial skills of a Princess, or Lady-In-Waiting from the Tang Dynasty Court, later brought to Japan by Cho Gyokko (also known as Yo Gyokko, possibly one person, possibly a group).

So these two arts are virtually unique in Martial Arts in that they are originally developed by women, rather than men (and to clarify, many other systems have had female heads, most notably a number of Koryu systems of Naginatajutsu, such as Toda-ha Buko Ryu, Yoshin Ryu, and Tendo Ryu, but no others that I know of that were founded/developed by women).

Both Wing Chun and Gyokko Ryu teach that protecting the centre of your body is very important (within Wing Chun, the basic posture has your hands in the middle of your body, protecting your "centre-line", in Gyokko Ryu, most postures have one or both hands over your heart to protect it).

Both systems involve weaponry as well as unarmed combat, again the comparrison with Gyokko is probably best. Wing Chun teaches Butterfly Swords and Long Pole techniques, Gyokko Ryu was famous for it's sword, knife, and bo techniques. But they are used quite differently, and we'll deal with that soon.

The tactics used could be seen as similar, but the application rules this out. It woul be like saying that boxing and tae kwon do are the same because they both strike.

So now to the differences. First off, although I have focussed on Gyokko Ryu so far, that is only because it has the most (superficial, though they are) similarities to Wing Chun. They really are nothing alike.

Wing Chun postures are very upright, and feature a 50/50 weight distubution, wiht the body facing forward. The hands are kept central, and relatively close to your body, with one slightly forward. Ninjutsu postures are predominantly one foot in front, with your weight between 70/30 and 60/40 back, depending on the system and/or posture. One hand is often extended, with the other held back to guard, or be cocked for a strike.

From these postures, the movement is quite different. Wing Chun has very minimal footwork, relying on handwork to deflect/trap incoming strikes, and counter strike. Ninjutsu, on the other hand, utilises a greater focus on footwork, using principals of angling, and distancing to primarily evade incoming strikes and attacks, often with a damaging "blocking strike" to create an openning, and similar footwork utilised to enter and strike or grapple.

Wing Chun is a primarily striking system with a bit of grappling added in (usually refered to as "trapping"). Ninjutsu, being a Japanese art, has much more grappling involved, with a repetoire of throws, chokes, limb controls etc, as well as having a larger-than-typical focus on the striking side of the art.

With regard to the weaponry, the simple fact that we are comparing a Japanese system with a Chinese art lends itself to huge differences. Without going too much into it, Chinese weaponry tends towards faster movements with lighter weapons (due to lighter armour being worn), and the Japanese having heavier weapons tend toward larger, heavier actions to cut through the heavier armour. This is a generalisation, but is accurate enough for this purpose.

So, essentially, there are a few very superficial similarities, but no real connection or similarities for consideration. Hope this helps.


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

profesormental said:


> Greetings.
> 
> The thing is that it depends what you call Ninjutsu...
> 
> ...


 
Oh, and just to clarify, Taijutsu simply means "body art/techniques", and the technical characteristics differ depending upon the specific system. For example, Koto Ryu is mostly striking with very little grappling, whereas Takagi Yoshin Ryu is almost all grappling.

As for the weaponry, kobudo mostly refers to the weaponry of the Okinawan martial arts, such as karate. The weaponry is very different from those found on the Japanese mainland, with a very different method of use, and very different types of weapons.

As for many branches, authentic Ninjutsu is only found is schools which trace themselves back to Hatsumi Masaaki, head of the Bujinkan. The Bujinkan itself is made up of the teachings of 9 separate systems, a few of which are Ninjutsu, the others are samurai classical arts.


----------



## KamonGuy2 (Mar 31, 2009)

I have a friend who is black level at ninjitsu and her movements are very very similar to wing chun

Youtube can help you only so much - much of the wing chun stuff on there is poor and very varied. 
You will probably be hard pressed to find any two wing chun clips (from different federations) that are similar, let alone ninjitsu and wing chun lol


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

Just to be sure, I mean no disrespect to your friend, but if what they are doing is similar to Wing Chun, then it is very possible that they are studying a bogus system. I have never seen any form of Wing Chun that looks anything like authentic Ninjutsu from any legitimate group. Oh, and the spelling "ninjitsu" is usually a dead giveaway. It is not a real word.


----------



## HooT (Mar 31, 2009)

Hey Chris

Thanks very much for that insight

i was just watchin a few youtube vids and sometimes these *authentic* clips look a bit similiar with each other, to a certain extent that is
so i was just curious


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

Not a problem. By the way, I would be a little doubtful of any "authentic" Ninjutsu that looks like Wing Chun. Probably Ashida Kim, Haha Lung, Frank Dux, or any of a number of other less than legitimate persons...


----------



## HooT (Mar 31, 2009)

yea, see the thing is ill be going to Japan, China or a slight maybe, Russia

and wherever country i go to i would like to learn their martial arts.
no where in Qld for me cause i live wayyyyyyyyyy away from any cities


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

It's probably going to be best if you find out what is around when you get there. Remember, not every street corner in China will have a Wing Chun school (from what I understand, it is based much more strongly in Hong Kong these days, anyway), and Ninjutsu dojos are not the easiest or most common you will find either.

How long are you going to be there for? Oh, and being in a regional area doesn't necessarily mean you are without options. For example, a regional town in New South Wales, called Gunnedah, has two very important treasures to offer. The first, and it's really hard for me to pick between these, by the way, is Miss Miranda Kerr, Victoria's Secret model with the cutest dimples around, and Sensei Philip Hinshelwood, who is a direct student of Kenji Shimazu Sensei of the Yagyu Shingan Ryu Heiho and Morishige Ryu Hinawajutsu. Now that's something I'm very interested in...


----------



## HooT (Mar 31, 2009)

ill be there a minimum 1 year, maybe 2 or 3, wherever i choose to go, which is looking more and more like China, im sure there will be some mcdojos over there so ill try n stay clear of em, ill get to know some of the locals and see if they can point me in the right direction

i know gunnedah well  im north of Goondiwindi

you obviously know what you are talking about too, so i just wanna ask for a comment on this that some knob wrote if that be cool

quote

"Dirty Boxing is more effective than Wing Chun. Wing Chun is corny. I just don't see any Wing Chun guy facing a good ,and "real professional" fighter using nothing, but Wing Chun nonsense. Sorry&#65279; man, I just don't. Maybe it will work against a guy who can fight period, and is weak. Really though, Wing Chun seems pretty crappy until it is proven otherwise. Real fighting is much more complex than Wing Chun teaching. Much more complex."

im just assuming this fool is just talkin crap? dunno
cheers for all your help tho mate!


----------



## Chris Parker (Mar 31, 2009)

Yeah, I wouldn't take that as the most informed opinion I've ever read...

Dirty Boxing is actually a more recent term for the way boxing was approached prior to the Marquise of Queensbury Rules, and included a range of other (non-boxing) aspects, such as grappling, takedowns, and more survival-type tactics.

As for saying Wing Chun is just corny, nonsense, and "crappy until proven otherwise", well, I'll just say that Wing Chun has quite a history of being used in violent street fights in Hong Kong for quite a long time. In fact, one of the catalysts that saw Bruse Lee leave Hong Kong was him getting caught up in such fights, as were people such as William Cheung, whose Academy is here in Melbourne (not far from where I teach, actually).

But back to your needs, depending on where exactly you are in China, you will probably find something, but exactly what is unknown at this point. And remember, each different art will have very different approaches to their art. For example, Wing Chun's great rival (who they had most of their fights against) is Hung Gar Kung Fu. 

Hung Gar is characterised by being diametrically opposed to Wing Chun. Wing Chun is upright, with a forward facing, narrow stance, whereas Hung Gar has deep, low, angled stances (even deeper and lower than Ninjutsu does, by the way). Wing Chun is based on straight line strikes, Hung Gar has longer, circular, hooking strikes and kicks. In essence, everything that Wing Chun is, Hung Gar is not, and vice versa, and that led to tensions and fights between the two as they both claimed their way was better, and tried to prove the other wrong.

Then you have things like the Shaolin systems, the various Animal styles, such as Tong Long Kung Fu (Praying Mantis), and almost countless others. And, of course, Wu Shu. This is primarily developed for the Beijing Opera, and is very showy and acrobatic, but was never intended to be viable as a combat system.

Again, though, see what is there when you get there, in the meantime, by all means get as much info as you can so you don't get duped by a bogus school when you find one (and yes, they are all over Japan, China, and everywhere else, not just the Western countries...).

Oh, and one last thing. You may want to check over the rules for this particular forum site. The concept behind Martialtalk is that discussion can be enjoyed by all, provided it is polite. I would probably refrain form using terms such as describing someone as a "knob", even if I disagree with them. Just a friendly note.


----------



## HooT (Apr 1, 2009)

do u reckon i should start out with 1 2 or 3 times a week training? keeping in mind im a total noob to this


----------



## Chris Parker (Apr 1, 2009)

I think you should see what is available when you get there, and see what their schedule provides you. Not every school will give you options to pick and choose when you train, most Ninjutsu dojos even in Japan only teach once a week. So all of this is really moot until you have better knowledge of what your real options are.


----------

