# Robert Bussey?



## Cowslayer (Jul 14, 2007)

Would anyone recommend any Robert Bussey DVDs for beginning Ninjutsu? I mean there are Dojos around but not in my town. And I cant afford classes....
So is good for just beginner stuff about attacks and grapples? I was almost about to buy one but then I saw the Bujinkan TaiKai USA 2003 Last Ninja DVD and now I cant decide... Help?


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 14, 2007)

If you are looking for Authentic Budo Taijutsu then I would personally recommend starting with Hatsumi Sensei's Kobudo no Kihon. This can be purchased at: http://www.ninjutsu.com/store/product.php?productid=5953&js=n

I *would not recommend* Robert Bussey's DVD's but that is just my opinion.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 14, 2007)

I would also strongly recommend finding a Dojo or at the very least attending some Budo Taijutsu seminars to get started.  Video's are good for referance material but not for learning first hand material you have not practiced before.  Good luck!


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## Cowslayer (Jul 14, 2007)

Thank you for the links!


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## Cowslayer (Jul 14, 2007)

Sorry for double posting, but the edit button wasnt working for some reason...
Anyways I think ill look into that but now I'm conflicted over that DVD you just recommended and Hatsumi's  "Bujinkan TaiKai  2003" whcih is also 50$ and is 360 minutes long......so I looked at reviews all were good but one guy said that is just a documentary and teaches nothing.....


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## jks9199 (Jul 14, 2007)

Cowslayer said:


> Sorry for double posting, but the edit button wasnt working for some reason...
> Anyways I think ill look into that but now I'm conflicted over that DVD you just recommended and Hatsumi's  "Bujinkan TaiKai  2003" whcih is also 50$ and is 360 minutes long......so I looked at reviews all were good but one guy said that is just a documentary and teaches nothing.....


What are you after?  

The Bujinkan TaiKai were seminars; they weren't set up to teach a new student, as I understand them.  

Personally, I'd look around.  Check out some of the links that are stickied under the Ninjutsu forums; I know there's a link or two with dojo directories.  You might be surprised to find that there is a dojo nearer you than you realize.  (I know I was!)


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## Cowslayer (Jul 14, 2007)

Well I'm just looking for a DVD that easily explain the basics of Ninjutsu. As for the Dojo, I did check but the closest is a 3 hour drive from my place and I didnt see the prices but I'm sure its expensive....Oh and BTW it was a Hatsumi Bujinkan Dojo...if anyone wants to know it was in San Francisco..so yeah really all I want to learn is some good fighting techniques as well as Stealth moves and weaponry.


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## jks9199 (Jul 14, 2007)

Cowslayer said:


> Well I'm just looking for a DVD that easily explain the basics of Ninjutsu. As for the Dojo, I did check but the closest is a 3 hour drive from my place and I didnt see the prices but I'm sure its expensive....Oh and BTW it was a Hatsumi Bujinkan Dojo...if anyone wants to know it was in San Francisco..so yeah really all I want to learn is some good fighting techniques as well as Stealth moves and weaponry.


If you haven't checked -- how do you know that it's expensive?  I know that at least one of the instructors in San Francisco is very highly regarded...  And almost certainly worth the time to train with.  (He's also a member here on MT.)

Even if you can only attend one class a week, maybe on a weekend (if any are offered), if it's something you're really serious about, there's no substitute for getting actual correction from an instructor.  There are just too many things that don't show up on a camera, or that you need someone to draw your attention to...  If you contact them, you might find out that there are other students closer whom you can train with, as well, that just haven't opened a school officially or registered it.

You'll find numerous threads here on MT that go into depth about learning without a teacher...  You'll find very few here that support it.


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## Mr. E (Jul 15, 2007)

Please allow me to explain something.

There are some self defense forms that can be learned from things like videos. They are crude and not meant to make you some sort of expert. They teach you only enough to get by. Videos by people like Kelly McMann are like this.

Then there are arts that require you to lay a very deep foundation to very demanding standards before you start to build on them. The progress is slow and must be done from the very start under a skilled teacher, but you can take the path a long way to mastery.

I have seen some true ninjutsu. It falls into the latter group. Anyone who thinks that they can teach or learn from the start by means of video either has a very low level of understanding of the art, or is inspired more by money than a desire to help others.

And from what I know of Robert Bussey, he is not a good representative of the art of ninjutsu. Perhaps you can do a search of past threads here to find out more about him. But any video course can't help you if you do not start your first lessons under a real teacher.


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## Bigshadow (Jul 16, 2007)

Cowslayer said:


> Well I'm just looking for a DVD that easily explain the basics of Ninjutsu.



To be brutally honest, I don't think any DVD will "explain the basics of Ninjutsu".


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 16, 2007)

Bigshadow said:


> To be brutally honest, I don't think any DVD will "explain the basics of Ninjutsu".


 
Truer words have never been spoken!


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## Shicomm (Jul 16, 2007)

Indeed  

I would at least try  a class at the nearest dojo to get a bit of the feeling.
Maybe it's a good idea to seek for contact details of people that train there.
You might get a chance for a ride along or maybe even a bit training with a few students that train for themselves besides their regular classes at the dojo.

There are tons of those little "training groups" just seek and you'll find them


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## Bigshadow (Jul 16, 2007)

You know this reminds me of a conversation I had with Jack Hoban when I last saw him.  I was asking him about obtaining his ninpo book.  I wanted to add it to my library.

He quickly said "Why?  You don't need it, you already know all that.  That book was for people that don't train.  Besides, it is in the past, there are no more."  

I think the same sentiment applies to many things.


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## Doc_Jude (Jul 16, 2007)

Cowslayer said:


> Would anyone recommend any Robert Bussey DVDs for beginning Ninjutsu? I mean there are Dojos around but not in my town. And I cant afford classes....



I suppose that the question that I'd ask is "What do you consider 'Ninjutsu'?"

Robert Bussey never attained grade above 4th dan. After attending training in Japan, he declined an opportunity to take the 5th dan test, claiming that it was "demonic" and that it conflicted with his Christian beliefs, and also that Hatsumi-sensei and the other Japanese Shihan lacked "skill" and "power". When the Japanese heard about this, of course, they were suprised, since Bussey didn't voice any concerns to their faces. Apparently, since Bussey couldn't see their "power", Hatsumi-sensei told his shihan that  if Bussey ever came back, to beat him within an inch of his life and send him packing (info via Noguchi-sensei).
Of course, he then came back to the US and began to push himself as some kind of "American Ninja Master" & "King of Combat", thus creating a huge American Ninja empire.

You may get some basic movements, or decent ukemi, but if you're looking for "Takamatsuden Ninjutsu", or anything close to authentic Japanese Ninja arts, Bussey's products would be the wrong direction to start with.

I would say, save up for classes, or look into Bujinkan Shihan that have basic kyu rank vids/dvds. Yeah, & look into training groups that may not have schools. Many shihan know of outlying "satellite" groups that are run by dojo-cho, under the authority of proper shihan or sensei of course.


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## Bujingodai (Jul 17, 2007)

Be careful of any video you buy period. Even the Bujinkan Shihan videos are poor at points.
See the school for yourself. A membership in any school will not guarentee what you are getting is current or decent training. Though Seago Sensei is in that area and he is a very good and reputable practitoner from what I have seen. I met him years ago, he is a very pleasent guy in addition to being here on MT

Bussey certainly lacks the subleties in his videos for a more pragmatic approach. I can see what he is getting at, but no I wouldn't call it Ninjutsu anylonger.

I wasn't there in those years so I won't comment on his past.

Caveat Emptor I think it the term to use.


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## rexthunder (Aug 11, 2007)

I haven't posted in quite a long time, but I would like to say that the Bussey videos were worth the 9.99 I paid if not only for the comedic value.  His trademark growls are like none other. But, not to beat a dead horse, videos would really only serve as a reference for techniques that you already know and would probably only hurt you in the future by giving you false confidence in techniques that may have not been practiced correctly.  Be warey of so-called "black belt by mail programs."


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## ArmorOfGod (Aug 11, 2007)

I have to stick up for Mr. Bussey.
I wouldn't buy them if I wanted authentic ninjutsu techniques, but I would highly recommend them if you wanted to add some brutal self defense moves to your personal repetoir (is that spelled right)?  They have a "ninpo flavor" to them though and are very much worth 9.99 per dvd.

AoG


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## Obliquity (Aug 11, 2007)

Ditto AoG.


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## rexthunder (Aug 12, 2007)

I didn't mean to sound like I was bashing Mr. Bussey.  His videos are quite good if you want to add a little bit of that flavor to your fighting, just don't expect to do anything more than that without some real instructorship, believe me I have tried


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## ArmorOfGod (Aug 14, 2007)

rexthunder said:


> I didn't mean to sound like I was bashing Mr. Bussey. His videos are quite good if you want to add a little bit of that flavor to your fighting, just don't expect to do anything more than that without some real instructorship, believe me I have tried


 
I agree with you.  Real instruction is the only way to go.  Videos add a little bit, but they are like salt and pepper.  The real dish comes from a live teacher.

On a side note, Mr Bussey gets a lot of bashing because he left the Bujinkan.  I have no problem with him and am a fan of his videos.

AoG


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## Brian R. VanCise (Aug 15, 2007)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I agree with you. Real instruction is the only way to go. Videos add a little bit, but they are like salt and pepper. The real dish comes from a live teacher.
> 
> On a side note, Mr Bussey gets a lot of bashing because he left the Bujinkan. I have no problem with him and am a fan of his videos.
> 
> AoG


 
If you characterize his videos as just self defense videos then yes there is some worth.  However, truthfully he characterized his videos as Ninjutsu which he clearly did not have enough authentic expertise in.  This is and will always be the source of issues with Mr. Bussey's Ninjutsu videos.  Now he has moved on and is teaching Bussey Combatives: http://www.robertbussey.com/ !  Personally I hope that everything goes well for him and that he finds his niche.


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## Bujingodai (Aug 16, 2007)

Agreed, I enjoy the videos. The bear thing makes me giggle a bit but there is a decent amount of pragmatic self defence and skill there.

I think to call him less than skilled would be wrong


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## rexthunder (Aug 17, 2007)

Indeed


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