# weight training help wanted



## pancasona (Mar 14, 2002)

hi everyone,
i need to improve my performance in martial arts by weight raining, but i don't know how should i start it. I need your suggestion and advice in weight training. i need it for strenth , endurance, and a good looking body.


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## Kirk (Mar 14, 2002)

While weight training helps increase your endurance, it doesn't
do it all that well.  Your best bet there is to do cardiovascular
workouts (aerobics).  Since you're a martial artist, go nuts on a
bag for 30 min. to an hour.  Go 10 minutes, rest for 2, and back
at 10 minutes again.  10 and 2, 10 and 2.  

As far as the weight training advice you're asking, one could
write a book.  The general advice would be 12 - 15 reps per set
for muscle tone, 8 - 10 reps per set for muscle building.  Both
will build strength, if you use the heaviest weight you can use
while still doing the exercises correctly.  If I were you, I'd go
to a "mom and pop" gym in your area, if you can find one.  I've
been to quite a few "in my time" (can't believe I jsut said that)
and every single one of them ask what my goals were, and put
me on a training regimen to accomplish just that.  After a few 
months, where that "good soreness" doesn't happening anymore,
you can have a personal training session (most gyms have them)
for about 25 bucks for an hour.  The personal trainer can revamp
your training list which should work for you for a few months.
Pay attention to your body, and when it feels like you're not
getting the best benefit you can from your workouts, pay for
another session.

:soapbox: 

Consult a physician before starting any exercise program.

:soapbox: 

Be sure to read, understand and follow, all the safety rules that
come with your power tools.  Learning how to use powertools
properly will greatly reduce the risk of personal injury.  And there's
no more important safety rule, than to wear these, safety 
glasses.
:soapbox:


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## WannaBeAmachine (Mar 25, 2002)

Like most here i'm not in anyway certified so i am speaking merely from personal experience...

how you train in weightlifting for martial arts is no different than how you train in weightlifting for anything else. build your program around your goal. and i think with martial arts we all have pretty much the same goal. good stamina, good strength, a balance unlike track runners or bodybuilders.
I am a pretty good sized guy 6'2 about 200lbs pretty tone and have good natural strength, and have been lifting for about a year for size and strength. So now starting martial arts my goal is to increase muscular stamina, without loosing strength/weight or size. the best way i find through practice and research is to lift mildly heavy with weights but to also do a lot of calisthetics. hindu squats for the legs, hindu pushups, back bridge, pullups, pushups, reverse pushups, etc.. for my goals i have found this pretty effective to increase stamina. 

my friend however is nearly my polar opposite, he has been in marital arts for a few years, never really lifted weights, has great stamina but no strength. he also does alot of calisthetics to maintain his endurance but is starting on a weight lifting routine to build some mass and strength. 

once again i'm no specialist but me and my friend have both seen good results, for our goals, from this type of workout and i think anyone who tried it would also.


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## tshadowchaser (Mar 25, 2002)

sometime strength training and martial arts do not go well togeather, however they can if you make the stength training a endurence excercise at the same time. Start with 10-15 repsof a comfortable weight , Do 3 or so sets. Jump the weight 10-25 lbs. repeat. Keep repeating till you get to the point where the reps, go down to 3-1, with a 10 lb. increase. Then work back up the scale.
Every week incress the starting weight by 10-15 lbs.
Once or twice a week after doing the scales have someone spot you and do negitive lifts with 50 lbs over your limit. When doing the negitive lift  do one or two all the way down, then try a third but only go 1/8 of the way down and try to push it back up. Then 1/4 to 1/2 way and try to push back up.
This regiment not only incresses strength but builds endurence at the same time. 
 I'm a small person 5'6" 140 lbs. but I have benched over 350 following this program.(that was 8 years ago when I was 46 ) at this time I don't have a weight set and not enough time to fit it back into my day
By the way I was an athletic traniner at one point in my life.
Shadow


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## bscastro (Apr 2, 2002)

All of the other posts have given good advice. However, if you have never lifted before, I would suggest keeping it simple.

I do mainly body-weight calisthenics, but the weight training exercises I do are few. Here are the ones I do and the ones I heard are most functional for martial arts.

1. Squat (one of my friends who is a personal trainer said if you only have time for one, make this the one).
2. Romanian Dead Lifts
3. Power Cleans (I don't do these because I don't have the proper equipment or space, but I hear these are great for developing power).
4. Bench Press

That's all I do at the moment. It won't get you the body builder body, but you'll get strong. I do others like curls, rowing movements, but the three (not including power cleans) are my core exercises plus body-weight calisthenics.

Good luck!

Bryan


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## Danny (Apr 2, 2002)

Remeber, protien, protien, protien.  You cannot build muscle without protien, in fact protien is the only thing muscles is made up of.  I suggest you eat some before, and after your work out.  Ideally you want to be getting some kind of protien into you ever 2 hours.

You might also want to look into getting a protien suppliment.  Easy to disgest, and takes less time to prepare.  Of course mine tastes like dogfood mixed with sand, so be preparred to get used to the taste.


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## Kirk (Apr 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Danny _
> 
> *Remeber, protien, protien, protien.  You cannot build muscle without protien, in fact protien is the only thing muscles is made up of.  I suggest you eat some before, and after your work out.  Ideally you want to be getting some kind of protien into you ever 2 hours.
> 
> You might also want to look into getting a protien suppliment.  Easy to disgest, and takes less time to prepare.  Of course mine tastes like dogfood mixed with sand, so be preparred to get used to the taste. *




DEFINITELY an acquired taste!   I recommend "Whey Protein" ..
studies have shown that it breaks down easier and serves
it's purpose best in men.  (more so in men than women)


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## arthurb999 (Jul 30, 2002)

Train 4 days a week...

Mon - Chest and Tris
Tues - Legs
Thurs - Back and bi's
Fri - Shoulders and traps

Get 1 gram of protien per pound of body weight everyday.  Drink tons of water.  Eat 5 small meals a day (all protien rich)

I've been working out for like 3 years and have it down pretty good.  I hang at a bodybuilding forum too.  There is a ton of good info there.  Here's a link to a pic of me and to the main forum:


http://www.anabolicreview.com/vbulletin/

http://www.anabolicreview.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8285


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## bscastro (Jul 31, 2002)

Check out Cyberpump! . It has a lot of info on strength training. Also check out Matt Furey's website. His book Combat Conditioning has excellent exercises. Basically, what I'm doing now is one hard day of calisthenics for muscular endurance (and increases in strength) and two days a week of weightlifting for strength.  

Also, don't forget to focus on your skill training also. I always think that I'm a martial artist who lifts weights, not the other way around, so always keep your goal in mind.

Good luck,
Bryan


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## Kenpo Wolf (Aug 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Kirk _
> 
> *While weight training helps increase your endurance, it doesn't
> do it all that well.  Your best bet there is to do cardiovascular
> ...




Contrary to the first comment, you can build a lot of endurance with weights. Just use light weights for a solid minute. I have found that shadow boxing with light weights does an excellent job of increasing my and speed as well as endurance. But if you do this, make sure you avoid any elbow damage by NOT fully extending the punches

The second comment offers some good advice. I'll add to it by saying take it slow until you know what you're doing


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## RyuShiKan (Aug 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by pancasona _
> 
> *hi everyone,
> i need to improve my performance in martial arts by weight raining, but i don't know how should i start it. I need your suggestion and advice in weight training. i need it for strenth , endurance, and a good looking body. *




There are 2 good books out on weight lifting and the martial arts.

One is "Going For Black Belt" by Tony Gummerson. This book breaks weight training down by style and has strength tests and workouts included. Great book.
The second is an oldie but a goodie by Leo Fong, sorry can't recall the title. I am sure a word search on Google will find it.


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## RyuShiKan (Aug 1, 2002)

In my dojo we usually do a more aero/anarobic combination of weight training. We warm up by doing 3 exercises, push up, sit ups, and squats. We start off by doing 1 squat, 1 push up, 1 sit up then two of each and so on until we get to 10 then it goes back down to 9 then 8 then 7 and so on till we get to 0. By the end you will have done 100 of each exercise. 
After that we use the bokken. The bokken is the hard wood sword that kendoka use to develop arm and shoulder strength. The ones we use are not the skinny "toothpick" kind you normally see but the thick heavy ones that weigh about 6lbs.. 
We do anywhere from 100 to 500 strikes with these while doing "suri ashi", this is a kind of walking that is timed with the strike of the bokken.
You can goes as fast or slow as you like, depends on who is with you I guess.
This exercise works your hand, wrist, biceps, triceps, deltoids, and back. Pretty good pump afterwards too.

Next we do 100~200 Sai strikes. Sai weigh about 1 to 2 lbs. each and can used for striking in all directions. A great hand and wrist work out.

Next we do a couple 100 punches with sashi, a kind of Okinawan lock mold. Hard to describe really. These weigh about 10lbs. each.

Then it's on to basics, then kata, then technique, then full contact sparring.

After 3~4 hrs of that it is on to the bar to work the biceps with those 12oz. kind of liquid weights and to take the edge off some of the pain from sparring.


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## tshadowchaser (Aug 1, 2002)

Thats one heck of a good work out.  Have you had any of the students that ever had rotator cuff or elbow problems as a result of doing punches with the sashi?  I have heard that sometimes extended punching with any type of weight  can cause these problems .  
  If they have, would you say it was because of incorrect technique or from wear and tear, on the muscle ,tendons, ligiments.


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## RyuShiKan (Aug 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by tshadowchaser _
> 
> *Thats one heck of a good work out.  Have you had any of the students that ever had rotator cuff or elbow problems as a result of doing punches with the sashi? *



No. 



> _Originally posted by tshadowchaser _
> 
> * I have heard that sometimes extended punching with any type of weight  can cause these problems .
> If they have, would you say it was because of incorrect technique or from wear and tear, on the muscle ,tendons, ligiments. *



The only problems they get is when doing randori (judoesque type wrestling with strikes, joint locks & jokes etc.) or kumite.
Kumite is not so bad, just bruises and so on. The randori is the one where they get "cranked on" and screw up joints from doing joint locks.


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## Nightingale (Aug 5, 2002)

how to learn weight training:

Go to your local gym and find a good personal trainer. Let them teach you how to do it right.   tell them that you just want to know how to use the machines and free weights and book five or six sessions to practice with the trainer.  sessions are usually about $50-70 an hour.

I trained with a PT for a year. Best thing I ever did for myself other than martial arts.  There are a lot of little subtleties in lifting that can make a huge difference.  I go to the gym a lot, and MOST of the people I see lifting are doing it wrong.  If you lift wrong, you can hurt yourself, or at the least, not gain any benefit from your workout.

common mistakes:

lifting too fast.  you use your momentum instead of your muscles.  doesn't accomplish anything for you except for maybe a brief cardio workout if you do it long enough

lifting too much.  don't be macho.  you'll look a lot less macho rolling on the ground in pain because you've torn something or given yourself a hernia.  If you're straining on the first few reps, its too much weight.

lifting too little.  If you don't feel any kind of burn after 2 sets of ten, you're lifting too little and not doing yourself any kind of good.

not wearing proper gear.  you need gloves and a weight belt at the least.  

improper weight machine alignment.  you have to know how to set up the machine. seats and weight grips are usually moveable. if you're in the wrong position, you don't work the right muscles, and can injure yourself.

improper use of free weights.  make sure you know what you're doing. repetitive motion injuries are not fun.


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## MartialArtist (Sep 2, 2002)

Get a powerlifting routine.  Done right, it will make you get stronger and faster at certain techniques without gaining mass that would slow you down.


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## AvPKenpo (Sep 4, 2002)

> _Originally posted by pancasona _
> 
> *hi everyone,
> i need to improve my performance in martial arts by weight raining, but i don't know how should i start it. I need your suggestion and advice in weight training. i need it for strenth , endurance, and a good looking body. *



I have been using a program that has  been listed on another thread and it is awesome.  It is here 
you will have to create a profile, no biggie.  The program explains a lot about: how to work our properly, nutrition, suplements and such.  Enjoy it I have.

Michael


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## hakuda (Sep 15, 2006)

1 Prime your Muscle Pump -- New studies say to improve lean muscle gains, prime your muscles with whey protein before workouts. This improves nitrogen delivery up to 162% better.

 (1) After 16 weeks, preworkout protein leads to 3x more lean gains in hard training athletes. 

(2) Of course, whey protein also produced better nitrogen uptake in muscle than free form amino acids. 

Whey More Anabolic -- To help you grow--whey is the word. Whey improves your muscle sensitivity to insulin--your body's most anabolic hormone. (2) University studies--324 blood tests in athletes--show  WHEY increases insulin 48.1% to drive anabolic response after 28 days. (3)

Speed Muscle Recovery -- Taking whey post-workout is critical to speed muscle recovery. 25g of a new whey isolate per day for 12 weeks improves strength and power while reducing muscle inflammation and soreness in lifters. (2)

4 Maximum Muscle Strength -- 40g of whey protein a day is shown to reduce muscle fatigue by 10.3% in 28 days when exercising. (2) Improves muscle relaxation between contractions, producing more strength for each rep! 

5 Faster Fat Loss --  Whey contains special fractions which help ACE inhibitors to prevent fat gain, BCAA's to preserve lean muscle and dairy calcium to target better fat loss. Use 25g of whey 3X a day or 40g of whey 2X a day for best results.

6 Raise Immune Response -- Whey has been shown for 20 years to improve immune response. Now the whey fraction--lactoferrin--has been found to raise immune response 800% in just 7 days. 

7 Activate Antioxidant Power -- New research shows 40g whey protein per day helps improve selenium status and glutathione activity. (2) Helps you adapt better to stress activities, like tough workouts and everyday life. In 1997, daily  WHEY dosing helped reduce tumor growth 60% in lab tests as part of cancer treatment protocol .

now with all that said .
the cheepest form of protein is egg white pwdr bout 95 to 98% protein
mix with
 skim milk,bananna,"small" amount of honey,teaspoon flaxseed oil.
any other recipes are good as well main part is eggwhite pwdr and skim milk.
graze through the day on small light meals (fresh n green) is best
lean beef.
but remember you need carbos as well but not after 4pm this is where you can use up your carbo from the day (you will sleep heaps better)
on waking have a glass of water with a teaspoon of lemon juice in it this starts you stomach acid so when you eat its waiting for the food to come down.
now pending on the art you study you may not need to do cardio (capeoria)
(taekwando) if you do aikido,taichi then cardio could help.
endurance "FARTLEK" running "STRENGTH" personal trainer ask about strength training not bulk training.  
put it all in one pack and ya gona have a good looking body as well.

Cheers
Hakuda


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## exile (Sep 15, 2006)

pancasona said:


> hi everyone,
> i need to improve my performance in martial arts by weight raining, but i don't know how should i start it. I need your suggestion and advice in weight training. i need it for strenth , endurance, and a good looking body.



Hi Pancasona---

I've been weight training for ten years, starting as a pretty out-of-shape ectormorph and adding upwards of twenty-five pounds of muscle over that time. Gaining muscle is very difficult for me---I have a fast metabolism that's showing no signs of slowing down and no genetic advantages whatever!---so what worked for me might do the trick for you.

From early on I followed the Pete Sysco/John Little `Power Factor' system which emphasises using _very_ heavy weights over _very_ short reps which are confined to your strongest range. Their explanation for this is a bit too detailed and technical to go into here, but the short story is, the heavier the weights you lift, the more neural motor units you recruit to fire, and the more motor units fire, the more the body responds to resistance that's just a bit outside what you can do comfortably. So the idea is, instead of a `full stretch' rep in a bench press which descends well below your zone of maximum leverage, confining your lifting to the top couple of inches of your strongest range and you can pretty much add another 80-100 lbs. to your benching right off the top. 

The catch is, you _must_ work in a power rack. Set the pins as close as you can to the bottom of your strongest range and lift to just below lock-out. That will for a standard bench press often be nothing more than a couple of inches, but if you do the reps fast, as they recommend, you'll be covering the same distance in the same time as a normal full-range rep, except with way more weight on the bar. You strive to increase the total weight you can lift during a fixed time period, and your strength increases steadily, and (if you're lucky and have the right DNA) fairly quickly. The other important point is, you train infrequently---really heavy weights demand corresponding recovery times.

My lifting routine involves training two different muscle groups, with workouts alternating between the two and each workout separated from the other by two to three weeks; any more frequent and I found my performance at the gym suffered, but if I kept to that schedule, I made progress virtually every workout. When I was at my best a few years ago, I was using 400 lb benches over a _very_ short range, doing weighted dips the same way carrying 120 lbs on a dipping chain around my waist, and so with seated shoulder presses, weighted chins for biceps, and leg presses (squats hurt like hell, even using a MantaRay, and I worried about spinal compression, so I avoid them). 

I started doing this kind of routine ten years back, when I was fifty. I had a bad accident doing a shoulder press a few years ago that slowed me down a bit---my fault entirely, lost track of what was where in the power rack in the gym I'd switched to when we moved, and had a 200 lb. barbell go back over my head and behind me because I'd neglected to set the pins high enough. But if you don't make stupid mistakes like that, the training system Sysco and Little describe is absolutely safe---power racks are great things, much more reliable than any human spotter!---and you can see your strength and mass increasing enough to forstall frustration. 

I found that the strength I gained from doing all this was just what I needed for TKD when I started doing MA, and I was quicker after a few years of weight training than I'd ever been before---I just don't buy the idea that naturally acquired muscle mass slows you down one little bit (steroid based enhancement is different, but with that stuff, slowness will be the least of  your worries if you do it for any length of time). It also can change the way you think about yourself, in some very positive ways...

Take a look at a couple of Sysco and Little's books and see if what they say might make sense for you. Good luck with your training!


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