# That was surprising.



## Xue Sheng (Aug 11, 2006)

Went to another Yang style school about 2 hours from my home, and I have to say they were amazing, it was the best Yang style I have ever seen. Not surprising since the teacher is very likely one of the last people alive that had Yang Chengfu as a long time teacher. 

I watched some of his students do the long form that had been training with him for 6 years and they were by far better than I after 12 years with my Sifu. The form was slightly different but the amazing part was that it was different in all the right places if that make any sense. It made the form and Qi flowed so much better and you could tell the power was so much stronger just because of those changes. Actually they were not changes, what I do, what most of us do has been changed, his is closer to the original. (sorry but this includes the current Yang family style too) I also saw a straight sword form I had never seen before and that is when it all hit me. 

He only teaches serious student and I was given permission to train with him, but surprisingly enough I turned it down. I would have to start from the beginning in Yang style all over again and although I have no problem with starting from the beginning it hit me all of a sudden that if I am going to start from the beginning why not go back to Chen. 

I always liked Chen better and it appears that there may be a group associated with Chen Zhenglei in my area that are actually more serious than I first thought. Also my wife&#8217;s family in Beijing has come across Chen style people in Beijing that we did not find when we were there (but we were not looking for Chen). And when I was there the most impressive Tai Chi I saw was by 2 guys doing Chen style. 

I also recently found out that an invitation to stop by and have tea when I was in China was not just a polite gesture on the part of Sifu Chen and his wife when my wife was his translator. It was in earnest, we have been invited again via e-mail; they thought we were there now. 

All roads appear to be pointing to Chen. I will still pursue Wing Chun (something else I have always liked) as I previously said in another post. But after seeing the Yang style master&#8217;s class, and I kid you not it was very very impressive, I seemed to be set free of Yang style all together. 

Just thought I would post this, since I was successful at resisting ranting today. :asian:


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## SFC JeffJ (Aug 11, 2006)

Glad you discovered that about yourself.  Also, I'm jealous!! No chocolate pie for you.

Jeff


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 11, 2006)

JeffJ said:
			
		

> Glad you discovered that about yourself. Also, I'm jealous!! No chocolate pie for you.
> 
> Jeff


 
OK just for that I am NOT changing my avatar to the sad eyed puppy and I am STILL going to go back to Chen. 

As a matter of fact I am going to go practice what I remember right now


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## Jade Tigress (Aug 12, 2006)

Xue Sheng said:
			
		

> Went to another Yang style school about 2 hours from my home, and I have to say they were amazing, it was the best Yang style I have ever seen. Not surprising since the teacher is very likely one of the last people alive that had Yang Chengfu as a long time teacher.
> 
> I watched some of his students do the long form that had been training with him for 6 years and they were by far better than I after 12 years with my Sifu. The form was slightly different but the amazing part was that it was different in all the right places if that make any sense. It made the form and Qi flowed so much better and you could tell the power was so much stronger just because of those changes. Actually they were not changes, what I do, what most of us do has been changed, his is closer to the original. (sorry but this includes the current Yang family style too) I also saw a straight sword form I had never seen before and that is when it all hit me.
> 
> ...



That's awesome XS. So glad for you.


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## Kensai (Aug 12, 2006)

That's very cool XS. I start my Sun style training on the 10th September. I'm greatly looking forward to that. I also intend to continue my Wing Chun training alongside it. Best of luck mate, let us know how that goes.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 12, 2006)

Jade Tigress said:
			
		

> That's awesome XS. So glad for you.


 
Thanks



			
				Kensai said:
			
		

> That's very cool XS. I start my Sun style training on the 10th September. I'm greatly looking forward to that. I also intend to continue my Wing Chun training alongside it. Best of luck mate, let us know how that goes.


 
Will do I am currently waiting for a response from the people in my area that have the Chen group associated with Chen Zhenglei.

Let us know how the Sun training goes. I have done Yang, Chen and a bit of Wu and I have seen Wu/hao demonstrated but I have never done Sun nor seen a live demo, it will be interesting to hear how it goes.


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## tshadowchaser (Aug 12, 2006)

you seem to be moving into a new realm, working/learning a style hat you want amd getting an invitation to one that my give you more knowledge of what you are currently doing.  Any way you can do both
anyway best of luck an happiness with your studies


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## MRE (Aug 13, 2006)

Thanks for sharing that Xue Sheng.  Congratulations on what sounds like a pretty clear decision.  It sounds like you would have had excellent instruction/training in either style you chose.

If I may ask, what style would you recommend a beginner in Tai Chi to start with.  I don't know much about Tai Chi or the different styles, but I have always wanted to try it.  The movements are beautiful, and the control that an experienced practitioner can present is awesome.

Thank you for your time


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 13, 2006)

MRE said:
			
		

> Thanks for sharing that Xue Sheng. Congratulations on what sounds like a pretty clear decision. It sounds like you would have had excellent instruction/training in either style you chose.
> 
> If I may ask, what style would you recommend a beginner in Tai Chi to start with. I don't know much about Tai Chi or the different styles, but I have always wanted to try it. The movements are beautiful, and the control that an experienced practitioner can present is awesome.
> 
> Thank you for your time



Actually that all depends on you. I always liked Chen style best, but there were no real Chen style teachers anywhere near me at the time (a teacher that actually knew Chen beyond the forms). I also liked Wu style as well, but there once again no teachers. There was a true Yang style teacher near me and since it was my second choice in a tie with Wu I went to train Yang. Yang now would be my third choice after Chen and Zhaobao. But true Zhaobao teachers are rare outside of China and California, and of course the occasional one that shows up for seminars in NYC. 

Chen and Zhaobao tend to have lower stances than Yang. But from what I have recently seen in the Old Yang style teacher all are rather impressive. Yang is more popular and there tend to be more people out there teaching Yang but that is both good and bad. So many Yang teachers make it easy to find a class and so few really know what Yang style really is about and many have no idea of true Yang style martial applications if they know anything about the martial side at all and many do not know the internal.

If you go to a Tai chi school and there is one teacher there that says he knows multiple styles, I doubt his or her validity. However that is not to say it isn't possible. Chen and Zhaobao are very closely related. Also look back at Sun Lutang the founder of Sun style, allegedly a master of Xingyi, Bagua, Wu/Hao style and developer of Sun Style. But he is the exception and not the norm. 

Read about the styles, see which appeal to you and then see what is available in your area. 

Note on yang, there is another line from Yang Binhao, but it is rare. The line from Yang Chengfu is more prevalent and it has been changed a lot since Yang Chengfu taught it. 

Taijiquan
http://www.answers.com/T'ai%20Chi%20Ch'uan

The following are the 6 families recognized by the Chinese government. 

Chen
http://www.answers.com/topic/chen-style-tai-chi-chuan

Yang
http://www.answers.com/topic/yang-style-tai-chi-chuan

Wu
http://www.answers.com/topic/wu-style-t-ai-chi-ch-uan

Wu/Hao
http://www.answers.com/topic/wu-hao-style-t-ai-chi-ch-uan

Sun
http://www.answers.com/topic/sun-style-t-ai-chi-ch-uan

Zhaobao 
Close cousin to Chen - comes directly from a Chen family member
Also the only style I have seen that trains push hands on 2 legs and 1 leg. 
There may be others, I have just not seen them.


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## tshadowchaser (Aug 13, 2006)

great informative links  thanks

please keep us informed on how you taining is going


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 13, 2006)

tshadowchaser said:
			
		

> please keep us informed on how you taining is going


 
So far as I said I am waiting for the Chen group to get back to me. As for Chen training I am doing the important basics that I remember from before. Stance training and the Chen version of Chan Ssu Chin  (Chen Style Silk Reeling Qigong) and there is a form I am trying to remember as well. 

I also talked with the Wing Chun Sifu last week I told him what my plans were and he agreed with what I was doing and told me to come when I was ready (I did not mention trying to remember Sil lum tao however). I am doing basic training at home for Wing Chun as well and what I remember from Sil lum tao. I know this teacher and I know it is very good but hard training so I need to do some work first

The last couple of years of strife with my Yang Sifu (amongst other things) have left me in less than acceptable condition.

Thanks


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## Kensai (Aug 14, 2006)

Glad to hear it's falling into place mate. I have to wait until the 10th September for my Sun style to start. Although, I've been told on other sites that Wing Chun's rubbish as there isn't enough resistance training. So you might wanna change your mind there, because other people that haven't ever once trained in the system said so.


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## SFC JeffJ (Aug 14, 2006)

Now I'm really jealous of you XS.  Just got word that the school that was hosting the Chen Tai Chi is coming under new ownership, so it looks like that won't be a possibility for me anymore.  They were also hosting a twice a month Arnis class.  But I'm going to see if the gentleman teaching the Chen would be interested in teaching out of my wifes TKD school.

Jeff


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 14, 2006)

Kensai said:
			
		

> Although, I've been told on other sites that Wing Chun's rubbish as there isn't enough resistance training. So you might wanna change your mind there, because other people that haven't ever once trained in the system said so.


 
The person I talked with is the Sifu of the Wing Chun School I am going to attend, I have known him for years, and he is a disciple of Ip Ching. 

The training I am doing at home is basically aerobic, sit-ups and push up. The last 2 years of polite arguments with my Yang Sifu have taken their toll on me physically. That and the fact that I got lazy because I did not have to train hard to do well in the class add that to getting old and I need some work. 

His Wing Chun School is currently 1 of 2 CMA schools I would recommend in my area. I went their briefly several years ago but stopped when I decided to focus on Yang style.

Still waiting for a response from the Chen group


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 14, 2006)

JeffJ said:
			
		

> Now I'm really jealous of you XS.


 
Instant karma.. You see you should have given me the chocolate pie recipe

Don't be jealous yet, I am still waiting for the Chen group to get back to me.


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## Kensai (Aug 14, 2006)

Xue Sheng said:
			
		

> The person I talked with is the Sifu of the Wing Chun School I am going to attend, I have known him for years, and he is a disciple of Ip Ching.
> 
> The training I am doing at home is basically aerobic, sit-ups and push up. The last 2 years of polite arguments with my Yang Sifu have taken their toll on me physically. That and the fact that I got lazy because I did not have to train hard to do well in the class add that to getting old and I need some work.
> 
> ...


 
Glad to hear that. Forgive my sarcasm earlier, it wasn't directed towards you. Merely a load of berks on another site acting like village idiots. I think we shall have to compare notes old boy. :asian:


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 14, 2006)

Kensai said:
			
		

> Glad to hear that. Forgive my sarcasm earlier, it wasn't directed towards you. Merely a load of berks on another site acting like village idiots. I think we shall have to compare notes old boy. :asian:


 
No problem

And Note comparisons welcome anytime


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## MRE (Aug 14, 2006)

Xue Sheng said:
			
		

> Actually that all depends on you. I always liked Chen style best, but there were no real Chen style teachers anywhere near me at the time (a teacher that actually knew Chen beyond the forms). I also liked Wu style as well, but there once again no teachers. There was a true Yang style teacher near me and since it was my second choice in a tie with Wu I went to train Yang. Yang now would be my third choice after Chen and Zhaobao. But true Zhaobao teachers are rare outside of China and California, and of course the occasional one that shows up for seminars in NYC.
> 
> Chen and Zhaobao tend to have lower stances than Yang. But from what I have recently seen in the Old Yang style teacher all are rather impressive. Yang is more popular and there tend to be more people out there teaching Yang but that is both good and bad. So many Yang teachers make it easy to find a class and so few really know what Yang style really is about and many have no idea of true Yang style martial applications if they know anything about the martial side at all and many do not know the internal.
> 
> ...


 
Thank you very much for the links.  I will be looking for a school very shortly.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 18, 2006)

UPDATE

The Chen group got back to me and it looks like I start Chen Zhenglei&#8217;s 18 forms, and Chen Silk reeling in mid September. 

Also I found that Ren Guang Yi does seminars in Flushing NY and getting to Flushing is easy for me; there is a Chinatown there my wife likes so we go there every couple of months anyway. So as I said time will tell. 

Ren Guang Yi also teaches in Manhattan and that may not be out of the question once in a while either. 

Chen Taiji Master Ren Guang-Yi's Compact Cannon Fist ll




 
But first the 18 form, it is the basics and I definitely need to return to the basics of Chen style. I have not trained Chen in about 11 years so I am more than a bit rusty.


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## Kensai (Aug 18, 2006)

My Sun style training will commence around that time too. Looking forward to it?  You betcha.


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## AidanO (Apr 21, 2011)

Xue Sheng said:


> I also saw a straight sword form I had never seen before



Would you be able to describe this form? I'm assuming you have seen the 54 point form before.

Yang (and Taiji in general) sword forms are a passion of mine (even if I only focus on training the one, knowing about the others and having video of them) and a new one is wonderfully exciting.


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