# Painful feet :( Any ideas?



## malteaser14 (Nov 16, 2012)

Hi, over the past 3 weeks I have been waking up with extremly painful feet, that eases (but doesn't go away) throughout the day. I'm a barmaid/waitress, mum of 2 and a martial artist in training, I don't get much time to sit down, but my feet have NEVER been this bad. The pain is on the base of my heels and the balls of my feet, but just the bit below my big toe. It's the same on both feet. The pain doesn't stop me training, however it's got to the point where a nice foot bath and massage doesn't ease the pain. Has anyone had the same symptoms before? Or do I just need to somehow rest my feet?

Thanks.


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## Tez3 (Nov 16, 2012)

What do the joints of your big toes look like? Is there a sort of knobbly bit on the joint below your big toe? Are you big toes straight or bent towards the other toes?


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## Bill Mattocks (Nov 16, 2012)

malteaser14 said:


> Hi, over the past 3 weeks I have been waking up with extremly painful feet, that eases (but doesn't go away) throughout the day. I'm a barmaid/waitress, mum of 2 and a martial artist in training, I don't get much time to sit down, but my feet have NEVER been this bad. The pain is on the base of my heels and the balls of my feet, but just the bit below my big toe. It's the same on both feet. The pain doesn't stop me training, however it's got to the point where a nice foot bath and massage doesn't ease the pain. Has anyone had the same symptoms before? Or do I just need to somehow rest my feet?
> 
> Thanks.



I am not a doctor and do not play one on TV, but it sounds like Plantar Fascitis to me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plantar_fasciitis

In my case, I had it badly for about six months; primarily in the mornings after waking up or if I had to get up in the middle of the night; very painful to walk.  I lost a lot of weight, and it went away.  That's all I know; but I'm sure others can help out where I cannot.  Sorry you're experiencing foot pain!


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## malteaser14 (Nov 16, 2012)

My toes are curved into my other toes, there's always been a slight curve though, don't think that's changed. The rest Olof the foot looks fine, no lumps at all. When touching the side of the base of the toe it does tingle tho, that's happened for about 2months, that used to be painful, but just tingles now so I've ccome to accept it.

Thanks Bill, I did see a post of yours on a previous thread about planter fasitis and checked it out already, I've also just taken anti inflamatries to see if the help too. Just wondering if my symptoms could be something different.


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## Flying Crane (Nov 16, 2012)

what kind of shoes are you wearing during work and the rest of the day, including training?


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## malteaser14 (Nov 16, 2012)

Training is bare foot, and work is a female version of a typical 'workman's boot' with steel toe caps (don't ask why!). I've put comfortable soles in them and they are actually very supportive and comfortable.


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## Flying Crane (Nov 16, 2012)

malteaser14 said:


> Training is bare foot, and work is a female version of a typical 'workman's boot' with steel toe caps (don't ask why!). I've put comfortable soles in them and they are actually very supportive and comfortable.



There is a current thought, with regard to running and footwear, that less is more.  We have embraced these heavily cushioned running shoes with lots of support and stablizers and whatnot, and it can actually lead to more foot injuries.  The cushioning causes you to actually strike harder when you run, and the arch support undermines the very design of an arch, which only works properly if there is nothing under it.  The foot, in it's design, is meant to work naturally, and when we wrap them up in thick shoes with lots of cushioning and support, we are preventing the foot from functioning in the way it is meant to.  This causes the foot to get weaker over time because it doesn't do any work anymore.  Think about if you break your foot and wrap it up in a cast for six weeks, the muscles of the foot and leg atrophy.  After the cast comes off, you need to rebuild that strength again.  This is kinda what happens every day when you put thick padded shoes on your feet.  Over time, as the feet get weaker, they become more prone to injury.  People try to solve the problem with MORE cushioning and support, which just makes it worse.

The solution, among runners, is a return to a more minimalist running shoe.  Shoes that are more like a thin slipper, with a thin sole and no cushioning and little or no support.  This allows the foot to function more naturally.  It also require that you re-learn how to run because you need to adjust your stride, shorten it, make for a mid-foot strike instead of heel strike, and a certain gliding stride that lessens the impact.  It takes a bit to figure it out, but it works.  It also requires time to allow the feet to regain their strength before one can run very far again, but it brings the function of the feet back into the running action, and is better for us.

This is how people used to run prior to about 1970. That's when Nike began making modern, cushioned running shoes, which changed how people run and basically destroyed runners in the process.

This may have something to do with what is happening to your feet.  It might be that your shoes are too thick and give you too much cushioning and support, and your feet are simply getting weak and prone to more injury.  Switching to a thinner shoe that allowes you to feel the ground thru the soles of the shoes might help you regain the strength in your feet and these problems might go away.  Whenever you can, like when you are at home, being bare-foot or just with socks all the time might help to begin rebuilding this foot strength as well.  Just take the shoes off whenever possible.  Stretch and flex your feet and just keep walking around the house, barefoot.

I would suggest a visit with a podiatrist first, to make sure you don't have any serious injury to your feet that require treatment.  But then going a more "natural" route with the shoes and the feet might help.

A good source of info on this is the book Born to Run, by Christopher McDougal.  It's really about runners and people who run super long distances, like 100 mile races and stuff, but he talks about the shoe issue and it's a fascinating book.


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## Tez3 (Nov 16, 2012)

malteaser14 said:


> My toes are curved into my other toes, there's always been a slight curve though, don't think that's changed. The rest Olof the foot looks fine, no lumps at all. When touching the side of the base of the toe it does tingle tho, that's happened for about 2months, that used to be painful, but just tingles now so I've ccome to accept it.
> 
> Thanks Bill, I did see a post of yours on a previous thread about planter fasitis and checked it out already, I've also just taken anti inflamatries to see if the help too. Just wondering if my symptoms could be something different.




Sounds like mine and I have a bunion on each big toe. I spend a lot of time on my feet as well. I've just been on four weeks leave and my feet have been fine, a day back at work and they hurt. I have four days off between shifts where they stop hurting just for it to start again on the first day shift. Doesn't matter what shoes I wear it's the being on my feet that does it. I have to wait seemingly for it to get worse before they'll operate. A physio showed me how to tape them when they really hurt.
I don't go running and I spend most of my when not working or out time bare foot even in the garden.


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## Flying Crane (Nov 16, 2012)

Tez3 said:


> Sounds like mine and I have a bunion on each big toe. I spend a lot of time on my feet as well. I've just been on four weeks leave and my feet have been fine, a day back at work and they hurt. I have four days off between shifts where they stop hurting just for it to start again on the first day shift. Doesn't matter what shoes I wear it's the being on my feet that does it. I have to wait seemingly for it to get worse before they'll operate. A physio showed me how to tape them when they really hurt.
> I don't go running and I spend most of my when not working or out time bare foot even in the garden.



again, what kind of shoes do you wear at work, when you are on your feet?

I wore some hiking type boots for about a year, the kind that kinda look like athletic shoes but they are a bit more robust.  Those were the shoes I wore for daily wear, all the time.  My feet always hurt with them, weird pains in the arches.  Once I read McDougal's book I threw them away and bought some shoes with thin soles.  they are much more comfortable, and over time the pains in my arches left.  My feet feel better all the time now.

that's just my experience, and it makes sense to me.  give it some thought


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## Tez3 (Nov 16, 2012)

Flying Crane said:


> again, what kind of shoes do you wear at work, when you are on your feet?
> 
> I wore some hiking type boots for about a year, the kind that kinda look like athletic shoes but they are a bit more robust. Those were the shoes I wore for daily wear, all the time. My feet always hurt with them, weird pains in the arches. Once I read McDougal's book I threw them away and bought some shoes with thin soles. they are much more comfortable, and over time the pains in my arches left. My feet feel better all the time now.
> 
> that's just my experience, and it makes sense to me. give it some thought



I've worn various types of shoes and boots with various soles, doesn't make any differnce I'm afraid. The joints in my big toes are knackered, all I can do when working is to make sure the shoes don't rub the joints.


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## Sukerkin (Nov 16, 2012)

My gut reaction was the same as Bills's (we've both suffered from the heinous pain that is plantar fasciitis ).

But that ailment usually affects the heel only:

http://www.patient.co.uk/health/Plantar-Fasciitis.htm

So, as ever with these things, it is best to see a real doctor rather than rely on well meaning folk on the Net telling you what they think it is based on their (non-qualified) experiences.


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## jks9199 (Nov 16, 2012)

malteaser14 said:


> Hi, over the past 3 weeks I have been waking up with extremly painful feet, that eases (but doesn't go away) throughout the day. I'm a barmaid/waitress, mum of 2 and a martial artist in training, I don't get much time to sit down, but my feet have NEVER been this bad. The pain is on the base of my heels and the balls of my feet, but just the bit below my big toe. It's the same on both feet. The pain doesn't stop me training, however it's got to the point where a nice foot bath and massage doesn't ease the pain. Has anyone had the same symptoms before? Or do I just need to somehow rest my feet?
> 
> Thanks.


Not a replacement for actual medical evaluation -- but it sounds a whole lot like plantar fasciitis.


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## Gnarlie (Nov 17, 2012)

What kind of surface do you train on?

Are you doing exercises involving even small jumps?

Are you doing exercises involving turning on the ball of the foot?

Are you kicking people or pads? How hard are they, and what shape ?

How far can you naturally pull your toes back towards you?

How far can you naturally flex your foot, for example do they hurt when you kneel with them flexed under you or when you kneel on the balls of the feet?

I have very large feet and most of my chronic foot soreness is a result of poor ankle and toe flexibility. I really have to work hard on improving toe flexibility but it is a painful and slow road. 

I suffer with plantar too.  My best advice for avoiding a flare up is watch your landings both after jumps and kicks. Try to feather your finish so that your heel never touches the ground until you PUT it there.

When spinning of the ball of the foot, try to pull up the toes of the standing foot to avoid lateral stress on the big toe joint and the knee.

Gnarlie


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## Dirty Dog (Nov 17, 2012)

What you describe certainly sounds like, most likely, plantar faciitis. But it's pretty much impossible to tell without an exam, and even with webcams, that can't be done over the internet. 

Take your favorite anti-inflammatory, not just once, but routinely for a few days, and make an appt to see your healthc are provider. The exam doesn't require any imaging or bloodwork.


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## malteaser14 (Nov 17, 2012)

Tex that could be part of it as the pain started with these new shoes, and I think I do walk differently in them coz the soles are so hard... But I was buying shoes every 4weeks because the soles were being torn to shreds and I was regularly getting wet feet and glass in my feet! Changing my work shoes at the moment isn't an option as These are the only ones I've managed to find that can cope with all the walking, spilt alcohol and broken glass! 

When I'm outside work my shoes are the first thing I take off! I hate wearing shoes. I don't know why, but Ive been like it since I was a child.


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## malteaser14 (Nov 17, 2012)

This was easier to copy and paste!

What kind of surface do you train on?
It's smooth padded flooring.

Are you doing exercises involving even small jumps?
Yes, jumping and jump spinning techniques.

Are you doing exercises involving turning on the ball of the foot?
Regularly!

Are you kicking people or pads? How hard are they, and what shape ?
All the time! I do kickboxing with a mhay thai influence. With use various pads depending On what we are doing, with vary degrees of softness/hardness.

How far can you naturally pull your toes back towards you?

How far can you naturally flex your foot, for example do they hurt when you kneel with them flexed under you or when you kneel on the balls of the feet?
No problems with flexibility, I did injure the ligaments in one ankl, but that's back to full movement now.

I have very large feet and most of my chronic foot soreness is a result of poor ankle and toe flexibility. I really have to work hard on improving toe flexibility but it is a painful and slow road. 
I damaged my right foot and lost movement in 3of my toes, couldn't move them without physically doing it with my hand, but with perseverance they now move as they did before. Keep working at it 

I suffer with plantar too.  My best advice for avoiding a flare up is watch your landings both after jumps and kicks. Try to feather your finish so that your heel never touches the ground until you PUT it there.
This is something I'm consciously working on and most of the time I manage! 

When spinning of the ball of the foot, try to pull up the toes of the standing foot to avoid lateral stress on the big toe joint and the knee.
Wont this put me off balance?


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## Jaeimseu (Nov 17, 2012)

I've been dealing with pf for about a year. I only have it in one foot, but it still sucks. 

I deal with it by wearing athletic shoes that have enough cushion and support. I saw that someone recommended not wearing this kind of shoe, but my pain gets noticeably worse throughout the day if I wear hard shoes, or shoes without support. I try to stretch my calf and foot before standing in the morning, and I take a few minutes to do it again before working out. Some days I have to avoid any activities that involve pushing off explosively, or rapidly changing directions. Other days it's ok. The pain is always there, but for the most part it's a pain I can live with. I'm hoping that it'll eventually go away, but until then I'll just have to deal with it.


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## Sukerkin (Nov 17, 2012)

With PF, different things work for different people and there are a couple of different causes of the problem too - one is an over-growth of bone spurs at the heels and that one requires surgery to fix.  In the main, tho', it never hurts to try out the cheapest options first - in my case orthopaedic insoles worked a treat.  They take a few weeks to do the job but, with them, I haven't been doing my Long-John-Silver-hopping-on-hot-coals impression for a long time now


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## malteaser14 (Nov 17, 2012)

Sounds like you guys might be right! I stretched this morning before getting out off bed and it made a noticeable difference.... I could remain standing instead if collapsing back onto the bed! It's still painful but it's a start! Now to book that doctors appointment


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