# history of the tengu



## shirobanryunotora (May 14, 2011)

Hi to all-have some pics of training scrolls used by Bujinkan Soke Hatsumi that show "tengu" teaching spear techniques.Have googled this term however the data is rather fairy-taleish and was hoping someone could refer me to any serious/academic research concerning these early ninja instructors? Visually they appear to be "shaman" type characters.

Thanks in advance-till the next rr


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## Chris Parker (May 14, 2011)

Tengu are Mountain Ogres/Demons, typically represented as half human, half crow, with the ability to read minds and great skill in martial arts, especially sword. They were reputed to be rather tempermental, one moment happy and playful, the next moment stealing people to feed them to their chicks/children. Obviously these creatures are mythical.

In Japanese traditions, it is not uncommon to have some kind of mythical, or divine origins to a system. For example, Minamoto Yoshitsune was said to have been taught swordsmanship by Tengu, the founder of Tenshinsho Den Katori Shinto Ryu recieved the techniques and teachings of the Ryu in a dream from the Deity of the Katori Jingu (Shrine), Futsunushi no Kami, and had the scroll in his hands when he awoke, and so on. As Ninja were sometimes represented by three legged crows, the link to divine/unnatural, or supernatural aspects is already present. The crow image then further adds to the connection to Tengu as well.

The reasons for this are found in the Japanese culture, really. The Japanese culture is one that prizes tradition, and conformity (for the most part), so coming along and saying "hey, I came up with a new, revolutionary method of using a sword" can be met with some resistance. The idea of a mythical or divine origin counters that, as the person isn't the one coming up with the revolutionary concepts or ideas, so it gets acceptance a lot easier.

The next thing to realise is that the various Ryu themselves tend to treat these histories as historical truth, regardless of what anyone may believe personally. So if you ask the members of the Katori Shinto Ryu about their origins, they will telll you that it was divinely transmitted to Iizasa Choisai Ienao by the Deity of Katori Jingu, and that divine origin is why their art has survived when so many others haven't, as well as surviving so intact and unchanged for so many centuries. In fact, they will tell you that the name of the Ryu is Shinto Ryu (Divine Way School), located at the Katori Jingu, and Truly and Correctly Transmitted from Heaven (Tenshinsho Den). So the very basic concept of the Ryu's name is that it is the Truly and Correctly Transmitted from Heaven (Tenshinsho Den) Martial Art of the Katori Shrine (Katori), the Shinto Ryu.

With that understanding, you will be hard pressed to find much in the way of academic research supporting or debunking these stories, as they are considered allegorical by outsiders, and unquestioned true history in the Ryu itself. What you may be able to find are the details of the founder of each system (or, at least, the claimed founder, or attributed founder), where they learnt, and so forth. But you really need to be looking at individual systems, rather than just "who taught them?"

EDIT: But, if you are looking for some more academic history books, I'd probably start with Kacem Zoughari's "The Ninja: Ancient Shadow Warriors of Japan", although it is certainly not without it's issues. Oh, and avoid anything from Antony Cummins whatsoever.


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## shirobanryunotora (May 14, 2011)

Thanks though got the gist of all that already.Am looking more towards the anthropological and social research into various shamanic cultures or traditions that may have coexisted in the same areas as the early ninja to see what types of crossover effects may have occurred between the two groups and/or whether such groups intermingled not necessarily "individual systems" data .Will check out the book to see if any such references apply.


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## Chris Parker (May 14, 2011)

I'm not really sure that you're going to find what you're after, then. Shamanism in Japanese culture and history is pretty much found in Shinto religious aspects, and while that was a major influence on a large number of martial practices, it was hand-in-hand with various forms of Buddhism (including esoteric forms such as Mikkyo). There was then the extensions of Shinto which lead to things such as Shugendo, but again although there may have been influence from one to the other, they are not necessarily related in any way.

Honestly, you're probably best off just researching the native religions of Japan (Shinto especially), rather than any links between them. However there are probably a few articles that I can think of that can start you on your way, and a few books as well. 

To start with, Koryu Books (run by Diane Skoss) have a range of articles in them that are interesting. The first volume, for instance, has an article by David Hall on Marishiten: Buddhist Influences on Combative Behaviour. Then there are the classical texts such as The Unfettered Mind, which is a book of a communication between a Zen master (Takuan Soto) and a Sword master (Yagyu Munenori). Also, checking in with the Hoplology Society could yield some results.


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## shirobanryunotora (May 16, 2011)

Hi-thanks too for the tip on A.Cummins.
I googled him and found some info though admittedly it was, mostly, of him by him!
It may rebound on me... however... think it would be appropriate to use your term "odd idea" person here too in this particular case anyway.

Have also begun to do Adelaide Library search on shamanic data in Japan and will keep you informed if anything comes out of that approach.The other data you provided will also be checked out.
Thanks and till the next-rr


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## elder999 (May 16, 2011)

The British kendoka, Roald Knutsen has a book coming out that's supposed to be just what you're looking for, in part, anyway: Tengu

Comes out in July, a year late......


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## Chris Parker (May 16, 2011)

Ha, yeah, "odd ideas"... that's a very gentle way of putting it with regards to Antony! I wouldn't be so kind to him, honestly, especially considering the dealings I've had with him!

Elder, nice find. I didn't realise Roald was still putting things out there, looks like another one for my collection!


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## elder999 (May 16, 2011)

Chris Parker said:


> Elder, nice find. I didn't realise Roald was still putting things out there, looks like another one for my collection!


 

It's just that I'm totally into all things shamanic...with a tie in to martial arts, though?? 

I've been looking forward to this.

And, yeah, Mr. Knutsen's gotta be pushing 80.....do I need to say how awesome that is?


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## Indagator (Jun 2, 2011)

I remember reading this on another website a long time ago. Not sure if it would be what you are looking for...?

LINK: http://mobilemouse.co.nz/ninjutsu/tengu.html


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