# Info on Ryukyu kempo



## Searcher (Dec 27, 2002)

I am looking for some info, experiences, insight etc into Ryukyu kempo.  I am looking to switch styles and there is a Ryukyu Kempo teacher in my area (he is a Dillman affiliate).  I did a search on this forum and the net but couldn't find a whole lot of information beyond the fact they (at least Dillman) are primarily into no-touch knockouts, which is something I'm not interested in.
I am also looking into a local Tracy's school in case anyone has information they'd like to share on that as well.  I also posted on the kenpo/kempo forum.
I am looking for a school that offers realistic self defense.  I had thought I was really tired of learning a lot of katas, but as long as the curriculum is manageable (i.e. there is still more than enough time for practice of techniques and sparring) and actual applications are taught, then I'm fine with it.  The reason I say that is the impression I get is Ryukyu kempo is based mainly in katas.


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## Jill666 (Dec 27, 2002)

Okay all I can tell you is what I saw in a seminar last month...
Dillman is a good presenter/speaker. I learned new info on pressure-point knockouts, along with the pertinent revivals. The no-touch knockout was covered in a separate seminar, and I'm not interested in pursuing that info at this time. 

Also teaching were Jim Korn, Gary Rooks, and the host was Evan Pitanski (probably spelling errors here). Small-circle jiu-jitsu was also covered. A great day, with some immediately helpful techniques, and some information needing a LOT more development over time.

Not really what you asked, I know, but my 2 cents.

:wink1: Jill


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## arnisador (Dec 27, 2002)

You can get a lot of good info. from the DKI group but must exercise some judgment.

I'd encourage you to follow up on it. Some schools follow the curriculum more closely than others; some teach, e.g., Isshin-ryu but with DKI "flavor". I like a lot of the DKI material, _excepting_ the no-touck knockouts and such.


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## sammy3170 (Dec 30, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *I am looking for some info, experiences, insight etc into Ryukyu kempo.  I am looking to switch styles and there is a Ryukyu Kempo teacher in my area (he is a Dillman affiliate).  I did a search on this forum and the net but couldn't find a whole lot of information beyond the fact they (at least Dillman) are primarily into no-touch knockouts, which is something I'm not interested in.
> I am also looking into a local Tracy's school in case anyone has information they'd like to share on that as well.  I also posted on the kenpo/kempo forum.
> I am looking for a school that offers realistic self defense.  I had thought I was really tired of learning a lot of katas, but as long as the curriculum is manageable (i.e. there is still more than enough time for practice of techniques and sparring) and actual applications are taught, then I'm fine with it.  The reason I say that is the impression I get is Ryukyu kempo is based mainly in katas. *



Forget no touch knock outs they don't make up the curiculum of Ryukyu Kempo.  They also don't work all of the time.  Dillman tried knocking out Benny the Jet with no success (not even a tingle)but has done it on other occasions.   Anyway if you find a good instructor the imporatance and relevance of kata will become apparent.  Trust me on one thing the self defence that comes from kata IS realistic.

Cheers
Sammy


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## DKI Girl (Dec 31, 2002)

Hi Searcher....Each DKI school varies in what they teach and how they teach it.  So I would suggest that you go to the schools that you are looking at and talk to the head instructor.

Usually you will know when you look at the school and talk to them whether or not you will enjoy training with them.  At least that's my instinct and I always tell my students that.  Everyone has different personalities and don't always get along, so you may enjoy the content, but not the instructor at any school you choose to attend.

dki girl

PS....If you would like to send me an email privately, I would discuss with you about the school in your location.  Not sure where you are at and whether I know the DKI instructor personally or not.


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *   I am looking for some info, experiences, insight etc into Ryukyu kempo.  I am looking to switch styles and there is a Ryukyu Kempo teacher in my area (he is a Dillman affiliate).  *



Which area are you in?





> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *   I did a search on this forum and the net but couldn't find a whole lot of information beyond the fact they (at least Dillman) are primarily into no-touch knockouts, which is something I'm not interested in. *



Thats good.

Here is a listing of some authentic Ryukyu Kempo Dojo world wide.
That dont teach no touch KOs" or any mumbo jumbo..just extremely practical, not to mention painful, self-defense.
http://www.ryushu.com/dojo.html


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## Searcher (Jan 5, 2003)

I am in the Lexington, Ky area.  The teacher here is a Dillman affiliate.  I've emailed him once so far but haven't had the time to set up a meeting or attend one of the classes.

And I think I mispoke before, I don't get the impression Dillman teaches 'no touch' knockouts, but instead 'one touch' knockouts.  Either way, I'm not interested in either.


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## arnisador (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *I don't get the impression Dillman teaches 'no touch' knockouts, but instead 'one touch' knockouts. *



He demonstrates no-touch knockouts and teaches them at least to his senior students.


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## Searcher (Jan 5, 2003)

'No-touch' ?!  Yikes, even worse.  How does that work?  A wave of the hand or something?


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## arnisador (Jan 5, 2003)

You can find more by searching on this site. He stands the person up, stands in front of them, holds his hands near their head for about a half minute, then they fall. If their toes are pressed down it may fail however. I've seen these demonstrated at his seminars and camps.


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *'No-touch' ?!  Yikes, even worse.  How does that work?  A wave of the hand or something? *



Actually it doesn't work.


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## yilisifu (Jan 5, 2003)

Dillman was originally a teacher of Matsumura Shorin-Ryu karate.  He learned some nerve-point strikes from a good friend of mine, Master Seiyu Oyata.....then began holding seminars and writing books which REALLY upset Oyata.  Dillman's aim was/is to make money on what he learned.

Oyata teaches authentic Ryukyu Kenpo.


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## arnisador (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by RyuShiKan _
> *Actually it doesn't work. *



Certainly the individuals receiving the technique almost always fall, but in my opinion it is essentially "stage magic" combined with a student's desire to not embarrass his teacher.

I am not convinced that Mr. Dillman shares this opinion--I think he has convinced himself that it really works. The power of belief is working all around.


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by yilisifu _
> *Dillman was originally a teacher of Matsumura Shorin-Ryu karate.  He learned some nerve-point strikes from a good friend of mine, Master Seiyu Oyata.....then began holding seminars and writing books which REALLY upset Oyata.  Dillman's aim was/is to make money on what he learned.
> 
> Oyata teaches authentic Ryukyu Kenpo. *




Dillman attended 6 seminars in total if I am not mistaken.....then figured he had "arrived" and started making books/videos. Dillmans claim to have received any instruction in these arts from Hohan Soken is bunk since he only met the man once and doesnt speak Okinawan & Hohan didn't speak English.

The main reason Dillman upset my teacher was Mr. Oyata didn't want a false or uneducated representation of tuite/atemi/and kyusho to be given to the general public. He didn't think Dillman was knowledgeable enough to write on the subject.
He didn't care so much about the marketing and moneymaking side of it since he was not in competition with Dillman.
Mr. Oyata has written 1 book that came out about 3 years ago and it contains very little material on tuite/atemi/and kyusho.


Yilisifu was also there during an Official Karate Magazine interview and photo shoot about Mr. Oyata that Mr. Dillman was also present at.
Kind of a funny article to read since some of the quotes Dillman has in there are 180 degrees opposite from some of the things he claims.


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## arnisador (Jan 5, 2003)

I mentioned in another thread an article on no-touch KOs featuring one of Mr. Dillman's students. In it it is stated that _kyusho_ means "first second" (second as in a unit of time), i.e. the fight should be ended in the first second.


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by arnisador _
> *I mentioned in another thread an article on no-touch KOs featuring one of Mr. Dillman's students. In it it is stated that kyusho means "first second" (second as in a unit of time), i.e. the fight should be ended in the first second. *




Now that you have your browser geared up for Japanese you might be able to read this word.

}@which means "vital point". 

Which in the west are confused with Atemi point/strikes. (i.e. people often call atemi points "kyusho" points wich are not really the same thing. )

The author might have taken a few liberties with the nuance of the word but it doesnft really mean "first second".


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## arnisador (Jan 5, 2003)

I can indeed see it correctly now--as opposed to the usual mish-mash of boxes and other nonstandard characters.

Now, how are you _entering_ these characters?


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by arnisador _
> *I can indeed see it correctly now--as opposed to the usual mish-mash of boxes and other nonstandard characters.
> 
> Now, how are you entering these characters? *




Magic....... 

I have my keyboard set up so I can switch from Japanese to English by clicking and icon at the bottom of my screen.


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 5, 2003)

If you go to Start/Settings/Control Panel/keyboard and then right click on the keyboard icon go to properties and then you should see an ADD button.
Click the ADD button and look for the Japanese version keyboard. 

After you do all the re-starting and what not you will see an icon at the bottom right of your monitor next to the clock that looks like EN.
Click it and you can see English & Japaneseclick the Japanese and you can enter Japanese in several ways, katakana, hiragana and so on.
Click hiragana and when you start typing it will come up in Hiragana, to choose a kanji click the space bar while the hiragana is underlined and you will see several options to pick from. This is when it gets hard since you have to know which one to pick.


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## Pyros (Jan 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Searcher _
> *I did a search on this forum and the net but couldn't find a whole lot of information beyond the fact they (at least Dillman) are primarily into no-touch knockouts, which is something I'm not interested in.*



No, they are not "primarily into no-touch knockouts", just knockouts. The no-touch thing is just a marketing gimmick. It seems to work on stage but they don't teach it for self defence (AFAIK) and certainly not "primarily".


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## DKI Girl (Jan 6, 2003)

So if everyone is done with the bashing.....can we get back to answering Searcher's questions and help him find a place to train....

Searcher....I don't know any of the instructors from the Kentucky area personally, but I would recommend that you call or drop in and watch a class and see what you think for yourself.


dki girl


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## RyuShiKan (Jan 8, 2003)

> _Originally posted by DKI Girl _
> *So if everyone is done with the bashing.... dki girl *




Bashing?
I didnt know exposing the truth about someone making false claims as to whom they trained with and for how long and what they actually learned was bashing.

If I ran into a mechanic that was dishonest and someone asked me if that mechanic could be trusted or not I would be doing them a favor by no sending him to that mechanic. 
Same thing here. 

When Georgie stops manipulating his martial Resume and comes clean I think the bashing will stop. Of course he wont be making any money if he does that though.


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## arnisador (Dec 17, 2003)

The current (Dec. 2003) issue of Budo International magazine has an article on Hohan Soken.


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## Sauzin (Dec 29, 2003)

Just my personal observation, but practitioners of Dillmans art can range greatly in street applicable knowledge.  They all tend to be very knowledgeable but the ability to apply their knowledge can vary.

I certainly understand the original poster's frustration with learning lots of kata.  I can only say that if you are learning kata from the right person then it is severely street applicable.  In fact it is what makes karate what it is.  And karate can be a pretty sport or a devastatingly efficient and well rounded combat system.  It all depends on who is practicing it and what is being taught.  And what is taught is kata.  

My suggestion would be to view or participate in a few classes.  Be respectful but ask questions and look to see if what they are doing works when they apply it.  Ask to be shown.   Look to see if they struggle to make it work.  You might feel a bit of pain, but you will know if what they are doing has real substance.  Don't make any judgments about the class until you've seen it.  A good teacher will practice what he teaches and can demonstrate when asked.

Hope this helps,

-Paul Holsinger


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