# mind and spirit



## bushidomartialarts (Mar 8, 2006)

so after spending the past five years or so studying spiritual matters and believing i was making real progress, i have made a discovery.

i've made virtually no spiritual progress at all.  i've made significant progress in my intellectual understanding of spiritual matters, but that's not the same thing.

anybody else bump up against this wall?  any thoughts/hints/advice/funny stories about it?


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## Touch Of Death (Mar 8, 2006)

My understanding is that your five basic fitnesses (mental, physical, spiritual, emotional, and perceptual) are inter-related and attention to one would effect them all. So my answer to you is, of course, you would notice the difference in the other fitnesses, and that you were unwittingly successfull in you endeavor.
Sean


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## White Fox (Mar 8, 2006)

Bushi in Yogic philosophy this is called Jania(I don't know if I spelled that right) Yoga which means understanding the difference between matter and spirit on the mental platform. But as we know the proof is in the pudding. Or the direct experience. For that that you must go inward into your heart of hearts and ask for truth there. I once heard the secret to success in spirtual life is sincerity. You must want the truth and be willing to endure the consquences.


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## MartialIntent (Mar 8, 2006)

bushidomartialarts said:
			
		

> so after spending the past five years or so studying spiritual matters and believing i was making real progress, i have made a discovery.
> 
> i've made virtually no spiritual progress at all. i've made significant progress in my intellectual understanding of spiritual matters, but that's not the same thing.
> 
> anybody else bump up against this wall? any thoughts/hints/advice/funny stories about it?


I think the problem arises because of the desire to quantify that's inherent in our arts. We hear these questions daily: When will I reach black belt? how many punches per second? Can my aikido handle a kickboxer? etc... And that's just in our practise halls. Our whole lives are a long list of measurable goals, targets and systematics for gauging our progress and success. Spiritual progress is alas one of those unquantifiables. So I'm wondering what metrics or point of reference you have for saying you have made *no* progress at all? What are you comparing with? And might there be any chance you're intellectualizing _too _much?

With your persevering attitude and spirit of learning, you'll have an epiphany, I've seen it so many times, I'd almost guarantee it. It may be in your training, it may be in your back yard on a rainy day, it may be with your family, who knows, but it'll happen sure enough.

I've always found it helps to document my thoughts. I believe this might also be helpful in showing you that progress *has* in fact been made and that you're not simply treading water.

I mean I don't want to sound too esoteric but if you're too focussed on reaching your destination, mightn't you be missing the views along the way?

Respects!


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## Xue Sheng (Mar 8, 2006)

Please excuse the philisophical tone, but could it be you are trying to hard?

This is not me, it is from the Tao Te Ching

When you wish to contract something
You must momentarily expand it
When you wish to weaken something 
You must momentarily strengthen it
When you wish to reject something 
You must momentarily join with it
When you wish to seize something
You most momentarily give it up
This is called subtle insight

The soft and weak conquer the strong


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## bushidomartialarts (Mar 8, 2006)

guilty on both counts.

it's a certainty that i'm trying too hard and overintellectualizing.

so the trick then, i guess, is to try even harder to understand why i'm intellectualizing?  study everything, buy every book....

thanks so much for your insights and encouragement.  i'll keep ya posted.


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## MartialIntent (Mar 9, 2006)

bushidomartialarts said:
			
		

> guilty on both counts.
> 
> it's a certainty that i'm trying too hard and overintellectualizing.
> 
> ...


If you don't mind me asking, has it been a particular event that's caused you to believe you've made no progress? I'd still be interested to know what you're measuring your spiritual "success" against.

A friend of mine bore such an oppressive burden of guilt and spiritual inadequacy and after a particular life event that it completely undermined his spiritual confidence. So much so that he felt no other option other than to _resign _his position as Pastor in his church...

I think there's much to be said for going with your own spiritual flow and not attempting to rationalize it overly.

Respects!


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## Xue Sheng (Mar 9, 2006)

bushidomartialarts said:
			
		

> guilty on both counts.
> 
> it's a certainty that i'm trying too hard and overintellectualizing.
> 
> ...


 
Actually stop.

Don't try so hard, relax and remember what you enjoy most about your chosen martial art. Reading may help, reading may hurt, I cannot say but I would just try and not think about it at all and you may find that it is already there. Train for the sake of training; train because you enjoy training, that's it.


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## bushidomartialarts (Mar 9, 2006)

sorry.  being ironic.  but thanks for the thought.


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## Xue Sheng (Mar 10, 2006)

bushidomartialarts said:
			
		

> sorry. being ironic. but thanks for the thought.


 
No problem, I'm just being slow on the up take


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