# Ninjutsu/Ninjitsu compared to other MA's



## marshallbd (Jun 18, 2004)

Cn anyone give me a thorough xplanation/description of the differences between Ninjutsu/ninjitsu (not sure of spelling) and other martial arts. Why in your opinion is Ninjutsu/ninjitsu worth studying?  I honestly mean no disrespect by these questions, I sincerely would like to know from those who practice! :asian:


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## Enson (Jun 18, 2004)

i am seriously not a know it all and never will pretend to be one. the way i see things are as follows:

Difference- kicks are kicks and punches are punches. theory is another issue! the way it was explained to me was that ninjitsu/ninjutsu was never made to fight toe to toe with someone i.e. exchange blows. since they were in to espionage they had to get in and out, eliminating those that blocked the exit as quickly and silently as possible. so the art or science is a more destructive art because of this same reason. its hard for a ninjutsu/ninjitsu practicionar to enter tournaments because of this same reason. kinda like a jkd idea but ninjitsu was first.
the reason i study- well i could give you the highlighted answer to balance mind, body, and spirit.
alright peace
and keep it real


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## Dale Seago (Jun 18, 2004)

If you're talking about specifically-ninja fighting methods as exemplified by Togakure ryu, they're fairly specialized. They were used by intelligence agents and by reconnaissance & guerrilla warfare types; and back then, just as today, a pitched battle was the absolute last thing they would want to be involved in. Accordingly, the fighting methods are particularly suitable for things like resisting/escaping arrest or battlefield capture situations; fighting in darkness or low-light conditions; etc. Hatsumi sensei has stated that someone trained only in the ninja fighting skills would have little chance in a "stand-up fight" against a well-rounded samurai (whose life basically was _all about_ combat). Having trained for twenty years now in both the ninja and samurai martial arts of the Bujinkan, I agree with him.

On the other hand, if you're talking about the martial arts of the Bujinkan in their totality, that's a different kettle of fish entirely.

What does it for me is that the training is principle-based rather than technique-based (even though there are about a gazillion techniques). It is infinitely adaptable and capable of addressing any situation you can imagine, any "fighting range", and is adaptable to any weapon including use of firearms. (Hatsumi sensei has said that any true martial art does not need to fundamentally change just because technology changes: It simply incorporates the new technology into the existing knowledge base in a way that will allow the practitioner to make the most effective use of it.)

I also like the philosophy, which is one of protection of life and living in accordance with nature, or "divine law" if you like.

The only other martial art I have examined and personally experienced which is really comparable to it is Russian Systema.


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## Shogun (Jun 18, 2004)

The Native american martial arts are also comparible, but yeah, I did'nt even think about Systema being similar. good thinking Dale. Basically Ninjutsu is an escape method. The art of running away, if you will. The motions are complex, but look effortless. My Instructor often describes it as the "old man's art".


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## Dale Seago (Jun 18, 2004)

Shogun said:
			
		

> The Native american martial arts are also comparible, but yeah, I did'nt even think about Systema being similar.



If you don't mind my asking, what arts are you referring to specifically? Apart from my Irish & Scottish ancestry I'm part Cherokee, Comanche, Lakota, Choctaw, and southern Canadian Cree and my paternal aunt is a traditional Comanche medicine person, so I have some interest in the possible survival of any Siberian-American (well, that is where they got here from!) martial arts. I'm not aware of any that have been authenticated as actual old family/tribal arts.

Actually, I wish I had a time machine so I could go back and look at Aztec combat (from a safe distance). Since warfare for them was largely about taking captives for sacrifice, it would seem that they must have had some very effective hand-to-hand methods.


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## Shogun (Jun 18, 2004)

Don't mind at all. Actually I was'nt refering to a specific system, but some of the modern adaptions are similar to ninjutsu. I practice Tushkahoma (The Red Warrior) thru Grandmaster Adrian Roman. There are several others out there. I have seen some pictures that belong to my grandpa that show Huron Wyandotte using wrestling and arm grabbing technique that look kinda like Aikido. (aside from 1/4 Italian and 1/4 German) I am Wyandotte, Koyukon, and Siberian Eskimo. A time machine would be handy to go back in time and learn (as you said,...from a distance) the Native techniques of every culture, before they became watered down.


cheers,
KE


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## Ninway J (Jun 19, 2004)

Saito Ninjitsu claims to be different, though in some ways similar, from Ninjutsu.  For more info, you can visit the other threads and debates here.

Generally, I can say that Saito Ninjitsu has many forms and application schemes.  Though claiming shaolin influence, there are no animal forms.  It is an evasive and mis-directing/un-balancing art.  We prefer to get behind the opponent, rather than go toe-to-toe.  There is seldom any man-to-man drills, as in Wing Chun or Pencak Silat.  It is similar to CMA in that many movements are flowing and circular.  Some unique features in the art include fushido (mat-work), shinkeido (nerve-shattering), and the tengu sword.


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## Bujingodai (Jun 21, 2004)

Ninway, can you describe the nerve shattering. That sounds interesting.
How far from normal nerve attacks is it, or the specific term Saito Ryu uses?


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## Ninway J (Jun 22, 2004)

Bujingodai said:
			
		

> Ninway, can you describe the nerve shattering. That sounds interesting.
> How far from normal nerve attacks is it, or the specific term Saito Ryu uses?



It involves slapping or whipping your hand(s) at a certain part of the opponent's body to prime for a second attack.  It's like a shock or stun.  Shinkeido can also be likened to a feint, but a little more painful.  Its in quite a few Saito Ninjitsu forms and schemes.  Quite different from striking or pressing your thumb into a pressure point, which is also taught.


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## Cryozombie (Jun 22, 2004)

Ninway J said:
			
		

> It involves slapping or whipping your hand(s) at a certain part of the opponent's body to prime for a second attack.



Ah... we do somthing similar... a strike, followed up by a second strike to the same location... I forget the japanese term for it, but it means somthing like "One for the muscle, one for the bone"


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## Shogun (Jun 24, 2004)

makes sense. Someone once tried to tell me that nerves cannot be broken....ha ha.....they said impact moves are useless and that they would slip out from underneath them......yeah, heres a story. my friend wanted to be an idiot. So he got really drunk and ran thru town. he was running thru the park and fell, smacking his face off a very small rock. the rock cut his nerve in half and paralyzed one half of his face and now he is on the waiting list for reconstructive surgery and must go to rehab classes.

So if anyone tries to say nerves dont "shatter" or "break", tell them to get drunk and run thru a park.jk.


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