# You can't say some people didn't warn us....



## Don Roley (May 27, 2005)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4581871.stm

Say it isn't so mommy!!!!



> Last Updated: Thursday, 26 May, 2005, 23:48 GMT 00:48 UK
> 
> Doctors' kitchen knives ban call
> 
> ...


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## KenpoTex (May 27, 2005)

And the stupidity continues...Is anybody surprised?


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## Simon Curran (May 27, 2005)

Personally (as a UK citizen) I don't have a problem with the restrictions on weapons in the UK, I have never needed one, and don't expect to ever need one. I also think that the kind of person who is going to commit a violent act with a weapon does not care whether that weapon is legal or not, so legislation is not really any help.

That said, I do think that has to come a time where common sense must prevail, I have long pointed kitchen knifes at my disposal in my home, and don't think of them as a weapon, rather a utensil. Once again though, my girlfriend does have some terrible mood swings...:wink2: :viking3:


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## Franc0 (May 27, 2005)

Jeez, first their guns, now their kitchen knives. Whats next? Soon they'll outlaw the use of fists after somebody beats someone to death. Makes me appreciate livin' in the U.S. even more. :mp5: 

Franco


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## Gemini (May 27, 2005)

After watching several episodes of McGeyver (sp), I think we are all capable of making a weapon out of anything we can think of.

Ban the kitchen knife, we use scissors.
Ban the scissors, we use a fork.
Ban the fork...you can easily gouge out someones eye with a spoon. We must ban them ALL while we're on the witch hunt.

C'mon. If someone wants to do bodily harm to another, they'll find a way. Maybe we should forget the objects and focus on the bent mind wanting to use it. Hey, I have a great idea! We can bring back shock therapy!

(hmm. I wonder if HAZMAT ever finds out I washed one of my kid's mouth out with a bar of soap, what kinda trouble I'd get in.)


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## arnisador (May 27, 2005)

Is it April 1st over there?

Really, this reads like parody. I know they think they have a 'knife epidemic' there, but really...


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## arnisador (May 27, 2005)

masterfinger said:
			
		

> Soon they'll outlaw the use of fists after somebody beats someone to death.


 Isn't that part of the story of Savate--a blow with a fist was considerd the equivalent of a blow with a weapon, but not so a kick or an open-handed slap, which then influenced the development of the system?


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## Jerry (May 27, 2005)

When will the bans on pointy sticks and rocks begin?


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## Franc0 (May 27, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> Isn't that part of the story of Savate--a blow with a fist was considerd the equivalent of a blow with a weapon, but not so a kick or an open-handed slap, which then influenced the development of the system?



Shhhhhhh!, or next they'll ban the development of systems! :whip: 

Franco


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## Bammx2 (May 27, 2005)

"aaualts are prompted by alcohol and drugs"...or something to that effect.


Ban the knives but keep the alcohol and drugs.
hhmm....

Pointy knives are baaad.
Blunt knives rip and tear.
hhmm....

Next they'll be after the MA schools.
Didn't the chinese try that with Shaolin?
When that was legalised again after 100 years or so....
Practitioners were everywhere!

things that just make ya go..

hhhmmmm..............................:shrug:


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## mj_lover (May 27, 2005)

actually, it looks like they are trying to reduce impulse murders. ie fight between husband and wife, the regular kitchen knife is usually very close by, especially if the fight happens in the kitchen. i agree with it, people rarly use the pointy end when i'm cooking, so it wouldn't effect to many people either. 
my 2c.


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## Bammx2 (May 27, 2005)

mj_lover said:
			
		

> actually, it looks like they are trying to reduce impulse murders. ie fight between husband and wife, the regular kitchen knife is usually very close by, especially if the fight happens in the kitchen. i agree with it, people rarly use the pointy end when i'm cooking, so it wouldn't effect to many people either.
> my 2c.


I see where you're commin from....
but its far worse than just "domestics".
In fact,you rarely ever hear about domestics getting to that level.
You always hear about "public" stabbings and worse.
There are some decent people here and some really nice people.
 Personally though....
Carry a stick with me.
The way I see it...
knives are too quick to kill be accident by the untrained AND trained person.
If I have a stick and if I get attacked(and I have) it kinda goes like this....

You use a knife,chances are pretty damn good you will kill or seriously injure the person "by accident".

The use of a stick in MY opinion..
I get attacked by someone with a knife,with a bit o skil and a bit o luck..
he gets "educated",i.e..broken arm.
the police get to arrest him.
I get to live.
the courts get thier conviction
and the NHS gets a piece of the action too.
Everybody's happy!
The only person left out....
the mortician.

Thats just me though......


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## searcher (May 27, 2005)

Jerry said:
			
		

> When will the bans on pointy sticks and rocks begin?


Why pointy sticks?  They might as well outlaw having sticks in your yard.   Then they can move on to the more menacing things like the walkers that senior citizens use.


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## Silat Student (May 27, 2005)

I am unceasingly amused by the policies of the UK in relation to the weapons of their citizens. I wonder if they're gonna attempt to ban the possession of Files and Grinders to keep people from putting points on their knives?


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## Simon Curran (May 27, 2005)

Bammx2 said:
			
		

> "aaualts are prompted by alcohol and drugs"...or something to that effect.
> 
> 
> Ban the knives but keep the alcohol and drugs.
> ...


 On some levels, I can see what you are getting at, but the point (no pun intended...) is that without the weapon there is not the opportunity, but once again we get back to what I stated before; the kind of person who is likely to commit an act of violence with a knife is gonna do it regardless of legislature, so I don't think banning the knives we have in our homes is the way to go, even though I do understand the motivation with regards to domestic assaults...
 Like you and CNC music factory said "Things that make you go Hmmmm"


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## arnisador (May 27, 2005)

masterfinger said:
			
		

> Shhhhhhh!, or next they'll ban the development of systems!


 LOL! Seriously, I understand the point made about banning the knives to reduce impulse murders, and that would be good...as someone suggested, alcohol is probably a greater factor.

 Banning cooking utensils just seems like a step too far. More people are probably hurt by boxcutters in street violence, I would think.


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## Flatlander (May 27, 2005)

I need a pointy knife when I fillet fish.  How will the British fillet their fish?


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## mj_lover (May 27, 2005)

"None of the chefs felt such knives were essential, since the point of a short blade was just as useful when a sharp end was needed.

The researchers said a short pointed knife may cause a substantial superficial wound if used in an assault - but is unlikely to penetrate to inner organs."

not trying to be a smart ***, but i would like to point out, it has been thought of.





fish...:barf:


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## 47MartialMan (May 27, 2005)

Dont forget broken plates cut nicely...


Treat everyone line 5 year-olds..


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## AnimEdge (May 27, 2005)

Bammx2 said:
			
		

> Pointy knives are baaad.
> Blunt knives rip and tear.
> hhmm....


Actually it has been proven that Blunt objects have a better chance of pushing the organs out of the way wail the pointed ones just stab through it


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## searcher (May 27, 2005)

mj_lover said:
			
		

> The researchers said a short pointed knife may cause a substantial superficial wound if used in an assault - but is unlikely to penetrate to inner organs."


I have a question concerning this statement.   How long of a knife did you here that they were going to allow?    

My degree field is in biology and I can tell you from first hand experience.   That unless the person is abnormally large or obese it only takes a three inch blade to reaech any vital organ in the human body.   It would only take a .5 to .75 inch blade to spill a grown man's guts out onto the ground.

I have seen the use of pocket knives(a 3 blade old timer) to literally gut a 200lbs body builder.   He was split open about 2" below his diaphram from left to right across his entire abdomen.


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## Franc0 (May 27, 2005)

AnimEdge said:
			
		

> Actually it has been proven that Blunt objects have a better chance of pushing the organs out of the way wail the pointed ones just stab through it



Jeez, I feel sorry for the poor monkeys that were part of that scientific study


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## mj_lover (May 27, 2005)

searcher said:
			
		

> I have a question concerning this statement.   How long of a knife did you here that they were going to allow?
> 
> My degree field is in biology and I can tell you from first hand experience.   That unless the person is abnormally large or obese it only takes a three inch blade to reaech any vital organ in the human body.   It would only take a .5 to .75 inch blade to spill a grown man's guts out onto the ground.
> 
> I have seen the use of pocket knives(a 3 blade old timer) to literally gut a 200lbs body builder.   He was split open about 2" below his diaphram from left to right across his entire abdomen.



i was just quoting the article...i have no more information on this then what is writen, i just thought i would bring up the point that it looks that potato knifes are probably going to be exemt, if this goes thru, well, thats what i'm reading in that statement.


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## hwarang (May 27, 2005)

lmao i have so many knives that could up you up better then a kitchen knife it aint funny, my favorite is my swat style butterfly knife... the government is stupid


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## arnisador (May 27, 2005)

I don't think SWAT teams use butterfly knives, do they?


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## arnisador (May 27, 2005)

AnimEdge said:
			
		

> Actually it has been proven that Blunt objects have a better chance of pushing the organs out of the way wail the pointed ones just stab through it


  What does that mean--pushing the organs out of the way? I don't understand.


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## BlackCatBonz (May 27, 2005)

what if he has a banana?


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## KenpoTex (May 28, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> I don't think SWAT teams use butterfly knives, do they?


 Probably about as many as actually use the "SWAT" knives from S&W...


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## Franc0 (May 28, 2005)

OK, I know this has been posted before, but here's a vid with someone who mentioned about moving their internal organs to avoid the knife also.
http://www.jkd-kbh.dk/video/karate.wmv
at the end, he moved "Mr. Happy" to avoid a knee to the groin also.

Franco


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## arnisador (May 28, 2005)

kenpotex said:
			
		

> Probably about as many as actually use the "SWAT" knives from S&W...


 Heh.

 Hey *masterfinger*, I see we admire the same master!


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## michaeledward (May 31, 2005)

This just in ... 


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8044197/

*Girl, 9, charged with stabbing 11-year-old pal*
Manslaughter case unprecedented for New York City

The Associated Press

NEW YORK - A 9-year-old girl fatally stabbed an 11-year-old girl in the chest with a kitchen knife during a fight over a ball, authorities said.

The 9-year-old, whose name wasnt released, was charged with manslaughter.

Police spokesman Paul Browne told The New York Times that he was unaware of anyone younger implicated in such an act in New York City.
The victim, Queen Washington, 11, was pronounced dead at a hospital.

I dont understand how this could happen, Joyce Porter, Queens grandmother, told the Times. She said Queens mother had called her earlier that afternoon. She told me, Queen is dead, Porter said, adding, It was over a ball.

The girls had been playing together at the 9-year-olds apartment on Monday, but the girls mother had stepped out to borrow something from a neighbor, police said.

A spokesman for the Brooklyn district attorneys office said the case would go to family court because the girl is younger than 14.


​


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## Franc0 (May 31, 2005)

Man, that's just sad. You gotta wonder what type of environment that 9 year old grew up in to make her think of using a knife over a freakin' ball.
Either she grew up in a very violent atmosphere to where she thought that was an answer, or perhaps it was an angry impulse reaction. Really hard to say, but the police thought it enough to charge her with manslaughter. Very sad.

Franco


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## Brother John (May 31, 2005)

kenpotex said:
			
		

> And the stupidity continues...Is anybody surprised?


H E double-hockey sticks NO.

Next thing you know, pencil sharpeners will be deemed too hazardous for the general public because they sharpen pencils to too fine a point. 
Garden sheers...too sharp.
Hoes will need to be made of flexible material.

We MUST be saved from ourselves!!!!!!


Sheesh....

Your Brother
John


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## 47MartialMan (May 31, 2005)

People were stabbing each other with knives perhaps more in the past, like the 60's-70's.

Why is this shocking nowadays?


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## michaeledward (Jun 4, 2005)

I guess this would have to be labeled "Oops!".


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8092034/



> Lovers' quarrel turned deadly
> By KATHRYN MARCHOCKI
> The Union Leader
> 
> ...


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## Tgace (Jun 4, 2005)

Darn it..and I love steak so. Guess I better start getting used to puree.


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## Don Roley (Jun 4, 2005)

Tgace said:
			
		

> Darn it..and I love steak so. Guess I better start getting used to puree.



MUST.....RESIST .... URGE... TO....JOKE....ABOUT....SWEENY TODD.....AND.... COMMENT.... ABOUT... HOW.... MEAT.... GRINDERS.....CAN... BE... USED.....


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## Tgace (Jun 4, 2005)

Brrrr....


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## TonyM. (Jun 6, 2005)

I've been predicting someone will try to ban stairs since the early seventies.


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## arnisador (Jun 7, 2005)

A search on steak knife on Yahoo! News turns up distressingly many impulse murders with them, such as this story that has been in the news of late:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nypost/20050605/lo_nypost/9yroldslayersawmawieldingaknife

While I still think it's silly to ban them, I can see why physicians would be frustrated and would want to bring attention to the issue.

But if you ban knives, they'll just find another available weapon, like frying pans or what have you. Still, knives are especially lethal.


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## Tgace (Jun 8, 2005)

What about ball point pens? I bet I could do some decent damake with a good steel Parker.


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## Simon Curran (Jun 8, 2005)

Although stabbing him in the back could definately be considered excessive, how come she isn't pleading battered wife syndrome?

I would have thought it was a viable excuse in this case?


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## Bammx2 (Jun 8, 2005)

Tgace said:
			
		

> What about ball point pens? I bet I could do some decent damake with a good steel Parker.


 Agreed. But think of the hassle you'll have trying to cut your steak with it!

 And speaking of "steak puree".....could this be a conspiracy by Gerber?!?!


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## Gemini (Jun 8, 2005)

Bammx2 said:
			
		

> Agreed. But think of the hassle you'll have trying to cut your steak with it!


LMAO! :roflmao:


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## TonyM. (Jun 8, 2005)

Ah the steel parker. I used to do pratfalls to amuse the children until five years ago when (this is where the stupid light comes on) I did one with a steel parker in my pocket and cracked two of my ribs. Had to jump up and pretend everything was OK so I didn't scare the kids. One of my best acting jobs.
And the number one murder weapon in China is.....drum roll please.......
RAT POISON!


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## arnisador (Jun 8, 2005)

Bammx2 said:
			
		

> Agreed. But think of the hassle you'll have trying to cut your steak with it!


 I laughed at this, but seriously, the point is that these are tools, and using tools is important...one can't limit them because they're multipurpose!

 What would be a compromise--so you could cut your steak but not kill someone else? I don't know.


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## Gemini (Jun 8, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> What would be a compromise--so you could cut your steak but not kill someone else? I don't know.


That would be too easy.


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## DavidCC (Jun 8, 2005)

searcher said:
			
		

> Why pointy sticks? They might as well outlaw having sticks in your yard. Then they can move on to the more menacing things like the walkers that senior citizens use.


I wish they would.  And send a city crew around to gather up the offending sticks and take them to stick jail.  I have to perform a "mower hazard sweep" every week and it's always sticks in my yard LOL!


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## Dan G (Jun 8, 2005)

I'd like to know which "top chef's" were consulted, and what they really said. I just can't believe any chef worth their salt would say anything that stupid. 

Not every knife needs a point, and I rather like cooking with the Japanese and Chinese style cleavers (not exactly safe in malign hands), but I would be severely annoyed if my 6 inch Sabatier vegetable knife became illegal. I don't use long large pointy knives that often in the kitchen, but I almost never use very short knives either. Anything much shorter than 5-6 inches is for odd jobs like peeling, and would be a fingers and thumbs liability in the kitchen if used for general jobs. 

I wouldn't get too excited with the article, it is just another publicity grabbing renta-quote effort, and thankfully neither government nor law enforcement are daft enough to take it seriously.

Frankly, over in the UK our beef is probably more dangerous than our steak knives!  

Does wind me up though, I like my kitchen kit just as it is!:samurai:


Dan


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## Brian R. VanCise (Jun 20, 2005)

Crazy, just bloody Crazy!

Brian R. VanCise


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## Bammx2 (Jun 20, 2005)

I have 2 questions to aproach on this subject.

1-EDUCATION seems to be lacking greatly here.
 After 1,000 years of being here...the UK gov't hasn't accomplished anything but self imposed arrogant blindness as far as they're "subjects" are concerned.
 They honestly believe if you put a plug socket in the bathroom...you WILL blow-dry your hair in the shower! So they are illegal in the bathroom.
 It is also heavily implied that trying to "educate" people and letting them make thier own decisions is too late.
Could that actually be possible?

2-Penalise the ACT...not the OBJECT.
 This is believed to be a useless approach as well.
Hence banning "every damn thing in sight".
 Not to mention the "lets provide everything FOR the criminals and nothing for people to defend" approach.
 Here...if you use a gun of any type to commit a crime,you get 5 yrs automatically.if you even have a gun of any type...5 years even if you do nothing.By the way...toy guns are being banned as well.
Airsoft,replicas,blank fires...whatever.
 If you get caught with a knife,especially with a locking blade.....2 years.
Crime not neccessary.
 Is this a viable option to actually penalise the crime...not the object?
What would be considered the "best" prevention,if one could even exsist?


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## arnisandyz (Jun 20, 2005)

I guess the next thing they might say are "knives are too sharp".


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## TonyM. (Jun 20, 2005)

The reason we have rounded end dinner knives now and only use pointed steak knives is because one of the Louis' was paranoid.


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## sgtmac_46 (Jun 22, 2005)

Bammx2 said:
			
		

> I have 2 questions to aproach on this subject.
> 
> 1-EDUCATION seems to be lacking greatly here.
> After 1,000 years of being here...the UK gov't hasn't accomplished anything but self imposed arrogant blindness as far as they're "subjects" are concerned.
> ...


It really has a lot to do with how the British government views their "subjects". You aren't responsible, reasonable, thinking adults who are capable of making your own decisions. You are "children" of the state, who need to be looked after and cared for. Isn't that what monarchies were? The lord fathers and mothers of their witless subjects? I mean, didn't God himself ordain that the King and Queen look after their subjects?

We, here in the US, demand to be treated like adults. That's why most of us reject this type of "mommy culture" (so far). We don't need maternalistic governments keeping us safe from ourselves.  Sorry to hear the rest of the world needs a nanny.


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