# Thuggery Vs Martial arts (a youtube clip)



## myusername

Idon't know if this clip has been posted on here before but it is well worth a watch to see what happens when the average thug picks on the wrong man!

Analysing this I personally think the martial artist allowed the thug to get too close and was at risk of a nasty headbutt numerous times but it was wonderful seeing how cool he kept under the pressure. When he decided enough was enough and fought back, his targeting was perfect so he was obviously managing any adrenal dump really well. He took complete control and popped the inflated ego of his attacker like a balloon!


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## Brian R. VanCise

I am glad it all worked out for him in the end. 

However, allowing someone to get up right in your face and initiate a dominance role like that is very, very, very, very dangerous. (can I say
very again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





)


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## Andy Moynihan

This much I will say for him, his patience is about 3 minutes longer than mine.

NOBODY walks that close to me unchallenged in a threatening manner as this particular lifeform did.


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## Emptyhand

He is a lot more patient than I would have been.


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## Bill Mattocks

It looked as though the skinhead had his hand on the defender's neck not once, but at several points during the confrontation.  I am not an expert, only a newbie, but I'd say that the defender let the skinhead get much, much too close to him starting from the very beginning of the clip.  The appears to have taken place in the UK, and perhaps laws are different there.  However, in the US, since the defender was on his own property, and the skinhead was clearly threatening violence, an instant response of the sort the defender eventually used would have been justified, I would have thought.

However, I heard what sounded like a bunch of people egging the skinhead on, including the person videotaping the event.  Perhaps the defender felt that he would have incurred the wrath of the crowd if he fought back.  It would be interesting to know the whole story.


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## bowser666

I love seeing a bully get his *** handed to him.  Kudos to that guy although personally I wouldn't have let the guy keep getting that close to me. What if they punk kid had a knife ?


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## elder999

Well, that's about 2:36 too long.....


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## JadecloudAlchemist

I have seen many instances where someone would stand like that and let someone get that close only to get themselves KTFO. It is as Brian said very dangerous to take a netural or defense stance that close in range.
Because in an instant you can get sucker punched.

The defender looks at least 40lbs heavier then the skinny guy who must be 105lbs in boots. So a good solid punch in which I think he walked into against his glass jaw did it. 

Here are some youths around my area having some fun:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXzavy70NmI&feature=related

How Miami plays football: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNypDGoC_8M&feature=related


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## searcher

Glad it worked out for him, but he waited way to long.   He needed to act faster.   From the video it looked like the neighbors were rooting for the skinhead.   Maybe I am wrong, but it seemed that way to me.


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## myusername

JadecloudAlchemist said:


> .
> 
> The defender looks at least 40lbs heavier then the skinny guy who must be 105lbs in boots. So a good solid punch in which I think he walked into against his glass jaw did it.



Personally, I think the defender deserves a little more credit than that assessment. To me the skinhead certainly appeared very intimidating. Additionally, though I know it is hard to tell from a phone camera view, but it also appeared to me that the martial artist hit him in the carotid artery or around that area, I say this because the few strikes he threw before connecting appeared to be knife hands directed at that area. I think that he demonstrated good striking skill in a high pressured situation in full view of a crowd that seemed to be rooting for the attacker. He managed to present himself as very composed and calm through out the whole confrontation.

I totally agree with you and every one else who suggest that the guy waited far too long and left himself very vulnerable to being assaulted. I train from the fence in both jujutsu and TKD so the idea of letting somebody get that close to me and allowing them to actually grab my head would feel very wrong for me. I would like to think that I would have acted a lot sooner personally.


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## Tez3

The law here says that most definitely the householder could have and in fact should have made the first strike. If you are in fear of your life or safety the law says its sensible to strike first. It would have been interesting to have heard the householders view on the situation.


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## Bill Mattocks

myusername said:


> artist hit him in the carotid artery or around that area, I say this because the few strikes he threw before connecting appeared to be knife hands directed at that area.



I agree.  But it did not look like a shuto, it looked like a haito to the carotid.  Devastating to see it - notice it did not take a massively powerful (or even very fast) strike.  Just open hand, haito to throat, ready stance and whammo, the guy falls over.  I really think it was a carotid strike just because of the fact that it seemed to take a second AFTER the strike for the guy to fall over.  My sensei would have said he 'disrupted his ki flow'.

Again, just a comment from a newbie, disregard if it sounds totally stupid.


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## Aiki Lee

He should have instantly dropped him the minute he entered his personal space. On a side note the guy doesn't appear to be a karate master by the way he was carrying himself, and by the way the situation was progressing until the end.

He probably should have just gone back in his house and called the coppers.


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## Andy Moynihan

Bill Mattocks said:


> I agree. But it did not look like a shuto, it looked like a haito to the carotid. Devastating to see it - notice it did not take a massively powerful (or even very fast) strike. Just open hand, haito to throat, ready stance and whammo, the guy falls over. I really think it was a carotid strike just because of the fact that it seemed to take a second AFTER the strike for the guy to fall over. My sensei would have said he 'disrupted his ki flow'.
> 
> Again, just a comment from a newbie, disregard if it sounds totally stupid.


 

I'm familiar with the term "shuto"( side of hand blow) but what is a "haito"? same thing but angled as more of a thrust?


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## Bill Mattocks

Andy Moynihan said:


> I'm familiar with the term "shuto"( side of hand blow) but what is a "haito"? same thing but angled as more of a thrust?



Sorry, I should have explained.  In isshinryu, a shuto is the outside edge of the hand, which can be used as a thrusting punch or a chop.  The haito is the inside ridge of the hand, which can be used in the same manner, although it is less frequently used and the thumb must be tucked in if you don't want to break it.  The striking surface for the haito is right at the base of the knuckle on the index finger, only on the side of the hand.  Lower is soft tissue, higher you break your finger.  But for a strike into soft tissue (like the neck) it can be quite effective.  We practice thrusting with it as well as bringing it in like a reverse chop.

But it also looked like the defender had his thumbs sticking out on both hands.  A throat grab?  I dunno.  When I leave my thumbs out like that, sensei offer to remove them for me.  But it might be that he grabbed and pushed the skinhead's throat using the 'vee' of his hand.  It kind of looked like it.


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## elder999

Andy Moynihan said:


> I'm familiar with the term "shuto"( side of hand blow) but what is a "haito"? same thing but angled as more of a thrust?


 

A ridgehand.


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## Andy Moynihan

Bill Mattocks said:


> Sorry, I should have explained. In isshinryu, a shuto is the outside edge of the hand, which can be used as a thrusting punch or a chop. The haito is the inside ridge of the hand, which can be used in the same manner, although it is less frequently used and the thumb must be tucked in if you don't want to break it. The striking surface for the haito is right at the base of the knuckle on the index finger, only on the side of the hand. Lower is soft tissue, higher you break your finger. But for a strike into soft tissue (like the neck) it can be quite effective. We practice thrusting with it as well as bringing it in like a reverse chop.
> 
> But it also looked like the defender had his thumbs sticking out on both hands. A throat grab? I dunno. When I leave my thumbs out like that, sensei offer to remove them for me. But it might be that he grabbed and pushed the skinhead's throat using the 'vee' of his hand. It kind of looked like it.


 
Yeah, maybe a dialed-down version of what I used to know as a "tiger mouth" strike.


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## elder999

Andy Moynihan said:


> Yeah, maybe a dialed-down version of what I used to know as a "tiger mouth" strike.


 

That'd be _koko uchi_, the "tiger mouth strike". DOn't have an image to show the difference, but it's sort of the same striking area, but with the hand shaped differently, and the motion of delivery more in line with a thrusting motion.


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## Andy Moynihan

elder999 said:


> That'd be _koko uchi_, the "tiger mouth strike". DOn't have an image to show the difference, but it's sort of the same striking area, but with the hand shaped differently, and the motion of delivery more in line with a thrusting motion.


 

That's the one. The particularly nasty version of it I was shown had the strike off center so that the thumb of the "V" directly impacted the trachea hollow. But I'm not such a fan of broken/jammed thumbs.


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## JadecloudAlchemist

> Personally, I think the defender deserves a little more credit than that assessment. To me the skinhead certainly appeared very intimidating. Additionally, though I know it is hard to tell from a phone camera view, but it also appeared to me that the martial artist hit him in the carotid artery or around that area, I say this because the few strikes he threw before connecting appeared to be knife hands directed at that area.


 I personally do not see it as a cartoid strike and the video is so grainy that I doubt we will ever know. We can see at 2:33 the strike is hitting somewhere on the upper part of the body but from jaw to throat we can not see with guy blocking the way. Also I don't know if he is a Skinhead or not http://www.solomax.com/images/skinheads.jpg

Usually if it was true Skinhead fasion it would be 5 skins on the one guy because most Skins fight in a group and attack like that.
 At least the groups I have seen.


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## Kichigai-no-Okami

LMAO ! Yep ! Doesn't take much. Skinhead got what he deserved. Wanker. 


(Ahem.) I do, however, concure 100 % with what Brian said. To let that confrontation go on that long without ending it quickly is just inviting more trouble. Once your personal space is invaded, ESPECIALLY when your attacker lays hands on you, it's time to act. Instead of letting that skinhead guy continue his tirade, the gentleman should have taken him out hard and fast (especially HARD !!!).

Kudos to the gentleman for handling his business, though. :bangahead::knight2:


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## Sukerkin

JadecloudAlchemist said:


> Usually if it was true Skinhead fasion it would be 5 skins on the one guy because most Skins fight in a group and attack like that.
> At least the groups I have seen.


 
Aye that does seem to be true.  I got off lightly in my one and only confrontation it appears ... there were only three of them.


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## jks9199

Brian R. VanCise said:


> I am glad it all worked out for him in the end.
> 
> However, allowing someone to get up right in your face and initiate a dominance role like that is very, very, very, very dangerous. (can I say
> very again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Lasted much, much too long.

And he didn't really understand that it wasn't a duel or sparring match.


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## terryl965

Emptyhand said:


> He is a lot more patient than I would have been.


 

I agree the first time he put his chest in mine that would have been enough.


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## arnisador

Himura Kenshin said:


> He should have instantly dropped him the minute he entered his personal space.



Really?



> On a side note the guy doesn't appear to be a karate master by the way he was carrying himself, and by the way the situation was progressing until the end.



It's very hard to judge from a tape what the whole circumstances were--encounters earlier that night, security presence, friends of the offending party, who has or might have a weapon on their person, whether the defender fears he's too drunk to fight well, etc.


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## arnisador

Another link for those blocked by YouTube:
http://www.forumeter.com/video/154458/Stupid-Skinhead-Messes-With-The-Karate-Master-One-Hit-K-O

I don't have sound enabled on this machine so I couldn't hear what was being said (if indeed there was audio).

He took a lot of risk standing there like that, and was nearly headbutted a few times. I think he should've popped the guy much, _much_ sooner, but: There were obviously lots of bystanders--did he know how they'd react? Was the jerk popular in the neighborhood and the defender unpopular, and hence worried he might win the battle then but lose the war later that night? Was he concerned that the jerk had a knife/gun on him?

Did he know he could drop the guy and hence felt he was being true to Karate's ideals by using violence only as a last defense? (A romantic ideal of questionable utility, sad to say.) Or was he cowed by the jerk's energy and concerned he might lose the resulting encounter? (Sure didn't seem that way.) I ain't one to judge. I wasn't there and don't have the whole picture, and nothing succeeds like success.


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## Omar B

Wow that went on long, and I didnt understand a word of it.  Nice ending though.


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## chinto

yes, distance is your friend in that situation. that said he did handle it well, in every other way and it worked out well for him.  

I  am not a British subject, and so am not positive of the laws, but my understanding is that even the most unhappy prosecutor would have a hard time charging him. I hope they did how ever charge the skin head.


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## MJS

myusername said:


> Idon't know if this clip has been posted on here before but it is well worth a watch to see what happens when the average thug picks on the wrong man!
> 
> Analysing this I personally think the martial artist allowed the thug to get too close and was at risk of a nasty headbutt numerous times but it was wonderful seeing how cool he kept under the pressure. When he decided enough was enough and fought back, his targeting was perfect so he was obviously managing any adrenal dump really well. He took complete control and popped the inflated ego of his attacker like a balloon!


 
I agree with your summary of this, and I was thinking the same thing while watching.  The MAist would have been in the right to do something as soon as that punk touched him, but likewise, I do give him a ton of credit for containing himself as long as he did.  

I had to laugh as the punk was getting off the ground, he was still sputtering and acting as if he had won.  Typical dirtbag.


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## sgtmac_46

I give the guy tremendous credit for patience, but I don't agree with letting this go on so long, or letting him get so close.......to each his own, though, it was his situation, and he dealt with it in the way he felt most right.   If the guy is doing his best to avoid conflict based on his moral and ethical views, I can't fault him for that.

Personally, i'd have probably dropped the guy as soon as he entered my yard yelling and screaming......but, then Missouri gives me as a property owner the authority to use physical force to eject trespassers........

.......again, ever person must take in to account what the law allows, and then factor in what they personally and morally feel most comfortable with.


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## jarrod

arnisador said:


> Really?
> 
> 
> 
> It's very hard to judge from a tape what the whole circumstances were--encounters earlier that night, security presence, friends of the offending party, who has or might have a weapon on their person, whether the defender fears he's too drunk to fight well, etc.


 
i kinda looked to me like he had to poo.

jf


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## Aiki Lee

By approaching the man on his own property and yelling at him the way he did (it was hard to make out words, but I'm sure they were threats of violence), the skinhead in the video was clearly commiting assault, and once he put his hands on the defender he was commiting battery. As soon as he committed the assault by moving forward a person could have easily assumed that he was planning some kind of attack, so I'd have dropped him the minute he entered my personal space with the way he was behaving and then gone inside, lock the door and call the police.


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## dnovice

He is definitely a better man than I and most other people. He definitely knew that with great power comes great responsibility. 

I've felt like this before in threatening situation in bars. I would just stare at the person calmly, patiently waiting for the person to throw the first blow. It never comes since I don't even respond to his rantings. I do this because I feel like I can drop the guy if I need to and don't feel the need to pick on someone not as practiced as i. This is probably what he was feeling. He knew he could take the guy out. 

He probably wouldn't have just stood there if the guy was way bigger than him and looked a punishing God. 

thumbs up to him.


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## dnovice

How do you think he would have reacted in this SITUATION.


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## myusername

jarrod said:


> i kinda looked to me like he had to poo.
> 
> jf



I laughed out loud at this! Thanks Jarrod!


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## Aiki Lee

dnovice said:


> How do you think he would have reacted in this SITUATION.


 
...and the dominoes fall.
------------------------------------------------------------------

side note:

A lot of people will just stand there when being screamed at thinking that this is the best way to de-escalate the situation, but sometimes this "inaction" can be taken as a non verbal challenge of dominance.

In my dojo we practice de-escalation drills by having someone yell at you as lond as possible and you matching their volume with the continuous use of the words "what do you want!?" over and over again slowly bringing the volume level down until the yelling becomes more subdued. What this does is force a person confronting you to a) match your voice and b) get into "thinking brain" which causes them to stop screaming and start talking more reasonable. All tghe while we are doing this we prepare for physical attack because once that fist rises or they rush us, the time for non-violence has passed.


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## Tez3

As I posted earlier, under British law ( that means English and Scottish law) you are allowed a pre emptive strike if you feel you are in danger of your life. The chav actually was committing a crime, "threatening behavior" as well as maybe 'breach of the peace" as there were people watching. I could probably come up with a couple of other things if I'd been in a position to see or hear what the householder had to say.


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## myusername

Himura Kenshin said:


> A lot of people will just stand there when being screamed at thinking that this is the best way to de-escalate the situation, but sometimes this "inaction" can be taken as a non verbal challenge of dominance.


 
A very good point, some times just standing there and not responding can esculate a situation very quickly. If people can put themselves in the other persons shoes and imagine that they are really pissed with someone and want that someone to know that they are pissed and why they are pissed but that person is just staring blankly back at them and not responding! How frustrated would they feel?? 

A genuine sounding apology and validation of the angry persons feelings (whilst maintaining your fence) can de-esculate a situation a lot more effectively than ignoring the persons anger. Though, I can see why the "calm silence approach" is often favoured as when the adrenine rush comes and the thinking brain is closing down it becomes very hard to communicate effectively and the words just don't come so it is often easier for people to use the emotionless, no response approach. It takes practice to verbally de-esculate someone when under pressure. Also, I think for some people presenting themselves as calm and emotionless is their way of detaching themselves from the situation and managing their adrenal dump. 

So though I personally don't favour it I can see why people do it. However people who use it should be aware that it is not a de-esculation technique as it can be viewed as passive aggression and is just another form of posturing and psyching out your opponent. So if you just stand there, emotionless and say nothing and the aggressor walks away, it is not that you have de-esculated and calmed that person down but more that you have beaten your opponent mentally by psyching them out. A bit like two cats fighting who never hit each other, they just keep shifting position and posturing until one decides to give in and retreat. I'm not knocking it, as if it works it works, but it is still fighting and not de-esculation.



Himura Kenshin said:


> In my dojo we practice de-escalation drills by having someone yell at you as lond as possible and you matching their volume with the continuous use of the words "what do you want!?" over and over again slowly bringing the volume level down until the yelling becomes more subdued. What this does is force a person confronting you to a) match your voice and b) get into "thinking brain" which causes them to stop screaming and start talking more reasonable. All tghe while we are doing this we prepare for physical attack because once that fist rises or they rush us, the time for non-violence has passed.



Sounds like an interesting drill and I think it is excellent that you practice verbal de-esculation under pressure in your dojo. From my experience in mental health nursing I personally would not match the volume in the beginning as that can still present as aggressive but instead start at a calm, lower volume in the first place as by doing this people do still tend to match your tone of voice eventually if you maintain it. 

I love the idea of using a question to engage their thinking brain! That sounds like a really good idea and I can imagine it working well. Even if it fails to de-esculate them it could still prove a useful distraction before a pre-emptive strike.


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## Tez3

One of my instructors favourite things is to ask someone who is screaming at him etc ( it happens a lot he does the doors in Newcastle) a seemingly random question like what colours custard, what's your mums name or who won the football. He says it gives you that vital couple of seconds to distract so you can hit them, it also makes them open their mouths to speak therefore making a KO even more likely or at least a broken jaw lol!


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## jks9199

Hey, Tez --

Can you give a definition or explanation of "chav"?  I get kind of what it is in context, but it's not real clear.  Doesn't seem to really be part of the Skinhead movements.


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## dnovice

Himura Kenshin said:


> ...and the dominoes fall.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> side note:
> 
> A lot of people will just stand there when being screamed at thinking that this is the best way to de-escalate the situation, but sometimes this "inaction" can be taken as a non verbal challenge of dominance.


 

When I just stand there, I'm looking the person dead in the eye not even blinking. It isn't my intention to de-escalate the situation. My only purpose is to silence myself and be ready to strike instantly if need be. I'm taking in my surroundings observing what weapons i can use. Its kind of a calm before the storm. The moment he strikes me, or throws a punch I'll be on him. 

This way, I'm calm and if i see the person will listen to reason I talk to them. 

I think if you yell with him you are more likely to get sucker punched because part of your attention is focused on yelling with him. Just my two cents.


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## myusername

dnovice said:


> When I just stand there, I'm looking the person dead in the eye not even blinking. It isn't my intention to de-escalate the situation. My only purpose is to silence myself and be ready to strike instantly if need be. I'm taking in my surroundings observing what weapons i can use. Its kind of a calm before the storm. The moment he strikes me, or throws a punch I'll be on him.
> 
> This way, I'm calm and if i see the person will listen to reason I talk to them.
> 
> I think if you yell with him you are more likely to get sucker punched because part of your attention is focused on yelling with him. Just my two cents.



To a certain extent both approaches are correct. However, the emotionless silence and eye staring is actually posturing. Therefore, it is no different or morally superior than other forms of posturing. It is just your way of managing your adrenaline and preparing to fight and psyching out your opponent. Another person's way might be to puff themselves up and start shouting obscenities but they are both agressive actions (just one is quieter than the other).

That is just fine as posturing is just as valid a way of ending a conflict without violence than the verbal de-esculation. There are times when one approach is more appropriate than the other. However, I think on the whole when confronted with an angry person, not a mugger or surprise attacker, but more someone who has become angry with you through heated discussion or percieved slight/insult then I personally believe verbal de-esculation is more appropriate (initially!) than posturing. 

Going all emotionless and coldly staring into some ones eyes at that point is a move on your part to take things to the next level. From that point onwards the angry party has no option but to engage in posturing of their own, fight you or back down. I totally disagree that by engaging the person in dialogue it opens you up to a sucker punch. It is possible and very wise to work any verbal de-esculation techniques from the fence position and with an awareness of when things should go to the next stage (be that posturing or striking). I personally would not use the yelling idea but would speak calmly conveying genuine remorse for the supposed insult.


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## dnovice

myusername said:


> To a certain extent both approaches are correct. However, the emotionless silence and eye staring is actually posturing.


 
Could be. However, in my case whenever i've done that its usually never escalated. 




myusername said:


> Therefore, it is no different or morally superior than other forms of posturing. It is just your way of managing your adrenaline and preparing to fight and psyching out your opponent. Another person's way might be to puff themselves up and start shouting obscenities but they are both agressive actions (just one is quieter than the other).


 
true. i never said its _morally_ superior. Rather it works pretty well for me sometimes. Its not the only thing i do. If i can talk reason to the person i would. But some people just don't listen. At that point the only thing left is either they punk out or they come at you either way you have to be ready.

Yelling can work well in a different situation. However, if you are yelling people around you might mistake you as being the person who started the fight (a third person perspective) so if you really injure your opponent you might not be able to claim self defense. 



myusername said:


> There are times when one approach is more appropriate than the other.


agreed.



myusername said:


> However, I think on the whole when confronted with an angry person, not a mugger or surprise attacker, but more someone who has become angry with you through heated discussion or percieved slight/insult then I personally believe verbal de-esculation is more appropriate (initially!) than posturing.


 
haha. it would be quite weird, even creepy, to suddenly go quiet after having a heated discussion. I would never do that, and that is definitely not what the karate guy was doing. 

Its more for people that wont listen to reason, at which point you just have to be ready to fight.



myusername said:


> I personally would not use the yelling idea but would speak calmly conveying genuine remorse for the supposed insult.


 
you use a verbal means of de escalating situations until it becomes futile to do so.


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## Andy Moynihan

Tez3 said:


> One of my instructors favourite things is to ask someone who is screaming at him etc ( it happens a lot he does the doors in Newcastle) a seemingly random question like what colours custard, what's your mums name or who won the football. He says it gives you that vital couple of seconds to distract so you can hit them, it also makes them open their mouths to speak therefore making a KO even more likely or at least a broken jaw lol!


 

Do I detect a devotee of The esteemed Mr. Thompson?


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## MJS

Himura Kenshin said:


> ...and the dominoes fall.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> side note:
> 
> A lot of people will just stand there when being screamed at thinking that this is the best way to de-escalate the situation, but sometimes this "inaction" can be taken as a non verbal challenge of dominance.
> 
> In my dojo we practice de-escalation drills by having someone yell at you as lond as possible and you matching their volume with the continuous use of the words "what do you want!?" over and over again slowly bringing the volume level down until the yelling becomes more subdued. What this does is force a person confronting you to a) match your voice and b) get into "thinking brain" which causes them to stop screaming and start talking more reasonable. All tghe while we are doing this we prepare for physical attack because once that fist rises or they rush us, the time for non-violence has passed.


 
Good points!   While it may be good, depending on the situation to attempt to defuse it, by talking the person down or by saying nothing at all, a line needs to be drawn somewhere.  Like I said, I give that guy in the original clip a ton of credit, because I highly doubt I'd have been able to contain myself that long.  Letting him get that close, grabbing, pushing....nope, thats where I gotta draw the line.  

I like the drill you do too!


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## Aiki Lee

Yes when de-escalating the situation one does need to be fully aware of the fact that you may be attacked without much warning.

The reason we start with matching their tone and volume is because when they are yelling at you, they may not hear what you are saying in a calm voice. I don't yell back at them angrily in the way they yell, but one needs to be heard and come off as being very serious and ready to go if the situation boils down to it.


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## bowser666

Tez3 said:


> The law here says that most definitely the householder could have and in fact should have made the first strike. If you are in fear of your life or safety the law says its sensible to strike first. It would have been interesting to have heard the householders view on the situation.




Remember though, he could have always just gone back inside his house and called the police.  It was a weird scenario to me anyways.


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## sgtmac_46

I often say random and bizarre things to people who are in a highly agitated state.......sometimes I act like i'm angry and upset at them for something that is bizarre and off the wall, and then they get confused as to why i'm mad at them......:whip:

I've done this for years.....i'm kind of famous for it among my colleagues.


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## Tez3

bowser666 said:


> Remember though, he could have always just gone back inside his house and called the police. It was a weird scenario to me anyways.


 
Depends on where he lives! a lot of places like to sort things out themselves lol! someone could have set the bad guy up though as punishment for something. It also be why it was filmed remarkable well for a mobile phone! a nice bit of humiliation?


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