# Britain, do you still think Obama likes you?



## billc (Feb 5, 2011)

A story about President Obama selling the secrets of British nuclear weapons to the Russians to get them to sign his disarmament treaty. Obama does not like Britain, our best ally, and takes every chance he gets to show it. Are you feeling the love yet?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-to-tell-Russia-Britains-nuclear-secrets.html

Defence analysts claim the agreement risks undermining Britain&#8217;s policy of refusing to confirm the exact size of its nuclear arsenal. 

The fact that the Americans used British nuclear secrets as a bargaining chip also sheds new light on the so-called &#8220;special relationship&#8221;, which is shown often to be a one-sided affair by US diplomatic communications obtained by the *WikiLeaks* website.


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## Archangel M (Feb 5, 2011)

WTF!?!?

Thats shameful.


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

:lol:

America, what makes you think we care?


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## billc (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez, you and your fellow British citizens should ask yourselves, what else is he doing to us behind the scenes?


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## Big Don (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> :lol:
> 
> America, what makes you think we care?


That our government told another government all about your arms? Really, you don't care? REALLY?


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## Bob Hubbard (Feb 5, 2011)

The last few presidents have made me rather ashamed of our government.


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

billcihak said:


> Tez, you and your fellow British citizens should ask yourselves, what else is he doing to us behind the scenes?


 
Yeah, yeah. You want that we should become as paranoid as you are? 
The truth is you don't know what is going on behind the scenes, you don't know how much the British and Americans work together behind the scenes and you certainly have no knowledge of the Great Game. We've been playing it for centuries and are certainly masters at it. You are naive in your believing only what you want to believe and in your attempts to put yourself forward as some sort of oracle who knows the truth while the rest of us sleep in ignorance. There is no great 'wake up call' here and if as you say Obama isn't a friend of the British well he's not the first president to be that way but he'll have enough common sense to know who his real friends are when push comes to shove, if he doesn't know how to play the game on the world stage he'll learn pdq as the rest of us run rings around him lol.

Grasshopper you are young in the ways of the world, stick around for a while and see how devious the UK really is,see why we have lasted for many centuries playing off one against another. If it appears that Obama is against us he will then have to make concessions to us to show he's not. America only sells us the launchers, we produce and maintain our own nuclear warheads,plus Trident is old and tired. The Russians knew all the details about them many years ago so Obama isn't giving them anything they don't know but of course they aren't going to say they know, we have to say we don't want the Russians knowing otherwise it doesn't look like Obama is giving the Russians something of value. If we said yes they can know it spoils the deal. So the Russians are given details about the launchers they already knew about and think Obama is their new best mate but of course they also have been playing the game for centuries so they know he isn't but it saves their face because they want to reduce their weapons because of the economic climate. It's the Great Game, it's what we do so, no the British aren't worried about Obama.


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

Big Don said:


> That our government told another government all about your arms? Really, you don't care? REALLY?


 
No they told the Russians about the launchers, the warheads are made and kept by us.

http://www.greenworld.org.uk/Past%20Editions/gw63/page136/page136.html

Now the people who know me here can work out which bit of this article is pertinant to me roflmao but it's nice to know someone cares.


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## Sukerkin (Feb 5, 2011)

I do have to say that despite the machinations of the Great Game, that was still not a grand thing for Obama to have done.  

To me it matters not that the Russians have had a pretty good idea of this information for ages; what matters that Obama did it over our objections.

That can mean many things, too many to go into here; and some will work to our advantage in diplomatic terms, true.  Doesn't mean that I, as an individual subject of the Crown, have to like our supposed ally sticking one in our back.

I guess that is why I'll never make a politician or high-stakes diplomat - I believe that giving my word is my bond, that you don't lie (even if you will suffer for not doing so) and you do not betray your friends confidences.

:chuckles:  aye, not much hope of a political career for me .


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## chrispillertkd (Feb 5, 2011)

Obama is unable to separate his hatred for the Brits because they tortured his grandfather from his role as President. He's still a street organizer working on sticking it to the man. Unfortunately for all concerned the stakes are substantially higher this time around.

His lack of judgement regarding our allies makes him unfit to hold office, every other failing of his aside, IMNSHO.

Pax,

Chris


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

Suk, I wouldn't worry too much about it, the Americans seem to think they sell us the nuclear weapons, they don't, all they supply is the launchers. It's the world stage, with Afghanistan going on as well as various other situations where America needs back up as they, frankly, don't have many friends in the world, you don't think the Obama would sell the launcher secrets to the Russians without the tacit approval from the UK. It *is* the Great Game, things have to be done that don't always gel with what the public perceive. 

We need politicians to lie sometimes thats why it's annoying to find out that some of them are very poor liars. World affairs are never what they seem and after all American presidents come and they go, the British really don't care what they say. 

Truth be told the general public have never been as enthuisastic about us being cousins as the media protray, many Brits have relatives in Commonwealth countries such as Canada, Australia and New Zealand and it's to these countries that most Brits would claim a relationship with.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/bagehot/2010/07/special_relationship


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

chrispillertkd said:


> Obama is unable to separate his hatred for the Brits because they tortured his grandfather from his role as President. He's still a street organizer working on sticking it to the man. Unfortunately for all concerned the stakes are substantially higher this time around.
> 
> His lack of judgement regarding our allies makes him unfit to hold office, every other failing of his aside, IMNSHO.
> 
> ...


 

http://www.newsbiscuit.com/2010/08/...ary-action’-to-liberate-britain-from-the-nhs/


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## chrispillertkd (Feb 5, 2011)

Not really sure how that's relevant but it was good satire.

Pax,

Chris


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

chrispillertkd said:


> Not really sure how that's relevant but it was good satire.
> 
> Pax,
> 
> Chris


 
Relevant in that's how we see America 

Look we don't take our politicians seriously let alone anyone elses. The Kennedy's disliked the British as well and survived that. What Obama is or does doesn't impinge on the average Brits life in the slightest, the Six Nations rugby starts today much more important than whther Obama likes or dislikes us, we are arrogant and blase enough to think it doesn't matter what he thinks of us and if it's about his grandfather we shrug and say well the grandfather shouldn't have been in the Mau Mau to start with, an organisation known for it's nastiness and violence including torture. 

http://ww2today.com/27th-september-1940-kennedy-the-british-are-a-lost-cause


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## billc (Feb 5, 2011)

What irritates me about it is Obamas lack of wisdom and understanding.  As an American I really dislike the way he is sticking to our friend and ally, especially when he is so friendly with all the really bad actors out on the world stage.    Wether or not what he is doing has any real teeth to it, it doesn't really matter who makes the weapons, its that he is selling out a friend, a long time friend, to a former KGB agent, because of his twisted, community activist view of the world.  It is pretty offensive.


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## Bruno@MT (Feb 5, 2011)

As Irene said: it's called the Great Game. What makes you think that suddenly, everything that is being reported in the media should be taken at face value, as if the politicians and intelligence departments have not been playing power politics for ages? This is a game of 'I know that you know we know, but you don't know for sure that we know you know we know'.

Somehow I don't think that the UK PM was watching FOX news, blissfully unaware, and suddenly went 'OMG Ponies, Obama told them Russkies our nukular secrets. Oh lawd, what is I go do?'


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## Blade96 (Feb 5, 2011)

isnt the cold war supposed to be over? If it is why do u care so much.


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

billcihak said:


> What irritates me about it is Obamas lack of wisdom and understanding. As an American I really dislike the way he is sticking to our friend and ally, especially when he is so friendly with all the really bad actors out on the world stage. Wether or not what he is doing has any real teeth to it, it doesn't really matter who makes the weapons, its that he is selling out a friend, a long time friend, to a former KGB agent, because of his twisted, community activist view of the world. It is pretty offensive.


 

I think your view of the world is somewhat naive, it's politics, rarely worth getting the blood pressure up.


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## K-man (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> http://www.newsbiscuit.com/2010/08/...ary-action’-to-liberate-britain-from-the-nhs/


 
Very good.  ROFL!  :rofl:


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## Tanaka (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> I think your view of the world is somewhat naive, it's politics, rarely worth getting the blood pressure up.


Indeed it is politics. The republicans within are trying to win over more republicans at home. So they release an article that the ones at home don't know "fully" about. And it makes Obama look bad. 

This won't be the last article that gets put out to make Obama look like an "anti-american"  "socialist" "blah blah blah"


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

A title like 'Britain, do you still think Obama likes you' is hugely pretentious, there's only a handful of Brits on MT that post and many people in this country don't care whether the president of the USA like us or not. We don't even care if David Cameron likes us , if he does a lousy job we'll kick him out next election or perhaps even before.


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## K-man (Feb 5, 2011)

I just think it incredibly sad to see an administration make such fundamental errors of judgement. Most records are released after 40 years or so and we see who has shafted who but after such time is just causes a shrug.  To see it happening real time is different and disturbing.  

Australia hasn't escaped unscathed either from the say one thing in public and the opposite in private syndrome from the same administrations.   Just call it "International Diplomacy".

As to the Poms  .... bastards!  It was our turn to have the ashes!!


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## chrispillertkd (Feb 5, 2011)

Tanaka said:


> This won't be the last article that gets put out to make Obama look like an "anti-american" "socialist" "blah blah blah"


 
No, just an idiot.

Pax,

Chris


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## Tez3 (Feb 5, 2011)

K-man said:


> I just think it incredibly sad to see an administration make such fundamental errors of judgement. Most records are released after 40 years or so and we see who has shafted who but after such time is just causes a shrug. To see it happening real time is different and disturbing.
> 
> Australia hasn't escaped unscathed either from the say one thing in public and the opposite in private syndrome from the same administrations. Just call it "International Diplomacy".
> 
> As to the Poms .... bastards! It was our turn to have the ashes!!


 
Ah to be beaten in your own country........

See, the Americans don't understand that there's far more important things than whther someones president likes you or not. The Ashes now, my other half was up most of the nights it was on to watch it live, it's not winning or losing it's more important than that, it's everything! There's certain things which eclipse everything like beating the All Blacks, winning the Ashes, watching your team beat Man U etc, these things are the staff of life not whether some Yank likes you. :lol:


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## granfire (Feb 5, 2011)

Do I need to google 'the ashes'?


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## CanuckMA (Feb 5, 2011)

And what makes you so sure that he did not tell the Brits in advance, the Brits feign offence, thre Russians know the info is near useless. At the end, everybody knows it's useless, but everybody can claim they gained something.


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## CanuckMA (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Ah to be beaten in your own country........
> 
> See, the Americans don't understand that there's far more important things than whther someones president likes you or not. The Ashes now, my other half was up most of the nights it was on to watch it live, it's not winning or losing it's more important than that, it's everything! There's certain things which eclipse everything like beating the All Blacks, winning the Ashes, watching your team beat Man U etc, these things are the staff of life not whether some Yank likes you. :lol:


 

Hockey gold at the Olympics. Nothing else matters.


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## Sukerkin (Feb 5, 2011)

:chuckles:  K-Man ... it is never your turn to hold the Ashes ... other than those times when we play cricket as if it is baseball ... {whistles innocently}


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## Sukerkin (Feb 5, 2011)

*Gran*, The Ashes is the ultimate prize of cricket - even those who don't care too much about cricket are at least vaguely interested in who holds them.

The Aussies are like our dearest cousins.  We love them and yet we will upbrade them at every opportunity (and the reverse is true also - if it wasn't we wouldn't take being called "Pommie {expletive deleted}" with such equanimity by a bunch of convicts {/wink}).  The international arm-wrestle that decides who has the upper hand at the time is largely determined by The Ashes.


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## Blade96 (Feb 5, 2011)

CanuckMA said:


> Hockey gold at the Olympics. Nothing else matters.



Two hockey golds male and female


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## Carol (Feb 5, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Ah to be beaten in your own country........
> 
> See, the Americans don't understand that there's far more important things than whther someones president likes you or not. The Ashes now, my other half was up most of the nights it was on to watch it live, it's not winning or losing it's more important than that, it's everything! There's certain things which eclipse everything like beating the All Blacks, winning the Ashes, watching your team beat Man U etc, these things are the staff of life not whether some Yank likes you. :lol:



I'm sorry, say again?  I've been too busy preparing for Super Sunday to pay attention.  :lfao:


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## Blade96 (Feb 5, 2011)

might i also add..two hockey golds male and female both of them won on our own soil


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## K-man (Feb 5, 2011)

Sukerkin said:


> *Gran*, The Ashes is the ultimate prize of cricket - even those who don't care too much about cricket are at least vaguely interested in who holds them.
> 
> The Aussies are like our dearest cousins. We love them and yet we will upbrade them at every opportunity (and the reverse is true also - if it wasn't we wouldn't take being called "Pommie {expletive deleted}" with such equanimity by a bunch of convicts {/wink}). The international arm-wrestle that decides who has the upper hand at the time is largely determined by The Ashes.


OUCH! Now we are getting personal! GG Grandfather was I'm sure very happy in Manchester before those nasty coppers pinched him for some minor nicking and offered him the holiday of a lifetime he just couldn't refuse. Free board and lodging for 7 years with all the trimmings in a wonderful new world.  He even skipped back once to see how things were and won another trip. Great land England .. such generosity.


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## Scott T (Feb 5, 2011)

Blade96 said:


> might i also add..two hockey golds male and female both of them won on our own soil


 Yeah, a repeat of winning them on American soil at Salt Lake City.


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## Big Don (Feb 5, 2011)

Yes, Tez, it is politics, however, even in politics, you aren't supposed to stab your allies in the back.


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 6, 2011)

billcihak said:


> What irritates me about it is Obamas lack of wisdom and understanding. As an American I really dislike the way he is sticking to our friend and ally, especially when he is so friendly with all the really bad actors out on the world stage. Wether or not what he is doing has any real teeth to it, it doesn't really matter who makes the weapons, its that he is selling out a friend, a long time friend, to a former KGB agent, because of his twisted, community activist view of the world. It is pretty offensive.


 
I wouldn't worry about it.  According to Tez, it really doesn't matter what we do, because the British (as she seems to speak for all of them) don't really care what we do.


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## Tez3 (Feb 6, 2011)

Look, America has two faces, one is the American people who we all like, we can drink, fight alongside with, shag and generally have a good time with, the other side is the United States of America, the official side, the one the world either hates or is scared of, the side that interferes in other countries affairs, that supports tryrannies because they 'oppose' the commies. We know the difference and we know which side is our friends.

The USA, the official side started losing world credibility with the McCarthy witchhunts then Vietnam. Supporting the Shah of Iran and his ilk around the world, arming the Taliban, selling weapons to Iraq, invading Grenada helped drag the USA's reputation down even more. The first Iraq war, then the second and finally Afghanistan has exhausted much of the good will that was left. However Americans have never been regarded the same way as their governments, although that may sound odd but they haven't. More than any other country we seem to disassociate Americans from their leaders.

5-0 Kenpo, snide remark there. Am I bovvered? Are you going to put your hand on your heart and swear that American follow everything the Brits do with mouths agape and words of wonder on their tongues? No, didn't think so, you don't care what we do either. the acid words aren't needed. 

The Americans are our friends and allies, always will be, their government who knows, until the black day the Americans decide to do what their government seems to be doing we won't be that concerned. 

Your government, you sort them out if they aren't doing as you wish, we'll take what they do with a pinch of salt while remembering who our friends are.


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## K-man (Feb 6, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Look, America has two faces, one is the American people who we all like, we can drink, fight alongside with, shag and generally have a good time with, the other side is the United States of America, the official side, the one the world either hates or is scared of, the side that interferes in other countries affairs, that supports tryrannies because they 'oppose' the commies. We know the difference and we know which side is our friends.
> 
> The USA, the official side started losing world credibility with the McCarthy witchhunts then Vietnam. Supporting the Shah of Iran and his ilk around the world, arming the Taliban, selling weapons to Iraq, invading Grenada helped drag the USA's reputation down even more. The first Iraq war, then the second and finally Afghanistan has exhausted much of the good will that was left. However Americans have never been regarded the same way as their governments, although that may sound odd but they haven't. More than any other country we seem to disassociate Americans from their leaders.


To back up what Tez is saying. Over the years I have had the privilage of visiting the US several times and met hundreds of Americans. They have been, almost without exception, friendly, polite and great company. It seems though, that the Government is out of step with the people. Polititians are backed by big business and they demand their pound of flesh. What suits the multinationals becomes Government policy regardless of what is requested.

On a different tack. If we look at terrorist operations world wide, where would you put the CIA? One again it doesn't bring the US to the top of the respectability charts.



> It is impossible to read any article on the CIA that does not contain details of actions which are not acceptable with sociological standards. They routinely describe procedures to deceive Congress, to overthrow established governments, to engage in theft and murder without end, and to conceal their nefarious acts behind national security. The instances where involved parties encounter accidental death or suicide is statistically beyond comparison. http://100777.com/node/1727


 
Years ago the US adminstration undermined Australia's overseas wheat exports by dumping their excess wheat as 'Aid' in our markets. Most ordinary Americans don't see what havoc American policy brings about overseas.

So with Obama. I thought it was a breath of fresh air when he was elected but his chosen path since has not done America a favour on the international scene and he seems to have lost a lot of support in the US as well. His attitude towards Britain may be influenced by the alleged torture of his grandfather by the British forces in Kenka. Totally wrong though that may have been, was it really a reason to jeopardise future relations with the UK? The idea that this torture is so wrong would be fine if the use of torture was not such a part of US operations anyway. 

I must confess, I just don't know what you can trust any more.


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## Ramirez (Feb 6, 2011)

It's been a couple of days since the Telegraph printed that story and I haven't seen it in many other news organizations,  the BBC so far hasn't thought it important enough to post as far as I can tell.

 You think if this was really serious Cameron would be having press conferences etc. by now.


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## Tez3 (Feb 6, 2011)

Ramirez said:


> It's been a couple of days since the Telegraph printed that story and I haven't seen it in many other news organizations, the BBC so far hasn't thought it important enough to post as far as I can tell.
> 
> You think if this was really serious Cameron would be having press conferences etc. by now.


 
No nothing is being said anywhere.

With some snide remarks on here being made I'd hate to have the rabid, feverish and manic thoughts that seem to colour the right v left debates on here ruin the friendship the Brits and the Americans have by bringing that into our discussions, the OP title is in that vein sadly. Can we keep the sensationalist out of our relationships please and keep it sensible.


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## granfire (Feb 6, 2011)

Maybe it's the problem that not too many American peple get to see the _people _of other countries, only (and in bits and pieces) a little about the governments of those countries.


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## Ramirez (Feb 6, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> No nothing is being said anywhere.
> 
> With some snide remarks on here being made I'd hate to have the rabid, feverish and manic thoughts that seem to colour the right v left debates on here ruin the friendship the Brits and the Americans have by bringing that into our discussions, the OP title is in that vein sadly. Can we keep the sensationalist out of our relationships please and keep it sensible.



 Yeah the thread title is a bit bizarre, it is not as if the Brits can vote him out of office......it is kind of pointless trying to get the citizens of Liverpool and Manchester upset at Obama,  they probably didn't notice because on the weekend it is all about the Premier League.


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## Ramirez (Feb 6, 2011)

Is this the treaty in question here?

Arms Treaty

 According to the BBC it was approved by the US senate, the Republicans on the Senate would know about the information given to the Russians, you think they would have been in the press right away about it.

  Could be the wikileaks information is just wrong.


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## Big Don (Feb 6, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> > blah blah blah blah blah
> 
> 
> while remembering who our friends are.


That last bit: 





Tez3 said:


> while remembering who our friends are.


 Is _*EXACTLY*_ what we are talking about. The Obama administration either has forgotten who our friends are, or, never cared. Look at how the Obama administration has interacted with the UK and Israel. Is that how you would treat your friends? If it is, you won't have friends for long, and rightly so.


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## Tez3 (Feb 7, 2011)

Big Don said:


> That last bit: Is _*EXACTLY*_ what we are talking about. The Obama administration either has forgotten who our friends are, or, never cared. Look at how the Obama administration has interacted with the UK and Israel. Is that how you would treat your friends? If it is, you won't have friends for long, and rightly so.


 
Well as I said that's the United States of America side of you, the side that has done this many times before, it's not just Obama you know. The American people however don't let us down so we aren't going to dump you are we.  

Your government, if you don't like the way they deal with things, vote em out. Don't involve us in your politics.


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

I can see that sarcasm is lost on you.  I shouldn't be surprised.



Tez3 said:


> Look, America has two faces, one is the American people who we all like, we can drink, fight alongside with, shag and generally have a good time with, the other side is the United States of America, the official side, the one the world either hates or is scared of, the side that interferes in other countries affairs, that supports tryrannies because they 'oppose' the commies. We know the difference and we know which side is our friends.


 
See, here you go again, "who we all like."  Who is "we?"  What gives you the right to speak up for anyone besides yourself.  That was the point of my comment of "as she seems to speak for all of them".  You constantly tell us what "the British" think and feel.  No, what you tell us is what _you _feel, and then pawn it off as though every single British subject believes as you do.  I could actually understand if you even said that the majority tend not to care, but you make blanket statements regarding the whole of your country.

What's funny is, you actually do the same thing regarding your religion "Jews don't care about non-Jewish beliefs", meanwhile you wax philosophic about how Jews argue about everything within their religion, which might actually include a comparison with other religious beliefs, if only on an intellectual curiosity basis.

And this discussion is not about the individual interpersonal relationships between U.S. citizens and UK subjects.  It is about the relationships between our two governments.  So that just means that you missed the entire point of the OP to begin with.  




> The USA, the official side started losing world credibility with the McCarthy witchhunts then Vietnam. Supporting the Shah of Iran and his ilk around the world, arming the Taliban, selling weapons to Iraq, invading Grenada helped drag the USA's reputation down even more. The first Iraq war, then the second and finally Afghanistan has exhausted much of the good will that was left. However Americans have never been regarded the same way as their governments, although that may sound odd but they haven't. More than any other country we seem to disassociate Americans from their leaders.


 
And this statement gives lie to the fact that "the British don't care about what Americans do."  If you didn't, the U.S. would have neither a good nor bad reputation with you.  The fact of the matter is that you have to think about the U.S. and take the time to form an opinion about us in order for us to have a reputation with you.



> 5-0 Kenpo, snide remark there. Am I bovvered? Are you going to put your hand on your heart and swear that American follow everything the Brits do with mouths agape and words of wonder on their tongues? No, didn't think so, you don't care what we do either. the acid words aren't needed.


 
That's B.S.  Once again your logic fails you.  Just because I would not care to think about, or care about what, the British _all _of the time, does not mean that I don't think about you do_ some of the time._  The issue need not be seen in either extreme measure, as you would have us believe.  

The fact of the matter is that I do, on occassion, listen to the BBC.  I do listen to what your politicians have to say, because it may affect my country.  Hell, I even watch some of your television shows and movies.  Just as the actions of the U.S. affect your, and therefore I am sure that some of your fellow countrypersons "think about what the U.S. does."



> Don't involve us in your politics.


 
You weren't involved until you decided to comment on a thread regarding U.S. politics.  You needn't have said anything.  This was, ostensibly, not to gauge your reaction to the issue, but to gauge how Americans feel that their government is treating yours.

Not only that, but to think that your country could somehow, in this day and age, be separate from out politics is naive.  To be sure, your government may play a greater or lesser role in the debate, but it's still there none the less.


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## K-man (Feb 7, 2011)

5-0 Kenpo said:


> What's funny is, you actually do the same thing regarding your religion "Jews don't care about non-Jewish beliefs", meanwhile you wax philosophic about how Jews argue about everything within their religion, which might actually include a comparison with other religious beliefs, if only on an intellectual curiosity basis.
> 
> And this discussion is not about the individual interpersonal relationships between U.S. citizens and UK subjects. It is about the relationships between our two governments. So that just means that you missed the entire point of the OP to begin with.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry, but IMO reference to ethnicity is out of place here. I am not Jewish, but I would really prefer that we keep on the topic and I am only saying this because I don't feel Tez should have to cop this %#*t. 

Back to the OP. The question wasn't phrased about Governments. 
_"Britain, do you still think Obama likes you?" _I would have thought that that was a question asked of any of the members from GB. It specifically starts "_Britain_, ..." Did you expect a reply from the British Government? It was NOT asking Americans how they feel about this but obviously they are going to put in their two bobs worth which is as it should be.

If Tez and Superkin didn't respond, who did you think would fill in the other side of the story? It wasn't a rhetorical question was it?

From an outside point of view Obama is losing the plot. I find that really sad as we need solid alliances, not the divisive rhetoric. His suck up to Sarkozy showed total lack of judgement, or does he want to ditch existing arrangements and go it alone with the French. I know if I was going in to a fight I'd have a New Zealander on one side of me and a bloody Pom on the other.  

 Edit  ..  I'd have a Canuck there too for good measure.


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## perceive (Feb 7, 2011)

K-man said:


> I'm sorry, but IMO reference to ethnicity is out of place here. I am not Jewish, but I would really prefer that we keep on the topic and I am only saying this because I don't feel Tez should have to cop this %#*t.
> 
> Back to the OP. The question wasn't phrased about Governments.
> _"Britain, do you still think Obama likes you?" _I would have thought that that was a question asked of any of the members from GB. It specifically starts "_Britain_, ..." Did you expect a reply from the British Government? It was NOT asking Americans how they feel about this but obviously they are going to put in their two bobs worth which is as it should be.
> ...


Kiwis, Poms and Canucks. Sounds about right.  Even better if the pom's bring their Gurkha's


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## Tez3 (Feb 7, 2011)

5-0 Kenpo, lets face it you have a problem with whatever I post wherever I post it so lets just not bother getting into an argument that bores everyone silly.

Governments screw each other all the time, what do you expect, honour among thieves?

If the OP is going to address the couple of British posters here as 'Britain' well, what did you think you were going to get? 

On subjects like this, with weekend and night shifts being boring at the moment, I bring up items from MT like these and see what others think, of course its a small proportion of views but hey I pass them on. 

Anzacs, Brits and Gurkhas....awesome!!  :ultracool


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## Tez3 (Feb 7, 2011)

Busy rushing around for work and forgot the Canadians, my humblest apologies!!!

The OP puts things in such a way that it makes it difficult for any Brit to really post in any meaningful way, whatever opinion we post about Obama we will get back from some, even though they dislike him themselves, is that we have no business making comments on Obama, that we have no right to criticise their President etc etc. We will be told to mind our own business and then the ineveitable, it seems, post that says 'If it weren't for us you'd be speaking German now....' It comes up every time a criticism of the US is made by a non citizen so what the hell do you expect us to say?


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## Ken Morgan (Feb 7, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Busy rushing around for work and forgot the Canadians, my humblest apologies!!!


 
...and don't let it happen again.....


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 7, 2011)

This is a bit off post but still applicable... I think

I&#8217;m an American and this will likely get me beaten up in the study but&#8230;..

What a lot of Americans fail to understand is that America does or says and what its president does or says may not matter one little bit to another country. We may be upset, disgusted, offended, happy sad or proud and people outside of our couldn&#8217;t care less, even if what is said or done effects people outside of our borders... and I have been as guilty as the next American about this before..... But...we are not the only country that does this or thinks this way about what they do either

OK, I&#8217;m done&#8230;have at me


Oh 
And what is this Canadian you speak of (Xue runs away and hides)


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## ballen0351 (Feb 7, 2011)

perceive said:


> Kiwis, Poms and Canucks. Sounds about right. Even better if the pom's bring their Gurkha's


 Whats a pom?


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## Sukerkin (Feb 7, 2011)

We are :lol:.  It's Australian slang for 'Englishman'.  Well it used to be "Pommie" when I was younger but seems to have contracted over the past few decades. "Pommie" usually comes with an epithet tagged on the end (that being a word that is still the legal definition of a child born out of wedlock).  An Aussie could probably give a more detailed explanation of the various inflections and abbreviations or elaborations that append to it.


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## Big Don (Feb 7, 2011)

ballen0351 said:


> Whats a pom?


A fuzzy, mostly worthless little dog?


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## Sukerkin (Feb 7, 2011)

Oh, the origin of the word in common usage has a couple of theories that attend to it - a contraction of the acronym of "Prisoner of Her Majesty" being one.  That one, tho' comedic, is not likely the case.  The most commonly accepted rationale being that it is derived from "Pomegranate", that being the colour that freshly arrived Englishmen went under the antipodean sun .


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## Big Don (Feb 7, 2011)

My answer was a lot funnier...


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## elder999 (Feb 7, 2011)

Tridents are employed on the Royal Navy's _Vanguard_ class submarines.

Of which there are *four.*

Each of them can be armed with up to 16 Tridents.

This is, in fact, the only declared in service nuclear weaponry of Great Britain, having decommissioned all others back in 1998.

You can read a great deal about the Trident here

And the Vanguard class elsewhere...like Jane's..you can read about the Trident there as well.....

Given all of that, how can you make a big deal of this? Both our nuclear communities cooperate a great deal, and have since....well, since the Manhattan Project.....and the Russian nuclear infrastructure is in such a ridiculous shambles that it couldn't pose much of a threat even if Putin single-handedly brought back the Evil Empire tomorrow......:lfao:


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 7, 2011)

elder999 said:


> Tridents are employed on the Royal Navy's _Vanguard_ class submarines.
> 
> Of which there are *four.*
> 
> ...


 
There you gogiving away the secrets of British nuclear weapons to the Russians MT...and EVERYONE ELSE....you got something against Britain do youhmmmmmm 

:disgust: You just had to bring Logic and reason into this didnt you :uhyeah:


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## elder999 (Feb 7, 2011)

Xue Sheng said:


> There you go&#8230;giving away the secrets of British nuclear weapons to the Russians&#8230; MT...and EVERYONE ELSE....you got something against Britain do you&#8230;hmmmmmm
> 
> :disgust: You just had to bring Logic and reason into this&#8230; didn&#8217;t you :uhyeah:


 
Oh, and the British are going to change out those Tridents for subsonic, low altitude cruise missiles....there, *now* I've given away a "secret."  :lfao:


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

K-man said:


> I'm sorry, but IMO reference to ethnicity is out of place here. I am not Jewish, but I would really prefer that we keep on the topic and I am only saying this because I don't feel Tez should have to cop this %#*t.


 
The reference was perfectly acceptable considering the topic.  It was to illustrate a point.  The fact is that Tez continuously tells us what "the British" think and feel.  I used her arguments made when speaking of Judaism to back my point, and to further show the inconsistency of her arguement.  It was perfectly on topic.  If you don't like it, fine, but your opinion is then irrelevant as to the relevancy of what I am saying and it's appropriateness to the discussion.

What's also interesting is the her comment was directly related to ethnicity, her ethnicity as a UK subject.  She is giving that ethnic perspective.  So why can she talk about that ethnicity, but I am forbidden to speak about her consistent illogical reasoning with regard to such subjects.



> Back to the OP. The question wasn't phrased about Governments.
> _"Britain, do you still think Obama likes you?" _I would have thought that that was a question asked of any of the members from GB. It specifically starts "_Britain_, ..." Did you expect a reply from the British Government? It was NOT asking Americans how they feel about this but obviously they are going to put in their two bobs worth which is as it should be.


 
No it wasn't.  This was a post from an anti-Obama person to try to show how he is undermining supportive relationships with other governments.  There was no _real _question involved.

The point I was making was that Tez stated, "don't involve us in your politics".  But then she goes on to involve herself in our politics by making a political commentary.  As with the above regarding "not thinking about the U.S." it is inconsistent.  If you don't want to be involved in U.S. politics, and by extension, discussions regarding U.S. politics, then don't interject yourself.  



> If Tez and Superkin didn't respond, who did you think would fill in the other side of the story? It wasn't a rhetorical question was it?


 
It was not about them not being able or not to comment.  It was about saying "don't involve us", but then becoming involved.


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> 5-0 Kenpo, lets face it you have a problem with whatever I post wherever I post it so lets just not bother getting into an argument that bores everyone silly.


 
That's just not true.  I have thanked you multiple times for your posts.  In fact, when it comes to your reasoning regarding the "secrecy" of the information, and the fact that the UK was likely to know exactly what information the Obama Administration was going to give over, I find that what you say is highly likely.

What I despise though is this ridiculous argument that "the British don't think about the U.S.".  It's B.S. because we have an impact upon your country, as yours does on us, so why wouldn't "the British" think about us, with varying degrees based on the impact that we have on the particular individual.  That does not mean that those in the UK don't think of the U.S. _at all_, as evidenced by your own admission that we have a reputation in the UK.  You were logically inconsistent _in that point_.



> Governments screw each other all the time, what do you expect, honour among thieves?


 
Absolutely.  Not only that, but they screw their own citizens when it suits their purpose. 



> If the OP is going to address the couple of British posters here as 'Britain' well, what did you think you were going to get?


 
If you had kept to your original premise regarding the nature of politics, I would have not said a word.  But you had to go and add a totally erroneous premise afterward.


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## K-man (Feb 7, 2011)

5-0 Kenpo said:


> The reference was perfectly acceptable considering the topic. It was to illustrate a point. The fact is that Tez continuously tells us what "the British" think and feel. I used her arguments made when speaking of Judaism to back my point, and to further show the inconsistency of her arguement. It was perfectly on topic. If you don't like it, fine, but your opinion is then irrelevant as to the relevancy of what I am saying and it's appropriateness to the discussion.
> 
> What's also interesting is the her comment was directly related to ethnicity, her ethnicity as a UK subject. She is giving that ethnic perspective. So why can she talk about that ethnicity, but I am forbidden to speak about her consistent illogical reasoning with regard to such subjects.


Tez is British and is responding from that position. Her Jewish background has nothing to do with the thread or any of the posts in it. You brought it up and to me it smacks of racism and I'm sorry, I don't like racist references.

You second point is totally wrong. The British population is not an ethnic race. They, like many Americans, Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders are of perhaps Celtic origins or more recently Picts or Scots, Saxons or Normans. So she is speaking from a British perspective, not an ethnic one.



> No it wasn't. This was a post from an anti-Obama person to try to show how he is undermining supportive relationships with other governments. There was no _real _question involved.


 Why label to poster 'anti Obama'? It's a fair question from anyone of any political persuasion. Why is Obama upsetting allies that have stood by the US in good times and in bad? To me that is bad politics.



> The point I was making was that Tez stated, "don't involve us in your politics". But then she goes on to involve herself in our politics by making a political commentary. As with the above regarding "not thinking about the U.S." it is inconsistent. If you don't want to be involved in U.S. politics, and by extension, discussions regarding U.S. politics, then don't interject yourself.


 Tez hasn't _involved_ herself in US politics. She is commenting on the topic of the OP and pointing out that regardless of what the US Government does, it won't affect the feelings the British people have for the American people. She also pointed out, quite rightly, that it doesn't matter what Britain thinks about Obama, the Brits don't vote in the US therefore they can't do anything to change things. Why concern yourself in issues that you can't change?




> It was not about them not being able or not to comment. It was about saying "don't involve us", but then becoming involved.


Under duress!     :asian:


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## granfire (Feb 7, 2011)

A little sidenote:

US politics does effect the rest of the world in various degrees.


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## Ramirez (Feb 7, 2011)

I don't know Kenpo,  the thread asks Britain a question and Tez replies back with "we",  doesn't seem to be a big deal.
  I've answered questions aimed at Canadians (usually about health care) with "we" assuming whoever answered the question is going to know I am speaking in generalities.


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 7, 2011)

elder999 said:


> Oh, and the British are going to change out those Tridents for subsonic, low altitude cruise missiles....there, *now* I've given away a "secret."  :lfao:


 

OH MAN!!! You just CAN'T stop GIVING away secrets..CAN YOU...

Well I HOPE you happy now that you have put the ENTIRE free world in jeapordy :uhyeah:


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 7, 2011)

granfire said:


> A little sidenote:
> 
> US politics does effect the rest of the world in various degrees.


 
Yes everything from 0 degrees to 360


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## K-man (Feb 7, 2011)

granfire said:


> A little sidenote:
> 
> US politics does effect the rest of the world in various degrees.


Unfortunately, when the US sneezes the rest of us catch cold! :asian:


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

K-man said:


> Tez is British and is responding from that position. Her Jewish background has nothing to do with the thread or any of the posts in it. You brought it up and to me it smacks of racism and I'm sorry, I don't like racist references.


 
It has to go to the nature of her form of argumentation, which is a relevant to how she deals with religious as well as this issue.  It was evidence to prove a point.  She argues for the fact that Jews often disagree as to what various edicts of the religion are about, but then argues for a homogeneous statment regarding whether they "think about other religions."  The same thing here, she argues that the British don't think about the US, but then goes on to show that we have a reputation there, showing that they, in fact, do think about us.

Interestingly enough, I was not actually referring to the ethnic nature of Jews in my post, but of the religious aspect of Judaism.  Not everyone who follows Judaism is ethnically Jewish.  Not only that, but not all Jews worship from in a traditionally Jewish perspective.  There are many ethnic Jews who are of the Christian, or some other, faith.

It may smack of racism to you, but that is only if you look at what I said superficially.



> You second point is totally wrong. The British population is not an ethnic race. They, like many Americans, Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders are of perhaps Celtic origins or more recently Picts or Scots, Saxons or Normans. So she is speaking from a British perspective, not an ethnic one.


 


> ethinicity: (from websters)
> 1.  relating to or characteristic of a human group having racial, religious, linguistic, and certain other traits in common
> 
> 3.  denoting or deriving from the cultural traditions of a group of people


 
So, yeah, I used it correctly, if broadly.  She is making a generalization regarding the British people, who share religious, linguistic and certain other traits, if not completely racial traits, though most do share even that.



> Why label to poster 'anti Obama'? It's a fair question from anyone of any political persuasion. Why is Obama upsetting allies that have stood by the US in good times and in bad? To me that is bad politics.


 
Uh, cuz it's billichak.  He has made his views perfectly known.  To ignore the fact that he disagrees with Obama's policys would be disingenuous.  How come I get challenged when I bring it up, but when others have, nothing is said?




> Tez hasn't _involved_ herself in US politics.


 
Well, let's examine this.  Somehow, individual citizens discussing politics, and bringing up the nature of Obama and his policies involving the UK is "involving" them in our politics.  No actual policy thing is done, but just a *discussion* over it, somehow involves them.  That is her perspective.  So by then interjecting herself into the discussion, by her definition that a debate is considered "involvement", she is involving herself into US politics.



> She is commenting on the topic of the OP and pointing out that regardless of what the US Government does, it won't affect the feelings the British people have for the American people. She also pointed out, quite rightly, that it doesn't matter what Britain thinks about Obama, the Brits don't vote in the US therefore they can't do anything to change things. Why concern yourself in issues that you can't change?


 
And how would she know.  Quite frankly, I don't deign to speak for all Americans, then how can she then speak for all Britons?  Did she take a poll?  Is she all-knowing?  Are the British that homogeneous in thought that, by extension, she knows what they are thinking?

Beyond which, that was never my point.  You brought up everything that she said _but _what I challenged, which is that "the British don't think about the US", which has to be patently false, based on her own statements.

Which is fine if she is speaking for herself.  It is not fine when she makes blanket statements about all British.



> Under duress! :asian:


 
The duress of being bored.  I guess I can understand that.  It's about the only thing that makes me come back here.


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## K-man (Feb 7, 2011)

5-0 Kenpo said:


> And how would she know. Quite frankly, I don't deign to speak for all Americans, then how can she then speak for all Britons? Did she take a poll? Is she all-knowing? Are the British that homogeneous in thought that, by extension, she knows what they are thinking?
> 
> Beyond which, that was never my point. You brought up everything that she said _but _what I challenged, which is that "the British don't think about the US", which has to be patently false, based on her own statements.
> 
> Which is fine if she is speaking for herself. It is not fine when she makes blanket statements about all British.


If one has the luxury of time, you can read the papers, listen to the news, talk with neighbours and friends and get a pretty fair feel for the mood of the populace. I can tell you pretty much what Australians think about different issues, even if there may be two points of view. For example, most Australians are in favour of a Republic. The minority wish to retain the Monarchy. The reason there is no republic is because the pro-republic people can't agree on the type of Republic to adopt. So we will stay with the Monarchy for the present. Now I have told you what Australians think. That's a blanket statement but is it biased? Which side do I support?

As to, "Is she all knowing?"

Yep! Probably ... she's a woman!


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

K-man said:


> If one has the luxury of time, you can read the papers, listen to the news, talk with neighbours and friends and get *a pretty fair feel for the mood of the populace*. I can tell you *pretty much what Australians think* about different issues, even if there may be two points of view. For example, *most Australians* are in favour of a Republic. The minority wish to retain the Monarchy. The reason there is no republic is because the pro-republic people can't agree on the type of Republic to adopt. So we will stay with the Monarchy for the present. Now I have told you what Australians think. That's a blanket statement but is it biased? Which side do I support?
> 
> As to, "Is she all knowing?"
> 
> Yep! Probably ... she's a woman!


 
Qualifiers which she doesn't use.  Usually ever.


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 7, 2011)

Ramirez said:


> I don't know Kenpo, the thread asks Britain a question and Tez replies back with "we", doesn't seem to be a big deal.
> I've answered questions aimed at Canadians (usually about health care) with "we" assuming whoever answered the question is going to know I am speaking in generalities.


 
Without having a particular example to cite without looking through your posts, I would venture to say that you were more likely to say "most" or "alot", etc, qualifiers which she doesn't use.

Either way, the larger part of the issue that I have is the "the British don't think about the US".  I call B.S.


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## Blade96 (Feb 7, 2011)

Big Don said:


> A fuzzy, mostly worthless little dog?



they're so cute though


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## mook jong man (Feb 7, 2011)

I think the more important question is -

*Obama, do you still think Britain likes* *YOU?*


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## Tez3 (Feb 8, 2011)

Lets face it, posting something on here addressing it to the British is only going to have me and Sukerkin answer isn't it? If we post anything degrogatory or even just criticising your president we'll get all sorts of stuff coming back at us. At least I'm polite and diplomatic when I talk about Americans. 

Am I right about the Brits not caring much about what Obama is up to? More than likely after all as it's been pointed out this Russian missile thing hasn't made the news or the other newpapers.
Today's papers, note what stories are from America and what they are about.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/

http://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/


So I'm Jewish and I'm a female, get over it. My post are my views, they are individual, idiosyncratic, most are tongue in cheek and if you don't like the way they are phrased I'm sorry but I'm not changing because someone feels I'm not politically correct enough.

The British do think about the Americans but probably don't spend enough time thinking about them to please some.


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 8, 2011)

mook jong man said:


> I think the more important question is -
> 
> *Obama, do you still think Britain likes* *YOU?*


 
:jaw-dropping: WHAT!!!! :xtrmshock Well them thar be fighten words...oh its on now :flammad: Now Its TUISHOU (Chi sau for you Wing Chun types) and 20 paces Mister :uhyeah:

I actually feel the important question would be...do either of them care at all? :shrug:

Later :ubercool:


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## Tez3 (Feb 8, 2011)

A more productive discussion might have been had if the OP hadn't been so sensationalised. simple addressing the Brits on here was inviting comments that were going to be taken the wrong way. 
Billcihak posts such statements as all left wingers are violent and unhappy, no exemptions while right wingers are happy and peaceful folk. He holds socialists alone to blame for the deaths of millions and right wingers can do no wrong, he calls people who lean to the left in their politics 'lefties' with as much scorn as he can muster, so the discussion is thrown off balance to start with, he wants to stir things up here to start yet another 'socialism is evil' thread. 
By refusing to get stirred up about the antics of one American president and not pouring the scorn he expected on Obama's head the thread ran out of steam for him. 
However if we had ranted on about how badly treated we were by Obama it would have caused more upset to Americans who while not liking Obama would have felt duty bound to defend their president. It is a fact that we can slag off our own politicians and leaders as much as we like but when someone else does it we get annoyed, even if the 'foreigners' are saying the same as we are! 

At least Mrs Obama doesn't hate us lol, she wears posh frocks from here!  

Hand on heart who actually every day sits and thinks about people in other countries and their politics, who doesn't let a day go by without thinking 'ah I wonder what the British/American government is up to', the truth is we are all so involved in our everyday lives that we rarely spare a thought for these things unless it's pointed out to us as here and we feel like saying something. We have jobs and homes to worry about, recessions, holidays, university fees, the dog to walk, so many other things to be concerned about than what a head of state of another country is doing.

Anyway,Trident is old and creaky, we'll probably sell it to the Russians in 2016, I expect Obama is the sales rep and working for his commision.


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## Sukerkin (Feb 8, 2011)

I appreciate your point, Tez but in response to:

*"Hand on heart who actually every day sits and thinks about people in other countries and their politics"*

Well, I do actually - it's why I end up being drawn into the Study time and time again .  Everything, is politics at the end of the day and, whilst I can do nothing about the state of the world, I do like to keep informed and have an opinion on things :blushes:.  

I reckon it's a hangover from my first years of higher education - doing politics and interntional relations as part of my economics degree clearly radicalised me :lol:.


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## elder999 (Feb 8, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> AHand on heart who actually every day sits and thinks about people in other countries and their politics, who doesn't let a day go by without thinking 'ah I wonder what the British/American government is up to', .


 
I watch the BBC news once or twice a week during my morning exercises, and listen to the BBC every day on NPR on the way to or from work. I also read a few foreign papers online.


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 8, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Hand on heart who actually every day sits and thinks about people in other countries and their politics, who doesn't let a day go by without thinking 'ah I wonder what the British/American government is up to', the truth is we are all so involved in our everyday lives that we rarely spare a thought for these things unless it's pointed out to us as here and we feel like saying something. We have jobs and homes to worry about, recessions, holidays, university fees, the dog to walk, so many other things to be concerned about than what a head of state of another country is doing.


 
Actually Hand on heart I do... but then I have time... I don't have a dog to walk. 

I tend to think about other countries often and I tend to end up in many a discussion about China since I my wife is from mainland China. And whenever I want to see somethig close to the real news I tend towards the BBC


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## Tez3 (Feb 8, 2011)

Xue Sheng said:


> Actually Hand on heart I do... but then I have time... I don't have a dog to walk.
> 
> I tend to think about other countries often and I tend to end up in many a discussion about China since I my wife is from mainland China. And whenever I want to see somethig close to the real news I tend towards the BBC


 
Ok so a couple out of what? Millions?

Don't watch the BBC! Yorkshirelad will tell you it's horrendously biased towards the left and lies all the time.
Keeping informed is one thing but do you want to be drawn into a discussion that has been loaded from the start as this one has, wouldn't it have been better to just post the alleged info up and asked what we thought?


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 8, 2011)

Tez3 said:


> Ok so a couple out of what? Millions?


 
No that is just plain wrong.... I'd say it is closer to a dozen 



Tez3 said:


> Don't watch the BBC! Yorkshirelad will tell you it's horrendously biased towards the left and lies all the time.
> Keeping informed is one thing but do you want to be drawn into a discussion that has been loaded from the start as this one has, wouldn't it have been better to just post the alleged info up and asked what we thought?


 
I take it you haven't seen the News in the US or China then 

Actually I should have qualified that, I tend towards the BBC on world events and they actually seem to be less bias than the US and China particularly when it comes to things about the US and China


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## Blade96 (Feb 8, 2011)

I don't mind what bill says about leftists anymore - i dont agree with him, but i just chuckle and say there goes ole bill again 

Besides, he's nice. He knows I'm a leftist but he dont treatme bad. I dont think he seems like a troll either. Doesnt seem like he just says that just to get peeps riled up or to start crap like trolls would do.


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## WC_lun (Feb 8, 2011)

billcihak said:


> A story about President Obama selling the secrets of British nuclear weapons to the Russians to get them to sign his disarmament treaty. Obama does not like Britain, our best ally, and takes every chance he gets to show it. Are you feeling the love yet?
> 
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-to-tell-Russia-Britains-nuclear-secrets.html
> 
> ...


 
According to the State dept this is a bunch of crap.  Also, the US has been helping the Russians with thier nuclear stuff since 1991...lot of Republican administrations there, huh?  More misinformation.


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## 5-0 Kenpo (Feb 9, 2011)

I see I've made my point.

Say what you want, however you want, but don't get pissy when people call you on it.


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## chrispillertkd (Feb 9, 2011)

mook jong man said:


> I think the more important question is -
> 
> *Obama, do you still think Britain likes* *YOU?*


 
Hard to say if he thinks so or not. But anyone who knows anything about Obama knows that he probably _hopes_ the answer is "no." He's done his best to give the U.K. the middle finger since day one of his administration, after all.

Pax,

Chris


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