# CMA Grappling



## 7starmantis (Feb 23, 2005)

I'm curious how many CMA-ist here spend time on groundwork, or "grappling". I'm not talking about standing grappling or Shuai Jiao, but pure on the ground type fighting. Working on getting taken down, avoiding takedowns, learning takedowns, and especially working on fighting while on the ground. 

 If you do train this way, is it within your kung fu school or style or do you supliment it with other training? Also, does your style make use of ground techniques? If not, do you think it is important?

 7sm


----------



## clfsean (Feb 23, 2005)

Yeah some. We use techniques we have from a mount or guard position & working in & out of them. Plus my sifu has some MMA in his background so we work off of that as well.


----------



## D Dempsey (Feb 23, 2005)

In my school we do a lot of ground grappling.  My teacher is really into Bjj and sambo.  Actually I've been noticing a lot of CIMA teachers have been learning and encouraging ground fighting.  We practice it all the time, its just like another part of class.
 -Dave Dempsey-


----------



## 7starmantis (Feb 23, 2005)

Sean, what kind of techniques do you guys work on? Do you work on fighting and having them shoot in and take you down, or are they more stationary takedowns?

7sm


----------



## Dronak (Feb 23, 2005)

No, we never did any ground fighting.  The only thing I can recall in the way of grappling was what our teacher called "grabbing hands" techniques.  But they seemed to be more along the lines of joint locks than wrestling-type grappling, most of them involving controlling the opponent's wrist.  My one year in high school as a wrestler is probably the most training I've had in the grappling area and that's pretty old and rusty now.  I have no idea if such grappling and ground fighting techniques would be taught later on though.  It's possible.  I'm fairly sure we only scratched the surface of what our art has to offer before our teacher moved back to his home country.

Is the ground fighting and grappling important?  Well, it's kind of hard for me to say with my limited knowledge and experience.  I suspect that how real life fights go may factor in to the answer as well.  But generally speaking, in this context I would think that at least a basic knowledge of how to fight in all ranges would be beneficial.  So if one or more of these ranges isn't covered, it may be worth supplementing your training with another art that will train those ranges.  You can still have your specialty, but by rounding out your training and covering everything, you shouldn't really be caught off guard and should know how to deal with any situation that may arise.  Just my thoughts.


----------



## clfsean (Feb 24, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Sean, what kind of techniques do you guys work on? Do you work on fighting and having them shoot in and take you down, or are they more stationary takedowns?
> 
> 7sm


7*... we normally approach the ground from a take down, ie a hook or shoot in & then if we don't stop that, we work it out off the ground. Every so often we'll start on the ground in a mount/guard situation & work our way out. 

We try to work on stopping the take down as best we can, but we also go with the idea that there are tons & tons of good take down guys so we work on the idea of dealing with it once we're down because we didn't get the stop in.


----------



## RHD (Feb 24, 2005)

We work against shoots and takedowns, but do not incluide any formal ground training.  I encourage my students to seek out qualified instructors that have expertise in ground based grappling, but I don't have it myself, and won't pretend to teach it.

Mike


----------



## 7starmantis (Feb 27, 2005)

Is "grappling" or "groundwork" something you would consider important to a CMAist ?

7sm


----------



## rox (Feb 28, 2005)

I think that we should avoid going to the ground, since we train 99% of our time standing up, and there are plenty of BJJ guys around wanting to get in a fight(at least in Brazil).

But even so, I believe a CMAist can do very well in the ground, because we will think on techniques that no BJJ guy would. For instance, atacks to the throat, or to the eyes. Preferably a tiger claw


----------



## pekho (Mar 1, 2005)

Ground fighting is what snake style was made for.  

Josh


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 1, 2005)

rox said:
			
		

> I think that we should avoid going to the ground, since we train 99% of our time standing up, and there are plenty of BJJ guys around wanting to get in a fight(at least in Brazil).
> 
> But even so, I believe a CMAist can do very well in the ground, because we will think on techniques that no BJJ guy would. For instance, atacks to the throat, or to the eyes. Preferably a tiger claw


 If you avoid going to the ground, wont you be unprepared for it when one of those BJJ guys takes you down? 

 7sm


----------



## Darksoul (Mar 1, 2005)

-Its like anything else in the ma's, it needs to be practiced, drilled, and repeated often. Its the only way to make it second nature and prepare yourself for combat. That way, if you have to go to the ground, cause the BJJ takes out your legs, then you'll be able to deal with it, respond appropriately. Of course, if you can avoid it, by all means, do so, but be prepared just in case.


A---)


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 1, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> I'm curious how many CMA-ist here spend time on groundwork, or "grappling". I'm not talking about standing grappling or Shuai Jiao, but pure on the ground type fighting. Working on getting taken down, avoiding takedowns, learning takedowns, and especially working on fighting while on the ground.
> 
> If you do train this way, is it within your kung fu school or style or do you supliment it with other training? Also, does your style make use of ground techniques? If not, do you think it is important?
> 
> 7sm


Well,

Like most chinese sifu that i know ,my sifu doesn't care much for groundfighting ,but he will do it to show us how applicable our techniques are on the ground also.

I've done some wrestling and have even learned a few subs ,but i'm by no stretch a ground guru. At the same point i rolled with some guys at a very well respected BJJ/MMA school and was only tapped by the instructor himself a BJJ black Belt. I was told that i had a very solid base and that i was much better than they expected coming from a CMA background.

Anyway....

I've rolled with my sifu who i honestly outweigh by close to 200lbs more like 180lbs but you get the point.

My sifu had no problems breaking any lock or sub that i rolled him into. His only training is entirely Black Tiger ,although 40yrs within Black Tiger. I must admit i was worried myself that CMA might be lacking when it comes to the ground ,but that was before we started working on the ground.

I have "NO DOUBT" in my mind if you know you techniques inside out "like we're all supposed to anyway" there's nothing you can't do standing up that you can't on the ground. We've worked from every position also mounted,half guard,etc.....

You just use short power in your strikes ,which is already a big part of most CMA styles anyway. I can't speak for every style ,but i'm sure there's more techniques to counter grappling in most styles than ppl know.

After all the Mongols(sp) were known for their grappling skillls.

jeff


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 2, 2005)

Yeah, I also wanted to make the point that it is something that needs to be practiced to be effective as well. knowing how to work against a grappler and doing it are different things.

7sm


----------



## rox (Mar 2, 2005)

Sorry, 7starmantis, I didn't mean to avoid training, just to avoid the ground in a fight.
I think we can train on the ground to defend against the ground fighters, but as Black Tiger Fist wrote, our own styles already have weapons that can be used in the ground; not the BJJ submissions themselves, but strikes to vital points and Chin na(that is mostly forbidden on BJJ).

What I meant by avoiding the ground is that we should train more against the takedowns than specifically on the ground. If we can NOT be taken to the ground, we are home.

(Sorry if I mistaken any preposition, I have trouble with 'in' and 'on' and 'at', etc)


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 2, 2005)

rox said:
			
		

> Sorry, 7starmantis, I didn't mean to avoid training, just to avoid the ground in a fight.
> I think we can train on the ground to defend against the ground fighters, but as Black Tiger Fist wrote, our own styles already have weapons that can be used in the ground; not the BJJ submissions themselves, but strikes to vital points and Chin na(that is mostly forbidden on BJJ).
> 
> What I meant by avoiding the ground is that we should train more against the takedowns than specifically on the ground. If we can NOT be taken to the ground, we are home.
> ...


 I dont know, training against the takedown is good and needed, but its not possible to defend against every takedown, so you need to really put in some time on the ground, in my opinion. Also, a takedown doesn't have to be a BJJ type takedown, we do many, many takedowns, sweeps, throws, and such that would all end up having the opponent on the ground. Of course, most times I'm not going down with them, but there are many techniques that do involve going to the ground with them in the 7* system. 

 I agree, that most CMAist are going to avoid going to the ground, but there are going to be times when you get taken down, you should be ready for those times as well as ready to defend against the takedown.

 7sm


----------



## rox (Mar 2, 2005)

Yes, you're right, we might be took down. But being 'sweeped' is very much the end of the fight, it can always be followed by a strike to the neck or to a mount with a thousand punches. I love sweeps  It's a shame I don't know them yet.

But I still think we should take a good emphasis on avoiding the takedowns, like common defenses. You can't always evade an atack, but you should train to do it very very often.


----------



## pekho (Mar 2, 2005)

Rather than train to avoid being taken down, it is better to see a takedown attempt as an offer.  Any takedown can be switched, and any time someone enters to throw, they can be thrown.

Josh


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 2, 2005)

rox said:
			
		

> But being 'sweeped' is very much the end of the fight


 Did you mean it *is not* the end of the fight?

 7sm


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 2, 2005)

Like most chinese masters my sifu does not see the idea of being taken down by anyone!!

But, at the sametime he will work on these things with us ,so i can see what rox is trying to say. What everyone has to understand is that we are not our sifu's or sigung's ,we don't have 40yrs "LIVE" practice within our arts.

My sifu has fought against many ppl and many styles ,he sought out my sigung for the sole purpose to fight. Not every sifu or master has learned that way or was interested in learning for that purpose.

My sifu was forced by his sifu to learn Black Tiger forms and weapons. In his eyes my sifu had no need for forms or weapons ,but as he learned everything he was able to see why they were needed.

When we train Black Tiger with my sifu it's strickly from a fighting/self defense point of view. If you're looking to learn forms? You will eventually but it will take yrs to learn each form because we drill each and every technique from every angle possiable.

But many masters have that skill where they can avoid being taken down ,but that takes many yrs of "live" practice. They can see from your body aliginment what your intentions are.

jeff


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 5, 2005)

Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> Like most chinese masters my sifu does not see the idea of being taken down by anyone!!


 I'm confused by this post, would you clearify it a bit for me? Your master doesn't think he can be taken down by anyone? Your master doesn't think its valid to take someone down? I'm sorry, I'm just a bit confused. 



			
				Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> My sifu has fought against many ppl and many styles ,he sought out my sigung for the sole purpose to fight. Not every sifu or master has learned that way or was interested in learning for that purpose.


 Thats true, there are many "sifus" out there who dont have good training, or experience. However, that doesn't negate the need to have at the very least experience in getting taken down, be it by a sweep, throw, or "tackle type" takedown. The ability to fall correctly, and stil be in your game after hitting the ground is something that must be experienced. Its just like a fighter who only trains forms then thinks they can not be defeated. 

   7sm


----------



## rox (Mar 5, 2005)

But you won't fight on a tatame, I don't think that those fall techniques would work 100% on the street.

And also, if you are in the ground and the opponent is standing up, you're in serious trouble!


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 5, 2005)

rox said:
			
		

> But you won't fight on a tatame, I don't think that those fall techniques would work 100% on the street.
> 
> And also, if you are in the ground and the opponent is standing up, you're in serious trouble!


 I'm not sure I understand what your saying. tatame? Fall techniques most certainly would work on the street, thats the whole reason to learn them, so you dont hurt yourself if you fall. If you dont know how to fall, your going to get hurt and most likely hurt bad, when you do fall on a hard surface. My school is concrete covered with tile, if we didn't know how to fall, we would be in bad shape. Its just not possible to say you will never get thrown or swept or takendown, especially in CMA. Thats like saying you wont get hit. 

 Also, in my opinion, if I'm on the ground and in a ready position and my attacker is standing up, I'm in a good posiiton, he has to extend to get to me, opening himself up. Then again, mantis uses very different strategies than alot of styles. If I'm on the ground and hurt or dazed, or just not ready, your right, but if I know how to fall and protect myself, then I can be ready on the ground. 

  7sm


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 5, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> I'm confused by this post, would you clearify it a bit for me? Your master doesn't think he can be taken down by anyone? Your master doesn't think its valid to take someone down? I'm sorry, I'm just a bit confused.
> 
> 7sm


My sifu doesn't feel he can be taken down by anyone!

He feels that unless he wants to be taken down ,noone will be able to take him down. That is a mindset that alot of old school chinese masters share. His reply to going to the ground is ,"why would i let someone take me down"?

Although he feels that way,he still will work with us on the ground.

Don't get me wrong he knows what to do when he's on the ground , he just doesn't think anyone can take him down.




			
				7starmantis said:
			
		

> Thats true, there are many "sifus" out there who dont have good training, or experience. However, that doesn't negate the need to have at the very least experience in getting taken down, be it by a sweep, throw, or "tackle type" takedown. The ability to fall correctly, and stil be in your game after hitting the ground is something that must be experienced. Its just like a fighter who only trains forms then thinks they can not be defeated.
> 
> 7sm


I think you misunderstood that part of my post.

I was saying that not all sifu/pupils train in kung fu for the need to fight. People train in kung fu for many different reasons ,my sifu only trained for fighting ,that was his only reason for learning kung fu.


jeff


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 6, 2005)

Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> My sifu doesn't feel he can be taken down by anyone!
> 
> He feels that unless he wants to be taken down ,noone will be able to take him down. That is a mindset that alot of old school chinese masters share. His reply to going to the ground is ,"why would i let someone take me down"?


 Thats a pretty bold statement to make, especially practicing CMA with all its sweeps, throws, locks, chin na, takedowns, and unbalancing techniques. I dont know any old school "masters" who share that mindset or mentality. Its not a case of letting someone take you to the ground, but unless you are the best there is someone who is better than you and in that case could get a throw or sweep or something on you. I know alot of people when talking about getting taken to the ground are refering to a BJJ type takedown with the attacker on top of you and lifting you off your feet type of deal, but I'm talking about sweeps, throws, and etc. 



			
				Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> Although he feels that way,he still will work with us on the ground.
> 
> Don't get me wrong he knows what to do when he's on the ground , he just doesn't think anyone can take him down.


 Thats good, because sooner or later, someone will get a technique that will make you fall and then you really need to know what to do. 



			
				Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> I think you misunderstood that part of my post.
> 
> I was saying that not all sifu/pupils train in kung fu for the need to fight. People train in kung fu for many different reasons ,my sifu only trained for fighting ,that was his only reason for learning kung fu.
> 
> ...


 No, I didn't misunderstand it, I just dont think someone who forgoes training to fight is really getting good training, or true kung fu training and really shouldn't be teaching in my opinion. 

   7sm


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 6, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Thats a pretty bold statement to make, especially practicing CMA with all its sweeps, throws, locks, chin na, takedowns, and unbalancing techniques. I dont know any old school "masters" who share that mindset or mentality. Its not a case of letting someone take you to the ground, but unless you are the best there is someone who is better than you and in that case could get a throw or sweep or something on you. I know alot of people when talking about getting taken to the ground are refering to a BJJ type takedown with the attacker on top of you and lifting you off your feet type of deal, but I'm talking about sweeps, throws, and etc.
> 7sm


Well,

I think if you spend time with any old school chinese sifu and talk with them about being taken down ,you'll see exactly what i mean. This is not olny a mindset shared by my sifu.

Yes you have all those things sweeps,throws,etc we use many of them in Black Tiger ,It still doesn't change what he thinks. Many old school sifu will tell you because of their rooting,balance,knowledge,etc that they can't be takendown. And until someone does ,who's to say their thinking is wrong?




			
				7starmantis said:
			
		

> Thats good, because sooner or later, someone will get a technique that will make you fall and then you really need to know what to do.
> 7sm


I agree with that ,but that still doesn't change his mindset. He feels that if he was to somehow go down it would only be for a second. 



			
				7starmantis said:
			
		

> No, I didn't misunderstand it, I just dont think someone who forgoes training to fight is really getting good training, or true kung fu training and really shouldn't be teaching in my opinion.
> 
> 7sm


Well, who said he did not train?

My sifu was the top disciple of Grandmaster Wong Cheung ,he trained three times a day one on one with Sigung for hrs at a time. At 25 yrs old he was made the Chairman of the Black Tiger Assocation in Hong Kong by Grandmaster Wong Cheung. He was chosen by Wong Cheung to succeed him as the styles heir.

Not to mention that in the many yrs he trained with sigung ,he only lost one fight to a senior when he was only 16yrs old. Not only did he never lose another ,but he was the schools Dai Sihing ,eventhough he was one of the youngest students Wong Cheung had.

So, i ask who is better qualified to teach or pass on a style than someone hand picked by the Master himself?

After all ,it is Martial Arts right.......

My sifu went with the fighting mindset ,but learned there is alot more to kung fu than fighting. At the sametime ,if you're learning kung fu ,you need to know how to defend yourself. 

So that's how he teaches

Some may not agree ,but when does everyone ever agree?!?!?!

jeff


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 6, 2005)

Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> Well,
> 
> I think if you spend time with any old school chinese sifu and talk with them about being taken down ,you'll see exactly what i mean. This is not olny a mindset shared by my sifu.
> 
> Yes you have all those things sweeps,throws,etc we use many of them in Black Tiger ,It still doesn't change what he thinks. Many old school sifu will tell you because of their rooting,balance,knowledge,etc that they can't be takendown. And until someone does ,who's to say their thinking is wrong?


 Thats what I'm saying, all the time I have spent with many chinese sifu, none have had that type of mindset. Most are very humble about their skill and even say that they have been beaten before by at least someone, their sihings, teachers, someone. I didn't say your sifu was wrong, I just think absolutes are hard to defend or prove. 



			
				Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> I agree with that ,but that still doesn't change his mindset. He feels that if he was to somehow go down it would only be for a second.


 Wait, he can't be taken down, or he would only be down for a second? Those statements contradict each other. 



			
				Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> Well, who said he did not train?
> 
> My sifu was the top disciple of Grandmaster Wong Cheung ,he trained three times a day one on one with Sigung for hrs at a time. At 25 yrs old he was made the Chairman of the Black Tiger Assocation in Hong Kong by Grandmaster Wong Cheung. He was chosen by Wong Cheung to succeed him as the styles heir.
> 
> ...


 Whoa there, calm down. No one said anything about your sifu not training. You completely misread my post. You have read my last post as an attack on you or your sifu, thats not so. I was agreeing with you actually about those who train without fighting. I dont know your sifu (or you) and I'm in no way trying to cut either of you down, my last post was agreeing with you about people training for different reasons, and my opinions on that training. A little touchy are we?

   7sm


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 8, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Thats what I'm saying, all the time I have spent with many chinese sifu, none have had that type of mindset. Most are very humble about their skill and even say that they have been beaten before by at least someone, their sihings, teachers, someone. I didn't say your sifu was wrong, I just think absolutes are hard to defend or prove.
> 7sm


Well, Like you ,i've spent time with chinese sifu ,and the ones i've talked to don't feel that they can be taken down. But i guess if you talk to a hundred ppl you'll get atleast as many different opinions......



			
				7starmantis said:
			
		

> Wait, he can't be taken down, or he would only be down for a second? Those statements contradict each other.
> 7sm


Yes they do ,and i knew that when i typed it  

He doesn't feel that he can be taken down against his will ,but if for some wild chance he did end up on the ground? It would only be for a second.



			
				7starmantis said:
			
		

> Whoa there, calm down. No one said anything about your sifu not training. You completely misread my post. You have read my last post as an attack on you or your sifu, thats not so. I was agreeing with you actually about those who train without fighting. I dont know your sifu (or you) and I'm in no way trying to cut either of you down, my last post was agreeing with you about people training for different reasons, and my opinions on that training. A little touchy are we?
> 
> 7sm


You are correct here and i want to say "I'M Sorry"

I misunderstood your post and got defensive about my sifu. My sifu and i share a very close bond ,so i can be a little defensive about him.

jeff


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 8, 2005)

Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> You are correct here and i want to say "I'M Sorry"
> 
> I misunderstood your post and got defensive about my sifu. My sifu and i share a very close bond ,so i can be a little defensive about him.
> 
> jeff


 Hey no problem, I'm glad we cleared that up, I can understand that bond, so its cool. This is the kind of posting I like to see here!!

 7sm


----------



## Black Tiger Fist (Mar 9, 2005)

Yeah once again sorry bro!


My sifu has basicly accepted me into his family ,so he's a father to me in a every sense of the word. It's funny because this is coming from a person who thought for the first 1 1/2 - 2 yrs that his sifu didn't like him  

He was very tough on me for the first 2 yrs he never smiled or joked with me at all ,he even rarely talked to me. You have to understand this was one on one training , i could understand in a school setting ,but i know why he did it now.

jeff


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 11, 2005)

7star, I have a question for you--do you work on the ground game at your school?  We haven't started on any of that yet, and I was wondering if you do a good amount of it later on, or if you are going somewhere else.


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 11, 2005)

CMack11 said:
			
		

> 7star, I have a question for you--do you work on the ground game at your school? We haven't started on any of that yet, and I was wondering if you do a good amount of it later on, or if you are going somewhere else.


 Yeah, I work on it here with my sifu. He is only now begining to really teach us alot of ground stuff, and he is only teaching a few of the more advanced (jow ga) students. Its tough, there is alot of tam tui's and sweeps, hoping from leg to leg while down in tam tui and such. Then it gets into ground chin na, breaks, traps, pressure points, locks, etc. We include ground work to be low sweeps, takedowns, anything done from on the ground while the opponent is still standing up as well. There is alot to it, and its really hard training, but I'm sure you guys will get to it. Remind me, your training under Sifu Hughes, correct? 

  7sm


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 11, 2005)

That's right.  I just took ~3 weeks off to get married, but I'm starting back next week.  I'm ready to move out of the beginner class--shouldn't be too long now.


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 11, 2005)

Oh, well, conradulations then!!

7sm


----------



## brothershaw (Mar 18, 2005)

Do to ufc and bjj being so popular  even people with no ground training may try to do what they see in ufc or whatever. It cant hurt to have a general idea of what can be done to you on the ground , cause you might wind up there. Although I have no intention of going to the grund intentionally, I have an interest in it from a defensive standpoint.


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 18, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Oh, well, conradulations then!!
> 
> 7sm


Thanks!  

And ask and you shall receive.  I just found out we have a groundfighting seminar next weekend.


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 18, 2005)

CMack11 said:
			
		

> Thanks!
> 
> And ask and you shall receive.  I just found out we have a groundfighting seminar next weekend.


 Awesome, your sifu doing it or someone else?

 7sm


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 18, 2005)

No, it's somebody else.  I wish I could remember his name, but I can't.  I'll find out when I go in tomorrow and let you know.


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 25, 2005)

It's a sifu McDaniels.  I don't think I've met him before.


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 25, 2005)

Oh yeah, I know Anthony. Dont know him all that well, but he seems nice enough. Hope it all goes well.

7sm


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 28, 2005)

It was a blast!  There were only 6 of us there, so we got a lot of hands-on.  It's amazing how good sifu McDaniel and Wade (the other instructor there)were.  We did a pretty cool randori against Wade at the end that quite a bit of fun.  We got to try our submissions against him while he was working against us.


----------



## 7starmantis (Mar 28, 2005)

CMack11 said:
			
		

> It was a blast! There were only 6 of us there, so we got a lot of hands-on. It's amazing how good sifu McDaniel and Wade (the other instructor there)were. We did a pretty cool randori against Wade at the end that quite a bit of fun. We got to try our submissions against him while he was working against us.


 Thats cool, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Did you guys work on takedowns and then ground, or shooting to the ground, or what? 

 7sm


----------



## CMack11 (Mar 28, 2005)

No, just straight groundwork.  Just the basics: 

The guard and passing the guard
Reversing the mount
Moving from half guard to guard

And then some submissions--armbar and armbar escape, Rear choke and rear choke escape, and the keylock.


----------



## Isrephael (Mar 29, 2005)

Black Tiger Fist said:
			
		

> My sifu doesn't feel he can be taken down by anyone!




That sounds like an advanced technique of the ever-popular Hubris-Fu.


----------



## Isrephael (Mar 29, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> I'm curious how many CMA-ist here spend time on groundwork, or "grappling".
> 7sm




Our Kwoon spends an hour a night, a third of our training, working prone Chin Na/BJJ.  It is, without a doubt, my least favorite part of our training.  However, I fully recognize the need for it, and make myself commit to learning it.  After all, however unpleasant it is to train the stuff, it's far more unpleasant when actually applied on the street.


----------



## clfsean (Mar 29, 2005)

Isrephael said:
			
		

> That sounds like an advanced technique of the ever-popular Hubris-Fu.


Or possibly the chance he never has been taken down in a grappling situation. Therefore, he feels he can't because no one has ever tried or no one has ever succeeded.


----------

