# help get karate into the olympics!!



## gyaku-zuki queen (Aug 1, 2004)

click the below link, and enter it in to help get karate into the olymipic games.  

http://portal.enfoque5.com/karateolimpico/ingles/contenido/participar.phphttp://portal.enfoque5.com/karateolimpico/ingles/index.php


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## Randy Strausbaugh (Aug 1, 2004)

Yeah!   Then the Olympics can do for Karate what it did for Judo...
Um, never mind.


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## Andrew Green (Aug 1, 2004)

If point fighting and kata in the olympics...?  why?

I say go for pankration


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## gyaku-zuki queen (Aug 2, 2004)

Andrew Green said:
			
		

> If point fighting and kata in the olympics...? why?
> 
> I say go for pankration


..i dont get it. :idunno: 
can you explain that in other words?


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## twendkata71 (Jul 8, 2006)

I have supported the movement to get karate in the Olympics for years,but I fear that it will never make it into the Olympics. It was shot down for the next Olympics. And no real reason was given by the IOC election committee.




			
				gyaku-zuki queen said:
			
		

> click the below link, and enter it in to help get karate into the olymipic games.
> 
> http://portal.enfoque5.com/karateolimpico/ingles/contenido/participar.php


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## JPH (Jul 9, 2006)

Unfortunately, the problem with getting Karate into the Olympics has always been that there was no central organizational control. Back in the late 60s and early 70s Master Nishiyama tried to gain control of the Olympic Karate movement but ended up alienating many who would, or should have been possible participants. As a result of the fueding between different styles, the AOC stopped trying to get Karate accepted as an Olympic sport. Tae Kwon Do, on the other hand, presented a more united front and surprised  the other MA organizations when they were granted Olympic status.

Some day, perhaps, Karate may acceptance. When, and at what price is unclear.


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## Martin h (Jul 10, 2006)

in the IOC meeting before the last olympic games, karate (as represented by the WKF organization -known as WUKO many years ago. It is their system that is being under concideration) was the top candidate to be included in the olympic program -it is already accepted as a olymic status sport. It received by far the most votes for introduction. However IOC decided that they want to reduce the number of sports on the olympic program, to reduce cost for the arrangers. So no new sports was allowed on the program to replace the sports that was removed.

So now we have to wait until they decide its time to include more sports again, I guess.


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## twendkata71 (Jul 12, 2006)

*It is a nice thought. And I hope that you are right. But, If it does not will karate be effected negatively. I don't think so. *







			
				Martin h said:
			
		

> in the IOC meeting before the last olympic games, karate (as represented by the WKF organization -known as WUKO many years ago. It is their system that is being under concideration) was the top candidate to be included in the olympic program -it is already accepted as a olymic status sport. It received by far the most votes for introduction. However IOC decided that they want to reduce the number of sports on the olympic program, to reduce cost for the arrangers. So no new sports was allowed on the program to replace the sports that was removed.
> 
> So now we have to wait until they decide its time to include more sports again, I guess.


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## karateka (Jul 18, 2006)

i dont think karate should enter the olympics, there is no discreet valuation to karate and further more i will quote what my sensei said to me many many years ago:


karate is not a sport, it is a way of life.


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## twendkata71 (Jul 21, 2006)

*I would say that I probably agree with that.  As for what your sensei said. Yes, it is a way of life.  The Japanese originally made it into a sport to popularize it.  Now in many cases it is barely recognizable from its original form and purpose. I do enjoy the sport aspects,but I do not let it interfere with true karatedo. *







			
				karateka said:
			
		

> i dont think karate should enter the olympics, there is no discreet valuation to karate and further more i will quote what my sensei said to me many many years ago:
> 
> 
> karate is not a sport, it is a way of life.


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## ArmorOfGod (Jul 22, 2006)

Even though I have been in karate for over 15 years, I really don't see a need to put it into the Olympics.  Right now, the Olympics has tkd, judo, boxing, archery, and fencing.  Do we really need another martial based sport in the Olympics.  Tack that on with the fact that wushu is now a demo-sport, and I think our interests are pretty well covered.

AoG


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## Haze (Jul 22, 2006)

Seeing how the olympic games are just that, games, why would you want karate which is a way of life and a combative art to be reduced to a mere game?


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## SFC JeffJ (Jul 23, 2006)

Looking at TKD, I really don't see the need to have Karate in the Olympics.  I understand the only thing that gets a lot of participation is the sparring.  Personally, I don't think that would be a good portrayal of Karate.  Also, it might just serve to increase the "sportiness" of the art overall.

Just my opinion,

JeffJ


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## Grenadier (Jul 23, 2006)

I'm going to present a slightly different point of view:

I am actually strongly in favor of seeing competitive Karate in the Olympics, provided that we use the somewhat universally accepted rules that the WKF / USANKF uses for traditional competition, and have the three major categories (Kumite, Kata, Kobudo).  

The way I see it, if a major organization such as the Pan-Am Games has a Karate event, then the Olympics can certainly do this as well.  

I would request that everyone stick to traditional-style competition.  None of these kata with constant 360 degree jumps and spins while holding escrima sticks with built-in bright red LED's, etc.  

If people can see Karate done in this manner, then it can certainly help the traditional arts.  It may be just a personal pet peeve, and I am certainly biased, but I really don't like it when people start doing XMA that ESPN2 covers.


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## ArmorOfGod (Jul 23, 2006)

Haze said:
			
		

> Seeing how the olympic games are just that, games, why would you want karate which is a way of life and a combative art to be reduced to a mere game?


 
I am going to step on some toes with this one, but karate is just a sport.  It is not a way of life.

Your religion (whatever that may be) is your way of life.  Karate is not a religion.  It is a sport that many teach as a religion, but it is still just a set of movements.  Karate, as most sports do, enforce good habits and maneurisms, but only enforce what you should have learned from your religion and even to a large extent from your upbringing.

I always read Dave Lowry's karate column in Black Belt Magazine and think about this.  He (and many like him) teach it as a "way of life" but fail to realize what they are saying by making that claim.  I listen to these people go on about how they are better people because of the martial arts, but never hear them talk about who they believe created life and how greatful they are to that god.  They thank karate, but never god.  Look at the people who say football and baseball are a way of life (and there are many who do).  They are making the same claim.  

It will always fall to the question: who/what should get the credit for the improvements on one's character?  Karate or your God?

AoG


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## twendkata71 (Jul 23, 2006)

*Karate originally was not intended to be a sport. It is a  method of self protection. It has been turned into a sport . The sport aspect was added by the Japanese to further assimilate it into the Budo culture. And it has worked in making it popular and recognized world wide.  And it was easy to make it popular through sport in the US , America being a sport oriented culture.  Karatedo is a way of life. In the sense that it is a life long study. Physical and mental development.  Religion is a separate thing all together.  Some people believe that if they get into the Asian religions (Buddism or Shintoism), that it will make them better martial artist. Doesn't really matter what religion that you practice. That is up to you and is a personal thing.*








			
				ArmorOfGod said:
			
		

> I am going to step on some toes with this one, but karate is just a sport. It is not a way of life.
> 
> Your religion (whatever that may be) is your way of life. Karate is not a religion. It is a sport that many teach as a religion, but it is still just a set of movements. Karate, as most sports do, enforce good habits and maneurisms, but only enforce what you should have learned from your religion and even to a large extent from your upbringing.
> 
> ...


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## Jama (Aug 10, 2008)

> I am going to step on some toes with this one, but karate is just a sport. It is not a way of life.
> 
> Your religion (whatever that may be) is your way of life. Karate is not a religion. It is a sport that many teach as a religion, but it is still just a set of movements. Karate, as most sports do, enforce good habits and maneurisms, but only enforce what you should have learned from your religion and even to a large extent from your upbringing.
> 
> ...


 
Actually, i think religion should never be used to state any opinion. Religion is religion, sports are sports. And maybe because I don't believe in religion, I am a more open person. Like the bible says (please forgive my unfaithfull statement), the universe came from life. And so does the most current scientific studies, with Bing Bang.

So, like everyone who likes karate, the making it into a sport, was a way to broadcast the martial art itself, so we all know what karate is.

Now, maybe karate didn't make the universe nor did it started anything, but LIKE ANY OTHER RELIGION, it is OUR CHOICE to LIVE LIFE in this earth HOW WE WANT IT.

Karate allowed me to see my gift and allowed me to use it, because that's the truth. I am good on karate and do work hard for a life living with karate in my heart.

My dream is to win an olympic gold medal. In karate. And that's why i work hard everyday, with pain assaulting every one of my moves, to that ultimate goal.

I hope karate makes it to the Olympic. And it may not be religion or a way of life, it's our heart telling us karate is a way to reach religion, by living the karate way of life.


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## twendkata71 (Aug 11, 2008)

I have been involved with the Olympic movement for karate in one way or another since the early 80's. We have been turned down so many times.  But, now we are closer than ever before.  I just don't see it happening, they already have taekwondo and Judo.  For a while a lot of people thought Wushu would get in, it closer to gymnastics than martial arts. But, it has the martial arts background.  Only time will tell. I am too old now to compete at that level even if it gets into he olympics. I would have to be a referee or get into the coaching program.


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## louscannon (Aug 14, 2008)

I come to you with empty hands...

Karate like any martial art is combative art. It has also evolved to a sport. The way of life statement is so valid and I have to agree with the post that religion should not be used as an argument to take away from whatever benefits one gains from Karate. Whether you believe in God or not, goodness comes from Karate when you put the work in and that credit goes to the practitioner. I have seen what Karate has done for insecure people and confident people. It nourishes the mind, body and soul.

It should be added to the Olympics so the most competitive of us can indulge. (Even if this is an agreed, compromised system that may deviate from one's style) If nothing else, elevating it to Olympic status would raise the profile and hopefully shake off the many misconceptions that many people have about martial artists being blood-thirsty, violent types. 

Look at all the money that is pumped into football etc. The Olympics would be a great plus for those who choose this sport/art as a way of life. Those who do not want to compete can still go to the dojo and get their traditional training.  Everyone's a winner!

I bet all of you who believe it shouldn't be in the Olympics would still tune in and watch it closely if it was!!!


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## Tez3 (Aug 15, 2008)

louscannon said:


> I come to you with empty hands...
> 
> Karate like any martial art is combative art. It has also evolved to a sport. The way of life statement is so valid and I have to agree with the post that religion should not be used as an argument to take away from whatever benefits one gains from Karate. Whether you believe in God or not, goodness comes from Karate when you put the work in and that credit goes to the practitioner. I have seen what Karate has done for insecure people and confident people. It nourishes the mind, body and soul.
> 
> ...


 
You'd lose your bet I'm afraid, I wouldn't watch it. The alterations, dumbing down and changing of rules that would happen would simply make me weep in despair if I watched it.


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## tshadowchaser (Aug 15, 2008)

Some of the problems with getting karate into the Olympics:


Setting up national OPEN tournament with regional through national titles, to decide whom will represent each country
Who is going to judge the competition at nationals ands the Olympics and how are they chosen
Finding enough judges and referees that are unbiased 
What is going to be allowed ( this should be a minor thing but would not be) open hands, groin kicks, take downs, etc.
Will this be under one organization or can anyone participate (Open tournaments mean just that open to all)


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## jkembry (Aug 15, 2008)

karateka said:


> i dont think karate should enter the olympics, there is no discreet valuation to karate and further more i will quote what my sensei said to me many many years ago:
> 
> 
> karate is not a sport, it is a way of life.



I agree!  To me karate is much more than a sport.  It is an art that is provides tools for living.


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## twendkata71 (Aug 15, 2008)

The USANKF is working on those issues.  I have talked to several officials about this. The USOC is working with the USANKF. It takes time to make the changes. 




tshadowchaser said:


> Some of the problems with getting karate into the Olympics:
> 
> 
> Setting up national OPEN tournament with regional through national titles, to decide whom will represent each country
> ...


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## twendkata71 (Aug 19, 2008)

The main thinng that concerns me about "if" karate is included in the Olympics in the future is that they will probably only include kumite and not Kata as well. I would hope that they would include kata.


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## Brian S (Aug 19, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I am going to step on some toes with this one, but karate is just a sport. It is not a way of life.
> 
> Your religion (whatever that may be) is your way of life. Karate is not a religion. It is a sport that many teach as a religion, but it is still just a set of movements. Karate, as most sports do, enforce good habits and maneurisms, but only enforce what you should have learned from your religion and even to a large extent from your upbringing.
> 
> ...


 
 AoG,

 Very well said!

 Personally, I hope karate never gets into the olympics. I hoe everyone goes the way of mma and I and a select few continue to do our kata by way of moonlight.


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## Cirdan (Aug 20, 2008)

No, we don`t need to give the world a dumbed down spectacle version of our art.


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## Grenadier (Aug 20, 2008)

The way I see it, Karate would be a fine addition to the Olympics.  Having all three divisions (kata, kobudo, kumite), would be no more complex than what you already see in gymnastics.  

They could simply use the USA-NKF or WKF rules (almost the same), which are already well-established.  If you really want to specify things, use the Shitei division rules for kata, and use the kobudo kata list that the USA-NKF / WKF uses, so that everyone is on a more or less even playing field.


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## Tez3 (Aug 20, 2008)

Brian S said:


> AoG,
> 
> Very well said!
> 
> Personally, I hope karate never gets into the olympics. I hoe everyone goes the way of mma and I and a select few continue to do our kata by way of moonlight.


 

We don't want MMA in the Olympics for the same reason we don't want karate. Btw some of us do katas and MMA. Iain Abernethy's take on Bunkai is very useful for MMA.


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## Brian S (Aug 20, 2008)

Tez3 said:


> We don't want MMA in the Olympics for the same reason we don't want karate. Btw some of us do katas and MMA. Iain Abernethy's take on Bunkai is very useful for MMA.


 
 That's because Abernathy's bunkai is taken from mma,lol.


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## Andrew Green (Aug 20, 2008)

Grenadier said:


> The way I see it, Karate would be a fine addition to the Olympics.  Having all three divisions (kata, kobudo, kumite), would be no more complex than what you already see in gymnastics.




Gymnastics routines are creative and acrobatic, are you wanting sport karate forms or traditional forms?

Personally I can't see traditional forms ever having a place in the Olympics, how on earth would you judge them?  Everyone does the exact same form, the difficulty level of the form is the same across the board, there is no creativity...  Does the 70 year old 9th dan win with a very solid and traditional performance of Seisan, or the 17 year old that does a creative and acrobatic form?


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## astrobiologist (Aug 20, 2008)

The way I see it... There are martial arts and there are martial sports.  
Martial arts study the way of war, of battle, between human beings.  Martial arts teach self-protection, are realisitc for an attack on the street, and usually include a lot of learning about the function of the human body and the spirit of the warrior.  Martial sports are based solely in competition.  They are studied by those who wish to fight with organized rules, stretegic battling with designated strikes and techniques, and trophies, belts, or awards for winners of fights.

Martial arts and martial sports are both a lot of fun to be involved with and are both very interesting.  Indeed, there are times when the two begin to mix a little.  Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu is mostly a martial sport, but I've read that many instructors also teach self-defense techniques which cannot be used in the ring/octagon/whatever.  Tang Soo Do is a mostly a martial art, yet many instructors and practitioners emphasize tournament theatrics and techniques which just don't work on the street. 

Martial arts don't really work well for competition...  I don't think karate should be in the Olympics.  But if there were a martial sport category beyond Tae Kwon Do (point striking) and Judo (point grappling), I'd be interested to see how it would work out.


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## Brian S (Aug 20, 2008)

I agree with you about the sport vs. art thing and we won't get into that any deeper here,lol.

 One thing though, if karate were to get into the olympics, it wouldn't be the karate I do.


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## Flying Crane (Aug 20, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I am going to step on some toes with this one,...


 
looks like I'm going to step on some toes back...



> Your religion (whatever that may be) is your way of life.


 
Maybe YOUR religion is YOUR way of life, and that's your choice.  But it's not mine, and not for many others, and that is our choice.  



> Karate is not a religion.


 
agreed.



> It is a sport that many teach as a religion, but it is still just a set of movements. Karate, as most sports do, enforce good habits and maneurisms, but only enforce what you should have learned from your religion and even to a large extent from your upbringing.


 
perhaps you feel this way for yourself, but many of us do not share this point of view.  To me karate is not a sport, and whatever good habits and mannerisms that I may have, I do not credit to religion, altho it would break my own mother's heart to hear me say so.  Altho I will give a lot of credit to my parents and my upbringing.



> I always read Dave Lowry's karate column in Black Belt Magazine and think about this. He (and many like him) teach it as a "way of life" but fail to realize what they are saying by making that claim. I listen to these people go on about how they are better people because of the martial arts, but never hear them talk about who they believe created life and how greatful they are to that god. They thank karate, but never god. Look at the people who say football and baseball are a way of life (and there are many who do). They are making the same claim.


 
Many people do not share your views on religion.  For them, karate is karate, and they get many benefits from it.  They might get many of the same benefits from some form of sport or other activity if they chose, but they didn't.  They chose karate, and there is no need to suggest that they need to look to a higher being for this.



> It will always fall to the question: who/what should get the credit for the improvements on one's character? Karate or your God?
> 
> AoG


 
that is a personal decision, based on one's personal feelings about religion and spiritual matters.  There is no single correct answer.  The correct answer depends on the individual.


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## chinto (Aug 21, 2008)

gyaku-zuki queen said:


> click the below link, and enter it in to help get karate into the olymipic games.
> 
> http://portal.enfoque5.com/karateolimpico/ingles/contenido/participar.php



considering what damage it has done to the other martial  arts such as TKD or JUDO  i would prefer that the Olympics leave Karate alone.. in short I would sign a petition to keep karate out of the Olympics before i would to have it in them!


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## chinto01 (Aug 21, 2008)

I agree in keeping karate out of the olympics. Tournaments are a fine example of how bad things can get.

In the spirit of bushido!

Rob


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## twendkata71 (Aug 24, 2008)

After what happened at this olympics with the Taekwondo, Taekwondo will probably get the boot and karate will never be in.  I really could care less now if karate got in.  I used to be in the Olympic push, but now I see the negative aspects of having karate do in the Olympics.


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## chinto (Aug 25, 2008)

I would have to say seeing what it has done to TKD and things.. will be part of any push to keep it out!!  but then I am so fed up and disgusted with what the olympics has become that if it never happened again i could not care less!!


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## Martin h (Aug 25, 2008)

Karate in the olympics would be a fantastic boost to the  economic side and for general acceptance. But it would be a great blow to both karate as a art (and a deathblow to styles). The sport would improve -but only within the specific bounds of the rules.  We only have to look at TKD today to see how it can go wrong.  But it wont happen.  There is no way karate will be able to present a single dominating world organization in order to appease IOC (or hand them enough cash under the table as  is the traditional alternative)


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## BrianF (Aug 25, 2008)

Please help keep karate out of the Olympics.  I watched boxing and it was horrible.  What can you get done in 2 minutes?  If the judges only count hard hits to the front of the head, why wear gloves or headgear?  

I saw no TKD or Judo coverage, mainly because there were not enough Americans winning to merit big time TV coverage.  Sad.  And the wrestling I saw left me underwhelmed.

I think Olympic karate would be over-regulated and too subjective to be true to the sport/art.  


BrianF


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 25, 2008)

Karate in the Olympics.surewhy not. It did wonders for TKD and Judo


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## hogstooth (Oct 14, 2008)

No thanks. I do not want to degrade my art to a mere sport for points. I think it would tear down the art by making it nothing more than a game of patty cake. 
I am usually pretty tolorant of others views but this would be the end of what we all hold so dear imo. I will never vote for Karate to enter into the olympics!


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## twendkata71 (Oct 14, 2008)

Not that this has anything to do with the topic, but hogstooth, what style do you teach/train in? I know several teachers in the Cincinnati area.  Just curious. And at this point I would not want karate in the olympics, I do enjoy the occational traditional tournament competition.  Old style, without all of the extra padding, maybe just some hand pads,the old WUKO type thin leather.


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## exile (Oct 14, 2008)

Looks to me as if there are a lot of savvy karateka on MT. The references to TKD and how the Olympic push has affected it are I think right on target. I know there's some disagreement about this on the board, but my own take is, the decades-long effort to get TKD into the Olympics had the result of defanging what was a very hard, no-bloody-nonsense combat system and was widely recognized as such. 

Here's a question for the Olympics advocates to ponder: why _should_ karate be in the Olympics? Greater recognition and participation? But if you are happy doing karate and progressing in it, just what difference does 'recognition' and increased participation make to _you?_ How are _you_ going to benefit from that? Sports officials will benefit from it, and administrators and so on; and maybe school owners and so on... if TKD is any model here... but how will the individual karateka be better off? I just don't see it. 

My guess is that at this point, it's unlikely to happen.  And students of karate who value it as a potentially very effective system of self-defense combat should be very glad that that's the case...


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## hpulley (Oct 15, 2008)

It looks like it's all been said but I'll still add my ditto: please keep karate as what it is, please don't dumb it down into a sport with rules that make it useless for self defense.


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## Blindside (Oct 15, 2008)

If they did get karate into the Olympics, I'd only want to see full contact "knockdown" competition styles ala Kyokushin-Kai or the equivalent.  No point fighting, no kata, just little bitty white foam pads for the hands and white gis.  That I could accept.

I take it back, They can wear helmets if they get this in the Olympics. 





Headbutts, knees, and elbows?  My kind of fight!

Lamont


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## exile (Oct 15, 2008)

Blindside said:


> I
> Headbutts and elbows?  My kind of fight!
> 
> Lamont



Look, _that_ is not going to get into the Olympics. Look at what TKD was when it was the combative system of the fearsome ROK Marines and special commando units like the White/Black Tigers, and look what it is now. Why do you think it wound up where it is? Because that's what was needed to ensure that it would be an acceptable Olympic event, heavy on spectacle and low on... um... _mortality_ :uhyeah:

Note what Simon John O'Neill has to say about this in his new book on TKD forms and their combat applications:
_An important by-product of the internationalization process and the move towards sport was the need for safety. Westerners would tolerate the possibility of serous injury in training less readily than the original Korean practitioners...[and] Dangerous techniques such as knifehand strikes and in the case of the WTFpunches to the face were suppressed.​_
No martial art will get to the Olympics without being thoroughly declawed and defanged.  You're not going to see headbutts and elbows. Old-style TKD had plenty of elbows; they're still there in the forms. But in the arena? Hell, you can't even get a simple punch to register points, most of the time. The head is off-limits for hand techs. It's not going to be any different for karate. Put it like this: any karate that got into the Olympics would be one you'd probably hate having to watch.


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## hogstooth (Oct 20, 2008)

twendkata71 said:


> Not that this has anything to do with the topic, but hogstooth, what style do you teach/train in? I know several teachers in the Cincinnati area. Just curious. And at this point I would not want karate in the olympics, I do enjoy the occational traditional tournament competition. Old style, without all of the extra padding, maybe just some hand pads,the old WUKO type thin leather.


 
Kobayashi Ryu. I also trained in Matsubayashi ryu for years in Loveland Ohio with Terry Peters Sensei until I left for the Marine Corps. I presently teach out of my house in Milford Ohio. Rent got out of control and my basement is only about 50 sq.ft. smaller than the place I was renting and it has a 9 ft cieling and its free (well sort of free) so it works out pretty well.


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## twendkata71 (Oct 21, 2008)

I know Terry and others at the loveland dojo. I used to train with James Driggs kyoshi, and Frank Grant Hanshi. That was twenty years ago. Did you train on Okinawa while in the Marine's?


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## hogstooth (Oct 21, 2008)

I lost touch with Terry when I joined the Marines. Do you still keep in touch with him? I would love to see him again. I know Hanshi Grant but that was years ago when I met him. I think 1982 but he wasn't a hanshi back then. 
My father trained directly under Katsuya Miyahira Sensei while in the service. My father took me to Okinawa when I was 10 and I got the pleasure of training under him with my father over summer break. I never got the chance to return while in the Corps but my father had made  a few pilgrimages over the years until he had his neck injury five years ago. He still is sharp as a tack and very knowledgable but can't train anymore. Had his neck fused because of slipped disks. 
Did you no Sensei Gutermuth? I hope the spelling is right. It's  been along time. She used to get mad at me because I wouldn't hit her. She always said it was alright but I could never bring myself to hit her. 
Boy that brings back old memories. If you still stay in touch with Peters Sensei or know how to get in touch with him I would really like to see him again. 
It's good to know there are others out there so close that have trained in the same or similar arts. 
God Bless.


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## twendkata71 (Oct 22, 2008)

No unfortunately I have not kept in touch. I am not sure if he still teaches in Loveland. If so he is no longer affiliated with the WSKF.  Or is not listed in their current dojo. I met Terry originally at a camp hosted by Master Driggs for the WSKF at his dojo in Stewart, Oh.


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## Grenadier (Oct 22, 2008)

exile said:


> The head is off-limits for hand techs. It's not going to be any different for karate. Put it like this: any karate that got into the Olympics would be one you'd probably hate having to watch.



Going to disagree wtih this. 

The USA-NKF is the governing body for the USOC, when it comes to Karate, and using their rules, you'll see punches and strikes to the head.  Given that the WKF follows virtually identical rules, I see no reason why such a ruleset couldn't be applied to the Olympic Games as well.  

All-out face contact, of course, isn't allowed, but they do allow a fair amount of contact to the face area, and people do get popped by backfists / ridge hands on the side of the head as well (anywhere there is non-facial hair).  

If they included empty hand kata as well as kobudo competition, in addition to the usual kumite, why not?  After all, gymnastics and swimming have multiple events in which the athletes can compete.  

I enjoyed watching the USA-NKF events this year (albeit on video, since I couldn't go there in person this year).


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## hogstooth (Oct 22, 2008)

twendkata71 said:


> No unfortunately I have not kept in touch. I am not sure if he still teaches in Loveland. If so he is no longer affiliated with the WSKF. Or is not listed in their current dojo. I met Terry originally at a camp hosted by Master Driggs for the WSKF at his dojo in Stewart, Oh.


 
No he isn't teaching in Loveland anymore. When I got out of the Corps I went back to see if he was still there and the dojo was closed down and didn't have his number any more. I was hoping since you said you knew him you might have a way to get intouch with him. There was one other Matsubayashi Ryu instructor down off of the western hills viaduct ( can't remember his name) but after meeting him I decided to pass on training with him and there were some sort of charges against him. I think rape but can't remember. He had the same patch but don't know if he was in the WSKF or not. 
Any way it was nice walking down memory lane. Really wish you had a way to get in touch with Peters Sensei. I wonder if I contact Hanshi Grant if he would have information on him? Might be worth a try. Thanks for your help anyway. God Bless.


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## Martin h (Nov 2, 2008)

Grenadier said:


> Going to disagree wtih this.
> 
> The USA-NKF is the governing body for the USOC, when it comes to Karate, and using their rules, you'll see punches and strikes to the head.  Given that the WKF follows virtually identical rules, I see no reason why such a ruleset couldn't be applied to the Olympic Games as well.



USA-NKF is member of WKF, as national organizatory body.
While they do have  a specific USA-NKF ruleset, this is just the local adaption of the standard WKF rules.
The kobudo rules are a local invention tough. They are not part of WKF.



Grenadier said:


> All-out face contact, of course, isn't allowed, but they do allow a fair amount of contact to the face area, and people do get popped by backfists / ridge hands on the side of the head as well (anywhere there is non-facial hair).



WKF allow hand strikes to the face/head with closed fists, but not open hand techniques. They are strictly banned.
Contact is skintouch. Although skintouch can be quite hard, the general idea is if you injure the opponent or knock him out/down, you get warned or disqualified.

Under the "new" (now 10+years old) WKF rules, kicks are scored higher points (higher for headkicks) than punches. So kicks, especially high kicks are seen more than punches nowdays. A sad development, made for audience appeal. But face punches ARE allowed.



Grenadier said:


> If they included empty hand kata as well as kobudo competition, in addition to the usual kumite, why not?  After all, gymnastics and swimming have multiple events in which the athletes can compete.



No.
The rules that are under considerations are WKF kumite and MAYBE kata (I have to check, but I dont think so) rules. Administrated by WKF as international organizatory body. No kobudo, no kumite rules variations. Nothing. Strict WKF as it is done today. Nothing else.
If some other karate sport (lets say knockdown karate rules for example) should want acceptance by IOC, it must first be accepted and administrated by the WKF as it is now the international karate organization recognized by IOC.. and unlike wrestling, WKF has no interest in housing several types of rules sets under its roof.


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## twendkata71 (Nov 2, 2008)

That is true. Most likely if karate did ever get accepted by the IOC to be included in the Olympics, if would be for Kumite. I doubt they would have kata, eventhough that I would like to see.  There would be no Kobudo. There is no Kobudo in WKF world competitions. You only see kobudo on the national level,i.e. USANKF competitions. If you go overseas, you usually don't see kobudo included either, like at the EKF, or KUGB.


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