# Former Marine Shoots Robbers



## MJS (Jun 29, 2007)

Came across this story in todays paper.  This happened in Florida!  



> FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. - Some are calling a former U.S. Marine a hero for shooting two men - killing one - during a botched robbery of a sandwich shop in Plantation, Fla. But others want to know how he could kill with impunity.
> 
> John Lovell had just finished dinner about 11:15 p.m. Wednesday when, Plantation police say, two men, armed with guns, rushed inside a Subway restaurant and demanded cash. After robbing the store, the men turned to Lovell. They wanted his money, police said.


 
More


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## CoryKS (Jun 29, 2007)

Former Marine trifecta!


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## Grenadier (Jun 29, 2007)

Justified self-defense.  

The way I see it, the ex-marine did everything right, and made the correct call.  

I'm guessing that when an armed thug tells you to get into the women's restroom, that it's not a good sign of things to come.


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## CoryKS (Jun 29, 2007)

There seem to be a lot of retired Marines hanging out in sandwich shops these days.  Robbers beware!  Jarheads love sammiches!


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## MA-Caver (Jun 29, 2007)

> But others want to know how he could kill with impunity.



Simple he's a marine, what do you want? His life (and others) was threatened and he did what he was *trained* to do; eliminate the threat. He was legally carrying a gun so he didn't do anything wrong. 
Attitude is everything. If Lovell saw that one or both of the robbers were scared (but committed) then he probably would've wounded them. If they were the brash, punk-tough-guy types he probably mortally shot them out of contempt, I probably would've too. 

Lovell should be left alone and respected for stopping a crime.


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## MJS (Jun 29, 2007)

MA-Caver said:


> Simple he's a marine, what do you want? His life (and others) was threatened and he did what he was *trained* to do; eliminate the threat. He was legally carrying a gun so he didn't do anything wrong.
> Attitude is everything. If Lovell saw that one or both of the robbers were scared (but committed) then he probably would've wounded them. If they were the brash, punk-tough-guy types he probably mortally shot them out of contempt, I probably would've too.
> 
> Lovell should be left alone and respected for stopping a crime.


 
Great points, and most likely, the comment you quoted, was made by the same type of person who, when a LEO shoots and kills someone, makes the comment, "Why did he have to kill him?  Why didn't he just shoot him in the leg?"  Sorry, but in a situation like that, there were no other options.  Had this man gone to the bathroom with that guy, he most likely would not be alive to comment today.


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## rompida (Jun 29, 2007)

It those ultra-liberal cry babies that question things like  "why did he have to shoot and kill them?"   I say, why didn't he finish off the other robber? (kidding of course)

I guess those same people would have still been waiting for the robbers to see the light as the were being executed in the bathroom.

kudos to the marine for removing these guys from the breeding population %-}


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## theletch1 (Jun 29, 2007)

OOH-RAH!!  One minor little point....It's FORMER Marine, not ex-marine.  The phrase "Once a Marine always a Marine" may sound a little kitchy to a lot of you but those of us who have worn the Eagle, Globe and Anchor live and die by it.


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## Budo_NJ (Jun 29, 2007)

I think the most liberal person would support the former marine for defending himself. He's 71 years old and was in a life-threatening situation.


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## Balrog (Jun 29, 2007)

I love this:


> But others want to know how he could kill with impunity.


 
I step on cockroaches with impunity.  Not much difference.  You do what you gotta do.


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## Sukerkin (Jun 29, 2007)

Well, I've read the article and despite the fact that I'm one of those pesky bleeding-heart types who believe that it is better to find another solution to a situation than killing, I really don't see that the fellow has much to reproach himself for.

He's in his seventies, so he's not likely to see engaging in hand-to-hand with twenty-somethings as a viable option, especially when he has a better, legal, alternative.

I've heard the odd rumble about the self-defence laws in Florida and I have to confess, to my surprise, that I quite agree with logic of the legislation.  It is far more sensible to allow a victim to defend themselves as best they can than legally hamstring them into inaction that gets them killed.


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## Grenadier (Jun 29, 2007)

Another article:

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/broward/sfl-flbsubway0629nbjun29,0,1772093.story

Of course, the families of the criminal are screaming for his head.



> But Gadson's grandmother, Rosa Jones, said: "He ain't no hero. He is a murderer and God will serve justice."
> 
> She and her husband, Ivory Jones, pastor of a Fort Lauderdale church, sat on their front porch in Fort Lauderdale on Thursday wondering how a man could shoot two people and not go to jail.
> 
> ...



The way I see it, those two thugs had every opportunity to not try to rob the place.


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## CoryKS (Jun 29, 2007)

Yup, every time somebody commits a crime, the family comes out and says something like, "He is a good person in every way except for, you know, his actions."  

Right.  Because it's your intentions that count, not pesky little details like the things you actually do.


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## MJS (Jun 29, 2007)

Grenadier said:


> Another article:
> 
> http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/broward/sfl-flbsubway0629nbjun29,0,1772093.story
> 
> ...


 
The family is no better than their scum bag son.



> But Gadson's grandmother, Rosa Jones, said: "He ain't no hero. He is a murderer and God will serve justice."


 
And if you were a decent parent, you'd have raised your kid better than you did!  Had this unfolded differently, its very possible their son would be a murderer, but I guess they're too blind to see that.



> She and her husband, Ivory Jones, pastor of a Fort Lauderdale church, sat on their front porch in Fort Lauderdale on Thursday wondering how a man could shoot two people and not go to jail.


 
Hmm..I wonder how they can look in the mirror and see that they have a dirtbag for a son.




> They said their grandson sometimes hung with the wrong crowd but never got into legal trouble. According to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, he has no arrest record. They said Gadson, who never finished high school, got tired of low-wage jobs and was pursuing his GED.


 
Tired of low wage jobs?? LOL, dude, try staying in school and maybe you could get a high wage job!



> Arrindell, friends said, found himself in a similar situation: no high school diploma and working odd jobs. So he went back to school. He was a man with past troubles, including a 2004 arrest for carrying a concealed weapon, but he was improving his life, they said. He recently bought a car and had a girlfriend.


 
Improving his life???  What by holding up a store??



> Kathy East, 54, whose son went to school with Arrindell, said she took him in two years ago when he and his mother had a falling out.
> 
> "I'm absolutely stunned," she said Thursday.


 
Yes, I know, its hard to believe Kathy, but the fact is, the kid has some serious issues.


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## MA-Caver (Jun 29, 2007)

HAD serious issues... he's dead now. 

Obviously the family of the dead robber isn't seeing the forest for the trees. They only know one of their own is dead. The hows and why's apparently don't matter. 
I'd be concern for the man who shot him... people like this can probably only understand violence. They may seek to be vindictive and give this guy some grief. While he may be able to hold his own... he may not. Hopefully the police will keep an eye out for a while to ensure that there's no immediate retaliation efforts being taken by the family. I don't think I'm being paranoid just sensible and knowing/understanding the mindset of a family enraged at losing one of their own in spite of the threat they posed against others. I've seen families like this, retaliation is all they understand.


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## KenpoTex (Jun 29, 2007)

Good for him...way to take action.

anybody else notice a heartwarming trend of old Marines taking care of business?  We had the dude on the bus in Costa Rica, the guy on the Northwest Airlines flight recently, and the guy the shot the man that murdered the trooper in New Hampshire.  Oorah!


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## Kembudo-Kai Kempoka (Jun 29, 2007)

He got tired of low-wage jobs, so he switched to a life of crime to include armed robbery..no record, cuz he hadn't been caught yet.

It will be interesting when we bring the boys home. We're going to see trained combatants enrolling in gangs due to pre-service cultural influences and financial pressures, and we're going to see their fellow veterans enlisting in law enforcement. I keep an ear to the floor for arrests gone awry because the guy getting arrested was a combat vet, compared to peacetime LEO's. It's already started.

If an old vet in a "shall issue" state like FLA caps a bad guy beofre the bad guy caps him, good. Watch the news; there WILL be more to come.

Be good and stay alert,

D.


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## MA-Caver (Jun 30, 2007)

Kembudo-Kai Kempoka said:


> He got tired of low-wage jobs, so he switched to a life of crime to include armed robbery..no record, cuz he hadn't been caught yet.
> 
> It will be interesting when we bring the boys home. We're going to see trained combatants enrolling in gangs due to pre-service cultural influences and financial pressures, and we're going to see their fellow veterans enlisting in law enforcement. I keep an ear to the floor for arrests gone awry because the guy getting arrested was a combat vet, compared to peacetime LEO's. It's already started.
> 
> ...



That is what's making it so scary to think about sometimes. You're in a restaurant or grocery store and this punk (Iraq war vet) wants to rob it (and you, and everyone else)  then wonder of wonders one of the LEO's shows on the scene is also an Iraq war vet... even further wonders... they served in the same unit. Now... imagine ... that. 
Far fetched but possible, one of those "one in a million" things. Gads sounds like a "movie of the week" don't it? 

But it is scary to think about the possibility of an armed robber being a vet and having the skills (and discipline to use them) and not being scared of someone else who'll stand up to him... it's going to boil down to who's quicker.

We've still haven't seen the long term effects of Iraq/Gulf-War syndrome.


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## theletch1 (Jun 30, 2007)

It's an interesting scenario to think about but will it really be any worse than what the Vets from 'Nam did when they got back?  The vast majority of Viet vets blended back into society as best they could and one of them actually going berserk was rare enough that you could be sure that when one of them did the press was sure to refer to him as a "Vietnam Veteran" at least ten times during each news broadcast.  The guys coming back from the Gulf have a support network ten times greater than those that came back from 'Nam so maybe things won't get too bad.  Yes, I know there have already been stories of gang members returning to their gangs after military service and beginning to train other members of their gang in H2H and marksmanship but these are very rare circumstances.  I truly WANT to believe that for many young men and women who left gangs to join the military there has been a fundamental change in mindset to show more honor and integrity.

Of course the pessimist in me says we've just created a bunch of super gansters!:shooter:


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## MA-Caver (Jun 30, 2007)

theletch1 said:


> It's an interesting scenario to think about but will it really be any worse than what the Vets from 'Nam did when they got back?  The vast majority of Viet vets blended back into society as best they could and one of them actually going berserk was rare enough that you could be sure that when one of them did the press was sure to refer to him as a "Vietnam Veteran" at least ten times during each news broadcast.  The guys coming back from the Gulf have a support network ten times greater than those that came back from 'Nam so maybe things won't get too bad.  Yes, I know there have already been stories of gang members returning to their gangs after military service and beginning to train other members of their gang in H2H and marksmanship but these are very rare circumstances.  I truly WANT to believe that for many young men and women who left gangs to join the military there has been a fundamental change in mindset to show more honor and integrity.
> 
> Of course the pessimist in me says we've just created a bunch of super gangsters!:shooter:


The optimist and pessimist in me agrees with you.


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## MJS (Jun 30, 2007)

Just a quick note.

I changed the title of this thread from "Ex" to "Former" as there was a concern from a few members.  Let me say that there was *no* disrespect intended on my part to any current or former Marines or service men/women, as I have the utmost respect for them and for what they are doing for this country.  I had simply typed as it read on the article.

Mike


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## theletch1 (Jun 30, 2007)

MJS said:


> Just a quick note.
> 
> I changed the title of this thread from "Ex" to "Former" as there was a concern from a few members. Let me say that there was *no* disrespect intended on my part to any current or former Marines or service men/women, as I have the utmost respect for them and for what they are doing for this country. I had simply typed as it read on the article.
> 
> Mike


No offense taken!  My remark was more tongue in cheek than anything else.  Being a Marine is something that you can't fully understand unless you've done it and understanding that I won't fault anyone for saying "ex" instead of "former".  So, no worries.:ultracool


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## Darth F.Takeda (Jun 30, 2007)

This happend about 5 miles from where I spent my teens and early 20's, and I know the type of robber and the types his parents where.

 Maybe if they did not teach the kid that society owns him, how to assimulate into polite society a little bit, then he would not have been a thug scumbag, wh felt he could rob people.

 SoFlo laws are the way they are because we have had alot of violent crime down there and many groups that self ghetto themselves and have an incredibly low value for anu human life, because they barley value their own.

CCW permits and Strand your ground laws are a loud and clear statment  that good people have every right to kill the bad when they step up and commit crimes of violence, as it should be the world round.

Criminals should have protection in the courts, that's good for all of us in the long run, but in the street, they have the right to .230 grains in their forehead.


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## Blotan Hunka (Jun 30, 2007)

The Ole' Jarhead is getting old and slow. He only killed one of them .

Siemper Fi.

As to the family of the dead scumbag. Well its not polite to say what i want to.


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