# Combat Jiu Jitsu?



## TMA17 (Aug 8, 2018)

One of the instructors at the IKMA school is a black belt in judo and combat jiu jitsu.  What are the differences between Japanese JJ, Brazilian and combat?


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## Deleted member 39746 (Aug 8, 2018)

Japanese has a dozen different styles to it, Brazilian usually refers to what was made by the Gracies(?)  and combat is probably a  modernization of a traditional style.     Not too sure if there is a singular Combat or multiple. 

I believe jujitsu is a general term for a segment of Japanese fighting styles as well.  (cant think of the wording) So it refers to quite a lot of styles and sub styles. 


thats the extent of my knowledge on the subject.


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## Anarax (Aug 8, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> One of the instructors at the IKMA school is a black belt in judo and combat jiu jitsu. What are the differences between Japanese JJ, Brazilian and combat?



Japanese Jujitsu has small-joint locks(wrists, fingers), large joint locks(elbows, knee, shoulders, etc), throws, sweeps, chokes, ground techniques and striking.

Judo has most of what JJJ has but without the small joint locks and usually without the striking.

BJJ actually came from Judo(some may dispute that), it focuses more on executing the locks and chokes on the ground.

I'm unsure of what the combat jujitsu.

Understand that these are a general overviews of what the styles are, you'll find the emphasis on certain techniques will vary from school to school.


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## now disabled (Aug 9, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> One of the instructors at the IKMA school is a black belt in judo and combat jiu jitsu.  What are the differences between Japanese JJ, Brazilian and combat?



Anything that has combat prefixing it could just be a marketing tool to make people come thru the door. 

There are many many schools of Japanese jiu jutsu and each has it's own curriculum etc Judo well I guess it depends on which school you go to as to what their emphasize will be on but I would assume that it will these days be competition focused. BJJ that you are better waiting until a guy of here picks the thread up and gives you the low down on that etc.

Are you looking to cross train or is it just curiosity ?


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## TMA17 (Aug 21, 2018)

Just curiousity as a few of the instructors at the IKMA school hold advanced black belts in judo and combat JJ.  I was told that it's more akin to Japanese JJ.

"First Day of BJJ" From The Japanese Jiu Jitsu Perspective

Differences Between Japanese Jiu Jitsu & Brazilian Jiu Jitsu


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 21, 2018)

Combat Jiu Jitsu


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## TMA17 (Aug 21, 2018)

Interesting, thanks Xue Sheng.  I just realized that I read the instructors background wrong.  He has a 5th degree bb in combat JJ from the United States Judo Association.  He said IKMA grappling is more similar to Japanese JJ.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 21, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> Interesting, thanks Xue Sheng.  I just realized that I read the instructors background wrong.  He has a 5th degree bb in combat JJ from the United States Judo Association.  He said IKMA grappling is more similar to Japanese JJ.



From what I read about "Combat Jiu jitsu" it sounds an awful lot like the Japanese Jujutsu I took in the early 1970s


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## Hanzou (Aug 21, 2018)

Japanese JJ are a variety of traditional Japanese martial arts dating from the samurai. Most actual Japanese JJ died out during the 20th century due to the rise of Judo and the collapse of the samurai class in Japan. 

Bjj is an offshoot of classical Judo that focuses on ground fighting and combines various forms of grappling and street fighting. It rose to prominence due to the Gracies issuing challenges against other martial artists and street fighters and mostly winning against them. 

I highly doubt that anything called "Combat Jiujitsu" is actually Japanese jj. In most cases, people who promote "combat jj" are just combining street fighting or karate with Judo (and more recently Bjj), and peppering it with "deadly moves" like throat jabs and eye pokes.


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## Buka (Aug 21, 2018)

Hanzou said:


> Japanese JJ are a variety of traditional Japanese martial arts dating from the samurai. Most actual Japanese JJ died out during the 20th century due to the rise of Judo and the collapse of the samurai class in Japan.
> 
> Bjj is an offshoot of classical Judo that focuses on ground fighting and combines various forms of grappling and street fighting. It rose to prominence due to the Gracies issuing challenges against other martial artists and street fighters and mostly winning against them.
> 
> I highly doubt that anything called "Combat Jiujitsu" is actually Japanese jj. In most cases, people who promote "combat jj" are just combining street fighting or karate with Judo (and more recently Bjj), and peppering it with "deadly moves" like throat jabs and eye pokes.



Welcome back, bro.


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## drop bear (Aug 22, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> Just curiousity as a few of the instructors at the IKMA school hold advanced black belts in judo and combat JJ.  I was told that it's more akin to Japanese JJ.
> 
> "First Day of BJJ" From The Japanese Jiu Jitsu Perspective
> 
> Differences Between Japanese Jiu Jitsu & Brazilian Jiu Jitsu



Find out if they compete and how they go. Combat jits can have strikes.

Which I had an instructor compete in once and only found out when he got slapped.



Hanzou said:


> Japanese JJ are a variety of traditional Japanese martial arts dating from the samurai. Most actual Japanese JJ died out during the 20th century due to the rise of Judo and the collapse of the samurai class in Japan.
> 
> Bjj is an offshoot of classical Judo that focuses on ground fighting and combines various forms of grappling and street fighting. It rose to prominence due to the Gracies issuing challenges against other martial artists and street fighters and mostly winning against them.
> 
> I highly doubt that anything called "Combat Jiujitsu" is actually Japanese jj. In most cases, people who promote "combat jj" are just combining street fighting or karate with Judo (and more recently Bjj), and peppering it with "deadly moves" like throat jabs and eye pokes.



Generally makes it better. I think Mat bryers and Chris parker in to it about that at one stage.

Ironically Mats system looked pretty good.


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## Hanzou (Aug 22, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> Just curiousity as a few of the instructors at the IKMA school hold advanced black belts in judo and combat JJ.  I was told that it's more akin to Japanese JJ.
> 
> "First Day of BJJ" From The Japanese Jiu Jitsu Perspective
> 
> Differences Between Japanese Jiu Jitsu & Brazilian Jiu Jitsu



I like that guard sweep video at the end of the first link.


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## FriedRice (Aug 25, 2018)

Combat BJJ is basically MMA Lite.

My main man, Eddie Bravo, coined that  phrase. Basically, just BJJ with slapping another dude in the face.


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## dunc (Aug 26, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> One of the instructors at the IKMA school is a black belt in judo and combat jiu jitsu.  What are the differences between Japanese JJ, Brazilian and combat?



There are quite a few articles on Japanese JJ kicking around the BJJ community at the moment, but TBH I feel that most of them are written by folk who don't have experience in JJJ

This is a short article that I wrote on the subject - maybe it's helpful 

Japanese Jiu Jitsu


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## TMA17 (Sep 10, 2018)

So two of the instructors from IKMA as mentioned are 5th degree black belts in jiu jitsu from the United States Judo Association.  

Jujitsu Sub-Committee


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## Hanzou (Sep 13, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> So two of the instructors from IKMA as mentioned are 5th degree black belts in jiu jitsu from the United States Judo Association.
> 
> Jujitsu Sub-Committee



So that really didn't make a lot of sense to me, and then I actually downloaded the document of their organization.....

Oh boy.... These guys are borderline delusional.



> Though some seek to learn jujitsu as a sport, our USJA jujitsu was not designed as a sport.  In fact, traditional jujitsu practitioners shun that thought.  For them, jujitsu is not a game.  Judo is the game, the safe facet of a deadly art.  To the traditionalist, when jujitsuka compete, there is but one winner -- the one still alive.



Utter nonsense. This is a common tactic by these schools to try to paint Judo as missing "real" Jiujitsu. Kano removed "Teh DeAdly" techniques because they couldn't be practiced effectively. However, you could practice throwing someone over and over again. As someone who has experienced getting thrown by a skilled Judoka onto a mat, I can assure you there's nothing "kiddie" about it. Ask the receiver of a hard Judo throw onto some concrete how "safe" they feel when they're crippled for life.

Strike one.




> Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, referred to as BJJ, advertises jujitsu as a sport and has become very popular and commercial.  To traditionalists, BJJ is Basically Just Judo groundwork except for headlocks that can damage the spine or neck, and leg or knee locks that can blow out knees or break ankles.



Except we don't practice headlocks. In Bjj we view headlocks as something you DON'T do because they suck and they're easy to escape from. Also neck and spine cranks are rarely practiced in modern Bjj because of the risk of injury to your partner. Leg or knee locks can blow out your knees and break ankles, but an arm, wrist, or shoulder lock can break those joints too, so what exactly was the point of bringing that up?

Also if you think the Guillotine is a "headlock", you're flipping clueless.

Strike two.




> For traditional jujitsuka, the last place you want to be is on the ground.  That’s because once there, you are subject to Number Two.  As long as you’re rolling around while being beaten by an attacker, it’s just one on one -- him on you.  But if you take the upper hand and begin to dominate the encounter, that’s when his buddy, whom you had not noticed sitting in his pickup truck, puts down his adult beverage, pats his hound dog on the head, picks up his baseball bat, and exits the vehicle to come to his friend’s assistance.  And while you are entangled on the ground, the standing buddy can kick and stick you.



What the hell is this? A scene from deliverance? There's so much wrong with this that it's not even worth going in depth.

Strike three, you're out.

And the picture.... OMG!


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## Buka (Sep 13, 2018)

I never actually heard anything be called Combat Jiu-jitsu. Read the term online over the past few years, a little bit anyway, but never in much detail.

That being said, my first exposure to Brazilian Jiu-jitsu was kinda sorta combat oriented, at least how it fit with everything I did at the time. It was originally taught to me to allow me to use my form of striking while I was on the ground, while I was in position and while I was in base - so that I could have enough leverage to actually create power in my strikes.....and not get myself killed in the process. And if as a result of said strikes submission opportunities arose - to take them and finish them.

I like the idea of what I consider Combat Jiu-jitsu. To me, it's what they call MMA today.


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## Xue Sheng (Sep 13, 2018)

Frankly...I'm holding out for Combat Ikebana


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## dunc (Sep 14, 2018)

TMA17 said:


> So two of the instructors from IKMA as mentioned are 5th degree black belts in jiu jitsu from the United States Judo Association.
> 
> Jujitsu Sub-Committee



I really don't know why so many people take a bit of judo and add in some karate and the odd finger lock to pass it off as Japanese (or Traditional) Jiu Jitsu


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