# The Karate Kid movies



## Drac (Mar 15, 2010)

Well ok, here is goes..Remember this is MT and not one of the " other " sites, so keep the name calling polite..I was recently involved in a discussion about the Karate Kid movies..I shocked the others involved when I made the statement that I *DISLIKED *all the Karate Kid movies, even the Next Karate Kid with Hillary Swank, most were stunned..Is there anybody here that also disliked them? I have NO DESIRE to see the next one either...


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## Blade96 (Mar 15, 2010)

I loved the first one (which i bought and watched like last week or so) and which I think is cute. I thought Daniel LaRusso (Daniel-san) was pretty sweet. (You just wanted to put him in your pocket and take him home as your own little son.)  And I really loved kindly and wise Mr Myagi.

even though as a real karate student I know parts of the movie were not realistic.

Havent seen the other movies though.


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## dancingalone (Mar 15, 2010)

Well, I don't think anyone would argue that the movies are great in the 'movie art' sense.  Because they weren't.  There was some cheesy overacting in all of them.

That said the movies (especially the first one) resonated with a great many youngsters in the eighties.  You've got the classic underdog (dork) kicking butt and getting the girl in the end.  You've got some funny fortune cookie wisdom doled out in perfect fashion by Pat Morita.  The movie probably got more than a few people to sign up for martial arts.  I know I did as a teenager.


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## SahBumNimRush (Mar 15, 2010)

Well to be honest, the original Karate Kid was what inspired me to start studying martial arts when i was a child (I was 4 years old when that movie came out).  I think that The Karate Kid was one of the few martial arts films to convey some of the aspects of martial arts beyond the kicking and punching aspect.  

Of course, it's Hollywood, so there is indeed fallacies associated with it.  But, IMHO, it captures an essence of TMA; studying will provide self-defense, self-confidence, and self-esteem.  Aspects of life transcend into martial arts, and aspects of martial arts transcend into real life.

Not to mention it has some of the sa-weetest quotes ever.. . "There is no mercy in this dojo!"  "Sweep the leg!"  **Not that I would EVER endorse either of those, but they are iconic**

As for the sequels I rate them more of B rate martial arts movies.  That said I still enjoyed them, but I enjoy most every martial arts movie I've ever seen, haha!


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## Drac (Mar 15, 2010)

dancingalone said:


> The movie probably got more than a few people to sign up for martial arts.


 
At one theater I know of a local dojo paid to have a table set up with flyers...


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## Drac (Mar 15, 2010)

SahBumNimRush said:


> Not to mention it has some of the sa-weetest quotes ever.. . "There is no mercy in this dojo!" "Sweep the leg!" **Not that I would EVER endorse either of those, but they are iconic**


 
I recently read in Black Belt that Martin Klove aka Kreese Sensei is using his character to teach children how to deal with bullies..


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## Joab (Mar 15, 2010)

I liked the first and second one, and I believe the poll should have allowed you to pick two or three not merely one or dislike all four. The first one was the best, which is typical of movies, the sequel is normally not as good as the first.

I never met anybody who didn't like the first one, even those who had no interest in martial arts at all. This was primarily because of the mentoring of an older man with a young one in ethics and morality.  My only problem with the first one was the full contact tournament without pads, I think that might turn off some parents from allowing their kids to compete. Than again, I'm not into sports martial arts at all, so it wasn't that big of a deal for me either.


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## Andy Moynihan (Mar 15, 2010)

It's rather ironic that the philosophies espoused by the "Cobra Kai Dojo" were considered to be "villainous" in the film, yet are perfect philosophies to adopt if one wishes to successfully defend oneself( Just a shame that was ALL the teacher knew and didn't know how to switch off).


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## Blindside (Mar 15, 2010)

I was a bit too young (12) for what should have been the least believable part of the movie (dork gets Elizabeth Shue), and I was already in karate so I wasn't impressed with the second least believalbe part (60 day wonder geek beats guys training for years.) All it caused me to do was have to listen to repeated "belts for holding up pants" quotes for several years.

And mostly that I think most modern dojos that have developed from that era need more "Cobra Kai" instructors than "Mr. Miyagi" if they want to impart an attitude geared toward survival.


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## Big Don (Mar 15, 2010)

The first is a classic. The second is mediocre. The third was a waste of film. The fourth? OMG? Seriously? Ballroom dancing,bowling, Buddhists? WTF was that?


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## MA-Caver (Mar 15, 2010)

Joab said:


> I liked the first and second one, and I believe the poll should have allowed you to pick two or three not merely one or dislike all four. The first one was the best, which is typical of movies, the sequel is normally not as good as the first.
> 
> I never met anybody who didn't like the first one, even those who had no interest in martial arts at all. This was primarily because of the mentoring of an older man with a young one in ethics and morality.  My only problem with the first one was the full contact tournament without pads, I think that might turn off some parents from allowing their kids to compete. Than again, I'm not into sports martial arts at all, so it wasn't that big of a deal for me either.


I agree that we should've had multiple choice polling here. But :idunno: anyway... 
Agreed that the acting was cheesy in places throughout... I did like the story-line of the first. I do think it's plausible for someone to train intensely to defeat someone who has been training over the years... "the fight goes to the one who wants it the most" ~ Bruce Lee. Understanding Daniel's plight and his knowledge deep down inside that if he DIDN'T win those guys would be after him regardless... so he knew he HAD to win and he did.  I'm speaking from personal experience with bullies hounding me until I got fed up and started fighting back and WINNING and they either respected me or knew that eventually they'd get seriously hurt. 
The second one was okay, putting Daniel in a real-world situation but again the acting was a bit over the top... if not alot. 
I lost interest after that and didn't pay attention to the third and didn't bother with the fourth (sequels have a way of wearing one's welcome out). 
Now with this re-make... :shrugs: who knows. Hollywood has been remaking classic films that don't NEED remaking so why should THIS one be any exception. 

What pisses me off is a rumor that Forbidden Planet will be remade  that is about as blasphemous as remaking The Day The Earth Stood Still.

Sorry about the thread hijacking


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## David43515 (Mar 15, 2010)

I watched the first two until I could pretty much quote them by heart as a kid.....but I was more interested in Elizabeth Shue and Tamilyn Tomita than I was in the plot.


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## Touch Of Death (Mar 15, 2010)

Drac said:


> Well ok, here is goes..Remember this is MT and not one of the " other " sites, so keep the name calling polite..I was recently involved in a discussion about the Karate Kid movies..I shocked the others involved when I made the statement that I *DISLIKED *all the Karate Kid movies, even the Next Karate Kid with Hillary Swank, most were stunned..Is there anybody here that also disliked them? I have NO DESIRE to see the next one either...


I am up to see Jackie Chan in anything he does these days. Some are stinkers, but I will give him a chance. The other flicks sucked to the degree of "Lethal Weapon IV". And that is bad.
Sean


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## Fiendlover (Mar 15, 2010)

Drac said:


> Well ok, here is goes..Remember this is MT and not one of the " other " sites, so keep the name calling polite..I was recently involved in a discussion about the Karate Kid movies..I shocked the others involved when I made the statement that I *DISLIKED *all the Karate Kid movies, even the Next Karate Kid with Hillary Swank, most were stunned..Is there anybody here that also disliked them? I have NO DESIRE to see the next one either...


 
I liked the first one and the second was ok.  I didn't even know there was a 3rd and 4th one and I have no desire to see the new one.


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## grydth (Mar 15, 2010)

Took my girls to the movies last weekend, and there was a trailer for the new Karate Kid film, set in China, with Jackie Chan. Even though the original title is now absurd to use, (The Kung Fu Kid?, The Wushu Wunderkind?), Jackie Chan has always struck me as having real skills and as being able to laugh at life and at himself. Both girls want to go when it comes out this summer. We'll give him a chance and I bet it pays off.


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## jks9199 (Mar 16, 2010)

The first one had a decent story, and some good points.  It was a coming of age movie that happened to involve martial arts...  Without too much alteration, it could have been a surfing movie, a boxing movie, or whatever.  I enjoyed and still enjoy it... though Daniel-san is a whiner.

The second one?  Daniel-san is annoying, but there was some nice scenery.

The third...  OK, nice scenery, cute girl... but gawd Daniel-san is a whiner!

The fourth? Hillary Swank was cool, some neat scenes and the monks were kind of fun.  Especially when they came to visit...

The new one?  Proof that Will Smith has the pull to gratify his ego.  But it's got Jackie Chan, so I'll probably end up watching it.  Probably at home, whenever it makes it to premium cable.


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## Bruno@MT (Mar 16, 2010)

In the first movie, a thing to remember is that Daniel would not have had his *** kicked so badly if he had realized that spraying the lead bully with a water hose was stupid. The moral of the story imo is that you can prevent a lot of bad things from happening if you know when it is time to bow out.

Daniel was out of his league. I am not 'blaming the victim' here, but if you want to taunt Mike Tyson, you had better have a plan for dealing with his fists. Daniel knew they would not let that one slide so doing what he did was stupid and shortsighted. If he really felt the need to strike back for past things, he should have been smart about it and not get caught.


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## Blade96 (Mar 16, 2010)

Andy Moynihan said:


> It's rather ironic that the philosophies espoused by the "Cobra Kai Dojo" were considered to be "villainous" in the film, yet are perfect philosophies to adopt if one wishes to successfully defend oneself( Just a shame that was ALL the teacher knew and didn't know how to switch off).



i see your point. after all martial mean the military aspect of things which that sensei certainly had in his cobra kai dojo. and we have it in ours too. 

Difference is, Warrant Officer or Lieutenant or w/e the frick title he had in the army..Kreese was a bully and a jerk. (I know for a fact what the us taught its soldiers about vietnamese wasnt good. and he was too young to have fought in WWII.) Army, even royal canadian army cadets, which i was in for 4 years, and martial arts, all with the genuine military aspect, builds you up. teaches you skills. makes you feel good about yourself. This guy used a military aspect, but tore people down in the process.



Bruno@MT said:


> In the first movie, a thing to remember is that Daniel would not have had his *** kicked so badly if he had realized that spraying the lead bully with a water hose was stupid. The moral of the story imo is that you can prevent a lot of bad things from happening if you know when it is time to bow out.
> 
> Daniel was out of his league. I am not 'blaming the victim' here, but if you want to taunt Mike Tyson, you had better have a plan for dealing with his fists. Daniel knew they would not let that one slide so doing what he did was stupid and shortsighted. If he really felt the need to strike back for past things, he should have been smart about it and not get caught.



Sure, we would think of that, but we're adults. realistically would we thought that stuff through when we were kids. Not me. and I was bullied. Actually I took revenge on a jerk girl who was mean to me by hiding poison ivies inside her sleeping bag at girl guide camp. I never got caught though and no one knew I did anything. Daniel-san was a high school kid who saw his chance to get back at johnny for hurting him. I think he thought he would get away at the time anonymously because he was hiding inside a shower =]


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## JohnASE (Mar 16, 2010)

Drac said:


> ..I shocked the others involved when I made the statement that I *DISLIKED *all the Karate Kid movies, even the Next Karate Kid with Hillary Swank, most were stunned..Is there anybody here that also disliked them? I have NO DESIRE to see the next one either...



Just curious, why didn't you like them, and why not see the new one?  Are your reasons related?  I don't think the new one will be anything like the old ones.

Personally, I liked the first one, thought the 2nd one was okay, don't remember much about the 3rd one but didn't hate it, and again, thought the 4th one was okay.  One of the things I liked about the first one was it's similarity to one of my favorite movies, the 36th Chamber of Shaolin, where tedious chores were used to build a foundation for martial arts training.  Hokey, yes, but fun.

Regarding the new one, I'll see it for sure.  Don't know if I'll spend the money to see it on the big screen, but even if it doesn't get great reviews, I'll want to check it out for myself.  I might wait until I can rent it.


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## chaos1551 (Mar 16, 2010)

SahBumNimRush said:


> Not to mention it has some of the sa-weetest quotes ever.. . "There is no mercy in this dojo!" "Sweep the leg!" **Not that I would EVER endorse either of those, but they are iconic**


 
"Put him in a body bag!  Yeeaaaah!"


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## Andy Moynihan (Mar 16, 2010)

chaos1551 said:


> "Put him in a body bag! Yeeaaaah!"


 
"On the street, if a man faces you, he is the enemy, _and the enemy deserves no mercy".irateph3_


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## MA-Caver (Mar 16, 2010)

chaos1551 said:


> "Put him in a body bag!  Yeeaaaah!"


Don't forget to add the stupid giggle at the end of that quote.


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## David43515 (Mar 16, 2010)

I can`t recall if it was this forum or another one where someone pointed out that it was easy to cheer on Daniel in the first one because his opponants were fully grown. I think that one problem with the new one will be that you feel like a shmuck cheering somebody who`s beating up a 9 or 10 year old kid. 

To look at it another way, in the scenes where Mr Miyagi had to fight the Cobra Kai  guys, there was some expectation that he was in danger. They were skilled and twice his size. Will anyone feel that way if Jackie chan fights what look to be Chinese Junior high kids?


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## Drac (Mar 17, 2010)

JohnASE said:


> Just curious, why didn't you like them, and why not see the new one? Are your reasons related? I don't think the new one will be anything like the old ones.


 
..Wimpy Daniel-San takes lessons from a skilled practioneer of the MA for x amount of months and gains the skill to get into the ring and BEAT kids who have prolly been doing kumite since day one under the watchful eye of the cruel Kreese Sensei and WINS????


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## chrispillertkd (Mar 17, 2010)

I really enjoyed the first movie when I saw it (I think I was maybe 13 at the time) and I think it holds up reasonably well. The second movie was also good, although not quite as good as the first.

The third one was horrendous. I didn't bother with the fourth movie.

I know some people are critical of Daniel-san learning karate well enough to beat all his opponents in, what?, 3 or 4 months. Yes, it's unbelievable. I do point out, however, that he did mention he had at least some training at a local Y before moving to California. It at least makes things a bit more realistic (but not much, granted).

Pax,

Chris


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## Big Don (Mar 18, 2010)

chrispillertkd said:


> I really enjoyed the first movie when I saw it (I think I was maybe 13 at the time) and I think it holds up reasonably well. The second movie was also good, although not quite as good as the first.
> 
> The third one was horrendous. I didn't bother with the fourth movie.
> 
> ...


He also had that book, don't forget the book.


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## Big Don (Mar 18, 2010)

Drac said:


> ..Wimpy Daniel-San takes lessons from a skilled practioneer of the MA for x amount of months and gains the skill to get into the ring and BEAT kids who have prolly been doing kumite since day one under the watchful eye of the cruel Kreese Sensei and WINS????


There are Black Belts around that I know I can beat, some of them have been around much longer than me, that part... It is sensational, but, possible. Likely, no, probable, Hell no, but, possible, yeah.


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## Andy Moynihan (Mar 18, 2010)

Big Don said:


> There are Black Belts around that I know I can beat, some of them have been around much longer than me, that part... It is sensational, but, possible. Likely, no, probable, Hell no, but, possible, yeah.


 

But how many of them get run ragged in class like Kreese ran HIS boys?

Who would DARE, given the current lawsuit culture?


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## Chris Parker (Mar 18, 2010)

(My favourite thoughts about Karate Kid, and a few other films, courtesy of the greatest role model available today, Barney Stinson from How I Met Your Mother [Neil Patrick Harris])

*Barney Stinson: *Hey, The Karate Kid is a great movie.It&#8217;s the story of a hopeful, young karate enthusiast whose dreams and moxie take him all the way to the All Valley Karate Championship.  Of course, sadly he loses in the final round to that nerd kid.  But, he learns an important lesson about gracefully accepting defeat.
*Lily Aldrin: *Wait, when you watch The Karate Kid you actually root for that mean blonde boy?
*Barney Stinson: *No, I root for the scrawny loser from New Jersey who barely even knows karate.  When I watch The Karate Kid I root for the karate kid, Johnny Lawrence from the Cobra Kai dojo.  Get your head out of your *** Lily.
*Marshall Eriksen*: You're telling me that when you watch "The Karate Kid", you don't root for Daniel-san? 
*Ted Mosby*: Who do you root for in "Die Hard"? 
*Barney Stinson*: Hans Gruber. Charming international bandit. In the end, he dies hard. He's the title character. 
*Lily Aldrin*: What about "The Breakfast Club"? 
*Barney Stinson*: The teacher running detention. He's the only guy in the whole movie wearing a suit. 
*Robin Scherbatsky*: I've got one. "The Terminator". 
*Barney Stinson*: What's the name of the movie, Robin? Who among us did not shed a tear when his little red eye went out in the end, and he didn't get to kill all those people? 
[_Breaks down_] 
*Barney Stinson*: I'm sorry. I just get so emotional. 
*Ted Mosby*: I am never watching a movie with you again. 
*Barney Stinson*: They didn't even try to help him!


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## jks9199 (Mar 18, 2010)

chrispillertkd said:


> I really enjoyed the first movie when I saw it (I think I was maybe 13 at the time) and I think it holds up reasonably well. The second movie was also good, although not quite as good as the first.
> 
> The third one was horrendous. I didn't bother with the fourth movie.
> 
> ...


It's actually not unreasonable -- if the focus was on function and fighting.  As shown (wax on, wax off, paint the fence...)... Unlikely, except that it seems to be something that didn't go on longer than a week or so.

A couple of months of near-daily, several hours long and hard training... Yeah, you can get skills that'll hold up well in a fight.  You won't have a highly refined kata or something like that...


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## Blade96 (Mar 18, 2010)

Drac said:


> ..Wimpy Daniel-San takes lessons from a skilled practioneer of the MA for x amount of months and gains the skill to get into the ring and BEAT kids who have prolly been doing kumite since day one under the watchful eye of the cruel Kreese Sensei and WINS????



well if the movie actually had to show years of training it would be umpteen hours long.

actually I've a figure skating movie that does the same thing. Teenage girl who had trained a little when she was younger takes figure skating lessons over one summer and gets good enough over just one summer to take second place at the sectional championships *rolls eyes*

Unrealistic most of the time but I understand why they have to condense down the amount of time it takes to learn such training to make their point.


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## Omar B (Mar 18, 2010)

Blade96 said:


> well if the movie actually had to show years of training it would be umpteen hours long.
> actually I've a figure skating movie that does the same thing. Teenage girl who had trained a little when she was younger takes figure skating lessons over one summer and gets good enough over just one summer to take second place at the sectional championships *rolls eyes*
> Unrealistic most of the time but I understand why they have to condense down the amount of time it takes to learn such training to make their point.



I hear you man.  What would work more for me is if Daniel already had a black belt but from a crap school with a bad Sensei so he's got the knowledge but not the whole package.  Him meeting a new, great teacher would take the tools he already has and applies them correctly.  Because we have all been in the position where we train with someone else and we get a different bit of coaching that suddenly supercharges what we already know.


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## JohnASE (Mar 19, 2010)

Who wants to see plausible movies about ordinary people doing realistic things?


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## zDom (Mar 19, 2010)

JohnASE said:


> Who wants to see plausible movies about ordinary people doing realistic things?



(Sheepishly raises his hand)




.. oh.. was that a rhetorical question ..?  :uhyeah:


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## Blade96 (Mar 19, 2010)

chaos1551 said:


> "Put him in a body bag!  Yeeaaaah!"



"Fear does not exist in this dojo! Pain does not exist in this dojo! Defeat does not exist in this dojo. Does it?"

"No Sensei!"

"What is the way?"

"Strike first, strike hard, no mercy, SIR!"


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## Blindside (Mar 22, 2010)

Blade96 said:


> "Fear does not exist in this dojo! Pain does not exist in this dojo! Defeat does not exist in this dojo. Does it?"
> 
> "No Sensei!"
> 
> ...


 
I'm still trying to figure out the downside to the training methodology of installing a "warrior" attitude if you want guys to actually win a fight with some regularity.


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## Haakon (Mar 22, 2010)

Big Don said:


> The first is a classic. The second is mediocre. The third was a waste of film. The fourth? OMG? Seriously? Ballroom dancing,bowling, Buddhists? WTF was that?



That's about what I think. The first one has been on cable the last couple of weeks so I've recently re-watched it. I was competeting in tournaments when the movie came out and wasn't so impressed with the rules in the tournament in the movie, but overall I liked it.

I'm looking forward to the new Karate Kid movie with Jackie Chan (even though I think they should call it something else) mainly because I really like Jackie Chan and will watch pretty much anything he's in.


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## Blade96 (Mar 23, 2010)

I wondered if when you first saw the movie when Mr Myagi told him 'wash the car' 'paint the fence ''sand the floor' and Daniel-san was doing the chores,

Who figured out the meaning behind the chores, what they were for, and who of you at first thought pretty much the same as Daniel-san did?

Myself, maybe because of the fact that I'd been doing karate six months before I saw the movie for the first time ever, and he was showing him how to move his hands, hold his wrists when painting the fence, etc. I watched it and thought 'Arm blocks!'  Because it might not be exactly how we Shotokankas move our arms when blocking (cause that wasnt shotokan in the film) but it was similar!

Which one of you caught on right away and which of you took longer to figure it out?

I was curious.....


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## Drac (May 16, 2010)

I just saw the trailer for the new Karate Kid move.. I now I feel like a hypocrite because it looked good and I will probaby see it..Leave me in my shame...LOL


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