# Recoil buffers--placebo or real?



## psi_radar (Feb 1, 2005)

I took my AK up to the range last weekend with a new BlackJack recoil buffer installed. This was an impulse buy--since I was already getting a new fire control group from the same store, I ordered one of these just to try it out. Now maybe it was just a placebo affect in addition to the smoothness of the new two-stage trigger, but it really seemed to me like the action was smoother and quieter, and I could fire more rapidly while keeping on target. 

What are your opinions on recoil buffers? Am I just imagining things, or are they a nice and inexpensive addition for all my semi-automatics?


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## Tgace (Feb 1, 2005)

They are what make the AR system so friendly to shoot.


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## GAB (Feb 1, 2005)

Hi, 
The BAR had recoil reducer's (buffers)in it's stock... The 30-06 is pretty tough on you, it worked so good you had to make sure it did not crawl away from you...

Regard, Gary


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## psi_radar (Feb 1, 2005)

GAB said:
			
		

> Hi,
> The BAR had recoil reducer's (buffers)in it's stock... The 30-06 is pretty tough on you, it worked so good you had to make sure it did not crawl away from you...
> 
> Regard, Gary



I can't imagine the recoil on one of those...my M77 30.06 is tiring at the range. M14 must be bad too.


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## dearnis.com (Feb 1, 2005)

I have used them quite a bit in my .45s.  I don't see much difference in recoil, but judging from how bad they get chewed up I'm sure they have saved some wear and tear on frames.
I would think in the in the AK they cusion the metal on metal contact a bit, which has to be better for the rifle.  The compression should drag the recoil over a few more fractions of a second, which would account for smoothing things out.
How 'bout a report on your trigger upgrade.


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## psi_radar (Feb 1, 2005)

dearnis.com said:
			
		

> I have used them quite a bit in my .45s.  I don't see much difference in recoil, but judging from how bad they get chewed up I'm sure they have saved some wear and tear on frames.
> I would think in the in the AK they cusion the metal on metal contact a bit, which has to be better for the rifle.  The compression should drag the recoil over a few more fractions of a second, which would account for smoothing things out.
> How 'bout a report on your trigger upgrade.



I also picked up a few recoil buffers for my 1911a1, I've yet to try them, though.

The trigger is fantastic. It's made by Red Star Arms/Power Custom, a very nicely made piece of hardware. I actually screwed up the install pretty well by mistaking a small, unmarked tube of loc-tite as gun oil. Imagine my surprise when trying to adjust the disconnector and it's frozen solid, along with the whole FCG...hilarity and 4 hours of serious labor with heat, dremel, vice grips and WD-40 ensued... 

But everything turned out great in the end. It's a very fine product--fit and finish are excellent. It can easily go from two stage to single stage with small allen-screw adjustments. I'm told the gun is easily bump-fired by using the single-stage setting. I'm not into that but that's what I heard. The pull can be adjusted from 3.5 to 8 pounds. The overtravel can also be adjusted easily. In operation, the trigger is definite and smooth, with no slap. With the addition of the new trigger and the recoil buffer the AK is like a different weapon altogether, it seems much more refined than a stamped Romanian gun that lists for between 300-350$. Red Star Arms sells the trigger for about 85$. 

Pete


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## GAB (Feb 2, 2005)

Lock tite? Sounds like that was ugly...

Regards, Gary


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## TonyM. (Feb 2, 2005)

This is why we never use the permanant locktite in gunsmithing.


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## psi_radar (Feb 2, 2005)

GAB said:
			
		

> Lock tite? Sounds like that was ugly...
> 
> Regards, Gary



Oh yeah, it was bad. Plus it was really hard to work on the thing while continually kicking myself. I was impressed that the FCG came out pretty much unscathed from all the rough treatment--another testament to its quality.


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## dearnis.com (Feb 2, 2005)

at least you can laugh at the mistake  (cause heaven knows I'm laughing at you!!!)
Thanks for the feedback; I've heard some good things about the red star units.  I'm swearing off any more gun projects for a while though.  Between the scout build up (and I can call it that; somehow I did manage to meet all Col. Cooper's specs) and the FAL I can barely afford my upcoming vacation.


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## psi_radar (Feb 2, 2005)

dearnis.com said:
			
		

> at least you can laugh at the mistake  (cause heaven knows I'm laughing at you!!!)
> Thanks for the feedback; I've heard some good things about the red star units.  I'm swearing off any more gun projects for a while though.  Between the scout build up (and I can call it that; somehow I did manage to meet all Col. Cooper's specs) and the FAL I can barely afford my upcoming vacation.



Hey, there's nothing better than a good laugh at someone else's expense! There was that terrible moment when I was rereading the manual and came across the sentence that said "use the supplied loc-tite to secure the screws," and I thought, loc-tite, there wasn't any loc-tite, just that small vial of oil....DOH!!!!  :whip:


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## psi_radar (Feb 2, 2005)

dearnis.com said:
			
		

> at least you can laugh at the mistake  (cause heaven knows I'm laughing at you!!!)
> Thanks for the feedback; I've heard some good things about the red star units.  I'm swearing off any more gun projects for a while though.  Between the scout build up (and I can call it that; somehow I did manage to meet all Col. Cooper's specs) and the FAL I can barely afford my upcoming vacation.



I'd like to hear about that Scout project--sounds like a good thread.


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## dearnis.com (Feb 2, 2005)

Believe me, I have done similar things.
I owe several project and review posts...but not until I get back from my vacation (leaving next week).  On the Scout I do have before and in progress pics, so it should be a decent write up.


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## AC_Pilot (Feb 3, 2005)

I use buffers in all my semi autos, from my 10/22s to my HK91.


And in semi handguns.. the only problem here is that in the 1911 for instance it limits slide travel by the thickness of the buffer, but really that has been no problem with the large ejection port and short ejectors I have. Some people have trouble ejecting loaded rounds with the longer ejectors and the pistol buffers.

One other big advantage is it limits the shock and damage to the slide/frame or rifle receiver/bolt assly. This at least in theory will extend service life, especially with hot loads.. Be aware that you have to change out the poly buffer every now and then.

My M14 is IMO a pussycat to shoot with the steel butt cap. But then I like the recoil of my 12 GA SPAS 12 with hot handloaded slugs and steel folder stock  :tank:


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