# Stick forms



## Owwthathurt,showmeagian (Jun 22, 2004)

Hello all

Well i just want to know, if you can help me.

Trying to learn stick forms, and i know they flow but i might (still am) be new. It's hard to learn the flow of them. If any one can give me some pointers please help me. 

I have 1-2-3 forms down and learning 4 as of the moment, just having some problems with the fluidity(sp) of the movement. I see diff ma and see them stall or slow down to "point out a move"? Do we need to do that in forms, or do we just flow?

I guess what im trying to say is I feel like im clubbing thru the forms,               

please help


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## Owwthathurt,showmeagian (Jun 22, 2004)

sry,Chris manley


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

Hi Chris,

Welcome to MartialTalk!!!

Yeah, it may seem that when you first learn the forms, the moves seem static because the movements are new and being developed into muscle memory, however, the more you do them, the more fluid the movements will become especially as you piece the parts together.

Please note that the stick forms are heavily built on ocho-ocho (upward and downward figure-eight) so practicing those striking styles will help in developing fluidity.

Best regards,

Palusut


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## arnisandyz (Jun 22, 2004)

Owwthathurt said:
			
		

> Hello all
> I guess what im trying to say is I feel like im clubbing thru the forms,
> 
> please help




try doing with a sword...you'll get more cutting, slashing and fluid movement


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## Bob Hubbard (Jun 22, 2004)

Welcome to MT! 

Datu Hartman has a CD out that has the Modern Arnis forms on it.  We have a clip up in the video library here: http://www.martialtalk.com/videos/anyolima.mpg
(352 x 240 10.9mb).  

Tim (who I believe was teh forms guy when Remy was alive) does them with a more 'karate' flavor, meaning a harder approach.  I don't know if he has a forms video out, but I've heard Datu Worden does them with a softer feel to them.  My personal preference is a more 'tai-chi' like flow rather than a 1-2-3 hard karate method.  Randy Schea also I believe has a forms video, however I haven't seen it yet so can't say what his approach is.


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## Cruentus (Jun 22, 2004)

Owwthathurt said:
			
		

> sry,Chris manley



Hi Chris.

IMHO, learn the basic movements, then do them the way you see fit. For learning the basic movements, doing it in steps is sometimes the easiest way to learn it. From there, do it how you'd like; flow or ridged. Forms are a tempelate for your own expression; that's how I teach them anyways.

If your a part of a larger organization or school, I say do what the instructor  wants. Your instructor or organization may want it done a standardize way for his own group. What you do on your own is your choice, however.

Question: who do you train with? If your looking for a product, who you train with may be a factor in what might be best for you.

Paul

p.s. I see that you said your from Warren. If that's Warren Michigan, then your welcome to stop in on my class in Rochester. Private Message me for more info.  :asian:


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

arnisandyz said:
			
		

> try doing with a sword...you'll get more cutting, slashing and fluid movement



With all due respect, try a training sword or machete first, its more forgiving! :jedi1:  :knight:  :samurai:  :ninja:  :anic:


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## Dan Anderson (Jun 22, 2004)

Hi Chris,

I do them according to the nature of the weapon used.  I hammer witht he cane and cut with the bolo.  With the cane you need to blast so I use much more of a karate motion, crank it up and fire.  With the bolo, a _contact and draw_ action of the slash is much more appropriate so that's what I do.  The stances are more fixed in my cane applications while they are more fluid and directional stepping oriented in the bolo applications.  Does this answer your question?

Yours,
Dan Anderson

PS - Kaith, RP relied on me as to forms in the Pacific NW.  Tim wasn't the only one.  DA


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## Flatlander (Jun 22, 2004)

For emptyhand applications, might I reccommend the book Mano Y Mano by Master Dan Anderson?  Not many (if any?) other books which address this issue, and in my opinion, understanding emptyhand applications is tantamount to really "owning" the movements.  :asian:


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

Like Flatlander, I also recommend Dan Anderson's Mano Y Mano book.  Its very well done!!!

Palusut


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

The stick forms are in the Modern Arnis "Pink" Book by Remy Presas.

The stick and empty hand forms are on the 1980's Modern Arnis tape series by Remy Presas.


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Jun 22, 2004)

Palusut said:
			
		

> The stick forms are in the Modern Arnis "Pink" Book by Remy Presas.
> 
> The stick and empty hand forms are on the 1980's Modern Arnis tape series by Remy Presas.



Don't forget they are also in Remy's first tape series. :asian:


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## Flatlander (Jun 22, 2004)

But VHS is so out, guys.  Anything on DVD?


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

Renegade said:
			
		

> Don't forget they are also in Remy's first tape series. :asian:



Hi Tim,

Wasn't the 1980's tapes the first tapes that he did.  You know the ones with Jim and Judy Clapp and and  Sifu Lee Lowery?

Thanks,

Harold


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Jun 22, 2004)

Palusut said:
			
		

> Hi Tim,
> 
> Wasn't the 1980's tapes the first tapes that he did.  You know the ones with Jim and Judy Clapp and and  Sifu Lee Lowery?
> 
> ...



I didn't see the whoe posy. I was multi tasking! They are the tapes I was refering to.


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

Renegade said:
			
		

> I didn't see the whoe posy. I was multi tasking!



Yeah Right Tim, What were you really up to? artyon:  :uhyeah:  :xtrmshock  :ladysman:


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Jun 22, 2004)

Palusut said:
			
		

> Yeah Right Tim, What were you really up to? artyon:  :uhyeah:  :xtrmshock  :ladysman:




If I told you it might cause an international incident.

artyon:


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## Rich Parsons (Jun 22, 2004)

You can find further discussion on Cane Forms Here

And a list of technical discussions Here

 :asian:


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## Guro Harold (Jun 22, 2004)

Renegade said:
			
		

> If I told you it might cause an international incident.
> 
> artyon:


 :asian:


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## Owwthathurt,showmeagian (Jun 23, 2004)

Thanks for the pointers guys Ill try them out tomarrow

And i must say, you all seem great and very professional, this is a great place thank you

chris


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## mcjon77 (Jun 23, 2004)

flatlander said:
			
		

> But VHS is so out, guys. Anything on DVD?


The 3 volume black belt magazine tapes are on DVD, but they don't have any forms IIRC.

Jon


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## Dan Anderson (Jun 23, 2004)

You know, this brings up a couple of very interesting questions: 

1.  Who currently owns the original 7 tapes Prof. Presas did.

2.  Are the most recent batch of tapes still in probate?

Yours,
Dan Anderson


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## Cruentus (Jun 23, 2004)

Dan Anderson said:
			
		

> You know, this brings up a couple of very interesting questions:
> 
> 1.  Who currently owns the original 7 tapes Prof. Presas did.
> 
> ...



#1. I have some of the originals

#2. Isn't Jeff Delenay selling some of the recent tapes on his website? If those aren't the tapes, then what are they?

Sincerely,

Lisa McManus


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## Dan Anderson (Jun 24, 2004)

Paul,

Are you posting as Lisa?  Is Lisa using your computer?  This is confusing.  Anyway, let me clarify:

1.  Who owns the rights to RP's first batch of 7 tapes?
2.  Yes, Jeff is selling those tapes on his website.  My question should be, "Who owns the rights to those set of tapes?"

Yours,
Dan Anderson


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## Cruentus (Jun 24, 2004)

Dan Anderson said:
			
		

> Paul,
> 
> Are you posting as Lisa?  Is Lisa using your computer?  This is confusing.  Anyway, let me clarify:
> 
> ...



That's not the ONLY thing Lisa is...(wink, wink)  :rofl: Kidding of course (she's a little old for me anyhow, and I'm a little almost married  :uhyeah: ).

So, those are the 7 tapes in question that he is selling. The bigger question is who owns the rights to sell them...and if it ain't Grandmaster Jeff, then I am sure that he'll have a problem, and he'll owe someone some bucks. As far as I know, who own the rights to what is still in probate.

Oh...and as to signing my name....I have a new-found hobby of humeriously signing someone elses name to my posts where I see fit. It makes me laugh...and I could laugh all damn day, with it! :rofl:  For some reason, I have ben doing it all week and it hasn't gotten old yet!  :boing2:  

Yours,

Dan Anderson


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## Flatlander (Jun 24, 2004)

Tulisan said:
			
		

> Oh...and as to signing my name....I have a new-found hobby of humeriously signing someone elses name to my posts where I see fit. It makes me laugh...and I could laugh all damn day, with it! :rofl: For some reason, I have ben doing it all week and it hasn't gotten old yet! :boing2:
> 
> Yours,
> 
> Dan Anderson


This is dangerous behaviour that could escalate into somethinng more serious.  I recommend you talk to someone.  If you would like to get together sometime, grab the next comet.

Yours in spirit,
David Koresh


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## Dan Anderson (Jun 24, 2004)

Tulisan said:
			
		

> That's not the ONLY thing Lisa is...(wink, wink)  :rofl: Kidding of course (she's a little old for me anyhow, and I'm a little almost married  :uhyeah: ).
> 
> So, those are the 7 tapes in question that he is selling. The bigger question is who owns the rights to sell them...and if it ain't Grandmaster Jeff, then I am sure that he'll have a problem, and he'll owe someone some bucks. As far as I know, who own the rights to what is still in probate.
> 
> ...



Dear Dan,

There is no such thing as almost a little bit married.  It's like being a little bit pregnant.

Also, your spelling is wobbly.  Go to spell check or learn the English language.

Yours,
Paul Groinulis
 :boing2:


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