# Bill Maher,  remember Theo Van Goh



## billc (Mar 12, 2011)

Bill Maher dicusses Islam with Keith Ellison. Maher does not look to have pulled any punches in the discussion.

http://dailycaller.com/2011/03/12/m...ate-filled-holy-book-that-inspires-terrorism/


bill Maher:   
&#8220;I do agree that there are other groups that pose a terroristic threat to this country,&#8221; Maher said, &#8220;I would say that the threat from radicalized Muslims is a unique and greater threat. It is the greatest threat.&#8221;   
​ 

I wonder if Jon Stewart would be so frank with Islam.


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## fangjian (Mar 12, 2011)

People get upset when things like "The Quran is a book filled with hate and inspires terrorism and ..........", are said. 

But ummm, *it is* filled with those things. We're not being _extreme_. The 'holy' books are.


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## Aiki Lee (Mar 12, 2011)

Well the Quaran does. You could make some arguement that it there is some of that in the Torah, but the New Testament doesn't have anything like that.


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## Touch Of Death (Mar 12, 2011)

Himura Kenshin said:


> Well the Quaran does. You could make some arguement that it there is some of that in the Torah, but the New Testament doesn't have anything like that.


Exactly, there was a lot of smiting going on, in the Old Testament. I guess calling genocide, smite makes it OK.
Sean


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## fangjian (Mar 12, 2011)

Himura Kenshin said:


> Well the Quaran does. You could make some arguement that it there is some of that in the Torah, but the New Testament doesn't have anything like that.



The bible and quran have nearly equal amounts of horror and hate in them. 

As far as the new testament, I will admit, it is definitely easier a read than the old testament. However, there's quite a bit of reference to a place called 'hell' in it. It seems fair that, telling children they will go there for mundane acts done in this life, is child abuse.


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## granfire (Mar 12, 2011)

Well, one has to look at Brother Phelps from our beloved WBC....and one can clearly see how much hate the bible can generate...


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## Big Don (Mar 12, 2011)

granfire said:


> Well, one has to look at Brother Phelps from our beloved WBC....and one can clearly see how much hate the bible can generate...


There is a huge difference, Phelps and his family are routinely denounced, loudly and clearly by just about everyone. People who speak out against Radical Islam, in any of its forms, be it, misogyny, intolerance of other religions, terrorism, etc are routinely denounced by the left and so called moderate Muslims as bigots.
You can't find a poster on here, for instance, supporting Phelps, but, you can find a whole passel condoning Islamic terrorism, misogyny, religious exclusion, sharia, etc.


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## billc (Mar 12, 2011)

The death of Theo Van Gogh:

Assassination


Place where Van Gogh was killed


Demonstration at the Dam square after Van Gogh was killed


Demonstrators. The sign, translated, says "Theo has been murdered."
Mohammed Bouyeri murdered Van Gogh in the early morning of 2 November 2004, in Amsterdam, in front of the Amsterdam East borough office (stadsdeelkantoor) on the corner of the Linnaeusstraat and Tweede Oosterparkstraat (52°21&#8242;32.22&#8243;N 4°55&#8242;34.74&#8243;E), while he was cycling to work.[3] Bouyeri shot van Gogh eight times with an HS 2000 handgun, and Van Gogh died on the spot. Bouyeri then attempted to decapitate him with one knife,[4] and stabbed him in the chest with another. The two knives were left implanted in his torso, one attaching a five-page note to his body. The note (Text) threatened Western countries, Jews and Ayaan Hirsi Ali (who went into hiding).[5][6] The note also contained references to the ideologies of the Egyptian organization Takfir wal-Hijra.

The killer, Mohammed Bouyeri, a 26-year-old Dutch-Moroccan citizen, was apprehended by the police after being shot in the leg. Bouyeri has alleged terrorist ties with the Dutch Hofstad Network. He was also charged with the attempted murder of several police officers and bystanders, illegal possession of a firearm, and conspiring to murder others, including Hirsi Ali. He was convicted on 26 July 2005 and sentenced to life in prison with no chance of parole.[7]

Imam Fawaz of the as-Sunnah Mosque in The Hague gave a sermon several weeks before the murder in which he called Theo van Gogh "a 'criminal bastard' and prayed for the filmmaker to be afflicted with an incurable disease."[8]

The murder of Theo Van Gogh sparked a storm of outrage throughout the Netherlands. Flowers, notes, drawings, and other expressions of mourning were left at the scene of the murder.[9]


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## Empty Hands (Mar 13, 2011)

Big Don said:


> You can't find a poster on here, for instance, supporting Phelps, but, you can find a whole passel *condoning* Islamic terrorism, misogyny, religious exclusion, sharia, etc.



Liar.


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## Twin Fist (Mar 13, 2011)

No, he is right, there are packloads of people HERE ON THIS SITE that excuse anything the islamiocs do, and before you can say "jack robinson" reply that "chirstianity is worse or just as bad " BS


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## Empty Hands (Mar 13, 2011)

Twin Fist said:


> No, he is right, there are packloads of people HERE ON THIS SITE that excuse anything the islamiocs do, and before you can say "jack robinson" reply that "chirstianity is worse or just as bad " BS



Produce a quote then.  Saying "christianity is just as bad" in no way "condones" or "excuses" anything.


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## Archangel M (Mar 13, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> Produce a quote then.  Saying "christianity is just as bad" in no way "condones" or "excuses" anything.




No..it just avoids the question.


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## Twin Fist (Mar 13, 2011)

and deflects and attempts to apply a moral filter of equality where there is none


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## shesulsa (Mar 13, 2011)

Archangel M said:


> No..it just avoids the question.



The burden of proof is on the poster.

Produce a quote of absolutely anyone on this site "condoning Islamic terrorism, misogyny, religious exclusion, sharia, etc."

Do it. I triple dog dare ya.

Actually, the original poster of that quotation - Big Don - ought to be the one, according to the MT rules, to prove what he said.

Otherwise, I CALL BS!!


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## billc (Mar 13, 2011)

Empty hands, that was a very nuanced comeback.


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## Archangel M (Mar 13, 2011)

Lets start here:

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=93962&highlight=crusades

and lets see how quickly the topic was changed to "Christians are just as bad" and by who.


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## Empty Hands (Mar 13, 2011)

billcihak said:


> Empty hands, that was a very nuanced comeback.



It has the virtue of being true.  

No one on this site has condoned Islamic terrorism.  Anyone who claims that is a liar, plain and simple.


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## shesulsa (Mar 13, 2011)

Archangel M said:


> Lets start here:
> 
> http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=93962&highlight=crusades
> 
> and lets see how quickly the topic was changed to "Christians are just as bad" and by who.



No. I'm not combing the thread. That's YOUR job.  Provide the quotation.


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## Archangel M (Mar 13, 2011)

I don't have any job. I just agreed with Don. Any criticism of Islam based atrocities gets "well what about the Crusades?" style responses. Playing the "I never said that Christians are just as bad" game is BS semantics.


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## Twin Fist (Mar 13, 2011)

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1369250&postcount=5


5 posts in......


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## shesulsa (Mar 13, 2011)

Archangel M said:


> I don't have any job. I just agreed with Don. Any criticism of Islam based atrocities gets "well what about the Crusades?" style responses. Playing the "I never said that Christians are just as bad" game is BS semantics.



Okay.

BIG DON - provide one or more quotations from this site where this is done.

And, Archangel, since you agree so vehemently, you do the same.  If you post that you agree, then you *surely* have an informed and defendable opinion, right?

Right?

Hello?

Oh, and using the point other people use that Islamic terrorism isn't the only terrorism out there is NOT the same, neither logically nor literally, as *condoning terrorism* or anything else.


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## Archangel M (Mar 13, 2011)

Re you reading my posts. My "opinion" is:



> Any criticism of Islam based atrocities gets "well what about the Crusades?" style responses.



Like this one:

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1369324&postcount=20


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## shesulsa (Mar 13, 2011)

Archangel M said:


> Re you reading my posts. My "opinion" is:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



AGAIN ... (lord, this is tiresome)

EVEN BILL MAHER *qualifies* his statement by saying - and I quote - "radicalized Muslims" and it is ACHINGLY CLEAR  he acknowledges that while many Muslims are NOT radicalized, it is the radicalized faction that are an enormous danger.

The position defended on this site by several is that it is the religion of Islam in its entirety that is the threat, that the Q'uran contains things designed to incite its members into horrific acts.

Failing to acknowledge that virtually all sacred writings contain such material is ridiculous.  To blame the entire religion itself and the entirety of its members for being potential terrorists is ignorant and wrong - the intelligent person would acknowledge that this is a potential for anyone with religion, so it has been demonstrated.

Providing historical references to such factualization is not endorsing radicalized Muslims nor terrorism of any kind.

It is reaching, to say the VERY least. And it is imperative for you to know this.


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## Blade96 (Mar 13, 2011)

Twin Fist said:


> http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1369250&postcount=5
> 
> 5 posts in......



That's my post.....and they asked you to provide an example where someone  condoned it. I never. Next please.


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## Twin Fist (Mar 13, 2011)

you DID try and divert away from muslim atrocities by saying falsely i might add, "christians do it too" without addressing or condeming the modern muslim crimes.

pretty much exactly what we are talking about.

you are free to disagree


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## Ken Morgan (Mar 13, 2011)

Definition of a religious war? Fighting over who has the best imaginary friend.

Please continue.
opcorn:


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## Blade96 (Mar 13, 2011)

Twin Fist said:


> you DID try and divert away from muslim atrocities by saying falsely i might add, "christians do it too" without addressing or condeming the modern muslim crimes.
> 
> pretty much exactly what we are talking about.
> 
> you are free to disagree



yeah i did say that cause all religions have their wingnuts.

I was suppsed to say 'Yeah it sucked what they did'? I thought that was a given. I thought everyone here knows me well enough to know of course i think it sucks. That's why i only left it at that, what i said in the post.


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## Twin Fist (Mar 13, 2011)

well, for one thing, they are worse, by any measurable stat, IMO

and B: ok, i didnt know you felt that way, cuz it wasnt said. thats all.


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## Blade96 (Mar 13, 2011)

Twin Fist said:


> well, for one thing, they are worse, by any measurable stat, IMO
> 
> and B: ok, i didnt know you felt that way, cuz it wasnt said. thats all.



All righty then.  I think we's good now.


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## billc (Mar 13, 2011)

I like it when people can talk about stuff and not go nuts.  It makes it more fun.  It's like mom and dad aren't fighting anymore.


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## jks9199 (Mar 13, 2011)

Thread locked pending staff review.

jks9199
Super Moderator


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