# Datu confusion



## CanNinja (Feb 19, 2002)

Hello All

     Well there sure seems to be a lot of confusion and Ego here in regards to who has what rank or title in regards to the Datu's.
And everyone has an opinion, some educated, some not all we can do is take what we read with a grain of salt and process it our own way.

As far as someone being active.. hmmmm well the fact that they don' participate in a certain groups own system, not modern arnis but certain federations created from this, that in no way means someone is not active. For instance: Would you say if someone has touched literally thousands of individuals and has spread the word of modern arnis, and has been an ambassidor to the art for years and years. That along with radio shows, tv, videos, training the US military, knife designs, impact weapon designs and more.

The idea that you would not be able to train with a person like this is really your own limitations or your own beliefs, as if you haven't figured it out by now I am talking about Datu Kelly Worden, he is active and teaching currently in Tacoma wash. you can contact him easily via his website: www.kellyworden.com 
his summer camp is held every year 20 mins from tacoma. As well Datu worden has numerous seminars throughout the year. 

I personally have been bringing Datu worden into Calgary Canada for over 6 years now and currently he is scheduled to be in Regina sask. in March, calgary in April, then I am hosting a summer camp west of Caglary the first weekend in August, then he will be in Edmonton around Oct. along with more canadian dates to follow. If you can't hit any of the Canadian locations Datu worden also has many seminars within the states.

So if everyone is wondering about his activeness, come check out a seminar and find out just how active he is 

One of my teachers, Jay Creasey is labelled as a Renegade Ninjutsu instructor by the Bujinkan, but he still has a very close realtionship with Hatsumi Sensi whom I have personally trained with as well, and anyone who breaks from a system and brings their own personality into the mix and is not just a drone can expect the same, but they are also on the edge and living every day!!

Take a chance, find out for yourselfs, don't fall into the bull sh*t trap of gossip.. find your own answers and keep true to yourself!!

Cheers, 

Train hard and stay true!

Rod Coulter


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## CanNinja (Feb 19, 2002)

Also one last thing regarding Datu Wordens' summer camp, this camp is open to all styles, ranks and systems.

Cheers,

Rod Coulter


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## Tapps (Feb 28, 2002)

> _Originally posted by CanNinja _
> *As far as someone being active.. hmmmm well the fact that they don' participate in a certain groups own system, not modern arnis but certain federations created from this, that in no way means someone is not active. *
> 
> 
> ...


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## no fefe (Feb 28, 2002)

Originally posted by Tapps:


> I think the definition of "active" is difficult now.



Sooo is this your definition?

Orginally posted by Tapps:


> If you were somehow training with Remy ... you were active in Modern Arnis. If you were not ... you were not.



So even you even you are out promoting Modern Arnis you still are not active??


Robert Koenig


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## Tapps (Mar 1, 2002)

Remy Presas WAS Modern Arnis. He WAS the IMAF.  He was the sun and everyone else was a planet, a moon, a comet or bit of debree revolving around him.

If you didn't train with Remy, in some fashion, you weren't active.You were not promoting Modern Arnis if you weren't with Remy ... in some fashion. When the art IS the MAN how can you promote the art and be estranged from the man?

Now a lot of this is subjective ... Granted. Some peple could see Remy more often than others depending on thier personal situation in life. But there are a few facts that are concrete.

Remy didn't promote anyone who didn't support him. In the last years of his teaching he began putting expiration dates on his rank certificates, I think because he had been hurt by some of his students who did the old "Learn and Burn"

My instructor used to advise me,"if you plan on testing, make sure you see Remt. The old dog watches everything and that's the best way to let him see what you can do."  My experience was that this was sage advice.

I agree that anyone interested in learning Modern Arnis should have an open mind and see what's out there. Different instructors bring different things to the table.

I've crossed sticks with Hartman and most of the MOTTS. I haven't trained with any of the Presas family but I look forward to the opportunity. I've never met Datu worden but I've read a lot of his stuff over the last eight years. I got the distinct impression until recently that he was training JKD. Very similar in a lot of aspects but not Modern Arnis.

I have no problem with any of Professors students teaching the art and honoring his memory. I have a problem IF people are using that memory for self promotion.

There will always be ONE Grandmaster of Modern Arnis ! Everyone else is just floating around.

:soapbox:  :soapbox: :soapbox:


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## Rich Parsons (Mar 1, 2002)

Quoted from above:
_______________________________________________
If you didn't train with Remy, in some fashion, you weren't active.You were not promoting Modern Arnis if you weren't with Remy ... in some fashion. When the art IS the MAN how can you promote the art and be estranged from the man?

Rich:
Ok, if you brought GM Remy Presas into your club
for training and testing, does this count, even
though many of the MOTTs may remember seeing you
but not ever seeing you train with the Professeur?
Just a question - not a slam - so please excuse
the tone of my typing ;~).

Quoted from above:
_________________________________________________
Remy didn't promote anyone who didn't support him. In the last years of his teaching he began putting expiration dates on his rank certificates, I think because he had been hurt by some of his students who did the old "Learn and Burn"

Rich:
What if your certificate(s) was/were recent, i.e. 
last five to seven years and no expiration date
is on the form? Yet is one of Remy's forms and
signed by him?

Quoted From Above:
________________________________________________
My instructor used to advise me,"if you plan on testing, make sure you see Remt. The old dog watches everything and that's the best way to let him see what you can do."  My experience was that this was sage advice.

Rich:
I would have to agree the GM Presas did see 
everything.


Just some randon questions popping into my head.
Thanks
Rich


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## Tapps (Mar 2, 2002)

If you brought Remy into your club then you were seeing the man in action.

To me that says you were supporting him and the art.  
You were also providing a vehicle for others to discover the art
... very important.

Most seminar hosts don't spend much time on the floor during thier seminars. 
They have business to take care of.  From what I've seen, 
if you brought Remy in for a seminar he always took care of you. 
A little training on the side.

I don't mean to discount that. If people didn't host seminars, 
I wouldn't have had the chance to go on the road and see him.

*What if your certificate(s) was/were recent, i.e. 
last five to seven years and no expiration date 
is on the form? Yet is one of Remy's forms and 
signed by him?* 

I am by no means claiming to be the expert on this topic
 but I can relay a story that happened to a friend of mine:

We were at Michigan State summer camp. 
He had a certificate that was expired (by a matter of days) 
The camp host told him he could not test. 
Professor corrected the host. His intention with the expiration dates 
was not to exclude anyone but to make sure people didn't 
dissappear forever. 
This had happened to him in the past and my impression 
was that it troubled him deeply.

:soapbox: 

Personally I don't recognize anyones authority to revoke anything 
from you now that Professor has passed. 
If you know you supported Professor to the best of you ability 
while he was with us you don't need to take S*** from anyone. 
(Including me and my tangents). 
You need only answer to your conscience.

I miss the old man a lot and 
I have little patients for polotics and power plays. 
I'm a member of the WMAA and I enjoy it. 
It works for me. I don't begrudge anyone affiliation with 
another organization or training on your own. 
At this point ... it's whatever meets your needs.

I do get surly when I think people are disrespecting 
the memory of the Professor by pumping themselves up.
 I don't apologise for that.  
If I do get carried away and offend someone who doesn't deserve it ... 
for that I'm sorry. 
No offense meant to you Rich.

:wavey: :wavey:


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