# Revitalized!



## MikeBielat (Aug 12, 2014)

I have been a practitioner of Isshin-Ryu Karate Do for well over half my life. I have been constantly trying to maximize my stances to give me the most out of my punches and kicks but everything up until this point has all be "hard" techniques... Punching HARDER. Kicking HARDER. You get the point.

Daily aches and pains from going too hard (or getting hit by something hard). It is always force against force...

Something was missing. There was no balance. 

It was then that I discovered Tai Chi. Maybe I'm getting older, and hopefully wiser, but I cannot believe why I didn't pursue it sooner.  I recently got a new job so I cannot make it to class as much as I used to. My wife got me this Workout DVD involving Tai Cheng and I cannot believe how much of a difference it has made in both my mind and body...

My joints hurt less from all these years of abuse and it's given me so much more energy... It's my coffee in the morning and my chill in the evening. Let me know if you have any questions about it and I'll be more than happy to answer any questions. PM me or get in touch with me.


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## Buka (Aug 12, 2014)

It is the most widely practiced Martial Art in the world. That should be of interest, especially to guys like us. I worked in it for a year, back when. Then the instructor moved far away. I know I am eventually going to go back to it.

It's probably where we're all going to end up, anyway. What a great thing.


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## Transk53 (Aug 13, 2014)

Got a DVD myself, although I have yet to sign up to a course for it. So far for me I have a little bit of improvement in my balance.


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## tshadowchaser (Aug 13, 2014)

Mike,   happy to hear you have found something that is helping you feel better and has given you a new outlook on the arts.

I am also one who did the hard arts for many years (still do ) but started learning the internal arts a few years back and enjoy them immensely


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 13, 2014)

MikeBielat

I have been training Taijiquan (Yang style) for over 20 years with some Chen on the side (for considerable less time). I have looked at the Tai Cheng and I have wondered what they are about, I likely will not be buying the DVDs anytime soon but I am interested in hearing what you think about them and what they have done for you. Also are there any applications trained or is Tai Cheng specifically for health purposes?


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## MikeBielat (Aug 13, 2014)

Thanks everyone for your replies.

Xue, the DVD's are a bit pricy... (3 payments of $39.95) but it comes with a 90 day money back guarantee, like workout program does these days...

I noticed first and foremost that the nutrition guide is delicious and allowed me to drop around 22 lbs in a 1.5 months. I'm only half way through the program but it is awesome. I normally don't do "workout dvd's" like P90X or Insanity but this one was interesting to me because of the fact that it dealt with martial arts...

The DVD covers the 18 essential tai-chi moves through the 90 days. Like I said, I am halfway there. I did notice that it is positively affecting my Isshin-ryu training as well. I have more circular self-defense patterns now and it's taking on an Aikido-esque form... I take the movement and redirect it.... 

Strength is about the same... Its the weightloss and energy that I feel are really helping me. Totally helps me unwind from a stressful day at work as well. 

PM me if you have any specific questions or to see if it may be right for you.
Take care.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 13, 2014)

MikeBielat

Thanks, I am happy to hear it is working for you. If I have any other questions I will send you a PM


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## zzj (Aug 14, 2014)

I took a peek at the site, seems like it's firmly in the 'Tai Chi for health' category, and probably based on the Yang Style. The intro vid doesn't offer much in the way of differentiating this 'Tai Cheng' system from any other health orientated, low impact tai chi exercise regime. Also, as a martial artist, wouldn't you be more interested in the actual martial art of tai chi (any style) rather than learning the empty derivative of the art? I still believe that learning tai chi as the martial art it was intended to be would be significantly more beneficial to one's overall development.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 14, 2014)

zzj said:


> I took a peek at the site, seems like it's firmly in the 'Tai Chi for health' category, and probably based on the Yang Style. The intro vid doesn't offer much in the way of differentiating this 'Tai Cheng' system from any other health orientated, low impact tai chi exercise regime. Also, as a martial artist, wouldn't you be more interested in the actual martial art of tai chi (any style) rather than learning the empty derivative of the art? I still believe that learning tai chi as the martial art it was intended to be would be significantly more beneficial to one's overall development.



If this was for mike, I cannot answer for him. But since it came after my post I assume it is for me so....I have been training Yang taijiquan with the martial arts intact for over 20 years. I also trained Chen with the martial arts intact as well, just not as long as Yang. Not really interested in Tai Chang for myself, O am mostly curious as to what it is beyond what I have seen on the website. I am wondering what the diet is like.


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## MikeBielat (Aug 14, 2014)

zzj said:


> I took a peek at the site, seems like it's firmly in the 'Tai Chi for health' category, and probably based on the Yang Style. The intro vid doesn't offer much in the way of differentiating this 'Tai Cheng' system from any other health orientated, low impact tai chi exercise regime. Also, as a martial artist, wouldn't you be more interested in the actual martial art of tai chi (any style) rather than learning the empty derivative of the art? I still believe that learning tai chi as the martial art it was intended to be would be significantly more beneficial to one's overall development.



Great question...

It's definitely a Western approach to tai chi so they have a more "scientisty" approach to things. Tai chi is hundreds of years old and they didn't know what we know today. So this program optimizes things and maximizes the effects of your movements. _I would love to actually take tai chi but classes in my area are few and far between_. The ones around (by around I mean 20-30 minute drives to and from) charge $80-130 a month and the classes aren't every day. I have my day job, my photo business, three kids and I help teach at my karate school so it's safe to say I don't have all the time in the world to take an 2 hours to take an additional class. 

My wife got started with that whole BeachBody thing. She got me started on the 21 Day Fix with her. She cooks so I fell into the clean eating, lean meats, fruits and veggies because that is what she made for us... She did the Shakeology thing too... I kept stealing it from her  I worked out with her in the mornings and then got hooked myself. I seen the other programs the site offered and gave this one a try because it seemed to fit in with what I was lacking in my life (as I mentioned above).

Like I said, I have three children and want to lead by example. If I am always on my computer working and snacking then what kind of role model am I? Nothing was cooler then when my wife and I were working out and we looked behind us to see my 3 and 5 year olds replicating the moves and working out with us... 

PM me if you have any questions about the shakes and programs that are out there. I will be more than happy to fill you in on things some more...


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## zzj (Aug 14, 2014)

Xue Sheng said:


> If this was for mike, I cannot answer for him. But since it came after my post I assume it is for me so....I have been training Yang taijiquan with the martial arts intact for over 20 years. I also trained Chen with the martial arts intact as well, just not as long as Yang. Not really interested in Tai Chang for myself, O am mostly curious as to what it is beyond what I have seen on the website. I am wondering what the diet is like.



The question was for mike, sorry for the confusion. You're very prominent in MT esp in the general and CMA forums so even newbies like me know roughly what you have trained in.


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## blindsage (Aug 15, 2014)

MikeBielat said:


> It's definitely a Western approach to tai chi so they have a more "scientisty" approach to things. Tai chi is hundreds of years old and they didn't know what we know today. So this program optimizes things and maximizes the effects of your movements.


If it significantly changes the movements, it isn't maximizing the effects of your movements, it's misunderstanding Taiji in the first place.  Taiji movements aren't intended for exercise.  The health benefits are a side effect.  Taiji is a martial art and it's movements are not "maximized" or performed even remotely correctly if they aren't taught with the martial applications in mind.  They may not have known what we now about exercise science hundreds of years ago, but they new their body mechanics and they were and still are extremely effective.  Taiji for health is basically just going through the movements.  Yes, there are health benefits, and yes, if that's the only way you're doing the movements, sure those movements could be maximized as just exercise.  But if you want the full benefits that were noticed through traditional practice, then you need to learn the methods of proper Taijiquan and how those movements are already 'maximized'.  Trying to make them more excercisy doesn't maximize them, it actually changes the methods and practice to something completely different.  Hence, the likely use of the name Tai Cheng.


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## MikeBielat (Aug 15, 2014)

blindsage said:


> If it significantly changes the movements, it isn't maximizing the effects of your movements, it's misunderstanding Taiji in the first place.  Taiji movements aren't intended for exercise.  The health benefits are a side effect.  Taiji is a martial art and it's movements are not "maximized" or performed even remotely correctly if they aren't taught with the martial applications in mind.  They may not have known what we now about exercise science hundreds of years ago, but they new their body mechanics and they were and still are extremely effective.  Taiji for health is basically just going through the movements.  Yes, there are health benefits, and yes, if that's the only way you're doing the movements, sure those movements could be maximized as just exercise.  But if you want the full benefits that were noticed through traditional practice, then you need to learn the methods of proper Taijiquan and how those movements are already 'maximized'.  Trying to make them more excercisy doesn't maximize them, it actually changes the methods and practice to something completely different.  Hence, the likely use of the name Tai Cheng.



I have never trained in taiji so I am not sure if any movements have changed any... It's not tai chi it's tai cheng like you mentioned. They explain the program best: "Dr. Cheng has simplified the effectiveness of thousands of years of of  practice into a platform of exercises that gives you stability,  strength, and safety.  It will calm your mind and prime your body to get  into the grove of training. Using Dynamic motion control, his special  teaching method,  Dr. Cheng will help you understand the 18 movements of  Tai Chi by helping you develop fluency of movement without being  overwhelmed by thousands of moves."

Everything I said was assumption based on the description of the program... It's not taiji but it sure gave me much more respect for the art...


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## TaiChiTJ (Aug 15, 2014)

Mike it sounds like you are having a good time with it and its hard for even long time tai chi chuan traditionalists to be totally negative to your positivity. 

Please let us know how your training in this continues, and a little more enlightenment about his "Dynamic Motion Control" would be interesting. I am glad its helping out with your harder art.


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## MikeBielat (Aug 15, 2014)

Thanks TJ. It's no problem, I'm a forum veteran and have seen it all


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## blindsage (Aug 16, 2014)

MikeBielat said:


> Everything I said was assumption based on the description of the program... It's not taiji but it sure gave me much more respect for the art...



This is an excellent response to my post.  As TaiChiTJ said, keep up the good vibes.


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## East Winds (Aug 17, 2014)

Sorry, I'm with Blindsage all the way on this one!!!

Best wishes

Alistair


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 17, 2014)

Gentlemen

Basically if it works at helping people feel better I have no problem with it.

Do I think it is taiji? No I don't, it may be based on taiji but it is not taiji. But then the reality it he does not call it taiji, he calls it Tai Cheng. To be honest I have more issue with "Combat tai chi", "3 minute Tai Chi:" and "Tai Chi Easy"

Now what does interest me is this



> Dr. Mark Cheng, a martial arts master with more than 20 years of experience teaching Tai Chi.



That is claiming background, or possibly a lineage, in Taijiquan and that is what I want to know before any judgment is passed by me. Where did he learn taiji and who did he learn it from? That is what I want to know


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## TaiChiTJ (Aug 19, 2014)

I found this:

*Who do you look to for wisdom and growth? 
*As far as martial arts masters with whom I have personal student, disciple, or family relationships with, that would be primarily Master David C.K. Lin & Sifu James Lin in Combat Shuai-Chiao, Grandmaster Arthur Y.S. Lee & Sifu Harlan Lee in Sil Lum Fut Ga, Magulang na Guro Dan Inosanto in Jeet Kune Do & Filipino Kali, Shihan Tsutomu Ohshima & Sensei Tom Muzila in Shotokan Karate, Dr. Joo Bang Lee & Grandmaster Taejoon Lee in Hwa Rang Do, Prof. Roy Harris in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu & Kalis Ilustrisimo, Prof. Thomas J. Desch-Obi in Capoeira Angola, and Col. Nattapong Buayam in Thai martial arts. 

So it would be Ch'ang Tung Sheng, the Shuai-Chiao master who adapted the 24 posture tai chi form to shuai chiao. I think he adapted the long form too.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Aug 20, 2014)

TaiChiTJ said:


> So it would be Ch'ang Tung Sheng, the Shuai-Chiao master who adapted the 24 posture tai chi form to shuai chiao. I think he adapted the long form too.


Just to be clear. GM Ch'ang Tung Sheng only taught 108 moves long Taiji form. Some of his students and his student's students had condensed that 108 moves long form into 

- 48 moves,
- 36 moves, or even
- 24 moves short form.

In Ch'ang style of Taiji, the number of moves in the form is not important since there are many redundant moves in 

- part 1 (20 moves),
- part 2 (30 moves), and 
- part 3 (58 moves),

 of the long form.

Mark Cheng had officially received the 3rd degree combat Shuai Chiao black belt (the teaching certificate) from ACSCA (American Combat Shuai Chiao Association) several years ago. He is a well qualified teacher for both "combat" and "health" since his 2nd degree black belt qualification did require official tournament record.

In the following clip he acted as David C. K. Lin's demo partner.


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## Rave_NY (Aug 24, 2014)

Tai cheng is where I started as well, and then I got a teacher. It's Tai Chi as much as Beach Body version of Tai Chi with Physical Therapy aspects involved could be. It's based off the Yang style, and it uses the moves martial application as a demonstration for better understanding. From my little understanding of the art, I don't see how this can be labeled anything other than Tai Chi. I never got all the way through the DVD, as I take actual classes now.


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