# Help kicking with ball of foot..how ?



## jwU (May 3, 2008)

I have been trying to do kicks in front of me to the solaplex area using the ball of the foot.


99% of the time im just scuffing my whole foot up the target as opposed to going into and thru the target.

I was told maybe to try and curl my toes back..but i dont know if it's just me or evryone but when I curl my toes back and tryto kick the heel of my foot comes forward and then I just end up scuffing the target area.

I tried and tried to adjust the angle of my foot but it always seems to end up vertical instead of on an angle so the ball is triking

eg . it always on this angle  l    instead of this angle /.

Im not the most flexible or co ordinated person bu this is frustratign me ...any help /tips are welcome..

thanks


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## MJS (May 3, 2008)

jwU said:


> I have been trying to do kicks in front of me to the solaplex area using the ball of the foot.
> 
> 
> 99% of the time im just scuffing my whole foot up the target as opposed to going into and thru the target.
> ...


 
Sounds to me like you're not chambering your leg, but instead just dead lifting it.  Some suggestions:  Work your kicks for proper form first, then worry about speed.  Break them down into 4 parts...1) chamber, 2) extending the kick, 3) re-chamber, and 4) planting your foot back down.  

If you stand naturally, and raise onto the ball of your foot, that is how your foot should look when you're kicking.  You're curling your toes back so you can hit with the ball of your foot.


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## ackks10 (May 3, 2008)

i don't now how long you have been training, but it really don't matter,because on the street you will have shoes on(you do wear them)
anyway when you use the front kick just do what Mike said and (chamber)
and them throw it,you will hit the person will the toe of the shoe,it would be much better if you had steel toe shoes:boing2:


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## hapkenkido (May 3, 2008)

MJS said:


> Sounds to me like you're not chambering your leg, but instead just dead lifting it. Some suggestions: Work your kicks for proper form first, then worry about speed. Break them down into 4 parts...1) chamber, 2) extending the kick, 3) re-chamber, and 4) planting your foot back down.
> 
> If you stand naturally, and raise onto the ball of your foot, that is how your foot should look when you're kicking. You're curling your toes back so you can hit with the ball of your foot.


 
i agree 100% do not dead lift your leg, bring the knee up to chamber when you kick pull the toes back but point the foot (the quote is the best way i can think of to discribe your foot) . it will come in time just slow it down and work the mechanics of the kick.


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## FieldDiscipline (May 4, 2008)

I agree with MJS.  Unfortunately it _does _matter, shoes or not, because the power is going in an upward curve rather than into the target.  

As MJS said, get your knee up, and concentrate on projecting your foot *forwards*, into the target.


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## ackks10 (May 4, 2008)

FieldDiscipline said:


> I agree with MJS.  Unfortunately it _does _matter, shoes or not, because the power is going in an upward curve rather than into the target.
> 
> As MJS said, get your knee up, and concentrate on projecting your foot *forwards*, into the target.




sorry about this, but i have to disagree, :lookie: because i have screen alot of people get hurt when they try to do a front kick with the ball of the foot
(and i know that how you learn, i know i did) but remember and i said this before, kenpo is tailored to each person, so as the years go by you learn of others way to teach things (this is not changing anything that parker did)
so i show them how to do it, and when they can't do it that way , i tell them "go put your shoes on " and then i tell them to do it again, and you know what?? it works, but thats just me, because thats what they will be 
wearing on the street.:asian:

ps i agree with Mike and what he said, it was the other, (no disrespect meant)


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## hapkenkido (May 4, 2008)

i think sometimes people don't kick with the ball of the foot is a metal thing. they don't want to hurt their toes. so when they put on the shoes it provides protection for the toes and it gets rid of the thought that it will hurt. i like to train bare foot, but from time to time i will wear shoes to train in because i will have them on if i need to defend myself. and you have to kick just alittle bit differently with them on.


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## ackks10 (May 4, 2008)

hapkenkido said:


> i think sometimes people don't kick with the ball of the foot is a metal thing. they don't want to hurt their toes. so when they put on the shoes it provides protection for the toes and it gets rid of the thought that it will hurt. i like to train bare foot, but from time to time i will wear shoes to train in because i will have them on if i need to defend myself. and you have to kick just alittle bit differently with them on.





i remember that i had a student (he was about 60) that when he tried to do a front kick (front ball kick) he got a cramp in his toes and he got mad, and said there has to be a better way,and you know what ,he's right, so  now you do what you have to do.:wink:  btw i also train without shoes.


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## Kacey (May 4, 2008)

In addition to what Mike said, here's an idea for you:  while kicking in the fashion Mike described, use a ping-pong ball as your target.  Attach a string to it (from experience, I'll say you should use tape - otherwise you'll have to use a very long needle and thread) and hang it from the ceiling at the height you want to kick.  Ping-pong balls are very light, and you can get a lot of feedback from them.  If the ball goes in a straight line (constrained by the string to be an arc) then you've hit with the bottom of your foot; if it goes up, the top of your foot; if it goes wildly astray, the tips if your toes; if your foot is arcing up, so will the ball, much more than if you hit it straight.  You can get tactile feedback based on how it feels when you hit it; it won't hurt in the slightest, but you'll be able to feel where you hit it.

Once you can hit the ping-pong ball consistently on the the string, start bouncing one on a hard surface floor and kick it - even more than with the string, you'll get a lot of feedback about which way your kick is moving by which direction the ball goes when you kick it.  A few warnings:  don't do this around breakable objects; the ball will go _everywhere_.  That includes under furniture and raised heating units (I've had to pull a few out of wall-mounted heaters in the past) as well as out open windows.  About 10 feet from a flat wall is a great location; if you kick it straight, it will come straight back at you.  

Good luck!


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## Doc (May 4, 2008)

jwU said:


> I have been trying to do kicks in front of me to the solaplex area using the ball of the foot.
> 
> 
> 99% of the time im just scuffing my whole foot up the target as opposed to going into and thru the target.
> ...



Do you not have an in-person teacher? If so, consult the teacher for help with your concerns. If not, there isn't much verbiage here that will help you be effective. What you speak of is "basics." You can't teach basics to an inexperienced beginner over the internet, or through video. Sorry.


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## marlon (May 4, 2008)

talk to your teacher...no question is stupid.  Practice slow, practice getting right...speed can come later, the mechanics is what gives power.  Also stand on your tippee toes and that is the angle.

respectfully,
Marlon


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## Sukerkin (May 4, 2008)

Doc said:


> Do you not have an in-person teacher? If so, consult the teacher for help with your concerns. If not, there isn't much verbiage here that will help you be effective. What you speak of is "basics." You can't teach basics to an inexperienced beginner over the internet, or through video. Sorry.


 
A most important point to make.  If you don't have a tutor then your chances of learning a martial art with any accuracy diminish greatly.


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## MJS (May 5, 2008)

ackks10 said:


> sorry about this, but i have to disagree, :lookie: because i have screen alot of people get hurt when they try to do a front kick with the ball of the foot
> (and i know that how you learn, i know i did) but remember and i said this before, kenpo is tailored to each person, so as the years go by you learn of others way to teach things (this is not changing anything that parker did)
> so i show them how to do it, and when they can't do it that way , i tell them "go put your shoes on " and then i tell them to do it again, and you know what?? it works, but thats just me, because thats what they will be
> wearing on the street.:asian:
> ...


 
Hey George,

Just to follow up on this post a bit.  Yes, there have been times, especially during sparring, if I didn't have shoes on, when I'd throw a front ball kick, and I didn't extend as much, therefore, jamming my toes.  Appeared that it was almost slightly rising.  Mistake on my part.  

I'm thinking more of a push kick would be applicable in this instance.  What changes, etc did you make for this student you're talking about?

Mike


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## FieldDiscipline (May 5, 2008)

ackks10 said:


> (no disrespect meant)



None taken, or implyed by me either .  I dont disagree with the shoes protecting the toes bit, I also agree that thats what you'd have in the street.  I disagree with saying that the power going in an upward curve doesnt matter.  You're not going to be transmitting all the power to the target, its why lots of people bounce off boards.


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## Baphomet (May 5, 2008)

Doc said:


> Do you not have an in-person teacher? If so, consult the teacher for help with your concerns. If not, there isn't much verbiage here that will help you be effective. What you speak of is "basics." You can't teach basics to an inexperienced beginner over the internet, or through video. Sorry.


 
Unfortunately, Doc's comment is very accurate.  While you can think of thousands of ways to practice a technique to make it stronger, nothing will help you until you grasp the most basic part of the technique.  Being able to throw an accurate kick is great, but it doesn't really help you if your mechanics within that technique are horrible.  No disrespect is intended by my above comments, but I strongly suggest that you find an in-person teacher.


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## Bodhisattva (May 5, 2008)

jwU said:


> I have been trying to do kicks in front of me to the solaplex area using the ball of the foot.
> 
> 
> 99% of the time im just scuffing my whole foot up the target as opposed to going into and thru the target.
> ...


 
I'd use my heel, personally.


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## jwU (May 5, 2008)

thanks all for your tips...a bit of experimentation has helped...

I think the ball of the foot kicks may just be one of those things I will always struggle with.

The joints in my toes , feet and ankles are rather seized so their isnt much flex/movemnt in them so getting toes to curl back is near impossible.

Rising onto the balls of my feet from a standing position also is close to impossible...my heel comes up just a bit over an inch off the ground .

I have had someone recomend toe flexion and stretching so will  try that....


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## Josh Oakley (May 6, 2008)

I think what's going to help you most, like others have said, is to find a good instructor. Rather than try and fumble through this on your own, you'll have someone who can help you grow in the martial arts a lot faster, and you won't unknowingly delop bad habits.


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