# Choi Kwang-Do



## celtic bhoy (Nov 3, 2002)

Has any Taekwon-Doists seen or tried Choi Kwang-Do. Whats the difference? No flame wars just opinions will do.

Best Regards


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## arnisador (Nov 3, 2002)

I've never heard of this! What is it--a substyle?


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## Langdow (Nov 3, 2002)

Actually it's a creation based on TKD from a master(?) who left his organization for some reason.
I've read some about this, and there's alot of controversy surrounding this. Legal and otherwise from what I remember. I'll try looking it up again to find out what other background there is before I say anything else. Don't want to stick my foot in my mouth


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## KennethKu (Nov 4, 2002)

CKD site:

http://www.choikwangdo.com/default.asp

Controversy:

http://ksdi.net/resign.htm

Other discussion  re: CKD
http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=48


Based on what I have learn, CKD is a modified version of ITF.
I have no opinion on CKD. Not qualified to comment.


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## TkdWarrior (Nov 5, 2002)

hmm CKD tries to teach Self Defense in "the easy way" which i m still figuring out.. i know a bout CKD much from one user in another forum(Mr Kenneth pointed out MAP already) ..
they try to avoid *sparring* they basically train with Focus Mitts(moving n static??), they try to avoid any contact or any conditioning excerscise caus the GM Choi(not confused with Gen Choi hong hi) got injuries from practicising Conditioning...
so they basically bashing other styles who uses conditioning n sparring(semi contact n full contact) n getting into politics things with other styles.. 
as usual like the other styles they hav to prove themselves...
it would not be called as Modified version of ITF cuase they dont' use ITF Forms or any style from ITF .
it's true that in Army GM choi hav recieved training from Gen Choi hong hi..
-TkdWarrior-


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## Bagatha (Nov 5, 2002)

Appearantly its Martialartists "military" TKD, maybe you should ask him.


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## Marginal (Nov 5, 2002)

Didn't MA'ist mention Chun Do Kwan, and not CKD?


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## MartialArtist (Nov 5, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Bagatha _
> 
> *Appearantly its Martialartists "military" TKD, maybe you should ask him. *


No, but...

It's not so much focused on sport style.  It is a bit softer than TKD in the sense that it can also be used by people with joint problems who don't want "hard" techniques but more fluid ones.


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## TkdWarrior (Nov 6, 2002)

> _Originally posted by MartialArtist _
> *
> It is a bit softer than TKD in the sense that it can also be used by people with joint problems who don't want "hard" techniques but more fluid ones. *


yea but they advertise with very fairly high kicks... that's seems contracdicting with their phylosophy....
yup ppl their go easy in CKD
that wat i hav heard from one of thier instructor
-TkdWarrior-


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## MartinHarvey (Dec 19, 2002)

There seems to be some confusion re CKD and TKD
CM Choi was an ITF master but he developed his own style of MA based on his findings over many years.  He did sustain joint injuries because of the lockout movements involved in TKD and developed a new way of executing technique because of this.

It doesn't have any similarity to TKD as there are no lockout movements in the punches, blocks or kicks.  

Every movement is executed with a follow through movement that ensures the attacking tool is still accelerating when it hits the target, giving a lot more impact energy than a traditional punch or kick.  I am not saying traditional techniques lack power but there is a definate difference.

Free sparring as such does not exist but they do train with focus mitts and kick shields allowing them to develop full power on moving targets.
There is no sporting aspect to the style, which is why you wont see any practitioner in competitions.

The stlye is based on self defence and therefore doesn't emphasise high kicking, but if you are capable of it then why not, as long as you remember that in a self defence situation low kicks are far more effective.  
GM Choi is one of the best kickers I have ever trained with and his flexibility is amazing for someone in his sixties.

I could spend a long time discussing the pro's and con's of the style.  I have practised various martial arts for 26 years and I found CKD to be a practical self defence style that was fun and effective, but I still enjoy TKD as well.

Always bear in mind that you can learn useful technique from all martial arts.  It is easy to slag off what you dont understand.

Regards

Martin
3rd Degree CKD
2nd Degree TKD


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## Cain (Dec 19, 2002)

CKD seems to promote that it is a 'complete' art, it promotes itself as being improved over other 'traditional' styles. On top of it CKDists mention is as an 'art of street fighting' 

But they don't even spar and ignore groundwork 

CKD actually lashes out at other styles for being traditional when they themselves are lower than that, it's not even good at self defence since they completely ignore groundwork as they say 'it's not required' 

Overall it would'nt be so bad if the CKDists admitted that their art was not complete, but it ends up at lasing out at other styles as we find out here - 

http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=548

I recommend reading the whole thing even if ya find it boring after some time 

|Cain|


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## SMAC (Dec 19, 2002)

The question was simply what is CKD about.
Any art is only as good as the person practising it, there is no better or worse, just different.
Personally i have seen black belts in CKD who are very impressive and some that are not so impressive, the same for any style.


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## MartinHarvey (Dec 20, 2002)

I agree with you SMAC.  There is good and bad technique in every style as well as good and bad people.

Yes CKD doesn't do much in the way of groundwork but groundwork also has it's limitations.  What happens on the mat is very different to what happens on the pavement.  What happens if there is more than one attacker?  You cant grapple 3 people at once.

Dont confuse sparring with fighting.  They are very different things

Cheers!

MArtin


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## Marginal (Dec 20, 2002)

Can you fight more than three people at once regardless?


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## MartinHarvey (Dec 20, 2002)

I think I would stand more of a chance against multiple opponents whilst standing rather than being on the floor.  At least you get the chance of using one of them to hinder the others.

Cheers!

Martin


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## Marginal (Dec 20, 2002)

I suppose... I kinda wonder in some cases though. In my TKD class, we run corner drills (one person stands in a corner then tries to escape a ring of "attackers" that have cornered the person in the corner. Attackers can grab or strike etc as they see fit) Most of the time, if the people in the corner just don't flat out run, they're grabbed then mauled.  One guy tried to slip past me, and I pinned him against the wall while another came in and pummeled him. (This is light contact, but it drives the point home.) 

Haven't fared all that well against two people tackling from different angles at the same time etc either. (This is where groundfighting/wrestling'd come in handy IMO. Not something you'd want to do all the time, but something in reserve in case all the stand up fighting fails, which it some times will in all likelyhood...)


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## MartinHarvey (Dec 20, 2002)

Ever thought of throwing one opponent into the others then legging it!

It sounds like a fun drill.   I have trained against multiple opponents and as you cant really hurt people in a dojang your only option is to hit and keep moving and position yourself so that you are only fighting one person at a time.  

It isn't easy but thats life.  In the street you just have to hurt the closest one as quickly as possible and then use him against the others

Cheers!

Martin


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## KennethKu (Dec 20, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Marginal _
> .............Haven't fared all that well against two people tackling from different angles at the same time etc either. (This is where groundfighting/wrestling'd come in handy IMO. Not something you'd want to do all the time, but something in reserve in case all the stand up fighting fails, which it some times will in all likelyhood...)



You mentioned that "..Haven't fared all that well against two people tackling from different angles at the same time ..."  but you think "...This is where groundfighting/wrestling'd come in handy.."  ?      Where is the logic in it?  It would be even worse to go to ground while the other standing attacker use your head for football practice.


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## TkdWarrior (Dec 20, 2002)

Mr. Kenneth is quite rite...going down in street fight(single or multiple) should be avoided... even ur oppnt is single u hav no idea if he hav some freinds/help out there or not...may be they r almost there...who knows...
been in couple of fights(Before MA n After starting) it's stupidiotic ...
in our class we do lots of multiple sparring(but that too isn't close to reality)... from my point of view gooo dirty ,fight dirty, maim the oppnt while dealing in streets...it's much better than to get crippled or be dead...
-TkdWarrior-


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## Marginal (Dec 20, 2002)

> _Originally posted by KennethKu _
> *You mentioned that "..Haven't fared all that well against two people tackling from different angles at the same time ..."  but you think "...This is where groundfighting/wrestling'd come in handy.."  ?      Where is the logic in it?  It would be even worse to go to ground while the other standing attacker use your head for football practice.   *


 In the scenario I mentioned that you're talking about in this quote, two guys tackle you. There isn't one standing around. Both are already on you, and you're going down. In that case IMO, it would be handy to know how to handle yourself on the ground. (Shrug) 

I'm not saying if two guys come at you,  grabbing one then falling onto your back is a good idea, somehow effective etc etc etc.. (Or anything half that retarded.)   

On the other hand, saying "Well, I just won't let them take me down" doesn't really help you if they *do* get you down... That's the logic driving my post. Nothing more, nothing less.


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## KennethKu (Dec 20, 2002)

fair enough

But the prospect is pretty grim,  to be on the ground with multiple attackers on you.  Unlikely that ground fighting technique is going to rescue the day. But that is no reason NOT to learn ground fighting.


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## Marginal (Dec 20, 2002)

Yeah, I'm not arguing that. 

It can be useful in some cases though. The assistant instructor of the TKD club I go to managed to tie up a guy and use him as a shield on the ground to protect himself from the other attackers in his younger days. (He said he'd have been in serious trouble if it wasn't for his really big friend shouting at them and scaring them off though.) Hardly a perfect solution, but it did keep him in one piece...


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