# David German Question (KenpoJoe will know)



## ArmorOfGod (Jan 12, 2009)

I was looking at David German's lineage here: http://www.urbin.net/EWW/MA/KF/famtrees.html





and it has him a few generations down from Ed Parker.  Is that right?  Did he not train directly under Ed Parker?  I remember he opened one of Parker's first franchised schools, so he must have been close to GM Parker.
Also, I saw a better family tree many years back that included the white eyebrow gung fu system (& some others) on the tree.  Could someone point to that or a better tree than the one that I listed above?
The martial arts family I come from can be split in half.  One half comes from GM German and the other half comes from several Gojo Ryu people.  I am trying to build a correct family tree for my school, but need a better David German reference.

AoG

AoG


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## KempoShaun (Jan 12, 2009)

Actually, all the people above him were also people who studied directly under SGM Parker, notice the lines don't denote any on instructor between he and those other people, but is off to the side with links denoting that each of these people has trained directly under SGM Parker, I also believe GM German was a first generation EPAKK BB, but I may be wrong there, but I DO know he helped Mr. Parker in coming up with many of the techniques and kata that are in the EPAKK system.  As stated, Rebelo Sensei will know more!


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## Brother John (Jan 12, 2009)

*Nothing but a matter for formatting. Not enough room to continue the dotted line horizontally, so it's vertical.
ALL of the people along the line down from Mr. Parker are being listed there as Direct students.


simple as that....


Your Brother
John 		*


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## John Bishop (Jan 13, 2009)

Brother John said:


> *Nothing but a matter for formatting. Not enough room to continue the dotted line horizontally, so it's vertical.*
> *ALL of the people along the line down from Mr. Parker are being listed there as Direct students.*
> 
> 
> ...




That's 100% correct.  I am sure of that, since I wrote the Inside Karate article that kenpo tree was taken from.  

The article was: "William KS Chow: the 20th Century's Greatest Martial Arts

Innovator" Jan. 1990 issue.   
It has also been used in various other articles I wrote since then.


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## Brother John (Jan 13, 2009)

John Bishop said:


> That's 100% correct. I am sure of that, since I wrote the Inside Karate article that kenpo tree was taken from.


 
I have a question concerning Mr. Castro sir. 
I have my old copy of the Black Belt mag where people were asked to share their memories of Mr. Parker after his passing. One of the people was GM Castro. In it he said that he was never a 'student of' Mr. Parker but that he did train with some, that Mr. Parker helped him get his school going and also that they went in together on running a major west coast Open Tournament.  But Mr. Castro states to the effect that his only "Kempo" instructor was Prof. Chow. 

WAS Mr. Castro a "Student" of Mr. Parker??
OR....did their paths simply have the same origin and later merge again businesswise???

Thanks for your time.

Your Brother
John


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## Brother John (Jan 13, 2009)

ArmorOfGod said:


> Also, I saw a better family tree many years back that included the white eyebrow gung fu system (& some others) on the tree. Could someone point to that or a better tree than the one that I listed above?


The "Infinite Insights" book #1 that I bought from Mr. Parker (at his seminar) in the late 80's had a Great "Family Tree" in it. Don't know if you can find that online or not. Worth looking for! 

The "White Eyebrow" system is known as "Bak Mei Gung-Fu", and there are several 'strains' of it (pun intended). I've not heard of it being in the Parker lineage, especially as it's MUCH MUCH older than American Kenpo OR Kara-Ho Kempo. Perhaps you mean that Bak Mei is in Mr. German's background. That, I can't answer. You can find out some more on it at this link:
*LINK* 



> The martial arts family I come from can be split in half. One half comes from GM German and the other half comes from several Gojo Ryu people. I am trying to build a correct family tree for my school, but need a better David German reference.


GoJu Ryu, good luck. There's several strains / lineages of that. Hopefully your instructor's instructor kept good records. 

Overall, if you're wanting any information on the late Mr. David German, you can't beat "Kenpo Joe" for the info!!! I suggest e-mailing him or PM'ing him directly. He's a very generous fount of information!!

Your Brother
John


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## John Bishop (Jan 13, 2009)

Brother John said:


> I have a question concerning Mr. Castro sir.
> I have my old copy of the Black Belt mag where people were asked to share their memories of Mr. Parker after his passing. One of the people was GM Castro. In it he said that he was never a 'student of' Mr. Parker but that he did train with some, that Mr. Parker helped him get his school going and also that they went in together on running a major west coast Open Tournament.  But Mr. Castro states to the effect that his only "Kempo" instructor was Prof. Chow.
> 
> WAS Mr. Castro a "Student" of Mr. Parker??
> ...


 

Some quotes of Ralph Castro from the book, "The Masters Speak".


_"I began in 1955, training under Master William Kwai Sun Chow in Hawaii.  I moved to the mainland in 1958 and became pretty good friends with the late Ed Parker.  At that time Mr. Parker was already teaching kenpo.  For 28 years we were affiliated and worked together".  _



_" My good friend Ed Parker helped me with the business side of it.  It was Ed Parker who gave me the black belt, because I didn't know if I'd ever see Prof. Chow again."_




One would think that at one time there had to be a student/teacher relationship for Mr. Parker to give someone their first black belt. 

People who were around at the time told me there was.  Some say there wasn't.  :idunno:


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

John Bishop said:


> Some quotes of Ralph Castro from the book, "The Masters Speak".
> 
> 
> _"I began in 1955, training under Master William Kwai Sun Chow in Hawaii.  I moved to the mainland in 1958 and became pretty good friends with the late Ed Parker.  At that time Mr. Parker was already teaching kenpo.  For 28 years we were affiliated and worked together".  _
> ...


Mr. Parker told me there was, and many of his earlier promotions came From Mr. Parker. I do not know how high, but I also saw a petition from Mr. Castro to be promoted to a high rank submitted by Mr. Castro that was said to be signed by all of his black belts. I don't remember what the rank was even though Mr. Parker mentioned it to me. Mr. Parker showed it to me sitting on his desk, with a look of indifference on his face. Keep in mind this was after they had a business dispute surrounding the paying of the bills in their partnership venture with the original CKC. (California Karate Championships)

Other than the money issues, I don't think there was any problems between the two, and to me the act of submitting the petition says a lot. My own relationship with GM CAstro has always been good, and he was present when I received my 8th, from the organization he co-founded (ATAMA), and praised my performance, along with Tak Kubota. He was always supportive of me and my efforts exclusive of the relationship with Mr. Parker, and I have great respect for him.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I was looking at David German's lineage here: http://www.urbin.net/EWW/MA/KF/famtrees.html
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The line doesn't denote generational breaks, but simply presents Mr. Parker's downline, in no particular order or status.

I am not Joe Rebelo, but I did stay in a Holiday Express before.


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## DavidCC (Jan 13, 2009)

Doc said:


> I am not Joe Rebelo, but I did stay in a Holiday Express before.


 
Funny, I think you will be staying in one again *(when you come to Omaha on 2/21/2009)*

I wonder if sleeping there will grow you a huge moustache?  that would be even funnier on Ryan.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

DavidCC said:


> Funny, I think you will be staying in one again *(when you come to Omaha on 2/21/2009)*
> 
> I wonder if sleeping there will grow you a huge moustache?  that would be even funnier on Ryan.



Nice places. I like them.


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## Twin Fist (Jan 13, 2009)

ATAMA is one of the FEW orgs that give rank that I like and approve of



Doc said:


> the organization he co-founded (ATAMA), and praised my performance, along with Tak Kubota. He was always supportive of me and my efforts exclusive of the relationship with Mr. Parker, and I have great respect for him.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Twin Fist said:


> ATAMA is one of the FEW orgs that give rank that I like and approve of



They were a good organization when I was recruited by GM Castro, and joined right after Mr. Parker died. I was the first Vice President of the Southern California Chapter for five years. I subsequently received two more ranks from them. It is my understanding they no longer confer rank.


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## Doc (Jan 13, 2009)

Brother John said:


> The "Infinite Insights" book #1 that I bought from Mr. Parker (at his seminar) in the late 80's had a Great "Family Tree" in it. Don't know if you can find that online or not. Worth looking for!



There's a "sticky" scan of the original in its entirety on KenpoTalk under the SubLevel Kenpo section.


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## Twin Fist (Jan 13, 2009)

they were good initially, esp for orphans like you were right after SGM Parker passed away, but they were conservative about it



Doc said:


> They were a good organization when I was recruited by GM Castro, and joined right after Mr. Parker died. I was the first Vice President of the Southern California Chapter for five years. I subsequently received two more ranks from them. It is my understanding they no longer confer rank.


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## tai scorpio (Jan 16, 2009)

hi there everybody,   my name is bernard(scorpio)strickland from birmingham,alabama and i would like to say that being a student and teacher of (tai-kenpo karate system) of (sr.g.m. david german) that i have a lot of respect for (sr.g.m.german) and his system.  my master who was a 1st gen. of (sr.g.m.german) his name is (mr bill parks) now decease move just like his master teacher. before i had any video of (master german) i knew by the way my teacher would talk about him so much and when kenpojoe send me (german) video and i took one look i knew that my master parks had study german every move.  the way master parks taught us is the way i teach my student the (tai-way), the last time i spoke to (sr.g.m. german) was about a week before his passing way he had authorize me to be his alabama reps. for his system.  if any one would like to check out the tai-system you can go to (TAI MARTIAL ARTS INTERNATIONAL.COM).   thank you so much     sincerely  bernard(scorpio)strickland    p.s. i would like to thank kenpojoe for all his hard work to keep our flame alive for the tai-system


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## ArmorOfGod (Jan 16, 2009)

Thanks to everyone.  I found the name of Mr. German's gung-fu teacher.  It is located here: http://www.davidgerman.com/About_Master_German.php and says: 



> *At that time Al Thomas' Budokan Academy in nearby El Monte was special to American martial artists as the Mecca of Malibu Beach is to surfers. It was here that he began study with Sifu Leonard Lum of San Francisco via Hong Kong, who taught him the systems of Sil Lum Kung Fu, White Tiger (Bok Fu Pai), White Hair, White Eyebrow (Bok Mei Pai), Chin Na and Chuan Fa. He did find time in those formative years to study with Ed Parker of American Kenpo, earning a black belt and eventually owning two studios with Parker at the age of sixteen.*


 
AoG


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## John Bishop (Jan 16, 2009)

ArmorOfGod said:


> Thanks to everyone.  I found the name of Mr. German's gung-fu teacher.  It is located here: http://www.davidgerman.com/About_Master_German.php and says:
> 
> AoG



Opps, sorry I missed that part of your question, or I would have told you he learned kung fu from his ex-wife's (Romaine Lum) father.  I knew both of them when they lived here in Chino, Ca.

http://www.violetphoenix.org/instructors/mlum.html


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## KENPOJOE (Jan 17, 2009)

John Bishop said:


> That's 100% correct. I am sure of that, since I wrote the Inside Karate article that kenpo tree was taken from.
> 
> The article was: "William KS Chow: the 20th Century's Greatest Martial Arts
> 
> ...


 
Hi folks!
Dear Mr. Bishop,
Thank you for listing Mr. German & the TAI system in your chart. It has been reproduced many times over the years. I have the original article as well. I first heard of Mr. German through the Black Belt articles written in 1981. Also the "Inside Kung Fu" articles written by John Soet in the mid 1980's as well. David German was listed as an honorable mention for Kenpo Instructor of the year in 1983. 
It was Mr. Bishop's chart that contributed to my contacting Mr. German.
BEGOOD,
KENPOJOE


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## KENPOJOE (Jan 17, 2009)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I was looking at David German's lineage here: http://www.urbin.net/EWW/MA/KF/famtrees.html
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hi Folks!
David German studied with several different Sifus over his career. He trained in the White Tiger [Bai Hu/Bok Fu] kung fu system under Wai Fung Doo [as well as the white eyebrow system],I know he had been certified as a fifth Duan [level] master in white tiger by the kuoshu federation [I saw the certificate], He had also trained in Sil Lum [southern Shaolin] and wushu. I'd have to go back to my notes and various video conversations to get the names he mentioned. He did teach me some of the bai hu hand sets.
BEGOOD,
KENPOJOE


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## KENPOJOE (Jan 18, 2009)

Brother John said:


> The "Infinite Insights" book #1 that I bought from Mr. Parker (at his seminar) in the late 80's had a Great "Family Tree" in it. Don't know if you can find that online or not. Worth looking for!
> 
> The "White Eyebrow" system is known as "Bak Mei Gung-Fu", and there are several 'strains' of it (pun intended). I've not heard of it being in the Parker lineage, especially as it's MUCH MUCH older than American Kenpo OR Kara-Ho Kempo. Perhaps you mean that Bak Mei is in Mr. German's background. That, I can't answer. You can find out some more on it at this link:
> *LINK*
> ...


Hi folks!
Dear John,
Thank you for the compliment! 
Regarding the "family tree" from IIIK: There are several mistakes and omissions. I remember Dan Laxson telling me a story where he saw the finished family Tree and Mr. Parker was proudly beaming about it. Dan looked at it and innocently said "My name's spelled wrong.". To which Mr. Parker gave him the famous "Laser Beam" look in response! David German is not on the tree, but that is not because he wasn't a Black Belt under Mr. Parker. Mr. German was a student back at the original studio in Pasadena [around the corner from the present walnut street location], His father, an auto mechanic, used to go to a transmission place on walnet street [which is still there,btw] and young David saw the sign for karate and asked his father if he could take classes. He took private classes in the afternoon w/ Mr. Parker. He and his father help build the Walnut studio, as his dad was good at carpentry. Later, David would ask his father if he could open a karate studio and got 2 franchises for the Las vegas area. James Ibrao,John Mcsweeney,Al Tracy and other first generation black belts have confirmed that over the years.
Wai Fung Doo was his White Tiger/White Eyebrow/White Hair system sifu. Brian Adams [author of "Medical Implication of Karate Blows" ([renamed "Deadly Karate Blows" by unique publications]), Parker Liniken & Jim Lacey [of "iron palm/18 taoist palm" fame] were all students of Doo Wai at that time. They trained and were certified by Doo Wai at that time.
I hope that I was of some service,
KENPOJOE


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## KENPOJOE (Jan 18, 2009)

Doc said:


> The line doesn't denote generational breaks, but simply presents Mr. Parker's downline, in no particular order or status.
> 
> I am not Joe Rebelo, but I did stay in a Holiday Express before.


ROFLMAO!
Hi folks!
I am not Ron Chapel, but I did get a bumper sticker from him once!
I've had my fair share of "interesting experiences" at that establishment!
How does that old Gene Simmons song go? "I'm living in sin at the Holiday Inn"?
Thank you,Doc!
BEGOOD,
KENPOJOE


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## KENPOJOE (Jan 18, 2009)

DavidCC said:


> Funny, I think you will be staying in one again *(when you come to Omaha on 2/21/2009)*
> 
> I wonder if sleeping there will grow you a huge moustache? that would be even funnier on Ryan.


Hi folks!
Gee Dave, Are you making fum of my facial hair?lol!!! Ron and I have both been members of the bushy mustashe club"!
BEGOOD,
KENPOJOE


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## Ray (Jan 18, 2009)

DavidCC said:


> Funny, I think you will be staying in one again *(when you come to Omaha on 2/21/2009)*


Does that mean Mr. Rebelo plans on being in attendance at the upcoming seminar?


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## DavidCC (Jan 19, 2009)

Ray said:


> Does that mean Mr. Rebelo plans on being in attendance at the upcoming seminar?


 
That would be a treat but I haven't heard from him 

I was just speculating that staying at HIE might cause massive facial hair growth.

Any fun I poke at big mustaches is purely driven by the fact that my facial hair genes seems to have come straight down the line from my American Indian ancestors... which is to say, I get very little of it.


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