# Sand vs. Rice?



## Telfer (Dec 5, 2009)

Something Ive read in the past is that sand is not a good choice to fill a striking bag because it gets too densely compacted and hard.

However, I noticed today at the back of Nakayama's classic 'Dynamic Karate' (page 294) that large hanging sand bags were definitely used for both punching and kicking.

So, whats the deal on the traditional way...Rice or Sand???

On a side note, heres a little diagram from a Chinese republican era training manual with a multiple target set-up. Got anything like that at your dojo?

http://i50.tinypic.com/21jqhdc.jpg


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## Big Don (Dec 5, 2009)

Rice tastes a hell of a lot better...


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## still learning (Dec 6, 2009)

Hello, Mixing sand and rice may be the better way to go...

Rice may not stick as much as all sand will...!

Portions will be have to be adjusted for your applications..

Aloha,

...we agree rice at least is eatable...sand....for sandwich...?


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## Telfer (Dec 7, 2009)

still learning said:


> Hello, Mixing sand and rice may be the better way to go...


I think the sand might eventually work its way to the bottom of the bag, no?


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## Carol (Dec 7, 2009)

Interesting question.  I don't think I have ever used a large bag filled with rice, so I can't answer for sure.  

Personally, I wouldn't use rice, or any other organic content that could attract insects or rot when coming in contact with moisture.  

If a softer bag is needed, one can stuffed with rags and scrap cloth...but is a bag of compact sand really an issue for martial training?   I would think that the issues caused with hitting a bag are from misuse or bad technique, rather than the bag's contents.


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## Stuey (Dec 8, 2009)

Many years ago I saw some advice on what to fill your bag with. The advice was to progress on to Iron dust! Where one would get said dust in such an amount is beyond me. Also, what the point in filling a bag up with iron dust is eludes me. I guess the point in a hardened bag is to condition the body to accept such impact shock on the limbs and joints. I dont expect to come across someone that solid though. Perhaps that is my down fall for not expecting the unexpected?!


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## Xue Sheng (Dec 8, 2009)

Big Don said:


> Rice tastes a hell of a lot better...


 
I got to say I agree with Don on this one


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## yak sao (Dec 8, 2009)

The sand can compact to the point that you feel like you're hitting concrete. Rice is OK, but it tends to compact as well. Dried beans work well (cooked beans are too messy)


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## tshadowchaser (Dec 8, 2009)

I always used sand but has been said it tends to compree over time.
I have never used rice  seems like the rice would desolve in to powde after a while.
Beans , no never used them yet, they give me gas


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## Nolerama (Dec 8, 2009)

I always thought that sand at the bottom of the bag is good to weigh it down, but to fill it up completely? I think it's a horrible idea.

If you keep on punching sand full bore, you're going to eventually damage your wrists in a very unnecessary way. Go for longevity. Healthy, trained limbs are much better for survival than mangled, aching ones.

I suggest filling that bag with old rags, and (maybe) add some sand on the bottom to weigh it down.

Rice in a bag?!?!?! That's for eating!


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## geezer (Dec 8, 2009)

First off, you need to specify _what type_ of bag you are talking about. I assumed you meant a flat wall-bag (about the size of a phone book) for striking. But reading all the posts in response, I think a lot of people have something different in mind.

Now as to the filling. At different times I've tried rice, sand and beans. The rice compresses some, but not too bad if you lift and "fluff" the bag every so often. And, yes it breaks down into powder over time. Sand compresses and gets very hard... Which I thought was pretty cool when I was in my twenties. Now that I'm in my fifties, I would say to avoid regularly striking anything really hard! Beans worked best for me. Of course I live in a very dry climate so mold or rot isn't much of a problem.

BTW I know many "iron palm" regimens call for working up to hitting very hard stuff like steel shot. And people swear that with proper, gradual training and the right dit da jow, chi gung and what-have-you, you will not risk injuries or gradual degradation of joints. Well, to be frank, I don't believe it. IMO over a long period of time, that kind of training can have negative consequences.  Others may disagree, but remember, you only have one set of hands.


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## celtic_crippler (Dec 8, 2009)

You ate what?


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## Telfer (Dec 8, 2009)

Carol Kaur said:


> If a softer bag is needed, one can stuffed with rags and scrap cloth.


Ideally I think a hanging bag should be heavy, but not too dense.

Its the density that causes injury to the hands.

Btw Carol...I LOVE your link!


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## Telfer (Dec 8, 2009)

yak sao said:


> The sand can compact to the point that you feel like you're hitting concrete. Rice is OK, but it tends to compact as well. Dried beans work well (cooked beans are too messy)


Mung beans?


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## Nolerama (Dec 8, 2009)

Mung beans? Are you making dinner or punching a bag? Use something that won't rot and ferment and possibly cause you to get sick because you're breathing that nonsense in.


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## mook jong man (Dec 8, 2009)

Hello , its the Donald here , as in Trump.

I've had fantastic results filling mine with crisp $100 bills.

They do give a very satisfying thwack type of sound as you strike the bag.

Now I realise that not everbody can afford to do this , some people might have to use $50s , just do the best with what you have.

If you choose not to follow this advice 

*YOUR FIRED.*


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