# Sikaran



## Black Grass (Jun 4, 2003)

This question really is for tshadow, but anyone who has info can answer.

In your post in the FMA magazine thread you say that Mark Wiley does not have the section on sikaran correct. Could you elaborate?

Also if you know what are the similarities and differences between Lagarejos system of Sikaran and Geronimo method?

Do you have sikaran style tournies in the states ?

Why the use of the term Karate, is it simply because people do not knowwhat Sikaran is or has your method adopted some karate techniques.


thx

Vince
aka Black Grass


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## tshadowchaser (Jun 4, 2003)

Vince,
 I belive you will find some of the answeres to your questions in the two areas below. After reading them Please feel free to ask specific question and I will try to answere them. My knowledge is by far NOT  complet.
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1049

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=786
 Let me say to star that  Mr. Lagarejos starting teaching his system of Sikaran in this country in 1952 and I have seen the article in the 1966 issue of black belt magizine with Mr. Geronimo still in his Issinru uniform when he met with some of the Old Men for the first time.  He was at that time head of the "All Phillipino Karate federation" I belive and did not even Practice Sikaran till after,
I try to stay away from the politics in such a disscussion because it never proves anything. I will disscuss other aspects after you have read my othe rposts if you wish or we can communicate via email if you wish 
Question : Do or have you been fortunate enough to study sikaran in the islands. I would love to here more of the habbits and practice methods there . My only contact with people who studied there has been brief and not to informative
My personal web site is : www.sikaran.net


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## tshadowchaser (Jun 4, 2003)

AS for why it has the term Karate connwected with it. Back in the 50's and early 60"s servicemen comeing back from the orient knew the terms Judo, and karate. Sikaran is not basicly a weapons art it is an art of kicking, much like TKD, and now hand strikes.  People could relate o the term Karate (back then) but to just call it a martial art would not have ment much to most people.
  The 2nd reason I think is because of the hand influence that we use today. we block and strike with our hands much more than the practictioners in the islands do.
 Our tourneys are run by "Karate" rules . Points not last man standing.


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## Black Grass (Jun 5, 2003)

> _Originally posted by tshadowchaser _
> *Question : Do or have you been fortunate enough to study sikaran in the islands. I would love to here more of the habbits and practice methods there . My only contact with people who studied there has been brief and not to informative... *



Sorry Tshadow.

I saw a little sikaran. It lloked like TKD to me with the exception of things such as  the ground to post a balance your weight with your hand.  But had no formal training when I was in the Philippines so i can't elaborate.

Vince
aka Blakc Grass


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## tshadowchaser (Jun 5, 2003)

I belive that mr. Geronimo mixed what he could gather of the old Sikaran kicks and mixed them with his "karate" training and then with his TKD.  I have had a few correspondence with people that told me his forms had a distint hotokan (they thought ) look. I dont know I have never sen them.
  Today I practice forms that the head of the systm learned from his instructor, the names given to these forms are names of the people he studied with. Other forms that we have are verry much what I have been told are also true Sikaran forms with no or little blocking and all feet.  Combone these with th eOakinawan forms my instructor learnes in his first martial art and the Chinese forms that he also learnes from one of his first instructors and a close friend of his (who happened to be a GM ) we now do a varrity of forms. I think we have kept the true Sikaran base while widening our scope of practice by doing all three sets of forms.
  Our hands strike at nerve complexes and muscle junctures. We try not to hurt one another while practiceing but we do go home often with  arms that are in pain or have no feeling for a while.
 I know that most of the people I have talked to think that Sikaran is only a subsystem but I have studied it as a complet system. With kicks and hand techniques that kill or parilise(sp) it looks much like karate to those that know no difference. Placement of strikes and intent of distruction aare practiced in a few Karate and Chinese systems so we are much the same.
 We teach weapons after a person learns their hands and feet. And yes I do use closely the same movements with a close range weapon as I do my hands.
 Vience, I am trying to answere your questons with out knowing exactly what you are loking for . I hope I am makeing some head way at it. Please feel free to go to our parent web site at www.sikaran.com and sign the quest book .If you ask a question there I think that GM Lagarejos will answere personaly.
tshadowchaser
 :asian:


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## Black Grass (Jun 5, 2003)

Tshadow,

Your answers are great. I'm not looking for anything specfic just general info. I'm interested in all FMA. 

Thanks,

Vince


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