# Bad Guys and Bullies:  Children's self defense



## hardheadjarhead (Nov 8, 2003)

I figure there are two issues for children in the martial arts regarding safety...bad guys (sexual predators) and bullies.

What are you folks teaching in each of these areas?  


Steve


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## Zepp (Nov 8, 2003)

I'm not an instructor, but this question brings to mind a few memories from my elementary school days that I thought I'd share.

Predators were a problem I never encountered, but I had to deal with bullies aplenty.  From the ages of 6 to 9 I was taking hapkido.  (Looking back now, I see that the hapkido instruction I had didn't have much grappling training, but that's a separate issue.)  I was a small kid, and I was usually thought of as a nerd, so I guess that made me seem like a good target to some bullies that didn't know better.  I actually started a couple of the scrapes I got into, but we won't go into that here.

When kids who were bigger and older than me wanted to threaten me physically, they tended to get in close.  I remember them trying to pick me up, put me in headlocks, ect.  My typical response was attack them in sensitive areas.  Nose gouging can work wonders.

There were also a few fights I got into with some of my peers (who were also usually stronger, if not bigger).  These tended to be more like boxing matches, with our classmates gathered around watching, but without rules.  My secret weapon here was my nose- tap it too hard and it bled.  When the other kid saw a little bit of blood, they always seemed to think they won for some reason, and they would drop their guard, giving me a chance to rush them.

As far as bullies go, I think the most important thing you can teach young kids is aggresiveness and tenacity.  Of course, the flip side of this is that you have to teach them how to avoid physical conflict, or you risk creating a bully.

For adult predators, I think some of the same things would work, such as being aggressive and attacking sensitive areas.  Obviously, making noise and attracting attention would be good things to teach too.


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## hardheadjarhead (Nov 8, 2003)

Thanks for your observations.

There are different playgrounds, different locations, with kids from different socio-economic backgrounds.

What other kinds of situations are kids up against?  Do kids in Buffalo fight differently than kids in Denver?  

Do kids of different age groups fight differently?  

What role do parents and teachers play in intervention?  How about us as instructors and parents?

What other questions do we need to ask?

SCS


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## tshadowchaser (Nov 8, 2003)

the kids on a playground in a major city (anahiem, NYC, Buffalo,)
will most likely fight in a pack rather than individual combate. I think this is do to the "Gang" mentality that is in larger cities. 
If you are from Backwater,  Froglick, athol, etc. you most likely (as a child) have not been under the influence of major gang and will fight one on one.
Bullies like to pick on the "meek" ther for  i a chil stands up to them and can make them look foolish in the eyes of their friends HE/SHE may have a better chance of not haveing it happen again.
A good poke in the nose or just under it works wonders, just getting out of the way and watching the bully look foolish trying to hit or catch you is also good. A little judo throw realy puts them of guard
Teachers need to care more about teaching and protecting our children then getting more benifits and what for lunch
Teachers need to be able to "see" trouble befor it happens and stop it befor it occures
Teachers need to not be afraid to step in when they need to
Parents need to stop sueing everytiime a teacher says something to an abusive brat
Parents need to listen to their childern and then speak with Teachers, school boards, and police
Oh ya, more parents should put there kids in martial arts schools.


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## loki09789 (Nov 10, 2003)

I taught in a rural school system and student taught in a city school in Bflo, they were both upper grades (7-12) so I can only go on what I was told in ed psych (which boils down to common sense) and what I saw first hand (which really wasn't that much, thank God).

Regardless of how the social cliques are defined, the physical fighting I saw in both places was individual.  Now, the gang mentallity definitely influences who will target who for the fight.  One guy from this group will target a guy from the other...

the other issue was that once you start it up, publicly you feel tons of pressure to finish it, even if you're just as afraid as the person your bullying.  The peer pressure to keep going can be very powerful.

I really don't know if instruction on a physical level should be any different, but maybe the awareness/reporting training might need to be tailored to a school setting.  Even interviewing teachers/principals/school counselors to get the 'administrator's' point of view might come in handy.  It would also go along way to protect you and your program if some whacky parent wanted to sue you because little Jonnie got beat up following your 'anti-bully' procedures.

Paul Martin


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## loki09789 (Nov 10, 2003)

Though I would agree that there are teachers/adults who care more about themselves or suffer from 'burn out', as an individual teacher in a school one of the rules on almost all job descriptions for teachers now is that you will NOT touch a student - period.  

Some schools are more confusing because they say that you can't touch a student unless they pose a serious threat to themselves or someone else... but who is dictating 'serious'.

On the other end, this also means that you can't give a student a pat on the shoulder to show a good job, or a hug if they are really in a bad state (I felt helpless watching a girl falling apart when she found out her mother was taken to emergency for a heart attack).

I would say that the most effective anti-bully/predatory training should go to the adults around children.  

Teach adults how to hold children responsible for their actions, good or bad.  Praise their successes and correct their bad choices.  An adult's goal for correction should not be to 'teach the child a lesson', but to retrain the child in the right way.  Both are uncomfortable to the child, we don't need to make it worse by enjoying it.

Budget enough money to make it reasonable to establish a safe, consistent environment - at least at school - so that teacher's and other staff can be trained to recognize problems and be proactive.  This also means that they need to be backed up from the parent/tax payer at the top all the way down to the principal in the building when they report or take action (as long as it is appropriate)

Sorry for the rant, just a chance to vent some professional frustration.

Paul Martin


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## hardheadjarhead (Nov 10, 2003)

I recall that when I was a kid nobody...NOBODY...taught us the consequences of fighting when we were eventually adults.  

I think that's one of the reasons we still see adults getting into fights because somebody cut them off in a parking lot...then when the cops arrive we hear one of them say "He started it!"  Its just like they were back in the sixth grade.  Many don't truly understand the dynamics of the law and the consequences of their actions.  

Peer pressure, as has been mentioned, is a big problem.  For fear of being branded a coward, many boys won't back down from a fight.  Testosterone can be an awful thing.


SCS


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## lvwhitebir (Nov 10, 2003)

I run a 5 week kid's self defense course geared for ages 5 through 12.  Here's what I teach:

General Information:
Always know your phone number
Always know your address
Always know your Parent's names
Never go out alone
Notifying an adult when you go out
Use your brain before your fists (avoid rather than engage)
Awareness
Difference between Assertive, Aggressive, and Passive behavior
Distancing and Verbal Boundaries
Blocking
Learning to say "No"


Bullies:
Types of bullies and what they want (control)
How to handle Teasing
Anger management and Conflict resolution skills
How to handle physical bullies
How to handle "give it to me" bullies
How to handle rumors
Revenge?  Never!


Dealing with Strangers:
Tattling vs. Telling
When you have to talk to strangers
Don't tell means tell, don't yell means yell


Most Common Child Lures Abductors Use
Sexual abuse and Inappropriate touching
Never keep a secret from your mom and dad
Stop or I'll tell


Safety at Home
How to answer the phone
How to answer the door
How to call 911


Physical Techniques:
Defense against Wrist Grabs
Defense against Pushes
Defense against Headlocks
Escaping the Mount


Since this is a short course, my preference is to teach anger management and conflict resolution skills with defenses rather than any aggressive techniques.

I'll teach more striking and control when I have them in my regular martial arts class so we can work more on appropriate use.

The most common problems that I believe kids (under 12) today have are inappropriate touching by someone the kid knows and non-physical bullies (teasing, rumors, etc.) that take their confidence to zero.

WhiteBirch


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## lvwhitebir (Nov 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by hardheadjarhead _
> *"He started it!"  Its just like they were back in the sixth grade.  Many don't truly understand the dynamics of the law and the consequences of their actions.*



It's also a lack of respect, common courtesy, and responsibility.  A lot of adults wonder why their kids don't show more respect when they themselves are out cutting people off on the roads and yelling profanity when someone "steals" their parking space.  It's always the other guy's fault when things don't go our way.  Great role models kids have today!

It's off topic, but one of the greatest things MA schools do today is teach the specifics of respect, courtesy, and generosity.  I don't know of any other place where these are truly taught with specific examples and exercises.

WhiteBirch


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## hardheadjarhead (Nov 10, 2003)

_It's also a lack of respect, common courtesy, and responsibility. A lot of adults wonder why their kids don't show more respect when they themselves are out cutting people off on the roads and yelling profanity when someone "steals" their parking space. It's always the other guy's fault when things don't go our way. Great role models kids have today!_ 

Very true.  When a parent sees someone do that, they should take the time to talk to their kid about it.  Its a good way for a kid to learn how NOT to act.

I liked your curriculum for kid's self defense.  Looks like you've put a lot of thought into it.  

In the section on dealing with strangers you distinguish "tattling" versus "telling".  I think that's a topic we can hit with kids all the time...not just when dealing with strangers.  Kids get this notion that they're "narc'ing" on each other...or tattling...if they report an offense against person or property.  

I tell them that "tattling" is when a kids tells on another kid just to cause trouble or get attention.   "Telling" is when they're reporting something that hurts another person or violates their property rights.

For instance...Jimmy doesn't bow when leaving the mat to get a drink of water.  Billy rats on him with the standard sing song "Teeeeeeeacher, yadda yadda yadda...". This is tattling.  Its a good time for teacher to remind Billy he isn't the "Bow Police" and that this is a form of tattling.  Its the instructor's job (or the other seniors, depending on class protocol) to get Jimmy to bow.  It isn't Billy's job.

However, if Jimmy punches Suzie at the water fountain or absconds with Daniel's afterschool snack, that is another issue.  That isn't tattling.  Serious offenses (misdemeanors and felonies if they were adults) against others have been committed.  In fact, students can be reprimanded for NOT reporting such abuse, and it can be hammered in as a social duty.  When we see a crime, we report it.

SCS


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## hapki-bujutsu (Nov 11, 2003)

I teach young children to run and yell fire when ever they can. Yelling help gets them nowhere. it is sad but true. As far as when the get grabbed or attacked stike vital organs fast. When the adult responds to the pain pull free and get away. I child should never try to fight an adult. Tv and movies biggest injustance to the martial arts is showing some child using his tkd skills to fend off a 250 pound adult. Not going to happen. For a kid a little older it is good to tell them that there is no shame in running from danger. Your are not being a coward by getting to safety you are being smart. I have taught both by kids from very young. My oldest boy of 14 always heard me tell him this. He one problem at school where an adult grabbed him and tried to pick him up. He kicked him in the groin and yelled fire. People came from everywhere I am told. It was only a much older boy who was mentaly handicapped and I relized later pretty harmless. But it could have been worse. Children should always be made aware. You never know. As the old saying goes better safe then sorry.


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