# punches and kicks



## drummingman (Feb 3, 2007)

i have seen in aikido that the blows that people defend against are like sword strikes.so my question is why do aikido teachers wait so long to start teaching how to deal with real punches and kicks and things like that?
also,why did ueshiba develop aikido with sword strikes in mind when he was in the age of fire arms and street fighting and knives and such? it just seems somewhat not practical to develope a martial art based off of the use of the sword when the use of the sword was no longer in use.it seems that it would have made more sense to teach the way to defend against punches and kicks instead of teaching how to get out of wrist holds when going for your sword.


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## SFC JeffJ (Feb 3, 2007)

Well, I've only studied Aikido for a short period of time back almost 15 years ago and I had similar questions.  My instructor at the time said it was like building blocks to teach you the concepts before you moved on to the more "practical" ways of doing the techniques.

Also, some styles of Aikido do focus more on dealing with more modern forms of attack earlier on.

And those old "against the sword" techniques can be surprising effective against punches and kicks once you get oh, 5,000 to 10,000 reps of them.

Jeff


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## bignick (Feb 3, 2007)

Each art teaches things in different order for their own reasons.  Aikido does have a reputation as a slow developing art, but stick with most arts long enough and you'll become well rounded.


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## charyuop (Feb 4, 2007)

I was training yesterday only with Senpai coz Sensei was away and the subject came out right then. What seems like a strike from the top it is not actually a pure strike from the top. Senpai told me that the slower movement makes it appear like that, but when it is done at higher level and full speed the Shomenuchi (that's what is called) even tho starts from a high position (like you said like the sword) it ends with a striking thrust from your center, thus done fast looking like a punch.

In our dojo I noticed (it might be a coincidence tho) Sensei has us use real punches to the face or chest or belly when we have to use a technique deflecting to the side, while he seems to opt more for a Shomenuchi when we have to deflect towards the top (which I admit as a beginner a real punch there would create more problems to me).

But of course an answer from a real Teacher will be more accurate than mine.


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## Yari (Feb 5, 2007)

drummingman said:


> i have seen in aikido that the blows that people defend against are like sword strikes.so my question is why do aikido teachers wait so long to start teaching how to deal with real punches and kicks and things like that?


 
It could be that sometimes you have to learn to walk before you can run. If you can't walk, you probably can't run. But if you can walk, the faster you can learn to run. So it you can defend yourself against simple / easy attackes, you can push on to the more difficult.



> also,why did ueshiba develop aikido with sword strikes in mind when he was in the age of fire arms and street fighting and knives and such? it just seems somewhat not practical to develope a martial art based off of the use of the sword when the use of the sword was no longer in use.it seems that it would have made more sense to teach the way to defend against punches and kicks instead of teaching how to get out of wrist holds when going for your sword.


 
I really don't know why Ueshiba choose to do that. But he did. And it works. And that is probaly the best reason to why.

Aikido is more than defences against wrist holds. It's a question of seeing and understanding how things function together. That in pricinple you only need to learn 1 or 2 techniques, and the rest are just spinoffs. And that these same 1 or 2 techniques can be used no matter which attack you have.

/Yari


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## Hand Sword (Feb 5, 2007)

drummingman said:


> i have seen in aikido that the blows that people defend against are like sword strikes.so my question is why do aikido teachers wait so long to start teaching how to deal with real punches and kicks and things like that?
> also,why did ueshiba develop aikido with sword strikes in mind when he was in the age of fire arms and street fighting and knives and such? it just seems somewhat not practical to develope a martial art based off of the use of the sword when the use of the sword was no longer in use.it seems that it would have made more sense to teach the way to defend against punches and kicks instead of teaching how to get out of wrist holds when going for your sword.


 

As stated above, it's learning to "walk" first. Remember Aikido was designed from a spiritual perspective. Not from a "fighting" perspective. Also, if you annalyze the motion one makes at grabbing the wrist, it's the same motion as a "strike" coming at you. It's not about getting out of wrist holds. That's just the starting point, before moving into more advanced, as your "eye" and timing become better, along with your coordination.


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## Touch Of Death (Feb 6, 2007)

drummingman said:


> i have seen in aikido that the blows that people defend against are like sword strikes.so my question is why do aikido teachers wait so long to start teaching how to deal with real punches and kicks and things like that?
> also,why did ueshiba develop aikido with sword strikes in mind when he was in the age of fire arms and street fighting and knives and such? it just seems somewhat not practical to develope a martial art based off of the use of the sword when the use of the sword was no longer in use.it seems that it would have made more sense to teach the way to defend against punches and kicks instead of teaching how to get out of wrist holds when going for your sword.


Aikido was always meant to compliment already existing Martial Arts skills.
Sean


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## rutherford (Feb 6, 2007)

The Aikido I studied briefly, students were free to choose the exact shape of the attack in most instances.  Only rarely did the teacher give more than a general specification.  

I threw lots of punches as Uke.  It did little to change the shape of Tori's movement.


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## morph4me (Feb 6, 2007)

I train in a style of aikido that deals with punches and kicks delivered any way that the attacker wants to deliver them, we learn the mechanics of the techniques and then applications from different attacks. 

The idea of the sword like attacks is to teach how to move when an attack comes from a certain direction, not how to defend against a particular attack. Like anything else, you build on the basics.


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## Shotgun Buddha (Feb 7, 2007)

Touch Of Death said:


> Aikido was always meant to compliment already existing Martial Arts skills.
> Sean


 
Weren't all of Ueshiba's original students well versed in other styles? I'd have to agree, I figure Aikido is something you learn after you've already learned to fight.


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## howard (Feb 7, 2007)

Touch Of Death said:


> Aikido was always meant to compliment already existing Martial Arts skills.
> Sean


It was?  Always?

Wasn't the old, "prewar" Aikido viewed as a complete martial art, like its source, Daito-ryu?


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## Touch Of Death (Feb 7, 2007)

howard said:


> It was? Always?
> 
> Wasn't the old, "prewar" Aikido viewed as a complete martial art, like its source, Daito-ryu?


I guess it would depend, but Aikido as we know it has very little Margin for Error.
Sean


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## Yari (Feb 8, 2007)

howard said:


> It was? Always?
> 
> Wasn't the old, "prewar" Aikido viewed as a complete martial art, like its source, Daito-ryu?


 
I don't know, but I geussing that many people see it as a complet art today. But there are a great deal of people that can see that their Aikido gets better by learning other arts too. 

But itsn't this true for many arts. The more you learn, about variations and movements, the more you understand what your doing.

To put an analogy on it. It's like living in one country(AIKIDO), but travvling in ohter countries (karate, kali, boxing...), you get to see your own country in another light. But I think this enlightment would exsist no matter which style you pratice.
/Yari


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## Steel Tiger (Feb 11, 2007)

I am not an Aikido practitioner myself, but I have observed a number of classes (they used the training hall before my classes began) and I noticed that the teacher and many of the senior students had BB in karate or jujutsu.

I think it affected the way that they taught technique because they were operating from a knowledge of punching and kicking techniques while many of the students were new to martial arts in general and Aikido in particular.

My personal view of Aikido is that it is an advanced art that really must be approached froma background of some basic martial training to get the most out of it.


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## theletch1 (Feb 12, 2007)

What Steel Tiger said.   Many of the students that come in to our dojo are brand new to the arts and have a difficult time understanding how the energy from a punch or kick will flow.  This compromises their ability to properly do a technique that requires a redirection of energy.  I came in from a kenpo background and I believe that it really helped my aikido.  The problem comes in when you initially try to make you brain make the switch from hard style in internal style.  Not impossible but not the easiest thing in the world.


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