# Why do you train in Wing Chun?



## Reeksta (Dec 23, 2014)

As a counterpoint to the negativity elsewhere, I thought it might be nice to start a thread celebrating Wing Chun and discussing what it is we enjoy about it. What first made you want to learn it and what keeps you going to class?
Personally I wanted to try something different to the sporting MAs I'd done before. I'm getting a little older now and wanted something that was going to result in less injuries and which I can continue to train as the years roll by. I was also interested by the internal elements of the art as nothing I've ever done before directly addresses this.
I'm still very new to WC but so far what I enjoy most is simply how much sense everything I'm learning makes. It feels really pragmatic and efficient. I've only started learning the first form but I love practicing it. Funny, because I was a bit sceptical about forms before I started with WC but I get a wonderful sense of relaxation when I do it and genuinely feel it's helping me to develop proper technique.
Well, that's me. How about you guys?


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## Kung Fu Wang (Dec 23, 2014)

WC is one of my "cross training" systems for the following reasons:

1. Since the Fu Shou already exist in the praying mantis system as "刁手(Diao Shou)", It has no additional usage to me.
2. The Bong Shou can be used in clinching (such as "single neck tie") to block my opponent's punch from outside by hidden my head under my raising elbow. It's a good tool.
3. I like the WC Tan Shou the most. I can use it to "protect my center from inside out". This way I can force my opponent to punch from either sides of my arms but not between my arms (except the short range uppercut which is far away from my chin). By using "double Tan Shou", I have created my "rhino (or big fist)" strategy from it. It can be used for grapplers who doesn't want to spend too much time in the striking art training but still have to deal with strikers in the ring.


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## J W (Dec 23, 2014)

My wife started training Muay Thai several years ago, and watching her practice that got me interested in taking up martial arts again after a long hiatus. I didn't have much interest in joining her for Muay Thai- not sure why exactly, maybe I just didn't want to get kicked in the shins. I considered going back to TKD (having earned a black belt in it back in high school), but decided to try something new instead. 

I first tried Kenpo. Had some fun with that for about a year, but to be honest the system is too bulky for me. Too many "techniques". Wing Chun appealed to me because it is a fairly "simplified" system, something I could fit better into my life. I stopped by the school where I now train and spoke with the sifu, and the concepts and principles of WC made alot of sense to me. Very direct, no nonsense approach. I trained a bit of boxing years ago, and enjoyed that for the same reason; so I decided to give "Chinese boxing" a try. 

I continue to train WC because such a "simplified" system continues to present so many challenges. Proper structure, relaxation, forward energy... all so much easier said than done! I'm enjoying the challenge of putting together all the pieces of the Wing Chun puzzle.


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## Transk53 (Dec 23, 2014)

I am going back to Wing Chun because I showed complete disrespect to the art. Namely getting off my face. Now though, different outlook leading to a different life. I am really looking forward to the 6th of January


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## zuti car (Dec 23, 2014)

...because there was no other Chinese martial art in my country .In Europe is very hard.  to find anything besides wing chun. As soon as I came  to Taiwan ,I've started to practice other things but after so many years of wing chun practice it is hard to stop


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## Jake104 (Dec 23, 2014)

This is going sound lame, but the movie "The Dragon, the Bruce Lee story" got me started. I knew nothing about Wing Chun. Although I did have quite a bit of fighting experience before that. Mostly getting my *** kicked, haha..

I started with my wife/then girlfriend. She did it for about a year, but I continued cause I loved the art. It just made sense to me. I was taught a Chinese Boxing style of WC at first. In the beginning there was no chi sao in the traditional sense. We did bridge work. Only after six months in, is when Dan Chi Sao started, then Poon Sao later.
We worked ranges, closing the gap and punch combinations. Punching straight, hooking and uppercuts. Punching high, medium and low. Working, long range, mid range and close. So for me WC is Chinese  boxing. I think that is why I liked it so much then. Now I get chi sao and I prefer to stick. Cause before I was young and athletic. Now I'm older and lazier.

I didn't know then that there were so many branches of WC. The only other branch I knew of was Sifu Jerry McKinley of Sifu Jim Lau Wing Chun Academy which was down the street. I didn't  know there was so much politics envoled until later. If I were to start now I probably would be turned off and would of taken a different art. So I'm glad I learned when I did. Later I took some HFY. Which was great. I'm thankful too the Sifu's/ coaches I have had. It's been a fun ride!


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## Danny T (Dec 24, 2014)

Plain and simply, because I like it.
Has increased my understanding of Shotokan, made my Muay Thai and Pekiti-Tirsia far better and Erik Paulson has incorporated many WC principles in CSW.
Because of this I continue to train and practice the WC system.


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## Vajramusti (Dec 24, 2014)

Reeksta said:


> As a counterpoint to the negativity elsewhere, I thought it might be nice to start a thread celebrating Wing Chun and discussing what it is we enjoy about it. What first made you want to learn it and what keeps you going to class?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Found wing chun to be  a great art, one that I can keep evolving with and happened to find  a superb teacher of the art,


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## Tez3 (Dec 24, 2014)

Danny T said:


> Plain and simply, because I like it.
> Has increased my understanding of Shotokan, made my Muay Thai and Pekiti-Tirsia far better and Erik Paulson has incorporated many WC principles in CSW.
> Because of this I continue to train and practice the WC system.



How do you find the quite different stances compared to those in Shotokan? A while back I did some training with a friend who teaches JKD, very interesting and very good fun, lots of differences but more similarities but I found after so many years of ingrained karate I could not do the stances. I've tried Tai Chi as well and it's the same problem which of course could well be me!
As I'm getting on a bit now I am looking for a style that I can still do into my dotage, however many say that CMA's are hard on the knees? Mine aren't so good now after years of martial arts, parachuting and horse riding!


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## Mephisto (Dec 24, 2014)

Tez3 said:


> How do you find the quite different stances compared to those in Shotokan? A while back I did some training with a friend who teaches JKD, very interesting and very good fun, lots of differences but more similarities but I found after so many years of ingrained karate I could not do the stances. I've tried Tai Chi as well and it's the same problem which of course could well be me!
> As I'm getting on a bit now I am looking for a style that I can still do into my dotage, however many say that CMA's are hard on the knees? Mine aren't so good now after years of martial arts, parachuting and horse riding!


You might check out a Filipino Martial art. Arnis/Eskrima/Kali offer a versatility that many martial artists can appreciate, blade, impact weapon and empty hand are trained interchangeably. In addition, the weapon takes the abuse rather than your body. Trainibg groups vary in approach as do any other system, some train very hard and physical but often the weapon does the work.


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## Reeksta (Dec 24, 2014)

I'm rather impressed by your 'rhino' @Kung Fu Wang, very cool! It's quite similar to something called the 'filter' I learned in personal protection training when I was a psyche nurse. Only real difference is that the arms were linked palm-over-palm with the hands facing away from you with that, rather than the entwined hands you're doing. Your way causes less flaring of the elbows so is probably a bit better for controlling the centerline. I like it


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## Xue Sheng (Dec 24, 2014)

Tez3 said:


> How do you find the quite different stances compared to those in Shotokan? A while back I did some training with a friend who teaches JKD, very interesting and very good fun, lots of differences but more similarities but I found after so many years of ingrained karate I could not do the stances. I've tried Tai Chi as well and it's the same problem which of course could well be me!
> As I'm getting on a bit now I am looking for a style that I can still do into my dotage, however many say that CMA's are hard on the knees? Mine aren't so good now after years of martial arts, parachuting and horse riding!



I have seen many who trained Karate or TKD go to Taijiquan and it is a problem and many don't take the time to get through the stiffness issues in stance and the over use of external power, but it can be done, one of my shifu's students was a long time Uechi Ryu guy, it took him a few years but he did get through it.

As for my knees (which are not good) much to my surprise the stance in Siu Nim Tao helped my knees. Right after training I was convinced that my knees would be out for a week when I woke up in the morning, it surprised me my knees felt much stronger.


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## J W (Dec 24, 2014)

Jake104 said:


> I didn't  know there was so much politics envoled until later. If I were to start now I probably would be turned off and would of taken a different art. So I'm glad I learned when I did.



You know, the only place I see the politics and bickering is online. That stuff doesn't come up in the mokwoon, so if I didn't bother with online forums I'd have no idea that stuff was going on. I'm pretty sure several of my sidai are ignorant to the political side of WC. 



Tez3 said:


> As I'm getting on a bit now I am looking for a style that I can still do into my dotage, however many say that CMA's are hard on the knees? Mine aren't so good now after years of martial arts, parachuting and horse riding!



Some of the "hard" style CMA's may be hard on the knees, with all the deep stances... I don't know much about those styles though, so I'm just speculating. As for WC, I usually tell new students that the YGKYM stance should hurt the muscles in the legs when you hold it for a while, but if it hurts your knees then you're doing it wrong. We have several older students at our school; age and bad knees shouldn't be much of an impediment to WC training if you were inclined to give it a try.


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## yak sao (Dec 24, 2014)

I came to WC 20 years ago with a screwed up hip from 14 years of a hard style CMA. Over time my hip injury healed and went away for the most part as I continued with my WC.
I have known several people over the years who have found the YGKYM stance therapeutic in helping with bad knees, backs, hips etc.


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## Danny T (Dec 24, 2014)

Tez3 said:


> How do you find the quite different stances compared to those in Shotokan? A while back I did some training with a friend who teaches JKD, very interesting and very good fun, lots of differences but more similarities but I found after so many years of ingrained karate I could not do the stances. I've tried Tai Chi as well and it's the same problem which of course could well be me!
> As I'm getting on a bit now I am looking for a style that I can still do into my dotage, however many say that CMA's are hard on the knees? Mine aren't so good now after years of martial arts, parachuting and horse riding!


Tez, I believe you've some boxing and muay thai experience. How do you find those stances? As for 'form' the stances are quite different. As to application Shotokan stances are higher and more natural than form. Stances are fleeting, but moments or snap shots in time and as important as they are the ability to move comfortably is more so in my opinion. When first learning WC it was difficult because of the tension and rigidness vs. relaxing into the stance. In time I became very comfortable and can easily transition between the different stances from Shotokan, Muay Thai, Pekiti, WC, Boxing all based upon the spatial relationship and what the opponent is presenting and what attack or counter attack I'm presenting. No it wasn't simple but in a relatively short period it was usable. After about a year it became almost natural. That said it has been over over 35 years since beginning wc.
I have bad knees also. Have had surgery on both twice and the left is going to require a partial replacement I've been told by two different orthopedics so I do understand your concerns. The basic stances actually relieves the stress on my knees. As to age just take your time and keep enjoying the journey.


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## Kwan Sau (Dec 24, 2014)

Reeksta said:


> What first made you want to learn it and what keeps you going to class?



My short story: years ago, thought I was already a bad-a$$...till the day I walked into a WC school and asked to attack the Sifu any way I wanted. Figured it was the fastest way to figure out if the guy was someone I would want to learn from. 
I never saw the guy move, ended up 15 feet backwards on my butt...wondering what happened. 
Ego got the best of me...stood up and asked if I could try again. Same result. 
Been a student ever since!


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## ALEX WHITE (Dec 30, 2014)

I train in wing chun for many reasons, one considering I met my sifu at a bus stop and he offered me private lessons, for a price of course, ever since then Ive never lost a non rule bound fight at all, the all is refined and improved in my long hours of conditioning, dummy work, strength/core/leg training to keep it in mint condition, I've versed everyone from boxers to tiger Kung Fu to drunken fist and it holds up pretty well on every fight, it is a truly fitting art for me 100%


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## Transk53 (Dec 31, 2014)

Kwan Sau said:


> My short story: years ago, thought I was already a bad-a$$...till the day I walked into a WC school and asked to attack the Sifu any way I wanted. Figured it was the fastest way to figure out if the guy was someone I would want to learn from.
> I never saw the guy move, ended up 15 feet backwards on my butt...wondering what happened.
> Ego got the best of me...stood up and asked if I could try again. Same result.
> Been a student ever since!



First name not Bruce then


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## Transk53 (Dec 31, 2014)

Danny T said:


> Plain and simply, because I like it.
> Has increased my understanding of Shotokan, made my *Muay Thai* and Pekiti-Tirsia far better and Erik Paulson has incorporated many WC principles in CSW.
> Because of this I continue to train and practice the WC system.



Curious as to what influence the WC has had on you're MT?


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## Danny T (Dec 31, 2014)

Transk53 said:


> Curious as to what influence the WC has had on you're MT?


Understanding the centerline, how to control it and how it affects the other person. How the immovable elbow and sinking controls the opponent in the clinch, how the hip placement controls the pressure and allows the frt leg to be lifted without shifting the body for leg checks, how to blend the WC structure within the MT structure when needed...: just to get started.


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## Transk53 (Dec 31, 2014)

Danny T said:


> Understanding the centerline, how to control it and how it affects the other person. How the immovable elbow and sinking controls the opponent in the clinch, how the hip placement controls the pressure and allows the frt leg to be lifted without shifting the body for leg checks, how to blend the WC structure within the MT structure when needed...: just to get started.



Yes I can imagine that you would lose me pretty much. Kind of sorry I asked  The two arts just seem poles apart.


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## J W (Dec 31, 2014)

Danny T said:


> Understanding the centerline, how to control it and how it affects the other person. How the immovable elbow and sinking controls the opponent in the clinch, how the hip placement controls the pressure and allows the frt leg to be lifted without shifting the body for leg checks, how to blend the WC structure within the MT structure when needed...: just to get started.



Interesting. Now for the reverse question... has training MT improved your WC?


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## Danny T (Dec 31, 2014)

J W said:


> Interesting. Now for the reverse question... has training MT improved your WC?


Absolutely. Has given me the opportunity to understand WC in a different environment. Knowing MT allows me to know its weaknesses and how to defeat it. I know how to utilize my WC skills vs a strong puncher, kicker. I know the close-guarter game, the boxer range game, and the longer kicking range game and how to control the range and the opponent. I can show a boxing or MT guard and still strike into and/or control the centerline without standing in the well known WC man sao guard. (which I feel is but an intermediate level of understanding) I can counter the MT kicks and understand the set ups.


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## Brummie (Jan 2, 2015)

Started WC for 2 main reasons, the health benefits and self defence.

The further into the journey I go, the more I enjoy the above aspects, but also the history and tradition of it as well.


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## Transk53 (Jan 2, 2015)

Four days to go for me peeps. Really looking forward to it. Any last minute tips for me. Been previously, so I am hoping that some things will come flooding back. However, I thinking that acting, and approaching, as a complete novice and treat the class as my first ever. What do you guys think? I know that some of you teach from your posts. It would be handy if you could tip me here. Not worried, but perhaps a little to switched off as it were. Want to make sure that I approach the class with the, in this case, correct frame of mind.


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## Kwan Sau (Jan 2, 2015)

Transk53 said:


> Any last minute tips for me. However, I thinking that acting, and approaching, as a complete novice and treat the class as my first ever. What do you guys think?



ALWAYS, regardless of how much time you've been studying...approach every class with an empty tea cup my friend! If you maintain this sort of 'dry sponge' attitude...you'll learn from each and every moment. 
TIP: "listen" to what your Sifu says...but pay rapt attention to how he moves, what he does, etc.


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## Transk53 (Jan 2, 2015)

Kwan Sau said:


> ALWAYS, regardless of how much time you've been studying...approach every class with an empty tea cup my friend! If you maintain this sort of 'dry sponge' attitude...you'll learn from each and every moment.
> TIP: "listen" to what your Sifu says...but pay rapt attention to how he moves, what he does, etc.



Thanks  One of my strengths is that I am hyper observant, I watch everything, including everybody more skilled. But yes, empty tea cup is the definitive answer


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## J W (Jan 6, 2015)

Danny T said:


> Absolutely. Has given me the opportunity to understand WC in a different environment. Knowing MT allows me to know its weaknesses and how to defeat it. I know how to utilize my WC skills vs a strong puncher, kicker. I know the close-guarter game, the boxer range game, and the longer kicking range game and how to control the range and the opponent. I can show a boxing or MT guard and still strike into and/or control the centerline without standing in the well known WC man sao guard. (which I feel is but an intermediate level of understanding) I can counter the MT kicks and understand the set ups.



Good stuff, thanks for the perspective. A Groupon for a local MMA gym came up the other day and my wife bought one, she's been wanting to get back into Muay Thai for a while. I think I'll join her. I've been looking to learn about how different boxing systems relate, exploring WC and MT seems like a good place to start.


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## wingerjim (Jan 21, 2015)

I train WC simply because there were three choices in my area, Karate, TKD or Wing Chun....for me the choice was simple because the other two were your generic cookie-cutter school like any other in Anytown, USA, but the WC school where I study is VERY traditional...no AC, not much heat, old wooden floor and plenty of old-school equipment full of blood sweat and tears....this is my kind of place. Also a clear line to Ip Man via Lueng Sheung.


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## jhexx (Jan 21, 2015)

I do wing chun because I was born into it thru my father who is a first generation WC man in my family. First for my health. Second because it keeps me balanced mentally and physically and keeps me occupied.third because my father is the first to do it, I want to keep it as a family treasure and I feel the art and connection to my father is priceless, so I want to keep in inside my family for as long as I can. It is my way of showing respect for my father's hard work and dedication to wing chun, as well as keeping the true sprit of martial arts alive within my family lineage.


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## Kwan Sau (Jan 21, 2015)

jhexx said:


> I do wing chun because I was born into it thru my father who is a first generation WC man in my family. First for my health. Second because it keeps me balanced mentally and physically and keeps me occupied.third because my father is the first to do it, I want to keep it as a family treasure and I feel the art and connection to my father is priceless, so I want to keep in inside my family for as long as I can. It is my way of showing respect for my father's hard work and dedication to wing chun, as well as keeping the true sprit of martial arts alive within my family lineage.



That's awesome jhexx. I'm sure your father is proud of you. Keep it alive brother!


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## jhexx (Jan 21, 2015)

Thank you kwan sau. The more I kept doing it I can feel almost as if i am in the same mind state and feelings as my father had when he went thru his training. I acquired his modified stance based on his personal experience, as well as retained the older way (1970's era) style of training thru hard work and perseverance. Plus I know traditional jiu wan and Wang Kiu lineages as well as mixing it with his wsl knowledge, I feel I have a deep sense of the traditional side, as well as the modified ways to help me evolve my style further.


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## geezer (Jan 21, 2015)

jhexx said:


> I do wing chun because I was born into it thru my father who is a first generation WC man in my family.
> ...It is my way of showing respect for my father's hard work and dedication to wing chun, as well as keeping the true sprit of martial arts alive within my family lineage.



Good for you. Wish my son thought like that. He chose to study TKD instead, saying "I want to learn from a _real_ instructor, not just you dad." And that's even after his TKD instructor started learning WC from me! ._..Kids these days  _


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## jhexx (Jan 21, 2015)

geezer said:


> Good for you. Wish my son thought like that. He chose to study TKD instead, saying "I want to learn from a _real_ instructor, not just you dad." And that's even after his TKD instructor started learning WC from me! ._..Kids these days  _


Geezer, it took a while to come full circle and realize how important it is for me to acquire my fathers skill set. I started at age three, trained for 12  Years and got lazy during my teens years, wasting time and not training. Then around 3 years ago, I took a serious look at the style again, and after trained with my father for two years to get back to shape, then after he had me train with herb schmeider in jiu wan to get the traditional side back into focus and compare to his modified style and merge the two. Now after moving which caused me to not be able to train under herb, I now train with one of two certified students of Dr Meier of the USA Wang kiu lineage, and loving it. I'm proud to walk in my father's path of the Eternal Crane and forever speak about the Eternal Springtime that lives within me.


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## yak sao (Jan 21, 2015)

geezer said:


> Good for you. Wish my son thought like that. He chose to study TKD instead, saying "I want to learn from a _real_ instructor, not just you dad." And that's even after his TKD instructor started learning WC from me! ._..Kids these days  _



Sorry to hear that....maybe he'll come around.
Perhaps Mark Twain's quote will give you a glimmer of hope:

_“When I was a boy of 14, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be 21, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years.”
_
I've been lucky in that regard. I have 2 sons. I taught them some basic/generic kicking, punching, footwork type stuff while they were little and began teaching them Wing Tsun when they were in their mid teens. My oldest is now 25 and doesn't do it so much anymore, although he still expresses an interest in getting back to it. He periodically drops by the class and gives my students an absolute run for their money.
My youngest is 21 and has an absolute passion for it and is very talented.

They help to keep me inspired.


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## wingerjim (Jan 22, 2015)

geezer said:


> Good for you. Wish my son thought like that. He chose to study TKD instead, saying "I want to learn from a _real_ instructor, not just you dad." And that's even after his TKD instructor started learning WC from me! ._..Kids these days  _


 Yes, give him time and if he sticks with it and understands your connection with WC, he may come to feel empty and want something more. I think most kids want and desire the belt system to feel a sense of accomplishment. My WC liniage does not use belts, sashes or any other reward....just results.


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## ShortBridge (Feb 9, 2015)

I tried Wing Chun after relocating to a different state in the 90s. I had studied a variety of styles for 15 years or so and wasn't really interested in Wing Chun, but it was the best option where I was. I thought I'd "learn some trapping" and mix it back into my own special sauce after I found a better place to train.

About 5 minutes in I knew that I was off base. It was not what I had read or what JKD friends had showed me. it was brutal, efficient and it fit me like a glove.


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