# When Aikido becomes your own



## samurai69 (Apr 4, 2006)

Following on from my thread about Aikido against a boxer really

there are lots of times in my "self defence class" where i am sparring with an opponent and, i suppose, using basic aikido principles, but not specific techniques, i either throw or restrain my partner

as with a lot of aikido techniques there are certain similarities to other martial arts (for what ever reason) but when do you introduce these principles or understandings to the aikido class, 

In my aikido class i try to teach aikido as it was taught to me, but i would like students to understand that, because there are so many variables when training, that its important to make aikido your own

eg. if i put a 5' student with a student 6'4" then both will need to adapt certain parts/principles to enable them to complete the techniques.

O sensai always said that aikido should evolve and i think as we progress it further it should.........

It would be interesting to read peoples various takes on the subject


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## Hand Sword (Apr 4, 2006)

My thought was always :the system should serve you, not you serving the system. That said, I feel learn the material the best that you can. Study hard and practice hard. For the regular training do what's expected of you, but for self defense, definitely, always do what works! If you have to "tinker" than do it! Don't be afraid to upset tradition if it means your personal well being.


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## SFC JeffJ (Apr 4, 2006)

I'm not an Aikidoka, but the jujitsu I do came from Aiki jujitsu and we use a lot of the same concepts.  I think using principles, without using specific techniques is something that comes naturally after training for a while.  When your body as well as your mind understands the principles, you'll start to us them in a way that doesn't mirror what you've been taught.  Don't know if you could teach it, but maybe encourage it once you see it start to develop in a student.  There's my $.02.

Jeff

(edit for grammar)


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## samurai69 (Apr 4, 2006)

JeffJ said:
			
		

> I'm not an Aikidoka, but the jujitsu I do came from Aiki jujitsu and we use a lot of the same concepts. I think using principles, without using specific techniques is something that comes naturally after training for a while. *When your body as well as your mind understands the principles, you'll start to us them in a way that doesn't mirror what you've been taught*. Don't know if you could teach it, but maybe encourage it once you see it start to develop in a student. There's my $.02.
> 
> Jeff
> 
> (edit for grammar)


 
Thats more like what i was thinking of, its about the encouragement


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## theletch1 (Apr 4, 2006)

I think that after awhile you build a certain degree of muscle memory that enable your body to react with a minimal input from the brain.  In the same thought, though, after some time you begin to be able to think about your response to an attack in the same way you think, say, when you're driving.  Hundreds of decisions per mile without much conscious thought.  When these two aspects of the mind/body link fall into place you'll begin to almost subconsciously analyze what's going on during a technique as it happens and make minute adjustments for differences in opponent size, strength, speed and such.  When you finish an attack line or a bit of randori, know that it went well and can't remember clearly a thing that you did...aikido is yours.


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## samurai69 (Apr 4, 2006)

theletch1 said:
			
		

> . *When these two aspects of the mind/body link fall into place *you'll begin to almost subconsciously analyze what's going on during a technique as it happens and make minute adjustments for differences in opponent size, strength, speed and such. *When you finish an attack line or a bit of randori, know that it went well and can't remember clearly a thing that you did...aikido is yours*.


 

   


.


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## Korppi76 (Apr 5, 2006)

I think aikido looks ... how to say... same as person who does it. For example strong person do different way than not so strong person.
 As in my training, my sensei said for me that "for first 5-10 years you should train with different aikido teachers and then I should decided who trains like I like to train". 
 After 1. Dan I was suggest to train different martial art as a "side" to see differences with aikido and different arts.
 Now a days my sensei trys to get me to do aikido in my way. He said to me again in last week that I shouldnt try to copy his doing too much, I just should to do aikido like I have come to understand it.
 So he basicly told me that aikido is aikido no matter how many different ways  people can find to do it.
Ofcource there is basics that we teach always same way but after that you should think what you do.
This is hard to explain in english.


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## Hand Sword (Apr 5, 2006)

I think all that practice any art for a long time eventually do it their way. In the beginning you try to focus on how the teacher shows you. Eventually your body and personal preferences take over, and it becomes yours.


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## PRehse (Apr 5, 2006)

Hand Sword said:
			
		

> I think all that practice any art for a long time eventually do it their way. In the beginning you try to focus on how the teacher shows you. Eventually your body and personal preferences take over, and it becomes yours.


My teacher is fond of saying there is no style of Aikido beyond the individual.  I remember the first time I heard it well because with a laugh he said - yes we have Peter's style - and this was in front of about 50 people with me a lowly, insecure, kyu grade.  That night I just drank more beer but I think I understand his point better now (still drink beer).

I think we have our own style from the first time we step on the mat.  In the early stages (Shu) we try to copy our teacher and senior students. Our style does change but it is still our own - constrained by body type and temperment.  

I don't think its a teacher's job to produce clones of himself but martial artists in their own right.


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## Hand Sword (Apr 5, 2006)

That is the key. Developing an individual should be a goal of teachers, if they are true teachers. Either way, like I said, you'll do it your way eventually, whether they foster that idea or not.


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## MartialIntent (Apr 5, 2006)

PRehse said:
			
		

> That night I just drank more beer but I think I understand his point better now (still drink beer).


 



			
				PRehse said:
			
		

> I think we have our own style from the first time we step on the mat.


Agree wholeheartedly! While techniques and the philosophy behind them were taught to each of us [at least in the same dojo] in exactly the same way, the individuality arises out of size and strength inequalities, the application intent of the student and their approach not only to training but also to how they utilize that training in their day to day lives. I think all of these join to ensure no aikidoka performs the same routine as a facsimile of any other.

In *samurai69*'s example of the taller and smaller opponents, in order to keep the back straight and the centre maintained, the taller will necessarily need to adapt with respect to bending the knees more and the smaller will need [as I've found] to increase their use of the circularity and rotational torque to avoid the evident need to apply greater leverage which would otherwise result in brute-forcing the tech.

I think also if one decides to study more of the Aikido philosophy, the intent and focus often changes from being one of put-them-down to one of put-them-down-but-don't-break-them [!] Although this change is subtle and usually comes about as a result of reading and transcending one's original intent, the differences in application I think are usually marked. Of course this isn't the case for all students but just another aspect of attaining individuality I've noted.

I'd say conformity should _never_ be encouraged - besides the fact that it's impossible to maintain, it does nothing to further individual learning, let alone to progress the art. And I don't see any contradiction in practicing the _traditional_ form of any art alongside the desire to create unique artists within that art. Individuality's where it's at! Interesting thoughts from all...

Respects!


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## PRehse (Apr 5, 2006)

MartialIntent said:
			
		

> I'd say conformity should _never_ be encouraged - besides the fact that it's impossible to maintain, it does nothing to further individual learning, let alone to progress the art. And I don't see any contradiction in practicing the _traditional_ form of any art alongside the desire to create unique artists within that art. Individuality's where it's at! Interesting thoughts from all...


Of course sacrificing good form and correct movement for the sake of individuallity is a dead end road all by itself.

It does not happen often (most people try hard to learn the art) but I remember one artiiiiiist.  Luckily he soon lost interest.


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## PRehse (Apr 5, 2006)

MartialIntent said:
			
		

> I'd say conformity should _never_ be encouraged - besides the fact that it's impossible to maintain, it does nothing to further individual learning, let alone to progress the art. And I don't see any contradiction in practicing the _traditional_ form of any art alongside the desire to create unique artists within that art. Individuality's where it's at! Interesting thoughts from all...


Of course sacrificing good form and correct movement for the sake of individuallity is a dead end road all by itself.

It does not happen often (most people try hard to learn the art) but I remember one artiiiiiist.  Luckily he soon lost interest.


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## SAVAGE (Apr 5, 2006)

I thinkall martial arts become your own, when you start to see it as priciples rather then technique.


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## Hand Sword (Apr 7, 2006)

SAVAGE said:
			
		

> I thinkall martial arts become your own, when you start to see it as priciples rather then technique.


 
Excellent point ! A true field general's perspective.


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