# questions



## drummingman (Nov 2, 2006)

is hapkido very good for self defense? i ask this because from what i can tell there are a lot of kicking techniques in this style which seem impractical.
also,are there more kicking techs then punching techs or are they about the same?
there seem to be quite a lot of schools that teach hapkido and TKD in america.what has made these 2 styles so popular in the usa? 
the thing that has gotten me thinking about hapkido is my liking for aikido but looking for something more ,i might say,street worthy.not saying that aikido is no when used by a good student of the art but it seems that within the hapkido style there are more strikes that would maybe make it more useful in a real fight.meaning if the techs used are practical (back to the kicks question).
hapkido looks to be a very cool art but it seems to really focus on the kicks like TKD.am i wrong? 
i ask all this stuff being a person that does not know much at all about hapkido so if im wrong please know that i have not been trying to be dis-respectful of those that practice this art.like i said,it does look like a very cool art.


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## morph4me (Nov 2, 2006)

drummingman said:


> is hapkido very good for self defense? i ask this because from what i can tell there are a lot of kicking techniques in this style which seem impractical.
> also,are there more kicking techs then punching techs or are they about the same?


 
I guess the answers would be yes and no.

I think of martial arts as giving me tools for my toolbox. If you have to defend yourself, and choose the correct tool, and use it correctly, the job gets done, if not, you get hurt. If you're in a cometition and you choose the correct tool and use it effectively, you score, if not..., you get the idea.

Different martial arts give you different tools and different ways to use them. It's a matter of choosing the correct tool for the job and wielding it effectively.


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## exile (Nov 2, 2006)

Morph4me's points here are excellent, drummingman. But it's also important to get a realistic sense of what the art really is about. If you look at TKD, for example, it has lots of hand techniques, very similar to the techniques in Shotokan karate, not surprisingly given the training history of the Kwan masters who came together to formalize the `national brand' MA for Korea in the 1950s. In competition, especially WTF, all you see are kicks, pretty much, because that's what sport TKD (and sport karate, to a large extent) value as reflected in their scoring systems. But if you watch skillful fighters doing what people in the UK call `all-in' sparring---much closer to real combat applications than you see in tournaments---you see combinations of deflections, elbow strikes, throw and all sorts of other stuff that have basically been barred from Olympic style competition. Very practical, very applicable---_but you have to train it that way_. 

Same with Hapkido---a great, versatile MA with kicks at all heights and fighting techniques at all ranges. Same with Kempo, Wing Chun.... etc etc endlessly. The key is how you train and what you want out of your art. There are people who do Shotokan for sparring competition. And then there are the Japanese police and defense forces, who train the way we got to see on that thread that just started, `Police Shotokan'. Both Shotokan, but look at the difference in how it's applied, eh? 

The point is, the art won't do it _for_ you, whichever one it is. You have to make it work for `practical' apps yourself, if that's what you want. Best thing is to find a dojo/dojang/studio/etc.  which emphasizes that kind of app and trains you for it. If you spend an hour or so observing a class, you'll wind up with a pretty good idea of whether that's their take on the art or not...


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## howard (Nov 2, 2006)

drummingman said:


> is hapkido very good for self defense? i ask this because from what i can tell there are a lot of kicking techniques in this style which seem impractical... hapkido looks to be a very cool art but it seems to really focus on the kicks like TKD.am i wrong? ...like i said,it does look like a very cool art.


Drummingman,

Traditional Hapkido is solely for self-defense.  It derives from some style of Aikijujutsu, probably Daito-ryu Aikijujutsu.  Daito-ryu techniques are designed for self-defense.

There are still a few Hapkido kwans that teach the Hapkiyusul-based art that Choi Yong Sool taught his closest students, and that use relatively little kicking (and almost all of it is low).  But, I'd estimate that at least 90% of the Hapkido schools in the US teach a style that derives from Ji Han Jae's Hapkido.  Those styles make much greater use of kicking techniques, including high kicks.  This is not a criticism of the Hapkido of Ji and his students, merely an observation to distinguish it from the handful of older, Choi-based kwans that still exist.

I'm not sure what you're thinking about when you refer to Hapkido as "cool"... traditional Hapkido was never meant to be a flashy, acrobatic art.   It is a straightforward self defense system that uses various means to take the attacker's balance when he initiates his attack and control / defeat him while he is unbalanced, and therefore vulnerable.  It is not typically pretty to watch.  But it is definitely effective for self-defense if you train in it toward that end.

If you're looking for an art that looks impressive, I'm sure you can find better choices.  It sounds like perhaps you're interested in an art that features competition?


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## matt.m (Nov 2, 2006)

drummingman said:


> is hapkido very good for self defense? i ask this because from what i can tell there are a lot of kicking techniques in this style which seem impractical.
> also,are there more kicking techs then punching techs or are they about the same?
> there seem to be quite a lot of schools that teach hapkido and TKD in america.what has made these 2 styles so popular in the usa?
> the thing that has gotten me thinking about hapkido is my liking for aikido but looking for something more ,i might say,street worthy.not saying that aikido is no when used by a good student of the art but it seems that within the hapkido style there are more strikes that would maybe make it more useful in a real fight.meaning if the techs used are practical (back to the kicks question).
> ...


 

I will begin by saying all hapkido is not the same.  My dan ranking is in judo but my pop is a master in hapkido who learned from Lee H. Park, Lee learned from Won-Kwang Wha, Won and Ji-Han Jae (Sin Moo Hapkido) were classmates under the founder Choi.

I have seen a lot of things that people call hapkido that just isn't hapkido.  A hapkidoan knows hapkido techniques when they see them.  I have seen a lot of people try and pass a collection of stuff as hapkido and it just isn't so.

I have a sneaking suspicion that what you have seen of "hapkido" was not true hapkido, maybe it was.  However, from my experience I have found hapkido a very good self defense art.  I have used basic hapkido while on active duty in the Marine Corps to defend myself against multiple and bigger opponents.  I was part of the Marine Corps task force that went to Haiti in 1994.

Hapkido is an assortment of locks, throws, punching/kicking/striking and throwing.  As you progress in belt ranking you will put mulitple techniques in combination.  Most hapkido schools will teach cane and modified throwing as well.

I will say this, and it is true of any art with its assortment of techniques...."It will only be good and usable if you practice it very very often.

Hapkidos kicks are very dynamic, very dynamic.  Hapkido is certainly known for its dynamic kicking, however what makes hapkido sought after as a self defense is the fact that hapkido has much more to bring to the table than tae kwon do alone.

Good luck in your search.  The main thing is this, research->find a school to train at-> go often-> practice, practice, practice.  When you do that you will know you can defend yourself.


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## arnisador (Nov 2, 2006)

It's good for self-defense. Some styles emphasize kicking more heavily, others emphasize joint-locking more heavily.


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## matt.m (Nov 2, 2006)

howard said:


> Drummingman,
> 
> Traditional Hapkido is solely for self-defense. It derives from some style of Aikijujutsu, probably Daito-ryu Aikijujutsu. Daito-ryu techniques are designed for self-defense.
> 
> ...


 
Well said Howard.  Very well said.


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## howard (Nov 2, 2006)

Hey Matt, thanks.

btw...



matt.m said:


> I will say this, and it is true of any art with its assortment of techniques...."It will only be good and usable if you practice it very very often...
> 
> The main thing is this, research->find a school to train at-> go often-> practice, practice, practice. When you do that you will know you can defend yourself.


You are absolutely right.

Any art as complex as Hapkido has to be practiced regularly and with conviction.  But if you do practice regularly and with conviction, there is a very good chance that it will work for you when you need it.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Nov 2, 2006)

howard said:


> Hey Matt, thanks.
> 
> btw...
> 
> ...


 
Practice and lots of it.  With that Hapkido can be a very, very effective martial art.


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## drummingman (Nov 2, 2006)

i notice that part of the description at the top of the page here on hapkido says that its more of an internal art then external art.what is ment by this?


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## matt.m (Nov 3, 2006)

That is a double sided analogy to me.  Consider this:  In truth there is no real formula to decide if true is true and false is false.  It is a generally accepted rule of sorts that a society believes to be for the good of itself.  A good example of this are the plethra of rules that we call laws.

To say something is more internal than  external falls under these same guiding rules.....All martial arts fall under this category.  It falls under your own personal conviction not only to the art your studying but to the single technique being performed as well.

Hapkido is, as far as Moo Sul Kwan hapkido is concerned, a very dynamic art.  It takes the "internal" spirit to successfully practice and master.  Few have ever mastered.  I know of only 5 men to ever master Moo Sul Kwan hapkido.  Won-Kwang Wha (Ji han Jae classmates under Choi)  Lee H. Park (Won-Kwang Wha's student), Eui Park (Won-Kwang Wha's student and Lee H Park's brother), Charles Hildebrand and Mike Morton,(Lee H. Park's first group of hapkido students).

4th dans would include: Bill Evans and Doug Johnson.

My point is that hapkido is a difficult art to master because of the physiology and kinesology of what is going on.  A lot of people look at a technique and see one person bending another persons arm, there is much more going on than that.

That is why it the summary says that it is more internal than external.


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## Hapkid0ist (Nov 10, 2006)

All well said, and bluntly put Hap Ki Do is not a morons art. It is more I would say an intelectual art. You in time realy do learn to understand how the body moves and flows and works. It takes a lot of hard work and patience, but when you become proficient I dare say that you would be a person to be reconed with. For us as for the kicking. We use mid and lower kicks for self defense. The high kicking techniques are practiced for 2 primary reasons. 
1. Demos. This is where a lot of people decide to give it a try, and the cooler something looks the better the public is gonna like it. Lets face it the general public loves the high fancy kicks.
2. The more you develop your high kicks the more you develop your legs, their flexability which in turn helps with speed and power. So working on those high kicks only really help with your self defense kicks. 
As for what we are, bluntly we are an art of joint manipulation, control and destruction, with all striking aspects put in there. Striking to include kicking, knees, all ways of punching, finger strikes, and elbows. We also learn and work on pressure points to assist our techniques. At times they can make or break your techniques, and at times they really do nothing. This is all variable on your opponent. But, there are a group of basic pressure points that are effective on a large majority of people. 
As you gain rank we start to work in a more internal direction. though meditation and breathing are taught at the gup ranks as you progress in the dan ranks you really begin to focus on them. This helps keep one centered and keep the mind clear as well as developing you self for maximum power and efficiency. Many HKD studios also learn accupuncture and / or accupressure and / or massage therapy along with some basic healing techniques. Things like resetting the wrist when it has been torqued on to many times, the ankles, back, neck ect... As well as some do basic first aid and revival techniques. 
Weapons are another story. 
One thing to be cautious of... HKD in TKD studios. Not all of these studios are teaching HKD, but HKD based defense techniques, even though they advertise HKD. Understand this, HKD players learn a specific fighting mindset. A way to move, act and react. Unlike TKD, we don't do a lot of bouncing, hopping and moving. To us that is a waste of energy. Yes it is a good idea to have blood flowing and your joints and muscles warmed up before a figh, but if you work out on a regular basis and learn to stretch right, then there is no reason to worry. 
The only true issue I have from HKD in TKD schools is that the TKD is gona most likely be the primary art and primary way of thinking. You see our midset is part of what makes up HKD.

Luck!! and for gods sake have funn!!!!!!!


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