# Pacquiao beaten by an Aussie.



## drop bear (Jul 2, 2017)

Which makes us cool. Pacquiao vs horn played out in Brisbane yesterday with some good technical boxing. Horn won on points.


----------



## JowGaWolf (Jul 2, 2017)

Lots of head butting. Was it a good fight?


----------



## drop bear (Jul 2, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> Lots of head butting. Was it a good fight?



A couple of pretty cool takedowns as well.

Two forward fighters are going to clash heads. Boxing is a tough sport.


----------



## Headhunter (Jul 3, 2017)

Beaten even though he completely out struck him the whole fight


----------



## drop bear (Jul 3, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> Beaten even though he completely out struck him the whole fight
> 
> 
> View attachment 20867



Its a controversy. Punch stats are not boxing judges.


----------



## Gerry Seymour (Jul 4, 2017)

drop bear said:


> Its a controversy. Punch stats are not boxing judges.


I understand less than nothing about boxing scores. How does someone out-punch their opponent (more landed, higher percentage in all categories) and lose by score? Is it a perception of damage done, control of the fight, or what?


----------



## Headhunter (Jul 4, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> I understand less than nothing about boxing scores. How does someone out-punch their opponent (more landed, higher percentage in all categories) and lose by score? Is it a perception of damage done, control of the fight, or what?


I think a lot of the time the judges don't even know....


----------



## Headhunter (Jul 4, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> I understand less than nothing about boxing scores. How does someone out-punch their opponent (more landed, higher percentage in all categories) and lose by score? Is it a perception of damage done, control of the fight, or what?


Also the fact it was in his hometown probably helped him out a lot


----------



## JP3 (Jul 4, 2017)

drop bear said:


> Which makes us cool.


Nah. Aussies were cool before then.  Doesn't that just mean that Manny's older?


----------



## JR 137 (Jul 4, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> I think a lot of the time the judges don't even know....


I could be wrong because it was quite a long time ago, but I'm 99% sure the judges all had Mike Tyson a good bit ahead of Buster Douglas when Douglas knocked him out.

I remember Jim Lampley reading the score cards and saying afterwards "What fight were they watching?"


----------



## Headhunter (Jul 5, 2017)

JR 137 said:


> I could be wrong because it was quite a long time ago, but I'm 99% sure the judges all had Mike Tyson a good bit ahead of Buster Douglas when Douglas knocked him out.
> 
> I remember Jim Lampley reading the score cards and saying afterwards "What fight were they watching?"


Yeah well I believe there's a lot of corruption in boxing and mma...lots of money involved very easy for judges to tip things there way


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> I understand less than nothing about boxing scores. How does someone out-punch their opponent (more landed, higher percentage in all categories) and lose by score? Is it a perception of damage done, control of the fight, or what?



There is more to it than punch stats. I think it is effective punches and other stuff. I can't tell very well with these things.

He was judged independently and still came out on top.

Judges confirm decision for Horn over Pacquiao


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

Double post.


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> Yeah well I believe there's a lot of corruption in boxing and mma...lots of money involved very easy for judges to tip things there way



But punch stats are impartial?


----------



## SOD-WC (Jul 12, 2017)

i still dont believe that a person getting higher scores wont be the winner? Its like getting number one rank in the class but they chose then 2nd in place to get the medal. 
does the link really "explain" the results? becuase i think i might have missed it? 

im aussie btw so not defending another country.


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

SOD-WC said:


> i still dont believe that a person getting higher scores wont be the winner? Its like getting number one rank in the class but they chose then 2nd in place to get the medal.
> does the link really "explain" the results? becuase i think i might have missed it?
> 
> im aussie btw so not defending another country.



It is really complicated.

How does scoring in boxing actually work? (It's not just about punching)

The best advice here is knock em out and leave no doubt.


----------



## SOD-WC (Jul 12, 2017)

thanks drop bear i get it a bit more.......but still the stat figures from the match shows pacquiao dominated in pretty much everything. Also seeing the score card and how he is only a few points away from being the winner still confuses me how the judges scored ....... ill just leave it as that, no point it trying to figure out what drive them to that decision.


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

SOD-WC said:


> thanks drop bear i get it a bit more.......but still the stat figures from the match shows pacquiao dominated in pretty much everything. Also seeing the score card and how he is only a few points away from being the winner still confuses me how the judges scored ....... ill just leave it as that, no point it trying to figure out what drive them to that decision.



Provided the stats are correct.


----------



## SOD-WC (Jul 12, 2017)

drop bear said:


> Provided the stats are correct.


oh i just looked at photos (dont know how to attach photo via phone) of both their faces after the match......COME ON clearly u can see whos face has been punched in more  .......... deep breaths......... happy thoughts.........


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

SOD-WC said:


> oh i just looked at photos (dont know how to attach photo via phone) of both their faces after the match......COME ON clearly u can see whos face has been punched in more  .......... deep breaths......... happy thoughts.........



So you have never seen a royce gracie fight?


----------



## SOD-WC (Jul 12, 2017)

drop bear said:


> So you have never seen a royce gracie fight?


is there a particular one you r referring too? but his fights arnt boxing so the rules would be different r they not?


----------



## Brian R. VanCise (Jul 12, 2017)

So I watched this fight and thought it was really close.  I felt Horn was coming forward and that exhibited a lot of ring control.  Manny had moments of brilliance in counter fighting.  In a really close fight who knows which way the judges will go.  Manny seemed to have no problem with the judges scores and since he has a stipulation in his contract that there will be a rematch he will get another shot at Horn and an even bigger pay day!


----------



## drop bear (Jul 12, 2017)

SOD-WC said:


> is there a particular one you r referring too? but his fights arnt boxing so the rules would be different r they not?



 kimo is a good one. But royce used to get panel beaten in fights.


----------



## Tony Dismukes (Jul 12, 2017)

The 10 point must scoring system can produce some weird results, especially since 10-8 and 10-7 rounds are typically awarded only for knockdowns or extremely dominant rounds.

Imagine fighters A and B have a 12 round match ...

Fighter B edges out his opponent in 7 rounds, averaging 10 punches landed per round, while A averages only 9. (For purposes of simplification, we'll stick to just punches landed and skip the other factors, although the principle would be the same for those.) That's seven 10-9 rounds for B/

Fighter A wins 5 rounds, but by a wider margin, averaging 15 punches landed  per round while B stays consistent with an average of 10. Unless B gets knocked down, those rounds will also probably be scored as 10-9.

At the end of the fight, fighter A has landed a total of 138 punches, while fighter B has only landed 120. Nevertheless, Fighter B wins the fight with a score of 115-113.

It's a similar concept to how a US presidential candidate can win the electoral college while losing the popular vote.


----------



## punisher73 (Jul 18, 2017)

That's what is hard for boxing, is what style do the judges like?  What fighter looks like they are doing more?

What would have happened even if the independent judges would have ruled in Pacquiao's favor?  Everyone remembers the Bradley robbery against Pacquiao and an independent committee did find that Pac should have won the fight.


----------



## drop bear (Jul 18, 2017)

punisher73 said:


> That's what is hard for boxing, is what style do the judges like?  What fighter looks like they are doing more?
> 
> What would have happened even if the independent judges would have ruled in Pacquiao's favor?  Everyone remembers the Bradley robbery against Pacquiao and an independent committee did find that Pac should have won the fight.



The thing is you don't get to that level of boxing and not know the rules of boxing and how judges judge.

That is the sport they both willingly compete in.


----------



## punisher73 (Jul 18, 2017)

drop bear said:


> The thing is you don't get to that level of boxing and not know the rules of boxing and how judges judge.
> 
> That is the sport they both willingly compete in.



I agree, but judges still have preferences on what they like to look for.  You can have all three judges look at a flurry of activity and score it three different ways based on what aspect they are looking for.  I have heard many comment that this occurred in this fight, when Horn would throw a flurry and didn't really land anything at all but was the "busier" fighter even though Pac landed more punches and did more damage.


----------



## drop bear (Jul 18, 2017)

punisher73 said:


> I agree, but judges still have preferences on what they like to look for.  You can have all three judges look at a flurry of activity and score it three different ways based on what aspect they are looking for.  I have heard many comment that this occurred in this fight, when Horn would throw a flurry and didn't really land anything at all but was the "busier" fighter even though Pac landed more punches and did more damage.



Yeah. But twice?


----------



## punisher73 (Jul 19, 2017)

drop bear said:


> Yeah. But twice?



I meant with the controversy of the initial decision.  I will be honest, I have not watched this one yet.  

It does sound like a very close fight either way.

The one I still can't believe was the first Bradley fight with Pac.  The independent group came back all in favor for Pac.  But, nothing happened the loss is still on the record and he smashed him in the rematch.  Boxing (and MMA) has some really bad decisions that make you wonder what they were watching.  But, in this case from what I have read about it, the fight was judged correctly, even though people didn't like it.


----------

