# youngest age for wing chun



## spatulahunter (Aug 17, 2005)

What do you guys feel is the youngest age a child should be allowed to learn wing chun at?
Wing chun is a fairly aggresive art where the moves are designed to hurt or maim, so with that taken into consideration would it be safe to teach to younger students or are they better off to start with a competitive art like wrestling or a calmer one like tai chi where martial applications arent always the most important?
I personally think they may be ready around 10-12 depending on the maturity level of the student. they could safely learn forms and basic drills but the applications would have to come later when they are able to handle the consequences of using techniques that can seriously hurt someone.

Just curious to see what you guys think


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## 7starmantis (Aug 17, 2005)

Its not true that others arts (especially tai chi) don't have serious techniques. Its the manner in which the child is taught not the art per se. Mantis has much more breaks, eye gouges and such than WC but we teach the young kids just basics of the system. The advanced techinques are too hard for them anyways. As they progress they laern more advanced techniques. You dont have to show every application to every move at first either.

7sm

7sm


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## spatulahunter (Aug 18, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Its not true that others arts (especially tai chi) don't have serious techniques. Its the manner in which the child is taught not the art per se. Mantis has much more breaks, eye gouges and such than WC but we teach the young kids just basics of the system. The advanced techinques are too hard for them anyways. As they progress they laern more advanced techniques. You dont have to show every application to every move at first either.
> 
> 7sm
> 
> 7sm




i believe my point was not well communicated about tai chi, I understand that there are some serious techniques in that art but the way it is commonly taught even to adults is focused on the flow of chi and internal strength while the martial applications get pushed to the way side. And the other art i listed was wrestling which is a sport and doesnt have the dangerous techniques. that is why i picked those 2 arts as examples.

so is there a minimum age at your school?


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## 7starmantis (Aug 19, 2005)

Yes we start at 4 years old, but not because we dont want to teach dangerous techniques to anyone younger, but because we dont want to have to babysit (which could be said for 4 and 5 year olds as well). A child of 5 years old is not going to understand or have the ability to perform a lethal technique in reality, so why try and teach them that, teach basics and drills, teach self defense and forms, teach sparring and hands, but why go into the lethal aspects with a child at all?

7sm


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## ed-swckf (Aug 20, 2005)

Personally i prefer to teach no one younger than 16 or 17, its not set in stone just a rough approxamation on when i feel people are prepared to learn and gain from wing chun in a mental and physical way.  If i were to teach kids who were younger i would prefer them to be accompanied by an adult.


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## 7starmantis (Aug 22, 2005)

Yes but if I'm doing a set technique from 4 years old to 17 and then at 17 truly understand it and the concept and application, how much more natural and effective is it going to be to me after having done it for so long?

7sm


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## ed-swckf (Aug 22, 2005)

7starmantis said:
			
		

> Yes but if I'm doing a set technique from 4 years old to 17 and then at 17 truly understand it and the concept and application, how much more natural and effective is it going to be to me after having done it for so long?
> 
> 7sm


Are you talking to me?  If so i think we have crossed wires.  However understanding the concepts and principles of wing chun does make it a lot more effective, as for how much more, well i don't believe there is a universal unit of measurement for that.  Like i said, its a personal preference that isn't set in stone but i would definitely teach 4 year olds in a completely different manner to the way i teach now and i would still require an accompanying adult.


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## Jam_master (Sep 22, 2005)

spatulahunter said:
			
		

> What do you guys feel is the youngest age a child should be allowed to learn wing chun at?
> Wing chun is a fairly aggressive art where the moves are designed to hurt or maim, so with that taken into consideration would it be safe to teach to younger students or are they better off to start with a competitive art like wrestling or a calmer one like tai chi where martial applications arent always the most important?
> I personally think they may be ready around 10-12 depending on the maturity level of the student. they could safely learn forms and basic drills but the applications would have to come later when they are able to handle the consequences of using techniques that can seriously hurt someone.
> 
> Just curious to see what you guys think


 
 Something to consider

 Jet Li had mentioned in an interview when he studied, his first 3 years was  devoted to hard physical training, mainly attributes like, (flexibility, strength, balance, and agility training). After the first 3yrs he would be moved on to 3 years of soft internal disciplines, like still and moving meditation and learning Buddhist, and Taoist doctrines to balance him out as a human being and martial artist. After that he would go to practicing the art to perfection doing forms, learning applications, and so on. He had been practicing since he was 4 or 5years of age, and was a champion wushu expert since the age of 10 or 15, and people that have met or known him have said he is a humble, nice, and compassionate man with real fight ability and knowledge. I think it also pays to  note that when he studied, his master becames also his surrogate father as well as his martial teacher. It is a time honored tradition of close teacher / student relationship of the  highest level, where the teacher's word is law and irrefutable, and he does assume the role of father, something none of us here in the USA are quite prepared to do by the way due how our culture is.

 I believe you can start them very young, but not without teaching them good human values first to balance them out, like (respect to all life, compassion, forgiveness, good heart, an so on). And what better time to learn these thing than when they are young and still developing, and are most able to absorb all you throw at them, especialy good human values.

 Perhaps it's better to show the the forms and build a good foundation in them first, like a good solid horse, forward energy, footwork, basics of trapping and jamming, and other more defense oriented techniques that can take up quite a long time for him/her to master anyways and it will keep them interested also. Then later on when they can comprehend and they show some maturity, at your own discretion of coarse, you can then explain some of the more deadly stuff like finger jabs to the eyes, pressure points, knee breaks, and so on, but of coarse teaching always good values and the consequences of using any technique or fighting in general should always also be at the top of every lesson.

 Personally I thing that unless your totally prepared and willing to put in that kind of dedication of almost raising another persons child other than your own, unless it is your own, I wouldn't take on such a responsibilty. There's just way to much involved than just teaching martial arts. And if you plan on teaching older students as well, you probably already know from experience that you can't just teach anyone either. You have a lot of jokers out there who want to learn all for the wrong reasons of looking to prove something to other and seriously looking to hurt someone as well as endangering themselves too, which is something else you'll need to judge as a teacher too before taking on anyone.

 Best of luck!

 JM


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## arnisador (Sep 23, 2005)

spatulahunter said:
			
		

> I personally think they may be ready around 10-12 depending on the maturity level of the student.


 This seems reasonable to me. For most arts, I feel that until they're about at puberty, training is of limited value.


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## bcbernam777 (Oct 21, 2005)

The good thing about Wing Chun is that it starts of at the Sui Lum Tao level which is really about the development of internal power and to train the techniques as in structure, it is not reallly until CK level that they start to learn how to apply those in a fighting situation, now at the SLT level you can introduce a lot of basic drills, (making shure that you dont make their hands tense) if you are that way inclined, so therefore you could quit easiliy build a solid curriculum on Sui Lum Tao and call that the childrens class starting probaly from 6--10, thereafter 10 onwards you can start to introduce them to the chum kui level. My daughter who is 2.5 is already doing the Sui Lum Tao form

I personally dont teach anyone under the age of 10, because of the level of Wing Chun I teach, I have little in the way of drills, unless it is the drill a concept, and the drills at times may mean getting hit, although I try to minimise this there is no way I can stop it. Preferablly the age would be 12-13. I dont particulary have the energy or the inclination to try to build a seperate curriculum for children, but that is my choice based on the long range vision I have for the school.


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## Flying Crane (Oct 21, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> This seems reasonable to me. For most arts, I feel that until they're about at puberty, training is of limited value.


Yes, you can find yourself becoming a babysitter if they are too young.


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## dmax999 (Oct 21, 2005)

I personally think Tai Chi is not appropriate for young childern, except in non-standard cases (Like childern of the teacher).  Kids lack the patience and focus to get far.

WC doesn't rely on much flexability, say compared to Shaolin styles, and the advantage of young kids is felxability.  I would personally suggest a type of Shaolin style for under 10-12 so they can keep flexability better then other kids.  After that, force them to take a couple classes in other styles, go to tournaments, whatever, so they can make their own decision on what they want to continue.

I have seen kids do great in Shaolin (Northern Kung-Fu) styles, before age 6-8 it is just a playroom for them though.  It has simple to understand concepts, builds strength, endurance, and flexability.  It is a great starting point for most other styles or to just stay in.  Almost all CMA has a large amount in common with typical Shaolin styles, and they will learn stuff useful in any other MA.

For the straight answer, youngest for WC?  I would say about 12, and thats probably pushing it.  Just my personal opinion though, your local WC schools may be better able to handle kids then where I took it.


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## brothershaw (Oct 30, 2005)

I think around 10 -12 you could start them on basic stuff, footwork , kicking , punching and the first form. After about 2-3 years if they are still around then you can start moving them along.


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## Dalum (Nov 1, 2005)

Flying Crane said:
			
		

> Yes, you can find yourself becoming a babysitter if they are too young.


 
I can totally relate to that statement.  But it isn't the fault of the kids as much as the parents.  Currently, of the 2 classes I do every Tuesday night, I've got maybe 1/4 of the students willing to excel and be more than a Power Ranger in their head.


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## barriecusvein (Nov 10, 2005)

The school i learn at teaches from about 8 years old. But they have a totally different system of learning to the seniors. They do loads of drills and chi sau, and play forms a lot, but hardly any real combat fighting. I've found when they move up into the class I'm in they have a really good training ethic and a good understanding of the concepts of WC. I think they start at about the right age, but they have to be tought very carefully.


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## 7starmantis (Nov 10, 2005)

Yeah, thats the way it should be. Welcome to the boards by the way!

7sm


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## barriecusvein (Nov 11, 2005)

why thank you!!


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## arnisador (Nov 11, 2005)

Yes, welcome! Always good to see more Wing Chun people here!


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## ed-swckf (Nov 12, 2005)

And welcome from me too!


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