# Iron Palm Training



## hogstooth (Oct 12, 2008)

Can anyone tell me the steps of conditioning in iron palm?


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## clfsean (Oct 12, 2008)

qi gong & conditioning with medicine specific to your brand/branch of iron paln. Indeed... questions for your sifu.


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## punisher73 (Oct 12, 2008)

clfsean said:


> qi gong & conditioning with medicine specific to your brand/branch of iron paln. Indeed... questions for your sifu.


 
True, although there are some generic things that will overlap.  Many branches have their own version of dit da jow which is used to help with the iron palm process.  Many schools still keep this a closely guarded secret.

If you do not have a sifu that can teach you that skill, there are some programs on the market that can help you.

www.wle.com has an iron palm kit (comes with dvd, 2 bottles of jow, beginner and intermediate bag)

Also, if you go to coiling dragon they have the jow, etc.
https://www.coilingdragoninternalar...=30_15&zenid=e251c9fb1933b30f089b89c70c57612a

To be VERY generic, iron palm relies on striking progressively heavier bags to condition the hand.  Many schools go mung bean, gravel, steel shot.  Some schools train a tiger claw type strike, while others claim that hitting with the fingertips will cause health problems due to the accupuncture points located there.


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## jow yeroc (Oct 13, 2008)

Good info, but ultimately i'd agree with clfsean.  Best to have a sifu
who knows what they're talking about to guide you thru this.  Could 
damage your hands/joints.


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## pstarr (Oct 14, 2008)

Yes, authentic iron palm training is not something you should attempt without the guidance of a knowledgeable teacher...


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 14, 2008)

As already stated.... find a Sifu.

Mess up in Iron palm training and you could be facing old age (or sooner) with a lot of debilitating pain. 

You need a teacher to show you how to train properly and fix you when you mess up.


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## ggg214 (Oct 14, 2008)

as i know, iron palm training contains two: methods of training and chinese medicine.the latter one is more important.and only be accepted as a disciple, one can get how to prepare the chinese medicine for training.


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## mograph (Oct 14, 2008)

Even with a Sifu, intense Iron Palm training can really stiffen your hands excessively, and you'd regret it in middle age. I met a fellow at a dinner who had been training for thirty years, and he regretted doing Iron Palm. He didn't break his hands, but price of the toughening was decreased mobility. 

Personally, I think that unless you need toughened hands with fused knuckles to save your life on a regular basis, I'd avoid it. Or reduce the intensity level.

Just my opinion.


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## Black Tortoise (Oct 14, 2008)

mograph said:


> Even with a Sifu, intense Iron Palm training can really stiffen your hands excessively, and you'd regret it in middle age. I met a fellow at a dinner who had been training for thirty years, and he regretted doing Iron Palm. He didn't break his hands, but price of the toughening was decreased mobility.
> 
> Personally, I think that unless you need toughened hands with fused knuckles to save your life on a regular basis, I'd avoid it. Or reduce the intensity level.
> 
> Just my opinion.


I believe this to be false! I personally know of one practitioner of over 50 years who has almost full mobility in his hand(he may not be able to pick up a paper clip off the floor but big deal). 

To the original poster..The long and short is there are many different styles of iron palm, *none* should be considered without proper instruction.


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## clfsean (Oct 15, 2008)

mograph said:


> Even with a Sifu, intense Iron Palm training can really stiffen your hands excessively, and you'd regret it in middle age. I met a fellow at a dinner who had been training for thirty years, and he regretted doing Iron Palm. He didn't break his hands, but price of the toughening was decreased mobility.
> 
> Personally, I think that unless you need toughened hands with fused knuckles to save your life on a regular basis, I'd avoid it. Or reduce the intensity level.
> 
> Just my opinion.



Gotta disagree with this. I've met a lot of people who have practiced Iron Palm through out their CMA training & have no issues. I've also met some who did. Normally those who did had shady training, no medicine or were "self taught". Everybody I know that had quality medicine along with a structured regime of conditoning, qi gong & dit da jow suffered no ill effects. 

The "fused knuckles" description sounds more JMA/OMA to me from hitting a makiwara. Every person I've met (my sifu, his sifu, his training brothers, etc...) have no problem with finger dexterity & mobility. Granted their hands are thicker than what'd you see a person that doesn't do any kind of iron palm or similar conditioning with hands or hard work with their hands. But there's no kind of loss of use or function with the hands & fingers with no physical deformities to the knuckles & joints.

A person to teach you, who was taught correctly themselves, is the only way to go.


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 15, 2008)

mograph said:


> Even with a Sifu, intense Iron Palm training can really stiffen your hands excessively, and you'd regret it in middle age. I met a fellow at a dinner who had been training for thirty years, and he regretted doing Iron Palm. He didn't break his hands, but price of the toughening was decreased mobility.
> 
> Personally, I think that unless you need toughened hands with fused knuckles to save your life on a regular basis, I'd avoid it. Or reduce the intensity level.
> 
> Just my opinion.


 
If you have a sifu that "REALLY" knows (well trained in) Iron Palm training this does not happen. If you try to train this on your own or have a sifu who is not well trained in Iron palm training himself then yes this is a very good possibility.

Example: part of my training is hitting trees. If you go out and start pounding trees you WILL hurt your hands. If however your sifu shows you how to strike and tells you what sound you are listening for then all works fine.


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## punisher73 (Oct 15, 2008)

If done right, makiwara will not cause damage to your hand.  Most people misuse it and try to be all macho and talk about punching it until it bleeds etc.

A makiwara should have give to it and should have a pad on it to protect the hand.

Use common sense in this and you will be fine.  Get Wing Lam's book on Iron Palm it is VERY descriptive on how to train iron palm and is designed for long distance students that don't have access to a sifu.


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## mograph (Oct 15, 2008)

The next time I see the fellow with the knuckles, I'll ask him for some details regarding his training.

Cheers, all!


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## mograph (Oct 15, 2008)

So what, biomechanically speaking, happens to your hands through proper Iron Palm training? What happens to the skin, joints, bones, muscles, tendons ... ?


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## clfsean (Oct 15, 2008)

mograph said:


> So what, biomechanically speaking, happens to your hands through proper Iron Palm training? What happens to the skin, joints, bones, muscles, tendons ... ?



In my experience... the hand becomes thicker & more muscular, the bones will continue to gain density just as they would with knuckle or regular pushups, skin doesn't change if ddj is used properly (if anything, it softens with results like a moisturizer except with a better smell), tendons & ligaments strengthen as well. 

"Iron" comes from when the hand tenses at the point of impact transferring the energy of the strike, then returning to normal once the strike is complete. There's no need for your hand to become unusable for "iron" striking skills.


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## ggg214 (Oct 15, 2008)

as i have been told, through these kinds of hard training, like hit trees etc., may damage your body. but meanwhile, there are some corresponding methods for recovering before you are going to next training.
if one's body have many thick calluses in body, it may be understand that their body is taugh, comparing to ordinary persons, but it's not so taugh. 
it's hard to imagine that the most taugh body is real soft, smooth, as a child, even the skin.
one of my brother who is training shao lin zhan zhuang for many years,have a couple of  baby-skin hands.but when he push hands, the power is so strong.
when you see old pics of chinese grandmasters, most of them are thin,but we all know that in their "tiny" body, it can burst huge deadly power.


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## JadeDragon3 (Oct 27, 2008)

Find a qualified teacher and use the right Dit Da Jow for what your doing.


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## Yoshiyahu (Dec 7, 2008)

My Sifu told me as for training Iron skills I should the following?

1. Get a bucket fill it rice and practice stabbing the bucket of rice with fingers and then squeezing the rice and let it run down my fingers and re stab the rice over and over again for an hour. He said eventually move up to Sand, gravel then use steel shots in bucket. This should be practice for one Hour.

2. Also he said get a canvas bag an fill it with sand practice dropping down force on it with my Gum Sau,Jum sau, and Jeong. He said after a year move up to gravel then progress to steel shots. He suggested not to force your palm to bag. But let your force just drop down naturally. 

3. Tiger claw of course he said to rake the tree bark off the tree with my finger tips. An after about year I will be able utilize my Tiger cal to rip flesh.

4. To harden the body he suggested I hugged a tree every day for atleast ten minutes. Well doing the first time bare chested the bark kinda hurts. lol...


Does anyone else train this way?


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