# 'open carry'



## FearlessFreep (Jun 9, 2008)

http://waronyou.com/2008/06/packing...d-of-hiding-their-weapons-embrace-open-carry/


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## KenpoTex (Jun 9, 2008)

While on some level I understand the "educate the public and exercise your rights" philosophy, I prefer to keep my weapon concealed for a few reasons.

1) Tactical advantage.  If they don't know I have it (and therefore aren't expecting an armed response) I'm going to have the element of surprise on my side since I'll be shooting while they're still going "WTF just happened?"  Another consideration is that while I'm sure there is a significant "deterrent factor" to open carry, I feel there is also a liability.  The bad guy might just decide to take you out of the equation right off the bat because he sees that you are armed, whereas if it's concealed, we're back to having surprise on our side.  

2) Being the "gray man."  This one is closely related to number 1, basically the idea is that you don't wear anything or act in a manner that would draw unecessary or undue attention to yourself.  This is also the reason I don't wear "gun" apparel (NRA hat, your favorite gun manufacturer's name on your shirt, etc.) or martial-arts apparel.

3) Image.  Many of the "open carry" advocates with whom I've interacted (both in person and on various forums) are exactly the type I don't really want being viewed as the "stereotype of the American gun owner."   I definately respect their right to carry in this manner if they choose, however, many of them are so "in your face" and obnoxious about it that their actions end up being counterproductive.  Instead of educating people and getting them used to the idea of an armed society, they end up alienating more people (as if we don't have enough of a problem).

Just my $0.02...


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## jks9199 (Jun 9, 2008)

kenpotex said:


> 3) Image.  Many of the "open carry" advocates with whom I've interacted (both in person and on various forums) are exactly the type I don't really want being viewed as the "stereotype of the American gun owner."   I definately respect their right to carry in this manner if they choose, however, many of them are so "in your face" and obnoxious about it that their actions end up being counterproductive.  Instead of educating people and getting them used to the idea of an armed society, they end up alienating more people (as if we don't have enough of a problem).
> 
> Just my $0.02...



OpenCarry.org stages events where they do their best to call attention to their guns, get people to call the cops, and then they try to get the cops to make mistakes.  I'm not saying that the cops who aren't properly aware of the gun laws are right -- but neither are the folks who set up disturbances.

If you choose to carry openly, and do so nonchalantly with confidence, you're not likely to run into problems -- assuming it's legal.  If you carry openly and pat the gun every two seconds, shift in the seat and complain about how the holster doesn't fit in the armrests... You're gonna freak folks out.

And that's really the thing... What's gained by freaking people out?


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## KenpoTex (Jun 9, 2008)

jks9199 said:


> OpenCarry.org stages events where they do their best to call attention to their guns, get people to call the cops, and then they try to get the cops to make mistakes. I'm not saying that the cops who aren't properly aware of the gun laws are right -- but neither are the folks who set up disturbances.
> 
> If you choose to carry openly, and do so nonchalantly with confidence, you're not likely to run into problems -- assuming it's legal. If you carry openly and pat the gun every two seconds, shift in the seat and complain about how the holster doesn't fit in the armrests... You're gonna freak folks out.
> 
> And that's really the thing... What's gained by freaking people out?


Exactly


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## FearlessFreep (Jun 9, 2008)

> OpenCarry.org stages events where they do their best to call attention to their guns, get people to call the cops, and then they try to get the cops to make mistakes. I'm not saying that the cops who aren't properly aware of the gun laws are right -- but neither are the folks who set up disturbances.



Lotta folks with guns trying to make a lotta cops (also with guns) make mistakes?  No, I don't see any potential problems with that at all


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## Deaf Smith (Jun 9, 2008)

I'm like Ken. I keep my gun concealed, unless I'm in a state that demands I expose it.

Why? 1) Most civilians who carry guns do not have real snatch resistant holsters, and thus exposing the weapon is not such a good idea. 

2) All you have really done is scare away the zeros who would not probably try to mug you anyway. The real bad ones will just take into account you have a gun and blind side you first (just as they would if you wear karate logos or such.) 

3) You do upset the bambi grass eaters to and that's a no-no.

The whole point of CCW is so the bad guys don't know who is armed. If they stick up a store, they feel real naked as anyone behind them can be the one who fires. It does make a difference.

Deaf


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## tellner (Jun 11, 2008)

Deaf Smith said:


> 2) All you have really done is scare away the zeros who would not probably try to mug you anyway. The real bad ones will just take into account you have a gun and blind side you first (just as they would if you wear karate logos or such.)


More likely they'll decide that someone else is easier prey. A predator isn't looking for a fight. He's looking for an easy meal.



> 3) You do upset the bambi grass eaters to and that's a no-no.



What do you expect from no neck, cousin-humpin', third grade dropout gun loons? Don't like that kind of slur? Don't use it yourself. 



> The whole point of CCW is so the bad guys don't know who is armed. If they stick up a store, they feel real naked as anyone behind them can be the one who fires. It does make a difference.



That's one point. Another one is open carry would have been DOA. It's a lot like the gays. A lot of people who are uncomfortable with the idea of gay people are willing to look the other way and pretend they don't exist as long as the queers are invisible. The Bilitis and Matuchin Societies were off the radar for a long time. There were lots of "Boston marriages". It only became a national political issue when they started demanding that they be treated like human beings and be allowed to go about their business just like anyone else. It remains to be seen whether there will be a Stonewall Riot for gun owners, whether most will be willing to continue as they are or if slow acceptance will work.

Same thing with guns. A lot of people are uncomfortable with you carrying around a weapon. They're willing to look the other way as long as you're invisible. They really don't like the idea of knowing that you personally have a firearm strapped to your body. The political types who got concealed carry laws passed understood this. That's why the NRA has been very cool to open carry campaigns.


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## Deaf Smith (Jun 11, 2008)

tellner said:


> What do you expect from no neck, cousin-humpin', third grade dropout gun loons? Don't like that kind of slur? Don't use it yourself.


 
tellner,

Long time ago I had this girlfriend. She was the, uh, grass eating type. She said I was a redneck cause I owned a truck. Yea, Toyota. Whew what was some red neck truck. I was not insulted, I was amused.

For me to get my dander up over some 'no neck, cousin-humpin', third grade dropout gun loon' talk would indicate I was real insecure as to my identity. And since I pretty much know who I am, it wouldn't bother me. I'd be just real amused.

On the other hand, I used to have a boss who was real real liberal. Very well educated on technical things, but not at all on how the world works. Fortunatly he realized most of us were Texans, and in Texas everyone has a gun. He didn't even say much to our real 'red neck' who kept a Mossburg cruiser 12 gauge in his truck, exposed (and I told him to stash it where people could not see it.) Maybe he never knew! Both him and the 'real redneck' are gone. 

But our boss was still shocked at crime and didn't have a clue as to what to do. All he could offer was for people to talk to each other and buy more locks for the house.

Now I dunno about the gay issues. One consultant that came from California to work on a project with me was shocked there were so many churches! He had never seen so many. Like we had one on every corner from the way he talked. Didn't help that I was Catholic....

So around here, gay marriage does not seem to be thought of as a Constitutional Right. At least we don't seem to be able to find it in the Bill of Rights.

Deaf


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## chinto (Jun 12, 2008)

I have no problem with open carry, and think it is a right .. in fact in my states laws it is a right... I would have a problem with some one who was carrying a weapon in an open holster or a concealed weapon using that fact to intimidate some one, or harass some one.  but just carrying the weapon on a belt holster or rifle slung... no problem if they are not being asses or trying to some how threaten openly some one with the weapon or its presence intentionally.

unsafe swinging of it or sweeping the muzzle on people or other stupidity, hammer them for reckless endangering and mensing.

but then I would like to see any one who can legally buy and own a fire arm be able to carry it how ever they want. openly or concealed with out permits or what have you. But I would also hold them 100% responsible for the use and or missuses of that weapon.


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