# Similarities in Church and Martial Arts?



## thardey (Jun 6, 2008)

Is anyone else as struck as I am by the similarities between Western Religion, and the Western Versions of Eastern Martial Arts?


They both promise a way to prepare for an event that can't be absolutely predicted, and can't be understood until it's been experienced. (Death/afterlife for Religion, and "Street Fights" for MA).
Those who have experienced said event can't explain it to those who haven't experienced it.
No matter what actions are taken, at the point of trial, the "win" is determined more by attitude than training.
The teachers are too often more obsessed with personal gain than actually training others, so they water down the teachings to make them more palatable.
Belittling of other denominations/styles is accomplished by over-generalization and straw man attacks.
The insecure often find refuge in either, and often become aggressive and hostile once they are in "the club."
For those who are confident, they have little problem interacting with others that don't agree with them.
Some teachers find pupils because of the lineage of their teachers, others find them by having a less-than-perfect lineage, but by teaching the truth.
The majority of people join so that they can remove their basic fears, and feel safe.
The minority join so that they can improve their own selves, and be able to accept their responsibilities.
Although I believe that my own training hall is the best, ultimately, the best answer for those looking for a place to learn is, "The one that will help _you_ improve."
You have to have a proper attitude of learning/submission before you can get any benefit.
You still have to realize that while being respectful to your teacher, and taking what they say in an attitude of trust, ultimately, it is up to you to teach yourself.
Once a week is not enough to improve. It has to be a daily pursuit.
Your personal journey may be like many others, but what helped you may not be the answer for another, and vice-versa.
Depending on where you are in your journey, the answers to the same questions may be different at different times, without being wrong.
What may appear as "Secrets" to the beginner are really just truths that cannot be understood until other, more basic truths are accepted.
Simply repeating and repeating sayings are not enough, they have to be internalized to be useful.
You never know when you will need it, or what form it will take.
While you are excited about what you are learning, many people, even your close friends, won't understand, or care.
Politics and Titles can be extremely helpful, or extremely frustrating and distracting.
It's not a journey that can be made faster by training harder, it is a journey that takes time to come to maturity.
It is useless if the lessons are forgotten as soon as the student leaves the presence of the teacher.
Simply sitting in the training area does not make you improve. You have to participate to get the benefit.
Wearing the uniform or taking the name alone, does not make you a true student.
Sometimes the hardest part is not learning new things, but unlearning old things.
Instinct is a lousy teacher for how to be the most effective. You have to train against your natural thoughts to find the effective way.
You will be judged by the actions of others who have mis-represented you.
It is very hard to demonstrate your effectiveness in an on-line forum.
 ??????
Any more thoughts to add?


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## Empty Hands (Jun 6, 2008)

31. Funny outfits.
32. Veneration of saint/ancestor figures.
33. Veneration of a mythical past "Golden Age".


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## thardey (Jun 6, 2008)

Good ones!


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## zDom (Jun 9, 2008)

34. Many of those who no longer show up promise they are coming back soon when they run into a current practitioner


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## Ninjamom (Jun 10, 2008)

35. Your religion/martial art is useless if it only works in church/dojo, but can't be applied on 'the street'.

36. People who know you might not see the value of your teaching/training, until they see you use it in a real pressure situation.

37. There's a whole lot more to either than just learning a new set of vocabulary.

38.  The more mature practitioners strive to be good examples, to encourage younger followers.

39. The more mature the practitioner, the more awareness there seems to be of one's own shortcomings and faults.

40. Fellow-practitioners serious about improving in the journey end up being some of your best friends.

41. Correction for one's mistakes is seen as a gift, more precious than gold.


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## Monadnock (Jun 10, 2008)

Seems these could be applied to anything people take up. Makes you rethink just "what" it is we're describing here... Maybe it's "who".


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## thardey (Jun 12, 2008)

42. Immature practitioners often don't realize that they're not ready to apply their studies, and when they get beat, it gives the whole organization a bad name.

43. Leaders are sometimes chosen by time spent in the organization, not time spent actually studying.


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## hkfuie (Nov 2, 2008)

Amazing thread!  I wish I had something clever to add, but I am not that clever!   Only clever enough to enjoy y'alls contributions!


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## IcemanSK (Nov 2, 2008)

hkfuie said:


> Amazing thread! I wish I had something clever to add, but I am not that clever! Only clever enough to enjoy y'alls contributions!


 
I'm glad I'm not the only one.:ultracool


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## terryl965 (Nov 2, 2008)

hkfuie said:


> Amazing thread! I wish I had something clever to add, but I am not that clever! Only clever enough to enjoy y'alls contributions!


 
I would have to agree


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## Nolerama (Nov 3, 2008)

Interchange "church" with "cult" and it's even funnier. I remember a thread about a NY CMA school that was a borderline cult...


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## IcemanSK (Nov 28, 2008)

Practitioners sometimes say they weren't at regular sessions because they were too busy "having fun" the night before. Isn't there fun in the regular session fun, also?

Some practioners think their training has no applications "in real life."


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## IcemanSK (Nov 28, 2008)

For some practitioners, their "style" is better than the "style" their neighbor is learning. Although they really can't tell you the difference between the name on their style's door & their neighbor's style.


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