# Bujinkan Curriculum



## Forever Training (Nov 22, 2013)

Hello, all.

I was wondering if there exists a set curriculum manual for the Bujinkan Dojo that shows the requirements for each kyu.

I imagine Masaaki Hatsumi has standardized this, for the purposes of consistency and completeness of training.

Does anyone know where one can find it?


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## Aiki Lee (Nov 22, 2013)

As far as I know it is not standardized and there is no set curriculum.


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## Tripitaka of AA (Nov 23, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Does anyone know where one can find it?



In the mind and experience of a good teacher, you will find it. Questions you have, will be answered.If on paper you hope to find it, then disappointed you shall be. If a rewind button in your own living room is your master, then knowledge that you seek will not be found. 
:yoda:


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## Forever Training (Nov 23, 2013)

Tripitaka of AA said:


> In the mind and experience of a good teacher, you will find it. Questions you have, will be answered.If on paper you hope to find it, then disappointed you shall be. If a rewind button in your own living room is your master, then knowledge that you seek will not be found.



Ah, but to rely on one's mind alone and therefore the minds of your paduan learners as they then become Shidoshi is to accept the inevitable losses in bits of the material with the transmission to each generation of your lineage.... and also to accept the inconsistencies that will inevitably occur from dojo to dojo.


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## Tony Dismukes (Nov 23, 2013)

Unless there have been some drastic changes in the Bujinkan in recent years, there is no standardized curriculum.  Nor are there consistent requirements for rank advancement.  Individual instructors may have their own curriculum and requirements, but it's not anything universally standardized by Hatsumi.


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## jks9199 (Nov 23, 2013)

As I understand it -- there's only one formalized test, and that's for godan.  That's the one where Hatsumi or one of a handful of designated very senior teachers swing a padded shinai at you when you're sitting quietly.  Pass or fail -- it's Hatsumi's call.  I don't think I've heard that he's let anyone else grade it, only deliver the strike.  And I've seen videos on YouTube where seemingly pretty similar reactions have been either pass or fail...  I have to assume that he sees something that I can't.


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## Hatsie (Nov 23, 2013)

jks9199 said:


> As I understand it -- there's only one formalized test, and that's for godan.  That's the one where Hatsumi or one of a handful of designated very senior teachers swing a padded shinai at you when you're sitting quietly.  Pass or fail -- it's Hatsumi's call.  I don't think I've heard that he's let anyone else grade it, only deliver the strike.  And I've seen videos on YouTube where seemingly pretty similar reactions have been either pass or fail...  I have to assume that he sees something that I can't.



Thats correct, but from 9th kyu to yondan pretty much everyone follows master Richard van donks black belt home study course, often the japanes shihan will refer to it several times during class, when they forget or cant do something, It's the only way to go !















GOT CHA!


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## Chris Parker (Nov 24, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Hello, all.
> 
> I was wondering if there exists a set curriculum manual for the Bujinkan Dojo that shows the requirements for each kyu.
> 
> ...



Er... you're not that familiar with the Bujinkan, then...?


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## Forever Training (Nov 24, 2013)

Chris Parker said:


> Er... you're not that familiar with the Bujinkan, then...?



Chris,

Having received my BB in another style, I am now contemplating training in the Bujinkan. Of the research I have done thus far, I find it fascinating, steeped in tradition and history, 
drawing its curriculum from the 9 ry&#363;ha of feudal Japan.

I recently visited a class at the only x-kan dojo near me (40 minutes away). New England Ninjutsu in Wallingford, CT. This is Shidoshi Kowalski's dojo, although he currently has some 
very impressive 4th degree Shidoshi-ho teaching class. Having a background in Chinese Kempo, I find Budo Taijutsu is very much outside my comfort zone, but that is exactly
what appeals to me.


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## Forever Training (Nov 24, 2013)

Hatsie said:


> Thats correct, but from 9th kyu to yondan pretty much everyone follows master Richard van donks black belt home study course, often the japanes shihan will refer to it several times during class, when they forget or cant do something, It's the only way to go !



Interesting. Is this the consensus among BBT practitioners here on MT? Should anyone interested in training in BBT get Van Donk's course, if only as a resource? (Thanks Hatsie.)


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## Forever Training (Nov 24, 2013)

jks9199 said:


> As I understand it -- there's only one formalized test, and that's for godan.  That's the one where Hatsumi or one of a handful of designated very senior teachers swing a padded shinai at you when you're sitting quietly.  Pass or fail -- it's Hatsumi's call.  I don't think I've heard that he's let anyone else grade it, only deliver the strike.  And I've seen videos on YouTube where seemingly pretty similar reactions have been either pass or fail...  I have to assume that he sees something that I can't.









   Just looked this up. The Sakki Test. Woa.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Nov 24, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Interesting. Is this the consensus among BBT practitioners here on MT? Should anyone interested in training in BBT get Van Donk's course, if only as a resource? (Thanks Hatsie.)



No he was joking!!!


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## Brian R. VanCise (Nov 24, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Chris,
> 
> Having received my BB in another style, I am now contemplating training in the Bujinkan. Of the research I have done thus far, I find it fascinating, steeped in tradition and history,
> drawing its curriculum from the 9 ry&#363;ha of feudal Japan.
> ...



If you can train at Greg's place that is absolutely great.  When he would come to the UofM for seminars they were excellent!!!  I mean really excellent.  Loved training when he was in town!


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## Forever Training (Nov 25, 2013)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> No he was joking!!!



Yeah, looking at Hatsie's reply, I should have picked up on the sarcasm.

Seriously though, now that Hatsie has been brought up......

I know that home study courses are a joke and that nothing replaces live instruction
from a qualified Shidoshi. But....

...if in considering it as a reference/resource tool, is the Van Donk's course considered a joke?
...is the material presented incorrect or incomplete?


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## Carol (Nov 25, 2013)

Can't comment on RVD myself not being a practitioner of the Takamatsuden arts.   But generally, if you are going to use a home study course as a supplement, the best bet would be to decide on a school first, and then go with material the instructor recommends for the class, if any.  Naturally it can be a waste of effort and money if the video sends you in a different direction.


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## Aiki Lee (Nov 25, 2013)

I have never actually seen the RVD footage, but the consensus seems to be that his movement is a little sloppy and some of his ideas of what is going on in the kata do not seem accurate. Again, I've never viewed them but he does not seem to be a widely supported source of quality among serious practitioners in the Bujinkan.


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## MJS (Nov 25, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Chris,
> 
> Having received my BB in another style, I am now contemplating training in the Bujinkan. Of the research I have done thus far, I find it fascinating, steeped in tradition and history,
> drawing its curriculum from the 9 ry&#363;ha of feudal Japan.
> ...



If you don't mind making the drive, I'd certainly suggest training there.  Greg is a great guy and a fantastic teacher.  I'm not sure how often he's there, which is probably why you see the 4th dans.  But nonetheless, he has some impressive teachers there.  I do know that Greg usually conducts monthly weekend seminars on various topics.


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## Hatsie (Nov 25, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Yeah, looking at Hatsie's reply, I should have picked up on the sarcasm.
> 
> Seriously though, now that Hatsie has been brought up......
> 
> ...



Sorry you fell for that, I did put 'gotcha' 

    IMHO and espescially if used with an instructor, there pathetic. Laughable in parts and Their also quite old now too. ( Meaning richard has probably improved significantly since then too. The best thing is to train with and listen to your instructor, don't just be another 'rent payer' in the dojo.  If you are keen and stick around your teacher will pick up on this. Most of the good ones just want  a few good students to train with.

   Lastly if there is anything you on those videos your teacher wouldn't crap all over easily, maybe you need a new teacher!  I would actually advise listening to people ( certain people) on these boards, upload videos to them maybe?, before shelling out a cent on some expensive tosh.
  Don't fall for slick salesmanship and try to buy a dream.

cheers


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## Brian R. VanCise (Nov 25, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Yeah, looking at Hatsie's reply, I should have picked up on the sarcasm.
> 
> Seriously though, now that Hatsie has been brought up......
> 
> ...



I would not recommend anyone using Van Donks videos for anything.  That is just my opinion!


I would however recommend purchasing Hatsumi Sensei DVD's and book's.  They are great reference material!


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## Hatsie (Nov 25, 2013)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> I would not recommend anyone using Van Donks videos for anything.  That is just my opinion!
> 
> 
> I would however recommend purchasing Hatsumi Sensei DVD's and book's.  They are great reference material!



thats a bit hard! The old VHS ones are great for little platforms for toilet training kids and the DVDs are great for hanging on strings for decoration. 

   One that sticks in my mind is him trying to do a 'soke like' technique with a kusari or something and its just horrible, the guys meant to be restrained but its all lose, Richard acts along pretending its secure and they all laugh!
   That made it past the edit stage and sold as a reference system for hundreds of dollars!?!?

  I think he's good with the patter, and people are certain times in their life might buy into it, prolly the target audience!

'reach for the stars, and pull them in!'


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## Chris Parker (Nov 26, 2013)

Forever Training said:


> Chris,
> 
> Having received my BB in another style, I am now contemplating training in the Bujinkan. Of the research I have done thus far, I find it fascinating, steeped in tradition and history,
> drawing its curriculum from the 9 ry&#363;ha of feudal Japan.
> ...



Sorry, what I meant was that there is no consistency in the Bujinkan, with all Shidoshi being able to create their own requirements/training program/curriculum from the material they've been taught (or not, in some cases...). And with the idea of "completeness of study", there are big debates on what that actually even is... with the most senior Shihan adding to the idea that Hatsumi hasn't shown everything yet... and others claiming to teach complete sections of some of the Ryu that are otherwise unknown... along with confusion and debate on what Menkyo Kaiden (certificate of complete transmission) actually indicates...

In other words, despite any sense that there might "need to be" any idea of consistency, or any assurance that what you're getting is the material in it's complete form, there's really nothing like that there. This is why one of the most immediate questions is going to be who you're training with, and from all reports I've come across, Greg Kowalski is a very good choice for the Bujinkan.


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## Jigoku (Dec 20, 2013)

There used to be in an old translation of the Ten Chi Jin Ryaku no Maki an Kyu grade ranking, apparently the one that Ishizuka Sensei used...talking late 80ies, early 90ies..

best
Stefan Marcec

PS: in the 90ies in Europe there some Kyu Rankings floating around, sb got a hold of Tanemuras Taijutsus book and just copied it....


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## 1992 (Dec 24, 2013)

The Shidoshi of my Bujinkan dojo put together a complete curriculum for the Kyu levels in a downloadable PDF file format.  What we have is a private membership Facebook group, and this curriculum along with any other information or reference material is available there. You can reference the curriculum from a smartphone, tablet, laptop, etc or print it out and make your own physical handbook. Along with that, our Shidoshi will post the waza, kata, and topics that were explored in each class the next day for those who want a review or missed class.  Also things he finds online that are relevant to training he will post.  I think its a great format using Facebook, because we are all on there and can interact with each other when we are not all together in the dojo.


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## Fritz (Mar 14, 2014)

I would switch the word curriculum to skill set, and that skill set can be found in an outline called the tenchijin ryaku no maki. 

Internalize that and everything else falls into place without asking.


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## Fritz (Mar 14, 2014)

I have had the chance to train with Mr. Kowalski and his dojo in the mid to late 1990's and I would reccomend them without hesitation. That said, despite being a reccomendation from a guy on the internet- check them out and see what you think. They will be friendly and inviting.


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## yorukage (May 29, 2014)

The RVD course was made in the early 90s I think, maybe even late 80s. This was a time of huge growth for the westerners in Bujinkan and we've come along way since then. The Course teaches things the way they were done then, at least the way they were understood to be done then. Heck, the Bujinkan has grown since 1999 when I started to now. Hatsumi is teaching more and more to the westerners and we are growing more every year thanks to dedicated teachers who go to Japan for more than just a short trip a year.


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## Troy Wideman (Jun 10, 2014)

Fritz said:


> I have had the chance to train with Mr. Kowalski and his dojo in the mid to late 1990's and I would reccomend them without hesitation. That said, despite being a reccomendation from a guy on the internet- check them out and see what you think. They will be friendly and inviting.




Although I am in another organization. I trained with Greg Kowalski back in the 80's when he had first come back from Japan. I found him to be a great teacher and technician back then. He was also very approachable.I am sure that would be a good place to train.

Kind Regards,

Troy Wideman


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