# If you picked 4 exercises what would they be?



## amateur (Mar 6, 2019)

According to this guy, you need merely 4 exercises to grow stronger.






Let's make a challenge. Can you make a strength training workout for martial artists consisting of 4 exercises? Mine would be...
-Knuckles push ups
-Ledge pull ups
-Horse stance
-Leg raises


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## Kababayan (Mar 6, 2019)

Push ups
Squats
Crunches
Pull ups

Twenty seconds each for four rounds.


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## JR 137 (Mar 6, 2019)

Body weight only, or could we throw in one piece of equipment like a kettlebell or dumbbell? I’ll asterisk the one using a single kettlebell...

Push-ups
Pull-ups/chin-ups
Planks
Turkish get-ups*

If no kettlebell is allowed...
Burpees/squat thrust


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## JR 137 (Mar 6, 2019)

I just watched the video. He’s right. His delivery leaves a bit to be desired IMO, but he’s right.

I’d argue overhead squats, but you can load up more weight with front squats. 

Perhaps better, the Olympic lifts - snatch, and the clean and jerk.


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## KenpoMaster805 (Mar 6, 2019)

Push up
Sit up
Crunches
Plank


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## jobo (Mar 7, 2019)

amateur said:


> According to this guy, you need merely 4 exercises to grow stronger.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


well yes, it's a point I've alluded to before, when people say they have t enough time to get fit, even more you can do one of those four for 5/ 10 mins a day and do the four over the course of a week , so somewhere between 20 and 40 mins a week. this is the principal of the 531 strength training program which " guarantee s you month on month strength gains. 

the problem with your selection is you need to be training at 80/90 percent of one rep max, which is difficult but not impossible with body weight exercises, but no way with knuckle  push ups and horse stance unless your going to out a bar across  your shoulder and call it half a sqaut


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## JR 137 (Mar 7, 2019)

jobo said:


> well yes, it's a point I've alluded to before, when people say they have t enough time to get fit, even more you can do one of those four for 5/ 10 mins a day and do the four over the course of a week , so somewhere between 20 and 40 mins a week. this is the principal of the 531 strength training program which " guarantee s you month on month strength gains.
> 
> the problem with your selection is you need to be training at 80/90 percent of one rep max, which is difficult but not impossible with body weight exercises, but no way with knuckle  push ups and horse stance unless your going to out a bar across  your shoulder and call it half a sqaut


Of course it only takes a few minutes, but you can’t do those effectively without equipment. Unless you’ve got the cash to buy weights and a rack, you’ve got to join a gym. With a gym you have to factor in commuting time. When all’s said and done, the 15 minutes can take an hour.

That’s not being pessimistic or saying it’s impossible to get a workout in, it’s just being realistic.

I bought a Total Gym because I didn’t have the time or desire for that stuff. My 20 minute workout takes me 20 minutes. I don’t have to go anywhere or do anything other than work out.


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## jobo (Mar 7, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> Of course it only takes a few minutes, but you can’t do those effectively without equipment. Unless you’ve got the cash to buy weights and a rack, you’ve got to join a gym. With a gym you have to factor in commuting time. When all’s said and done, the 15 minutes can take an hour.
> 
> That’s not being pessimistic or saying it’s impossible to get a workout in, it’s just being realistic.
> 
> I bought a Total Gym because I didn’t have the time or desire for that stuff. My 20 minute workout takes me 20 minutes. I don’t have to go anywhere or do anything other than work out.


well as I said with a bit of imagination you can do them with body weight and a weighted vest if/ when it gets to easy. buy the time you can do one handed hand stand push ups your already a good way along the journey and weights are not expensive, you can pick them up for a few $ from failed body builders, or buy those plastic ones you fill with sand or infqct just use a bag of wet sand taped to a broom handle, if your a real cheap skate. I biceps curl my bags of shopping on the walkhalk, coz I am a cheap skate


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## JR 137 (Mar 7, 2019)

jobo said:


> well as I said with a bit of imagination you can do them with body weight and a weighted vest if/ when it gets to easy. buy the time you can do one handed hand stand push ups your already a good way along the journey and weights are not expensive, you can pick them up for a few $ from failed body builders, or buy those plastic ones you fill with sand or infqct just use a bag of wet sand taped to a broom handle, if your a real cheap skate. I biceps curl my bags of shopping on the walkhalk, coz I am a cheap skate


I was talking about the exercises in the video. You’re going to need equipment to do front squats and deadlifts properly, especially front squats.


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## jobo (Mar 7, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> I was talking about the exercises in the video. You’re going to need equipment to do front squats and deadlifts properly, especially front squats.


it depend what you mean by properly.  properly so that it has a positive strength benifit ?one leged squates are a challenge for most people, one legged squats holding a 20/ 50/ 100 lb plate or bag of sand even more so.

I'm not arguing that having a gym doesn't make it less of a faff,  just that it's by no mean a nessersary requirement unless or u til your already ridiculously strong/ can't find some thing heavy lying a iut you can lift


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## Gweilo (Mar 7, 2019)

Press up on knuckles
Sit up
Squat
Leg raise but feet end up touching the top of your head.


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

amateur said:


> According to this guy, you need merely 4 exercises to grow stronger.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



For calisthenics:
Push Ups on Fingers (Grip)
Wide Grip Pull Ups
Squats with Crescent Kicks
Headstands to Handstand transition then dips

For Martial Arts:
Horse stance while holding end of a bo staff with one hand (great for wrist strength)
Walking lunges with front or round kicks
Stagger or Clapping Push Ups - If you're strong enough, Muay Thai push ups
(Im gonna push it and give 5 exercises)
Wide Grip pulls ups, if strong enough with legs out in front)
Headstand to handstand transition with dips


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

amateur said:


> According to this guy, you need merely 4 exercises to grow stronger.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



For calisthenics:
Push Ups on Fingers (Grip)
Wide Grip Pull Ups
Squats with Crescent Kicks
Headstands to Handstand transition then dips

For Martial Arts:
Horse stance while holding end of a bo staff with one hand (great for wrist strength)
Walking lunges with front or round kicks
Stagger or Clapping Push Ups - If you're strong enough, Muay Thai push ups
(Im gonna push it and give 5 exercises)
Wide Grip pulls ups, if strong enough with legs out in front)
Headstand to handstand transition with dips

I recommend interchanging both workouts for ultimate results. One in the morning one in the evening. You need to be extremely consistent to get gains when it comes to bodyweight workouts. Or one workout one day, the Other the next etc


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## jobo (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> For calisthenics:
> Push Ups on Fingers (Grip)
> Wide Grip Pull Ups
> Squats with Crescent Kicks
> ...


finger push up wont really help grip strength, it's an isometric exercise  that will on strengthen the fingers at more or less the angle youat holding doing the push up .

grip strength really requires you to actually grip something, either using the full range of motion or at the exact angle to need for what ever your envisaging needing to grip, ie griping a pull up bar will make your grip strong at that angle, but not much as other angles, like someones wrist,which is really a long way of saying , buy some grip strengtheners if you want a handshake that can crack walnuts


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

jobo said:


> finger push up wont really help grip strength, it's an isometric exercise  that will on strengthen the fingers at more or less the angle youat holding doing the push up .
> 
> grip strength really requires you to actually grip something, either using the full range of motion or at the exact angle to need for what ever your envisaging needing to grip, ie griping a pull up bar will make your grip strong at that angle, but not much as other angles, like someones wrist,which is really a long way of saying , buy some grip strengtheners if you want a handshake that can crack walnuts


Perhaps you are correct and I wouldn't be surprised if you were; I cannot claim to know everything. But from my experience, it has helped me a lot with my Traditional Jujitsu and my grip there, and I don't do any other exercises for grip unless you count pull ups. I also went to physio after a full recovery of some injuries and I was told my grip is excellent (don't meant to brag, sorry) for my age.


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## jobo (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> Perhaps you are correct and I wouldn't be surprised if you were; I cannot claim to know everything. But from my experience, it has helped me a lot with my Traditional Jujitsu and my grip there, and I don't do any other exercises for grip unless you count pull ups. I also went to physio after a full recovery of some injuries and I was told my grip is excellent (don't meant to brag, sorry) for my age.


well your young and active it should be good, and griping in jujitsu is its self excellent grip training.  and it more likely that rather 5han finger push ups which have improved your grip.if its excellent is a subjective judgement, was he comparing you with other jujitsu practitioners who also use grip strengheners. because theres a good chance you grip strength is less than theirs


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

jobo said:


> well your young and active it should be good, and griping in jujitsu is its self excellent grip training.  and it more likely that rather 5han finger push ups which have improved your grip.if its excellent is a subjective judgement, was he comparing you with other jujitsu practitioners who also use grip strengheners. because theres a good chance you grip strength is less than theirs


For starters keep in mind I mean traditional, Japanese jujitsu. I was being compared to a chart of scores from other teenagers my age at the time (I was 15, I've just turned 17 a week ago) ranked from poor to good etc


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## jobo (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> For starters keep in mind I mean traditional, Japanese jujitsu. I was being compared to a chart of scores from other teenagers my age at the time (I was 15, I've just turned 17 a week ago) ranked from poor to good etc


ok, so do an experiment, buy a cheap adjustable grip strengthened,  use it for a week, at your max, then youl have to turn it up as it wont be your max any more, then do a week of finger press ups and see if your grip strength has improved.  measuring yourself against a mean average gives flattering results as there an awful lot of unfit inactive people in there, always measure yourself against other fit people


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> I just watched the video. He’s right. His delivery leaves a bit to be desired IMO, but he’s right.
> 
> I’d argue overhead squats, but you can load up more weight with front squats.
> 
> Perhaps better, the Olympic lifts - snatch, and the clean and jerk.


I'd go back to kettlebells. 

Clean, or clean clean and press
Squats (overhead or goblet, for the same reasons you state, probably favoring goblet)
Turkish get-up (no way I'd leave that out)
KB push-ups (I like the instability, and you can add rows in the up position).
If I was adding one more, it'd probably be the 2-hand anyhow. It covers a lot of the body and a wide ROM, and takes some real concentration to learn to do. I might convince myself it's an alternate to clean and press, though you'd likely never be able to do the same weight (and certainly not as much as a straight clean).


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

jobo said:


> finger push up wont really help grip strength, it's an isometric exercise  that will on strengthen the fingers at more or less the angle youat holding doing the push up .
> 
> grip strength really requires you to actually grip something, either using the full range of motion or at the exact angle to need for what ever your envisaging needing to grip, ie griping a pull up bar will make your grip strong at that angle, but not much as other angles, like someones wrist,which is really a long way of saying , buy some grip strengtheners if you want a handshake that can crack walnuts


Does the angle of the pull-up really limit grip strength development? You're correct that it mostly only affects the angle used in the exercise, but what other angles would matter for grip? As I think through it, what other angles are you likely to use when gripping for maximum grip?

Your point about being able to squeeze (rather than hold) is accurate enough. There's some cross-over, but squeezing something that moves is a much better way to develop squeezing ability than simply holding something (including your own weight during a pull-up).


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> Perhaps you are correct and I wouldn't be surprised if you were; I cannot claim to know everything. But from my experience, it has helped me a lot with my Traditional Jujitsu and my grip there, and I don't do any other exercises for grip unless you count pull ups. I also went to physio after a full recovery of some injuries and I was told my grip is excellent (don't meant to brag, sorry) for my age.


It does strengthen the muscles involved, and any strengthening will bleed to other positions of the hand. But he's right that the position being strengthened most by fingertip push-ups is pretty far from the position used in gripping. I still use it - you just have to know the limitation and be okay with it. It likely also stresses the support muscles in a different way, which would be helpful for grappling.


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> It does strengthen the muscles involved, and any strengthening will bleed to other positions of the hand. But he's right that the position being strengthened most by fingertip push-ups is pretty far from the position used in gripping. I still use it - you just have to know the limitation and be okay with it. It likely also stresses the support muscles in a different way, which would be helpful for grappling.


Thanks for sharing this with me


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## Kung Fu Wang (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> I don't do any other exercises for grip unless you count pull ups.


To develop strong grip, you can do:

- throw square bag.
- throw long bag.
- twist cane bundle.
- crack belt.
- twist brick.
- twist single head.
- twist wood stick.
- ...


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> To develop strong grip, you can do:
> 
> - throw square bag.
> - throw long bag.
> ...


Thank you so much! These will make a fine addition to my collection!


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## JR 137 (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> Perhaps you are correct and I wouldn't be surprised if you were; I cannot claim to know everything. But from my experience, it has helped me a lot with my Traditional Jujitsu and my grip there, and I don't do any other exercises for grip unless you count pull ups. I also went to physio after a full recovery of some injuries and I was told my grip is excellent (don't meant to brag, sorry) for my age.


If you want to increase grip strength, do pull-ups with a towel rather than the bar. A former strength and conditioning coach colleague of mine at a college I worked at used it a lot for football, hockey and lacrosse players.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Mar 29, 2019)

One more clip for reference.

- twist single head.


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> To develop strong grip, you can do:
> 
> - throw square bag.
> - throw long bag.
> ...





JR 137 said:


> If you want to increase grip strength, do pull-ups with a towel rather than a bar. Roll the towel up and hang it over the bar where the handles normally are. A former strength and conditioning coach colleague of mine at a college I worked at used it a lot for football, hockey and lacrosse players.


I do most of my pulls up at the gym. I have the choice to use the climbing grips instead of the bar  but thanks for the advice too!


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## JR 137 (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> I do most of my pulls up at the gym. I have the choice to use the climbing grips instead of the bar  but thanks for the advice too!


I never thought of that or saw it before. Very interesting.

Towels would probably hit more muscles in your hands, but those would probably be murder on the ones they hit.


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## Ivan (Mar 29, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> I never thought of that or saw it before. Very interesting.
> 
> Towels would probably hit more muscles in your hands, but those would probably be murder on the ones they hit.


Yeah I can't curl my hand into a fist for like 10 mins if I do a proper workout on them. Theres 2 standard rubber covered grips, and behind them there is 2 of those ^^^ which you can use instead.


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## jobo (Mar 29, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> Does the angle of the pull-up really limit grip strength development? You're correct that it mostly only affects the angle used in the exercise, but what other angles would matter for grip? As I think through it, what other angles are you likely to use when gripping for maximum grip?
> 
> Your point about being able to squeeze (rather than hold) is accurate enough. There's some cross-over, but squeezing something that moves is a much better way to develop squeezing ability than simply holding something (including your own weight during a pull-up).


not t he angle of the pull the angle of the fingers, which then depends on how thick the bar iI and if that matches more of less the thickness of what you want to grip real world. crushing a tennis ball is different than cracking a walnut. and pull ups are largely finger hangs, which don't work the thumb to much. and grip strength has a lot of thumb in it


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> To develop strong grip, you can do:
> 
> - throw square bag.
> - throw long bag.
> ...


This is a good set of exercises that don't require specific equipment. Almost anything that requires holding on to a moving weight will help with the kind of grip used in grappling. Of course, grappling is one of those exercises, itself - the rest is to get stronger than the other grapplers!


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> If you want to increase grip strength, do pull-ups with a towel rather than the bar. A former strength and conditioning coach colleague of mine at a college I worked at used it a lot for football, hockey and lacrosse players.
> View attachment 22159


That's another good one - I hadn't thought of that in a while.

Something Tiger Woods used to do that I liked (though you'll probably have to improvise). He'd take a newspaper (that's the part you might need to improvise), lay out a thick section on the table, and crumple the sheets (one at a time) with one hand, into a tight ball. Doing a few sheets like that makes it clear how much you're exercising.


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

Ivan said:


> Yeah I can't curl my hand into a fist for like 10 mins if I do a proper workout on them. Theres 2 standard rubber covered grips, and behind them there is 2 of those ^^^ which you can use instead.


Yeah, when I was rock climbing, my grip was insane for my overall size. It's an amazingly good forearm/grip workout.


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 29, 2019)

jobo said:


> not t he angle of the pull the angle of the fingers, which then depends on how thick the bar iI and if that matches more of less the thickness of what you want to grip real world. crushing a tennis ball is different than cracking a walnut. and pull ups are largely finger hangs, which don't work the thumb to much. and grip strength has a lot of thumb in it


That's a good point. I think most gripping in grappling comes pretty close to the grip size of the average pull-up grip I've seen. Most are tubular steel with a rubber or foam grip, so would be near the size of my own wrist and a lapel grip on a grappling gi (the wrapped bar being a bit smaller than the former, but larger than the latter). It would't develop the grip as efficiently for grabbing sleeves and such.


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## Tony Dismukes (Mar 30, 2019)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> To develop strong grip, you can do:
> 
> - throw square bag.
> - throw long bag.
> ...


Can you give some more details on the belt cracking exercise? How to do it, what attributes you are trying develop, etc?


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## skyeisonfire (Mar 30, 2019)

My fav four are;

1) knuckle/finger tip push-ups and planks
2) v-sit hold and v crunches
3) modified dragon flag and variations
4) cable machine...specifically geared towards pushing and pulling actions.  I use these to maximize my strength and endurance.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Mar 30, 2019)

Tony Dismukes said:


> Can you give some more details on the belt cracking exercise? How to do it, what attributes you are trying develop, etc?


You fold a Karate belt into 3 parts. Hold on both ends and pull it to make a crack sound. It can develop your grip strength, arm strength. Also it can blend into you move and footwork. For example, if you

- twist your opponent clockwise, you can crack your belt by moving your left arm up and right arm down.
- right hand push on your opponent's neck and left hand pull his leading leg, you can crack the belt with right hand up/forward and left hand down/backward.
- ...

Each belt cracking can be act as a push and a pull, or a twist. Your legs will move exactly the way as you will apply your throw.











This is my favor "leg lift" belt cracking training. You can crack your belt to train almost any throw that you may prefer.


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## Gerry Seymour (Mar 31, 2019)

So, I was thinking about this as I led exercises yesterday. Apparently my answer to this for before class:

Turkish get-up
Push-up (sometimes Judo push-ups, sometimes rock star push-ups)
Medicine ball pass (2 people back-to-back, pass the medicine ball around themselves)
Reverse crunches
Of course, the issues are a bit different before a class, and when leading a group in the exercise, but those are the 4 I seem to nearly always include. Others show up at times.


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## Flying Crane (Mar 31, 2019)

For grips, you can tie together a bundle of chopsticks, then grip it like you are holding a baseball bat.  Twist in both directions, over and over.  You can do it while watching tv or otherwise relaxing.

I also like archery as a form of strength training.  I rarely make it to the range to actually shoot, but I pull out my bows and practice drawing them while watching tv or hanging around.  It develops the fingers that you use to pull, and the arms, shoulders, back, chest.  Pull both right-and left-handed for equal development on both sides, don’t become lop-sided.


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## Gaucho (Jun 26, 2019)

Push ups, sit ups, running.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jun 27, 2019)

Gaucho said:


> Push ups, sit ups, running.


You have one left. C'mon, finish the exercise!


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## punisher73 (Jun 27, 2019)

https://www.amazon.com/Power-Putty-...s=power+putty&qid=1561654857&s=gateway&sr=8-5

Another thing for grip strength I have used and really liked is Power Putty.  Think of a very tough silly putty.  It was designed and sold for rock climbers.  I also like my Captains of Crush.

As to the video, I would agree with his choices if you have access to weights and a power rack.

Bodyweight is much tougher after a certain point.

Push ups working to a one arm push up
Squats working up to a one legged pistol squat
Handstand push ups working to a one armed one
Pull ups working to a one armed pull up.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jun 27, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> You have one left. C'mon, finish the exercise!


Nah. Take the time you'd spend on a fourth exercise and do more running


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## Xue Sheng (Jun 27, 2019)

Yoga, Savasana...4 times


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## dvcochran (Jun 28, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> Does the angle of the pull-up really limit grip strength development? You're correct that it mostly only affects the angle used in the exercise, but what other angles would matter for grip? As I think through it, what other angles are you likely to use when gripping for maximum grip?
> 
> Your point about being able to squeeze (rather than hold) is accurate enough. There's some cross-over, but squeezing something that moves is a much better way to develop squeezing ability than simply holding something (including your own weight during a pull-up).


This makes me think of my Kali training. Each practice we spent time dropping the catching steel balls as hard as we could. Not only gravity but the force of "pushing" into the ball as you tried to catch it worked against you. One hundred with each hand and you definitely would be feeling it. The balls were about the size of a soft ball, maybe slightly bigger and all the same size regardless of weight. The heaviest were 15 lbs. Very good for grip strength.


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## jobo (Jun 28, 2019)

dvcochran said:


> This makes me think of my Kali training. Each practice we spent time dropping the catching steel balls as hard as we could. Not only gravity but the force of "pushing" into the ball as you tried to catch it worked against you. One hundred with each hand and you definitely would be feeling it. The balls were about the size of a soft ball, maybe slightly bigger and all the same size regardless of weight. The heaviest were 15 lbs. Very good for grip strength.


this seems to have migrated from the context of the vid,which was, you could get a strong well balanced health body with only 4 weighted exercises, which is also the same conclusion as jim wendles 531 strength training program, you could do much the same with body weights but would quite possibly need more exercises unless your very good? at gymnastics and can do compound lifts in one movement/ exercise

the conclusion that you can mix and match your favourite 4 exercises and get the same balance and performance benefits is faulty.  quite the contrary, if you include say push ups you also need to include some pulling exercise  to get any semblance of a balanced body, but you've still got all those other muscles you haven't used,and if you suddenly find you've a need to lift something over head, you likely find you have little strength in that direction. unless you've been doing overhead lifts or hand stand push ups

so really, it's all 4 listed ( or a good few more for body weight)and then you can add your running and jumping and squeezing etal


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## JP3 (Jun 28, 2019)

I was unclear if the O/P only wanted bodyweight exercises, or if he wanted weight training stuff, too?

Bodyweight, I'd go with burpees, pushups, pullups & probably lunges.

Gym work, it'd be squats, deadlifts, weighted pullups and pick a cardio machine or hit the road (my preference. Get at least 4 miles, 4x/week) ws my best result-maker, any more and I'd be pulling muscle off, not holding it or putting it on, any less and I could tell in my wind conditioning).


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## MetalBoar (Jun 28, 2019)

The OP said strength training workout for the martial artist. I'm running with the assumption that I'm still doing training in my martial art and all the drills and such that go along with it (so if I box, I'm still hitting the heavy bag, doing pad work, sparring, etc.).

1st choice (assuming I had access to my current set of machines or equivalent quality equipment):

Leg press 
Hip extension
Seated dip or a good chest press
Seated row (1st choice) or a good narrow, underhand grip pull down (good alternate)
2nd choice (assuming just free weights are available):

Dead lift
Squats
Bench Press
Bent over row
Last choice if I had no other options - body weight:

Wind sprints
Dip or push ups
Slow chin ups (working towards 1 minute up and 1 down or longer at a consistent speed)
Plank?


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## _Simon_ (Jun 29, 2019)

Years ago I would've picked straight up strength-based exercises. Amongst probably deadlifts, squats, dips, chinups, bench, rows etc. Martial arts ones moreso pushups and variations, pullups, pistol squats, particular isometric holds.

But if it was just four exercises that I had to stick with, it'd be ones that focused more on mobility with strength. I've developed many imbalances due to too much focus on weights/resistance training for years, plus toooo many pushups (not always a good thing!), so I'm now focusing more on mobility type work in addition to weights. Exercises which work on the joint's range of control to maintain structural health and integrity rather than just muscular strength at certain ranges.

A work in progress [emoji14]


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jun 29, 2019)

amateur said:


> Can you make a strength training workout for martial artists consisting of 4 exercises?


Here are 4 of my favors to share.

- Water container rotation.






- Weight pulley.






- Single head.






- Double heads.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Jun 30, 2019)

Weights, weights, weights and weights.

Joking aside, pushups, squats, pullups and probably kettle bell swings.      I dont think you can do 4 exercises and get stronger the NHS recommends you do a routine of cardio, resistance and/or strength exercises.       Its something like a hour of each a week.    (i dont recall if resistance is strength or not or if they use both on the website)


Doesn't seem feasible, but i think exercises which do multiple muscle groups are good.  someone has probbly given a similar response to this but there isnt exactly much deviation to what you can do. 

I probably should explain my reasoning:

Pushups are good caliphetics movement for a few muscle groups, squats are the same more focusing on legs, pull ups are pretty good for building upper body strength and kettlebell swings work out your arms, legs and core and to incorporate some weight moving in there.  

I have heard mixed things about sit ups and how good they actually are.


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## jobo (Jun 30, 2019)

Rat said:


> Weights, weights, weights and weights.
> 
> Joking aside, pushups, squats, pullups and probably kettle bell swings.      I dont think you can do 4 exercises and get stronger the NHS recommends you do a routine of cardio, resistance and/or strength exercises.       Its something like a hour of each a week.    (i dont recall if resistance is strength or not or if they use both on the website)
> 
> ...


the nhs set the bar really low, if they recommend high intensity training then they will have people being admitted to the cardio unit left right and centre, so they recommend an hour of moderate training, which if your going from nothing, is a good step forward, but no use at all if you actually want to be FIT,


if your going close to flat out, as you should be, then it's extremely difficult to do an hour of either, most people would fall over at 5 mins, if you mean spend an hour, 45 mins of which is resting in between sets, then yes that's very do able I was listening to this conversation in a pub, where this over weight and clearly out of condition woman was bragging to her friend, that she spent two hours at the gym, three times a week, which made me wonder what she was doing there for the other 1hour 55 mins,  as it clearly wasn't exercise

 but you can get quite fit on 5 mins a day, provided you use that time productivity

the problem with push ups, is if you have your feet clamped, your exercising you hip flexors more than anything else, and most people don't need tighter hip flexors, have your feet free and a 20 lb weight on your chest and you getting benefit to you abs,, though you still need some lateral movement


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## Fedora (Jun 30, 2019)

_Upper body push, upper body pull.
Something for the legs. Add some cardio._

Examples:
Pushes: Overhead press / bench press / dips.
Pulls:  Chins / rows / deadlift
Legs: Squat / lunge / carries
Cardio: KB swing / KB snatch / skip rope


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## Deleted member 39746 (Jul 1, 2019)

jobo said:


> the nhs set the bar really low, if they recommend high intensity training then they will have people being admitted to the cardio unit left right and centre, so they recommend an hour of moderate training, which if your going from nothing, is a good step forward, but no use at all if you actually want to be FIT,



Its what they deem the MINIMUM standards you should do as far as i recall.  Spread out over the week is also listed as well, its not a hour long session i think its meant to be something like several smaller sessions balanced out with the other listed requirements, i really cant be bothered to open it to quote it at the moment.       And their entire motif is as stated, getting people to do something rather than nothing as a step up.  

It at least doesnt have you doing only cardo/calisthenics exercises (i know the two are different, but some calisthenics are used for cardio/warm up by some people more than a resistance exercise) and lists a portion of strength exercises to do, i dislike a focus on just calisthenics as it gets you good at moving your own weight but not a outside weight, or at least you have no experience in how to move something heavy not attached to your own nervous system/body. 




jobo said:


> the problem with push ups, is if you have your feet clamped, your exercising you hip flexors more than anything else, and most people don't need tighter hip flexors, have your feet free and a 20 lb weight on your chest and you getting benefit to you abs,, though you still need some lateral movement



Just to confirm did you mean push ups or sit ups?      Because i think under the confines of the 4 exercises given it should be a decent all rounder, obviously not including running and such.    And i dont think i chose any really specialist move set or advanced variation of any.     


But again feel like stating i don't agree with the notion you can get fit/stronger with only 4 exercises as you need a bunch of different exercises to strengthen your body in different ways.    And your goals influence what you will do/should do and all that same with any impairment in your body.         And i don't consider doing boxing, running or what ever as a way to get good at what ever listed as a exercise as the sub components have more than 4 in it.   Unless the sport in question is to only get good at 4 specific exercises.


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## jobo (Jul 1, 2019)

Rat said:


> Its what they deem the MINIMUM standards you should do as far as i recall.  Spread out over the week is also listed as well, its not a hour long session i think its meant to be something like several smaller sessions balanced out with the other listed requirements, i really cant be bothered to open it to quote it at the moment.       And their entire motif is as stated, getting people to do something rather than nothing as a step up.
> 
> It at least doesnt have you doing only cardo/calisthenics exercises (i know the two are different, but some calisthenics are used for cardio/warm up by some people more than a resistance exercise) and lists a portion of strength exercises to do, i dislike a focus on just calisthenics as it gets you good at moving your own weight but not a outside weight, or at least you have no experience in how to move something heavy not attached to your own nervous system/body.
> 
> ...


yes I meant sit up, fundamentally resistance training is resistance training,  weight exercises don't general mimic real word issues you come accross either, they just give a base of strength for you to apply when necessary, 

if 4 are enough depends what your fitness goals are, but they can certainly be so, if your goals are a strong healthy balanced body with a good aerobic capacity rather than having a specific goal to run fast or jump high or what ever. it's less that 4 are enough for all eventualities rather those 4 are a requirement for moire or less any sporting endeavour, which you then add to as you see fit.

you can do the same 4 with different weights and intervals to build strength  strength endurance, endurance and out and out cardio. it does give an indecation that the gym myth is a myth and you can get at least comparable results with a bare minimum of equipment or no equipment at all. just as its a myth that the effectiveness if exercise has time critical component, like how many mins you do a week for example, increasing the time you  spend exercising may in factse have the effect of  decrease your fitness, dependent of course on how you measure fitness


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 1, 2019)

Rat said:


> Its what they deem the MINIMUM standards you should do as far as i recall.  Spread out over the week is also listed as well, its not a hour long session i think its meant to be something like several smaller sessions balanced out with the other listed requirements, i really cant be bothered to open it to quote it at the moment.       And their entire motif is as stated, getting people to do something rather than nothing as a step up.
> 
> It at least doesnt have you doing only cardo/calisthenics exercises (i know the two are different, but some calisthenics are used for cardio/warm up by some people more than a resistance exercise) and lists a portion of strength exercises to do, i dislike a focus on just calisthenics as it gets you good at moving your own weight but not a outside weight, or at least you have no experience in how to move something heavy not attached to your own nervous system/body.
> 
> ...


There's some relatively recent research that suggests we can get some real longevity and fitness benefits from just 5-10 minutes of moderate exercise a day. It turns out that small amount of movement has significant impact on quality of life.


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## vince1 (Jul 3, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> Body weight only, or could we throw in one piece of equipment like a kettlebell or dumbbell? I’ll asterisk the one using a single kettlebell...
> 
> Push-ups
> Pull-ups/chin-ups
> ...



I also like to add biking and fast walking or just long walks.


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## jobo (Jul 3, 2019)

vince1 said:


> I also like to add biking and fast walking or just long walks.


biking/ cycling, is a really bad exercise for introduction out of alignment issues, road cycling particularly, mountain biking less so, to the point that you need a whole exercise routine to put right all the out of balance/ over use injuries it causes, its not a good way to  over all fitness, its something you have to be fit to do ,


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 3, 2019)

jobo said:


> biking/ cycling, is a really bad exercise for introduction out of alignment issues, road cycling particularly, mountain biking less so, to the point that you need a whole exercise routine to put right all the out of balance/ over use injuries it causes, its not a good way to  over all fitness, its something you have to be fit to do ,


I wasn't aware of that - haven't really looked into biking much over the years. Can you point me to some info?


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## vince1 (Jul 3, 2019)

jobo said:


> biking/ cycling, is a really bad exercise for introduction out of alignment issues, road cycling particularly, mountain biking less so, to the point that you need a whole exercise routine to put right all the out of balance/ over use injuries it causes, its not a good way to  over all fitness, its something you have to be fit to do ,



I have introduced casual cycling and walking long distances to my exercise routine over the last five years and have experienced great benefits. I made no mention of road cycling or mountain biking. I use to be a runner many years ago and have no more desire to run and suffer the impact of sore joints.I do a lot of stretching as well before biking and martial arts. I know many people that use to run that have switched to biking and find it easier on the joints than running.


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## jobo (Jul 3, 2019)

vince1 said:


> I have introduced casual cycling and walking long distances to my exercise routine over the last five years and have experienced great benefits. I made no mention of road cycling or mountain biking. I use to be a runner many years ago and have no more desire to run and suffer the impact of sore joints.I do a lot of stretching as well before biking and martial arts. I know many people that use to run that have switched to biking and find it easier on the joints than running.


I've. No idea what casual cycling is? Or that it's even a thing, but cycling is all push and no pull,( that's why they are called push bikes) it's a bit better if you use clip on peddles, but you've still got a forward bend on your back and shoulders rounded forward and your head  bent at a silly angle , it's much same as being slump over your desk for hours, if by casual you mnmean no great time effort or distanc e, then you may not notice it, but then you won't notice much benefit either,


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## MetalBoar (Jul 3, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I wasn't aware of that - haven't really looked into biking much over the years. Can you point me to some info?


I haven't looked at the research (assuming there is any) but anecdotally road cyclists that come in to work out with me have some of the (functionally?) weakest low backs of any group I get. I've found that I have to start them off with extremely light work and supervise them very closely to avoid injury. I use an extremely safe protocol and I have never had this sort of issue with any other group. I assume it is related to the very exaggerated, forward leaning posture required by many road bikes, but that's a guess. I've also been shocked by the number of avid cyclists of all types that come in with relatively weak legs, especially considering the number of hills in the Seattle area.

I'm not against cycling and used to bike everywhere when I was living in a place that wasn't wet, hilly, and filled with the worlds most oblivious drivers. Still, based on what I've seen and experienced, I don't think cycling is a particularly good or efficient way to build strength even in the legs. If I were to start riding again I'd definitely do some research and choose a bike that put me in a more natural upright position.


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## vince1 (Jul 3, 2019)

jobo said:


> I've. No idea what casual cycling is? Or that it's even a thing, but cycling is all push and no pull,( that's why they are called push bikes) it's a bit better if you use clip on peddles, but you've still got a forward bend on your back and shoulders rounded forward and your head  bent at a silly angle , it's much same as being slump over your desk for hours, if by casual you mnmean no great time effort or distanc e, then you may not notice it, but then you won't notice much benefit either,



Go to the Netherlands where my family immigrated from and see a population of 17 million people who own an estimated 22.5 million bicycles. You will see a variety of bicycle designs for every age group, purpose and has a proven overall health benefits. My grandparents from both sides of the family biked well into their late 80's early 90's and had rock hard strong legs. Most of my old uncles and aunts still bike on a daily bases and have very few health concerns if any. They are all lean , eat a high fat diet with lots of vegetables and some fruit. Most of the dutch use an upright bike design not slumped over but some young and old dutch racers do, but are still some of the healthiest people.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jul 3, 2019)

vince1 said:


> I know many people that use to run that have switched to biking and find it easier on the joints than running.


You can change running into fast walking too. I agree that to maintain your knee joint is very important.

I still train jumping kick. I don't jump high any more. I jump forward instead. This way when I land from my jumping kick, I won't get too much shocking on my knee joints. It's the same comparison between running and fast walking.

Old Chinese saying said,

- "Knowing how to train is easy. Knowing how to maintain is hard."
- "When you are young, you learn how to fight against others. When you get old, you learn how to fight against yourself."


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 3, 2019)

MetalBoar said:


> I haven't looked at the research (assuming there is any) but anecdotally road cyclists that come in to work out with me have some of the (functionally?) weakest low backs of any group I get. I've found that I have to start them off with extremely light work and supervise them very closely to avoid injury. I use an extremely safe protocol and I have never had this sort of issue with any other group. I assume it is related to the very exaggerated, forward leaning posture required by many road bikes, but that's a guess. I've also been shocked by the number of avid cyclists of all types that come in with relatively weak legs, especially considering the number of hills in the Seattle area.
> 
> I'm not against cycling and used to bike everywhere when I was living in a place that wasn't wet, hilly, and filled with the worlds most oblivious drivers. Still, based on what I've seen and experienced, I don't think cycling is a particularly good or efficient way to build strength even in the legs. If I were to start riding again I'd definitely do some research and choose a bike that put me in a more natural upright position.


I wonder if the ease of shifting, and the use of very low gears (rather than pushing harder) is why many cyclists don't gain leg strength. I know when I was a kid, my 1-speed, really heavy bicycle (with shocks, heavy steel frame, etc.) probably contributed to building my legs up.


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## jobo (Jul 4, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I wonder if the ease of shifting, and the use of very low gears (rather than pushing harder) is why many cyclists don't gain leg strength. I know when I was a kid, my 1-speed, really heavy bicycle (with shocks, heavy steel frame, etc.) probably contributed to building my legs up.


yes definitely, the correct cycling technique is to wiz the peddles d round at 2 revolution per secon, and use the gears to keep minimum resistance, so your never putting any physical effort in, beside spinning the legs, hobby cyclists tend to spin at one rev a second, but the same technique applies, of using the gears to keep actual effort low, they just can't go as fast as the other group,  bad techniques of being in a high gear and forcing the peddles down with all you weight, does work the quads, but not much else 

cycling is mechanically assisted walking, you can always go further and faster for less effort on a bike, that not to say you can put effort in


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## escuelafraternidad (Jul 4, 2019)

A combination of 5?
- Push ups
- Pull ups
- Crunches
- Rowing
- Squat

All days, except by rowing changing exercises one or twice a month.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 4, 2019)

jobo said:


> yes definitely, the correct cycling technique is to wiz the peddles d round at 2 revolution per secon, and use the gears to keep minimum resistance, so your never putting any physical effort in, beside spinning the legs, hobby cyclists tend to spin at one rev a second, but the same technique applies, of using the gears to keep actual effort low, they just can't go as fast as the other group,  bad techniques of being in a high gear and forcing the peddles down with all you weight, does work the quads, but not much else
> 
> cycling is mechanically assisted walking, you can always go further and faster for less effort on a bike, that not to say you can put effort in


I'm thinking through the mechanics (don't have a bike handy to try to feel them) and it seems pushing hard would also work the calves, since the ball of the foot (rather than the middle or heel) is on the pedal. I also wonder if the glutes are getting much work if you're standing to push hard - maybe a little.

But, yeah, I wouldn't think there'd be much benefit for most of the rest, at all.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 4, 2019)

escuelafraternidad said:


> A combination of 5?
> - Push ups
> - Pull ups
> - Crunches
> ...


Hey, the image in your signature is HUGE. You might want to consider either cropping it down or scaling it, so it doesn't dominate every post you make.


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## jobo (Jul 4, 2019)

vince1 said:


> Go to the Netherlands where my family immigrated from and see a population of 17 million people who own an estimated 22.5 million bicycles. You will see a variety of bicycle designs for every age group, purpose and has a proven overall health benefits. My grandparents from both sides of the family biked well into their late 80's early 90's and had rock hard strong legs. Most of my old uncles and aunts still bike on a daily bases and have very few health concerns if any. They are all lean , eat a high fat diet with lots of vegetables and some fruit. Most of the dutch use an upright bike design not slumped over but some young and old dutch racers do, but are still some of the healthiest people.[/Qsvince


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## jobo (Jul 4, 2019)

vince1 said:


> Go to the Netherlands where my family immigrated from and see a population of 17 million people who own an estimated 22.5 million bicycles. You will see a variety of bicycle designs for every age group, purpose and has a proven overall health benefits. My grandparents from both sides of the family biked well into their late 80's early 90's and had rock hard strong legs. Most of my old uncles and aunts still bike on a daily bases and have very few health concerns if any. They are all lean , eat a high fat diet with lots of vegetables and some fruit. Most of the dutch use an upright bike design not slumped over but some young and old dutch racers do, but are still some of the healthiest people.


vince I'm not sure why you are disliking posts that are factual, unless you don't like the facts, but then you need to take it up with the fact fairy

. I cycle myself, because I enjoy it and it's an efficient way of getting places, that efficient as the most miles per pound of effort, but in the certain knowledge that its not doing a great deal for my fitness and also has a detrimental effect on overall fitness unless I also exercise to adjust the out if balance issues

. I started again when I got a very fit dog that wanted 15 mile walks and I couldn't walk that far, so I got a bike as I could travel 15 miles whilst only expanding the same energy as a three miles walk, mostly because the bike carried all my then considerable weight and the gears gave me a mechanical advantage. but that's exactly what bikes are designed to do and why they are not a particular fitness boon

 if your going hard enough for long enough they work your heart and lungs, but that's not most cyclists, certainly not casual cyclists, who bubble along whilst not actually sweating buckets.  and would certainly expend a loot more effort if they walked the same distance or just the same if they walked a 5 th of it

. I'm not sure what Holland has to do with it.! the Dutch are not a particularly health nation despite or maybe because of all the bikes, though admittedly if you get a Dutch bike made t of old girders with no or limited gears changes, that would indeed be hard work, up hill,if the Dutch actually had any hills to climb up, which is why I suppose they invented such rubbish bikes in the first place and why tthey're not popular in most other places


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## jobo (Jul 4, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I'm thinking through the mechanics (don't have a bike handy to try to feel them) and it seems pushing hard would also work the calves, since the ball of the foot (rather than the middle or heel) is on the pedal. I also wonder if the glutes are getting much work if you're standing to push hard - maybe a little.
> 
> But, yeah, I wouldn't think there'd be much benefit for most of the rest, at all.


year a bit of calves if your using your toes, which people general don't if their stanmping the peddles, but I wouldn't think much if any glute, as the glutes move your leg backwards and sideways, which is why they are so hard to train, its really a very big set of muscles that has evolved as something for you to sit on, rather than because of the work they commonly do


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## pdg (Jul 9, 2019)

I won't quote everything, but rather generalise...

Cycling.

There are a few problems with people not getting the benefit they should from it - the primary ones being bike setup and technique.

The majority of people I see on bikes just don't have them set up correctly - the saddle is almost invariably too low and the reach is all wrong (stem length and height if the frame is suitable, or just wrong sized frame).

And technique - ball of foot should be over pedal axle, in all situations, no exceptions. Yet (again, the majority) stomp with their heels.

Too much weight being carried by the arms and butt - the (researched) optimum cadence (pedaling rpm) is 90-100. For racing... That's not about spinning with minimum load though, that's supposed to be maintained with your feet carrying the majority of your weight and lifting your upper body, with the help of your lower back...

Using cycling as a way to get fit is very often counterintuitive - it's very easy to hide behind numbers.

Someone may boast about doing X amount of miles, but push them to near maximum effort and they'll be done after 500 yards.

That's because you can coast - running is kind of better for honesty because if you stop trying you stop. On a bike you can stop trying after 5 seconds and keep moving.

When I go out with my son it's a gentle meander for me - we can do 10 miles and I barely feel like I've started. But it's about getting out with him, spending time together and having fun while he gets some exercise too.

Out by myself, I might do the same 10 miles in less than a third of the time, sweating buckets and getting a more real workout.

The latter is how you need to approach it if it's a get/stay fit goal, but most casual (or even 'avid') cyclists only ever do the former.


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## pdg (Jul 9, 2019)

I will quote this one:



gpseymour said:


> I wonder if the ease of shifting, and the use of very low gears (rather than pushing harder) is why many cyclists don't gain leg strength. I know when I was a kid, my 1-speed, really heavy bicycle (with shocks, heavy steel frame, etc.) probably contributed to building my legs up.



It goes both ways...

It probably contributed to your legs, because it was a case of put in the effort or walk. A lot (especially adults) would choose to walk.

Modern tech (light bikes with climbing gears) has allowed people to make a different choice - to cruise up the hill easier than walking.

To get the same benefit you need to set and apply the mindset "it doesn't get easier, you just get faster".

Use the gears and weight advantage to clean the hill in less time for the same effort. Then shift gears and put the same amount of effort into going back down instead of freewheeling it.


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