# Has Anyone Used the XXL Wavemaster (Top) Bag?



## Madcity

I am looking into getting a free-standing bag to practice with and have been looking at the XXL Wavemaster (Top) on Century MMA. The onsite reviews give it a 4 of 5 stars, and overall people sound happy with it.

I was just wondering if anyone here has had any experience with this product or the Wavemaster brand? I am looking for a tall bag like this so I can practice low, medium and high dead leg kicks, as well as punches, knees and elbow strikes.

Also, does $250 seem like a reasonable price? I have seen less expensive bags with hit or miss reviews, but would be open to other suggestions.

 If you were using this in a basement would you recommend filling it with water or sand? My only concern with water is the horrible placement of the drain in my basement in the event of a leak.

Thanks for any advice or insight people can offer!


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## Bill Mattocks

Madcity said:


> I am looking into getting a free-standing bag to practice with and have been looking at the &#8220;XXL Wavemaster (Top)&#8221; on Century MMA. The onsite reviews give it a 4 of 5 stars, and overall people sound happy with it.
> 
> I was just wondering if anyone here has had any experience with this product or the Wavemaster brand? I am looking for a tall bag like this so I can practice low, medium and high dead leg kicks, as well as punches, knees and elbow strikes.
> 
> Also, does $250 seem like a reasonable price? I have seen less expensive bags with hit or miss reviews, but would be open to other suggestions.
> 
> If you were using this in a basement would you recommend filling it with water or sand? My only concern with water is the horrible placement of the drain in my basement in the event of a leak.
> 
> Thanks for any advice or insight people can offer!



We use the XXL Wavemaster original in our dojo.  We fill ours with water.  I don't know how old they are (I am a student, not the sensei), but a couple of them have started leaking water slightly.  Of course, they get used a lot and they may be quite old, I don't know.  The original can be adjusted up or down for high or low kicks.  We have a couple big dudes who can consistently knock the thing over when it's set up high.  I've never seen one filled with sand, so I could not tell you if that's better or not.  I guess if you need to move it, it's easier to empty out water than sand?  I like them and they work for me, but that's about all I know.


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## Dansolo

Water seems like bad idea jeans to me...


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## rlobrecht

The dojang I attend also uses Wavemaster XXLs filled with water.  I've never seen a child or teen knock one over, but I can pretty easily (side kick, back kick, etc.)  We have one that leaks from the fill cap, when it gets knocked over, but not bad.  They get a lot of use (abuse) and have held up well.

We have another brand and its terrible.  The bag itself broke down very quickly, and now has a two foot wide soft spot around the middle, making it almost useless.

I was told by my instructor that for yourself, filling with sand means it never leaves your home, as it is almost impossible to get the sand out, and becomes too heavy to lift.  Water can be drained, but has the problem of potentially leaking.

$250 is a good price.  It's a lot less that I ended up paying for a hanging heavy bag, stand, and the weights to keep the stand from moving.


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## MAist25

Yea I've trained with the Wavemaster XXL and it's a solid bag. I would definitely recommend it. It can get knocked down if you hit it with a solid kick but so will every freestanding bag. I've only had positive experiences with it though and it is a very durable bag. As for water or sand, sand is better than water because it wont leak and it holds the bag down better but it is much harder to drain if you ever wanted to move the bag.


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## Master Dan

WE have used Wavemaster alot the last 15 years great for teaching large groups with one instructor ect. but the tops wear out and spin when the plastic sets wear out I am going to order replacement tops only which in our case can go by parcer post ect. the XXL we have wanted for a long time but due to shipping costs of over $1,200 each we could not afford but had sent to Seattle for only $50 each then by water Barge for about $150 each and they are great. XXL is good for focus combination of feet hands however the regular are for children not adults the xxl is good for kids due to lower bag height but in my Dojang we have Cardio kick box and MMA people and we do not allow them to touch these the wave masters over emphasis on hands in same location will wear them out the foam deteriorates and they will not be usable for kicks so I have hanging bags or MMA bags for them. the XXl is good for TKD combination of hands feet balanced good cardio but to have multiple people using predominate hands is not good.


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## Master Dan

Bill Mattocks said:


> We use the XXL Wavemaster original in our dojo.  We fill ours with water.  I don't know how old they are (I am a student, not the sensei), but a couple of them have started leaking water slightly.  Of course, they get used a lot and they may be quite old, I don't know.  The original can be adjusted up or down for high or low kicks.  We have a couple big dudes who can consistently knock the thing over when it's set up high.  I've never seen one filled with sand, so I could not tell you if that's better or not.  I guess if you need to move it, it's easier to empty out water than sand?  I like them and they work for me, but that's about all I know.



I would have to say the XXL for some reason do leak water from day one at the fill spout when you roll them around to put them away or if you know over but easy to fix with tephlon tape I intend to get the wave master makawara wrapped with rope for conditioning and I would like to research a heavier version of wave master for adults that does not wear out so fast


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## Dansolo

Keep in mind a water leak from the bag is likely to be worse in the home environment for a lot of people. I have a lot of electronics and computer stuff in my basement, servers and stuff. Gonna have a home theater room down there soon as well. I don't know if you guys keep anything of value in your basement, but that's what I'd be worried about.

I can imagine sand would be hard to get out, but it just seems so much safer.


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## Madcity

Thanks for all the great input guys.

I put in an order with Century and was able to find a 25% off coupon code online, so I got the XXL Wavemaster Top & Base, a Speed Bag, Jump Rope, Cup and Hand Wraps for roughly $300 dollars. (Coupon Code: DZMMA100 if anyone needs it.)

I am planning on just making a mount for the speed bag by basically installing upside down shelving supports and using some Oak plywood I have in the garage. I have heard the composite board that many come with usually falls apart pretty quickly.

Dansolo: Exactly, we have a home theater downstairs, electronics & carpeting in one area that will be close to my training room. Unfortunately the drain was installed nowhere near this area by our sinks and water softener and instead is across the basement near our water heater.


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## Madcity

Just an FYI to anyone thinking about ordering the Wavemaster XXL.

 I ordered mine from Century MMA and in the item description it says you need to order item# xxxxx with it (which is the base.) I did not realize this at the time and placed another order the next day for the base.

When my original order showed up it did in fact come with a base. SO now I have a second base coming that I don&#8217;t need (although I have offered it to a guy at my school who wants to get a Wavemaster XXL so this will save him some cash if he just gets the &#8220;Top&#8221; piece).

In any case, if you order one online you may want to contact the retailer to confirm what it comes with because the shipping cost of sending the base back for refund is about $20-25 if they will accept a return. Just a heads up.


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## rframe

Madcity said:


> SO now I have a second base coming that I dont need (although I have offered it to a guy at my school who wants to get a Wavemaster XXL so this will save him some cash if he just gets the Top piece). In any case, if you order one online you may want to contact the retailer to confirm what it comes with because the shipping cost of sending the base back for refund is about $20-25 if they will accept a return. Just a heads up.



That's nonsense man, I'd be on the phone with them giving them an earful and threatening a charge-back if they dont resolve the problem at "their own cost".  Just looked at their web site and see where it says you need to order the base.  That's clearly an error on their part that they should 1) correct on their site and 2) reimburse you for.


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## Dansolo

rframe said:


> That's nonsense man, I'd be on the phone with them giving them an earful and threatening a charge-back if they dont resolve the problem at "their own cost".  Just looked at their web site and see where it says you need to order the base.  That's clearly an error on their part that they should 1) correct on their site and 2) reimburse you for.



I agree with this. Their fault, their loss.


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## MilkManX

They are okay but I prefer a hanging bag.

I would use Sand for sure. Its cheap at Home Depot and it will hold it better.


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## JakeMax

I've used with Wavemaster XXL many times. Overall it's a pretty good free standing bag. Personally, I always recommend a hanging bag as I think they are better. When you hit a hanging bag it tends to move a little which helps develop your timing and speed. You don't get that same kind of movement with a free standing heavy bag. Also, the center of gravity is different. However, if you need to get a free standing one then the XXL is the way to go. I filled mine with water and it never had any problems with leaks. The good thing about water is that it's pretty easy to unfill (well compared to sand anyway). So if you ever need to move the bag water is a good option. This site seems to have a pretty objective review of positives and negatives of the XXL.


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## Markku P

JakeMax said:


> I've used with Wavemaster XXL many times. Overall it's a pretty good free standing bag.



Wavemaster XXL is good to get..and use with sand


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## Mark Lynn

I know it is an old thread but in case anyone reads this and is thinking about getting one here is my experience.

We have three in my school and they are without a doubt my most used piece of training equipment.  I teach in a Rec. Center so I can't have hanging bags and I have to use the free standing type.

I have 2 of the Kid kick WMs, 1 Powerline Original WM, 3 WMXXls in my room at the Rec.  Out of the 3 WMXXls I have only had problems with one and that was due to someone coming in after hours un screwing the base and then beating on the WMXXL (probably they unscrewed it when moving it and not realizing it then beat on it) and they then tried to correct the problem by unscrewing it more and cross threading it back in and beating on it again  thereby breaking the top and costing me roughly $300.00.:erg:   That same base might have dripped out a few drops of water when it was moved around but that was it.  The other two have held up well.  I teach multiple classes per night, from kids to teens, 4 times per week and they are used several times each night being rolled onto and off of the mat.

Pros

While my oldest teenage student can knock it over with a well place side kick for the most part unless the students are doing running and jumping kicks they get rocked back, but don't go over.  However having the younger kids do running and jumping kicks trying to knock it over is a great way to end class on a high note, also it is a great confidence builder, as well as a retention tool for the classes.
The base unlike the Powerline WM (an original WM with a Powerline top) is lower so even my students (ages 6-7) can get their little legs up and kick the bag, the WM has a taller base and it is harder for the young beginner kids to kick that high.  Believe me you don't want little Johnny all of the sudden to cry out OWWWW! because the lost concentration and kicked the hard base.  Terrible for retention.  This is a reason I always have to remind the kids "Ok kids what part of the bag do we hit?"   "The top"   "Do we hit the base?" "Noooo"  "Why not"    "Because it hurts".
The WMXXL weighs about 150-170lbs with water in it so it is solid enough to take good punches, and kicks, and yet it rolls easy on and off of the mat.
As a teacher it is a very versatile training tool in class, I have kids using it from 6 yrs old through Adults.  We hit the bags with Nunchaku, Tonfa, Jo, escrima sticks, etc. etc. in addition to the flying kicks etc. etc.

Cons

The base rocks back and then slams down to the ground.  This is a concern of mine for the younger kids especially, you don't want any toes getting under that base.  When the students are in their early teens (or younger with the jumping kicks) they have enough power to rock the WMXXL back (not enough to knock it over but...) enough to rock the front of the base up off of the mat.  In seven years of using them we've never had an issue with toes getting under the WMXXL but it is something that I watch like a hawk in class.
Because of the design and with the base rocking backwards I don't use it to train/teach elbows with because the feet are so near the base.  I've tried to find a method of teaching a particular strike elbow that the students don't like to hold pads for.  However the WMXXL (any of the WMs for that matter) the base is two wide for that strike without the fear of getting the feet under it.  Likewise same goes for leg kicks as well for practicing on the WMXXLs and certainly on the WMs.

For my money I would recommend the WMXXLs over the original designed WMs (including the Powerline models).  Also Century now also has the WMXXL Pro their redesigned WMXXL with a different base that might correct or help with some of the issues of the base rocking back.  HOWEVER they list for around $100.00 more than the WMXXL.  The WMXXL is being phased out and only the WMXXL Pro is now listed in the catalogs but they can be ordered from the company.

In regards to sand vs. water
I need the WMs (all of them) to be able to move; since I have limited mat space, they are moved several times per night.  I have placed water in them since they are easier to move.  In another school that I have filled in as a guest instructor they have filled their original type WM with sand and it is planted, I don't think it has moved from  it's spot in the past 3-4 years.  I tried to move it onto the mat for the students to kick and it wasn't worth the effort.  I'll take being able to have the WM rock back and even be knocked over in a trade off for maneuverability.

In regards to shipping and handling.
Be aware that Century does charge a $25.00 over sized box fee and then shipping charges on top of that.  Sometimes they offer specials where you don't pay for shipping but you have to catch them at the right time.  I have never had to order a base separately.


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## Danny T

We have a couple XXL's and use them 'Only' with the youth and Beginner teens and adults for learning the basic fundamentals of kicking. After that we use hanging heavy bags. Have snapped the base of the post on 3 XXLs from kicking. Have them filled with water in order to be able to move them but they do move around when kicking and punching on them. Great for youth and beginners but heavy kickers will destroy them.


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## JMike

I actually use the XXL a lot at home. I'd of course prefer a traditional hanging bag, but in terms of setting it up (and moving it around when needed) the bag serves it's purpose. With the XXL I didn't have to worry about drilling holes into my ceiling or getting a heavy bag stand. Here's a decent review of it that I would say is pretty accurate. Sure it suffers the same issues as all free standing bags, but it's probably the best one available. So if you want a standing bag I'd go with the XXL.



Danny T said:


> We have a couple XXL's and use them 'Only' with the youth and Beginner teens and adults for learning the basic fundamentals of kicking. After that we use hanging heavy bags. Have snapped the base of the post on 3 XXLs from kicking. Have them filled with water in order to be able to move them but they do move around when kicking and punching on them. Great for youth and beginners but heavy kickers will destroy them.


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