# Average Rent Costs...?



## Sapper6

hey gang,

just wondering, what is the average cost of rent for commercial space these days?  i know it will differ somewhat depending on the areas.  mainly just wanted some input from the folks who already run their own place.

the demographic is southern missouri.  small town of about 10,000 people.  this space is in a small strip mall kinda thing, just off the busiest street in town.  nice parking lot with established business neighbors.  the space is 1250 sq. ft. and rents for $450.00 per month w/ $450.00 deposit.

in all appearances, it really looks like an ideal setting for a MA school.  1 main entrance, large store front windows, no inner obstructions from the front to the back.  what do you all think....?


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## Andrew Green

Just don't forget your other costs...

Are there any common area feew on top of that?  maintanence, garbage removal, etc.

Insurnace?

Advertising?

Utilities?

Business taxes?

Phones?

Do a little research and find out how much all the other stuff is going to cost you too.


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## Sapper6

hey andrew,

yeah i've already considered all of those fees and costs as well.  my question is rather specific.  im wondering about the cost per square foot in particular.  of course with every business there are added expenses, just like all the ones you've just mentioned.  thats been covered.  i've never operated in a commercial space before and im just wanting to know what everyone thinks.

basically: 1250 square feet rents for $450.00 per month.  good deal or rip off...?

thanks again andrew :ultracool


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## Andrew Green

But they all come into it,  if your monthly check to the landlord is $450 including utilities you got a good thing.

If they are going to tack on another $300 common area fees, plus you get another $200 in utilities it starts looking less like a good deal...

But call a few different places and see what the rates are around you, figure out how many students paying how much you have.  

Really whether or not it is a good deal or not comes down to how much money you are making (or losing) while you are there.


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## Rob Broad

$450 is a great base price.  I would also do a little checking on the common fees, utilities, and other costs to make sure you don't get over your head.


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## lvwhitebir

My monthly was about $2000 per month (including CAM and utilities) for a 2000 sq.ft. commercial space.  I was in a more up-scale area, with a 20' storefront, all windows.  Other places I checked out in my area were comparable. 

You should check out other spaces, just to get an idea of the cost in your area.  I would check out spaces you don't even intend to rent (don't let them know that though), just to see what companies are offering.

WhiteBirch


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## Sapper6

thanks again andrew, Rob & white birch for the info.


hey everyone, feel free to chime in as well, unless there's only 3 people here that pay rent...? :idunno:


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## Mark Weiser

I actually got a great deal due to the neccessary needs of the Mall Mgmt of getting Renters into the mall and building up the traffic flow.  I got a 2301 sq ft area with two dressing rooms, a Retail space aka office area and a very good size practice area with two entrances. For the amazing price of only $600 a month on a month to month lease.


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## D_Brady

Mark Weiser said:
			
		

> I actually got a great deal due to the neccessary needs of the Mall Mgmt of getting Renters into the mall and building up the traffic flow.  I got a 2301 sq ft area with two dressing rooms, a Retail space aka office area and a very good size practice area with two entrances. For the amazing price of only $600 a month on a month to month lease.



That's awsome. I'm renting a smaller space right now for 450 amonth utilities included 2 bathrooms in a stripmall, oh I should say sublease so there are some issues.But I figure you have to start paying you dues and set your goals to get what and where you want to be.


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## Jeff Boler

A couple of things to keep in mind....

Location shouldn't be the "Biggest" of all factors in opening a school.  Most people that are wanting instruction will go looking for it.  So it's not neccessary to go rent some outlot right next to the Walmart Supercenter.  Look at some of the "less" traveled strip malls, and try there.  I'm sure the rent will be monumentally cheaper.  You can spend those left over funds on advertising.

In my opinion, anyone paying under $800 a month is doing really well for themselves....


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## Dr. Kenpo

I currently pay 240 a mo., for twice a week. Is this good?

I rent a spacious room out of a dance studio.

Thanks


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## Rob Broad

That seems like a good rate to me.


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## calmone

Sapper6, 
My school has three locations. The first one is in Springfield, Mo it runs $500 a month plus utilities, The second one is in El Dorado Springs, Mo the instructor owns the building. The third one is in Joplin, MO it runs $350 a month plus utilities and I run it. Be prepared for the expenses you will incur painting walls, carpet, signs, advertisement, I thought I would be ok with 10 students, I actually need 30 students to make it pay for itself


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## lvwhitebir

Dr. Kenpo said:
			
		

> I currently pay 240 a mo., for twice a week. Is this good?
> 
> I rent a spacious room out of a dance studio.
> 
> Thanks



That really can't be answered without knowing a lot more.  If it was space in Times Square NYC I would say it was an excellent deal.  If it's a space in the boondocks of North Dakota I would say it wasn't.

The big difference is what is the going rate per square foot for *your* area.  You can only get that by looking around at other spaces.  In my area, paying about $0.75 - $0.85 per square foot per month is about average for leasing space.  Here's how I would come up with a reasonable rate for someone to rent a space I'm leasing.  I would determine how much "dead" time my facility has per month that is rentable.  I figure about 16 hours per day is usable and I use about 4 hours for my classes so I have about 12 hours of dead time.  Divide that into my monthly rent, gas, and electric to determine the cost per hour of that dead time to me.  I would then charge slightly more.  So, my rent/electric/gas/CAM (a 2000sf space) was about $2000 per month and my facility had about 12 hours per day of dead time.  That's about 360 hours per month.  Divided into $2000, that would be a cost of $5.56 per hour.  At 16 hours per month that would be about $89 per month.  I would probably round that up to $100.  The more the facility does for you, too, (as in advertising, etc) the higher you'll pay.

You also need to just know that if you charge a "reasonable" rate for your classes, are you at least breaking even?  If so then the rent is reasonable but you might still get a better deal elsewhere.

WhiteBirch


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## Kempojujutsu

My school is located inside a health club. I have the whole downstairs area. Which is about 2200 sq. feet. I pay $400 a month that includes everything, electric, grabage, water. I do have to pay for my own phone. Many times in there ads they mention karate available. I also have a free membership with that also. This is start of my third year there.


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## Kembudo-Kai Kempoka

Sapper6 said:
			
		

> hey andrew,
> 
> yeah i've already considered all of those fees and costs as well. my question is rather specific. im wondering about the cost per square foot in particular. of course with every business there are added expenses, just like all the ones you've just mentioned. thats been covered. i've never operated in a commercial space before and im just wanting to know what everyone thinks.
> 
> basically: 1250 square feet rents for $450.00 per month. good deal or rip off...?
> 
> thanks again andrew :ultracool


I'm behind "the orange curtain", in Southern Cali. 450 for 1250 would be a dream come true, or a spot in the 'hood where no business would survive. Consider the number of "covers" (tuitions/month) it would take to cover your overhead, and does the avg income in the area support the disposable income required to gain your minimum number of covers.  In other words, 450/mo. is great if you're in a neighborhood where the mean income is large enough for 25 people to pay 45 a month. But if the SES is low, you might have some trouble.

Good luck.

Dave


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## lvwhitebir

Kempojujutsu said:
			
		

> My school is located inside a health club. I have the whole downstairs area. Which is about 2200 sq. feet. I pay $400 a month that includes everything, electric, grabage, water. I do have to pay for my own phone. Many times in there ads they mention karate available. I also have a free membership with that also. This is start of my third year there.



If I may ask, how many hours a week do you use the facility for teaching?

WhiteBirch


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## Kempojujutsu

I have my own training area that I don't share with anyone else. It is not like a big area where they would have cardio, yoga, karate etc. Since it is my own area I could run classes every day if I choose. But since I do have a full time job also, I have some off days that I don't run classes. About 11 hours per week, there is some kind of class going on.


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## Rob Broad

As a suggestion to anyone looking at seting up some time to teach in a health club or YMCa etc...  You could try a profit sharing program with a cap.

You offer to pay them half of all tuitions up to a maximum each month.  You would be surprised how many places will go along with this.  You only pay a portion of what you bring in and never pay more than you are making.


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## Galvatron

Man I was just looking at a retail space in a newly developed area here in North Florida and it was $20 per sq ft!!! (per year)


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## hoshinco

In Denver it'll run you from $6-$12 a sq. ft. which is a lot more than I could handle right now. 
 I'm renting space for a couple of classes per week at different locations. My evening class is at a holistic center and it's costing me $20 and hour. My upcoming morning class is at one of the Denver rec centers and is costing me $25 an hour. The rec center is actually the better deal because they have mats that I can use and plenty of room to grow.

 Anybody in Denver want to form a co-op and go in together on space? 

 Robert Morgen
www.highmountainhoshin.com


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