# Gi or no-gi, which is safer?



## Andrew Green (May 8, 2006)

What's everyones take on this debate purely from the point of safety in training?

What sort of takedowns / throws / groundwork is more likely to cause training injuries?


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## Eternal Beginner (May 8, 2006)

I'm not the most experienced person on the board but I have actually trained both gi and no gi for a little while now.  As far as minor injuries go, I'd have to say I have found the gi a little more dangerous.  It isn't uncommon to get a finger or toe caught in a fold of fabric and have it twisted the wrong way.

As far as major injuries go, from personal experience, the ones I have seen haven't had a direct correlation to gi or nogi.  They were situational and I don't think the attire made a difference.  I'm not saying it may not make a difference, just that I haven't seen it yet.

I have heard from some more experienced grapplers that they prefer no gi for safety as the big throws aren't as likely in a nogi situation...but that is just heresay on my part.


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## Lisa (May 8, 2006)

Having not done gi grappling much myself, anything I would ofer here would be pure speculation.

One would think that bigger throws etc, would be possible with gi as opposed to without thus increasing the potential for injury.  I am also figuring gi burn would hurt a lot.


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## Andrew Green (May 8, 2006)

I'd vote no-gi as being safer, not only the big throws and causght fingers, but a lot of those judo style throws, sweeps and wheels are no exactly knee friendly.

Wrestling style takedowns are not "great" for your knees, but I'd say they are a lot nicer then Judo ones as a whole


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## green meanie (May 8, 2006)

Having done both, I can't really think of anything significant that would tip the scales one way or another.


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## Makalakumu (May 8, 2006)

green meanie said:
			
		

> Having done both, I can't really think of anything significant that would tip the scales one way or another.


 
I'd have to agree.  I think the bigger throws are all about learning the ukemi.  Get those and you are fine.  Of course, alot of those throws really only work well with a gi on.  Hopefully, your opponent has a jacket or something.  Or you could just work O soto gari alot.


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## Sapper6 (May 8, 2006)

Gi's are dangerous now?

wow.  what's next?

in case you've all forgotten, it's called the martial arts...not tap dancing.  perhaps you just wear the Gi and be more respectful of your training partner.  don't blame the uniform for a lack of control on your part.


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## Eternal Beginner (May 8, 2006)

green meanie said:
			
		

> Having done both, I can't really think of anything significant that would tip the scales one way or another.


I think it is often people who have never really trained  in a gi that think gi training is so dangerous.  My comments were purely anecdotal.

Personally, I have seen nasty throws and the like in both gi and nogi environments and not too many injuries in either so far.  Of course, I'm not near as experienced as some of the other members who have far more extensive training than myself.


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## Andrew Green (May 8, 2006)

Sapper6 said:
			
		

> in case you've all forgotten, it's called the martial arts...not tap dancing. perhaps you just wear the Gi and be more respectful of your training partner. don't blame the uniform for a lack of control on your part.



Not dangerous, grappling safe in general.  Question was which is more safe 

Not sure about the wearing it to be respectful of your training partner idea, what do you mean by that?  How is a gi more respectful then other clothes?

Differences in safety are pretty minimal, enough to influence someones choice?  probably not.  All comes down to what you enjoy more


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## Sapper6 (May 8, 2006)

Andrew Green said:
			
		

> Not dangerous, grappling safe in general. Question was which is more safe
> 
> Not sure about the wearing it to be respectful of your training partner idea, what do you mean by that? How is a gi more respectful then other clothes?
> 
> Differences in safety are pretty minimal, enough to influence someones choice? probably not. All comes down to what you enjoy more


 
sure, it is about choice and preference.

the respect aspect?  when the gi comes to be used as a "handle" for gripping, enhancing the execution of throws and locks.  that's why i mentioned the respect thing.  it's about control, regardless whether you wear a gi or not.  it's not the uniform that determines safety; it's the person wearing it.


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## Andrew Green (May 8, 2006)

Sapper6 said:
			
		

> sure, it is about choice and preference.
> 
> the respect aspect? when the gi comes to be used as a "handle" for gripping, enhancing the execution of throws and locks. that's why i mentioned the respect thing. it's about control, regardless whether you wear a gi or not.



hmm...  ok, well I still wouldn't call wearing a gi more respectful for your partner.  Unless of course it is a gi class, but then wearing a gi in a no gi class could also be seen as unsportsmanlike.



			
				Sapper6 said:
			
		

> it's not the uniform that determines safety; it's the person wearing it.



Very true, some people just don't get the "It's not a competition it's a drill thing"


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## Eternal Beginner (May 9, 2006)

I asked some guys about this last night.  The general consensus was that neither was "safer" but the injuries were different.  

The one injury mentioned repeatedly was the neck injuries in nogi, which seemed fairly prevalent and serious (ie., long term).  They seem worse in nogi because when breaking the posture in gi, you can grab collars and the like, whereas in nogi grabbing the back of the neck is far more common.  You may also take into consideration that most of these guys are professional fighters or regular competitors so they go against high level competition.  They aren't just people rolling with their friends for fun...different level of intensity.

Lots of the strictly nogi guys I know have neck issues.  The gi guys seem to have more finger issues (usually from getting them twisted, hyper-extended, etc.   As far as knees go, it seems fairly equal.  There doesn't seem to be a huge gi/nogi difference.  Again, one caveat, this is all anecdotal.


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## The MMA kid! (May 9, 2006)

I think that wearing the gi is safer for begginners.why? because it teaches you more control. also, I haven't heard anyone mention the sweat-factor. No gi will cause a lot more slipping than training with the gi.

grappling with the gi will help you become much better at escapes. for example, if you are put in a lock, and are able to escape it with wearing a gi, you would have absolutely no problem at all escaping it without the gi. most no-gi BJJ grapplers have started they're training with the gi. it essential to wear when learning the basics.

learning with the gi will make no-gi grappling safer because you learn control.


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## Eric Daniel (May 9, 2006)

upnorthkyosa said:
			
		

> Of course, alot of those throws really only work well with a gi on. Hopefully, your opponent has a jacket or something. Or you could just work O soto gari alot.


 
I think that throws that only work with a gi are not really meant to be used in a comfrontaition in real life because I don't think anyone is going to walk around town with a gi on. I think that it's good to train the techniques with and without a gi.


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## Andrew Green (May 9, 2006)

True, but some other clothing can be used to throw people, t-shirts might not work, bu most jackets or hoodies or other heavier clothes should work for a throw.  Might get stretched or ripped, but I don't think that would be a concern at the time


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## Eternal Beginner (May 9, 2006)

Eric Daniel said:
			
		

> I think that throws that only work with a gi are not really meant to be used in a comfrontaition in real life because I don't think anyone is going to walk around town with a gi on. I think that it's good to train the techniques with and without a gi.


I think you have to realise that many of the throws that are done with the gi can be modified without gi.  Grips on necks, arms and waists can replace collars, sleeves and belts.  If you have actually trained in both gi and nogi this becomes abundantly clear.  

I have surprised myself in a nogi competition by pulling off a takedown that I had only practiced in a gi by just adjusting what I was gripping.  I do acknowledge there are differences, but if you train both  you will see a lot of similarities as well.  I'm glad I have been open to training both because I think each benefit the other.


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## green meanie (May 9, 2006)

Andrew Green said:
			
		

> True, but some other clothing can be used to throw people, t-shirts might not work, bu most jackets or hoodies or other heavier clothes should work for a throw. Might get stretched or ripped, but I don't think that would be a concern at the time


 
Agreed. I've found jeans and a denim jacket to be _VERY_ comparable.


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