# Reality Kenpo Technique Clips?



## HKphooey (Oct 2, 2008)

Has anyone seen any good video clips where kenpo artists are using techniques on "non-compliant" training partners.  Most clips we see have very scripted attacks with little or no zealous or resistance/follow-through.  If anyone has any good clips, I would love to see them.

Thanks.


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## thetruth (Oct 3, 2008)

I'd like to see some kenpo on attackers in FIST or spear suits being uncooperative that way they could go to town and it would certainly show a particular persons kenpo is just a regurgitation of techniques or if they can alter and adjust using the principles of kenpo and maintain the flow and movement without pause to think.  This would interest me greatly.  


Cheers
Sam:asian:


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## JTKenpo (Oct 3, 2008)

I have a camera anybody got a suit that is willing to put it on?


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## thetruth (Oct 3, 2008)

If I was anywhere near you and could get hold of a suit I would gladly do it.


CHeers
Sam:asian:


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## marlon (Oct 3, 2008)

anyone interested and coming to Canada near Montreal, we can do this and hopefully learn from each other.

Respectfully,
Marlon

514-453-0460
514-983-7352


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## JTKenpo (Oct 4, 2008)

thetruth said:


> If I was anywhere near you and could get hold of a suit I would gladly do it.
> 
> 
> CHeers
> Sam:asian:


 
I take it your not a New Englanda.


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## JTKenpo (Oct 4, 2008)

marlon said:


> anyone interested and coming to Canada near Montreal, we can do this and hopefully learn from each other.
> 
> Respectfully,
> Marlon
> ...


 

Marlon do you have a red suit or Hitech?


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## thetruth (Oct 4, 2008)

JTKenpo said:


> I take it your not a New Englanda.



Negative.  Melbourne, Australia mate.


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## JTKenpo (Oct 4, 2008)

thetruth said:


> Negative. Melbourne, Australia mate.


 

eh hop skip and a 22 hour plane ride.


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## marlon (Oct 4, 2008)

JTKenpo said:


> Marlon do you have a red suit or Hitech?


 

??
i have a black gi and a white one...if you mean padding though i have access to some good padded suits for anyone to go all out...plus i do not mind getting bruised from hard hits and training...there really, in the end, no other way to say that you train fully and properly, imho

marlon


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## JTKenpo (Oct 4, 2008)

marlon said:


> ??
> i have a black gi and a white one...if you mean padding though i have access to some good padded suits for anyone to go all out...plus i do not mind getting bruised from hard hits and training...there really, in the end, no other way to say that you train fully and properly, imho
> 
> marlon


 
LOL!!!  I wasn't referring to the color of your gi.  A red suit is century's version of the fully padded suit and Hitech is one used in "reality" training such as Jim Wagners, I believe.


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## marlon (Oct 4, 2008)

JTKenpo said:


> LOL!!! I wasn't referring to the color of your gi. A red suit is century's version of the fully padded suit and Hitech is one used in "reality" training such as Jim Wagners, I believe.


 

Well then...i do have access to such suits.  Are you coming up so we can do some filming and beat the crap out of each other?


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## Doc (Oct 5, 2008)

thetruth said:


> I'd like to see some kenpo on attackers in FIST or spear suits being uncooperative that way they could go to town and it would certainly show a particular persons kenpo is just a regurgitation of techniques or if they can alter and adjust using the principles of kenpo and maintain the flow and movement without pause to think.  This would interest me greatly.
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Sam:asian:



Interesting idea, but I fail to see the point. Considering most sophisticated aspects of most traditional arts are NOT supposed to be about blunt force execution. The Red Man, and other versions of the padded adversary are excellent tools in short self-defense courses, that obviously bring a degree of reality to the uninitiated, and have a place with the appropriate objective.

However, as a long term training tool in an art that utilizes the weak points of the body, along with the physical manipulation of body posture through these weak areas, padding the "attacker" would not be demonstrative of the effectiveness of the applications. 

It would be akin to checking the effectiveness of a bullet on a particular substance, by protecting  the substance you want to test with a bullet resistant material. Pick your objective, and then counter what you're trying to find out so you do not reach the objective, makes no sense.


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## Doc (Oct 5, 2008)

HKphooey said:


> Has anyone seen any good video clips where kenpo artists are using techniques on "non-compliant" training partners.


I believe they call them "fights."  The idea of a "non-compliant training partner" would be contradictory to full on street execution in any application. How do you go "all out" on a "training partner?" Not that you couldn't, but you probably would only get one opportunity, and run short on training partners rather quickly.


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## HKphooey (Oct 5, 2008)

Doc said:


> I believe they call them "fights."  The idea of a "non-compliant training partner" would be contradictory to full on street execution in any application. How do you go "all out" on a "training partner?" Not that you couldn't, but you probably would only get one opportunity, and run short on training partners rather quickly.


 
Agreed, but I would love to see an atacke other than a slow motion punch (not even directed at person).


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## thetruth (Oct 6, 2008)

Doc said:


> Interesting idea, but I fail to see the point. Considering most sophisticated aspects of most traditional arts are NOT supposed to be about blunt force execution. The Red Man, and other versions of the padded adversary are excellent tools in short self-defense courses, that obviously bring a degree of reality to the uninitiated, and have a place with the appropriate objective.
> 
> However, as a long term training tool in an art that utilizes the weak points of the body, along with the physical manipulation of body posture through these weak areas, padding the "attacker" would not be demonstrative of the effectiveness of the applications.
> 
> It would be akin to checking the effectiveness of a bullet on a particular substance, by protecting  the substance you want to test with a bullet resistant material. Pick your objective, and then counter what you're trying to find out so you do not reach the objective, makes no sense.



Fair Call.  I can understand that with the SL4 etc but with the motion Kenpo that many practice a lot of the strikes are blunt force and not all strikes/blocks are to vulnerable points.   

I would also be interested in the mind lag created when someone behaves unexpectedly and how that mind lag translates to stopping or interrupting the flow of kenpo techniques and how long it takes for a practitioner  to  change their strategy and resume that flow.  

Cheers
Sam :asian:


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## JTKenpo (Oct 6, 2008)

Docs post represents what has been nagging at me all weekend about this idea, not that it is a bad idea none the less.  No matter the outcome the nay sayers will still be nay sayers and the faithfull will still believe.

But again still a good idea even if only to learn something for ourselves.  Marlon I'm with ya buddy we should talk and see what we can work out!!  I think we are only 4-6 hours apart.


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## DavidCC (Oct 6, 2008)

HKphooey said:


> Agreed, but I would love to see an atacke other than a slow motion punch (not even directed at person).


 
If you go look at Doc's Youtube page, he shows a number of videos where the punches are full-speed.  Most of them demonstrate blocking drills, but I think there is one really good one of Mr. Bode doing Attacking mace.


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## marlon (Oct 6, 2008)

JTKenpo said:


> Docs post represents what has been nagging at me all weekend about this idea, not that it is a bad idea none the less. No matter the outcome the nay sayers will still be nay sayers and the faithfull will still believe.
> 
> But again still a good idea even if only to learn something for ourselves. Marlon I'm with ya buddy we should talk and see what we can work out!! I think we are only 4-6 hours apart.


 


sounds good to me!


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## Doc (Oct 6, 2008)

JTKenpo said:


> Docs post represents what has been nagging at me all weekend about this idea, not that it is a bad idea none the less.  No matter the outcome the nay sayers will still be nay sayers and the faithfull will still believe.
> 
> But again still a good idea even if only to learn something for ourselves.  Marlon I'm with ya buddy we should talk and see what we can work out!!  I think we are only 4-6 hours apart.



I agree wholeheartedly sir. Its all about the objective. If it is to check the effectiveness of the commercial kenpo product, it would not make sense. However, to put things in context and to discover personal issues of your own psyche in conflict, I think its great. They do the same in self-defense courses, and in many ways, you come out of those courses better prepared after the experience because of the level of reality it brings to the emotional aspect of the training..


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## DavidCC (Oct 6, 2008)

Doc said:


> ... However, to put things in context and to discover personal issues of your own psyche in conflict, I think its great. They do the same in self-defense courses, and in many ways, you come out of those courses better prepared after the experience because of the level of reality it brings to the emotional aspect of the training..


 
Wen we do our "women's self defense" course, a good portion of it is aobut the emotional capacity to do something in the face of danger.  it is not unusual for some of them to become very emotional, upset, etc.

We have a few of the mroe fool-hardy (or altruistic) kenpo students come to class, pad up, and the women get to smack us around some.  It seems to help.  We offer 1-night and 6-night versions, in the longer version, it gets a lot mroe physcial )see my youtube page for an example, under KempoDavid)


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## Doc (Oct 6, 2008)

DavidCC said:


> Wen we do our "women's self defense" course, a good portion of it is aobut the emotional capacity to do something in the face of danger.  it is not unusual for some of them to become very emotional, upset, etc.
> 
> We have a few of the mroe fool-hardy (or altruistic) kenpo students come to class, pad up, and the women get to smack us around some.  It seems to help.  We offer 1-night and 6-night versions, in the longer version, it gets a lot mroe physcial )see my youtube page for an example, under KempoDavid)



Martial Science University
SubLevel Kenpo Concepts
Taken from the Course 102 Coursebook


*ADRENAL STRESS TRAINING*​


Now that you have passed Course 101, and as you prepare for Course 102, you are beginning to embark upon a completely different experience. To insure a students ability to perform in real life situations, it is necessary to spend considerable time from this point forward, physically interacting with other students. It is only through this methodology will you begin to absorb the nuances of proper technique execution on a live active and resistant human being. The subtleties inherent in this type of study can only be understood through these hands on experiences. 

Additionally at this level, another element will be interjected into your study. It is called Adrenal Stress Training. This component is a necessary part of our curriculum and will serve you well in your academic and physical journey to self-defense proficiency. 

Up to now you have worked diligently on basic skills, and technique sequences. However, although you may feel you are beginning to feel comfortable with some of your physical movements, they are in what we call soft or Preliminary Muscle Memory. That is, the Synaptic Pathways you are beginning to build that are associated with your Preliminary Muscle Memory have yet to be hardened to the chemical effects of an Adrenal Dump. This is a natural surge of chemicals into the bloodstream in reaction to external stress and the possibility of bodily harm.

Adrenal Stress Training or AST in conjunction with continued repetitions in realistic scenarios is designed to harden Synaptic Pathways, and make them impervious to Adrenal Stress Syndrome or the dump in the heat of a confrontation. This is accomplished in two ways. First, through artificially created external verbal stimulus. Translation: You will be subjected to extreme verbal abuse. Second, your training partner will attack you with a degree of realism forcing you to perform properly. Although it is a gradual process, ultimately you will arrive at a place where you will feel comfortable with this type of training as well.

It is important you realize this type of training can and will elicit significant emotional responses from most people. This is a normal part of the training and is not to be taken personally. In the classroom, once that component of the training is over, instructors will evaluate your performance for the day in a calm way and allow your heartbeat and adrenalin levels to return to normal. Some students have been known to become angry, while others are driven to tears. This is normal. Embrace it, and work your way through it. Once you can perform a technique sequence under these conditions with consistent effectiveness, you are equally prepared for street encounters of similar circumstances. 

This is the same type of training used in public safety health care, the military, and civilian law enforcement. It is a tried and true methodology used in the training of persons who may be subjected to, and be forced to perform under life and death circumstances to insure the best chances for survival.

It is the only way you can be assured without actually being attacked on the street, that you have sufficient skills, and are capable of effectively handling a situation. Therefore, it is a great confidence builder. Additionally, this continued physical interaction, will also build significant cardio vascular strength as well as mental and physical toughness.

You may at first experience Physical Shutdown. Under stress the body can stutter and freeze even when you mentally feel you know what to do. This is part of the effect of the Adrenal Dump. Work through it, and do the best you can. However never stop. Complete your technique to the best of your ability. If you fail, youll have another chance to succeed. In class, everyone fails sometimes. We deal with failure in the classroom so we dont fail on the streets.

Although emotionally and physically demanding, you can go no further at the Martial Science University College of SubLevel Four Kenpo without this type of training. For some, it may be difficult at first. You are encouraged to communicate with other students near your rank and share experiences to better able you to cope with it. You are also encouraged to talk to instructors about what you are feeling. We want you to communicate to make your study and training a unique and productive experience. If you do that, you and the institution both succeed.


Good Luck,


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## DavidCC (Oct 7, 2008)

Doc said:


> Martial Science University
> SubLevel Kenpo Concepts
> Taken from the Course 102 Coursebook
> 
> ...


 
I remember well my first taste of this, and I remember thinking "what the hell happened to that guy who came to our school and was so much fun to train with???" ROFL  it was tough, but even the short time I went through this I feel did have a positive effect... 

Sometimes I think we should be doing more of this at our school, and sometimes I'm glad we don't.  Depends on whether I am teaching or training LOL.

OK Doc, now a serious question:  is this effective on younger students?  (9-14 years old)?  or are they not mature enough to handle it?  I can think of only a handful of our child students who would be able to deal with training like this in a positive way... but that is just a guess


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## JTKenpo (Oct 7, 2008)

DavidCC said:


> I remember well my first taste of this, and I remember thinking "what the hell happened to that guy who came to our school and was so much fun to train with???" ROFL it was tough, but even the short time I went through this I feel did have a positive effect...
> 
> Sometimes I think we should be doing more of this at our school, and sometimes I'm glad we don't. Depends on whether I am teaching or training LOL.
> 
> OK Doc, now a serious question: is this effective on younger students? (9-14 years old)? or are they not mature enough to handle it? I can think of only a handful of our child students who would be able to deal with training like this in a positive way... but that is just a guess


 
I don't think many adults can handle it.  LOL


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