# UK Title Fight Ends With Boxer in a Coma.



## Tez3

Boxer Nick Blackwell in coma after title fight defeat

There's a lot of criticism of the referee for not stopping the fight sooner, the medical services for not jumping in sooner and the promotion for making the fighter parade around while waiting for the decision. Chris Eubank Snr. who is himself a well known boxer, told his son to target his opponent's body after fearing something was wrong after the heavy pounding he'd taken with the ref showing no sign of stopping the fight. Eubank Snr was banging on the mat telling them to stop the fight. It was stopped by the doctor eventually.
Eubank Sr. knows exactly what he's talking about, 25 years ago during one of his fights his opponent Michael Watson was hurt so badly he collapsed in the ring and was on the point of death. It took him years to recover but what happened to him changed the way athletes here are treated.Boxing: The night Michael Watson's career was ended
My thoughts and prayers are with Nick Blackwell, for a speedy and full recovery but while he fought bravely he really shouldn't have been in that ring, he simply wasn't ready for a fight with Eubank.


----------



## Gerry Seymour

Tez3 said:


> Boxer Nick Blackwell in coma after title fight defeat
> 
> There's a lot of criticism of the referee for not stopping the fight sooner, the medical services for not jumping in sooner and the promotion for making the fighter parade around while waiting for the decision. Chris Eubank Snr. who is himself a well known boxer, told his son to target his opponent's body after fearing something was wrong after the heavy pounding he'd taken with the ref showing no sign of stopping the fight. Eubank Snr was banging on the mat telling them to stop the fight. It was stopped by the doctor eventually.
> Eubank Sr. knows exactly what he's talking about, 25 years ago during one of his fights his opponent Michael Watson was hurt so badly he collapsed in the ring and was on the point of death. It took him years to recover but what happened to him changed the way athletes here are treated.Boxing: The night Michael Watson's career was ended
> My thoughts and prayers are with Nick Blackwell, for a speedy and full recovery but while he fought bravely he really shouldn't have been in that ring, he simply wasn't ready for a fight with Eubank.


I wish there was some way to truly protect the brains of fighters and others in contact sports. I understand people who choose to fight - I just don't think they should have to be permanently disabled for sport, competition, or entertainment. I hope he recovers fully.


----------



## Tez3

This is where Chris Eubank Snr. stepped into the ring to give his the instructions to not hit his opponents head, the fight should have been stopped in the 7th round it was obvious to us watching but not the referee it seems.


----------



## Transk53

Hope for a speedy and full recovery. On Talksport this morning, a boxer was saying that Eubank Snr did not say the above.


----------



## Tez3

Transk53 said:


> Hope for a speedy and full recovery. On Talksport this morning, a boxer was saying that Eubank Snr did not say the above.


Fingers crossed for him, the boxer was mistaken as he clearly did say it though. 
Did you watch the fight, it was on Five, I can't find a video of it to post up at the moment, perhaps it's copyright?


----------



## Tez3

This is Blackwell just before he collapsed.


----------



## Transk53

Tez3 said:


> Fingers crossed for him, the boxer was mistaken as he clearly did say it though.
> Did you watch the fight, it was on Five, I can't find a video of it to post up at the moment, perhaps it's copyright?


 
No I missed it. Did not that Five were showing any boxing. Thought it would have been ITV. Admittedly I don't follow too many of the Brit middleweights, but maybe now Jnr has a more realistic shot at Golovkin. Don't agree with Snr that Jnr would take him, at least not yet. Golovkin has a lot of experience with ring craft. Still though, that fight at the Brighton AMEX stadium would likely sell out.


----------



## Buka

What a damn shame. I hate seeing when this happens. I'm not pointing out any blame, but I'm glad I always had good corner men. Part of their job is to watch out for their fighter, especially when he's in trouble.


----------



## JowGaWolf

Transk53 said:


> Hope for a speedy and full recovery. On Talksport this morning, a boxer was saying that Eubank Snr did not say the above.


Full fight video.  From what I could tell it was clear that Eubank Sr knew the damage that was going on. You can actually see Eubank Jr let up on the punches as he seems more concerned with trying to score than trying to knock the guy out and put him away.


----------



## JowGaWolf

Tez3 said:


> View attachment 19810
> 
> This is Blackwell just before he collapsed.


Is it normal for boxers to have such large pupils in the ring?  I would have thought that it would be smaller with all of the light there.


----------



## Tez3

JowGaWolf said:


> Is it normal for boxers to have such large pupils in the ring?  I would have thought that it would be smaller with all of the light there.



That's one of the first things you notice isn't it, how wide the pupil is. I think it's a symptom of the bleed on his brain, it's certainly one of the signs of head trauma.


----------



## ShawnP

Tez3 said:


> This is where Chris Eubank Snr. stepped into the ring to give his the instructions to not hit his opponents head, the fight should have been stopped in the 7th round it was obvious to us watching but not the referee it seems.


Sorry Tez3 but i failed to hear him say that, i also failed to see that happen. after watching both the full video below and this one, what i heard and saw was Chris Eubank Sr. told his son that "Maybe he shouldn't leave the decision to the referee" and "your not gonna take him out in the face, your gonna take him out to the body" meaning hitting the head will not get him a knock out and right after the bell rang for the 9th round he came out and pounded Nick Blackwells head to what i would assume was an attempt to knock him out. i feel bad that Blackwell got hurt and i do agree the referee should have stepped in 2 rounds earlier to have a Dr. check the eye but in all honesty it was clear that Blackwell continued to fight back and defend and the swelling was not so prominent in that round (you can see it clearly at 34:39 there was a little swelling) and i believe the real damage came in round 8 from that barrage of rights and uppercuts and even the announcer was saying so, but what made the swelling over his eye extend to the point that the Referee stopped the fight was the right hook at 37:08 that you can clearly see as he turns around at 37:13 and at 37:47 the announcer states that. the fact is Chris Eubanks Jr. was targeting that eye throughout round 9. the bottom line is the during the entire fight, even up until the stoppage, Blackwell was fighting back and defending, i blame his corner and the Dr. for not giving the correct diagnosis in the corner at the end of round 9 but the Referee i think did a fair job.

Also i dont like that way Eubank would jab his head into Blackwells eye either, thats just dirty fighting in my book, but all they see is a win and unfortunately a lot of fighters get away with that.


----------



## Tez3

The day Chris Eubanks says 'gonna' will be the day freezes over, I assume you haven't heard him speak before, I heard him speak quite clearly albeit with his usual lisp.


----------



## Brian R. VanCise

Thoughts and prayers sent his way!


----------



## JowGaWolf

ShawnP said:


> Sorry Tez3 but i failed to hear him say that, i also failed to see that happen. after watching both the full video below and this one, what i heard and saw was Chris Eubank Sr. told his son that "Maybe he shouldn't leave the decision to the referee" and "your not gonna take him out in the face, your gonna take him out to the body" meaning hitting the head will not get him a knock out and right after the bell rang for the 9th round he came out and pounded Nick Blackwells head to what i would assume was an attempt to knock him out. i feel bad that Blackwell got hurt and i do agree the referee should have stepped in 2 rounds earlier to have a Dr. check the eye but in all honesty it was clear that Blackwell continued to fight back and defend and the swelling was not so prominent in that round (you can see it clearly at 34:39 there was a little swelling) and i believe the real damage came in round 8 from that barrage of rights and uppercuts and even the announcer was saying so, but what made the swelling over his eye extend to the point that the Referee stopped the fight was the right hook at 37:08 that you can clearly see as he turns around at 37:13 and at 37:47 the announcer states that. the fact is Chris Eubanks Jr. was targeting that eye throughout round 9. the bottom line is the during the entire fight, even up until the stoppage, Blackwell was fighting back and defending, i blame his corner and the Dr. for not giving the correct diagnosis in the corner at the end of round 9 but the Referee i think did a fair job.
> 
> Also i dont like that way Eubank would jab his head into Blackwells eye either, thats just dirty fighting in my book, but all they see is a win and unfortunately a lot of fighters get away with that.


I think Eubanks and the announcer questioned the effects the punches.  If my memory is correct Eubanks made a statement that he didn't know why the referee wasn't stopping the fight. I think it was right before he made the comment about not taking him out up top and to take him out at the body.

The way he fought with that injury makes me think he may have had a preexisting brain injuries.  He looked as if he could have continued if it hadn't been for his swollen eye, but the other eye was telling a different story.  The head can take a lot of damage and it just didn't seem like the damage he took that night would require a medically induced coma.

I agree with you.  The responsibility was on the his corner and the Dr giving an honest diagnosis.  The referee did his job.  Corners know their fighters better than the referee and the doctor, so they should be the first line of protection for a fighter.  They are the first ones that would recognize that "something is off" with their fighter.


----------



## Tez3

I imagine many boxers have some degree of damage to the brain, it's been proved now that repeated blows to the head even if not heavy cause damage, and that damage accumulates over time.
I was taught when refereeing MMA to check the eyes of fighters, the pupils being that wide would have been a warning sign to have the doctor check on the fighter. Did the corners know this as well, I have no idea, I do know that Blackwell had very little amateur experience as a boxer before he turned pro, he didn't follow the usual steps for fighters go through, he'd actually had little fight experience compared to most, many people I know were saying before the fight he wasn't ready for this fight.
Nick Blackwell: What are the rules for stopping boxing bouts?
Ironically the fact that there now has to be two doctors ringside is a result of Eubanks Snrs. fight with Watson who collapsed with catastrophic brain damage and there wasn't even a doctor attending they had to call an emergency ambulance.
On a more hopeful note it seems the doctors are hopeful they can bring Blackwell out of the coma today, all being well.


----------



## Transk53

JowGaWolf said:


> Full fight video.  From what I could tell it was clear that Eubank Sr knew the damage that was going on. You can actually see Eubank Jr let up on the punches as he seems more concerned with trying to score than trying to knock the guy out and put him away.



Unfortunately Channel 5 are being party poopers, they have blocked it. Speaking with a semi boxer, he has pretty much said the same. No doubt Eubank Snr had flashes of that fateful night against Michael Watson.


----------



## ShawnP

what i failed to remark on was the fighter himself, experienced or not, who knows better than anyone if some thing was not right, it is ultimately on the fighter themselves to either continue fighting or say wait a minute im not feeling right i should stop this fight before i die! look at the "greatest Boxer of all time" Ali who has irreversible brain damage, i also believe, MY favorite fighter Roy Jones Jr had a brain injury and decided to stop fighting, that may not have been reported as the actual reason he retired but that is my belief. i watched him fight one night and destroy his opponent and his very next fight was like watching a golfer beat the heck out of him as if he were a cripple and i found that very odd and still to this day have no good explanation for what actually happened. it was a sad time for me, i loved watching him fight even though i hated boxing.


----------



## elder999

ShawnP said:


> what i failed to remark on was the fighter himself, experienced or not, who knows better than anyone if some thing was not right, it is ultimately on the fighter themselves to either continue fighting or say wait a minute im not feeling right i should stop this fight before i die! look at the "greatest Boxer of all time" Ali who has irreversible brain damage, i also believe, MY favorite fighter Roy Jones Jr had a brain injury and decided to stop fighting, that may not have been reported as the actual reason he retired but that is my belief. i watched him fight one night and destroy his opponent and his very next fight was like watching a golfer beat the heck out of him as if he were a cripple and i found that very odd and still to this day have no good explanation for what actually happened. it was a sad time for me, i loved watching him fight even though i hated boxing.



Nope.

It's not the fighter's job to stop fighting-it's the referee's and cornermen. Period. Full stop.


----------



## ShawnP

elder999 said:


> Nope.
> 
> It's not the fighter's job to stop fighting-it's the referee's and cornermen. Period. Full stop.


so your saying if the corner says "hes ok to fight" and the fighter continues and dies, thats ok? comon now! the fighter has a right to preserve his own life and the final decision is up to him, not the corner, the ref, the Dr. or anyone else.


----------



## Tez3

ShawnP said:


> so your saying if the corner says "hes ok to fight" and the fighter continues and dies, thats ok? comon now! the fighter has a right to preserve his own life and the final decision is up to him, not the corner, the ref, the Dr. or anyone else.



In MMA there are rules for stopping a fight, I can't see that there wouldn't be similar rules in boxing, the main rule is 'stop the fight the second a fighter cannot *intelligently* defend himself'.
In some cases the fighter is not in a position to intelligently decide whether he/she should continue, the fighter wants to fight, his will to win is telling him to fight, his heart is telling him to fight but his brain is foggy.
Elder is not saying it's okay if a fighters dies because the corner says he's okay to continue, there are three safeguards, the corners, the referee and the doctor. The final decision is not the fighters. I stopped an MMA fight when one lad's arm was bending too far and he wouldn't tap, he was mad at the time but thanked me afterwards because although his arm was very sore it wasn't wrecked. It was my responsibility for him and to him to make sure he wasn't hurt despite himself.


----------



## JowGaWolf

ShawnP said:


> what i failed to remark on was the fighter himself, experienced or not, who knows better than anyone if some thing was not right, it is ultimately on the fighter themselves to either continue fighting or say wait a minute im not feeling right i should stop this fight before i die! look at the "greatest Boxer of all time" Ali who has irreversible brain damage, i also believe, MY favorite fighter Roy Jones Jr had a brain injury and decided to stop fighting, that may not have been reported as the actual reason he retired but that is my belief. i watched him fight one night and destroy his opponent and his very next fight was like watching a golfer beat the heck out of him as if he were a cripple and i found that very odd and still to this day have no good explanation for what actually happened. it was a sad time for me, i loved watching him fight even though i hated boxing.


The mindset of an athlete is to win no matter what torture they have to put their body through. Athletes will always push their body beyond reasonable limits and will always fight through the pain. Their focus isn't to be safe. Their focus is to win at all costs.  We see this mentality in all sports.  Because of this, it's up to the coaches and medical staff to stay grounded in reality and keep their athlete safe. They are the "fail safe logic" for an athletes extreme desire and drive to win.


----------



## Tez3

JowGaWolf said:


> The mindset of an athlete is to win no matter what torture they have to put their body through. Athletes will always push their body beyond reasonable limits and will always fight through the pain. Their focus isn't to be safe. Their focus is to win at all costs.  We see this mentality in all sports.  Because of this, it's up to the coaches and medical staff to stay grounded in reality and keep their athlete safe. They are the "fail safe logic" for an athletes extreme desire and drive to win.



This is exactly right. Fighters will also fight anyone who offers, one of the most important jobs that a coach/manager does is picking the right opponent for his/her fighter. A sensible fighter never chooses his own opponent. I've seen a lot of independent MMA fighters take any fight offered to them and this leads to trouble, the promoter is hopefully genuinely wanting good matches but often they just want a fight. Often they have a local fighter who is going to sell tickets, the trick is to get a fighter below the local one's level so there's a win for them. This leads to the less experienced or less prepared fighter getting hurt. Independent fighters all too often also take too many fights.
   However, worse than a fighter doing his owning managing is a fighter who is pushed by his management into fights he's not ready for. MMA in the UK hasn't reached the point where managing a fighting brings in big money, even fighting doesn't bring in much but boxing does, it brings in very big money. 
  Blackwell has no amateur boxing experience and his first 8 fights were in white collar boxing, good boxers but not professionals. His 9th fighter he lost against an experienced professional boxer, his next four opponents he won against but back at white collar level then again another loss against an ex European champion. His opponents then were good but only good, nothing of Eubanks Jrs standard though. If you look at Chris Eubanks record he has been fighting pro boxers who have held or hold records on big shows not small leisure centres. Blackwell may be a good talented and have the heart to fight but he has been badly managed. He did win the Commonwealth title by dint of the fact his opponent's corners threw in the towel ironically enough.
  The latest news on Blackwell is that he not deteriorating and will be brought out of the coma soon, so fingers crossed all goes well.


----------



## Transk53

I think many different things compelled Blackwell to completely defy logic. Most wouldn't have been in the thought processes though. I think simply that Blackwell should be commended for sticking it out. He did want to stop, or give up, knowing full well want the penalty is. Yeah he will be okay, but still hurting. He seems to, using that as I am kind of winging it here, but seems logical to me that the mental capacity is there. Just needs a little tactical overhall.  Anyway, sincerely hope that his boxing licence is safe, and he makes a fighting recovery.


----------



## Transk53

Bump "Not"


----------



## Tez3

To be honest I'm pretty sure he'll never fight again with a licence and not many unlicensed promoters will take a chance on having him fight.


----------



## Transk53

Yeah guess so, not a good way to go for sure. Suppose it would somewhat romantic to hope for a neurological mirical.


----------



## Transk53

According to the UK press, Eubank Snr has said what was posted in the OP. The wasn't that clear, but I am inclined to believe Chris. Especially in light of that horrendous night back in 91.


----------



## Tez3

Transk53 said:


> According to the UK press, Eubank Snr has said what was posted in the OP. The wasn't that clear, but I am inclined to believe Chris. Especially in light of that horrendous night back in 91.



I watched it on the BBC news where they had a clearer recording, he definitely said that. They had experts on saying that's what was said. Chris Eubank Snr, speaks in a very distinct way, I don't know anyone else who speaks as he does. he doesn't act or dress like anyone else either for that matter, he's unique.


----------



## Transk53

Tez3 said:


> I watched it on the BBC news where they had a clearer recording, he definitely said that. They had experts on saying that's what was said. Chris Eubank Snr, speaks in a very distinct way, I don't know anyone else who speaks as he does. he doesn't act or dress like anyone else either for that matter, he's unique.



I concur sounds somewhat underwhelming. I had a very all to brief contact with Chris in the marina. Yeah unique individual and more intelligent than given credit for IMHO.


----------



## Tez3

Watching Sky news ( other half wanting T20 scores, England in the final now yay!) and Blackwell is still in the coma. Hopefully things are still on track though for him.


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

Just read this article on it. Suggests that he'll come out of coma on his on (doesn't cite anyone saying that), along with a video talking to his fighter with clear audio.
"If the referee doesn't want to stop it then...I don't know what to tell you. But I will tell you this: If he doesn't stop it, and you keep on beating him like this 1. He is getting hurt 2. If it goes to a decision...Why doesn't the referee stop the fight? I don't get why. So maybe you shouldn't leave it to the referee. You're not going to take him out to the face you're going to take him out to the body."
No idea what he said during the round, but that is very clearly what he is telling Chris Jr. in between rounds (after the 8th I believe).
Boxing fans launch Just Giving page for Nick Blackwell


----------



## JowGaWolf

kempodisciple said:


> Just read this article on it. Suggests that he'll come out of coma on his on (doesn't cite anyone saying that), along with a video talking to his fighter with clear audio.
> "If the referee doesn't want to stop it then...I don't know what to tell you. But I will tell you this: If he doesn't stop it, and you keep on beating him like this 1. He is getting hurt 2. If it goes to a decision...Why doesn't the referee stop the fight? I don't get why. So maybe you shouldn't leave it to the referee. You're not going to take him out to the face you're going to take him out to the body."
> No idea what he said during the round, but that is very clearly what he is telling Chris Jr. in between rounds (after the 8th I believe).
> Boxing fans launch Just Giving page for Nick Blackwell


Boxers and cornermen talk funny.  I guess it's broken grammar because on the amount of time the have to get their point across.  sorry of like a verbal short hand.


----------



## Tez3

JowGaWolf said:


> Boxers and cornermen talk funny.  I guess it's broken grammar because on the amount of time the have to get their point across.  sorry of like a verbal short hand.



Chris Eubank always speaks with perfect grammar and perfect diction albeit with a slight lisp, that's what makes his speech distinctive lol. He was at the pre fight press conference with a cup of tea in a bone china cup and saucer with his little finger up. He dresses like a gentleman from the early 1900s, he has always done this, he is very much a character. He was also world champion for five years so knows what he's talking about.


----------



## Transk53

JowGaWolf said:


> Boxers and cornermen talk funny.  I guess it's broken grammar because on the amount of time the have to get their point across.  sorry of like a verbal short hand.



With Tez. Like him or lothe him, Chris Eubank is a superb boxer, with a chin made of granite. Do not disrespect a superb  British boxer. I thank you.


----------



## JowGaWolf

JowGaWolf said:


> Boxers and cornermen talk funny.  I guess it's broken grammar because on the amount of time the have to get their point across.  sorry of like a verbal short hand.


Should be "sort of" instead of "sorry." Tez3 I didn't hear his lisp in the clips I watched. Is it a heavy lisp?


----------



## JowGaWolf

Transk53 said:


> With Tez. Like him or lothe him, Chris Eubank is a superb boxer, with a chin made of granite. Do not disrespect a superb  British boxer. I thank you.


There was no disrespect.  I even stated that they may talk with broken grammar because of the small amount of time that they have in between lines. This is something that I've noticed from all cornermen.  Iong proper sentences probably don't register when you are pumped up with adrenaline or dizzy from punches.  even though the grammar is broken,  it's straight to the point.  take a look at clips of corner men and you'll see the same way. Not sure how that is disrespectful for me to point that out.


----------



## Tez3

JowGaWolf said:


> There was no disrespect.  I even stated that they may talk with broken grammar because of the small amount of time that they have in between lines. This is something that I've noticed from all cornermen.  Iong proper sentences probably don't register when you are pumped up with adrenaline or dizzy from punches.  even though the grammar is broken,  it's straight to the point.  take a look at clips of corner men and you'll see the same way. Not sure how that is disrespectful for me to point that out.



It's a slight lisp. Eubank Snr wasn't cornering. He came into the ring especially to tell his son to hit to the body because he could see the other fighter was hurt. I don't think he's ever cornered a fighter.


----------



## Transk53

JowGaWolf said:


> There was no disrespect.  I even stated that they may talk with broken grammar because of the small amount of time that they have in between lines. This is something that I've noticed from all cornermen.  Iong proper sentences probably don't register when you are pumped up with adrenaline or dizzy from punches.  even though the grammar is broken,  it's straight to the point.  take a look at clips of corner men and you'll see the same way. Not sure how that is disrespectful for me to point that out.



Sorry, jumped the gun . Corner men are tune with their charges. They know their boxers. Yes you are right, it is fight speak


----------



## Transk53

Tez3 said:


> It's a slight lisp. Eubank Snr wasn't cornering. He came into the ring especially to tell his son to hit to the body because he could see the other fighter was hurt. I don't think he's ever cornered a fighter.



Nor did Snr.


----------



## Tez3

Transk53 said:


> Nor did Snr.



it was him I was speaking about.

Here's a video of Eubanks snr talking about his son. He has some interesting views on boxing.


----------



## Transk53

JowGaWolf said:


> There was no disrespect.  I even stated that they may talk with broken grammar because of the small amount of time that they have in between lines. This is something that I've noticed from all cornermen.  Iong proper sentences probably don't register when you are pumped up with adrenaline or dizzy from punches.  even though the grammar is broken,  it's straight to the point.  take a look at clips of corner men and you'll see the same way. Not sure how that is disrespectful for me to point that out.



Oh don't need to look at corner man clips. Thanks


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

JowGaWolf said:


> There was no disrespect.  I even stated that they may talk with broken grammar because of the small amount of time that they have in between lines. This is something that I've noticed from all cornermen.  Iong proper sentences probably don't register when you are pumped up with adrenaline or dizzy from punches.  even though the grammar is broken,  it's straight to the point.  take a look at clips of corner men and you'll see the same way. Not sure how that is disrespectful for me to point that out.


I think it actually helps the boxer more. They have their adrenaline all pumped and may be pretty dizzy a couple rounds in. Definitely not going to want to decipher long articulate sentences. A short, straight to the point message with no extra fluff is exactly what they want.


----------



## Tez3

kempodisciple said:


> I think it actually helps the boxer more. They have their adrenaline all pumped and may be pretty dizzy a couple rounds in. Definitely not going to want to decipher long articulate sentences. A short, straight to the point message with no extra fluff is exactly what they want.



I'm sure it does but I will repeat that Eubank senior _*was not cornering*_, he came into the ring specifically for one reason, to tell his son not to hit to the other boxer's head.


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

Tez3 said:


> I'm sure it does but I will repeat that Eubank senior _*was not cornering*_, he came into the ring specially to tell his son not to hit to the other boxer's head.


Yup. I realize that, I wasn't commenting on Eubank, his speech, or his intentions. He was very clearly trying to help blackwell, which is the only reason he had to go into the ring, and he was pretty obviously frustrated. JowGa said that it's something he noticed about cornermen in general, so I was giving a reason.


----------



## Tez3

Not all those cornering fighters are male btw, I've cornered MMA fighters and kickboxers many times over the years, there's an art to it, not shouting very much is best, they rarely hear you anyway though a female voice will carry and penetrate the crowd noise better. There's also much more to the job than 'shouting', you need to be prepared for a lot of things. Many corners just come up with the tired old clichés anyway 'he's tiring, he's losing, you won that round, you've got him now'. A good corner will pick up on 'tells' from the other fighter, will watch for opening their fighter maybe can't see and often in MMA when on the ground to remind your fighter to punch and knee their opponent.


----------



## Transk53

kempodisciple said:


> Yup. I realize that, I wasn't commenting on Eubank, his speech, or his intentions. He was very clearly trying to help blackwell, which is the only reason he had to go into the ring, and he was pretty obviously frustrated. JowGa said that it's something he noticed about cornermen in general, so I was giving a reason.



JowGa response whatever, you have to know boxing. General does not apply. I see what you are saying  The Eubanks situation is sensitive


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

Tez3 said:


> Not all those cornering fighters are male btw, I've cornered MMA fighters and kickboxers many times over the years,


 I actually thought about this while I was writing, and considered writing cornerpeople, but figured it was unnecessarily pc since 'cornerman' is an established phrase. Guess I was wrong 


> A good corner will pick up on 'tells' from the other fighter, will watch for opening their fighter maybe can't see and often in MMA when on the ground to remind your fighter to punch and knee their opponent.


This is true, but at the same time you don't want to be overly wordy when you're doing this. However, this is based on what I have been told from friends who have fought and been cornerpeople, I have no personal experience, and you have more experience than I have been alive, so I will very readily defer to you in this.


----------



## Tez3

Mostly communication during the rounds is a sort of shorthand code, you build it up during training. No point in shouting for your fighter to do some thing if the other fighter can hear lol.


----------



## JowGaWolf

kempodisciple said:


> I think it actually helps the boxer more. They have their adrenaline all pumped and may be pretty dizzy a couple rounds in. Definitely not going to want to decipher long articulate sentences. A short, straight to the point message with no extra fluff is exactly what they want.


totally agree. 

I used to really like boxing a lot but I lost interest in it once all of the great fighters left retired.  I don't know who the top dog is these days.  I just know that Don King pretty much soured my stomach with his promotions.


----------



## JowGaWolf

Tez3 said:


> Not all those cornering fighters are male btw, I've cornered MMA fighters and kickboxers many times over the years, there's an art to it, not shouting very much is best, they rarely hear you anyway though a female voice will carry and penetrate the crowd noise better. There's also much more to the job than 'shouting', you need to be prepared for a lot of things. Many corners just come up with the tired old clichés anyway 'he's tiring, he's losing, you won that round, you've got him now'. A good corner will pick up on 'tells' from the other fighter, will watch for opening their fighter maybe can't see and often in MMA when on the ground to remind your fighter to punch and knee their opponent.


How different is it with MMA compared to Boxing?


----------



## JowGaWolf

Tez3 said:


> it was him I was speaking about.
> 
> Here's a video of Eubanks snr talking about his son. He has some interesting views on boxing.


I'm impressed.  I still don't hear the lisp.. lol probably my American ears lol.  Our it could be all of the mumbling (specifically Young Thug) that has become popular with the younger generation's rap music that makes Eubanks voice music to my ears. lol 
For those who don't know of Young Thug, consider yourself lucky.

But back to Eubanks.   He sounds very down to earth.


----------



## Tez3

JowGaWolf said:


> I'm impressed.  I still don't hear the lisp.. lol probably my American ears lol.  Our it could be all of the mumbling (specifically Young Thug) that has become popular with the younger generation's rap music that makes Eubanks voice music to my ears. lol
> For those who don't know of Young Thug, consider yourself lucky.
> 
> But back to Eubanks.   He sounds very down to earth.



He's like Marmite you either love him or hate him but he's never ignored.




JowGaWolf said:


> How different is it with MMA compared to Boxing?




In what ways? there's often more time to shout at your fighters in MMA!


----------



## Kenpoguy123

Tez3 said:


> Boxer Nick Blackwell in coma after title fight defeat
> 
> There's a lot of criticism of the referee for not stopping the fight sooner, the medical services for not jumping in sooner and the promotion for making the fighter parade around while waiting for the decision. Chris Eubank Snr. who is himself a well known boxer, told his son to target his opponent's body after fearing something was wrong after the heavy pounding he'd taken with the ref showing no sign of stopping the fight. Eubank Snr was banging on the mat telling them to stop the fight. It was stopped by the doctor eventually.
> Eubank Sr. knows exactly what he's talking about, 25 years ago during one of his fights his opponent Michael Watson was hurt so badly he collapsed in the ring and was on the point of death. It took him years to recover but what happened to him changed the way athletes here are treated.Boxing: The night Michael Watson's career was ended
> My thoughts and prayers are with Nick Blackwell, for a speedy and full recovery but while he fought bravely he really shouldn't have been in that ring, he simply wasn't ready for a fight with Eubank.


Fact is yes what happened sucked but let's be honest yes he was getting hit hard but he was defending himself and fighting back it's not like he was staggering around the ring with his hands down barely able to stand. He was throwing hard punches back and no he wasn't winning but he wasnt getting absolutely dominated either


----------



## Tez3

Kenpoguy123 said:


> Fact is yes what happened sucked but let's be honest yes he was getting hit hard but he was defending himself and fighting back it's not like he was staggering around the ring with his hands down barely able to stand. He was throwing hard punches back and no he wasn't winning but he wasnt getting absolutely dominated either



You don't wait until a fighter is staggering around or unable to defend himself before pausing the fight to get the doctor in when the fighter has a lump that size on his forehead. It wasn't the usual swollen eye _it was a lump on his head_, a look at his eyes would have told the ref there was a concern then the doctor should have looked. Perhaps boxing refs don't do this, perhaps that's another difference between boxing and MMA.
The damage may well have been accumulating, while he is a talented boxer Blackwell is basically an amateur who came into pro boxing from white collar, there was no amateur career to prepare him, he wasn't on an England youth or senior squad, never fought for his country in any European, World, Olympic or Commonwealth games all the usual routes, tried and tested ways to prepare for a pro career. He has taken a lot of punches to the head over his short career.


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

Kenpoguy123 said:


> Fact is yes what happened sucked but let's be honest yes he was getting hit hard but he was defending himself and fighting back it's not like he was staggering around the ring with his hands down barely able to stand. He was throwing hard punches back and no he wasn't winning but he wasnt getting absolutely dominated either


I don't think anyone is suggesting that the ref stop the fight by calling a TKO, just stop it to have a doctor look at it and let the doctor make a call.


----------



## Tames D

I may have missed it but has anyone asked the ref and the doctor why they didn't stop it to examine the fighter? If so, what was their response?


----------



## JowGaWolf

Tames D said:


> I may have missed it but has anyone asked the ref and the doctor why they didn't stop it to examine the fighter? If so, what was their response?


It's a judgement call and no one is 100% accurate with those type of calls


----------



## Monkey Turned Wolf

Tames D said:


> I may have missed it but has anyone asked the ref and the doctor why they didn't stop it to examine the fighter? If so, what was their response?


From what I've gathered, the ref didn't stop it primarily because hindsights a *****, and he thought blackwell wasn't being 100% dominated.


----------



## Tez3

kempodisciple said:


> From what I've gathered, the ref didn't stop it primarily because hindsights a *****, and he thought blackwell wasn't being 100% dominated.



As MMA refs we tend to watch the fighters reactions and injuries more, perhaps because of the likelihood of different injuries and things like chokes. I guess we just watch faces/eyes more by habit than boxing refs do because nearly all of my MMA mates thought the lump should have been looked at, perhaps too because we don't have standing counts we like to make sure a person is 'out' or unable to continue before declaring the fight finished. A boxing ref can do standing counts so can take the risks we can't. We also don't do 'dominated' as such, our criteria is 'intelligently defending himself' that mean no putting hands up out of habit or reflex, they have to be defending themselves properly, another reason we look at faces and eyes to make sure the fighter is 'all there' and not just being a robot.


----------



## Tez3

Very good news. Nick Blackwell has been woken out of the coma and is talking to his family. Fingers crossed for a full recovery now.


----------



## Steve

Tez3 said:


> Very good news. Nick Blackwell has been woken out of the coma and is talking to his family. Fingers crossed for a full recovery now.


Good news, indeed.  Thanks for sharing.


----------



## Tames D

Great news!


----------



## Tez3

A statement released by promoters Hennessy Sports revealed he had woke from his coma on Saturday.

The statement read: "On Saturday, April 2, 2016, Nick 'Bang Bang' Blackwell woke from an induced coma. Twenty-four hours later, on Sunday, he was talking to family and close friends at his bedside.

"Nick had been placed in an induced coma following a British middleweight title contest at The SSE Arena, Wembley, on Saturday, March 26. Contrary to early reports, though, his bleed was outside the brain - on the skull, in fact - and was minor enough for there to be no need to operate.

"He was in an induced coma for almost seven days, given the very best possible treatment by the incredible team at St. Mary's Hospital, and the sedatives used were gradually reduced over this period of time.

"Finally, at the weekend, Nick woke from this induced coma, acknowledged the voices of loved ones and, by Sunday, was starting to talk. It was the outcome everyone had been hoping and praying for; Nick had won his toughest fight yet.

"On behalf of Nick, his family, and very close friends, we'd like to thank everyone for their continued support and well-wishes. It has been overwhelming at times and has certainly not gone unnoticed.

"Nick Blackwell won the hearts of over three million [television] viewers on March 26 with an astonishing display of all-action bravery and determination. In the past week, however, he has humbled millions more. He's a fighter. He's a warrior. He's a true champion and gentleman.

"If you could continue to respect the Blackwell family's desire for privacy at this time, it would be greatly appreciated."


----------

