# Connection to Japan or Okinawa?



## Mike Clarke (Mar 21, 2003)

I was just wondering how many of you who train in Japanese or Okinawan karatedo are connected to associations in either Japan, or Okinawa?

I'm talking about direct connection, not through someone else who is connnected though someone else etc.....

Also how often you manage to travel over there to recieve instruction?

Mike.


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## Mike Clarke (Mar 24, 2003)

Hello.................Hello.................

Guess I'm on my own then?

Funny, I could have sworn this was the Karate section?
Maybe I was mistaken?
Perhaps everyone on M.T. trains in karate from some other place?
But this place is full of Shihans and Sokey Dokies. High Dans and Low Dans, even members of the Masters Guild of Martial Artists.

Ehmmmmm,   perhaps if I offered a prize for the best connected person to Japan or Okinawa, That might get them to say hello? Money, that's it, I'll offer cash.

Okay everyone. All those with direct connections to either Japan or Okinawa please post so I can make arrangments to forward on your cash prize. You have to be over five feet two, 15 years old, and be at least a Fourth Dan [that should get me lots of replys?].

Please don't leave me hanging here alone for too long. I was only asking a question after all.

Mike.


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## RyuShiKan (Mar 24, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Mike Clarke _
> *
> Funny, I could have sworn this was the Karate section?
> Maybe I was mistaken?
> ...



Mike, 

You are not mistaken.
Karate, and I mean ALL karate, is connected to Okinawa either directly or in directly via Japan.
Funny you should mention weird associations and guilds.
I got this in my mail box the other day.

http://extreme.hostserver2003.com/umaa/index.php

Do you think I should join? 

Oh, and yes I have direct connections to Okinawa.
What kind of prize do I get?


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## chufeng (Mar 24, 2003)

RSK,

Welcome back...this section has been a ghost-town while you were away.

:asian:
chufeng


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## Mike Clarke (Mar 24, 2003)

Hey Ryu Shin Kan, great to hear from you again.

Now, about that membership to the Sokie Docki club, do you think they would be open to a group deal?

I thought all karate groups were connected too, though I was interested in speaking to those who have a direct [personal] connection. I know you have, but I was hoping to get others to step up and say "G'Day".

As for the prize? Well, I'm hoping we'll meet up in Naha in February, and if we do I'll 'give' it to you then. It's warm and wet, so now your thinking, does he mean a kiss, or English beer!!!

Seriously though, I can't reveal the prize as it might invite imposters to post. Your post has been logged and will be kept on file.

Good to have you back, I hope you stick around for a while longer.

Mike.


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## James Kovacich (Mar 25, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Mike Clarke _
> *Hello.................Hello.................
> 
> Guess I'm on my own then?
> ...



I can't speak for anybody else in here but you half way answered it yourself. 

But in the USA the seeds were planted along time ago and now the branches and its individual leaves have matured. 

Standards change for the better and for the worse but assuming that all the world could have the same standards, the average Joe does not have have the money to travel overseas. 

Our Sensei and Sifu before us had those connections but today I would think that it is a very small percentage of martial artists out there who go to Japan today.

On the other hand, one big number of martial artists going to Japan are the mixed martial artists that are competitors. Japan loves them.


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## RyuShiKan (Mar 25, 2003)

> _Originally posted by akja _
> *I can't speak for anybody else in here but you half way answered it yourself.
> 
> But in the USA the seeds were planted along time ago and now the branches and its individual leaves have matured.
> ...



Actually there are still quite a few people that come to Japan to train.
There is no place better to train in Japanese sword. I am not saying you cant find quality instruction outside the Japan but this is the place with the highest population of knowledgeable teachers in sword arts.
Most foreigners I see dont come to Japan to train in MMA. They come to train in some Japanese art as can be seen by the high percentage of foreigner students in many Japanese dojo.


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## James Kovacich (Mar 25, 2003)

> _Originally posted by RyuShiKan _
> *Actually there are still quite a few people that come to Japan to train.
> There is no place better to train in Japanese sword. I am not saying you cant find quality instruction outside the Japan but this is the place with the highest population of knowledgeable teachers in sword arts.
> Most foreigners I see dont come to Japan to train in MMA. They come to train in some Japanese art as can be seen by the high percentage of foreigner students in many Japanese dojo. *



I believe your right about why they go there to train but my % assumption came from the big numbers of martial artists in the world and actual amount of those who make it to Japan. 

And we know that the Japanese do love the MMA competitions.

Some day I will go there too. I'm going to travel as long it is safe at the intended destiation. First I have to make it possible for me to leave Silicon Valley work and then the fun begins.

Actually my wife and daughter are both signed up as students with Lou Angel and George Alexander under me. My daughter has 1 more year of high school after this year and then she goes to college. Thats when my wife and I are going to travel and train.


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## Mike Clarke (Mar 26, 2003)

It's been interesting to see [or not see?] the lack of repsonse to my original question.

Does this mean that there are few people on M.T. directly connected to Okinawa/Japan, or just that those who are don't want to say?

By the way, I'm not making a call on the 'quality' of peoples karate due to a connection [or not], I was just wondering who out there makes the journey from time to time?
Thanks to those who did reply.

Mike


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## arnisador (Mar 26, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Mike Clarke _
> *Does this mean that there are few people on M.T. directly connected to Okinawa/Japan*



Well, it is an English-language board!


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## okinawagojuryu (Mar 26, 2003)

Hey mike ! I'm not affiliated directlly , but I am affiliated w/ Okinawa . Through the Okinawa Goju Ryu Seibukai , and as you know I am hopping to go to Okinawa next year . I have had the privallege to train w/ both Morio Higaonna & Kinei Nakasone Sensei's though . I know you asked about direct affiliation , well not yet  .

David


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## RyuShiKan (Mar 27, 2003)

Mike, 

Not to get too far off track but do you think the training you have seen in Okinawan styles outside Okinawa is different than the training they do on Okinawa?
If yes how do you think it differs?


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## Mike Clarke (Mar 27, 2003)

RSK,
Well, as you know there is some really 'bad' karate going on in Okinawa just as there is everywhere else, it's not all good. So I would have to answer your question by saying, on the whole most Westerners have a different purpose for training in karate than the average Okinawan, so the way they train [their mind set] is not always the same.

I like to think my dojo runs just as the Jundokan dojo in Naha does. I know I insist on the same etiquette and intensity of training as I have gone through whilst in Okinawa. I still train that way myself and so I expect it from my students too.

I know some Western people who train much harder than their Okinawan counterparts, but I know many many more who spend hardly any time training and do nothing but teach [please read; make money]. 'Hoshin' [purpose] is a real problem for many Westerners. They don't have a clear understanding of why they are doing what they are doing at all.

As for the physical training. Again, it comes down to the individual person [Okinawan/ Westerner]. Some things are done differently outside Okinawa, and I'm not sure why? I have introduced training drills based on kata that I did not learn in Okinawa, but then, after thirty years training, I figure I'd be lacking a serious attitude if something wasn't coming from inside after all this time.

On balance, I would say the average [serious] Okinawan karate-ka is still one step a head of their Western counterpart. It is after all, part of their culture and heritage and so lends its self better to their way of 'seeing' things than it does to us. Having said all that, I know some Okinawans who's understanding of karate is shocking in spite of the quite high rank they hold.

I'm not sure if that answers your question?

Hey David,
Nice to hear from you again. I wish you nothing but the best for your trip to Okinawa next year, and hope I was of some help in the making of your plans?

Anisadore,
I know it's an English language board, do I look stupid:shrug: 
Don't answer that!!!!!!
I was talking affiliation or personal ties, stuff like that.

Mike.


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## RyuShiKan (Mar 27, 2003)

Mike, 

Yes, that answers my question very well.

I have to admit I agree with you too.

There are paper tigers, money grubbers, frauds, etc everywhere.


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## D.Cobb (Mar 29, 2003)

I guess that somewhere's down the track, I have Okinawan links. I am studying Ryukyu Kempo, my instructor studied under George Dillman, originally, I'm not sure of the actual lineage to Okinawa though.

--Dave:asian:


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## Mike Clarke (Mar 29, 2003)

Dave,

I'm not sure Mr. Dillman had any links with Okinawa did he?
I'm sure those on MT who follow his methods will be kind enough to let me know.

Mike.


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## D.Cobb (Mar 29, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Mike Clarke _
> *Dave,
> 
> I'm not sure Mr. Dillman had any links with Okinawa did he?
> ...



I do know he attended about 6 seminars run by Oyata Senseii, but other than that I couldn't say.

--Dave

:asian:


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## RyuShiKan (Mar 30, 2003)

> _Originally posted by D.Cobb _
> *I do know he attended about 6 seminars run by Oyata Senseii, but other than that I couldn't say.
> 
> --Dave
> ...



Yes I think it was around 6 total.
I think Dillman used to claim to be a Ishin Ryu practioner until he met my teacher. I have never heard of him actually studying with an Okinawan before that time either.


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