# More or less Korean terminology?



## IcemanSK (Jul 4, 2015)

Karate folks tend to use Japanese terms for instructors (sempai, sensei, shihan etc.) and Judo folks tend to use Japanese terms nearly exclusively for techniques. We TKDoan seem to be all over the maps as far as the amount of Korean terms that we use. Some Sa Bum or Yup Chagi more than others, but very few (in my experience) will use Sa Bum Nim, or Kyo Sa Nim as if it's the person's given name (as Karate folks seem to lean toward in greater numbers). 

Why do you think that is? How much Korean do you use in class & how often? Is your master referred to as Sa Bum Nim as if it's their given name, or is it more often by Mr/Ms./Master, etc.? How much technique terminology is used in your dojang?


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## Gwai Lo Dan (Jul 4, 2015)

Funny I was watching this video yesterday and realized how limited I am in understand Korean terms for stances, blocks, punches, and kicks. The Korean TKD school I used to go to would use basic Korean techniques, but English for more complex techniques. For example, I learnt dollyeo chugi for turning kick, but never the Korean term for a spinning hook kick.

In terms of addressing the Grand Master, we typically called him Grand Master or Master (last name).  In bowing in class, we called him sabunim.


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## Earl Weiss (Jul 4, 2015)

Back in the old days when dinosaurs roamed and the earth cooled and my instructor was under a Korean pioneer we had to learn Korean names for everything. Even had Flash cards.   Later, my instructor became disenchanted with Korean instructors feeling they treated the round eyes disfavorably. At about the same time we got a hold of General Choi's 1975 Book and since it was in english with everyting indexed in English use of Korean terminology fell away.   Unless there was a large Korean group in attendance, General Choi taught in english as well.   While the Korean salutation is used for formal opening and closing of class the english word is typicaly used to address seniors in the organization and classes use english terms.

When I hosted Nam Tae Hi he said "Shuto" for  knifehand which is the Japanese term.

Periodicaly I get a transplant from another country who had strong ties / roots to a Korean instructor. Since the Koreans did not know the native tongue and since the terms were often not translated on a widespread basis the korean terms were the only ones used and I have to dig deep into my memory to recall some of the names for techniques.   Had one canadian BB who looked puzzled when I said the english aname of a technique and i asked if his instructor taught in English and he said no. Then I asked if he taught in Korean and he said no.   Fianly I asked if he taught in french and he said yes.   I said sorry, can't help you there. Just watch and imitate.


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## Balrog (Jul 4, 2015)

We use about a dozen Korean terms.  The rest is English.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

All Korean at our place, including techniques, steps, stances and transitions. The instructors sometimes translate to German, but not often and only if necessary.


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## Dirty Dog (Jul 5, 2015)

It varies by instructor and from day to day. I use more Korean usually, but not always. 
While it's nice for students to learn the Korean terminology, it is not vital.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

Dirty Dog said:


> It varies by instructor and from day to day. I use more Korean usually, but not always.
> While it's nice for students to learn the Korean terminology, it is not vital.



I agree, it is not vital and some of the best instruction I have had has been in other languages. It is important if those students will have contact with korean instructors or want to visit Korea, but even then one can get by with sign language.

What is interesting is when Koreans visit us even for a short time they typically learn the german terms for 'line up', 'sit down' and so on, but still use Korean for the techniques.

Also notable is some inconsistency in terminology even among Koreans. A good example of this is the twin knife hand block, which I have heard called all of the following:

kodeureo sonnal momtong bakkat makki
Sonnal makki
Shuto
Sudo
Yangsonnal makki
Kodeureo yangsonnal bakkat makki

It has just as many names in English and German. Which is why we tend to stick with Korean, and try to use the standard KKW terms.


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## Dirty Dog (Jul 5, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> I agree, it is not vital and some of the best instruction I have had has been in other languages. It is important if those students will have contact with korean instructors or want to visit Korea, but even then one can get by with sign language.



Probably not an issue for the vast majority of students.



Gnarlie said:


> What is interesting is when Koreans visit us even for a short time they typically learn the german terms for 'line up', 'sit down' and so on, but still use Korean for the techniques.



I imagine it would be problematic for them to learn the local terminology, since it's likely they will be doing seminars in other countries as well.



Gnarlie said:


> Also notable is some inconsistency in terminology even among Koreans. A good example of this is the twin knife hand block, which I have heard called all of the following:



Let's see how many we can translate. 



Gnarlie said:


> kodeureo sonnal momtong bakkat makki
> Sonnal makki
> Shuto
> Sudo
> ...



"double knifehand middle section outside block"
"knifehand block"
"Japanese term..."
"Possibly a japanese term with an accent..."
"double knifehand black" 
"double double knifehand outside block"

I think kodeureo and yang are both ways of saying a move is doubled, but that kodeureo is usually used to indicate a 1-2 technique, like the kodeureo yop chagi in Koryo.



Gnarlie said:


> It has just as many names in English and German. Which is why we tend to stick with Korean, and try to use the standard KKW terms.



It does get confusing...


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## IcemanSK (Jul 5, 2015)

Does anyone use Sa Bum Nim more often than Mr./Ms./Master in reference to their instructor? How about using terms like Kyo Sa Nim or Gyeo Kyo Nim for assistant instructors? Who uses these in their school?


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

IcemanSK said:


> Does anyone use Sa Bum Nim more often than Mr./Ms./Master in reference to their instructor? How about using terms like Kyo Sa Nim or Gyeo Kyo Nim for assistant instructors? Who uses these in their school?


I do, but not the terms for assistant instructors. Kwanjangnim and Sabeomnim are regularly used though, as are the terms Yukeupja and Yudanja.



Dirty Dog said:


> Probably not an issue for the vast majority of students.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The yeop chagi is 'kodeup'; repeated, kodeureo for blocks is 'supported'  or 'reinforced'.

The full technique name for twin knifehand in Korean is Kodeureo Yangsonnal Momtong Bakkat Makki - the koreans we have with us tell me that it's not a redundancy, but we are struggling to get to the definition of the 'Yang' part.


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## TrueJim (Jul 5, 2015)

At the school my son and I attend, most of the instructors are Korean. They tend to use Korean terms for stances and kicks, then follow that up with the English equivalents. The Korean terms they use for some things seem a little odd to me sometimes though. For instance they call a conventional rear-leg roundhouse kick _ap doolyo chagi _rather than just _doolyo chagi_. When I asked why they add the extra "ap" at the front, they said it's because you're facing forward, which makes sense, but...aren't you assumed to be facing forward anyway?

When we practice kicking combinations, we're required to call-out the Korean names of the kicks as we perform them. Also interestingly, they use Korean terms only for stances and kicks. For strikes and blocks they use only the English terms. Counting is always done in Korean. Regardless of level, instructors 2nd-dan and up are referred to as Master, but I think that's done to just keep things simple for the children students. Adult students are always addressed as Mr. and Ms. (I'm only first dan in Kukkiwon taekwondo, though I have prior taekwondo experience from my college years and of course I'm now _older _than everybody else there...I help out a lot in class so they recently decided to give me an instructor's uniform and have me addressed as instructor, another example of how they're a little loose on titles at my school.)

For the formal closing of class, bowing to the flag and the instructors etc., that's all done in Korean.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> At the school my son and I attend, most of the instructors are Korean. They tend to use Korean terms for stances and kicks, then follow that up with the English equivalents. The Korean terms they use for some things seem a little odd to me sometimes though. For instance they call a conventional rear-leg roundhouse kick _ap doolyo chagi _rather than just _doolyo chagi_. When I asked why they add the extra "ap" at the front, they said it's because you're facing forward, which makes sense, but...aren't you assumed to be facing forward anyway?.



Ap dollyo chagi came about when the koreans wanted to differentiate between the old style big swing of the knee through the target slower trad dollyo and the newer knee up and forward then turn in sporty ap dollyo. I remember seeing the newer kick for the first time, and struggling to get it right.



TrueJim said:


> When we practice kicking combinations, we're required to call-out the Korean names of the kicks as we perform them. Also interestingly, they use Korean terms only for stances and kicks. For strikes and blocks they use only the English terms. Counting is always done in Korean. Regardless of level, instructors 2nd-dan and up are referred to as Master, but I think that's done to just keep things simple for the children students. Adult students are always addressed as Mr. and Ms. (I'm only first dan in Kukkiwon taekwondo, though I have prior taekwondo experience from my college years and of course I'm now _older _than everybody else there...I help out a lot in class so they recently decided to give me an instructor's uniform and have me addressed as instructor, another example of how they're a little loose on titles at my school.)
> 
> For the formal closing of class, bowing to the flag and the instructors etc., that's all done in Korean.



Interesting. I wonder why they use English for hand techs.


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## TrueJim (Jul 5, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> Interesting. I wonder why they use English for hand techs.



This is pure conjecture on my part, but I get the impression that they view knowing the names of kicks as being part of the "culture" of takewondo, whereas knowing the names of blocks and strikes is unimportant.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> This is pure conjecture on my part, but I get the impression that they view knowing the names of kicks as being part of the "culture" of takewondo, whereas knowing the names of blocks and strikes is unimportant.


That's a shame if it's true.

The kicks are easier to learn though, because they are all chagi, whereas hands have makki, chigi, jireugi, tzireugi, ppaegi, milgi, and a host of others. That might be why.


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## TrueJim (Jul 5, 2015)

While we're on that topic...

The name they teach us for Back Hook Kick is _hwe chook_. No "chagi" in the name. Any idea what those two words mean? Hwe chook? I could ask them, but I know what the answer would be: "back hook kick"  

Also, here's another thing I puzzle over. Jump Front Snap Kick..."eedan ap chagi"...I believe "eedan" means 'second level', but why not use the word for "jump" there instead? Any theories?


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## TrueJim (Jul 5, 2015)

Oh, I'll give you another example of the weird names they teach us. Skip roundhouse..."balun bal" which I believe means "fast foot." In our school we call a skip roundhouse a balun bal.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> While we're on that topic...
> 
> The name they teach us for Back Hook Kick is _hwe chook_. No "chagi" in the name. Any idea what those two words mean? Hwe chook? I could ask them, but I know what the answer would be: "back hook kick"



Dwi chook is the underside of the heel, it could be named after the striking surface (although that would technically be dwikoomchi, the back of the heel). Alternatively it may come from the verb stem hwiro (crescent shape), with chook meaning the heel (although apchook is the ball of the foot too, dwichook the heel). 


TrueJim said:


> Also, here's another thing I puzzle over. Jump Front Snap Kick..."eedan ap chagi"...I believe "eedan" means 'second level', but why not use the word for "jump" there instead? Any theories?



Eedan Yeopchagi is also used for jumping /flying side kick. Because jumping and airborne techniques are a focus at second dan, along with balance and power. Alternative name is Twio Ap / Yeop Chagi.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 5, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> Oh, I'll give you another example of the weird names they teach us. Skip roundhouse..."balun bal" which I believe means "fast foot." In our school we call a skip roundhouse a balun bal.


Bareun Bal is fast foot, yes, meaning step kick. I bet they use Narae Chagi for switch kicks too...


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## Dirty Dog (Jul 5, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> I do, but not the terms for assistant instructors. Kwanjangnim and Sabeomnim are regularly used though, as are the terms Yukeupja and Yudanja.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You are correct. I plead "3AM posting syndrome" as my defense for the stupid error. #facepalm


Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Not TapaTalk. Really.


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## WaterGal (Jul 5, 2015)

IcemanSK said:


> Does anyone use Sa Bum Nim more often than Mr./Ms./Master in reference to their instructor? How about using terms like Kyo Sa Nim or Gyeo Kyo Nim for assistant instructors? Who uses these in their school?



We teach them - we require students to learn some Korean terms for each guep level, and instructor titles are one of them - but don't generally use them in class.  I'm Ms ______ and my fiancé is Master ________, and our other assistant instructors are Mr or Ms ________.  We do use Korean words for counting, common commands (cheryot, shijak, etc), and sometimes use them for stances, strikes and blocks.


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## andyjeffries (Jul 6, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> The full technique name for twin knifehand in Korean is Kodeureo Yangsonnal Momtong Bakkat Makki - the koreans we have with us tell me that it's not a redundancy, but we are struggling to get to the definition of the 'Yang' part.



The Kukkiwon website doesn't seem to show any usage of "yang", but they do shown quite a few "hansonnal" blocks.  World Culture Taekwondo Kukkiwon will make it   That said, it is a reasonable term - yang means "both" in this context, so they're saying "Guarding both-knifehand middle outward block".

Kukkiwon terminology was standardised in recent years to remove unnecessary words, so they generally don't specify momtong (except for momtong makki) in every body section block, instead only emphasising low or high if it isn't a body block, they don't specify outer forearm or outward-direction (bakkat) if it's obvious (and in a knifehand block you aren't blocking with the forearm but the knife-edge of the hand).

I don't have my Kukkiwon textbook or Master Instructor Course book with me, but Grandmaster Ikpil Kang just uses "sonnal makki" (in both English and Korean) in his book.

I've just asked two friends - one is an ex-Kukkiwon Demonstration Team member (he left the team about 3 years ago).  He said they have always just called it "sonnal makki". He said that it's either called that or "geodeureo sonnal makki", depending on the instructor (so I guess they just used the short less specific form, because generally they all knew what they were supposed to be doing).

The other friend is a current member of the Kukkiwon Education Committee, he said it used to be called "sonnal makki", then they changed it about one year ago to the current term which is "doosonnal geodeureo bakkat makki" (two knifehand guarding outward block).  He said most people haven't changed yet though.

Anyway, hope that adds something to the conversation....


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## Gnarlie (Jul 6, 2015)

andyjeffries said:


> The Kukkiwon website doesn't seem to show any usage of "yang", but they do shown quite a few "hansonnal" blocks.  World Culture Taekwondo Kukkiwon will make it   That said, it is a reasonable term - yang means "both" in this context, so they're saying "Guarding both-knifehand middle outward block".
> 
> Kukkiwon terminology was standardised in recent years to remove unnecessary words, so they generally don't specify momtong (except for momtong makki) in every body section block, instead only emphasising low or high if it isn't a body block, they don't specify outer forearm or outward-direction (bakkat) if it's obvious (and in a knifehand block you aren't blocking with the forearm but the knife-edge of the hand).
> 
> ...



Indeed it does, thank you.

I agree that what's on the KKW website and in the textbook is often simpler, but there's not much consistency between instructors, even Korean ones.

Not everyone is using 'Naeryo Makki' and 'Ollyo Makki' yet, for example, and there is a lot of variation in what to call a dollyo chagi in each country. In the UK, that seems to mean head height, but here in DE it can be any height, and the term 'paltung' is often used for the midsection kick that we called bitchagi in the UK.

This is why I tend to stick with the KKW terms, but I try to be aware of the alternatives too.


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## Earl Weiss (Jul 6, 2015)

IcemanSK said:


> Does anyone use Sa Bum Nim more often than Mr./Ms./Master in reference to their instructor? How about using terms like Kyo Sa Nim or Gyeo Kyo Nim for assistant instructors? Who uses these in their school?



In referring to instructors the English Title is used. Korean typicaly only but always used only for the opening and closing ceremonies.

Boo Sa Bum - Assistant Instructor
Sa Bum - Instructor
Sa Hyung - Master Instructor
Sa Sung - Grandmaster Instructor
Chong Shee Ja - Founder  Used as salutation for General Choi in later years.  Apparently also used by Won Kuk Lee.


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## TrueJim (Jul 6, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> Bareun Bal is fast foot, yes, meaning step kick. I bet they use Narae Chagi for switch kicks too...



Switch Kick? They use "Narae Chagi" for a Double Roundhouse (where the first kick is a feint). Is that what you're calling a Switch Kick? I think I read once that Narae means "wings"? I guess the idea is that both legs in the air is supposed to make it look like wings.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 6, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> Switch Kick? They use "Narae Chagi" for a Double Roundhouse (where the first kick is a feint). Is that what you're calling a Switch Kick? I think I read once that Narae means "wings"? I guess the idea is that both legs in the air is supposed to make it look like wings.


That's the one!


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## TrueJim (Jul 6, 2015)

And another weird thing! At our school they romanize *Ee* (2) as *Yi*. Craziness man!

As an aside, we recently put our curriculum online. (I was the video editor...the performers are a couple of previous K-Tigers.)  Here it is in case anybody is curious: *Majest Martial Arts - YouTube*

Here's what the kicking combinations look like for our color-belts (I diagrammed these in my Poomsae Designer software): *Image - ExampleKickingCombinations.png - Taekwondo Wiki* 





That shows the names we use for most of our kicks. During drills we're required to call out the Korean names as we kick, but the instructors always use both terms (English and Korean) when teaching, one term right after the other, to make sure we know both names.


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## WaterGal (Jul 6, 2015)

andyjeffries said:


> I don't have my Kukkiwon textbook or Master Instructor Course book with me, but Grandmaster Ikpil Kang just uses "sonnal makki" (in both English and Korean) in his book.



Just checked, and they have the double/twin knifehand listed as "sonnal makki" and single knife hand as "hansonnal makki".


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## TrueJim (Jul 6, 2015)

(Referring to a Double Roundhouse as a Switch Kick...)



Gnarlie said:


> That's the one!



Hey, let me ask another question: at a recent test we had to do a Double Roundhouse (in which, again, presumably the first kick is a feint), but...*we had to break two thin boards*. Like, the feint had to be hard enough to snap the first thin board before executing the second (real) Roundhouse on another thin board. I actually found that surprisingly tricky to do (presumably because I'm fat, old, and slow). But more to the point, it struck me as odd to require a board-break on the feint. Do any of you guys do that at your schools? Require a board-break on the feint? I mean, it certainly requires that you sell the feint!

By the way, I Googled a bit and it seems most people use the term Switch Kick to refer to _any_ double-combination where the first kick is a feint? So that's the definition I added to the wiki, with the Double Roundhouse being cited as an example. (Always learning.)


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## Gnarlie (Jul 6, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> (Referring to a Double Roundhouse as a Switch Kick...)
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, let me ask another question: at a recent test we had to do a Double Roundhouse (in which, again, presumably the first kick is a feint), but...*we had to break two thin boards*. Like, the feint had to be hard enough to snap the first thin board before executing the second (real) Roundhouse on another thin board. I actually found that surprisingly tricky to do (presumably because I'm fat, old, and slow). But more to the point, it struck me as odd to require a board-break on the feint. Do any of you guys do that at your schools?



Yes, but when we do, we refer to it as a 'doppel dollyo' or double turning kick i.e.  both kicks are full kicks but they only turn in to 45 degrees or a little more. The feint is only a feint if there happens to be no target, otherwise it is a kick when the opportunity presents itself. 


TrueJim said:


> Require a board-break on the feint? I mean, it certainly requires that you sell the feint!



It does, and also encourages the student to acquire the hip switch motion control required to decide which of the kicks to commit to. 



TrueJim said:


> By the way, I Googled a bit and it seems most people use the term Switch Kick to refer to _any_ double-combination where the first kick is a feint? So that's the definition I added to the wiki, with the Double Roundhouse being cited as an example. (Always learning.)



Yes, any kick where a switch motion of the hips is used as the mechnical principle. Dollyo to Bandae Dollyo would also apply, if only one foot touches the floor at a time. Typically we mean chain dollyos though. 

We don't really use the term roundhouse in Europe or the UK, at least not in TKD (maybe in MMA), that seems to be an American term. I remember one of our Korean visitors asking me what it meant and why it was a round house!


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## TrueJim (Jul 6, 2015)

Gnarlie said:


> It does, and also encourages the student to acquire the hip switch motion control required to decide which of the kicks to commit to...



They place a big emphasis on turning over the hip at our school, for both kicks. I'm sure you know, a lot of kids especially try to turn the Double Roundhouse into Double Front Kicks instead.  Our instructors want to see the hip turn over on the first kick, and then the other way on the second kick, even if you have to sacrifice height to do it. Interestingly, I've read articles that suggest not turning over the hip so much for the Double Roundhouse...but that would not fly at our school.


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## Gnarlie (Jul 6, 2015)

TrueJim said:


> They place a big emphasis on turning over the hip at our school, for both kicks. I'm sure you know, a lot of kids especially try to turn the Double Roundhouse into Double Front Kicks instead.  Our instructors want to see the hip turn over on the first kick, and then the other way on the second kick, even if you have to sacrifice height to do it. Interestingly, I've read articles that suggest not turning over the hip so much for the Double Roundhouse...but that would not fly at our school.


Ours either. I think the point is to learn to get power in with the hip first, then you can roll back the power and find the best compromise of power versus speed and deceptiveness for each situation. Putting boards in front of people forces them to confront the common weakness with this combo which is, as you say, two apchagis with no hip.


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## andyjeffries (Jul 8, 2015)

WaterGal said:


> Just checked, and they have the double/twin knifehand listed as "sonnal makki" and single knife hand as "hansonnal makki".



That makes sense I guess - knifehand block and one-knifehand block.


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## Jaeimseu (Jul 8, 2015)

andyjeffries said:


> That makes sense I guess - knifehand block and one-knifehand block.


That's what we use at Arirang.


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## Earl Weiss (Jul 8, 2015)

AFAIAC for many, learning a language presents difficulties.   Further, there is no "Intuitive Connection" for non Korean speakers between terms like "Sonkal" and Knifehand, or "Maki" and Block.
I think this was one of the brilliant ideas by General Choi which included publications in the native language using intuitive names, and developing instructors and organizations from the people of each country  limiting control by Korean Seniors. (Admittedly some of this was born of neccessity.)


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## Drakanyst (Jul 9, 2015)

ah heck. kukkiwon standardizing their terms is nice- my old textbook has all of their fun twenty mile long specific names. here at my school in korea they keep terms as simple as possible, especially for the kids. while i've heard a bunch of variations between terms, they all have the same root. it just depends on how in detail the instructor wants to be with the term. 

some of my classes however, are english immersion. the students learn all of the english terms for techniques and commands. we do half of the classes in korean, half in english. 

in america, it is a part of our testing cycle to learn your form's new terms in korean. you have to identify these in order to pass to your next gup. greetings, numbers, kicks, blocks- everything is in korean aside from the explanations for the most part. our school follows the "master, mr., mrs., ms., etc" line for referring to other students and instructors- however the korean terms are slowly being integrated into normal school communication.


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## Buka (Jul 9, 2015)

Billy Blanks opened a Tae-kwon-do school in Japan a couple years ago. I can only imagine what terminology is being used there. I'll bet it's fun, though.


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## Manny (Jul 20, 2015)

IcemanSK said:


> Karate folks tend to use Japanese terms for instructors (sempai, sensei, shihan etc.) and Judo folks tend to use Japanese terms nearly exclusively for techniques. We TKDoan seem to be all over the maps as far as the amount of Korean terms that we use. Some Sa Bum or Yup Chagi more than others, but very few (in my experience) will use Sa Bum Nim, or Kyo Sa Nim as if it's the person's given name (as Karate folks seem to lean toward in greater numbers).
> 
> Why do you think that is? How much Korean do you use in class & how often? Is your master referred to as Sa Bum Nim as if it's their given name, or is it more often by Mr/Ms./Master, etc.? How much technique terminology is used in your dojang?



I use korena words and comands in the classes I teach, however the owner of the dojang not is that way, I eman she uses spanish comands and sometimes she uses korean words, I must confes is a kidie sporty dojang. I was taught the old way and I remain this way no matter what, it seems the comercial dojangs tend to be softher in this respect.

El Manny


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## oftheherd1 (Jul 22, 2015)

My teacher in TKD, in the USA, did use some Korean terms, but mostly for things like ready, attention, begin.  My Hapkido teacher in Korea was about the same; Korean words for attention, ready, meditate, breathing.  All techniques had English names.

@ Dirty Dog - doesn't sudo mean knife hand?


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## reeskm (Aug 4, 2015)

sudo should be knife hand, or open hand
sang sudo mahkkee is a double knife hand block.
These terms are often used in TangSooDo. I'm pretty sure the fact that they use the same or simlar Hanja to the Japanese Kanji for the same technique in Karate was the reason why you TKDers use new terminology that was developed by the Kukiwan or KTA in order to distance yourself from the "older" names in Korean.

I want to add, that when addressing seniors, it's my belief that the military history of Korea had a huge influence here. This is why there is more "Sir/Ma'am" used in Korean arts when compared to Karate and Japanese arts, where "Shihan/Sensei/Sempai" is more common.

We usually refer to seniors in class as "Mr. or Mrs [Surname]" if they are black belts, and "Sir/Ma'am" without a surname.
For masters, we would say "Master [Name}" or "Sir/Ma'am" without a surname.
For all class commands and formal situations (writing an email, a letter, on the phone) we often say "Kyo Sah Nim [surname}" or "Sah Bom Nim [Surname]".

To keep things interestings, keep in mind the Hanja/Kanji for:

KyoSah is identical to the Japanese KyoShi
SahBom is identical to the Japanese ShiHan or HanShi (reversed Kanji)
note how both KyoSah/SahBom share the same Hanja: "Sah". The japanese equivalents do as well. You can see here the similarity of the Japanese and Korean languages. There are patterns and the syllables have similarities.
I have not seen an equivalent to the Japanese "Renshi" used in Korean.
These three are curiously all official ranks in the Butokukai (Kyoto, JP)
As a friend and "brother" to you TKDers and a fellow Korean stylist, I hope I have added to the debate! I'm sure some of you who have issues with Japan's past, will like me, also see the similarities and cultural sharing here to promote goodwill between nations.


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