# Don't Talk to Strangers--Good Advice for Kids?



## arnisador (Aug 3, 2005)

http://www.cnn.com/2005/HEALTH/parenting/08/03/kids.safety.ap/index.html?section=cnn_latest

 This AP story states that experts are questioning whether "Don't Talk to Strangers" is good advice for kids, given that:

 --The vast majority of abductions are by non-strangers;
 --Strangers are the most likely sources of help for a lost child (e.g, police).


 The recent case of a child who hid from rescuers because they were "strangers" is cited.



> Sabin advised parents to practice "what if" scenarios with their children to give them experience making decisions that might help them escape danger. What would the child do if suddenly separated from a parent at a mall? How to respond if, while playing games in a video arcade, an adult man approaches?
> 
> "Make it non-threatening," Sabin said. "You don't want to make a child afraid. If any of us are afraid, you can't think clearly."
> 
> ...



 Personally, it sounds like good thinking to me, and I've always thought that the "Don't Talk to Strangers" advice was unrealistically broad. Kids have to speak with strangers all the time, and _should_ locate a responsible-appearing adult if lost. It's better to teach them the very basics of "verbal judo" and awareness of threats, appropriate to their age.


 On the other hand, I worry that for some parents it's better to have them teach that simplistic advice than give up on trying to teach something more complicated. Keep It Simple, Sir is good advice for a mass education campaign like this one.


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## OUMoose (Aug 3, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> On the other hand, I worry that for some parents it's better to have them teach that simplistic advice than give up on trying to teach something more complicated. Keep It Simple, Sir is good advice for a mass education campaign like this one.


I'd have to agree with the KISS priniciple here.  Yes, there are situations where children would have to speak to a strange adult.  However, I'd be willing to bet the large majority would be better off not talking.

Also, you can take it too far.  I mean c'mon, an 11 year old hiding from rescuers?  Did he not realize he was lost?  Did he not think there would be people looking for him?  That example seems much more like an exception than the rule.


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## CuongNhuka (Aug 3, 2005)

my oppinion is that kids in, say, kidnergarden should be taught how to identify people who can help them if they are lost or what have you. then again my thought is that kids in school should also be encouraged to learn some form of martial arts/self defense. you have to keep in mind that the myth that you only get attacked by strangers is incredibly false. crimes with intened victims (assault, rape, arson, murder, and so forth. as apposed to smockey pot, and underage smocking and the like.) are acctuly more likely to be done by some one you know. or if you donn't get that, you are more likely to be shot by some one you know the some one you donn't. and the same with rape and so forth. but back on subject, ya kids, and every one for that matter, should learn who is safe to talk to who is not and who you cann't tell until it's to late. but that is my 2 cents.

Sweet Brighit bless your blade

John


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## MA-Caver (Aug 3, 2005)

I've come across "lost kids" before and have been *very* careful about how to handle the situation. I desire to help of course but still am mindful about how things look. Often I'll wait in the wings if I can see the kid is in no immediate danger of being physically harmed i.e. in a mall or similar setting. Depending upon the age I'll wait to see if the parent will show up and find their kid. If I see an authority figure (police or security) then I'll point the kid out to them. Otherwise I'll intervene and make contact with the child. 
For example a three year old boy had wandered outside a store and into a parking lot, walking around and was crying for his papa. Since he was so small I knew the danger of a car backing into/over him was great. I stopped what I was doing and walked up to the kid and bade him to take my hand (my finger actually because he was so small) and led him out into the open where we both could be seen easily. I had no idea which store he came out of and didn't want to be dragging a crying kid around trying to find the dad (whom the boy was crying for clearly). I didn't try to shush him or get him to stop crying. I *wanted* to be heard and seen. 
There was a police station a half block away and I was planning to take the kid over there if "dadda" didn't show up in 10 minutes or so. Luckily Dadda came out  of a store with this frantic look on his face... He saw us standing there... gave me a quick supicious look but when I walked _towards_ him he smiled with relief and gave me thanks and asked no questions... the kid stopped crying when back in his arms so it confirmed to me at least this was "Dadda". 

This was a three year-old and while you can teach them the "don't talk to strangers and find a policeman..." thingy, but when they get lost they get scared and forgetful. It's an awfully big world to a little kid and scary if the comforting presence of a familiar adult (parent or relative) isn't around. 
Older kids might remain calm enough to think and be able to differentiate better (hopefully), between a helpful and harmful person. But then even we adults have that problem too sometimes. 

Parents (and guardians) get distracted and kids wander off. There are sincere honest people that want to help and there are animals that want to take advantage of the situation. How is the kid going to know the difference between a man in a tailored suit and a scruffy laborer? 
I've seen kids being dragged off screaming and crying by an adult in a mall and thought well it's a parent with a spoiled kid... was I wrong?  :idunno: 
We can teach kids to yell, rant, rave, scream bloody murder if a stranger is trying to take them... we can even teach them to yell *Help Help!* How many will pay attention and how many more will actually intervene even though they don't have the authority (of a police officer) to stop someone on a suspicion? 
That I think is the real sticky here. 
 :asian:


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## Marvin (Aug 3, 2005)

Check out "Protecting the Gift" by Gavin DeBecker, This book is the best I've ever read on protecting a child!


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## arnisador (Aug 3, 2005)

The Gift of Fear is sitting on my shelf (having been recommended here on MartialTalk), but I haven't read it yet!


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## proud beginner (Sep 1, 2005)

Speak, run or scream.

Speaking is the best thing, even if abducted.

A children predator feels, most of the time, excluded by the society -- He's trying to get a feeling of social control by hunting for defenseless youngers -- a deny of communication from the child will unleash bursts of agressivity driving to punches, kicks and, may be, torture and death.

Besides, children predators are often very good to look like perfect "good guys" to lure their preys. I don't think that one can teach a 3 yrs old to discriminate the real good guy from the fake one.

Speak to everybody.

Avoid being touched. (The real good guy will understand that).

If somebody tries to forcefully touch you, run to the most crowded place you can see while yelling for help.


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## arnisador (Sep 2, 2005)

An article today on kids and the martial arts:
http://family.msn.com/tool/article....ame=me_072905_martialarts&signup=true&offer=2


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## CrankyDragon (Sep 2, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> An article today on kids and the martial arts:
> http://family.msn.com/tool/article.aspx?dept=health&sdept=hsy&name=me_072905_martialarts&signup=true&offer=2


Very good article, but UGGG! They left out Aikido! 

Anyway, my daughter just got her 1st stripe Junior White Belt! Our NGA classes are like a father/daughter project. She is very smart and aware, but since starting classes Ive noticed she is much more situational aware. She notices more things that could present a potential risk, and even verbalizes it. 

In my line of work, I am always in condition yellow, even outside of work. I regularly CCW and do things like scan the area when I exit the vehicle in a parking lot before everyone else has a chance to exit the vehicle, heck I scan for the location of the parking space before I pull in. I am always examining peoples face and eyes, and hand position. I am always aware of position, myself and others around me/my family. I observe conversation and tone. All the while, the wife and kids are not aware of my actions but know I am performing them.

BTW, I work in the corrections field and now that Ive been doing this for as long as I have, I regularly run into individuals when where out. Have never felt to be at risk during those times, but my life has been threatened several times.

What Im getting to, is my sense of situational awareness, as the term I use as an umbrella for everything you do and think to keep safe, is being passed on to the family so they too can be safe with a skill that will last a life time, no exceptions, even the little ones. They do NOT feel as though they have to be sceared, simply realize that risk exist and the necessity to be "awake". 

Good luck to all,
Andrew


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## ginshun (Sep 2, 2005)

I think maybe teaching them which strangers to talk to is more appropriate that the broad "Don't talk to strangers"

 As a general rule I would say don't talk to male strangers is better. It sounds kinda bad, but its true, most of the time people that would hurt kids are men. Even though it would make a stange child not talk to me for help, I still think it is good advise.


  I would say that if they are lost or in trouble, find and old grandma or a mom with kids.

  Just my take on it.


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## proud beginner (Sep 2, 2005)

proud beginner said:
			
		

> Speak, run, scream.
> 
> Speaking is the best thing, even if abducted.
> 
> ...



If a predator and a kid are to fence about who is the smarter, the predator will win. 

A young kid is, in now way, able to discriminate efficiently people, besides, not speaking, even to an abductor, is going to *worsen*  the situation.

Even a young kid is able to discriminate between speaking/listening and being touched. 

1 Speak and smile to everybody
2 Avoid any physical contact with unknown people
3 If forced to physical contact, run and scream.

This is possible to teach very soon.


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## Matt (Sep 2, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> The Gift of Fear is sitting on my shelf (having been recommended here on MartialTalk), but I haven't read it yet!




Read it. It answers this question well. Infact, I think he sums up in a chapter as much as he says in Protecting the Gift  on this topic. 

In a  nutshell:
Talk to strangers, wave to strangers, interact with strangers. 
Don't go anywhere with a stranger. This avoids the confusion when parents are making their own rule meaningless by prompting the kid to say hi to the stranger at the bank, the stranger bagging their groceries, etc. Kids then feel capable of asking a (chosen by the kid) stranger for help. 

He doesn't advocate: if you are lost, find a cop. To kids, security guards look like cops. He casts a suspicious eye on that lot, as it has provided several serial killers - they fit the profile. 

He does advocate: Ask a woman for help. Most (more than 90%) sex criminals are male. 

It's not perfect, but puts the odds in a kid's favor. 

Matt


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## Loki (Sep 2, 2005)

Matt said:
			
		

> Read it. It answers this question well. Infact, I think he sums up in a chapter as much as he says in Protecting the Gift on this topic.
> 
> In a  nutshell:
> Talk to strangers, wave to strangers, interact with strangers.
> ...


  *pulls 'The Gift of Fear' off the shelf and begins reading...*

  *...or, at least, intends to after finishing current book*


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## lhommedieu (Sep 16, 2005)

arnisador said:
			
		

> http://www.cnn.com/2005/HEALTH/parenting/08/03/kids.safety.ap/index.html?section=cnn_latest
> 
> This AP story states that experts are questioning whether "Don't Talk to Strangers" is good advice for kids, given that:
> 
> ...



My friend, Dave Tillet, has written two articles on the subject of how to teach children to help themselves if they get lost:

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Travel/story?id=886373&page=1 
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Travel/story?id=886376&page=1 

Although it may seem unbelievable that children will hide from rescuers, the reality is that getting lost for hours (or days) is a stressful and disorienting  experience for children (and for most adults, by the way), and they cannot be expected to act rationally - especially if "stranger danger" is drilled into them from the time they can walk.  Teaching children that there are special situations wherein they can talk to strangers seems like good advice to me.

Best,

Steve Lamade


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