# The psi/chi wheel



## GeorgeWOE (Aug 23, 2012)

I believe that most of you know about this and the videos that exist on youtube about making a piece of paper spin on a needle.Even I made one about it(don't ask why :-/)...


But is it true or fake?


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## Gnarlie (Aug 23, 2012)

If you mean can a person really make a piece of paper spin on a needle, then yes, it's real. 

If you mean is the spinning caused by chi, then no, it isn't.

I suggest watching this:






And this






Myth: Busted

Gnarlie


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 23, 2012)

Gnarlie said:


> If you mean can a person really make a piece of paper spin on a needle, then yes, it's real.
> 
> If you mean is the spinning caused by chi, then no, it isn't.



NOT REAL!!!!!!

Don't MAKE me knock you down...without touching you...form miles away....with my awsome powers of Qi :uhyeah:


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 23, 2012)

I know that guy you are talking about

I meant things like this one:






and this one:


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## oaktree (Aug 23, 2012)

I have a story. I was talking with a daoist priest
and we were talking about a Chinese idiom.
The idiom is about Lu dong bin and his dog.
Its about how master Lu treats his dog nice
but one day the dog bites him.
So last night I got stung by a bee.
I was trying to save it by opening my car door
And it stung me! I asked the priest did you
Send that bee to sting me to teach me the idiom?
He laughed not even my magic is that powerful.
He said maybe Lu dong himself bit you to
Teach you it. I replied well its OK I forgive him
anyway this thread reminded me of that conversation.


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## Gnarlie (Aug 23, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> I know that guy you are talking about
> 
> I meant things like this one:
> 
> ...



Convection.  No more than convection.  Hot hands.  In the example with the glass beaker over the wheel, the beaker is warmed in water prior to performing this feat of telekinesis.

There are two factors that allow me to categorically deny the existence of psychic or telekinetic phenomena:

1) If either existed, large companies would now be exploiting and making money out of it. 
2) For the past 40 years, James Randi has offered between 10000 and 1 million US dollars to anyone who can prove to him the existence of psychic abilities that he is unable to replicate via other means.  No such phenom has emerged in that time, though several fakers have ruined their careers. 

Esoteric energies remain internal without physical contact. 



Gnarlie


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 24, 2012)

Yes I can understand your point of view on this.

To tell you the truth I believed to it for some time because you see when I did it I tried this.I putted the psi wheel on my desk and 
I was standing away from it about 2 meters.I was looking at it and it wasn't moving.When I started thinking that it would move it did.
(I was having my hands behind me and i wasn't breathing durring it).But after i found the same videos that you showed me I think that 
yes I might fooled myself...


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## Cyriacus (Aug 24, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> Yes I can understand your point of view on this.
> 
> To tell you the truth I believed to it for some time because you see when I did it I tried this.I putted the psi wheel on my desk and
> I was standing away from it about 2 meters.I was looking at it and it wasn't moving.When I started thinking that it would move it did.
> ...



Hey, if you didnt fool yourself, you can go and get $10,000 off of James Randi. ...Or let James Randi add you to his list


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## Gnarlie (Aug 24, 2012)

It's a cheque for 1 million dollars now, even better.

Randi seems like a rather bitter old man, especially when he talks about homeopathic medicine, but essentially he speaks the truth in my opinion. 

In over 100 years of private funded research, both in universities and commercial enterprise, the Parapsychological Association has failed to find conclusive evidence for the existence of psychic phenomena.  If they can't do it in a century of active research, you're not going to find the first piece of evidence on Youtube.  You could try them, but this little wheel thing would be quite low on their list, I would think. 

I hear Uri Geller has been looking for a new idea since his spoon thing was rumbled.

Gnarlie


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 24, 2012)

Why didn't someone simply showed him a Ki ball?That's more easier right?


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 24, 2012)

*KA MEHA MEHA




*


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## oaktree (Aug 24, 2012)

Please do a google search to see how his conditions and terms are impossible to meet and are not fairly objective at all.
http://dailygrail.com/features/the-myth-of-james-randis-million-dollar-challenge

http://subversivethinking.blogspot.com/2009/03/james-randi-backs-out-of-challenge-with.html


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## Gnarlie (Aug 24, 2012)

I would say they are impossible to meet for serious research groups.   But funding research groups with the million was never his aim.   His aim was to out and bust people who claimed to have large effect paranormal abilities: psychics, telekinetic individuals and so on.   The element within parapsychology who could be considered as purely showmen. 

The second article about pseudoskeptics I don't agree with at all.   It's not necessarily true that a pseudoskeptic does not believe in free will, and this is the premise of the whole article. 

Gnarlie


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## oaktree (Aug 24, 2012)

I am sorry I disagree, his aim was never to part with the million dollars. He wrote his terms and condition specifically so he would never loose.
 Anyway this is slightly off topic I will let you have the final word concerning the matter.


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 24, 2012)

So in other words what he does is just a trick to lure out liars...
That doesn't sound bad but also selfish because as you said he hadn't accepted anyone so even if someone from you went there and showed him what you guys can do he would still call you a liar...

I believe he still does this only for the fame now...


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## Gnarlie (Aug 25, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> So in other words what he does is just a trick to lure out liars...
> That doesn't sound bad but also selfish because as you said he hadn't accepted anyone so even if someone from you went there and showed him what you guys can do he would still call you a liar...
> 
> I believe he still does this only for the fame now...



Absolutely.  The point is, anyone with any sense and any realisation that psychic phenomena do not exist will not take up the challenge. 

The only people who will take it up are fakers with big egos, who under the terms can't win the money and will be exposed.

If any one of us went there we would be refused.  But none of us claim to do what we do using psychic powers or externalised chi.

People that do claim those things deserve to be exposed as what they are. 

Gnarlie


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 25, 2012)

So in order to not end up in a misunderstanding can you tell me what we are able to do (with chi) that they refuse to accept?


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## Gnarlie (Aug 25, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> So in order to not end up in a misunderstanding can you tell me what we are able to do (with chi) that they refuse to accept?



No legitimate martial artist claims to have psychic or supernatural abilities.  Randi's challenge sought out people who claimed those abilities.  Therefore a legitimate martial artist would neither want to, nor be eligible to enter.

There is no supernatural, psychic or paranormal ability in martial arts.   Only practice. 

Gnarlie


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 28, 2012)

So to close this subject let me put everything in one post:

Chi can't be used for telekinesis and stuff like that because researches that took 100 years 
and they are still going showed that nothing was found that was similar to that kind of abilities
-Gnarlie

James Randi uses 1 million dollars as a bait to lure fakers with big egos and even if there was someone
that was able to do what he/she was claiming  he/she would be refused since Randi's rules are to his favor.
-Oaktree

The psi wheel is just a trick that happens from the heat that is being produced from the hands and other tricks that people use to make it spin.
As the mythbusters say BUSTED.

I wrote what you said in short.Please be gentle if i forgot anything...


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## rainesr (Aug 28, 2012)

Generally I have no issues with people who believe in chi, we workout, we learn from each other, great.

There have been a few people who really pushed their views concerning chi and their magic powers even though I had no interest. My challenge to them was that if their chi is so amazing I will give them 10 chances with my eyes closed and completely prone, to knock me over without touching me (this is what they claimed). If they are not successful I get one chance to do the same full contact with my fist or foot, after all their chi will protect them. Not one has taken my challenge.


~Rob


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 29, 2012)

rainesr said:


> There have been a few people who really pushed their views concerning chi and their magic powers even though I had no interest. My challenge to them was that if their chi is so amazing I will give them 10 chances with my eyes closed and completely prone, to knock me over without touching me (this is what they claimed). If they are not successful I get one chance to do the same full contact with my fist or foot, after all their chi will protect them. Not one has taken my challenge.



Sadly when I was younger I thought I was supposed to be able to do that.
But then I took reality to the face.
For the first one of course anyone would be able to do that.
About the second one wouldn't a good position of the body effect your result.Or if he/she was a shaolin kung fu
 practitioner there wouldn't be any effect on him right?

By George


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## GeorgeWOE (Aug 29, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> For the first one of course anyone would be able to do that.
> By George



Damn you instagram.I wanted to write that noone would be able to do what you ask them :-/


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## GeorgeWOE (Oct 14, 2012)

GeorgeWOE said:


> Damn you instagram.I wanted to write that noone would be able to do what you ask them :-/



Sorry guys someone got in and sent the last two messages.It wasn't me :/


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## Blaze Dragon (Nov 2, 2012)

Never heard it called the Qi wheel before, but the psi wheel is real, as far as it's actually use if you choose to mess with it and intentionally move it by other means then our mind your just cheating yourself. It's just one visual representation of energy work. I've never seen someone move a pencil or anything with there mind. However the psi wheel's purpose is helping with direction of intent. after all we are all made up of energy, and the energy we project can affect things. The thing is the effective or spiritual or magical energy is subtle. For those of you of a more scientific mind check this out.

http://youtu.be/k1-0ulKgmio

it's research on the affects of human thought on water. as we are mostly water this is why magical energy can affect us. However I dont' know if I would go so far as to say you could hit someone from a distance or even move a physical object. I mean yes you create vibration with your thoughts and these waves will affect things on the subtle level but I've personally never witnessed it affecting things on akin to actually moving something. There is a reason the psi wheel is on the tip of a needle. so to answer your question, yes the psi wheel is real.

just a note my insight and opinions are not a product of my martial arts training, but of my research, practice and beliefs.


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