# Grab the bird tail question...



## charyuop (Feb 19, 2007)

I have seen in many videos, apart from the style, that there are two different ways to do the Press after the Rollback. In one version (which is the one I do) after shifting the weight back in the Rollback you set the hands ready for the Press and while turning the body you shift the body on the front leg and start pressing forward with the hands.
The other version I have seen after shifting the body weight back from the rollback you set the hand ready twist the torso to face the fron leg and only after that you carry out the pressing movement.
Basically with one Press you have a rotating force towards the opponent, while in the other version you have more a streight force towards the opponent.

Now my question is not "which one is correct?", but more what is the actual difference between the two version in an application in a fight? In a fight the version I do (mind I don't do it as Martial Art, unfortunately, thus no way to try it in class) if following the rollback since you have more a rotating motion you can use it to compress the opponent towards the front leg thus taking its balance. While the other version would just be to push the opponent away?

Thanx in advance, and sorry if it's a beginner question...


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## charyuop (Feb 19, 2007)

I thought a couple of videos might make more clear the difference I am talking about, since I don't know if I was clear enough.

Second Version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6WyGxWBdc8&mode=related&search=

First version:


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## dmax999 (Feb 19, 2007)

The most common application that I know for that move is reversing a large rollback.  When someone is basically putting your arm into an armbar and standing towards your back and side while doing that, you bend the elbow before being locked and step right up next to him in front while doing the move you are asking about.  In that case you have to perform the press while turning your waist.  If by some way you end up not having to turn your waist (Doing the reversal slightly different then I have seen), I guess that would be correct as well.

Its difficult to describe what I am talking about and I don't know any videos online of it.  Its fairly simple once you see it.


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 20, 2007)

I don't know what to tell you here. Without actually seeing what you are talking about. And the Videos are basically 2 different styles and neither is of traditional Yang. 

Just from your written description possibly both are right depending on who the teacher was and the style.


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## charyuop (Feb 20, 2007)

XS, I was not questioning if one is correct or not. I was just wondering in case of a fight what is the difference in the outcome of the 2 different versions. In fact in my message I said apart from the style. I was wondering the difference of the effect that the 2 techniques have on the opponent.


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## East Winds (Feb 20, 2007)

charyuop,

In doing the form, either is correct. However in a martial sense turning to the front first is correct.  As you may know, one of the applications of roll back is an arm lock on your oppopnents left arm. However, he can counter attack by attempting to strike you with his left elbow. This can be neutralised by turning to the front and locking down his elbow with your own right forearm. (or squeezing your elbows together).  Remember that "Press" can also be translated as "Squeeze". 

Very best wishes


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## Xue Sheng (Feb 20, 2007)

charyuop said:


> XS, I was not questioning if one is correct or not. I was just wondering in case of a fight what is the difference in the outcome of the 2 different versions. In fact in my message I said apart from the style. I was wondering the difference of the effect that the 2 techniques have on the opponent.


 
Oops sorry, both right depending on the application you are going for.


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## charyuop (Feb 20, 2007)

Thanx East Wind, it makes alot of sense.


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