# The Karate Kid Movies



## matt.m (Feb 14, 2008)

Look, all of us train in one or more arts.  My question is this:  Karate Kid trilogy, did you like it or hate it.  I really enjoy the aspects of the "Moral" teachings of Myagi.  Very kind, forgiving, generous, never asked for anything in return.  He tried to pass this along as every good instructor does.  Notice I didn't say "Teacher", I believe that it all goes with anyone can learn a side kick or shoulder throw.....however are they decent human beings?  The same is held in the difference between instructor and student.  I can teach all the Kodokan Judo I want, however......if I am not passionate about my students doing the best they can then I am not an instructor, therefore I will not continue to learn and grow myself.

I think, in the end that the relationship between instructor and student went full circle by the end of the 3rd one.  I just got done watching the second one so I was just kind of pondering and would like to know everyone else's feedback if I may.  I know there are a lot of instructors on the board.  I don't care what style, it is all about "Presence of mind" and "Humility".  And that works both ways or not at all.


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## arnisador (Feb 15, 2008)

I liked it! There's lots to criticize, but it presented the art in a new way, and with an Okinawan emphasis. Of course compromises were made to make it popular, but I think the trilogy is a new plus.


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## terryl965 (Feb 15, 2008)

I really enjoyed them and today I have a better understanding ot the movies than when first saw them.


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## MA-Caver (Feb 15, 2008)

matt.m said:


> Look, all of us train in one or more arts.  My question is this:  Karate Kid trilogy, did you like it or hate it.  I really enjoy the aspects of the "Moral" teachings of Myagi.  Very kind, forgiving, generous, never asked for anything in return.  He tried to pass this along as every good instructor does.  Notice I didn't say "Teacher", I believe that it all goes with anyone can learn a side kick or shoulder throw.....however are they decent human beings?  The same is held in the difference between instructor and student.  I can teach all the Kodokan Judo I want, however......if I am not passionate about my students doing the best they can then I am not an instructor, therefore I will not continue to learn and grow myself.
> 
> I think, in the end that the relationship between instructor and student went full circle by the end of the 3rd one.  I just got done watching the second one so I was just kind of pondering and would like to know everyone else's feedback if I may.  I know there are a lot of instructors on the board.  I don't care what style, it is all about "Presence of mind" and "Humility".  And that works both ways or not at all.


I liked it. As Arnisador said it presented the art in a new way. It also gave kids a good way to feel better about themselves, particularly those who are bullied by those bigger and stronger than them. It showed that you don't have to take it. You don't always have to run. That there are ways to keep from getting hurt when you can't run. It also showed how you will gain the most important respect of all. SELF-respect. 
Saying that Miyagi didn't ask for anything is incorrect however; using the alternate method of teaching he got his house, cars, landscaping work all done. Daniel worked towards his lessons and was learning at the same time. Miyagi hints that is the way his father taught him, the basics. Once Daniel had the katas down then he advanced his teachings. 
True, promoting him to black belt in those two short months is unrealistic but I like to think that Myagi gave him the "belt" as a temporary measure just so that Daniel could compete in the tournament which would complete their bargain with the Cobra-Kai's and to show Daniel what he could do when he believed in himself. 
The film(s) were designed to be a "Rocky" for the younger generation. The writer, Robert Mark Kamen is a long time Martial Artist and wanted to use Karate to showcase the art(s) as a means to give back what he had gotten from them. 
His writing is excellent I think. Here are a couple of quotes which (like Terry) means more today than when I first heard them. 


> Daniel: Hey - you ever get into fights when you were a kid?
> Miyagi: Huh - plenty.
> Daniel: Yeah, but it wasn't like the problem I have, right?
> Miyagi: Why? Fighting fighting. Same same.
> ...





> Miyagi: Your friend, all karate student, eh?
> Daniel: Friend? Oh, yeah, those guys.
> Miyagi: Problem: attitude.
> Daniel: No the problem is, I'm getting my *** kicked every other day, that's the problem.
> ...


If you haven't bought the DVD, get the "Special Edition" which has interviews with the cast and crew, along with some nice bonuses.


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## DavidCC (Feb 15, 2008)

matt.m said:


> Look, all of us train in one or more arts. My question is this: Karate Kid trilogy, did you like it or hate it. I really enjoy the aspects of the "Moral" teachings of Myagi. Very kind, forgiving, generous, never asked for anything in return. He tried to pass this along as every good instructor does. Notice I didn't say "Teacher", I believe that it all goes with anyone can learn a side kick or shoulder throw.....however are they decent human beings? The same is held in the difference between instructor and student. I can teach all the Kodokan Judo I want, however......if I am not passionate about my students doing the best they can then I am not an instructor, therefore I will not continue to learn and grow myself.
> 
> I think, in the end that the relationship between instructor and student went full circle by the end of the 3rd one. I just got done watching the second one so I was just kind of pondering and would like to know everyone else's feedback if I may. I know there are a lot of instructors on the board. I don't care what style, it is all about "Presence of mind" and "Humility". And that works both ways or not at all.


 
Loved the first one, not so hot for the others.

In our school we define an Instructor as 'someone who shows you how to do something' and a Teacher as 'someone who gives you knowledge',


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## zDom (Feb 15, 2008)

I really like the first Karate Kid.

However, I have to say that I might have had to kick Daniel-san's ***, too. He pretty much asks for it several times in the movie 

Sweep the leg, Johnny!!


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## Sukerkin (Feb 15, 2008)

In common with many, I thought that the first Karate Kid was a great film that put a lot of decent core MA philosophy in an easily digested format.  

Because it had to be diluted for the broad audience it's drawn a lot of criticism for espousing what people have derided as half-baked, home-spun, fortune-cookie philosophy.  That, I think, has been very unfair to the film for, if you're trying to put across a serious subject in bite-sized, entertainment wrapped, chunks, what else can you do?

Some of Miagi Sensei's one-liners, half-Americanese/half-Zen are classics (in fact I used one myself right here at MT the other night ).

The second film I don't really recall as we've never been offered an un-censored version over here and I haven't watched it on principle (caught it once one Christmas when I was at a friends house for dinner.  Likewise I don't think I've ever seen III either.  

I've seen IV several times tho', despite it probably being the low point in some ways ... I wonder if anyone can guess why I've seen that one a few times :lol:.


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## MA-Caver (Feb 15, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> In common with many, I thought that the first Karate Kid was a great film that put a lot of decent core MA philosophy in an easily digested format.
> 
> Because it had to be diluted for the broad audience it's drawn a lot of criticism for espousing what people have derided as half-baked, home-spun, fortune-cookie philosophy.  That, I think, has been very unfair to the film for, if you're trying to put across a serious subject in bite-sized, entertainment wrapped, chunks, what else can you do?
> 
> ...



Umm... some Swank girl I presume? 

Watching the (original) film last week, I thought Miyagi's lines were well written. Morita said he enjoyed them. He also has NO idea where that gravely Miyagi voice came from, I think he must've gotten it off of Toshiro Mufune at some point in his memory. BTW Mufune was considered first choice for the role of Miyagi but I think he was either unavailable or they looked around a bit more and found Morita, glad they chose him. Mufune is a great great actor but probably TOO serious (IMO) for the role of Miyagi to which Morita played perfectly. 
The second film I think was hastily written, to ride on the success of the first film, but at least was given more thought than the third (which I probably only watched once). I don't even recall ever having watched the fourth. I think I was on my anti-sequel phase at the time. 
At least it kept a well liked Japanese actor working after his brief but wonderful stint on Happy Days. Anyone remember Arnold teaching Karate episode?


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## Ninjamom (Feb 15, 2008)

The first one was a classic.  I didn't see K2 until many years later, but then I really enjoyed it - Pete Cetera theme song and all.  Like others have said, K3 rounded the story nicely, and showed why Daniel-san needed his butt kicked.


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## thardey (Feb 15, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> The second film I don't really recall as we've never been offered an un-censored version over here and I haven't watched it on principle (caught it once one Christmas when I was at a friends house for dinner.  Likewise I don't think I've ever seen III either.



What "censored" version are you talking about -- what was censored?


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## MA-Caver (Feb 15, 2008)

thardey said:


> What "censored" version are you talking about -- what was censored?



The part where Miyagi was hitting on that cute young Yuki that Daniel was trying to hook up with. :lol:


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## kidswarrior (Feb 15, 2008)

matt.m said:


> I know there are a lot of instructors on the board.  I don't care what style, it is all about "Presence of mind" and "Humility".  And that works both ways or not at all.





			
				DavidCC said:
			
		

> In our school we define an Instructor as 'someone who shows you how to do something' and a Teacher as 'someone who gives you knowledge'


That's a pretty good distinction, but think I'd go further and say a teacher is someone who leads you to the door, but then steps back to let the student walk through (or not) and discover the world for themselves. And yes, humility and presence of mind are definitely required, imho.


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## Kacey (Feb 15, 2008)

Did I like them?  Yes.

Do I think that they did some damage to the MA community?  Yes.  The movies - especially the first one - led far too many people to believe that they could learn Karate (or some other MA) quickly and easily, through household chores... and I had students within that era (I started instructing around 1990) who didn't understand why I wasn't teaching _them_ the same way, or as quickly.

Still, they presented Karate in an accessible fashion - different from many other movies in which MAs were not available to anyone not Asian.


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## Sukerkin (Feb 15, 2008)

MA-Caver said:


> Umm... some Swank girl I presume?


 
A little too obvious to win a prize I suppose - then again, recall that she had some growing to do so I count her in my 'Predictions Proven to be Correct" column with regard to somewhat gawky 'teens who leave the Ugly Duckling phase well behind.


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## Sukerkin (Feb 15, 2008)

thardey said:


> What "censored" version are you talking about -- what was censored?


 
Sadly, British TV and video is heavily censored when it comes to the use of martial arts and martial arts weapons, especially the weapons.  It would seem that our government has ever had a bee in it's bonnet about that, so I suppose it's latest drive to get rid of katana's should come as no surprise.

I was a big fan of Cynthia Rothrock movies many years ago but have always regretted not keeping my first purchases of her videos as subsequent releases are so heavily chopped they're not worth the time.  After all, a martial arts flick with most of the martial arts taken out is just a terrible story with bad dialogue :lol:.


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## matt.m (Feb 25, 2008)

Kacey said:


> Did I like them? Yes.
> 
> Do I think that they did some damage to the MA community? Yes. The movies - especially the first one - led far too many people to believe that they could learn Karate (or some other MA) quickly and easily, through household chores... and I had students within that era (I started instructing around 1990) who didn't understand why I wasn't teaching _them_ the same way, or as quickly.
> 
> Still, they presented Karate in an accessible fashion - different from many other movies in which MAs were not available to anyone not Asian.


 

I like your point of view.  But it didn't start with "The Karate Kid",  It was Bruce Lee, then Seagal and Van Damme, now its all the cartoons and Jet Li and Jason Stratham.

The circle will always continue, it is our job as instructors to instructor new ones that are wide eyed with curiousity correctly.  Late GGM Park, the founder of Moo Sul kwan was asked the following by my father in 1973......"Is Bruce Lee really that good?"  GGM Park answered "Good technique, very fast, certainly good for business."


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## Drac (Feb 25, 2008)

I didn't like them, *ANY* of them...


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## MA-Caver (Feb 25, 2008)

Drac said:


> I didn't like them, *ANY* of them...


Atta boy Drac. Stand for what you believe in!


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## Fiendlover (Feb 25, 2008)

i enjoyed all of them and myagi showed more than kicks and punches which is what i liked about it.  he put the wisdom and moral into martial arts too.:ninja:


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## Grenadier (Feb 25, 2008)

As a TMA practitioner, I certainly enjoyed the fact that those Karate Kid movies gave some exposure to Karate, and not the usual Gung Fu movies that came out of Hong Kong.  Nothing wrong with the Gung Fu flicks; it's just that traditional Karate never got quite the exposure.  

I know for certain, that the movies did help generate more interest in Karate amongst the kids who watched it, and yes, even the parents who watched it along with their kids.  

It was also nice to see that some nerdy kid (actually a full grown man in the way of Ralph Macchio), was able to learn Karate, and beat the big bad guy.  Heart warming, to say the least.  


Where I frown upon the movies, though, is that they did fill some kids' heads with delusions of grandeur, that they suddenly thought that by doing common household chores, they could somehow defeat the big bully in school.  Come on now... 

Also, where I crinkled my nose, is how the character of Daniel LaRusso seemed to regress horribly from the second movie to the third.  In the second movie, he had kicked the butt of one seriously bad dude (Chozen), who was the Golden Boy of Sato's Karate empire.  

In the third movie, he was getting his butt kicked badly by the bad boy "Mike," and seemed to be a helpless whelp.  Sorry, but he didn't seem nearly as tough as Chozen did...  


Overall?  I think it was a very positive thing for the martial arts.  The TMA needs decent exposure, and even though we may scoff at some of the things in the movies, none of us can argue the fact that the movies did generate some more interest.  

As long as people actually set foot in our dojo, I know that I have a pretty good chance of getting them to sign up for classes.  If a franchise of movies can bring more people into that doorway, then I'll simply be grateful for such favors.  Really!


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## Dusty (Feb 25, 2008)

sweep the leg Johnny!!!


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## rdonovan1 (Aug 1, 2009)

I personally liked all of them, but the ones that I tended to like the best are 2 and 4.

I guess what made me like those the best was the girls. While I liked the girls the best I can't say that I did'nt enjoy the philosophy in all of them as the overall philosophy that Mr. Miyagi teaches is and always will be important as much of what Mr. Miyagi is true in real life.


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## Gordon Nore (Aug 1, 2009)

I liked the first and second -- the opening parking lot scene which begins part two had actually been shot during part one and saved for a sequel. The two films had a nice symmetry to them. Miyagi sticks up for Daniel in the first one; Daniel returns the favour in the second.

KKIII was gratuitous -- in real time, it was several years after the original films, and Macchio was pushing thirty. It didn't look right. I also found the plot way over the top.

TNKK (or KKIV) with Hilary Swank was silly, I thought.


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## DergaSmash (Aug 9, 2009)

I loved the Karate Kid movies. Still do. 

They are still making moral MA movies. Anyone see Redbelt?


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## girlbug2 (Aug 9, 2009)

DergaSmash said:


> They are still making moral MA movies. Anyone see Redbelt?


 
I thought Redbelt was pretty good, maybe a bit overrated. But it definitely had a good moral message.


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## Big Don (Aug 9, 2009)

The first one was awesome, inspiring.
The second was marginal.
The third was crap.
The fourth was (what is less than crap?)


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## DergaSmash (Aug 10, 2009)

Though not a true MA movie, Unleashed was awesome


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## MA-Caver (Aug 10, 2009)

Big Don said:


> The fourth was (what is less than crap?)


The scum that's at the corner of your mouth when you first wake up in the morning?


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## Stac3y (Aug 10, 2009)

*Loved* the first one; second was pretty good; third was possibly the worst movie I've ever seen.


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## zDom (Aug 10, 2009)

DergaSmash said:


> I loved the Karate Kid movies. Still do.
> 
> They are still making moral MA movies. Anyone see Redbelt?



Yep. Enjoyed it very much.


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