# Mr Hartman's Local Seminar



## Northern (Mar 1, 2004)

Mr Hartman hosted a three school tourney, and his place was jammed.  It looked like everyone was having a good time and the spectators were riveted.   
By Next Year perhaps he will have knocked out that wall and expand the tourney.


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## Rich Parsons (Mar 1, 2004)

Northern said:
			
		

> Mr Hartman hosted a three school tourney, and his place was jammed. It looked like everyone was having a good time and the spectators were riveted.
> By Next Year perhaps he will have knocked out that wall and expand the tourney.


Cool, did you compete?

Tell us more Please


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## Northern (Mar 1, 2004)

Well, there were no Adult Male BlackBelts there for me to fight (according to Tim)... mainly teenagers in the mens division... There were adult females.  I watched some of the kids weapons sparring... and it was interesting.  Tim and Hutch and the other host kept things running smoothly, and actually I was having fun "working" the crowd.  Just thought I should show support for Mr Hartmans event (and possibly fight).  I guess if he promotes a Mens tourney with more widespread advertisment you can come down and kick my butt a little.


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## Northern (Mar 1, 2004)

It seemed very high energy in general and the participants of all ages were very enthusiastic (sp?)...   along with the parents...   It just seemed like good old fashioned fun.  
artyon:


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## Rich Parsons (Mar 1, 2004)

Northern said:
			
		

> Well, there were no Adult Male BlackBelts there for me to fight (according to Tim)... mainly teenagers in the mens division... There were adult females. I watched some of the kids weapons sparring... and it was interesting. Tim and Hutch and the other host kept things running smoothly, and actually I was having fun "working" the crowd. Just thought I should show support for Mr Hartmans event (and possibly fight). I guess if he promotes a Mens tourney with more widespread advertisment you can come down and kick my butt a little.


 
Northern,  

I am glad it went well and you had fun working the crowd. All I can say is that all the adult male black belts must have  stepped out for fear of the Teenagers  . Seriously though it is good to see events succeed.

As to beating you up though, Are you sure I would not be asked to join the teenagers for the Maturity factor? , By mass yes, I would me in the adult division 

Glad to see you posting 
:asian:


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## Northern (Mar 1, 2004)

I suspect we would have to let the judges decide that...  
Also, I seem to recall we weigh the same even if I do have a lower center of gravity.


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## Rich Parsons (Mar 1, 2004)

Northern said:
			
		

> I suspect we would have to let the judges decide that...
> Also, I seem to recall we weigh the same even if I do have a lower center of gravity.


 
Well that Moly-B-Den-um or Mo-Lyb-De-Num Plate in my head helps  to raise my center of gravity.


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## loki09789 (Mar 2, 2004)

What were the rules/events for sparring?  Weapon/empty hand?  Equiptment/protective gear requirments....?


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 2, 2004)

Form, openhand and weapon (single/double stick and sword were the options)
5 point, no time limit, light contact were the announced rules.


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## loki09789 (Mar 3, 2004)

Kaith Rustaz said:
			
		

> Form, openhand and weapon (single/double stick and sword were the options)
> 5 point, no time limit, light contact were the announced rules.



Thanks Bob,  what were the safety equiptment/padding and weapon specs for the weapon sparring.

Curious because if this type of thing takes off in the area, I might be interested in trying it out.  But the specifics of regulation striking techniques/rules would be nice to know.  How were the points awarded?  Like a point sparring tourney where the play stops when the judges rule a hit as a point or was it a rolling clock and the judges rule the round for one or the other player.  Way back in 90 something, I judged for a tourney Tim ran and it was the rolling point thing, with lacrosse type gloves and helmets, cups and not much else.  The weapons were padded sticks(pcv pipe with insolation taped over).


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## Rich Parsons (Mar 3, 2004)

loki09789 said:
			
		

> Thanks Bob, what were the safety equiptment/padding and weapon specs for the weapon sparring.
> 
> Curious because if this type of thing takes off in the area, I might be interested in trying it out. But the specifics of regulation striking techniques/rules would be nice to know. How were the points awarded? Like a point sparring tourney where the play stops when the judges rule a hit as a point or was it a rolling clock and the judges rule the round for one or the other player. Way back in 90 something, I judged for a tourney Tim ran and it was the rolling point thing, with lacrosse type gloves and helmets, cups and not much else. The weapons were padded sticks(pcv pipe with insolation taped over).


 
Paul M,

Not sure what Tim H did use, although I know he still has the helmets (padded and gloves (padded) and ActionFlex Stixs. 

I like the style of sparring with continuous striking. I have done some impromptu sparring like this at his place with his students and guests. I enjoy it, as people can see and feel the strikes 

Best Regards


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## loki09789 (Mar 3, 2004)

Rich,

I prefer the flowing sparring as well.  I think it translates good skills over to self defense better than stopping play and awarding points.  In the real deal, continuous motion and fighting through ups and downs is more important than acknowledging the perfect strike.  Stopping when you think you have won the point, or when the judges think you  have won the point is not an idea translation.

Either way, sparring, used correctly and with the proper goals, can be helpful for student development.

Paul M


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 3, 2004)

They used Action Flex weapons, padded 'kendo' style cage helmets, gloves and foot gear.  Cups were required, shin guards and chest protectors were optional.  The judges placed a great deal of emphasis on 'light contact' during the matches.  

The matches were point  stop-n-go, not continuous.

I wanted to play but back issues have me shelved until summer... 

Next ones set to run sometime in May, with reportedly more weapon options..


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Mar 3, 2004)

The tournament was fun. 

The first event was Kata (open hand).

Second was Stick Sparring ( adults could also use the Katanna).

Then we finished with Open Hand Sparring.

The rules were simple. We would stop the action after a point was scored, like in most tournaments. The first person to reach 5 points was the winner. The equipment that was used that from http://www.samuraisports.com/ 

Next years tournament will be a two day event. 13 years and under on Saturday and 14 and over on Sunday.

artyon:  :jedi1:


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## loki09789 (Mar 3, 2004)

Renegade said:
			
		

> The tournament was fun.
> 
> The first event was Kata (open hand).
> 
> ...



What about the acceptable targeting both weapon and empty hand events, also what was the rule on sweeps,takedowns,throws, and empty hand strikes/kicks in the weapons sparring?

Fight like you train, train like you fight and all.

Paul M


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Mar 3, 2004)

Since this was a tournament we had to make it safe for the men, women and children that particapated in the event. The only way to score was to hit with the padded end of the weapon. No takedowns, sweeps, etc were allowed. This is not to say how I train in my school, this is just the limit that we were willing to go to with out endangering anyone at our event. The only parts of the body that *weren't* allowed as target were the neck, spine and groin


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## loki09789 (Mar 3, 2004)

Renegade said:
			
		

> Since this was a tournament we had to make it safe for the men, women and children that particapated in the event. The only way to score was to hit with the padded end of the weapon. No takedowns, sweeps, etc were allowed. This is not to say how I train in my school, this is just the limit that we were willing to go to with out endangering anyone at our event. The only parts of the body that *weren't* allowed as target were the neck, spine and groin



I had no intention if making a criticism or comment on your training.  I expressed a possible interest in any future event and wanted to know the ground rules for the sake of my event preparation.  Train like you fight, fight like you train was to explain my interest in the specifics so that I could train like I would need to fight (play) in the tourney, if I were to attend.

Based on the skill, age and goal of the tourney, I can understand the rules/safety consideration.

I don't think I wrote anything that could imply an attempt to cut you or your training down.


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## Datu Tim Hartman (Mar 3, 2004)

loki09789 said:
			
		

> I had no intention if making a criticism or comment on your training.  I expressed a possible interest in any future event and wanted to know the ground rules for the sake of my event preparation.  Train like you fight, fight like you train was to explain my interest in the specifics so that I could train like I would need to fight (play) in the tourney, if I were to attend.
> 
> Based on the skill, age and goal of the tourney, I can understand the rules/safety consideration.
> 
> I don't think I wrote anything that could imply an attempt to cut you or your training down.




I never said you did.


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## Northern (Mar 4, 2004)

Yes, and I was just getting the word out on all the fun things the WMAA has it's hands on.


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