# Pen Jillette. Atheist. Libertarian. Okay, now that there are some empty seats, movie time!



## Josh Oakley (Jan 11, 2012)

Alright, so, I was trying to figure a good way to hail my triumphant return to The Study after spending most of the holidays NOT developing a healthy green glow from the computer screen, and I came across this video.

I can guarantee, SOMEONE will have a disagreement with this video. And SOMEONE ELSE will disagree with THAT person.

And I'LL chime in with something that's, like, TOTALLY POIGNANT, but irrelevant to the developing conversation that has developed, because, you know, it'll reference the actual video in some way.

Then the BILLS will go at it, Tez will smack me for starting this all in the first place, sukerkin will just sit back, look cool, and say about 5 words that make everyone look like a blithering imbicile from his SHEER AWESOMENESS, Elder will bring up some esoteric bit of info that will send everyone in a tissy, and the other regulars will pop in with a comment or two about how TOTALLY AWESOME THE OP IS FOR POSTING THIS THING, Brian King will read all this and be all like, "Wow, this Josh Oakley character sure yells a lot. I'm totally glad I threw him off my trail with that cancelled class in Milton", MJS will wave the Mighty Banhammer of DOOM menacingly at the whole room.

Ultimately, Bob Hubbard's head will explode, and I'll get his job. Not running THIS gaggle of loons *shudder*. I'd get the one where he takes nudie pictures of hot girls!

I think this is a perfect plan. Who is with me?










...Oh, and I think Penn Jillette makes some really good remarks about how we would do well to refocus our thinking as Americans in the coming years.


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## Tez3 (Jan 11, 2012)

Er, I have no idea who the chap is in the video so you might have to explain before it goes any further, besides he's talking about America of which I have no knowledge! I wouldn't smack you btw it would be a RNC


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 11, 2012)

Point well taken. It WOULD be a RNC!

Penn Jillette is an American illusionist and part of the two man team of Penn and Teller. You _might_ know them from the show _Fool US_. Penn and Teller are known also for using their magic bit as a vehicle for social commentary, on specials and shows such as _Bullsh-- _(the Actual show is spelled out. 

Penn Jillette is also known for being a _ver_ vocal critic of religion of all forms, an avid libertarian, and one to step on toes.


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 11, 2012)

Actually, the last clip I posted featuring Penn Jillette was debunking Martial Arts BS.


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## Tez3 (Jan 11, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> Actually, the last clip I posted featuring Penn Jillette was debunking Martial Arts BS.




Ah that one, I have a thing about magicians, I really don't like them! It's probably totally illogical but there's something about them I find creepy, much like some people think of clowns. I never ever watch them, they make me shudder. I know, I'm weird lol but if you didn't know that before..........


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## oftheherd1 (Jan 11, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> Could you post a link to that video please?


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 11, 2012)

oftheherd1 said:


> Could you post a link to that video please?



OH YOU SO FUNNY! HA HA HA!

Now Rebut something!


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## Sukerkin (Jan 11, 2012)

:chuckles: I can't watch the video at present as works Net Nannie is very 'anti' that sort of thing {:sad face:}. 

I have to confess that I have a definite liking for Penn's 'bucket-of-water-followed-up-by-a-slap-in-the-face-with-a-wet-fish' style when it comes to assailing topics. I know that that is a bit odd, given that I much prefer to take a calmer, more rational, approach when debating something myself but I do appreciate a good 'ranter' as it's a talent I lack .

P.S. Thank you very much for the implied compliment by the way - tho' I shall be horribly self-conscious when I post for the next few days {'Englishness' has it's downside }.


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## Big Don (Jan 11, 2012)

Interesting


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## Bill Mattocks (Jan 11, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> Actually, the last clip I posted featuring Penn Jillette was debunking Martial Arts BS.



Yes, like an a-hole.  And he was totally off-base about some of it.  I was and remain highly insulted.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jan 11, 2012)

This is the first video with him in it that I've been able to sit through.  I don't agree with him on basically any of his points, but at least he was not a condescending little jackhole this time.


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## oftheherd1 (Jan 11, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> OH YOU SO FUNNY! HA HA HA!
> 
> Now Rebut something!



Rebut may be too strong a word.  I don't agree with all he says, but he kind of rambles.  He starts out talking about whether or not the State should be involved in education or if it should be religion.  He talks of the Bush years (which Bush I don't know) being considered libertarian.  I guess I need to get out more.  I never heard anyone say that before.

Then he tries to tie in the internet in as a substitution for any formal education, apparently assuming that all kids will gladly strive to get an education there, mentioning (I think) his kids as getting more education on the 'net than at their expensive school.  I would change schools quickly.  And I never assumed the net did or does provide a structured learning opportunity.  But perhaps he should apply for home schooling and just let his kids surf the 'net all day.

He is a _little_ entertaining, but I don't see much if any substance.  If this was intended to ba a joke or satire, I either don't know enough about him or he doesn't carry that off well.

Just my impressions since you asked.  YMMV


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## shihansmurf (Jan 11, 2012)

Its an odd thing for me with Penn.

I love his magic shows. He an Tellar are amazing. My wife and I caught their show in Vegas last year. They stay in the lobby after each performance doing photos with fans, signing autographs, and are both remarkably warm and approachable. Great guys.

Then there is the way in which they conduct their "investigations" on their show as well as the callous, insulting, and degrading way in which they treat those that disagree with them. I find their methods appalling enough that I find it hard to be supportive of them even when I agree with their stance.

The dichotomy is difficult to parse.

Mark


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## Makalakumu (Jan 11, 2012)

State bestowing enlightenment doesn't work.  

Education in the future will come from the web and be individualistic in nature.

People are overwhelmingly good and the state turns them wicked.

Rich people are gaming the big government system by socializing risk and privatizing profits = fascism.

Stop spending money we don't have to kill people don't know for reasons we don't understand.

Stop killing people overseas, locking up non-violent drug offenders, and giving bailouts for too big to fail corporations.

There, a quick summation of the points in the video.  I agree with every single one.


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## Sukerkin (Jan 11, 2012)

With regard to people, especially the very young, self-educating from the web:

http://www.ted.com/talks/sugata_mitra_the_child_driven_education.html


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## MaxiMe (Jan 11, 2012)

Ohh so those kids walking blindly towards my car while crossing (illegally) the street while totally focused on some electronic device are just learning. Hmm whodda thunk it.


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## Makalakumu (Jan 11, 2012)

Sukerkin said:


> With regard to people, especially the very young, self-educating from the web:
> 
> http://www.ted.com/talks/sugata_mitra_the_child_driven_education.html



You beat me to it.  This video is the revolution.  It's an example of disruptive technology in education.  It essentially breaks the paradigm and challenges just about everything regarding what we think we know.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jan 11, 2012)

Makalakumu said:


> State bestowing enlightenment doesn't work.
> 
> Education in the future will come from the web and be individualistic in nature.
> 
> ...



Well, I disagree with every single one.  Strongly.


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## Makalakumu (Jan 12, 2012)

Bill Mattocks said:


> Well, I disagree with every single one.  Strongly.



Well, that explains why you're wrong about everything!  :ultracool


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 12, 2012)

MaxiMe said:


> Ohh so those kids walking blindly towards my car while crossing (illegally) the street while totally focused on some electronic device are just learning. Hmm whodda thunk it.



Non-Sequitor. I mean, this is a pretty broad thread to start. and you still managed to bring in something that has almost nothing to do with anything. I applaud you, sir!


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 12, 2012)

Bill Mattocks said:


> Well, I disagree with every single one.  Strongly.



You disagree that there are companies who are gaming the system and benefitting thereby? Really? and STRONGLY? Or are you just taking the opposite points to Makalakumu on principle?


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## granfire (Jan 12, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> Non-Sequitor. I mean, this is a pretty broad thread to start. and you still managed to bring in something that has almost nothing to do with anything. I applaud you, sir!



:lfao:


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## Bill Mattocks (Jan 12, 2012)

Josh Oakley said:


> You disagree that there are companies who are gaming the system and benefitting thereby? Really? and STRONGLY? Or are you just taking the opposite points to Makalakumu on principle?



I disagree that *"Rich people are gaming the big government system by socializing risk and privatizing profits = fascism."*  He did not say what you just said, he said something different.  And I disagree with it.  Strongly.


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## Josh Oakley (Jan 12, 2012)

Ok I'll agree with inasmuch as Makalakamu presented it.


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## Makalakumu (Jan 13, 2012)

Bill Mattocks said:


> I disagree that *"Rich people are gaming the big government system by socializing risk and privatizing profits = fascism."*  He did not say what you just said, he said something different.  And I disagree with it.  Strongly.



The language is not precise, but it captures the theme expressed below.

http://www.naturalnews.com/034620_Monsanto_diplomats_GMOs.html



> (NaturalNews) Biotech giant Monsanto has been genetically modifying the  world's food supply and subsequently breeding environmental devastation  for years, but leaked documents now reveal that Monsanto has also deeply  infiltrated the United States government. With leaked reports revealing  how U.S. diplomats are actually working for Monsanto to push their  agenda along with other key government officials, Monsanto's grasp on  international politics has never been clearer.
> 
> Amazingly, the  information reveals that the massive corporation is also intensely  involved in the passing and regulations concerning the very GM  ingredients they are responsible for. In fact, the information released  by WikiLeaks reveals just how much power Monsanto has thanks to key  positions within the United States government and elsewhere. Not only  was it exposed that the U.S. is threatening nations who oppose Monsanto  with military-style trade wars, but that many U.S. diplomats actually  work directly for Monsanto.



This is gaming the system.

http://www.naturalnews.com/033784_GMO_animal_feed.html



> (NaturalNews) A new paper reviewing data from 19 animal studies shows  that consuming genetically modified (GM) corn or soybeans leads to  significant organ disruptions in rats and mice, particularly in livers  and kidneys (http://www.enveurope.com/content/23...).  "Other organs may be affected too, such as the heart and spleen, or  blood cells," stated the paper. In fact some of the animals fed  genetically modified organisms had altered body weights, which is "a  very good predictor of side effects in various organs."
> 
> The GM  soybean and corn varieties used in the feeding trials "constitute 83% of  the commercialized GMOs" that are currently consumed by billions of  people. While the findings may have serious ramifications for the human  population, the authors demonstrate how a multitude of GMO-related  health problems could easily pass undetected through the superficial and  largely incompetent safety assessments that are used around the world.
> 
> The  researchers, lead by French Professor Gilles-Eric Seralini, found that  nearly 1 out of every 10 measured parameters in the studies, including  blood and urine biochemistry, organ weights, and microscopic analyses,  were significantly disrupted in the animals fed GMOs. The kidneys of  males fared the worst, with 43.5% of all the changes. The liver of  females followed, with 30.8%. The report, published in _Environmental Sciences Europe_  on March 1, 2011, confirms that "several convergent data appear to  indicate liver and kidney problems as end points of GMO diet effects."  The authors point out that livers and kidneys "are the major reactive  organs" in cases of chronic food toxicity.



And this happens because the risk is socialized.  Imagine if a company like Monsanto could actually be held accountable for the damage that it has done?

Do you think they would push products that would cause so many health problems?

BTW - its just been shown that RNA from GMO passes through the digestive tract and incorporates itself into the cells of animals that eat it.  These changes alter the nature of the cells and cause abnormal growth.  This means that GMO crops cause cancer...


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