# bagua vs wing chun



## taitsechien

i started learning bagua last night... and i remember sparring with a wing chun friend of mine... and he kept backing me up... bagua seems like a perfect defense against wing chun... others thoughts on this... also is there a bagua forum some where..?


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## Flying Crane

No art is a perfect, or magical, solution to any other art or particular problem.  Every art probably has some good methods and ideas which can lead to a good solution for any situation.  It's up to you, the practitioner, to develop your skill accordingly, so you can utilize these methods and respond spontaneously and effectively against whatever an opponent throws at you.


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## Xue Sheng

taitsechien said:


> i started learning bagua last night... and i remember sparring with a wing chun friend of mine... and he kept backing me up... bagua seems like a perfect defense against wing chun... others thoughts on this... also is there a bagua forum some where..?


 
How long have you been training bagua and how long has your friend been training Wing Chun?

Bagua from my limited experience tends to not fight in a straight line it tends to very good at going around. Not that it can't go straight it can. But don't back up, avoid by moving at an angle to the attack. If you were Xingyi against Wing Chun you would tend to go straight at him using defense as attack. But this does not mean that a good Wing Chun person can't pound the living daylights out of you in the process, beleive me they can.



Flying Crane said:


> No art is a perfect, or magical, solution to any other art or particular problem. Every art probably has some good methods and ideas which can lead to a good solution for any situation. It's up to you, the practitioner, to develop your skill accordingly, so you can utilize these methods and respond spontaneously and effectively against whatever an opponent throws at you.


 
Agreed


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## JadecloudAlchemist

From what I was told if attacked on a straight line move at an angle 
If add up all the angles you come to a circle. Thus no matter which line of attack the opponent comes at your energy is always moving. Interesting note about Xing yi my teacher had me still move the foot off the line of attack.


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## taitsechien

Flying Crane said:


> No art is a perfect, or magical, solution to any other art or particular problem.  Every art probably has some good methods and ideas which can lead to a good solution for any situation.  It's up to you, the practitioner, to develop your skill accordingly, so you can utilize these methods and respond spontaneously and effectively against whatever an opponent throws at you.


i agree with you 100 percent... there isn't any perfect system... but i guess just comparing the two ideas... where wing chun is very straight forward, and bagua is very circular it seems they would control(for lack of a better word) each other very well...
i just started learning bagua and have only sparred against wing chun practitioners... so i'm only taking both at face value, more or less... it was just an interesting thought that came to me while learning the first two guas...


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## Xue Sheng

JadecloudAlchemist said:


> Interesting note about Xing yi my teacher had me still move the foot off the line of attack.


 
That is true but shhhhh we don't tell outsiders to Xingyi that it angles and turns :EG:


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## Xue Sheng

taitsechien said:


> i agree with you 100 percent... there isn't any perfect system... but i guess just comparing the two ideas... where wing chun is very straight forward, and bagua is very circular it seems they would control(for lack of a better word) each other very well...
> i just started learning bagua and have only sparred against wing chun practitioners... so i'm only taking both at face value, more or less... it was just an interesting thought that came to me while learning the first two guas...


 
Wing Chun - after about 1 year of training you can defend yourself, you are far from being a master but you can fight.

Bagua takes a bit longer as does Xingyi and taiji.


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## Flying Crane

taitsechien said:


> i agree with you 100 percent... there isn't any perfect system... but i guess just comparing the two ideas... where wing chun is very straight forward, and bagua is very circular it seems they would control(for lack of a better word) each other very well...
> i just started learning bagua and have only sparred against wing chun practitioners... so i'm only taking both at face value, more or less... it was just an interesting thought that came to me while learning the first two guas...


 
Yeah, Xue kind if hit the bullseye there.  Wing Chun, in my experience, can give you some pretty useful skills in a fairly short period of time.  Bagua is much more subtle and tricky, and can take quite a long time, even many years, before you figure out how to make it useful.  But it can be quite powerful for those who reach that level.  

I see what you are saying here, and yes, it makes sense in a way.  I guess from my perspective, I just don't think it's a fruitful approach to think of a complete system that you need to know, in order to counter another system.  You'd end up studying 100 different systems because you think you need them all to counter what you might run into someday.  But it ain't so.  If you really understand one system, you ought to have enough to deal with what life might throw at ya.  Sure, some of us study several, but for me, it's really based on perpetual personal curiosity.  Not because I think I need to to fill in holes and gaps in other systems.


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## Steel Tiger

Xue Sheng said:


> That is true but shhhhh we don't tell outsiders to Xingyi that it angles and turns :EG:


 
I think that cat might have escaped the bag some time ago. 

Bagua is a very good foil to arts like wing chun, no doubt.  Circular versus linear, constant motion versus minimised motion.  From a conceptual point of view they are somewhat in opposition, but it is up to the practitioner to make it work.

I have to agree with Xue about being backed up during sparring.  While it is the easiest route to take, it doesn't get you anywhere.  For bagua to work you need to be willing to move into attacks, and that can be a tough ask.  But it is, in fact, a common concept for all niejia.  As Xue pointed out with regards to Xingyi attack and defence become one, the same applies with bagua.  

A really good bagua practitioner should be able to make their opponent feel quite uncomfortable with changing angles and distances


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