# WTSDA vs TSDI



## Kaygee (Dec 18, 2012)

Besides the belt systems, does anyone know what the difference is between the styles of the World Tang Soo Do Association vs Tang Soo Do International?

Thanks!


----------



## bluewaveschool (Dec 18, 2012)

The people that get your money?


----------



## Kaygee (Dec 19, 2012)

Ok thanks......


----------



## dancingalone (Dec 20, 2012)

Kaygee said:


> Ok thanks......



Don't know anything about TSD International, but I am somewhat familiar with WTSDA.  Is there anything specific you want to know?  Their tournaments in the local region are usually well run and pleasant to attend.  Level of physical contact is low - a few even forbid any face/head contact at all.


----------



## Kaygee (Dec 20, 2012)

dancingalone said:


> Don't know anything about TSD International, but I am somewhat familiar with WTSDA. Is there anything specific you want to know? Their tournaments in the local region are usually well run and pleasant to attend. Level of physical contact is low - a few even forbid any face/head contact at all.



Thank you! What you said about the tournaments was something that I was looking for.
Also what I am looking for are, how much different are the forms? Does the WTSDA institute the self defense type of "Hapkido" techniques that the TSDI uses?


----------



## dancingalone (Dec 20, 2012)

Kaygee said:


> Thank you! What you said about the tournaments was something that I was looking for.
> Also what I am looking for are, how much different are the forms? Does the WTSDA institute the self defense type of "Hapkido" techniques that the TSDI uses?



As I said, I don't know anything about TSDI so I can't compare there.  The WTSDA hyung are readily found on Youtube, since they are a fairly large org as far as TSD goes.  Do a search and I am sure you'll find lots of examples from tournaments.  From my impression, they seem fairly 'standard' to me with the usual TSD adaptations to the karate kata like sidekicks and crescent kicks/blocking kicks.

WTSDA does have self defense routines.  They suffer from the same usual mix bag as with all such training drills - most studios never get past the idealized grab and stand there dumbly as the defender performs a rigid, preset response.  While the wrist locks, etc., have equivalent analogs in hapkido, jujutsu, or aikido, they frequently aren't taught with the principles that actually make them work - likely because the instructor doesn't understand them perfectly himself.  I am sure there are instructors that teach such material in a fashion I like better, but you'll have to work hard to find them.  To be fair, this is not a criticism that can be solely levied at WTSDA.  Such is life when you practice material that ISN'T your mainstay.

I hope that helps you at least a little.  I recall your posts on a few other threads...  To be clear WTSDA is family oriented martial arts.  You probably won't find the same culture as a MMA gym in the average WTSDA dojang.


----------



## Kaygee (Dec 20, 2012)

I have been studying Tang Soo Do in a TSDI school for nearly 3 years and was thinking about changing it up a bit as my school is nearly dead, but I wanted to see what the differences are because some of the schools that I am considering are WTSDA and some are TSDI. 

I just wanted to see how much different it would be because the one WTSDA school wants to evaluate my "rank conversion" if I join. I informed them that this was not neccesary and I would gladly start at white belt again, because most likely all of their material is different then what I have learned so far, but they insisted, so I will go in and see what happens.

But I like the hapkido/akido stuff that I have learned in Tang Soo Do so far and just wanted to make sure that they still taught it in the WTSDA or if it was just the TSDI that taught it!

And I agree...the actual principle behind those types of techniques are not part of learning the technqiues in Tang Soo Do....which is a shame.

Thank you!


----------



## dancingalone (Dec 20, 2012)

Kaygee said:


> I just wanted to see how much different it would be because the one WTSDA school wants to evaluate my "rank conversion" if I join. I informed them that this was not neccesary and I would gladly start at white belt again, because most likely all of their material is different then what I have learned so far, but they insisted, so I will go in and see what happens.



Start a rank appropriate to your skill.  Modesty and a desire to 'earn' your way up is commendable but honestly doesn't do you nor the studio a whole lot of good.  Everyone will be happier all around if you are recognized at a level you deserve.  As a studio owner, I would rather students wear a belt that matches their true level of knowledge and skill - that way they can be paired up with partners appropriately for both safety and efficiency.

I am sure your new studio if you pick one will let you keep whatever belt you currently have.  I have much the same policy with transfers where I reserve the right to reduce or advance students from outside as appropriate, but I've never saw things so out of whack that I felt necessary to start a transfer at a lower rank than they already possessed. 

Good luck!


----------



## Kaygee (Dec 21, 2012)

Just in case anyone ever searches for this in the future, I figured I would answer a few my own questions.

Last night, I attended a WTSDA school for the first time for a "rank evaluation". They differences I noticed are that the first three basic forms from TSDI (Gi Cho Hyung forms) are different.
In Basic Form #1 in TSDI, you throw three punches on the way up and back on your "I" formation.
In Basic Form #1 in WTSDA, you thrown three front kicks on the way up and back on your "I" formation.

The differences are for all three:
In Form #2, in TDSI, you trow three high blocks on the way up and back, in WTSDA, you throw three side kicks. 
In Form #3, you thrown three side punches in TSDI, in WTSDA, you throw three round house kicks.  

I can't remember what they call them....the "Vega" forms or something. Anyway, I kind of like that better, honestly, it adds more depth to the forms. 

I didn't get a chance to see or do them, but the instructor stated that the Pyung Ahn Forms and Bassai are generally the same the way I was taught them in my prior school.

Their one steps are a little odd as well, but I think they may be more effective, even though I always doubt the practicality of one step sparring techniques.

I will report in later when I attend another class next week. Then I make the hard decision as far as if I leave my old school to go to this new school.

Happy Holidays!


----------



## kitkatninja (Dec 28, 2013)

Cool 

Have you tried out the other Tang Soo Do International school you were talking about?


----------



## JT_the_Ninja (Dec 30, 2013)

@Kaygee: By TSDI, do you mean the International Tang Soo Do Federation (ITF)? []


----------



## JWLuiza (Jan 16, 2014)

No, not ITF. This person probably means Traditional Tang Soo Do International (Master Scott's organization). Seeing as they have trained for three years I doubt they mis-named their organization and it sounds like Kaygee is near Philly which has more WTSDA and TSDI than ITF schools.


----------



## Wilde (Oct 21, 2016)

To be honest I myself am interested in Tang Soo Do, but I need more information on the differences between the World Tang Soo Do Association and The International Tang Soo Do Federation.


----------

