# Wing Chun as you age...



## geezer (May 27, 2010)

On another thread I commented on the youthful appearance of a prominent WC Sifu. Well, though the photo I was looking at was a bit dated, one of his senior instructors responded that indeed the man is "well preserved" for his years. This lead me to reflecting on how I've returned to the practice of Wing Chun in my fifties, and how important a part of my fitness regimen it has become. Since I've returned to training and conditioning, I've lost weight and feel a good deal better, although much of this may be attributed to diet and other exercises I do as well. 

In short, my question here is, "How does Wing Chun affect aging?" Do you feel it is an appropriate activity for older individuals, or even perhaps an _extremely beneficial activity_ for older folks, similar in this regard to tai chi? And how long do you guys plan to continue practicing this art?


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## yak sao (May 27, 2010)

I've mentioned on other threads that my previous art was a southern shaolin system. After 14 bone jarring,joint stressing, muscle tearing years of that I knew I needed to find something more user friendly on the old bod.
I looked into tai chi, as a lot of aging martial artists do, but quite frankly, while I appreciated the art and am convinced of its health benefits, tai chi just wasn't "martial" enought for me. And all the tai chi schools I had seen in our area seemed to attract all the flakes..... just saying.

I found WT and it turned out to be just what I was looking for. Not just from a MA standpoint, but I was also impressed with its health benefits.

When I practiced shaolin I was in terrific shape, kind of had the 'ol Bruce Lee muscle cut thing going....actually had an 8 pack.....sigh. 
Now, at 47 years old, after 15 years of WT training, my resting pulse rate is actually lower than it was in my 20's when I was busting my **** with all that vigorous forms training.
I am totally convinced of WT's health benefits.
PS other than a little strength training by way of pullups, push ups and Total Gym, WT is pretty much my only form of exercise.

How long do I intend to practice? Till they pry my cold dead fingers off my BJD.


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## dosk3n (May 28, 2010)

Hi Geezer,

Im not in the same age range being that I am 24 but I definitly think there are health benefits. 

Wing Chun isnt the magic bullet though and you would still need more cardio and strength such as push ups and a jog every now and then to get your heart rate up while you can. As you get older power walks would be fine.

I used to practice Parkour a few years back and when I went training early in the morning you would see a lot of elderly chinese people power walking.

The main health benfit I see as you get to an older age is keeping the mind active through chi sau as well as keeping some flexibility.

Here is a quote from a health website:

"As you get older, keeping your mind active and healthy can become a big challenge. Your mental abilities generally decrease with age, particularly if your brain is not stimulated much. If your mind is not healthy and active in later life, you can have an increased chance of developing dementia (otherwise known as Alzheimer's Disease)."

As Im sure you would have heard a lot of times, WC in like Chess. Chess keeps your mind active and top notch as you age and in the same way Chi Sao would.

Dean.


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## K-man (May 28, 2010)

geezer said:


> In short, my question here is, "How does Wing Chun affect aging?" Do you feel it is an appropriate activity for older individuals, or even perhaps an extremely beneficial activity for older folks, similar in this regard to tai chi? And how long do you guys plan to continue practicing this art?


I don't think you need to restrict the benefits to just WC.  Goju karate, and I am specifying goju because I only have superficial knowledge of other styles, has the potential to provide the same benefits. All MAs work to sharpen the reflexes and keep the body mobile. True goju also contains a lot of soft techniques which prevent a lot of wear and tear on the body. From what I've seen and the way I feel, I don't think in unreasonable to continue MA training into my 80s, assuming I can survive another 20 years.


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## profesormental (May 29, 2010)

Greetings.

While Wing Chun training can affect time perception, it will not stop time from passing (yet...  ).

Fortunately, Wing Chun can be trained in ways that promote ultimate health and you can walk with dignity until they find you dead clinging to you Mook Jong. With the added benefit that you can kick serious *** no matter what.

The way Wing Chun makes your body move and accommodating for less impact with later age, you should get many benefits, which is easy to do.

Just listen to what your body says and make sure to stay healthy and challenged.

Enjoy!


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## dungeonworks (May 30, 2010)

Geezer, I personally think Wing chun is MOST EFFECTIVE for our advanced aged martial artists.  Lets face it, people don't move like they did when they were younger.  Wing Chun fills that void with soft force, efficient movement, and redirection of force and *adds some tools to fill the void that nature naturally takes away from all of us*.  Heck, I am 37 and when I spar, my eyes and brain see things that I would have not even thought of 10-15 yrs ago because I have the physical tools to:

A)  instinctively deal with them efficiently with less movement.
B)  Over power them
C)  Disconnect and regroup for my next attack/counter much faster

You see, when we are younger and fighting/sparring, we _*severely*_ overlook our abilities and rely on the physical gifts our youth provides.  As we age, this is not noticable unless we have an epiphany sparring/fighting younger fighters.  The body goes out before the mind.

I'm older and meaner now.  Remember, nothing hurts a young man worse than an a$$ whoopin from an old man!  They just seems to be more "sting" in them "old man punches"!  (I had a guy at work tell me that.....I have to agree!  ).


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## geezer (May 30, 2010)

dungeonworks said:


> Remember, nothing hurts a young man worse than an a$$ whoopin from an old man!  They just seems to be more "sting" in them "old man punches"!.



Not to mention how insulting it is to get whupped by an old guy! Personally I've found it well worth incurring aches and pains that last for weeks in return for the pleasure of beating a snotty teenager... even though _they_ heal overnight. As a small, bookish-looking high-school ceramics teacher I have occasionally challenged particularly cocky students to various physical contests, be it pull-ups, push-ups, arm wrestling or lifting a heavy janitor's broom by the handle with wrist-power alone (can you say "luk dim boon kwan"). Being sneaky, I always rig the challenge in my favor. Big heavy football player, pick pull ups. Tall kid with long arms, push-ups. Stocky kid with a strong chest, maybe go for the broom trick.

Funny, I guess the word is out. I don't get challenges much these days. I overheard one kid using almost the same words as you. He said, "Don't mess with Mr. F (as they call me) 'cause _you know he's nuts_, and worse, _he's got that old-man strength_ just like my dad!". Now I don't know the kid's dad, but I like him already.


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## yak sao (May 30, 2010)

I like the old saying: "never get in a fight with an old man, if he's too old to beat you, he'll just kill you".


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## dungeonworks (May 30, 2010)

geezer said:


> Not to mention how insulting it is to get whupped by an old guy! Personally I've found it well worth incurring aches and pains that last for weeks in return for the pleasure of beating a snotty teenager... even though _they_ heal overnight. As a small, bookish-looking high-school ceramics teacher I have occasionally challenged particularly cocky students to various physical contests, be it pull-ups, push-ups, arm wrestling or lifting a heavy janitor's broom by the handle with wrist-power alone (can you say "luk dim boon kwan"). Being sneaky, I always rig the challenge in my favor. Big heavy football player, pick pull ups. Tall kid with long arms, push-ups. Stocky kid with a strong chest, maybe go for the broom trick.
> 
> Funny, I guess the word is out. I don't get challenges much these days. I overheard one kid using almost the same words as you. He said, "Don't mess with Mr. F (as they call me) 'cause _you know he's nuts_, and worse, _he's got that old-man strength_ just like my dad!". Now I don't know the kid's dad, but I like him already.



When a young guy uses "old man strength", he is giving you respect!


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## Vajramusti (May 31, 2010)

Hey Steve and others-I have been in wing chun consistently since 1976 and I did other martial stuff before that. I am 76 years old and will be 77 in a couple of months.I don't plan to box 12 rounders or run in a 100 yard context.
My self defense skills are actually better than ever because wing chun develops skills that don't primarily depend on athleticism.

Wing chun is not only effective but it delays the ravages of time.

I teach wing chun 5 times a week in Tempe... and it's kind of the students to help me in  some things that I prefer to be lazy about- such as digging and pouting concrete  for shoring up a wall bag stand.It's for their benefit any way.

And by practicing, teaching, thinking and staying in touch with my sifu who is 110 miles down the road- I keep discovering more things about wing chun and it's applications.

I have had the good fortune in having Augustine Fong as my sifu and one of Ip Man;s best-Ho Kam Ming for my sigung.

How long will I practice?ha ha. Even when I die I expect to face the unknown with my wu sao...ready to spring into place.

joy chaudhuri
www.tempewingchun.com


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## KamonGuy2 (Jun 1, 2010)

How does wc affect aging - have a look at youtube for Kevin Chan

The guy is in his mid 40s and looks like he is 20!!!

Or of course Mr Wan Kam Leung - he is something like 75 and looks 30!!


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## Domino (Jun 1, 2010)

I would take Joy Chaudhuri's advice as this is where I would like to be on my path when I am his age.  All the benefits of personal development and muscle / tendon development.


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## dungeonworks (Jun 1, 2010)

Vajramusti said:


> Hey Steve and others-I have been in wing chun consistently since 1976 and I did other martial stuff before that. I am 76 years old and will be 77 in a couple of months.I don't plan to box 12 rounders or run in a 100 yard context.
> My self defense skills are actually better than ever because wing chun develops skills that don't primarily depend on athleticism.
> 
> Wing chun is not only effective but it delays the ravages of time.
> ...




GOOD ON YOU FOR STICKING WITH IT JOY!  You have made my list of people I aspire to be like!  That is just awesome because I know others your age that just sit and do nothing because they believe they can not.


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## Domino (Jun 1, 2010)

Agree totally with the last bit of what Dungeon said


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## turninghorse (Jun 13, 2010)

I have been thinking about this issue a lot myself lately. In my early 40's and with a succession of orthopedic issues (knees and back) to deal with. Since my need for the martial aspects is minimal ("situational awareness" seems to keep me pretty well free of physical confrontation) I have been wondering if I wouldn't be better served with Tai chi chuan with it's more "internal" focus. I stay fit with swimming and calisthenics.

Of course there's no good TCC school near me, so it's more of an academic diversion.


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## geezer (Jun 13, 2010)

turninghorse said:


> I have been thinking about this issue a lot myself lately. In my early 40's and with a succession of orthopedic issues (knees and back) to deal with. Since my need for the martial aspects is minimal ("situational awareness" seems to keep me pretty well free of physical confrontation) *I have been wondering if I wouldn't be better served with Tai chi chuan* with it's more "internal" focus.



I think this decision depends on the exact nature of your health issues. For example: I have some knee problems too, but more severe problems with my ankles ...especially the left. Bone fusions, calcification and traumatic arthritis (from old skiing accidents) make it impossible to bend my knee forward without my heel lifting off the ground. I attempted Tai Chi and was told that it was impossible to do if I could not bend my knees with my feet flat on the ground to "sink". On the other hand, while this condition also makes Wing Chun difficult, I _have_ been able to compensate. 

As far as abandoning the "martial" aspect... my lifestyle doesn't put me at a lot of risk of physical confrontation either, but the martial aspect of the art is still very important to me. Otherwise why not just go for yoga or pilates?


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## bully (Jun 13, 2010)

My back is fubar'd too. Had 2 ops and the 2nd was a fusion. Got a couple of bolts in my spine now at S1 L5. WC gives me something to help my core and my mind. 

If I met my self from the 90's now and had a punch up? My 90's self would give me a good pasting.

Would never happen though, on the way outside for the fight I would hit my 90's self over the head with a bar stool from behind.

With age comes experience


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## turninghorse (Jun 13, 2010)

One knee is pretty well arthritic now, 4 operations later. Back had one operation, but didn't hold. I've been told I "need" a fusion, but I'm going to have to be a lot worse than I am now for that.

However it does interfere with achieving a proper horse as it's best if I keep the lower back straight or slightly hyperextended rather than "tucked." The striking force transmitted through the spine either with hands or kicks is also not really good for the whole situation. 



> Otherwise why not just go for yoga or pilates?



Pilates doesn't really have the mind/body depth to it. Yoga has the same problem with Tai Chi: in my area, the teachers are really all fitness instructors rather than a true Yogi or Sifu.

I'm hoping just sticking with it, I will eventually heal, but I do wonder if consciously cultivating Qi as a primary focus would be more beneficial.


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