# Scenario sparring?



## Oni_Kadaki (Apr 25, 2021)

A few years back, when I was changing duty stations and, as a result, leaving my dojo, my Shorin-Ryu Karate Sensei arranged a special send off. Specifically, he had us get into minimum sparring gear (mouthguards, cups, and gloves), and he had me stand in the center of the room and close my eyes. He instructed my colleagues to attack me as they saw fit. The result was that I was forced to defend myself against a variety of grabs and holds with no prior warning. It was a pretty awesome exercise.

Fast-forward to the present day, my Chito-Ryu Karate Sensei was discussing kumite. He explained that we do it infrequently because, while it is a challenge and helps build some good habits, the artificial nature of it also causes us to build some habits that are bad in an actual self defense situation. It occurred to me that my sendoff from my Shorin-Ryu school seems like a good way to bridge the gap, allowing free fighting with resistance, but without the artificiality of squaring off like one would in the octagon.

Thoughts?


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## drop bear (Apr 25, 2021)

We do positional sparring a bit.


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## JowGaWolf (Apr 25, 2021)

All of the fights I've been in started as a conflict and then squared off.  I haven't been attacked from out of no where yet, and that could be due to my habit of having watchful eyes.


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## jobo (Apr 25, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> All of the fights I've been in started as a conflict and then squared off.  I haven't been attacked from out of no where yet, and that could be due to my habit of having watchful eyes.


what other types of eyes are there?


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## drop bear (Apr 25, 2021)

jobo said:


> what other types of eyes are there?



Suspicious eyes

Bedroom eyes.

I even hear there is a brown eyed girl lurking around somewhere.


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## JowGaWolf (Apr 25, 2021)

jobo said:


> what other types of eyes are there?


eyes that only see a mobile phone and nothing else.  lustful eyes that only see something sexually attractive.  Racists eyes, eyes that see things only in the context of race vs race.  Criminal eyes. eyes that only look for what they can steal.   I can continue if you still need examples

When I speak of "watchful eyes" I speak of those who tend to take in a much larger picture. Those are the ones who often have a natural tendency to protect be it a father out with the family and eyes watch with the purpose of "keeping the family safe" or a gang member looking to be aware of rivals, the police, and the well being of the game.

Watchful eyes tend to be aware of more things than those that focus on one thing.


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## JowGaWolf (Apr 25, 2021)

Not watchful eyes, in so many ways.  A blind man would have more awareness


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## jobo (Apr 25, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> eyes that only see a mobile phone and nothing else.  lustful eyes that only see something sexually attractive.  Racists eyes, eyes that see things only in the context of race vs race.  Criminal eyes. eyes that only look for what they can steal.   I can continue if you still need examples
> 
> When I speak of "watchful eyes" I speak of those who tend to take in a much larger picture. Those are the ones who often have a natural tendency to protect be it a father out with the family and eyes watch with the purpose of "keeping the family safe" or a gang member looking to be aware of rivals, the police, and the well being of the game.
> 
> Watchful eyes tend to be aware of more things than those that focus on one thing.


all that types of eyes appear to be watching things !that would make them eer watchful


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## drop bear (Apr 25, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> Not watchful eyes, in so many ways.  A blind man would have more awareness



Eye of the tiger.

Good one.


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## Buka (Apr 25, 2021)

I liked training my guys with all kinds of sparring….
And yes, there are certain drills that are questionable here, safety wise. But nobody ever got any more lumps than they did with our regular sparring. But they were a hell of a lot more fun.

A round of kickboxing at a time. Various length rounds, sometimes ten minutes.

Two on one.

Bull in the ring.

All hands.

All feet.

Subtraction Game - two guys do a round, we all point to who we thought won the round, he stays up there, new fighter steps in. New fighter picks one leg of the defending champ. He cannot use that leg for this next round. We point to the winner, new guy comes up. If the defending champ has won...the new guy picks one hand he cannot use. So that next round he only has one arm and one leg to strike with. He can block (sometimes sweep, sometimes not)

If the champ wins yet again he can no longer use the other leg. Now he can only strike with one hand. You might think that’s silly, but what it forces the fighter to do is really move, use faster footwork, escape with faster and better head movement, really STICK that jab or hook. And it’s incredibly tiring and good for endurance.

Sparing outside, in rain, in snow, on ice (which is the stupidest thing we’ve ever done….come downs to a grapple, and that sucks just as much because it’s really, really cold, especially on the hands and the back)
But, hey, we lived in New England, we got a lot of snow and ice and cold.

Under a strobe light. Insanely fun. A lot of kicks banging shins, a lot of bloody noses, a lot of hooting and hollering by the people awaiting their turn.

Tag teams.

Tag teams by just one side.

Unfortunately, I could never teach anybody how to defend themselves on stairs. I never could figure it out, or how to safely try. I could not teach, nor do, sparing in water (pool, beach etc)

I sucked in the dark, too.


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## JowGaWolf (Apr 25, 2021)

drop bear said:


> Eye of the tiger.
> 
> Good one.


Eye really don't understand people sometimes.


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## isshinryuronin (Apr 25, 2021)

Buka said:


> I liked training my guys with all kinds of sparring….
> And yes, there are certain drills that are questionable here, safety wise. But nobody ever got any more lumps than they did with our regular sparring. But they were a hell of a lot more fun.
> 
> A round of kickboxing at a time. Various length rounds, sometimes ten minutes.
> ...



We did many of the same things back in the day.  It was certainly fun to get roughed up in novel ways.  We practiced in the alley and up in the hills.  Relying on just feet or just one side was effective in teaching how to maximize performance within the given parameters.  Can you fight one handed?  With practice, aggressiveness and good footwork/body motion - better than one would think!  It actually makes you think how to adapt to this new situation and explore possibilities.  Blindfolded was a tough one.  The only strategies that worked were clinching or going so berserk no one wanted to close on you.  Most opted for the second to everyone's delight. 

The more unique (even unrealistic) situations, limitations or environments you practice MA in, the more you are prepared for the unpredictable situation that sooner or later will jump out at you.  Not that you have developed any great particular skill, but I think it develops a broader skill of not freaking out in unique situations and learning to cope even if you are at a disadvantage.


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## Buka (Apr 26, 2021)

isshinryuronin said:


> We did many of the same things back in the day.  It was certainly fun to get roughed up in novel ways.  We practiced in the alley and up in the hills.  Relying on just feet or just one side was effective in teaching how to maximize performance within the given parameters.  Can you fight one handed?  With practice, aggressiveness and good footwork/body motion - better than one would think!  It actually makes you think how to adapt to this new situation and explore possibilities.  Blindfolded was a tough one.  The only strategies that worked were clinching or going so berserk no one wanted to close on you.  Most opted for the second to everyone's delight.
> 
> The more unique (even unrealistic) situations, limitations or environments you practice MA in, the more you are prepared for the unpredictable situation that sooner or later will jump out at you.  Not that you have developed any great particular skill, but I think it develops a broader skill of not freaking out in unique situations and learning to cope even if you are at a disadvantage.



The not freaking out is what it’s all about, yes. 

Unfortunately, I still would freak out in water. Fortunately, I don’t go into the water, ever. I would never go near water unless I was with my wife, who seems to be part fish and could save anyone who was going under. The best I could do would be to drown with them.

I can’t fight well inside a car either. And I’ve trained it more than a few times.

Hills, at least steep ones, really screw me up. 

Here’s a question, for anyone really. If Kata is part of your training regime, have you done any kata on a hill? How bad does that mess you up? I imagine it might depend on which way you face to start, yes?

For grapplers, a hill must be kind of nuts I imagine. Again, probably depends on position maybe.

For strikers - doesn’t heavy winter clothing really suck? To me, it makes everything shorter. But not evenly. My footwork is screwed slightly less than my hand techniques, which messes up everything, big picture wise.

Not enough hours in the day, not enough days in a life. But we try.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Apr 26, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> Not watchful eyes, in so many ways.  A blind man would have more awareness



to be fair, they blend in quite well, and if you arent expecting one in your enviroment/have never seen one its not programmed into you.      Some people dont think foxes go into cities etc for example.


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## jobo (Apr 26, 2021)

Rat said:


> to be fair, they blend in quite well, and if you arent expecting one in your enviroment/have never seen one its not programmed into you.      Some people dont think foxes go into cities etc for example.


yes it a design feature, how quickly people can perceive,  process and react to totally unexpected danger is intresting, I'd be stood thinking a tiger! wtf, I'm seeing things,

people seem to regularly fall into quite obvious holes or walk in to obstructions on a regular route that wernt there yesterday, holes or obstructions that they may well have seen on a strange route


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## Deleted member 39746 (Apr 26, 2021)

Now replying to the actual OP.      As far as i recall, Krav maga tends to start you off with your eyes shut, so you close your eyes in what ever posture you want to emulate someone shoves you from where ever and you respond.  Granted it scales up into what you described, but i dont know if they close eyes for the circle of death or they have them open to encourage scanning.     Id imagine they arent the only ones to do this or come up with it, so as long as you punish people for mistake, so are wearing armour so they can hit you, seems decent enough.      

the main issue with it is, they need armour, saw a video on the death circle for begginers in krav maga and someone could wack the person round the head with their stick but because they wernt wearing armour they just waited.      Seen a drill in a rory miller book of effectively having people beat the **** out of you, so as long as you stay standing you dont get stomped by the swarm. For a time duration, i think up to 5 minuetes.  Granted he doesnt dictate it as a must, and says to impliment what ever rules you morally/legally need to.(as is the norm here)    dont take that as a from him wording its just a paraphrase of the drill i saw. 

I cant see why that cant work, or be impliment or variations of it in a currcilium, other places do it more often.  


Addednum: The royal marine demo team sort of does the circle thing,  but since its demos its not realstic, the signal is normally they make a sound or something, like someone picking up a stick for the stick routine would hit it on the ground as a audio cue.


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## dvcochran (Apr 26, 2021)

drop bear said:


> We do positional sparring a bit.


AKA, drills?


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## dvcochran (Apr 26, 2021)

drop bear said:


> Suspicious eyes
> 
> Bedroom eyes.
> 
> I even hear there is a brown eyed girl lurking around somewhere.


Betty Davis eyes.


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## dvcochran (Apr 26, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> Not watchful eyes, in so many ways.  A blind man would have more awareness


No, that is 100% a "stupid is as stupid does" moment. Had nothing to do with a persons eyes. If we must coin a MA moniker, she forgot or never used situational awareness; possibly her irrational anger blinded her to the Very present danger. 

Those tigers must have been hungry. The emphasis on were.


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## dvcochran (Apr 26, 2021)

Oni_Kadaki said:


> A few years back, when I was changing duty stations and, as a result, leaving my dojo, my Shorin-Ryu Karate Sensei arranged a special send off. Specifically, he had us get into minimum sparring gear (mouthguards, cups, and gloves), and he had me stand in the center of the room and close my eyes. He instructed my colleagues to attack me as they saw fit. The result was that I was forced to defend myself against a variety of grabs and holds with no prior warning. It was a pretty awesome exercise.
> 
> Fast-forward to the present day, my Chito-Ryu Karate Sensei was discussing kumite. He explained that we do it infrequently because, while it is a challenge and helps build some good habits, the artificial nature of it also causes us to build some habits that are bad in an actual self defense situation. It occurred to me that my sendoff from my Shorin-Ryu school seems like a good way to bridge the gap, allowing free fighting with resistance, but without the artificiality of squaring off like one would in the octagon.
> 
> Thoughts?


Great post.

One thing I did in advanced classes was a modified type of round robin. 
While doing static warmup/stretching I would hand out a list of 10 different attacks/scenarios and we would discuss them at length, talking about various counters and appropriate attacks. Then we would circle up into groups of 11 (one person in the middle). Each person knew their number but we lined up asynchronously so you never knew where the attack was coming from. We would usually work an attack/number for a max of 1 minute then move on. If someone was having difficulty with a counter/attack we would take extra time. No hesitancy in attack and a brisk pace. 

This can go on for as long as you wish. We had several sessions that lasted longer than 8 hours. 
Nothing like driving home at 2 in the morning after one of these sessions. Good times.


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## Flying Crane (Apr 26, 2021)

Buka said:


> The not freaking out is what it’s all about, yes.
> 
> Unfortunately, I still would freak out in water. Fortunately, I don’t go into the water, ever. I would never go near water unless I was with my wife, who seems to be part fish and could save anyone who was going under. The best I could do would be to drown with them.



says the man who lives on Maui.  Too bad I let my scuba instructor rating expire.  I would have been happy to teach you.  It’s an amazing world under there.


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## isshinryuronin (Apr 26, 2021)

Buka said:


> The not freaking out is


  Physical training becomes mental training in TMA.



Buka said:


> I don’t go into the water,


  Then it's a good thing you live on a small tropical island ???



Buka said:


> I can’t fight well inside a car either


  Survival rules say fight before getting stuck in a vehicle.  If so, I think head butts and biting would be my first tactics.



Buka said:


> If Kata is part of your training regime, have you done any kata on a hill?


  Yes.  After working graveyard shift I would take a short drive to the hills, climb to the windy top and practice bo and sai as the sun came up.   I'm getting goose bumps just writing about it.



Buka said:


> For grapplers, a hill must be kind of nuts I imagine.


  I have this vision of two guys wrapped up rolling and bouncing allll the way down.



Buka said:


> Not enough hours in the day, not enough days in a life.


  You're right there!  So much good stuff to learn.  Sad to realize I did not take full advantage of some opportunities when they were there for me.


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## Graywalker (Apr 26, 2021)

I remember back when I first started training, during sparring class our instructor would yell 'Free Fight" and would do this right in the middle of a sparring match. You would never know where the attack was coming from. 

You'd be right in the middle of a match, and then all of the sudden, be getting attacked by several people waiting their turn to spar, or even someone sparring another, in their match.

And, is where I learned how devastating a shin block could be. 
Good times...good times.


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## Buka (Apr 26, 2021)

isshinryuronin said:


> Physical training becomes mental training in TMA.
> 
> Then it's a good thing you live on a small tropical island ???
> 
> ...



Yeah, but I live Upcountry, at elevation. Course it's on the side of a volcano, so if it goes off in my lifetime, well, you know. 

I still get those goosebumps about certain things in the Arts. I love getting them.

I've always told everyone I've trained, or trained with - If I ever stop getting nervous inside before fighting OR sparring, or if I ever stop getting goosebumps from certain things in Martial Arts, I'll quit, burn my belt, and just drink vodka.

So, you know, just to be prepared, I occasionally hunt the elusive Goose de' Grey. And smoke the occasional good cigar - in case I have to signal passing ships or something.


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## Oni_Kadaki (Apr 26, 2021)

dvcochran said:


> Great post.
> 
> One thing I did in advanced classes was a modified type of round robin.
> While doing static warmup/stretching I would hand out a list of 10 different attacks/scenarios and we would discuss them at length, talking about various counters and appropriate attacks. Then we would circle up into groups of 11 (one person in the middle). Each person knew their number but we lined up asynchronously so you never knew where the attack was coming from. We would usually work an attack/number for a max of 1 minute then move on. If someone was having difficulty with a counter/attack we would take extra time. No hesitancy in attack and a brisk pace.
> ...



Thanks! I've seen similar drills before. I believe @Kemposhot does something like this by the name of "no mind's" at his dojo.

Also, @JowGaWolf , might I ask why you stayed to fight if a square-off was involved? To me, escape is usually the better option, barring a professional responsibility to stay and fight (e.g. law enforcement/military). To me, you only fight if escape for you or others (e.g. a child) is not viable, in which case you fight like life itself is on the line.


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## dvcochran (Apr 27, 2021)

Buka said:


> Yeah, but I live Upcountry, at elevation. Course it's on the side of a volcano, so if it goes off in my lifetime, well, you know.
> 
> I still get those goosebumps about certain things in the Arts. I love getting them.
> 
> ...



Very well said, Sir. 

That passion you mention seems to be getting more and more watered down or outright lost, Sans Vodka. 

Maybe it is a generational thing. Folks seem to express themselves differently these days. Somehow it is supposed to express emotion when you enter certain keystrokes on your keyboard. Never have really got that one. .Sure it expresses your intention but your emotion? 

Admittedly, it have not felt it in a while and I am not sure I can describe it but there is nothing like the feeling leading up to a tough match. Some people use the analogy of a powder keg but that never worked for me. I never 'blew up' in a split second. Instead the pressure (emotion) would build and build until it had to be released. Over time I learned how to control the release. There were several days when you had as many as three 3-minute round matches in the same day. And then had to show up the next day and do it again. Blow off all that emotion & energy in the first match and you were going home early. Great times.
For me at least, this is one of the elements of competition that Does transfer to life. 

I would say there are ineffective, overly safe, non-mental stressing tournaments that have little to no value. 
One the other side of the spectrum are matches like I mentioned above. 
In the middle is the majority of tournaments where there is varying degrees of pressure testing, both mental and physical. If they are done with enough frequency they have good, applicable, real world value. If they are only done a few time where a person never really 'gets it' they have no value at all. 
I think they can be put in the tool bag category if done to proficiency. And the variety in going to tournaments of various styles is a very great asset and just fun as hxll.


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## Buka (Apr 27, 2021)

dvcochran said:


> Very well said, Sir.
> 
> That passion you mention seems to be getting more and more watered down or outright lost, Sans Vodka.
> 
> ...



The passion, may it never go away....and maybe I'm just an easy mark....

On Saturday Night the UFC was on TV (please bear with me) there were prelims on, which I didn't watch and I'd never pay for pay per view.

There were two title fights. In one, Kamaru Usman (the Champ)  defeated Jorge Masdival (former Champ) with a laser right hand to the chin for a KO. Oh my, it was such a beautiful punch. And hours after the fight, Masdival had the classiest things to say, which to me, just makes watching these things so much more enjoyable.

In the other title fight, Rose Namajunas (former Champ) KO's Weili Zhang (Champ on a 21 fight win streak) with a text book front leg roundhouse kick to the jaw. It was beautiful. Zhang is the best woman MMA fighter I've ever see. My wife and I have been following Rose Namajunas since she started. (again, please bear with me)

A friend of mine sent us the KO's on a text. As well as to a few of our friends and students. We then spent a few hours on texts and phone calls discussing the techniques. The passion we all had discussing it was the same as the passion we had as young students of the arts. Heck, I had a forty minute phone discussion on the front leg round kick alone with a fellow fighter and that was just so much fun.

Second - I visited work last Wednesday. Been out since the pandemic started. My Lt. (a good friend) wanted to introduce me to a young man who works security, that's been waiting to meet me. This kid, Paul, who's about 27, was born and raised in Tahiti. He's been boxing and competing since he was five, training and competing in Muay Thai since he was seven. He's one of the nicest young men I've met in a long while. He wants to be an MMA fighter, but doesn't know how to grapple. I'm going to teach him until he gets the basics down and then hook him up with some other people.

He's in superb shape, about two twenty, and built like a beast. My Lt sent me a vid of him shadowboxing back in Tahiti and he's quick as all hell, has nice footwork, just looks good. I wish I knew how to post it, I'd love for you guys to see it.

My point is - I'm really looking forward to training him when this pandemic is under control, both him and I are passionate about both the training and him competing.  So passion still lives!

And what you said about competing, I agree completely. And "control the release" is as good a way to put it as any.


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## dvcochran (Apr 27, 2021)

Buka said:


> The passion, may it never go away....and maybe I'm just an easy mark....
> 
> On Saturday Night the UFC was on TV (please bear with me) there were prelims on, which I didn't watch and I'd never pay for pay per view.
> 
> ...


That is awesome!! This thing is about over so I hope you guys get to lock up very soon.


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## Gerry Seymour (Apr 28, 2021)

drop bear said:


> Suspicious eyes
> 
> Bedroom eyes.
> 
> I even hear there is a brown eyed girl lurking around somewhere.


Private Eyes.


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## Gerry Seymour (Apr 28, 2021)

Buka said:


> Here’s a question, for anyone really. If Kata is part of your training regime, have you done any kata on a hill? How bad does that mess you up? I imagine it might depend on which way you face to start, yes?


Yes. Kata isn't a big part of what I do, but I find it's an interesting way to try things like this. So I've done kata on gravel a little too fast. I've done it on some hills, in crowded spaces, with impediments on the ground, on dramatically uneven ground (in the woods), in snow...

I don't think any one of those makes a major difference in my training, but all those experiments feed into my overall understanding of how the environment affects my movement. My striking footwork (for both punching and kicking) suffers more than my grappling movement.


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## dvcochran (Apr 28, 2021)

gpseymour said:


> Private Eyes.


They're watching you. 
They see your every move.


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## Buka (Apr 28, 2021)

gpseymour said:


> Yes. Kata isn't a big part of what I do, but I find it's an interesting way to try things like this. So I've done kata on gravel a little too fast. I've done it on some hills, in crowded spaces, with impediments on the ground, on dramatically uneven ground (in the woods), in snow...
> 
> I don't think any one of those makes a major difference in my training, but all those experiments feed into my overall understanding of how the environment affects my movement. My striking footwork (for both punching and kicking) suffers more than my grappling movement.


Gravel.....I had forgotten how much I dislike training or fighting on gravel. Any kind of training or fighting.


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## Gerry Seymour (Apr 29, 2021)

Buka said:


> Gravel.....I had forgotten how much I dislike training or fighting on gravel. Any kind of training or fighting.


Yeah, it's not fun. My most common place to do kata is the top of my driveway. It's pretty degraded, so there's some unevenness and a bit of exposed gravel. I could practice more in that gravel. I could.


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## dvcochran (Apr 29, 2021)

Buka said:


> Gravel.....I had forgotten how much I dislike training or fighting on gravel. Any kind of training or fighting.


As long as you are standing and in rubber soled shoes it is manageable. Once you go to the ground everything changes. It can be your ally and an offensive tool.  Ask me how I know. 

But you may be digging gravel out of your crack when is it all over.


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## Tony Dismukes (Apr 29, 2021)

Buka said:


> I can’t fight well inside a car either. And I’ve trained it more than a few times.





isshinryuronin said:


> Survival rules say fight before getting stuck in a vehicle. If so, I think head butts and biting would be my first tactics.


From my practice, BJJ is the best foundation for fighting in a car. The techniques all have to be modified, but the underlying principles come through nicely.


Buka said:


> For grapplers, a hill must be kind of nuts I imagine. Again, probably depends on position maybe.


I'm okay with grappling on a hill or with weapon sparring. Unarmed striking feels much stranger.


Buka said:


> Gravel.....I had forgotten how much I dislike training or fighting on gravel. Any kind of training or fighting.


A portion of my time learning to roll (as in ukemi, not BJJ "rolling") was on gravel. I'm not a fan. I'm glad to have the experience, but I'm not rushing out to do that again for fun.


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## drop bear (Apr 30, 2021)

Tony Dismukes said:


> From my practice, BJJ is the best foundation for fighting in a car. The techniques all have to be modified, but the underlying principles come through nicely.
> 
> I'm okay with grappling on a hill or with weapon sparring. Unarmed striking feels much stranger.
> 
> A portion of my time learning to roll (as in ukemi, not BJJ "rolling") was on gravel. I'm not a fan. I'm glad to have the experience, but I'm not rushing out to do that again for fun.



Car BJJ, by the way is a thing.


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## angelariz (May 11, 2021)

Mass attack, muay thai sparring, and bjj rolling is how my teachers prepared us for violence.


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## jayoliver00 (Jun 3, 2021)

Oni_Kadaki said:


> A few years back, when I was changing duty stations and, as a result, leaving my dojo, my Shorin-Ryu Karate Sensei arranged a special send off. Specifically, he had us get into minimum sparring gear (mouthguards, cups, and gloves), and he had me stand in the center of the room and close my eyes. He instructed my colleagues to attack me as they saw fit. The result was that I was forced to defend myself against a variety of grabs and holds with no prior warning. It was a pretty awesome exercise.
> 
> Fast-forward to the present day, my Chito-Ryu Karate Sensei was discussing kumite. He explained that we do it infrequently because, while it is a challenge and helps build some good habits, the artificial nature of it also causes us to build some habits that are bad in an actual self defense situation. It occurred to me that my sendoff from my Shorin-Ryu school seems like a good way to bridge the gap, allowing free fighting with resistance, but without the artificiality of squaring off like one would in the octagon.
> 
> Thoughts?



All the fights I've fought in the streetz (over 10) usually started with cussing & yelling; squared off. 

It's rare for Ninjas to jump you in the dark in real life. If you're walking down the street at night and people can sneak up on you like that in the first place = white belt.


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## jayoliver00 (Jun 3, 2021)

JowGaWolf said:


> Not watchful eyes, in so many ways.  A blind man would have more awareness



Uh no, that broad was just plain stupid and she got her friend killed. A freakin' tiger park.


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## Bill Mattocks (Jun 4, 2021)

Oni_Kadaki said:


> A few years back, when I was changing duty stations and, as a result, leaving my dojo, my Shorin-Ryu Karate Sensei arranged a special send off. Specifically, he had us get into minimum sparring gear (mouthguards, cups, and gloves), and he had me stand in the center of the room and close my eyes. He instructed my colleagues to attack me as they saw fit. The result was that I was forced to defend myself against a variety of grabs and holds with no prior warning. It was a pretty awesome exercise.
> 
> Fast-forward to the present day, my Chito-Ryu Karate Sensei was discussing kumite. He explained that we do it infrequently because, while it is a challenge and helps build some good habits, the artificial nature of it also causes us to build some habits that are bad in an actual self defense situation. It occurred to me that my sendoff from my Shorin-Ryu school seems like a good way to bridge the gap, allowing free fighting with resistance, but without the artificiality of squaring off like one would in the octagon.
> 
> Thoughts?


We have (rarely) done as you report, and it's good fun and I think a good training method.  It still requires restraint on the part of the tori as well as the uke or someone can get seriously injured, as I'm sure you know.  So in that sense, it is still somewhat artificial.

None of us want to injure or kill our training partners, nor do we want to be seriously injured or killed.  It takes a certain amount of skill to apply focus well enough to demonstrate the effectiveness of any given technique without doing so.  Bruises are part of the curriculum.  In my opinion, broken bones should not be.

I understand what your current sensei is saying, and I also see what your former sensei was doing.  Ultimately we each have to find our own path and work within those limitations.


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## drop bear (Jun 4, 2021)

For above. The whole is made up by the sum of its parts. So say in 5 minutes sparring there will be times squaring off but there will be times you are recovering from a barrage of strikes. 

So it is not that you are ignoring these elements of fighting  

Otherwise you take pieces of this 5 minutes session and focus on that aspect and that is scenario sparring. 

And the idea is you should be able to put together these pieces in whatever order you need.


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