# The strengths and weaknesses of 5 popular grappling arts



## Hanzou (Jun 18, 2015)

Strengths and Weaknesses of 5 Popular Grappling Arts - Black Belt

There are no words to describe the hilarity of this article. Just about everything amounts to "using dirty tricks because that dumb grappler can't adapt his sport style to the streets".

This one about Bjj is simply classic;



> His weaknesses include the fact that he usually trains and fights while wearing a uniform. Without it, he has no extra “handles” on his opponent and loses the ability to execute many chokes. His standing techniques, including takedowns and striking, are often weak.



Yeah, has this guy never heard of no-gi? Does this guy know that many Bjj schools teach about handles despite having the uniform? Even sport-oriented schools teach no-gi because many competitions are no-gi based.

Anyway, enjoy the article. If you train in one of these grappling styles, I'm sure you'll get a good chuckle from it.


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## Buka (Jun 19, 2015)

I thought it was a great article, but incomplete. I'd like to add some of my own.

*Boxing* - The strengths of a boxer are combinations and a high level of contact done at three minute intervals in all aspects of training. Therefor, one must utilize "audio signaling" or rote reaction to certain senarios.

His weakness - the bell. Audio signaling - Have a friend handy with a bell/gong app on his phone. As soon as you're losing, your buddy hits the app. The boxer will hear the gong and stop. Scenario defense - as soon as you're getting your *** kicked, fake a fall to the ground. The boxer, going on rote reaction, will immediately seek a nuetral corner. This could be blocks away, giving you ample time to escape and maybe steal his car.

*Traditional Martial Arts*. Their strengths are a dogged dedication to training in all aspects of Martial Arts and Sciences. Therefor, just before the fight starts, tell him you don't believe in Traditional Martial Arts because you read it on the internet. You will then become invisible. Try not to whistle while you make your escape so he won't hear you.

*American Karate*. Especially by an older guy. Just when he's about to come at you, hold up a finger and ask, "Hey, who did you used to be?" This will cause a pontification that could last a month. You could escape, get some food, take a nap and come back. He'll still be talking. Try not to get sucked in and listen, you could starve to death being polite.


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## elder999 (Jun 19, 2015)

Hanzou said:


> Strengths and Weaknesses of 5 Popular Grappling Arts - Black Belt
> 
> There are no words to describe the hilarity of this article. Just about everything amounts to "using dirty tricks because that dumb grappler can't adapt his sport style to the streets".
> 
> ...



He left out that many  BJJ_ studios _practice techniques from a kneeling position.....I don't like his "answers" any more than you do, though......


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## Sub Zero (Jun 19, 2015)

This is up there with Krav Maga guys who bash BJJ, Muay Thai, MMA, and any other style that is not theirs.  Always with the logic just poke your opponents eye(s) or bite them.  Because they train with rules they won't know how to handle it.  Right... except a guy with training can do the same exact things to the Krav person but with superiour skill
and experience striking and/or ground fighting to back up those "magical moves".


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jun 19, 2015)

The writter has no knowlodge about Shuai Chiao (Chinese wrestling).


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## Juany118 (Jun 29, 2016)

In all fairness the Gracies, until they started to lose in Pride fought in "all Gi" and most schools in my area, that are teaching BJJ and not MMA and BJJ have their students in all Gi.  It may be "wrong" but tradition is like a Vampire.  You need to stake it in the heart, decapitate it, burn both parts separately then spread the ashes separately and that takes time.


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## Hanzou (Jun 29, 2016)

Juany118 said:


> In all fairness the Gracies, until they started to lose in Pride fought in "all Gi" and most schools in my area, that are teaching BJJ and not MMA and BJJ have their students in all Gi.  It may be "wrong" but tradition is like a Vampire.  You need to stake it in the heart, decapitate it, burn both parts separately then spread the ashes separately and that takes time.



Rickson didn't fight in a gi during his pride days, and he definitely wasn't losing when he fought.

There's also plenty of Bjj schools that don't use gis. 10th Planet JJ is a major example.


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## Buka (Jun 29, 2016)

I trained with Rickson many times. I never once wore a gi top, just a t-shirt. Many times he did, too.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jun 29, 2016)

From a western wrestler point of view, a western wrestler may not know how to take advantage on the clothes. With clothes, you can "pull" much easier. You can use pull to set up push. This kind of "pull" training is weak in the western wrestling system.

Without clothes, this kind of foot sweep is hard to execute.


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## Buka (Jun 29, 2016)

Hanzou said:


> Rickson didn't fight in a gi during his pride days, and he definitely wasn't losing when he fought.
> 
> There's also plenty of Bjj schools that don't use gis. 10th Planet JJ is a major example.



This is how we always trained with Rickson, just t-shirts. And if you're wondering what's going on here, we tied his hands together. And he couldn't use the tie to wrap your neck or limbs.
Didn't really matter, submitted me in less than two minutes. (And if I told you how, you probably wouldn't believe it.)


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## Charlemagne (Jun 29, 2016)

Juany118 said:


> In all fairness the Gracies, until they started to lose in Pride fought in "all Gi" and most schools in my area, that are teaching BJJ and not MMA and BJJ have their students in all Gi.  It may be "wrong" but tradition is like a Vampire.  You need to stake it in the heart, decapitate it, burn both parts separately then spread the ashes separately and that takes time.



I believe you are wrong.  First of all, I have no desire at all to get rid of traditions.  Secondly, the overwhelming majority of top No GI competitors started off with the GI, and still train it heavily.  Draculino weighs on this, and a few other things, in this video.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jun 29, 2016)

What I've gathered from this article is: Punch him in the face, he will never expect that in a fight!


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jun 29, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> What I've gathered from this article is: Punch him in the face, he will never expect that in a fight!


This is why you will need to use elbow to deal with your opponent's punch during "clinch". To be able to hide your head inside your arm by raising your elbow can achieve that.

IMO, even if punching is not allowed in the grappling game, you still have to assume that your opponent may punch your head.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jun 29, 2016)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> This is why you will need to use elbow to deal with your opponent's punch during "clinch". To be able to hide your head inside your arm by raising your elbow can achieve that.
> 
> IMO, even if punching is not allowed in the grappling game, you still have to assume that your opponent may punch your head.


I completely agree, but most grappling arts will teach how to do that (my original comment was not me agreeing with the article). You should always assume the opponent knows how to punch.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Jun 29, 2016)

kempodisciple said:


> You should always assume the opponent knows how to punch.


This is why IMO the "under hook" throw is superior than others. If you can control your opponent's arms when you throw him, you don't give him any chance to punch you.


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## Skullpunch (Jun 29, 2016)

Kung Fu Wang said:


> The writter has no knowlodge about Shuai Chiao (Chinese wrestling).



To be fair, he has no knowledge about any of the martial arts he wrote about either.


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## Juany118 (Jun 29, 2016)

Hanzou said:


> Rickson didn't fight in a gi during his pride days, and he definitely wasn't losing when he fought.
> 
> There's also plenty of Bjj schools that don't use gis. 10th Planet JJ is a major example.



Yes but Royce and Royler did (if I recall).  Some even say the GI is one of the things that worked against Royce in his fight against Sakuraba.  You are right of course in that not all schools do, just there are some schools, and students, still tied strongly to tradition.  That can create bias in some people and bias can be reflected in publications. It's not some universal rule but we can't ignore that in SOME people tradition creates bias.


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## drop bear (Jun 30, 2016)

Juany118 said:


> Yes but Royce and Royler did (if I recall).  Some even say the GI is one of the things that worked against Royce in his fight against Sakuraba.  You are right of course in that not all schools do, just there are some schools, and students, still tied strongly to tradition.  That can create bias in some people and bias can be reflected in publications. It's not some universal rule but we can't ignore that in SOME people tradition creates bias.



I am pretty sure the major thing that worked against royce and sakuraba

Was sakuraba.

As far as gi goes.  There are just too many no gi fighters who train in gi to really make it anything more than an individual choice


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