# More effective combat through zones



## Thesemindz (Feb 2, 2004)

I was writing up some notes on zones for my notebook and I was trying to make a list. I have seen several different descriptions of "zones" and "zone theory." Some of the terms I was thinking about are, 

White Zone
Black Zone
Obscure Zone
Zone of Confusion
Gray Zone
Neutral Zone
Egg Zone
Zone coverage
Zone Domination


I was wondering if anyone here had anything to offer to this concept? Are there specific zones that you teach your students? What concepts related to zones do you feel are important? Do you use these terms? What definitions do you apply to them?

Some of these terms have multiple applications. Zone of confusion could be an area of convergence between techniques, sort of a "fuzzy borderline" to graft in, or it could be related to the obscure zone, reffering to parts of your environment that are undiscernable. How does this concept relate to our understanding of our environment?

I hope you can see where I am going with this. I would especially like to hear any new ideas that you may have. I know that there are many independent kenpoists out there who may be teaching something unique to their school or system, what do you teach of zones? 

Does anyone have any drills related to zones? I can think of drills that enhance our awareness of the white zone and the neutral zone. Any darkness drills would assist in our sensing the obscure zone. I suppose all the techniques contain lessons in proper zone coverage. What else is there?

Thanks for all your help on this. I hope I get alot of new ideas.

-Rob


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## kenpo12 (Feb 4, 2004)

I thought the "white zone" was for loading and unloading passengers only?


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## jeffkyle (Feb 4, 2004)

There is NO Parking in the RED Zone!


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## Rainman (Feb 4, 2004)

> Thesemindz





> I was wondering if anyone here had anything to offer to this concept?



White zone= White dot focus
Black zone= Black dot focus
Obscure zone= Obscure zones
Zone of confusion= Relative Positioning
Gray zone= Critical Distance
Nuetral zone- Out of range, within range contact penetration contact manipulation.
Egg zone- Outer rim theory
Zone coverage- Quadrant zone theory
Zone domination- Zone cancellation

All of these terms have multiple applications.  Zone cancellation has to do with your targeting and the reactions you will get when  the target is struck with enough power, at a particular angle, and so one down the list of things to understand.


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## Touch Of Death (Feb 5, 2004)

> _Originally posted by Thesemindz _
> *I was writing up some notes on zones for my notebook and I was trying to make a list. I have seen several different descriptions of "zones" and "zone theory." Some of the terms I was thinking about are,
> 
> White Zone
> ...


The only zone I can see that you are missing is the ZONE OF SANCUARY. There is a ZOS on the inside of calming the storm or on the outside as in returning the storm. Perhaps this is your white zone.
Sean


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## 8253 (Mar 4, 2004)

One zone that works really good is just hit them really hard anywhere that it hurts.


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## ArnoldLee (Mar 4, 2004)

8253 said:
			
		

> One zone that works really good is just hit them really hard anywhere that it hurts.



You gotta be careful though... in Kenpo we're only allowed to hit our opponents from the tops of their heads to the soles of their feet.    :wink2:


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## Chicago Green Dragon (Mar 4, 2004)

Hahaha unless you are in Russia.  :redcaptur

:lool:

Chicago Green Dragon

 :asian: 




			
				jeffkyle said:
			
		

> There is NO Parking in the RED Zone!


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## 8253 (Mar 5, 2004)

ArnoldLee said:
			
		

> You gotta be careful though... in Kenpo we're only allowed to hit our opponents from the tops of their heads to the soles of their feet.    :wink2:




I heard that! :btg:


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## Bill Lear (Apr 4, 2004)

Rainman said:
			
		

> White zone= White dot focus
> Black zone= Black dot focus
> Obscure zone= Obscure zones
> Zone of confusion= Relative Positioning
> ...



Zone Cancellation occurs when you put your opponent into a negative body posture through striking or contact manipulation. You might want to elaborate on Anatomical Positioning a little bit too...

(Just some extra thoughts...)  :supcool:


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## Rainman (Apr 4, 2004)

Bill Lear said:
			
		

> Zone Cancellation occurs when you put your opponent into a negative body posture through striking or contact manipulation. You might want to elaborate on Anatomical Positioning a little bit too...
> 
> (Just some extra thoughts...)  :supcool:



Yeah right.    What does targeting mean?  I thought you said Chapel had nothing to "teach" you?  Why are you using terms he is known for using?  Negative body posture was used by him on another forum many years ago and in print in a magazine.   If you are going to use anothers material give credit where it belongs instead of acting like it is your material. 

I did elaborate on anatomical positioning, maybe just over the head of an underbelt like yourself.  Read targeting again...  targeting is the cause, zone cancellation is the effect.


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## Bill Lear (Apr 4, 2004)

Rainman said:
			
		

> Yeah right.    What does targeting mean?  I thought you said Chapel had nothing to "teach" you?  Why are you using terms he is known for using?  Negative body posture was used by him on another forum many years ago and in print in a magazine.   If you are going to use anothers material give credit where it belongs instead of acting like it is your material.
> 
> I did elaborate on anatomical positioning, maybe just over the head of an underbelt like yourself.  Read targeting again...  targeting is the cause, zone cancellation is the effect.



Hey Chad,

I guess you read my post as a condescening communication... it wasn't. I think you were on the right track, and agreed with you to an extent.

As for targeting... Targeting is fine... Hitting your targets at the right angle, with the right power, at the right time and causing the reaction you desire is a little different. Doing this, and keeping your opponent in check while doing it is Zone Cancellation isn't it? (Something I think you could have elaborated on.)

I never claimed that any of what I said was my material. It looks like Ed Parker's material to me. At least, that's the system that I'm discussing.

Chapel and I haven't had problems in a while. The last time I saw him (at the homecoming camp), he and I were pretty civil to each other.

Relax, you seem a little testy. Put the coffe down, stop taking the caffine pills, and try getting a little sleep. It's only Karate.

One last thing... I don't measure a person's worth by the color of their belt. Why do you?

:idunno:


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## Dark Kenpo Lord (Apr 4, 2004)

Rainman said:
			
		

> Yeah right.  What does targeting mean? I thought you said Chapel had nothing to "teach" you? Why are you using terms he is known for using? Negative body posture was used by him on another forum many years ago and in print in a magazine. If you are going to use anothers material give credit where it belongs instead of acting like it is your material.
> 
> I did elaborate on anatomical positioning, maybe just over the head of an underbelt like yourself. Read targeting again... targeting is the cause, zone cancellation is the effect.


Man, you can sure be a real *** can't you?   Underbelt, you're all underbelts.   Take the blinders off and see things for what they are Jr.

Dark Lord


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## Brother John (Apr 5, 2004)

Dark Kenpo Lord said:
			
		

> Man, you can sure be a real *** can't you?   Underbelt, you're all underbelts.   Take the blinders off and see things for what they are Jr.
> 
> Dark Lord


I'm afraid that this over-inflated sense of self is getting way to common around those in the art I love. Gotta watch myself for it too I suppose.

I generally find that those who talk about what others can or can't do, can or can't understand based on what rank they are or aren't.... just displayed their own ignorance & arrogance.
Too bad, cuz sometimes he has some good things to say/share.

Your Brother
John


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## Bill Lear (Apr 5, 2004)

Brother John said:
			
		

> I'm afraid that this over-inflated sense of self is getting way to common around those in the art I love. Gotta watch myself for it too I suppose.
> 
> I generally find that those who talk about what others can or can't do, can or can't understand based on what rank they are or aren't.... just displayed their own ignorance & arrogance.
> Too bad, cuz sometimes he has some good things to say/share.
> ...



We all get our undies tied in a knott sometimes. I must have done something bad to Chad that i don't remember. For what it's worth... I'm sorry.
:asian:


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## Doc (Apr 5, 2004)

Bill Lear said:
			
		

> We all get our undies tied in a knott sometimes. I must have done something bad to Chad that i don't remember. For what it's worth... I'm sorry.
> :asian:



Hey Billy, What's up dude? I see you were listening when I gave you that lesson a while back uh? 

The term "Negative Body Posture" emcompasses a variety of applications in SubLevel Four Kenpo, and although I coined the term like many others in SL-4, it is based on significantly advanced Ed Parker principles conveyed to me. I have had the task of writing, creating, and codifying the advanced and very specific curriuclum since the late seventies to free Mr. Parker to pursue other venues.

Your definition is correct, but essentially incomplete for the applications are far reaching. When I see you I'll share a bit with ya.


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## Doc (Apr 5, 2004)

Hey Chad. Well the hell are you? Man you're as hard to get a hold of as I am. I've been considering checking the computer to see if you're incarcerated some where. Come clean dude, are you in jail?   You can tell me. I won't mention it to anyone.


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## bdparsons (Apr 5, 2004)

Anybody remember the basics?

Height Zone
Width Zone
Depth Zone

Which of course coorelate directly to Zones of Protection and Zone Therories.

If you haven't got a handle on those, everything else is irrelevant.

Pardon me while I "zone-out".

Respects,
Bill Parsons
Triangle Kenpo Institute


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## Bill Lear (Apr 5, 2004)

bdparsons said:
			
		

> Anybody remember the basics?
> 
> Height Zone
> Width Zone
> ...



And we can't forget the forth zone... THE TWILIGHT ZONE. Ha ha ha!
 %-}


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## Rainman (Apr 9, 2004)

Doc said:
			
		

> Hey Chad. Well the hell are you? Man you're as hard to get a hold of as I am. I've been considering checking the computer to see if you're incarcerated some where. Come clean dude, are you in jail?   You can tell me. I won't mention it to anyone.



No way.  I am a law abiding citizen   Give you a ring again soon for a visit!

*I must have done something bad to Chad that i don't remember. For what it's worth... I'm sorry.*

That's cool Billy, I appreciate that. :asian:


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