# Bruce Lee Rushed It



## PhotonGuy (Jan 11, 2019)

No, Bruce Lee didn't really rush it but lets just say he did learn and develop amazing knowledge and skill in the martial arts in the 32 years he had. He did put in lots of time, lots of hours per day, so you could say he learned more in less years than most people.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jan 11, 2019)

What's your point?


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## drop bear (Jan 11, 2019)

Is his development more impressive than your average full time fighter? Say Kit Dale who was a bjj black belt in 4 years.


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## frank raud (Jan 11, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> No, Bruce Lee didn't really rush it but lets just say he did learn and develop amazing knowledge and skill in the martial arts in the 32 years he had. He did put in lots of time, lots of hours per day, so you could say he learned more in less years than most people.


  Surely there is a point to this. Either he rushed it or he didn't. How about you decide what your thoughts are before you commit them to pixels?


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## Headhunter (Jan 12, 2019)

Okay....so as others have said is there a point to this or is this just a Bruce Lee fanboy post?


Personally I'm a Bruce Lee fan...the guy was in great shape and did some above average movies. But I'm also not obsessed with him and think he could beat everyone on earth like some people. He was a human being and he could be beaten like everyone else. Also there's no legit proof how well he could fight. He obviously had great skill, speed, accuracy and knowledge. But there's more to being a fighter than that. Could he take a punch? Could he carrying on fighting at his best level after getting tired, could he adapt his style If his game plan wasn't working. Could he handle a weight cut and fight well after dehydrating his body. Could he deal with the mental pressure of fighting in front of a crowd.

Those are things pro fighters deal with. Things that he never proved. And there's no shame in that he preferred acting and teaching. There's no problem with that. Not everyone's a fighter. He didn't want to step in a ring that's his choice doesn't take away his skills but you also can't call him the best fighter ever


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## Martial D (Jan 12, 2019)

Hmm. That's two utterly ridiculous OPs by longtime members today.

 I wonder if Bruce Lee would have learned faster or slower with 4 arms? Maybe that can be a post.


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## Headhunter (Jan 12, 2019)

Martial D said:


> Hmm. That's two utterly ridiculous OPs by longtime members today.
> 
> I wonder if Bruce Lee would have learned faster or slower with 4 arms? Maybe that can be a post.


Maybe if he hadn't died after 32 years he would've learned more damm quitter


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## Gerry Seymour (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Is his development more impressive than your average full time fighter? Say Kit Dale who was a bjj black belt in 4 years.


Probably more than the average full-time fighter, but not any more impressive than some (probably including Kit Dale).

Back to what I think the OP's point was, we sometimes find ourselves telling people "don't rush it - take your time". But is there really anything wrong with moving fast...if you can? Should Kit Dale (or Bruce Lee) have spent more time at their beginner and intermediate level, rather than "rushing" to become more advanced? (Notice I didn't say rushing for rank, nor rushing for more advanced material.) If someone can advance their ability and knowledge faster than what's "normal", and has the desire to do so, they should charge ahead.

The caution we usually give, though, is because most of us have seen many more people who thought they could go really fast, and just ended up missing the point of the training, never really developing any understanding or skill. (The extreme of this is the person with no experience who says they're going to go to Japan and train 8 hours a day for 2 years to master an art they just heard of.)


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## hoshin1600 (Jan 12, 2019)

My opinion is Bruce didnt rush anything. he just spent more dedicated hours to it then the average person would be willing to do and he was better then a lot of people too.  you would never hear the same kind of comment about Tiger Woods.  _"oh i think tiger should have gone slower learning golf, he should have spent 3 years just learning mini golf before moving on the real golf, then just focus on putting for the next 10 years to make sure he really understood what he was doing" 
_


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## Gerry Seymour (Jan 12, 2019)

hoshin1600 said:


> My opinion is Bruce didnt rush anything. he just spent more dedicated hours to it then the average person would be willing to do and he was better then a lot of people too.  you would never hear the same kind of comment about Tiger Woods.  _"oh i think tiger should have gone slower learning golf, he should have spent 3 years just learning mini golf before moving on the real golf, then just focus on putting for the next 10 years to make sure he really understood what he was doing" _


I think that was the OP's point.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Is his development more impressive than your average full time fighter? Say Kit Dale who was a bjj black belt in 4 years.


What was Kit Dale's training regimen? How many hours per day and days per week did he put into his training?


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

frank raud said:


> Surely there is a point to this. Either he rushed it or he didn't. How about you decide what your thoughts are before you commit them to pixels?


The point is that I don't think he rushed it but what some people consider "rushing" by their definition it would mean he did, developing all the knowledge, skill, and ability in just 32 years.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I think that was the OP's point.


Yes, sort of.


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## drop bear (Jan 12, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> What was Kit Dale's training regimen? How many hours per day and days per week did he put into his training?



Pretty much full time I think.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Pretty much full time I think.


Full time, so that would mean 8 hours a day five days a week, after all that is what your full time work load for a job is. So are you saying that's how much Kit Dale trained?


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## drop bear (Jan 12, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> Full time, so that would mean 8 hours a day five days a week, after all that is what your full time work load for a job is. So are you saying that's how much Kit Dale trained?



We have training from 6am to about 7:30 and then 5pm to about 8:30pm.

7am Saturday
And guys have a running club they do Sunday.

So about 27 hours a week.
A good jujitsu club will offer about the same. And competitive guys will do those hours on top of their job generally.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> And competitive guys will do those hours on top of their job generally.


For some, actually for lots of those competitive guys, training *is* their job.


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## drop bear (Jan 12, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> For some, actually for lots of those competitive guys, training *is* their job.



Not that much. Fight sports generally don't pay that well.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> We have training from 6am to about 7:30 and then 5pm to about 8:30pm.
> 
> 7am Saturday
> And guys have a running club they do Sunday.
> ...


Alright, so if a person trains 27 hours a week with approximately 50 weeks in a year that would mean they would train about 1350 hours a year. They get a black belt in four years so when you multiply 1350 by four you get 5400 so it takes them about 5400 hours to get a black belt. 

Now lets say somebody else gets a black belt in ten years which is more or less the average length of time it takes to get a BJJ black belt. Lets say they train five days a week for two hours each day and from time to time they might do an extra day and/or extra hour of training. If you do the math that's about how much a person would have to train to be able to do 5400 hours in ten years. 

So, the point is this, in the first example it took a BJJ practitioner 4 years to get a black belt. In the second example it took a BJJ practitioner 10 years to get a black belt. Yes you can say in the first example the practitioner got a black belt sooner than in the second example since 4 years is obviously less than 10 years but the fact remains in both cases it took 5400 hours. Although the practitioner got the black belt sooner in the first example they didn't rush it since they spent just as much time as the practitioner in the second example, 5400 hours. Therefore the practitioner in the first example did not rush it. 5400 hours is 5400 hours whether its spread out over four years or ten years. 

Trying to get the same results of 5400 hours of training in say, just 1000 hours that's rushing it. Training for 5400 hours in four years instead of ten is not.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Not that much. Fight sports generally don't pay that well.


Boxing does, if you're a top champion. Back in his heyday Evander Holyfield could lose a fight and still make $40 million just for being in the fight. If he were to win he would make even more. 

But aside from that a fighter might make passive income.


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## drop bear (Jan 12, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> Boxing does, if you're a top champion. Back in his heyday Evander Holyfield could lose a fight and still make $40 million just for being in the fight. If he were to win he would make even more.
> 
> But aside from that a fighter might make passive income.



I have a mate who fought in the UFC. And it wound up costing him money.


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## Headhunter (Jan 12, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> Boxing does, if you're a top champion. Back in his heyday Evander Holyfield could lose a fight and still make $40 million just for being in the fight. If he were to win he would make even more.
> 
> But aside from that a fighter might make passive income.


Yeah and for every big money champion how many small time guys are fighting for absolutely nothing. A lot more than there are big money guys


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## Gerry Seymour (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> I have a mate who fought in the UFC. And it wound up costing him money.


See? Competition is bad for you.


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## drop bear (Jan 12, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> See? Competition is bad for you.



He did it so that he could develop as a person. Because MMA is about developing your spiritual side.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jan 12, 2019)

drop bear said:


> He did it so that he could develop as a person. Because MMA is about developing your spiritual side.


Bah, we all know you MMA people are just beasts. He just wanted to hit people, so he could feel safe. That's why he...um, got in a fight with another big bloke?? Or something like that.

You MMA people don't even make sense, man.

STREET!


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## drop bear (Jan 13, 2019)

Seemed applicable.


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## Flying Crane (Jan 14, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> Alright, so if a person trains 27 hours a week with approximately 50 weeks in a year that would mean they would train about 1350 hours a year. They get a black belt in four years so when you multiply 1350 by four you get 5400 so it takes them about 5400 hours to get a black belt.
> 
> Now lets say somebody else gets a black belt in ten years which is more or less the average length of time it takes to get a BJJ black belt. Lets say they train five days a week for two hours each day and from time to time they might do an extra day and/or extra hour of training. If you do the math that's about how much a person would have to train to be able to do 5400 hours in ten years.
> 
> ...


There is a risk in training too intensively, however.  If you don’t take time to let your body recover, then you risk injury as well as mental exhaustion/boredom/burnout.  

There is also something to be said about taking enough time to let the lessons sink in.  Your brain needs time to process the information.  

So if your 5400 hours is actually realistic, then cramming them all into the shortest possible timeframe may not be the best approach to training.  Just what is optimal may vary from person to person and probably cannot be objectively determined.  But it is definitely something to keep in mind.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 15, 2019)

Flying Crane said:


> There is a risk in training too intensively, however.  If you don’t take time to let your body recover, then you risk injury as well as mental exhaustion/boredom/burnout.
> 
> There is also something to be said about taking enough time to let the lessons sink in.  Your brain needs time to process the information.
> 
> So if your 5400 hours is actually realistic, then cramming them all into the shortest possible timeframe may not be the best approach to training.  Just what is optimal may vary from person to person and probably cannot be objectively determined.  But it is definitely something to keep in mind.


You got a point there about physical recovery although when it comes to mental exhaustion or boredom or burnout that would not be the case for somebody who really has the passion for the martial arts such as Bruce Lee. Heck I don't think Bruce Lee even had much of a problem with physical burnout.

As for the brain processing information, just look at some of those college students studying for advanced degrees. I've got a cousin who got both an MD and a PhD at the same time and all he did was study and eat and sleep and maybe exercise enough to stay in shape and would take the occasional 15 minute break at the video arcade. 

Anyway, the average work week is 8 hours a day 40 hours a week, more than the 27 hours a week of training that was discussed in this thread.


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## drop bear (Jan 15, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> You got a point there about physical recovery although when it comes to mental exhaustion or boredom or burnout that would not be the case for somebody who really has the passion for the martial arts such as Bruce Lee. Heck I don't think Bruce Lee even had much of a problem with physical burnout.
> 
> As for the brain processing information, just look at some of those college students studying for advanced degrees. I've got a cousin who got both an MD and a PhD at the same time and all he did was study and eat and sleep and maybe exercise enough to stay in shape and would take the occasional 15 minute break at the video arcade.
> 
> Anyway, the average work week is 8 hours a day 40 hours a week, more than the 27 hours a week of training that was discussed in this thread.



Yeah. You definitely can train like a beast and get results.

And diligence really seems to be the secret to success.


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## Steve (Jan 15, 2019)

I think it’s a good thing he rushed it.  He died so young, he didn’t have much time to spare.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jan 15, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Yeah. You definitely can train like a beast and get results.
> 
> And diligence really seems to be the secret to success.


Assuming the body is recovering, no excessive injuries, etc., there's a real benefit to compressing the timeframe. You get more exercise, discipline, and toughness from the same total hours when you compress them into fewer days. Like the fight camp you guys do.


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## PhotonGuy (Jan 16, 2019)

Steve said:


> I think it’s a good thing he rushed it.  He died so young, he didn’t have much time to spare.


All the more reason to get done what you can when you can and not take any longer than you have to, you've only got so long to live and you don't know beforehand when you're going to go.


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## StellarAevum (Jan 21, 2019)

PhotonGuy said:


> No, Bruce Lee didn't really rush it but lets just say he did learn and develop amazing knowledge and skill in the martial arts in the 32 years he had. He did put in lots of time, lots of hours per day, so you could say he learned more in less years than most people.



I do not understand why this post was made.

You are making the claim that Bruce Lee learned more in less years than most people and you say he did not really rush it. Additionally, you made the title of the post be "Bruce Lee rushed it".

So you are making a general statement that does not seem to have be capable to open any discussion and you, admittedly, used a misleading title. 

Maybe if you re-word your opening statement into a question we may have more to work with to create a meaningful discussion?

Thanking you for your time,

Aevum


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## NYFIGHTSOURCE (Feb 1, 2019)

I will lend my thoughts based on talking to some of Bruce Lee's students and friends.   

Bruce was an extremely driven man.   He took things like the self confident formula...or definite chief aim and wrote himself letters of his goals he wanted to achieve.   If you google search on just these terms you will see reference to Bruce even though they are not a Martial arts web site.   Cause Bruce was driven.   Driven to be an Asian actor, have money, and also a great martial artist.

As a kid growing up he was driven to excel in martial arts.   Even showing up to Wing Chun class ahead of other students to tell the other students that class was canceled so he could privately train.   He would purposely wear odd clothing in the streets to invoke fights with bully's so he could test his skill.  His fighting made his parents relocate him to the US so he wouldn't be imprisoned.

Friends of his/students has personally told me about his watching reels and reels of Ali within a 2 week period to work on western boxing.   He slept, ate, breathed Martial Arts all the time.   He trained his body, his mind.   Who throws 500/600 jabs a day with each hand.   Who runs 5 miles a day.   Who then finishes up on a stationary bike after the 5 mile run.   Lifting and isometric workouts.
He was a machine.   

I have heard stories where he would be on his back on the floor.   He was lifting his legs off the floor for an ab work out.... Brandon on his stomach and bouncing him as a baby.   Hand weights doing arm workouts.... while watching a martial arts on tv... or reading a book that was propped up.    The guy was nuts.   

Did he rush it?   Yeah... in one sense I say yes.   I think he probably never had down time.   His body could handle it.   I think mentally he was stressed at times.   So consumed with fame and being at a higher level.    He probably didn't have a lot of time to smell the roses.     But.... I think he progressed rapidly cause of his amount of dedication.    Yes... probably not a good balance for him.

Me personally.... I know that in my training.... I have at points in my life been able to dedicate more time than what my instructor held for class when I was initially learning JKD.    Class was suppose to be 2x a week.   But my Sifu let me join in other classes.   At times I was training 4x a week... plus staying after class to train with him privately and be his training partner.   In addition I also invited students from class to my house on the weekend and we would train again for 2-3 hrs what we did in class that week.   When my schedule allowed this time... I learning and ability rocketed.    Was it too fast?   Nope.   not for me.   And I would personally think that Bruce was constantly doing this... and it wasn't too fast for him.   Maybe too fast cause he didn't have down time.

My two cents based on my own opinions formulated from training and talking to many of Bruce's students.


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