# Is silat harder or easier to learn than wing chun?



## kehcorpz (Jun 13, 2016)

How many techniques are there in silat?

I noticed that in wing chun there are very many different blocking techniques.
If you want to learn them all you probably need many years. But I also don't know
if you really need them all or if you could also get along with just a few techniques.

Anyway, how is this in silat? Do they also have dozens of different arm deflections and
stuff like that? If yes, do you have to master them all in order to effectively use silat
for self defense or would knowing just a handful of them already be enough?

Personally I'd rather focus on fewer techniques and try to learn them instead of having like
50+ techniques and then not even being able to decide which one to use if somebody attacks
me. :/


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## Dirty Dog (Jun 13, 2016)

Looks like you're doing an outstanding job then, since given your posting history, it would appear that so far you're focusing on exactly zero techniques.
Get off the computer, go find a school, and actually do some training.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 13, 2016)

but before i can even start to train something i first have to decide what's best! that's my issue right now


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## Dirty Dog (Jun 13, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> but before i can even start to train something i first have to decide what's best! that's my issue right now



No, that isn't your issue. Not at all. Not even close.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 13, 2016)

then what's my issue?


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## Dirty Dog (Jun 13, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> then what's my issue?



Well, your *** seems to be vacuum sealed to your chair, and as a result you don't actually do ANY training.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 13, 2016)

No that's not it. I am simply uncertain about pretty much everything which makes it really hard for me to make decisions.


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## Blindside (Jun 14, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> No that's not it. I am simply uncertain about pretty much everything which makes it really hard for me to make decisions.



In one of the systems I studied one of the terms of "analysis paralysis," this is what you are doing now.  Go try some classes, you are just spinning your wheels right now, and you could have started two months ago.


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## drop bear (Jun 14, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> No that's not it. I am simply uncertain about pretty much everything which makes it really hard for me to make decisions.



What do you think the worst case scenario would be?


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## kehcorpz (Jun 14, 2016)

The worst scenario would be having to sign on for something for 12 month (which is common practice where I live) and then noticing that I made the wrong decision.


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## geezer (Jun 14, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> The worst scenario would be having to sign on for something for 12 month (which is common practice where I live) and then noticing that I made *the wrong decision*.



No, in your case, that would_ not _be the "wrong decision". After a year of training, even in a system you decided you didn't like, guess what.... you'd actually _*know*_ something!!!! Then you'd make a more informed choice about what and where to study next.

If I hadn't gotten involved in Wing Chun and Escrima, Maybe I would have spent my time doing BJJ, or HEMA. Silat is definitely cool, but harder to find. Aikido? Maybe not as practical in some ways, but also really cool in other ways. Any one of them, and dozens of others would have been awesome! _Dude, _ if you find a good school, YOU CAN'T LOSE! 

Even if you choose a bad school, you will learn _something_, and then know what to look for in a good school. Or you can keep on dithering, and start seeming _really pathetic._

Of course you've already been told this, many times by some forum members that know a lot more than me. And I've been doing this stuff a while myself ...like since the 70's!
So _get on with it._ If you really can't manage that, maybe you should get some counseling ....because frankly you don't seem to have it together right now. Good luck.


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## Dylan9d (Jun 15, 2016)

In addition to what geezer posted, get some links up from the schools near you and then we can help a bit better.

Im a Silat guy, and I couldn't get used to the postures in Ving Tsun, it would probably be same way around if I were practising Ving Tsun for a longer time.


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## drop bear (Jun 15, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> The worst scenario would be having to sign on for something for 12 month (which is common practice where I live) and then noticing that I made the wrong decision.



Then in 12 months you would at least know what the right decision was. 

Took me more than a year.


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## geezer (Jun 15, 2016)

Dylan9d said:


> Im a Silat guy, and I couldn't get used to the postures in Ving Tsun, it would probably be same way around if I were practising Ving Tsun for a longer time.



I'm told the term Silat is very broad, so I don't know if what you do is anything like this, but the _standing _postures this guy does in the middle section of this clip seem _a lot _like Wing Chun to me. The silat punches shown are very different, far more whipping and circular than the basic straight-line WC punch. But the elbows look very familiar to me as a WC guy.

Now the crouching groundwork is quite different, but very like the nasty stuff my DTE Eskrima coach likes to do to me. Not something my old knees can handle, but very, very cool. I really like the way the demonstrator always looks so cool and relaxed, like an Indonesian gentleman casually crouching down for a moment's rest and conversation ...all the while his opponent, as though by pure happenstance, is being torqued into a screaming pretzel! Gotta love it.


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## Dylan9d (Jun 15, 2016)

geezer said:


> I'm told the term Silat is very broad, so I don't know if what you do is anything like this, but the _standing _postures this guy does in the middle section of this clip seem _a lot _like Wing Chun to me. The silat punches shown are very different, far more whipping and circular than the basic straight-line WC punch. But the elbows look very familiar to me as a WC guy.
> 
> Now the crouching groundwork is quite different, but very like the nasty stuff my DTE Eskrima coach likes to do to me. Not something my old knees can handle, but very, very cool. I really like the way the demonstrator always looks so cool and relaxed, like an Indonesian gentleman casually crouching down for a moment's rest and conversation ...all the while his opponent, as though by pure happenstance, is being torqued into a screaming pretzel! Gotta love it.



No, Ving Tsun I experienced and the Silat I practised are very different in execution but I didn't practised VT long enough to see similar principles or tactics. The guy in the video is a student from Maul Mornie, I think Maul Mornie has alot of interesting stuff and it is alot like the stuff im doing nowadays.

Silat and Eskrima are way closer to eachother.

I also do the pretzel stuff sometimes to my students and they love it


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## Juany118 (Jun 17, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> No that's not it. I am simply uncertain about pretty much everything which makes it really hard for me to make decisions.



Do what I did.  In the end it's not just the Art, it's the teacher.  Send emails.  The ones who respond are worth trying.  Most recent teachers let you sit in or try for a class or two.  Get a feel for it.  If it fits it fits.  Even 1000 different techniques can feel easy if everything fits.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 17, 2016)

Can it be that in silat they use the elbows much more to defend and hit?

I emailed different schools just to ask a few questions and some didn't even reply. They're off my list now.


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## geezer (Jun 17, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> Can it be that in silat they use the elbows much more to defend and hit?
> 
> I emailed different schools just to ask a few questions and *some didn't even reply.* They're off my list now.



_That _(the bolded section above) is understandable.  Maybe they are too busy teaching students who actually show up and commit to training than some guy emailing them and wasting their time.


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## Juany118 (Jun 17, 2016)

geezer said:


> _That _(the bolded section above) is understandable.  Maybe they are too busy teaching students who actually show up and commit to training than some guy emailing them and wasting their time.



believe it or not I only had one school that didn't reply.  That being said the content of any written communications matters.  Mine basically said (short form) 

"I am a Veteran and police officer with X years experience.  I have formal training in Olympic Foil and Saber fencing, Aikido and Ryushinkan Karate.  I wish to begin formal training again but with a focus on the Art being applicable to modern police work in a high crime area, does your school address such a concern?"

a precise question on a point like that tends to get an answer, generic questions, not so much.


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## geezer (Jun 17, 2016)

Juany118 said:


> believe it or not I only had one school that didn't reply.  That being said *the content of any written communications matters. *



Yes content matters. I'd absolutely take the time to respond to an inquiry like yours. To the kinda stuff _Kehcorpz_ is going on about... meh.


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## Juany118 (Jun 18, 2016)

geezer said:


> Yes content matters. I'd absolutely take the time to respond to an inquiry like yours. To the kinda stuff _Kehcorpz_ is going on about... meh.



As you are am instructor, and correct me if I am wrong, there is a difference between sounding like an informed person with a specific purpose and someone who, at least appears whether they really are or not, on a fishing expedition.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 18, 2016)

You don't even know what my email looked like!
I only asked a few questions and even separated them in 1,2,3,4... so that answering would be easier.
If they don't feel like they have to reply to such an email then I'm not going there. I think I'll also write
them another email telling them how displeased I am and that I've already crossed their facility from
my list.


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## Tames D (Jun 18, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> You don't even know what my email looked like!
> I only asked a few questions and even separated them in 1,2,3,4... so that answering would be easier.
> If they don't feel like they have to reply to such an email then I'm not going there. I think I'll also write
> them another email telling them how displeased I am and that I've already crossed their facility from
> my list.


Instead of emailing them, try showing up at their door. They will be happy to answer all your questions in person. Trust me.


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## Juany118 (Jun 18, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> You don't even know what my email looked like!
> I only asked a few questions and even separated them in 1,2,3,4... so that answering would be easier.
> If they don't feel like they have to reply to such an email then I'm not going there. I think I'll also write
> them another email telling them how displeased I am and that I've already crossed their facility from
> my list.



That is a problem though man.  E-mails are easy to write in this day in age.  Taking that into account stop and think.  Most Martial Arts schools are not a full time affair.  The person answering that email has a "day job", a family and THEN teaches Martial Arts in most cases.  If you do not have a laser focus on why you want to learn martial arts first and then (perhaps) a diagnosed physical limitation you are unlikely to get a response. Not saying whether it is right or wrong but they do not want "1, 2, 3, 4", via email, if you want a response, you need to say "Hi I am bob, I want to learn martial arts for reason 1 is that your philosophy?"  If you have physical limitations I would add that in, however the more questions you ask the more it sounds like a "form letter" and that reduces responses in almost any venue.


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## kehcorpz (Jun 18, 2016)

My email was friendly and I was just asking a few valid questions. I wrote that I want to learn some kind of SD but I'm not sure yet and 
I asked if their stuff is practical and if they can comment on differences between their stuff and other stuff like wing chun,krav maga and so on.
I told them I got different advice from different people and that bc of this I'm uncertain what's best.

All normal questions. When they don't reply it simply means they suck and don't care about customers.


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## Tames D (Jun 18, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> My email was friendly and I was just asking a few valid questions. I wrote that I want to learn some kind of SD but I'm not sure yet and
> *I asked if their stuff is practical* and if they can comment on differences between their stuff and other stuff like wing chun,krav maga and so on.
> I told them I got different advice from different people and that bc of this I'm uncertain what's best.
> 
> All normal questions. When they don't reply it simply means they suck and don't care about customers.


I bolded a portion of your post above. Bad question. Do you really think anyone is going to tell you their "stuff is *not* practical" and they are teaching crap even if they are?


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## Juany118 (Jun 18, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> My email was friendly and I was just asking a few valid questions. I wrote that I want to learn some kind of SD but I'm not sure yet and
> *I asked if their stuff is practical *and if they can comment on differences *between their stuff and other stuff like wing chun,krav maga and so on.*
> I told them I got different advice from different people and that bc of this I'm uncertain what's best.
> 
> All normal questions. When they don't reply it simply means they suck and don't care about customers.



This is the error.  First no teacher saying they teach a Martial (read war) Art is going to say it is impractical.  Second. teachers I know HATE comparisons to an insane degree because they see the issue in bold as "tell me if you are better than and if you are why".  Please note I am not saying that was your intent, only that the questions in bold will often be perceived that way.


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## Chris Parker (Jun 18, 2016)

kehcorpz said:


> You don't even know what my email looked like!



We know what your posts look like, and what your communication style is like. We could make a pretty good guess at your emails, frankly.



kehcorpz said:


> I only asked a few questions and even separated them in 1,2,3,4... so that answering would be easier.



As mentioned, most martial art instructors (including myself) don't teach full time. To give you an idea of my schedule, I work in retail, so I work 5 days a week, including most weekends (one Sunday off a fortnight)… and, due to the commute, I leave the house at about 7:30am most days. Mondays I'm leading a study group in Kenjutsu, meaning I get home about 10:30pm… Tuesdays I'm teaching, home about 11:30pm… same every second Friday… I also work late every second Thursday night. Then, I have my own personal training time at home, structuring classes and preparing them, writing emails to students, checking for messages, and so on… before we even start to get to any social life or family commitments.

Now, imagine I get home, and there are three emails waiting for me… one asks where and when I teach, so they can come along to watch… another asks what we teach… and then there's an email asking a series of questions, each numbered and requiring a dedicated answer. How much energy do you think I have to put into answering that one in detail? I might send a brief answer, with the message of "come along to see a class", but it might also get put to the back of the pile… 



kehcorpz said:


> If they don't feel like they have to reply to such an email then I'm not going there.



Wow, that's some sense of empathy you have there… 



kehcorpz said:


> I think I'll also write them another email telling them how displeased I am and that I've already crossed their facility from
> my list.



Kid, grow up. You've roundly ignored many messages, questions, and posts directed towards you here… maybe we should write you an email about how displeased we are that you didn't take the time to immediately respond to our questions and comments… and frankly, if that's your attitude, the school has dodged a bullet if you "cross them off your list". Honestly, if I got an email like the one you describe here, saying how displeased you are that I didn't take time out to spoon feed you answers, I'd be grateful you didn't turn up.



kehcorpz said:


> My email was friendly and I was just asking a few valid questions.



"Valid questions" from you might not be anywhere near as valid as you think they are. And as far as "friendly", again, you might not understand how you come across at times.



kehcorpz said:


> I wrote that I want to learn some kind of SD but I'm not sure yet



And what would that mean to them? A noncommittal question about an area you might want to focus on but you might not? What?



kehcorpz said:


> and I asked if their stuff is practical and if they can comment on differences between their stuff and other stuff like wing chun,krav maga and so on.



Besides the lack of interest in comparisons to other arts, you also have to realise that most martial artists, instructors and students alike, are aware and knowledgable (to a degree) about their own system… not necessarily about any others. It's a real rare breed that has a wider perspective, so asking an instructor how their system compares with one they've never studied or possibly even heard of is frustrating to them in the extreme.



kehcorpz said:


> I told them I got different advice from different people and that bc of this I'm uncertain what's best.



You're uncertain because you have no frame of reference… the solution? Get to a damn school already and start!



kehcorpz said:


> All normal questions.



From your limited and completely inexperienced viewpoint. You may understand that we, having been involved in this for years, decades even, have a different view of the "normal questions" you present here and in your email.



kehcorpz said:


> When they don't reply it simply means they suck and don't care about customers.



Crap, son. It means that your email wasn't answered. It doesn't give you the reason, and it doesn't give you any reason to make any such comments about them. 

Once again, if this is your attitude, grow the hell up. You're acting like a spoiled entitled brat.


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## crazydiamond (Jun 23, 2016)

You know many schools offer either free week trails. Or the teachers may allow you to observe from off the matts. I really think you need to go see some schools. Also for what ever M.A. you want - even the schools themselves - usually have videos of their practice.

I get a little W.C. and Silat in my marital art. Actually I get little of everything in my classes - its a blessing and a curse of  my MA. I see them as very different - I find WC to be a bit static and technical but good for energy redirection. I find Silat to have a wider range of body motion and flow and its a challenging physically from that standpoint. Also Silat has alot more take downs than W.C. so you should be okay with hitting the mat.

I spent a long while "thinking about" taking an MA - took me over a year to decide I did want the right art and the right school.My goals were specific so it made it a bit easier to choose what I wanted. I was also very out of shape  at the time - and I felt I wanted to get in basic shape first - so I did that (working out)  and was ready for the physical demands of my school when I showed up. Lastly, taking a MA was an change in mindset for me that took a while to get used to. I got lucky and found the right school near me - but even then I waited 4-6 months to join. 

Just because some school did not return an email - don't write them off. Find the one that fits your goals and has an environment that feels right. Also check the backgrounds of the owners and instructors .


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## geezer (Jun 23, 2016)

_@crazydiamond_ --you are wasting your time. I do not believe that this "kehcorpz" individual will ever enroll in a program and begin training. I know physically and mentally disabled individuals, as well as little kids, and even elderly individuals in their 80s who train. But I will be very surprised if _this guy_ ever comes back on this forum to say that he is actually enrolled in a school and working at learning martial arts! Time to let it go....


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## Dylan9d (Jun 24, 2016)

geezer said:


> _@crazydiamond_ --you are wasting your time. I do not believe that this "kehcorpz" individual will ever enroll in a program and begin training. I know physically and mentally disabled individuals, as well as little kids, and even elderly individuals in their 80s who train. But I will be very surprised if _this guy_ ever comes back on this forum to say that he is actually enrolled in a school and working at learning martial arts! Time to let it go....



Thats why I stopped posting except for this message


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