# Hapkido, Combat Hapkido



## That-a-Way (Apr 7, 2017)

Still searching for my favourite Hybrid Art here 

My only question is, what are the focuses and differences between this arts? Does any of this ones include any kind of weapon?

Thanks!!


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## oftheherd1 (Apr 7, 2017)

I really don't know anything about Combat Hapkido.  I don't know anything about other Hapkido styles. 

In the Hapkido I learned, we are a defensive art that uses grappling a lot.  I would not say we are a hybrid art at all.  We learn some weapons, but mostly to learn how to defend weapon attacks.  Even our use of the short stick is primarily for defense.

I thought you mentioned no Hapkido in your area.  If there is, I would suggest you visit them and form your own opinion as to whether or not you would like to study the art.


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## JP3 (Apr 8, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> Still searching for my favourite Hybrid Art here
> 
> My only question is, what are the focuses and differences between this arts? Does any of this ones include any kind of weapon?
> 
> Thanks!!


I think that most hapkido schools have some sort of weapons training available in them, though in some schools such as the one that I spent most of my time training within, the weapons training isn't mandatory, it's sort of optionakl and depends on what you're trying to get out of the art.  At the school under Mikhail Kuns in Seabrook where I was for a few years, he taught some rope/belt, short stick and cane.  As I've done all my life, I declined to train in weapons, opting for empty handed method first, which I realize is both a benefit and a detriment to my training.

My point is that Murphy's Law, Sod's Law, or just bad luck or whatever, the one time I have to use my stuff to truly defend my "life," not just honor, or my lady's backside, or whatever, my [fill in the blank with weapon] will be on the other side of the room at the instand I reach for it, and thus waste a very important half-second in realization and adjustment. I can move a long way in a half-second if I'm not stood there like an idiot saying, "Why right now?"


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## jks9199 (Apr 8, 2017)

Combat Hapkido is a variant of hapkido developed in the US.  We used to have an active member who was a black belt, perhaps we can convince him to stop by and enlighten us.  It takes a sligbtly different take on the art than traditional hapkido. 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## That-a-Way (Apr 8, 2017)

oftheherd1 said:


> In the Hapkido I learned, we are a defensive art that uses grappling a lot.  I would not say we are a hybrid art at all.  We learn some weapons, but mostly to learn how to defend weapon attacks.  Even our use of the short stick is primarily for defense.



Ok, that's useful. Thanks!



oftheherd1 said:


> I thought you mentioned no Hapkido in your area.  If there is, I would suggest you visit them and form your own opinion as to whether or not you would like to study the art.



I haven't checked schools yet. Will do as soon as I know more and I know what to look for.



JP3 said:


> I think that most hapkido schools have some sort of weapons training available in them, though in some schools such as the one that I spent most of my time training within, the weapons training isn't mandatory, it's sort of optionakl and depends on what you're trying to get out of the art.  At the school under Mikhail Kuns in Seabrook where I was for a few years, he taught some rope/belt, short stick and cane.  As I've done all my life, I declined to train in weapons, opting for empty handed method first, which I realize is both a benefit and a detriment to my training.



Probably learning empty hand combat and weapon combat simultaneously could be a bit "greedy", unless you can dedicate a lot of time to it. As you say, It would not be normal to walk around the streets with a sword or a stick, so probably weapon training is a lot of effort for little reward.



jks9199 said:


> Combat Hapkido is a variant of hapkido developed in the US. It takes a sligbtly different take on the art than traditional hapkido.



Yeah, that's all I could find out online. I hear it's a "modern adaptation" or something. Sounds better (depending on what you want of course) on paper. Maybe the reality is completely different.



jks9199 said:


> We used to have an active member who was a black belt, perhaps we can convince him to stop by and enlighten us.



That would be great! how could I do that?


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## JP3 (Apr 9, 2017)

For me, which is not for you maybe but perhaps, I'd start out with google and find out what is available near to you, how they do what they do (in the marketing/internet prescence etc) and then go and visit 3 or 5 schools ... if you are lucky enough to be able to have that many close. Experience the class environment, the class environment, what they are doing and how, the style and manner of the instruction and the apparent personalities involved.  Once you've got that data, you'll almost certainly be drawn to 1 or 2 of them over the others.


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## That-a-Way (Apr 9, 2017)

JP3 said:


> For me, which is not for you maybe but perhaps, I'd start out with google and find out what is available near to you, how they do what they do (in the marketing/internet prescence etc) and then go and visit 3 or 5 schools ... if you are lucky enough to be able to have that many close. Experience the class environment, the class environment, what they are doing and how, the style and manner of the instruction and the apparent personalities involved.  Once you've got that data, you'll almost certainly be drawn to 1 or 2 of them over the others.



Yes I'll do that once I define which art I want to practice.


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## Flatfish (Apr 9, 2017)

Don't define just yet, narrow down and then see what's available and feasible for you. I do TKD and am very interested in HKD but from what I can tell there are no really good schools around......SOL on that


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## oftheherd1 (Apr 10, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> ...
> 
> Probably learning empty hand combat and weapon combat simultaneously could be a bit "greedy", unless you can dedicate a lot of time to it. As you say, It would not be normal to walk around the streets with a sword or a stick, so probably weapon training is a lot of effort for little reward.
> ...



Imho no training is wasted if it is correctly taught and correctly learned.  And FYI, the short sick as I learned it, was about 12 inches long, and made of wood.  Doesn't set off magnetometers, and is easily hidden.  

Many people ask about studying more than one art at a time.  I have given my input based on how the question was asked.  But I personally am inclined to think it is probably better to study one art at a time, and the first art should probably be learned to at least the 2nd degree if not the 3rd.  Learning the sword should provide some insight to using a cane.  But of course you would not likely be slicing with a cane. 

But learning both means it will take you longer to learn each of them, and at the end, you may decide one wasn't worth it after all.  YMMV.


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## WaterGal (Apr 11, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> Probably learning empty hand combat and weapon combat simultaneously could be a bit "greedy", unless you can dedicate a lot of time to it. As you say, It would not be normal to walk around the streets with a sword or a stick, so probably weapon training is a lot of effort for little reward.



Like JP3 mentioned, the common Hapkido weapons are short stick (wooden baton about 12-18" long), rope, and cane.  The idea behind those weapons is that the skills you learn from them can be applied to everyday objects in your environment.  For example, short stick strikes could theoretically be done with anything from a wrench to a soup ladle.



> Yeah, that's all I could find out online. I hear it's a "modern adaptation" or something. Sounds better (depending on what you want of course) on paper.



For whatever it's worth, Hapkido was developed in the 1950-60s, which already seems fairly modern to me.


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## That-a-Way (Apr 18, 2017)

oftheherd1 said:


> Imho no training is wasted if it is correctly taught and correctly learned.  And FYI, the short sick as I learned it, was about 12 inches long, and made of wood.  Doesn't set off magnetometers, and is easily hidden.



Yeah walking around with a stick would actually be quite reassuring 



oftheherd1 said:


> Many people ask about studying more than one art at a time.  I have given my input based on how the question was asked.



What do you mean? I don't want to study 2 arts simultaneously.



WaterGal said:


> For example, short stick strikes could theoretically be done with anything from a wrench to a soup ladle.



Huh, yeah that makes sense. I read something about it in the MCMAP book. The "weapons of oportunity" they call them. Very interesting.


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## oftheherd1 (Apr 20, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> Yeah walking around with a stick would actually be quite reassuring
> 
> *If you feel the need, and know how to perform techniques correctly.  And as you pointed out below, and Watergal commented on, there are always weapons of opportunity available.*
> 
> ...



Those are almost always available.  A long stick may be used in place of a sword or bo.  A rifle with bayonet as a short sword.  A short piece of wood or other tool (like watergal mentioned) can be used in place of a short stick.  In the event of advance notification, nunchaku are fairly easy to manufacture.  But you really need to know how to use them to be sure you don't injure yourself.

That is another reason I think it wise to learn at least the rudiments of weapons for learning not only how to defend against them, but also, how to use weapons of opportunity as force multipliers.


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## Gerry Seymour (Apr 20, 2017)

JP3 said:


> For me, which is not for you maybe but perhaps, I'd start out with google and find out what is available near to you, how they do what they do (in the marketing/internet prescence etc) and then go and visit 3 or 5 schools ... if you are lucky enough to be able to have that many close. Experience the class environment, the class environment, what they are doing and how, the style and manner of the instruction and the apparent personalities involved.  Once you've got that data, you'll almost certainly be drawn to 1 or 2 of them over the others.


And I'll assert that what you learn in these visits is far more important than which art each teaches.


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## JP3 (Apr 20, 2017)

gpseymour said:


> And I'll assert that what you learn in these visits is far more important than which art each teaches.


We're on the same page, but we're old hands and I think the O/P is still trying to fit himself into a style, rather than take the style and make it his.


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## That-a-Way (Apr 20, 2017)

JP3 said:


> We're on the same page, but we're old hands and I think the O/P is still trying to fit himself into a style, rather than take the style and make it his.



Yeah exactly.

Hapkido is common here. I'll walk around some clubs and see what I can find. Combat Hapkido on the other hand... Not so much.

 I wish there was some Baritsu or Kajukembo schools near, or in my country really 

I'm just tryind to find the best art overall. I know it's stupid to put it that way, there is no best art, but... I don't know. The problem is knowing what each art looks like. Fights are almost never true to the real art, and I honestly don't know what to Google...


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## Gerry Seymour (Apr 20, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> Yeah exactly.
> 
> Hapkido is common here. I'll walk around some clubs and see what I can find. Combat Hapkido on the other hand... Not so much.
> 
> ...


The issue with picking the art first, is that the quality and focus can vary greatly from one school/instructor to the next. As can the atmosphere. If you find the "best art", but don't really like the instructor's approach, you won't stay, and it won't be the "best art" for you, in your location. It's better to visit schools and look for what engages you and looks like someplace you'd want to spend a few hours a week for a few years. That's a heck of a commitment, and not one you can reasonably make based upon the art. The people will matter much more.


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## dancingalone (Apr 21, 2017)

That-a-Way said:


> Still searching for my favourite Hybrid Art here
> 
> My only question is, what are the focuses and differences between this arts? Does any of this ones include any kind of weapon?
> 
> Thanks!!



Sorry for missing this discussion when you first posted it.  If you are still interested... well, I've been told by a friend that got into Combat Hapkido that John Pelligrini intentionally designed his system to have less techniques in general to make it more friendly and accessible to all.  Thus, no high kicking is required and there is not a lot of high flying break falls and roll outs.  Of course individuals can freely add on whatever they like, but these are not requirements to achieve rank/recognition from Mr. Pelligrini.

I did see my friend's syllabus to test up to 3rd dan at one point.  The curriculum is definitely streamlined compared to some I've seen in hapkido.  No rope or fan techniques techniques, not a lot of elaborate kicking, no weapons requirements (though I believe CH offers an optional modular program in something like escrima though they may not call it that).


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## That-a-Way (Apr 21, 2017)

dancingalone said:


> Sorry for missing this discussion when you first posted it.  If you are still interested... well, I've been told by a friend that got into Combat Hapkido that John Pelligrini intentionally designed his system to have less techniques in general to make it more friendly and accessible to all.



No problem 

Actually that's great information. Makes sense too. I'm probably a little less interested in it now 

Thanks for the information!


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## Hanshi (May 2, 2017)

Hapkido is a fascinating art and is, at its roots, aikido.  More emphasis is placed on kicks and strikes, however.  I like hapkido and found it complimented my aikido training.  Learn the art and adapt it later.  Combat is simple, boiled down and uncomplicated; cool moves look and feel good in class but mostly have no place on the streets.


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## That-a-Way (May 2, 2017)

Hanshi said:


> Combat is simple, boiled down and uncomplicated; cool moves look and feel good in class but mostly* have no place on the streets.*



Huh, I would have thought it was the opposite. Thank you for the information. However, it seems there are not many Hapkido schools around and not one Combat Hapkido school at all in my city. I'm almost decided on Ninjutsu. Thanks again for your reply!


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## oftheherd1 (May 2, 2017)

Hanshi said:


> Hapkido is a fascinating art and is, at its roots, aikido.  More emphasis is placed on kicks and strikes, however.  I like hapkido and found it complimented my aikido training.  Learn the art and adapt it later.  Combat is simple, boiled down and uncomplicated; cool moves look and feel good in class but mostly have no place on the streets.



I think you are a little mistaken.  Hapkido and Aikido both are considered to have descended from the same art, no one from the other.  But Hapkido is distinctly Korean nonetheless.  I would suggest due to their ancestry, each would likely have equal chance on the street.


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