# Judo and Weight Classes.



## arnisador (Sep 9, 2003)

I read a post on Judo in rma that made the following point (among others): We always hear that Judo/Jujutsu allows a smaller person to defeat a much larger opponent. But, isn't having weight classes in Judo in opposition to this idea? How does one train for this if one is always matched against someone of roughly equal size?

I don't find it a fully compelling argument, and the benefits of being an Olympic sport clearly outweigh it, but I did find it interesting to think about. I've trained in both Judo and BJJ and I find that in BJJ I'm more likely to be paired with someone of a dissimilar weight--though of course most of the time I work with someone my own size. But the smaller students definitely get a chance to test themselves against larger opponents.

Background material, from here:


> the introduction of weight categories. In the early days, weight differences were not considered important. Everyone fought everyone else, with the result that, if two players were equally matched in skill, the bigger man usually won. There was much opposition to the introduction of weight categories. Some masters feared that it meant the end of Judo as a skillful art.


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## pknox (Sep 9, 2003)

Good point.  But sometimes it goes the other way too, in that the larger guy gains more out of rolling with the smaller guy.  As a bigger guy (6', about 245 depending on what I had for lunch  ) - I rarely get someone my size.  Usually it's some 280 pound beast of a guy, or someone I outweigh by at least 40 if not 80 lbs.  To tell you the truth, I have a much harder time with the smaller guys, because they're usually quicker.  It seems they get my back a lot more often, and I'm always fighting from underneath.  If anything, I feel I'm getting the better of the deal as it helps me work on my quickness.  When the guy is bigger than me, it's usually more strength than technique, and we basically see who gets tired enough to make a mistake.  Sometimes it ends up not very graceful, or as one of my instructor's put it, "like two big dogs scrappin' for the last biscuit"


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## arnisador (Sep 14, 2003)

Small guys _can_ be wiry.

In BJJ and back when I did Judo I always seemed to be the second-largest person and so was always paired with the largest person, who invariably was at least 50 lbs. heavier than me. It was a pain, and I much prefer working with someone of roughly my size or smaller. In BJJ now I am fairly well matched in size by a couple of guys.


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## Hollywood1340 (Sep 14, 2003)

When the Japanese started getting beat in judo on an international level they decided weight classes might be a good idea. Before that it was a heavily resisted idea.


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## Abbax8 (Sep 14, 2003)

In shiai you fight who you get. At the club, fight everyone you can, smaller, bigger, more experianced, etc. Don't worry too much about shiai results. The best training and learning are done at the club.

                                                       Peace
                                                        Dennis


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## arnisador (Oct 26, 2003)

Any other thoughts on this?


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## JDenz (Oct 30, 2003)

Well i think it was developed so you could beat someone bigger who didn't train.  I think when you get two people with the same skill level the bigger guy is going to win 8 out of ten times.


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## arnisador (Nov 1, 2003)

Yes, in any wrestling-type activity, a little weight can make a big difference.


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## pknox (Nov 1, 2003)

Yes, provided you know how to use it properly.  Realize that a weight advantage, if it is not accompanied by a proportional strength advantage, may not be a real advantage at all -- when the 200 pound man has his momentum pushed in one direction, it is harder for him to stop, when compared to someone half his size.  If someone trains in an art that relies on unbalancing and using someone's momentum against them (say judo or aikido), then the excess weight (provided it is truly "excess" and not simply more functional muscle) can actually be a liability.  True, it may be harder to get the bigger fellow started in that direction, but once he starts, he rarely stops.


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## arnisador (Nov 1, 2003)

I agree as far as standing techniques go. On the ground, howevere, Weight is Weight.


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## pknox (Nov 1, 2003)

Agreed.


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## JDenz (Nov 2, 2003)

Ya really every try and sweep someone that weighs more then 100 pounds more then you lol or even lock your guard lol.  On the feet I disagree to.  To get that momentum moving the way you want you have to break his base.   I don't care what anyone says two people with EQUAL skill the bigger guy will win far more times then the smaller guy.


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## arnisador (Nov 2, 2003)

Yeah, there's a guy I often play BJJ with who is big enough that I can't close my guard around him, and whne I mount him I can't have both knees on the ground. It sucks.


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## JDenz (Nov 3, 2003)

lol that is a big guy lol.


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## arnisador (Nov 3, 2003)

But then you get guys like *ace* who aren't that big but are skilled and a ball of energy! There's no winning.


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## JDenz (Nov 3, 2003)

that is true lol.


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