# Iraqi Journalist attacks Pres Bush with Shoes



## Cryozombie (Dec 14, 2008)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/28223089#28223089

Wow.  Just wow.


----------



## Sukerkin (Dec 14, 2008)

You don't get a much clearer political statement than that.


----------



## Makalakumu (Dec 14, 2008)

Omg...you don't throw shoes at the most powerful person in the world.  Especially a guy who legalized torture, secret prisons, suspension of habeus corpus, and rendition.  That dude will never be seen again.  Some people need to learn that there are some people that you just don't **** with.


----------



## myusername (Dec 14, 2008)

Nothing like a good old bit of impartial journalism!


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 14, 2008)

Put it in cultural perspective.

He -really- insulted Bush.  

Remember, when Sadams statues fell, they beat them with shoes.

LOL!


----------



## Twin Fist (Dec 14, 2008)

you can lead a country to civilazation, but you cant make them not be jerks


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 14, 2008)

Twin Fist said:


> you can lead a country to civilazation, but you cant make them not be jerks



I thought the mission was to oust Sadam, find the WMDs, and restore democracy. Nobody said anything about civilizing anybody.


----------



## MA-Caver (Dec 14, 2008)

I betcha the bombs in the shoes didn't go off when they were supposed to and the journalist was frustrated and tossed them. 

Dubya ducked pretty good though. Twice heh


----------



## grydth (Dec 14, 2008)

What a repugnant, disgusting and dangerous act by that "journalist". 

Who put him in charge of Iraqi foreign policy?

That opinion would not change if a different President had been the target.

This violent act easily could have been mistaken as an assassination attempt by an agent who didn't clearly see what was being thrown. Had just one agent opened fire, innocent people could have died.

I don't care how much this jackass disliked President Bush... he should have used his pen, his keyboard to express that.


----------



## myusername (Dec 14, 2008)

MA-Caver said:


> Dubya ducked pretty good though. Twice heh



Bugger! Where are the three legged Iraqi Journalists when you need them!


----------



## exile (Dec 14, 2008)

grydth said:


> What a repugnant, disgusting and dangerous act by that "journalist".
> 
> Who put him in charge of Iraqi foreign policy?
> 
> ...



This is I think the crucial point: doing that could have gone horrifically sideways, with many innocent lives put at risk. As Grydth says, challenge away, the more sharply the betterthat's an important part of journalismbut do it _sanely_.


----------



## CoryKS (Dec 14, 2008)

Sure he wasn't from the NYT?


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 14, 2008)

exile said:


> This is I think the crucial point: doing that could have gone horrifically sideways, with many innocent lives put at risk. As Grydth says, challenge away, the more sharply the betterthat's an important part of journalismbut do it _sanely_.



I think that point, on it's own, is a valid one. In doing that the journalist showed no regard for the safety of others in the room.

As for sanity among journalists :deadhorse


----------



## MA-Caver (Dec 14, 2008)

It is a testament to the eyes and control of the SS that they did not start whipping out their weapons and such. They saw it was a shoe and that the President wasn't struck. Still they should've been able to stop the second shoe from being even thrown or at least stand in the way of it. I know they're supposed to catch bullets for the Prez but maybe they're not trained on catching shoes... 

Kinda makes me wonder how well will they defend Obama? Oh of course they will I shouldn't doubt it.


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 14, 2008)

MA-Caver said:


> It is a testament to the eyes and control of the SS that they did not start whipping out their weapons and such. They saw it was a shoe and that the President wasn't struck. Still they should've been able to stop the second shoe from being even thrown or at least stand in the way of it. I know they're supposed to catch bullets for the Prez but maybe they're not trained on catching shoes...
> 
> Kinda makes me wonder how well will they defend Obama? Oh of course they will I shouldn't doubt it.


As long as he stays out of Dallas, he should be fine.....


----------



## MA-Caver (Dec 14, 2008)

Bob Hubbard said:


> As long as he stays out of Dallas, he should be fine.....


Or a hotel kitchen in Chicago? Or a theater in Washington D.C. ? Or how about a train station or an Exposition? Or even a 2nd floor Motel Room?


----------



## arnisador (Dec 14, 2008)

Heh, if that had happened in the U.S. he would've been buried beneath so many Secret Service agents that he could be buried in a large flat mailing envelope. I remember when Ronald Reagan was shot...security people teleported in from nowhere to form the World's Largest Scrum.


----------



## Big Don (Dec 14, 2008)

Luckily, the _shoeter_ was quickly apprehended.


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 14, 2008)

Big Don said:


> Luckily, the _shoeter_ was quickly apprehended.



Time was, a good Secret Service man would take a shoe for his President. Those days are gone.


----------



## Big Don (Dec 14, 2008)

Gordon Nore said:


> Time was, a good Secret Service man would take a shoe for his President. Those days are gone.


In days gone by, the mere sight of all the security would have made many with bad intentions shoo.


----------



## shesulsa (Dec 14, 2008)

Gordon Nore said:


> Time was, a good Secret Service man would take a shoe for his President. Those days are gone.



Perhaps they know something we don't ....



arnisador said:


> Heh, if that had happened in the U.S. he would've been buried beneath so many Secret Service agents that he could be buried in a large flat mailing envelope. I remember when Ronald Reagan was shot...security people teleported in from nowhere to form the World's Largest Scrum.



I remember that. It was as though they were just suddenly there. An impressive sight, I must say.



MA-Caver said:


> It is a testament to the eyes and control of the SS that they did not start whipping out their weapons and such. They saw it was a shoe and that the President wasn't struck. Still they should've been able to stop the second shoe from being even thrown or at least stand in the way of it. I know they're supposed to catch bullets for the Prez but maybe they're not trained on catching shoes...
> 
> Kinda makes me wonder how well will they defend Obama? Oh of course they will I shouldn't doubt it.



Um ... not with shoes. 



CoryKS said:


> Sure he wasn't from the NYT?



:lol2:


----------



## Brad Dunne (Dec 14, 2008)

UPI NEWS BULLETIN...................

Iraq, December 14, 2008...........
1300 Zulu................

President Bush on a secret arrival in Iraq to meet with the countries leaders, was the victim of an attempted walk-in-shoeing  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The President bobbed and weaved  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 as the assailant threw both his shoes, that were not conditioned with Dr Shoals foot powder by the way,  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 at the Presidents head. The President was not hurt in the attempt, but medical personel are checking for athletes foot in mouth anyway.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The President went on to say and we quote, "If the shoe fits, don't throw it"!........... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Officials from Nike have stated that they intend to offer a new athletic shoe, designed for easy throwing, that will be balanced to fit the hand better.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




On another front, the Korean Olympic council stated that they will attend the National OAC in March and seek to have KST (Korean Shoe Throwing) recognized as an Olympic medal sport.


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 14, 2008)

I was watching some 'analysis' of this on the news. Naturally, after we had seen the clip 800 times, CNN felt obliged to bring in a protection expert to parse the attack. He suggested that the room was extremely secure, in that weapons could not have been brought in and that all present would have been screened through various databases. Had the Mr Bush been injured or if there was a lurking threat, he would have been pulled into a safe room.

The fact that the shoe was used was symbolic of this person's disdain for President Bush, since, as we have learned, the throwing of a shoe, or hitting someone with a shoe, is highly and intentionally offensive. The President himself joked about, perhaps not realizing the import of this event to others in the room.

As the protection commentator pointed out, the reporter could easily have thrown a camera at the President. Some things you can't plan for.


----------



## shesulsa (Dec 14, 2008)

There is a thread about this in the Study complete with video.


----------



## crushing (Dec 14, 2008)

maunakumu said:


> Omg...you don't throw shoes at the most powerful person in the world. Especially a guy who legalized torture, secret prisons, suspension of habeus corpus, and rendition. That dude will never be seen again. Some people need to learn that there are some people that you just don't **** with.


 
Maybe Bush will have mercy on his sole?


----------



## MA-Caver (Dec 14, 2008)

shesulsa said:


> There is a thread about this in the Study complete with video.


Aye,  suggest this one be moved/merged with the other... with all due respect to the OP


----------



## terryl965 (Dec 14, 2008)

To bad he missed


----------



## terrylamar (Dec 14, 2008)

terryl965 said:


> To bad he missed


 
Really, your advocating an attack on a sitting US President?


----------



## Marginal (Dec 14, 2008)

Pretty agile for a lame duck.


----------



## terryl965 (Dec 14, 2008)

terrylamar said:


> Really, your advocating an attack on a sitting US President?


 
It was a shoe and he was standing. Look he is making lite of it so why can't I? Ig it was something terrible then I would responed in a different manner but all the news has done is treat it as nothing and so has he, like he said it was a size 10 and laughed.


----------



## Big Don (Dec 14, 2008)

nevermind


----------



## Makalakumu (Dec 14, 2008)

crushing said:


> Maybe Bush will have mercy on his sole?


 

 :lfao:


----------



## CoryKS (Dec 14, 2008)

crushing said:


> Maybe Bush will have mercy on his sole?


 
He'd be a terrible heel not to.


----------



## shesulsa (Dec 14, 2008)

terryl965 said:


> It was a shoe and he was standing. Look he is making lite of it so why can't I? Ig it was something terrible then I would responed in a different manner but all the news has done is treat it as nothing and so has he, like he said it was a size 10 and laughed.



The thing is - in that reporter's culture, the sole of the shoe is the worst thing that could ever touch a person. So to throw a shoe at Bush is *really* insulting him.  And the man doing so was a journalist for a television station.  He had a much better way of delivering his opinion.

I'm asking this thread be merged with the study thread.


----------



## MA-Caver (Dec 14, 2008)

Gordon Nore said:


> I was watching some 'analysis' of this on the news. Naturally, after we had seen the clip 800 times, CNN felt obliged to bring in a protection expert to parse the attack. He suggested that the room was extremely secure, in that weapons could not have been brought in and that all present would have been screened through various databases. Had the Mr Bush been injured or if there was a lurking threat, he would have been pulled into a safe room.
> 
> The fact that the shoe was used was symbolic of this person's disdain for President Bush, since, as we have learned, the throwing of a shoe, or hitting someone with a shoe, is highly and intentionally offensive. The President himself joked about, perhaps not realizing the import of this event to others in the room.
> 
> As the protection commentator pointed out, the reporter could easily have thrown a camera at the President. Some things you can't plan for.


Aye, it's a clear message to me that they want the U.S. (and other forces) OUT! And well that we should. Get out entire and let them go as it may. Eventually they'll probably call us back for help. 
They don't WANT a democracy there it's clear to say. Many do and many don't. Let THEM decide amongst themselves.


----------



## CoryKS (Dec 14, 2008)

MA-Caver said:


> Aye, it's a clear message to me that *they* want the U.S. (and other forces) OUT! And well that we should. Get out entire and let *them* go as it may. Eventually *they'll* probably call us back for help.
> *They* don't WANT a democracy there it's clear to say. Many do and many don't. Let *THEM* decide amongst themselves.


 
They?  Them?  So you're okay with letting one guy with a shoe dictate policy for ALL Iraqis?  Or does "they" refer to him and the mouse in his pocket?



MA-Caver said:


> Eventually they'll probably call us back for help.


 
And presumably you'll look down and whisper, "No."


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 14, 2008)

*Mod Note:*
Threads Merged.


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 14, 2008)

Just a couple bits.

1- I don't condone any attack on any US President regardless to my opinion of him. 

2- In Iraq, to be hit with a shoe is a real big insult, kinda on par with being spit on or shat on.



> The Iraqi journalist, Muntader al-Zaidi, 28, a correspondent for Al Baghdadia, an independent Iraqi television station, stood up about 12 feet from Bush and shouted in Arabic: "This is a gift from the Iraqis; this is the farewell kiss, you dog!" He then threw a shoe at Bush, who ducked and narrowly avoided it.
> 
> As stunned security agents and guards, officials and journalists watched, Zaidi then threw his other shoe, shouting in Arabic, "This is from the widows, the orphans and those who were killed in Iraq!" That shoe also narrowly missed Bush as Prime Minister Maliki stuck a hand in front of the president's face to help shield him.
> 
> ...


http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/12/15/africa/15prexy.php


----------



## Rich Parsons (Dec 15, 2008)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Just a couple bits.
> 
> 1- I don't condone any attack on any US President regardless to my opinion of him.
> 
> ...


 

I think it was a risky thing to do, for little reward other than personal Glory of claiming to be the person to have hit him with a sole of the shoe or to show him the sole of a shoe. 

He should have made his opinion known in his questioning. 

I also do not agree with a physical attack on the President of the US. I do support using the system to make issues known and to bring forth grievences. 

As to being really insulted, he could have been shot, and then bleed out. I think that would have been an insult. But, now he could be the guy who is killed as someone else needs to show they were not insulting him, and so they have to "do the right thing"


----------



## Tez3 (Dec 15, 2008)

It seems that being hit with a shoe and being called a dog are grave insults in Iraq which obviously was wasted on us as we didn't understand the significance! In fact it gave the president a chance to turn it into a joke.
Makes you wonder how many people we've inadvertantly insulted or who have insulted us without anyone being the wiser!


----------



## Andy Moynihan (Dec 15, 2008)

CoryKS said:


> And presumably you'll look down and whisper, "No."


 
At this point, so would I. *shrug*.

(Kudos on the Watchmen reference BTW)


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 15, 2008)

Has president Bush done some type of training before , maybe boxing or something ? He slipped that first shoe pretty good .


----------



## Tez3 (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm not sure the shoe journalists view are just his, the BBC went out and interviwed a lot of Iraqis and they share the opinion that we should leave Iraq.

The thing I suppose we forget is that we did invade Iraq and while we see it as liberating them they don't necessarily see it that way. Turn it around, a lot of Americans don't like Bush but how would they feel if Russia/China whoever came along and invaded America to 'rid' you of Bush? Many of you aren't Obama fans but would you tolerate another country deposing him thinking that it's for the greater good and they were giving you back democracy or would you resist the invasion? Saddam was appalling but he was the Iraqis appalling guy and while they are glad to be rid of him they also want us gone. 
Things were bad for some while Saddam was in power but for ordinary Iraqis things got a whole lost worse when we arrived, so we can hardly blame them for wanting us gone. You can't expect gratitude after everything that has happened.


----------



## Kreth (Dec 15, 2008)

The money (and lives) that we're pissing away in Iraq and Afghanistan on a daily basis could be put to much better use right here at home.


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 15, 2008)

See, but thats 'different' because were the 'good guys'. Anyone invading us is the 'bad guys',  don'tchaknow.


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 15, 2008)

Tez3 said:


> The thing I suppose we forget is that we did invade Iraq and while we see it as liberating them they don't necessarily see it that way. Turn it around, a lot of Americans don't like Bush but how would they feel if Russia/China whoever came along and invaded America to 'rid' you of Bush? Many of you aren't Obama fans but would you tolerate another country deposing him thinking that it's for the greater good and they were giving you back democracy or would you resist the invasion? Saddam was appalling but he was the Iraqis appalling guy and while they are glad to be rid of him they also want us gone.


 
Can't dispute that.


----------



## arnisador (Dec 15, 2008)

shesulsa said:


> The thing is - in that reporter's culture, the sole of the shoe is the worst thing that could ever touch a person.



He may reconsider his position on this after a few months in prison.


----------



## shesulsa (Dec 15, 2008)

arnisador said:


> He may reconsider his position on this after a few months in prison.


Indeed!  Isn't homosexual contact and nudity even worse?


----------



## kaizasosei (Dec 15, 2008)

Nice dodge!  Especially the first one.


j


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 15, 2008)

Why am I seeing a bad Disney movie starring George Bush and Jackie Chan?


----------



## Makalakumu (Dec 15, 2008)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Why am I seeing a bad Disney movie starring George Bush and Jackie Chan?



Jackie can do the moves and Bush can deliver the one-liners.  This President could be like a reverse Ronald Reagan.  President, then actor!


----------



## arnisador (Dec 15, 2008)

Someone said this is actually a sign of Pres. Bush's success in Iraq--imagine what would've happened if he had thrown a shoe at Saddam Hussein!


----------



## Bob Hubbard (Dec 15, 2008)

Um, I'll take "Cleaning his brains off the wall" for $400 Arni!


----------



## zDom (Dec 15, 2008)

kaizasosei said:


> Nice dodge!  Especially the first one.
> 
> 
> j



I agree: nice reflexes!


----------



## CoryKS (Dec 15, 2008)

> There's a weird double standard buried deep in all of this, and I don't just mean the biases against Bush. When conservatives hold up unsavory Muslims or Arabs as representative of the region's problems, we're told how simplistic and two-dimensional we're being. But when the same sort of unsavory doofus behaves in ways that confirm liberal biases and coform to liberal passions, then suddenly this doofus speaks for millions.


 
- Jonah Goldberg


----------



## ArmorOfGod (Dec 15, 2008)

I question how good the secret service is after that.  That just watched the first shoe.  Then watched the second shoe.  Then stood around and stared.
If the secret service won't take a shoe, would they take a bullet?

AoG


----------



## ArmorOfGod (Dec 15, 2008)

Part of piece at http://www.236.com/blog/w/jon_friedman/questions_that_i_have_for_the_10713.php =



> Questions That I Have for the Secret Service
> Jon Friedman |
> 
> 1. Shouldn't you have jumped in front of that shoe?
> ...


----------



## CoryKS (Dec 15, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> I question how good the secret service is after that. That just watched the first shoe. Then watched the second shoe. Then stood around and stared.
> If the secret service won't take a shoe, would they take a bullet?
> 
> AoG


 
Maybe they were waiting for the other shoe to drop?

/here all week
//try the veal


----------



## zeeberex (Dec 16, 2008)

Twin Fist said:


> you can lead a country to civilazation, but you cant make them not be jerks




WRONG... Bush just ducked too fast


----------



## elder999 (Dec 16, 2008)

Real men of Genius: Mr. Iraqi Journalist Shoe Thrower Guy

:lfao:


----------



## Nolerama (Dec 16, 2008)

Apparently, the Shoe Throwing Incident is creating a base of solidarity among many of Iraq's (as well as the Muslim/Middle Eastern World) many peoples.

The questions I want to pose to everyone here: How much of a "Win" is this for those opposed to American involvement in the Middle East? How far can something wholly insulting take Anti-American sentiment?


----------



## Gordon Nore (Dec 16, 2008)

Nolerama said:


> Apparently, the Shoe Throwing Incident is creating a base of solidarity among many of Iraq's (as well as the Muslim/Middle Eastern World) many peoples.
> 
> The questions I want to pose to everyone here: How much of a "Win" is this for those opposed to American involvement in the Middle East? How far can something wholly insulting take Anti-American sentiment?


 
How much of a win, I don't know, but there is an interesting dynamic at play. I would say around the fourth anniversary of the war, the tide of public opinion in the USA began run against the President. Prior to that time, anyone who spoke out against the mission was accused of being for the other side, or at the very least, hurting the morale of the troops.

Then Bush pulled a switch-hit and said -- I remember it vividly -- "We're here at the request of the Iraqi government." Now the other shoe is dropping in Iraq. Maybe Iraqis who don't want the troops in Iraq aren't terrorists or anything like that; they just don't want the troops there, and are not going to thank an uninvited guest.


----------



## arnisador (Dec 16, 2008)

*Secret Service Defends Shoe Response*



> William H. Pickle, a former Secret Service agent and former sergeant at arms in the Senate, said, "Other than the shoes, the most deadly weapon in that room was probably going to be a chair or a pen." He said there are limits to what security officers can do in such situations.


----------



## SensibleManiac (Dec 16, 2008)

"Dubya ducked pretty good though. Twice heh"

I agree and the first time, he still had a smile on his face.
I'm no fan of Bush but his slipping skills were impressive.
lol


----------



## Nolerama (Dec 16, 2008)

SensibleManiac said:


> "Dubya ducked pretty good though. Twice heh"
> 
> I agree and the first time, he still had a smile on his face.
> *I'm no fan of Bush but his slipping skills were impressive.
> lol*




I was thinking the same thing.


----------



## Tez3 (Dec 16, 2008)

Nolerama said:


> I was thinking the same thing.


 
Perhaps he's had plenty of practice wth the missus chucking things at him?


----------



## SensibleManiac (Dec 18, 2008)

Tez3 said:


> Perhaps he's had plenty of practice wth the missus chucking things at him?



Or maybe he was just expecting the day that someone would throw something at him and started to train to avoid it!


----------



## arnisador (Jan 31, 2009)

*Iraq sculpture honoring Bush shoe-thrower removed*


----------



## grydth (Jan 31, 2009)

Well, this is a country that peppered their cities with statues of Saddam Hussein, so their taste in art must be considered somewhat suspect. 

When next the Iraqis come looking for a handout, they should be given those shoes back and sent on their way.


----------

