# Collar Bones



## shiho (Mar 25, 2007)

HI, I,ve been practicing Aikido for over two years now and lately have been having pain in my collar bones mostly connecting to the shoulder.
   I take a number of breakfalls and never had problems. just wandering if anybody has any advice or similar problems. I'm trying to vary my forward ukemi to see if it helps. any advice would be appreciated. I've been told I'm no spring chicken and refuse to hear thats the reason. If so I'll live with it till the end. Thanks


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## Jade Tigress (Mar 25, 2007)

shiho said:


> HI, I,ve been practicing Aikido for over two years now and lately have been having pain in my collar bones mostly connecting to the shoulder.
> I take a number of breakfalls and never had problems. just wandering if anybody has any advice or similar problems. I'm trying to vary my forward ukemi to see if it helps. any advice would be appreciated. I've been told I'm no spring chicken and refuse to hear thats the reason. If so I'll live with it till the end. Thanks



LOL! Ok spring chicken, it could be an AC joint separation. 

Article.



> This is where the clavicle (collar bone) meets the acromion process of the scapular. It is a bony bit on the top of the shoulder. This joint can be injured by falling onto the shoulder, elbow or an outstretched arm. It can range in severity from a little bit of pain to a complete rupture of the joint where you might get a lump where the collar bone sticks up out of the neck.


Be sure to scroll down and take note of the warning about neglecting the injury. 

See a doc.


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## morph4me (Mar 25, 2007)

Jade Tigress said:


> LOL! Ok spring chicken, it could be an AC joint separation.
> 
> Article.
> 
> ...


 
All it takes is one bad fall. I agree with Jade Tigress, see a doc


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## tellner (Mar 25, 2007)

All it took for me was one bad fall. See a doctor.


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## Yari (Mar 26, 2007)

*See a doctor*.... get the obvios out of the picture, then you can look into how your practice....

/Yari


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## Brian R. VanCise (Mar 26, 2007)

See a doctor and get it checked out.  

One thing about advanced high breakfalls is that they can still cause injury even if performed correctly. (energy always goes someplace) To many and it adds up.  

Besides seeing the doctor look at what you are doing with your breakfalls and analyze if you are doing to many high/hard ones in your regular training.

Good luck!


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## shiho (Apr 1, 2007)

thanks everybody, I have to have my overdue checkup anyways so I'll have him take a look. hopefully it can heal easily. Thanks again


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## Jade Tigress (Apr 2, 2007)

shiho said:


> thanks everybody, I have to have my overdue checkup anyways so I'll have him take a look. hopefully it can heal easily. Thanks again



Let us know how it goes.


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## shiho (Apr 29, 2007)

the bones are better, doc said the 20 plus years of concrete work weren't kind. it's just arthritic joints. they became inflamed from excess practice. Alls well though.


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## Yari (Apr 30, 2007)

Good. Nice to know. Keep up the good work! Just take i easy on the collar bone!

/Yari


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## kidswarrior (Apr 30, 2007)

shiho said:


> the bones are better, doc said the 20 plus years of concrete work weren't kind. it's just arthritic joints. they became inflamed from excess practice. Alls well though.



I got similar news re: neck a couple of years ago ('Were you in a car accident?' asked the dr. No-a train wreck: train is called Kung Fu San Soo :lol. the martial lifestyle can take its toll, especially as we age. Doesn't mean we can't pursue our passion. Just tweak it a little, maybe?  As *Brian *said, the energy has to go someplace--so maybe more rolling and fewer hard breaks? Don't know Aikido that well, so only you can determine what's best. But have seen practitioners user a standing 'roll' and return to their feet. Maybe you could do more of that? :idunno:

Anyway, good to hear you're doing OK. Keep us posted. :ultracool


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## shiho (Apr 30, 2007)

slow down maybe, never quit. Thanks


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## charyuop (Apr 30, 2007)

Ask your Nage's to throw you slower so that you can perform a normal front or back roll instead of a breakfall. Pain to shoulders can take a while to go away (been there), so take it very easy. I know this is not very nice to say, but try to be more complaiant with Nage so that you have time to take care of your joint in the fall. Nage will still be able to work on his form even tho with you been more complaint might come a bit less the flowing part. When yoy are 100% healed Nage will still be there....to break you again hee hee.


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## theletch1 (Apr 30, 2007)

Shiho, glad to hear that it isn't anything too serious.  Popping a couple of advil before class always seems to help me.

Kidswarrior, I hear ya on the conversation with the doctor.  The physical therapist I was seeing used to discuss MA related abuse with me during my back and shoulder rehab.  He couldn't understand loving something as much as martial artists do that can cause so much wear and tear on the body over the years.  As my sensei told one of the younger students the other night...pace your damage over the years.  I watch the youger guys doing unneeded breakfalls or training injured beyond what the injury should allow and I shake my head.  They'll be feeling that at 35... 'course my wife says I'm just as bad at almost 37 for pushing when I shouldn't but I remember what I was like in my 20s and know that I've slowed down a good bit.


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## kidswarrior (Apr 30, 2007)

theletch1 said:


> Kidswarrior, I hear ya on the conversation with the doctor.  The physical therapist I was seeing used to discuss MA related abuse with me during my back and shoulder rehab.  He couldn't understand loving something as much as martial artists do that can cause so much wear and tear on the body over the years.  As my sensei told one of the younger students the other night...pace your damage over the years.  I watch the youger guys doing unneeded breakfalls or training injured beyond what the injury should allow and I shake my head.  They'll be feeling that at 35... 'course my wife says I'm just as bad at almost 37 for pushing when I shouldn't but I remember what I was like in my 20s and know that I've slowed down a good bit.



Well, at least you get it at 37. Like you said, you're pacing yourself knowing what's ahead (and slowing down a little is the body's way of _making _us pace ourselves). Some mornings I wonder if I'll be able to swing my legs out of bed, and _then stage _two, stand up. So far, so good, although sometimes (especially the days after I've taught a couple of classes) it might take about 5 mins.  Straightening my fingers out may take longer (as straight as they go after all the breaks, anyway).  

But it really should go much better for you, since you know what's ahead. And anyway, it's not like we can quit! :ultracool Besides, stopping now and doing nothing would probably be worse than continuing to keep things moving, even if it means banging around a little.


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## kiaiki (Aug 11, 2007)

I had a total separation of the AC joint many years ago. Bad throw, rubbish ukemi, tired, I aeroplaned from head height to the deck - the crunching noise made the whole gym stop and look! 

(Specialist: "We don't usually use the term 'snapped' but in your case....")

Couldn't be pinned or operated on at all, so trained with it for another 10 years or so, and put up with the pain.  I was warned it would get arthritis (osteo-arthritis) eventually & now I have it - but in both shoulders and knees - I thank Judo frog-jump training for the knees!

Whatever the injury, if you train on with it be aware that arthritis is a possible consequence and get your GP to monitor it regularly.

I have to say, though, it was worth it!


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