# Pledges



## GouRonin (Mar 11, 2002)

How many of the Parker Kenpoists here still use the belt pledges as part of their belt system?


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## Rob_Broad (Mar 12, 2002)

My first instructor had us use the pledges even though we were a Tracy school.  I thought they were a great idea.


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## Rob_Broad (Mar 13, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz _
> 
> *Ah.  Thank you.
> 
> ...



That would probably be the Kenpo Creed


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## Rob_Broad (Mar 13, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz _
> 
> *Hmm....actually, no.
> 
> ...



Ingmar is pretty cool, and he is a wealth of knowledge.  You should attend Jeff Blay's camp in August, Ingmar is supposed to be at it.


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## stal0225 (Mar 19, 2002)

But it seems alot of schools have gotten away from the pledges. Not only that but alot of the discipline as well. I mean the strictness. When i first started when i was young I remember getting push-ups galore. Heck i was a smart mouth punk then. Now i watch the kids classes and the kids will yell out an answer or just start lossing attention in the middle of the instructor speaking(time & place etc.)

When I asked about this I was told that soemtimes you have to give in a little and that in this day and age parents don't put up with that.

Not sure.... maybe a little off topic here.

Later

p.s. My school doesn't do the pledges either. Heck after they where posted i copied them out and want to memorize them myself.


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## stal0225 (Mar 19, 2002)

That and I started one last night about a problem i'm having with an egotistical Sempai but after going to bed and thinking about what i wrote i was worried about airing out my schools laundry.

But yeah I guess i can do that. Just gotta remember to stay on topic.

Later


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 11, 2002)

Belt Pledge?  If its what I think it is, I've heard the kids classes do it, but haven't seen any adult classes do it.


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 12, 2002)

Kenpo beginner question here:

Whats the pledge?


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 12, 2002)

Ah.  Thank you.

I stand corrected.  The school I went to doesn't use them.  There was 1 shorter one that the kids classes did, but the adults don't do anything like that.

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 13, 2002)

Hmm....actually, no.

It might be something unique to the school.... alot is.

It's got quality instructors, but, sometimes, I wonder if I can get fried at the next belt test (Beer money nights I call em).

Now that I think about it...

its sad.

I learned more from Ingmar in 10 minutes, than 6 months in classes there.


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## Kirk (Mar 11, 2002)

No pledges here.


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## Kirk (Mar 17, 2002)

Are you a kenpo student Kaith?  All this time I thought you did
like Kendo, and FMA.   Am I right or wrong?


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## Robbo (Mar 12, 2002)

We have pledges for each belt, but we only had to repeat them after the grading instructor. Do you guys have to memorize them. Do you have to keep the all straight? Could get a little much at 5th degree. Or is the only pledge that is relevent the one for your rank?

Thanks,
Rob


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## Robbo (Mar 19, 2002)

Why don't you start a thread with that idea in mind? The one about losing discipline in this day and age.

Rob


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## AvPKenpo (Mar 11, 2002)

Yes.  We still use the pledges.  And I believe that some of the wording is slightly different than the originals(in our schools).

Michael


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## Klondike93 (Mar 11, 2002)

Well, I know GD7 does as he has said so, and the school I go to has them posted on the wall but I have yet to hear any students have to recite them. The first kenpo school I went to, you had to recite the kenpo pledge a couple of times a week. 

:asian: 

Chuck


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 11, 2002)

Yes, I require all the Pledges.  I don't think many other studios do however, sad.  I feel there is much to learn and ponder.  Like other areas of our art, we should not lessen the philosophy.

:asian:


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 12, 2002)

There are several..... one for each Belt ..... Orange through Black.  They can be found near the beginning of Infinite Insights Volume #'s 3, 4, & 5.

Kenpo Pledges:

ORANGE BELT PLEDGE
           I UNDERSTAND THAT I AM BUT A BEGINNER IN A NEW 
     AND FASCINATING ART WHICH WILL DIRECT ME TO GREATER  
     OBLIGATIONS AND RESPONSIBILITIES. TO HONOR MY  
     OBLIGATIONS AND RESPONSIBILITIES, I PLEDGE MYSELF TO  
     SERVE MY INSTRUCTOR, FELLOW STUDENTS, AND FELLOW
     MEN. 

PURPLE BELT PLEDGE
            I HOLD THE ART OF KENPO SACRED, AND FREELY TAKE  
     UPON MYSELF THE OBLIGATION AND RESPONSIBILITY THAT I 
     SHALL NEVER MISUSE MY SKILL TO HURT OR MAKE AFRAID. I 
     SHALL FIGHT ONLY IF FORCED TO DEFEND MYSELF, AND SHALL 
     BE SLOW TO ANGER, LOATH TO TAKE OFFENSE, QUICK TO 
     FORGIVE AND TO FORGET PERSONAL AFFRONT. 

BLUE BELT PLEDGE 
             I SHALL NEVER LET PRIDE RULE MY PASSIONS, AND WILL
        DEFEND WITH ALL THE SKILL I POSSESS: THE WEAK, THE 
        HELPLESS, AND THE OPPRESSED. I PLEDGE AN 
        UNSWERVING  LOYALTY TO THE ASSOCIATION AND MY 
        INSTRUCTOR. IN  ADDITION, I PLEDGE AN UNENDING EFFORT 
        TO EARN THE SELF  SAME LOYALTY FROM THOSE WHO LOOK 
        TO ME FOR TRAINING. 

GREEN BELT PLEDGE 
             I PLEDGE A CONTINUED EFFORT TO SHARPEN MY SKILLS, 
        TO  INCREASE MY KNOWLEDGE, AND BROADEN MY 
        HORIZONS. I SHALL  OBLIGATE MYSELF UNDER THE 
        DIRECTION OF MY INSTRUCTOR TO  LEARN THE SKILLS OF A 
        TEACHER, WHICH WILL ENABLE ME TO  TEACH MY SKILLS IN 
        THE PRESCRIBED MANNER OUTLINED BY MR. PARKER.

3RD DEGREE BROWN BELT PLEDGE 
              I PLEDGE THAT AS MY SKILL AS A TEACHER PROGRESSES,
         I WILL NEVER CONDEMN, RIDICULE, EMBARRASS, OR SHAME 
         ANY  STUDENT OR FELLOW INSTRUCTOR IN THE PRESENCE 
         OF A CLASS  OR GROUP. ALL GRIEVANCES OR DISPUTES 
         SHALL BE CONDUCTED  IN PRIVATE, AWAY FROM GROUP 
         OBSERVATION.

2ND DEGREE BROWN BELT PLEDGE 
            I UNDERSTAND THAT LIKE A DOCTOR, THE PRIVATE 
         AFFAIRS OF STUDENTS AND FELLOW INSTRUCTORS THAT 
         COME TO MY ATTENTION DURING THE EXERCISING OF MY 
         RESPONSIBILITIES ARE PRIVILEGE COMMUNICATIONS AND 
         MUST NEVER BE DISCUSSED WITH ANY LIVING  SOUL. I VOW 
         THAT I WILL NEVER VIOLATE THIS PLEDGE NOR ANY OTHER 
         FOR THE SAKE OF PERSONAL BENEFIT. 

1ST BROWN BELT PLEDGE 
             I HONOR AND HOLD SACRED THE RIGHT OF ALL MEN TO 
         PROTECT THEMSELVES. I FURTHER HOLD THAT AS A TRAINED 
         MARTIAL ARTIST IN KENPO, I WILL TAKE UPON MYSELF ALL 
         OBLIGATIONS AND RESPONSIBILITIES DEEMED SACRED TO 
         MY GOD, FAMILY, COUNTRY, AND ASSOCIATION. 	

1ST BLACK BELT PLEDGE 
             I HOLD THAT MY TIME AND MY SKILL ARE THE ASSETS TO 
        MY PROFESSION, ASSETS WHICH GROW IN VALUE AS I 
        PROGRESS IN KENPO, UNTIL AS A THIRD DEGREE BLACK BELT 
        I STAND AS A FULLY QUALIFIED INSTRUCTOR.  IT SHALL ALSO 
        BE MY RESPONSIBILITY TO PROTECT ANY INDIVIDUALS WHO 
        WOULD TRY TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF PERSONAL 
        WEAKNESSES TO DIVEST THE GULLIBLE INTO UNPROFITABLE 
        PATHS.  TO PRESERVE THE SACRED THINGS, GOD, FAMILY, 
        AND COUNTRY, I PLEDGE MY ALL. 

:asian:


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 13, 2002)

Kenpo Creed

I come to you with only "Karate", empty hands.  I have no weapons but should I be forced to defend myself, my principles, or my honor... should it be a matter of life or death of right or wrong then here are my weapons -- Karate --  my empty hands.

:asian:


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 16, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Rob_Broad _*
> 
> Ingmar is pretty cool, and he is a wealth of knowledge.*



He is? hee hee

:asian:


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 18, 2002)

He is a student of the Renegade!


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 20, 2002)

Respect is on the downside in many studios I feel.  It is an important thread as far as I am concerned.  The Pledges are an important part of your training and guidance.  Students need the philosophical side as well as the physical.

:asian:


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## Touch Of Death (May 25, 2004)

Goldendragon7 said:
			
		

> ... I PLEDGE AN
> UNSWERVING  LOYALTY TO THE ASSOCIATION AND MY
> INSTRUCTOR.
> 
> ...


Hi I thought I would address an issue with the pledges that I have. Is it just me or are some of these pledges more of an imposition and enforced loyalty. What if it turns out your instructor is a creep? what if your organization ceases to exist? What if some of what ED Parker taught was proven to be less effective than something Jet lee comes up with(hypotheticly)? What is wrong with personal bennefit again?
Sean :asian:


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## Michael Billings (May 25, 2004)

What is your opinion Sean.

 I think loyalty is earned, and should be reciprical.  I give loyalty conditionally at first, as a sign of respect for the rank or organization, if you prove yourself not worthy of respect, then you have to live with those consequences.

 It is pretty simple to me, but you can make it very complicated, especially in times of fragmenting Associations or in Mr. Parker's case, when very senior students were leaving him and hanging out their own shingle and making money off his name and the Art he created.  I understand and agree with the pledges, especially now days when it seems like the almighty buck can buy you a Black Belt or equivalent training, without necessarily including the moral values inherent in some of the more traditional arts.

 What do you think of it?  "Stupid Pledges" ... I have heard said, of course this was said by stupid people who did not want to commit to the spirit of those pledges (which is more important to me than the actual words).

 -Michael


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## Touch Of Death (May 25, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> What is your opinion Sean.
> 
> I think loyalty is earned, and should be reciprical.  I give loyalty conditionally at first, as a sign of respect for the rank or organization, if you prove yourself not worthy of respect, then you have to live with those consequences.
> 
> ...


I too think its conditional. I've said this before but as a kid I didn't really care about the IKKA. I only knew that my instructor was a member and by default, so was I. When He was no longer a member neither was I. I don't think any student should feel betrayed because there instructor ceases to belong to an organization; hence, this is my problem with the blue belt pledge. For the most part the pledges are sound advice to anyone in your personal dealings with your fellow man, and I have never heard the term "Stupid Pledges" until just this moment. The pledges seem to advise against cross training though, and with that I have a problem. And committing to pledges without caring about the "actual words" seems a little blind, maybe its just me. All in all I like about 90% of what we are asked to pledge, but with the death of the IKKA's leader I think it interesting to examine what we are pledging. :asian: 
Sean


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## sumdumguy (May 25, 2004)

My school requires all of the pledges white through black. They are to be recited from memory at each belt testing. Failure to do so will result in a re-test at a later date. These pledges are important to have and learn, for some people that are learning a leathal art form and have not real guidance these are a must.
 :asian:


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## Michael Billings (May 26, 2004)

sumdumguy said:
			
		

> My school requires all of the pledges white through black. They are to be recited from memory at each belt testing. Failure to do so will result in a re-test at a later date. These pledges are important to have and learn, for some people that are learning a leathal art form and have not real guidance these are a must.
> :asian:


 I concur, and do the same.  I understand newer student's doubts, and I don't think "shame on them" for not seeing the importance, rather I attribute the failure of the student to see the importance and spirit of the pledges to the instructor they train under.

 One of my favorite questions on tests is "OK, so what does that pledge mean, to you, to your students (if you are at an instructor level), and how do you try to live up to it or use it in your life?"

 Respectfully,
 -Michael


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## sumdumguy (Jun 9, 2004)

Michael Billings said:
			
		

> What is your opinion Sean.
> 
> I think loyalty is earned, and should be reciprical.  I give loyalty conditionally at first, as a sign of respect for the rank or organization, if you prove yourself not worthy of respect, then you have to live with those consequences.
> 
> ...



    Very well put! I must include (in addition to my other post) the I have modified the Blue belt pledge and others for personal reasons to exclude the bit about associations. This to me, is a rediculous notion since the associations of today ( not all) can't even live by, or follow their own standards and rules predicated by Presidents and founders. Associations to me, are political arena's devised to escalate the prominance and rank, stature of a few individuals within said association. I realize that not all are like this, there are some that are and in my opinion serve no REAL greater purpose! 

 :asian:


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## Michael Billings (Jun 9, 2004)

I understand the distinction in associations, and unfortunatley have to agree with you.  We are starting to see the dissolution of some of the ones that started up in the early-mid 90's.  It's a lot of work to "do it right" and a major commitment.

 -Michael


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## dubljay (Jun 14, 2004)

The belt pledges are never required for our belt exams, however, my instructor expects that we know they exist and at various times we will discuss them during a class... usually in a deep horse stance.


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## True2Kenpo (Jun 14, 2004)

Fellow Kenpoists,

We require knowledge of the pledges in our school.  As Mr. C said, I think they are very important.  It really helps define the attitude one would want to develop in Kenpo, and for that matter in any Art.

Respectfully,
Joshua Ryer


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## Touch Of Death (Jun 14, 2004)

dubljay said:
			
		

> ... discuss them during a class... usually in a deep horse stance.


Gotta love those conversations.
Sean


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## dubljay (Jun 22, 2004)

True2Kenpo said:
			
		

> Fellow Kenpoists,
> 
> We require knowledge of the pledges in our school. As Mr. C said, I think they are very important. It really helps define the attitude one would want to develop in Kenpo, and for that matter in any Art.
> 
> ...


 So very true, to me, each pledge sounds like some one screwed up and the pledge was written as an example to prevent others from making the same mistake.  For example:

*[font=Arial,Helvetica][size=-1]Purple Belt Pledge: I hold the art of Kenpo sacred and freely take upon myself the obligation and responsibility that I shall never misuse my skill to hurt or make afraid. I shall fight only if forced to defend myself and shall be slow to anger,  loath to take offense, quick to forgive, and to forget personal affront.  
[/size][/font]*[font=Arial,Helvetica][size=-1](shamefully stolen off of Mr. Billings website)
[/size][/font] 
 To me it really sounds like this pledge was written as a direct result of some one misusing their skills.

 This is just my interpertation and has no factual standing what so ever.:idunno:

 -Josh-​ [font=Arial,Helvetica][size=-1]
[/size][/font]


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## rmcrobertson (Jun 23, 2004)

Um...ah...why in the world should adults recite pledges? As though they were some substitute for what's really in the heart?

At first glance, I thought they were cool, too. Somebody smarter talked me out of it. And this stuff about, "unswerving loyalty to my instructor?" Sorry, but this is a kenpo thread, right? Do we really want to recite a line like that, given some of our history--Mr. Mitose's downfall comes immediately to mind, but there have been others. 

It seems to me that heads of schools, instructors, and senior students should be setting real examples, not teaching pledges. For example, anybody else ever get the feeling that some of the people screaming, "Kill 'em!" at little kids sparring, or behaving arrogantly in sparring themselves, or cranking out sloppy and spiritless forms, or teaching students to just wail away and screw the technique, are some of the people who insist on the pledges most?

I agree that even in my short time in kenpo, there's some weird sort of slippage in how people behave--and at times, I suspect that kenpo has contributed to that slippage. But scotch-taping over that, with recited words...I'm doubtin' it.

Personally, I think that all new students should have to watch the pilot of, "Kung Fu." At least they'd have seen some of the major myths, and have some clue about what they're getting into.


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## Touch Of Death (Jun 23, 2004)

rmcrobertson said:
			
		

> Um...ah...why in the world should adults recite pledges? As though they were some substitute for what's really in the heart?
> 
> At first glance, I thought they were cool, too. Somebody smarter talked me out of it. And this stuff about, "unswerving loyalty to my instructor?" Sorry, but this is a kenpo thread, right? Do we really want to recite a line like that, given some of our history--Mr. Mitose's downfall comes immediately to mind, but there have been others.
> 
> ...


Wow... I agree and disagree. The unswerving loyalty thing bothers me but as far as pledges go in general. I believe memorizing and repeating an oath does effect behavior. The pledge of alegiance to the US is in my opinion part of what makes people feel an alegiance, which is why I am concerned about the unswerving loyalty to the association thing. Repetition of mysoginistic Rap lyrics over and over is what scares the hell out of parents, not the lyric in and of its self. With repetition comes internalization good or bad. (I can quote you any number of NWA lyrics by the way)
Sean


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## rmcrobertson (Jun 23, 2004)

I agree with you about internalization, Sean. It's part of what bothers me...especially given the history (and some of the present) of kenpo, I really doubt that we want adults internalizing loyalty oaths of any kind.

After all, we're supposed to be free, right? And thoughtful? 

Further, the whole spirit of kenpo--which insists on criticizing the tradition, with its dead recitation of frozen kata, rituals, and all the rest (not saying I wholly agree, just that that's the basic premise of kenpo)--should be against such recitations. 

It just seems to me that we want something better than pledges, something less solid but more real. Or are we just assuming that, "kids today," can't handle that? 

And look at some of our religious traditions--aren't they also about going beyond set rules, and growing up into true morality? Well...


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## Touch Of Death (Jun 23, 2004)

rmcrobertson said:
			
		

> I agree with you about internalization, Sean. It's part of what bothers me...especially given the history (and some of the present) of kenpo, I really doubt that we want adults internalizing loyalty oaths of any kind.
> 
> After all, we're supposed to be free, right? And thoughtful?
> 
> ...


To be honest I don't know if the school where I train requires the pledges for each belt level.(I'm a new student at a new school) If we do its at test time. Day to day we spend time talking about respect, integity ect. we are more interested in the fact that they can give defenitions and relate their usefullness in day to day life. However they must be able to recite THE PLEDGE," I come to you with Karate, my empty hand..."
Sean
Sean


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