# Short form one....



## Goldendragon7 (May 31, 2002)

is considered a dictionary of motion...... just what definitions are there.....


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## Seig (May 31, 2002)

Stepping(transitions between stances), blocking, striking, multiple zones of defense/attack


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## Rainman (May 31, 2002)

It contains:

Blocks: Inward, outward, upward, downward

Stances: nuetral bow, cat stance, twist stance, etc- derivitives of a horse stance.

Concepts:  Double factor, methods, paths, 4 angles of attack using the clock principle-12-3-6 and 9 o'clock etc.

I think the Instructor defines.  The more precise the form the more the instructor has taught about it- or the more the student has been taught about using the tools of the trade.   I believe only then can the form start to define.   





:asian:


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## Klondike93 (May 31, 2002)

The double factor would be the block with the back elbow?


:asian:


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## jfarnsworth (May 31, 2002)

The transition from moving stance to stance with your blocks. The blocks crossing at a particular point across your centerline. Once again just my opinion.
Jason Farnsworth


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## Rainman (May 31, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Klondike93 _
> 
> *The double factor would be the block with the back elbow?
> 
> ...



Sure is- as well as opposing forces.

:asian:


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## C.E.Jackson (Jun 1, 2002)

The back elbow can also be thought of as a strike... making this movement combined with the inward block as a two man attack.

The back elbow can also be thought of as a countergrab and pull against a grab and the inward block thought of as a strike against the opponents elbow for a break.



> _Originally posted by Klondike93 _
> 
> *The double factor would be the block with the back elbow?
> 
> ...


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## C.E.Jackson (Jun 1, 2002)

And this is just the opening move!!!


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## Klondike93 (Jun 1, 2002)

I'm begining to see why it's important to not just look at the pictures, but to also read the text.


:asian:


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## Rainman (Jun 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Klondike93 _
> 
> *I'm begining to see why it's important to not just look at the pictures, but to also read the text.
> 
> ...



Right- and understanding depth ends with how far you want to take it.

:asian:


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## Sandor (Jun 1, 2002)

How about Power Principles in Short One?

Short One gives examples of;

Marriage of Gravity
Torque (rotation and counter rotation)
Backup Mass

Peace,
Sandor


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## Klondike93 (Jun 1, 2002)

Torque and back up mass I understand, but where does marriage of gravity come in?


:asian:


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## JD_Nelson (Jun 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by C.E.Jackson _
> 
> *The back elbow can also be thought of as a strike... making this movement combined with the inward block as a two man attack.
> 
> ...




This is similar to the B1a and B1b methods is it not??? instead of striking to the to the elbow you could apply one of these i think.  

Not sure if the Freestyle terminology is being used  correctly here???

~~~Salute~~~

Jeremy


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## Rob_Broad (Jun 1, 2002)

What about "Spatial Orientation"?


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## jfarnsworth (Jun 1, 2002)

Hmm.
My opinion is it occurs when you settle into your stances (rooting), I could be wrong but that's how I'd look at it.
Jason Farnsworth


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## Rainman (Jun 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Bonehead _
> 
> *What about "Spatial Orientation"? *



what's that? 

:asian:


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## Rob_Broad (Jun 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Rainman _
> 
> *
> 
> ...



It is one's ability/inability to be perceptive and functional in situations such as:

The body inverted

The body rotating

The body at heights

The body in flight



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Why Is Spatial Orientation Important?
Safety in the martial arts is, of course, paramount. It is also dependent upon the student knowing where they are.

The execution of many skills relies on the correct training of some muscular action during the performance of the skill. The more aware the student is of what the body is doing, where the body is, where the limbs are relative to the body, etc., the safer the student will be.



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What Limits One's Spatial Orientation Abilities?
This motor attribute is governed for the most part, by the kinesthetic sense that is compromised of two main anatomical components: the Vestibular System and the Proprioceptive System. The Vestibular System consists of the semi-circular canals in the middle ear and the Proprioceptive System consists of many different sensory receptors in the muscles, tendons and ligaments that monitor the position of body parts relative to the body.

As with all other senses, the kinesthetic sense responds to concentrated usage with greater sensitivity and to lack of usage with reduced sensitivity. .


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## Kalicombat (Jun 2, 2002)

Short Form 1, as stated in INFINITE INSIGHTS, Volume 5, teaches 17 points:
1. Staying down while in a stance.
2. To use an erect carriage.
3. Increasing peripheral vision
4. Always looking at your opponent.
5. Never exposing your back unnecessarily.
6. How to cover in a neutral bow stance.
7. To keep your head at a constant level while changing stances.
8. How to retreat from an opponent when you turn to face the then unkown.
9. Basic timing of hands and feet.
10. How to retreat from an opponent while retreating, (opposite hand, opposite foot).
11. Relaxing and tensing at the proper moment.
12. Angle changes in preparation for a mass attack.
13. How to use the opposite arm as a hidden weapon.
14. How to move up and down in an "L" pattern.
15. Repetition of the four basic blocks while you are retreating.
16. To have your block make contact at a distance from you so that your opponents punch will be diverted.
17. Crisp moves with snap and torque. 

Gary Catherman


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## Goldendragon7 (Jun 2, 2002)

What about (not in any particular order)...

1.  Lowering height
2.  Narrowing width
3.  Increasing depth
4.  Breathing
5.  Proper Body Alignment
6.  Point of Origin
7.  Directional Harmony
8.  Coordinative Explosion
9.  Back Up Mass
10. Knee checks
11. Rear Buckles
12. Settling
13. Timing
14. Rotational Force (body) & (arms)
15. RLLR - LRRL Hand Coordination
16. LRRL - RLLR Foot Coordination
17. Others..........
:asian:


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## C.E.Jackson (Jun 2, 2002)

If you wanted to take a good look at ALL the theories and principles, as well as possible self defense applications in Short Form 1 ... you could probably spend up to a year on this form ALONE!:shrug:


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## Goldendragon7 (Jun 2, 2002)

:asian:


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## Rainman (Jun 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Bonehead _
> 
> *
> 
> ...



Intersting material, where did it come from?

:asian:


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## Bob Hubbard (Aug 19, 2002)

Mod Note: This is a thinned down copy of a previous thread.:asian:


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## Sigung86 (Aug 19, 2002)

How about throws, locks and cavity presses? :lol:

Dan


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## Goldendragon7 (Aug 19, 2002)

they are all there.......

:asian:


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## Sigung86 (Aug 20, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Goldendragon7 _
> 
> *they are all there.......
> 
> :asian: *



Where?

Dan:asian:


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## jeffkyle (Aug 20, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Goldendragon7 _
> 
> *What about (not in any particular order)...
> 
> ...




I have never though of it that way....hmmmmmmm..that opens up a lot of new doors..  Thanks!


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## Doc (Aug 28, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Sigung86 _
> 
> *
> 
> ...



Dan, I thought you had stopped doing that. Watch out for the crickets, they can be deafening.


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## Sigung86 (Aug 28, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Doc _
> 
> *
> 
> Dan, I thought you had stopped doing that. Watch out for the crickets, they can be deafening. *



:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: 

Thanks for the heads up!

Dan "My Great Grandaddy was the Evil Fu-Manchu" Farmer


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## Elfan (Dec 1, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Kalicombat _
> 
> *Short Form 1, as stated in INFINITE INSIGHTS, Volume 5, teaches 17 points:
> 1. Staying down while in a stance.
> ...



Is that the exact order and wording from II 5?



> _Originally posted by C.E.Jackson _
> 
> *If you wanted to take a good look at ALL the theories and principles, as well as possible self defense applications in Short Form 1 ... you could probably spend up to a year on this form ALONE!:shrug: *



Well it seems to me that that is exactly what you want to do.  At orange you shoudn't be doing Short Form 1 like you did at your yellow belt test, it should be even better.  At purple it should be better still. Make sense?

How many people actually require something like that at your schools?


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## Kenpomachine (Dec 2, 2002)

I agree with you Elfan.
You couldn't possible tell a yellow belt to extract all those teachings at first. They have enough with the foot-block coordination, changing directions and then imagining someone punching them to request more of thems.

But I must tell that I never thought of short one as exhaustive as you made look into it. And at first, with the cat stance and so, I even thought you were talking af long one.  So it's great to read those wondedrful msg of yours.


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## SingingTiger (Dec 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Elfan _
> 
> *At orange you shoudn't be doing Short Form 1 like you did at your yellow belt test, it should be even better.  At purple it should be better still. Make sense?
> 
> How many people actually require something like that at your schools? *



The owner of my school is fond of saying that he considers Short One to be one of the most challenging forms.  And all of those who conduct tests do, indeed, expect progressively better form while executing Short 1 as you progress up the chart.

Rich


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## desert_dragon (Mar 2, 2003)

While practicing short form 1  or any other form for that matter...try executing the form in reverse. First move step back with your left foot into a left neutral bow facing six o'clock as you simultaneously execute a right inward block followed by a left downward block creating double factoring as your right fist returns to chamber at your right hip utilizing torque in its return motion...etc. What does this teach? What about using the defensive (blocks) moves as offensive (strikes) moves? ie:the downward block could be used as a hammerfist the right inward block could be used as first a check or as a heelpalm claw or a simple punch. This all comes back to the question , when is a block a block and a punch a punch? All defensive moves can compound to offensive and vice versa


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## jazkiljok (Mar 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by desert_dragon _
> *. This all comes back to the question , when is a block a block and a punch a punch? All defensive moves can compound to offensive and vice versa *



and that's still a great question-- but i'd take it step further and ask do you feel a block HAS the same inherent components of a strike or do you feel  there is a significant difference - is intent truly all that makes one one thing  or changes it to the other or are there physical principles that apply mostly to one and not the other.

I've heard opposing views in the past-- but i'd be interested in hearing what folks here think.


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## ProfessorKenpo (Mar 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by desert_dragon _
> *While practicing short form 1  or any other form for that matter...try executing the form in reverse. First move step back with your left foot into a left neutral bow facing six o'clock as you simultaneously execute a right inward block followed by a left downward block creating double factoring as your right fist returns to chamber at your right hip utilizing torque in its return motion...etc. What does this teach? What about using the defensive (blocks) moves as offensive (strikes) moves? ie:the downward block could be used as a hammerfist the right inward block could be used as first a check or as a heelpalm claw or a simple punch. This all comes back to the question , when is a block a block and a punch a punch? All defensive moves can compound to offensive and vice versa *




Is this who I think it is  LOL?   No one else thinks this way but people I know, right E.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde


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## Kenpo Yahoo (Mar 7, 2003)

AKKI form one is similiar to a combined short form 1 and long form 1 sort of.  

It contains various contact manipulation techniques and weapon disarms, but like all good kenpo they tend to hide in plain sight :shrug:


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## Doc (Mar 8, 2003)

> _Originally posted by jazkiljok _
> *and that's still a great question-- but i'd take it step further and ask do you feel a block HAS the same inherent components of a strike or do you feel  there is a significant difference - is intent truly all that makes one one thing  or changes it to the other or are there physical principles that apply mostly to one and not the other.
> 
> I've heard opposing views in the past-- but i'd be interested in hearing what folks here think. *



Mental point of reference plays an important part.


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 9, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Doc _*
> Mental point of reference plays an important part. *



You're gonna get flooded with questions!  Like.... what is that!


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## desert_dragon (Mar 10, 2003)

yeah Clyde its me. I thought it was time to knock some rust off and start thinking again! LOL


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## Sigung86 (Mar 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Goldendragon7 _
> *You're gonna get flooded with questions!  Like.... what is that!
> 
> *



It is, essentially, perception Dennis.  Like mind set ... If my mind set is that you are tougher than me, then every time we fight ... You are going to win, by definition.

Block/strike is the same way... If you look at a block as simply a block, then in your paradigm, that is all it will ever be.  If you look at a block as an opportunity to strike ... Ahhhh .... Then it takes on a completely different significance.  Capishe?

Dan "I may be wrong, but I am trying" Farmer


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Sigung86 _*
> Capishe?
> *



HuH?
 

:shrug:


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## Kirk (Mar 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Goldendragon7 _
> *HuH?
> *



He means "Capisci". 
Capisci paisan?


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## Goldendragon7 (Mar 10, 2003)




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## Sigung86 (Mar 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Kirk _
> *He means "Capisci".
> Capisci paisan?  *



No I didn't!  I meant capish!  I can't help it if they never learned to spell correct English in Italy!!!!!!!!!  Eh PieZahn???

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dan


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## brianhunter (Mar 11, 2003)

I like your flag in your signature there! Thats a nice one!


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## ProfessorKenpo (Mar 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by desert_dragon _
> *yeah Clyde its me. I thought it was time to knock some rust off and start thinking again! LOL *



Well it's about time, I knew the posts were to good not to be, and the way cool ScreenName.  Give me a call when you're ready to go down to Larry's with me on a Saturday.    Probably the next time on the 29th and we'll hit the computer fair on the way home Yeeehaa.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde


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## jeffkyle (Apr 25, 2003)

> _Originally posted by ProfessorKenpo _
> *Well it's about time, I knew the posts were to good not to be, and the way cool ScreenName.  Give me a call when you're ready to go down to Larry's with me on a Saturday.    Probably the next time on the 29th and we'll hit the computer fair on the way home Yeeehaa.
> 
> Have a great Kenpo day
> ...



What is up with you and those computer fairs??  LOL!  JK!


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## Making the Journey (Jan 29, 2006)

Klondike93 said:
			
		

> Torque and back up mass I understand, but where does marriage of gravity come in?
> 
> 
> :asian:


 
I believe that marriage of gravity comes into play by rooting yuorself into your stances... Also, if all blocks are strikes and all strikes should move in a downward motion(with the exception of upward blocks, upper cuts, etc. which then reverse marraige of gravity is effective), then marraige of gravity definitly plays a role...


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## Making the Journey (Jan 29, 2006)

Goldendragon7 said:
			
		

> is considered a dictionary of motion...... just what definitions are there.....


 

I think that directional harmony is definitly something short one can teach.  Mentioned before, short one teaches marraige of gravity, back up mass, and torque, but without directional harmony you cannot acheive those three power principles.


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