# JKD effectiveness?



## OldManJim (Aug 4, 2019)

So I have another post asking about bjj at different schools. One of the schools has JKD as part of the curriculum. It’s directly from Dan Inosanto so I guess it’d fall under Concepts? Ron Balicki will be visiting in November at this school. My question is, is JKD (in this particular branch I guess you’d say) effective for self defense? What are it’s pros and cons?


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## jobo (Aug 4, 2019)

OldManJim said:


> So I have another post asking about bjj at different schools. One of the schools has JKD as part of the curriculum. It’s directly from Dan Inosanto so I guess it’d fall under Concepts? Ron Balicki will be visiting in November at this school. My question is, is JKD (in this particular branch I guess you’d say) effective for self defense? What are it’s pros and cons?


your in danger of being like a few other posters and spend so long wondering which art is best , you forget to study an art, jkd is undsibtably better at self defenc e than what your doing now, how effective that is in reality depends more on you than the art you studif your really really concerned with self defence, get your self hyper fit and do an art with full contact sparing, , anything else is less


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

The full contact or pressure testing is a no brainer, the concept of JKD is to build an effective system that suits you, be it wing chun and BJJ or western boxing and judo, if you are missing the point, perhaps you do not fully understand yourself. Yes it's great to be fit jobo, but as the founder of the concept said, take what's useful, and disgard the rest.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

Oh and old man Jim,  best start reading up on Systema, because Guru Dan has been training it for approx 2 years.


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## jobo (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> The full contact or pressure testing is a no brainer, the concept of JKD is to build an effective system that suits you, be it wing chun and BJJ or western boxing and judo, if you are missing the point, perhaps you do not fully understand yourself. Yes it's great to be fit jobo, but as the founder of the concept said, take what's useful, and disgard the rest.


the founder of the concept appeared to be incredibly fit, so perhaps fitness wasn't one of the things he thought could be left


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

I agree he was extremely fit, and was an advecote of your skill improves as your fitness does, and your fitness improves as your skill does, but his approach did not put physical attributes over abilities, in fact some of his biggest pointers where the water principle, keep moving, be relaxed and natural, try to hide your intensions within your movements.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

Just a quick point, Frank Bruno, I hear you chuckling, but 45 fights, 40 wins 38 of those by knock out, his 5 loses were, 2 to mike Tyson (1 in mikes prime and one to regain the title after the buster Douglas loss) 1 to Lennox lewis, and 1 to Tim Witherspoon, 1 to an up and coming James Bone crusher Smith,  experts now say, Tyson was a better fighter, but the others they now say, Frank was so fit, even his muscles had muscles, his punch was like getting hit by a motorbike at 30 mph, but because he was so fit, come the later rounds, he could not take in enough oxygen to fuel his muscles. There does come a point when being fit and your skill level, are no longer compatible.


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## Buka (Aug 4, 2019)

OldManJim said:


> So I have another post asking about bjj at different schools. One of the schools has JKD as part of the curriculum. It’s directly from Dan Inosanto so I guess it’d fall under Concepts? Ron Balicki will be visiting in November at this school. My question is, is JKD (in this particular branch I guess you’d say) effective for self defense? What are it’s pros and cons?



JKD is really good in my opinion. Always worked well against me, that's for sure.

But in the other thread you said you were only interested in BJJ, so both might overwhelm you, or at least take up too much of your time.

But maybe that's because you be old.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

Buka said:


> But maybe that's because you be old.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> Just a quick point, Frank Bruno, I hear you chuckling, but 45 fights, 40 wins 38 of those by knock out, his 5 loses were, 2 to mike Tyson (1 in mikes prime and one to regain the title after the buster Douglas loss) 1 to Lennox lewis, and 1 to Tim Witherspoon, 1 to an up and coming James Bone crusher Smith,  experts now say, Tyson was a better fighter, but the others they now say, Frank was so fit, even his muscles had muscles, his punch was like getting hit by a motorbike at 30 mph, but because he was so fit, come the later rounds, he could not take in enough oxygen to fuel his muscles. There does come a point when being fit and your skill level, are no longer compatible.


What you're describing isn't being too fit, it's having too much muscle.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

kempodisciple said:


> What you're describing isn't being too fit, it's having too much muscle.


Through becoming obsessed with fitness


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> I agree he was extremely fit, and was an advecote of your skill improves as your fitness does, and your fitness improves as your skill does, but his approach did not put physical attributes over abilities, in fact some of his biggest pointers where the water principle, keep moving, be relaxed and natural, try to hide your intensions within your movements.


And based on how I've heard bruce lee split his time training MA & fitness, I would be shocked to find out that he didn't consider them equally important. Also, i dont see how those quotes relate to fitness vs non-fitness.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> Through becoming obsessed with fitness


Nah, becoming obsessed with musclebuilding. If he was obsessed with fitness, he'd portion his time better between musclebuilding and cardio, and be able to last all his rounds.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

The man used to run a marathon twice a week, yes he raised a lot of money for charity, but his obsession led him to being sectioned under the mental health act, he lost his family, his respect from most, and his sanity, thankfully he is recovering now.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

Talking about frank


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## jobo (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> Just a quick point, Frank Bruno, I hear you chuckling, but 45 fights, 40 wins 38 of those by knock out, his 5 loses were, 2 to mike Tyson (1 in mikes prime and one to regain the title after the buster Douglas loss) 1 to Lennox lewis, and 1 to Tim Witherspoon, 1 to an up and coming James Bone crusher Smith,  experts now say, Tyson was a better fighter, but the others they now say, Frank was so fit, even his muscles had muscles, his punch was like getting hit by a motorbike at 30 mph, but because he was so fit, come the later rounds, he could not take in enough oxygen to fuel his muscles. There does come a point when being fit and your skill level, are no longer compatible.


I saw most of big franks fights, and all other things being equal he wasn't very good, he was carefully managed to fight " bums" he was just to big for and some of them gave him a good run for his money, before h eventually  knocked them out  I remember him being booed of a good few times. when he did fight anyone of merit he lost, I remember fighting a very curvy Tim Witherspoon and losing heavily, if someone that fat can beat you, your problem is having to much muscle, its that your  ***  it didn't even get to the later rounds


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> The man used to run a marathon twice a week, yes he raised a lot of money for charity, but his obsession led him to being sectioned under the mental health act, he lost his family, his respect from most, and his sanity, thankfully he is recovering now.


Thats interesting. Id revise my other statement and say that he probably was obsessed with fitness too much-but the issue you pointed out still wasnt an issue so much with fitness, as that he spent too much time on musclebuilding. My reason for saying this is that i believe at some point muscle does become counterproductive, but i dont believe thats the case for cardio.


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

Tyson, bone crusher Smith and Lewis bums, hmmmm


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

kempodisciple said:


> Thats interesting. Id revise my other statement and say that he probably was obsessed with fitness too much-but the issue you pointed out still wasnt an issue so much with fitness, as that he spent too much time on musclebuilding. My reason for saying this is that i believe at some point muscle does become counterproductive, but i dont believe thats the case for cardio.


I take your point, but there has to be a balance, that fits with each individual.


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## jobo (Aug 4, 2019)

Gweilo said:


> Tyson, bone crusher Smith and Lewis bums, hmmmm


no there the ones he lost to, the bums were the ones he beat

he was completely out boxed by a 37 to Joe bugner, who was about half his size, before landing a lucky punch


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## Gweilo (Aug 4, 2019)

jobo said:


> no there the ones he lost to, the bums were the ones he beat


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## PhotonGuy (Aug 4, 2019)

OldManJim said:


> So I have another post asking about bjj at different schools. One of the schools has JKD as part of the curriculum. It’s directly from Dan Inosanto so I guess it’d fall under Concepts? Ron Balicki will be visiting in November at this school. My question is, is JKD (in this particular branch I guess you’d say) effective for self defense? What are it’s pros and cons?


If its directly from Dan Insanto then I would say yes its effective. Dan Insanto is just one step away from Bruce Lee when it comes to JKD. Dan trained alongside Bruce Lee and they were good friends, so I would definitely say the style is most effective if its under Dan Insanto.


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## FinalStreet (Jul 21, 2020)

1


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## punisher73 (Jul 21, 2020)

Gweilo said:


> I agree he was extremely fit, and was an advecote of your skill improves as your fitness does, and your fitness improves as your skill does, but his approach did not put physical attributes over abilities, in fact some of his biggest pointers where the water principle, keep moving, be relaxed and natural, try to hide your intensions within your movements.



No, as a matter of fact it did.  If you read his notes (Tao of JKD) when he lists the "facts of JKD" weight training is listed as one of them.  When he talked about the "preliminaires" in that book he said, _*"Training is one of the most neglected phases of athletics. Too much time is given to the development of skill and too little to the development of the individual for participation".  *_In fact, it was lack of physical fitness (his fight with Wong Jack Man taking way too long) that sparked him into creating JKD and better strength and conditioning methods along with developing his own approach to martial arts.


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