# new rank every 6 months??



## Tlaloc (Apr 7, 2007)

So I recently began studying (for the second time in my life) cheezic tang soo do with a club at my university which holds classes twice a week for 2 hours. As much as I love doing it again, I have to admit I'm somewhat weary of the way they reward ranks. The idea in the club seems to be that we test at the end of every semester (so after about 4 months of consecutive training), and they seem to reward everyone a new rank during the test. The other thing is that they skip yellow belt, so a white belt tests for 8 gup blue their first testing. 

We also learn on average 2 forms per semester. Last class I learned Pyung ahn ee dan (I'm currently at 8 gup) and the 4 gups are learning bassai dai already. 

While I really cant say for sure, I do feel like I am learning ALOT in the class, but I'm not certain if the way they test is... proper I suppose? Any thoughts?


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## terryl965 (Apr 7, 2007)

If you feel you are getting value out of the training then it is all good. For me a test is when you are ready not prearrange by a timetable just my opinion.


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## ArmorOfGod (Apr 7, 2007)

It sounds somewhat reasonable to me, assuming the teaching is done right.  Still, I would have to watch to be sure of it.
Like the above poster said, as long as you feel you are getting good training, that is all that matters.

AoG


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## MBuzzy (Apr 7, 2007)

I wouldn't worry much about skipping a belt.  A lot of schools have added and deleted belts.  In fact, Originally, TSD was meant to have only White, Yellow, Green, Red, and Black (Midnight Blue) and 8 gup levels.  

As for what you learn and the speed....it is up to your instructor.  Many organizations have formalized the test system and set "time in grade" requirements and a standard curriculum, which is great.  But if your current instructor doesn't follow the curriculum from your last school, it doesn't mean there is anything wrong.


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## Tlaloc (Apr 7, 2007)

Thanks for your opinion guys. I feel quite confident in what we are learning and I do understand that it's what the knowledge, wisdom, and spirit that you gain from martial arts that matters, and not what color your belt is (hell, I've heard of some forms of martial arts that dont even have a belt system at all!). 
I remember when i was studying mu duk kwan tang soo do they had the white, orange, green, red, midnight blue, black system, and the style that I'm learning now is pretty much the same except for instead of white-orange-green, it's white-yellow-blue-purple-green. Weird stuff, I'm not that big of a fan of so many colors quite honestly.

I think I'm learning enough. The only thing that bugs me is that occassionally I would feel that we over emphasize sparring, and breaking and self defense are put so far onto the back burner that in one semester, we spend about a total of 1 hour on breaking and probably around 3 hours of self defense.

But, no school is perfect, right?


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## JT_the_Ninja (Apr 9, 2007)

Tlaloc said:


> So I recently began studying (for the second time in my life) cheezic tang soo do with a club at my university which holds classes twice a week for 2 hours. As much as I love doing it again, I have to admit I'm somewhat weary of the way they reward ranks. The idea in the club seems to be that we test at the end of every semester (so after about 4 months of consecutive training), and they seem to reward everyone a new rank during the test. The other thing is that they skip yellow belt, so a white belt tests for 8 gup blue their first testing.


Well, 6 months for the first few gup tests isn't all that bad, I'd say -- then again, my school has 10 gup levels and 2 pre-test levels before cho dan. 9 gup levels x 6 months per level = somewhere around 5 years for cho dan? Not bad. 



Tlaloc said:


> We also learn on average 2 forms per semester. Last class I learned Pyung ahn ee dan (I'm currently at 8 gup) and the 4 gups are learning bassai dai already.


Whoa...that's a bit rushed. I didn't learn bassai dai until 1st gup. I guess if you're going to give it 6 months between lower-belt tests, it's not all that bad, but two hyung per testing period is still a bit off to me, somehow.

As to everyone passing gup tests, that's pretty common from where I'm sitting, up to a point. Kids get an easy time passing, only failing if they don't even try, but even they really have to show good technique when they get to tests closer to cho dan level. And from what I hear, the ITF tests are getting stricter, thankfully. 

Just make sure your techniques are the best you can make them. If you _want_ to get something out of TSD training, you'll get it.


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## McZ (Apr 9, 2007)

first - in Cheezic Tang Soo Do 9th gup is not yellow belt - its orange belt
second - i this federation bassai hyung is for 3rd Gup


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## Drac (Apr 9, 2007)

terryl965 said:


> If you feel you are getting value out of the training then it is all good.


 
If you've learned the moves and they come to you without having to really think about it,* "you have learned"*



			
				Terryl965 said:
			
		

> For me a test is when you are ready not prearrange by a timetable just my opinion.


 
I agree...


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## McZ (Apr 9, 2007)




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## foggymorning162 (Apr 13, 2007)

Welcome to the forum and to the federation. I am also a student of Cheezic Tang Soo Do. I train at Federation Headquarters in Naugatuck Don't panic I won't tell the Grand Master you questioned the rankings . I can tell you that you will probably move faster because lets face it your entire class is at it's physical and mental peak where as a class of junior students is not mentally ready to move that quick and a normal class of adults might have people like me who aren't so young anymore and there for have fallen off that peak. As far as what the ratio of forms to sparring and breaking etc., that is your instructor not federation every teacher will tend to teach  more of what they are personally good at or know best. I hope this helps you and I hope to see you at the next tournament.:uhyeah:


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## foggymorning162 (Apr 13, 2007)

McZ said:


>


Not quite right but it's too much to type right now. Cheezic Federation also uses 1/2 gup rankings.


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## Tlaloc (Apr 14, 2007)

Once again, thank you everyone for all the information!

Nice to see someone in the cheezic federation, foggymorning! Next class that I go to, I think I'll ask my instructor about those Chil sung forms, because I'm actually not sure if we're learning those in my classes, which would be kind of a disappointment!

I'll also have to see about finding another tsd school where I live, because I'm only in college for 2 more years (which I have a feeeling, it will go by very quickly). By then, I hope to be either at 4 or 3 gup.

But until then, time to go practice those forms and everything


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## johnboy (Apr 15, 2007)

I don't know what you meant by skipping yellow because my TSD go white, orange, green, brown, red, blue, black. and there is one strip onthe white through red belts.


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## JT_the_Ninja (Apr 15, 2007)

Since McZ posted a handy image, I thought I'd post another image for illustration's sake, to show how different organizations handle belt rankings. Here's the ITF system, up to 1st dan:





Yes, I made this in Paint; turns out that's a pretty fast way to do something like this. Since this thread is about time between promotions, I also included that information. These are approximate times, though. Promotion isn't directly linked to time but rather to passing the tests which can only be taken after certain time distances. 

This also makes it clear why I often say it felt like I was a red belt forever. You can get to the red belt level (3rd gup) in 21 months, but then you're a red belt for another 30 months, and then some, since they usually don't let you know if you passed your dan test until a few months after you take it. At my level, I don't even count the time any more till my next belt test, since it's measured in years/recertifications, not months. Back then, though, it seemed like an eternity.


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## tellner (Apr 15, 2007)

I really can't see the point in all those stripes and levels. The distinctions between student ranks are, in my considered opinion, way too fine grained. If there's a fee along with every test, well, I can see the point for the organization. Otherwise it doesn't seem like it helps very much.


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## JT_the_Ninja (Apr 15, 2007)

tellner said:


> I really can't see the point in all those stripes and levels. The distinctions between student ranks are, in my considered opinion, way too fine grained. If there's a fee along with every test, well, I can see the point for the organization. Otherwise it doesn't seem like it helps very much.



Yeah, there is a fee for each test...won't say there are completely pure reasons for having so many levels. However, there is at least a good reason behind having multiple pretests before cho dan. The idea of being a "black belt" has too much of a wrong connotation in the mind of Americans. People seem to think that when you get a black belt, you've mastered the art. That's when most people quit, in fact. Make it a long enough target, and at least it's less of a fruitless effort when they do so.

Then you take a look at McDojangs where you can get a black belt in 18 months (or less). Americans look for achievement. If they don't feel they're achieving anything, they lose interest. Note that the first 6 gup levels for an ITF student only take 3 months between tests. Having them so often keeps up that feeling of achievement, I guess. Then they get to red belt and we find out who stays and who gives up when it gets harder and the tests are farther apart. Then, when those that stay make it to cho dan, we see who sticks with it when there are years between tests and it gets exponentially harder. 

Gotta thin out the faint-hearted somehow, I guess.


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## Chizikunbo (Apr 15, 2007)

Interesting...


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## McZ (Apr 16, 2007)

foggymorning162 said:


> Not quite right but it's too much to type right now. Cheezic Federation also uses 1/2 gup rankings.



in Poland we dont use 1/2 gup rankings.


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## JT_the_Ninja (Apr 16, 2007)

foggymorning162 said:


> Not quite right but it's too much to type right now. Cheezic Federation also uses 1/2 gup rankings.



1/2 gup rankings? That's a bit much, don't you think?


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## tellner (Apr 16, 2007)

What's the purpose of all these ranks and sub-ranks? It isn't pedagogy. It isn't necessary as a quick thumbnail impression for visiting people.


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