# Viability in combat



## shesulsa (Aug 8, 2005)

Hand to hand, baby.  It's not uncommon for joint locks to be used for disarming - care to expand on that?


----------



## Tgace (Aug 9, 2005)

In real life, against a resisting opponent, classic "joint locks" are very tough to pull off.


----------



## Rich Parsons (Aug 9, 2005)

Tgace said:
			
		

> In real life, against a resisting opponent, classic "joint locks" are very tough to pull off.




I have found that if a joint lock works, it is becuase it jsut happend, or the opponent did not see it coming or understand it. 

I like them for it gives me away to control the body, and by knowing that if a person resists in one direction there  most likely is a different lock or control in another direction.

I also know that the body seems to want to stay attached to the head, so where ever the head goes, the body follows.


----------



## Tgace (Aug 9, 2005)

I think joint "attacks" like popping elbows, stomping on wrists and ankles, kicking knees  etc. are a lot more likely to be effective in a "fight". I have put people into wrist locks at work, but all of them have been what I term "maybe" people. Not fully resisting, but not following commands either. The trick is to not be so "commited" to making the lock work that you just hang on and start wrestling over it when you should go to plan B.


----------



## Paul B (Aug 9, 2005)

Yes they are viable. 

Flow drills..lot's and lot's-o-flow drills. Build the resistance level up as you go.


----------



## matt.m (Jul 14, 2006)

I was in Haiti in 1994 while serving in the USMC.  Sorry I am going to agree with Paul B.  During riot control and house to house fighting we couldn't just shoot someone.  However, using the hapkido son mok so (wrist techniques) and Eui Bok Soo (Clothes techniques) was very effective.  Using the three foot N.A.T.O. batons for hapkido cane was awesome.

Hapkido is very effective, if you practice.  Just like Tae Kwon Do, Karate, Aikido, Wing Chun.  Whatever, if practiced, it can be used effectively.

It is easy to pick on a white or yellow belt and say, "I can defend this way or that".  "It is not effective because of X,Y,Z."  

However these statements are not as readily made to a person holding dan ranking in whatever art.


----------



## spinkick (Jul 16, 2006)

I disagree with Paul B. If someone resists my joint lock then i turn it into another jointlock goinbg the way he is resisting thats the beauty of hapkido


----------



## iron_ox (Jul 17, 2006)

Hello all,

I think that it is important to consider that not all Hapkido is the same.  

Frankly, I have always taught using heavy resistance, and find that the opponent is put in much worse pain when correct body mechanics are employed to do a joint lock.

If the body is already going one way, to completely change direction and flow is often wasteful and compromising of the defender.  Changing direction under resistance occasionaly has its place, but nothing takes the place of learning correct body mechanics and practicing those.  I most often see complete redirection of resistance as a counter to a technique or as a counter to a counter motion, not JUST resistance.


----------



## Paul B (Jul 17, 2006)

iron_ox said:
			
		

> Hello all,
> 
> Frankly, I have always taught using heavy resistance, and find that the opponent is put in much worse pain when correct body mechanics are employed to do a joint lock.
> 
> If the body is already going one way, to completely change direction and flow is often wasteful and compromising of the defender. Changing direction under resistance occasionaly has its place, but nothing takes the place of learning correct body mechanics and practicing those. I most often see complete redirection of resistance as a counter to a technique or as a counter to a counter motion, not JUST resistance.


 
Resisting or "locking out"/stiffening up"..as Kevin rightly pointed out..really does increase the pain level when the lock is applied and sunk correctly. 

I think the the perceived difference in our approach may be the use of the escaping motion of the partner which leads into our next technique,which is usually the direction the attacker is moving.._away_ from the pain.

Everyone has started to apply an S-Lock or J. "Kote Mawashi/Nikkyo" and had their partner roll their elbow over. Can we crank? Sure..and it will hurt. The easy option IMO,without wasting energy on the defenders part, would be to "flow" with his turning motion into a cutting arm bar or another appropriate technique. 

That little scenario is what I mean by flow drills and combative sequencing. I hope I cleared that up a bit.


----------

