# Metallica Fans, recommendations?



## Flying Crane (Aug 17, 2008)

Hi Folks,

I've never paid much attention to Metallica, but lately I've been running across some of their music on the radio, and I'm kind of digging it.

Any recommendations on some good CDs to start with?

Thanks!


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## Kreth (Aug 17, 2008)

Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


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## MJS (Aug 17, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


 
I 2nd these selections!:ultracool


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## Jenna (Aug 17, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


Agree 99% 

I would go for the black album first, MoP second   J


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## Flying Crane (Aug 17, 2008)

Thanks guys, much appreciated!


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## Andy Moynihan (Aug 17, 2008)

Everything of theirs from the Black Album backward, none of it after.


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## Kreth (Aug 17, 2008)

Andy Moynihan said:


> Everything of theirs from the Black Album backward, none of it after.


See, I disagree here. I actually like quite a bit of Load and Reload. And even if you want to play the "Metallica sold out" card, there's heavy stuff like Ain't My *****, 2x4, King Nothing, and Fuel on those two albums. I'm not a big fan of St. Anger, but I do like Frantic, Some Kind of Monster, and the title track. All of the songs sound better on the DVD that came with the album, mainly because they fixed Lars' snare...


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## SensibleManiac (Aug 17, 2008)

I agree with the first reply, but would definetely get PUPPETS and LIGHTNING before everything else.
I've been a fan for 21 years and can honestly say those two are the best albums. You have to listen to Cliff before the others.
I also agree that after the Black album, there's good and bad on the later albums.


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## Sukerkin (Aug 17, 2008)

If you really must listen to second-hand, reconfigured Black Sabbath {} then the Black Album is good and the work they did with the orchestra is very good - that is what turned me from a 'hater' to a 'tolerator' :lol:.


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## terryl965 (Aug 17, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


 
Abso;utely on with these selections.


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## Rich Parsons (Aug 18, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.




I would have to agree with this. I liked Load maybe more than Kreth did, but when it came out it was a time of my life when some of the lyrics just hit me right.


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## CoryKS (Aug 18, 2008)

Essentials:  _Master of Puppets_, _Ride the Lightning_, _Black_.  Get _...And Justice For All_ secondhand just for _One_.

_Kill 'em All_ has good songs, but if you've heard later Metallica it's hard to listen to because apparently Hetfields balls hadn't dropped yet.  He sounds like a yowling high school boy.  

I like _Load_ and _Reload_ a lot, but wouldn't consider them representative of the Metallica sound.  Can't explain why, they're just... different.

_St. Anger_... meh.

_Binge & Purge_:  One of the best concert albums _ever_.


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## JBrainard (Aug 18, 2008)

Master of Puppets, Ride the Lightning, then And Justice For All. IMHO, what put Metallica strides ahead of other bands of that ilk was Burton, and the band went downhill fast when he died (Burton wrote a lot of the stuff on "Justice," but didn't get the chance to play it  )


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## Kreth (Aug 18, 2008)

JBrainard said:


> Master of Puppets, Ride the Lightning, then And Justice For All. IMHO, what put Metallica strides ahead of other bands of that ilk was Burton, and the band went downhill fast when he died (Burton wrote a lot of the stuff on "Justice," but didn't get the chance to play it  )


I'll probably be crucified for this, but Newsted was in the band much longer than Cliff ever was, and he's not exactly shabby. And now they've moved on to Trujillo, a phenomenal player in his own right. If there was ever a weakness in bass, it was caused by Lars' and Hetfield's micromanagement, and they've admitted as much.


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## JBrainard (Aug 18, 2008)

Kreth said:


> I'll probably be crucified for this, but Newsted was in the band much longer than Cliff ever was, and he's not exactly shabby. And now they've moved on to Trujillo, a phenomenal player in his own right. If there was ever a weakness in bass, it was caused by Lars' and Hetfield's micromanagement, and they've admitted as much.


 
I agree, Newsted is a good bass player, and yes, Trujillo is great. My point though was that the complexity and epic sound that Metallica used to produce died when Burton's music composition left the table. I mean come on, the tracks on the black album sound like they were written by third graders compared to the brilliant song writing on Puppets.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 18, 2008)

Flying Crane said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> I've never paid much attention to Metallica, but lately I've been running across some of their music on the radio, and I'm kind of digging it.
> 
> ...


 
Kill &#8216;Em All
Ride the Lightning
Master of Puppets
Metallica (aka the Black Album)

And of course "Peace Sells...But Who's Buying"&#8230;oops sorry that not Metallica that is from their first lead singer after he got kicked out


*NOT*  St Anger


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## Jenna (Aug 18, 2008)

JBrainard said:


> I agree, Newsted is a good bass player, and yes, Trujillo is great. My point though was that the complexity and epic sound that Metallica used to produce died when Burton's music composition left the table. I mean come on, the tracks on the black album sound like they were written by third graders compared to the brilliant song writing on Puppets.


Hey you.. In what way do you mean songwriting??  Lyrically?  Surely you would not be listening to any metal for the complex underlying symbolic allegorical meanings to the lyrics, pffft.. You would get them kicks elsewhere surely?? I think MoP was just too raw.. the production on black for me surpasses anything they have done before or after.. I listen to it because it does not screech in my aged ears  J


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## Kreth (Aug 18, 2008)

Jenna said:


> Surely you would not be listening to any metal for the complex underlying symbolic allegorical meanings to the lyrics, pffft..


Well, it's not exactly Sk8terboi, but check out lyrics by Metallica, Megadeth, Maiden, Tool, Clutch, Corrosion of Conformity, et al...



:uhyeah:


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## JBrainard (Aug 18, 2008)

Jenna said:


> Hey you.. In what way do you mean songwriting?? Lyrically? Surely you would not be listening to any metal for the complex underlying symbolic allegorical meanings to the lyrics, pffft.. You would get them kicks elsewhere surely?? I think MoP was just too raw.. the production on black for me surpasses anything they have done before or after.. I listen to it because it does not screech in my aged ears  J


 
By songwriting I mean the music, not the lyrics (Hatfield wrote most if not all of the lyrics, if my memory serves me). Burton had a masters degree in music theory and it definitly shows IMO.
Hey, are you knocking my taste in music? 
As far as raw vs. "well produced," that's all a matter of personal taste. I think MoP was very well produced. The black album, on the other hand, was _too_ well produced. Made for radio, you might say... 



Kreth said:


> Well, it's not exactly Sk8terboi, but check out lyrics by Metallica, Megadeth, Maiden, Tool, Clutch, Corrosion of Conformity, et al...



For the record, I think Tool has amazing lyrics.


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## Jenna (Aug 18, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Well, it's not exactly Sk8terboi, but check out lyrics by Metallica, Megadeth, Maiden, Tool, Clutch, Corrosion of Conformity, et al...
> 
> 
> 
> :uhyeah:





JBrainard said:


> By songwriting I mean the music, not the lyrics (Hatfield wrote most if not all of the lyrics, if my memory serves me). Burton had a masters degree in music theory and it definitly shows IMO.
> Hey, are you knocking my taste in music?
> As far as raw vs. "well produced," that's all a matter of personal taste. I think MoP was very well produced. The black album, on the other hand, was too well produced. Made for radio, you might say...
> 
> ...


Actually ok, I think Tool are a slightly different proposition though.. Megadeth (Countdown to Extinction is my only LP) I think lyrically, yeah I can get with that.. but man surely you would agree, metal lyrics are secondary, yes?  I do not believe the fury and the power of any decent metal can be relayed properly through any lyrics and so they are just token, right?  Hey I am not arguing or anything.. each to his or her own.. anyways I never argue when I am right  J


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 18, 2008)

I dont know I think Raven, "pick your window" can be pretty darned phylisophical


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## JBrainard (Aug 18, 2008)

Jenna said:


> Actually ok, I think Tool are a slightly different proposition though.. Megadeth (Countdown to Extinction is my only LP) I think lyrically, yeah I can get with that.. but man surely you would agree, metal lyrics are secondary, yes? I do not believe the fury and the power of any decent metal can be relayed properly through any lyrics and so they are just token, right? Hey I am not arguing or anything.. each to his or her own.. anyways I never argue when I am right  J


 
OK, I'm going to go out on a limb, but I will have to disagree with that one. I would argue that because metal is _supposed_ to be raw, the lyrics can be equally raw. I should also point out that in the metal genre there are _specific_ bands (like Tool and maybe Rage Against the Machine) and _specific_ songs have very artistic, intelligent and powerfull lyrics.


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## Kreth (Aug 18, 2008)

Just to throw out an example, I think Creeping Death is pretty interesting lyrically. The lyrics are from the point of view of the entity that God unleashed on the Egyptians on behalf of Moses.


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## punisher73 (Aug 19, 2008)

I agree with the suggestions so far, I guess if your exposure to metallica has come from the radio I would start with the black album.  That has most of the "radio hits" that really put them on the map to the general public.

I had always been a metallica fan, and I remember my sister stealing my black album in high school because metallica was suddenly the "in thing".


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## Kreth (Aug 19, 2008)

I remember being at a party a year or so after the Black Album came out, and someone put on For Whom The Bell Tolls.
Bandwagon fan: "Holy ****! Who is this?"
Me: "Metallica"
Bandwagon fan: "Really? I didn't know they had a new album out already!"
Me: *rolls eyes and goes to get another beer*


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## JBrainard (Aug 19, 2008)

Kreth said:


> I remember being at a party a year or so after the Black Album came out, and someone put on For Whom The Bell Tolls.
> Bandwagon fan: "Holy ****! Who is this?"
> Me: "Metallica"
> Bandwagon fan: "Really? I didn't know they had a new album out already!"
> Me: *rolls eyes and goes to get another beer*


 
LOL. I remember having similar experiences.

Trivia: Who here knows what the original title for the "Kill 'em All" album was? Kreth can't answer 'cuz this is metal 101 and I'm sure he knows.


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## CoryKS (Aug 19, 2008)

JBrainard said:


> LOL. I remember having similar experiences.
> 
> Trivia: Who here knows what the original title for the "Kill 'em All" album was? Kreth can't answer 'cuz this is metal 101 and I'm sure he knows.


 
"Metal Up Your ***".  The lawyers didn't like it, so they changed it to "Kill 'em All"... in reference to the lawyers.:rofl:

/Bought the Black album on release day
//In Okinawa
///The Japanese version included "So What" as a bonus track.


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## JBrainard (Aug 19, 2008)

CoryKS said:


> "Metal Up Your ***". The lawyers didn't like it, so they changed it to "Kill 'em All"... in reference to the lawyers.:rofl:


 
Give the man a cigar


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## Darksoul (Aug 19, 2008)

-I'm willing to admit that it was 'Load' that got me into Metallica. 'Until it Sleeps' is my favorite Metallica song. From that album, I worked my way backwards to discover their previous work. Chances are, you can't like every single thing a band does. Well, maybe they're exceptions, but with a band like Metallica, having been around for many years now, its a lot of material. Funny how I look back in the 80s and see Metallica as heavy metal, and now think of them as hard rock. A change in perspective I guess.

Andrew


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## punisher73 (Aug 20, 2008)

Darksoul said:


> -I'm willing to admit that it was 'Load' that got me into Metallica. 'Until it Sleeps' is my favorite Metallica song. From that album, I worked my way backwards to discover their previous work. Chances are, you can't like every single thing a band does. Well, maybe they're exceptions, but with a band like Metallica, having been around for many years now, its a lot of material. Funny how I look back in the 80s and see Metallica as heavy metal, and now think of them as hard rock. A change in perspective I guess.
> 
> Andrew


 
I think they have changed from their heavy metal days to more of a hard rock sound.  They have more of a mass appeal now as well after changing to more of a hard rock sound.  This is why old fans always say that they 
"sold out".


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## JadeDragon3 (Aug 20, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


 

Ride the Lightning is good.  Anything from thier early years is good.  Anything after the Black cd is not as good. Check out a song called "Sanitarium".  I think its on Master of Puppets cd.  "For Whom the Bell Tolls" is a good song.  Hope this helps you.


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## JadeDragon3 (Aug 20, 2008)

Jenna said:


> Hey you.. In what way do you mean songwriting?? Lyrically? Surely you would not be listening to any metal for the complex underlying symbolic allegorical meanings to the lyrics, pffft.. You would get them kicks elsewhere surely?? I think MoP was just too raw.. the production on black for me surpasses anything they have done before or after.. I listen to it because it does not screech in my aged ears  J


 
I wouldn't say that the Black cd was great.  It was okay but not great.  It definitely wasn't as good as Master of Puppets, Ride the Lightning, or Kill Em' All.  How can you beat songs like Sanitarium, Battery, Master of Puppets, For Whom the Bell Tolls, and the instrumental song Orion.


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## JadeDragon3 (Aug 20, 2008)

If you like Metallica then check out Megadeath, Sepultura, Pantera, Slayer, Biohazard, Queensryche(sp?), Anthrax, and Judas Priest.


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## Darksoul (Aug 20, 2008)

-Yeah I never looked at Metallica as having sold out. I saw 4 guys who were getting older, which brings experience, if nothing else, and trying different things with their music. And I think as accepted as heavy metal was, Metallica found a way to make harder music enjoyable for a wider audience. Especially with the Black Album. Load is what did it for me, there is even hard country song thats pretty good, and I hate country music. But yeah, some older fans were rather upset by that. There are many who were angsty teenagers wanting to rock out but then time passed. Are some people still channeling that angst into their 20s, 30s and beyond? Yep. But I think Metallica has simply grown up a bit, well, mostly grown older;-)

Andrew


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## JadeDragon3 (Aug 20, 2008)

There newer stuff just isn't as "hard" as their earlier stuff.  St. Anger cd sucked big time.


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## Fiendlover (Aug 20, 2008)

Flying Crane said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> I've never paid much attention to Metallica, but lately I've been running across some of their music on the radio, and I'm kind of digging it.
> 
> ...


 Ride the Lightning and Master of Puppets.

I WOULD NOT suggest you get the St. Anger album though and I'm a hardcore Metallica fan.  :headbangin::bangahead:


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## Fiendlover (Aug 20, 2008)

JadeDragon3 said:


> If you like Metallica then check out Megadeath, Sepultura, Pantera, Slayer, Biohazard, Queensryche(sp?), Anthrax, and Judas Priest.


 I agree although I've never heard of Queensryche before...


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 20, 2008)

Fiendlover said:


> I agree although I've never heard of Queensryche before...


 
 WHAT!!!!
You never heard Queensryche before.... Go out right now and buy Queensrÿche (the first album)..*IMMEIDIATELY* 

And while your at it pick up Y&T Black Tiger too


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## Flying Crane (Aug 20, 2008)

Fiendlover said:


> I agree although I've never heard of Queensryche before...


 

I actually saw them in concert back in about 1993.  It was OK, but Suicidal Tendencies as the opening act was just painfully bad...


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## Sukerkin (Aug 20, 2008)

Have to concur with *Xue* about _Y&T_.  "Black Tiger" is a splendid album.

Queensryche are something of an aquired taste.  Musically brilliant, their sound is just a little off 'beam' and takes some getting used to.

Again, tho' I have learned to tolerate them, I have never understood why Metallica got to be so famous when much better bands already existed e.g. the one they most copied, Black Sabbath.


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## Xue Sheng (Aug 20, 2008)

Sukerkin said:


> Have to concur with *Xue* about _Y&T_. "Black Tiger" is a splendid album.


 
"Mean Streak" too


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## celtic_crippler (Aug 20, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good as well.


 
I agree that Master of Puppets is great, but I would say anything from that album back is good. 

IMHO, with the exception of Garage Days...., everything after the death of Cliff Burton is sold-out-commercialized-crap.


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## Fiendlover (Aug 20, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> WHAT!!!!
> You never heard Queensryche before.... Go out right now and buy Queensrÿche (the first album)..*IMMEIDIATELY*
> 
> And while your at it pick up Y&T Black Tiger too


 lol alright but if I don't like it you gotta pay for the money I wasted lol.


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## JBrainard (Aug 21, 2008)

Kreth said:


> Master of Puppets, hands down. Anything from "the Black Album" (self-titled) and earlier is good. Load and Reload are hit and miss, and I only like maybe 3 tracks off St. Anger. Garage Inc (a cover album) and *S & M (with the San Francisco Philharmonic) are pretty good* as well.


 
??? S&M sounded really forced. The symphony and Metallica's stuff did not mesh well.
If you like the concept of mixing metal with symphony, check out the album "Death Cult Armageddon" by Dimmu Borgir. It was recorded with the Prague Philharmonic orchestra and the metal mixes seamlessly with the symphony, which results in some very powerful tunes.
There was a magazine review (I wish I remembered the mag, I'll look it up if I need to) that said, and I quote, "Death Cult Armageddon is everything the Metallica's S & M _should_ have been."


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## Kreth (Aug 21, 2008)

JBrainard said:


> ??? S&M sounded really forced. The symphony and Metallica's stuff did not mesh well.


I thought the opposite, especially on stuff like Call of Ktulu. That song sounded like it was written to be played with a full orchestra.


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