# Chinese word for Kiai ?



## bowser666 (Nov 12, 2009)

Sorry if this is a dumb question but what is the Chinese word for Kiai ?  Cantonese or Manadarin if you know it    Thanks in advance.


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## masherdong (Nov 12, 2009)

Hmm, I believe it is hut or hiat.


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 12, 2009)

bowser666 said:


> Sorry if this is a dumb question but what is the Chinese word for Kiai ? Cantonese or Manadarin if you know it  Thanks in advance.


 
What does Kiai translate to? 

If it is simply a short yell before or during a strike or technique technically there isn't one. As a matter of fact connecting ones breathing to striking to some in CMA can be a bad thing. If you can only strike with force on an hard exhale (with or without a yell) then I am going to attack you right after that exhale (or yell) since you have no power to strike until you inhale and then exhale again.... Just breathe

The only other thing I have seen in training CMA that is similar to that is used in CMA as a Kiai is just a hard exhale, not noise needed other than breath. But this would be External CMA, internal CMA I have not seen it used at all. My Xingyi Sifu absolutely hated it when people would exhale and strike together "just breathe" and my taiji Sifus thought is simply breathe naturally.


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## Flying Crane (Nov 12, 2009)

Xue Sheng said:


> What does Kiai translate to?
> 
> If it is simply a short yell before or during a strike or technique technically there isn't one. As a matter of fact connecting ones breathing to striking to some in CMA can be a bad thing. If you can only strike with force on an hard exhale (with or without a yell) then I am going to attack you right after that exhale (or yell) since you have no power to strike until you inhale and then exhale again.... Just breathe
> 
> The only other thing I have seen in training CMA that is similar to that is used in CMA as a Kiai is just a hard exhale, not noise needed other than breath. But this would be External CMA, internal CMA I have not seen it used at all. My Xingyi Sifu absolutely hated it when people would exhale and strike together "just breathe" and my taiji Sifus thought is simply breathe naturally.


 
I would agree with this, at least in some of my experiences.  

I believe a kiai is intended to both match the exhale with the strike, and cause a momentary tension in the muscles as the strike is delivered.  This can improve the strike compared to an untrained strike.  However, in some of the Chinese arts, Bak Hok for example, we absolutely do not want to tense the delivery of the strike, even at the last moment of impact.  There needs to be tension in the fist, of course, for it to survive the impact.  But the delivery of the fist, meaning the muscles of the shoulder and arm and upper back and chest, should not ever tense up in delivery.  We drive the punch with a pivot of the entire body, and just let it drive on thru.

Trying to match such a punch with a kiai, would destroy the integrity of that kind of punch.

Other Chinese styles may find a use for it, however.  Seems there might be a kiai equivalent in wing chun, perhaps...


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## mook jong man (Nov 12, 2009)

I don't know about other peoples Wing Chun lineages but in ours which is Yip Man --- Tsui Seung Tin --- Jim Fung --- me , we were told to always breath naturally.


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## ggg214 (Nov 12, 2009)

Kiai as i know, is in karate do. 
in Xinyi Liuhe, there is a senior technique called &#34382;&#35961;&#38647;&#38899;. although i don't know exactly how it works,  we believe it connects to voice. 
and for our training, shou shi is done with kiai, the vocie is Yi(&#21670. in chinese medicine, it relats to lung, it helps to calm down after each tough movement.


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## geezer (Nov 12, 2009)

mook jong man said:


> I don't know about other peoples Wing Chun lineages but in ours which is Yip Man --- Tsui Seung Tin --- Jim Fung --- me , we were told to always breath naturally.



I spent a dozen years in the Yip-Man --- Leung Ting Wing Tsun lineage and later a bit of time with some other folks and the same was true for us. Relaxed, natural breathing for relaxed, "flexible" striking.


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## oxy (Nov 13, 2009)

I tend to think of Kiai as training wheels to get the person to tuck in their tail bone slightly during the strike. Tucking in the tail bone is independent of breathing and can be done on an in or out breath. It's a substitute for good instruction, basically.


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## bowser666 (Nov 13, 2009)

Some good information here.  I apologize however for not wording my question better.  I was actually looking for the translation of kiai into chinese.  Again in Manadarin or Cantonese if possible. Sorry i was not more specific. Simply as if i were to look in a Chinese/Japanese dictionary, what word would I find in Chinese for Kiai, meaning the technique used while applying a strike, etc.....  Wasn't really looking for whether it is effective or not.  Although that would be a good thread topic.


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## Jin Gang (Nov 14, 2009)

I think what they're trying to say is, there is no exact Chinese equivalent, since most Chinese martial arts don't use shouts the way modern karate does (and when they do, they don't have a special name like that).  The word kaia is a compound word specific to Japanese, in Chinese the same two characters together probably don't have the same meaning.  If you put it into a dictionary you woldn't get anything.

kiai = &#27683;&#21512;, literal meaning of the two characters is spirit/breath/energy and to join, joining.  So it literally means something like joining with spirit.
from wikipedia - "However, Frederick John Lovret notes, "One should note that ai, the conjunctive stem of the verb au, does not mean "to join" in this case: when used in the second position of a compound word, ai becomes an emphatic marker. Kiai, therefore, should be translated as "spirit!", not "spirit-joined".[3]
they are the same characters in aikido, reversed &#21512;&#27683;&#36947;

You can break it down literally into mandarin Chinese using the characters 
&#27683;ki = qi  &#21512;ai= he

so a literal mandarin translation is qihe (chee huh)
but again, I wouldn't assume it has the same connotation, if it means anything at all

I've seen a reference that indicates some styles may use the term fa sheng &#21457;&#22768; "releasing shout", which would be a better equivalent to kiai.  I found this on a site for a school in Australia which teaches some form of hung gar, though you have to dig around to even find where they say what style they're teaching.  I don't know if anyone else uses this term, or if these people made it up (since I've never heard it before, and haven't found any other sources mentioning it)


In some qigong practices there are certain specific sounds emitted that have a specific purpose in harmonzing qi, and this is taught in some martial arts as well.  It's not necessarily a loud shout, but a specific noise that is made when breathing in or breathing out.  Yang Jwing Ming's white crane style uses six sounds. Some sounds aid in emitting energy, and others in storing energy, and different sounds are related to different organs.  Different styles also have different sounds.


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## yak sao (Nov 14, 2009)

All the WT/WC that I've ever seen is natural breathing only.
Punching multiple times per second, if you tried to exhale on each one
you would pass out.

I never practiced it first hand, but Hung Gar has a form that is called Iron Thread, and they use many different sounds throughout the set. I believe it has to do with each sound producing a different vibration internally, thus aiding in chi development.


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## mograph (Nov 15, 2009)

Side note: at our Godson's karate class, the teacher had them all shouting "kiai!" when they punched or struck. It seemed silly, like shouting "shout!" at someone. Oh well ... I don't think it was a very good dojo. 

In my CMA experience, I've heard and read "breathe naturally", "exhale", and even "inhale slightly" when striking. <shrug> Personally, I prefer to breathe naturally.


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## bowser666 (Nov 16, 2009)

Thank you everyone for the input.  I think fa sheng is most like what I was looking for.  I was looking for something to tell my students ( I'm a assistant instructor at my Kung Fu school) and I appreciate it.


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 16, 2009)

From my experience in CMA (Taiji, Xingyi, Shaolin, Wing Chun, Sanda) all I can say is basically there ain't one.

So, again IMO, it is best to tell your students, there is no CMA equivalent used, it is a JMA thing.


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## TenTigers (Dec 7, 2009)

several terms can be used;
Hei-hop/hahp-direct translation of ki-ai, can be slurred as, hei-ahp
hoi-sang-shout
faht-sang -releasing shout
hei-faht-breath technique
hei-gung-breath work
depending on the type of strike the sound would be different. Heavy strike,rooted stance,the breath is sunk to the dan-tien-"Ha"
short,quick strikes,kicks, the breath is higher- "hite"
or "tst" -multiple releases of short strikes from one inhale-several exhales.
eventually they become sub-audible as the body learns to breathe properly.
Sometimes a long "Ahhhht!" for one breath, several strikes.


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