# Two UK Officers Handle Knife Wielding Attacker...



## Brian R. VanCise (Apr 4, 2017)

Here is an interesting video featuring two UK police officers handling a knife wielding man.

Knife-wielding man attacks cops - CNN Video


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

UK officers can also carry tasers, and can call for armed back up if they need it, obviously these two didn't feel they needed to.
The police service in Northern Ireland (PSNI)  though are armed and officers also carry weapons when off duty. The Ministry of Defence police are also an armed force.


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## Steve (Apr 4, 2017)

Self defense step number one: be a cop.


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## CB Jones (Apr 4, 2017)

Nope....I'd have shot him


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

CB Jones said:


> Nope....I'd have shot him



Not necessary in this case. In the case of the terrorist attack in London yes he was shot dead. It all depends on the situation and the officer.


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## CB Jones (Apr 4, 2017)

Tez3 said:


> Not necessary in this case. In the case of the terrorist attack in London yes he was shot dead. It all depends on the situation and the officer.



If he had come towards me with that knife...I'm putting him down.

I'm not taking the chance of my wife and kids being presented a folded flag in my memory.


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

CB Jones said:


> If he had come towards me with that knife...I'm putting him down.
> 
> I'm not taking the chance of my wife and kids being presented a folded flag in my memory.



British police officers don't take chances either and the fact they can put him down without shooting shows they are very professional and adept at what they do. they do risk assess and will call appropriate back up if necessary, not often necessary though.


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## CB Jones (Apr 4, 2017)

Tez3 said:


> British police officers don't take chances either and the fact they can put him down without shooting shows they are very professional and adept at what they do. they do risk assess and will call appropriate back up if necessary, not often necessary though.



No problem Tez....no disrespect intended towards them.

Just saying what I would have done.  Just a difference in philosophy.  I've been cut by a knife before but at this point in my life I tend to take fewer chances.

Glad the officers weren't injured.


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

CB Jones said:


> No problem Tez....no disrespect intended towards them.
> 
> Just saying what I would have done.  Just a difference in philosophy.  I've been cut by a knife before but at this point in my life I tend to take fewer chances.
> 
> Glad the officers weren't injured.



It's a different culture here, different training methods and different ways of thinking, not better or worse just different.


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## Buka (Apr 4, 2017)

I'm glad the officers are okay. 

If those officers weren't carrying firearms, they really didn't have any choice in whether to shoot or not, did they?

Me? I would have shot him so fast there might have been a sonic boom.


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

Buka said:


> I'm glad the officers are okay.
> 
> If those officers weren't carrying firearms, they really didn't have any choice in whether to shoot or not, did they?
> 
> Me? I would have shot him so fast there might have been a sonic boom.



The general consensus among serving UK officers ( apart from Northern Irish officers) is that they don't want to be armed, in fact it's proving hard to get officers to volunteer to be on armed response teams.


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## Buka (Apr 4, 2017)

Tez3 said:


> The general consensus among serving UK officers ( apart from Northern Irish officers) is that they don't want to be armed, in fact it's proving hard to get officers to volunteer to be on armed response teams.



I can see their point as I imagine armed response teams are called into situations of great danger involving firearms. I wouldn't volunteer for that either.


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## Tez3 (Apr 4, 2017)

Buka said:


> I can see their point as I imagine armed response teams are called into situations of great danger involving firearms. I wouldn't volunteer for that either.



Actually it's not that because being unarmed when suspects are armed is worse, it's actually about the relationship between the British public and the way British policing works. This is an old article and despite the recent terrorist attack it's still how people think here. Shocking as it was, terrorist attacks have happened in the UK for decades, so we've had plenty of time to think about arming the police. More officers on patrol in certain places that need higher security are armed though often the MoD police will come in due to their familiarity with weapons ( plus it makes a nice change for them to work in other places rather than defending American bases for demonstrators, a very tedious thing I can assure you..the demonstrators that is, the bases are great apart from the chocolate that tastes funny )
Why British police don’t have guns - BBC News

However our armed response officers are rather good. SCO19 - British Armed Police


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## Midnight-shadow (Apr 6, 2017)

Buka said:


> I can see their point as I imagine armed response teams are called into situations of great danger involving firearms. I wouldn't volunteer for that either.



Not always. There are 2 major roles of the armed response units. First is to neutralise immediate threats (i.e. when a suspect is threatening to use a gun on someone), while the other is to secure and dispose of weapons that are found. Let's say for example the police raid a drugs hide-out, securing everyone inside very easily. Then in the ensuring search for drugs they find a live gun or ammunition. Normal police officers aren't allowed to handle a live gun in case it accidentally fires, so they have to call in the armed response unit to dispose of it.

In the case of the video with the knife-man, once again it shows that guns aren't always the answer to everything and you can do a lot without a gun. UK police officers are very well trained especially when it comes to dealing with knife attacks, as that is the most common weapon UK criminals use. That said, you could tell that the guy with the knife really didn't want a fight, it was just a bluff. His body language and movements gave him away. You'll notice that as soon as the female officer positioned herself behind him, he did a wild swing with the knife to clear space and tried to run. The male officer had positioned to cut off any escape attempt which was why the knife got so close to him. If he really wanted to hurt them he could have just charged the male officer and potentially done more damage.


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## JP3 (Apr 8, 2017)

Tez3 said:


> Not necessary in this case. In the case of the terrorist attack in London yes he was shot dead. It all depends on the situation and the officer.


It also depends on the jurisdiction and general practices and policy of the peace officers involved.

In Houston, and I do't like saying this, it's "Drop the knife and get on the ground!"

"Upyours, pig" or whatever.

Another, "Drop the knife and get on the ground!" With the now added, "Or I am going to shoot you!"  Remember, the sidearms are already out and pointed at the knife-wielder.

And, if still no compliance, the next words heard are "He's down! He's down. Call for an ambulance."

Don't try to use blades on a US PD officer, is my advice. Granted, people still do, successfully, which is a pity, but it's because of bad luck, or bad tactics, or a bad decision or all three.

Anyone know why the guy had the knife drawn on the cops anyway?


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## Midnight-shadow (Apr 8, 2017)

JP3 said:


> Anyone know why the guy had the knife drawn on the cops anyway?



This is pure speculation but I'm guessing that the guy with the knife was locked out of his house, wanting to get in to use the knife on his family when the police arrived. This is quite common in domestics where the would-be victim barricades themselves in a room away from the attacker and calls the police. 



JP3 said:


> It also depends on the jurisdiction and general practices and policy of the peace officers involved.
> 
> In Houston, and I do't like saying this, it's "Drop the knife and get on the ground!"
> 
> ...



We have similar phrases in the UK, particularly for police dog handlers, except instead of "or I am going to shoot you!" it's "I will release the dog". 9 times out of 10 as soon as the dog appears the criminal surrenders. If they try to run the dog chases them down, and if they try to fight the dog will attack. In my personal opinion, a trained police dog is a far bigger deterrent than a gun, but of course there are a lot fewer police dogs than guns.


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## JP3 (Apr 8, 2017)

I had  a student for a short time about 10 years ago who was a K-9 Officer dduo member, and I'd agree that bad guys are a Lot more scared at a visceral level of the police dog than the police officer who is armed with his service pistol.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Apr 8, 2017)

One of my good friends is also a K-9 Officer and you are absolutely correct JP3!


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## Tez3 (Apr 8, 2017)

I don't know why he was upset enough to start threatening police officers but I do know the police officers names. PC Alex Prentice and PC Debbie Wishart. Just nice to know where the credit should go.


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## CB Jones (Apr 8, 2017)

JP3 said:


> In Houston, and I do't like saying this, it's "Drop the knife and get on the ground!"
> 
> "Upyours, pig" or whatever.
> 
> ...



Why don't you like saying that?


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