# Sparring versus Self-Defense



## FearlessFreep (Oct 6, 2006)

No, I don't mean this to be an argument of one versus the other.  Some discussion in the MMA forum and others has me thinking that maybe it would be good for all of us to try to articulate how a sparring match (of any variety) compares or contrasts to a real 'street'  encounter.  Not for the sake of argument but to discuss a) what can/do you do in a sparring match that will be of use in a street encounter b) what about the two environemtns is *different* that you have to be aware of?

I'll throw out some examples (and I may be wrong)

Differences:
1. Motivation - In a match, you're motivation is to score points.   On the street, the motivation is to get home alive, with your friends and loved ones.  This changes your reasoning about what and why you will do something.  Matches require aggressiveness to go out and 'win'.  Even if you are a counter-fighter, you are still being passive-aggressive in that you are waiting for the opponent to commit before attacking, but you are looking for a way to attack.  In a self-defense situation, you want to de-escalate the encounter to avoid physical confrontation if at all possible, and if it gets to that point, your actions are based on a desire to end the conflict, not rack up points.
2. Legal Ramifications - If you spar clean, you don't fear legal action based on your actions.  On the street, you need to be able to articulate why you did what you did, so some actions (ground and pound?) may not be something you want to do.  Once you have successfully defended yourself, beating the heck out of someone ma not be legally defensible, so you have to know when to stop.
3. Terrain - contrete and asphault surfaces.  Chairs, tables, or cars.  Etc...
4. Friends - He may have friends, they may get involved, watch your positioning for an unexpected attack
5. Weapons - Ditto.

Simularities:
1. Conditioning to be used to getting hit/hurt - If you spar..you will get hit.  Fighting past the pain and continuing to function is not automatic but is something you need to get used to.
2. Speed - You spar all full speed, you get used to moving at full speed.
3. Randomness -  Sparring gets you used to reacting instantly to an outside, independent agent who may do what you are not expecting
4. Adrenaline and Focus - Keeping adrenaline under control to keep your mind and eyesight focused is important to sparring, and to surviving.


Just some examples, and I may be wrong.  Those who do MA for self-defense but who also spar as part of your training may have othe  insight into what your sparring teaches you, and what it doesn't...


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## SFC JeffJ (Oct 6, 2006)

A lot of people forget that sparring is just another drill.  I love sparring.  It's about the most fun cardio workout there is!  It can help you prepare for a SD situation, but it's only a single piece of the puzzle.

Jeff


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## zDom (Oct 6, 2006)

JeffJ said:


> A lot of people forget that sparring is just another drill.  I love sparring.  It's about the most fun cardio workout there is!  It can help you prepare for a SD situation, but it's only a single piece of the puzzle.
> 
> Jeff



Well said!

I love to spar -- one of my favorite games to play.


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## Kacey (Oct 6, 2006)

JeffJ said:


> A lot of people forget that sparring is just another drill.  I love sparring.  It's about the most fun cardio workout there is!  It can help you prepare for a SD situation, but it's only a single piece of the puzzle.
> 
> Jeff



And that's the key - sparring is a game, with very specific rules, which both participants agree to abide by.  There is only one rule in street fighting:  win at all costs; methodology:  do it fast, do it first, do it dirtiest.  Anyone who thinks differently is deluding themselves.  Certainly, sparring can help you prepare for street fighting - fitness, training your reflexes and awareness, and so on - but it is most definitively *not* the same thing.


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## Nomad (Oct 9, 2006)

Sparring also can teach you good things about distancing and controlling the distance, timing, and how to read your opponent.

These don't translate directly, since in a street fight your opponent won't act and react the same way a sparring partner will, but I don't think there's any question of these skills being useful in such an encounter.


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## bushidomartialarts (Nov 2, 2006)

another issue with sparring v. self defense is committment.

when sparring, we tend to throw with less body behind it. for one, we don't want to hurt our friends.  for two, a committed strike leaves us open to counterattack.

 on the offensive side, it trains us to throw weak strikes.

on the defensive side, there are a number of good self-defense options that we never get the chance to throw while sparring.

sparring is a great game, a good drill and a terriffic workout.  but it ain't self-defense.  in fact, i'm apt to say that it teaches more bad fighting habits than good...

just my 1.5 cents canadian.


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## Bigshadow (Nov 2, 2006)

bushidomartialarts said:


> sparring is a great game, a good drill and a terriffic workout.  but it ain't self-defense.  in fact, i'm apt to say that it teaches more bad fighting habits than good...



Nicely put!  I agree with that 100%!


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## Brian R. VanCise (Nov 2, 2006)

Yes, I would have to say that sparring is a great *drill* and can help you develop your attributes.  However, it is definately not like a real life violent encounter.  Can it help you?  Probably (no guarantee) but it is in no way equivalent to violence in the real world.  One is a game/drill with rules and another is simply chaotic when it occurs.  Still it can be fun!


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## Bigshadow (Nov 2, 2006)

Brian R. VanCise said:


> Yes, I would have to say that sparring is a great *drill* and can help you develop your attributes.  However, it is definately not like a real life violent encounter.  Can it help you?  Probably (no guarantee) but it is in no way equivalent to violence in the real world.  One is a game/drill with rules and another is simply chaotic when it occurs.  Still it can be fun!



No doubt it is fun!  We did quite a bit of randori last night.  I even took one in the grill, but it was fun!  We did half of it in very low light (almost dark).  Although it all seemed the same/felt the same to me.  (no big deal)   FUN FUN!


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## terryl965 (Nov 2, 2006)

JeffJ said:


> A lot of people forget that sparring is just another drill. I love sparring. It's about the most fun cardio workout there is! It can help you prepare for a SD situation, but it's only a single piece of the puzzle.
> 
> Jeff


 

Excellent post


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## Robert Lee (Nov 2, 2006)

Point spars  to me help with bad habits. And several of the kicks and moves made in point spars could get you hurt in a real fight. Now light to medium contact sparing That benifits your self defence skills. You take less chance doing fancy moves and kicks ect. You know you land the strike kick ect. You learned to close the gap. But yes any spar is better then No sparing at all.


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## mikeXedge (Nov 9, 2006)

sport karate sparring has many pros... i feel... that being able to control your self in a sparring situation can directly translate into a real self defense situation... the one good thing i have taken from tae kwon do is good control... being able to control my movements helps to control my opponents movements...  sport karate sparring also has cons... in real fighting situations i have had to much control... i've not been able to really fight back until i've seen a friend be seriously hurt... or be seriously hurt my self... luckly i have shifted from tae kwon do into more practical styles like splashing hands kung fu and shaolin do... that last line was not a strike at tae kwon do... i will always hold tae kwon do at high regard... it being my base...


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## morph4me (Nov 9, 2006)

One big omission in the differences column - Rules. Sparring has them, SD doesn't. Nobody there to break it up to keep you from getting hurt or killed, nobody there to stop someone from picking up a rock or a bottle and using it.  Sparring is a great drill, and when done properly, helps you develop some of the skills that can be helpful in a self defense situation, but it's a game.


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## FearlessFreep (Nov 9, 2006)

I wonder if a professional baseball player, if getting mugged on the street, would sit back and wait for the perfect positioning to swing his bat or just club the crap out of the attacker with it?  Baseball teches a lot of bad habits if you need to use a bat for self-defense....can they be overcome?


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## mikeXedge (Nov 10, 2006)

morph4me said:


> One big omission in the differences column - Rules. Sparring has them, SD doesn't. Nobody there to break it up to keep you from getting hurt or killed, nobody there to stop someone from picking up a rock or a bottle and using it.  Sparring is a great drill, and when done properly, helps you develop some of the skills that can be helpful in a self defense situation, but it's a game.



after reading this response i put some more thought into how i feel about sparring... it seems that different schools teach very different methods... sport tae kwon do sparrin has lots of rules that, although good for teaching control, can devolp very bad self defense habits... but on the other hand, i have been training in splashing hands kung fu, which is an in fighting style... completly geared to self defense and street fighting... everything is trained full contact... the only gear you have is a cup... and the only rule is any strikes that could seriously injure or kill are obviously controlled... i consider the full contact drills i do in splashing hands to be very effective in self defense... i have been fortunate enough to not have to really test them that often... but when it has counted my splashing hands training came as second nature... i would consider the drills we do in splashing hands as sparring...


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## morph4me (Nov 10, 2006)

FearlessFreep said:


> I wonder if a professional baseball player, if getting mugged on the street, would sit back and wait for the perfect positioning to swing his bat or just club the crap out of the attacker with it? Baseball teches a lot of bad habits if you need to use a bat for self-defense....can they be overcome?


 
The rule of thumb is that you don't rise to the level of the situation, you sink to the level of your training.


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## Tez3 (Nov 11, 2006)

I train and fight MMA, people can argue whether something with rules can help with self defence. It can, it has taught me I can take a punch without panicking, also I can keep my wits about me when being taken down, choked or held. All the SD techniques in the world won't help you if you freeze when attacked. MMA is full contact and even the sparring is pretty full on when you've had some experience. If you don't know you can take a punch or hit your imagination makes it pretty scary, the reality is that it's not nearly as bad as you think it would be. Btw I'm female, 5' 4" and American size 8. ( I like American sizes they're smaller than ours lol)


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## morph4me (Nov 11, 2006)

Tez3 said:


> I train and fight MMA, people can argue whether something with rules can help with self defence. It can, it has taught me I can take a punch without panicking, also I can keep my wits about me when being taken down, choked or held. All the SD techniques in the world won't help you if you freeze when attacked. MMA is full contact and even the sparring is pretty full on when you've had some experience. If you don't know you can take a punch or hit your imagination makes it pretty scary, the reality is that it's not nearly as bad as you think it would be. Btw I'm female, 5' 4" and American size 8. ( I like American sizes they're smaller than ours lol)


 
Tez, I don't think anyone is arguing whether something with rules can help in self defense, I think that everyone pretty much agrees that any tool you have in the toolbox will help. The original question was about the differences one would have to be aware of in the transition. Getting used to getting hit is a definite plus, knowing what to do when you go to the ground is also a plus being able to recognize openings and use the correct weapon or technique to exploit those openings is a plus. 

Depending on having a referee to keep you from getting seriously hurt is a plus when you're training or fighting in a ring, but it won't help in a self defense situation. Rules fall into the same category, a plus in training, a minus if you can't get past it in self defense.


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## Tez3 (Nov 11, 2006)

You are assuming perhaps that as MA's we get stuck in a groove and can't move out of that if the situation is one without a referee? I would disagree, in a street fighting situation I have no thoughts of rules, refs or MMA. Due to the nature of my work I have had occasion to fight my way out of things. I don't rely on rules, I rely on fighting dirty. I will headbutt ( I was taught how to do it properly) gouge, fish hook, rip eyes out and basically do anything I have to as well as any MA moves. My instructor makes sure we know how to defend ourselves without fancy moves or techniques. I don't care if it's brutal or bloody as he says "it's better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6". Too many people only have theories about fighting in the street, too many what if's. The trick to fighting in the street is not to think. Have a trigger word, that when you want to attack ( ie defend yourself!) you say this word and you launch yourself. Practice, practice and practice this word and action until it becomes second nature and purely instinctive to able to react without hesitation, without the "what if he does this or what if I hurt him ( yes people do hesitate over that). Everyone I train with, soldiers, doormen, police and security officers also fights MMA and none of us have problems differenciating between MMA bouts and SD.


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## morph4me (Nov 12, 2006)

Your profession, and alternate training, gives you advantages that most who practice martial arts don't have, the way some of us grew up gives us those same advantages. I've never had the problem differentiating, because I learned MA in order to make my streetfighting more effective, I never used a trigger, but I love that idea. I have heard horror stories from some of my students, who are also police officers, about some of their colleagues, who are great in the dojo, getting seriously hurt, because they couldn't separate the dojo from the street. On the other hand, most of those, we found out later, had a MA background and then joined the force, so their MA training was secondary.


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## Tez3 (Nov 12, 2006)

What's always worried me is that if you do a lot of punching into the air and pulling your punches when you spar you learn to do that all the time. When doing uppercuts/rising punches people more often than not stop too short rather than practising following it through.
 The trigger thing came from my instructor and I think works especially well for women who can't summon up the aggression in the same way men can. Another little trick is when talking to someone you feel could kick off bring your 'punching' hand up to your face, put your hand on your chin/side of the face/ stroke your nose etc anything so that you have your hand immediately there to either strike or block. It's a non-threatening movement and if they don't attack all you do is end up looking thoughtful.


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## morph4me (Nov 13, 2006)

Tez3 said:


> What's always worried me is that if you do a lot of punching into the air and pulling your punches when you spar you learn to do that all the time. When doing uppercuts/rising punches people more often than not stop too short rather than practising following it through.
> The trigger thing came from my instructor and I think works especially well for women who can't summon up the aggression in the same way men can. Another little trick is when talking to someone you feel could kick off bring your 'punching' hand up to your face, put your hand on your chin/side of the face/ stroke your nose etc anything so that you have your hand immediately there to either strike or block. It's a non-threatening movement and if they don't attack all you do is end up looking thoughtful.


 
I was about to respond to your comment about aggression in men when it occurred to me, I actually do have a trigger, but I use it to remind myself that I'm training and not defending myself. Intersting, since I never really considered myself to be aggressive. Thanks for the insight.


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## Tez3 (Nov 13, 2006)

It can actually be very hard to get women to spar realistically (though there are exceptions lol) let alone defend themselves in a SD situation. Boys grow up scuffling with each other, batting each other around the head, punching each other and that's just among mates! They carry on doing it when they are grown up, "Hi Doug" he says giving him a friendly punch on the arm. Friendly tussles on the floor, play fights which are actually quite hard hitting are the norm for boys so sparring and defending themselves comes a whole lot easier. Women and some men need "permission" to be able to hit out. We have a training drill to help turn on "aggression" ( I'm not actually sure if that is the right word, adrenaline rush perhaps?). The class is paired up with one partner given pads, the other partner lies face down on the floor eyes closed. The people with pads move round the room. When the instructor gives the word the people on the floor jump up, find their partners and start punching, kicking,knees whatever. Then at the word go back to the floor. It's repeated several times then the partners change over. 
   It's actually a lot harder than it it sounds. When the instructor tells you to that you are sparring in class you have time usually to get your head together for it, this drill means you have to go from static to movement in seconds which is what would happen in a SD situation.


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