# Short 1 Trivia ?



## Atlanta-Kenpo (Jul 24, 2003)

In short 1 there are 2 types of torque and they are direct rotation and counter rotation.  Everything is direct rotation except the 2nd vertical outward and the 2nd downward.  There is supposed to be an example of doing both in the same move.  I think that it is in the cover step inward (minor) upward (major) secquence,.  Could anyone tell me if I am right or wrong?:asian:


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## ProfessorKenpo (Jul 25, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Atlanta-Kenpo _
> *In short 1 there are 2 types of torque and they are direct rotation and counter rotation.  Everything is direct rotation except the 2nd vertical outward and the 2nd downward.  There is supposed to be an example of doing both in the same move.  I think that it is in the cover step inward (minor) upward (major) secquence,.  Could anyone tell me if I am right or wrong?:asian: *



If you would explain the difference and significance of doing either direct or counter rotation I might be able to answer this.   I'm going to assume you mean clockwise and counter clockwise for now.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde


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## kenpoevolution (Jul 25, 2003)

There is both direct rotation and counter rotation in three places:

1) After completing the second block, when you cover to face 9:00 and execute a transitional right inward block (direct rotation) and then execute a left outward block (counter rotation), you see both direct and counter rotation. Additionally, from another perspective, there is direct rotation with the back elbow and counter rotation simultaneously with this outward block.

2) After completing the fourth block, when you cover to face 3:00 and execute a transitional right inward block (direct rotation) and then execute a left upward block (counter rotation), you see both direct and counter rotation. Additionally, from another perspective, there is direct rotation with the right back elbow and counter rotation simultaneously with this upward block.

1) After completing the sixth block, when you cover to face 6:00 and execute a transitional left inside downward palm-up block (direct rotation) and then execute a right outside downward palm-down block (counter rotation), you see both direct and counter rotation. Additionally, from another perspective, there is direct rotation with the back elbow and counter rotation simultaneously with this downward block.


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## JD_Nelson (Jul 28, 2003)

although these are not my own thoughts, i do believe they have some good merrit.  

I think the definition of torque may apply for clarity.   I think the question may be how to create the torque.

Not sure but a thought.



http://www.stormkenpo.com/oxymorons.html


JD


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## kenpoevolution (Jul 28, 2003)

A couple of sites to check out on this topic: 

1)  Definition of Torque: a power principle where we get added power from rotational force. Example: unwinding from a twist stance. (from http://www.kenpo-texas.com/kenpoterminology.html )   

2) Check out this site for a good method of breaking forms down by Mr. Burks:
http://www.uks-kenpo.com/v4i1/The_Technical_Corner.html


3) Read the fourth paragraph on this site for a little information on what types of rotation the different types of blocks use: http://kenponet.tripod.com/flame/articles/forms/patterns.html


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## Atlanta-Kenpo (Jul 29, 2003)

Kenpo-evolution, I can see your logic and I have previously thought of that but the reasons that i gave that up is because in Mr Wedlake's book he states that if you look hard enough you will even see 1 example of both.  I think.  I will double check on that.:asian:


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## kenpoevolution (Jul 29, 2003)

Please tell me what you find! 

Thanks.:asian:


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## dcence (Jul 31, 2003)

> If you would explain the difference and significance of doing either direct or counter rotation I might be able to answer this. I'm going to assume you mean clockwise and counter clockwise for now.



I think the original poster means something more than clockwise/counterclockwise.

To me, Direct Rotation refers to those moves in which your hips are moving the same direction as your arm. Counter rotation refers to instances in which your hips rotate one way, your arm the other. In Short 1, the first 3 blocks (rt inward, lt inward, lt vert outward) are done with direct rotation, meaning your hips are rotating the same direction your blocking arm is moving. This is in line with directional harmony. In the 4th block (the 2nd vert outward block) the hips rotate one direction (counterclockwise), but the arm moves the opposite direction. This uses mid-point balance (which I would argue still is directional harmony, just another type of "harmony").

I think I saw someone say they use counter rotation on the 3rd block (1st vert outward).  I don't do the third block (the 1st vert outward block) with counter rotation. To me it is too choppy and slow to do it that way. I would rather do the double factor and the primary block in one stance change.  To me it is smoother and quicker.

As far as direct and counter rotation in one move, you find this where your hips are moving counter to the block [such as in the 4th block (2nd vert outward block)]. The hips move counter to the block arm, but in tthe same direction as the back elbow strike.

Derek


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## kenpoevolution (Aug 1, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Atlanta-Kenpo _
> *...the reasons that i gave that up is because in Mr Wedlake's book he states that if you look hard enough you will even see 1 example of both.  :asian: *



What is Mr. Wedlake's book called?


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## Atlanta-Kenpo (Aug 1, 2003)

He has them (all 3) on his web site.  www.lwkarate.com
The book I am refering to is the most recent one released.:asian:


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## kenpoevolution (Aug 1, 2003)

Thanks.


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