# Black Belt Test Fees



## troubleenuf (May 16, 2016)

Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!


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## Buka (May 16, 2016)

That's just nuts. You should run. I'm serious.


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## dancingalone (May 16, 2016)

That's pricey.  I paid $800 for my 4th dan fees and I recognized that included KKW registration along with a nice profit for my master.  I was OK with it, but I knew this part of doing business (I bought a school from him too).

I would not pay $4800 unless it came with considerably more fanfare and benefits than what I received.


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## Dirty Dog (May 16, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!



Our fee for 4th Dan is about $600, a chunk of which is spent bringing in a couple of Masters to be judges.
For $4800, I hope you're getting the large economy size jar of lube.


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## KenpoDave (May 16, 2016)

I have never paid for a Kenpo rank test, nor have o charged for one.


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## Bill Mattocks (May 17, 2016)

I have never paid for an Isshin Ryu rank test, at any belt level.  I have paid for a belt when it changed colors.  $10 a pop.  It's killing me with these expenses!    Thank goodness I finally made it into the black belt ranks, the color won't change anymore!  Whew!

I am not going to say anyone else's system is wrong.  It is what it is.  Everyone has to make their own choices.

The fees didn't figure into my decision about which system to train in, but I'm awfully glad I don't get nickel-and-dimed every time I turn around.


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## Danny T (May 17, 2016)

This appears you are paying for the privilege to rank not by work and skill development but through the purchasing of your rank with money. Are you the only person testing and having to bear the total cost of the event yourself? 
The greatest amount of money I have ever paid for a ranking was $150.00.


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## Blindside (May 17, 2016)

Never paid for a rank test in kali or kenpo (graded through full and high instructor ranks in both), clearly we are crappy salesmen.


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## Kenposcholar (May 17, 2016)

Our school has increased tuition in return for no testing fees.


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## Tony Dismukes (May 17, 2016)

I presume that since this thread is in the TKD section, you're specifically asking about TKD belt fees. I can't address that, but I can speak to fees in some other arts if it helps give perspective.

When I was in the Bujinkan, there was no belt test, the fee for my shodan certificate was $100. I understand that fees for the higher dan levels went a few times higher. This was about 20 years ago, so prices may have gone up.

When I got my instructor license in the Thai Boxing Association, I had to pay a small annual fee for my TBA membership. (Which I've since let lapse, so I suppose that means my license is no longer officially valid.)

There was no fee for my black belt in American kickboxing.

I have never paid any fees for any rank in BJJ and don't expect that I ever will. If I wanted to compete in IBJJF sanctioned tournaments as a black belt I would have to pay the IBJJF a registration fee of $400 + $150 annually. Since I have no plans to compete in those particular tournaments and the IBJJF has no relevance to my training it is highly unlikely that I will ever pay those rip-off artists a dime.


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## SahBumNimRush (May 17, 2016)

Something to consider, and I am not saying that $4800 is worth it or not, is are you willing to support your instructor by paying the amount to test.  

My instructor came here from Korea back in the 60's, and teaching TKD is his career.  I respect him and his teaching enough to pay a few hundred dollars for my dan testing fees, as without him, I would not have had the opportunity to learn the skill sets that I now have. 

I don't believe that the rank test itself costs that much, but I wish to support my teacher earn a living.  For what it's worth, I paid about $800 for my 6th dan test, and for the previous 6 years he received no money from me.  From that perspective, I feel it was money well spent to help keep a roof over my teacher's head.


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## Andrew Green (May 17, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!



Look at the big picture, not just the one number.  Is it $4800 for a half day thing at his gym and a certificate?  Might be a little out there, especially if it is onto of regular tuition.

If it is from a reputable "brand" and is treated more as a licensing deal when you run your own school allowing you to use their brand and promote within it, along with mentorship in growing your school and being a better instructor... that's a different sort of financial arrangement.


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## Michael Shayne (May 17, 2016)

It sounds more like a Franchise fee. If not, it is definitely an excessive amount. 

I know of a school that charges $1500 for there black belt test, but it is a franchise fee as well. You just lose it, if you decide not to open a school under that affiliation.


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## WaterGal (May 17, 2016)

In TKD, testing fees are very common, for a variety of reasons.  But I think that's pretty far outside the norm, even for a 4th dan test.  I think something in the range of $500-1500 would be more typical.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (May 17, 2016)

Any chance you can test but not be 'official' in the affiliation (get registered) for a cheaper price? If you're not planning on opening a school, no real reason to pay for the registration.


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## Buka (May 17, 2016)

I'm still stunned by the figure in the OP.


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## Blindside (May 17, 2016)

I would be a third dan for the rest of my martial arts career and be perfectly happy beating the black off of those 4th, 5th, and 6th dans.


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## Jaeimseu (May 18, 2016)

I used to hear numbers that high, especially for 4th Dan, back in the days before official Kukkiwon fees were well-known, but I'm surprised that anyone is still managing to get that much now. 

But who knows, maybe the test includes a down payment on an official "black belt club" car. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RTKDCMB (May 18, 2016)

The only cost for a 4th Dan test in my art is 20 or more years of hard work and dedication to the art.


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## Earl Weiss (May 18, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!



I note that he is your "Old" instructor.   Does "Old" = Former?   Also, do you learn of these fees or adjusted for time inflation something like that when you sign up, or is it a "Surprise".?


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## troubleenuf (May 19, 2016)

OK.. I started this thread and as I said my "old" instructor charged this much and still does.  I have not been with him for 18 years after he went even more into the money game.  After I left him I more than halved the test fees I charge but still believe they are too high so I am/was wondering what the norm is.  Hope that clarifies it.


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## JR 137 (May 20, 2016)

Just when I thought the $400+ fee for 1st dan in the system I'm in was ridiculous.  It goes up for each dan rank, but not a night and day amount.  Don't really know why it would go up for each rank either, but possibly because you test less often and it's another way of meeting the bottom line financially for the school.  I've still got at least 18 months before I test for 1st dan, so I've got time to save up.  

My teacher doesn't do dan testing.  We go to our headquarters dojo in NYC, where the cost of living and doing business is exponentially higher than where I currently am.  My teacher could do dan testing if he wanted/had to, but we're reasonably close to our headquarters that he'd rather his teacher test us instead of him.  

I also train for dirt cheap, so I just look at dan testing fees as making up for the money I've saved in tuition, which after adding up the dan test fee and tuition is still far cheaper than anywhere else I know.

My teacher doesn't receive any of the money.  It goes directly to the dojo that's testing.

When I tested for 1st dan in my former system about 15 years ago, I paid $125.  The embroidered belt and certificate cost about $75, so it's not like he was pocketing a ton of cash.  4 or 5 people tested twice a year.  My 2nd dan test would have also been $125, but I left for grad school 2 million months before I could take it.


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## JR 137 (May 20, 2016)

Stupid question...

Does the $4800 include anything other than the test, belt, and certificate?   Some TKD schools around me charge more than that for 1st dan, but it includes all tuition and any other testing fees (other than uniforms) until 1st dan.  They call it the black belt plan - pay one price (up front or through monthly payments) for everything until you pass your 1st black belt test.


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## RTKDCMB (May 21, 2016)

JR 137 said:


> but I left for grad school 2 million months before I could take it.


Five and a half thousand years is a long time to wait for a test.


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## TrueJim (May 21, 2016)

RTKDCMB said:


> Five and a half thousand years is a long time to wait for a test.



Anything less than three thousand years between belt tests is a McDOJO!


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## andyjeffries (May 21, 2016)

We charge about $160 including Kukkiwon certification for 4th Dan. If you sign up on a yearly plan you get it for free. We're one of the cheapest schools around though, with other UK instructors complaining about it. I'm not in this for the money...

Stevenage Taekwondo - Olympic Sport and Korean Martial Art of Self-defence in Herts


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## WaterGal (May 21, 2016)

JR 137 said:


> Just when I thought the $400+ fee for 1st dan in the system I'm in was ridiculous.  It goes up for each dan rank, but not a night and day amount.  Don't really know why it would go up for each rank either, but possibly because you test less often and it's another way of meeting the bottom line financially for the school.  I've still got at least 18 months before I test for 1st dan, so I've got time to save up.



There are a couple reasons why the testing fee may go up for each dan rank.  If the test includes being certified through a federation, the federation may charge more for each dan level (Kukkiwon, for example, does this). Also, oftentimes, each dan level involves a longer test, more boards to break, etc.  So conducting a 2nd dan test may involve more work and expense for the school/examiner than running a 1st dan test. I think it's reasonable for them to charge $50 or $100 more for 2nd dan for that reason.

But it also might just be "because they can".


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## JR 137 (May 21, 2016)

JR 137 said:


> ...My 2nd dan test would have also been $125, but I left for grad school 2 million months before I could take it.



Damn iPhone autocorrect!

2 months before my 2nd dan test.

The organization I'm in (Seido Juku) doesn't have any licensing associated with rank that I know of.  I'd imagine there's things you have to do if you open your own dojo, but I don't think there's blanket licenses.


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## granfire (May 21, 2016)

Oh, wow!

Back when (can't hardly believe it's been over a decade by now)
I paid 50 bucks for color belt testing (on top of my membership), then 95 for BB tests - but they were not every wo months, but every 4, so the price went down - then again, I think the belts cost the Sabum maybe $5

In the beginning, three schools pooled their resources and held tests in a rented gym - even schools charge you these days. 
#rd Dan on up - if I recall this right, as I dropped out at 2nd - was at a national tournament (which would save the extra cost for the judges to travel, as they were already there)
but 4800, that is a lot of mullah!


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## Balrog (May 21, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!


ATA is $100 x rank being tested for.  They require 3-4 midterm testings during the time in rank, and the fees for the midterms are credited toward the testing fee.  If you NC, you test the next time for free.


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## Chester Wright (May 21, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!



Your getting ripped off!


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## IcemanSK (May 24, 2016)

A few years ago, a man posted here that he had spent $11,000 for his son's 2nd Dan Kukkiwon test. He wondered if that was the norm. After some questioning to gain information, it came to light that the instructor had brought in GM Hae Man PARK to oversee the 2nd Dan test. GM PARK is one of the designers of the Tae Geuk poomsae & a huge name in Taekwondo. In short, the man paid so much because he had equivalent of the Rolling Stones play at his kid's birthday party. GM PARK is my instructor's instructor & I highly doubt that he charges THAT much to come to an event. This instructor certain took advantage of this student.

My point is, with bringing grandmasters or masters in for a test can be a reason for a larger amount for a test. To the OP: did you have other grandmasters than your own sit on your testing board? Was there a large party-type event in your honor that would constitute such a large amount for your test? I'm trying to assess why he would charge so much for 4th Dan.


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## troubleenuf (May 26, 2016)

I will try to answer most of your questions... First of all I tested for 4th Dan with my old instructor 20 years ago.  I left him after 5th Dan partly because of his getting greedy and party because he was supporting what I would deem a child molester in opening another school.  
First:  He charged that much, and still does to those that are still with him, because he made us all believe that it was the norm and that a Kukkiwon was hard to get and we were "lucky" that we were one of the only ones in the states getting them.  
Second:  We did not bring in anyone else for that test.  I did test in front of GM Byung Jik Ro for first dan when he came over from Korea.  
Third:  No parties, no special privileges, just spent a lot of money on something that should not have cost that much.  Basically he has made a career out of taking advantage of us in ND.  He is able to do this mainly because he kept us isolated from anyone else.  
A side note... after I left him he began promoting his instructors to black belts in Hopkido and Kumdo on weekend seminars that he charged $1500 for.  And of course everyone passed and received a black belt.


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## Kong Soo Do (May 27, 2016)

KenpoDave said:


> I have never paid for a Kenpo rank test, nor have o charged for one.



Same here.  

For $4800 for a test?  A fool and his money are soon parted.


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## Archtkd (May 27, 2016)

IcemanSK said:


> A few years ago, a man posted here that he had spent $11,000 for his son's 2nd Dan Kukkiwon test. He wondered if that was the norm.



Iceman, was that a typo? $11,000 and someone asked if that was the "norm."???. I need only three students like that.


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## IcemanSK (May 27, 2016)

Archtkd said:


> Iceman, was that a typo? $11,000 and someone asked if that was the "norm."???. I need only three students like that.



The number is correct: eleven thousand dollars for 2nd Dan. It was posted here in maybe 2009 or so. If I remember correctly, that student was testing for 2nd Dan & there were 2 other students testing for 1st Dan (I don't recall how much the others were charged). Yeah, pretty crazy. Another odd part was that the instructor didn't even tell the students, "GM Hae Man PARK is going to be there." The father of the student posted a photo of the testing group from their small town Texas newspaper. He had no idea who GM PARK until I told him. So there was no reason given for the high price of the test by the instructor to the students.


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## IcemanSK (May 27, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> I will try to answer most of your questions... First of all I tested for 4th Dan with my old instructor 20 years ago.  I left him after 5th Dan partly because of his getting greedy and party because he was supporting what I would deem a child molester in opening another school.
> First:  He charged that much, and still does to those that are still with him, because he made us all believe that it was the norm and that a Kukkiwon was hard to get and we were "lucky" that we were one of the only ones in the states getting them.
> Second:  We did not bring in anyone else for that test.  I did test in front of GM Byung Jik Ro for first dan when he came over from Korea.
> Third:  No parties, no special privileges, just spent a lot of money on something that should not have cost that much.  Basically he has made a career out of taking advantage of us in ND.  He is able to do this mainly because he kept us isolated from anyone else.
> A side note... after I left him he began promoting his instructors to black belts in Hopkido and Kumdo on weekend seminars that he charged $1500 for.  And of course everyone passed and received a black belt.



I'm sorry that happened to you. I'm glad you've moved on.


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## Kinghercules (May 28, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> OK.. I started this thread and as I said my "old" instructor charged this much and still does.  I have not been with him for 18 years after he went even more into the money game.  After I left him I more than halved the test fees I charge but still believe they are too high so I am/was wondering what the norm is.  Hope that clarifies it.


Who was your instructor?


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## Gerry Seymour (May 28, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> Hello,  Wondering what the norm is around the country for 4th, 5th and 6th Dan test fees?  My old instructor is still charging $4800 for 4th Dan?!


I have no problem with reasonable fees at any level. That's not reasonable.


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## Gerry Seymour (May 28, 2016)

Michael Shayne said:


> It sounds more like a Franchise fee. If not, it is definitely an excessive amount.
> 
> I know of a school that charges $1500 for there black belt test, but it is a franchise fee as well. You just lose it, if you decide not to open a school under that affiliation.


Charging a "franchise fee" to someone who is not opening a school is inexcusable, IMO.


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## Gerry Seymour (May 28, 2016)

troubleenuf said:


> OK.. I started this thread and as I said my "old" instructor charged this much and still does.  I have not been with him for 18 years after he went even more into the money game.  After I left him I more than halved the test fees I charge but still believe they are too high so I am/was wondering what the norm is.  Hope that clarifies it.


I don't think there is a norm. Some schools and associations don't charge any additional fee at any level. Some charge significant fees at black belt levels. Both are acceptable, so long as there's some reasonable level of fees. My personal view is that normal fees should support testing and promotions - the average shodan has paid thousands of dollars for the training that got him there. If an instructor wants to charge $100 or more for that promotion, that's still reasonable. When you get up to 4 figures, there had better be a lot more involved than just the promotion to the next level. Franchise fees (for those wanting to start a school) may be okay, or even just instructor training fees (assuming there's specific training on instruction).


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## msmitht (May 29, 2016)

Belt test fees are high and the norm in san diego. I know a GM who charges 75 a test and has 17 belts before poom. Then it is 1000 x poom/Dan level. Of course everyone passes and no one fails.


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## Wilde (Jun 1, 2016)

In my association it's a $100 for first Dan and for each rank then on is plus $100.


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## wade (Jun 6, 2016)

1st Dan, $300. 2nd Dan, $400, ect. skip dans are doable up to 4th. Must pay for all ranks skipped and rank applying for.  If, IF, and this is a biggie, you pass the test and your thesis is good. You come to me or you pay me to come to you. There are no free rides, you have to actually earn the belt.


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