# You can't call back a bullet



## PhotonGuy (Nov 4, 2014)

One of the things thats been taught in most if not all of my shooting classes is that you can't call back a bullet. Once the shot has been fired its been fired and if your shot hits something that you don't want it to hit such as an innocent bystander you can't undo it. That is why you have to know your target and what's beyond and know where your bullets can land. That being said, bullets are one thing but how about words? Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?


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## Blindside (Nov 4, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> One of the things thats been taught in most if not all of my shooting classes is that you can't call back a bullet. Once the shot has been fired its been fired and if your shot hits something that you don't want it to hit such as an innocent bystander you can't undo it. That is why you have to know your target and what's beyond and know where your bullets can land. That being said, bullets are one thing but how about words? Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?



You can't take them back, but you can certainly show through your posts that your approach to posting has changed.  I think one of your issues on posting is that you tend to post your opinion or experience as a fact throughout the martial arts communities.  "As martial artists we are supposed to be kind, courteous, and nice" is an opinion, it doesn't hold true for all martial arts though it may hold true for yours.  A better way to say that might be "I was taught in my martial arts studies to be kind, courteous, and nice," which is something nobody could disagree with.

Also, acknowledging the difference in opinion on a topic is fine, there were a couple of threads that you would just not let die, and that was a bit aggravating.  I think you are a well intentioned poster that has a different approach than many on this board, and quite frankly, there are many odd personalities in martial arts, the forums are usually pretty good about tolerating that.


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## Buka (Nov 4, 2014)

Blindside said:


> I think you are a well intentioned poster that has a different approach than many on this board, and quite frankly, there are many odd personalities in martial arts, the forums are usually pretty good about tolerating that.



You're on the money, Blindside. Odd personalities in martial arts....gee, ya think? As a karate guy, wow, I think there's more odd folks in Karate than in any other discipline. Lots of great folks, for sure, but karate seems to be a magnet for odd. Except, me of course, I'm perfectly normal.


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## ballen0351 (Nov 4, 2014)

Just because you use the word bullet doesnt make this a firearms related topic


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## Buka (Nov 4, 2014)

And you CAN call back a bullet. It just won't come.


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## Tames D (Nov 4, 2014)

ballen0351 said:


> Just because you use the word bullet doesnt make this a firearms related topic



I took it as a metaphor. Maybe the thread should be moved.


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## Dirty Dog (Nov 4, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> One of the things thats been taught in most if not all of my shooting classes is that you can't call back a bullet. Once the shot has been fired its been fired and if your shot hits something that you don't want it to hit such as an innocent bystander you can't undo it. That is why you have to know your target and what's beyond and know where your bullets can land. That being said, bullets are one thing but how about words? Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?



You can retract statements, but humans don't forget on command. How the retraction is received, and how much it influences people, will depend on many things. Including how the retraction is worded, the reasons given for the retraction, and how future posts tie in with the retracted words and/or the newly adopted position.


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## jks9199 (Nov 4, 2014)

ADMIN NOTE:

Thread moved to The Bar & Grill as it is a better fit for the topic. 

jks9199
Asst. Admin


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## wingchun100 (Nov 4, 2014)

Buka said:


> You're on the money, Blindside. Odd personalities in martial arts....gee, ya think? As a karate guy, wow, I think there's more odd folks in Karate than in any other discipline. Lots of great folks, for sure, but karate seems to be a magnet for odd. Except, me of course, I'm perfectly normal.



That's funny. In my wing chun school, we seem to be a magnet for nerds/geeks/whatever term you prefer. Me, I like nerd for myself.


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## Blindside (Nov 4, 2014)

wingchun100 said:


> That's funny. In my wing chun school, we seem to be a magnet for nerds/geeks/whatever term you prefer. Me, I like nerd for myself.



I don't doubt that an instructor will attract a certain crowd, but I swear the kali groups tend toward libertarian leaning, sci-fi reading, CCW packing, survivalist geeks.

Please ignore my stack of Baen books titles pile on top of the gunsafe.....


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## Blindside (Nov 4, 2014)

Buka said:


> You're on the money, Blindside. Odd personalities in martial arts....gee, ya think? As a karate guy, wow, I think there's more odd folks in Karate than in any other discipline. Lots of great folks, for sure, but karate seems to be a magnet for odd. Except, me of course, I'm perfectly normal.



Actually one of the compliments (I guess) I have gotten was "you are the most normal martial arts instructor I have ever had."


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## drop bear (Nov 5, 2014)

wingchun100 said:


> That's funny. In my wing chun school, we seem to be a magnet for nerds/geeks/whatever term you prefer. Me, I like nerd for myself.



All martial arts are a magnet for nerdgeeks. Cool kids play ball sports.


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## Buka (Nov 5, 2014)

Blindside said:


> Actually one of the compliments (I guess) I have gotten was "you are the most normal martial arts instructor I have ever had."



I think only those who have trained in the Arts can really appreciate how cool that is.   Pretty awesome.


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## Balrog (Nov 5, 2014)

Buka said:


> You're on the money, Blindside. Odd personalities in martial arts....gee, ya think? As a karate guy, wow, I think there's more odd folks in Karate than in any other discipline. Lots of great folks, for sure, but karate seems to be a magnet for odd. Except, me of course, I'm perfectly normal.



To paraphrase an old saying:  Everyone on this board is crazy except for you and me.  And you've been posting some strange stuff lately.

:boing1:


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## Tony Dismukes (Nov 5, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> One of the things thats been taught in most if not all of my shooting classes is that you can't call back a bullet. Once the shot has been fired its been fired and if your shot hits something that you don't want it to hit such as an innocent bystander you can't undo it. That is why you have to know your target and what's beyond and know where your bullets can land. That being said, bullets are one thing but how about words? Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?



Getting back to the original question...

You can't just retract things you've said and expect people to forget you've ever said them. However...

If you have been arguing a stupid/uninformed/immature position and then you say "I've been thinking about what you've said and you've convinced me that I was wrong and you were right," you will earn a certain amount of respect from many folks. If you continue to demonstrate that you really have learned the lesson in question, you will earn more respect.

If you have said hurtful things and you say "I shouldn't have said that. I apologize," you will make some progress towards soothing the feelings of those you may have offended. If you continue to demonstrate that you sincerely are sorry and you refrain from saying further hurtful things, then you have a good chance of winning forgiveness from most folks.

Some people hold on to first impressions and grudges longer than others. For those people you will have to demonstrate a longer period of good behavior before they let go of the opinions they have formed of you.

That's just general theory. In terms of your behavior on this board, I don't think you've been particularly offensive or exceptionally stupid. You have been somewhat ... fixated on a few odd ideas, but if you let go of those and move on I expect most of the other posters here will as well.


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## Tony Dismukes (Nov 5, 2014)

Blindside said:


> Actually one of the compliments (I guess) I have gotten was "you are the most normal martial arts instructor I have ever had."



In my family that would be considered an insult. "What do you mean calling me _normal_?  You take that back!"


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 7, 2014)

Blindside said:


> You can't take them back, but you can certainly show through your posts that your approach to posting has changed.  I think one of your issues on posting is that you tend to post your opinion or experience as a fact throughout the martial arts communities.  "As martial artists we are supposed to be kind, courteous, and nice" is an opinion, it doesn't hold true for all martial arts though it may hold true for yours.  A better way to say that might be "I was taught in my martial arts studies to be kind, courteous, and nice," which is something nobody could disagree with.
> 
> Also, acknowledging the difference in opinion on a topic is fine, there were a couple of threads that you would just not let die, and that was a bit aggravating.  I think you are a well intentioned poster that has a different approach than many on this board, and quite frankly, there are many odd personalities in martial arts, the forums are usually pretty good about tolerating that.



Well Im not the only one who states my opinion as fact there are other people who have done it as well. Also, people have said that I dodge certain questions, well people here also dodge certain questions of mine so Im just pointing that out. 

If I don't let a thread die its usually because I haven't made my point which is sometimes because the thread goes off in another tangent or because some of my questions haven't been answered, as I said, people dodge some of my questions too.


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## Zero (Nov 7, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well Im not the only one who states my opinion as fact there are other people who have done it as well. Also, people have said that I dodge certain questions, well people here also dodge certain questions of mine so Im just pointing that out.
> 
> If I don't let a thread die its usually because I haven't made my point which is sometimes because the thread goes off in another tangent or because some of my questions haven't been answered, as I said, people dodge some of my questions too.


That may be true and in keeping with your original post, while hard to recall, you can dodge bullets (if you have studied the correct MA).


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## Transk53 (Nov 7, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well Im not the only one who states my opinion as fact there are other people who have done it as well. Also, people have said that I dodge certain questions, well people here also dodge certain questions of mine so Im just pointing that out.
> 
> If I don't let a thread die its usually because I haven't made my point which is sometimes because the thread goes off in another tangent or because some of my questions haven't been answered, as I said, people dodge some of my questions too.



Hey Photon Guy, I do the odd because I am just different. I don't make my point either, some people may laugh but I do not care. I go off in tangents because that is also me. However, I don't dodge questions and don't assume to know what I am talking about with MA. Just my take.


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## Transk53 (Nov 7, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> One of the things thats been taught in most if not all of my shooting classes is that you can't call back a bullet. Once the shot has been fired its been fired and if your shot hits something that you don't want it to hit such as an innocent bystander you can't undo it. That is why you have to know your target and what's beyond and know where your bullets can land. That being said, bullets are one thing but how about words? Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?



No offence intended.


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## Buka (Nov 7, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well Im not the only one who states my opinion as fact there are other people who have done it as well. Also, people have said that I dodge certain questions, well people here also dodge certain questions of mine so Im just pointing that out.
> 
> If I don't let a thread die its usually because I haven't made my point which is sometimes because the thread goes off in another tangent or because some of my questions haven't been answered, as I said, people dodge some of my questions too.



Your question -_ Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?_

I can only speak for myself. I forgot about it already, no worries.

Besides, it's the Internet and a bunch of strangers. I can hear the conversation now - I'm in blue text talking to anyone I know with common sense.
"And then you know what he said?"
"Who's_ he_?"
"The guy on the forum."
And again, who's _he_?"
"A guy I talk to on the forum thing."
"Who you don't know?"
"No, not really."
"But you think he's wrong? Or he pissed you off."
"Yes, he is and he did."
"So, someone who you don't know, who trains in something different than you, said something you didn't like and it bothers you? And you teach Martial Arts? let me ask you this...would you train under somebody as stupid as you?"


Anyway, no worries.


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## Tony Dismukes (Nov 7, 2014)

Buka said:


> Your question -_ Can I take back stuff I say on this board and ask people to forget I said it?_
> 
> I can only speak for myself. I forgot about it already, no worries.
> 
> ...



But duty calls!


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 10, 2014)

Transk53 said:


> Hey Photon Guy, I do the odd because I am just different. I don't make my point either, some people may laugh but I do not care. I go off in tangents because that is also me. However, I don't dodge questions and don't assume to know what I am talking about with MA. Just my take.



Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.


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## Dirty Dog (Nov 10, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



I would have planned ahead and allowed time to prepare for my party. If you crank up the heat, you ruin the cake, your party is spoiled, and you look like a buffoon. Same as when you try to rush your training. Or work projects. Which will prevent you from holding down a job, since an employee that can't plan ahead and finish jobs properly isn't worth keeping.


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## Blindside (Nov 10, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



Make a different cake, for example banana cream cakes are quick, about a half hour prep time, half hour bake time, cool and frost.  

But I don't think that is what you are looking for.


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## Zero (Nov 11, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



And where you have been too lax to plan ahead appropriately, outsource.  Get on your bike to the local shop or order up online some iced masterpiece.  

Focus on the important things, if you like to bake, then bake, if not spend the two hours to make the cake working on your heavy bag and have someone else do that baking.  Simples Dimples.


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## Tony Dismukes (Nov 11, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



With a literal cake, turning up the heat won't work, so you examine your options. You can go out and buy a pre-made cake. You can prepare a different kind of dessert that doesn't take as long. You can plan additional party activities to keep the partygoers occupied until the cake is ready. You look at the specifics of your situation to decide which option works best for you.  Ideally you would have planned ahead and started the cake on time, but I'm assuming that in your hypothetical scenario there is some good reason why that didn't happen.

Of course you're using the cake as a metaphor, but the same principles apply to whatever real world situation the cake is meant to represent. Look at the available realistic options and select the one which works best under the circumstances. We can't offer a specific solution without knowing the specifics of the problem.


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## Transk53 (Nov 11, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



Well for one thing, the cake would have would wait. The main course would fill them up, thus the need for the cake would just be casual, not thought as necessary.
Yeah though, bad timekeeping is one my bugbears.


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## Chris Parker (Nov 12, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well here is one of my questions that's been dodged. Somebody once pointed out that it takes 2 hours to make a cake and if you try to speed it up by turning up the heat in the oven you will only ruin the cake. Well this was my question, lets say you got a party at 8 and you need to get the cake done by then, what would you do? That is a question of mine that's been dodged and my point was that in life there are things that need to be done within given time periods and that's how it is with most jobs. If you're not able to get stuff done within given time periods then there are some very important things in life you wont be able to do such as hold down a job.



This is from a completely discussion that you've had a few times&#8230; but I'd like to point out that no, that question wasn't "dodged", as, well, it wasn't asked in the first place. But, more importantly, the idea of the "cake" was used as a way to try to explain to you why your mentality and beliefs were not realistic, nor in line with the real factors involved&#8230; you are here trying to expand it in a way-too-literal form, missing entirely what was said, why it was said, and what it was trying to relay to you.

Your questions, when you've had them, have not been dodged. You may not have understood or accepted the answers you were given, but you were answered. The same cannot be said for you, however.


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## Steve (Nov 12, 2014)

With contracting, the adage is that the job can be done fast, done well or done cheap, but you can only pick two.  

I've found that this applies to most things, including your cake metaphor.   


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 13, 2014)

Steve said:


> With contracting, the adage is that the job can be done fast, done well or done cheap, but you can only pick two.


Than I would pick having the job done fast and well.


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## Steve (Nov 13, 2014)

In your cake scenario, that means buying it from a pro.  


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 13, 2014)

Planning ahead to have the cake done for the party would definitely work. Making a cake that you don't have to bake so you can get it done faster, serving it later in the party, or buying it from a pro would also work but what Im trying to get at is if you've got something that needs to get done and it needs to get done within an X amount of time to get it done within that X amount of time. The cake scenario is just one example, there are gazillions of other examples.


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## Steve (Nov 13, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Planning ahead to have the cake done for the party would definitely work. Making a cake that you don't have to bake so you can get it done faster, serving it later in the party, or buying it from a pro would also work but what Im trying to get at is if you've got something that needs to get done and it needs to get done within an X amount of time to get it done within that X amount of time. The cake scenario is just one example, there are gazillions of other examples.



Planning ahead is investing time.  In other words, you're opting for cheap and done well, in lieu of done well and done fast.

Of course, this all presumes competence to do a good job.   Nothing will help an incompetent do a job well.


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## donald1 (Nov 14, 2014)

Buka said:


> You're on the money, Blindside. Odd personalities in martial arts....gee, ya think? As a karate guy, wow, I think there's more *odd folks* in Karate than in any other discipline. Lots of great folks, for sure, but karate seems to be a magnet for odd. Except, me of course, I'm perfectly normal.



I prefer to think of it as a different perspective...  Or special...


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 14, 2014)

Steve said:


> Planning ahead is investing time.  In other words, you're opting for cheap and done well, in lieu of done well and done fast.
> 
> Of course, this all presumes competence to do a good job.   Nothing will help an incompetent do a job well.
> 
> ...



The important thing is to get the job done in the time it needs to get done, and to do a good job, I wouldn't settle for a slip shod job.


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## Steve (Nov 14, 2014)

There is a functional limit sometimes on what can be done when and for how much money.   


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## PhotonGuy (Nov 19, 2014)

Blindside said:


> You can't take them back, but you can certainly show through your posts that your approach to posting has changed.  I think one of your issues on posting is that you tend to post your opinion or experience as a fact throughout the martial arts communities.  "As martial artists we are supposed to be kind, courteous, and nice" is an opinion, it doesn't hold true for all martial arts though it may hold true for yours.  A better way to say that might be "I was taught in my martial arts studies to be kind, courteous, and nice," which is something nobody could disagree with.


Well yes I have been taught that martial artists are supposed to be  kind, courteous, and nice and from what I've seen, most dojos do emphasize some sort of courtesy among students. If anything, one of the morals that's been taught in my experience in the martial arts is not to be a bully. I know not all martial artists live up to that but I think at least on this site we should be like that, after all in the title of this site it says its the, "Friendly Martial Arts Community," key word "friendly." And, for those of us that emphasize patience we should set a good example by being patient with other members on this site.


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## Blindside (Nov 19, 2014)

PhotonGuy said:


> Well yes I have been taught that martial artists are supposed to be  kind, courteous, and nice and from what I've seen, most dojos do emphasize some sort of courtesy among students. If anything, one of the morals that's been taught in my experience in the martial arts is not to be a bully. I know not all martial artists live up to that but I think at least on this site we should be like that, after all in the title of this site it says its the, "Friendly Martial Arts Community," key word "friendly." And, for those of us that emphasize patience we should set a good example by being patient with other members on this site.



Very nice post.


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