# Karate Teacher Charged With Kicking Child Over 200 Times



## ArmorOfGod (Nov 26, 2007)

http://www.wvec.com/news/topstories/stories/wvec_local_112607_karate_abuse_charges.3f9762db.html
Click there to read the news story.

AoG


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## ArmorOfGod (Nov 26, 2007)

If you want to see that school's website, it has been taken down, but you can see what it looked like several month ago through archive.org , which takes snapshots of what dead sites (& currently active ones) looked like.
Click here to see it: http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.jbkarate.com/

AoG


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## exile (Nov 26, 2007)

This is such a twisted concept of what MA training is about that you have to assume, if the story holds up factually, that the Batemans were involved in some shared mental pathology, a kind of _folie à deux_ that led them to use their positions as instructors to express what  has to be some kind of sadism disorder. Every parent's nightmare, in other words&#8212;your child winds up being cannon fodder for sickos who've been able to conceal their game&#8212;maybe for years. Let's just hope the child ultimately recovers from his injuries, and that the prosecution brings in the maximum indictment possible for this crime. 

What I don't get,  though, is where the parents were when this happened. I have a ten-year old, and if he were doing MAs, I'd be present at every class he was in. And that wouldn's change a year down the line, after he turned 11. For a lot of people, MAs are a kind of babysitting/after-school rec program for their kids; this is one excellent example of the dangers of thinking of the MAs that way.


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## grydth (Nov 26, 2007)

As my youngest used to say," Sumpin' stinks in here!"......... but what, exactly?

We'll need to see what facts come out in the legal proceedings.

200 kicks sounds immense - - - what's the deal here:  S+M posing as karate?  The evil Karate Kid dojo come to life?  Could they be fakes who went way too far with their act? 

Yet, seen another way - how powerful could those kicks have been if the kid's still around. Nobody would take a tenth of that number of real kicks from the instructors at my kids' school and still be around to complain.

Yes, where indeed were the parents? Isn't it odd that, in so many tales of abused and murdered children, the parents were off doing something else?

Lots of questions - let's see what we get for answers as this unfolds.


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## exile (Nov 26, 2007)

grydth said:


> Isn't it odd that, in so many tales of abused and murdered children, the parents were off doing something else?



See, that's what really troubles megiven the vulnerability of children to predators of all kinds, why was this kid left on his own to undergo this kind of treatment?

And yes, it's true_200_ kicks? That does seem like a huge number to absorb and still be alive. ... yet another news story which on the face of it makes no sense.


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## tellner (Nov 26, 2007)

Nothing witty or insightful to say. Just that that is some really ****ed up ****.


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## seninoniwashi (Nov 27, 2007)

Unfortunately all it takes is one egg to ruin the whole cartoon. Seeing stuff like this bothers me, it gives martial arts a bad name. The art of Kenpo has received a lot of bad publicity due to teachers like this taking it too far. Anyone out there that is familiar to Kenpo knows that per tradition when belt testing a student sustains a kick from the instructor. The kick is a single kick and is controlled by the instructor fitting what he believes is JUST enough for the student at their progressed level. 

My hope is publicity stays within just their school.


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## Logan (Nov 27, 2007)

That's a bit bizarre....but who counted 200 kicks? Not that I don't believe what I read in the media or anything....if someone kicked me 200 times I would be more prone to worry about injury etc than thinking "hmm 198,199,200,...."


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## MBuzzy (Nov 27, 2007)

Not just that kid's parents....but where were the OTHER parents?  I mean, we have parents that drop their kids off, but there has NEVER been a class where there were no parents that stayed.  There's always at least one, and even if it wasn't their kid, most parents would say something about that.  Or pull their own kid out.


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## jks9199 (Nov 27, 2007)

MBuzzy said:


> Not just that kid's parents....but where were the OTHER parents?  I mean, we have parents that drop their kids off, but there has NEVER been a class where there were no parents that stayed.  There's always at least one, and even if it wasn't their kid, most parents would say something about that.  Or pull their own kid out.


I'd suspect that the TKD school is one with "before & after school programs" where the kids are dropped off before school, go to "real" school from the TKD school, get picked up after school, and the parents pick them up in the evening.  

I've said it before; these programs scare me, and this is exactly why.  They aren't supervised or regulated like the day care program they really are.  And the parents are blindly trusting that it'll be fine...

But I also doubt this was the first time something like this happened at this school.  I doubt that the instructor woke up that day, and said "I think I'm gonna beat on a kid today."  I suspect that they did similar things for a while.


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## exile (Nov 27, 2007)

jks9199 said:


> But I also doubt this was the first time something like this happened at this school.  I doubt that the instructor woke up that day, and said "I think I'm gonna beat on a kid today."  I suspect that they did similar things for a while.



Exactlya martial arts program can be the perfect camouflage for sadistic personalities to get free rein to indulge their personality defect. Misconceptions about the MAs are general enough in the poplulation that, unfortunately, the Cobra Kai model is probably viewed as the default by many people who don't really have a clue. I suspect that some parents, at some level, confuse that kind of structured brutality with the instillation of `discipline' in their children, something they find themselves unable to do in an effective way themselves.


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## arnisador (Nov 27, 2007)

exile said:


> And yes, it's true_200_ kicks? That does seem like a huge number to absorb and still be alive. ... yet another news story which on the face of it makes no sense.



Yeah, I'm wondering what more there is to this or what may have gotten confused in the early reporting...


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## exile (Nov 27, 2007)

arnisador said:


> Yeah, I'm wondering what more there is to this or what may have gotten confused in the early reporting...



Given the accuracy level of most journalism, it would be worth keeping an eye on this story to see exactly what turns out to have happened. This is the problem with forming judgments on the basis of newpaper stories... I suspect there's more than a little Rita Skeeter in many reporters working for dailies... I'm still trying to withhold judgment till the facts are made clearer, but we'll probably have to wait for the court hearings themselves for that.


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## Shotochem (Nov 27, 2007)

This one sounds like it could have some truthful elements along with a heavy dose of exaggeration.

     First of all, I have trained where taking kicks and punches was the norm and just part of regular conditioning.  (No we did not blast each other as hard as we could.)  They were controlled strikes and were varied according to the individual.  We used common sense the goal was to condition you body NOT break it.

Kids were never hit by the instructors.  Only each other.  (What were they thinking?)

     Second, if the instructors stepped over the line and even half of it is true, they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and serve as an example of what not to be.

 For now I will step outside of my usual box and not condemn until the facts are in........????


Marc-


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## phlaw (Nov 27, 2007)

Wow...

http://www.wavy.com/Global/story.asp?S=7411739

*Martial arts teacher arrested for kicking student 200 times
*if (document.layers) {document.write(''); document.close();}*coreAdsCreate('wnsz_20', 'loc', '100');**




*



_Associated Press - November 26, 2007 8:15 PM ET _
SUFFOLK, Va. (AP) - A martial arts instructor has been arrested for kicking an 11-year-old student more than 200 times, causing internal injuries and possibly breaking a rib.
Police say 47-year-old Susan Bateman of Hampton was arrested November 20th and charged with one felony count of child endangerment.
Police Lieutenant D.J. George says Bateman issued a challenge November 7th during class at a Suffolk dojo to see how many kicks to the abdomen students could take. Students got into a push-up position while Bateman kicked, stopping when the student either said to or went to his or her knees.
George says the 11-year-old boy and another student took more than 200 kicks as the class counted.
The student didn't tell his parents until he needed medical attention.

Information from: The Virginian-Pilot, http://www.pilotonline.com
_Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed._


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## phlaw (Nov 27, 2007)

Another on the same story...

http://www.wavy.com/Global/story.asp?S=7410233&nav=23iiZga0

*Karate instructor accused of kicking student over 200 times
*
Posted:var wn_last_ed_date = getLEDate("Nov 26, 2007 3:56 PM EST"); document.write(wn_last_ed_date); Nov 26, 2007 02:56 PM CST 
Updated:var wn_last_ed_date = getLEDate("Nov 27, 2007 12:48 PM EST"); document.write(wn_last_ed_date); Nov 27, 2007 11:48 AM CST 









*Also on WAVY.com*

*Go to the WAVY Blogs and blog this topic*





if (document.layers) {document.write(''); document.close();}coreAdsCreate('wnsz_20', 'loc', '100');






Karate teaches self-control, discipline, and moderation. But Suffolk police say one lesson was too much for a young boy, when instructor Susan Bateman, of Jeff Bateman's School of Karate, kicked him in the ribs and stomach more than 200 times.
Police say Bateman was teaching her students toughness, challenging them to take as many kicks as possible.
"Some students may have taken ten kicks, and some students may have taken fifty kicks. And two actually took over 200 kicks," says Debbie George, of the Suffolk Police Department.
One student, an 11-year-old, was injured. George says "he did suffer some internal injuries and possibly a fractured rib."
Bateman turned herself in last Tuesday on a Felony charge of Child Endangerment. But a conversation with Susan Bateman's brother sheds a different light on the karate instructor.
"I think everybody's jumping the gun," warns Charlie Walston, Bateman's younger brother.
Walston says the student could've stopped the kicking at any point. The student was in a push up position and Bateman would kick the student between the stomach and ribs 25 times before asking if the student wanted to stop. If the student said he would like to continue, Bateman would then switch to the other side for 25 more kicks before asking once again.
Walston says the student was trying to break a record set by a different student in the Hampton studio when he kept going for some 200 kicks.
"He was asked repeatedly if he wanted to stop and he kept going until he beat the record. Then he said, 'Well, now I hold the record,'" says Walston.
And Walston says parents in the nearby observation room could've jumped in to stop the kicking if they thought it was too much.
"There was definitely other people's parents there to stop the abuse, if there was any abuse going on at any time and I just don't think that's the case."
Police say Bateman could face more charges as they find out if any other students have been injured.


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## arnisador (Nov 27, 2007)

If you kick an 11 year old 200 times and just "possibly breaking a rib" then you just may be the product of a McDojo.


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## Carol (Nov 27, 2007)

Moderator Note: 

Threads Merged.

- Carol Kaur
- MT Moderator


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 27, 2007)

I know someone that kicks trees to train... can he kick the instructors just oh say 25 times apiece 

Hell can I kick the instructors just 10 times apiece

Or can we line up and give them the full 200

What the HELL is wrong with them, you DON&#8217;T kick an 11-year-old PERIOD.


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## Live True (Nov 27, 2007)

phlaw said:


> And Walston says parents in the nearby observation room could've jumped in to stop the kicking if they thought it was too much.


There were parents in a nearby observation room!  And NO ONE stepped in?!?!?!?!? :angry: What kind of idiots stand by and watch kids get kicked that many times and don't at least QUESTION what is going on?...The class counted the kicks?  And no one thought to question?
I can appreciate competitive spirit. I can appreciate the concept of conditioning (being new to MA, I have a very limited experience here), but my understanding is that conditioning is based on what the instructor thinks the student can handle...not on what an 11 year old judges as "cool".  I can even appreciate challenging oneself, but shouldn't the instructors have been a voice of reason and control?

That's it...put this down in the books as another example of
some people are just sheep.  grrr, hiss, spit, growl!


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## Shotochem (Nov 28, 2007)

Live True said:


> There were parents in a nearby observation room! And NO ONE stepped in?!?!?!?!? :angry: I can appreciate competitive spirit. I can appreciate the concept of conditioning (being new to MA, I have a very limited experience here), but my understanding is that conditioning is based on what the instructor thinks the student can handle...not on what an 11 year old judges as "cool". I can even appreciate challenging oneself, but shouldn't the instructors have been a voice of reason and control?
> 
> That's it...put this down in the books as another example of
> some people are just sheep. grrr, hiss, spit, growl!


 
There is a big difference between "Conditioning" and pure stupidity.

This seems to border on the latter.  

     What may be even more disturbing as you have stated, is why no one even asked what the **** is that instructor doing to that kid and why would they not remove their kids from that dojo as well.  

It just baffles me.  You would think that anyone observing and a non MA more so, would at least question what was going on.
-Marc-


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## gblnking (Nov 28, 2007)

Welcome to the wonderful world of the McDojo, the karate mill. Just because someone attains the rank of BlackBelt doesn't mean he or she posses the ability to teach. Whenever I come across someone that lives martial arts as a religion I shake my head because it's those self-absorbed individuals that very well might be your childs future teacher.


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## bydand (Nov 28, 2007)

Well the brothers comments have put it into perspective for me now.  They're complete ****ing morons who need to be locked away.  And the parents who just sat there and didn't see anything wrong need to be smacked upside the head.  God help the McDojo instructors if I ever seen something like this.:angry::flammad:  Oh my goodness, I just may have to sign up for anger management classes if I keep reading things like this.  Just makes my blood boil with the utter stupidity people try to pass off under the MA banner.  Conditioning, training, discipline, whatever you want to call this crap. If a rose would still be a rose by any other name; beating a child is still beating a child no matter what you call it.   

I have to stop now before I type something that will get me banned, because that is where this is going in the express lane. :wavey:


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## Guardian (Nov 28, 2007)

bydand said:


> Well the brothers comments have put it into perspective for me now. They're complete ****ing morons who need to be locked away. And the parents who just sat there and didn't see anything wrong need to be smacked upside the head. God help the McDojo instructors if I ever seen something like this.:angry::flammad: Oh my goodness, I just may have to sign up for anger management classes if I keep reading things like this. Just makes my blood boil with the utter stupidity people try to pass off under the MA banner. Conditioning, training, discipline, whatever you want to call this crap. If a rose would still be a rose by any other name; beating a child is still beating a child no matter what you call it.
> 
> I have to stop now before I type something that will get me banned, because that is where this is going in the express lane. :wavey:


 

My thoughts exactly, pure stupidity and someone will probably get his **** whipped before it's all said and done.


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## arnisador (Nov 28, 2007)

Yahoo! now has a video news story about it:
http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/yne...N8MUMRhxOxH2ocA?ch=4226713&cl=5232294&lang=en


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## exile (Nov 28, 2007)

According to the story arnisador posted, the _class_ counted out the kicks.... ??!!

words fail me.


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## grydth (Nov 28, 2007)

It's all speculation, but I have some suspicions...

From the 'defense' that the instructor's brother is offering, that the child could have stopped it, one gets the impression that at some point control of the class passed from instructor to child.... that is never appropriate.

Let's presume these were supposed to be very nominal kicks, that this misbegotten exercise was only supposed to test ability to stay in push up position, so let's do some kick counting ourselves - - - If another kid took 200 kicks, and some others also took a few score between them...... maybe this instructor is working on kick #600 by the time things get serious. Now how many people are still going to have control at that point?

The cracked rib is attention getting - but I'd worry much more about those unspecified "internal injuries".... what was she thinking??? Most parents have their kids in MA to AVOID beating like this!

I don't feel this reflects at all on other teachers or dojos..... every occupation has rotten apples these days.


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## kidswarrior (Nov 28, 2007)

Logan said:


> That's a bit bizarre....but who counted 200 kicks? Not that I don't believe what I read in the media or anything....if someone kicked me 200 times I would be more prone to worry about injury etc than thinking "hmm 198,199,200,...."


Was thinking the same thing.


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## exile (Nov 28, 2007)

kidswarrior said:


> Logan said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Apparently (from the news clip that Arni posted) the class itself counted the kicksthey were there watching!!

No kid is going to want to look as though s/he `can't take it', particularly under the apparently aggressively macho Cobra Kai culture of this particular dojo. So the fact that the child, on the spot and trying to save face in front of his classmates, didn't stop the thing is almost the default; no adult in his/her right mind would believe that the child's silence constituted justification to continue striking him or her. Children have small bodies; many of those 200 kicks were going to be, necessarily, strike to the same still-fragile bones. And as grydth points out, the real danger has to do with the internal organs. A ruptured spleen? A damaged pancreas? 

The more I think about it, the more I want to see not just the book, but a grand piano loaded with lead ingots,  thrown in court at the vermin running this `school'...


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## kidswarrior (Nov 28, 2007)

exile said:


> No kid is going to want to look as though s/he `can't take it', particularly under the apparently aggressively macho Cobra Kai culture of this particular dojo. So the fact that the child, on the spot and trying to save face in front of his classmates, didn't stop the thing is almost the default; no adult in his/her right mind would believe that the child's silence constituted justification to continue striking him or her.


Excellent point. I work with street-fighting kids (high schoolers who've been expelled) for a living, and have found they often can't even admit to _themselves _when they're in pain. In teaching kids a martial art, the adult instructor has to remain the adult _and _the instructor, even if taunted by the kid to abandon reason (which I'm not at all sure happened in this case, anyway). There are plenty of safe ways to prove machismo. One that jumps to mind is who can hold a deep horse riding stance the longest. And contrary to being physically risky, this kind of contest has huge health and practical MA benefits.


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## Live True (Nov 29, 2007)

Is anyone else concerned about how this will affect public perception of Martial Arts?  I'm glad the clip Arni posted did mention that this was not the norm.  I'd be curious to see if other Dojos, clubs, classes in the area had a sudden drop in enrollment or kids pulled out of classes?  Or even if it had a nationwide effect with how news is spread these days.

I know that I had heard some horror stories about McDojos (I called them popcorn Dojos...same diff).  I know I would have started MA much sooner if not for fear of self-important idiots like this.  It was only after the recommendation of someone I really trusted, and trying out a class that I was hooked.  I have to say that I am loving the challenge, the outlet, and the chance to improve myself physically, emotionally, etc.

Still, I wonder how many more people would give MA a try as a child or an adult...if it weren't for stories like this?


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## bushidomartialarts (Nov 30, 2007)

http://www.dailypress.com/news/local/virginia/dp-va--kickingarrest1126nov26,0,1593850.story


The short version is the teacher was doing a 'stomach conditioning drill' where students got a kick to the stomach until they said 'no more'.  A couple kids took over 200 kicks.  One got hurt.

It bothers me that a qualified teacher would let it go that far.  But I can totally see how it could have happened even to a qualified professional.


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## newGuy12 (Nov 30, 2007)

Yes, this was posted here somewhere else.  People should realize that there is a correct way to play these "toughness drills" with children, and this is not it!

Instead, you should have the competitors get in a line, and do the horse stance.  The last one standing is the winner!  No cheating!


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## Jai (Nov 30, 2007)

We use to do stuff like this as well, but as an instructor you also need to know when to put a stop to something before serious injury can happen, or any kind of injury for that matter.


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## Guardian (Nov 30, 2007)

Since I've never taught kids and we did use drills like that for the adults with variations of course.

I can't see this happening with children, qualified or not qualified, that's just plain stupid in my view.


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## newGuy12 (Nov 30, 2007)

Guardian said:


> Since I've never taught kids and we did use drills like that for the adults with variations of course.
> 
> I can't see this happening with children, qualified or not qualified, that's just plain stupid in my view.



Right.  Stupid.  Injury can result.  

With young children (<= 12), you must do any kind of "toughness training" in such a way that it is safe for them.

If the children have a very strong, tough teacher, and wish to be tough themselves, they do not have enough sense to "tap out" (so to speak) in time to avoid some injury.  That is why you have to have them do things that are safer!

You can have them kick the side kick out and hold it in position, over the kendo stick.  No one can lower the kick so that it touches the stick.  The one who does so loses!

But to strike children in this way is just courting disaster! 

That is the way that I see it.

There is no harm if you can get away with it for the children to be very frightened of the teacher.  If the teacher says, okay, keep on!, then the children keep on.  But, many folks nowadays will not allow their children to be taught in this way, which is regrettable.

And, this kicking the children business is absurd!


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## exile (Nov 30, 2007)

*MOD NOTE: Duplicate thread merged with earlier thread.

Bob Levine (exile)
MT Moderator*


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## IcemanSK (Dec 1, 2007)

This is unbelievable...& yet very believable. On what planet did this gal think THAT was a good idea?! Also, where were the ANY of the parents of the kids in the class?!

Too bad I wouldn't make it on the jury for this one.


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## bluekey88 (Feb 7, 2008)

I came across this thread from elsewhere.  I wanted to weigh in on the question of why other parents didn't step in and stop what was happening.

First of all, the posters who mentioned the kids were essentially given control of the class were spot on.  It's likely that the parents tought all was fine because the kids said so.

Second, people have a tendency to trust those they perceive to be in authority.  It takes a great deal of strength and courage to speak out.  Reseach done after WWII looked at how ordinary caring people could go along with such heinous things as what happened during the holocaust.  One series of studies had  subjects giving a series of increasing electric shocks to a person.  The shock device was labreld from mild to lethal.  The shockee was an actor (so not actually getting shocked).  The subject was told by a peson in a lab coat with a clip board to continue.  As the "shocks" got increased the actor would writhe and scream in "agony", subjects got clearly uncomfortable, some even questioning if they should continue.  The lab coat person simply said "you must continue."  Most people continued delivering "shocks" into the lethal range...basically because they perceived the person in charge knew what they were doing.

In the case of this karate instructor, she clearly woudl have been perceived as being in charge and in control of things...thus reducing the likelihood that anyone would have spoken out.  Hell, given the way students and families rallied to her defense, it is likely there is a bit of a cult of personality thing happening.

Another factor might have been what is called diffusion of responsibility.  That means that the more witnesses that see something bad going on, the less likely it is that any one person will step up and intervene.  basically, each witness figures another witness will step up.  In an extreme case in New York city, something like 10 people saw and heard a woman being mugged and stabbed.  They clearly heard her cries for help, many saw what was going on and no one intervened.  They figured someone else would do it.  However, in research looking at this phenomenon, people were more likely to step into intervene if no one else was around to do so.

In the end, all responsibility for what happened rests on the shoulders of the intructors/owner of the karate school.  

What's important is that those of us who teach be cognizant of our position as instructors.  We shoudl recognize that we have a great deal of influence over not just our students but their parents as well (we're the experts after all).  It is easy to cross certain lines and it is up to us to not do so.  It is unlikely that others will prevent it.

Peace,
Erik


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## Sanchin-J (Feb 9, 2008)

This is an outrage, a test to see how many kicks you can take? W.T.F?!!! I hope the instructor or instructors responsible get sent to a nice cozy cell with people who can kick harder than they can, maybe a dose of their own medicine will awaken them to just how messed up they are.

That being said, I train my son at home, he's 5 years old, and we do make contact while training, we don't hit each other full blast, but I make him aware of where his strikes should be aimed at, how each strike should be landed, how his stance should be set, and how to move his body into his strikes to gain more power. I've never hit him at more than a tap, and through this training he's already learned a good bit of control in his own striking.

 I don't see physical contact being a problem in training someone, but for pete's sakes a full power kicking marathon to the side of an 11 year old??? I'd drag them out into the street and let all the parents play "let's see who can take it" and then we'll see how effective that training was.


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## ellies (Jun 19, 2008)

Live True said:


> Is anyone else concerned about how this will affect public perception of Martial Arts?  I'm glad the clip Arni posted did mention that this was not the norm.  I'd be curious to see if other Dojos, clubs, classes in the area had a sudden drop in enrollment or kids pulled out of classes?  Or even if it had a nationwide effect with how news is spread these days.
> 
> I know that I had heard some horror stories about McDojos (I called them popcorn Dojos...same diff).  I know I would have started MA much sooner if not for fear of self-important idiots like this.  It was only after the recommendation of someone I really trusted, and trying out a class that I was hooked.  I have to say that I am loving the challenge, the outlet, and the chance to improve myself physically, emotionally, etc.
> 
> Still, I wonder how many more people would give MA a try as a child or an adult...if it weren't for stories like this?



Instructor; doesn't that mean you are in a position of leadership, Always in control, knowing when to say okay that's ridiculous?   How about the part wher you are the adult and just plain know better.  I see this all the time in Military Combatives and Martial Arts training.  The worse part is when they come into the clinic days after it happens, and these are adult!  So imagine when some kid thinks he or she is tough enough to handle a strong kick.  You as the instructor must say to yourself and them, I don't think it is necessary for you meld foolishness and wisdom as one.  I often hear from parent in class about how little billy or susie is tough enough to take it, and I respectfully reply with:  That may be, but this is  training environment, I am not here to play how tough is my child.  This the same method I use with soldiers, only train as you fight, but be wise about it.


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## ArmorOfGod (Jun 19, 2008)

Sanchin-J said:


> This is an outrage, a test to see how many kicks you can take? W.T.F?!!!


 
What does the World Taekwondo Federation have to do with this?


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## Kacey (Jun 19, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> What does the World Taekwondo Federation have to do with this?



Uh... different abbreviation - starts "what the..."


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## ArmorOfGod (Jun 19, 2008)

Kacey, it was a joke....

I actually detest the WTF abbreviation on the internet, so I like to rag people on martial arts message boards when the use it.

AoG


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## Kacey (Jun 19, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> Kacey, it was a joke....
> 
> I actually detest the WTF abbreviation on the internet, so I like to rag people on martial arts message boards when the use it.
> 
> AoG



S'allright... too much digging up sod in my yard!


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## Touch Of Death (Jun 20, 2008)

ArmorOfGod said:


> http://www.wvec.com/news/topstories/stories/wvec_local_112607_karate_abuse_charges.3f9762db.html
> Click there to read the news story.
> 
> AoG


I really have no problem with an agreed upon event with  controlled shots, while doing pushups or pull ups. I've been the recipient myself when was doing some Tracy's Kenpo. Its sounds like it went to far though. 
Sean


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## Touch Of Death (Jun 20, 2008)

Xue Sheng said:


> I know someone that kicks trees to train... can he kick the instructors just oh say 25 times apiece
> 
> Hell can I kick the instructors just 10 times apiece
> 
> ...


OK now you have gone too far. Control is the key.
sean


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## grydth (Aug 22, 2008)

By way of update, the school's website is up. She is listed as an instructor, 3d dan. There is a request for all to support "Sensei Susan" at her hearing on August 28, 2008.


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## grydth (Aug 29, 2008)

Final Update - Today, the website of Jeff Bateman's Karate School announced that the City of Suffolk had dropped all charges against Susan Bateman, who had always maintained her innocence. 

They further assert that this is a great victory for martial arts schools and athletic departments across the nation. (One may have their own feelings on that score.)

WAVY - 10 (wavy.com) ran a story that she was actually acquitted of all charges by a Suffolk Judge. However, it was noted that there has been a "drastic" drop in membership at the Suffolk branch of the organization.


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## Nolerama (Aug 29, 2008)

Thanks for the update.

I wonder why none of the parents were interviewed. Especially the parent(s) of the child in question.

*Bad journalism... Just bad news writing.*

Red flags shot up as soon as I finished reading/watching the story. I mean, I kick 11-year-olds in the privacy of my own home... and even they can only take, like, 50 or so shots to the head until they pass out...

Just kidding... Only 10 times to the face...

*Still kidding.*


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