# Do you compete when not ready?



## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

Our school hosts it's annual competition tonight and tomorrow.  We are expecting around 2,000 people the rumor goes.  Definitely, people arrived from Wales last night.  And some may be coming from Spain as well.

Last year, I competed in forms, board-breaking and sparring.  I have to say it was worthwhile for the personal growth.  For me, it took a lot of courage.

This year I'm only doing sparring.  I don't feel comfortable with Pyung Ahn O Dan as I've only been doing it for about 5 weeks.  I could have done Chil-Sung E Ro Hyung but need work on the breathing/energy press - not quite sure what I'm doing there.

There is a lot of pressure for us to participate in all categories.  I was told a good martial artist participates in all categories.  Well, I don't feel comfortable competing in all categories this year.  I'd rather not compete than do a poor job.


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## MBuzzy (Oct 10, 2008)

In my experience, anytime someone says "A good martial artist does _____."  or even more broad "A Good ______ does _________." it is usually not reliable.  Broad, sweeping generalizations like that are usually pretty unreliable.

Personal opinion, if you're not ready, don't compete.  There is, of course, a line.  It doesn't hurt to try, it doesn't hurt to go up there and not do well, it is always a good experience, but if you are sincerely not ready and don't feel comfortable, no one can make you, and it doesn't make you any less of a martial artist or a person.  Most people do what they're good at and that's ok.


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

MBuzzy said:


> In my experience, anytime someone says "A good martial artist does _____." or even more broad "A Good ______ does _________." it is usually not reliable. Broad, sweeping generalizations like that are usually pretty unreliable.
> 
> Personal opinion, if you're not ready, don't compete. There is, of course, a line. It doesn't hurt to try, it doesn't hurt to go up there and not do well, it is always a good experience, but if you are sincerely not ready and don't feel comfortable, no one can make you, and it doesn't make you any less of a martial artist or a person. Most people do what they're good at and that's ok.


 There is a bit of pressure and I think I'm feeling guilty!

I made the right decision to not compete in forms.  I still have to think about the moves in my form and need some work on my balance.  I must say the Pyung Ahn forms are really helping me with balance (amazing).

I could have competed in board-breaking but it would have been without the benefit of practice.  I'm not so sure I can do some of the breaks I want to do.


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

One of the "words of wisdom" that came my way was, "It's frowned upon if you don't do a form."  That was from one of my seniors. Oh well.  Next time!


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## MBuzzy (Oct 10, 2008)

I'd say let them frown!


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

MBuzzy said:


> I'd say let them frown!


 I agree.


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## IMP (Oct 10, 2008)

Lol, I've only done 1 competition, and the only thing I _did _do was forms. I realize I should've sparred, but I just didn't feel ready. My sparring has always been an extreme weak point for me.


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## Flying Crane (Oct 10, 2008)

Many of the very best martial artists have kept a lifelong low profile and have never competed in tournaments of any kind, ever.  

Sometimes there can be pressure from your school to compete.  Not everyone likes to compete, or has an interest in competing.  

Personally, I think it ought to be the choice of the student, but the school ought to be able to encourage it as well.  It's unfortunate when the encouragement crosses the line and becomes pressure on students, or they even start twisting their arms or coercing them somehow to get them to compete.  It just ain't for everyone, and it often represents a financial obligation as well.


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## thesandman (Oct 10, 2008)

I agree with Mbuzzy.

Really, for personal growth, you need to do some soul searching and identify why you REALLY didn't want to compete in those categories.

Was it because you didn't feel prepared or was it because you were afraid to do poorly?

Personally, I doubt this tournament sprang up on you.  You should have had plenty of time to prepare for whatever category you wanted to compete in.  The question then is, why didn't you properly prepare?  If you're reasons are valid and your lack of desire to compete was based mostly on your lack of preparation, let the nay sayers talk themselves silly.

If you slacked off of preparing because you were afraid of competing, you need to confront that.

Bottom line, if you don't want to compete, don't.  But know why.


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

Flying Crane said:


> Many of the very best martial artists have kept a lifelong low profile and have never competed in tournaments of any kind, ever.
> 
> Sometimes there can be pressure from your school to compete. Not everyone likes to compete, or has an interest in competing.
> 
> Personally, I think it ought to be the choice of the student, but the school ought to be able to encourage it as well. It's unfortunate when the encouragement crosses the line and becomes pressure on students, or they even start twisting their arms or coercing them somehow to get them to compete. It just ain't for everyone, and it often represents a financial obligation as well.


 Our school is very competitive.  My first competition was a very valuable experience and I think it's good for everyone to compete at least once.  However, I am not that into competing.  I would prefer to quietly learn my art and contribute to the school by teaching some day.

In order for us to get our black belts, we will have to travel to Massachusetts and attend a summer camp hosted by our Grandmaster.  I don't know how I'm going to be able to afford it.

Yes, there is pressure to compete.  Our association doesn't want you unless you are active via competing.  That just happens to be the philosophy.


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

thesandman said:


> I agree with Mbuzzy.
> 
> Really, for personal growth, you need to do some soul searching and identify why you REALLY didn't want to compete in those categories.
> 
> ...


Oh, yes, you are right.  We certainly had months to prepare for the competition.  I enjoyed competing last year and am not afraid to compete.  In fact, I am doing sparring.  Last year, I placed second in sparring (and first in board-breaking)  but this year it will be much more competitive.  I am not afraid to lose.  The learning experience will be invaluable for me.  Either way, I win.

Now, as far as forms go, I don't feel comfortable doing Pyung Ahn O Dan because I don't have the muscle memory yet.  To be honest, I haven't received any feedback on the form at all from instructors.  I didn't get any corrections during my spotlight either.  That tells me I'm probably performing the form fine for a month's practice though.  I don't believe a month's practice is enough to perform the form well in competition.  I guess I don't feel prepared.  Some of that may be lack of confidence that is misplaced.


No, I've never slacked off on training.  I go to classes at least twice a week.  I practice at home.  What some students have done is schedule private training sessions.  I just found that out.  I was wondering how green belts my level were picking up Chil-Sung Il Ro Hyung (black belt form) so fast.  We only do that that form once a month.  I've only learned the first half though we have been through the whole form twice. One cannot learn that form in just a few sessions.  There are many, many fine points that haven't even been touched upon in class - some preparations, leaning back on the heel at certain points, how to breathe, etc.  Some people are going to extra help classes, too, to fine tune their forms.  Extra help is no longer advertised but one can schedule a session here and there at no charge.  I was surprised, thought they had been cancelled.  Now I know though.


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## terryl965 (Oct 10, 2008)

Only compete if you are ready otherwise go watch and support your team and school.


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

terryl965 said:


> Only compete if you are ready otherwise go watch and support your team and school.


 Thank you for your support, Terry.  I feel better now. I'm doing sparring but am not prepared to do my highest level form (I just began learning it about 5 weeks ago).

We have to compete by the way.  If we don't, we aren't allowed to spotlight or test for two months


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## terryl965 (Oct 10, 2008)

Lynne said:


> Thank you for your support, Terry. I feel better now. I'm doing sparring but am not prepared to do my highest level form (I just began learning it about 5 weeks ago).


 
You are welcome Lynne and have fun


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## JT_the_Ninja (Oct 10, 2008)

Compete where you know your strengths are. I have never once competed in sparring at a tournament, because I know I'm not, as an asthmatic, cut out for three minutes of that kind of fighting, let alone several fights' worth of it. I spar in class and at tests because I want to show that I can and that I'm dedicated to my art, but I'm not interested in competing where I know my strength lies not. 

Summary: just do what you know you can do. 

Tang Soo! Good luck!


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## Lynne (Oct 10, 2008)

JT_the_Ninja said:


> Compete where you know your strengths are. I have never once competed in sparring at a tournament, because I know I'm not, as an asthmatic, cut out for three minutes of that kind of fighting, let alone several fights' worth of it. I spar in class and at tests because I want to show that I can and that I'm dedicated to my art, but I'm not interested in competing where I know my strength lies not.
> 
> Summary: just do what you know you can do.
> 
> Tang Soo! Good luck!


 Thanks, JT!

I have watched a few asthmatics in class.  We have three and one has scared me quite bad.  I honestly wondered if she was going to die.  We ran into the locker room to find her inhaler.  Of course she couldn't tell us where it was and we weren't even sure which sparring bag was hers. One of our black belts has to stop every few minutes and use his inhaler while sparring.  Another has exercise-induced asthma which doesn't look like much fun either.


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## thesandman (Oct 11, 2008)

Lynne said:


> Thank you for your support, Terry.  I feel better now. I'm doing sparring but am not prepared to do my highest level form (I just began learning it about 5 weeks ago).
> 
> We have to compete by the way.  If we don't, we aren't allowed to spotlight or test for two months



Are you required to compete with your highest form?  Couldn't you compete using whatever form you think is best for you?


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## Yossarian (Oct 11, 2008)

Ive competed a few times when not ready with mixed results. You may do better than you think or it can be quite disheartening. If i dont do well at a comp it makes me train and prepare a lot harder for the next one. My next comp is a week after my Sam Dan test, providing I pass I will be competing against third Dans and Masters. There is no way I will be able to learn Kong Sang Koon in a week and I expect to do quite badly but im still entering all the categories since I have to be there anyway. I plan to just enjoy myself.


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## foggymorning162 (Oct 11, 2008)

We are incouraged to compete but we are not a tournament school so it is not required, except at apprentice black but even then you are required to "participate" in 2 federation tournaments I am not competative so I did registration and clean-up etc. I have only competed once. My question is are you allowed to keep your trophies? Our instructor feels they are your's as you were the one that won them but I have heard of schools that make you bring them in too be displayed at the dojang.


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## Lynne (Oct 11, 2008)

thesandman said:


> Are you required to compete with your highest form? Couldn't you compete using whatever form you think is best for you?


 Well, guess what?  I could have done any form I would have liked to do.  I didn't know that until today.  I found out a lot of people have been in my situation where they were just learning their new form, so they did a lower form.  They did not let themselves be pressured into doing a Chil-Sung form instead.  (Colored belts in the black belt club are taught Chil-Sung forms.) Arggggh! I could have done Pyung Ahn Sa Dan.

Live and learn.


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## Lynne (Oct 11, 2008)

Yossarian said:


> Ive competed a few times when not ready with mixed results. You may do better than you think or it can be quite disheartening. If i dont do well at a comp it makes me train and prepare a lot harder for the next one. My next comp is a week after my Sam Dan test, providing I pass I will be competing against third Dans and Masters. There is no way I will be able to learn Kong Sang Koon in a week and I expect to do quite badly but im still entering all the categories since I have to be there anyway. I plan to just enjoy myself.


 Wow, that will be tough, Yossarian.

I feel badly for our Dan candidates.  They began testing early this week, had to do two days of competition, and finish testing tomorrow in front of the panel of masters.  A very tough week indeed.  I would think they are lacking in the sleep department.


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## Lynne (Oct 11, 2008)

foggymorning162 said:


> We are incouraged to compete but we are not a tournament school so it is not required, except at apprentice black but even then you are required to "participate" in 2 federation tournaments I am not competative so I did registration and clean-up etc. I have only competed once. My question is are you allowed to keep your trophies? Our instructor feels they are your's as you were the one that won them but I have heard of schools that make you bring them in too be displayed at the dojang.


 Oh, yes, we are allowed to keep our trophies.

I'm on the fence about competition.  I enjoy it but it's also a lot of stress.  Honestly, there's the money factor, too.


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## Lynne (Oct 15, 2008)

I'm so glad I didn't compete with Pyung Ahn O Dan.  I learned three more things about the form last night. Sheesh.


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## JT_the_Ninja (Oct 15, 2008)

There are always more things to learn about a form. Remember that it isn't a test...it's a demonstration. Not to say you shouldn't pay attention to the correct techniques, and in fact that's my point. Even if there's some nuance to the form you don't yet know, so long as you're showing overall good technique and good spirit, you should do fine. Judges see each form about a billion times during a tournament; you gotta make yours stand out as exceptional in some way, some highly visible way.


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## Kwanjang (Oct 15, 2008)

No way...


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## Flying Crane (Oct 15, 2008)

Lynne said:


> However, I am not that into competing. *I would prefer to quietly learn my art and contribute to the school by teaching some day.*
> 
> In order for us to get our black belts, we will have to travel to Massachusetts and attend a summer camp hosted by our Grandmaster. *I don't know how I'm going to be able to afford it.*
> 
> Yes, there is pressure to compete. *Our association doesn't want you unless you are active via competing*. That just happens to be the philosophy.


 
In my opinion, these comments are very telling.  On top of this, we have discussed in the past some of the practices of your school, such as not allowing any restroom breaks or water breaks during a six hour test.  These a practices that are downright dangerous, in my opinion.

I don't mean to stir the pot, but I'm noticing a pattern here, and I'll make a suggestion that you can either consider or disregard:  you might consider looking for a different school.  This one just might not be a good match for you.  I know that if I was in your position, I would feel it was not a good match for me and I would not study at that school.

Anyway, I just wanted to make the comment.  THink about it, and do what's right for you.


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## Lynne (Oct 16, 2008)

Flying Crane said:


> In my opinion, these comments are very telling. On top of this, we have discussed in the past some of the practices of your school, such as not allowing any restroom breaks or water breaks during a six hour test. These a practices that are downright dangerous, in my opinion.
> 
> I don't mean to stir the pot, but I'm noticing a pattern here, and I'll make a suggestion that you can either consider or disregard: you might consider looking for a different school. This one just might not be a good match for you. I know that if I was in your position, I would feel it was not a good match for me and I would not study at that school.
> 
> Anyway, I just wanted to make the comment. THink about it, and do what's right for you.


It is true, a competition school is not for everyone.  I made a commitment, so I'm sticking to it...unless I'm not financially able to do so (regarding competition fees, hotel fees and such).


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## Lynne (Oct 16, 2008)

JT_the_Ninja said:


> There are always more things to learn about a form. Remember that it isn't a test...it's a demonstration. Not to say you shouldn't pay attention to the correct techniques, and in fact that's my point. Even if there's some nuance to the form you don't yet know, so long as you're showing overall good technique and good spirit, you should do fine. Judges see each form about a billion times during a tournament; you gotta make yours stand out as exceptional in some way, some highly visible way.


 Good points, JT.  I recall that people do make errors in their forms but that's not what judges are looking at.  When members of my group were doing Chil-Sung forms, I noticed the judges intently watching feet, looking at stances I'm sure.  Those students who had snap, intensity, and focus seemed to place better.


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