# Cheung/Boztepe Fight



## Cthulhu (Dec 22, 2001)

Several years ago, there used to be downloadable video clips of William Cheung's and Emin Boztepe's fight in Germany.  I can't seem to find them these days.

Does anyone happen to have a .mov, .avi, .mpg, etc of this fight?

From what I hear, there are supposedly two versions of this fight on tape: a supposedly unedited version from Cheung's group and a version that was supposedly edited to make Boztepe look good from Leung Ting's group.

I don't really give a hoot who won/lost the fight, or who started it, I just want to see it again out of curiousity.

Cthulhu
nosey sumb!tch


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## arnisador (Apr 3, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Cthulhu _
> 
> *I don't really give a hoot who won/lost the fight, or who started it *



I'll say this, I keep hearing people refer to this fight all the time!


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## Cthulhu (Apr 8, 2002)

I found a video clip, but the quality was so crappy, I'm not going to bother posting a link.  You can't even tell who was in the fight.

I wish I could find that vid clip I had 5 years ago or so.

The hunt continues!

Cthulhu


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## kenpojujitsu (Feb 4, 2006)

The first time I met Boztepe at a clinic around 1990, this is all people wanted to ask him about.  But he was sick of it too, and said he wished he never did it.

He was about 18 at the time and I do not know how old Cheung was.  It wasn't much of fight at all.  Cheung basically laid out an open challenge in an interview, it may have been in "Inside Kung Fu Magazine", he said something to the effect that he was the greatest of all the Wing Chun Masters and could defeat any and all who would dare to challenge him.
Boztepe was young and impressionable in addition to being incredibly skilled.  He was sent to the clinic to embarrass Cheung, which he did.
He asked Cheung if he as ready to fight.  Cheung said yes.  Boztepe kicked his butt.  
One thing that Boztepe was ordered to not do was hurt him. Which is where Cheung was lucky.
I saw one of the videos before, but only a portion of it.  It was not from the beginning and not good quality at all.


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## yipman_sifu (Feb 5, 2006)

I don't think that Boztepe was 18 at that time, perhaps a bit older. I think that people in here is not forgetting about such incidents. I think that what happened was something must be forgotten, because we always look in the bright side of things, I mean that both are renowned masters and worth respect. Wong sheung Leung always stated that Wing Chun trainers must respect all sigungs, sifus, and friends. although Wong was the best fighter of his time, he never said I am the best, and humbly respected everyone's approach to the fighting level they can achieve, and he said that no one can claim that his system is the best, it can only be achieved by hard training and absolute devotion to the cause.


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## ed-swckf (Feb 5, 2006)

yipman_sifu said:
			
		

> I don't think that Boztepe was 18 at that time, perhaps a bit older. I think that people in here is not forgetting about such incidents. I think that what happened was something must be forgotten, because we always look in the bright side of things, I mean that both are renowned masters and worth respect. Wong sheung Leung always stated that Wing Chun trainers must respect all sigungs, sifus, and friends. although Wong was the best fighter of his time, he never said I am the best, and humbly respected everyone's approach to the fighting level they can achieve, and he said that no one can claim that his system is the best, it can only be achieved by hard training and absolute devotion to the cause.


 
Its true that both boztepe and cheung deserve respect and we shouldn't really focus our sights on a small incident that has little bearing on things.  We should, like master wong, respect everyones approach and be humble in our own.


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## yipman_sifu (Feb 5, 2006)

Also it may happened because William cheung Wing Chun was somehow a different system compared to others, he thaught it was the best. Well many thaught that until that incident happened. (well that's not important)

What is important is the following: I wonder why do Wing Chun masters have different systems. Imagine that all of them unite their ideas to produce the ideal system of combat, I mean that those Yipman disciples schools must share ideas together and choose the most effecient and simple moves to be learned in the concepts of the system. Doing such a thing is like a dream to any Wing Chun trainer wheather he was a student or a practitionar. What do you think?


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## Kobayashi (Feb 11, 2006)

Cthulhu, I know there is a version of the fight on Bullshido.com under the videos section. The quality isn't that good and the camera isn't in a good position to see what is happening. 

I have seen the same sentiment expressed on other forums - no one wants to revisit this topic.


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## DeLamar.J (Feb 19, 2006)

Cthulhu said:
			
		

> Several years ago, there used to be downloadable video clips of William Cheung's and Emin Boztepe's fight in Germany. I can't seem to find them these days.
> 
> Does anyone happen to have a .mov, .avi, .mpg, etc of this fight?
> 
> ...


I seen the foight on video. Boztepe basicly triped up William and then got on top of him and started punching him. Thats about all there is to it.


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## SAVAGE (Feb 19, 2006)

DeLamar.J said:
			
		

> I seen the foight on video. Boztepe basicly triped up William and then got on top of him and started punching him. Thats about all there is to it.


 
looked more like a UFC fight than a test of Wing Chun skills.....however..what is victory...except subduing the enemy!


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## barriecusvein (Feb 21, 2006)

There is a version on Sifu Emin's website, but i think its the edited version that just shows him in control for the whole thing.

http://www.ebmas.net/video/emin-vs-cheung.mpeg

i watched it first time out because i thought it would be an excellent display of wing chun, but its more like a street brawl.


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## barriecusvein (Feb 21, 2006)

yipman_sifu said:
			
		

> What is important is the following: I wonder why do Wing Chun masters have different systems. Imagine that all of them unite their ideas to produce the ideal system of combat, I mean that those Yipman disciples schools must share ideas together and choose the most effecient and simple moves to be learned in the concepts of the system. Doing such a thing is like a dream to any Wing Chun trainer wheather he was a student or a practitionar. What do you think?


This would be the best thing that could happen to Wing Chun. Unfortunately we are now at a stage where many masters think that they have already done this; they think their system of Wing Chun is the most efficient and effective. Also, many people have claimed that Yipman wanted them to pass on Wing Chun and the he taught them the complete system. They now dont want to say ok my system can be improved by combining it with others. 

This is just my opinion.


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## Flying Crane (Feb 21, 2006)

barriecusvein said:
			
		

> This would be the best thing that could happen to Wing Chun. Unfortunately we are now at a stage where many masters think that they have already done this; they think their system of Wing Chun is the most efficient and effective. Also, many people have claimed that Yipman wanted them to pass on Wing Chun and the he taught them the complete system. They now dont want to say ok my system can be improved by combining it with others.
> 
> This is just my opinion.


 
Good thoughts.  I think there is a lot of ego and resentment that prevents people from working together and sharing ideas.  Some people are notoriously abrasive and hard to get along with.  They laugh at anything that is not part of what they do.  But neither do they take the time to examine it fairly to determine if it has any merit.  Instead they just automatically write it off as rediculous, just because it is done by someone they don't like.  Sometimes these people miss out on something good.  If they would just change their attitude, open their minds, and leave their egos at the coat-check, some real improvements could be made.

This is often the way it is in the martial arts.  I definitely see this in the Capoeira world here in the San Francisco area.  there are some very talented people here, but there is so much ugly history that they cannot associate.  It is even difficult for their students to associate, even outside of a class setting.  They can't even be friends because they have made thier teacher's fight into their own, when it really has nothing to do with them.

Any art can be improved.  it just takes an open mind and some people with talent and knowledge who are willing to work together and admit that there might be some deficiencies in their individual skills and their art.


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## DeLamar.J (Feb 21, 2006)

I think the bottom line is, Emin can kick Williams behind. End of story.


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## Jonathan Randall (Feb 21, 2006)

kenpojujitsu said:
			
		

> The first time I met Boztepe at a clinic around 1990, this is all people wanted to ask him about. But he was sick of it too, and said he wished he never did it.


 
Glad to hear that. It was a bit of a sordid affair, IMO, and a black eye on the MA at the time.


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## AceHBK (Feb 22, 2006)

DeLamar.J said:
			
		

> I think the bottom line is, Emin can kick Williams behind. End of story.


 
Is that the only thing that matters?
Fighting under a variety of circumstances can lead to different outcomes.
Just because a person can win a fight one day doesnt mean they will win it the next.  When differnet things are on the line that can drastically effect the outcome.

To me I rather see the both of them work together than sparring trying to prove a point.  Like someone said, all it does is put a black eye on MA.


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## DeLamar.J (Feb 23, 2006)

AceHBK said:
			
		

> Is that the only thing that matters?
> Fighting under a variety of circumstances can lead to different outcomes.
> Just because a person can win a fight one day doesnt mean they will win it the next. When differnet things are on the line that can drastically effect the outcome.
> 
> To me I rather see the both of them work together than sparring trying to prove a point. Like someone said, all it does is put a black eye on MA.


True, but Emin still did kick his butt.


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## Ivel Dragon (Sep 10, 2006)

I saw this video on google, and after hearing some of the things you guys said about Boztepe I laughed. Boztepe got cheung on his back, but failed to hit him at all, every punch he through was blocked. plus cheung was wearing kung fu slippers instead of his normal addias, so he had very little traction. one more thing people who think wing chun fighters can't fight on the ground are wrong, everything we do standing up can be done on the ground. it is just more efficent to stand fight


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