# Concealed Weapons and Airline Security.



## arnisador (Aug 6, 2003)

See this story for info. on the FBI warning about things like sword canes/umbreallas, belt buckle knives, key knives, and so on. See also the FBI Guide to Concealable Weapons (same thing at a second site).


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## Bob Hubbard (Aug 6, 2003)

Hmm... interesting article.

Course, the problem with metal detectors is, they dont detect high-grade plastic that can hold an edge.  I've made throwing stars outta old credit cards...who needs metal?

Dangerous world out there.


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## Cryozombie (Aug 7, 2003)

Heh heh... I have one of those Crucifix knives on my Biker jacket...


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## satans.barber (Aug 7, 2003)

I've seen knives made out of fibreglass too...

Ian.


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## Turner (Aug 7, 2003)

Stangely enough I own several of the weapons and containers discussed in the article for novelty/collection purposes. I own a ceramic knife and was surprised to see that it did a decent job of showing up on the scanner.

I haven't flown since 2000 so I'm not familiar with the new security procedures, but I don't know how they'll catch some of that stuff if it's not much different than the old procedures. Pens, necklaces, belt buckles and the like will not actually go through the scanner.. they'll be worn or put in that tray when you empty your pockets. Will they actually start checking your ink pen for a knife? I doubt it. Let's just hope that terrorists won't think of such things and that the possibility of an Air Marshall on board will be a good deterence. I personally don't think that those of us in the states have to worry about it happening again. Too much security, however overseas flights still remain a risk because security isn't that great.


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## Disco (Aug 7, 2003)

We gave a small seminar to one of the heads of the pilots union. He was impressed with what we showed him, but we stressed that you really can't fight in the cockpit. He totally agreed. We further stressed that not the pilots, but the flight attendents need training. They would be the first to encounter hostile actions. Again, he was in total agreement. Now comes the real truth about your security and the airlines. We were told that there was no way that an airlines would pay to have their people trained. It's fine if they want to do it on their own, but he was imfactic about the airlines as an industry would not assist. Bottom line is your really on your own folks.

 Sky marshals are undergoing reductions. Gate security is not what it should be and cargo/bagage security is not there. What many people in security don't realize or their keeping it hush hush, is the fact that chem / bio weapons can be smuggled upon the aircraft very easily. I'm not letting out any state secrets here. I have not seen any security at the gate before boarding do a professional search.

We, meaning the general public, seem to have really short memories. Our fast pace way of life seems to force us to disreguard the values of the past and just offer token lip service to our future. The people in charge just seem to be worried about the bottom line.............PROFITS.
:soapbox:


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## DAC..florida (Aug 7, 2003)

I for one think the U.S. should follow in the steps of the Isralies in airline security, they seem to have thier problems under control.
Israel takes the highest of security precautions prior to the flight and also during the flight having visible armed personell on every flight.


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## Seig (Aug 8, 2003)

When we flew to Boston, security confiscated one of my student's lighters.


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## Phil Elmore (Aug 8, 2003)

What is disturbing about this story is that this crude, poorly constructed document was the best our own FBI could concoct.

Pathetic.  Any member of a knife discussion forum knows this material better than the agency, and knows most of these are "gimmick" knives that couldn't be trusted to cut fruit, much less used to hijack planes.


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## Turner (Aug 8, 2003)

I agree with the sentiment that most of the knives shown are gimmick knives and couldn't be trusted to cut fruit, but one must realize that cutting isn't necessarily the goal of a terrorist. Their number one objective is to terrorize people into submission. Since those gimmick knives are sold quite frequently, apparently the general public would think that they are effective at causing damage and will be frightened if threatened with one.

I know, mostly because of scars that I carry on my fingers, that even a cheap gimmick knife can cause significant damage if enough force is applied. A terrorist is certainly willing and able to apply the appropriate force that one time to 'prove' his seriousness and to cow the rest. However, It is my belief that a terrorist would be foolish to attempt a hijacking again in the US. I think it will be more difficult now, after the events of 9/11, to get the passangers to submit because they will assume that they are dead already and fight to retake the plane.

Future targets for Airline hijackers will be US and Allied interests overseas, primarily in the middle east and africa. Though they may resort back to the old tactics of terrorizing just by destroying the planes and not expect anything else.


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## Turner (Aug 8, 2003)

Oh, and as for the FBI presenting this poorly concocted list... it could be more of a 'no-duh' list, to get the people a little more aware while not circulating the full list or full analysis because they don't wish to give the terrorists any ideas.


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## Phil Elmore (Aug 8, 2003)

One of the knife photos in that document is labeled as being from an "unknown" manufacturer despite the manufacturer's logo clearly visible on the blade.

That's bureaucracy in action.


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## satans.barber (Aug 8, 2003)

I noticed that, ironically, most of the products are made in the USA as well (out of the ones I read through before getting bored with the stupidity of the document).

How long before someone passes a bill to stop the production of novelty knives in the USA, in case American lives are threatened with them? I've heard of dafter things than that happening in the States, so it wouldn't surprise me!

Ian.


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## OULobo (Aug 8, 2003)

I think it would be excessively hard to hijack a plane with a knife or even medium sized edged weapon currently, even if you got it past the security checkpoint. Very few people are going to stand-by or be threatened. I know that I and most of the people here have the confidence to say that, but realistically now everyone is scared enough to not let a knife stop them from trying to stop a hijacking. Hell, my Dad is 5'8" and pretty portly and he has said he'd tackle anyone who trys to force their way into the cockpit or threaten the safety of the plane.


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## arnisador (Aug 8, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Sharp Phil _
> *What is disturbing about this story is that this crude, poorly constructed document was the best our own FBI could concoct.
> *



I agree, though in fairness it sounds like the result of one man's initiative and not an organizational effort. From the story:



> Officials say a worker at the FBI lab in Quantico, Va., began the catalog shortly after the Sept. 11 attacks so that security personnel would be aware of the vast array of dangerous items that can be legally purchased and might be difficult to detect.



It's the TSA that should be doing this anyway--not the FBI.


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