# boxing legality



## Porong (May 30, 2019)

I THINK LEGALLY IF YOUR A BOXER AND YOU FIGHT OUT SIDE OF THE RING IT Could qualify as a deadly weapons charge so would  you agree I should learn boxing or kick boxing to increase me defensI've skills thoughts please thank you.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (May 30, 2019)

Are you saying you think it does qualify, or that you're suggesting it should qualify as a deadly weapon. If the first, there are a lot of issues i dont feel like explaining, but the relevant one:

Why would it being illegal to punch someone as a boxer mean you should learn boxing for self defense? That makes no sense.


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## Porong (May 30, 2019)

What I am trying to say is I think in both martial so arts and boxing if you maliciously punched some one my martial art instructor or a police officer has stated that if you use martial also arts abusively a complaint could potentially read deadly weapons charge I am sure it's the same with  boxing so do you think if I learn boxing it will increase my self defense skills? Thoughts you don't think learning boxing will increase my self defense skills?


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## Dirty Dog (May 30, 2019)

Absolutely. Didn't you know that all of us with Black Belt ranks have to register our hands as Deadly Weapons?
And unless we have a Concealed Weapons Permit, we're not allowed to put our hands in our pockets.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (May 31, 2019)

Porong said:


> What I am trying to say is I think in both martial so arts and boxing if you maliciously punched some one my martial art instructor or a police officer has stated that if you use martial also arts abusively a complaint could potentially read deadly weapons charge I am sure it's the same with  boxing so do you think if I learn boxing it will increase my self defense skills? Thoughts you don't think learning boxing will increase my self defense skills?


You were fed a bunch of lies, by some unknown person probably popular myth, and even if it was true that would have no indication on self defense.


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## drop bear (May 31, 2019)

Porong said:


> I THINK LEGALLY IF YOUR A BOXER AND YOU FIGHT OUT SIDE OF THE RING IT Could qualify as a deadly weapons charge so would  you agree I should learn boxing or kick boxing to increase me defensI've skills thoughts please thank you.




Yep.........


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## kickboxingtalk (May 31, 2019)

Hi,

If used in ‘self defence’ as a last resort then who knows these days how that would stand up in a court of law?

Saying that if you have or want to learn the knowledge you can still protect yourself without hitting back!

Best Regards
Jay


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## Danny T (May 31, 2019)

What?!??
If you don't train in any type of fighting and "YOU FIGHT OUT SIDE OF THE RING" it could qualify as a deadly weapons charge depending upon the situation.


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## kickboxingtalk (May 31, 2019)

Why is this reminding me of the film ‘Con-Air’ where the character played by Nicholas cage gets into more trouble because of his training in hand-to-hand combat...


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## Deleted member 39746 (May 31, 2019)

I wish that was a thing, but its not here.       Im sure some places do in fact put people who practice martial arts on a list though.  



kickboxingtalk said:


> Why is this reminding me of the film ‘Con-Air’ where the character played by Nicholas cage gets into more trouble because of his training in hand-to-hand combat...



There may be some different view on someone who has training, but i dont think its drastically different.    Like the jury/judge might expect you to walk away from more/come to a peaceful settlement for more things.      I don't know, it can very well change perception on you though.  


And just because it exists:  





But yeah, unless you live under a despot, im pretty sure someone was just bloating the style/feeding you lies and mis information.     Happily cite a law to your country which shows martial artists have to be registered to some degree, im all for learning new laws in different countries for interest sake. 


(how ever i do have a hook for a hand so thats registered as a deadly weapon)


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## JR 137 (May 31, 2019)

I remember back during my first stint in karate, I was wearing a t-shirt from my dojo. Somehow I was talking to a random older guy and he asked about my training. He stated he trained karate in Korea while he served in the Korean War, got his black belt and won some competitions. Then he said when he got back to the states he registered his hands and feet with the local police. And I immediately knew right there that the whole story was complete bullish!t.


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## Dirty Dog (May 31, 2019)

Rat said:


> I wish that was a thing, but its not here.       Im sure some places do in fact put people who practice martial arts on a list though.



And from what evidence do you arrive at this surety?


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## JR 137 (May 31, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> And from what evidence do you arrive at this surety?


Well... I guess he’s right... my teacher has a list of his students. Doesn’t that count as a place that puts people who train in MA on a list?


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## Dirty Dog (May 31, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> Well... I guess he’s right... my teacher has a list of his students. Doesn’t that count as a place that puts people who train in MA on a list?



True enough, although from the context I think the implication that this is being done by some government/law enforcement office is pretty clear.


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## JR 137 (May 31, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> True enough, although from the context I think the implication that this is being done by some government/law enforcement office is pretty clear.


Yeah, I know.


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## Headhunter (May 31, 2019)

Rat said:


> I wish that was a thing, but its not here.       Im sure some places do in fact put people who practice martial arts on a list though.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wait why do you wish that was a thing? Do you want martial artists to get in trouble whenever they defend themselves? And no frankly I've traveled to different places and I've boxed and kickboxed and fought Mma and done karate bjj and Krav Maga and never have I ever been asked to register myself....the whole idea is dumb. So if I quit training do I still have to register for the rest if my life or what if I don't register and then I get in a fight what's the proof that I've got training or that I actually used said training, I mean if I'm a boxer and I end up kicking a guy in the head or choking him then that's not using my training is it since kicks and chokes aren't in boxing so how can a prosecutor say I used my martial arts when I used techniques that aren't my martial art?


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## Headhunter (May 31, 2019)

kickboxingtalk said:


> Hi,
> 
> If used in ‘self defence’ as a last resort then who knows these days how that would stand up in a court of law?
> 
> ...


No you can't...if someone's attacking you hard full on trying to hurt you you can't just keep blocking you have to be aggressive to end it, whether it's just a restraint or a joint lock or a choke or a kick or punch 9 out of 10 times you'll need to do something aggressive.


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## Buka (May 31, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> Absolutely. Didn't you know that all of us with Black Belt ranks have to register our hands as Deadly Weapons?
> And unless we have a Concealed Weapons Permit, we're not allowed to put our hands in our pockets.



How I got to be this old and never thought about, or heard, that hands in the pocket line just baffles me.

Great line.


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## drop bear (May 31, 2019)

I really want to get a hands as leathal weapons permit now.


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## JR 137 (May 31, 2019)

Registering is for sex offenders, not MAists.


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## dvcochran (Jun 1, 2019)

The nearest thing I can think of is if someone local is notorious for fighting. It was not an official list but LEO all knew of certain people that could and liked to fight (and usually drink). If we got a call and dispatch was able, the first name of the person would go out with the call. More cars would roll if possible.

Quite often there would be only two people on the road on Sundays. It was not uncommon for Saturday' nights escapades to flow over into Sunday morning. I had calls where a name went with the call. Your whole train of thinking changes when you know there is no backup.


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## Deleted member 39746 (Jun 1, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> And from what evidence do you arrive at this surety?



On a probability scale given there are 100and some odd countries out there, some of which are dictatorships, some of which have banned the practice or restrict it, so surely at least probability speaking one could have some form of list to put practitioners on even if it is a banned list. (actually i think most that did, yielded it was more useful to keep the practice going just force change what is taught)

Plus i swear some people have legit tried to get practitioners registered on a  list.  not entirely sure if that was a joke or not.  So if you apply those people in a position of power where they can do that with little impediment.   


Hell many people laugh at body Armour being banned/restricted in some countries, still is in them.


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## Gaucho (Jul 10, 2019)

I had to get a Concealed Carry permit so that I could wear mitts in winter.


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## JR 137 (Jul 11, 2019)

Gaucho said:


> I had to get a Concealed Carry permit so that I could wear mitts in winter.


That’s not concealed. That’s the equivalent of carrying a knife in a sheath on your belt or carrying a pistol in a holster on your belt. Concealed would be in your pockets or pulling your sleeves over your hands


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Jul 11, 2019)

JR 137 said:


> That’s not concealed. That’s the equivalent of carrying a knife in a sheath on your belt or carrying a pistol in a holster on your belt. Concealed would be in your pockets or pulling your sleeves over your hands


Just get a really big overcoat and hide your hands in there


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## punisher73 (Jul 12, 2019)

From my understanding, the myth about "registering your hands" started after WW2, where many people did register with the police in general for location purposes and missing people.  So, if a GI would have asked about finding the local karate guy, he would have been registered with the police.  I have NOT been able to track down the accuracy of this, but it seems to make sense where the myth started.

In Michigan, MA training CAN be used against you in enhanced penalties/charges.  I personally, saw a domestic violence case that the male punched and broke the jaw of the female and his training was brought into it as a competitive kickboxer.

Also, some states have statues on the book about "kicking with a shod foot".


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## jobo (Jul 12, 2019)

punisher73 said:


> From my understanding, the myth about "registering your hands" started after WW2, where many people did register with the police in general for location purposes and missing people.  So, if a GI would have asked about finding the local karate guy, he would have been registered with the police.  I have NOT been able to track down the accuracy of this, but it seems to make sense where the myth started.
> 
> In Michigan, MA training CAN be used against you in enhanced penalties/charges.  I personally, saw a domestic violence case that the male punched and broke the jaw of the female and his training was brought into it as a competitive kickboxer.
> 
> Also, some states have statues on the book about "kicking with a shod foot".


I think it can be used against you most places if your judged in the wrong, as you likely to be if you break the jaw of your spouse, the issue I don't understand is how they would know, unless yourfamous or you tell them or your known tothe victim, or of course if your wearing your outfit


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## punisher73 (Jul 12, 2019)

jobo said:


> I think it can be used against you most places if your judged in the wrong, as you likely to be if you break the jaw of your spouse, the issue I don't understand is how they would know, unless yourfamous or you tell them or your known tothe victim, or of course if your wearing your outfit



I agree.  Most often, I think it is the guy who always goes around bragging and getting into fights that it becomes more known.  But, as you stated it is only used against you in unlawful uses of force.  If what you do is reasonable in protecting yourself than it doesn't matter your training level.


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## Buka (Jul 12, 2019)

In some circles, registering your hands is called being fingerprinted.  

I believe it's best in life to never register your hands.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 13, 2019)

kempodisciple said:


> Just get a really big overcoat and hide your hands in there


Umm....what are your hands doing inside your overcoat???


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 13, 2019)

jobo said:


> I think it can be used against you most places if your judged in the wrong, as you likely to be if you break the jaw of your spouse, the issue I don't understand is how they would know, unless yourfamous or you tell them or your known tothe victim, or of course if your wearing your outfit


I always stop and put my training gear on (especially the big skirt!) before a fight. I mean, that's what I train in, so gotta wear it.


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## drop bear (Jul 14, 2019)

jobo said:


> I think it can be used against you most places if your judged in the wrong, as you likely to be if you break the jaw of your spouse, the issue I don't understand is how they would know, unless yourfamous or you tell them or your known tothe victim, or of course if your wearing your outfit



Facebook.


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## jobo (Jul 14, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Facebook.


yes well if your going to parade your life on Facebook your asking for all sorts of trouble


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## Deleted member 39746 (Jul 15, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I always stop and put my training gear on (especially the big skirt!) before a fight. I mean, that's what I train in, so gotta wear it.



Lesson of today:  Always wear a cup, always have a gum shield on you and always wear body armour.  


oh and always keep your .44 Magnum S&W handy with at least two reloads on your person.


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 15, 2019)

drop bear said:


> Facebook.


Or dojo/gym website, some Youtube video. Yeah, lots of ways these days.


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## jobo (Jul 15, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> Or dojo/gym website, some Youtube video. Yeah, lots of ways these days.


I make a point if not having myself identifiable in any of those mediums, because of the potential trouble it can cause  you, personally or professionally, even if it's just old " friends "you don't want to see, tracking you down. I've run in to conflict with people who post pictures and vids containing me on their sites/ channel, . they may want the world to know how they spent their Saturday night, but I dont


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## Gerry Seymour (Jul 15, 2019)

jobo said:


> I make a point if not having myself identifiable in any of those mediums, because of the potential trouble it can cause  you, personally or professionally, even if it's just old " friends "you don't want to see, tracking you down. I've run in to conflict with people who post pictures and vids containing me on their sites/ channel, . they may want the world to know how they spent their Saturday night, but I dont


I have nobody I worry about seeing that kind of thing. All of my old friends are just that - no arch nemeses lurking about (@elder999 - is that you back in the corner?).

But that's a good point. I could see folks with a mixed past, LEO, and others having a reason not to want their activities to be trackable. For most of us, it's just not that much of a concern.


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## jobo (Jul 15, 2019)

I hace the vuew that you lost touch with people for a good reason, ussually either you or they couldnt be bothered to keep in touch , that and I hate the company of " old" people , which is what all my old friends now are , they just want to moan about the world and relive the past, . I'm not making it easier for them to find me and make me depressed .

Lots and lots of people have come to regret posts they made years ago, it's common for employers to reaseach your social media, and make hard out if context judgement on you , and it's not hard to do a reverse image search,  I read that America visa people wanted social media details so they could assessment you as a threat to the state, or at least undesirable , .
My ex used to plaster me all over her face book page, , which is one of the reasons she is an ex  it's a vacuas medium I want no part of..though my dog .has his own face book page, which lets me use to argue with people about Brexit, lets see them track me through that


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