# Cyborg charged for assault



## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

So there was this ufc retreat at the weekend and during the time cyborg santos assaulted another girl over some tweets she'd said about her and the other girl is pressing charges.

A lot of people are on cyborgs side but Im not. I think what she did was totally inappropriate. Sure the girl was talking trash but that's no excuse for assault. It also makes people believe the sports full of thugs. Now I'm not condoning what the other girl said but fact is cyborg assaulted her and should be charged just like I would be if I punched some guy outside a nightclub who I was arguing with. It wasn't self defence so I think she deserves what punnishment she gets.

Cristiane 'Cyborg' Justino cited for misdemeanor battery


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## drop bear (May 23, 2017)

You really can't say horrible things to people and expect them to take it lying down.


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## EMT (May 23, 2017)

Too much testosterone I guess :-D


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## JR 137 (May 23, 2017)

drop bear said:


> You really can't say horrible things to people and expect them to take it lying down.


I agree with that.  But there's a limit to how you're allowed to react.  You can't go around beating people up who talked trash about you.  If you're going to be a celebrity/someone in the public eye, you have to expect people are going to say the worst imaginable things about you, true and completely false.

I didn't read the article nor do I know anything that's not been said here.  Being involved with high level college sports (NCAA Division 1 basketball and football), I've seen some really shady stuff said and written.  I've seen the reaction of the athletes to it, good, bad, and not caring.  Beating someone up over it isn't justifiable IMO.

I even had people say and write things about me, and I was just the trainer.  I always quietly felt "they'd never say that to my face in a dark alley."

I know, the difference between college and professional sports is night and day.  And I'm quite sure you don't feel like she deserved it.

Edit: But people like to say whatever they want and think there's no consequences.  Now she thinks she's some sort of victim.  I read the article and skimmed through a related article or two.  There's no end in site to the "victim's" doo-doo talking.  She's probably happy she got hit.  She can try to end her career and sue, thereby getting money without working for it.  It's a win-win for her.  But that doesn't mean I agree she should've been punched.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

drop bear said:


> You really can't say horrible things to people and expect them to take it lying down.


Doesn't justify assault in any way. Lets put it this way who's going to get in more trouble for this


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

I'm not sure why this made news. Someones gets punched because of something they said.  That's nothing new.  Why is this news?

Lesson #1: Be careful of what you say about someone because that person may punch you.

Lesson #2: Never assume that someone won't punch you, and in some cases shoot you, for the words that come out of your mouth.


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## Martial D (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> So there was this ufc retreat at the weekend and during the time cyborg santos assaulted another girl over some tweets she'd said about her and the other girl is pressing charges.
> 
> A lot of people are on cyborgs side but Im not. I think what she did was totally inappropriate. Sure the girl was talking trash but that's no excuse for assault. It also makes people believe the sports full of thugs. Now I'm not condoning what the other girl said but fact is cyborg assaulted her and should be charged just like I would be if I punched some guy outside a nightclub who I was arguing with. It wasn't self defence so I think she deserves what punnishment she gets.
> 
> Cristiane 'Cyborg' Justino cited for misdemeanor battery


I was bound to agree with you eventually on something. If you lay hands on someone when you are in the public eye at all, especially if you're a pro fighter, you are opening up a whole can of worms.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> I'm not sure why this made news. Someones gets punched because of something they said.  That's nothing new.  Why is this news?
> 
> Lesson #1: Be careful of what you say about someone because that person may punch you.
> 
> ...


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## iamduanejackson (May 23, 2017)

I can't stand Magana.. right or wrong I can't help but be happy she got popped, she isn't a real fighter she shouldn't have even been at that retreat and it's a shame the UFC ever gave her a platform to make a name


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

iamduanejackson said:


> I can't stand Magana.. right or wrong I can't help but be happy she got popped, she isn't a real fighter she shouldn't have even been at that retreat and it's a shame the UFC ever gave her a platform to make a name


She fights that makes her a real fighter


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## iamduanejackson (May 23, 2017)

I applaud you for your intelligence.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

iamduanejackson said:


> I applaud you for your intelligence.


And yet you claimed she wasn't a fighter...good intelligence. Also nice how you're first post on this forum is trashing a fighter...


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

Martial D said:


> I was bound to agree with you eventually on something. If you lay hands on someone when you are in the public eye at all, especially if you're a pro fighter, you are opening up a whole can of worms.


It's stupid how people are defending her actions. Probably people think it's a tough guy thing someone trash talks you you so you drop them...that's just dumb and especially anyone on here who are martial artists claiming she was in the right....would you say that to your students that if someone says something mean you punch them.....i should really hope not


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## Martial D (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> It's stupid how people are defending her actions. Probably people think it's a tough guy thing someone trash talks you you so you drop them...that's just dumb and especially anyone on here who are martial artists claiming she was in the right....would you say that to your students that if someone says something mean you punch them.....i should really hope not


I should hope, in general at least, in a place like this full of life long MAists, it would be generally frowned upon to use your skill to assault people over words spoken.

I personally find such actions dishonorable.


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## iamduanejackson (May 23, 2017)

boooooooommmmmmmm

FloCombat on Twitter


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## DanT (May 23, 2017)

Talk **** get hit.

Talk smack get whacked.

Etc.

Rule of thumb: don't run your mouth.

At the same time, most martial arts teach us patience, detachment, etc... my thoughts? Too much steroids, too little meditation.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

There's a pretty clear cause and effect going on in this one.  I think there's a middle ground here. 

She'll pay a fine and maybe do some community service and life will move on.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

DanT said:


> Talk **** get hit.
> 
> Talk smack get whacked.
> 
> ...


That's just a stupid playground attitude for kids. Adults should be big enough to ignore a few words


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

I'm not taking sides.  Just stating a truth.  Some people will punch you in the mouth for talking bad about them. Ole skool Self-defense 101.  "If you can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all."    Don't base your safety on what you think people should do and how they should behave.  Base it on the reality that running off at the mouth can get you into trouble, because everyone isn't going to exercise patience or tolerance.  People need to understand that and understand that what they say has consequences. It doesn't matter if the person gets hit or not.   

Take your safety in your own hand. Don't escalate, de-escalate.  Like I said.  Things like this happen all the time and some cases people get shot for running off at the mouth.  Was cyborg wrong? yeah of course.  Did her being wrong stop her from punching the other lady in the face?  Nope.


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## CB Jones (May 23, 2017)

If you decide you are going to hit someone because of what they said...then you also have to accept the consequences of those actions.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

CB Jones said:


> If you decide you are going to hit someone because of what they said...then you also have to accept the consequences of those actions.


Agreed. Honestly it's very worrying how many people are saying she was right to do it...not just here but all over the Internet. 

I've heard one comment saying "oh they're fighters what do you expect" umm well maybe for them to act like adults and professionals and not drag the sport down. Especially cyborg who's a known steroid cheat


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Martial D said:


> I should hope, in general at least, in a place like this full of life long MAists, it would be generally frowned upon to use your skill to assault people over words spoken.
> 
> I personally find such actions dishonorable.


I'm not a zen martial artist.  For things like this honor could be hitting someone in the face for disrespecting you.  Honor is not a legal matter.  If I went up to my Sifu and talked disrespectfully to him and got in his face, and as a result he punched me in my face, then a person can say that my Sifu did the honorable action.  Even though both of the situations are the same.  One person punching another for talking smack.

The best thing is to understand human nature and accept it.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

CB Jones said:


> If you decide you are going to hit someone because of what they said...then you also have to accept the consequences of those actions.


I totally agree and some people are more than happy to accept those consequences.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> umm well maybe for them to act like adults and professionals and not drag the sport down


Adults act like that all the time and they are professionals.  I don't know why this is so shocking to you.


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## Paul_D (May 23, 2017)

Most TMA clubs have something within their rules that means this sort of behaviour gets you kicked out of the club.  Does that ever happen in MMA, or will they all high five her when she goes back training?


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Most TMA clubs have something within their rules that means this sort of behaviour gets you kicked out of the club.  Does that ever happen in MMA, or will they all high five her when she goes back training?


Could be either or neither of those options.   As with TMA, it depends.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> Adults act like that all the time and they are professionals.  I don't know why this is so shocking to you.


Not shocked simply saying it's dumb and that she's in the wrong and should be charged for it


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> Not shocked simply saying it's dumb and that she's in the wrong and should be charged for it


I'm glad she's being charged as well.  I'm all about consequences.  I don't young people think that punching someone like that can be done without a cost.  It's good lessons on both ends of the conflict.  I'm sure one will use more caution when mouthing off and the may use more restraint depending on what she gets as a punishment.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Most TMA clubs have something within their rules that means this sort of behaviour gets you kicked out of the club.  Does that ever happen in MMA, or will they all high five her when she goes back training?


TMAs don't know how to fight anyway...lol.  But seriously TMA often practice restraint so that they aren't crippling their fellow classmates.  Many of the TMA are full of people who don't want to fight, so it's a different breed of people that we are comparing.


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## Paul_D (May 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> TMAs don't know how to fight anyway...lol.  But seriously TMA often practice restraint so that they aren't crippling their fellow classmates.  Many of the TMA are full of people who don't want to fight, so it's a different breed of people that we are comparing.


Was comparing the culture within the two tbh.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Was comparing the culture within the two tbh.


I've met a lot of a-hole TMA guys in my life.  Culture can be broken in any school, in my experience.  Depends a lot on the school owner/head instructor.  Where the head goes, so goes the body. 

Sounds like you've made up your mind, though.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> TMAs don't know how to fight anyway...lol.  But seriously TMA often practice restraint so that they aren't crippling their fellow classmates.  Many of the TMA are full of people who don't want to fight, so it's a different breed of people that we are comparing.


Efficacy of the training is beside the point here, in my opinion.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Was comparing the culture within the two tbh.


The different types of style means nothing. You're either a good person who doesn't do stupid stuff like that or you're an idiot who gets into fights. You can have both in mma or traditional styles


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## Paul_D (May 23, 2017)

Steve said:


> I've met a lot of a-hole TMA guys in my life.  Culture can be broken in any school, in my experience.  Depends a lot on the school owner/head instructor.  Where the head goes, so goes the body.
> 
> Sounds like you've made up your mind, though.


Don't have an opinion, as I don't know, that's why I'm asking people who do.  Plenty of a-holes too n TMA yes, but like I say in TMA there is usually a rules saying you are only allowed to use your skills to protect people etc etc


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## Paul_D (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> The different types of style means nothing. You're either a good person who doesn't do stupid stuff like that or you're an idiot who gets into fights. You can have both in mma or traditional styles


You can yes absolutely,  but usually if you do it in a TMA club you get kick out, just wanted to know if that happens in MMA as well, as we has a local MMA fighter get charged with assault for beating someone up in the street, and his club let him keep training and teaching.


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

EMT said:


> Too much testosterone I guess :-D


Yep hell of a lot of roid rage


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## Headhunter (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> You can yes absolutely,  but usually if you do it in a TMA club you get kick out, just wanted to know if that happens in MMA as well, as we has a local MMA fighter get charged with assault for beating someone up in the street, and his club let him keep training and teaching.


That's more of a myth than anything. I've been in loads of clubs where people have gotten in fights and nothing happens. I mean most times the instructor won't even find out.


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## Paul_D (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> I mean most times the instructor won't even find out.


Well yes if they don't know, bit hard in this case though when she's all over the net.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Don't have an opinion, as I don't know, that's why I'm asking people who do.  Plenty of a-holes too n TMA yes, but like I say in TMA there is usually a rules saying you are only allowed to use your skills to protect people etc etc


And you were given the answer from people who know, but are still going on about it, which leads me to believe you weren't asking a question in good faith.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Steve said:


> Efficacy of the training is beside the point here, in my opinion.


It's not the training. It's the type of people that are attracted to TMA vs the type of people who are attracted to UFC.


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## drop bear (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> Doesn't justify assault in any way. Lets put it this way who's going to get in more trouble for this



In a world where you can stab someone and get a bond. I am going to suggest nobody will get in trouble.

Provocation does justify assult. Defence against assult includes more than just self defence.

Fighting Words Law and Legal Definition | USLegal, Inc.


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## drop bear (May 23, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> It's stupid how people are defending her actions. Probably people think it's a tough guy thing someone trash talks you you so you drop them...that's just dumb and especially anyone on here who are martial artists claiming she was in the right....would you say that to your students that if someone says something mean you punch them.....i should really hope not



So martial artists promote trash talk.

Not sure when that was a thing.


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## drop bear (May 23, 2017)

Paul_D said:


> Well yes if they don't know, bit hard in this case though when she's all over the net.



Her camp wont care over a punch during a verbal attack. And Brazilians hate disrespectful behaviour more than they like free speach.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> It's not the training. It's the type of people that are attracted to TMA vs the type of people who are attracted to UFC.


So, wait.  I'm confused.  Are we talking about people who train in MMA or people who are attracted to the UFC?  While there is some overlap, I'm not sure that it's any different than the overlap between people who train in TMA and people who are attracted to the UFC.

I am also not sure I agree with what I THINK you mean, which is that people who train MMA are people who want to fight. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you mean (which I admit is very possible here), but it sounds like you're suggesting that a "typical" MMA athlete likes to fight and/or hurt other people.   I feel pretty comfortable saying this isn't true, any more than for a typical TMA.


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## drop bear (May 23, 2017)

Steve said:


> So, wait.  I'm confused.  Are we talking about people who train in MMA or people who are attracted to the UFC?  While there is some overlap, I'm not sure that it's any different than the overlap between people who train in TMA and people who are attracted to the UFC.
> 
> I am also not sure I agree with what I THINK you mean, which is that people who train MMA are people who want to fight. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you mean (which I admit is very possible here), but it sounds like you're suggesting that a "typical" MMA athlete likes to fight and/or hurt other people.   I feel pretty comfortable saying this isn't true, any more than for a typical TMA.



I think there is an element of liking to fight people that exist in competitive styles.

I definitely know there are things you could say to every one of my coaches that would get you punched in the head.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Steve said:


> So, wait.  I'm confused.  Are we talking about people who train in MMA or people who are attracted to the UFC?  While there is some overlap, I'm not sure that it's any different than the overlap between people who train in TMA and people who are attracted to the UFC.
> 
> I am also not sure I agree with what I THINK you mean, which is that people who train MMA are people who want to fight. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you mean (which I admit is very possible here), but it sounds like you're suggesting that a "typical" MMA athlete likes to fight and/or hurt other people.   I feel pretty comfortable saying this isn't true, any more than for a typical TMA.


I'm talking about the people who train MMA.  I can go to an MMA gym and everyone that is training there for at least a year would have some sparring experience though there classes.  The same can't be said about TMA's because TMA's attract people who are looking for zen, peace, and stress relief.  They aren't looking to fight.  There are people in my school who have been training for 7 years and have never sparred.  Things like that is the norm in many TMA's where students either haven't sparred or they spar very little.  Those type of student's aren't there to learn.  If you look at extreme martial arts then you'll have a bunch of people who like to do exciting performances with flips and kicks.  If you look at Tai Chi then you will see that most people are focused on health benefits and are past their fighting prime.

I'll use myself as an example,  I like to spar a lot, but not at the same level of commitment that you'll find in many MMA gyms.  I spend 1 day a week for sparring and sometimes I don't even do that.  Are there people in TMAs that can and like to fight? Of course, but they don't have near the aggression that is found in MMA environments.  MMA embraces their aggression, Many TMA schools are often training to suppress it.  This is not a bad or good thing.  It's just 2 schools with 2 different perspectives on fighting.

For me personally I like TMAs schools that allow students to embrace their aggression vs trying to suppress it.



Steve said:


> but it sounds like you're suggesting that a "typical" MMA athlete likes to fight and/or hurt other people.


I'm saying that the typical MMA athlete likes to fight.  It's not just me. Here's a Traditional Martial Artist that talks about controlling the emotional state through meditation, and physical fitness.  Listen to how long how he talks about non-fighting aspects of TMA.  By the way it didn't take me long to find something like this for a TMA.  By the way I don't think this way about Martial Arts.  Just showing you the different and you'll won't get this "zen" perspective from an MMA athlete.  There some TMA students like me that won't give you this type of zen, but it's very few in comparison to those who do. 











Also it's ok to like fighting.  There's nothing wrong with that as long as the person isn't going around fighting people off the streets just to get that thrill.


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## Martial D (May 23, 2017)

Lol @ that second video. Is that guy for real?

Ringworm? LMFAO.


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## Steve (May 23, 2017)

drop bear said:


> I think there is an element of liking to fight people that exist in competitive styles.
> 
> I definitely know there are things you could say to every one of my coaches that would get you punched in the head.


There's liking to compete which is different from lacking impulse control and liking to punch people outside of the gym.


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## jks9199 (May 23, 2017)

Comes down to time and place.  Cyborg has access to the right time and place to make the other fighter back up her words.  Instead, she chose to do it in the wrong time and place.  She'll have to take some lumps in the legal arena and looks like a hot head.


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## JowGaWolf (May 23, 2017)

Martial D said:


> Lol @ that second video. Is that guy for real?
> 
> Ringworm? LMFAO.


Yeah he's for real.  He's always talking like that.  He should spend more time reading about the history of martial arts and warfare.


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## drop bear (May 24, 2017)

Steve said:


> There's liking to compete which is different from lacking impulse control and liking to punch people outside of the gym.



Yeah.  But there is a trend in some martial arts to never engage in conflict even in the gym. 

I assume those guys will never fight regardless of the impulse.


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## Martial D (May 24, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> Yeah he's for real.  He's always talking like that.  He should spend more time reading about the history of martial arts and warfare.


Why? According to him, real martial artist don't fight. Or get their hair messed up....(????)


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## JowGaWolf (May 24, 2017)

Martial D said:


> Why? According to him, real martial artist don't fight. Or get their hair messed up....(????)


you misunderstood me.   "He's for real" as in, he really believe the nonsense that is coming out of his mouth.  He's not faking that.  He really believes what he is saying to be true


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## Headhunter (May 24, 2017)

jks9199 said:


> Comes down to time and place.  Cyborg has access to the right time and place to make the other fighter back up her words.  Instead, she chose to do it in the wrong time and place.  She'll have to take some lumps in the legal arena and looks like a hot head.


Pretty much yeah personally I think she should be cut from the ufc. She's a known steroid user and has caused a lot of trouble.


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## Martial D (May 24, 2017)

JowGaWolf said:


> you misunderstood me.   "He's for real" as in, he really believe the nonsense that is coming out of his mouth.  He's not faking that.  He really believes what he is saying to be true


Ya, I was being sarcastic. I guess that doesn't always translate well to text


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## JowGaWolf (May 24, 2017)

Martial D said:


> Ya, I was being sarcastic. I guess that doesn't always translate well to text


yep. lol.


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## Andrew Green (May 24, 2017)

drop bear said:


> So martial artists promote trash talk.
> 
> Not sure when that was a thing.



It became a thing when they became professional fighters, which merges sport and entertainment.

Many would consider Ali the greatest boxer of all time, and a lot of what made him such a big star was his ability to trash talk.

Trash talking done well in any professional sport tends to increase ticket sales, and in turn increase the salary of the person doing it.  Chael Sonnet probably made more money because of his mouth then anything.  Connor McGregor would probably be considered a guy with a lot of potential, but with the jury out until he defends a belt a few times without his.

In any sport as soon as it turns into a profession you have "entertainment" and self-promotion playing a part.  Some are naturally good at clever trash talking and making it entertaining.  Listening to Ali or Sonnen rattle them off can be quite entertaining... others try, but it just doesn't work.  Maybe because they just come across as mean, or it's just not in their personality and comes across as forced and awkward (ex. "I was not impressed with your performance")


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## DanT (May 24, 2017)

Headhunter said:


> That's just a stupid playground attitude for kids. Adults should be big enough to ignore a few words


I agree, but you can't expect more from people.


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