# Not a beginner, but the first time dealing with a horrible loss... any advice?



## DianeK (Feb 21, 2019)

Hi there, 
 I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:

I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits. 

Key point of the story: I kinda have a "nemesis", a girl one year younger than me who joined my gym a bunch years ago and with whom, for some reason, I immediately developed a bitter rivalry. We really couldn't stand each other and hard spars sometimes became proper fights. Once we even got in a fight in the locker room, and another time we really beat each other up on the lawn outside the gym, with the end result of both of us going to the hospital. I am pretty ashamed of that since I am usually a mellow and friendly person who never gets into fights or whatever! After that incident I was ready to leave the gym but she did it even before me. But when I began competing, she crossed my path again in a bunch of occasions.

We fought 4 times, in real matches, like it should be. The first three times I got two decisions and we had a draw. The fourth time, things went differently. Clearly, it was the most important match of all because the stage was quite bigger than the previous times. Early in the fight I felt very confident and I managed to give her a really hard time. It came to a point I hit her hard a couple of times and she looked stunned and was noticeably slowing down. When I saw her like that I decided I had to KO her and recklessly started throwing everything I got at her. Next thing I knew, they were waking me up and asking me if I was alright. She knocked me out cold. They told me she hit me with two right hooks in a row that stunned me, then KOd me with a kick. There is a video recording of that match but I never wanted to watch it.

I lost a bunch of times before, and I was TKOd once, but I've never been KOd in such a brutal fashion, and especially by my "arch-enemy" during a match I was clearly winning. The physical damage is now gone, but since that day I kinda lost a bit of my confidence and my grit...

I know there are some controversial aspects in this story, especially regarding my behavior outside the ring, but as I said I came here to get honest opinions about this whole story. THanks a lot.


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## jobo (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> Hi there,
> I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:
> 
> I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits.
> ...


what's the question? there are people in the world who hate each other on sight, if that's most people who have that reaction to you, then you need to look at yourself, if it's an odd one that's just life.

if she has left the dojo that problem solved,  but an important lesson was learnt your not winning a fight till it's over and you've won. winning up until the point you get knocked out is losing, and therefore she is better than you, train harder


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## Danny T (Feb 21, 2019)

Sounds like ego got the best of you.


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## Kung Fu Wang (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> I kinda lost a bit of my confidence and my grit....


If we put the whole earth population into a tournament, there will be only one winner. After that winner dies, the earth will be filled with all losers.


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## Martial D (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> Hi there,
> I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:
> 
> I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits.
> ...



If it gets personal you get dragged out of your game, every time.

Compete against a blank face with skills you prepare for. This is not a person, this is an opponent. Disconnect yourself.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Feb 21, 2019)

Honestly I would avoid fighting her in the future, until you can get your emotions in check.


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## DianeK (Feb 21, 2019)

Danny T said:


> Sounds like ego got the best of you.


this is very true, no doubt at all



kempodisciple said:


> Honestly I would avoid fighting her in the future, until you can get your emotions in check.



that's the problem... I think after such a loss I should feel the urge to get it back and win again against her... but right now I don't have that desire... I can't tell if I'm scared and that... scares me quite a bit 

after such a devastating loss I also feel like all my 2 previous wins against her are worth nothing. I really don't want to make it personal and I'd love to forget this unhealthy and silly rivalry, but I just can't seem to be able to do it.


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## wab25 (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> There is a video recording of that match but I never wanted to watch it.


Watch the video. There is a lot to learn from it. Sure, you lost because your ego got involved. But, I would be willing to bet, that your ego was creeping in before you think it was. 

Also, learn how she hit you. Specifically, where did the holes in your defense come from? Did you just drop your guard and go crazy with your attack? Did she punch with you, in between your shots? Did you not retract your punch to your guard fast enough or at all? Did you over commit, to create the initial opening? Now you have something to work on. Ideally, we train so that we respond without thought. This video will show you how you responded, without thought. Now you know what to fix.

Maybe it wasn't so much that you did something wrong. It also could have been, that she read you, figured out your tells before your shots. See if you can find the tell she did. Did she find a pattern to your attack that you need to address? (by become less predictable) Did she bait you into something? Even if she did something better than you this time out, it will still give you something specific to improve upon.

Either way, there are some good lessons to learn in that tape. The higher you get, the more tape of you will be out there... wins and losses. Your opponents will be watching and analyzing those tapes... Just like you should be for your opponents. 

Lastly, it may help you get past this event. Instead of seeing this as a complete failure... you can see what you did right, and where exactly it went wrong. Identifying that, means you can make the needed adjustments. This should bring back your confidence... knowing that you addressed the weaknesses she exposed.


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## Headhunter (Feb 21, 2019)

Honestly? You kind of need to suck it up and move on. You hit the floor it happens. Also calling someone your "arch enemy, is a bit extreme you don't like her then don't have anything to do with her and especially don't get into stupid street fights. You're an adult not a kid doing that could end up with you being locked up. She beat you simple as that. It's the fight game you win some you lose some who cares. I very much doubt it's your full time job so it means it's a hobby you do for fun. Don't take it so seriously and just enjoy yourself in there


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## JR 137 (Feb 21, 2019)

Whenever a fight is full contact (with or without gloves, where a KO is a win), the fight is never over until the final bell. You can dominate your opponent the entire fight, hitting them at will and them not landing a single punch, and get KOed by one shot because you made a single mistake. That’s simultaneously the great and the horrible thing about fighting. 

While there’s far more to your posts and story, there’s one thing that’s certain regardless of all the back story - you made a mistake. And that mistake got you knocked out. If you’re ever going to compete again, watch it. Try to stay as unemotional as possible and analyze what the mistake was. Then fix it. It’ll be impossible to divorce all emotion from it, but you’ve got to. If you don’t watch it and learn from it, it’ll happen again. The question isn’t if it’ll happen again, it’s when will it happen again.

Regarding the back story, I’m sure there’s far more than you’ve written regardless of who’s right and wrong and which times. Grow up and move on. This person isn’t part of your everyday life unless you let her be. Carry around the anger, and she’s part of your life. Let the anger go, and she’ll be nothing but a distant memory. Easier said than done, but definitely not impossible. It doesn’t matter if you were right 100% of the time, wrong 100% of the time, nor anything in between. If you want the drama, keep carrying that weight. If you don’t, forget it and move on.


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## CB Jones (Feb 21, 2019)

Win or learn....chalk that one up to learning and keep grinding.


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## Tez3 (Feb 21, 2019)

CB Jones said:


> Win or learn....chalk that one up to learning and keep grinding.




Damn I was going to write that! Totally agree. There's another saying too 'if you win all your fights you aren't fighting the right people'.

When I saw the title I thought a 'horrible loss' was a life changing injury or the death of a loved one not just losing a fight! The OP needs to put things in perspective.


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## CB Jones (Feb 21, 2019)

Tez3 said:


> Damn I was going to write that! Totally agree. There's another saying too 'if you win all your fights you aren't fighting the right people'.
> 
> When I saw the title I thought a 'horrible loss' was a life changing injury or the death of a loved one not just losing a fight! The OP needs to put things in perspective.



My old football coach (real football not soccer...) used to always say....our failures are our seeds to success.

You learn from them and the pain of them pushes you to get better


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 21, 2019)

What "horrible loss" are you talking about?
There's no "horrible loss" mentioned in your little story. Just an every day run of the mill ego spanking.
In other words, suck it up, princess, and get back to work.
You might also want to grow up a little, if your ego is that important and that fragile.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> that's the problem... I think after such a loss I should feel the urge to get it back and win again against her... but right now I don't have that desire... I can't tell if I'm scared and that... scares me quite a bit
> 
> after such a devastating loss I also feel like all my 2 previous wins against her are worth nothing. I really don't want to make it personal and I'd love to forget this unhealthy and silly rivalry, but I just can't seem to be able to do it.



It sounds like you actually have the perfect opportunity to forget this unhealthy rivalry. You don't have the urge to fight her again, for whatever reason (I wouldn't consider it a scared reaction, more than a wake-up call for your body that you were being arrogant/egotistical and paid the price), and considering your history that's a good thing. You really shouldn't be continuing focusing on her, and just think about the grind.

Something else to consider, if things get heated again, and you get in a fight outside the ring...both of you have the ability to do some serious damage. If you do, and she press charges, you could end up in jail for this rivalry, or at the very least lose your ability to enter the ring again. The sooner you can remove yourself from her the better.


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## drop bear (Feb 21, 2019)

Anyone any good suffers horrible defeats. Think of the fighters you have respect for. And guaranteed they lost at some point. 

It sucks but it doesn't make you a bad person in any way.


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## drop bear (Feb 21, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> What "horrible loss" are you talking about?
> There's no "horrible loss" mentioned in your little story. Just an every day run of the mill ego spanking.
> In other words, suck it up, princess, and get back to work.
> You might also want to grow up a little, if your ego is that important and that fragile.



This is something you wouldn't understand.


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## JowGaWolf (Feb 21, 2019)

DianeK said:


> Hi there,
> I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:
> 
> I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits.
> ...


Good fighters spend more time, energy, and focus on being a good fighter and less time on trying to beat a specific person.

You spent a lot of time trying to beat one person you don't like.  Just focus on being a good fighter, then focus on being a better fighter than you were a month ago.  

Making it personal will decrease your skill level.  Emotion clouds performance.


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## JR 137 (Feb 21, 2019)

drop bear said:


> This is something you wouldn't understand.


Sometimes... keepin’ it real goes wrong. 
Make It Funny: When Keeping it Real Goes Wrong - Brenda Johnson


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 22, 2019)

drop bear said:


> This is something you wouldn't understand.



Why? Because I've never lost a fight? Sure I have. Plenty.
But it's not a horrible loss.
I lost an eye in a fight. That might qualify as horrible.
Your mum dying in a fiery crash. That's horrible.
Your child dying because some idiot wouldn't vaccinate theirs. That's horrible.
Watching your best friend die a slow miserable death from alcoholism. That's horrible.
Some nutter intentionally driving a car into a crowd. That's horrible.
You got your butt kicked in a competition match?
That's not horrible. Suck it up.


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## DianeK (Feb 22, 2019)

kempodisciple said:


> Something else to consider, if things get heated again, and you get in a fight outside the ring...both of you have the ability to do some serious damage. If you do, and she press charges, you could end up in jail for this rivalry, or at the very least lose your ability to enter the ring again. The sooner you can remove yourself from her the better.



That never happened before and won't happen again... To my partial excuse we were about 19 and 18 when that stuff happened... It wouldn't happen now that I'm 25. Still, for sure my eagerness to beat her up badly in a real match got me kod...

For everyone: thanks a lot for every reply, but, about the words I choose, I kindly remind you english is not my native language, so maybe I can't express some concepts as I wish.


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## Steve (Feb 22, 2019)

Am I the only one who thought from the title that the OP experienced the loss of a loved one?


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## Steve (Feb 22, 2019)

DianeK said:


> That never happened before and won't happen again... To my partial excuse we were about 19 and 18 when that stuff happened... It wouldn't happen now that I'm 25. Still, for sure my eagerness to beat her up badly in a real match got me kod...
> 
> For everyone: thanks a lot for every reply, but, about the words I choose, I kindly remind you english is not my native language, so maybe I can't express some concepts as I wish.


That makes sense.

Regarding competition, it can be tough to work really hard, be as prepared as you can possibly be, and just come up short.  But learning to recover from a tough loss is important, and speaks to resilience.  Something you might consider is seeing a sports psychologist.  They specialize in working with athletes.


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 22, 2019)

Steve said:


> Am I the only one who thought from the title that the OP experienced the loss of a loved one?



Or something else that would qualify as a "horrible loss"...


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## Steve (Feb 22, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> Or something else that would qualify as a "horrible loss"...


Yeah, but now that I realize that the OP is not a native English speaker, I don't think it's a huge deal.


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 22, 2019)

Steve said:


> Yeah, but now that I realize that the OP is not a native English speaker, I don't think it's a huge deal.



Meh.
There are a few here for whom English *is* their native language who don't speak it as well as the OP.


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## Steve (Feb 22, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> Meh.
> There are a few here for whom English *is* their native language who don't speak it as well as the OP.


Some who ARE English.


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## Monkey Turned Wolf (Feb 22, 2019)

Steve said:


> Am I the only one who thought from the title that the OP experienced the loss of a loved one?


That's exactly what I thought before opening it. That either they lost the ability to train, or someone close died and they were grieving.


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## Bruce7 (Feb 22, 2019)

DianeK said:


> Hi there,
> I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:
> 
> I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits.
> ...



That was a well written thought provoking post.

In the old days when I spared with girls I took it easy on then, but they did not care if they hurt me, in fact I think they like it.
Today when men spar girls they treated each other as equals, probably a good thing just hard for me to get my head around it.

When an All Navy Boxer knock me out, it was a good thing. Before he knock me out I thought I was bullet proof and was probably a little cocky. It did not stop me from fighting,  just made me a lot more careful.


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## drop bear (Feb 22, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> Why? Because I've never lost a fight? Sure I have. Plenty.
> But it's not a horrible loss.
> I lost an eye in a fight. That might qualify as horrible.
> Your mum dying in a fiery crash. That's horrible.
> ...



It depends on how much the results matter. If you don't really try then you never really lost.


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 22, 2019)

drop bear said:


> It depends on how much the results matter. If you don't really try then you never really lost.



I do try. In any competition (assuming it's an even match) I do my flat out best. But it's not horrible if I lose. My ego doesn't demand that I be The Best In The World. I'm allowed to have an off day. I'm even allowed to be just plain not as good as someone else.


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## Headhunter (Feb 22, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> I do try. In any competition (assuming it's an even match) I do my flat out best. But it's not horrible if I lose. My ego doesn't demand that I be The Best In The World. I'm allowed to have an off day. I'm even allowed to be just plain not as good as someone else.


Yep at the end of the day so what if you lose a competition? What've you lost....a plastic trophy? Who gives a damm. I've never been paid for any fighting competition I've been in so I get the same if I win or lose. I can understands pros getting a bit more upset with it because they miss out on a bigger payday and future better money but even then it's not a horrible thing. I just don't understand these people who can't accept it and it messes them up. Like get over it it's an amateur competition most times that probably only about 5 people saw (3 of them your family) so losing really doesn't matter at all


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## drop bear (Feb 22, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> I do try. In any competition (assuming it's an even match) I do my flat out best. But it's not horrible if I lose. My ego doesn't demand that I be The Best In The World. I'm allowed to have an off day. I'm even allowed to be just plain not as good as someone else.



And try as in three months training camp. Weight cuts. Basically a chunk of your life sacrificed so you can win that competition?


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## Gerry Seymour (Feb 23, 2019)

drop bear said:


> It depends on how much the results matter. If you don't really try then you never really lost.


I don't know that I can draw a _necessary _correlation between how much it matters and how hard you fight. When I played competitive sports, losing never hurt near as much as winning felt good. I could live with a loss, as long as I'd done all I could. So I played hard and got over losses. There were things I wouldn't do (rules were part of the game, and I had no interest in "taking out" another player), but I did all I could to win within those limits.


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## drop bear (Feb 23, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> I don't know that I can draw a _necessary _correlation between how much it matters and how hard you fight. When I played competitive sports, losing never hurt near as much as winning felt good. I could live with a loss, as long as I'd done all I could. So I played hard and got over losses. There were things I wouldn't do (rules were part of the game, and I had no interest in "taking out" another player), but I did all I could to win within those limits.



There might be a correlation between really wanting to succeed and succeeding though.

Do many elite athletes share this ho hum approach to competing?

I have a ho hum approach to competition as well. But the I am also not very successful. But the people who have a serious attitude towards competition tend to do better.

Is this striving to be mediocre?


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## Gerry Seymour (Feb 23, 2019)

drop bear said:


> There might be a correlation between really wanting to succeed and succeeding though.
> 
> Do many elite athletes share this ho hum approach to competing?
> 
> ...


The distinction I was trying to point to is the difference between wanting to succeed and being crushed by loss. Those are not the same thing for me, in anything.

I do think there's an inherent advantage to those who are more driven to avoid the loss. They are willing to do things I'm not during the competition (some within the rules, some not). And the drive to not lose possibly (probably?) drives them to train harder, too.


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## Dirty Dog (Feb 23, 2019)

drop bear said:


> And try as in three months training camp. Weight cuts. Basically a chunk of your life sacrificed so you can win that competition?



In my younger days, sure. And losing wasn't horrible.
Still isn't. 

I've a friend who was on the US Olympic Soccer team in 1980. The year we didn't go. He wasn't thrilled about it. But I've seen plenty of people who have suffered horrible losses. He didn't act like them. Not at all.


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## mrt2 (Feb 23, 2019)

DianeK said:


> *That never happened before and won't happen again... To my partial excuse we were about 19 and 18 when that stuff happened*... It wouldn't happen now that I'm 25. Still, for sure my eagerness to beat her up badly in a real match got me kod...
> 
> For everyone: thanks a lot for every reply, but, about the words I choose, I kindly remind you english is not my native language, so maybe I can't express some concepts as I wish.


That is a good thing.  I don't know what country you live in but in the US, if you are fighting outside of a ring like, say, in the locker room or outside the dojo, the authorities can treat it as an assault and battery which, depending on the damage inflicted, carries with it between 9 months and 3 or 4 years in prison.  And, you could lose your right to vote, and your right to own firearms if that sort of thing is important to you.

I am wondering how your instructor dealt with this conflict with this other girl.  I know at my school, such behavior would have serious consequences, possibly including one or both students being kicked out.


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## drop bear (Feb 23, 2019)

gpseymour said:


> The distinction I was trying to point to is the difference between wanting to succeed and being crushed by loss. Those are not the same thing for me, in anything.
> 
> I do think there's an inherent advantage to those who are more driven to avoid the loss. They are willing to do things I'm not during the competition (some within the rules, some not). And the drive to not lose possibly (probably?) drives them to train harder, too.



People who are willing to accept more loss are willing to try harder. And are generally better at stuff.

A way of dealing with a crushing defeat is not competing. But it is striving to be mediocre. Can't win, don't try.

A way of rationalizing that mediocrity is suggesting that striving big and loosing hard is somehow immature or egotistical. Because it makes people feel better about their own decisions.


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## drop bear (Feb 23, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> In my younger days, sure. And losing wasn't horrible.
> Still isn't.
> 
> I've a friend who was on the US Olympic Soccer team in 1980. The year we didn't go. He wasn't thrilled about it. But I've seen plenty of people who have suffered horrible losses. He didn't act like them. Not at all.



So you don't really engage in that emotional risk. And you don't know anyone who engages in that emotional risk.

Well I do. And they go further in martial arts than you or me.

Which is why you wouldn't understand someone who does.

It isn't egotistical to suffer a loss. It is egotistical to condemn someone for their suffering.


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## drop bear (Feb 23, 2019)

And by the way. My issue isn't people being mediocre. My issue is the constant rhetoric of dragging people down that are trying not to be.


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## _Simon_ (Feb 23, 2019)

drop bear said:


> So you don't really engage in that emotional risk. And you don't know anyone who engages in that emotional risk.
> 
> Well I do. And they go further in martial arts than you or me.
> 
> ...


Yep makes sense to me.

I know when I started competing I was doing it for the experience and connecting with other martial artists in the community. Then I really started to enjoy it and actually tried to win. It pushed me as a martial artist and I learned so much in the process.

It is very humbling to work so hard for something and have a loss. It's a great practice in putting yourself out there, putting something at stake and willing to be vulnerable. You grow, big time. And when training to win (and by that I don't mean throwing a tantrum when you lose and being a dick to the other competitors, but in training to be your best and work towards something), you really start to see the value in it. It can have a deeper meaning than just a 'trophy', and I'd say alot who compete see that it's what the competition and winning symbolizes rather than what material stuff you get.

You see the ones who want it, the glint in the eye, the focus, the drive and willingness to overcome all limitations and barriers, it's inspiring. Watching the Olympics you see that... just how long and how much effort they went into preparation, and how uplifting it is when they get a win. You see the spirit within them driving them and expressing their potential. It's a shame when people can't see the value in that, and judging the Olympics or sporting endeavours saying "so much money, could have been put to better use", they're missing the point entirely, and it's all about context and the place it has in humanity.

And the mental/emotional component is huge... so much to process and work through.

And everyone competes for different reasons for sure. And that's not to say that those that don't compete are "playing it safe". To each their own really, there's value in each approach.

But for sure I definitely see the value in competing to win. Not as a thing to fulfill the ego, but a way of seeing what strength you have in you, and it serves to inspire so many other people in the process too.


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## Gerry Seymour (Feb 24, 2019)

drop bear said:


> People who are willing to accept more loss are willing to try harder. And are generally better at stuff.
> 
> A way of dealing with a crushing defeat is not competing. But it is striving to be mediocre. Can't win, don't try.
> 
> A way of rationalizing that mediocrity is suggesting that striving big and loosing hard is somehow immature or egotistical. Because it makes people feel better about their own decisions.


That's some good, thoughtful stuff, DB. I can't do it justice in a response at the moment (the Hobbit and I stayed up until almost 4AM doing our annual Lord of the Rings marathon). I'll try to remember to come back and comment later.


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## Gerry Seymour (Feb 24, 2019)

_Simon_ said:


> Yep makes sense to me.
> 
> I know when I started competing I was doing it for the experience and connecting with other martial artists in the community. Then I really started to enjoy it and actually tried to win. It pushed me as a martial artist and I learned so much in the process.
> 
> ...


I think a lot of the reaction has to do with how much of our identity (rather than effort, which may be correlated, but isn't the same) we invest in the thing...and especially in the win. When I've competed in sports, losses were disappointing, but never crushing and never all that important. Wins were exhilarating and fun, but never all that important, either (in fact, I can't really think back and actually remember a single significant win in a game, now that I think about it). It was playing the game that was important to me, and putting everything I had into it at the time. I mostly played in goal when I played soccer. The game I remember most vividly, I dislocated a finger a few minutes into the game. I played that game out in goal, because we only had 10 players that day, and nobody else with experience in the goal. We lost pretty handily, but I was happy about how hard I'd played and with the rest of the team's effort. To my point, my "identity" was as a good soccer player who gave all he had at games and practice, but there was no more of me tied up in it than that, so a loss didn't really hurt.


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## dvcochran (Feb 24, 2019)

DianeK said:


> Hi there,
> I signed up to this forum because I wanted to share my story with a wide audience of people I don't personally know and get their honest opinion about what recently happened to me. English is not my native language so you could find some sentences being a bit "off", I apologize in advance. So, here's the story:


A logical and cogent way of thinking.



> I'm 25 years old, I've been practicing kickboxing since I was 11 and jiu-jitsu since 2014. I never really competed until 2015. I've always been pretty good at kickboxing and when I started entering tournaments and stuff I always did very very well in increasingly bigger circuits.


So you enjoy tournament sparring and have some degree of skill. So far so good.



> Key point of the story: I kinda have a "nemesis", a girl one year younger than me who joined my gym a bunch years ago and with whom, for some reason, I immediately developed a bitter rivalry. We really couldn't stand each other and hard spars sometimes became proper fights. Once we even got in a fight in the locker room, and another time we really beat each other up on the lawn outside the gym, with the end result of both of us going to the hospital. I am pretty ashamed of that since I am usually a mellow and friendly person who never gets into fights or whatever! After that incident I was ready to leave the gym but she did it even before me. But when I began competing, she crossed my path again in a bunch of occasions.



What is your training environment? If you are in a formal dojo/dojang where was the instructor(s) and what are they doing to mitigate such encounters and help each of you process your anger into something positive. In the competition realm, this kind of adversarial relationship in class can be a good thing, if learned you use productively. This clearly is not your case. You need to be under someone who can teach you how to use this aggression and more importantly control it.



> We fought 4 times, in real matches, like it should be. The first three times I got two decisions and we had a draw. The fourth time, things went differently. Clearly, it was the most important match of all because the stage was quite bigger than the previous times. Early in the fight I felt very confident and I managed to give her a really hard time. It came to a point I hit her hard a couple of times and she looked stunned and was noticeably slowing down. When I saw her like that I decided I had to KO her and recklessly started throwing everything I got at her. Next thing I knew, they were waking me up and asking me if I was alright. She knocked me out cold. They told me she hit me with two right hooks in a row that stunned me, then KOd me with a kick. There is a video recording of that match but I never wanted to watch it.



I lost a bunch of times before, and I was TKOd once, but I've never been KOd in such a brutal fashion, and especially by my "arch-enemy" during a match I was clearly winning. The physical damage is now gone, but since that day I kinda lost a bit of my confidence and my grit...[/quote]

Clearly you are very competitive. I get it. But you have to adjust your perspective if you want to keep a competitive edge. You best performances and drive only comes to the surface when you are fighting this one person. It just doesn't work that way. You are getting up to your best level when fighting her, then loosing your drive and ambition either based on the results of that match or when fighting someone else. In other words you are emotionally getting high, high in one scenario then getting low, low for everything else. A good fighter does not do this. Ask yourself, "can I perform at the same high level without the visual and emotional motivation of fighting this one person. That needs to be what you work on to get your mojo back.



> I know there are some controversial aspects in this story, especially regarding my behavior outside the ring, but as I said I came here to get honest opinions about this whole story. THanks a lot.



Controversial is overstating things. It is just being childish and letting emotions control the event. Not what an experienced fighter does and certainly not what a martial artist does. You are 25 so you should be maturing beyond this kind of emotion. Period.  If you truly have skills good enough to compete in a legitimate circuit, and you truly enjoy the competition aspect, forget about this girl and start getting ready for you next match. In short time you will feel much better about yourself. Step back and look at yourself for someone else's point of view and ask yourself "do I like what I see". What you don't like has to go. 
Keep in touch and let us know how it goes.


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## DocWard (Feb 28, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> Why? Because I've never lost a fight? Sure I have. Plenty.
> But it's not a horrible loss.
> I lost an eye in a fight. That might qualify as horrible.
> Your mum dying in a fiery crash. That's horrible.
> ...



Well, I for one am relieved that we have you here to tell us what we can and can't consider horrible, regardless of our own personal lives and history and your lack of knowledge of them. While at face value the title seems hyperbolic, I'm not so deific as to stand in judgment of the OP. Offer advice, sure. Since I don't know anything-squat, zero, nil, null, nada, zilch-about the OPs life, personal experiences, fears, psyche or weaknesses, I don't feel qualified to do more. I'm glad you do.


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## Dirty Dog (Mar 1, 2019)

DocWard said:


> Well, I for one am relieved that we have you here to tell us what we can and can't consider horrible



You're welcome.


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## Steve (Mar 1, 2019)

drop bear said:


> There might be a correlation between really wanting to succeed and succeeding though.
> 
> Do many elite athletes share this ho hum approach to competing?
> 
> ...


I believe that there is an important distinction between competitive drive and resilience, and that really successful, elite athletes tend to have an overabundance of both.  Or at least, I should say, lack of one or the other is limiting at some point. 

Look at Rhonda Rousey or Mike Tyson, as just quick examples.  Sure, they were elite athletes who did really well, but once the veneer of invincibility was peeled back and they suffered a truly disappointing loss, they were never the same.

On a much more "average joe" level, folks who are competitive but not resilient will tend to go 100% until they hit a snag of some kind, and then quit.  See it all the time in all manner of situations.


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## Steve (Mar 1, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> You're welcome.


Stop trolling.


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## DocWard (Mar 1, 2019)

Dirty Dog said:


> You're welcome.



In the future, I will give your thoughts and opinions the same worth I give those of others who regard themselves so highly.


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## Dirty Dog (Mar 1, 2019)

DocWard said:


> In the future, I will give your thoughts and opinions the same worth I give those of others who regard themselves so highly.



As I will yours, of course.


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## Headhunter (Mar 1, 2019)

At the end of the day with all this. If the worst thing that ever happens to you is you lose a sport fight....then I'm very envious of you


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## KenpoMaster805 (Apr 5, 2019)

You let your ego get the best of you thats why you got ko and shes girl calling her arch enemy is not right maybe shes your arch enemy because you have an attitude thats why she hates you sparring is sparring suck it up like man of course in sparring u gonna get hurt or even knock out maybe your hitting hard in sparring thats why she hits back harder


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## Buka (Apr 5, 2019)

In competitive fighting you should never take things personal. 

The OP, who's a young fighter, tells us - _Early in the fight I felt very confident and I managed to give her a really hard time. It came to a point I hit her hard a couple of times and she looked stunned and was noticeably slowing down. When I saw her like that I decided I had to KO her and recklessly started throwing everything I got at her. Next thing I knew, they were waking me up and asking me if I was alright. She knocked me out cold. They told me she hit me with two right hooks in a row that stunned me, then KOd me with a kick.
_
When you take things personally in the fight game and throw "everything you have at your opponent going for a knockout" bad things tend to happen. It's an old story, we've all seen it too many times to remember. In the grand scheme of things, not just in life, but in the fight game itself, I don't consider it a horrible loss_, _I consider it a lesson learned. Sounds like it from the OP's honest description of the match.
Strong emotion in competition tends to bleed into anger. Anger will slow you down, distort your sense of distance, interrupt your breathing, tire you and screw up your timing. But I suppose getting slowed down, having distorted distance, poor breathing and timing and tiring is a Horrible Loss - because it's easily avoided. Let's hope it's a lesson that will help the OP in the future.

Always remember, swinging for the fences in baseball is one thing, but in fighting the fences sometimes swing back.


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## paitingman (Apr 5, 2019)

Reassessing things after a shock like this is normal. You reassess your training, your methods, your motivations. 
Hopefully, it lets you get a good look at what is good and bad for you. 
It's normal to not feel so confident in this period of questioning things and owning up to mistakes.

My advice is to not dwell too hard on the loss itself. Learn your lessons, decide what direction you are going to take and keep training hard.

I would also advise you not to dwell on the advice of dudes here who can't even help but make fools of themselves on this very thread.


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