# Anyone practice with extendable steel batons?



## trevorama (Sep 6, 2006)

If so, in what ways have you had to adapt Arnis for its use?


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## Guro Harold (Sep 6, 2006)

There are numerous techniques that can be translated to the baton.

Simple deployment using the #5, #6, and #7 pokes. The stopping action of your checking hand deploys the baton.


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## Perpetual White Belt (Sep 6, 2006)

Yes I have and the only thing I've had to change is anything that requires you to flip the stick around so to speak.


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## trevorama (Sep 6, 2006)

Palusut said:


> There are numberous techniques that can be translated to the baton.
> 
> Simple deployment using the #5, #6, and #7 pokes. The stopping action of your checking hand deploys the baton.


 
Not sure if I understand this correctly. How does your checking hand deploy the baton? Usually I've found that a #1, #2, #8 or #9 striking motion is the quickest and most effective for deploying the baton quickly and safely.


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## trevorama (Sep 6, 2006)

Perpetual White Belt said:


> Yes I have and the only thing I've had to change is anything that requires you to flip the stick around so to speak.


 
What about Abaniko? For me, the weight of the baton makes that strike too slow and painful -- at least if it's done with the wrist flick.


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## Guro Harold (Sep 6, 2006)

trevorama said:


> Not sure if I understand this correctly. How does your checking hand deploy the baton? Usually I've found that a #1, #2, #8 or #9 striking motion is the quickest and most effective for deploying the baton quickly and safely.



When you execute the thrust and then check the wrist of the weapon hand, the resulting inertia causes the baton to deploy. The checking hand literally acts like a driver slamming the brakes on a car.

This is one of the reasons why I include the hand checks on the #5, #6, #7, #10, and #11. The hand checks also help to train counters to hyper-extensions and aids in not overextending the thrusts..


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## trevorama (Sep 7, 2006)

Palusut said:


> When you execute the thrust and then check the wrist of the weapon hand, the resulting inertia causes the baton to deploy. The checking hand literally acts like a driver slamming the brakes on a car.


 
Gotcha! Thanks for the clarification. I've just tested it out and it works like a charm.


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## Brian R. VanCise (Sep 7, 2006)

Really the only thing that is differant for me is the length my ASP is only 18" or 19" long.  That is the biggest differance.  The weight is negligle in my opinion.  The ASP also is very sturdy when locked out so you can still thrust with it. (though it could conceivably collapse)

A quality extendable baton is an excellent toll, just make sure that you are able to carry it legally in your area before you take it out of the house.


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## trevorama (Sep 7, 2006)

Ah, yes I'm using the 26" ASP and the extra weight is considerable. I'll investigate one of the shorter models.


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## Guro Harold (Sep 7, 2006)

trevorama said:


> Gotcha! Thanks for the clarification. I've just tested it out and it works like a charm.


 
Ok, now it time to up it notch...

Those self-checks correspond to the three general checks from an opponent, ie, the #5, #6, and #7 drill.


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## arnisandyz (Sep 7, 2006)

Good for going from corto to largo range in a hurry!

Easy to carry to class!

Good to use against they guy using acrylic sticks that tear up the rattan!


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## Brian R. VanCise (Sep 7, 2006)

arnisandyz said:


> Good to use against they guy using acrylic sticks that tear up the rattan!


 
Hey that guy is not still doing that is he?


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## Guro Harold (Sep 8, 2006)

Techniques in the he MA Weapon Retention thread can  be utilized with the extendable baton as well!


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## Guro Harold (Sep 8, 2006)

Cool locks and takedowns that can be incorporated with the extendable baton:
- Armbar
- Backward lock
- "Armpit leverage of pain"
- One finger lock lock, up and down positions.
- Un-natural armbar

For starters.


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## Tony Torre (Oct 2, 2006)

I train with and often carry a telescopic baton.  The one I carry is 26 inches.  My training stick is also 26 inches.  The weight isn't an issue since my training sticks are usually are usually pretty heavy.

Consider practicing deploying it.  Train in it as a transition from empty hands.  Also train in the use of the baton in the closed position like a pocket stick.

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com


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## Drac (Oct 2, 2006)

I carry and teach Monadnock's AutoLock baton..Also the expandable PR-24 ( tonfa)..


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## arnisador (Oct 2, 2006)

Tony Torre said:


> Also train in the use of the baton in the closed position like a pocket stick.



That's a heavy pocket stick!


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## Tony Torre (Oct 2, 2006)

Its lighter than my gun. :wink2:

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com


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## trevorama (Oct 2, 2006)

What are the most effective ways to use the collapsed baton ("pocket stick")?


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## arnisador (Oct 2, 2006)

There are all sorts of traditions of the short stick--Korean (_dan bong_), Japanese (_yawara_), Fiilipino (_dulo_), and more I'm sure, plus of course the tactical flashlight. There's also the Kubotan, and the Judge's Pen! There are many ways to do it.


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## Drac (Oct 2, 2006)

arni beat me to it...Dan-Bong techniques work real well with a close baton...


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## Guro Harold (Oct 2, 2006)

- Pressure point striking.
- Muscle/tendon/nerve pinching (Not that Spock stuff either).
- Joint/finger lock flows as well.


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## Tony Torre (Oct 3, 2006)

Heres a couple of ideas.  If the closed baton is in my rear hand I can use the butt to destroy his fist on any straight punches and follow up with a lead hand blow followed imediately with a downward hammering blow.  Repeat as necessary or until you can safely open the baton.  If the closed baton is in my lead hand I would use it for thrusting with the butt end much like I would with a knife held in reverse grip.  Of course open as soon as you can safely.  The dulo methods are great.  The monadnock course is excellent for a short course as well.

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com


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## trevorama (Oct 3, 2006)

Great information Tony and practical techniques -- thanks!


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## trevorama (Oct 3, 2006)

arnisador said:


> There are all sorts of traditions of the short stick--Korean (_dan bong_), Japanese (_yawara_), Fiilipino (_dulo_), and more I'm sure, plus of course the tactical flashlight. There's also the Kubotan, and the Judge's Pen! There are many ways to do it.


 
Thanks for all the leads Arnisador -- I can't wait to explore the different arts!


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## K Williams (Oct 8, 2006)

arnisador said:


> That's a heavy pocket stick!


 
The F16 ASP makes a perfect pocket stick when closed. My favorite size is the F21.


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