# Has anyone bought this ring?



## Satt (May 26, 2010)

I saw this ring on the interwebz and I was wondering if anyone has it and can tell me if it's as nice as it looks.

Here is the link...
http://www.bujinkanatl.com/category/Jewlery-7/rec/20

And the pic...


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## Drizzt (Nov 14, 2010)

I have not purchased this ring but I did train at the Atlanta Bujinkan Dojo with Bud Malmstrom for many years. He used to have that ring in the shop at the front of the Dojo. It is a very nice ring, 14k gold if I remember correctly. I believe Bud had them made by a local Atlanta jewelry shop. He's a great guy the ring will be worth it if thats what you are looking for.

Hope this helps.

Ric


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## Bruno@MT (Nov 14, 2010)

Ooooh look at my pinkie ring. I'm a NINJA! 
Given that for a ninja, remaining inconspicuous was essential, I think this ring indicates that whoever owns it is missing the point completely.


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## oaktree (Nov 14, 2010)

It is a nice ring. It has the Kanji Nin &#24525; on it. Nin means to endure in Chinese Hanzi it is read as Ren. Personally if I saw someone with a tattoo or ring with the Kanji Nin I would not associate Ninja with it just like I do not associate Wuxing &#20116;&#34892; tattoo or ring to mean that person does Xingyiquan.


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## Drizzt (Nov 15, 2010)

Some people don't ware things like this to give any outward impression of who they might be. Rather, to help themselves keep a higher ideal forefront in their minds, a guide or reminder if you will of the path they have chosen to walk. Something to help them stay focused on that higher purpose in their life.

Maybe Bruno should wear a ring to help him remember to learn compassion.


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## Chris Parker (Nov 15, 2010)

Really, son? For someone who's "Primary Art and Ranking" is "My own, Black", you may reconsider your approach here. Especially if you have a total of 2 posts, and choose to use the second to attack an established and respected member. Not sure how long your time here will be, as this is the "friendly" martial arts forum, and the mods don't tend to appreciate such personal attacks.

Just a friendly word.


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## Bruno@MT (Nov 15, 2010)

Last I checked, this is a ninjutsu related forum.
Stealth and inconspicuousness were of major importance to ninja.
So a heavy gold ring with the nin kanji would go against everything that a ninja was trying to achieve. You don't see Hatsumi sensei or Tanemura sensei wear outward symbols of their art, do you? And they have most certainly dedicated their entire life to that goal.


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## Carol (Nov 15, 2010)

Personally I do not think a raised design is a good idea.  The raised kanji will be more susceptible to scratches and damage.  In addition, such a thing could be uncomfortable to wear.  If your fingers brush against the design while going about your day, it may cause a bit of discomfort. Likewise when you are shaking someone's hand.


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## Cirdan (Nov 15, 2010)

Drizzt said:


> Maybe Bruno should wear a ring to help him remember to learn compassion.


 
Maybe you should stop making extra accounts just for trolling.


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## DuskB4Dawn (Nov 16, 2010)

wearing this would be like wearing a big sign on your back saying rob me please. 
shinobe is suppose to blend into the environment.


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## kungfu penguin (Nov 16, 2010)

i see a lot of guys who wear a cross and they are not christian by any meaning of the definition  i also know people who wear the cross to remind them of their walk with christ  the ring could just be a keepsake of remebering what is important in their life or maybe they just like the ring!  my 2 cents--tom


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 16, 2010)

oaktree said:


> It is a nice ring. It has the Kanji Nin &#24525; on it. Nin means to endure in Chinese Hanzi it is read as Ren. Personally if I saw someone with a tattoo or ring with the Kanji Nin I would not associate Ninja with it just like I do not associate Wuxing &#20116;&#34892; tattoo or ring to mean that person does Xingyiquan.


 
What about &#20116;&#34892;&#25331;


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## Bruno@MT (Nov 16, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> What about &#20116;&#34892;&#25331;



I have no idea what this means, but the kanji in Japanese would mean something like '5 step' something or '5 movements something'? Am I close?


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## Chris Parker (Nov 16, 2010)

Hey, Bruno,

The last character is "Ken" in Japanese ("Chuan" in Chinese), meaning "fist". It's found, for us, in Da KEN Taijutsu, for instance. The whole phrase is Wuxing Chuan in Chinese, I believe. If I'm wrong, I'm sure Xue will correct me.


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## Muawijhe (Nov 17, 2010)

DuskB4Dawn said:


> wearing this would be like wearing a big sign on your back saying rob me please.
> shinobe is suppose to blend into the environment.


 
As others have said, it is probably more as a keepsake to have in one's room. Or perhaps they are very proud of being a ninja.

Besides, they probably take if off during their ninja missions so they can blend in.

Then again, if they think they are a ninja and are going on "ninja missions" then they have some severe mental health issues to worry about first...


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 17, 2010)

Bruno@MT said:


> I have no idea what this means, but the kanji in Japanese would mean something like '5 step' something or '5 movements something'? Am I close?


 

It means Wuxingquan, which is 5 elements fist and directly associated with Xingyiquan, kind of a CMA, IMA inside joke. I was just being silly based on oaktree's post


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## oaktree (Nov 17, 2010)

> &#20116;&#34892;&#25331;


 
Well then that person would be a Taiji player :uhyeah:



> I have no idea what this means, but the kanji in Japanese would mean something like '5 step' something or '5 movements something'? Am I close?


 
Yes. &#20116;=five(see five lines) &#34892;=movement/phases &#25331;=fist


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## Kajowaraku (Nov 17, 2010)

oaktree said:


> &#20116;=five(see five lines) &#34892;=movement/phases &#25331;=fist


 
Not trying to nitpick here, but &#20116; is a four stroke character, not five. The downwards angle is one stroke. Ironically, the character for four (&#22235;) is actually a five stroke character. I'm afraid the correlation between stroke count and numeric value only holds if you don't count beyond three.

And to go back on topic. If got tons of T-shirts of taikai and other ninpo related events. Mostly i just wear them during keiko or related events, but sometimes i wear them on other special occasions too, like important exams or interviews. It helps me relax and it helps to keep me level-headed, somehow. I've got a few "pins" too, most don't have the nin character, but one (the nicest) actually does. It's the kind of thing you only wear on special gatherings, and it identifies you as an instructor even when in regular clothing. But you really need to get close or stare at it to make out the kanji.  Even than, most people don't have a clue what the kanji means, let alone what it looks like. Those in you immediate environment that do are probably already quite aware of who you are and where you train. It's a gold ring. I goes the OP would reserve it for special occasions, and not wear it for hunting ducks or digging latrines. Kanji belong to the realm of the exotic and the mystic for most people in the west. It looks kewl but they don't have a clue what they're looking at. In these days of pop-culture, wearing a t-shirt with popular ninjer-anime or movie iconagrafy can be a better disquise than denying any knowledge. It allows some minor slips in the cover and it will prevent people from taking you serious. So you see Bruno, real moders ninja need a good collection of powerranger shirts. (ok, dignity forbids it, but the point stands).


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 17, 2010)

Kajowaraku said:


> Not trying to nitpick here, but &#20116; is a four stroke character, not five. The downwards angle is one stroke. Ironically, the character for four (&#22235;) is actually a five stroke character. I'm afraid the correlation between stroke count and numeric value only holds if you don't count beyond three.


 
Don't want to nit pick here but &#20116; is a five stroke character in Chinese the means 5

&#20116;


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## Kajowaraku (Nov 17, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> Don't want to nit pick here but &#20116; is a five stroke character in Chinese the means 5
> 
> &#20116;


 
I know what it means, i know what it looks like and i know how it is written. In correct calligraphy it is only 4 (four) bushu. Not five. The middle horizonal stroke and the second vertical are ONE stroke. Obviously you *could* write it in five strokes, but that would not be correct calligraphy. 

Clearly you will disagree with me again, and this will go on forever, so for the sake of our fellow forumusers i suggest we don't turn this little discussion in a neverending debate on strokes. 

I guess i can at least get you to agree on the fact that my bike is a fourstroke.


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 17, 2010)

Kajowaraku said:


> I know what it means, i know what it looks like and i know how it is written. In correct calligraphy it is only 4 (four) bushu. Not five. The middle horizonal stroke and the second vertical are ONE stroke. Obviously you *could* write it in five strokes, but that would not be correct calligraphy.
> 
> Clearly you will disagree with me again, and this will go on forever, so for the sake of our fellow forumusers i suggest we don't turn this little discussion in a neverending debate on strokes.
> 
> I guess i can at least get you to agree on the fact that my bike is a fourstroke.


 
Clearly the only thing I will disagree with you about it the accusation that I will disagree with the stroke count a second time based on your assumption that I will do so and of course the mini lecture about forum etiquette was cute but unnecessary as well. Please in the future do not make such judgment calls when you have no basis to do so.

I had to check, which I should have done in the first place and I most certainly would have done this time prior to posting.... and I was mistaken it is 4 and you are correct... I was making one stroke 2. 

Please next time to not prejudge me, and make accusations you have no basis for, you do not know me... and next time I will check before I post thank you.

http://www.ehow.com/video_4402162_more-ways-write-number-5.html

http://www.motionelements.com/stock-animation/49799/chinese-word-5.html

And just cause I am a bit miffed at the monument, without know what your bike is I cannot agree that it is a four stroke, for all I know it could be a 2 stroke


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## oaktree (Nov 17, 2010)

> Not trying to nitpick here, but &#20116; is a four stroke character, not five. The downwards angle is one stroke. Ironically, the character for four (&#22235;) is actually a five stroke character. I'm afraid the correlation between stroke count and numeric value only holds if you don't count beyond three.


 Yes it written in 4 strokes. 

Its easier to remember it as 5 when you see it because it has five lines. To be fair the old way of five was written in 2 strokes &#13317;. You can think of &#21313; ten and ten side ways is &#13317; 5.

Some people remember it as 5 because the shape kinda of looks like a five. Other people remember it as five because there is 4 lines(counting 4 strokes) and a space in the middle as five.

When I remember 4 it looks like it makes a box with four sides. For 7&#19971; looks like a backwards 7.
8 does not have 8 strokes so the trick does not always work but in some cases it does.
For the word &#38376; I remember it looks like a gate.

Whatever helps you remember your hanzi/kanji


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## Kajowaraku (Nov 17, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> Clearly the only thing I will disagree with you about it the accusation that I will disagree with the stroke count a second time based on your assumption that I will do so and of course the mini lecture about forum etiquette was cute but unnecessary as well. Please in the future do not make such judgment calls when you have no basis to do so.


 
whoah. It seems the message got across differently than i intended. I by no means meant to lecture you on forum etiquette, however upon rereading my post I must admit I didn't formulate it all too well. I'm not a native English speaker and while that usually doesn't impair me all too much, it sometimes gets in the way of conveying the correct feeling when posting on a forum. Clearly I got it wrong here. There was an element of assumption (for which I apologise should it have offended you), but what i meant was: "we could go on about this sort of thing for a long time, while actually this thread is about a ring, not strokecounts." By the way, the reason i assumed you would stick to your point was because of the tone in your reply to my first post. to me it came across like you were saying "look at the hanzi you oaf. COUNT the lines". Clearly another case of linguistic misinterpretation on my part. I will watch more carefully where I put my assuming feet down in the future. 

The bike is a Suzuki SV1000. It, in fact, is an actual fourstroke.


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## Xue Sheng (Nov 18, 2010)

Kajowaraku said:


> whoah. It seems the message got across differently than i intended. I by no means meant to lecture you on forum etiquette, however upon rereading my post I must admit I didn't formulate it all too well. I'm not a native English speaker and while that usually doesn't impair me all too much, it sometimes gets in the way of conveying the correct feeling when posting on a forum. Clearly I got it wrong here. There was an element of assumption (for which I apologise should it have offended you), but what i meant was: "we could go on about this sort of thing for a long time, while actually this thread is about a ring, not strokecounts." By the way, the reason i assumed you would stick to your point was because of the tone in your reply to my first post. to me it came across like you were saying "look at the hanzi you oaf. COUNT the lines". Clearly another case of linguistic misinterpretation on my part. I will watch more carefully where I put my assuming feet down in the future.
> 
> The bike is a Suzuki SV1000. It, in fact, is an actual fourstroke.


 
No worries, sorry about my previous tone and I know nothing of Hanzi. All I know is the Chinese side of things and I have no idea what the Japanese do or how they count.

and, I agree your bike is a four stroke


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## Bruno@MT (Nov 18, 2010)

Xue Sheng said:


> and I have no idea what the Japanese do or how they count.



If different lines are drawn in the same motion without lifting the brush (or whatever you're writing with) then it counts as 1 stroke, regardless of how many lines were drawn.


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## Master Dan (Nov 18, 2010)

I will never buy any Jewerly online again with out seeing it or trusting the Jewler!

My wife and I bought wedding sets after reviewing alot of online rings and the company was called World Jewlers out of Hollywood CA. We got this impressive warranty and appraisal for more that we paid.

After wearing them my finger became infected so bad I had to have the ring cut off and it took 3 months for the finger to heal.

I contacted the company and they said oh by the way 24 carrot rings are made with a Canadian alloy called Yellow# 24? send them back and we will give you full credit to other rings? two years later we have no other rings or any compensation of any kind.

I have owned alot of rings never had one do that before?

I would want to see the ring or have a good understanding how it was made. Walmart, Fred Meyer Jeweler and other large discount chains are very good about quality and value.


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## Kajowaraku (Nov 18, 2010)

Bruno@MT said:


> If different lines are drawn in the same motion without lifting the brush (or whatever you're writing with) then it counts as 1 stroke, regardless of how many lines were drawn.


 
that too isn't neccesarily true, since cursive calligraphy tends to not or hardly lift the brush at all. Accents are laid by changes of speed and sometimes pressure (which would count as lifting or pushing, depending on the motion, obviously). Still, that would make it night impossible to index characters, so strokecounts and radicals are used to differentiate and classify. For example, look at hiragana, those are (essentially) cursive calligraphy of kanji. While katakana would resemble a more straight style. 

This is one of those rare occasions where wikipedia actually provides a useful illustration:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Hiragana_origin.svg

it shows how hiragana originated from certain kanji, trought cursive calligraphy, using less strokes to write the same. Truely fascinating languages, both Chinese as Japanese (and to a lesser extent: Korean). The way to understanding how both languages link is trough Wenyan and Kanbun, in my oppinion. But modern Japanese (or chinese) is probably more convenient to start studying. My knowledge of classical Korean is too limited to fairly compare, so i won't. What i'm saying is: time has a way of obscuring original meaning and turning one thing into another, like hiragana.

And back on topic:

I fully agree with masterdan. Spending money on a gold ring without actually seeing what you'll get or trying it on is probably not something I would do either. Apart from that, it's hard to maintain plausable denial if the police finds a few unconscious muggers with a negative of the nin kanji imprintend between their eyes. (i'm not a big fan of jewelry or ornaments, but that's just me).


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