# Blood



## Shadow Hunter (Jul 18, 2003)

Why is it that nobody in the knife fighting arena deals with the matter of blood?

Let's face it, when you deliver damage by means of a knife there is going to be a lot of blood all over the place. Because of how close knife fighting is, it gets all over everyone involved.

It throws off your footwork, interferes with your grip and marks you very visibly as a participent for the local law enforcement.

Yet no one seems to want to deal with it. I think it is because so few of the people who teach how to use a knife actually have done more than play in school with it. They have never seen a person bleed out, release his bowels, etc.

Yet I have seen guys talk about how after a knife fight you should not try to get the cops involved and walk away. As if a blood covered guy walking away from a fatal stabbing is not going to attract attention. 

I am not saying it can't be done, it happens every day. Some guy gets stabbed to death and the police can't find the killer. But the guys that do it are usually criminals very well experienced in getting away from the cops.

But it seems that no one who sells kinfe fighting courses deals with this simple reality.

I have done training while covered in various types of animal blood. How many people have trained in similar ways and how?


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## Touch Of Death (Jul 18, 2003)

The issue of blood has been dicussed in any knife class that Iv'e ever attended. Maybe you should get out more.


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## Shadow Hunter (Jul 18, 2003)

Discussed, yes. But have you trained for it? Have you ever seen it in a knife training video? Has enyone ever suggested you take some run off butchers blood and pour it over your hand to let you feel just how different the grip on your knife is?


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## Touch Of Death (Jul 18, 2003)

actualy yes, It has been suggested that I take advantage of any roadkill I come across with the fresher the kill the better. I know where your going with this line of questioning and yes I've been instructed to get as down and dirty as possible. I have yet to prey on dead animals but I may take it up one of these days. I'm still young.:deadhorse


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## Shadow Hunter (Jul 18, 2003)

Ooog!!

Don't go with road kill- you don't know what sort of parasites you may be picking up. Talk to a local butcher about gettting some blood. Make friends with people in a supermarket about getting some of their expired meat and tape it to a post while you practice grabbing and stabbing. Oh, and before you do that, get a set of clothes from the Salvation Army to wear during training and throw out afterwards. You might even want to put it on top of the meat.


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## Touch Of Death (Jul 18, 2003)

I said fesh and I wasn't talking about some racoon. I should have said dog or cat. Besides I get all my clothes from "value village" these days because the chemicals I work with eat them away at an alarming rate. Hey now there is an Idea! I could carry a spray bottle full of nitric acid. That could win a fight!


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## arnisador (Jul 18, 2003)

I've seen a Sayoc Kali instructor discuss it in some depth and have heard Dr. Gyi (Bando) address it as well. Less commonly I have heard FMA instructors address it.


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## Rich Parsons (Jul 19, 2003)

Yes, A long and drawn out knife fight can cause a proble wiyh the grip and footing.

Yes, it is possible to stab someone numerous times and for you to not know there is blood on you and that the opponent has been stabbed or cut. the opponent may not know either, until one or bothof you see of feel the blood. Then shock can set in. On both sides.


In stead of training in blood from the butcher, can you train in dish soap? It is slippery both on grip and footing. It  may be more expensive, yet I think easier to clean up.

So, have I ever trianed in blood? Nope? Have I used dish soap? Yes. Is it the same, obviously not. Your opinion?


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## OULobo (Jul 21, 2003)

A suggestion may be simply using water as a blood substitute. I know the consistancy is slightly different, but blood is majority water anyway and you get the benefit of training for a wet day. Rain makes weapon training very interesting. Before I get jumped on here, this is only a suggestion for grip purposes, not visibility issues or shock conditioning.


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## Cthulhu (Jul 21, 2003)

From what little I've seen, the Sayoc people do deal with the blood issue quite a bit.

Cthulhu


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## lost_tortoise (Aug 8, 2003)

Why Nitric?  Why not concentrate H2SO4?


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## Marcus Buonfiglio (Aug 10, 2003)

In the Combat Knife application that Mr. Pick (head of the UKF) teaches, blood flow control is a taught as one of the primary considerations of engagement. Mr. Pick's speakes of this from an expierenced perspective having been engaged in CQC while serving for our country. It is a very real aspect of combat that must be addressed for victory to be assured. I am not speaking about the aftermath of a knife engagement where it was stated "you have blood all over you while you are walking down the street" but during the encounter. It does you no good in a multiple attack scenerio to be blindes by arterial spray as a result of cutting the first combattent and still have to deal with others wishing to kill you.


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## Touch Of Death (Aug 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by lost_tortoise _
> *Why Nitric?  Why not concentrate H2SO4? *


Please talk 'merican.  I don't know that formula. The worst stuff we got besides syanide is this stuff called nitric hydrofloric. The hydrofloric will bond with the calcium in your blood stream and kill you dead even if you get blood transfusions to try to save you. I think the explosive potential of just the plain old nitric is enough to make me wonder why I work alone in a building that terrorists may target for supplies not to mention the meth heads. My freinds had a buddy that was killed last year for the batteries he sold (mini car race track). That makes me nervous because compared to that I'm sitting on a gold mine. I guess I'll keep training in Karate for that fatefull day.


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## lost_tortoise (Aug 11, 2003)

H2SO4=Sulfuric Acid


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## OULobo (Aug 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Touch'O'Death _
> *Please talk 'merican.  I don't know that formula. The worst stuff we got besides syanide is this stuff called nitric hydrofloric. The hydrofloric will bond with the calcium in your blood stream and kill you dead even if you get blood transfusions to try to save you. I think the explosive potential of just the plain old nitric is enough to make me wonder why I work alone in a building that terrorists may target for supplies not to mention the meth heads. My freinds had a buddy that was killed last year for the batteries he sold (mini car race track). That makes me nervous because compared to that I'm sitting on a gold mine. I guess I'll keep training in Karate for that fatefull day. *



Any halogen acid like hydrochloric (HCl), sulfuric (H2SO4), nitric (HNO2), or flouric (HF) pose only a threat in the varying degrees of their caustic nature. Flourine won't replace calcium, but it can bond with calcium. Calcium ions have a positive charge and halogens like flourine have a negative charge. Flourine is a fickle creature. It can help save your teeth, burn you, help in building nuclear weapons, help destroy the ozone layer, help make rubber or just poison you in quite a few different ways.


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## Touch Of Death (Aug 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by lost_tortoise _
> *H2SO4=Sulfuric Acid *


I thought I recognized those letters. Well to tell you the truth sulferic acid is way to thick to put in a spray bottle. yes it can be diluted with say... nitric, but why bother when you have pure nitric.


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## Touch Of Death (Aug 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by OULobo _
> *Any halogen acid like hydrochloric (HCl), sulfuric (H2SO4), nitric (HNO2), or flouric (HF) pose only a threat in the varying degrees of their caustic nature. Flourine won't replace calcium, but it can bond with calcium. Calcium ions have a positive charge and halogens like flourine have a negative charge. Flourine is a fickle creature. It can help save your teeth, burn you, help in building nuclear weapons, help destroy the ozone layer, help make rubber or just poison you in quite a few different ways. *


 Yes, hydrofloric with out nitric would be less evil.


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