# Damascus steel knife blanks



## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

Hi folks,

Pleas take a look at the link.  Does anyone have any thoughts about the quality of knives made with these kinds of blanks?  What are the thoughts on the 1095 and 15n20 Damascus combo?  Thx!

KnivesAndKnifeMaking.com - Hunting Knife Blank: Drop Point Damascus Knife Blank Blade Partial Tang with Brass Bolster Hunting Skinning Skinner


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## paitingman (Aug 7, 2018)

1095 and 15n20 make some great knives!

If you have bought from this guy before and like the stuff they sell then go for it.

That being said, imho, production knives and blanks are more often than not subpar in the quality department. With knives, and most things, you really do get what you pay for. It truly all depends on who it came from and what they did to it. I've come across absolute crap knives of all sorts of steel. 

I would just shoot an email and ask about the hardness and if there's info available on the treatments done to the steel. (the seller not being sure is a bad sign obv) 

I can say that texas knife makers sells a lot of blanks. My buddy has shown me some he's put a handle on and he's never had issues with the quality to my knowledge. I've only used them for handle supplies.
Either way I hope this helped and I'm sure you'll have some real fun with a project like this


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## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

paitingman said:


> 1095 and 15n20 make some great knives!
> 
> If you have bought from this guy before and like the stuff they sell then go for it.
> 
> ...


I’m not actually looking to make one, but this is good info if I decide to do that in the future.

I’ve seen a knife in a store that I kind of like, not sure the source nor the maker and the shop owner does not know much either. He gets them through a supplier somewhere. The blanks on that website seem similar to what is on that knife, it’s damascus with the same component steels.  So that is a good start, at least.

I realize that how the steel was treated makes a huge difference, and that is the great unknown in this case.  But at least the component steels used to make the Damascus are reputable.

Blade is something like 5-6 inches, with a fairly nice leather sheath, handle is stacked leather washers with a steel butt-plate.  Price is $180, which seems maybe high if the maker just bought the blank and slapped together a handle, but might be a good price if the maker created the Damascus and built it all himself and did quality work on the steel.


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## pdg (Aug 7, 2018)

Flying Crane said:


> Price is $180, which seems maybe high if the maker just bought the blank and slapped together a handle, but might be a good price if the maker created the Damascus and built it all himself and did quality work on the steel.



If the maker did all the work himself - and did it well - then that price is selling himself seriously short.


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## paitingman (Aug 7, 2018)

Flying Crane said:


> I’m not actually looking to make one, but this is good info if I decide to do that in the future.
> 
> I’ve seen a knife in a store that I kind of like, not sure the source nor the maker and the shop owner does not know much either. He gets them through a supplier somewhere. The blanks on that website seem similar to what is on that knife, it’s damascus with the same component steels.  So that is a good start, at least.
> 
> ...



I would bet that they are made from blanks. I've grown to be very wary of any damascus knives from unknown sources. 
Finding good fixed blades for a bargain is very difficult. It's one of my main gripes about knives. There's loads of really great folders for great prices, but fixed blades will make you put up big money, but it's usually worth it if it's worth it to you.


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## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

paitingman said:


> I would bet that they are made from blanks. I've grown to be very wary of any damascus knives from unknown sources.
> Finding good fixed blades for a bargain is very difficult. It's one of my main gripes about knives. There's loads of really great folders for great prices, but fixed blades will make you put up big money, but it's usually worth it if it's worth it to you.


Yeah, the more I think about it, the more certain I am that the “maker” simply bought a kit, put it together and sold it to a distributor.  If he had really make it from the ground-up, you can bet that his information would be included with it.  Given that, maybe I’ll order a kit and put it together, just for fun...


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## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

pdg said:


> If the maker did all the work himself - and did it well - then that price is selling himself seriously short.


I was thinking that as well.  It’s what made me immediately hesitate when I was looking at it.


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## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

So what do people think of D2 or 1095 steel all by itself, for a knife?  If I get a kit to put together for fun, those blanks are cheaper.  And of course it ultimately depends on how well the steel is treated, I do realize that.  So for the sake of discussion, let’s pretend they are well made and properly treated.


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## paitingman (Aug 7, 2018)

I have no knowledge of D2, but 1095 is great steel when treated properly.

Takes and holds a really good edge


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## Flying Crane (Aug 7, 2018)

paitingman said:


> I have no knowledge of D2, but 1095 is great steel when treated properly.
> 
> Takes and holds a really good edge


I appreciate the input.


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## frank raud (Aug 8, 2018)

Flying Crane said:


> So what do people think of D2 or 1095 steel all by itself, for a knife?  If I get a kit to put together for fun, those blanks are cheaper.  And of course it ultimately depends on how well the steel is treated, I do realize that.  So for the sake of discussion, let’s pretend they are well made and properly treated.


1095 is a good steel for knives, with the caveat that it is a high carbon steel, so rusts easily. Be prepared to clean it immediately after use, and to keep it oiled.


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## BrendanF (Aug 23, 2018)

What the others have said.  In addition, of the 10 series steels, 1075 is regarded as the easiest 'beginner steel' to heat treat.  But 1095 is a wonderful steel - I'm about to knock up some billets of 1095/15n20.

But really, all 10 series (the commonly used ones at least, 1075, 1080, 1084, 1095) and 15n20 (which is essentially just 1075 with nickel for contrast) are good beginner steels.  But so is O1, W2 etc.



paitingman said:


> I have no knowledge of D2, but 1095 is great steel when treated properly.
> 
> Takes and holds a really good edge



D2 is essentially 5160 - higher chromium tool steel.  Tough as nails.  Great steel, but not typically recommended for beginners.


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## Flying Crane (Aug 23, 2018)

BrendanF said:


> What the others have said.  In addition, of the 10 series steels, 1075 is regarded as the easiest 'beginner steel' to heat treat.  But 1095 is a wonderful steel - I'm about to knock up some billets of 1095/15n20.
> 
> But really, all 10 series (the commonly used ones at least, 1075, 1080, 1084, 1095) and 15n20 (which is essentially just 1075 with nickel for contrast) are good beginner steels.  But so is O1, W2 etc.
> 
> ...


What is the minimum carbon point recommended for a blade that is tough and can be properly treated to hold a good edge?


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## BrendanF (Aug 24, 2018)

Flying Crane said:


> What is the minimum carbon point recommended for a blade that is tough and can be properly treated to hold a good edge?



I would qualify my response by pointing out that I'm a beginner bladesmith -  don't rely on my information alone.  There are some fantastic online resources out there regarding smithing, and in particular around different steels and heat treating protocols.  Kevin Cashen is the man in this field - google him and you'll find a wealth of info.

That is not as simple a question as it appears, from what I understand.  The use of alloys such as chromium, vanadium, nickel etc has allowed for the development of a variety of steels with differing carbon points which behave in very different ways, with distinct heat treating characteristics.

In terms of simple carbon steels - of which the 10xx series are the typical examples, a 'high carbon' steel is needed in order to be able to harden to an adequate level to hold an edge.  Steels with .04% Carbon are known as 'mild steel' and won't harden sufficiently. .05%, .06% is about where the action starts, and as one increases carbon content obviously (theoretical) potential hardness increases, however brittleness does also.  For the unaware, the second number on the 10xx series indicates the carbon content - 1075 has .075%C, 1084 has .084%C etc.


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## BrendanF (Aug 24, 2018)

Apologies - I realised too late to edit - I have placed decimals incorrectly in my post above.

Carbon levels in high carbon steels are fractions of a percent.. not fractions of fractions of a percent.

ie - 1075 has 0.75%C.


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## kunetao (Oct 16, 2018)

If your just starting out with knife making and don't have kilns and such 1095 is the way to go .. 1. its CHEAP      2. easy to harden  3. Easy to temper.......... you could make a knife with nothing more than a file and a camp fire...... after its ground/files to desired shape sharpness get the blade edge red hot then throw in some used motor oil pull out after about a minute. Then clean it up check for cracks on the blade and straightness. let air cool the rest of the way ... check the edge with a file if it bites try again. at this point it is SUPER BRITTLE now you need to dial back the hardness a bit throw it in the oven at 400 and cook it for an hour take out and air cool then do it one more time. if it is a skinny knife or has a fine tip cook it a 3rd time.... if not you will break the tip.... when that happens in your head you will hear me say " I told you so"... but with that being said it will hold a RAZOR EDGE. I still have my first knife I made its my shop knife I've thrown it used it to chop I have even beat it with a hammer through wood like a splitter and it still going strong (had to redo the tip once but because I only tempered 1 time)..... 440c is about the same process but cost about 5x as much but is stainless...........


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## Dirty Dog (Oct 16, 2018)

kunetao said:


> If your just starting out with knife making and don't have kilns and such 1095 is the way to go .. 1. its CHEAP      2. easy to harden  3. Easy to temper..........



Even cheaper. Worn out files. Worn out saw blades. Old leaf springs.



> after its ground/files to desired shape sharpness get the blade edge red hot then throw in some used motor oil pull out after about a minute.



Please don't do this. It's far too flammable. I have always used water, brine, or cooking oil. I especially like the cooking oil. The temper is excellent, and it makes the workshop smell like you're baking cookies.


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## kunetao (Oct 16, 2018)

I would never use saw blades.... a lot of the newer blades have carbide tips for cutting and the rest of the saw is crap steel (as far as blades go anyhow) a file would be ok if you are forging... Leaf springs are good IF you have a good grinder and a forge as they tend to be HEAVY AND THICK (and curved)..  a 18 inch piece of 1095 is about 8 bucks well worth the price to know exactly what you are dealing with and at a thickness/size that is easy to deal with.  for the price of a happy meal you can afford a decent size piece 1095. I get mine from Jantz..... a 1/8 thick by 1.5 x18 inch is like 7 bucks


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## Dirty Dog (Oct 16, 2018)

kunetao said:


> I would never use saw blades.... a lot of the newer blades have carbide tips for cutting and the rest of the saw is crap steel (as far as blades go anyhow)



I should have been more clear. I'm talking sawmill blades. No carbide tips, and they really do make excellent blades.



> a file would be ok if you are forging...



I do. Forged blades are just better than stock removal.



> Leaf springs are good IF you have a good grinder and a forge as they tend to be HEAVY AND THICK (and curved)..



Again, I'm wasn't terribly clear. I love leaf springs. For swords, or quite large knives.

These are the sort of thing I am talking about. The large Templar-style sword is forged from a leaf spring. So is the English longsword. The rapiers are 1090. The daggers were mostly made from old files. The stiletto was made from an old, broken foil. The really big dagger/small sword (the designation on that one is debatable) is another leaf spring.


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## kunetao (Oct 16, 2018)

OK well we are on the same page but from his post it did not seem that he has a lot of tools. So a 1095 stock removal is a cheep fast reliable sharp blade...... but yea I have 3 leaf springs just waiting by my forge to be reborn


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## BrendanF (Oct 17, 2018)

Avoid using used motor oil to quench.  It produces toxic smoke, and offers no advantage over warmed high smoke point vegetable oils.  Buy a bottle of canola and warm to 50-60 degrees C.


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## kunetao (Oct 18, 2018)

This is my shop knife about 10 years old 1095 and razor sharp


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