# Kukkiwon Skip Dan Promotion



## terrylamar (Aug 24, 2008)

If I am reading the rules right, the Kukkiwon allows a Skip Dan Promotion of more than one rank.  Further a Skip Dan Promotion can only used once.  A Skip Dan Promotion to 5th Dan would require testing at the Kukkiwon itself.

Does anyone have experience with Skip Dan Promotions, especially with skipping more than one Dan at a time.

Has anyone tested at the Kukkiwon for 5th Dan and are you willing to share your experiences?


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## Laurentkd (Aug 25, 2008)

My first instructor took a bunch of people's money but never delivered the Kukkiwon certificates- including my 1st and 2nd.  After she closed the school over night  and left the country, my parents tracked down a near by Korean master who was at my 2nd degree testing.  He agreed to submit my paper work and when it came in it was a 2nd Dan (I was only 12 at the time) certificate.  I have no record of a 1st degree with the Kukkiwon, but it has never presented any problem (I now hold a 4th with the Kukkiwon).


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## YoungMan (Aug 25, 2008)

Two of our master instructors did this.
The first was our Grandmaster's original student who made 1st Dan at the organization's first Dan test. Some 25 years later, because all of his peers had gone on to master instructor, our GM used his pull with the Kukkiwon to get him promoted to 4th Dan. Very rare exception.
The other was one of our black belts who made 3rd Dan and then was in the Army for 10 years while his peers went on to master instructor. Because of his Army rank. our GM again used his Kukkiwon credibility to allow him to test for 5th Dan. Again, not something done very often.


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## terrylamar (Aug 25, 2008)

YoungMan said:


> Two of our master instructors did this.
> The first was our Grandmaster's original student who made 1st Dan at the organization's first Dan test. Some 25 years later, because all of his peers had gone on to master instructor, our GM used his pull with the Kukkiwon to get him promoted to 4th Dan. Very rare exception.
> The other was one of our black belts who made 3rd Dan and then was in the Army for 10 years while his peers went on to master instructor. Because of his Army rank. our GM again used his Kukkiwon credibility to allow him to test for 5th Dan. Again, not something done very often.


 
Did they have to go to the Kukkiwon to test?


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## Miles (Aug 25, 2008)

Not quite what you are inquiring about, but I processed a skip dan for a student who had a Kukkiwon 1st dan and necessary time-in-grade and training and level of expertise (IMO as instructor) to Kukkiwon 3rd dan.


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## terrylamar (Aug 25, 2008)

Miles said:


> Not quite what you are inquiring about, but I processed a skip dan for a student who had a Kukkiwon 1st dan and necessary time-in-grade and training and level of expertise (IMO as instructor) to Kukkiwon 3rd dan.


 
Yes, essetially what I am asking.  A 2nd Dan Kukkiwon to a 5th Dan Kukkiwon.  Time in Grade requirement is met, expertise is also met.  Extenuating circumstances.

I have read on the  USA Taekwondo's website that skip dan promotions to 5th Dan require testing at the Kukkiwon.  I have read the same thing on the Kukkiwon's website, although the English translation isn't perfectly clear.

I'm just trying to find out if this is true, if anyone has had or knows of someone who has had experience skipping more than one Dan at a time and what testing is like at the Kukkiwon.


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## YoungMan (Aug 25, 2008)

terrylamar said:


> Did they have to go to the Kukkiwon to test?


 
No. In fact, the gentleman who tested for 5th Dan tested alongside me when I tested for 4th Dan.


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## terryl965 (Aug 25, 2008)

To skip from 1st to anything higher than third you need to go directly to the Kukkiwon, anytime it is more than one rank it must be done there. When I tested for my fourth I could have went to sixth because of time in but did not see the extra expense in going for a test. Sure I could have gotten my fifth but I figure I wait another 16 years to test for that one I will only be 63.


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## terryl965 (Aug 25, 2008)

YoungMan said:


> No. In fact, the gentleman who tested for 5th Dan tested alongside me when I tested for 4th Dan.


 
If he was a third he can, the only time you need to go is when skipping more than one rank.


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## turtle (Aug 27, 2008)

I'm not sure about the testing at the Kukkiwon requirement, but I do know that it has become a lot harder to test for a skip dan than say 10 or 15 years ago.


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## terryl965 (Aug 27, 2008)

turtle said:


> I'm not sure about the testing at the Kukkiwon requirement, but I do know that it has become a lot harder to test for a skip dan than say 10 or 15 years ago.


 
The only time is when you are skipping two grades.


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## YoungMan (Aug 27, 2008)

As I said, the other gentleman went from 1st Dan to 4th Dan. And to my knowledge he did not go to the Kukkiwon to test.


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## terryl965 (Aug 27, 2008)

YoungMan said:


> As I said, the other gentleman went from 1st Dan to 4th Dan. And to my knowledge he did not go to the Kukkiwon to test.


 
Like I said that is very strange, the rules clearly state anything over one skip needs to be done at the Kukkiwon. I am glad he was able to get it done without going.


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## terrylamar (Aug 27, 2008)

terryl965 said:


> The only time is when you are skipping two grades.


 
And, I believe, promotions above 6th Dan.


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## YoungMan (Aug 28, 2008)

I think he was able to go from 3rd to 5th without going to the Kukkiwon because of my instructor's credibility. He has told us those are the only two times he used his credibility like that.


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## terryl965 (Aug 28, 2008)

YoungMan said:


> I think he was able to go from 3rd to 5th without going to the Kukkiwon because of my instructor's credibility. He has told us those are the only two times he used his credibility like that.


 
That is great and I hope he is in the arts for a long time.


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## turtle (Aug 29, 2008)

I know of a few people who were able to cross rank from 5th dan in another tkd organization to KKW 5th dan simply on the signature of a well-connected instructor. That probably isn't likely to happen anymore. 

I do know that the KKW is planning to hold special tests locally in countries with enough interest to skip dan promote people up to 3 ranks. Just got a letter about it today. Seems like they are trying to assess interest at this point on a country by country basis, so there were no definite plans included beyond a 2009 projected date.


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## terrylamar (Aug 29, 2008)

turtle said:


> I know of a few people who were able to cross rank from 5th dan in another tkd organization to KKW 5th dan simply on the signature of a well-connected instructor. That probably isn't likely to happen anymore.
> 
> I do know that the KKW is planning to hold special tests locally in countries with enough interest to skip dan promote people up to 3 ranks. Just got a letter about it today. Seems like they are trying to assess interest at this point on a country by country basis, so there were no definite plans included beyond a 2009 projected date.


 
turtle, 

Do you have any dates or locations for testing in the US?  Is there a source I can go to for this information, perhaps your website?


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## Laurentkd (Aug 29, 2008)

turtle said:


> I know of a few people who were able to cross rank from 5th dan in another tkd organization to KKW 5th dan simply on the signature of a well-connected instructor. That probably isn't likely to happen anymore.
> 
> I do know that the KKW is planning to hold special tests locally in countries with enough interest to skip dan promote people up to 3 ranks. Just got a letter about it today. Seems like they are trying to assess interest at this point on a country by country basis, so there were no definite plans included beyond a 2009 projected date.


 

Why would there be such a need to hold special tests to skip multiple ranks?


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## terrylamar (Aug 29, 2008)

Laurentkd said:


> Why would there be such a need to hold special tests to skip multiple ranks?


 
Attaining rank in other than WTF Taekwondo and switching styles.

Missing test for whatever reasons.


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## IcemanSK (Aug 29, 2008)

Laurentkd said:


> Why would there be such a need to hold special tests to skip multiple ranks?


 

Off the top of my head: 1) Say you have a KKW 1st Dan, & changed schools & ranked up in say the ITF. then you want to come back to the KKW after a number of years. 2) You were told that you had legit KKW rank past 1st Dan & it was found that your instructor never sent it in. You think you're a KKW 4th Dan, but you only have a 1st Dan.

Sorry, but "getting screwed" in the past was my 1st thought as to why someone might benefit from a special test like this.


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## Laurentkd (Aug 29, 2008)

IcemanSK said:


> Off the top of my head: 1) Say you have a KKW 1st Dan, & changed schools & ranked up in say the ITF. then you want to come back to the KKW after a number of years. 2) You were told that you had legit KKW rank past 1st Dan & it was found that your instructor never sent it in. You think you're a KKW 4th Dan, but you only have a 1st Dan.
> 
> Sorry, but "getting screwed" in the past was my 1st thought as to why someone might benefit from a special test like this.


 
Ahhh I didn't think about gaining rank in other federation and then wanting to transfer over to KKW. That makes sense.

I guess I didn't think "getting screwed" was all that common (although maybe I should have since it happened to me personally!)

I don't know, I still don't think it should be all that common though... I think easily attained rank is one of the misconceptions we have to fight from other styles. I just worry about making it so easy to skip degrees.


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## Brad Dunne (Aug 29, 2008)

What I have been told (it dosen't come from anyone special, but it makes sense), is that this is an offering, an olive branch if you will, mainly for the ITF folks, in hopes that it will generate the beginnings, of that rumored consolidation we have heard about. The problem with this is that the ITF folks, which branch I have no idea, want an equal crossover of rank, but this does not sit well with the high dans of the Kukkiwon. They would have to share those high ranks with their counterparts and they just don't want to it seems, otherwise it would have been a done deal right after Choi passed away and before the ITF split into 3 seperate factions. Just another observation for thoughts...........


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## IcemanSK (Aug 29, 2008)

A few years ago, there was an article in TKDTimes by a guy who was told for years that his instructor was sending in his KKW info after each test. Many years later it was found to not be true. It was his quest to get his actual KKW 4th Dan which he had tested for. It was not easy, as one could imagine.

I has a friend, a KKW 8th Dan, who bought a school from someone who told his students he was a KKW 9th Dan. As you can guess, he was not a 9th Dan....... but a 1st Dan! My friend became an instant hero to the BB's in his new school by being able to get them legit KKW rank.

There are tons of stories like this, sadly. I'm glad they are having a special test. Please post info on the when & where of the test.


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## terryl965 (Aug 29, 2008)

IcemanSK said:


> A few years ago, there was an article in TKDTimes by a guy who was told for years that his instructor was sending in his KKW info after each test. Many years later it was found to not be true. It was his quest to get his actual KKW 4th Dan which he had tested for. It was not easy, as one could imagine.
> 
> I has a friend, a KKW 8th Dan, who bought a school from someone who told his students he was a KKW 9th Dan. As you can guess, he was not a 9th Dan....... but a 1st Dan! My friend became an instant hero to the BB's in his new school by being able to get them legit KKW rank.
> 
> There are tons of stories like this, sadly. I'm glad they are having a special test. Please post info on the when & where of the test.


 

I agree some many people like myself was taken for a fool once by someone and it is a ***** to get it staighting out. Thank God for good people who knows you and your abilities.


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## Loomie (Aug 29, 2008)

Same thing happened to my Masters. Their instructor never sent in their paper work and disappeared with their money. They are 4th dans and could very likely be 7th or 8th dans. Not sure if they would be interested in testing at this point though, they are more into the giving back more than anything.


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## terryl965 (Aug 29, 2008)

Loomie said:


> Same thing happened to my Masters. Their instructor never sent in their paper work and disappeared with their money. They are 4th dans and could very likely be 7th or 8th dans. Not sure if they would be interested in testing at this point though, they are more into the giving back more than anything.


 
Great way to be.


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