# Do you practice outside of class?



## Badger1777 (Aug 17, 2014)

Hello all.

A couple of months ago, my son and I joined a new martial arts club. We're loving it, but we're not very good at it yet.

Here is a dilemma I face. Do we practice at home between classes or not?

Here's what I'm thinking.

On one hand, if we practice at home, then obviously that would generally be a good thing. BUT, as we're still total beginners, what we currently do will not be quite right. I'm worried that if we practice without the supervision of our instructor, all that will happen is we will perfect the art of doing it wrong.

Any thoughts?


----------



## donnaTKD (Aug 17, 2014)

i practice all the time outside of the gym --- it's the only way to get to grips with things 

also if you practice in front of a mirror then you can correct yourself so that when you next go to class then with a bit luck and a following wind it'll be good enough


----------



## tshadowchaser (Aug 17, 2014)

Home practice is always a good way to help learn.  Even if you get thngs a little wrong it can be corrected the next class but you will improve faster.


----------



## KydeX (Aug 17, 2014)

Practice at home. Just try to practice what you have been taught in class. Don't add stuff from other sources.


----------



## donald1 (Aug 17, 2014)

Don't worry,  I never seen a form done perfectly and i know certainly i never been perfect.  Mistakes are going to happen.  But with practice they can be better than they were before practice.  Focus on what your instructor has been getting on to you for.  If he/she says fix something that would be something to focus on while practicing at home.


----------



## jks9199 (Aug 17, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Hello all.
> 
> A couple of months ago, my son and I joined a new martial arts club. We're loving it, but we're not very good at it yet.
> 
> ...



Yes, practice at home.  Stick with what you've been taught, concentrate on replicating what you learned in class.  But you can also take it further.  For example, in the two hours of class I teach, I might have time to work a drill with one of our 9 punches.  I hope my students go home, and over the course of the week, take the drill through all 9 punches.  (Or however many they've learned if they haven't learned all 9 yet.)

Yes, you will practice some things "wrong."  Your teacher will correct you on this.  But you'll practice things "wrong" in class, too...  That's why you're learning!  And even instructors need to have outside eyes check them every once in a while, because things will drift off.


----------



## MJS (Aug 17, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Hello all.
> 
> A couple of months ago, my son and I joined a new martial arts club. We're loving it, but we're not very good at it yet.
> 
> ...



I'm assuming that your teacher is telling you and your son whether or not you're doing something wrong, so if they are, then I'm also assuming that they're telling you how to do it correctly as well?  Even if you only worked on a few things, that's better than nothing.  I would suggest taking notes.  Write down as many of the fine points as you can, so you have something to go by.  You might also see if your inst. would be willing to let you video them performing the material.  That way, you could have a visual when you're at home.


----------



## yak sao (Aug 17, 2014)

Yes, practice outside of class every chance you get. If you wait until you get it absolutely perfect then you will never train.
Besides, you're only learning on a surface level while in class. To truly learn something, you must ingrain it, which means going over and over and over the material.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Aug 17, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Do we practice at home between classes or not?


The following "true" story may give you some idea.

A Chinese tea shop owner (an old man) had one good skill but won't teach anybody outside of his family. A young boy wanted to learn that skill. The young boy went to that tea shop, provided free labor, and hope the old man might teach him. One and half year of time had passed. One day before the tea shop owner closed his shop, the old man said, "I know what you are up to. Now watch this and I'll only show you once." After he had done a 6 seconds short form, he then told the young boy never to come back again. That evening, the young boy grabbed his young brother, spent the entire evening to figure out the application in that 6 seconds material. Next morning, the boy took his young brother to the old man and performed the "application". The old man said, "You can demonstrate it, but can your "use" it?" 1 months later, there was a local tournament, the young boy used that move to win that tournament. The old man stood up from the audience and spend 3 hours explained the information in that 6 second short form. The old man and the young boy had established a good relationship since then.

If the young body didn't spend time at home to

- figure out the application from that 6 second "solo form" material,
- develop that skill, and be able to apply in tournament,

by using his young brother as his training partner, his relation with that old man would just stop right there. The young boy would end with just 6 second "solo form" from his one and half year of free labor.


----------



## Danny T (Aug 17, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Hello all.
> 
> Do we practice at home between classes or not?
> Any thoughts?



Only practice what you want to become good at. You will make mistakes. Making mistakes is good, learn from them. You will discover many things about yourself and your abilities. Self discovery is an amazing teacher, learn from it. Practice even if some is not correct, you will gain strength, balance, coordination, along a with an awesome bonding with your son. Yeah I strongly encourage you to practice.


----------



## Dirty Dog (Aug 18, 2014)

Class time is for instruction, not practice.


----------



## Kung Fu Wang (Aug 18, 2014)

Some people go to school to 

- "learn" and come home to "train". 
- "train" and come home to "rest".


----------



## Reedone816 (Aug 18, 2014)

train at home is better to makes you comfortable to the technique, then comes to class to check if your understanding is right or not, then fix it, continue it at home, and so on...
just like studying in school, you read the book again after class to understand more and put some question for future class...


----------



## Buka (Aug 18, 2014)

Dirty Dog said:


> Class time is for instruction, not practice.



That's a great answer, right there.


----------



## Badger1777 (Aug 20, 2014)

Thanks all. It seems to be unanimous, we train at home.

The reason for my question was that my son and I were struggling to master basic form number 1 from our club's style. I thought I'd finally cracked it, so I practiced and practiced in my garden, convinced myself I had it, then showed my son who was also struggling with it.

In the following lesson at the club, I started to do it along with everyone else, and it was noticed that I was doing the turns completely wrong. Now, 3 weeks on, my son is getting the whole form right except the turns.


----------



## jks9199 (Aug 20, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Thanks all. It seems to be unanimous, we train at home.
> 
> The reason for my question was that my son and I were struggling to master basic form number 1 from our club's style. I thought I'd finally cracked it, so I practiced and practiced in my garden, convinced myself I had it, then showed my son who was also struggling with it.
> 
> In the following lesson at the club, I started to do it along with everyone else, and it was noticed that I was doing the turns completely wrong. Now, 3 weeks on, my son is getting the whole form right except the turns.



That happens.  That'll sometimes happen even during class.  I've looked at everyone doing something that I just taught, and seeing multiple interpretations... which tells me that I simply need to re-teach it, because I didn't get it across properly.  I've worked my butt off to learn something for months -- and met with the person teaching me, only to discover that I got major parts wrong or out of sequence.

It happens.  The plus is that, through the practice, you can fix the parts that went off.  It's like you're writing a word with an ie combination... instead of having to get the whole word right, you just have to fix that part.  (Not the best analogy, I hope it's clearer than it seems.)  If you wait 'til you have it absolutely perfect and correct to practice, you'll never succeed in learning it...


----------



## ks - learning to fly (Aug 20, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Thanks all. It seems to be unanimous, we train at home.
> 
> The reason for my question was that my son and I were struggling to master basic form number 1 from our club's style. I thought I'd finally cracked it, so I practiced and practiced in my garden, convinced myself I had it, then showed my son who was also struggling with it.
> 
> In the following lesson at the club, I started to do it along with everyone else, and it was noticed that I was doing the turns completely wrong. Now, 3 weeks on, my son is getting the whole form right except the turns.



Train in class

Practice at home

When I practice at home - and I have been since I started - I work on small pieces of material..example, the turns in your form: for a couple nights - just work on the turns and then try incorporating the steps with the turns...it took me 3 weeks to get Basic 1 form - but when it 'clicked', I woke up at 3 am and did it in my pajamas!


----------



## Buka (Aug 20, 2014)

We do Martial Arts, that's just what we do. How do you not think of it outside of class? I don't mean all the time, or even most of the time, I mean when it just jumps into your head from one trigger or another. Like none of us have ever been walking across a room and suddenly had that urge to....whatever, just for the fun of it. Or have been watching TV and seen something in a fight scene that we know wasn't realistic, but we happen to like the way they shot it. Or seen a couple of people interacting in a stressful situation that might end up in a scuffle - and start looking for cues. Next thing you know you're doing things at home that are usually reserved for class, looking for that spare hour to do more, but not usually finding it. Ah, but when you do...nice! It's inevitable, we're screwed.


----------



## Dirty Dog (Aug 20, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Thanks all. It seems to be unanimous, we train at home.
> 
> The reason for my question was that my son and I were struggling to master basic form number 1 from our club's style. I thought I'd finally cracked it, so I practiced and practiced in my garden, convinced myself I had it, then showed my son who was also struggling with it.
> 
> In the following lesson at the club, I started to do it along with everyone else, and it was noticed that I was doing the turns completely wrong. Now, 3 weeks on, my son is getting the whole form right except the turns.



Do you know what the single most common mistake is for new students learning our Basic form 1?
Turning the wrong way.
Do you know what the second most common mistake is?
Thinking you know the form. You don't. Mostly because as you learn more, your understanding of the form will (or at least, *should*) change, and you'll perform it differently. We require students to learn Basic 1 before they can wear a uniform. To move to yellow belt (9th geup) they have to perform the Basic 1, 2 and 3. The way they perform it to get their uniform and the way they perform it for their 9th geup promotion will not be the same. Grossly the same, yes, but the details (which are what really matter) will change constantly.

So relax about it. Practice as best you can when you're at home, and trust that your instructor(s) will make corrections in class.

This is also one place where books and videos are useful. While the consensus position (with which I agree) is that you're really not going to be able to learn from a book, you can certainly use one as a reference to check which way you're supposed to be turning. Just make sure the book matches the program you're in. The way we do Basic 1 in our Moo Duk Kwan Tae Kwon Do program may or may not match the way you do it in whatever system you're studying, especially in the fine details. So ask your instructor(s) for guidance before using any supplemental books or videos.


----------



## Dirty Dog (Aug 20, 2014)

ks - learning to fly said:


> Train in class
> 
> Practice at home
> 
> When I practice at home - and I have been since I started - I work on small pieces of material..example, the turns in your form: for a couple nights - just work on the turns and then try incorporating the steps with the turns...it took me 3 weeks to get Basic 1 form - but when it 'clicked', I woke up at 3 am and did it in my pajamas!



This is excellent practice. I've said about a bazzilion times that the best way to improve your forms is to stop practicing them.
Focus on the individual techniques or combinations that seem the most difficult to you.
Forms are, at their root, a bunch of techniques strung together. If you improve the individual techniques, the form will improve. And if you focus on just the areas that you're struggling with, they will improve faster than if you practice the entire form.


----------



## PhotonGuy (Aug 22, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Hello all.
> 
> A couple of months ago, my son and I joined a new martial arts club. We're loving it, but we're not very good at it yet.
> 
> ...



As beginners its fine to do some practice at home and as a matter of fact, on my first day I was told to practice the techniques I was taught at home. However, you don't want to overdo it. At home you don't have a sensei to watch over you so you can develop bad habits without knowing it. So, I would recommend maybe doing a total of a hundred repetitions of every technique you've been taught, in between classes. As a beginner you probably haven't been taught too many techniques yet, just the basics. So lets say you were taught the front kick on wednesday and your next class is on friday. You could do maybe thirty front kicks at home after class, forty on thursday, and then another thirty on friday before class. That way if you do develop bad habits your instructors can correct them in time.


----------



## Shai Hulud (Nov 10, 2014)

Definitely! 

The beauty of pre-set/pre-rehearsed forms (katas, pumse's, etc.) is that you can practice them on your own, and then have your instructor correct or follow up on your progress the next time you show up in class.  I highly recommend drilling those until they're second nature to you, and you can "perform them in your sleep", so to speak. 

Power to you and your son! 

Ally


----------



## crazydiamond (Nov 12, 2014)

Yes I do. My school provides a curriculum. My outside school work includes

Reading - books and web and web videos. Don't discount the mind work.

Video instruction - I have collected videos (DVDs), and also created private youtube collections of videos that match (mostly) my schools cicutlumn. I also recently bought some online training from my schools teachers. I practice to these in front of the TV at home.

Heavy bag at home - do contact punching, trapping and kicks.


----------



## Elbowgrease (Nov 19, 2014)

I think you should practice at home. Although what specifically you should practice is none of my business. "The real players are made in the off season..." I think it doesn't even get interesting until you find yourself coming up with new combinations to open, move through and close a door (maybe that's why all of the doors in my house are busted). If you are standing, you have an opportinuty to practice stances. If you are moving, you have an opportunity to practice moving. Some things might not be terribly obvious, but the more time you spend practicing, the more often you might find yourself using things you practiced in entirely un-martial ways(?). When it comes down to it, isn't that really the point. If you find that it's something you want to do for the rest of your life, you have to come up with a way to use it that isn't going to injure you so that you can continue to do it until you're 90. That's the beauty of art. It isn't ever over.


----------



## tshadowchaser (Nov 19, 2014)

As one gets older if they stay in the arts I think that they will practice in the privacy of their minds as much as they practice where others will see them.
Sometimes it is almost a constant almost process that you do not realize is happening. At other times it is the reevaluation of techniques, people, other arts, even philosophy of founders. Sometime it just questions about everything including why you chose the arts you study.


----------



## zzj (Nov 19, 2014)

Curse the price of real estate in my part of the world, I have hardly any space to practise my forms at home without knocking into the coffee table or tv. I don't really like to practise at the small park next to my apartment block cos all of all the funny looks I would get; the only time I feel slightly less self conscious doing it is when this weird guy walks circles around a tree in the same park. (well, not weird, I gather he is a Baguazhang guy but it just looks weird to others)


----------



## Elbowgrease (Nov 19, 2014)

I really don't have the space at home inside to move either. I'm lucky in that I got a key to my gym, so I can go in and practice as much as I can handle. I really can't stand trying to practice in front of innocent bystanders. I do like using doors, though. It's kind of limited, but you can get a bit out of it. Push it one way, catch it and pull it back the other way, practice sticking to it, open it, move through it and close it without losing contact, etc. I never learned how to use a wooden dummy, but I try to approach it with what I think is the same kind of idea. Like I said, all the doors in my house are busted.


----------



## Rich Parsons (Nov 19, 2014)

Badger1777 said:


> Thanks all. It seems to be unanimous, we train at home.
> 
> The reason for my question was that my son and I were struggling to master basic form number 1 from our club's style. I thought I'd finally cracked it, so I practiced and practiced in my garden, convinced myself I had it, then showed my son who was also struggling with it.
> 
> In the following lesson at the club, I started to do it along with everyone else, and it was noticed that I was doing the turns completely wrong. Now, 3 weeks on, my son is getting the whole form right except the turns.



Badger, 

I know I am late to this discussion with you. When my students mess up as they say and learn different turns or strikes / blocks, I smile and tell them they went and did the advanced version. So think of that as a different form and just re-learn the form you were trying to learn. Of course this time around it should be easier as you have a lot of the pieces.


----------



## Rich Parsons (Nov 19, 2014)

zzj said:


> Curse the price of real estate in my part of the world, I have hardly any space to practise my forms at home without knocking into the coffee table or tv. I don't really like to practise at the small park next to my apartment block cos all of all the funny looks I would get; the only time I feel slightly less self conscious doing it is when this weird guy walks circles around a tree in the same park. (well, not weird, I gather he is a Baguazhang guy but it just looks weird to others)




zzj,

One can still practice and shorten up stances and steps so that you do it all in the same 3 foot / 1 meter square area. This might seem more advanced approached then the original posters comments, and it may not allow full work on all turns or lunges and or stances. The idea is to practice the movements and then when you can make it to the park or where ever put all the small pieces together into your set of motions of form or kata or *insert name here*.


----------



## zzj (Nov 19, 2014)

Rich Parsons said:


> zzj,
> 
> One can still practice and shorten up stances and steps so that you do it all in the same 3 foot / 1 meter square area. This might seem more advanced approached then the original posters comments, and it may not allow full work on all turns or lunges and or stances. The idea is to practice the movements and then when you can make it to the park or where ever put all the small pieces together into your set of motions of form or kata or *insert name here*.



I do shorten some stances and take steps back when necessary in order to do my form at home, however, that would ultimately be a compromise that is only good enough for purposes of memorizing the form. As you have pointed out, at home I would try to memorize the form and work on specific movements but I would still practice in the park despite being self-conscious, just that I don't do it as much as I probably should. Maybe I should learn from that Bagua guy, he is totally oblivious to onlookers and just keeps walking those circles around a small tree.


----------



## Dylan9d (Nov 20, 2014)

For my system Ilmu Buka BelaDiri im teaching a friend of mine the basics now at home, when he is at a certain level ill start teaching in public again.

So yes i only train privately.


----------



## MuayThai1987 (Nov 21, 2014)

I practice only my stamina outside a gym, it´s "dangerous" to practice technics at home, because on my opinion it´s really easy to do sth wrong, so then you have to learn from the beginning one more time.. sorry for my english, i´m from germany ^^


----------



## donald1 (Nov 21, 2014)

MuayThai1987 said:


> I practice only my stamina outside a gym, it´s "dangerous" to practice technics at home, because on my opinion it´s really easy to do sth wrong, so then you have to learn from the beginning one more time.. sorry for my english, i´m from germany ^^


Don't worry,  your English is fine 

While to a certain degree i do agree but in some ways not completely.  This might be just my opinion but along with techniques there should be careful.  I might be wrong but if taught correctly and practiced carefully it is safe to practice at home.  Maybe there are some things you shouldn't do at home but there are plenty ways to practice martial arts at home 
Best of luck


----------



## Cirdan (Nov 21, 2014)

We got the keys to the dojo so me and some other equally fanatic students train several hours outside of class every week. We also often show up early and stay after class if possible to practice and stretch even more.

To the OP I`d advice beginners to practice stuff they have already been instructed in and not move on to new stuff (and certainly not copy youtube vids unless your instructor told you about a good one to study).


----------

