# KFM or The Keysi Fighting Method



## Rocco

Hi All
I work long hours and sometimes find it difficult to get to a regular class so just wanted to ask what you all think of KFM.
I know there is no comparison between training with a partner and a real instructor, but the at home over the internet  training has peaked my interest as I would be able to fit it in, but really? Can at home training really be any good at all? I've done some research on the internet, and on the whole the reviews seem to be pretty good, but before I part with my hard earned cash I'd really like to know an un-biased opinion on it.
Thanks very much indeed for any replies!


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## Chris Parker

The standard response is that it is really not good for anything other than a refresher/reference. However I notice that you state that it is "difficult to get to a regular class". Does that mean that you are attending a school, and this is to make up the time inbetween when you can attend? If so, ask your instructor as to whether or not there is a good reference for what they're giving you. If this is just because you consider it too much of a hassle to attend classes irregularly, and want to do the DVD thing instead, well, then we get back to "it's really not good".


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## Cyriacus

It really depends what You want. If You think Youre going to learn, and supplement Your Training with Videos, Youre wrong. If You just want to absorb some theoretical information, go for it.
But You ultimately cannot learn effectively from a Video or DVD, of any kind.
All You can learn, soundly, is Theory.
Practice at Home, what You have been taught in Training. Things like KFM will get reviews based on their content, and the validity of it. Its kinda like if I said "Punching people in the head with Your Arm like this works". Id be correct. I could probably write an instructional about it. People have done similar things. It doesnt mean Youd be able to do it all of a sudden, even if You practiced it daily, because if You are doing something wrong, theres noone there to tell You. You could be doing something too much, or too little. Or You could be too tense, or too loose. Youd just end up with bad habits.
If what Youre after is to learn some Theory, again, that will work. Just dont expect to gain capabilities from it. I can learn Boxing Combinations from a DVD or Book. But I already know how to Box. If I tried to learn how to Box from a Book, that would just be silly, and probably wouldnt amount to much more than not haymaking as early on, and probably being a bit fitter. In short, Id be better off with a Gym Membership.

Sorry about the long reply, but this type of question is asked alot around here. And I can only hope You arent doing what so many others have done, and asked the question seeking confirmation and positives. But since You wanted an Unbiased Opinion, there it is.
I can link You to a few other similar Threads, so You can see many others say all the same stuff as I just did, if You like.

In short;
You cant learn how to Fight/A Martial Art/Self Defense from a DVD.
You can learn alot of Information from a DVD.
You can find equally good stuff to learn from on Youtube, frankly.

And theres what Chris said above. There may be a more suitable reference tool for Your particular System.


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## K-man

Personally, it doesn't appeal to me.  They have a slick production on their website which doesn't say a lot.  If they say they are into Hollywood stunts it rings more alarm bells.  Then they have "Deckem and Reckem" to get you up to speed to compete with the Gracies or Anderson Silva ..  I don't think so.

Apart from anything else, you need a training partner or partners.   :asian:


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## Chris Parker

Well, Keysi really only has it's fame due to it's usage in the current crop of Batman films... the founders are martial artists and stunt people..... but I wasn't going there initially!


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## Cyriacus

Chris Parker said:


> Well, Keysi really only has it's fame due to it's usage in the current crop of Batman films... the founders are martial artists and stunt people..... but I wasn't going there initially!



If I recall correctly, isnt it comprised mostly of Hammerfisting people?


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## Chris Parker

Lots of elbows, twisting the spine, odd angles, and hammerfists, yeah. Just watch a Batman film and you're watching Keysi (not Ninjutsu, despite the first one.... ha!).


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## Cyriacus

Sounds about right for a Batman film. Im not sure where I stand with it on a personal opinion level. I always thought Batman Films looked a touch weird in their Choreographing. If the Choreo was with this Keysi, Im not impressed frankly  No offense to them. Im basing this off of Batman films. But from a preview of them I saw on Youtube, I suspect theyre forgetting that Your hands can get hurt if You use the backs of them to block Punches.


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## Chris Parker

Hmm, not quite sure what you mean by "blocking with the back of your hands" there... Keysi doesn't really have much in the way of blocking methods from what I've seen, it's more evasion and covers. And the cover is really just a variation of the "Crazy Monkey Boxing" one, just applied with a less practical approach. I was kinda trying to avoid turning this thread into a "bash Keysi" one, but to be frank, there are a large number of problems that I see with the system itself, mainly stemming from the founders thinking through what they think it should be, to the point where they add a "salute" which has really little relevance to the system itself, because they thought a "demonstration of respect" was a part of it being a martial art... I'm really not impressed with it myself.


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## jks9199

I was working with someone last weekend, trying to find/develop a "language" for movement.  One thing he brought up, that I really liked, was a great breakdown about what it takes to learn, which does a nice job of pointing out the flaw in video learning.  First, you need an image of what you're supposed to be doing.  For a physical skill, this has to be a 3-dimensional image; you have to see it, and do it.  You need an external coach, who provides that image, and who critiques you to lead you to match & then refine that image.  Finally, you need to develop your internal coach so that you can correct yourself and match yourself to your image.  Video learning has 2 out of 3, but without that external coach to look at you and to shape that image for you -- you're going to get stuck and miss things.


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## Cyriacus

Chris Parker said:


> Hmm, not quite sure what you mean by "blocking with the back of your hands" there... Keysi doesn't really have much in the way of blocking methods from what I've seen, it's more evasion and covers. And the cover is really just a variation of the "Crazy Monkey Boxing" one, just applied with a less practical approach. I was kinda trying to avoid turning this thread into a "bash Keysi" one, but to be frank, there are a large number of problems that I see with the system itself, mainly stemming from the founders thinking through what they think it should be, to the point where they add a "salute" which has really little relevance to the system itself, because they thought a "demonstration of respect" was a part of it being a martial art... I'm really not impressed with it myself.


What I saw was covering the head with the palms clasping the top of the head, and open hands. I kept thinking that being hit in the back of the hands would be terribly dumb.


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## Chris Parker

Their aim is more like a boxing compression cover, where the blow is taken on the forearms (with the elbows extended to hopefully have the bad guy punch onto them, injuring themselves). The hands clasping seems to be more to ensure that the arms are in close enough, as well as adding some cushioning effect to your head, should it be hit. Gotta say, though, I'm not fond of it, as it leaves the front open, and the cushioning is of little effect, other than stopping the bad guy breaking their own hands on the thickest plates of bone in your body... hmm.


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## Cyriacus

Yeah, Im sure in idealism land the enemy will just continuously punch Your jutting Elbows and forearms, especially when you lean over. Im pretty sure in Reality Land Theyre not going to just throw the same punch at Your Elbows all day long. Id argue that a Boxing Helmet Guard is possibly superior.


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## Rocco

Thanks everyone for your replies, some interesting points there. Perhaps I was falling for the marketing hype. I do quite like the look of the striking tho, any other Arts that could be recommended?


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## Cyriacus

Rocco said:


> Thanks everyone for your replies, some interesting points there. Perhaps I was falling for the marketing hype. I do quite like the look of the striking tho, any other Arts that could be recommended?



How do You mean?
You cant fig a round peg into a square hole - Or rather, You cannot learn from DVDs or Books unless its just as reference material for practicing what Youre actually Training in.
Or are You looking into other Systems altogether?


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## Chris Parker

Rocco said:


> Thanks everyone for your replies, some interesting points there. Perhaps I was falling for the marketing hype. I do quite like the look of the striking tho, any other Arts that could be recommended?



For looks? Not that I'd ever want to recommend as a martial art.


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