# Is Ninjutsu Real??



## InvisibleFist (Jan 14, 2005)

My apologies if this is a FAQ, but I've searched the net and gotten no good answer.  

 I've heard several authorites say that Ninjutsu is a made up style, based on 19th and twentieth century pop-cultural legends of the "ninja".  That the "ninja" as such never existed...that there was no secret clan of invincible assasins with spiritual powers. 

 If that is in fact the case, where did the style come from?


----------



## ShadowKnight (Jan 14, 2005)

Im no history expert but im pretty sure there where ninja. I doubt they where like how they are mostly portrayed in the movies though. I suppose you could compare them to our special forces like Navy Seals, British SAS and so on. They where just highly trained experts who didnt exist on any sort of paper trail. 

 They probably didnt wear any flashy black ninja outfit like so often show in cinema but just some worn dark clothing and possibly a mask to cover their identity. 

 As for the spiritual powers, thats just fiction. Running on walls, maybe a couple steps IF they are REALLY good. Ive seen videos of a french "Street Climber" who can do some really amazing acrobatic stuff. There are some videos of him jumping from a 2 story climbing wall, running on walls, jumping from roof to roof. 

 In short, ninjas most likely did exist but probably not in the sense that Americans basterdized them like so many other things.


----------



## Bester (Jan 15, 2005)

Short version:
Yes

Medium Version:
Ignore verified frauds, storytellers and con artists like Ashida Kim, Frank Dux, Robert Bussey, Rick Tew and HaHa Lung. They are 'Hollywood' without any real historical tie-in.

Look at information by people like Stephen Hayes, Dr. Hatsumi, and Richard Van Donk for example, who have legitimate ties to a tradition dating back several centuries.


----------



## dubljay (Jan 15, 2005)

ShadowKnight said:
			
		

> As for the spiritual powers, thats just fiction. Running on walls, maybe a couple steps IF they are REALLY good. Ive seen videos of a french "Street Climber" who can do some really amazing acrobatic stuff. There are some videos of him jumping from a 2 story climbing wall, running on walls, jumping from roof to roof.
> 
> In short, ninjas most likely did exist but probably not in the sense that Americans basterdized them like so many other things.


 
 here is a thread based on that person i belive 
http://martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17432&highlight=chan+spiderman+jackie


----------



## jibran (Jan 15, 2005)

Ninjutsu is not real. It is fradulent and spelled wrong. Ninjitsu, on the other hand, is an actual art with great masters like Frank Dux, Ashida Kim, and Rick Tew; it is also spelled correctly.


----------



## Dale Seago (Jan 15, 2005)

InvisibleFist said:
			
		

> I've heard several authorites say that Ninjutsu is a made up style, based on 19th and twentieth century pop-cultural legends of the "ninja".



If it's not from one of the so-called "X-Kans", then it almost certainly is.



> That the "ninja" as such never existed...that there was no secret clan of invincible assasins with spiritual powers.



Now that statement, going strictly on the precise wording you used, is true. 



> If that is in fact the case, where did the style come from?



Here are a couple of bits from one of Hatsumi sensei's books, translated into English by Michael Asuncion. Even though (or perhaps even because) they're from a "children's" book, I think they're particularly appropriate to what you're asking and they may shed some light on your question:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mza/UM_articles_content.html#7

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mza/UM_articles_content.html#8


----------



## tshadowchaser (Jan 15, 2005)

It is as true as any martial art to come out of Japan or China.  It can be traced and its headmasters can be traced (to a point). It may have changed over the years but what art hasn't. 
Now finding a ligit teacher and not someone who just calls what he dose Ninjutsu is another matter.


----------



## MA-Caver (Jan 15, 2005)

Bester said:
			
		

> Short version:
> Yes
> 
> Medium Version:
> ...





			
				jibran said:
			
		

> Ninjutsu is not real. It is fradulent and spelled wrong. Ninjitsu, on the other hand, is an actual art with *great masters* like Frank Dux, Ashida Kim, and Rick Tew; it is also spelled correctly.



..Ok, so who do we believe here? Which of you two is telling the truth? It's very confusing to those who wish to know and to have their questions answered as accurately as possible.  Will the real Ninjas please stand up? 

Ninjutsu/Ninjitsu however it's spelled; IMO is a legitimate martial art but the HYPE that goes around them (via hollywood) is just pure  :bs:


----------



## Kreth (Jan 16, 2005)

Jibran was attempting to be funny, I believe. Ninjitsu is the spelling used by Kim, Dux, and other frauds...

Jeff


----------



## Bester (Jan 16, 2005)

jibran said:
			
		

> Ninjutsu is not real. It is fradulent and spelled wrong. Ninjitsu, on the other hand, is an actual art with great masters like Frank Dux, Ashida Kim, and Rick Tew; it is also spelled correctly.


 :rofl: Remember, all you need to know about martial arts, you too can learn playing "Power Ranger" in your back yard like "Sensei" Screw-Yew-Tew and Soke-on-a-Rope Frank "Daffy" Dux.

 As to Ashida....Shhhh...he may already be here...someone check the closet and see if he is ready to come out.


 :rofl:


 Poof-cough-gag-stumble
 I pass out!
 -thid-.


----------



## jibran (Jan 16, 2005)

MACaver said:
			
		

> ..Ok, so who do we believe here? Which of you two is telling the truth?


 Bester is; I was being sarcastic (hence the smileys).


----------



## MA-Caver (Jan 16, 2005)

jibran said:
			
		

> > Originally Posted by MACaver
> > ..Ok, so who do we believe here? Which of you two is telling the truth?
> 
> 
> Bester is; I was being sarcastic (hence the smileys).


Well okay then... sheesh... :lol: 

A while back I mentioned that I had a friend that was taking up Ninjutsu and he was telling me about how they're able to do this, do that and all that. No, I wasn't taken in by any of it. I knew that it was a legitimate martial art but the stuff of being able to make a weird hand sign and vanish only to re-appear behind your opponent and blending "through" (not with) a tree for camoflague... aww man plueeezzee  His list went on and on. And, I was soooo privaledge because he "trusted" me not to be repeating this.  Makes me shake in my boots thinking that he might be reading this and will appear to me on one dark night for breaking the vow:ninja: .  
About four or five months later we meet up again and I ask him how's his study going. He says that he's a black belt. He said that the art is different because they advance more rapidly based on personal skill and motivation to learn by studying hours and days of it. Again I bit my cheeks to keep from laughing in his face. After all he was "totally serious."  He's a good friend man, you just don't dis on some b.s. that he's laying on you because he sincerely believes it. 
Makes me wonder the guy he's learning from isn't chuckling to himself while enroute to the bank.   

It must be hard to find a serious instructor that will show the *REAL* stuff when you got all this hype tossed out by Hollywood and crap that's out there. Sigh. 
Good luck to you guys that *are* studying the *REAL* art.


----------



## Kreth (Jan 16, 2005)

MACaver said:
			
		

> A while back I mentioned that I had a friend that was taking up Ninjutsu and he was telling me about how they're able to do this, do that and all that. No, I wasn't taken in by any of it. I knew that it was a legitimate martial art but the stuff of being able to make a weird hand sign and vanish only to re-appear behind your opponent and blending "through" (not with) a tree for camoflague... aww man plueeezzee  His list went on and on. And, I was soooo privaledge because he "trusted" me not to be repeating this.  Makes me shake in my boots thinking that he might be reading this and will appear to me on one dark night for breaking the vow:ninja: .


It amazes me that these frauds can attract students. It sounds like your friend was mixed up with one of the Ashida Kim types. They focus on the esoteric at the expense of getting on the tatami. 



> It must be hard to find a serious instructor that will show the *REAL* stuff when you got all this hype tossed out by Hollywood and crap that's out there. Sigh.
> Good luck to you guys that *are* studying the *REAL* art.


I know I was a bit skeptical when I found my first instructor. I'd read some of Hayes' stuff, and seen Kim's silly books, and my first thought when I read an ad in the local paper promising "authentic ninjutsu" was "Yeah, right!" Luckily, he turned out to be one of the good guys...

Jeff


----------



## Cryozombie (Jan 16, 2005)

MACaver said:
			
		

> It must be hard to find a serious instructor that will show the *REAL* stuff when you got all this hype tossed out by Hollywood and crap that's out there. Sigh.
> Good luck to you guys that *are* studying the *REAL* art.


 Not hard at all... there are whole lists like the one at www.winjutsu.com , you just have to be willing to look and research so some film-flam man doesnt do a ninja-pickpocket routine on your wallet.


----------



## Kreth (Jan 16, 2005)

Technopunk said:
			
		

> Not hard at all... there are whole lists like the one at www.winjutsu.com , you just have to be willing to look and research so some film-flam man doesnt do a ninja-pickpocket routine on your wallet.


Unfortunately, the frauds seem to target the younger crowd. Sure, you and I can point out how silly their lineage claims or techniques are, but a young person can be suckered in by the Hollywood aspect.

Jeff


----------



## Elizium (Jan 23, 2005)

One book I read in a bookstore was of Kim's "let us all be ninj3rz" type of book.  It was making perfect sense until page 16 when he turned round and said to concentrate on the muscles on your ***.  By keeping them clenched, you can live longer.  I then got a PC and Internet connection and stole his book of a P2P downloader. :idunno: 

But ninjas did not exist.  The people did, the word did not.  Try Shinobi instead.  It is more fun to learn the history of Shinobi than ninja.


----------



## Bester (Jan 24, 2005)

Hey, I played Shinobi at the arcades in the 80's.

Oh wait, you mean a different Shinobi.  Sorry. :ninja:


----------



## Elizium (Jan 24, 2005)

Bester said:
			
		

> Hey, I played Shinobi at the arcades in the 80's.
> 
> Oh wait, you mean a different Shinobi. Sorry. :ninja:


That's the one.


----------



## Cryozombie (Feb 18, 2005)

*MOD NOTE

The Same Post is Posted Multiple times in all 3 Forums of Ninjutsu. I am removing all but the first post.  Please be aware that this type of cross-posting is against the rules of the Forum.

-TECHNOPUNK
-MT MODERATOR
*


----------



## Bester (Feb 18, 2005)

Actually, I did see in the rules that upto 3 cross posts were allowed for posts that fit.

 Of course, Mr. Tews "Marital Science" system has nothing to do with the forus of this forum (Traditional Ninjutsu) as Mr. Tew and his followers have stated repeatedly that what they do is NOT a traditional system.  In fact, by posting here as he did, it was little more than SPAM, which clearly indicates his "Quality".

 The following threads in the Horror Stories forum (where the frauds are) will clearly define Mr. Tew and his "System" as well as indicate what type of "person" follows him.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19028
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19505
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19191

 Perhaps since he has finally decided to grace us with his experience, he will visit those threads and answer the questions that his customers, err, I'm sorry, his "students" could not?

 Otherwise, please "Morph" somewhere else. :rofl:

 Thank you TechnoPunk for "taking out the Trash". :asian:


----------



## Cryozombie (Feb 18, 2005)

There were more than Three Duplicate posts, and in each case they had little to do with the topic, which is why they were removed.


----------



## bignick (Feb 19, 2005)

Are Ninja's real?

We'll never know for sure...they're too good at sneaking around to ever find one...


----------



## Skankatron Ltd (Feb 19, 2005)

Elizium said:
			
		

> But ninjas did not exist. The people did, the word did not. Try Shinobi instead. It is more fun to learn the history of Shinobi than ninja.


 I beleive the word ninja has chinese roots (this is what my chinese teacher says). The japanese kanji for 'ninja' corresponds to "person of endurance" in meaning and is pronounced ren zhe (which is pretty much ja). Renja, ninja; they're pretty close.
 I'll give ninja's this, grappling hooks and those boots they wear (tabbis) are fricken sweet. I have a pair of boots, but they don't fit 
 Grappling hook works though.


----------



## Grey Eyed Bandit (Feb 19, 2005)

I saw a janitor wear tabi boots while in Japan...he must have been a real ninja.:2xBird2:


----------



## Kizaru (Feb 19, 2005)

> Is Ninjutsu Real??


Of course not, it's all an illusion.


----------



## Whitebelt (Feb 19, 2005)

Sadly there are only a few REAL Ninjas left because it is so hard to qualify as a REAL Ninja and also it's very hard to find a hardcore Ninjitsu schools with masters.


----------



## Elizium (Feb 19, 2005)

Whitebelt said:
			
		

> Sadly there are only a few REAL Ninjas left because it is so hard to qualify as a REAL Ninja and also it's very hard to find a hardcore Ninjitsu schools with masters.


Whats ninjisu?  I always thought it was ninjutsu.  Maybe that is why we can not find them, we have all spelled it wrong and it has fallen off the radar :whip:


----------



## Skankatron Ltd (Feb 20, 2005)

Whitebelt said:
			
		

> Sadly there are only a few REAL Ninjas left because it is so hard to qualify as a REAL Ninja and also it's very hard to find a hardcore Ninjitsu schools with masters.


 And they're invisible. Wow ninjas are amazing.


----------



## blood shadow (Dec 31, 2007)

nah ninjas are fake now the real ones are long gone and live only in story books.


----------



## kagemaru74 (Jan 24, 2008)

This is my Truth!
Ninja doesn't exist!
But it's the term is new, the old one was shinobi or better known as grass!
I Don t remebmere japanese word!
Anyay i Trrain in bujinkan!
I wear its suit and i like it!
I Don t wanna look other truth, because the truth is your not of someone else!
Just looking at our heart, anyone has his personal motives to train!
So good training anybody, anyway you chocie!
Kage


----------

