# WT Training



## Nabakatsu (Dec 17, 2008)

Hi all, not sure if my initial introduction thread is still here or if it's moved, it appears to be here, but I was told it was moved, so I'm not sure! either way.. I'd like to go over some of the things I have been doing and to see if anyone has any suggestions...
Brief Brief history if you missed my initial thread, I just started ebmas WT about 7 weeks ago.. and yeah thats about it 
So! I have been doing the following daily for past couple of weeks
SNT for roughly an hour, in one big chunk, and than a few times after that during the day, Been doing triangle push ups usually in sets of 10-20 a couple times a day, sometimes I'll take a day off if my arms are hurting too much tho 
Been doing this set of 3 kicks side to middle to other side, for 1 set, in sets of 20, 3 times per leg a day.. and than i've been working on my stepping using adduction about 30 mns a day. oh yeah, and I've been pushing my palm upside down against a wall trying to enable palm strikes from that position eventually, this has not seemed to increase my flexibility at all, and i've been doing it in like 3-4 2 mn segments for a couple weeks.. not sure if there is a better way to be doing this.. so yeah! if anyone has any suggestions of other things I could be doing, or possible ways to improve the quality of what i'm doing I would appreciate it! I've also been watching a lot of instructional videos and fights.. even watched the prodigal son a good 20 times and warriors two a couple times too! (can't wait for the new one with donnie yen!) 
        Naba


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 17, 2008)

Sounds like your really devoted!  Your doing a good job.
Work your stance and footwork as much as posible, chain punch for as long as you can keep your arms up.  Enjoy the teaching, stick with it, the good stuff will come.


----------



## paulus (Dec 17, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> I have been doing the following daily for past couple of weeks
> SNT for roughly an hour, in one big chunk, and than a few times after that during the day


I think for someone only 7 weeks in, what you're doing with SNT is really good. I'd stick with that for now. I wish I had 1 hour to devote to SNT each day!

Also, if you're looking for advice regarding your training, your sifu is probably the best (and safest) person to ask first.


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 17, 2008)

Its good that you are devoted to your training Nabakatsu , but make sure you don't burn yourself out . 
I have seen this phenomenon before when people joined up , they would be obsessed with it and set themselves punishing training regimes in a vain attempt to be as good as other students in the school that had been training for years , they would keep it up for a little while and then leave 

 You have to be in this thing for the long haul , in the early stages improvement is made in leaps and bounds after a few years it seems that you have reached a plateau and sometimes you might even feel you are going backwards . 

It is during these times that you have to dig deep and keep yourself consistantly training . All I'm saying is that you should pace yourself a little bit , once the novelty wears off you might begin to see training as a chore and begin to hate it . 

Gaining skill in Wing Chun is a slow process sort of like a sculptor chipping away on a massive block of stone , every day the sculptor chips away a little more and more , until after many years a beautiful statue is revealed .


----------



## paulus (Dec 17, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> I have been doing the following daily for past couple of weeks
> SNT for roughly an hour, in one big chunk


Sorry Naba, it's obvious I'm fixated on your SNT practice, but can I ask how you work this? How long does each SNT last?

At the moment, each one I do lasts around 20 minutes. I feel like I could go on longer, but at the same time, I really can feel the benefit from those 20 mins.


----------



## yak sao (Dec 17, 2008)

Your work ethic is admirable and an inspiration, but keep in mind that mastering WT is a marathon and not a sprint. 
Your sifu Emin is an incredible martial artist and he will take you far, but keep in mind he's been studying WT for 28 years. So while he is definetly someone to emulate, you won't get there overnight. 

I guess what I'm trying to say is don't be so wrapped up in your destination that you miss out on the journey.

Good luck.


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 17, 2008)

Have you seen the movie..Descendants of Wing Chun and the Movie Wing Chun with Michelle Yeoh. Thats a great movie...




Nabakatsu said:


> Hi all, not sure if my initial introduction thread is still here or if it's moved, it appears to be here, but I was told it was moved, so I'm not sure! either way.. I'd like to go over some of the things I have been doing and to see if anyone has any suggestions...
> Brief Brief history if you missed my initial thread, I just started ebmas WT about 7 weeks ago.. and yeah thats about it
> So! I have been doing the following daily for past couple of weeks
> SNT for roughly an hour, in one big chunk, and than a few times after that during the day, Been doing triangle push ups usually in sets of 10-20 a couple times a day, sometimes I'll take a day off if my arms are hurting too much tho
> ...


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 17, 2008)

To si-je, That sounds perfect for what I need to be doing, I gassed out tonight in class so easily when we were doing punching drills, Too many triangular push ups and not enough stanima chain punching! What good is power if you can't use it? I also asked my Sifu like.. 20 questions and figured out how to improve my stance, I feel my footwork is doing pretty good, because Thats what was the hardest for me at first, so I really trained it hard for a few weeks.. but I will continue, It could be a lot faster, thats for sure! Thanks for your words of encouragement and good advice!

To mook jong man, I feel like I've gone back and forth between being burnt out and not, but I'm a very stubborn person, and the underlying fact (at least how I see it, hopefully i'm not too deluded) is that I have martial arts in my soul, and I never really acted on it until now, so I feel like I have a lot of catching up to do, and yeah, I am kind of trying to catch up the whole world in this respect, I think your advise comes from deep understanding and I admire your ability to see so clearly. I think i'm going to train even harder actually, lol.. I have such huge ambitions, I feel like my stubborn side will help keep me in it, even if I begin to hate it, but I have a love of love and deep wisdom stored within me as well, and I can look at things concerning myself from outside of myself, for the most part, altho I don't always act on it, but I'm getting better at that too!
Thanks for your words of wisdom, they are quite appreciated!

To paulus, I have been doing various differant SNT's sometimes I go really slow, sometimes as fast as I can.. sometimes as hard as I can.. but usually I just do it, or try to do it, like we do it in class, pretty quickly, but accurate and true to the prinicipals as far as I have witnessed, Typically I just set an alarm for an hour and than practice until it goes off, but during the day I just feel like doing it, and will do it than as well, usually like we do it in class. the ones In class I would venture a guess as to say it lasts about 2-4 minnutes roughly. Thanks for kind words, good advice in regards to asking my sifu, and also sharing your own practice with me!


To yak sau, I appreciate your kind words and your insightful way of looking at things, like I said in my above post, I feel like I have so much to catch up on, it probably would be good for me to slow down, and it's quite plausible I will sooner or later, but I think for now, I'm going to continue to push myself, so long as it doesn't feel like it's becoming too much. Thanks for the luck, I may just well need it 


To yoshiyahu, I have seen both, it doesn't appear that the movie with michelle yeoh they actually are using a whole lot of wing chun, but that doesn't make it any less enjoyable to watch! A couple of my favorites include Shaolin temple strikes back from ninja theatre, fist of legend, jet li's remake.. the timeless classic shaolin master killer, aka 36 chambers of shaolin.. I'm actually really fond of the progidal son as well.. I'm sure I could go on and on, but those are some of the ones I've watched well over 50 times lol


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 17, 2008)

Actually. Michelle Yeoh is using alot Wing Chun. It appears because she does high kicks that she is not using Wing Chun but her principles are all the same. Defend the centre line, Use their force against them, flow, Attack their structure and center line, punish their guards and structure. etc etc. Actually My lineage reminds me much of the movie Wing Chun and the Prodigal son. Remember in the movie wing chun where she is on a table fighting. Classic table fighting scene. But as for the other actors. No they were using Wing Chun just Michelle Yeoh. Many people say she isn't using Wing Chun but if you simply slow down the dvd and scrutinize what she is doing you will see it is wing chun very much soo. On another forum I gave a long analyiticall anaylsis of her wing chun scenes. But I will spare you that here.

But simply analyse her moves...you will see its all wing chun in principle...

But advice to you would never stop seeking ways to make your WC better. always strive for what benefits you from running to jumping rope to build up your stamina. Chain punches trains your abilitiy to punch. In about three months you should be able to throw one thousand chain punches a day. But just because you can throw a thousand chain punches doesn't mean your stamina is going to better than your Average ground fighter who runs three miles a day. Also the way you practice Sil Lim Tao is similiar to what my Sifu told me to do. He said do it slow with softness. Than medium that fast. I usually do it hard with snap when I go a medium speed. An fast I use more of flow. As for punching drills. Also do the punching drills at home on your own every day along with more push ups. The more you do this the stronger your body gets. I also like to do punches and push ups in between this trains the power and stamina at the same time for punching. Your power will increase greatly. With out power your chain punches are useless even if you have stamina. Your sifu is wise. My Sifu had us do so much before we even got to punch. That by the time we had to punch into our arms fell off it was actually like a break.

In my Wing Chun class we had to 
lift bricks
push ups on bricks
hold jars filled with water out to our sides(Eagle claw hold)
torque a metal pipe
hold traditional horse stances and Arrow stances
Hold hanging horse 
each stance like two minutes each
Hold YGKYM for like five to ten minutes
Do Chi Kung exercises 

Then finally the punch routines. 

Then after that steps.

Then kicks

Then chi sao

Then sparring...

Wow i am tired just thinking about it.






Nabakatsu said:


> To si-je, That sounds perfect for what I need to be doing, I gassed out tonight in class so easily when we were doing punching drills, Too many triangular push ups and not enough stanima chain punching! What good is power if you can't use it? I also asked my Sifu like.. 20 questions and figured out how to improve my stance, I feel my footwork is doing pretty good, because Thats what was the hardest for me at first, so I really trained it hard for a few weeks.. but I will continue, It could be a lot faster, thats for sure! Thanks for your words of encouragement and good advice!
> 
> To mook jong man, I feel like I've gone back and forth between being burnt out and not, but I'm a very stubborn person, and the underlying fact (at least how I see it, hopefully i'm not too deluded) is that I have martial arts in my soul, and I never really acted on it until now, so I feel like I have a lot of catching up to do, and yeah, I am kind of trying to catch up the whole world in this respect, I think your advise comes from deep understanding and I admire your ability to see so clearly. I think i'm going to train even harder actually, lol.. I have such huge ambitions, I feel like my stubborn side will help keep me in it, even if I begin to hate it, but I have a love of love and deep wisdom stored within me as well, and I can look at things concerning myself from outside of myself, for the most part, altho I don't always act on it, but I'm getting better at that too!
> Thanks for your words of wisdom, they are quite appreciated!
> ...


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 18, 2008)

Wasn't the wing chun different when the nun and Yim wing chun did it back then?  I thought it changed with her husband adding the weapons, and exposure to the chinese opera?

Oh, make sure you relax in every movement.  You've got to learn to be loose before the power.  The power you see on videos will come with relaxation, speed, and flow.

Only stance muscles should be flexed and tight.  Upper body stays totally relaxed, shoulders, arms, neck. 
Tense up only at the moment you actually hit target. (mainly your fist clenches and upper back/shoulder blade muscles flex.) 
  Don't tense fists when punching, you will be able to punch longer.  (espectially if punching in air)  If arms and fists are lose you'll punch longer and faster by being relaxed.  Your stamina in this will build, time yourself to see how long you can punch in the air and then go longer and push yourself to keep punching even if your punching slower because your tired.  
Keep upper body still when punching.  Don't move shoulders, stance.  Only arms, like a rock 'em sock 'em robot toy.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 18, 2008)

Thanks for your replys,
To yoshiyahu, I think my potential misconceptions lie in that when I watched it the first time around I hadn't really internalized as many of the concepts as I have now, The main thing I remember was flourishing flowery hand movements, and it seemed to go against the concept of economy of motion, I will take a look at it later when I can find my copy and try to keep and open mind!
Your advice about training seems quite sound, my arms are already aching thinking about doing 1000 punches followed by push ups! Maybe I'll start running too, at least when the 20 feet of snow has subsided a little, it sounds like your sifu trained you guys hard! thats awesome, thanks for your reply!

To si-je, you have a good point regarding the wing chun movie, I certainly failed to make that potential connection, well said! 
I've managed to get the general idea of relaxing with my movements/strikes now, after doing it so much flexing I finally pieced it together, "release yourself from your own force" I thought I had understood, lol.. nothing like a bizillion punches to open your eyes eh?
Thats a good idea regarding timing and continuing to push the legnth I do this for, thanks for your reply! Rock'em sock'emmm Rock'em sock'emmmm yeahhhhhhhh!


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 18, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> Thanks for your replys,
> To yoshiyahu, I think my potential misconceptions lie in that when I watched it the first time around I hadn't really internalized as many of the concepts as I have now, The main thing I remember was flourishing flowery hand movements, and it seemed to go against the concept of economy of motion, I will take a look at it later when I can find my copy and try to keep and open mind!
> Your advice about training seems quite sound, my arms are already aching thinking about doing 1000 punches followed by push ups! Maybe I'll start running too, at least when the 20 feet of snow has subsided a little, it sounds like your sifu trained you guys hard! thats awesome, thanks for your reply!
> 
> ...


 
Its okay to punch in the air , but you need to do impact training as well and if you are planning on doing a lot of training at home it would be a good idea to get a wallbag , that will really speed up your progress .

 But I don't know your situation , you might be living in a rented apartment or something where the neighbours won't appreciate some dude thumping the wall bag all night long , maybe you could stick it on a tree outside.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 18, 2008)

This is actually a great idea, I didn't even think of such a possibility, I used to have a punching bag up in my garage but I ended up cutting a whole thru it and sticking my three section staff into it to practice blocking and what not.. long story short it's no longer a punching bag..
either way tho.. it's like -20 outside.. not my cup o tea.. a wall bag would be great.. thanks for the suggestion!


----------



## qwksilver61 (Dec 18, 2008)

I hope this tidbit helps;I started with the traditional Wing Tsun under my direct Dei Si-Hing being Steve Brandon of the Wing Tsun discipline.Years later I found Wing Tzun taught out of Miami beach,I didn't know what to expect in fact I was even skeptical,coming out of a traditional school.Sifu Emin the top fighter and direct student of Sifu,now GM Kieth Kernspecht (GGM Leung Ting Wing Tsun)branches off to form his own style of the same system.Agressive right off the bat.My advice to you,keep doing what you are doing,drop the push ups altogether,load up on chain punches,and wall bag exercises,pay attention especially to your delivery....if you rock back you are defeating the purpose.Smack the bag repititiously,slow accurate..speed.... then Power.it is likened to the end of a whip...in the future add the turnstile...incoming force...the ride you get from  energy coming towards you and there you have it...ride the lightning!
Second if all,keep up your efforts do not get discouraged,most important...*do not be anxious*.SNT is part meditation...be CALM! When my arms contacted Sifu Emins He was TOTALLY and Completely relaxed,however exhibited flexible* power*.7 mos. is nothing more than scratching the surface.Stick to it and try to understand without..anxiety or what's next..you dig? What is common I find are people who want to be skilled pugilists at an instant...yes it does take time to cultivate and to release and trust that this will eventually work for you given time.Take care......


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 18, 2008)

Well Nabakatsu you are right about the fancy hand movements. Thats because its a movie...So movies are going to having flying in the air and over dramatization of skills and actual techniques. But many of the basic Techniques are hidden with in those flowery movements. I don't know. When I first saw the movie was in the 90's I was at a friends house who was named Fieshun. He was Chinese. I don't know if his Father did Wing Chun or not. But Fieshun's little sister certainly had a excellent Tan Sao. I learn alot from that five year old girl when I was in high school. It was amazing that she was able to Tan sau our hands down. An she had the technique really good.

But I analyse the girls moves to a Tee. Its because alot of what she was doing I saw before from watching my Sifu or Uncle or Big brother spar. So its pretty cool. I remember one time My Sidai had question my Sifu about Wing Chun working. My sifu told him to defend. With in like three seconds my Sidai was hit ten times and the last blows were two elbows to his chin. He had no time to defend. When he said he was ready two seconds later he was hit ten times. I was like wow. I need that on video tape. What the hell just happen. I need to watch it over and over again. My Sifu is rather short man. My Sidai was like 5'11 or 6 foot. and Muscular build. So it was incredible to see someone younger and bigger just standing there like in the movies with hands down by his sides getting hit. 


But your right she could have done those same moves with out the flowery technique. But now and days I don't even see the fancy movements I just see Pak Sau, Tan Sau bong sau, Tan da fok Sau, Fok Da, Bong Da, Pak Da,Kwun Sau, Jut sau, etc etc.




Nabakatsu said:


> Thanks for your replys,
> To yoshiyahu, I think my potential misconceptions lie in that when I watched it the first time around I hadn't really internalized as many of the concepts as I have now, The main thing I remember was flourishing flowery hand movements, and it seemed to go against the concept of economy of motion, I will take a look at it later when I can find my copy and try to keep and open mind!
> Your advice about training seems quite sound, my arms are already aching thinking about doing 1000 punches followed by push ups! Maybe I'll start running too, at least when the 20 feet of snow has subsided a little, it sounds like your sifu trained you guys hard! thats awesome, thanks for your reply!
> 
> ...


----------



## qwksilver61 (Dec 18, 2008)

It is not so much  how you look as it is where your arms seek and controlling the centerline under pressure..trust...it took me a while to get it....don't fight it...clearly evident when performing Chi sau or any two man sets...you will tire easily ( of course consider working muscle groups that are not accustomed to labor) FLEXIBLE force;clear precise accurate movements...skill....speed.... then RELAXED power! trust yourself and be confident!......stick to the format...perfect your skill....do not be anxious...then build speed....only after perfecting your skill move to speed.When we do any thing at speed it becomes grossly exagerated.... give it time,benefit,then you can control chaos........


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 18, 2008)

Yes Quicksliver. Practicing Slowly, Accuratley and relax will definitely increase your skill.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 19, 2008)

Thanks for your responses, 
To qwksilver61: I have a few questions, firstly may I ask why you suggest dropping the triangular push ups? A realistic anwser would make my day, because man! they are not fun to do! lol.. I don't have a wall bag yet, but hopefully I can get one soon.. if not Maybe I will try and craft a makeshift one to hold me over.
Another question, you said "in the future add the turnstile... incoming force... the ride you get from the energy coming towards you"
Can you explain this in depth a little bit more, it sounds like some very useful information, but I don't fully understand the dynamics behind it! 
another thing I didn't quite grasp was "7 mod. is nothing more than scratching the surface." can you elucidate your meaning of that too please? I appreciate your advice about taking things slow, yet steady, can never hear that enough times, thanks for your general good intentions as well!

To Yoshiyahu, i'm going to watch wing chun tonight while I practice holding my various stances and adducting like a mother! I'll get back to you in regards to that sometime tommorow morning, possibily even tonight!


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 19, 2008)

Okay let me know what you see. Especially In the fight against the guy at hide out and at the beginning with those guys who jump her you know the bandits.

I could possible post some links to fight scene?





Nabakatsu said:


> Thanks for your responses,
> To qwksilver61: I have a few questions, firstly may I ask why you suggest dropping the triangular push ups? A realistic anwser would make my day, because man! they are not fun to do! lol.. I don't have a wall bag yet, but hopefully I can get one soon.. if not Maybe I will try and craft a makeshift one to hold me over.
> Another question, you said "in the future add the turnstile... incoming force... the ride you get from the energy coming towards you"
> Can you explain this in depth a little bit more, it sounds like some very useful information, but I don't fully understand the dynamics behind it!
> ...


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 19, 2008)

I appreciate the offer, I have the dvd somewhere, I looked earlier without much success, but I'm pretty sure I could find it online if not, butttt it'd be cool if you could find the fight scene your alluding to in case I can't find it and decide to watch another movie during practice, cheers!


----------



## qwksilver61 (Dec 19, 2008)

Easy,extensors and contractors work against each other.Repetitive relaxed chain punching will remedy anything that ails you trust me( don't forget,borrowing and the turnstile theory.....) .SMACK! the wall bag without rocking and you will achieve power....remember the formula speed times....equals..... also a heavy bag would not hurt.The hardest punches are delivered relaxed...study boxing.... the Hero's and you will know.
Smack down power baby...use the force Luke! Heck try taking down guy's the size of tree's..I call it John Wayne syndrome...I can do it and so can you!


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 19, 2008)

Can anyone tell me the name of this Movie?





 

As for Michelle Yeoh Wing Chun Fight Scenes:

First one




 
Second One




 

Has anyone seen this Wing Chun Movie?




 


Nabakatsu said:


> I appreciate the offer, I have the dvd somewhere, I looked earlier without much success, but I'm pretty sure I could find it online if not, butttt it'd be cool if you could find the fight scene your alluding to in case I can't find it and decide to watch another movie during practice, cheers!


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 19, 2008)

Yoshiyahu, the first one is from the t.v. series kung fu, someone made a comment about it, and the last one is from: Legend Of Twins Dragon aka Shuang Long Ji (2007). Happy hunting!

To qwksilver61 thanks for your elucidiations, I'm not familar with the concept of turnstiles tho! can anyone give me a brief explanation please?


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 19, 2008)

Did you see the Wing Chun clips with Michelle Yeoh yet...they were in the middle?



Nabakatsu said:


> Yoshiyahu, the first one is from the t.v. series kung fu, someone made a comment about it, and the last one is from: Legend Of Twins Dragon aka Shuang Long Ji (2007). Happy hunting!
> 
> To qwksilver61 thanks for your elucidiations, I'm not familar with the concept of turnstiles tho! can anyone give me a brief explanation please?


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> Yoshiyahu, the first one is from the t.v. series kung fu, someone made a comment about it, and the last one is from: Legend Of Twins Dragon aka Shuang Long Ji (2007). Happy hunting!
> 
> To qwksilver61 thanks for your elucidiations, I'm not familar with the concept of turnstiles tho! can anyone give me a brief explanation please?


 
He's saying that you are borrowing the attackers force and giving it back to him in the form of a strike . Say for example a heavy punch comes in , using the appropriate hand structure you intercept it , re-direct and if the force is strong enough you will pivot and strike the opponent .

 The opponents force is used to power your own pivot , so you are taking the force he has given to you and are using it back against him , using the same principle as a turnstile .


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 20, 2008)

I get what your saying its classic wing chun. But does the word Turnstile mean? Whats the actual definition of it in English?


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 20, 2008)

Yoshiyahu said:


> I get what your saying its classic wing chun. But does the word Turnstile mean? Whats the actual definition of it in English?


 
I don't know what you call them in America , but in Australia they are the things that turn around usually at barriers like in railway stations . You put your ticket in the slot and the metal arms of the turnstile turn around and let you through the barrier .


----------



## qwksilver61 (Dec 20, 2008)

Thanks Mook,for explaining....another way to illustrate is the "revolving door"
the sideling stance is not just a sideling stance.when practicing have your partner execute a sun punch towards you, you are in the pre fighting posture
turn your man sau into tan sau,wu sau into sun punch along the centerline all simultaneously,slow at first.The Idea behind the drills is to get you more comfortable and relaxed,there is also a diagonal stepping drill where you go nose to nose while stepping out diagonally drawing the front leg in for adduction,tan sau...sun punch.In an actual fight thats where it can get scary,you have to trust you can carry it out and go forward to meet your opponent, second he cannot hit himself so you borrow the momentum of his roundhouse punch and drive it back to him,this take practice and skill,like I always say slow at first for a while....speed then power.oh, to the fellow that has trained for seven months don't take it personal,there is a lot that I still don't know,I remeber being new and overly anxious to try my new techniques,just stay cool and patient take time to digest.Hope this helps someone....I too take heed and learn from the posters....sometimes we just have to be good listeners.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

Sweet thanks for the information guys!

And to Yoshiyahu, I watched the first clip last night and I reallllyy saw how in the first fight segment, before michelle was using a sword, how she was sticking to the wc/wt/vt principals and certainly any using some of the techniques, thanks for opening my eyes, I'll take a look at the second clip in a little bit!


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

We call them turnstyles in America at the railways, in Boston and such.
That's a good description of the movement.



mook jong man said:


> I don't know what you call them in America , but in Australia they are the things that turn around usually at barriers like in railway stations . You put your ticket in the slot and the metal arms of the turnstile turn around and let you through the barrier .


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabatksu, have they shown you side slash and punch with pivot yet?
This can help you get a feel for the turnstyle or revolving door theory and motion.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

I've been shown a type of uppercut, which has the wrist bent straight up, and uses the knees for the main source of power, I've been show a hook which uses shifting from fighting stance into iras and than to fighting stance again to do a 180 turn and than the chain punches, also an elbow to utilize to escape a chokehold


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 20, 2008)

Okay also take a note...When she was using the broadswords....Did you see the Wing Chun there too?


Think about it. Tan Sau, Pak Sau Bong Sau all using broad swords. an Wu Sau and others. Think about Short swords and how one could apply short sword form to broad swords?

The Weapon is just an extension of the hand!




Nabakatsu said:


> Sweet thanks for the information guys!
> 
> And to Yoshiyahu, I watched the first clip last night and I reallllyy saw how in the first fight segment, before michelle was using a sword, how she was sticking to the wc/wt/vt principals and certainly any using some of the techniques, thanks for opening my eyes, I'll take a look at the second clip in a little bit!


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

As a side note! The training is going good... started running yesterday, did a mile, and did another mile today.. I hope it gets easier as I continue, lol.. my legs are so sore, been working on my stepping, just basic footwork.. one thing I'm having trouble doing is going from iras to circle stepping.. I can do the footwork fine, and punching isn't an issue, but the circular step makes my arms want to go in a circle too! ack.. so hard to stop myself from doing that, lol.. I've been chain punching the air in between SNT off and on during the day.. it's been really tough.. my arms feel like lead, I can barely do SNT afterwards! I was punching the wall just to change it up.. seems so much easier to punch something solid as oposed to air... on the verge of crafting a wall bag so I can keep practicing when the air has taken it's toll!


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 20, 2008)

Very Interesting excellent. Punching Air does build power alot of power in fact. So does kicking Air!




Nabakatsu said:


> As a side note! The training is going good... started running yesterday, did a mile, and did another mile today.. I hope it gets easier as I continue, lol.. my legs are so sore, been working on my stepping, just basic footwork.. one thing I'm having trouble doing is going from iras to circle stepping.. I can do the footwork fine, and punching isn't an issue, but the circular step makes my arms want to go in a circle too! ack.. so hard to stop myself from doing that, lol.. I've been chain punching the air in between SNT off and on during the day.. it's been really tough.. my arms feel like lead, I can barely do SNT afterwards! I was punching the wall just to change it up.. seems so much easier to punch something solid as oposed to air... on the verge of crafting a wall bag so I can keep practicing when the air has taken it's toll!


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> I've been shown a type of uppercut, which has the wrist bent straight up, and uses the knees for the main source of power, I've been show a hook which uses shifting from fighting stance into iras and than to fighting stance again to do a 180 turn and than the chain punches, also an elbow to utilize to escape a chokehold


 
That's good.  I was wondering if you were taught pivoting with your stance yet.  We teach this at first by pivoting with a side slash following up with a punch.  Then you pivot and side slash again the same side your pivoting towards and follow up with punch.  You do this back and forth to help learn your footwork with pivoting and also to learn to keep arms relaxed when pivoting for other techniques later.  Like a "turnstyle" kinda.  
Then you hit focus mits with the side slash and punch.  two people on each side of you hold a mit and you pivot and strike one then the other continously.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

I was taught how to switch at an 180 degree angle to hit attackers behind me if thats what your refering to, still having some trouble with the footwork when I'm hitting pads my sifu holds up for me, I tend to do a lot better practicing on my own, lol.. we don't have class until the 1st of january! so I hope to make some serious improvements by than and "redeem myself" lol, thanks for your support my fellow brothers and sister!


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> I was taught how to switch at an 180 degree angle to hit attackers behind me if thats what your refering to, still having some trouble with the footwork when I'm hitting pads my sifu holds up for me, I tend to do a lot better practicing on my own, lol.. we don't have class until the 1st of january! so I hope to make some serious improvements by than and "redeem myself" lol, thanks for your support my fellow brothers and sister!


 
I ask because I don't want to mess you up if your not working on pivot yet.  
eep.. hubbie told me you have another month or so to go.  Ignore what I said, don't worry about pivot and side slash.  Sorry. I didn't train traditional in a kwoon, sometimes I tell people stuff too early.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

I already know for a fact i've learned and have been practicing things 2-3 levels beyond what I should be already, be it from sifu or my sihings 
But I have enough on my plate as it is, It work serve as much a distraction


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> I already know for a fact i've learned and have been practicing things 2-3 levels beyond what I should be already, be it from sifu or my sihings
> But I have enough on my plate as it is, It work serve as much a distraction


 
Well I was trying to figure out how to describe side slash and pivot in text and it comes out too messed up.  You do alot in one movement and can be used as a 180 degree turn between two attackers (although we don't train it that far of a pivot)
I think I'd just confuse you.  But, it is a good way to turn from one focus mitt/or attacker to another in that fashion.


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 20, 2008)

Si-Je

Let me asked you about the side slash pivot. 

Lets say your Yee Gee Kim Yeung facing east. An your turn your body to side body posistion with your chest facing south but your left hand punching East. Then you pivot again your chest faces North but your right hand punches East. So each time you move your chest centerline and your left and right shoulder are on the centerline and your punch on the shoulder facing the opponents goes out?


Is this about what your saying?

So in other words your body is doing a side punch? Like the second picture to your left below!






1. Meridan Punch   2.Side Punch      3.Dragon Punch      4.Arrow Punch





Si-Je said:


> Well I was trying to figure out how to describe side slash and pivot in text and it comes out too messed up. You do alot in one movement and can be used as a 180 degree turn between two attackers (although we don't train it that far of a pivot)
> I think I'd just confuse you. But, it is a good way to turn from one focus mitt/or attacker to another in that fashion.


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Yoshiyahu said:


> Si-Je
> 
> Let me asked you about the side slash pivot.
> 
> ...


 
No, that's a totally different thing.  help me out Mook!
It's far simpler than that.
okay, here goes...
1.  you start out in basic stance, with guard up.
you pivot to the left, you raise your elbow up a bit (kinda like dai sau) on the left arm as you pivot.
2. your knife edge on had hits the focus mit to your left with your left hand.
3.  you follow up with one punch to the same pad with your right hand.
4.  The right hand that just punched the pad, now "side slashes" as you pivot to the right hitting the second focus mitt.
5.  you immediatly follow up with left hand one punch to right side focus mit.
You do this back and forth like the little drum in "the karate kid" (remember that movie, where he's doing the death match for his girl friend and the whole village busts out with these little drums spinning the string and ball back and forth to hit both sides of the drum?  I'm sure you do. lol!)

Kinda like that...  I knew I couldn't describe it well in text! ack!
But, it teaches you to pivot and stay relaxed as you turn and strike.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

My curiosity is peaked! i'm tempted to try and figure this out now, lol


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 20, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> My curiosity is peaked! i'm tempted to try and figure this out now, lol


 
Stop that! lol! It seems that no one does this except us.  I don't want to mess you up in your training now.
But, it is a handy drill to learn to pivot and move hands too.
I'm sure they have something similar at your school.  You've just got a couple months more to go before your ready to learn that.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 20, 2008)

Micheal casey should be coming out for a seminar my sifu sets up every 3-4 months soon, at which point I will be testing for 2nd level, so hopefully thats when that will be introduced!


----------



## mook jong man (Dec 21, 2008)

Si-Je said:


> Stop that! lol! It seems that no one does this except us. I don't want to mess you up in your training now.
> But, it is a handy drill to learn to pivot and move hands too.
> I'm sure they have something similar at your school. You've just got a couple months more to go before your ready to learn that.


 
Sorry I can't help you Si- Je I've never heard of that technique , did you make it up your self , its very creative I must say . 

Only joking , of course I know it , you described it pretty good . I might clarify it a little more by saying that you know the second section of SLT where you slash out to the sides with both arms , well it is one of those side slashes but with a pivot and a punch that  follows immediately  after the side slash in exactly the same spot . Its used to hit a target right at the side of you .


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 21, 2008)

Ohhh, I see.. yeah I've some some defense exercises using a similar move, they'd come to sucker punch ya from the side and we would use a wu sau and the slashing hand move for one side


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 21, 2008)

So.. my legs and arms seem to be losing more and more strength each day.. I think i'm going to have to change my diet up a bit.. too much pizza and meat.. and greasy hashbrowns with cheese and brocoli and onions.. mmmmmmmm.. ack! so yeah.. anyone have some suggestions? Thanks in advance if so!


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 21, 2008)

Buy a juicer and start juicing fruits and veggies. Also take some multi vatimins...

An Si-Je I understand what your saying now. I just did it at the computer and figured it out. Very interesting drill. We have drills similiar in YKS but we mostly do it straigt forward down the center. Like we have one where we do parallel punch and we also pivot with Tan Da. Thats when you turn your body while punching with the lead hand and Tan Sau with hand closet to your body.

Very interesting dril



Nabakatsu said:


> So.. my legs and arms seem to be losing more and more strength each day.. I think i'm going to have to change my diet up a bit.. too much pizza and meat.. and greasy hashbrowns with cheese and brocoli and onions.. mmmmmmmm.. ack! so yeah.. anyone have some suggestions? Thanks in advance if so!


----------



## Mystic Wolf (Dec 21, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> So.. my legs and arms seem to be losing more and more strength each day.. I think i'm going to have to change my diet up a bit.. too much pizza and meat.. and greasy hashbrowns with cheese and brocoli and onions.. mmmmmmmm.. ack! so yeah.. anyone have some suggestions? Thanks in advance if so!


 
My diet mostly consist of chicken, gound turkey, fish, vegies, pasta, and fruit.


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 21, 2008)

Okay well try eating meat once a day or no more than twice. Like for lunch and dinner. The rest of time eat vegatables and rice, Noodles and Vegatables, Pasta with veggies. An maybe try some lamb from time to time instead of chicken and turkey...





Mystic Wolf said:


> My diet mostly consist of chicken, gound turkey, fish, vegies, pasta, and fruit.


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 21, 2008)

Nabakatsu said:


> So.. my legs and arms seem to be losing more and more strength each day.. I think i'm going to have to change my diet up a bit.. too much pizza and meat.. and greasy hashbrowns with cheese and brocoli and onions.. mmmmmmmm.. ack! so yeah.. anyone have some suggestions? Thanks in advance if so!


 
You need more veggies, fruits and carbohydrates.  I like to make a big salad and keep it in the fridge so I can eat a bowl whenever I get hungry or such.  A fruit salad or soup is handy to have in the fridge for snacks, and fillers in your day.  
We'll make spagetti (replace the beef you put in the sause with ground turkey meat. ) or eat cold noodle salads, and make Chicken fettichini, or linguini.  
Lots of salad and fruit will lighten your body up, poop all that greasy garbage out, and make you feel much more energetic.


----------



## Nabakatsu (Dec 21, 2008)

I live with my mom and sis, and soon to be her bf, and yeah we make ground turkey spaghhetti like 3 times a week! lol, I eat an apple a day.. lots of pears and grapes too, usually more so in the summer/spring.. veggies Is a problem.. the only one I like is brocoli.. going to have to start eating some nasty veggies I guess, salads a great idea tho.. I like the thought of fruit salad too.. thanks for the help


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 21, 2008)

Aww man I love Brocoli especially with some melted chees and pepper or some bad salt. But yea its the best goes great with nice season steak. Or some Venison. But I do like strean beans. You have to know how to cook em though. Also some Cabbage aint bad if they know how to cook em. Greens with enough salt is cool. I also like red beans and rice, jimabalya with beef, The best way to eat veggies is to mix it with rice...check this out...

Get you some carrots cut them really small, Get some white rice or brown rice, mix in some brocoli and some corn and some black beans. Get some good salsa to go with it or maybe some parmesan sauce. Season it with some pepper and some cheynne pepper. Ummm good,...

This will take your mind off it being vegatables. You have to add some spices. Mix it up like they do in the MMA. Rice and veggies are the best. Or you can take a small amount of veggies and put them in the blender along with a larger amount of fruits an make your healthy smoothie if you like...mix it up with some vanilla or strawberry ice cream. Take like some cucumbers,spinach,brocoli,totmatoes put them in the blender. Than take some bannans strawberries and some vanilla ice cream an blend a way. Use some organe juice or grape juice along with it...wooow...not only will it taste wounderful an give you some great energy but you will be on toilet no need to be backed up. It will clean your system out all the junk. I don't mean you will have diarra but you will use the bathroom atleast three times a day. Which is what your body is suppose to do.



Nabakatsu said:


> I live with my mom and sis, and soon to be her bf, and yeah we make ground turkey spaghhetti like 3 times a week! lol, I eat an apple a day.. lots of pears and grapes too, usually more so in the summer/spring.. veggies Is a problem.. the only one I like is brocoli.. going to have to start eating some nasty veggies I guess, salads a great idea tho.. I like the thought of fruit salad too.. thanks for the help


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 21, 2008)

Yea the best grape juice to make you poop regularly is 

Kedem

or 

Manischewitz 


of course manicschewitz is a wine too but they also have grape juice that is non fermented...I love kedem for the taste but Manischewitz will clean your system out alot quicker. Two or three glasses of that an here comes the pooper...


here is a link for the wine.

https://wwws.onlinekosherwine.com/a...lor=&price=&mevushal=&submit.x=44&submit.y=10


Si-Je said:


> You need more veggies, fruits and carbohydrates. I like to make a big salad and keep it in the fridge so I can eat a bowl whenever I get hungry or such. A fruit salad or soup is handy to have in the fridge for snacks, and fillers in your day.
> We'll make spagetti (replace the beef you put in the sause with ground turkey meat. ) or eat cold noodle salads, and make Chicken fettichini, or linguini.
> Lots of salad and fruit will lighten your body up, poop all that greasy garbage out, and make you feel much more energetic.


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 22, 2008)

The trick to making veggies yummy: 

1. don't steam them, (I hate that)
2.  Cook them in deep skillet with butter(or margine) and/or lemon juice (depending on the veggie) season them with Italian seasoning, garlic, salt pepper, cilantro, onion, whatever is your favorite seasoning.  Mix em up experiment.
3. mix 'em up in your dishes, i.e. stew, chinese style stir fry (with lots of sauce), casserols, 
4. You can also cook them with bits of bacon , i.e. green beans are yummy this way, breakfast ham chunks, etc. get creative. 
5. get nice fattening and yummy salad dressing for your salads.  French, 1,000 island, or my fav. ranch dressing.


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 22, 2008)

Waht about raw veggies that have been clean properly...hmmmm goooooddd, Some Rice andsome spices. Along with lamb cubes or beef cubes. Or what about some lamb stew with some great spices and sauces...lol





Si-Je said:


> The trick to making veggies yummy:
> 
> 1. don't steam them, (I hate that)
> 2. Cook them in deep skillet with butter(or margine) and/or lemon juice (depending on the veggie) season them with Italian seasoning, garlic, salt pepper, cilantro, onion, whatever is your favorite seasoning. Mix em up experiment.
> ...


----------



## Si-Je (Dec 22, 2008)

That's the spirit!  Make the veggies yummy.


----------



## Yoshiyahu (Dec 22, 2008)

Well said Si Je


----------

