# Self-Defence Weapons For Home



## Andy_46 (Feb 9, 2008)

Hi

Does anyone know if its legal to purchase those extendable batons that the police use here in the uk?.  I'm wanting to purchase something long and hard to keep in the house to wack any potential burglars over the head with.

I've never actually been burgaled or anything,  i just want something to hand incase i ever am !!

Andy


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## terryl965 (Feb 9, 2008)

I do not know but I have one in my car just in case.


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## LawDog (Feb 9, 2008)

In most states the mere possesion of an expandable baton is not illegal. The problem usually comes when it is placed into a motor vehicle.
In Massachusetts it cannot be within "wing span" of the operator. In other states it cannot be stored within the cabin of the vehicle.
:duel:

I would be careful on the use of your phrase, using something "long and hard"


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## terryl965 (Feb 9, 2008)

LawDog said:


> In most states the mere possesion of an expandable baton is not illegal. The problem usually comes when it is placed into a motor vehicle.
> In Massachusetts it cannot be within "wing span" of the operator. In other states it cannot be stored within the cabin of the vehicle.
> :duel:
> 
> I would be careful on the use of your phrase, using something "long and hard"


 

Lawdog I have not heard of the Collapseble baton to be illegal in a motor vehicle? I need to check into that Thanks.


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 9, 2008)

LawDog, to my understanding, having anything that is specifically designed to be used as a weapon (not including normally legal pocket knives & the like) within arms reach of the driver is illegal, unless one has a concealed carry permit. Is this correct (except in states that have free carry, of course)?


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## jamz (Feb 9, 2008)

To the OP, I don't know about extendable batons in particular, but if you ave the mindset that *everything* is a weapon, you can't go too far wrong if the need arises.

I would imagine that the extendable part of it is necessary for those who have to carry them around, whereas at home you could have a full sized weapon conveniently lying around in pre-selected areas.  Not knowing the layout of your abode, but if you were a cricket fan, maybe having a few bats around wouldn't be a bad idea, or if you've golfed once or twice, had an old iron with the head cut off because you were "working on it" in various corners would probably do someone no good as well.
 They tend to have nice rubber grips, too.


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## searcher (Feb 9, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> LawDog, to my understanding, having anything that is specifically designed to be used as a weapon (not including normally legal pocket knives & the like) within arms reach of the driver is illegal, unless one has a concealed carry permit. Is this correct (except in states that have free carry, of course)?


 

Yes and no.   In my state we have CCH, not CCW.   This means we can conceal and carry a handgun only.    But you can carry a shotgun in your car if it is not loaded(alot of good that will do you).    As far as expandable batons, most states restrict the use or carry of these and will prosecute you if you are caught carrying one.   

Now if your state has CCW and you have one, then it would be up to your state's AG to decide if they would be legal or not, but I would not want to be a test case on that.


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## Drac (Feb 9, 2008)

jamz said:


> but if you were a cricket fan, maybe having a few bats around wouldn't be a bad idea.


 
A friend of mine use to have a couple of cricket bats..Easier to swing than a Louisville Slugger he always said..


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## jks9199 (Feb 9, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> LawDog, to my understanding, having anything that is specifically designed to be used as a weapon (not including normally legal pocket knives & the like) within arms reach of the driver is illegal, unless one has a concealed carry permit. Is this correct (except in states that have free carry, of course)?


Your statement is too broad.  To begin with, I'm not aware of any state that freely permits carrying a firearm *concealed*.  Many states are open carry states, where you may openly carry any legally possessed firearm.

But, even more importantly, the idea of "anything that can be a weapon" cannot be carried concealed is to subjective; it really depends on several factors starting with the local law.  (In response to the OP... I have no idea about UK law.)  It depends on how the state law defines a weapon, or what weapons are prohibited, as well as the circumstances.  Virginia recently made carrying a machete illegal; the defition of "machete" they used is "an exposed blade 12 inches or longer."  Now, I find a kid in baggy Dickies pants, a web belt a mile long, wearing a blue shirt, and carrying a blue bandana neatly folded, with a machete hidden in his pants leg... Yeah, he's charged.  But, if I'm dealing with a guy carrying a machete "concealed" in his bag of gardening tools... It's a little different.


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## LawDog (Feb 9, 2008)

Doc_Jude,
I do not know of any state that issues a permit to carry a baton like weapon. You should such the internet for your state, probably under illegal weapons - your state.
As for any weapons carry in vehicles most states have various rules and reg's. The ones that I listed in my previous post are the ones that are in common usage across the country.
In most states, especially with the "Homeland Securit" issue, the possesion of expandable batons is not illegal it is the "vehicle/tranpostation carry" part which can be the problem.


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## still learning (Feb 9, 2008)

Andy_46 said:


> Hi
> 
> Does anyone know if its legal to purchase those extendable batons that the police use here in the uk?. I'm wanting to purchase something long and hard to keep in the house to wack any potential burglars over the head with.
> 
> ...


 
Hello, All you need is a metal baseball bat (totally legal to carry next to the bed! )  One more thing is "long handle Hammers".

In Hawaii lots of us go spear fishing...and leaving your spear gun in the home is legal...even to carry in the car?  spears, spear guns, three prongs..  Note: you can add a block of wood to cover the spear tip and make it act as a spear club? 

We have a 6 C-cell mag light next to bed...can be use as a flashlight too!
"D" are fatter but heavier.

Be carefully not all expandable batons are not equal and as powerful as you think?  ....you must try different ones...a friend use it on a big guy...didn't work...he give it away. (car rage fight).

Aloha (alarms and double door locks, window guards, motion lights,etc...prevention is better than cure!


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## chinto (Feb 9, 2008)

LawDog said:


> In most states the mere possesion of an expandable baton is not illegal. The problem usually comes when it is placed into a motor vehicle.
> In Massachusetts it cannot be within "wing span" of the operator. In other states it cannot be stored within the cabin of the vehicle.
> :duel:
> 
> I would be careful on the use of your phrase, using something "long and hard"



much of the east coast seems to not want any one to defend themselves any way. and California and some other more liberal states are getting almost that bad, so that does not surprise me.  I wonder does you state requier a retreat regardless of if its in your home or not till no longer physically possible to retreat before you can legally take offensive action to stop the attack?  
ohh by the way in my state as long as it is in plain sight you may have a loaded gun in your car. it may be with in reach of the driver. but do not conceal it from sight with out a CCL.
you can use a good heavy mag light and skip a lot of hassals in most states as there is no law against an aluminum flash light... that is why some unarmed security guards carry them as they are still "unarmed" but have a usable weapon if it gets dicey.


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 9, 2008)

Sheesh, why bother at all? In my house, I have stuff all over the place, guns, sticks, blades. I'm no more than a couple seconds away from a world of hurt for anyone that would dare perpetrate harm upon my little girls. I won't pray for them, but you can. Pray to whatever god you like, they're gonna need it.
As for keeping an "extendable baton" in the house for home defense... a waste of time, IMO. There are many perfectly legal implements, such as axe or maul  handles that would serve much better. If you practice martial arts, just keep a baston or bokuto close at hand. 
In the car, I keep a BOB, with a Russian SF Shovel next to it. A friend of mine that does construction and roofing keeps a roofing hammer (practically a tomahawk) in his truck. My mechanic friend keeps long socket wrenches in his car. My advise, look at your life, your work, your hobbies, and find a plausible reason to carry something in the car, or even on your person if possible.


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## Andy_46 (Feb 10, 2008)

Hi guys

Thanks for the help

Andy


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## Tez3 (Feb 10, 2008)

Andy_46 said:


> Hi
> 
> Does anyone know if its legal to purchase those extendable batons that *the police use here in the uk?.* I'm wanting to purchase something long and hard to keep in the house to wack any potential burglars over the head with.
> 
> ...


 
It's not legal. TBH unless you can use one it would be a waste of money to buy one. there's plenty of things around your house that you can use IF you need to. The law in here is that 'reasonable' force is allowed to be used in defence of yourself/family/friends etc. Belting them over the head may not be reasonable force when you could defend yourself in other ways, besides extendable batons aren't the best for hitting the head with really!
If you carry baseball/rounders/cricket bats in your cars here I'd suggest also carrying the ball and anything else connected with the sport to prove you weren't carrying an offensive weapon.


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## KempoGuy06 (Feb 13, 2008)

i carry about about a 4-5 ft long galvinized solid steel pipe in the back seat (hood struts are blown so I use it to prop open the hood) also makes a dandy club, on my person I carry a foldable locking box cutter.

B


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## geezer (Feb 13, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> Sheesh, why bother at all? In my house, I have stuff all over the place, guns, sticks, blades. .


 
I don't own a lot of  actual weapons since somebody broke in and stole all my guns some years back. But, there are more suitable self-defense objects in my nine-year old son's room alone to arm a small mob--baseball and t-ball bats, mini-golf clubs, tennis racquets, a bokken, sticks, hard objects, painful leggo toys, and, just for effect, a couple of light sabers. And as for the previously stated uselessness of an unloaded shotgun??? Hell, beat 'em with the stock!!!


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## JadeDragon3 (Feb 18, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> LawDog, to my understanding, having anything that is specifically designed to be used as a weapon (not including normally legal pocket knives & the like) within arms reach of the driver is illegal, unless one has a concealed carry permit. Is this correct (except in states that have free carry, of course)?


 
In my state that I live in (Kentucky), it is *LEGAL* to carry a weapon (gun, knife, etc....) in the glove box (whether the glove box is locked or unlocked) as long as it was installed by the manufacturer of the car. 

*Kentucky Revised Statute*​
*527.020 Carrying concealed deadly weapon.*
*Sec.*
*(8)* A firearm or other deadly weapon shall not be deemed concealed on or about the person if it is located in a glove compartment, regularly installed in a motor vehicle by its manufacturer, regardless of whether said compartment is locked, unlocked, or does not have a locking mechanism. No person or organization, public or private, shall prohibit a person from keeping a firearm or ammunition, or both, or other deadly weapon in a glove compartment of a vehicle in accordance with the provisions of this subsection. Any attempt by a person or organization, public or private, to violate the provisions of this subsection may be the subject of an action
for appropriate relief or for damages in a Circuit Court or District Court of​competent jurisdiction.

http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/527-00/CHAPTER.HTM


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 19, 2008)

JadeDragon3 said:


> In my state that I live in (Kentucky), it is *LEGAL* to carry a weapon (gun, knife, etc....) in the glove box (whether the glove box is locked or unlocked) as long as it was installed by the manufacturer of the car.
> 
> *Kentucky Revised Statute*​
> *527.020 Carrying concealed deadly weapon.*
> ...



Yep. Laws suck (well, laws that interfere with MY 2nd AMENDMENT RIGHTS suck). Gawd, if I could I'd be wearing my .357 & my Cold Steel Cutlass or Valiant Bolo 24/7. 

Sometimes I wish all of us righteous citizens had halos or some damn thing so we could tell who was who...


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 19, 2008)

geezer said:


> I don't own a lot of  actual weapons since somebody broke in and stole all my guns some years back...



Damn bro, I feel for you. Little is more sacred than the sanctity of the home. Did you move, or improve your security?


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## Whitebelt (Feb 19, 2008)

This is the law for the UK


> 1. Section 141 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988 (offensive weapons) shall apply to the following descriptions of weapons, other than weapons of those descriptions which are antiques for the purposes of this Schedule:
> 
> (a) A knuckleduster, that is, a band of metal or other hard material worn on one or more fingers, and designed to cause injury, and any weapon incorporating a knuckleduster;
> 
> ...



I see no mention of enormous HeMan-esque swords! YEAH!


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 19, 2008)

Whitebelt said:


> This is the law for the UK
> 
> 
> I see no mention of enormous HeMan-esque swords! YEAH!



Just as soon as you can get it out of that pesky stone, huh?


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## Grenadier (Feb 19, 2008)

Andy,

For home defense, a 6 D-cell MagLite, or even a child's aluminum baseball bat, would be much easier to use, and keep you within the confines of legality.  Heck, even a hickory axe handle (with no axe head), or an old Wilson T-2000 steel tennis racquet.  

Because of the questionable legality of the baton, there are plenty of alternatives.



On another note, I did get a kick out of one particular UK laws:



> (h) the weapon sometimes known as a *"death star"*


 
Yikes!  Well, I can understand that!  Nobody needs a superlaser capable of destroying entire planets!


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## Doc_Jude (Feb 19, 2008)

Grenadier said:


> Yikes!  Well, I can understand that!  Nobody needs a superlaser capable of destroying entire planets!



Not to mention that the Empire was a just a big galactic Old White Boys Club....


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## geezer (Feb 19, 2008)

Doc_Jude said:


> Damn bro, I feel for you. Little is more sacred than the sanctity of the home. Did you move, or improve your security?


 
I moved. But not before "they" stole my truck too. Actually, I had two vehicles stolen at that address in about six weeks time. Sheesh!


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## searcher (Feb 19, 2008)

geezer, I like that you mentioned the "painful lego toys."   I have rolled my ankles and cut open the bottoms of my feet with those nasty little buggers.


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## thardey (Feb 19, 2008)

searcher said:


> geezer, I like that you mentioned the "painful lego toys."   I have rolled my ankles and cut open the bottoms of my feet with those nasty little buggers.



"Kiddie caltraps"


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