# Okinawan karate question



## twendkata71 (Mar 7, 2008)

How many Okinawan karate stylist in here use/train with the tsumisaki geri(toe tip kick)? I still train and use it in my training eventhough I no longer study Matsubayashi shorin ryu. I find it a very practical and lethal kick, directed at vital points on the legs and torso. Let me know your thoughts.


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## arnisador (Mar 7, 2008)

When I studied Uechi-ryu I learned the toe-knuckle kick and it drove me crazy! I've occasionally used a pointed-toe kick to hit a soft point but never trained it specifically.

It's amazing how many ways there are to do the front kick!


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## shoshinkan (Mar 8, 2008)

yes indeed it is terrific if used in a Uchi manner (strike), we use the heel for Tsuki (thrust).

The ball of the foot has it's use of course but its not considered as effective in our dojo.


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## Brandon Fisher (Mar 8, 2008)

Yes I use it alot and I do condition my toe using a maki stick and the makiwara post.  I have a student who breaks 1in pine on a regular basis with his big toe.  People have even gotten got with it in kumite in the dojo and in tournaments by him and it hurts even when controlled.


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## Scarey (Mar 9, 2008)

I think I would be a bit leary of this kick. It seems like the type of strike that could cause as much damage to you as it does your opponent. That is, if anything goes wrong in the delivery. The toes are not exactly the sturdiest part of the body, especially when you take into account the amount of force a leg can produce. As anyone who's been under extreme pressure to preform knows, when the adrenaline drops, 50% of your training goes out the window. Now I don't know about everyone else but I'm not a big fan of things going wrong at vital moments. Add all of that to the fact that it's not exactly brilliant in a self-defense situation to lift your leg off of the ground high enough (above the level of your own knee) to hit a soft target, and this strike just keeps seeming less and less practical to me. I prefer to work with techniques that have low potential for backfire.


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## Brandon Fisher (Mar 9, 2008)

Scarey,
Take a look at these videos.  This is Kiyohide Shinjo, Sensei (Kyoshi / 8th Dan of Uechi Ryu) I would say that his toe is extremely strong can't say I would want to take it this far.





 




 
Last time I was in Sensei Tom Ward's (I know you know him being a part of PKC and from Indiana) dojo about a year ago I was using his makiwara.  When he came towards the back of the dojo and saw me kicking the post of his makiwara he looked at me smiled and just shook his head. I knew his thought was Brandon your crazy.  Funny that he is the one that taught it to me back about 14 or 15 years ago but its taken that long to be able to use it effectivly without injury. If I get back to one of the Indiana State Tournaments this year I will show you what my toe looks like as a result of training this kick.  But it is definetly a soft area technique.


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## Doc_Jude (Mar 9, 2008)

In Shobayashi Shorin Ryu we'd kick the makiwara with it but also kick the bottom of the heavy bag for a little different and perhaps more realistic angle. When properly conditioned it's very practical, especially since it's easier to apply when wearing shoes of all kinds, as opposed to using the ball of the foot with shoes on.


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## twendkata71 (Mar 9, 2008)

The Uechi ryu version of this kick is different. The way they bend the toe. In Matsubayashi ryu, I learned to fold the second to over the big toe to reenforce the toe. This kick is very effective when kicking the artery on the inside of the leg. But, it does take a lot of training to be effective and accurate.


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