# Got a concussion



## BlueShirtGuy (Nov 1, 2022)

I started boxing recently after upping my grind at the community gym. So far, I feel like everything is going great. I spared with some vet guy and got a concussion. Will that affect my brain or something?


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## Tez3 (Nov 1, 2022)

BlueShirtGuy said:


> I started boxing recently after upping my grind at the community gym. So far, I feel like everything is going great. I spared with some vet guy and got a concussion. Will that affect my brain or something?


Please seek advice from a medical professional, we are a discussion group all you will get is opinions, often varying in actual knowledge. Take care.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 1, 2022)

BlueShirtGuy said:


> I started boxing recently after upping my grind at the community gym. So far, I feel like everything is going great. I spared with some vet guy and got a concussion. Will that affect my brain or something?


If you're asking, you probably didn't talk to a doctor yet, right?  If you did they would have told you what you want to know.

Layman answer: yes concussions affect the brain, often long term.  Boxing concussions are particularly notorious for this going back to ancient times.  There's even a cool old Latin term for it: dementia pugilistica.

You do not want this.  It's not that hard to avoid it in boxing class, just try not to get hit by upping your defensive game.  Keep your hands up, tuck your chin, bob, weave, dodge, duck...all the D's of dodgeball.









						Chronic traumatic encephalopathy - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 1, 2022)

BlueShirtGuy said:


> I started boxing recently after upping my grind at the community gym. So far, I feel like everything is going great. I spared with some vet guy and got a concussion. Will that affect my brain or something?


Yes. It will and as already affect your brain.  The question is how it will effect you from now on.  The only person that can answer that question is a qualified doctor.  The general rule is that you see a doctor whenever you have a concussion.  Not all concussions are the same.   I had one as a child.  After hitting my head and crying, I passed out as some gut carried me about 800 yards to the medical building. They woke me up and I threw up.  Then I passed out again then woke up in the hospital and threw up again.  I think I stayed in the hospital for a few days.   I had 2 concussions that were like that. Both required medical attention and observation. Sometimes I wonder if those injuries are affecting me now or if my memory is just being overloaded with a lot of things going on in my life.  

It's not too late to get a check up just to make sure things are good. The best thing is that you won't have that worry and concern about the same question you are asking now.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 1, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> You do not want this. It's not that hard to avoid it in boxing class, just try not to get hit by upping your defensive game.


I tell students all the time that I'll take a hit to the body if it means that my head is protected. My body can deal with injury better than my head.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 1, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> I tell students all the time that I'll take a hit to the body if it means that my head is protected. My body can deal with injury better than my head.


You know the reality is most people never get punched in the head their whole lives.  They get concussions from car doors and low hanging lamps.

Sports players are just starting to understand the risks of CTE.  Will Smith only made that movie a few years ago.

Full contact fighters, it's all about defense.  People are often so focused on hitting things they forget the crown jewels arent below the belt...

People who spar really need to protect their necks and everything up more.than anything.  Which is why it's so telling when a "martial artist" drops their hands...ok if you're Floyd Mayweather trying to bait, that works, but for most you're asking for it, once the fight is on.


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## Darren (Nov 1, 2022)

BlueShirtGuy said:


> I started boxing recently after upping my grind at the community gym. So far, I feel like everything is going great. I spared with some vet guy and got a concussion. Will that affect my brain or something?


Did you see a bright white light?


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## Darren (Nov 1, 2022)

Darren said:


> Did you see a bright white light?


If it your first no! I have had 5-6 concussions things seem to be alright!!


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## Hanshi (Nov 6, 2022)

Certainly There are several kinds and levels of a concussion from "rush to the OR" and how they affect you're "shake it off".  I know very little about concussions although I have had at least1 time and likely a few more.
Some doctors who have researched concussion now warn that a concussion can and does happen by hitting a soccer ball with your head.

So IMHO   One can get a concussion and be back fine sitting on the couch, rubbing your face, taking a nap or just sit & close both eyes and listen to Mozart.

Getting one from boxing and not likely having any side affects is not so bad.  But if the sparring continues it can be much worse.  Mahammad Ali for instance.  He had a long and spectacular career that he never stopped, he just put the gearshift on "N" and relaxed.        
The overload from concussions adds up, big time.  For every boxing match one sees on TV the boxers put in many more hours daily in training between matches.  In the champ it manifested as a Physical disease that makes it difficult for him to walk.  I find I am now having having some sort of nervous tics in my hands and walk with some difficulty especially outside.  And thanks to *ra* I've developed (runs in the family) chronic fatigue which is very reminiscent of the flu.  So I do know if concussions cause these symptoms: That's not what got me.


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## drop bear (Nov 6, 2022)

Concussion as in you got dizzy. Or Concussion as in you are puking your guts up for a week?


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## Darksoul (Nov 6, 2022)

Years ago, possibly 25 or more, I was riding my bike home and hit a curb. Went flying over the handle bars and slammed into the ground pretty hard. After I hit, my memory of what I did next is muddled. Managed to get back on and ride home, got off the bike and struggled into the house screaming bloody murder. My brothers literally appeared out of nowhere and hauled me upstairs, put me into bed while they called our parents. Blurs really, I was out for a bit, but when I came to, I asked my one brother what time it was. He said "If you ask me what time it is, one more time, I'm going to hit you." Apparently I had asked the exact same question about 50 times in a row, according to them. My thoughts and emotions eventually calmed down, to the point that my parents figured I was okay, and didn't need medical attention.

But did I? Should I have been taken to a doctor and checked out? Today I would say yes. I wonder how that bike accident scrambled my brain and if there was any long term impact. I don't think there was but I honestly don't know that answer.

Go get checked out.


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## geezer (Nov 6, 2022)

Darren said:


> If it your first no! I have had 5-6 concussions things seem to be alright!!


_This_ is the type of response you often read on a discussion forum. And that's fine. 

But it's also the reason you should seek advice from qualified medical professionals!


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 6, 2022)

geezer said:


> _This_ is the type of response you often read on a discussion forum. And that's fine.
> 
> But it's also the reason you should seek advice from qualified medical professionals!


5-7 concussions is pretty high.  Pro NHL, NFL high.

Find a better agent.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 6, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> 5-7 concussions is pretty high.  Pro NHL, NFL high.
> 
> Find a better agent.


ha ha ha. 5-7 is small compared to the sports you just listed.  They would have gone through that many long before they hit Pro Status.





I remember I got hit so hard during a lacrosse game that all of the people disappeared.  I got up and heard people yelling and I could see the field, but I couldn't find the other players  or the field they we were playing on.  I probably should have gone to the doctor after that game but continued to play and didn't see a doctor.  To this day I have never been that disoriented, thank goodness.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 6, 2022)

Darren said:


> Did you see a bright white light?


ha ha ha.  I never remember any bright lights with my concision.  For me it was like the lights went off and when they came back on I was on the ground lol.  I'm not sure if that's because I closed my eyes or if it was because my brain stopped processing vision.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 6, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> ha ha ha. 5-7 is small compared to the sports you just listed.  They would have gone through that many long before they hit Pro Status.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


We're not talking about how hard you got hit at Lacrosse.

5-7 concussions is high, pro or amateur...

It's high compared to most humans living today.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 6, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> We're not talking about how hard you got hit at Lacrosse.
> 
> 5-7 concussions is high, pro or amateur...
> 
> It's high compared to most humans living today.


I'm using myself as an example because I played sports and was very active.  I've never played football, hockey or any impact sports until college.  By the time I was in college I had more than 5 concussions.    5 to 7 concussion is low for those who play high compact sports.  I can't use anyone else as an example of  "It's high compared to most humans living today." because I can only speak of my own experience..

I'm pretty sure many people in here have had more than 5 concussions.


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## tkdroamer (Nov 7, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> We're not talking about how hard you got hit at Lacrosse.
> 
> 5-7 concussions is high, pro or amateur...
> 
> It's high compared to most humans living today.


Think of out toddler years. All the stumbling, tumbling, and falling. I would aver nearly every person got at least one concussion during that time. Most, more than one.
The average person, body, and brain are more pliable than it seems people are giving them credit for.
It would definitely come down to one's upbringing, but I would bet money that most people to adult age have had 5 concussions in their lifetime. 
Of course, much of this would come down to the very unreliable measurement of what is a concussion.


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## Darren (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> ha ha ha.  I never remember any bright lights with my concision.  For me it was like the lights went off and when they came back on I was on the ground lol.  I'm not sure if that's because I closed my eyes or if it was because my brain stopped processing vision.


On 2-3 of mine I saw a bright white light.


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## Darren (Nov 7, 2022)

geezer said:


> _This_ is the type of response you often read on a discussion forum. And that's fine.
> 
> But it's also the reason you should seek advice from qualified medical professionals!


All they can do is ask ya questions see how ya respond tell ya to go home with somebody, make sure they wake ya up every hour to make sure you wake up, no sedation of any kind! Give you a aspirin if ya have a headache and see what happens a little later. At first reading is out, can’t concentrate really on anything, conversation is out ya seem to just be in a blur, sunlight hurts, ya just slowed down. Depending on how bad it is first time count on a few weeks to 3-4 months to get over it, effects can last 6-9 months afterwards guess it comes with age too!!  Maybe it has affected me somewhat then again there’s whatever! Have read were people get hit in the head and dies a few hours later. Life is strange!!!!!


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> I'm using myself as an example because I played sports and was very active.  I've never played football, hockey or any impact sports until college.  By the time I was in college I had more than 5 concussions.    5 to 7 concussion is low for those who play high compact sports.  I can't use anyone else as an example of  "It's high compared to most humans living today." because I can only speak of my own experience..
> 
> I'm pretty sure many people in here have had more than 5 concussions.


Maybe you're an outlier dude, and I'll have to dig up some studies but 5 diagnosed concussions is on the high end as far as I've ever known, but especially now in football etc.  

Did you know you can't even enter certain full contact fighting comps if you have a history over just a handful of diagnosed concussions?  They won't even let you fight, and you have to provide medical files to prove it (and that you don't have HIV etc).

Let's keep medical concussion separated from hitting your head, getting tackled, etc.  Big difference.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 7, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> Think of out toddler years. All the stumbling, tumbling, and falling. I would aver nearly every person got at least one concussion during that time. Most, more than one.
> The average person, body, and brain are more pliable than it seems people are giving them credit for.
> It would definitely come down to one's upbringing, but I would bet money that most people to adult age have had 5 concussions in their lifetime.
> Of course, much of this would come down to the very unreliable measurement of what is a concussion.


Let's keep it to the clinical definition, which is brain damage.  Traumatic closed head injury.

And yes, the brain is well protected in it's little pool from many impacts.  I've done both full contact sports and combat sports, including competition.  Never one concussion (well there was this one time playing tackle football with my buddies, major cooperative slam of two giants both going for the ball...it is was like matter and antimatter coliding).

Trained boxers take hundreds of strikes to the head (per fight in some cases, thousands over a career), few cause concussions.  Otherwise every pro and ammy boxer out there would have CTE.


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## Steve (Nov 7, 2022)

Just a couple of thoughts.

First, to the OP, definitely talk to a doctor.  Taking advice from us is just a bad idea.  😅

Second, concussions are no bueno. The brain is a complex organ and I think protecting it is a good idea.  I don’t think I’m overprotective of my kids, but I have always been very careful when it comes to their heads and brains.  

Third, regarding boxers, I’ve read that 1 in 5 people with CTE never had a diagnosed concussion.  The repetitive blows a boxer takes, along with some rules like a standing 8 count, can mask trauma.  

All that said, I’m not a doctor. My understanding is gleaned from articles and studies I’ve read over the years and from having had three diagnosed concussions in my life.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 7, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> Maybe you're an outlier dude, and I'll have to dig up some studies but 5 diagnosed concussions is on the high end as far as I've ever known, but especially now in football etc.
> 
> Did you know you can't even enter certain full contact fighting comps if you have a history over just a handful of diagnosed concussions?  They won't even let you fight, and you have to provide medical files to prove it (and that you don't have HIV etc).
> 
> Let's keep medical concussion separated from hitting your head, getting tackled, etc.  Big difference.



 "Concussions are among the 5 most frequent injuries for boys and girls in high school lacrosse. Boy’s lacrosse has the third-highest rate of concussions (0.42 per 1000 athletic exposures), next to ice hockey (0.46 per 1000 athletic exposures) and football (0.91 per 1000 athletic exposures). Girl’s lacrosse has the second-highest rate (0.38 per 1000 athletic exposures), next to soccer (0.67 per 1000 athletic exposures). "
@0:40  The guys story sounds like mine.  The only difference is that I didn't remember where I got hit.  I just know I got hit hard enough to where my vision cut out, When I got back up I couldn't find the teams playing nor the people who came to watch.  I heard them, I saw the field but visually the field was empty as if everyone went home.





Blindside hits are the norm in lacrosse.  This is the norm for Lacrosse not the exception.  Get hit like this and you won't even realize that your head hit the ground.






Just saying.  People get laid out on the regular.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> "Concussions are among the 5 most frequent injuries for boys and girls in high school lacrosse. Boy’s lacrosse has the third-highest rate of concussions (0.42 per 1000 athletic exposures), next to ice hockey (0.46 per 1000 athletic exposures) and football (0.91 per 1000 athletic exposures). Girl’s lacrosse has the second-highest rate (0.38 per 1000 athletic exposures), next to soccer (0.67 per 1000 athletic exposures). "
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 1 of 5 injuries ok.  20%.

1 concussion per kid?  .91 per 1000 seems pretty small to me.


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## Wing Woo Gar (Nov 7, 2022)

Darren said:


> If it your first no! I have had 5-6 concussions things seem to be alright!!


That’s what you think.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> blindside hits are the norm in lacrosse.  This is the norm for Lacrosse not the exception.  Get hit like this and you won't even realize that your head hit the ground.


Those aren't necessarily concussions


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 7, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> 1 of 5 injuries ok.  20%.
> 
> 1 concussion per kid?  .91 per 1000 seems pretty small to me.


It's not as small as you think.  That count that is recorded is just that.  It doesn't include those who have concussions but don't report it. Cases where atheletes "Walk it off" don't get put in the books.

I've had more than 2 concussions in my life.  It's just that I only got medical treatment for 2


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> It's not as small as you think.  That count that is recorded is just that.  It doesn't include those who have concussions but don't report it. Cases where atheletes "Walk it off" don't get put in the books.
> 
> I've had more than 2 concussions in my life.  It's just that I only got medical treatment for 2


Ok. 

So let me ask you.

Did either of those 2 include magnetic resonance imaging?


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## Gyakuto (Nov 7, 2022)

I’m a little concerned about the (mis)information on this thread as a whole. Brain injury is very serious, cumulative and not to be taken lightly. I wonder if this thread should be locked and deleted.









						Chronic traumatic encephalopathy
					

Find out about chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE), a progressive brain condition that's thought to be caused by repeated blows to the head and repeated episodes of concussion.




					www.nhs.uk


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 7, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> Ok.
> 
> So let me ask you.
> 
> Did either of those 2 include magnetic resonance imaging?


I don't know.  I have gaps in those days from not being conscious for part of the experience.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 7, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> I’m a little concerned about the (mis)information on this thread as a whole. Brain injury is very serious, cumulative and not to be taken lightly. I wonder if this thread should be locked and deleted.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No need to lock it, if facts are being posted.  So far the advice to see a doctor is sound advice.  It also give the opportunity to present some documentation.  Not so much to tell what the OP should do, but to provide an opportunity to inform and correct gaps in understanding.


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## Gyakuto (Nov 7, 2022)

JowGaWolf said:


> No need to lock it, if facts are being posted.


A substantial amount of what I’m reading appear to be opinions.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 7, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> A substantial amount of what I’m reading appear to be opinions.


That's where the opportunity exists to post sources and additional information about Concussions.  Maybe like the type of concussion
For example: "Concussions are fairly common. Some estimates say a mild brain trauma is sustained every 21 seconds in the U.S." Source::  WebMD  Concussion: Symptoms, Causes, Treatments


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

WebMD is _not_ peer reviewed but written by medical doctors. Andrew Wakefield was a medical doctor and wrote the most deceitful paper ever published, on the MMR vaccine and it’s false link to autism and in doing so , popularised the anti-vax movement.


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## tkdroamer (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> A substantial amount of what I’m reading appear to be opinions.


Here in lies the problem. "Opinions or advise". Any person can post up links to support just about any opinion. So, are they information or misinformation.
They are definitely buyer beware.


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> Here in lies the problem. "Opinions or advise". Any person can post up links to support just about any opinion. So, are they information or misinformation.
> They are definitely buyer beware.


If the supporting evidence is ‘peer reviewed’ and/or from an independent (has no stake in the claim) educational establishment (University), a government agency (such as the NHS) and preferably from multiple sources saying the same things, then it moves from being an unsubstantiated opinion to substantiated and likely ‘true’ until further evidence says otherwise of course.


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## tkdroamer (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> If the supporting evidence is ‘peer reviewed’ and/or from an independent (has no stake in the claim) educational establishment (University), a government agency (such as the NHS) and preferably from multiple sources saying the same things, then it moves from being an unsubstantiated opinion to substantiated and likely ‘true’ until further evidence says otherwise of course.


Logical enough. But who is to say that even half of the links posted in this thread meet those requirements?


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> Logical enough. But who is to say that even half of the links posted in this thread meet those requirements?


It is the poster’s responsibility to check those data. 






						How to Tell if a Website is Credible | EasyBib
					






					www.easybib.com


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

I started read a BBC ‘Science’ magazine article about the Vagus nerve and anxiety states the other day. The article began within something like, …’the body is controlled by 12 nerves that travel down the spinal cord to the body - the vagus is one of these.’ This is absolutely incorrect and the sort of thing I might expect an ‘A’-Level student to say. I checked the authors credentials and she was a biology graduate and freelance science write.

I stopped reading after searching for a way to tell her about her error of fact (there wasn’t one). People will believe what she wrote because it’s a BBC publication and this new error will be perpetuated.


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## Steve (Nov 8, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> Ok.
> 
> So let me ask you.
> 
> Did either of those 2 include magnetic resonance imaging?


I’m pretty sure not in my case.  We’re MRIs a routine diagnostic in the 80s and before?   I don’t recall.  If anything, an MRI was pretty cutting edge and in our for profit medical industry, I would guess most people didn’t get the use of the most expensive machine in the facility.  😅


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

Steve said:


> I’m pretty sure not in my case.  We’re MRIs a routine diagnostic in the 80s and before?   I don’t recall.  If anything, an MRI was pretty cutting edge and in our for profit medical industry, I would guess most people didn’t get the use of the most expensive machine in the facility.  😅


CT Scans were common and their resolution is much better than most MRI scanners.


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## Steve (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> CT Scans were common and their resolution is much better than most MRI scanners.


That could be.  Which of those is the one with the tube?  I've had a couple of those for my back.  

Regarding the rest, I'll take you at your word.  Just sharing my experiences.  Maybe I just didn't have very good insurance.  We were pretty poor growing up.


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

Steve said:


> That could be.  Which of those is the one with the tube?  I've had a couple of those for my back.
> 
> Regarding the rest, I'll take you at your word.  Just sharing my experiences.  Maybe I just didn't have very good insurance.  We were pretty poor growing up.


MRIs are a ‘tube’. CT Scans are more like a polo mint 😀

In the U.K, head scans are routine for people with significant head injuries. My elderly father (RIP) once fell and banged his head on a bathroom sink and had quite an egg on his head! The paramedics came and wanted to take him to hospital for a head scan. As he lay on the bathroom floor, he told them to ‘P*ss off’ as he wasn’t going to wait for 4hrs in a drafty, cold A&E for a scan and since he was he a retire consultant physician he _knew_ his brain was fine 😂 He demanded a whiskey when they left….not his first of the day, I’m sure!🙄


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## Steve (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> MRIs are a ‘tube’. CT Scans are more like a polo mint 😀
> 
> In the U.K, head scans are routine for people with significant head injuries. My elderly father (RIP) once fell and banged his head on a bathroom sink and had quite an egg on his head! The paramedics came and wanted to take him to hospital for a head scan. As he lay on the bathroom floor, he told them to ‘P*ss off’ as he wasn’t going to wait for 4hrs in a drafty, cold A&E for a scan and since he was he a retire consultant physician he _knew_ his brain was fine 😂 He demanded a whiskey when they left….not his first of the day, I’m sure!🙄



Got it.  So, I've never to my knowledge had a CT scan for any reason.  Though, it's possible they did one the last time... I hit the bottom of a swimming pool with my head and spent the night in the hospital.  That night was a blur, to be honest, so who knows what they really did?  That must have been around 1986.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> If the supporting evidence is ‘peer reviewed’ and/or from an independent (has no stake in the claim) educational establishment (University), a government agency (such as the NHS) and preferably from multiple sources saying the same things, then it moves from being an unsubstantiated opinion to substantiated and likely ‘true’ until further evidence says otherwise of course.


This shouldn't be a problem as multiple sources can be posted to either verify or dispute another source.  In terms of medicine there will always be disputes not all doctors believe the same cure.  It wouldn't be the first time that multiple sources have been posted.  Studies are often temporary as well and there have been times where one study stated that a chemical was safe, only to learn more about it in the future and then reverse it.    Multiple sources = a more accurate picture.  A medical opinion is still valuable which is why people recommend getting that second medical opinion.  One doctor may know something that another one doesn't  One doctor may be more political.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 8, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> It is the poster’s responsibility to check those data.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is always a case even with peer reviewed documents and studies..


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## Gerry Seymour (Nov 8, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> We're not talking about how hard you got hit at Lacrosse.
> 
> 5-7 concussions is high, pro or amateur...
> 
> It's high compared to most humans living today.


That depends how you're defining concussion. If you're counting major concussions, you're probably correct. Many athletes have had a bunch of minor concussions (and yes, those count). I know of at least 2 I had playing soccer in a recreational league (hit in the head by a kicked ball) and at least two from bad falls in MA. I likely had one in a car accident as a kid. And that's just the ones I can think of off the top of my head. Soccer players who "head" the ball are likely suffering small trauma from that, though I doubt they'd often qualify as concussions. Football players are likely suffering minor concussions on a percentage of hard hits - we just don't have a good way to measure that at present.


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## Gerry Seymour (Nov 8, 2022)

Darren said:


> All they can do is ask ya questions see how ya respond tell ya to go home with somebody, make sure they wake ya up every hour to make sure you wake up, no sedation of any kind! Give you a aspirin if ya have a headache and see what happens a little later. At first reading is out, can’t concentrate really on anything, conversation is out ya seem to just be in a blur, sunlight hurts, ya just slowed down. Depending on how bad it is first time count on a few weeks to 3-4 months to get over it, effects can last 6-9 months afterwards guess it comes with age too!!  Maybe it has affected me somewhat then again there’s whatever! Have read were people get hit in the head and dies a few hours later. Life is strange!!!!!


I'm not a medical person (though I do have WFR certification), but aspirin is NOT recommended (nor are other NSAIDs) with a suspected concussion, bercause of the risk of bleeding.

Medical professionals can do much more than ask a few questions and suggest incorrect medication.


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## Gerry Seymour (Nov 8, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> Maybe you're an outlier dude, and I'll have to dig up some studies but 5 diagnosed concussions is on the high end as far as I've ever known, but especially now in football etc.
> 
> Did you know you can't even enter certain full contact fighting comps if you have a history over just a handful of diagnosed concussions?  They won't even let you fight, and you have to provide medical files to prove it (and that you don't have HIV etc).
> 
> Let's keep medical concussion separated from hitting your head, getting tackled, etc.  Big difference.


"Diagnosed" would mean those were seen by a medical professional. There is a long history in sports of NOT suggesting that.


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## Gyakuto (Nov 8, 2022)

Steve said:


> .  That night was a blur, to be honest, so who knows what they really did?


Do you remember what the aliens did to Cartman in the very first episode of South Park? 😉


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## Gerry Seymour (Nov 8, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> Let's keep it to the clinical definition, which is brain damage.  Traumatic closed head injury.
> 
> And yes, the brain is well protected in it's little pool from many impacts.  I've done both full contact sports and combat sports, including competition.  Never one concussion (well there was this one time playing tackle football with my buddies, major cooperative slam of two giants both going for the ball...it is was like matter and antimatter coliding).
> 
> Trained boxers take hundreds of strikes to the head (per fight in some cases, thousands over a career), few cause concussions.  Otherwise every pro and ammy boxer out there would have CTE.


There is some question whether all impact is the same. Axonal twisting appears to be in play for knock-out blows. Since part of the determination of risk is change in responsiveness, being knocked out seems to qualify as a concussion. And the brain's "little pool" doesn't protect well against that.

As for boxers, it's very likely more than we know have CTE. Without post-mortem examination, it's difficult to identify milder forms of it.


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## Gerry Seymour (Nov 8, 2022)

Oily Dragon said:


> 1 of 5 injuries ok.  20%.
> 
> 1 concussion per kid?  .91 per 1000 seems pretty small to me.


That's .91 per 1000 athletic exposures. We'd need to know what that term means. It seems likely that refers to a game or practice. If you're practicing 4 times a week and playing once a week, you'd hit 100 exposures in 20 weeks. I'm guessing that's close to a season's exposure.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 8, 2022)

Gerry Seymour said:


> "Diagnosed" would mean those were seen by a medical professional. There is a long history in sports of NOT suggesting that.


That's why I was glad to see it on the forms I had to sign to fight full contact.

If I had more than (I think it was 3) on file, sayonara baby.  Somebody somewhere was watching out for me.


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## Oily Dragon (Nov 8, 2022)

Gerry Seymour said:


> There is some question whether all impact is the same. Axonal twisting appears to be in play for knock-out blows. Since part of the determination of risk is change in responsiveness, being knocked out seems to qualify as a concussion. And the brain's "little pool" doesn't protect well against that.
> 
> As for boxers, it's very likely more than we know have CTE. Without post-mortem examination, it's difficult to identify milder forms of it.


This is why I focus on defense.  Hands up, chin tucked.  Neck strong.


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## JowGaWolf (Nov 8, 2022)

Steve said:


> That could be.  Which of those is the one with the tube?  I've had a couple of those for my back.
> 
> Regarding the rest, I'll take you at your word.  Just sharing my experiences.  Maybe I just didn't have very good insurance.  We were pretty poor growing up.


MRIs and CT weren't common.  Those were big ticket items back then.  Also concussions weren't viewed in the same light back then.  A bump on the head was just a bump on the head.  It was only a biggie if you passed out.  Repeated hits to the head.  I grew up on the Three Stooges so that gives a person some insight on how head injuries were viewed as lol.  and how to defend against eye pokes lol


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## tkdroamer (Nov 9, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> CT Scans were common and their resolution is much better than most MRI scanners.


If that is true (and I have no reason to believe it isn't) why are MRI's used so heavily in orthopedics?


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## Gyakuto (Nov 9, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> If that is true (and I have no reason to believe it isn't) why are MRI's used so heavily in orthopedics?


MRIs do not use powerful ionising radiation (X-Rays) to form an image whereas CT Scans do. There’s a limit to how many CT scans you can have in a year as a consequence and cannot be used at all on pregnant women. MRIs use tiny changes in magnetic flux’s caused by the rotation and realignment of protons in hydrogen molecules of the body. But you cannot use MRI scans if people have most types of ‘metal work’ in their body and even the repeated use of metallic scalpels can leave sufficient quantities of microscopic ferro- and paramagnetic particles in and around the incision as to ‘blur’ the MRI image. To avoid this you used to be able to buy flint/obsidian scalpel (yes…dragonglass 😄) but they're very pricy and I can’t find them online anymore 🤔


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## tkdroamer (Nov 9, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> MRIs do not use powerful ionising radiation (X-Rays) to form an image whereas CT Scans do. There’s a limit to how many CT scans you can have in a year as a consequence and cannot be used at all on pregnant women. MRIs use tiny changes in magnetic flux’s caused by the rotation and realignment of protons in hydrogen molecules of the body. But you cannot use MRI scans if people have most types of ‘metal work’ in their body and even the repeated use of metallic scalpels can leave sufficient quantities of microscopic ferro- and paramagnetic particles in and around the incision as to ‘blur’ the MRI image. To avoid this you used to be able to buy flint/obsidian scalpel (yes…dragonglass 😄) but they're very pricy and I can’t find them online anymore 🤔


Ah, that explains a lot. I am chocked full of metal.


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## Gyakuto (Nov 9, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> Ah, that explains a lot. I am chocked full of metal.


Wolverine? Is that you?


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## Darren (Nov 9, 2022)

Gerry Seymour said:


> I'm not a medical person (though I do have WFR certification), but aspirin is NOT recommended (nor are other NSAIDs) with a suspected concussion, bercause of the risk of bleeding.
> 
> Medical professionals can do much more than ask a few questions and suggest incorrect medication.


Going from my last experience.


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## tkdroamer (Nov 9, 2022)

Gyakuto said:


> Wolverine? Is that you?


???


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## Gyakuto (Nov 9, 2022)

We used to be made to watch an MRI safety video from tim-to-time of a work man entering an MRI room with a hammer. As he walks in and approaches that ‘tube’ the fixed magnet pulls out his arm/hammer very forcefully, but he manages to keep hold of it. Then they turn on the variable magnetic and his arm starts rotating in circle, getting more and more violent. In the end, he lets go of the hammer and it flies through the air into the MRI tube at high speed into a strategically placed breeze block and smashes it to pieces!


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## Darren (Nov 9, 2022)

tkdroamer said:


> ???


Don’t know if this was directed to me? But no wolverine here! But very ferocious animals I hear!!!!!


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