# Dr. Larry Sanders ???



## tshadowchaser (Aug 13, 2002)

I'm posting a note that was placed in the Sikaran web site guestbook. (Yes I have permission to do so)  can anyone provide me with any information about the gentelman who signed it and his claims to be Mr. Delaneys first instructor?
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                             Entry posted 8/5/02 from Sikaran Guestbook:  

                             Gretings to my Sikaran brothers and sisters. I have been a practitioner of the martial arts for 46 years and of Sikaran for 32.I am the original instructor of
                             Grandmaster Jeff Delaney who now heads Remy Presas organization. People always asked me if my kicks were Chinese,Japanese, or Korean I always said
                             Yes...and Sikaran if i'm in a real fight.Sikaran has always been what I call the epitome of kicking.May you and your organization grow and live long. Dr Larry
                             Sanders Founder Nei Wai Chia Martial Arts

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Just courious as to who he is  I have no knowledge of him or what he now teaches.  Any information will be helpful.
Shadow:asian:


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## Cruentus (Aug 13, 2002)

But I would guess that if he knew anything, he would be smart enough not to admit to have taught jokester Delaney anything.

Oops....did I say that out loud?


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## streetwise (Jan 31, 2003)

Dr Sanders, of Austin, Tx,  teaches an eclectic blend of CMA styles, with a little BJJ, FMA, and Aiki thrown in. His lineage is Chin Wu based, and the guy will train ANYTHING that he can get. A friend who has a high rank in Shorin ryu was teaching his stuff to Dr Sanders and his students, I know he goes down to San Antonio whenever the Yang Tai Chi guys have the old Master in from China.  He is pretty darned good at Wing Chun, and I have seen some of his students who have excellent N. Shaolin skills. I don't know if he was Jeff's first instructor, but Jeff studied with him for years and taught at his old location in East Austin. I attended a seminar with Grandmaster Remy Presas at Dr Sanders' kwoon many years ago. To show what a wide range of things are doen there, I also attended a Ron Van Browning/Frank Shamrock!!/Guy Mezger seminar there.

And Paul, I hope that was just a joke. If not, what is your beef with my old BJJ/FMA training partner?


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## Cruentus (Jan 31, 2003)

It was kind of a Joke.......but kind of not, unfortunatily.

I used to like Jeff, we were both "classmates," if you will, under GM Remy Presas.

Based on his actions, I don't like him anymore. I think he's a clown. This goes back to a lot of Modern Arnis politics that you may or may not know about, but Jeff basically got his "rank" on Professors death bed. He then broke away from one of the Modern Arnis Organization's, gave himself the title of "Grandmaster of Modern Arnis," and has been riding on the Presas name ever since the poor mans death. Unfortunatily I think that people had the bad habbit of "using" Professor Presas, and there are many people who are loyal to him (like myself) who won't stand for it.

Frankly, I think Jeff Delenay was lookin' for a new meal ticket, and he found one at the expense of my teacher and my art, and he took his screw-buddy Lisa Mcmanus and a few others with him in the confusion. It brightens my day everytime a member of his group leaves his organization and joins another, when they realize what really has been going on.

His group caused a rucca's for many people here in Michigan also when He and Lisa REFUSED to drop a certain Deno Cain from his group. Deno Cain operated a Martial Arts school here in Michigan. He is now up for charges for molesting children. Another friggin' thing I can't stand is child molesters. The allegations have been known by many prominant people in the martial arts community for about 6 years now, there just wasn't enough evidence for a conviction until now. Regardless, I know for a fact that people had begged and PLEADED for Jeff and Lisa to drop Deno Cain from the group, yet they kept him on board, at least until Mr. Cain was arrested. I'm sure it was profitable for them though. They maybe got 1 or 2 seminars in before the S**t hit the fan for Deno...probably made a few bucks. I hope the few bucks were worth supporting a child preditor.

Now if Jeff had done the right thing I and others wouldn't have had a problem with him. He could of broke away and started his own style, and called it "ackward-lanky Texan Arnis" for all I would of cared, but instead he used my teacher and his name in exploitation. His business practices and organization are based upon lies and deception. And it's exactly this kind of B.S. that ruins the reputation of Modern Arnis, and of Martial Arts in general.

Now, I really don't mean offense to you or Dr. Sanders....I don't know either of you enough to pass any kind of judgement. But your friend Jeff....He's a clown. Also, just a side note, he and his people have had ample opportunities to publically address these issues, as well as others. They continue to hide behind their martial arts ads, their web-site, and their colorful inflated language instead. 

A wise man once said, "You can be the master of the universe if you never leave your own backyard." That's just fine with me...but if he is ever ready to come out and play I'll be waiting for him with my cane. That is, if the many others who want a piece of him don't beat me to it. And if he has a problem with anything I have said, then he can address it with me personally. Hopefully it will be face to face.

Time will only tell who the real master is.....and who's the b**ch!      :soapbox: 

Well, sorry for the rant. Hopefully that answered your question. I don't know what your current ralationship is with Jeff now, but if you see him, send him my regards.

Thanks
PAUL

 :apv:     :2pistols:


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## streetwise (Jan 31, 2003)

Ahh, the old politics thing. With Grandmaster Presas' passing I guess this was to be expected. Jeff has little contact with Dr Sanders, though I still see them both from time to time. He is unlikely to address personal attacks, as I have heard him express admiration for many of the people involved, and we have a mutual dislike of martial lineage feuds. I have never heard him express anything negative about other Modern Arnis instructors, no matter what affiliations they have. And now no one alive knows what Grandmaster Presas intended.

I do know that GM Remy Presas held Jeff in high regard, both for his skills, and personally.

"I'll be waiting for him with my cane. That is, if the many others who want a piece of him don't beat me to it. " How mature, but since Jeff is constantly teaching all around the country, he has never been hard to find.

Sorry to have brought up an issue so painfull for you.


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## Rich Parsons (Jan 31, 2003)

> _Originally posted by tshadowchaser _
> *I'm posting a note that was placed in the Sikaran web site guestbook. (Yes I have permission to do so)  can anyone provide me with any information about the gentelman who signed it and his claims to be Mr. Delaneys first instructor?
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> 
> ...




Shadow,

I know it is a technicality, but could you state that Jeff Delaney is heading * One * of the Modern Arnis Organizations. It will avoid the other groups feeling slighted or taken offense when none was meant.

Just a thought on peace within the Modern Arnis Family.

Train Well :asian:


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## Cruentus (Jan 31, 2003)

> I do know that GM Remy Presas held Jeff in high regard, both for his skills, and personally.



Remy Presas was  nice guy. He held almost everyone in high regard, but that also caused a problem, unfortunatily.



> How mature, but since Jeff is constantly teaching all around the country, he has never been hard to find.



Mature? I know you are but what am I! Yea, I guess that wasn't really that mature at all. 

Although he may be "traveling around the country" as you put it, he stays clear of other people in Modern Arnis from other organizations. He steers clear of his critiques because many of them are correct. He has not made any attempt to talk with his peers regarding the matter, at all. 

Plus, this isn't feudel Japan, or a Barangay under Marcus' rule; no one in their right mind is going to purposely find him at one of his seminars and challange him, or even confront him without a law suit.

I'm glad to hear that he seems nice, but killing you with kindess then stabbing you in the back is all to common these days.

Oh...and terms of "Nobody know GM Presas true intention," all I have to say is that there are a lot of past posts on this forum, as well as others regarding the matter. But, let's just say that there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes, and evidence shows that Jeff was not supposed to go off by himself and claim to be the true heir to the art, or "the Grandmaster".

Sorry to get so heated here; this is just the way I feel.

Good luck with your training.

Respectfully,
PAUL  
:asian:


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## streetwise (Feb 3, 2003)

Ok, now I know your point of view. Jeff doesn't need me to defend him, but I will add that I, personally, use Grandmaster as a title for the head of a "political" association or "system" within a style. This is sort of CMA-centric, but it seems to work. In other words, I don's care if there are 20 "Grandmasters" in Wing Chun (or Modern Arnis), they can each do their thing and I will do mine. Jeff is a good instructor, and has advised me that I would enjoy working with several of the "competing" groups, especially the ones with close "Phillipine connections". 

Take note of the chaos lineage fights have caused in CMA. THOSE guys can feud like the Chinese equivilant of hillbillies! In the end, our disputes seem, to me anyway, sort of small when compared to what we all have in common.


I have been off polishing a few MMA skills of late, but I am planning to do more FMA in the next few years, maybe we will get a chance to train together. 

            The Best to You and Yours


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## Cruentus (Feb 3, 2003)

Training together? That would be neat; if I am ever in Texas I'll let you know.

In terms of "grandmaster" title; I actually have no problem with the use of any title, it's just the lying and the deception that gets me.

I was doing a lot of thinking this weekend; I had my 25th B-day on Sunday. I've been thinking more about wisdom; some people can be so wise about certian things, yet so lost or ignorant about others. I was just thinking that it would be much wiser for me to not get so worked up over political issues. It is my duty to disagree with people, or to speak up if I see something harmful going on. It is not my duty to make snide remarks about other people and organizations, even if I feel that there motives are selfish and dishonest. It is one thing to say, "I don't like what that group/person stands for or does." It is quite another to belittle and challange people out of anger.

I apoligize for subjecting you and others to my anger, even if the anger was totally justified and not directed specifically at you. 

"Do not worry, Faulino, just relax." A very wise instructor once said that to me, and I would be better off listening.

 :asian:


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