# Arnis and Escrima



## The Kai (Oct 14, 2004)

I've heard, but can't be sure that teh art of Escrima ifluenced early Kenpo.  Supposedly there was a lot of Escrimador's on hawaii-inwatching them the Kenpo pioneers were taken with the movements.
True or 
False ?
Todd


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## Doc (Oct 14, 2004)

The Kai said:
			
		

> I've heard, but can't be sure that teh art of Escrima ifluenced early Kenpo.  Supposedly there was a lot of Escrimador's on hawaii-inwatching them the Kenpo pioneers were taken with the movements.
> True or
> False ?
> Todd


In my opinon that would be incorrect. The greatest influence on early Kenpo in Hawaii would be Japanese/Okinwan, including a great deal of what came to be Henry Okazaki's Jiu-jitsu, which dominated the islands. I know of no significant Erscrima presense at the time. Perhaps John Bishop, (whom I consider THE historical expert) could enlighten us all more.


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## John Bishop (Oct 24, 2004)

The Kai said:
			
		

> I've heard, but can't be sure that teh art of Escrima ifluenced early Kenpo. Supposedly there was a lot of Escrimador's on hawaii-inwatching them the Kenpo pioneers were taken with the movements.
> True or
> False ?
> Todd


I can't speak for EPAK, but Kajukenbo and it's offshoots like "Karazenpo Goshin jutsu",Shaolin Kempo, etc. do have a escrima influence.  
Sijo Emperado, and most of the early Kajukenbo instructors were Filipino-Hawaiians.  Just about all of them had some or a lot of exposure to escrima/kali. And it's still true today with most of the Filipino-Hawaiian instructors.  In fact escrima is so popular with Kajukenbo practitioners that we even have stick fighting divisions at our annual tournament in Las Vegas. 
If you take a look at the empty hand strikes in Kajukenbo you'll see what the escrima people call "limb destruction" type strikes.  These are bottom fist cutting type strikes to the muscles of the arms.  These and other empty hand strikes are done in the same fashion that a escrimador would do with a knife or stick.


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 24, 2004)

At some point in their carrers, Remy Presas, Bruce Lee and several other notables all spent some quality time with Ed Parker.  There was a definate exchange of ideas from all involved.  I've seen FMA in Kenpo, and Kenpo in Modern Arnis for example.  The Seniors can hopefully give some detail on that time period as sadly all three of those gentlemen are no longer here.


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## Doc (Oct 24, 2004)

Kaith Rustaz said:
			
		

> At some point in their carrers, Remy Presas, Bruce Lee and several other notables all spent some quality time with Ed Parker.  There was a definate exchange of ideas from all involved.  I've seen FMA in Kenpo, and Kenpo in Modern Arnis for example.  The Seniors can hopefully give some detail on that time period as sadly all three of those gentlemen are no longer here.



That is an interesting observation sir, however Bruce Lee is not a part of the equation in that he actually brought very little to the table in the presence of the other two. Bruce was essentially a young novice martial artist with tremendous athletic talent and an intense resolve to train. Both Ed Parker and Wally Jay were quoted publicly commenting on his talent, but that he was not yet knowledgeable.

Bruce learned his Filipino Martial Arts weapons from Dan Inosanto, A Parker black belt, as most know, who left to exchange ideas and train with Bruce. In many ways, these two men were much alike. Dan had studied many arts including a stint with Ark Wong, (one of Parkers teachers), and Jimmy Woo, along with the Filipino Martial Arts and Pentjak Sila, among others, and he brought that knowledge to the Lee group. Parker often said that Dan taught Bruce much more than the other way around.

Although he had a great deal of respect for the Filipino Masters, (he knew them all) Parker thought more of the Filipino empty hand methodology than he did the weapons. He felt the weapons material was too culturally laden with large movements he felt were impractical for the novice.

Working on his own methodologies he created some interesting concepts but never finished his weapons work, and instead opted for moving his empty hand techniques slightly modified with sticks.

His original club work took some interesting perspectives designed for modern streets, but he never finished the work.


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