# Ju-jitsu



## steven.g.sellars

Hi all I'm looking for an instructional DVD of DVD quality covering Ju-jitsu gradings from white belt up to black belts but all the ones I've found so far are old vhs remastered poorly and don't really show the requirements for grading! Can anyone help? 


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## Tez3

Can your instructor tell you what is needed?


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## steven.g.sellars

Yeah but it more for when I'm at home 


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## Chris Parker

There is no such single system as jujutsu (ju-jitsu, jiu-jitsu, or any variant). As a result, there is no  single curriculum for "white to black belt" (classical systems won't even have any such rankings, of course). To help narrow it down, can you say which system of "ju-jitsu" you are studying?


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## steven.g.sellars

Bushido 


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## Chris Parker

Er... is that a "style", is it? If so, I will say that it is certainly a modern, Western creation... not anything really similar to Japanese jujutsu systems, nor indeed terribly alike to Brazilian jiu-jitsu (itself based in early Judo). Most likely, it's an amalgam of a range of modern arts, such as karate, boxing, judo, wrestling, maybe some weaponry with more or less legitimacy depending on exactly what's being taught. As a result, there is nothing outside of your own school that can offer what you're after... you will need to see if there's anything your teacher/school can supply.


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## steven.g.sellars

No we do both traditional and modern 


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## Chris Parker

Then name the ryu-ha. I can save you some time... you won't be able to. You don't learn one. You learn something you've been told is "traditional jujutsu", but believe me, it isn't. Now, that's not a bad thing in and of itself... unless  you invested yourself in the idea that that's what you were actually learning. If you enjoy it, and enjoy the classes, get what you need out of them, that's great... and all that's needed, really. But if you're actually after genuinely traditional (classical) Japanese jujutsu, you haven't found it.


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## Tony Dismukes

In addition to the points Chris makes (which are all correct), I will add that _if_ your instructor is teaching a system he/she calls "Bushido Ju-jitsu", then that is not a widespread art. Most likely it would be something your instructor (or their instructor) came up with which is taught at no more than a few schools. In that case, the only instructional videos available for that system would be whatever was put out by your instructor or their organization and would probably only be available for sale through that organization.

It may be more likely that "Bushido Ju-Jitsu" is the name of the school, not the art. There are a number of schools out there with names like "Bushido Ju-Jitsu Academy." These schools are named for the sake of a cool sounding brand more than anything else. The actual art they teach may be any of a large number of jujutsu/jiu-jitsu/ju-jitsu systems. If you want to know whether instructional videos might be available for that particular art, you'd need to find out the full name of the art being taught. If your school has a website you could point us to, we might be able to take a look and see what we can tell on the matter.


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## Steve

Not really sure what you're looking for.  The best product I've seen for BJJ that outlines what you need to know and be able to do at each belt level are the "Requirements" videos by Roy Dean.


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## Chris Parker

Except he's not looking for BJJ... and this isn't the BJJ section... he's after something that will help him with the grading requirements for his school... so....


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## Steve

Chris Parker said:


> Except he's not looking for BJJ... and this isn't the BJJ section... he's after something that will help him with the grading requirements for his school... so....


Look, Chris.  I'm trying to help the guy.  You're trying to run him off the site.  He said "traditional and modern" and no one knows exactly what he's looking for.  So....

(and those videos are excellent)


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## Chris Parker

I'm not arguing the quality of Roy Deans videos... but you didn't read the OP properly, didn't pay attention to the forum this thread is in, the section of the forum this area is in, the subsequent posts by the OP that clarified a few things, and as a result gave a suggestion that has absolutely no relevance. That's not helping, that's ignoring the actual thread and request itself, and arrogantly thinking that your form of training is going to be relevant when it's simply not.

Look, you can 'dislike' all my posts you want... but you have yet to be able to actually argue against them. And I'm not running anyone off anywhere... for the record, I know of some two dozen or so "Bushido Jujitsu" groups...  all different, but all modern, Western interpretations of what they think "jujutsu" is... none of them are legitimately traditional (in the sense of traditional jujutsu), with quite a few being less than spectacular, but with some being quite good modern systems. Until we know which one, we can't say anything definitive... other than that it is not something universal enough to actually have the material and resources out there that the OP is after, and that it certainly isn't traditional jujutsu nor BJJ.

I heartily recommend you get that chip off your shoulder where I'm concerned, take a step back, and actually read what's written.


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## Xue Sheng

Post deleted


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## Brian R. VanCise

Steven, do you have a website link to your school so that we could help you better?


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## Chris Parker

Brian R. VanCise said:


> Steven, do you have a website link to your school so that we could help you better?



This.

As mentioned, Steven, there are a large number of schools that use the name (or a variation of) Bushido Jujitsu. Clarifying will help a great deal.


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## Tony Dismukes

Steve said:


> Not really sure what you're looking for.  The best product I've seen for BJJ that outlines what you need to know and be able to do at each belt level are the "Requirements" videos by Roy Dean.


Of course, those videos really only address the belt requirements for Roy's school(s). They wouldn't really be applicable to the belt requirements for the vast majority of BJJ schools. (That isn't to say they aren't excellent BJJ instructionals _in general_, they just don't address the promotions requirements for most schools.)


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## Steve

Chris Parker said:


> I'm not arguing the quality of Roy Deans videos... but you didn't read the OP properly, didn't pay attention to the forum this thread is in, the section of the forum this area is in, the subsequent posts by the OP that clarified a few things, and as a result gave a suggestion that has absolutely no relevance. That's not helping, that's ignoring the actual thread and request itself, and arrogantly thinking that your form of training is going to be relevant when it's simply not.
> 
> Look, you can 'dislike' all my posts you want... but you have yet to be able to actually argue against them. And I'm not running anyone off anywhere... for the record, I know of some two dozen or so "Bushido Jujitsu" groups...  all different, but all modern, Western interpretations of what they think "jujutsu" is... none of them are legitimately traditional (in the sense of traditional jujutsu), with quite a few being less than spectacular, but with some being quite good modern systems. Until we know which one, we can't say anything definitive... other than that it is not something universal enough to actually have the material and resources out there that the OP is after, and that it certainly isn't traditional jujutsu nor BJJ.
> 
> I heartily recommend you get that chip off your shoulder where I'm concerned, take a step back, and actually read what's written.


Chris, please.  Would this person be the first to post something like this in the wrong subforum?   The guy asked for some suggestions about belt requirements from white to black.  I offered a suggestion and was specific that it applies to BJJ.

Edit.  To clarify, I wasn't trying to post anything definitive.  I was offering a simple, helpful suggestion.  You're kind of crapping all over the thread.


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## Steve

Tony Dismukes said:


> Of course, those videos really only address the belt requirements for Roy's school(s). They wouldn't really be applicable to the belt requirements for the vast majority of BJJ schools. (That isn't to say they aren't excellent BJJ instructionals _in general_, they just don't address the promotions requirements for most schools.)


Agree, but they're not off base, and are a solid baseline regardless of school.  (BJJ only, of course.)


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## Brian R. VanCise

We are all just spinning wheels here until we have a more definitive answer to what ju-jitsu style he trains in or website link to his school.


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## Tez3

Chris Parker said:


> This.
> 
> As mentioned, Steven, there are a large number of schools that use the name (or a variation of) Bushido Jujitsu. Clarifying will help a great deal.



I know of a Bushido Karate Association, a Bushido Judo School and a Bushido School of Martial Arts as well of hearing about a Bushido Warriors School.


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## Tony Dismukes

Steve said:


> Agree, but they're not off base, and are a solid baseline regardless of school.


Yeah, from what I've seen, Roy Dean is an excellent teacher and I'm sure his videos could be helpful for a BJJ student wanting pointers on the foundations of the art. He learned from Roy Harris, who is a very detail-oriented instructor. I just don't want anyone from a different BJJ organization thinking that their own school will necessarily follow that specific promotion curriculum.


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## Chris Parker

Steve said:


> Chris, please.  Would this person be the first to post something like this in the wrong subforum?   The guy asked for some suggestions about belt requirements from white to black.  I offered a suggestion and was specific that it applies to BJJ.
> 
> Edit.  To clarify, I wasn't trying to post anything definitive.  I was offering a simple, helpful suggestion.  You're kind of crapping all over the thread.



No, they wouldn't be. But they have also chosen it specifically... and have also never mentioned BJJ... not even spelt it the BJJ way. They have also named their system (Bushido)... and have described their system as "traditional and modern"... all of which was before you made your suggestion. What I'm trying to avoid is the OP thinking it's the same thing, and that your advice is valid.

Dean's videos are great. But they have no place in this discussion... which five minutes of reading would have told you.


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## Steve

Tony Dismukes said:


> Yeah, from what I've seen, Roy Dean is an excellent teacher and I'm sure his videos could be helpful for a BJJ student wanting pointers on the foundations of the art. He learned from Roy Harris, who is a very detail-oriented instructor. I just don't want anyone from a different BJJ organization thinking that their own school will necessarily follow that specific promotion curriculum.


Absolutely.  I guess I'm presuming that, regardless of school or style, anything will be strictly supplemental because the person responsible for establishing standards is the school owner.


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## Steve

Chris Parker said:


> No, they wouldn't be. But they have also chosen it specifically... and have also never mentioned BJJ... not even spelt it the BJJ way. They have also named their system (Bushido)... and have described their system as "traditional and modern"... all of which was before you made your suggestion. What I'm trying to avoid is the OP thinking it's the same thing, and that your advice is valid.
> 
> Dean's videos are great. But they have no place in this discussion... which five minutes of reading would have told you.


Why are you attacking me, Chris?   And could you please stop?  And don't you think it's for the OP to decide whether my suggestion was unhelpful or helpful?  If you don't have enough information to evaluate the op, then you don't have enough information to evaluate the appropriateness of my suggestion.


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## Tony Dismukes

Steve said:


> Would this person be the first to post something like this in the wrong subforum?


He would be by no means the first, but usually BJJ is well branded enough that most students know they are studying BJJ and not some other branch of the JJ family. Based on the name and the spelling he's using, I'm wondering if it might be something like this place: Bushido Ju-Jitsu | The Art of Self-Defence.



Steve said:


> Absolutely.  I guess I'm presuming that, regardless of school or style, anything will be strictly supplemental because the person responsible for establishing standards is the school owner.



For BJJ, yeah. In a lot of other systems there are specific requirements for promotions laid down by the governing association for that style, often many levels above the individual school owner.


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## Brian R. VanCise

Let's wait and here from the OP regarding more information about his system so that we can help him better!


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## Chris Parker

Steve said:


> Why are you attacking me, Chris?   And could you please stop?  And don't you think it's for the OP to decide whether my suggestion was unhelpful or helpful?  If you don't have enough information to evaluate the op, then you don't have enough information to evaluate the appropriateness of my suggestion.



For one thing, I'm not attacking you, I'm correcting you, and providing context for your answer to the OP. For another, you're the one who is harassing me with the negative ratings on almost every post I make these days, regardless of whether or not you have any actual valid reason to use them (it really is just a personal issue you have, and nothing to do with the content of my posts, you realise... I mean... take post 23 above that you "Disagree" with.... I basically just list exactly what is in the thread, and point out how your BJJ videos have no place... so what do you disagree with?), so might I ask you to stop that unless you actually have some argument against me? And finally, no, that's not correct at all... I have more than enough information to say that your suggestion is completely irrelevant to their situation, and there is nothing to suggest that the OP is experienced enough to recognise that themselves.



Tony Dismukes said:


> He would be by no means the first, but usually BJJ is well branded enough that most students know they are studying BJJ and not some other branch of the JJ family. Based on the name and the spelling he's using, I'm wondering if it might be something like this place: Bushido Ju-Jitsu | The Art of Self-Defence.



Yeah, that was one of the potentials I found... but, not knowing the OPs location, it could be that, similar, or very different... for example, here's another (less quality) school with the same name:







Tony Dismukes said:


> For BJJ, yeah. In a lot of other systems there are specific requirements for promotions laid down by the governing association for that style, often many levels above the individual school owner.



Yep. Very much based on the school itself... as Brian said, we'll need to wait for clarification from the OP... but regardless, the answer he's after will most likely be to talk to the instructor....


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## Steve

Tony Dismukes said:


> He would be by no means the first, but usually BJJ is well branded enough that most students know they are studying BJJ and not some other branch of the JJ family. Based on the name and the spelling he's using, I'm wondering if it might be something like this place: Bushido Ju-Jitsu | The Art of Self-Defence.
> 
> For BJJ, yeah. In a lot of other systems there are specific requirements for promotions laid down by the governing association for that style, often many levels above the individual school owner.


not disputing any of that.  And, as I said before, the OP may look at the Roy Dean vids and determine they aren't relevant.  No problem.

I'm genuinely confused by the nuclear response to a very simple suggestion that no one can say for sure isn't helpful to the OP.


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## Chris Parker

I can say that for sure. He's not doing BJJ. It's not a help for him for his grading requirements in a different system.


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## Steve

Chris Parker said:


> For one thing, I'm not attacking you, I'm correcting you, and providing context for your answer to the OP. For another, you're the one who is harassing me with the negative ratings on almost every post I make these days, regardless of whether or not you have any actual valid reason to use them (it really is just a personal issue you have, and nothing to do with the content of my posts, you realise), so might I ask you to stop that unless you actually have some argument against me? And finally, no, that's not correct at all... I have more than enough information to say that your suggestion is completely irrelevant to their situation, and there is nothing to suggest that the OP is experienced enough to recognise that themselves.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, that was one of the potentials I found... but, not knowing the OPs location, it could be that, similar, or very different... for example, here's another (less quality) school with the same name:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep. Very much based on the school itself... as Brian said, we'll need to wait for clarification from the OP... but regardless, the answer he's after will most likely be to talk to the instructor....


Chris, please.  You've managed to completely derail the thread.  I'm sorry, but I'm just going to have to ignore you going forward.


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## Chris Parker

You do realise that you could have avoided that by saying "oh, sorry, didn't realise it wasn't BJJ", yeah? But you kept arguing when it was obvious to everyone... and I'm derailing the thread? Okay, Steve...


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## Steve

Brian R. VanCise said:


> Let's wait and here from the OP regarding more information about his system so that we can help him better!


i see absolutely no problem with offering a simple suggestion.  It was specific enough to make the context of the suggestion clear and would take the OP very little time to evaluate its relevance to him.

You guys had the interview well in hand.  Instead of adding more questions, I proposed a possible answer.    Nothing I wrote undermined or contradicted any of the useful posts that came before it.   Why wait?


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## Xue Sheng

Oh for crying out loud...everybody... take some deep breathes and relax...

What on earth does this bickering have to do with anything the OP asked? If the actual concern is chasing of new posters then explain to me exactly how starting an argument in their thread helps. And of course I absolutely understand no one is at fault and the "He started" defense is being used

This is what was posted



steven.g.sellars said:


> Hi all I'm looking for an instructional DVD of DVD quality covering Ju-jitsu gradings from white belt up to black belts but all the ones I've found so far are old vhs remastered poorly and don't really show the requirements for grading! Can anyone help?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




1) Need to find out what style he is talking about

2) Find out what DVD, if any exist, that can help him in with his grading question

3) Possibly get posters with similar style backgrounds to give some helpful input if necessary, or possible

3) Move on (hopefully) having help him, if possible, with his question


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## Steve

Xue Sheng said:


> Oh for crying out loud...everybody... take some deep breathes and relax...
> 
> What on earth does this bickering have to do with anything the OP asked? If the actual concern is chasing of new posters then explain to me exactly how starting an argument in their thread helps. And of course I absolutely understand no one is at fault and the "He started" defense is being used
> 
> This is what was posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1) Need to find out what style he is talking about
> 
> 2) Find out what DVD, if any exist, that can help him in with his grading question
> 
> 3) Possibly get posters with similar style backgrounds to give some helpful input if necessary, or possible
> 
> 3) Move on (hopefully) having help him, if possible, with his question


This is how the argument started, xue.  


Chris Parker said:


> Except he's not looking for BJJ... and this isn't the BJJ section... he's after something that will help him with the grading requirements for his school... so....


. How is this a mystery to anyone?


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## Xue Sheng

Don't care, like I said, I am fully aware that the "He started" defense will be in play here.

Can we just drop it and focus on what the OP is asking


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## steven.g.sellars

Lankin Fa rings a bell 


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## Xue Sheng

steven.g.sellars said:


> Lankin Fa rings a bell
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Would it then be associated with this

St Mary's Centre - Lankin-Fa Jujitsu

I am not a JJ guy, I was in the early 70s so I am likely of little help with your actual question, but I can help with working to clarify


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## steven.g.sellars

Not sure only been doing it for 6 weeks now I do know my instructor was a personal student of the late Prof Bill Rankin


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## Xue Sheng

steven.g.sellars said:


> Not sure only been doing it for 6 weeks now I do know my instructor was a personal student of the late Prof Bill Rankin
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Then this may help others point you in the right direction

Prof. Bill Rankin 

Bill Rankin was a student of Yukio Tani


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## steven.g.sellars

Funny enough that's the club I'm at 


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## oaktree

steven.g.sellars said:


> Hi all I'm looking for an instructional DVD of DVD quality covering Ju-jitsu gradings from white belt up to black belts but all the ones I've found so far are old vhs remastered poorly and don't really show the requirements for grading! Can anyone help?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi Steven there is no one set of Jujutsu grading standard as Jujutsu is a pretty generic word unless it is  particular ryuha(school) of Jujutsu. You can ask your sensei for references about your schools grading system.
I am going to assume it is this:
Bushido Ju-Jitsu | The Art of Self-Defence
You can read more about the teacher on this thread

Important new info. on British jiujitsu history and lineage!!


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## Xue Sheng

steven.g.sellars said:


> Funny enough that's the club I'm at
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



I shall now get out of the way and let those, like oaktree above, and others, who know more about the topic than I, give you what help they can


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## oaktree

So I am guessing the line falls into Fusen Ryu as Yukio Tani was a student of that style, OP it is doubtful to find dvds to teach you that style.


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## Steve

steven.g.sellars said:


> Not sure only been doing it for 6 weeks now I do know my instructor was a personal student of the late Prof Bill Rankin
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


if you're only 6 weeks into training, you are probably better off working directly with your coach.  A common mistake in BJJ is guys start looking on the web for extra help and it gets overwhelming.


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## Tony Dismukes

oaktree said:


> So I am guessing the line falls into Fusen Ryu as Yukio Tani was a student of that style, OP it is doubtful to find dvds to teach you that style.


There may be a lineage leading back to Fusen Ryu, but the current system the OP is studying is called Lan-Kin-Fa Ju-Jitsu and the founder reportedly brought into it influences from Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi and possibly more. If any instructional videos exist for the style, they probably would have to come from the Chief Instructor of the school the OP trains at, since he is apparently the current head of the system.


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## Tez3

Xue Sheng said:


> Then this may help others point you in the right direction
> 
> Prof. Bill Rankin
> 
> Bill Rankin was a student of Yukio Tani



Mmm, now I realise the article was based on reminiscences by someone else but I'm afraid the military history part doesn't add up. 4 commando wasn't a training regiment, there wasn't a regiment called just 'the Border Regiment' and the his name isn't on the nominal roles of any of the 12 Commando Regiments. Sorry but while that means nothing to most and isn't I suppose relevant here I had to point it out in sadness.



oaktree said:


> You can read more about the teacher on this thread
> 
> Important new info. on British jiujitsu history and lineage!!




This however is opening up a whole can of worms because of one name on there. James Shortt, who despite the description really hasn't been there and done that. He is what we call here a 'Walt' who has fabricated a whole web of lies about his military service, he was outed in the national press and has made the squaddies very angry at the same time. Baron Castleshort
The Baron of Castleshort Fake SAS Conman – In Ukraine ? | Alternative

The martial arts stuff I will leave you to sort out for yourselves, it makes my head hurt but certainly give me a shout about the military bits!


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## Tony Dismukes

Tez3 said:


> The martial arts stuff I will leave you to sort out for yourselves, it makes my head hurt but certainly give me a shout about the military bits!


The membership in the "World Head Of Family Sokeship Council" is a bit of a red flag, but there are plenty of legitimately skilled martial artists out there who for some reason have felt the need to try impressing people with phony military history or inflated mail-order ranks. Mr. Rankin may have been one of them.


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## Tez3

Tony Dismukes said:


> Mr. Rankin may have been one of them.



Or indeed his student in a case of reflected 'glory'. The military part of me demands I have to look these things up, there is complete lists of all the nominal rolls from the war time years online and despite having Viking swords, shields and food to sort for the Rainbow Guides to sort I had to look! It was actually the story of him besting the instructor that caught my notice, I've heard that so many times from so many people........
I'm sorry if I've derailed the thread, blame it on military OCD lol. Still it gets away from other disagreements


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## oaktree

Tony Dismukes said:


> There may be a lineage leading back to Fusen Ryu, but the current system the OP is studying is called Lan-Kin-Fa Ju-Jitsu and the founder reportedly brought into it influences from Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi and possibly more. If any instructional videos exist for the style, they probably would have to come from the Chief Instructor of the school the OP trains at, since he is apparently the current head of the system.


Ya I saw that lan kin fa nonsense oh well. I think fusen Ryu is a lot cooler.


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## Gerry Seymour

steven.g.sellars said:


> Bushido
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That's even more generic than jujutsu.


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## Buka

Welcome to MartialTalk, Steven.


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## steven.g.sellars

The Border Regiment was formed in 1881 till is was amalgamated with the King's Own Royal Regiment (Lancaster) into the King's Own Royal Border Regiment in 1959


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## Tez3

I am on Catterick Garrison and have checked with the Infantry Training Centre's archivist.
There was a Border regiment but for the Second World War they went into the Lancashire Fusiliers, then into the 1st Glider Brigade part of 1st Airborne and went to Sicily. Later most were lost in Operation Market Garden.
Kings Own Border Regiment went into the Duke of Lancaster's Regiment who have not long gone to Cyprus from here in Catterick.
All infantry regiments recruits however train here.


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## Flying Crane

Tez3 said:


> I know of a Bushido Karate Association, a Bushido Judo School and a Bushido School of Martial Arts as well of hearing about a Bushido Warriors School.


I've also heard of a modern system called "Budo Jiu-Jitsu" or some spelling variant, founded by a guy named Al Thomas back some time in the 1960s to 1980s or thereabouts.  He had a promotional video sort of introducing his system, featuring a few well known fellows to help endorse it, including Benny Urquidez and Up-Chuck Norris.  I have no idea if the system is still practiced or taught anywhere anymore.

Could be this...


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## Flying Crane

Steve said:


> This is how the argument started, xue.
> . How is this a mystery to anyone?


Chris is right, actually.  There is no mystery.

Let's move along.


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## Steve

Did we ever get to the bottom of this border regiment thing?


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## steven.g.sellars

Yes there was a regiment called the border regiment 


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