# Serious Help for beginner needed



## mcjayded (Jun 2, 2008)

attention all!  looking to get kickstarted in martial arts training.  Im not at all interested in MMAs..im wanting to find one that fits me that i can concentrate on and work hard at and at the sametime...an art that TRULY is practical.  In my area there isnt a wide range of arts offered.  the majority being Karate(a few different styles), Hapkido, Kung-Fu, Kickboxing fitness, Tae Kwon Do, and ShaoShin Ryu.  With that said, I have a very strong wrestling/grappling background im looking to become an expert on my feet.  Which of these would be my best bet to incorporate kicks/strikes/throws/submissions.  Ive did my research but every one seems to offer them same thing.  any help would rock!

Jared


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## bowser666 (Jun 2, 2008)

I studied Kenpo and that was fun for stand up.  I am currently studing Shaolin Longfist and that is even more fun !!!  It is not the easiest of styles but it is rewarding and a lot of fun. Especially when you get into intermediate ranks and start weapons training


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## Shodan (Jun 3, 2008)

What part of the country do you live in?  My vote is for Parker's Kenpo (if available).....but I am slightly biased!!


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## CrimsonPhoenix (Jun 3, 2008)

Well it sounds as though you've got a more wide selection than I do. I know of only two Tae Kwon Do schools in my area and a Karate school even farther away. 

I'm not that well versed in many other styles as I do Tae Kwon Do with a little Judo and Hapkido mixed in. Not all schools are alike and so my Tae Kwon Do class may take a different path in what it teaches than the than the one in your city. Mine incorporates a lot of punches and kicks (to be expected in TKD) and a good bit of self defense. My advice to you however would be to visit some of the schools that interest you and see if you can sit and watch a class or two if you haven't already. It's not just about the art either, but also the instructor. You could have a perfectly good martial art and it be watered down by mediocre instructors. 

Best of luck!


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## Jade Tigress (Jun 3, 2008)

mcjayded said:


> attention all!  looking to get kickstarted in martial arts training.  Im not at all interested in MMAs..im wanting to find one that fits me that i can concentrate on and work hard at and at the sametime...an art that TRULY is practical.  In my area there isnt a wide range of arts offered.  the majority being Karate(a few different styles), Hapkido, Kung-Fu, Kickboxing fitness, Tae Kwon Do, and ShaoShin Ryu.  With that said, I have a very strong wrestling/grappling background im looking to become an expert on my feet.  Which of these would be my best bet to incorporate kicks/strikes/throws/submissions.  Ive did my research but every one seems to offer them same thing.  any help would rock!
> 
> Jared



Well, kickboxing fitness is out if you're looking for something applicable. That would just be an exercise class. Tae Kwon Do would depend on how sport oriented the school in your area is. Karate and kung fu depends on the styles. Just like sport Tae Kwon Do, you wouldn't want to train modern wushu for self-defense. 

Take some time to visit the schools in your area and see what they're about. Also, Martial Talk has specific forums for the arts mentioned, so you may want to do some reading on them and see what appeals to you. 

Good luck and keep us posted.


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## terryl965 (Jun 3, 2008)

Jade Tigress said:


> Well, kickboxing fitness is out if you're looking for something applicable. That would just be an exercise class. Tae Kwon Do would depend on how sport oriented the school in your area is. Karate and kung fu depends on the styles. Just like sport Tae Kwon Do, you wouldn't want to train modern wushu for self-defense.
> 
> Take some time to visit the schools in your area and see what they're about. Also, Martial Talk has specific forums for the arts mentioned, so you may want to do some reading on them and see what appeals to you.
> 
> Good luck and keep us posted.


 
Jade has given some great advice here go and talk and listen.


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## Xue Sheng (Jun 3, 2008)

Jade Tigress said:


> Well, kickboxing fitness is out if you're looking for something applicable. That would just be an exercise class. Tae Kwon Do would depend on how sport oriented the school in your area is. Karate and kung fu depends on the styles. Just like sport Tae Kwon Do, you wouldn't want to train modern wushu for self-defense.
> 
> Take some time to visit the schools in your area and see what they're about. Also, Martial Talk has specific forums for the arts mentioned, so you may want to do some reading on them and see what appeals to you.
> 
> Good luck and keep us posted.


 
What she said

As far a Kung Fu is concerned, as Jade said, it depends on the style.


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## shesulsa (Jun 3, 2008)

I'm a little stumped because you said you wanted to know "Which of these would be my best bet to incorporate kicks/strikes/throws/submissions."  This really depends on who's teaching.  It is not uncommon for people teaching and running martial arts schools to be trained in more than one art and to bring their cumulative knowledge to whatever they decide to teach.

I think the more important question for you to ask of yourself is "why do I want to train?" What is your purpose? What do you hope to get out of it? If it is to be another form of fitness for you, you can get fitness out of most sport-based systems and your own extra physical training.  If you want self-defense to supplement a law-enforcement career or just for your person as your main concentration ... well whatever it is you want to get from martial arts training, you're going to have to beat feet and talk to as many instructors and visit as many schools in your area as you can stand plus a couple more.  

Take your time.  It's easy to fall in love with something quickly and just forsake looking at everything else. Ask if you can sign a waiver and get on the mat a couple times for free to have a feel for it. Watch about three or four classes.  This should give you a rudimentary idea if it's the place for you.

Good luck!


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## arnisador (Jun 3, 2008)

mcjayded said:


> an art that TRULY is practical.  In my area there isnt a wide range of arts offered.  the majority being Karate(a few different styles), Hapkido, Kung-Fu, Kickboxing fitness, Tae Kwon Do, and ShaoShin Ryu.



There are so many styles of Karate and Kung Fu that it's hard to say. Of your list, I'd favor Hapkido given your background and goals (and I would not have rules out MMA so quickly either). But, the instructor and how he trains the art matters most! Visit several schools. You need a coach who will help you integrate your knowledge and abilities and new techniques for your weaknesses. Arts like JKD and, yes, MMA could be good for you if available!


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## Kacey (Jun 3, 2008)

Visit the classes available, talk to the instructor(s) and students, and see which one fits your interests and personality - this is, ultimately, more important than the style; if you don't like how the instructor teaches, or the climate of the class, you won't stay, and nothing else will matter.


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## nitflegal (Jun 3, 2008)

Speaking as a guy who has bounced around a lot due to frequent moves I'd suggest that the teacher is more important than the style.  I started in Shotokan karate with a great teacher and the stuff was effective and useful.  Moved and tried to continue with Shotokan and the teacher was not so good and the art was flat and lifeless.  I am very partial to Bujinkan Taijutsu and have had the good fortune to have some great teachers.  However, when I moved to an area without a good teacher I studied other arts and didn't regret it.

Matt


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## gilgsn (Jun 5, 2008)

Truly practical... I'd say choose a style that:

- Doesn't concentrate on sport and competitions.
- Doesn't have too many (or no) rules.
- Doesn't emphasize belts and ranks too much, or at all.
- Isn't stuck in old traditions, no longer evolving.
- Includes weapons training, especially against knives.
- Trains for multiple opponents, not just one.
- Includes ground and 'on your feet' practice.
- Does some sparing without protections (slow).
- Doesn't concentrate too much on techniques, but rather principles.

I could go on...

If you see 12 year-olds with black belts, RUN!
If they promise you a black belt next year, RUN!

Other than what I practice myself (Systema), I have seen some styles that look interesting, on a practical basis.. I am sur there are more..

- Wing Tsun
- Bujinkan (NinJutsu)
- Penjak Silat
- Kali
- Kuntao

Just on top of my head...
I don't think Kickboxing fitness or Tae Kwon Do are what you want. They just have different objectives. Jade is right..

I hope this helps..

Gil.


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## Supra Vijai (Jun 10, 2008)

gilgsn said:


> Truly practical... I'd say choose a style that:
> 
> - Doesn't concentrate on sport and competitions.
> - Doesn't have too many (or no) rules.
> ...



Hey everyone,

This if my first post on MT although I have been reading a few forums and I tend to agree with the points mentioned above by gilgsn. I am a practitioner of Ninjutsu myself (I'll be the first to admit I'm a newbie - 6 months training @ 1 class a week). However, it's the most versatile art I've found in my city. I don't train with the Bujinkan, I actually train with one of the "X-Kan"s that has split from them and our organisation takes a very different approach the traditional and the modern techniques. 

White belts and Black belts alike spar together (contact sparring) and learn from each other and our Sensei's are brilliant. Really helps having someone teaching you who know what they are talking about and are willing to help you progress in both your mental and physical understanding of your particular art.  

But back to the topic, I'd recommend trying to find a Ninjutsu school even if it's not around the corner from you (my dojo is an hours drive for me but it's a trip I make gladly every time). The art teaches Ground defence/fighting, How to fight on your feet, Unarmed defence against Punches/Kicks/Grapples and the sort, Unarmed and Armed defence against weapons, Breakfalling, Rolling, Limb controls, Strikes and Kicks, Ki projection, Intuition awareness and Sensory Perception, Meditation and so much more and it is truly a well rounded experience and one that I would recommend to anyone looking for an art to call their own. 

Interesting thing to note also is that the majority of "real" Ninjutsu organisations will not place emphasis on competitions (over here in Australia, most Ninjutsu practitioners are not even allowed into the ring in tournaments) but will rather place on the emphasis on personal growth at your own pace. 

Just my 2 cents  Sorry to have rambled on a bit


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## JoeW (Jun 11, 2008)

I would say ken/mpo i good for street self defense.  They focus on a lot of "dirty" fighting i.e striking the throat, groin, back of neck, spine ect..  If your looking for just striking and fitness I would go kickboxing.


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## Twin Fist (Jun 11, 2008)

Here is my advice, based on my experience.

There are different levels of complexity in the martial arts. 

I started with TKD, a comparitively simple art. I then moved on to kenpo which is much more complex.

this worked out very well for me.

Kenpo is very good for self defense, but requires a more complex understanding to make it really effective.

Pick a hard style like TKD or one of the karate's, and try it for at least 6 months. if nothing else, you will get a good idea of the basics of the  arts. 

if you like it, fine, stick around till at least BB level before you try out a different art.

But one thing to remember, the man makes the art, the art doesnt make the man.

if it is right for you, it is right.






mcjayded said:


> attention all!  looking to get kickstarted in martial arts training.  Im not at all interested in MMAs..im wanting to find one that fits me that i can concentrate on and work hard at and at the sametime...an art that TRULY is practical.  In my area there isnt a wide range of arts offered.  the majority being Karate(a few different styles), Hapkido, Kung-Fu, Kickboxing fitness, Tae Kwon Do, and ShaoShin Ryu.  With that said, I have a very strong wrestling/grappling background im looking to become an expert on my feet.  Which of these would be my best bet to incorporate kicks/strikes/throws/submissions.  Ive did my research but every one seems to offer them same thing.  any help would rock!
> 
> Jared


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## newGuy12 (Jun 11, 2008)

Kacey said:


> Visit the classes available, talk to the instructor(s) and students, and see which one fits your interests and personality - this is, ultimately, more important than the style; if you don't like how the instructor teaches, or the climate of the class, you won't stay, and nothing else will matter.


Right -- this is the most important thing.  You have to meet the Teacher, and the Assistant Instructors if you can, and see the School.  Do you want to train with this group of people?  This trumps everything, in my opinion.

If you watch the class, and if they are going about doing things, when the Teacher says something, everyone should STOP and be mindful of the Teacher.  That is, the Teacher should always be in control of the enviroment.  This shows that the students are endowed with good respect, as they should be!



Twin Fist said:


> Kenpo is very good for self defense, but requires a more complex understanding to make it really effective.
> 
> Pick a hard style like TKD or one of the karate's, and try it for at least 6 months. if nothing else, you will get a good idea of the basics of the arts.
> 
> if you like it, fine, stick around till at least BB level before you try out a different art.



This also, is very good advice, in my opinion.  My personality is such that I enjoy the "rowdy" feeling of the TaeKwonDo practice.   The warmups get me going well.  When everyone turns around and yells, then I know, okay, its time to kick HARD, its time to rock and roll, now!!!  I feel this energy of the group moving together, I enjoy that a lot. 

It is also very expressive, it has kicks that produce BIG power!  I like that and the ways and means of the Dojang!

That said, you may also wish to look into the American Kenpo.  It has many smaller moves put together in such a way that it is not so much one or two BIG strikes, but many "smaller" strikes all linked up very nicely.  It is hard for me to say what this means, but you will see!

In any event, who can say what you will enjoy the most?  Only you can say that.





Keep in touch with us and let us know how you get along with this!   


Robert


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## bowser666 (Jun 12, 2008)

Style in my opinion isn't that big of a deal.  You need to decide what your goals are? Are the fitness oriented ? Competition oriented ? Or are you more interested in tradition?  What you seek to gain is what is most important , not " oh I think thsi stlye is better so you shoudl try it...........  or avoid systems with belt rankings etc.........  That really has nothing to do with it.  Just keep in mind certain factors as some styles can be more physically demanding than others, meaning some like KungFu may emphasize lots of low stances , very leg intensive, or Muay Thai which is also leg intensive as well etc...  Or Wing Chun which is very hands intensive, ( yes there are kicks as well but emphasis is mostly on footwork and hand techniques)  Think of what might best compliment your stature and what might interest you the most.  I personally am training in Shaolin KungFu because I am fascinated with all the weapons they train with   That is my personal preference though. So think hard on those items and whatever choice you make will be a good one.


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## KamonGuy2 (Jun 13, 2008)

newguy12 has it spot on. 

There are some arts like BJJ that have a fabulous reputation but some schools are less friendly or less intense than others

When I first trained in BJJ I went to one school and the instructor was a bit of a bully
However I then went to Roger Gracie academy in London and the guys are the best people you would ever want to train with

For standup, I love wing chun, even though I have done boxing, karate, TKD and MT. This is more to do with the progressive nature of Kamon and Master Chan

Get down to the classes and have a look. The attitude of the teacher is an important part of your training (ie is he open minded, strict, aggressive, friendly, knowledgable of other arts etc)


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