# Horse Stance variations



## JDenver (Apr 23, 2009)

Hi all -

I finally found a qigong class in my area (see my other, painful thread).  The Sifu spoke very broken English and breezed in and out of the session, making any questions challenging.

So, my qigong horse stance is either the typical qigong rest posture, or, at best, widened to 1 1/2 width with toes angled out.  While doing this type of palm qigong (sorry, no names from Sifu), we did HORSE STANCE WITH TOES POINTED INWARDS.

I'd love to hear any thoughts on the subject.  It was an odd posture for this newbie, more used to Zhan Zhuang----


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## JadecloudAlchemist (Apr 23, 2009)

Like this?

http://www.shaolinkungfu.nl/images/img_mabu.jpg

Or like this?

http://www.martialdevelopment.com/wordpress/wp-content/images/tsui-sheung-tin-snt.jpg

I really do not know what Qigong it is so I can not really commit on it.

But lets look at it in Anatomy structure.
 When you stand feet apart normally everything is straight knees right under feet everything is an alignment.
When place the toes pointing out the Kua opens more then if the feet are staight. If the toes are pointing in the Kua closes more. Different teachers have different theories on close vs open and for starting out a deeper wider horse stance will help you feel root more externally while a closed Kua is more internal closing type feeling.  I do not know the style the teacher's history or anything so can not really comment.


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## JDenver (Apr 23, 2009)

The shaolin pic is closer to what I might do in a deep stance, though toes not so forward.  That second pic is exactly how the Sifu had us stand!

Okay, closed or open kua ---- interesting and I'll read more.  I also see that the use of horse stance is based on their teaching styles.  This Sifu does Choy Lee Fut, but I know nothing of the type of qigong, which centred on the meridians through hand positions, no focus to dan tian or breathing or 'closing' the system with the tongue ..........


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## Xue Sheng (Apr 24, 2009)

Its all Ma Bu, I wouldn't worry to much about it beyond what your Sifu tells you to at this point. Don't rush it, qigong taked time.

Some forms of Qigong in the beginning are just more intersted in simply standing, not focus, just trying to quite your mind and let things flow naturally.


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## pete (Apr 24, 2009)

probably not pointing toes inward, but as I've been taught, alignment of the inside edges of the large toes to be parallel lines pointing forward will feel as if they are pointed inward.

the inguinal crease (kua) should still remain open, by gently lifting upward through the crown of the head and outward through the knees... the inguinal crease will close only if you are not activating the connections from knees to feet. in fact, the lower back (mingmen point) will close as the feet are turn outward from this alignment. 

further, to develop deeper rooting you should feel the circular connection from the hip crease, through your knees, through the feet, and meeting somewhere below the surface of the floor. the better this physical alignment is balanced by (a) the lifting through the crown of the head and (b) the elimination of mental stress and muscular tension... the deeper your root will go.

hope this helps,
pete


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## Quotheraving (Apr 24, 2009)

The toes turned inward stance is common in Wing Tsun as you can see here...




I suspect that it has crept into Taiji and Qigung through people cross training in that art... though I really can't be sure about that.

What makes me think that this may be the case is that the only form of Taiji that I know of which uses this stance for their Wu Chi (beginning rest stance) and for their QiGung exercises is taught by Waysun Liao and his Taiji form shows many other tell-tale signs of cross pollination from Wing Tsun.


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## East Winds (Apr 25, 2009)

Yes, good post Pete.

When the toes turn out the Kua opens and the Sacrum closes. When the toes turn in the Kua closes and the Sacrum opens. The balance is the toes pointing ahead. If the outsides of the feet are parallel then the toes tend to point inward and if the insides of the feet are parallel, the toes tend to point outward. Depends on what you are attempting to achieve.

Very best wishes


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