# Bagua again



## Xue Sheng (Oct 4, 2012)

A chance to train bagua for a month or two popped up so I took advantage of it.

Training Bagua agian for a bit....so far so good


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## arnisador (Oct 4, 2012)

I took a weekend seminar in it once--that's my whole experience of it. Different!


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 4, 2012)

Last time I officially I trained it was about 18 years ago and then it was only forms


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## oaktree (Oct 4, 2012)

What type are you doing?


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 5, 2012)

&#31243;&#24311;&#33775;


:EG:



Chéng


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 11, 2012)

So far, still basics and a drill or two and it is actually pretty awesome. More basics than I got 18 years ago and that is a good thing and a drill I had not done before too.. Im happy


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## oaktree (Oct 11, 2012)

There is a drill I like to do. I like to use an old pair of shoes
And pretend that is an opponents feet. I might put one forward
To act as someone stepping in throwing a punch.
I practice kou bu and bai bu stepping like this.
It helps your angles and change of directions working on
Trips and setting up throws and getting behind a person.


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 14, 2012)

In my basement today practicing Mud stepping in a straight line and in a circle, then I did some work on a heavy bag trying to figure out blocking and some attack and you know what I discovered........

Baguazhang is pretty damn cool

I also came to an understanding, at least for me, that taiji and xingyi are at opposite ends of the spectrum and bagua is in the middle&#8230; that is if you stay within neijia


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## arnisador (Oct 14, 2012)

Mud stepping?


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## DaleDugas (Oct 14, 2012)

Stepping with the feet slightly off the ground and sliding the foot forward then attaching it to the ground and then shifting the weight forward on to it and then doing the same thing with the other leg.  Pistoning the legs forward and back like you were stepping through mud.


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## OzPaul (Oct 15, 2012)

Mud stepping sounds like slow marching in the Army...


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 15, 2012)

cheng style bagua - mud walking step and 8 palms


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## OzPaul (Oct 15, 2012)

Thanks for the video.  Can you explain the things he is doing please?  I am interested and have no idea about internal arts


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 15, 2012)

Walking the circle doing Cheng 8 palm form, beyond that I don't have much.

Baguazhang


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## oaktree (Oct 15, 2012)

Hi OzPaul
I think what the video is the Cheng 8 Stake/Fixed form. 2 other Baguazhang styles I have seen use it as that. 
  Here is an example of the Cheng Mother palm set:




It is interesting to see the first palm change compared to other styles.

I will see if I can find some other stake/fixed sets, I don't know if anyone put any online. 

 As to what the stake set is for. I was told it was for training, But I do not see why it could not be used for application.


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## ilhe4e12345 (Oct 17, 2012)

i miss my training in Bagua. I havent been able to train since my minor surgery on my knee and getting over a back injury. Im just starting to get back into being able to do forms (spent almost an hour and a half doing nothing but Bung Bo, Shaolin 8 Step and Long Fist 1) as well as some of the Xingyi elements and a little wing chun) but my back is still a little sore. I really cant wait till im back to 100% so i can start training again. I havent seen Sifu Rick (my bagua teacher) in so long 

I love Bagua...its so relaxing and such a great style. Im really glad I found Sifu Rick, hopefully soon I can get back to training


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 18, 2012)

Well that was cool

Still liking Baguazhang, still happy I went but it looks like there is only one more class

I was used for apps demonstration and it was mighty cool.... but there is one thing I can't figure out... was rest of the class was really not getting it or was it they just enjoyed seeing me get beat on


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## blindsage (Oct 28, 2012)

Xue Sheng said:


> cheng style bagua - mud walking step and 8 palms


This is basically mud stepping, and the way most people do it, but doing the way he does will ruin your knees.  I know of a couple older masters who have serious knee problem because of this and other issues.  It also goes against the basics of how most teacher's teach the way mud stepping should be done, but they step this way anyway.


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 28, 2012)

blindsage said:


> This is basically mud stepping, and the way most people do it, but doing the way he does will ruin your knees.  I know of a couple older masters who have serious knee problem because of this and other issues.  It also goes against the basics of how most teacher's teach the way mud stepping should be done, but they step this way anyway.



I do not doubt what you are saying but that is Liu Jing Ru and he has been doing Baguazhang and Xingyiquan since 1957 and from what I have seen of him his knees appear fine


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## blindsage (Oct 28, 2012)

And they very well might be, but a lot of people's aren't.  Ever heard people say "I can't do Taiji, it hurts my knees?"


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## oaktree (Oct 29, 2012)

A lot of the knee issues are due to not having correct structure. If you are not properly sinking in the kua and sinking in the knees you will have problems.
 If you are twisting your knee you will have problems. My teacher says always check your structure, feel where you are sinking.

But you are correct Blindsage many people practice incorrectly and develop knee problems in the internal arts.


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## Xue Sheng (Oct 29, 2012)

blindsage said:


> And they very well might be, but a lot of people's aren't.  Ever heard people say "I can't do Taiji, it hurts my knees?"



Yeah but they were all Southern Wu people 

I do not doubt it happens, since it does happen in Taiji, but that is due to doing the stance wrong (training incorrectly) and I have no doubt that the same can be said of Bagauzhang as well.


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## blindsage (Oct 29, 2012)

Xue Sheng said:


> Yeah but they were all Southern Wu people


Well of course!



> I do not doubt it happens, since it does happen in Taiji, but that is due to doing the stance wrong (training incorrectly) and I have no doubt that the same can be said of Bagauzhang as well.


Absolutely, and if you look at the way the mud stepping is done in the video (and in a LOT of bagua videos) you can see how it violates those same alignment principles that cause problems.  The knees are out waaayyyy too far past the feet.   A lot of bagua people do this because it looks good for demos and on camera, but it violates the principles they usually teach their own students.


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