# Tear gas deployed against Occupy: Oakland.  Crackdowns begin across the US.



## Bob Hubbard (Oct 26, 2011)

Reports are trickling in that Oakland California police have deployed tear gas against Occupy: Oakland protesers who had reportedly become violent and begun throwing rocks and paint at police.  Mainline media reports are spotty as all major news media helicopters needed to get fuel at the time the gas was deployed. No reporters were on the ground as the protesters had previously made it clear their safety was at risk should they stay.



> [h=2]Media Turns Away As Oakland PD Fires Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets At Protesters[/h]             Occupy Oakland activists were very adamant last week when  they forbade reporters from recording them, even to the point of  assaulting and siccing a dog on them. So they shouldnt be surprised  when the media turned its cameras off as police fired tear gas, bean  bags and flash grenades at the activists Tuesday night, turning an  American city into a blistering war zone. Was it the right thing [...]



Police in Atlanta Georgia arrested a number of protesters after some were seen carrying weapons, including an assault rifle.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/us/occupy-wall-steet/index.html?&hpt=hp_c1

Additional reports indicate that police are now moving on Occupy camps in Albuquerque New Mexico, and Portland Maine.

NYC is also reported to be preparing to move on the original movement however several other reports on that front have contradicting news.


My question is a simple one.  How many people will be killed in what is ultimately a doomed and misguided and misdirected effort?


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## granfire (Oct 26, 2011)

Ok, just looking at a little snipped of the supposed facts:
Tell me again, why exactly is it bad to keep assault rifles out of private hand?


But over all, I suppose it was to be expected. Peaceful protest does have a long standing history of attracting the (mostly unemployed) nuts and trouble makers. Eventually the protests will become a stage for the anarchists. 

(In retrospect, I am still amazed that the East German protests in 89 did not turn violent, though in that case courtesy of the state)


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## Empty Hands (Oct 26, 2011)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Police in Atlanta Georgia arrested a number of protesters after some were seen carrying weapons, including an assault rifle.http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/us/occupy-wall-steet/index.html?&hpt=hp_c1



Bit of a double standard, none of the guys like this were arrested:








Bob Hubbard said:


> Additional reports indicate that police are now moving on Occupy camps in Albuquerque New Mexico, and *Portland Maine*.



Now that is funny.  I happened to be in Portland on business last Saturday, and saw the Occupy group.  There were *maybe *9-10 people.



Bob Hubbard said:


> My question is a simple one.  How many people will be killed in what is ultimately a doomed and misguided and misdirected effort?



Probably none.  If some do die however that doesn't make protestors engaging in Constitutionally protected speech in the wrong.  No more than if the cops had decided to shoot up all the Tea Partiers carrying guns and assault rifles at their rallies.


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## granfire (Oct 26, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> Bit of a double standard, none of the guys like this were arrested:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am assuming the man with the red hat is not a LEO....


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## JohnEdward (Oct 26, 2011)

One thing is it is Oakland, and if you have lived there you know what I mean, and you would think something like this would have already happened in New York. In any large peaceful demonstration like this you're going to have  antagonizer(s) who are bent on the intent to break the peace and turn things into chaos. Be it a cop, someone sent in, or a rouge individual.  It goes along the lines of how in the hell do riots break out in some cities and not others after large sporting events. Do you discredit all sporting events because of the fans in a city go rouge and riot, because there are injuries and deaths?  Overall, for the length of time and duration, and so far after all these months  this event has been peaceful, with no deaths as implied.  The worse that has happened that has made the headlines up until this point is rouge New York cops pepper spraying peaceful unsuspecting woman as it where sport.  If this didn't cause a riot in New York then it says the protesters resovle is doing the Gandhi.


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## Carol (Oct 26, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> I happened to be in Portland on business last Saturday



Aww you didn't say hello?  Bummer


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## JohnEdward (Oct 26, 2011)

As many years ago that it was I hope lessons are learned from the  Kent State shootings, I hope. As pointed out by another poster here there are no groups carrying automatic rifles or side arms openly among the protestors. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings.


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## Empty Hands (Oct 26, 2011)

Carol said:


> Aww you didn't say hello?  Bummer



I thought you were in Mass?  I only had a few hours.


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## Carol (Oct 26, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> I thought you were in Mass?  I only had a few hours.



I left Mass and went north!  Bought a condo up in New Hampshire.     Business travel on a Saturday stinks...I'm sure you would rather be at home with your family!   But if you're this far north again, I'd be more than happy to head over to Portland to meet you for a drink or a bite.


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## Empty Hands (Oct 26, 2011)

Carol said:


> I left Mass and went north!  Bought a condo up in New Hampshire.     Business travel on a Saturday stinks...I'm sure you would rather be at home with your family!   But if you're this far north again, I'd be more than happy to head over to Portland to meet you for a drink or a bite.



I will remember that!  It's possible I will be moving to Portland in the next 4-5 months, but I'm not sure yet.


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## Carol (Oct 26, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> I will remember that!  It's possible I will be moving to Portland in the next 4-5 months, but I'm not sure yet.



Very cool! Definitely keep me in the loop.  Try not to move north in January or February if at all possible, moving in the snow gets....challenging.


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## billc (Oct 26, 2011)

Here you go OWS guys...


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## JohnEdward (Oct 26, 2011)

I get the picture it is funny. Another would be instead of the riot police, a group of hot women in bikinis standing around a guy looking like The Donald sitting on the deck of a mega yacht smoking a Bolivar and holding a bottle of Cristal with  a scraggly worn out protester as a foot rest, with the same heading underneath it. I wish, I had photoshop.


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## ballen0351 (Oct 26, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> It's possible I will be moving to Portland in the next 4-5 months, but I'm not sure yet.


Wow from Fla to Portland thats a shock to the system weather wise.


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## David43515 (Oct 27, 2011)

Okay, so let me get this straight. This is just a summary of the news reports I`ve read lately on Yahoo News and CNN but here goes. 

Protesters are carrying weapons where they are actually illeagal, they`ve been interfereing with fire and rescue personell called into treat injured people, they`ve been crapping and pissing all over the sidewalk, they`ve threatened and chased off bystanders (the press), and they have had physical and sexual assaults take place in their groups that they`ve tried to talk people out of reporting. Now that their trash is piling up to the point that it`s created a public health risk they`ve been told to move on to another location until it can be cleaned up or they`ll face arrest. And after they`ve been moved by police they try to return and in the process begin throwing rocks and paint at police officers. (Some peacefully do the sit in thing and are arrested&#12288; for trespassing and such) The ones who were coming back,  disturbing the peace,interfereing with the police and occasionally assulting an officer with a rock or bottle of paint got tear gassed. Is that how it stands?

And they`re saying that violates their free speech? Like the old saying goes, my right to swing my arm ends where your nose begins. Their refusal to work within the system society sets up to make changes just enssures that 1) the changes they want won`t happen and 2) that society will end up turning on them.


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## kegage (Oct 27, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> Bit of a double standard, none of the guys like this were arrested:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Here's the story I found on this man.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PHXBeat/60504

Kevin


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## Empty Hands (Oct 27, 2011)

ballen0351 said:


> Wow from Fla to Portland thats a shock to the system weather wise.



It won't be my first.  I've moved from Oregon, to Baltimore MD, to Los Angeles, then to Florida, now Maine or who knows where else.  The life of a scientist.


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## granfire (Oct 27, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> It won't be my first.  I've moved from Oregon, to Baltimore MD, to Los Angeles, then to Florida, now Maine or who knows where else.  The life of a scientist.



And the view from the dungeon of the Ivory Tower is the same everywhere, no?


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## Sukerkin (Oct 27, 2011)

David43515 said:


> Okay, so let me get this straight. This is just a summary of the news reports I`ve read lately on Yahoo News and CNN but here goes.
> 
> <snip many good and pertinent statements>
> 
> And they`re saying that violates their free speech? Like the old saying goes, my right to swing my arm ends where your nose begins. Their refusal to work within the system society sets up to make changes just enssures that 1) the changes they want won`t happen and 2) that society will end up turning on them.



The thing that troubles me in the background to this is that the image of the protesters' being delivered by the media seems largely one made of cliches deliberately chosen to inflame right-minded peoples opinions against them.  Whilst it may well be true that they are all like that after all, the worry is that we, the ignorant viewer/listener/reader have no way of easily verifying the truth of the image being delivered.

Which means that they who decide what image we are fed are the ones with an inordinate sway on the turn of events - that is not comfortable.


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 27, 2011)

Police in Ohio and Albany NY have reportedly refused to remove protesters who have been acting peaceful and within the law.  In Buffalo, the protest is literally across the street from city hall which has given some approval of the encampment provided they continue to be peaceful. To my knowledge, there haven't been any arrests in the Buffalo group...though they are reportedly getting quite sick of donated ramen noodles.


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## JohnEdward (Oct 27, 2011)

That was funny...."sick of donated ramen noodles."  :spitcoffee:


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## ballen0351 (Oct 27, 2011)

Empty Hands said:


> It won't be my first. I've moved from Oregon, to Baltimore MD, to Los Angeles, then to Florida, now Maine or who knows where else. The life of a scientist.


Nice I live outside Baltimore now.


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## Empty Hands (Oct 27, 2011)

ballen0351 said:


> Nice I live outside Baltimore now.



I lived in Owings Mills, and commuted to U. Maryland downtown by the subway.


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## Grenadier (Oct 27, 2011)

With regards to the protester who was hit by a flying object and got a fractured skull, he just happens to be an Iraq War veteran.  It's a shame that the idiotic protesters keep trying to bring up his veteran status...  

First, and foremost, I thank him for his military service to our country.  

However, just because you are a war veteran does NOT give you the right to interfere with law enforcement carrrying out their lawful orders. 

If you don't want to take the risk of getting hit by flying tear gas cannisters, rubber bullets, etc., then simply put, obey the orders given out by the police.  When they tell you to disperse, obey the law, and disperse.  It's that simple.


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## crushing (Oct 27, 2011)

So this is what happens when a pro big government movement comes face to face with the government.


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## billc (Oct 27, 2011)

I am still not sure why they aren't protesting in front of congress or the white house or the offices of Reid, Pelosi, Frank and Dodd as well as Biden and Obama.  they actually vote for the legislation, regardless of who is paying their money.


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## JohnEdward (Oct 27, 2011)

Well they can't find Reid's place, Pelosi's place has magically disappeared off the GPS, Frank's place is too crowded with Fannie and Freddie hanging out there, Dodd's home? They don't know he exists.  Biden's place is party city and the protest would fall apart at the keg. Obama, well no one is home.


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## granfire (Oct 27, 2011)

JohnEdward said:


> Well they can't find Reid's place, Pelosi's place has magically disappeared off the GPS, Frank's place is too crowded with Fannie and Freddie hanging out there, Dodd's home? They don't know he exists.  Biden's place is party city and the protest would fall apart at the keg. Obama, well no one is home.



LOL, I think everybody is at Joe's place anyhow!


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 27, 2011)

Peaceful Protester


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## David43515 (Oct 27, 2011)

Sukerkin said:


> The thing that troubles me in the background to this is that the image of the protesters' being delivered by the media seems largely one made of cliches deliberately chosen to inflame right-minded peoples opinions against them. Whilst it may well be true that they are all like that after all, the worry is that we, the ignorant viewer/listener/reader have no way of easily verifying the truth of the image being delivered.
> 
> Which means that they who decide what image we are fed are the ones with an inordinate sway on the turn of events - that is not comfortable.



You make a very valid point. Whomever controls information controls how we form our opinions. That`s why I phrased it like I did, so that if someone who has more information wants to correct me they can. I`m not afraid to admit that I`m not always the most informed on every subject. Some of our American news outlets have been hailing these guys as the saviors of democracy in the US, the 2nd coming of the civil rights movement. I admit I`m pretty opinionated, but I try to be fair.

The thing that frustrates me the most though is that I really do have faith in the idea that our system works because we set up ways to change it peacefully from the begining. And even though the democratic process is really just a very genteel form of mob rule, it`s still the best system we`ve come up with.


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## Carol (Oct 27, 2011)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Peaceful Protester



Winning the cup seems so much sweeter when I see what sore losers the Bruins defeated


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## David43515 (Oct 27, 2011)

kegage said:


> Here's the story I found on this man.
> 
> http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PHXBeat/60504
> 
> Kevin



Thanks for the link. I did notice however that the story _implies _that he was at the rally that took place one block from the venue where the President was speaking.He wasn`t. He was actually at a seperate rally five blocks away. And although he was "in public" he was on private property. 

My favorite recolection of the event was when several media outlets showed closeups of just the weapon and his shirt and tried to claim that he fit their dreamed up idea of violent white guys protesting Obama because he was black. It was at least 3 days after the event before MSNBC actually admited he was a black man protesting policy (very politely I might add) from several blocks away.


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## Big Don (Oct 27, 2011)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Peaceful Protester
> View attachment 15559


How many cops did it take to control the AV squad geek?


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## kegage (Oct 28, 2011)

David43515 said:


> Thanks for the link. I did notice however that the story _implies _that he was at the rally that took place one block from the venue where the President was speaking.He wasn`t. He was actually at a seperate rally five blocks away. And although he was "in public" he was on private property.
> 
> My favorite recolection of the event was when several media outlets showed closeups of just the weapon and his shirt and tried to claim that he fit their dreamed up idea of violent white guys protesting Obama because he was black. It was at least 3 days after the event before MSNBC actually admited he was a black man protesting policy (very politely I might add) from several blocks away.



You're welcome

Not to stir up a who reports what, or how accurately, hornets nest, but I first saw the fact that he was a black man reported on FOX News just after the event. Part of the report was a "This what, and how, "THEY" reported it, and here is the reality." kind of thing. If I remember correctly, it was after that is when MSMBC corrected themselves.

Kevin


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## Josh Oakley (Oct 28, 2011)

David43515 said:


> Thanks for the link. I did notice however that the story _implies _that he was at the rally that took place one block from the venue where the President was speaking.He wasn`t. He was actually at a seperate rally five blocks away. And although he was "in public" he was on private property.
> 
> My favorite recolection of the event was when several media outlets showed closeups of just the weapon and his shirt and tried to claim that he fit their dreamed up idea of violent white guys protesting Obama because he was black. It was at least 3 days after the event before MSNBC actually admited he was a black man protesting policy (very politely I might add) from several blocks away.



Um... he was on a city street that had been blocked off for the rally. You know a great many city streets in Oakland that are private property?


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 28, 2011)

Personally, I like the Greek answer to Occupy protesters.

As the weather gets colder, the OB group is calling for donations of cold weather gear. Some people have made the evil suggestion that they buy it themselves. It's also been suggested that they stop using city electricity for their encampment. They are also calling for straw bales to build shelters out of. Personally, I wish they'd just go the hell home as they ruin the look of the park (a traffic circle actually) they are squatting on.  Gas mask sales at a local surplus store saw a small spike, though it's unlikely that they'll be needed (except when I visit my relatives who smoke) as Buffalos groups so far little more than a blip. A few notables in the crowd are members of Anonymous, fresh off the Scientology protests from last year. (Those weren't too effective, other than discouraging the org from setting up at the county fair this year. I see similar success in this mission.)


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 30, 2011)

[h=3]Police fire _mace_ at Denver protesters, 20 arrested[/h]

Arrests continue, and as expected the retards fail to "get it".
They point at cops doing their job of -enforcing the law- and claim fascism and "theres democracy in action".

Well you clueless little ****tards, you're right, it is.
You are -breaking the law-.
You are -refusing to obey lawful orders-
You will be arrested.
Duh.



> Police arrested more than two dozen people who refused to leave a  park in northwest Portland, Oregon, after warnings that the park closed  at midnight, police said.
> Authorities in Portland "gave protesters numerous opportunities to  simply walk away or choose to be arrested," Mayor Sam Adams told CNN  affiliate KPTV.


What part of "Closed" is too hard for you to grasp?  
Just because you're protesting doesn't give you a pass on following posted regs.



> Police also arrested 38 people in Austin, Texas, who had set up a  table with food and other items outside City Hall. When the group was  asked to leave the area, the 38 refused and were arrested, police said.
> The arrests came two days after the city of Austin issued rules  saying food tables at the event must be put away between 10 p.m. and 6  a.m.



They are allowing you to protest. They are also looking out for the 99% of the population who thinks you're a bunch of wackaloos.

The biggest irony to me is that the idiots in Buffalo who are squatting in a traffic circle and running off my tax paid electric are having no problems with the cops.
Might have something to do with getting the permits they needed to get (required of all), not throwing rocks and paint at cops, not blocking traffic, not causing more problems, not building a tent city or little Hooverville. They are about 100' (as in right in front of and across the street from) city hall. 

Why do the WNY idiots get it, and the 'leaders' oh I'm sorry, 'inspiration' doesn't?


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## David43515 (Oct 31, 2011)

Josh Oakley said:


> Um... he was on a city street that had been blocked off for the rally. You know a great many city streets in Oakland that are private property?


 Church parking lot...........in Arizona. That`s why it was legal, Arizona has open carry.


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## shesulsa (Oct 31, 2011)

Devil's advocate here:

I'm not so sure political protest assemblies are really *meant* to be neat, tidy and accommodating - isn't that the nature of the protest, after all? I mean, if the bad guy tries to choke you out, are you supposed to say, "um ... no thanks" and smile at him as he carries on?

Just for clarity - I'm not advocating protestors inciting violence or doing gratuitous damage ... that said, we do have a right to assemble and to stand up against the government ... just seems like another constitutional right being scrubbed away with accommodation, safety, comfort and other public and political pacification.


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## Bob Hubbard (Oct 31, 2011)

I'm still in favor of deploying Droideka's.


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## Carol (Oct 31, 2011)

Bob Hubbard said:


> I'm still in favor of deploying Droideka's.



They replaced the DroidX2 already???? :lfao:


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## Josh Oakley (Oct 31, 2011)

David43515 said:


> Church parking lot...........in Arizona. That`s why it was legal, Arizona has open carry.



Oh. IN which case I retract my statement.


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