# what size is good for combat



## blackswordshinobi (Mar 26, 2012)

I use 27 inch  ninjato  some time 28 inch  in old day these commen size for ninjto  what size you choes for combat!


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 26, 2012)

An interesting expose on the fallacy of the "Hollywood Ninja Sword"
http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/ninja-swords.html



> The second most common style of Ninja swords are the straight bladed _Chokuto_ style &#8216;Hollywood&#8217; Swords.
> The actual historical accuracy of these swords is very doubtful to say the least.
> (There are no actual antique swords of this style and it is generally believed that the  design is a modern invention of martial arts master  Stephen K. Hayes).



But, fantasy swords aside, I'd go with a good 20-24" wakizashi, Hanwei or Paul Chen. 
2 of them.

A full length katana is nice on an open battlefield, but try fighting inside a building with one. Smaller blade means more maneuverability, less chance of getting hung up on doorways.


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## Sanke (Mar 26, 2012)

Bob Hubbard said:


> But, fantasy swords aside, I'd go with a good 20-24" wakizashi, Hanwei or Paul Chen.
> 2 of them.
> 
> A full length katana is nice on an open battlefield, but try fighting inside a building with one. Smaller blade means more maneuverability, less chance of getting hung up on doorways.



Out of curiosity, why 2 of them? Personally I'd much rather just have the one, it leaves your other hand free to grab, punch and do all sorts of fun things


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## Jameswhelan (Mar 26, 2012)

Sanke said:


> Out of curiosity, why 2 of them?



Nito kodachi is not unknown in bugei. You see it in Yagyu Shingan ryu. Yamato Yoshin ryu has some very dynamic nito kodachi katas in continuation, if I'm not mistaken, of ideas from Takagi ryu daisho sabaki.


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 26, 2012)

Sanke said:


> Out of curiosity, why 2 of them? Personally I'd much rather just have the one, it leaves your other hand free to grab, punch and do all sorts of fun things



Blame it on my FMA training, as well as my being a geek.  'Always have a backup'.


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 26, 2012)

will my wakizashi, is 28 inch this second ninjto my real ninjato is not all striegth 3 33 meter slint crver but two sword together fight that be school of two sword nito ryui dig youll awsure


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## Aiki Lee (Mar 26, 2012)

I'm with Sanke on this one. I like to leave one had free. Might be I want to throw shuriken at the guy first then stab or slash.


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 26, 2012)

point will taken


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## The Last Legionary (Mar 26, 2012)

blackswordshinobi said:


> will my wakizashi, is 28 inch this second ninjto my real ninjato is not all striegth 3 33 meter slint crver but two sword together fight that be school of two sword nito ryui dig youll awsure



Billy, thank you for working on the spelling, this is better. Could you reread and correct the grammar a bit more before posting too? This is still a little hard to follow.  I think you are saying you have a 28 inch wakizashi and a 33 inch ninjato? 
I would just like to be sure I'm understanding you properly.

Thank you.


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## The Last Legionary (Mar 26, 2012)

One would think that a shorter sword would also better fit the ninja's reputation for stealth. Smaller is easier to conceal.


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## Sanke (Mar 27, 2012)

Jameswhelan said:


> Nito kodachi is not unknown in bugei. You see it in Yagyu Shingan ryu. Yamato Yoshin ryu has some very dynamic nito kodachi katas in continuation, if I'm not mistaken, of ideas from Takagi ryu daisho sabaki.



Really? Now that I would love to see! Don't suppose there's any footage out there? 



Bob Hubbard said:


> Blame it on my FMA training, as well as my being a geek.  'Always have a backup'.



Ah, that explains it  though with my background I'd probably throw the first one and move in, haha. 



Sanke on the move.


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## Sanke (Mar 27, 2012)

The Last Legionary said:


> One would think that a shorter sword would also better fit the ninja's reputation for stealth. Smaller is easier to conceal.



I imagine it would depend largely on the time period, mission and social status of the ninja in question. Many ninja were samurai in rank, so carrying a daisho wouldn't be an issue.
Hard to generalize really. 


Sanke on the move.


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## Jameswhelan (Mar 27, 2012)

Sanke said:


> Really? Now that I would love to see! Don't suppose there's any footage out there?



It seems there is, I'm surprised to find. First technique after kuji:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C7_X7INZZU&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## Chris Parker (Mar 27, 2012)

blackswordshinobi said:


> I use 27 inch  ninjato  some time 28 inch  in old day these commen size for ninjto  what size you choes for combat!



Hi Billy,

So you know, the idea of having a sword for combat is really not a realistic plan... for training, yes, but for actual combat, no. Asking what size sword we choose for combat will have people thinking you're purely fantasy-based.

From there, though, the dimensions (length, curve, and so on) of any particular sword will be given by the school you are training in. Some have very specific sizes that they use, so personal choice doesn't really enter into it at all.



Bob Hubbard said:


> An interesting expose on the fallacy of the "Hollywood Ninja Sword"
> http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/ninja-swords.html
> 
> But, fantasy swords aside, I'd go with a good 20-24" wakizashi, Hanwei or Paul Chen.
> ...



Hmm, Hanwei or Paul Chen... it's like choosing between Twilight films... oh dear.... 

That said, it should be remembered that, in Japan at least, swords were never really major battlefield weapons. The original battlefield weapons that defined the warrior was the bow and arrow, and later naginata, then spear. It only became the sword when Japan entered into peacetime. So the idea of having a full length katana (not that long, really) for an open battlefield isn't really a good idea... after all, you'd have just over two feet of steel, going up against nine foot of spear.... 



blackswordshinobi said:


> will my wakizashi, is 28 inch this second ninjto my real ninjato is not all striegth 3 33 meter slint crver but two sword together fight that be school of two sword nito ryui dig youll awsure



I'd also be interested in whether you mean you have a 28 inch wakizashi and a 33 inch katana... they are quite long weapons! Remember that the length of a sword is measured from the back of the blade (where it goes into the handle) to the tip, not the entire length including the handle itself.

Oh, and while there is a form of training and competition in Kendo that uses long and short swords, and refers to it as "Nito Ryu", there isn't an actual Ryu called that (there are systems like Nito Shinkage Ryu, but that's about as close as I've found). You're most likely thinking of Niten Ichi Ryu, the school of Musashi Miyamoto. And it has some two sword techniques, but that's not all they do... and many other schools have two sword techniques as well.



Jameswhelan said:


> It seems there is, I'm surprised to find. First technique after kuji:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C7_X7INZZU&feature=youtube_gdata_player



Nice find, James! I hadn't come across much about them before, and didn't know they had any Nito Kodachi in their syllabus... but what on earth was with the tameshigiri in reverse?!?


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## Bob Hubbard (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris Parker said:


> Hmm, Hanwei or Paul Chen... it's like choosing between Twilight films... oh dear....



Well, compared to the $10 wall hangers you see at the flea markets. 

or this "Ninja" sword





:lol:


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 27, 2012)

28 inch wakizashi  yes and 27 inch  ninjato with 3,33 slint cuver it look streigth but not


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 27, 2012)

no man  my didnt come  home shopping  network    /   if look my pic you see black sword with no tusba that  27 inch ninjato  in other pic there is   28 inch wakizashi  got all my sword real deiler


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris Parker said:


> Hi Billy,
> 
> So you know, the idea of having a sword for combat is really not a realistic plan... for training, yes, but for actual combat, no. Asking what size sword we choose for combat will have people thinking you're purely fantasy-based.
> 
> ...



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I AM  not fantcy base  ninja I DO  training morden form of ninjutsu  we do traning gun war fair as will  first gun was tengasshum japaness mustket that trun  samuai to gun then  shinobi yes some samurai  was ninja also but most was higher ro retaaned by them a spy  if figer it sword dont run out bullet and use after gun is used..


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## Ken Morgan (Mar 27, 2012)

My Shinken is 2.5 Shaku, iaito same, but MJER uses long swords......

Chris is correct, a sword would be one of the last things I would use for combat, however, anyone dating my daughter may meet it personally....


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## blackswordshinobi (Mar 27, 2012)

lololo my omg you would real do that no ofind the whom ever it would **** them self fast sorry ofin any one


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## Chris Parker (Mar 28, 2012)

blackswordshinobi said:


> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I AM  not fantcy base  ninja I DO  training morden form of ninjutsu  we do traning gun war fair as will  first gun was tengasshum japaness mustket that trun  samuai to gun then  shinobi yes some samurai  was ninja also but most was higher ro retaaned by them a spy  if figer it sword dont run out bullet and use after gun is used..



Billy,

I was saying that you could be mistaken for a fantasy ninjutsu student (Koga Ryu, Ashida Kim, Frank Dux, Christa Jacobson, Mountainous etc) by asking about "sword for combat". And I probably know more about the history than you do, so you know. The early matchlock rifles were brought into Tanegashima Island, the Daimyo there bought three, and ordered his swordsmith to make copies. As a result, early matchlock rifles are sometimes called "Tanegashima"; they can also be called Hinawa, or a few other names. And the great majority of "ninja" were samurai, not just some of them.

I know you've said that you hold a Shodan rank (black belt), who was your teacher? When did you test for your black belt? What was the test itself? I'm just curious for the minute.


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## Tanaka (Apr 7, 2012)

A sword in combat wasn't a bad idea. Nowadays it is because I can't really think of a scenario in modern times where a sword would be the best weapon to use unless zombies start attacking(Unless you just like cutting people). Even in feudal Japan the sword was an auxiliary weapon. The primary weapons like Chris said would be Bow/Arrow and Spear. Now this was with the Katana. The Tachi used from horseback which was also "curved" but much longer was a very good weapon for quick slashing cuts while riding horseback. While a stabbing weapon would be more prone to getting stuck or breaking. 
Also I think "modern form of Ninjutsu" is kind of misleading. Since Ninjutsu is an ancient art.


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## Chris Parker (Apr 7, 2012)

Depends on the combat. Battlefield? Nope. Dueling? Yeah, sure. Modern? Well, you'll end up on the evening news being hosed down with high power water cannons, or pelted with beanbags and tear gas, but what the hell, go for it! Just don't expect success... 

Studying sword from a historical point of view, to attain a particular mindset (or mentality), to improve senses of distance, angling, timing, fantastic. But when someone talks about "what size (sword) is good for combat?", and is talking in the modern sense, that's when we start getting concerned.

Frankly Ninjutsu has a bad enough image as it is, Billy, and his lack of any real knowledge or understanding, doesn't help.


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## The Last Legionary (Apr 9, 2012)

Historical perspective is fine. You are unlikely to need a sword for real combat these days, but knowing how to use one and how to defend against it is still something good to know.  There's always a few 'cops stop machete swinging nutter' or 'wannabe ninja shot by cops' stories in the news. I know enough to know safe handling, which way to parry and what to look for to tell quality from wall hanger. Beyond that, swords aren't my thing. Well, except for my gladius. :rofl:


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## Ken Morgan (Apr 9, 2012)

The pointy end part goes in the other guy...right? Or is that just koryu?


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 9, 2012)

Remember "_Sword is personal weapon_. When slicing thru a man you get that immediate feedback." Lo Wang, the Shadow Warrior.


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## Aiki Lee (Apr 9, 2012)

I can't be the only one thinking life isn't too far off from becoming like the movie _The Book of Eli_. When you run out of ammo for the post apocolyptic future you may find yourself asking "what size sword is good for combat".


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## Cyriacus (Apr 9, 2012)

Himura Kenshin said:


> I can't be the only one thinking life isn't too far off from becoming like the movie _The Book of Eli_. When you run out of ammo for the post apocolyptic future you may find yourself asking "what size sword is good for combat".


In Postapocalyptia, wouldnt it be the sharp one?


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 9, 2012)

I still favor a wakizashi.  lightweight, easily maneuvered in tight places, easily concealed under a long coat.  Downside is you have to get in close. Applying the "ROTLA" concept, it's also not a smart thing against someone with a gun.


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## Carol (Apr 9, 2012)

Ken Morgan said:


> The pointy end part goes in the other guy...right? Or is that just koryu?



Hey, quit stealing ideas from the FMAs


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## Josh Oakley (Apr 9, 2012)

Chris Parker said:


> Billy,
> 
> I was saying that you could be mistaken for a fantasy ninjutsu student (Koga Ryu, Ashida Kim, Frank Dux, Christa Jacobson, Mountainous etc) by asking about "sword for combat". And I probably know more about the history than you do, so you know. The early matchlock rifles were brought into Tanegashima Island, the Daimyo there bought three, and ordered his swordsmith to make copies. As a result, early matchlock rifles are sometimes called "Tanegashima"; they can also be called Hinawa, or a few other names. And the great majority of "ninja" were samurai, not just some of them.
> 
> I know you've said that you hold a Shodan rank (black belt), who was your teacher? When did you test for your black belt? What was the test itself? I'm just curious for the minute.



For the record, most dux-ryu students would be using a knife or a gun, not a sword.

(Before you go crazy on that statement, do remember I quit training with him.)
Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk


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## Cryozombie (Apr 10, 2012)

Bob Hubbard said:


> Remember "_Sword is personal weapon_. When slicing thru a man you get that immediate feedback." Lo Wang, the Shadow Warrior.



You. Did. NOT.


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 10, 2012)

Cryozombie said:


> You. Did. NOT.



Course I did.  The God Emperor dares all.


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## Flying Crane (Apr 10, 2012)

Himura Kenshin said:


> I can't be the only one thinking life isn't too far off from becoming like the movie _The Book of Eli_. When you run out of ammo for the post apocolyptic future you may find yourself asking "what size sword is good for combat".



There's a lotta bullets out there that need to be used up first.  But then, yeah, blades don't need reloading, to quote from Max Brooks.


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## Josh Oakley (Apr 10, 2012)

I have my wakazashi just in case I make it into the Freehold army, a machete for the zombie apocalypse, and like a million throwing knives... for DUCK HUNTING!

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 10, 2012)

Though, thinking about it, I might go with a zanbato.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/56/180513254_618483a71b.jpg


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## The Last Legionary (Apr 14, 2012)

There's nothing wrong with a Gladius. It's optimized for in-close work. It'll also crack those wakitaki toothpicks dude :lol.


Oh, the OP's moved on to blogging about how mean we are, and bugging the folks at "martialartstalk.com" and ranting at Google. In case anyone cared, which I know most don't.  :roflmao:


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## Bob Hubbard (Apr 14, 2012)

The OP's not here to reply, lets not snipe at him. Not what we do here.
Thanks.


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