Worst Idea Ever= Beatings

[Knifehand]

So, as some of you know, i'm pumped about my first tournament. If i go and spar other yellow/orange belts, there isn't much i can learn there, because they are just as inexperienced as i am. So i got the bright idea... why don't i ask a black belt to spar me so they can help me and all. Well, there is only one Dan i know well enough to ask such a favor, My girlfriend's father.

How many fathers have their daughters boyfriends willing suject themselves to beatings? Just one... moving on.

I went over to my girlfriend's house after my TSD class and hung out for a while... He dad comes home from his Dan class. My first words to him were, "So when are you going to kick my ***?"

The largest smile i've ever seen... i don't think i've ever seen anyone so happy to hear that.

We agreed on a date... and I, being a man of my word (and i really want to learn how spar really well) plan on sticking to it.

Any thoughts...

 

[terryl965]

Remember he'll probaly only use techniques for your level. if you want more than that you might have to explain to him your real objectives for the sparring practice. At any rate have fun and keep us updated on the outcome. Good luck, remember no cheap shots or the dating of the daughter might be over.

Terry Lee Stoker

Twin Draons MAS:asian:

 

[Zepp]

Wear a cup. Sometimes our subconcious mind does funny things, and seeing as how you're dating his daughter, a wayward strike might be more likely to hit certain places.

Good idea asking a higher belt for sparring help. Lots of lower belts seem scared to do that for some reason.

 

[Knifehand]

Wear a cup. Sometimes our subconcious mind does funny things, and seeing as how you're dating his daughter, a wayward strike might be more likely to hit certain places.

Good idea asking a higher belt for sparring help. Lots of lower belts seem scared to do that for some reason.

I understand that he may go easy on me... but that doesn't help me any... he has to beat the crap out of (figurativly (SP?) speaking). I may end of fighting upperbelts in the tournament. If i can defend and learn how to attack a Cho Dan, Orange/Green belts won't be such a "problem"

I've already sparred him once... he went easy on me... can't say i learned much though...just that i have good guards...

 

[MA-Caver]

So, as some of you know, i'm pumped about my first tournament. If i go and spar other yellow/orange belts, there isn't much i can learn there, because they are just as inexperienced as i am.

Any thoughts...

Personally I'd disagree with the line of thinking that you aren't going to learn anything because your opponents are just as inexperienced as you are. That's another defeatist thinking if you ask me.
Miyamoto Mushashi may have never lost a sword fight it's true, but even when he was still just green he still learned a lot.
For one thing even if you lose, if you learned something... you won. To me one shouldn't be at a tournament (just) to win. Tournaments are wonderful opportunites to learn about different fighting techniques, styles (even if it's the same art...it's done differently by each person when it comes down to it).
Sparring with the inexperienced is also a learning opportunity. Use your head, think, watch, observe, experiment, test this and try that. Never, ever stop learning, even if it's from someone lesser than you, they can teach you if you are open enough to see the lesson they give, whatever it may be.
I've been in plenty of (real) fights, lost more than I've won. However; the ones I've won were in my latter days of fighting and the experience I've gained not only from my own losses but from the ones that had "beaten me" (literally), helped me to win.
Winning isn't everything, learning is everything. Get what practice you can from anyone you can. The results may surprise you.

Besides, you'd be helping them as well.

 

[Zepp]

He's going to have to go easy on you somewhat. That's just the way it is when two people of vastly different skill levels spar. You can always ask him to turn it up a notch, but don't be too proud to ask him to turn it down either. (That warning is from experience.)

 

[Knifehand]

Personally I'd disagree with the line of thinking that you aren't going to learn anything because your opponents are just as inexperienced as you are. That's another defeatist thinking if you ask me.
Miyamoto Mushashi may have never lost a sword fight it's true, but even when he was still just green he still learned a lot.
For one thing even if you lose, if you learned something... you won. To me one shouldn't be at a tournament (just) to win. Tournaments are wonderful opportunites to learn about different fighting techniques, styles (even if it's the same art...it's done differently by each person when it comes down to it).
Sparring with the inexperienced is also a learning opportunity. Use your head, think, watch, observe, experiment, test this and try that. Never, ever stop learning, even if it's from someone lesser than you, they can teach you if you are open enough to see the lesson they give, whatever it may be.
I've been in plenty of (real) fights, lost more than I've won. However; the ones I've won were in my latter days of fighting and the experience I've gained not only from my own losses but from the ones that had "beaten me" (literally), helped me to win.
Winning isn't everything, learning is everything. Get what practice you can from anyone you can. The results may surprise you.

Besides, you'd be helping them as well.

Very good points, i agree with you, mostly. My thinking is... First, I will learn more from him than i will from another yellow belt. Second, I only have 36 days to prepare the tournament. We won't spar again for another couple of weeks, and i don't know any yellow belts outside of class. but i know a Dan who i see almost everyday.

I never said that is wasn't helpful to spar underbelts... but it doesn't help me much for competition sparring. I would like to place... its a goal i set for myself. If i don't win, i don't win. I will analyze what happend and teach others the error of my ways...

just like when a Dan i was sparring, hook kicked me in the face... I would have never learned how bad my guards were if it weren't for the kick... a yellow belt isn't likely to kick me in the face...

 

[John Bishop]

I understand that he may go easy on me... but that doesn't help me any... he has to beat the crap out of (figurativly (SP?) speaking). I may end of fighting upperbelts in the tournament. If i can defend and learn how to attack a Cho Dan, Orange/Green belts won't be such a "problem"

I've already sparred him once... he went easy on me... can't say i learned much though...just that i have good guards...

You really don't learn much from having a black belt beat the crap out of you. In fact a lot of times it does more harm then good.
I do suggest that you always try and spar with someone that is one or two ranks above you. That way they will push you to go 110% to keep up with them. And you will see the results of your extra efforts.
Sparing with someone who is a black belt (when your only yellow/orange) either causes you to become frustrated if they go all out. Or, they will have to tone down their performance to let you experiment and get your shots in. That is a good learning experience for the lower belt, but it dosen't push the black belt to improve his abilities. And a lot of times the black belt will tone down too much, and then you'll get a false sense of your abilities.
But all training is beneficial, so spar with your girlfriends dad and enjoy the experience.
But when you want some good sparing, spar with your seniors. They'll go 100%, and you'll have to push yourself 110% to keep up. Or maybe you'll push yourself 120% and beat them. And when you do, you'll know you didn't beat them because they were holding back. Nice feeling

 

[MJS]

I disagree that in order for you to learn anything he has to beat the crap out of you, as you're saying. As an upper belt, he should be assisting you with your offensive and defensive skills, showing your techs./combos, that are going to be effective for you.

I'm assuming that this is your very first tourny?? If that is the case, while its always nice to win, that is not always the case. You should be using this as a learning experience, especially for future tournies. When I was competing, there were times when I'd drive with a group for 1 1/2 hrs., wait a few more hours for my event, and then get into the ring, only to be beaten. Talk about a let down. However, I'd take that as a learning experience, go back home, train twice as hard on what I was weak on, and do my best in the next one.

Again, I can't stress enough to slow down a little and work on the fundamentals, rather than have him 'beat' on you.

Mike

 

[MJS]

Sparring with the inexperienced is also a learning opportunity.

I agree with this 100%!!!!! Even as a BB, this can be a learning tool, as most likely a beginner will not be fighting like another BB, therefore, they'll be moving different, throwing strikes with most likely less control, etc.

They definately keep you on your toes!!

Mike

 

[shesulsa]

It is also the resonsibility of higher ranking color belts and of black belts to spar with you at your level and a bit higher to aid your growth. This BB might have been evaluating your ability ... that or sandbagging.

 

[Rob Broad]

Ask any seasoned black belt who they would rather spar against and they will tell you, "Another Black Belt." The reason for this the low level belts are the most dangerous guys in the ring. They get nervous, and their control flies out the window, put them in a public venue and it becomes even worse. The low level belts, are still working on the technique and flexibilty, so often there is a lot of low blows, and lastly they don't know what they shouldn't do.

I started off my sparring working with much higher belts than myself and thought my forst tournament would be a cake walk, was I ever wrong. I was used the speed and power fo the brown belts i worked out with, which did not prepare for the clumsy beginner who broke my nose, bashed my shins, and snapped the strap on my cup when he tried a thrust kick to my belly and ended up a lot lower.

My suggestion is spar every person you can, you will learn from all of them, and they will learn from you.

If possible I would video tape your sparring sessions with your girlfriends father and then watche them together so he can point out some of your mistakes, and help you correct them.

 

[Blindside]

There is a reason why the beginner mens (and 14+ boys) divisions are called the "black and blue" divisions.

Knifehand, there are going to be some things that you will be unable to pull off on a blackbelt, that doesn't mean that they won't work perfectly well against another beginner.

Lamont

 

[Tremble]

One thing I would say, is listen to any advice given, and act on it.

 

[Sin]

a couple questions on the ordeal...

1) How old are you
2) How old is the GF
3) How long have you dated her
4) Do you love her
5) Does her father like you
6) Do you go to the same school as her father
7) Are you and your GF ::ahem:: Active.
8) If so, does the father/mother know
9) How old is the father
10) Do you have insurence cause this guy might put you in the hospital...I mean honestly...your dating his baby girl.

I have a little sister and shes only 10 talking about her little BFs and such and I am all like...."now if he hurts you you'll let me know right" i know there just kids but you gotta teach the young boys manners at a young age...or we'll end up with major problems in the future. although my little sister is in Karate class now so she will eventually be able to take care of herself...but as a Big brother...i'm still there...if needed.

the reason for all the questions is that all of these variables can change the out come of the relationship with your GF after this sparring match...who knows you might actually hurt her father...or he hurt you seriously.....what would your GF think.

Just throwing those ideas out there is all.

 

[shesulsa]

I went over to my girlfriend's house after my TSD class and hung out for a while... He dad comes home from his Dan class. My first words to him were, "So when are you going to kick my ***?"

The largest smile i've ever seen... i don't think i've ever seen anyone so happy to hear that.

We agreed on a date... and I, being a man of my word (and i really want to learn how spar really well) plan on sticking to it.

Okay, I guess I only just absorbed this - was concentrating on the whole sparring a black belt thing.

All kinds of things come to mind here, but ... this guy is either thinking, "Wow, this kids has some guts to ask his GFs father to kick his ***," or "Heh heh heh - fresh meat!" or some variable combination of the two.

You set a date ... to spar a black belt ... and ... you're trying to train for this? No wonder the BB you did spar didn't give you much of a challenge - he wants you to lose.

Dude ... pick your battles, 'kay?

 

[chinto01]

I also disagree with you like many other people have on this post.You feel that you have nothing to learn by fighting with people of the same rank as you at this tournament. Well I hope you plan on taking first place then because anything else should be unacceptable correct? Afterall they cannot teach you anything.

Your mindset is one that plaques too many of us thinking that people of our same rank or lower have nothing to teach us. . We all need to be more open as to where we learn things. I have learned things from white belts all the way up to Grand masters of styles just by keeping an open mind and empty cup. Good luck.

 

[Knifehand]

I also disagree with you like many other people have on this post.You feel that you have nothing to learn by fighting with people of the same rank as you at this tournament. Well I hope you plan on taking first place then because anything else should be unacceptable correct? Afterall they cannot teach you anything.

Your mindset is one that plaques too many of us thinking that people of our same rank or lower have nothing to teach us. . We all need to be more open as to where we learn things. I have learned things from white belts all the way up to Grand masters of styles just by keeping an open mind and empty cup. Good luck.

I want to be challenged. I don't see anything wrong with that. If i don't win... i don't win. But I want to try, i want a chance. A majority of yellow belts in my class are like 6 or 7 years younger than I and don't even have any gear, can't spar without gear.

I am asking my girlfriend's dad to basicly be the toughest opponent i've faced so far. I have really good guards (for my level that is) and i can score points. But i want to get better. Our school isn't having sparring until right before the tourament and i want to work on this on my own time. The only person i feel comfortable sparring with is her dad, outside of the school that is.

The whole beating this was apart of the humor. Her dad, brian, is an excellent martial artist. I've sparred him once, hes helped me in the past, thats why i asked him.

If, at the tourament, i get my *** kicked; it would probably be because the other person had no control. If they draw blood, they're disqualified. I want to be skillful.I want to avoid being that guy who gets nervous. This is also a confidence booster.

White - orange belts can teach me mini-lessons, things i need to work on. Such as keeping my guards up, but they aren't teaching stuff i don't already know. I know i need to keep my guards up; but i might, for a second, let them down and bam... got one in the chest. Upperbelts can tell me what i am doing wrong. Force me to get better and faster. I'm looking for a different type of knowledge, one i can only gain from someone better than me, and someone it trust.

 

[Knifehand]

a couple questions on the ordeal...

1) How old are you
2) How old is the GF
3) How long have you dated her
4) Do you love her
5) Does her father like you
6) Do you go to the same school as her father
7) Are you and your GF ::ahem:: Active.
8) If so, does the father/mother know
9) How old is the father
10) Do you have insurence cause this guy might put you in the hospital...I mean honestly...your dating his baby girl.

I have a little sister and shes only 10 talking about her little BFs and such and I am all like...."now if he hurts you you'll let me know right" i know there just kids but you gotta teach the young boys manners at a young age...or we'll end up with major problems in the future. although my little sister is in Karate class now so she will eventually be able to take care of herself...but as a Big brother...i'm still there...if needed.

the reason for all the questions is that all of these variables can change the out come of the relationship with your GF after this sparring match...who knows you might actually hurt her father...or he hurt you seriously.....what would your GF think.

Just throwing those ideas out there is all.

1) 19
2) 19, this month
3) over a year
4) With all my heart
5) yes, very much
6) yes
7) yes...
8) we think they do
9) early 40s i think
10) Yeah, i got insurance

Hes told me and his wife (who is a Red 4) that if someone hurts you during training or sparring, you hurt them back;Not injure... so if i hurt him.... he'll hurt me back... and likewise (i'll try)

as for the other post...

Okay, I guess I only just absorbed this - was concentrating on the whole sparring a black belt thing.

All kinds of things come to mind here, but ... this guy is either thinking, "Wow, this kids has some guts to ask his GFs father to kick his ***," or "Heh heh heh - fresh meat!" or some variable combination of the two.

You set a date ... to spar a black belt ... and ... you're trying to train for this? No wonder the BB you did spar didn't give you much of a challenge - he wants you to lose.

Dude ... pick your battles, 'kay?

What i am training for is a Tourament, and i asked a BB, (my GFs father) to help me train. Historically, i've sparred (non-MA) my friend blake... whose a good street fighter... better than me. He beat the crap out of me (later admitting he went easy one me... LOL) but i learned a lot from him. But in TSD the sparring is different and i have to relearn how to spar. It only makes sense to spar someone who knows the rules, who has been to this tourament before, and who has the control to teach me something. I never said anything bad about sparring underbelts, just that i was unable because they lacked equipment, we had conflicting schedules, and i didn't feel comfortable asking them. I'd really like to spar them sometime, but i'm looking toward my Cho Dan mentors to help me train.

 

[Marginal]

White - orange belts can teach me mini-lessons, things i need to work on. Such as keeping my guards up, but they aren't teaching stuff i don't already know. I know i need to keep my guards up; but i might, for a second, let them down and bam... got one in the chest. Upperbelts can tell me what i am doing wrong. Force me to get better and faster. I'm looking for a different type of knowledge, one i can only gain from someone better than me, and someone it trust.

Most of it's been said one way or another already, but I'll add these two thoughts...

If the more experiences MA'ist gives you a hard time, but you manage to hold your own, it does run the risk of making you complacent. One ofthe neat aspects of a tournament is you're going up against people you've probably never gone up against before, and their focus and training can vary from your own. Going up against the BB may make you complacent regarding what your competition is capable of offering. Not a yea or nay vote regarding what you're doing, just something to keep in mind.

Also, sparring isn't just a collection of combos, keeping your guard up and counterhits. Strategy makes it gel.