Who is Who in Modern Arnis?

[Dan Anderson]

I personally think the top ten to carry on the art would have been:
1. me - age over beauty
2. Tonya Harding - hubcap specialist
3. Moe Howard - great hair
4. George Michael - teen appeal
5. William Jefferson Clinton - common sense and truthfulness
6. Slim Whitman - pencil thin mustache
7. Marcel Marceau - stealth
8. B.O.B. (body opponent bag) - toughness
9. Renegade (or Rene' to his friends) - subservient attitude
10. Arthur Blythe - blows a mean alto
Which art I'm not sure.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

 

[Dieter]

In 1999 Professor started referring to me at the seminars as ONE of his successors.

He said a similar thing to me in 1996, after I received my 6th Dan and the Datu title. His words were:

"Now you belong to the "group of 10" from which I will choose my successor."

I never had the aim of being the successor of the Professor, but Im felt honored, that he held me in that high regard.

Regards from Germany


Dieter Knüttel
Datu of Modern Arnis

 

[Cruentus]

4. George Michael - teen appeal

Dan your showing your age. George Michael teen idol? Yea, in like 1983!

How bout' Justin Timberlake?

 

[David Hoffman]

Originally posted by jaybacca72
there were probably 10 like dan said,i heard remy say in Toronto 1999 that there was to be a board to carry on his art and renegade was said to be one of them. looking forward to meeting some of you in buffallo.
later
jay:asian:

Hello Dieter and Dan,

You recollection is correct. In fact, there were a total of 30 people nominated to be board members after our teachers passing. As suggested in this thread, Dan, Dieter and Tim were among the nominated players. The same is true for all the present IMAF board members. I personally urged both Dan and Dieter to accept this nomination and "come on board." To date both have chosen to remain independent. Regardless of your choice to refuse the nomination it is still historically significant that you were nominated. The “successor” idea was something entirely different, primarily intended for continuing the seminar series while Professor retired. I was “groomed” for this position, which I resisted, followed by Tim. Professor considered others, such as Dan and Dieter, but no one took the bait. Most of us simply did not have the time to take on all the travel involved. I agree with Dieter, It was a great honour to even be considered. But it is a role that no one could truly live up to.

I think the major thing most people do not understand is: Professor wanted a cooperative board which would show teamwork and diversity and work together to preserve and promote his art. All the "top dog" business, was just that, a business strategy meant to stimulate competition and satisfy egos. Professor never intended to name a singular "top dog", all those now coming out of the near and distant past to advance their claims to this are simply "entertaining themselves". Professor was very blunt in saying, “The BS is over.” When he became ill. The art was intended to outlast individual agendas and egos. Individually, I have never met anyone who was Professor's equal, not even close, no one can ever replace him. Working together as a group, we have the best hope of preserving the teaching for future generations. The "top dogs" are an illusion to whom Professor threw scraps as you would a pack of hungry wolves, they apparently needed this to continue their chase to have their greatness revealed, but in the final analysis, they are just noise in the wilderness. What Professor wanted, intended and clearly named for his legacy and for future generations, was a mature, thoughtful, and cooperative team who would work together to promote the art, not their own agendas and egos.

Datu David Hoffman

 

[norshadow1]

Originally posted by David Hoffman


I think the major thing most people do not understand is: Professor wanted a cooperative board which would show teamwork and diversity and work together to preserve and promote his art. All the "top dog" business, was just that, a business strategy meant to stimulate competition and satisfy egos. Professor never intended to name a singular "top dog", all those now coming out of the near and distant past to advance their claims to this are simply "entertaining themselves"... The "top dogs" are an illusion to whom Professor threw scraps as you would a pack of hungry wolves, they apparently needed this to continue their chase to have their greatness revealed, but in the final analysis, they are just noise in the wilderness. What Professor wanted, intended and clearly named for his legacy and for future generations, was a mature, thoughtful, and cooperative team who would work together to promote the art, not their own agendas and egos.

Datu David Hoffman

Well said. Hopefully in time it will come into being.

Lamont

 

[Brian Johns]

Originally posted by norshadow1
Well said. Hopefully in time it will come into being.

Lamont

I do believe that the current IMAF, Inc. Board of Directors (Schea group) is what Professor had in mind. What we have is a "mature, thoughtful, and cooperative team who would work together to promote the art, not their own agenda and egos. (quoting Datu Hoffman.)"

Take care,
Brian Johns

 

[Red Blade]

Originally posted by David Hoffman
The “successor” idea was something entirely different, primarily intended for continuing the seminar series while Professor retired. I was “groomed” for this position, which I resisted, followed by Tim. Professor considered others, such as Dan and Dieter, but no one took the bait.

Could you explain this?

 

[David Hoffman]

Originally posted by Red Blade
Could you explain this?

Yes, I would be happy to explain further. Can you ask me what specifically you are curious about? This so I don't ramble on without answering what you want. (As I do.) Also 2 things. I know this is a somewhat anonymous forum, but I prefer to only "talk" directly to people I can identify, as some of these matters are very personal and serious to me. If you do not wish to publish your name you can email me privately with your identity and questions and I will do my best to respond, (and respect your anonymity if you wish.)

Additionally, as I am off to my camp in the woods, please understand if I don't reply immediately. Please also consider that there are still many things which I do not feel at liberty to discuss in detail; either because they are personal or for legal reasons.

I have information and documents from our Grand Master, of beloved memory, which I am preparing for publication later this summer, in accordance with written instructions he left concerning how things were to be run after his passing. Very clear, very specific.

While this may do nothing to influence those with a private agenda in conflict with Professor’s wishes and vision, (some of the “complaints and demands for increased recognition and status which I see now on the internet where historical and well known to Professor, myself and numerous others. Professor simply did not agree with some students who in turn felt they had to do their “own thing” and sometimes quit in protest to form their own organizations.

I am not judging them, it is a free country as they say. Perhaps they are right and Professor was wrong or unfair. The time has past when he could speak for himself and past misunderstandings can never be resolved. Only one side of every story can now be argued. I chose to try to follow Professor’s wishes when he was with us, though often I failed out of ignorance or pride; and now I try, even harder, to remain loyal to his wishes and instructions for this, the time after he has left this world. In some cases Professor felt very betrayed: rightly or wrongly.

Knowing how easy misunderstandings and hurt feeling take place, I choose still to side with Professor exclusively, and I’m not that interested or bothered by others justification or arguments to the contrary. It does not make me right or correct, my personal bias is forever with my teacher. Those who also share with me this sincere intent to understand our teacher will, I’m sure, be very interested. Those with their own agendas will, I expect, not be so influenced, as they thought they knew better than Professor when he was alive. I hope those sincere students thirsty for information will bear with me on this and accept my good faith representation that some things must wait a bit longer before being publicly released.

May I offer please, to the Modern Arnis family this one idea; it is still not yet two years since our Grand Masters untimely departure, much understanding will come in the fullness of time. Many things are not yet settled; yet it seems as though sides are already being taken and judgements made. In my opinion, there has been a rush to publish opinions, debate and make and break allegiances, much of this, though perhaps unintentionally, is very premature and damaging to the Modern Arnis family as a whole.

This began even in the last months of Professor’s life and was a source of great pain for him. We owe it to his spirit to take the necessary time to let the story unfold. I expect we will all find much more to mutually endorse and respect than we realize. Myself very much included. There is so much more that includes us than that which divides, or excludes us.

Thank You,

David Hoffman

 

[MJS]

That is probably why there are so many problems in Modern Arnis today. Just like any other art, when the head of the systems passes, there are too many chiefs and not enough indians!! Of course everybody wants to be the next in line. The Prof. probably has told so many people that they are the next one, that he lost count. My opinion-- the person who was around him the longest, was able to perform the material the best, and could spread the art the way he did---THAT is the person that should be next in line!

Mike

 

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by WhoopAss
I do believe that the current IMAF, Inc. Board of Directors (Schea group) is what Professor had in mind. What we have is a "mature, thoughtful, and cooperative team who would work together to promote the art, not their own agenda and egos. (quoting Datu Hoffman.)"

Take care,
Brian Johns

I wouldn't be so sure.

What Professor had in mind, what 'works,' and what actually is occuring are totally different things. The IMAF, Inc. is trying to do their best to follow professors wishes, but it is not exactly what professor had in mind.

If I recall (and this backs what Mr. Hoffman is saying) there were about 30 or so people listed to be on a democratic board of directors. Many of these people listed are not even IMAF, Inc. members, let alone IMAF, Inc. Board members.

Besides, even though this is what was detailed, this doesn't discount the fact that Tim Hartman was offered the system when Professor was in Germany. If Tim had taken the promotion instead of worrying about Professors health, then all that was detailed about a "democratic board" would have been obsolete.

So, even though a democratic board was detailed as the way to go, can we even be sure that this was his true "wishes?" I say that it is difficult to be sure of anything at this point.

My point is, what "professor had in mind," whatever that was exactly, will never occur.

This doesn't mean that we can't all continue Professors dream in our own way, and we all do not need the IMAF, Inc. structure to do so.

And out of those who claim leadership, the strong will survive, and the weak will disappear, or be integrated with another stronger group. This will occur, dispite any petty internet objections.

Just my thoughts........

 

[Dan Anderson]

Originally posted by David Hoffman
Hello Dieter and Dan,

You recollection is correct. In fact, there were a total of 30 people nominated to be board members after our teachers passing. As suggested in this thread, Dan, Dieter and Tim were among the nominated players. The same is true for all the present IMAF board members. I personally urged both Dan and Dieter to accept this nomination and "come on board." To date both have chosen to remain independent. Regardless of your choice to refuse the nomination it is still historically significant that you were nominated. Datu David Hoffman

David,

Sorry bud, but I have to take issue on this one. Up to and including now, no one from IMAF central (anyone in a decision making position) has either written, telephoned or emailed me requesting or nominating me to be one of the board members of IMAF. The closest thing has been you mentioning it in a forum post or in private email.

I asked Dr. Shea, et al, and got nothing but very general replies as to what my position would be in IMAF, should I affiliate.

But I repeat, no one has approached me. I do not take your mentioning in a private post as any kind of substantial request or urging. I cannot speak for Tim or Dieter.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

 

[Dan Anderson]

David,

I am also curious about the documents you mention. One thing for sure, it is very hard to tell "what the Professor wanted" nearly two years after his death. As to the offer of being groomed for the "hot seat," yes, I was one among others. How many others I don't kow but I can certainly claim I wasn't the only one in the last 20+ years. That is truely a moot point in present time. I think what we, collectively (IMAF, WMAA, WMAC, independents, etc.), are doing is the right thing - continuing to train in and promoting Modern Arnis.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

PS - Symposium time is rapidly approaching!!

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Wasn't all this stuff mentioned in the will?

 

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz
Wasn't all this stuff mentioned in the will?

Dan;

I think to answer yours and Mr. Hubbards question: Yes.

It was my understanding that Professors wishes were detailed in his will; which I have not seen. This is what I have heard from others who have seen it.

I believe some where near 30 leaders were supposed to come to agreements, and democratically run the old IMAF. There are inherent problems with this, however. We can't get 30 leaders to agree on anything now, even with seperate orgs., so how the hell would be able to do it by committee?

There were inherent problems with this structure. Plus, Professor had the habit of changing his mind. So depending on when that will was dated, even if it was a week before he passed his wishes could have changed.

You just brought up another issue also, Dan; if you where on this list of 30, then why weren't you contacted? It is a good question, one that I ain't touching with a 10 foot pole.

To further complicate things; people in general are f**king lyers; whether by accident or on purpose. People like to change history to suit their own agenda's. People often like to look at only one side of the story as well; their side.

The fact is, I know a lot about what happend in the past, how ugly it got, and I have made my own logical conclusions as too what Remy's "wishes" were. Problem is, all my information is second hand; remember I took a year off seminars when all the S**t hit the fan.

But at least I'll call it like it is, and at least I'll admit my short comings. I can't say the same for others who are supposedly higher ranked and more experienced, yet have bigger short comings then me. I know all my info regarding the matter at hand is second hand info. So what? I also know that I feel that I should have known more about Remy's condition back then. But I will be the 1st to admit that to my knowledge it wasn't like he was asking, "Where is that Paul Janulis kid?" either. I also know that due to my age (not experience or skill) there is no way I would have been on that list of 30.

And you know what? I am glad that I wasn't on the list, and I am glad I wasn't invited to the @$$ kissing party in Victoria, Canada. Back then I was angry, but now I am not; I am just being blunt here. Because I missed it, this makes the issue NOT MY RESPONSABILITY; and while other leaders may bicker, jocky, or hide behind half-truths and ambiguity, I am training and getting better. So watch out, mother f**kers, because if you don't see me right on your tail right now, it is because I am already ahead of you. And you'll only have the pleasure of finding this out when you someday get shown up by a "junior".

And if it is I who gets "shown up" then I am even happier, because then I just learned something. I already have the mentality that says, "I suck", so I will always learn. It would just be nice if this light bulb would go on for everyone, but that is asking for to much, I think.

Sorry for the rant. Although I have been vocal in the past about certian things, there are a lot of issues that I haven't touched within a mile. The details of the will, and his overall plan and such is one of these issues. I haven't touched these (and won't in a public forum) because I was not there; so my information is second hand.

Dan, if your looking for answers, give me a ring and I can tell you what I know, or at least what I have heard. This might help you in your search.

As for everyone else and for those who like to twist and conceal information; I'll just say that I am glad that I have no skeletons in my closet. So for those of you who have information, yet are hiding it, or twisting it to fit your own agenda, I hope that you someday come clean. And for those of you who are playing the "I know a secret" game, when you really don't have anything but crap on your thumb from sitting on it all day, then I hope you feel real special about yourself.

Just never forget that you are messing around with a dead man's wishes, and if you don't come clean then you are the one who has to wear that black mark on your soul.

I'm just glad that mine is clean, at least in regards to this issue...

Paul Janulis

P.S. To cover myself, this dark and dreary post is not directed at anyone in particular (except in that I answered Dan Anderson and asked him to call me). So, do not take anything as a personal slam. However, for those whom the shoe fits, it is up to you to show it off. Don't come crying to me with your responses because you have much bigger issues to contend with, and it ain't with me.

 

[arnisador]

I've been hearing about the will for years. If Mr. Hartman hadn't assured me that it exists I'd be thinking it was just an old wives' tale by now--'a legend used to frighten children' as they say.

When it finally does come out so much will have happened that I fear its impact will be diminished.

 

[Datu Tim Hartman]

Mr. Janulis does not speak for the WMAA on this matter. We encourage and support our member’s freedom of speech. However his statement does not reflect the opinion of the WMAA.

:asian:

 

[Brian Johns]

Paul said:

To further complicate things; people in general are f**king lyers;

Problem is, all my information is second hand; remember I took a year off seminars when all the S**t hit the fan.

And you know what? I am glad that I wasn't on the list, and I am glad I wasn't invited to the @$$ kissing party in Victoria, Canada. Back then I was angry, but now I am not; I am just being blunt here.

So watch out, mother f**kers, because if you don't see me right on your tail right now, it is because I am already ahead of you.

Just never forget that you are messing around with a dead man's wishes, and if you don't come clean then you are the one who has to wear that black mark on your soul.

[/B][/QUOTE]

Wow, Paul, judging by the language (see above) in your post, it appears that you still harbor quite a bit of anger, contrary to your assertions. I was under the impression that you wanted to mend things and move forward. At least that's the impression that I got from Mao when he told me that you two had spoken on the phone recently. I hope that you are able to resolve some of these issues and move on.

It was good talking with you at Michigan. I still remember that great meal your mom cooked up after Professor's seminar in May of 2000. Hope that all is well with your mom and your brother.

Take care,
Brian

 

[Datu Tim Hartman]

The problem is that there are 3 sides to every story. Yours, Mine and the TRUTH! The problem here is that everyone has a STORY.


I’m curious what you meant when you wrote the following?

The “successor” idea was something entirely different, primarily intended for continuing the seminar series while Professor retired. I was “groomed” for this position, which I resisted, followed by Tim.

Are you saying that I was supposed to take over the seminars? This does make sense. When was this all planned, before or after his retirement?

 

[Mao]

Paul,
Ouch. What happend with what you and I had talked about on the phone? Did something new happen?
Et all,
I have said before that, for some, the answers won't make much difference because they won't be satisfied with ANY answer.
It would be nice if people with only second hand information would seek information from more places. Paul had guts enough to come to the Mi. camp even after some of the things that he had said regarding the group. It would have been a good time to begin to build, mend, re-establish relationships and move forward. It sounds, though, like there is more to deal with. He still showed up. Kudo's. As David Hoffman has said, it has been but two years since Remy's passing. Many things are not yet settled, personally as well as legally. In the fullness of time they will be. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that has been given US. (how Gandalf, eh?) I have found myself biting my tongue alot lately. I'll do this more, I'm sure. So much of the second guessing, posturing, self promoting and self agrandizing is just so much noise. Who does it really benefit in the end? It won't get you into Heaven.
MAO

 

[Cruentus]

My post was kind of my way of throwing a granade into the crowd. I re-read what I wrote, and I sound a lot more pissed then I actually am. Whoops! You know it's bad when Tim has to put up a disclaimer for the WMAA!

Thing to remember when Paul posts: I write a lot, but I really don't spend a lot of time here. I can read and type fairly quickly; so I often rattle off a post that might have a different tone then I even expect. Oh well....it's more fun that way....hmmm what will I rattle off next?

My intention in writing it was to give people a wake up call. As I said previously I wasn't directing my post to any one person or group in particular.

The shoe fits many people across the modern arnis world. Many people have been so fixated on trying to position themselves that they aren't growing. Many others are trying so hard to preserve what they've learned without moving forward, and they aren't growing. There are also many others who are trying to preserve "their version" of the "truth" of Remy's wishes and passing, instead of trying to find out the actual truth (whether it works in their favor or not) and they are not growing either.

I think that their are many people in Modern Arnis who are not growing; and they don't even realize it. Furthermore, it is bad for the art. So for those who are not growing, I can't stop your behavior, but at least you can't say that you weren't told. Meanwhile, their are other people who are considered "juniors" to many of the leaders who are still training and growing, despite the mess. All I am saying is that if the "seniors" who are guilty of the above keep screwing around, they will find many "juniors" (not just me) are going to leave them in the dust.

In terms of unfinished business; there is still a lot of it, especially regarding the infamous "will" and other matters. All I am saying, as I had said before, is that I am damn glad that none of that is my responsability.

MAO and WHOOP:

Hi fella's. Yes, I am moving forward. Please don't take my posts here personally; as I said before I am not directing it at any one group. If we were in the same room having this discussion, I would have said the same thing I said above, cept' you would have seen the smile on my face and the even tone in my voice, so you would have understood that I am just stating how I feel, but I am not an emotional wreck or angry over these feelings. Modern Arnis has moved forward in leaps and bounds in many ways since Remy's passing; but there is still a lot of mess, and unfinished business. Sometimes when the subject comes up, I may say things to try to donk people on the head :hammer: so that they will get a reality check. If by my post I got one person to think outside of the box, then I feel that it was worth it.

There are a lot of issues and unfinished business; I am just glad that it is not my responsability to piece it all together, that's for sure. Since it is not my responsability, I can still move forward, build relationships, visit other peoples events, etc., with a clear conscience.

So don't worry guys; I may have my opinions, and some may be harsh, and different then yours. This doesn't mean that I am going to be a negative nancy all the time; or that my opinions are going to effect my progression, or my ability to progress the art.

"And that's all I'm gonna say" :mst: