Wing Woo Gar
Grandmaster
Well, there you have it. Same story three times.
White Crane Element Hands
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Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
I think that sometimes some people are inclined to take a deep dive into the esoteric side of this stuff and they try and give it more significance than it merits. There may be a legitimate place for it but it is small and useless without the mainline stuff. The sprinkles vs. the cake, as @Wing Woo Gar put it.
Some years ago a fellow came onto the forums here and was pushing a line of esoteric knowledge in the Tibetan lineages. He took mild offense when I asked for some clarification on some points he was making, I didn’t simply take what he said at face value especially when it was in direct conflict with how I understood things. I get the impression that some people want to feel like they have something extra special and rare and keeping it a secret gives them power. He alluded to having a list of all the lineage holders of the Tibetan method from its founding to the present, and making a point that he would not be sharing it publically. I think he was hoping I would beg him to share his special sauce with me, as if knowing a list of Tibetan and Chinese practitioners, all of them long dead, would somehow improve my practice.
He eventually went away.
Some years ago a fellow came onto the forums here and was pushing a line of esoteric knowledge in the Tibetan lineages. He took mild offense when I asked for some clarification on some points he was making, I didn’t simply take what he said at face value especially when it was in direct conflict with how I understood things. I get the impression that some people want to feel like they have something extra special and rare and keeping it a secret gives them power. He alluded to having a list of all the lineage holders of the Tibetan method from its founding to the present, and making a point that he would not be sharing it publically. I think he was hoping I would beg him to share his special sauce with me, as if knowing a list of Tibetan and Chinese practitioners, all of them long dead, would somehow improve my practice.
He eventually went away.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
I wonder if some of these teachers might simply recognize that the concepts will not translate well into the English language and the Western culture. And maybe the extra value that the sprinkles add isn’t worth the aggravation of trying to bridge that language and cultural gap.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
Make it 4, had a Xingyiquan teacher say pretty much the same thing once as well
Or, perhaps there are other, more practical ways to convey that knowledge in Western culture? I know my old Chinese sifu felt that way when explaining certain things about Wing Chun. He felt that Westerners (and some Chinese) tended to make way too much of traditional concepts of yin and yang, qi, and wuxia stuff.
He was not fond of making things mystical and mysterious. He just wanted us to learn good kung fu. Too much mystical speculation was seen as a distraction. The classic response to this chatter is Mo kung kau, gung sau! (Don't work your mouth, work your hands!).
The Xing Yi 5 elements is very useful fighting strategy. If used properly, it can make a fight simple. If you can detect your opponent's fighting strategy, you can select the right fighting strategy to against him.
For example, if your opponent likes to
- use hard block (metal), you can use uncommitted fake punches to let him to block into the thin air (fire).
- use kick (wood), you can use hard block to hurt his leg (metal).
- borrow your force (water), you can use strong defense to move in slowly so he can't borrow your force (earth).
- punch (fire), you can wrap his punching arm and take him down (water).
- move in inch by inch with strong defense (earth), you can use long range kick or foot sweep to disturb him (wood).
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isshinryuronin
Senior Master
It is human nature, I think, to be attracted to the exotic. Western men may be attracted to Oriental women and Oriental men may dream about Western women for this reason. Oriental thought is not exotic to Orientals, it's part of how they grew up and accepted at face value. For Westerners, it's seen as something mysterious and so given undue importance. This is not saying it's of no value, but rather it should just be kept in perspective.
This attraction to the exotic may even be a survival instinct. It draws us to the mysterious and exposes us to new ideas, a broader gene pool, and other experiences we might otherwise not be inclined to explore. I'm sure in the 60's thru the 80's, fascination with the exotic and mysterious East led many to explore TMA.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
I think the teachers that really know what they are talking about tend to stay away from the mystical and the wuxia stuff. When they don't, to me that is a bit of a red flag.
Wing Woo Gar
Grandmaster
Anyone I know?
Wing Woo Gar
Grandmaster
Sifu Gale used to say that “ the mumbo jumbo is real but not without the physical reality “. In other words, “shut up and work your legs”. He was a believer in proper diet for training and would often suggest individual meals or ingredients for individuals in some state or at some points of training and would vary those instructions the seasons as well. He never said much about it and we were careful to only ask well thought out and pertinent questions. If asked how he was able to do some things his answers could vary from “it’s a simple trick” to “ that’s why my name is on the sign outside”.
isshinryuronin
Senior Master
Exactly!
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
and my wife is Chinese
