What truly is "Traditional" Tae Kwon Do?

[Miles]

Traditional TKD also included getting hit with a shinai or in our case a plastic wiffle ball bat when your stance wasn't perfect.

The "tradition" of Taekwondo is evolution.......

 

[dortiz]

Ah, the good old sound of the Chukto WHACK!

"Taekwondo has spent the past 54 years trying to be not-karate, but in order to get off of the ground, it began as essentially Korean karate. In the process, it inherited a good number of traditions from karate."

Also most of TKD has spent that time trying to become the vanilla of Martail Arts to the world. Making it FUN, and "A great place for families". This process of mass appeal has had many comprimises.

I think this is what some of us are talking about. The difference from the old school fighting /conditioning gym to a the family fun activity center.

Dave O.

 

[IcemanSK]

Traditional TKD also included getting hit with a shinai or in our case a plastic wiffle ball bat when your stance wasn't perfect.

The "tradition" of Taekwondo is evolution.......

Can I get get an Amen!

 

[terryl965]

Can I get get an Amen!

Amen Brother​

 

[troubleenuf]

In our case it was a vacuum hose extensions.... you know one of those aluminum things about 4 feet long with a little hole in the end of it for the attachments... when you herd the little whistle coming you knew it was time to get your butt up on pushups!!! We sometimes got the shania sword as well...try doing THAT little tradition in your classes now!???

Traditional TKD also included getting hit with a shinai or in our case a plastic wiffle ball bat when your stance wasn't perfect.

The "tradition" of Taekwondo is evolution.......

 

[terryl965]

Traditional TKD also included getting hit with a shinai or in our case a plastic wiffle ball bat when your stance wasn't perfect.

The "tradition" of Taekwondo is evolution.......

Well my instructor used a Kendo stick man it did ever feel great against the back of the legs.:toilclaw: :flushed: :mrtoilet:

 

[Joab]

I've seen "traditional tae-kwon-do" advertised as "korean karate" on a sign outside a Tae-Kwon-Do school in Seattle. To those who laugh at traditional Tae-Kwon-Do being labeled as "non contact", that was what I was told by Ed Bailey, a teacher of Tae-Kwon-Do in Edmonds, Washington when I asked him what is traditional Tae-Kwon-Do. Just parotting what he told me.

 

[spinny]

Traditional TKD also included getting hit with a shinai or in our case a plastic wiffle ball bat when your stance wasn't perfect.

The "tradition" of Taekwondo is evolution.......

Haha. My instructor likes to threaten us with his golf club. But I think that in light of attitudes toward what constitutes abuse, he'd never hit us with it, though I've heard stories from the old timers...
I have received several smacks with a kicking paddle though. Pinches, too. That's probably the worst anyone can get away with these days.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

You need to understand that Safety Gear was primitve to non existant in the 1960's and earlier.

Han Cha Kyo was originaly Chung Do Kwan and one of the pioneers, involved in the demo before President Rhee in 1954 (1953?). And an Original Oh Do Kwan member / instructor. He was once asked why they did non contact sparring as he had done in the Oh Do Kwan.

His answer was simple. At any moment they might be engaged in real combat and hand to hand warfare. They couldn't risk having to do that with injuries sustained in TKD sparring.

Just to clarify, when I said that my experience was the opposite of Joab's, that was not a jab. My experience really was just the opposite; a lot of contact. My early experience was not like that; it was kids classes with light to no contact. It was not until I was a teen in the early eighties and trained at a school where contact was the norm where I was specifically told that it was traditional.

I can completely understand the reasons for non-contact in the pre-hogu days, especially for students who have day jobs and a life that requires them to remain reasonably uninjured.

Daniel

 

[Tez3]

I suppose you youngsters couldn't refrain from phrases that make us older ones feel so much older! I would much prefer things that have come about since I was born to be called 'habits' rather than traditions lol!

TKD was introduced into the UK in the sixties so it is young here.

Daniel you'd be surprised what MMAers wear, I know a good heavyweight that wears Gi and his Blackbelt, does mean kata too. To get his blackbelt he went through the old style 30 man kumite. We have plenty of blackbelt TKDists too.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I suppose you youngsters couldn't refrain from phrases that make us older ones feel so much older! I would much prefer things that have come about since I was born to be called 'habits' rather than traditions lol!

TKD was introduced into the UK in the sixties so it is young here.

Taekwondo is young everywhere. Even in Korea. Taekwondo came here in rougly the sixties or early seventies. Same with everywhere else outside of Korea; they were still arguing over what to call it over who had control until the sixties. There was a good deal of resistance to the name by many of the principles involved, and there were other names that were in rotation. At one point, it was kong soo do, I believe also tae soo do, and even Tang soo do, which never unified and exists as a separate art today.

Daniel you'd be surprised what MMAers wear, I know a good heavyweight that wears Gi and his Blackbelt, does mean kata too. To get his blackbelt he went through the old style 30 man kumite. We have plenty of blackbelt TKDists too.

MMA with a gi. That sounds cool! I figured that if I said MMA shorts, though, everyone would know what I meant. Saying 'boxer shorts' has non athletic connotations.

Daniel

 

[Tez3]

We've had a couple of fighters actually fight in BJJ Gi's and quite a few come on in karate Gis and belt, removing the jacket only.
We've had fighters fight in Speedos too lol! Shorts or Gi bottoms sooo much better!
I know a lot of people would prefer TKD (and TSD, my TSD book says its a couple of thousand years old) to be a really old martial art but it's honest and refreshing when people tell the truth about it. Whether it's an effective art or not doesn't depend on it's age it depends on it's practitioners.

 

[Manny]

Your spelling looked okay to me.

Just to clarify, it is not so much that I feel that it is too new to have traditions; it does. But it is new enough that those traditions are still being sorted out.

Taekwondo has spent the past 54 years trying to be not-karate, but in order to get off of the ground, it began as essentially Korean karate. In the process, it inherited a good number of traditions from karate.

One was the kyu/dan and belt system (karate inherited that from judo), another the dogi (also inherited from judo by karate). Forms were inherited, much of the base technique was inherited, sparring style was inherited, and even the name, "karate" was used early on when promoting taekwondo outside of Korea.

Now, taekwondo has its own forms, and in some orgs, is on its second or third generation of them, its own dobok in Kukkiwon/WTF, its own unique sparring style in the WTF, which is now an olympic event as well and is very distinct from Shotokan karate.

But all of taekwondo has not adopted the same items. Only the WTF uses its sparring style, a lot of schools do not use the vee neck dobok, and all of taekwondo still uses the same belt and kyu/dan system found in karate.

There are traditions in terms of behavior that are common to all Asian MA due to them being common to Asian culture, and I would expect these to endure.

Daniel

Daniel, thank you very much my friend, you are a truly gentelman and very prepared and versed about TKD.

Yes, it's true Kukiwon and WTF have make super efforts to separate TKD of Karate, the sparring is totally diferent and now I reallize why, Korean wants that every time a person (Tae Kwon Doing or just the regular guy) sees TKD sparring they wanted that people recogniced TKD as a Korean Martial Art/Sport and not a Japanese or Chinese one. For this KKW/WTF has set worldwide standars rules for kyorugi, poomsae (more latter),uniforms (V neck),etc,etc.

That's why TKD is mainly a kicking art, because they don't want any comparision with other Asian Martial Arts Like Judo,Karate or Kung Fu.

TKD has takedowns, but if TKD emphasis in this it will be not TKD, it will be somekind of judo, TKD has empty hand techs but if it emphasised in this it will be come some kind of Karate, etc,etc.

TKD has the largest arsenal of kicks in the world, no other MA has so many kicking techs or aerial licks or fancy kicks, this is a tarde mark of TKD.

TKD is a young MA that comes from older MA (inlfuenced by japanese/chinese), however even is young it has it's history and have old techs thar are very good for self defense, this is what we must to keep to not only see TKD as a full contact kicking sport.

About the poomsae, the taeguk 1 to 8 have little japanese resemblance, however from above kungam the poomsaes has some japanese moves (techs).

Even I don't like at all the WTF Sparring rules, I love TKD, that's why I am still inside it. When I was thinking about taking other martial art to COMPLEMENT my hunger of self defense techs, I have a first aproach to Japanese Karte but declined cause it was TKD but with more hands than feet, then I took Kenpo Karate but only with the goal of upgrated my TKD in the form of self defense techs that in my dojang are not taught, and let me write againg TO UPGRATE my TKD.

I am realicing those days that I will not change TKD, TKD is what it is, a heavily oriented kicking sport/martial art, that's it's sence, that's it's goal and I am changing my mind and way of thinking (slowly but I am doing it).

Daniel thank you very much for helping me to understand the facts of TKD.

Manny

 

[Steve]

Does anyone else here read Colin Wee's blog? I've been reading it for a couple years now and enjoy it very much. He has a lot of interesting things to say about TKD.

http://traditionaltaekwondo.blogspot.com/

 

[Tez3]

Daniel, thank you very much my friend, you are a truly gentelman and very prepared and versed about TKD.

Yes, it's true Kukiwon and WTF have make super efforts to separate TKD of Karate, the sparring is totally diferent and now I reallize why, Korean wants that every time a person (Tae Kwon Doing or just the regular guy) sees TKD sparring they wanted that people recogniced TKD as a Korean Martial Art/Sport and not a Japanese or Chinese one. For this KKW/WTF has set worldwide standars rules for kyorugi, poomsae (more latter),uniforms (V neck),etc,etc.

That's why TKD is mainly a kicking art, because they don't want any comparision with other Asian Martial Arts Like Judo,Karate or Kung Fu.

TKD has takedowns, but if TKD emphasis in this it will be not TKD, it will be somekind of judo, TKD has empty hand techs but if it emphasised in this it will be come some kind of Karate, etc,etc.

TKD has the largest arsenal of kicks in the world, no other MA has so many kicking techs or aerial licks or fancy kicks, this is a tarde mark of TKD.

TKD is a young MA that comes from older MA (inlfuenced by japanese/chinese), however even is young it has it's history and have old techs thar are very good for self defense, this is what we must to keep to not only see TKD as a full contact kicking sport.

About the poomsae, the taeguk 1 to 8 have little japanese resemblance, however from above kungam the poomsaes has some japanese moves (techs).

Even I don't like at all the WTF Sparring rules, I love TKD, that's why I am still inside it. When I was thinking about taking other martial art to COMPLEMENT my hunger of self defense techs, I have a first aproach to Japanese Karte but declined cause it was TKD but with more hands than feet, then I took Kenpo Karate but only with the goal of upgrated my TKD in the form of self defense techs that in my dojang are not taught, and let me write againg TO UPGRATE my TKD.

I am realicing those days that I will not change TKD, TKD is what it is, a heavily oriented kicking sport/martial art, that's it's sence, that's it's goal and I am changing my mind and way of thinking (slowly but I am doing it).

Daniel thank you very much for helping me to understand the facts of TKD.

Manny

Actually Wado Ryu karate has more kicks, jumping as well than TKD, also has more stances and strikes. Sorry.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Nothing against TKD, I use to train it and rather liked back in the old days

That's why TKD is mainly a kicking art, because they don't want any comparision with other Asian Martial Arts Like Judo,Karate or Kung Fu.

Yes it is mainly a kicking art and not wanting to be argumentative but CMA styles like Changquan, Shaolinquan and Sanshou have a rather large number of kicks as does Muay Thai and I am guessing as much or more than TKD

TKD has takedowns, but if TKD emphasis in this it will be not TKD, it will be somekind of judo, TKD has empty hand techs but if it emphasised in this it will be come some kind of Karate, etc,etc.

TKD pre-1988 had takedowns, joint locks as well as close in fighting drills

TKD has the largest arsenal of kicks in the world, no other MA has so many kicking techs or aerial licks or fancy kicks, this is a tarde mark of TKD.

Again no; see Tez’s post and again Changquan, Shaolinquan, Muay Thai, Sanshou.

 

[Twin Fist]

Actually Wado Ryu karate has more kicks, jumping as well than TKD, also has more stances and strikes. Sorry.

as does HRD and Kuk Sul Won

TKD actually doesnt have many kicks at all. Many kung fu styles have more, and more complex kicks than TKD

 

[Twin Fist]

"traditional" tKD is NOT the pull over uniform, all kicking, hogu wearing olympic style stuff

that is a creation of the 80's

TRADITIONAL TKD is pretty much Shotokan with different names for the techniques

 

[MSUTKD]

Nor is it a black uniform with red stripes.

Traditional TKD has nothing to do with uniforms or hogus or the use/non use of them. Learn some REAL history please.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

as does HRD and Kuk Sul Won

TKD actually doesnt have many kicks at all. Many kung fu styles have more, and more complex kicks than TKD

And HKD as well.

As for the quantity of kicks in TKD, I am curious as to how much variance there is between the different styls of TKD (Kukkiwon, Chang Hon, Songham, etc.).

Daniel