To past critics of killing intruders, I give you..

[MJS]

MJS, while I do not support having to leave and support the right to defend oneself I was repeating a discussion. I can only imagine this guy asking what would you do in the above mentioned fire? You should have a rope or flexible ladder by a window(s) upstairs so they could be used to go down to the patio. Then on the patio, you also would have a flexible ladder to get down as well.

I just remember this guy saying you could go to jail and loose your house and car and pension and savings and then who would take care of your wife and kids then? (* See the whole in the arguement here? It is ok to take care of the bad guy, but not the nice guy wife and kid who is in jail for defending them. *)

I know that it seems like a reasonable person would say you were just protecting your family. Although good investigation might check for blogs or forums to see if you have expressed an opinion, and then use it against you to show you had predermined your actions with taking your chances with defending yourself.

Now personally, I think you and everyone should be able to defend themselves. I tink it is silly to assume that someone breaking into your house has the rights of posession while you the legal owner have to leave. If is just crazy to think about that in my mind.

I wish you luck.

Send a letter or e-mail to the sponsor of the firearms forum http://glsda.org/ . They helped lobby here in Michigan. They might be able to help you in your state.

I know Rich. Thanks for the link and the advice. Its really a shame that the laws are set up to protect the bad guy. Someone breaks into my house with ill intent, I defend myself, and I could end up in jail and possibly get sued by this guy?:idunno: That makes sense. When you stop and think of all this, whats the sense of training, owning a firearm, or pretty much anything? Use it and you're shafted, don't use it and you're still shafted. Doesnt look like good odds to me. I say screw it...I'd rather take my chances, than sit back, do nothing and end up tied up while someone rapes my wife.

Mike

 

[CuongNhuka]

I know Rich. Thanks for the link and the advice. Its really a shame that the laws are set up to protect the bad guy. Someone breaks into my house with ill intent, I defend myself, and I could end up in jail and possibly get sued by this guy?:idunno: That makes sense. When you stop and think of all this, whats the sense of training, owning a firearm, or pretty much anything? Use it and you're shafted, don't use it and you're still shafted. Doesnt look like good odds to me. I say screw it...I'd rather take my chances, than sit back, do nothing and end up tied up while someone rapes my wife.

Mike

My thoughts exactly. Hay, if they can sue me, can I sue them back? For, like, the emotion distress of having to seriously wound/kill somebody? Getting arrested.. well... I dunno.

 

[MJS]

While surfing the web this morning, I came across this. Looks like it was written in 2007, so its pretty up to date.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

I'm not gonna say publicly what I would do or how I feel except to add a little bit of wisdom I heard awhile back that fits:


Everyone is entitled to their last mistake.

 

[CuongNhuka]

Everyone is entitled to their last mistake.

And their right to take a bullet (or sickle) in the face for it

 

[KenpoTex]

Always be sure it is an intruder and not a family member going to the bathroom. Once you are sure, game time is over. If they are still in the house they get carried out, if they make it out they are not free because I will do the same as if they were still in the house only you now have to carrier them back in. You have to know your capabilities and your limitations. Life one o one.

Everyone seems to have "a friend that's a cop" who told them to drag the body back inside if you kill them outside...

That's ********! it's called tampering with the evidence. If you're dumb enough to do this, anybody with half a brain will be able to see the signs and it will NOT be looked upon favorably.

If you shoot/stab/hit them and they flee, let the police catch them. If you chase them down and finish them off, you've just committed murder.

 

[elder999]

Everyone seems to have "a friend that's a cop" who told them to drag the body back inside if you kill them outside...

That's ********! it's called tampering with the evidence. If you're dumb enough to do this, anybody with half a brain will be able to see the signs and it will NOT be looked upon favorably.

If you shoot/stab/hit them and they flee, let the police catch them. If you chase them down and finish them off, you've just committed murder.

..what he said...

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Everyone seems to have "a friend that's a cop" who told them to drag the body back inside if you kill them outside...

That's ********! it's called tampering with the evidence. If you're dumb enough to do this, anybody with half a brain will be able to see the signs and it will NOT be looked upon favorably.

If you shoot/stab/hit them and they flee, let the police catch them. If you chase them down and finish them off, you've just committed murder.

Can't be overemphasized.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Actually while talking to an ADA (* don't ask *) a few years ago he explained to me that if you live in a two tory house you should have an escape plan if there is a fire in the stairwell. So since you are expected to have a safe way out of your house in case of a fire, you should take the route to leave if there is an intruder. I asked him about this escape plan and if it did not or would it not make the house more accessible to intruders? He said if they come in that way then go down the stairs.

The good news is that Michigan changed many of its' basic laws last year. So this nonsense and craziness of protecting the intruder in your house.

Thank goodness for those changes in laws!

 

[jks9199]

Everyone seems to have "a friend that's a cop" who told them to drag the body back inside if you kill them outside...

That's ********! it's called tampering with the evidence. If you're dumb enough to do this, anybody with half a brain will be able to see the signs and it will NOT be looked upon favorably.

If you shoot/stab/hit them and they flee, let the police catch them. If you chase them down and finish them off, you've just committed murder.

Just to add to that...

An otherwise defensible situation becomes automatically suspiciously guilty-looking if you move the body or change the scene around (other than in a reasonably attempt to render aid).

In other words... it's typically pretty obvious if you've altered the crime scene. And if you do so -- you look guilty and wrong, even if you were in the right.

 

[MJS]

Looks like the Prosecutor is seeking the death penalty!

http://www.wfsb.com/news/13762474/detail.html

 

[Drac]

Intruder, meet Mr. Mossberg.

Just the sound of Mr Mossberg getting ready to speak is enough to get uninvited guests to run-like-hell................

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Mr. Mossberg only has to clear his throat but ONCE.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Looks like the Prosecutor is seeking the death penalty!

http://www.wfsb.com/news/13762474/detail.html

I try not to be someone who normally rejoices in someone's upcoming death.

But in this specific case I believe a drink is warranted.

 

[Sapper6]

I try not to be someone who normally rejoices in someone's upcoming death.

But in this specific case I believe a drink is warranted.

be careful with that. you could easily be construed as a death-monger

 

[MJS]

Well, one of two things needs to happen. These scumbags need the death penalty or spend the rest of their lives in prison. Given their long criminal history, and considering they were out on parole and I don't think that B&E, in addition to arson, sexual assault and murder are things that one can do when out on parole, they just dont seem like they learned their lesson from the previous prison time.

 

[Thesemindz]

Well, one of two things needs to happen. These scumbags need the death penalty or spend the rest of their lives in prison. Given their long criminal history, and considering they were out on parole and I don't think that B&E, in addition to arson, sexual assault and murder are things that one can do when out on parole, they just dont seem like they learned their lesson from the previous prison time.

I disagree. I think they learned their lessons well. My understanding is that their previous crimes were mostly non violent property crime. Theft, burglary, breaking and entering. After enough time in prison, they learned to escalate the violence of their actions. They learned to target the wealthy. They learned to take advantage of the love of family to make people vulnerable. They learned to destroy the evidence of their crimes. They learned to seperate and restrain their victims to make escape more difficult. They learned to sexually assault people, because they're gonna kill them anyway, so why not?

If they are parolled again, I'm sure they will have learned a great deal from this experience. The next time they drive a woman to the bank to get money from her account while they torture her family back at home, they'll make sure she isn't able to alert anyone to her predicament. Next time they'll make sure they get away without getting caught. Next time they'll target someone with more to lose. Next time there won't be any survivors.


-Rob

 

[MJS]

I disagree. I think they learned their lessons well. My understanding is that their previous crimes were mostly non violent property crime. Theft, burglary, breaking and entering. After enough time in prison, they learned to escalate the violence of their actions. They learned to target the wealthy. They learned to take advantage of the love of family to make people vulnerable. They learned to destroy the evidence of their crimes. They learned to seperate and restrain their victims to make escape more difficult. They learned to sexually assault people, because they're gonna kill them anyway, so why not?

If they are parolled again, I'm sure they will have learned a great deal from this experience. The next time they drive a woman to the bank to get money from her account while they torture her family back at home, they'll make sure she isn't able to alert anyone to her predicament. Next time they'll make sure they get away without getting caught. Next time they'll target someone with more to lose. Next time there won't be any survivors.


-Rob

True, true, true!! Sadly the lessons that they should have been learning, they failed.

Mike

 

[Andy Moynihan]

be careful with that. you could easily be construed as a death-monger

Hell, Sapper:

*I'm American.

*I'm a gun owner(with CCW).

* I'm a martial artist.

* I'm in the State Guard(AND the Civil Air Patrol.

*I'm not liberal.


So to most of these people I probably already AM a "death-monger", may as well have 'em know up front what they're getting into.

 

[CuongNhuka]

*I'm not liberal.

-cough, cough- Republicans suck -cough cough-

Just kidding!