Thinking of starting

[Supra Vijai]

Hey guys (and girls),

I'm currently training in JMA - Ninjutsu to be exact - and have been for close to 3 years. While I love the art and find it versatile enough to cover a wide range of aspects, I'm finding I get a lot more of the traditional side of it rather than the "street". Now Ninjutsu itself was never designed for use in today's streets so that makes sense but it means I'm a little deficient with a few areas.

I sat in on a class at a Doce Pares training centre near my area and am interested in cross training. I've mentioned this to my sensei who's said he thinks I'd probably get a fair bit out of it as well. I was just hoping to get some clarification on the distinctions of the different systems? Doce Pares on here is listed as it's own system, I thought it was just the name of the school - similar to the Bujinkan with Ninjutsu for example.

Also, from what I've read in the past, Arnis, Escrima, Kali etc are all just different names for the same art based on where it's from. Is that right or they actually different arts? Is there one in particular which is more suited to be adapted to street/modern self defence?

Also one final thing, I'm not huge on competitions/tournaments. Nothing against them or people in them but I'm after something that's a bit more "real" and combat based rather than sport based. Thoughts on that would be good too!

Thanks in advance

 

[MJS]

Hey guys (and girls),

I'm currently training in JMA - Ninjutsu to be exact - and have been for close to 3 years. While I love the art and find it versatile enough to cover a wide range of aspects, I'm finding I get a lot more of the traditional side of it rather than the "street". Now Ninjutsu itself was never designed for use in today's streets so that makes sense but it means I'm a little deficient with a few areas.

I sat in on a class at a Doce Pares training centre near my area and am interested in cross training. I've mentioned this to my sensei who's said he thinks I'd probably get a fair bit out of it as well. I was just hoping to get some clarification on the distinctions of the different systems? Doce Pares on here is listed as it's own system, I thought it was just the name of the school - similar to the Bujinkan with Ninjutsu for example.

Also, from what I've read in the past, Arnis, Escrima, Kali etc are all just different names for the same art based on where it's from. Is that right or they actually different arts? Is there one in particular which is more suited to be adapted to street/modern self defence?

Also one final thing, I'm not huge on competitions/tournaments. Nothing against them or people in them but I'm after something that's a bit more "real" and combat based rather than sport based. Thoughts on that would be good too!

Thanks in advance

I've been training in Arnis (Remy Presas) for quite some time now, and I love it! The weapon work and empty hand stuff is great and effective. Its amazing how easy Arnis blends with my Kenpo, but also how easy things translate from empty hand to weapon.

There are alot of similarities but alot of differences as well, as some of the arts tend to focus on specific things more than others. For example, you'll probably see alot more knife stuff in Pekiti Tirsia and Sayoc. This isn't to say knife stuff isnt in other FMAs, just that there may be more of a focus.

As for the competition....IMO, you dont need to do something like that, but I would suggest doing some sparring/pressure testing at your own school. You definately get a whole different feel to things, when the pace is picked up. But no, you dont have to enter the Dog Bros events. LOL! Unless you wanted to of course.

Not sure what kind of FMA schools you have in your area, but I'd definately check them out. Take a few trial classes, ask questions, including here, as there're alot of people here who can help you out.

Good luck and if you do decide to join up somewhere, I'm sure you'll enjoy it very much.

 

[Supra Vijai]

I've been training in Arnis (Remy Presas) for quite some time now, and I love it! The weapon work and empty hand stuff is great and effective. Its amazing how easy Arnis blends with my Kenpo, but also how easy things translate from empty hand to weapon.

There are alot of similarities but alot of differences as well, as some of the arts tend to focus on specific things more than others. For example, you'll probably see alot more knife stuff in Pekiti Tirsia and Sayoc. This isn't to say knife stuff isnt in other FMAs, just that there may be more of a focus.

As for the competition....IMO, you dont need to do something like that, but I would suggest doing some sparring/pressure testing at your own school. You definately get a whole different feel to things, when the pace is picked up. But no, you dont have to enter the Dog Bros events. LOL! Unless you wanted to of course.

Not sure what kind of FMA schools you have in your area, but I'd definately check them out. Take a few trial classes, ask questions, including here, as there're alot of people here who can help you out.

Good luck and if you do decide to join up somewhere, I'm sure you'll enjoy it very much.

Thanks MJS

The instructor I was speaking to at Doce Pares said that their tournaments are more an in house affair with students from all the branches around the state getting together and sparring against each other. The aim being to expose you to training with/reacting to people you don't know with different skillsets etc. Now they list Arnis, Escrima and Kali as part of the school so would that mean that the focus will be shared between all 3?

Their website is http://www.doceparesaust.com/html/introduction.html If you (or anyone else with a spare moment) could take a look and give me some feedback that would be very appreciated!

I'm not sure if we have a Dog Bros school near me at all - I live in Melbourne, Australia. I've seen a couple of the freelance schools but when I spoke to them, they included entering competitions as a compulsary requirement of their students which put me off a little bit.

I know it's very early days yet given that I haven't even started to train but there are already similarities to taijutsu movements that I've noticed - little things like moving off the primal line, distancing which I think I can pick up fairly easily given my training so far.
They are currently closed however, and will be reopening mid Jan 2011 after a short break so am thinking of starting up then!

 

[MJS]

Thanks MJS

The instructor I was speaking to at Doce Pares said that their tournaments are more an in house affair with students from all the branches around the state getting together and sparring against each other. The aim being to expose you to training with/reacting to people you don't know with different skillsets etc. Now they list Arnis, Escrima and Kali as part of the school so would that mean that the focus will be shared between all 3?

The in-house events sound pretty cool. As for the rest, unless I missed it, the only reference to the Arnis, Kali and Escrima was on the history page. Sounds like the rule set that they use for the tournaments falls under the WEKAF, but from what I can tell, this is just a Doce Pares school.

Their website is http://www.doceparesaust.com/html/introduction.html If you (or anyone else with a spare moment) could take a look and give me some feedback that would be very appreciated!

The site looks great! It appears that all of the teachers there have alot of skill. Like I said, you have nothing to lose by checking it out and taking a lesson or two.

I'm not sure if we have a Dog Bros school near me at all - I live in Melbourne, Australia. I've seen a couple of the freelance schools but when I spoke to them, they included entering competitions as a compulsary requirement of their students which put me off a little bit.

You could probably check out the DB website to see if they have any affiliate schools in your area.

I know it's very early days yet given that I haven't even started to train but there are already similarities to taijutsu movements that I've noticed - little things like moving off the primal line, distancing which I think I can pick up fairly easily given my training so far.
They are currently closed however, and will be reopening mid Jan 2011 after a short break so am thinking of starting up then!

Alot of the stuff can seem confusing at first, but in no time, it should be easy to pick up.

 

[Supra Vijai]

As for the rest, unless I missed it, the only reference to the Arnis, Kali and Escrima was on the history page. Sounds like the rule set that they use for the tournaments falls under the WEKAF, but from what I can tell, this is just a Doce Pares school.
[/quote]

Hi sorry, forgot to mention that it lists Arnis-Escrima-Kali under the Doce Pares logo on their front door and on banners in the actual training area, not on the site.

 

[MJS]

As for the rest, unless I missed it, the only reference to the Arnis, Kali and Escrima was on the history page. Sounds like the rule set that they use for the tournaments falls under the WEKAF, but from what I can tell, this is just a Doce Pares school.

Hi sorry, forgot to mention that it lists Arnis-Escrima-Kali under the Doce Pares logo on their front door and on banners in the actual training area, not on the site.[/quote]

Hmm...well, in that case, you're probably going to have to ask the inst.

 

[Supra Vijai]

Will do! Thanks so much for your patience with all the questions! One last thing, I think I don't know where to look online to find accurate distinctions of differences between the systems/arts to find out what's covered. The best I've managed to do so far is find a forum which has the following post:

Doce Paras - the Filipino Canate Family -a large group of materials in:

hand,
single stick,
double stick,
knife
stick and knife
"Bo" /staff material
"other" Filipino weapons
As large and big as the Ernesto Presas Arnis program which also covers these exact categories

I'm going to email the instructor once I get home and get the business card to double check all of this but I'm just trying to take some initiative and do my own research as well before flooding the instructors with questions - a trait that's encouraged to us by our Sensei in Ninjutsu.

 

[Emma]

I'm probably going to be absolutely no help to you at all, but I know two of the guys on there listed as instructors, and although I don't do FMA (yet) I have been told that one tends to focus on the sticks side of things, whereas the other prefers the knife defence and empty hand work. So you might find that other instructors are the same, and each have their own focus.

(Just doing my bit for the post count on the forum... )

 

[Supra Vijai]

I'm probably going to be absolutely no help to you at all, but I know two of the guys on there listed as instructors, and although I don't do FMA (yet) I have been told that one tends to focus on the sticks side of things, whereas the other prefers the knife defence and empty hand work. So you might find that other instructors are the same, and each have their own focus.

(Just doing my bit for the post count on the forum... )

Thanks Emma! Quite the contrary, every little bit of info helps when you know nothing to start with! I understand that everyone will have their favourite topics etc and it may come into the training a little but I'm not overly fussed as long as there is at least a taste of everything over time.

Nice work on helping the post count too lol. It's pretty much why I started posting in the first place and now I'm addicted to the site, keep checking back to see what's new

 

[Emma]

You're welcome.

I want to have a go at the sticks class they run before the muay thai class I go to next year, but I'll have to tell my instructor he is NOT to laugh at me when I hit myself in the head with the stick! :lol:

 

[Supra Vijai]

You're welcome.

I want to have a go at the sticks class they run before the muay thai class I go to next year, but I'll have to tell my instructor he is NOT to laugh at me when I hit myself in the head with the stick! :lol:

Oh you study at Doce Pares? I'm thinking of heading down there on Monday night actually as a friend of mine is interested in the Muay Thai class they run. He just wants to see how it's run before he makes up his mind.

Stick work isn't that hard on it's own. The whole trick to the spinning and the flair work is to go very slowly till you get the distancing and the wrist work right and then you can increase the pace with not too many dramas

 

[Emma]

No, I'm northern Victoria, on the NSW border. You guys in Melb have such a great variety of different arts to chose from, up here there are a few muay thai clubs around, but not much else.

 

[Supra Vijai]

Haha that we do! Guess we're the lucky ones! Maybe you should move down here and expand your skillsets

 

[Emma]

But then I'd have to live in Melbourne...lol

 

[Supra Vijai]

We're not that bad!

 

[billc]

Try looking at the FMAtalk.com area. There are dedicated forums for some of the major styles of FMA. The FMA are great, they are a lot of fun and you can gain a lot of insight into fighting with them. Keep an eye open for the FMA that may not be practised out of a regular school. Keep in mind you will find differences in the sword based FMA and the stick based FMA. They are all fun but I find the sword based arts are a little more fun. I have practised a few arts in my time, including Iaido and western fencing and I have to say IMO the FMA are the most clever when it comes to weapon work. You'll also find some pretty interesting stories about the legends of FMA when you hang out in FMA circles. There is a lot of practical combat experience among the teachers who taught some of the last generation of instructors. Kali illustrisimo, Balintawak, DTS kali, Pekiti Tirsia, doce pares they all have interesting stories. Good luck. Enjoy.

 

[Supra Vijai]

Thanks Billchiak Yeah from my experience with martial arts, I definitely prefer sword based techniques and I would like to think that's where I'm most proficient at but at the same time I want to expand the skill sets and try not favour any one thing hence the cross training. I have emailed the instructors to get an idea of the syllabus and the history etc so will definitely keep you posted on how I go. Thanks for the wishes too

 

[Emma]

We're not that bad!

I know, I'm just a country girl.

 

[MJS]

Will do! Thanks so much for your patience with all the questions! One last thing, I think I don't know where to look online to find accurate distinctions of differences between the systems/arts to find out what's covered. The best I've managed to do so far is find a forum which has the following post:

Doce Paras - the Filipino Canate Family -a large group of materials in:

hand,
single stick,
double stick,
knife
stick and knife
"Bo" /staff material
"other" Filipino weapons
As large and big as the Ernesto Presas Arnis program which also covers these exact categories

I'm going to email the instructor once I get home and get the business card to double check all of this but I'm just trying to take some initiative and do my own research as well before flooding the instructors with questions - a trait that's encouraged to us by our Sensei in Ninjutsu.

You could do a general search, ie: google, for each respective system. I'm sure a number of sites will pop up.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. If/when you do check out the school, I'd be interested in hearing about it.

 

[Supra Vijai]

Emma - That's ok, we won't hold it against you

MJS - Will do! I've emailed the instructor some questions as well and am waiting to hear back, the school reopens mid Jan after a 3 week break for Christmas so will be looking at trying a class out then and seeing how it goes. Will definitely keep you posted.