Tai Chi styles

[Arithon]

I've been doing yang style for about 4 years. I don't bother with the forms much at the moment but concentrate more on the fajing and pre-emptive training methods.

 

[Taiji fan]

While most people tend to study Yang (or a derivative of Yang) it is amazing the amount of people who don't realise that it comes from Chen style. In fact during a recent conversation with an indoor student of Chen Zheng Lei from Lianyungang, he was astounded to learn that people still think that the Godfather of taiji was Chang San Feng.

he said "This is a story thst was created by the grandson of Yang Lu Chan. Yang Lu Chan studied taijiquan in ChenJiagou then took his skill to Beijing. He and his family taught palace officials. When his grandson wrote a book he decided that taiji should have a much grander origin thn a poor rural village so he looked for a famous Taoist to give credit to. He came across Chan San Feng a monk from Wudang mountain. However Chan San Feng was a scholar and not a martial artist. He also lived at the wrong time in history. This book went out to Taiwan and Hong Kong just before China closed its doors. There was no one able to criticise this story and it spread to the west. This story has been long disproved in China, but again lack of knowledge in western taiji teachers helps to keep this myth alive

just something that may be of interest to you folks!:asian:

 

[East Winds]

Well done Taijifan.

Nothing more satisfying than poking a stick into the hornets nest!!

"When asked about breathing in Taji, my master replied "YUes, keep doing it"

 

[Taiji fan]

No offence intended....its just about time we stopped perpetuating the myths surrounding taiji......its like the people who try to boost their status by claiming false lineages .....like I studied with master so and so up a mountain in China...lets get it straight not every Chinese person is an expert or a master of taiji and so many of the made up lineages are un verefiable anyway, just get your potograph taken with a Chinese resteraunt owner and hey presto instant 'Chinese' linage......now that China is becoming more open and more people are getting acces to higher level teachers I hope that some of the more unscrupulous folks will fade into the background and the overal standard will start to go up.....who knows we may even get some proper recognition as a martial art ! So many Western teachers have 'filled in the blanks' creating really what is their own system (nothing wrong with that...everything develops) but claiming it to be 'as genuinely taught by...Master so and so from up a mountain' who thought none of his own family were worthy of giving the secrets too, but some westerner he met five minutes ago is worthy of becoming the next linage holder....as if

 

[George Martin]

How long should Yang 37 Form take? We do 7 mins

 

[East Winds]

George,

Do you mean Cheng Man-ching form or the real Yang Short Form as formulated by Yang Zhen Duo and Yang Jun?

Either way, seven minutes seems pretty fast.

Incidentally, Yand Zhen Duo has just introduced a 13 step form.

"When asked about breathing in Taji, mys Master replied "Yes keep doing it!"

Best wishes

 

[Kong]

The 37 form is Cheng Man Ching`s, I believe CMC himself said around 5-7 minutes, 6 minutes being the most beneficial time pace for the 37 form. I don`t know about Yang Zhenduo or Yang Jun`s version,,, Do they even have a 37 form? I thought the short taught by the Yang lineage was 49 movement?

 

[East Winds]

Kong,

Of course, you are absolutely correct in that the Yang Short Form (As taught by Yang Zhen-duo and Yang Jun) has 49 postures. The point I was making (perhaps labouring might be more appropriate) is that Cheng Man-ching form is exactly what it is - Cheng Man-ching form and not the Yang short form. The postural and structural differences owe little to Traditional Yang Forms.

Very best wishes

"When asked about breathing in Tai Chi, my master replied "Yes keep doing it"

 

[Brian Patrick]

I hate to interrupt this discussion, but I was reading "Will" the autobiography of G. Gordon Liddy, and he writes about his training in a martial art called "High T'ai Chi Tiger-style". I was interested in knowing if anyone on this board has ever heard of it, and if you have, how does it differ from other styles of Tai Chi? Thank you.

Brian

 

[Kong]

The point I was making (perhaps labouring might be more appropriate) is that Cheng Man-ching form is exactly what it is - Cheng Man-ching form and not the Yang short form

I didn`t mean to argue this point and I totally agree. I was just replying to the question about the duration of the form.

 

[George Martin]

Its the yang short form by Cheng Man-Ching.

 

[Taiji fan]

Hello George.....I am sure by now you might have picked up on a little freindly argument going on here....the distinction between Cheng Man Ching STYLE and Yang STYLE...Cheng Man Ching style doesn't do the Yang short form, it does the Cheng Man Ching style short form.......Cheng Man Chings style of taiji was 'developed' from his studies of Yang style, but it is very different to the Yang family style.....just as Yang was developed from Chen to be come a different style. It is most commonly thought that all Cheng Man Ching did was to cut out some of the repetitions of the Yang long form to create his form, but he did more than that, he also altered the body mechanics that make Yang style what it is........CMC stylist frequently have very upright backs in all the postures, this is incorrect in Yang style as it breaks the connection in the lowerback. The back leg is too loose in the knee so there can be no energy from the back foot through the leg ad beyond. The hands are floppy with an over emphasis on relaxation and lack energy and spirit. Many CMC people I have worked with also have hunched backs over emphasising and missenterpretating the essence of sinck the chest pluck up the back. Even in the first move of raise hands CMC altered the method in which its done....ie wrists leading and floppy hands, you don't see this in Yang style, the wrists are never floppy and most times the hands are lead by the finger tips, above all you can clearly see the mechanical structure in Yang style. Sorry to be a bore, this is sucha bug bear of mine...based on years of rubbish training with rubbish teachers and then finally seeing the light........

 

[East Winds]

Good summary Taijifan.

My thoughts entirely. Some might claim that we are only indulging in semantics, but I for one think that the distinction is important. I have no problem with what Cheng Man-ching stylist do, only what they call it! For instance I would be totally wrong in calling what I do (Traditional Yang Family Taijiquan) modified Chen style!!

Regards

"When asked about breathing in Tai Chi, my Master replied "Yes keep doing it"

 

[CraneSpreadWings]

Hey Guys and Gals! I have just started studying Professor Cheng's Tai Chi because it is taught in conjunction with my Chinese Medical training. After learning Yang Chen Fu 38 form and practising Chen Pan Ling Taiji as my real primary focus, I have found the CMC form to be pretty cool. I dont like the way it is usually taught in pieces, I feel that breaks the continuity of what Taiji really is. But in linking the postures together properly with flow its pretty nice. The small stances kind of mess me up though! I also can see now where William CC Chen derived his 'Body Mechanics' from. Some of the ideas Ive learned from the CMC style have helped my push hands a lot. (After being thrashed by CC Chen's students last year at Orlando Nationals)

-2cents...

 

[Taiji fan]

what do you mean 'taught in pieces'?

 

[ob2c]

Originally posted by Tachi
What styles of Tai Chi... how long have you studied and what got you interested?

Yang style. About thirty weeks.

We are fortunate to have an instructor about 20 mi away- I live in a rural area. I'd been curious about it for a long time, even got some tapes and books and tried to do some on my own. When one of the local martial artists, who I'd met at seminars and events, was ok'd by her sifu to teach, I signed up. She studies Kali Jukine Do, Chinese Long fist, and is good at working the martial applications of TCC. I also study American Kenpo, and have a slightly over developed Yang nature. TCC provides a good ballance.

 

[arnisador]

What is this?

 

[ob2c]

It's a PMA based hybrid. Pretty effective. I don't remember all the details, but they do grappling, joint locks and manipulation, a lot of weapons besides the PMA stuff, and a complete venue of PMA.

 

[CrushingFist]

Just incase... I doubt it anybody mentioned this one

Yangjia Michuan Taijiquan (Yang Family Hidden Tradition Taiji or T'ai Chi)

I don't study this, well let me say not yet... I don't train in this art, but I will pretty soon... oh yea the reason you guys might not know about it because its a Hidden Tradition, so of course is a very rare style...

for more info on Yangjia Michuan, American Yangjia Michuan Taijiquan Assocation (AYMT)

 

[liangzhicheng]

I have been learning Wu Style for almost three years now, very much the rank beginner. I've learned the 108 square form, 54 form, jian, dao, several types of push hands, and meditations. Became a disciple this year

i learned a lot of it with high stances, which is so contradictary to traditional shaolin that its quite an experience

Wu style can be practiced with low stances, though I have not seen anyone doing stances as low as Chen style at my school. I'm currently working on a higher stance after working on sitting lower. It is a challenge to keep the root in a high stance, but theoretically, the height of the stance shouldn't matter.

For those without any knowledge of Wu style, it is characterized by 100% weight separation, and the forward lean. Go to www.wustyle.com for more information (it's the main website)