stop kick

[AdrenalineJunky]

I'm not allowed to crush the bones in the foot, break a knee, kick as hard as I can to the groin, do a chop or half fist to the throat, stick my rigid fingers right in the eye socket, or drive an elbow through his temple. I like the tire iron idea too! :mp5:

Honestly, fighting is a very small part of what our school does, mostly for the above reasons. Our philosophy is that there's no rules in a fight. Those in our school who do fight, follow Kuoshu rules and techniques as a side branch to Bok Fu Do. That said, our full contact fighters do exceptionally well in competition. I do just enough to fare reasonably well in point sparring and because we don't allow 42 year olds on the Lei Tai. For that, a Japanese or Chinese thrust kick to the solar plexus can stop an opponent fairly well without risking a limb.

I really don't mean to sound like a jerk, but this looks like the classic, "we're too deadly to fight," kind of assertion that really urks me. Your in S.F., I'm not far away. Personally, I bet a thrust kick to the solar plexus isn't really going to stop me all-that-well, and I would gladly show up to your gym, just to see if anyone my size could put me on my back, uncontested, with a "stop kick." If you can, great; I got nothing to say.

Fighting is a big part of training. . .when you think about it, it's the sole, traditional attribute of martial arts--getting past the various underground variations that kept the arts alive. Bottom line: if you don't train to fight, I wonder what gives you the right to really preach about fighting in a manner that's above and beyond theory. Again, man, I mean no disrespect, but I spent time--about four years--getting paid to handle "real life" situations; and I've come across the "I'm too deadly to fight" thing before, and maybe, just maybe, I'm a bit overtly skeptical.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Also, I did confront a guy with a tire-iron. . .I did it with a three-cell mag-lite in one hand and a sixteen-inch, titanium, telescopic in the other hand. . .and about six other guys wearing "security" shirts. That's uninhibited by rules for you.

 

[CuongNhuka]

We teach it in Coung Nhu. We call it a jam. The major dif. is that we go for the hip sockett. We also train it to stop kicks. I've never personally used it but I've seen it used with amazing results.

Sweet Brighit Bless your Blade,

John

 

[cfr]

cfr, from the website, it looks like JKD is just part of a hybrid system of a number of different styles. Do you like it?

From what website? Yes I like it. It has its downsides like other styles, but I like it.

 

[muffin_cup_of_death]

As a 9 yr. practioner of JKD, I have to say the stop kick is one of the most effective manuevers in JKD. I would say I really didnt get good at it until about 2-3 yrs in. I was not very confident kicking in my beginning years, I was all hands, and an occasional kick due to my heavy boxing exp. But nowadays, when i spar, I find myself doing stop kicks ALL the time. I t is a very good defensive weapon, and opponents usually have a lot of trouble stopping them, as they are extremely fast, and come from far below with not much chance of blocking them. And usually I execute them at the point where the opponent is mid-way through their technique, catching them completely off gurad, and knocking them either off balance, or knocking them down if done right. When I was first attending tournaments, before I stopped going due to so much BS, and the usual junk, I used to wait for my opponent to load a kick, then move in fast, trap the hands, and oblique kick(cross stomp) their rear leg. It would put them flat on their back EVERY time. I didnt score for them, but it really jumbled their minds..and the judges hated it too. In a reality scenario, a stop side kick to the knee can potentially end the fight if it is done with enough power to break the bone. So yes, Stop kicking should be tuned very well, and used often, especially against non JKD people.

Mike

 

[jdinca]

I really don't mean to sound like a jerk, but this looks like the classic, "we're too deadly to fight," kind of assertion that really urks me. Your in S.F., I'm not far away. Personally, I bet a thrust kick to the solar plexus isn't really going to stop me all-that-well, and I would gladly show up to your gym, just to see if anyone my size could put me on my back, uncontested, with a "stop kick." If you can, great; I got nothing to say.

Fighting is a big part of training. . .when you think about it, it's the sole, traditional attribute of martial arts--getting past the various underground variations that kept the arts alive. Bottom line: if you don't train to fight, I wonder what gives you the right to really preach about fighting in a manner that's above and beyond theory. Again, man, I mean no disrespect, but I spent time--about four years--getting paid to handle "real life" situations; and I've come across the "I'm too deadly to fight" thing before, and maybe, just maybe, I'm a bit overtly skeptical.

Then I must be mistating my position. Being too deadly to fight is not what our philosophy is at all. The training for the ring is very different than training for self defense. There are definite rules about what strikes you can use and where they can go when fighting on the Lei Tai, or in point sparring. Our techniques are designed to go to targets that for the most part would be illegal in the ring, or seriously injure somebody if done right (key point). As I stated, we do have full contact fighters but the right is not where we focus our efforts. Those that want to fight are eligible first for our "light contact class" and from there can advance to the full contact class.

Ring fighting can have great value, especially when when it comes to fighting inner fear, developing courage and learning how to take a punch. It's just not a real life setting and has the potential of developing habits that may not be the best when confronted by someone on the street. No ego, we just choose to focus on the real life situation.

In regards to the thrust kick, I was strictly speaking from a point sparring point of view, because that's the ring experience I have. As for full contact, the thread was about stopping a punch with a kick, not taking somebody out. A thrust kick can work in this situation too. If it keeps your punch from hitting my head, then it's done its job, hasn't it?

 

[jdinca]

From what website? Yes I like it. It has its downsides like other styles, but I like it.

The website listed on your public profile.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Then I must be mistating my position. Being too deadly to fight is not what our philosophy is at all. The training for the ring is very different than training for self defense. There are definite rules about what strikes you can use and where they can go when fighting on the Lei Tai, or in point sparring. Our techniques are designed to go to targets that for the most part would be illegal in the ring, or seriously injure somebody if done right (key point). As I stated, we do have full contact fighters but the right is not where we focus our efforts. Those that want to fight are eligible first for our "light contact class" and from there can advance to the full contact class.

Ring fighting can have great value, especially when when it comes to fighting inner fear, developing courage and learning how to take a punch. It's just not a real life setting and has the potential of developing habits that may not be the best when confronted by someone on the street. No ego, we just choose to focus on the real life situation.

In regards to the thrust kick, I was strictly speaking from a point sparring point of view, because that's the ring experience I have. As for full contact, the thread was about stopping a punch with a kick, not taking somebody out. A thrust kick can work in this situation too. If it keeps your punch from hitting my head, then it's done its job, hasn't it?

Right on, man, I can appreciate that response. It's just when I see things like:

I'm not allowed to crush the bones in the foot, break a knee, kick as hard as I can to the groin, do a chop or half fist to the throat, stick my rigid fingers right in the eye socket, or drive an elbow through his temple. I like the tire iron idea too!

I often look like :shrug:, because, as I've said, I used to get paid to toss people out of bars, and have come across the person who thought he could easily smash my knee, or explode my heart by tapping my wrist, my forearm and my neck. . . Like I said, that stuff might work in theory, but in four years of dealing with my share of unruly tough-guys, I haven't seen anyone have all the bones in their foot crushed, heel stomp or otherwise. Where I was coming from was not a "ring-fighting" perspective. Anyway, I agree, I have derailed this thread enough; I offer my humble apologies to the original poster. :asian:

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Right on, man, I can appreciate that response.

I often look like :shrug:, because, as I've said, I used to get paid to toss people out of bars, and have come across the person who thought he could easily smash my knee, or explode my heart by tapping my wrist, my forearm and my neck. . . Like I said, that stuff might work in theory, but in four years of dealing with my share of unruly tough-guys, I haven't seen anyone have all the bones in their foot crushed, heel stomp or otherwise. Where I was coming from was not a "ring-fighting" perspective. Anyway, I agree, I have derailed this thread enough; I offer my humble apologies to the original poster. :asian:

I would like to retract this statement, as it is not accurate. I have seen a guy get all the bones in his foot crushed; someone ran-over it with a Silverado.

 

[FearlessFreep]

So would you recommend using a Silverado as one of those 'improvised weapons of opportunity'?

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

So would you recommend using a Silverado as one of those 'improvised weapons of opportunity'?

I had two separate people try and run me over with their cars because I threw them out. One ended up in a building across the street, the other ended up running over someone else, ran, and my buddy and I had to jump in the back of a CHP car in pursuit of the guy to ID him. The lady he ran over was okay; drunk people survive the most insane accidents, without a scratch. :idunno:

 

[FearlessFreep]

So if you are going to want to be able to use a vehicle as an improvised weapon of convenience, you would recommend training regularly with something similar?

 

[tshadowchaser]

did you use a stop kick on the car

 

[Flatlander]

The low side thrust and the inside oblique kick are two of the more common types of stop kick used in JKD. The reason for the stop kick is primarily to interrupt your attacker's cadence and gain entry. Speed of execution and targetting are of primary importance. Power is quite secondary to those. Generally, the thing is used as a set up.

Stop hitting and stop kicking can be done one of two ways, depending on the circumstances. Attacking the weapon (punch, kick, etc.) or simply attacking the person using an intercepting line. Both strategies fall within the realm of "stop hitting".

Regarding the question, would a JKDer attack the arm - yes, of course. For example, we may pull a cross over into a lock or armbar or what have you, or gunt the joint, or use elbow strikes to the bicep, or some combination of various things, or whatever comes out, really.

For a stop kick to be effective in application, it must be practiced repeatedly, for what seems like for ever. They really do need to be lightning fast, or they are of no value.

 

[cfr]

The website listed on your public profile.

Ahhh, sorry. I moved away from Ca. about 9 months ago and now train with Richard Weiss in Phoenix, Az., who trained here.

http://www.jkdwednite.com/

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

So if you are going to want to be able to use a vehicle as an improvised weapon of convenience, you would recommend training regularly with something similar?

Not being drunk seems to really help.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

did you use a stop kick on the car

Evasion tactics. I went toe-to-toe with a car before; I lost.

 

[jdinca]

I would like to retract this statement, as it is not accurate. I have seen a guy get all the bones in his foot crushed; someone ran-over it with a Silverado.

Very innovative.

My comments that got your attention were a somewhat tongue in cheek response to Navarre. No harm, no foul. Sounds like the bar you work at is the wrong place to get drunk and stupid. :burp:

 

[DArnold]

I train in JKD currently. For those that don't know, JKD trains with they're strong side forward. Meaning that I, being left handed, fight with my left foot forward, like a traditional right handed fighter. Also for those that don't know, a stop kick is when an opponent moves in even slightly, a side kick(for lack of better words) is delivered to the lead leg of the opponent. Anyways, how many of you train stop kicks? Whats your take on them? Are they hard to pull off? How long did it take you to get good at them? I'd imagine it's more of a JKD tool as it's probably much easier to do with the strong leg forward, but I was wondering if anyone else does them also?

Correct me if I am wrong but JKD got most of their kicks from TKD.

In TKD they are called checking kicks, and they have many uses.

It is easy to stop someone who doesn't know how to chamber their kicks properly so you can stop them from kicking you in an instant.

It also can be used in the hip socket to stop someones movement, disrupt their timing, and throw them off balance.

The strength of the leg is irrevelant as these kicks are easy. The hardest/cirtical part is the timeing.

With very little effort they can be aimed at joints to do damage
.

 

[Tez3]

Correct me if I am wrong but JKD got most of their kicks from TKD.

In TKD they are called checking kicks, and they have many uses.

It is easy to stop someone who doesn't know how to chamber their kicks properly so you can stop them from kicking you in an instant.

It also can be used in the hip socket to stop someones movement, disrupt their timing, and throw them off balance.

The strength of the leg is irrevelant as these kicks are easy. The hardest/cirtical part is the timeing.

With very little effort they can be aimed at joints to do damage
.

I believe that JKD derives from Chinese styles?