Star Trek Movie. (Contains Spoilers)

[shesulsa]

While I greatly enjoyed this movie, they left physics bruised and bleeding on the floor, even for a Star Trek movie.

First, the black holes were generated using what couldn't have been more than a few grams of "red matter", or a few hundred kilos for the whole set. Thus, any black hole generated would have at most the mass of a few hundred kilos. Such a black hole would be very, very small, and would rapidly evaporate. It probably couldn't consume a planet, or even consume enough to sustain itself.

If you were to try to detonate something inside or just outside a black hole, it would have no appreciable impact on the hole itself. The mass of the explosion would be consumed just like anything else. Active massive black holes are very energetic places, with plasma and x-rays and such out the wazoo. Nothing you could detonate off a starship would have any effect. It would just be consumed.

That is assuming it could even be detonated at all, another pet peeve. If the Enterprise was being pulled backwards into a black hole despite going faster than the speed of light (they said they were at warp) then they would be inside the event horizon. The tidal forces at such a close distance to the black hole would cause massive gravity changes over very short distances. Basically, the Enterprise, everyone in it, and the exploding cores would be very, very long spaghetti. Even after that then, considering they were already going faster than the speed of light inside the event horizon, then no explosion, no matter how energetic, could possibly accelerate them enough to escape. At that point, conventional physics and chemical reactions should be non-functional anyway.



Black holes evaporate and release energy through Hawking radiation very, very slowly. A supermassive black hole like the one in the middle of our galaxy would take several lifetimes of the Universe to evaporate. A small one would evaporate much more quickly, but even then, it only has as much energy to release as it has consumed. If the black holes had the mass of the Romulan mining ship and a few hundred kilos of "red matter", then that is all the energy it would have to release - which would occur slowly anyway. Thus, no big bang.

The real big bang did come from a singularity similar in conception to a black hole, but with two big differences. First, it had the total mass of the entire universe contained within - a lot more than a starship, or even a galaxy or two. Second, unlike standard black holes, this singularity exploded and released all that energy simultaneously. This doesn't happen with regular black holes.

Well, thanks for letting me geek out and vent. Probably more than you wanted to hear.

Pun intended, but truly fascinating. Black hole physics is beyond me and WAY, WAY over my head. Geekness appreciated and ah ... we're not worthy.

:bow:

 

[Empty Hands]

Pun intended, but truly fascinating. Black hole physics is beyond me and WAY, WAY over my head. Geekness appreciated and ah ... we're not worthy.

:bow:

LOL! I'm just a biologist, I really don't know anything about this stuff. I just like to read a lot.

 

[jim777]

I saw it Sunday with the Mrs. and kids, and everyone loved it I thought it was a great flick, and can easily see myself eventually watching it many more times. I thought all the actors were great as well.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I saw it today. Being the purist I am, i expected to be disappointed. I was quite surprised to enjoy it. I liked it. I'll be getting the dvd when it's out.

 

[Nomad]

While I greatly enjoyed this movie, they left physics bruised and bleeding on the floor, even for a Star Trek movie.

Um... it's called "suspension of disbelief" Keep in mind that above all else, this was an action movie intended as summer entertainment.

Why, the odds of Kirk being marooned on the right planet after his aborted mutiny within a couple of miles (at best) of where Spock just happened to be hiding in a cave are alone astronomical... dang... now you've got me doing it.

Star Trek, like most good science fiction series, has always played fast and loose with science, and with coincidence as well.

 

[Empty Hands]

Um... it's called "suspension of disbelief" Keep in mind that above all else, this was an action movie intended as summer entertainment.

Well sure. However, you have to play Suspension of Disbelief right. I can accept warp speed or transporters, as impossible as they might be, because they've been established and follow the rules conveyed by the universe of the story. However, the Suspension is lost when something else jumps out as being off when it hasn't been established by the story. Like if Kirk suddenly cast a fireball at one of his foes. Casting a fireball is about as likely as warp speed, but it's easier to accept warp speed in a Star Trek movie because it has been established in that universe. Similarly, I would get annoyed if Gandalf pulled out a Glock to blast the Balrog with.

That said, I'm sure the black hole elements didn't bother the average moviegoer. They annoyed the hell out of me though when something like warp speed doesn't because it hasn't been accounted for in the story.

 

[arnisador]

Why, the odds of Kirk being marooned on the right planet after his aborted mutiny within a couple of miles (at best) of where Spock just happened to be hiding in a cave

...within walking distance of Scotty...

 

[Bob Hubbard]

You could assume that the intent was for Kirk to make it to the outpost. The finding Spock bit was just creative license.

The more I think about the movie, the more I like it. It felt like "Trek", abet an alternate timeline version, but close enough to the original to feel comfortable. The actors did a good job of giveing the younger-version feeling to the old characters.

 

[Ken Morgan]

When Kirk is walking on the ice planet, I kept thinking back to Hoth, and expecting Kirk to stumble onto an AT-AT, or a Tauntaun. Now that would be so cool. “Oops, so sorry wrong Universe.”

 

[matt.m]

Not the biggest Trek fan. However, I do dig the original series and the 1st 4 movies. You know though when someone nit picks how "Science isn't followed correctly" well its just a movie. I mean look at Star Wars, 12 parsecs is supposed to be how fast the Falcon can go. I have never seen a parsec that is distance be a speed. Oh well, it is just a movie.

 

[shesulsa]

When Kirk is walking on the ice planet, I kept thinking back to Hoth, and expecting Kirk to stumble onto an AT-AT, or a Tauntaun. Now that would be so cool. “Oops, so sorry wrong Universe.”

OMG I thought the same thing! :lfao:

 

[celtic_crippler]

Loved it. I've seen it twice so far and will probably go back again this weekend.

 

[arnisador]

When Kirk is walking on the ice planet, I kept thinking back to Hoth, and expecting Kirk to stumble onto an AT-AT, or a Tauntaun. Now that would be so cool. “Oops, so sorry wrong Universe.”

I found images of Hoth very distracting myself in that scene. They could've done all that without the ice, and that would have been better.

 

[Gordon Nore]

Took the day off and caught it with the missus this afternoon -- terrific. I'm a big-time fan, but not a Trekker/Trekkie, so I have no problem looking past canon. The alternate timeline is fun. If they have sequels, they can do a lot of things with the TOS concept up to the time of the movies.

Kirk is not Shatner. I'm glad Pine didn't do too many Shatnerisms. McCoy, however, is a ringer. I know that Nimoy really liked Zachary Quinto for the Spock, and he brought a lot to the character. The love affair between Spock and Uhura will be interesting.

I liked Sulu, but I wasn't reminded in the slightest of Takei's performance, except the interest in swords was in TOS. Chekov was hysterical.

Did anyone else catch the nod to the Enterprise prequel series? Scotty had a transporter accident with Admiral Archer's prize Beagle.

It's not the old Star Trek -- that's for sure, but they're obviously committed to building a strong bond between Kirk and Spock, which is at the heart of TOS. And it is an actual big budget Hollywood blockbuster.

Big thumbs up here.

 

[AoCAdam]

When I went to see it I had no expectations, I never watched Star Trek ever except catching glimpses of it when flipping through the channels. After I left the movie I was very happy I went to see it. I thought it was really good and would recommend it to all of you.

 

[Omar B]

You don't have to recommend ... we already saw it. LOL

 

[MA-Caver]

It sounds much like the rebooting of James Bond as I just watched Quantum Of Solace for the first time last night and really like the new grittier Bond, zero to fewer gadgets (against canon), not as suave with the ladies (against canon), hair and face messed up after a fight/chase (against canon), the opening sequence now is the closing sequence (the walking into a white circle and shooting at the screen canon) etc.

So it's reasonable to assume a reboot of Trek would do the same. One thing I think die hard fans should be grateful for is that they didn't just go a whole new round of character replacement, kept the same names, races, etc. Imagine if Spock were actually Andorian? Uhura was Chinese and Sulu was African and so on. Or totally new people, totally new enterprise. They could and WOULD do it. But they DIDN'T!

 

[Gordon Nore]

So it's reasonable to assume a reboot of Trek would do the same. One thing I think die hard fans should be grateful for is that they didn't just go a whole new round of character replacement, kept the same names, races, etc. Imagine if Spock were actually Andorian? Uhura was Chinese and Sulu was African and so on. Or totally new people, totally new enterprise. They could and WOULD do it. But they DIDN'T!

What I think is clever about this reboot is that it's an alternate time line. I'm trying to imagine what this holds for future films. Vulcan is gone, and Vulcan race is numbered at a few thousand according to older Spock. Younger Spock is isolated from a people that rejected him. I assume Romulus is gone too, so who holds the balance of power in the quadrant? Who are the new bad guys?

One of the taglines of the film was, This isn't you father's Trek. I find that quite funny because my father's Trek is my Trek. My father didn't actually watch TOS -- I did as a little boy when it first aired.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Changes in the TimeLine:
- Vulcan is gone, as are most Vulcans. So, no T'Pring, no Wedding, no Kohlinar for Spock.
- Spock. His mothers dead, yet he appears to have a good relationship with his father. No estrangement? Hooking up with Uhura? Fascinating. There were hints in TOS of affection between the two, but very subtle. Much of TOS Spock was built from his battle between is 2 halves. This Spock, seems more conflicted, yet more likely to embrase IDIC in himself.
- Kirks dad died. Kirk rather than grow up idolizing his dad, never knew him. Instead of a star student, he was a street tough in Iowa. So, no Kodos. Still, much of the TOS Kirk is there. Kirk never served as a midshipman on the Farragut. No Cloud Creature.
- Pike. He never took the Enterprise to Talos 4. So no illusion should he be crippled.
- Romulas is still there, but only for 120 years. There will probably not be Reunification, Spock will most likely not befriend Pardek, and Picard will not goto Romulas seeking Spock.

I don't like the new Enterprise. It's a fracking Tardis. Engineering is a maze of 19th century plumbing. Gone is the elegant facility (that actually fit in the hull) from TOS, and TNG. It's like thy designe it after a 20th century battleship. The bridge also seems cluttered, though I dig the viewscreen/window.

I did like the green chick though. LOL!

 

[arnisador]

I too thought the bridge looked a bit cluttered! The insides of Engineering and such worked for me, though.