Sitting defense

[artist89]

What I was wanting to know is,(I can also ask my instructor too) how would you defend yourself sitting in a chair and someone punched you from your r or L side? Would you lean back then commence the attack?

 

[arnisador]

There are many ways this could happen, and I could imagine doing as you say but also just bringing my arms up and absorbing the attack, or trying to dodge under the punch with a takedown.

Some jujutsu and aikido styles practice techniques from sitting or from seiza, and BJJ often goes from kneeling.

 

[TigerWoman]

Actually I did defend myself years before even knowing martial arts. I had pulled open my car door and was sitting-down actually when the car door jerked open. I kicked my left leg toward him, a young attacker, and hit him in the groin, actually a lucky shot then. He went backwards, falling and I shut the door and got out of there.

Our instructor later advised that for a frontal attack and a sidekick to knee for a side attack. Oh, and block that punch or duck out of the way! TW

 

[mj-hi-yah]

There are some variables you must consider in training against an attack from a seated position. Is the chair you are in against a wall? Are you are seated at a table?...on a train? You won't be able to gain leverage by pushing back on the chair to stand up if there is a wall, or if the chair is immovable like on a train, and you may not be able to go forward if there is a heavy table in front of you. In a side attack as you describe in a chair in the middle of a room, you could block and grab the arm controlling the punching arm as you stand and counter by using an arm bar to roll your attacker over and either subdue or continue with follow up moves. You have to be careful in terms of how you allow your opponent to come in on you. You want to strike so he will fall away from you, and you can use your feet to redirect his body before striking if need be, especially in a frontal attack from a seated position. You do not want your opponent falling on you and trapping you in the chair. In my opinion the best way to find out is to grab a chair and some training partners and work it. It's actually a very fun exercise.

 

[Tony]

A very good post! Something we should all take into consideration because we are all in a very vulnerable position sitting down and just imagine how easy it is for some potential mugger to rob a disabled person.
I remember one silly situation a so called friend of mine tried to stop me from driving off in my car . He tried to hold on to my door so I use one of my keys and violently dug it into the back of his and and he immediately let go. Thank god it was him and not some violent criminal intent in harming me.

A while a go my Kung fu instructor held a self defense seminar but one of the situations we did not cover was being attacked in a seated position.
There are many things you should consider in this kind of situation and our traing should help us come up with possible answers.

 

[tshadowchaser]

It would be a good question to put to your instructor.
I might do it in private not in the middle of a class.

 

[FearlessFreep]

How much does this fall under 'situational awareness'? Don't allow yourself to be in a tough to defend situation. If you feel threatened in anyway, don't sit down, or if already seated, stand up. ??

 

[arnisador]

I know that Vlad Vasiliev covers some such techniques in Systema, notably for carjacking situations.

FearlessFreep, true enough but I don't think it's always that simple.

 

[Paul Genge]

There are very few systems that cover this area of work with any authority. One of those that does is Systema. This are has been developed because the system has been taught and used by members of the Russian Special Forces and intelligence community.

If you are looking at work from the seated position first take stock of your surroundings. If you are simply sitting in a chair with no obstructions it is possible to stand or move to the floor to escape the attack.

In the case where your movement is restricted by the furniture or because you are in a vehicle you have to be able to work in a manner that has the maximum effect with out expending too much energy.

You have to understand that being seated is not a disadvantage. The chair or in the case of a vehicle, the body of the car will limit the angles of attack and provide various hard surfaces that the attacker can be encouraged to collide with. Also in the case of the car the attacker has to either reach in though an open window or open the door to gain entry.

If the attacker opens the door it will give you some time to react. If the attack comes through the window opening the door can be very effective at destroying the attackers posture and attack. Using the pillar of the door or the frame of the window as a pivot point for an arm lock or a pain hold is very effective.

One problem with these situations if they occur when the engine is running is that the victim gets emotionally involved and forgets that they can simply drive away.

Vladimir Vasiliev has released a video that covers work in a vehicle and another that looks at working from the ground. Another video that covers related information is his video defence in confined spaces. These tapes will give you some ideas if you are prepared to think outside of the box of what most people understand about martial arts.

I will try to put some video clips together in the future covering defence while seated and work around vehicles. I will post a link to it when I get it done.

Paul Genge
http://www.russianmartialart.org.uk

 

[sgtmac_46]

What I was wanting to know is,(I can also ask my instructor too) how would you defend yourself sitting in a chair and someone punched you from your r or L side? Would you lean back then commence the attack?

Get up. And don't sit with your back or side exposed in a public place. Ask Wild Bill Hickock.

 

[MJS]

Unless this is something that you don't see coming, I suggest standing up to deal with the attack. If standing is not an option, I would attempt to turn to face the opp. while still seated. Keeping your hands up and possibly using your legs to kick are also possibilities.

Mike

 

[47MartialMan]

We had many. One for example was to purposely fall back (pending the height of the chair) and simultaneously bring the chair up to use as a block or striking weapon (like a big cat/lion tamer)

 

[mj-hi-yah]

How much does this fall under 'situational awareness'? Don't allow yourself to be in a tough to defend situation. If you feel threatened in anyway, don't sit down, or if already seated, stand up. ??

In the case of a train, subway or bus ride don't bury your head in a paper or a book and/or fall asleep, make sure you are aware of the people walking by. Actually the same would go for a restaurant or bar situation where you might be seated at a table, and what about when seated in a dark movie theater? Be aware of your surroundings notice the people around you and where the exits are. If I wasn't comfortable with someone near me I'd move my seat. If you are in a car and are involved in a road rage situation you should be ready to react. It will help you to consider your options. Hopefully you won't need options, but if you do, you'll be glad you thought it out. One of the women I used to study with would think about what she would do when people got too close to her in church! :uhyeah: LOL A little extreme, but I guess you can never be too careful...

 

[47MartialMan]

One of the women I used to study with would think about what she would do when people got too close to her in church! :uhyeah: LOL A little extreme, but I guess you can never be too careful...

Yeah, those people who get the spirit, shake, and speak in "tongues" can get physical

 

[arnisador]

In the case of a train, subway or bus ride don't bury your head in a paper or a book and/or fall asleep, make sure you are aware of the people walking by.

True story: There seems to be a rise in NYC subway crime. They're stealing iPods.

 

[Kenpodoc]

There are very few systems that cover this area of work with any authority. One of those that does is Systema. This are has been developed because the system has been taught and used by members of the Russian Special Forces and intelligence community.

If you are looking at work from the seated position first take stock of your surroundings. If you are simply sitting in a chair with no obstructions it is possible to stand or move to the floor to escape the attack.

In the case where your movement is restricted by the furniture or because you are in a vehicle you have to be able to work in a manner that has the maximum effect with out expending too much energy.

You have to understand that being seated is not a disadvantage. The chair or in the case of a vehicle, the body of the car will limit the angles of attack and provide various hard surfaces that the attacker can be encouraged to collide with. Also in the case of the car the attacker has to either reach in though an open window or open the door to gain entry.

If the attacker opens the door it will give you some time to react. If the attack comes through the window opening the door can be very effective at destroying the attackers posture and attack. Using the pillar of the door or the frame of the window as a pivot point for an arm lock or a pain hold is very effective.

One problem with these situations if they occur when the engine is running is that the victim gets emotionally involved and forgets that they can simply drive away.

Vladimir Vasiliev has released a video that covers work in a vehicle and another that looks at working from the ground. Another video that covers related information is his video defence in confined spaces. These tapes will give you some ideas if you are prepared to think outside of the box of what most people understand about martial arts.

I will try to put some video clips together in the future covering defence while seated and work around vehicles. I will post a link to it when I get it done.

Paul Genge
http://www.russianmartialart.org.uk

Vladamir's tapes would be an excellent start.

The eastern martial arts seem to have done a good job of including just about every piece of furniture or tool available as a weapon. As westerner's we've done a poor job of following suit. So at contests you'll see people doing forms with Oars, Benches, Sticks, Flails but I've not seen anyone use a common Kitchen Chair as a weapon in a form. With this in mind my overly simple answer to the initial question would be to redirect the attack and use the chair as an obsticle or weapon. This adds further questions. Does the chair have arms? Is the chair Mobile? How large is the room? Is a desk in front of you? etc, etc, etc.

A good question and a lot of fun to explore.

Jeff

 

[Jibbler]

if possible i would stand up and grab the chair as a weapon. the chair is also a good thown weapon. a friend and i where dicking around in school and fighting with chairs i threw mine at him an accidently threw to hard, i thankfully missed and trashed a messege board standing behind him.

i don't think fighting for fun in school is a good idea by the way!

:iws:

 

[47MartialMan]

Vladamir's tapes would be an excellent start.

So at contests you'll see people doing forms with Oars, Benches, Sticks, Flails but I've not seen anyone use a common Kitchen Chair as a weapon in a form. With this in mind my overly simple answer to the initial question would be to redirect the attack and use the chair as an obsticle or weapon. This adds further questions. Does the chair have arms? Is the chair Mobile? How large is the room? Is a desk in front of you? etc, etc, etc.

A good question and a lot of fun to explore.

Jeff

Well, you havent been to a tourney that my students been in. Over 20 years we had used everything from "afro picks", umbrellas, shoes, chairs, coffee cups, jackets, heeled shoes, bakers rolling pin, fishing pole, brooms/mops.....to name a few.

 

[mj-hi-yah]

True story: There seems to be a rise in NYC subway crime. They're stealing iPods.

I believe it and one of the things we teach in women's self defense classes is not to jog in the street with headphones on, because you become so absorbed in what you are listening to that you lose your sense of awareness. I would think in terms of a sitting self defense situation, an ipod is easy pickings. One way to possibly combat that is to look for some of the newer backpacks and jackets that are now being made with inside pockets to hold the devices so the only thing that is accessible is the headphones, but using an ipod in public will still cut down on your awareness.

 

[arnisador]

Yeah, awareness is more than half the battle, but almost no one teaches it. Teaching the 'technical' aspects of the martial art is more fun than teaching the 'common-sense' aspects of self-defense, it appears.