Ramblings of a Madman

[Flying Crane]

Being constantly offended Is also behaving like a jerk because you are showing intolerance. There is no moral high ground in that even though it may feel like it is. Same with calling people a troll. It is still just name calling.

Bear in mind this thread is about how much of a bunch of scumbags some posters are. (Which includes me aparently) now I am a jerk. But I am not such a jerk that I would have done that.

Here we go some helpfull tips.

How To Stop Being Offended

Oh and by educating people you have to come from a position that you are better than them which is an arrogant stance.

And then there is comedy.

 

[drop bear]

And then there is comedy.

There are people here who simply have a very narrow range of experience. When they encounter something outside of their experience they lack the frame of reference and the tools to understand it.

Instead of trying to understand it for what it is, they try to cram it into the perspective of their limited experience. They fail. Square peg, round hole and whatnot.

Instead of simply recognizing that this is something that they have not experienced and do not understand (failing also to realize that there is no shame insuch an admission) they judge it deficient and begin the criticisms.

 

[Steve]

Steve

Been there done that and I feel the threads purpose is not to turn a blind eye to what is going on. That is never a good thing, and there are many examples in history where people looked the other way and things went bad

but steve, you have gone after everyone you listed, except drop bear and Hanzou, It seems to be ok with you if they insult, bash and cause problems. But I make a post about what I feel is wrong and then you show up to lecture.

Actually its an excuse.So you see some body getting harassed you do what..look the other way because it takes two to tango and your involvement would just make it worse. Is that it. Some one is getting bullied and that is ok with you then...interesting

Speaking of Cliches; here is one you should think about, physician heal thyself...You should look to your own examples. they also treat everybody equally, you do not

It appears you have not been paying attention, I have tried, multiple times to change it, but it never does...started back when Bob was still in charge, even talked with Bob about it.... as for you Steve.... your lack of bias in these topics, and jumping to the defense of the biggest perpetrators has been a disappointment. You have not intervened or told your pals they were out of line or told them to look to Buka or Tony D (who are good guys). But I say something against one of your new found pals and you come after me....now please stop lecturing me... and you need to check yourself here my friend

Thanks for stopping by

1: You're calling me out for not going after drop bear and hanzou, but I don't recall you going after anyone but drop bear and hanzou. You are very intolerant of them, but I don't recall you "going after" tez, ballen or anyone else who acts the fool. Should I infer that you agree with everything they say? When Chris is bullying a new poster, should I infer that you are on board with him? Come on. This is some ******** that others have tried to put on me before, and it needs to stop. I don't hold you accountable for not calling out other posters. Do me the same courtesy.

2: Related to number 1, I acknowledged that Hanzou and drop bear are in the mud pit with all of us. How is that not me calling them out? Am I just not calling them out in the way you would like? Not snarky enough for you? You think I should call them out in the threads and join the fray? See below.

3: I don't want to treat everyone equally. I'm not required to treat everyone equally. Nor are you, and I wouldn't expect you to. An impossible task, for sure. I do expect that if you're going to call people out for something, that you will either acknowledge your own hand in it or hold yourself above it. As I said, I'm as muddy as anyone else, and don't hold myself above it. You don't seem to be willing to acknowledge your own role in the current situation. You say you've tried to change things, but I haven't seen much more than crankiness and snarkiness. You're accusing me of behaving in a certain way, but you have done exactly those same things. You don't call every poor post out. You focus on those with whom you have a particular issue. You don't treat everyone equally. Why would you think I should (or even could) meet a standard that you are either unwilling or unable to meet yourself?

4: I hate to disappoint you, but I like drop bear. I appreciate his perspective and agree with a lot of his thoughts and ideas on martial arts and self defense. I think he challenges the status quo around here, and my opinion is that a lot of the reaction to his ideas and posts is mostly unwarranted. Hanzou also says a lot I agree with and some that I don't. He goes overboard, and I've said as much. I just don't say it the way some here think I should.

5: In case this was too subtle in the four points above, I'll make it separate. I respond to your lecture with a lecture, and I'm in the wrong? I do what you do, and I'm wrong but you're **** doesn't stink. I call out posters with whom I disagree, as you do, but you see what you want to see. The sorry passing of the good old days, when everyone got along and no one argued and there was nothing for the moderators to do, and life was great. I've been around for a while and I don't remember that time. I think you're remembering a time that never existed.

I don't begrudge you your opinions about any poster and I don't begrudge you your rant. It's the double standard that drives me up the wall. The lack of personal accountability. You are what you allege to hate, and that's a problem.

Steve

One final thing.... where you here when Don Roley use to post here?

I had a few PM conversations with him about something very similar to this years ago. Only then I was trying to think of ways to get him to stay, since he was (and is) incredibly knowledgeable. At the time I did not fully agree, but you know, I now think Don was right. I have seen a lot of real knowledgable people leave, come and go from MT over the years and I am certain they have left for all sorts of reasons. But I am equally sure some left for the same reason Don did and back then I was of the belief that you should just ignore the problems.... it did not make it better, and a lot of good people left.

You keep looking the other way.....later

Are you talking about Big Don? If so, I think you might have a different residual impression of his value to the site.

 

[drop bear]

I am pretty sure I have gone after every body.

 

[drop bear]

I am pretty sure I have gone after every body.

No you haven't.

 

[hoshin1600]

Interesting this thread came up, I've been really frustrated lately and was thinking I was going to have to stop coming to this page. Many people here do seem to be angry and just hop on things that are totally unimportant but they seem to argue for the sake of arguing.

 

[Hanzou]

Meh... People need to grow a thicker skin.

 

[Tez3]

I've been reading this with interest, I even took one person off ignore to see what he had to say because I could see I had been spoken about. As I thought, he went after me ...again.
I understand that people can dislike other posters, can not like the way they post, what they say etc but this has gone beyond that. It started a long time ago on a discussion where I said metaphorically 'look if it were your kids' and then it kicked off, I didn't even know he had children, it was a figure of speech only. Ever since that day every word I have written has been twisted, I got screamed at for accidentally breaking a guy's nose, other poster were shocked at the sheer vitriol aimed at me so I put him on ignore where he's been since, I don't feel the need to even peek until now. I also know he said some very scathing, nasty things about me on the mentor's site, the part of MT we don't see. I don't report him any more, it's pointless, no one does anything. It's stalking and it's a vendetta but I'm not leaving to please him. I will add it's bewildering and hurtful to have someone come after you so much, to speak about you with so much hate and bile when you don't know them and haven't actually done anything to them. The problem is also he says he speaks his mind... on this thread he's the only one who 'names' people instead of keeping it general, but when others speak plainly which a few of us do it's 'bullying'. If you can't take it, don't dish it out. The other thing is not to hate me so much that everything I say is twisted in the mind to mean something I don't. I speak very plainly, if I mean something I say it ( I don't assume anyone has to agree or like it btw) I don't infer things, if I don't say it I don't mean it. Do not infer anything from my words that isn't there. We all have our posting 'style', Chris Parker has one, I do, XS does, it's inevitable, we are individuals, Chris' style may be terser, more 'no nonsense' than most but I've never seen it bullying. I find he can be extremely patient with people that others have lost patience with. Bullying is a word that gets thrown around a lot, yet often the one chucking it around is the bully. Just because you hate the poster or don't like what they say doesn't make it bullying, you may not like the message but it doesn't make it bullying. that's all I'm going to say on that subject, the situation isn't going to change so as far as I'm concerned it's closed again.

Dropbear likes to wind people up, he said so, he says threads here are sparring so he likes to spar with people, my difficulty with him is not understanding most of what he says because it comes out in the written version of slurring your words. Hanzou, has the narrowest viewpoint you can have in any subject, he doesn't call people names though or be deliberately rude. It just turns posters away with the constant recitation of how we don't know anything, our style is rubbish, theirs isn't but neither are hurtful posters in the way that Steve is with me. They hurt the board because they turn posters off but don't actually call people names. It makes tedious reading and there is a reluctance to post any new thread because it gets turned into a any style v MMA/BJJ argument, it means the site will die a slow death as more and more people don't post. If people can't post their viewpoint without being told their style is rubbish because they don't spar hard enough or they don't do ground work they will leave, it's quite simple. If there's no conversation the site will die. Arguing is where people want to know who is right, debating is where people want to know what is right, too much of the former here and not enough of the latter here at the moment.

Now if you want to discuss a disruptive, insulting poster look to 'Friedrice', I have reported his insults, (not just to me but to a poster who had only been here days) a couple of times now, he's still making them, to me and others. I assume nothing is to be done about this, perhaps he too is seen as an 'interesting' poster. He looks to wind people up by clicking 'funny' on their posts and is actually abusive to posters. The new MT seems tolerant of this now. This too will lead to people having a break from here and then not missing it and not coming back. No one likes being called names. It's also time perhaps to stop having mentors, it was a good idea but surely a place where some posters talk about others behind their backs is not conducive to good relations between all posters. If there's something to say about someone, say it to their face or not at all.

Now, after that soul baring lol, I'm off for my elevenses

 

[Buka]

From Tez's post above I had to look up the last word, "Elevenses". Never heard or saw that before.
What a great word. Thanks, Tez.

 

[lklawson]

I have tried, multiple times to change it, but it never does...

You can't change human nature. The best you can do is run off, ban, or somehow force to shut up the ones who show up. But there is always going to be the next guy. It's always been that way with humans and it always will.

As far as what the implications are for this (or any) forum, well, that depends upon a solid Moderator team to enforce whatever rules exist regulating personal interactions. I've been on countless Forums since (quite literally) before there was a World Wide Web. I was a LOOOONG time member on usenet rec.martial-arts and several email list-serves. I've seen forums which were moderated with an iron fist. I no longer go to those. I've seen forums which were completely unmoderated. There was only one of those which I stayed at. Most forums need to be somewhere in the middle. On the forums/lists where I am a Mod, we understand that there are always going to be people butting heads. We try to mediate between folks who do but sometimes that isn't possible. If we have a forum member who consistently attacks people, well, they get warnings, then "vacations" (short term, temporary bans), then, if they still don't get the message, they get perma-banned.

But my (not insignificant) experience with the media & format has taught me that being a martial artist or not is pretty much irrelevant to a person's behavior, either online or face to face.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Tez3]

From Tez's post above I had to look up the last word, "Elevenses". Never heard or saw that before.
What a great word. Thanks, Tez.

How an English ( different in other parts of UK) day goes... breakfast, elevensies, lunch, tea, dinner, supper.

 

[Buka]

I've always taken Martial Arts as a serious undertaking. My bet is all you guys do too. At the same time I try to not take myself too seriously. I have plenty of guys who've always kept me in check in that department, some of whom have never trained.

I've always enjoyed the hell out of training, it's just so the balls, if I didn't find it fun I doubt I would have lasted very long.

I find this forum the same way. I take opinions on technique, training, styles, fighting etc seriously because I do all those things and I know there's a lot of ways to skin a cat. I also find it fun to read what everybody thinks. I take what you say seriously,(except when you're obviously kidding) I give a lot of it some thought and some of it I try to explore. But I don't take you guys too seriously because I try not to take anyone too seriously in every day life. Because people tend to suck. I much prefer dogs. If only they could type I think they'd make great forum members. Yeah, there would be some accidental peeing on a few of the threads, but you know how it goes.

As far as all the arguing, I'm with Rhett Butler when he was asked about forum bickering.

So keep at it. I'll even ref if you want, I already have the shirt. But it's two hundred bucks.

 

[Tez3]

I think the people who think what goes on here is 'deadly' serious which we all have to be po faced about and I think too they assume we all think like that so get very upset when a real numpty comes on, starts spouting the latest MMA beats everything stuff and we respond with mickey taking along with our facts showing that said numpty is not only incorrect but ludicrous. That's not bullying it correction. Sticking up for these ludicrous posters saying we should all respect each others opinion is also incorrect, there's nothing anywhere that says we should 'respect' opinions. We can respect the right to have an opinion but not the opinion itself. It makes for interesting discussions and debates when this is understood, it also helps if people tell us that it's their opinion and not a fact.

 

[Grenadier]

Admin's note:

Thread closed, pending review.