Pacific Martial Arts

[JBrainard]

This karate organization (which claims to be Japanese in origin) is run by "Grandmaster" Jerry Devine. Anyone ever heard of this guy?

 

[twendkata71]

If memory serves me right. Jerry Devine studied Washin ryu karate do under Hanshi Hidy Ochiai. Apparently going his own way some time later. I have never met him personally, but I do know Master Ochiai.

 

[JBrainard]

Do you know what Dan rank "grandmaster" Jerry Devine attained under master Ochiai?

 

[Xue Sheng]

I know nothing abuot Pacific Martial arts, but I just googled it, but which one there appears to be a few.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Pacific+Martial+Arts&btnG=Google+Search

 

[twendkata71]

Do you know what Dan rank "grandmaster" Jerry Devine attained under master Ochiai?

Actually no. I do not know what dan rank he achieved under Master Ochiai. I have not seen or talked to him since 1992 when he was at one of our camps. The first time I met master Ochiai was at the Atlantic league championships for the AAU Karate in 1985.

 

[Jeff Richardson]

The Pacific Martial Arts school in Portland has been around for quite a few years. Dr. Michael Kapiloff (sp) passed the school on to Karen Underwood. They teach traditional Shotokan Karate.

We currently sub-let space from them. They are really nice people with polite and dedicated students.

I recently pointed out to Karen that Master Devine's name seemed familiar to me. He is visiting town next week for a special training session with them.

Master Jerry Devine, Michael Kaminski and Nathaniel Burger will be visiting and teaching a public class on April 5th 2008 at 1pm.

THey have invited the students from my small western martial arts class to particippate in another class taught by Mr. Devine on a night we are normally renting the space from them.

http://www.pmakarate.com/
and the Portland/Beaverton school here
http://pmakarate.org/

More info can be found here
http://www.pmakarate.com/newspage.htm

And I used to compete against Tim Nguyen who is an outstanding martial artist. His info is listed here.
http://www.pmakarate.com/teachers.htm


Don't know how up to date those pages are though.

 

[Nomad]

Grandmaster Jerry Devine has been the lead instructor at Pacific Martial Arts for 30 years (this October). His direct teacher was Burt Konzak many years ago, and he has studied with Ochiai, Ozawa, Sato and many other well-known karateka.

He received the title of Grandmaster a few years ago, which I believe was presented to him by (now deceased) Grandmaster Victor Hughes.

He has a tremendous depth and breadth of knowledge of karate techniques and the mechanical principles behind them, and is a phenomenal teacher.

I have been studying with Pacific Martial Arts for 6 years. It's a good place with some terrific people. Come try it out if you're curious.

 

[Jeff Richardson]

Having met and talked with Master Devine and taken a single class with him, I can assure you he is the real thing. Reminds me of my own teacher Hanshei Jerry Piddington. Moves just like him.

 

[Oldschool1]

This karate organization (which claims to be Japanese in origin) is run by "Grandmaster" Jerry Devine. Anyone ever heard of this guy?

This guy Jerry Devine claims a 10th Degree from Victor Hughes. These degrees and paper given to someone from Vic was only honorary awards. Vic himself was basically a self taught martial artist who taught his own style, DOCS - Defense Offense Common Sense. He was a very lovable guy who many considered their friend including me. Little is really known exactly where Vic got his black belt himself. It is questionable also exactly who awarded Jerry Devine his first black belt and all the degrees to reach this so called 10th degree. Mr Devines style claims also has changed names on numerous times and he had many children students to support the money making business. Pacific Martial Arts is not a style name either. It is debatable also the so called martial arts masters who came to his in house parties for his personal degree awards on diffrent occasions and exactley where they got their degrees from also. it is debatable and questionable exactly just who Jerry Devine really is as he never was in a open tournament in kumite of kata that any of us old timers have seen of him. He preferred to watch from the bleachers from what we saw and know of him. Mr Jerry Devine and his black belt claims are questinable as also his made up styles. So the question is just WHO taught Jerry Devine and where is the evidence of these so called ghost instructors excluding good old Vic. If Mr Devine would like to prove his mastery we invite him to compete in one of the tournaments in the southern california and las vegas areas. We are all good old boys above 58 years old and welcome his mastery to teach us a thing or to in a tournament.

Old School

 

[Zero]

No ideas or knowledge re Devine but is the term "grandmaster" bandied about that often in different karate styles? I am more familiar with Sensei or shihan. Grandmaster as a term in the karate context does not seem to fit well, I have only been training and fighting in martial arts and karate for about 20 years so nothing like the experience or age of some of you "good old boys" but from my experience and the way/environment I was always trained in, and my karate style being goju ryu, the term grandmaster seems a bit out of sorts and that's putting it politely.

It seems a very Westernised, pro-marketing concept (no offense to this Devine chap himself, I'm talking about use of the title now).

More than appropriate with respect to someone such as the late Gichin Funakoshi or the sort but otherwise a bit of a try-hard attempt. What's more, Funakoshi, in what I have read about him and by his own hand, seemed to be a very humble person (only going on written records as he passed away long before before I was born) and many of these types of his stature from Okinawa or Japan seemed uncomfortable with such formal or high and mighty titles.

Or maybe I am being unfair and white/Westerners in this modern age with enough experience should be able to adopt or merit such a title???????? But I would expect someone to be uber-special to use this title without shame and with credibility.

I mean, I would struggle to even call the likes of Chuck Norris grandmaster...speaking of which, the rumour doing the rounds at the moment is that when the seal team actually busted into Osama's compound, Bin laden was already dead. He looked to have been the victim of a reverse round house kick executed from long range*....


*ok, so no offense meant here, not sure what the humour filter/threshhold is like here at MT but nothing meant to seriously take away from seal team 6!!

 

[Oldschool1]

Grandmaster is a very generic loose title in the martial arts. More self taught stylist 'claim this title' then anyone else. If you look at the statistics of THOSE who USE this title you will see that their styles are "off the norm" of a real and traditional style. Just look at their kata they make up or imitate. They look funny and weak. Look at their student age and gender. Mostly women and children. Most "Grandmasters" use this title to MAKE MONEY on those gullible students who are LOOKING for a quick black belt, as their 'Grandmaster' could have got. So funny and sad at the same time. There is many of these so called "Grandmasters" who CLAIM this title and really have not had much training experience with a real authentic black belt dan teacher.

As for this claim of 'Grandmaster' by Jerry Divine we challange him to verify his instructors, and dates, and locations, and open tournament awards, of these great awards and titles he claims leading to his first authentic black belt by a authentic and real verifiable traditionalist teacher, who can claim this award given.

From what we remember ,all of the Pacific Martial Arts tournaments are closed in-house tournaments among Devines' association. hummmm.

In the United States there is no regulation on martial arts schools. Anybody can claim a title in the martial arts, with little to no experience, and open a karate studio to teach the innocent who know no better.

 

[Oldschool1]

Grandmaster is a very generic loose title in the martial arts. More self taught stylist 'claim this title' then anyone else. If you look at the statistics of THOSE who USE this title you will see that their styles are "off the norm" of a real and traditional style. Just look at their kata they make up or imitate. They look funny and weak. Look at their student age and gender. Mostly women and children. Most "Grandmasters" use this title to MAKE MONEY on those gullible students who are LOOKING for a quick black belt, as their 'Grandmaster' could have got. So funny and sad at the same time. There is many of these so called "Grandmasters" who CLAIM this title and really have not had much training experience with a real authentic black belt dan teacher.

As for this claim of 'Grandmaster' by Jerry Divine we challange him to verify his instructors, and dates, and locations, and open tournament awards, of these great awards and titles he claims leading to his first authentic black belt by a authentic and real verifiable traditionalist teacher, who can claim this award given.

From what we remember ,all of the Pacific Martial Arts tournaments are closed in-house tournaments among Devines' association. hummmm.

In the United States there is no regulation on martial arts schools. Anybody can claim a title in the martial arts, with little to no experience, and open a karate studio to teach the innocent "toy soldiers".

 

[Oldschool1]

Do you know what Dan rank "grandmaster" Jerry Devine attained under master Ochiai?

IMHO he did not get any rank at all, however maybe , just maybe he went to a seminar one day long with the rest of the white belts.:BSmeter:

 

[ichiookami]

Oldschool, I would think one would base his opinion on facts and not hear say. I strongly believe through common sense and training with PMA for 5years that you can tell a master by training, observing his technique and his attitude. I generally do not do these forums, because despite their purpose it turns into disrespecting someone. I have seen others bashed who do not deserve "opinions" based on what they have heard and not seen. Rank or who you trained with does not matter, if you are not taught proper technique, and in karatedo that also includes the right presense of mind. That alone was worth the short time with PMA and I visit from time to time and miss the comaraderie and the training. I have been training over 22 years and still miss it there. I have trained with people some famous people and some with pedigress, and trophies but if it doesn't work it doesn't work.

 

[modethirteen]

Grandmaster is a very generic loose title in the martial arts. More self taught stylist 'claim this title' then anyone else. If you look at the statistics of THOSE who USE this title you will see that their styles are "off the norm" of a real and traditional style. Just look at their kata they make up or imitate. They look funny and weak. Look at their student age and gender. Mostly women and children. Most "Grandmasters" use this title to MAKE MONEY on those gullible students who are LOOKING for a quick black belt, as their 'Grandmaster' could have got. So funny and sad at the same time. There is many of these so called "Grandmasters" who CLAIM this title and really have not had much training experience with a real authentic black belt dan teacher.

As for this claim of 'Grandmaster' by Jerry Divine we challange him to verify his instructors, and dates, and locations, and open tournament awards, of these great awards and titles he claims leading to his first authentic black belt by a authentic and real verifiable traditionalist teacher, who can claim this award given.

From what we remember ,all of the Pacific Martial Arts tournaments are closed in-house tournaments among Devines' association. hummmm.

In the United States there is no regulation on martial arts schools. Anybody can claim a title in the martial arts, with little to no experience, and open a karate studio to teach the innocent who know no better.

Disclosure: I have trained with Pacific Martial Arts and Jerry Devine for 20 years. This has turned a pretty hostile thread (that seems to keep getting reopened) involving a school and person I am very close to. I at least want it to contain some truth directly from someone who has knowledge of the school and the person in discussion, since its indexed on Google.

This thread pretty much demonstrates the reason Pacific Martial Arts keeps its tournaments closed, and in-house only. We hold tournaments for our own students' development (facing the fear of performance, accepting defeat gracefully, or winning in healthy manner). PMA is a classical, traditional Japanese style Dojo. It is not in the business of arguing which style or school is superior, and in general we keep our students unexposed to the uglier, political aspects of martial arts (like this thread). From time to time we do send teams to open and Shotokan tournaments, but only those students we know won't bring back to our school the aggressive, over-competitive attitude often found there. We train primarily for self defense and character development, not kumite competition or trophies. If "verifying" teachers with their tournament awards was some sort of standard, Gichin Funakoshi would have zero credibility - despite pretty much founding modern Karate.

All that really needs to be said is the following…

This thread attempts to disparage a person who has dedicated his life to the martial arts, loyalty, character development, anti-drug, anti-bullying, pro-education message. I'm not going to entertain those who want scrolls listing lineages and who or when gave him his titles (despite knowing precisely all that information). There is a reason why many have trained with the school for decades and are loyal students for life. Pacific Martial Arts does not "give away" black belts, the average time to attain one is 4-5 years, and our black belts rarely leave -- they recognize it is just the beginning of their training.

You are correct however, Grandmaster is not a dan rank or a rank of any sort. It is a title given to an individual that the martial arts community recognizes as having accomplished a lifetime of service to the martial arts. A Grandmaster is not "grandmaster" over anyone else, he/she is a Grandmaster. It can certainly be abused for marketing reasons, as there is no official requirements to bestow the title. However, after running a school for 32 years, and producing nearly 80 black belts (out of the thousands who of have been through the school), and each black belt awarded with at least 4-5 years training, and half of them still training or involved with the school in some way -- Grandmaster Jerry Devine has earned a Grandmaster title.

Let's turn this into a positive thing, however... a chance to get some insight into our philosophy.

Some links from the Pacific Martial Arts website:
http://pmakarate.com/martial-arts
http://pmakarate.com/self-defense-through-martial-arts-study

Master Devine also writes articles on loyalty, courtesy, what to look for in a Dojo, and training intensity in the martial arts on his personal site:
http://www.pmakaratenation.com/easy/tetsudai.htm
http://www.pmakaratenation.com/easy/concentration.htm
http://www.pmakaratenation.com/easy/Chosingaschool.htm

 

[chinto]

nope, can't say I have ever heard the name before this. sounds like a few people know something of him though.

 

[Jeff Richardson]

Wow, the level of disrespect here from people hiding behind pseudonyms who are too gutless to even identify themselves is astounding.

Just for the record.... being good at a modern sport karate tournament proves nothing about your karate other than that you have trained well to win at point tournaments. Some of the best point score people I have seen have had terrible karate.

These are good people. Show a little respect and quit making yourselves look bad.

Jeff Richardson
American Karate Academies National Association
Association for Historic Fencing
Academia Duellatoria

 

[Josh Oakley]

Really the disrespect is coming from a sole source, not many.

Oldschool1, I would like to remind you about the forum rules. We don't fraudbust, here. If you have something concrete, take it to the investigations forum under Horror Stories. Not here.

We also don't do challenge posts.

Them's the rules, bub.

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk

 

[clfsean]

Guys... necromancy... it's frowned on in D&D and on most forums... check the dates.

 

[Johnny169]

Jerry Devine

Having met and talked with Master Devine and taken a single class with him, I can assure you he is the real thing. Reminds me of my own teacher Hanshei Jerry Piddington. Moves just like him.

Jerry Devine is a fraud. Bullshido idiots already proved that. Terry Wilson the writer is also a fraud in the Martial Arts. Bullshido proved that to. BTW I hate Bullshido scum. Both Jerry Devine and Terry Wilson should own up to their deception and ranks from Victor Hughes another fraud.