open hands

[markyboy]

applegate was taught by fairbairn himself,chop or palm comes under open hands-it is a natural strike.
Ever tried pushing a car with your fists?
1 -its not going very far.
2 - it hurts.Unless you're wearing your boxing gloves!!(unlikely)

Under extreme stress, techniques go out the window.

 

[allenjp]

I agree. This is not a one-size-fits-all, one-strike-rules-all argument. Palm strikes, knife hands, fists, backfists, etc. all have their place in fighting techniques, and are all effective in different applications.

The real question, however, is how any of this fits into typical MMA rules and engagement. As I said, I'm not sure the effect of 4 oz gloves on a palm strike.

From my experience, palm strikes are good for some targets and situations. I am not convinced, however, that they are highly applicable in the typical MMA bout.

Very good points

 

[Brian S]

applegate was taught by fairbairn himself,chop or palm comes under open hands-it is a natural strike.
Ever tried pushing a car with your fists?
1 -its not going very far.
2 - it hurts.Unless you're wearing your boxing gloves!!(unlikely)

Under extreme stress, techniques go out the window.

You are comparing apples and oranges.

Pushing is naturally done with the palm. Hitting is naturally done with the clinched fist. When falling it is natural to catch yourself with an open hand.

Quit stating your opinions as facts without anything to back it up.

There are very experienced people here that disagree if you care to read and address their posts.

Bas Rutten use to ko people with palm strikes,but on Fight Science his punches put out more force.

Ko's are more frequent with punches, but that all depends on the target, not the hand formation.

 

[Nolerama]

nolerama- when you observe there are always lots of useless stuff being done.for me i cant beleive how many people drop their arms as they kick and therefore telegraph the incoming technique or/and leave themseves open to counter.think that why few people try to kick the iceman...??
matsu

I think kicking is effective if you can pull it off. But you're mentioning Chuck Liddell, right? There's been a few fights where a slower kicker has been caught by Chuck, only to realize his entire face is open to one of Chuck's nasty straight punches.

And he smelled that a mile away. You're right.

It's all about the two people in the ring, so that's just an isolated example.

About the open handed argument here, I think the body's more inclined (and therefore your mechanics are more available) to throw a fist than an open hand. Although I doubt a huge difference in striking power, I do throw my lot into being able to strike from a more dominant position, rather than winging a hard slap.

But getting slapped in the face is pretty angering, and demoralizing. So that might work.

I'm just saying I saw what I saw. And what I saw from "hardened veterans" was two guys playing patty cake.

 

[matsu]

thanks again for the "lively" debate hee hee.
there has been some very good arguements over a valid point.

i do believe that open hand palm strikes as david c stated,have a place in a clinch where the body angles determine where the strike can come from.
and i wonder,STILL< if it it becuse the fighters are not taught that particular option or wether they feel it isnt effective enough to use.
which is why i asked in the 1st place.

thanks again.. matsu

 

[Skpotamus]

Even the fighters that fought under open hand rules and were comfortable with them don't throw them when they have other options (punching, elbowing)

The gloves help protect the hands so punching is safer. A trained fighter doesn't leave as big an opening as an untrained one, palm heel strikes force your hand into a position where it needs a much larger gap to get through vs a punch in a clinch. The palm heel works best on an opponent with their chin up, standing more upright in a close range position. Fighters typically tuck their chins to avoid being KO'ed, making it hard to land a good palm heel strike to the chin.

 

[Odin]

Even the fighters that fought under open hand rules and were comfortable with them don't throw them when they have other options (punching, elbowing)

The gloves help protect the hands so punching is safer. A trained fighter doesn't leave as big an opening as an untrained one, palm heel strikes force your hand into a position where it needs a much larger gap to get through vs a punch in a clinch. The palm heel works best on an opponent with their chin up, standing more upright in a close range position. Fighters typically tuck their chins to avoid being KO'ed, making it hard to land a good palm heel strike to the chin.

Very good point, look at the stance of any trained fighter and you'll see a palm strike is very difficult to land.....unless you want to palm strike the forehead.

 

[markyboy]

You are comparing apples and oranges.

Pushing is naturally done with the palm. Hitting is naturally done with the clinched fist. When falling it is natural to catch yourself with an open hand.

Quit stating your opinions as facts without anything to back it up.

There are very experienced people here that disagree if you care to read and address their posts.

Bas Rutten use to ko people with palm strikes,but on Fight Science his punches put out more force.

Ko's are more frequent with punches, but that all depends on the target, not the hand formation.

Stop backing your own arguments with other people's opinions -have your own,thats what "opinion" means!!

You are stating there are very experienced people here-do you include yourself in that statement?or riding off the back of their knowledge?

 

[MJS]

Interesting thread. One thing to keep in mind, is that everyone is going to have their own opinions, and while we may not agree with them, we still should try to respect them and have a civil discussion.

So...that being said...IMHO, I think that the strikes used should fit the situation. In other words, if you enter a submission only match, then no need to worry about strikes or kicks. In a MMA setting, closed hand striking is probably the best way to go, although there are some cases, where a palm to the side of the head may work. We've seen Royce do this many times, when attempting a choke. He's hit the persons head in an effort to move it to aid in sinking in the choke.

Interestingly enough, a few nights ago, when I got home from work, I flipped on the tv, and saw a Fight Science episode. They were talking about the effect certain strikes had on the body. One of the strikes was an open palm. They hit the dummy or whatever device they were using and it had some pretty good results.

MMA and real world SD are 2 different animals. A pre-emptive hit to the face, chin or ear, with an open palm, while maintaining a submissive, but yet defensive hand posture, can be very effective.

Mike

 

[markyboy]

A good palm strike can kill very easy I know this.!!!.
I think they are still on the falkland islands somewhere and some out to sea.
The cliffs were very dangerous when the Parachute Regiment came out to play.

 

[allenjp]

A good palm strike can kill very easy I know this.!!!.
I think they are still on the falkland islands somewhere and some out to sea.
The cliffs were very dangerous when the Parachute Regiment came out to play.

Huh???

did anyone else miss the meaning of this or am I the only idiot here?

 

[Nolerama]

A good palm strike can kill very easy I know this.!!!.
I think they are still on the falkland islands somewhere and some out to sea.
The cliffs were very dangerous when the Parachute Regiment came out to play.

Your anger amuses me.

Bottom line: fists are seen more than open hands in an MMA fight because they are more effective.

But I'd rather pound fists than high-five. Thats' just me.

 

[Brian S]

A good palm strike can kill very easy I know this.!!!.
I think they are still on the falkland islands somewhere and some out to sea.
The cliffs were very dangerous when the Parachute Regiment came out to play.

How do you "know" this? Are you reading the responses here?

I do have my own opinion and I count myself as quite experienced,thanks.

 

[Brian S]

Huh???

did anyone else miss the meaning of this or am I the only idiot here?

Count me in. That was completely random. :coocoo:

??????? Markyboy, Why are you so upset with me about my opinions???????

 

[Skpotamus]

Don't feel bad, I couldn't understand that last post either.

It's almost like three seperate sentences from different posts, or maybe it's some form of haiku....

 

[meth18au]

applegate was taught by fairbairn himself,chop or palm comes under open hands-it is a natural strike.
Ever tried pushing a car with your fists?
1 -its not going very far.
2 - it hurts.Unless you're wearing your boxing gloves!!(unlikely)

Under extreme stress, techniques go out the window.

Now we add to the Apes, WW2, falling over and slamming the palm on the wall!!!

In the end we're still debating the effectiveness of palm strikes vs closed fist strikes- and why they aren't used in MMA more often. Or are we? How does pushing a car with your fists vs pushing it with your open hands facilitate your argument? I'm curious- and I put it to you to clarify what you mean and how this applies to the topic of palm strikes vs open hand strikes in MMA?!?!

If you explain why you have such opinions- and you backup your argument- I'm sure you'll find people here to be very open to friendly debate where both parties can learn from each other.