bcbernam777
Brown Belt
Ah ha this proves conclusivly that Kung Fu is crap and that grapplers rule the universe
MMA versus Kung Fu Video!
- Thread starter Brian R. VanCise
- Start date
OP
OP
Actually we all know that not to be the case. All it proves is that on this one day the guy who won the match was better. Even though it appears that there were less rules than your typical MMA match today it was still not a real life self defense situation. Chinese martial arts are not only beautiful but effective and I have met with more than a few CMA's that I would not mind having them guarding my back in a violent encounter.
Why I posted this was to generate some discussion regarding this individuals woeful eye attacks on the ground and woeful body positioning. That is what I saw as important. The CMA practitioner was simply not defending the crossbody or side control well. His eye gouge was completely ineffective as well. I will bet after this altercation that he reevaluated his training and hopefully took some measures to counter this.
One practitioners failure in a contest has no bearing on the overall arts effectiveness for self defense.
Kembudo-Kai Kempoka
Senior Master
Not the grappler who lost. aka, the kung fu guy. His leg work displayed a basic knowledge of how to slow a guy going from side mount, to mount, as did his attempt at getting a heel under the grapplers chin in an attempt to peel him off with the leg. Poor selection considering the size difference, but it tells me he spent a few evenings rolling with some buddies who showed him what he HOPED would be enough to keep the wrassler at bay.
So which grappler won? As far as I could see, the more experienced, better conditioned, and stronger/larger of the two...which I would expect to be the case on most days, anyway.
Regards,
Dave
bcbernam777
Brown Belt
I know I am just having a dig
Look the TMA practicioner off the bat made a couple of opening errors, the first was that he attacked first. I remember one time reading something Sun Tzu said about two armies at a river, he said let your oponant make the first move then attack whilst he is halfway across the river. We all know the value of allowing your oponant to go first, and that nuerologically reaction is always faster than initiation, that was his first mistake, the second was that he did what every inexperianced TMA does, they go in with the legs (why do they do that), not only does it telegraph intention, it also allows your oponant to catch your root. Those ehere just his opening mistakes.
bcbernam777
Brown Belt
Look I agree the better man won on the day
PeaceWarrior
Green Belt
IMO its all about experience and the type of training. I know some TMAists who would definetly hold their own, even against a pro fighter. I just wish that these arrogant "masters" wouldnt do this, it just gives kung fu a bad rep and 90% of people know only what they see on film (concrete evidence obviously) and take it as evidence of how "ineffective" kung fu is...and therefore how superior MMA is...
I also agree 100% with bcb
Peace
Keith
I also agree 100% with bcb
Peace
Keith
Gone are the days of true challenge fights. If you challenge anyone you would generally be looking at mma rules and why be a moron and challenge a pro mma guy. In my opinion if you challenge anyone you deserve an *** whipping. I couldn't imagine a challenge happening now days with guys striking the throat, eyes etc.
Cheers
Sam:asian:
Odin
2nd Black Belt
well considering its MMA he could have chosen to mount him and pound him with bare fists ruining that guys goodlooks...or from the side control he had he could have tied him up and unleashed downward elbows (REMEMBER THAT FAMOUS GARY GOODRIDGE MATCH) downward elbows to the head kill you know....instead he chose to use submissions, therefore i thought he went easy.
Odin
2nd Black Belt
whoops i replied before reading your reply....took the words right out of my mouth.( :
zDom
Senior Master
Er.. that is my point: he didn't GO for "submission" (wait for a tap out) he went for a MAIM Ā breaking his arm.
Personally if I had a choice between maimings, I would prefer some cuts and bruises on my face, even a broken nose, from elbow strikes, for example, over having my elbow dislocated.
I've had my face pounded before (with a tire tool on one occassion, with a lead-filled maglite on another) and I healed up pretty well Ā heck, I still have my dashing good looks
(and chicks dig scars ) But a dislocated elbow can take YEARS to rehabilitate.A choke would have been even better: loss of conciousness for a few moments, then awakening none worse for the wear other than the loss of pride.
You guys sure do have some strange (to me) ideas of "taking it easy!"
The way it seemed to me was that the pro MMA fighter was showing respect to his opponents skills. He was keeping a very tight lid on him and not allowing him the possibility to strike back. You're assuming he would have been able to strike him with impunity if he went for the GnP. That may be the case, but based on the fact that this guy was betting 25 G's on his skills ( the KF guy ), I'm willing to bet he knew a thing or two.
Grappling was simply beyond him. If you don't know and train grappling, its damn near impossible to reverse an undesirable situation.
I'd agree with zDom, breaking someones arm is not exactly showing leniency.
Interesting....I don't think Kung Fu Man is Hung-Ga. We don't wear that jacket, most schools it's just a t-shirt.
As for the technique or lack of it. Kung Fu Man doesn't kick but feeds his leg to MMA Guy, which plays right into his grappling speciality - take em to the ground & finish em off. One legged Kung Fu Man didn't stand a chance.
Here is a pretty good tread about the video. It's long but a few of the posts are from people who where there and can fill in all the details.
http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40361&highlight=san+soo
http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40361&highlight=san+soo
Odin
2nd Black Belt
''He was a standup specialist who thought he could beat a MMA fighter using eye gouges, finger breaks, and pressure points.
He actually did have a small amount of ground fighting experience as you can see when he defends the mount. However, he didn't have enough to understand not to go for the eye gouge from an inferior position.l''
I read that on that on the kungfumagazine link posted up.
Where have i heard this before hey? ''eye gouges, finger breaks and pressure points'' i seem to hear that in every Tma vs Mma argument (ie..if someone had me in mount i would gouges his eyes out!raghhhh!!)not saying that the video disproves that notion but i think everyone should now relise its not that easy.
and i dont know about you but if someone is trying to gouge my eyes out DMAN RIGHT IM GOING TO SNAP HIS ARM!he's be lucky if i didnt go for a leg lock and really mess him up for life.
He actually did have a small amount of ground fighting experience as you can see when he defends the mount. However, he didn't have enough to understand not to go for the eye gouge from an inferior position.l''
I read that on that on the kungfumagazine link posted up.
Where have i heard this before hey? ''eye gouges, finger breaks and pressure points'' i seem to hear that in every Tma vs Mma argument (ie..if someone had me in mount i would gouges his eyes out!raghhhh!!)not saying that the video disproves that notion but i think everyone should now relise its not that easy.
and i dont know about you but if someone is trying to gouge my eyes out DMAN RIGHT IM GOING TO SNAP HIS ARM!he's be lucky if i didnt go for a leg lock and really mess him up for life.
Well, while you have a good point, the quote you posted is simply someones own thoughts and viewpoints of the fight, so its really just opinoins at best. No one really knows what the "kung fu guy" was planning or thought....do you? Obviously it was something other than serious fight training, but we can't really debate his thoughts, ideas, or plans can we?
Odin
2nd Black Belt
You can see him clearly going for eye gouges in the film...and also pulling the MMA guys hair.
All we can do is express our thoughts and opinions its the best way to get a conclusion.
bcbernam777
Brown Belt
Thats the thing about any form of fighting it just isnt easy
Odin
2nd Black Belt
Agreed.
It just annoys me when people have the whole ''if he does this i would just do this'' mentality, when reality is much different.
