Mirroring Techniques

[GAB]

mj-hi-yah:
The information you are receiving from your fellow Kenpoist's is very good.
Good luck in your art. Regards, Gary

 

[Goldendragon7]

mj-hi-yah:

There was much discussion on this very same topic a couple of years ago as well.........

My personal views can be found on page 2 post 29.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2576&page=1&pp=15

Glad to see you expanding your physical prowess..

:asian:

 

[mj-hi-yah]

mj-hi-yah:

There was much discussion on this very same topic a couple of years ago as well.........

My personal views can be found on page 2 post 29.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2576&page=1&pp=15

Glad to see you expanding your physical prowess.. What do you have to do the rest of your life but train Kenpo....... lol.



:asian:

Thanks Kato! I read that entire thread the other day. It was interesting, but more of a debate on the topic rather than an exchange of what works for people, and since I need to do this now I thought I'd reopen the topic in a different way. I think your starting at purple (or at least earlier than black) as some have suggested was a better idea than waiting until black when it's all so ingrained.

Yes I need to expand my physical prowess to fight the dark side :duel: and you're right I'll hopefully be doing this for the rest of my life, so I might as well learn both sides...

Thanks,

MJ :asian:

 

[Goldendragon7]

l'll be doing this for the rest of my life, so I might as well learn both sides...
Thanks, MJ :asian:

It can't hurt..... only can make you better....!

 

[kenpo tiger]

Pete,

Thanks for pointing out Shackle Break B - I was up and doing that piece as I was reading the initial post with Crossed Twigs and wondering if I was lost!

MJ,

Ask Chris about being lefty and training in kenpo.
I've also noticed that when I teach the kids, they don't have any preconceptions of the "correct" side on which to do a tech - so a lot of times techs like Alternating Mace are done to the left - or Crossing Guard. I think that using Donna's suggestion of the mirrors, and teaching left (which is what I do and was taught to do as a teacher) can only help 'right' your left! (Easy for me to say. Wait till I get there.) KT

 

[mj-hi-yah]

I've also noticed that when I teach the kids, they don't have any preconceptions of the "correct" side on which to do a tech

That's always good advice ...think like a kid! :boing2:

 

[Rob Broad]

That's always good advice ...think like a kid! :boing2:

If you can think like a kid and learn like a kid you, will be amazed at what you can learn. Children have no preconceived notions, no prejudices, and a wonder when it comes to learning. They are truly amazing.

 

[jfarnsworth]

MJ,
Sorry I'm late on this but havne't turned my cp on in a couple of days. Anyway, your body already has the movements. Your muscle memory has the basics locked up inside. You know when your in the horse and you hear punch etc. etc. you do it automatically. My suggestion is when you practice your techniques (probably at home at first) start at yellow and work your way up. Start at Delayed Sword do the right side then perform the left. The body will move. All you can do is improve on your basics. For example, D.S. step back left, block right, right front kick, right handsword (to sum it all up). Step back to natural D.S. step back right, block left, left front kick, left outward handsword. Get somewhat comfortable the move onto Aggressive Twins or whatever is next for you and do the same thing.

 

[mj-hi-yah]

. My suggestion is when you practice your techniques (probably at home at first) start at yellow and work your way up. Get somewhat comfortable the move onto Aggressive Twins or whatever is next for you and do the same thing.

Thanks Jason,

Since at first it won't be pretty, LOL :lol: at home at first is a very good idea! I think starting at the beginning is good advice too. I expect the lower belt moves to be much more easily adapted. I think the harder ones are some of the moves that were complicated for me to learn to begin with like Falcons of Force for example. I can't even go there yet!

MJ :asian:

 

[jfarnsworth]

I think the harder ones are some of the moves that were complicated for me to learn to begin with like Falcons of Force for example. I can't even go there yet!

Now, now, tisk, tisk . I see your point but remember the self defense techniques are just basics put together in a specific sequence. If you need to practice one move at a time. Do the first move of the right side then do the left. Next add two movements then a third and so on. There's nothing to lose and will be time worth vested in the art. You will start to see gains in your knowledge and your abilities. Your spontaneous reactions will get better in time. Many things gained in my opinion.

 

[mj-hi-yah]

Now, now, tisk, tisk . I see your point but remember the self defense techniques are just basics put together in a specific sequence. If you need to practice one move at a time. Do the first move of the right side then do the left. Next add two movements then a third and so on. There's nothing to lose and will be time worth vested in the art. You will start to see gains in your knowledge and your abilities. Your spontaneous reactions will get better in time. Many things gained in my opinion.

Ok I see your point here too For those long crazy ones break them down into basics. That makes sense!

 

[rmcrobertson]

1. Learn the kenpo system that Mr. Parker left.

2. Look in the mirror when you practice.

3. Learn to dummy respectably.

4. Learn, and practice, the forms and the sets.

5. Learn, and practice, the forms and the sets.

6. Go back and look at a meditating horse stance, left over right (is THAT symmetrical?) and the rest of what you were taught and practiced.

 

[Goldendragon7]

6. Go back and look at a meditating horse stance, left over right (is THAT symmetrical?) and the rest of what you were taught and practiced.

Sooooooooo what are you saying?:idunno:

 

[jfarnsworth]

Sooooooooo what are you saying?:idunno:

Well sir, with all due respect. I believe we are embarking on one of those trivial threads where everyone will say why or why not we should train both sides of the techniques, forms, and sets. :asian:
Jason

 

[jfarnsworth]

...I was just following my instructor's movement, but when I tried to do Returning Viper on my own for my personal form

Have not heard of it. What is the attack and basic sum of the technique. I'm not asking you to post your instructors technique from step 1 until completion but basic idea of the tech. :asian:

 

[Brother John]

1. Learn the kenpo system that Mr. Parker left.
2. Look in the mirror when you practice.
3. Learn to dummy respectably.
4. Learn, and practice, the forms and the sets.
5. Learn, and practice, the forms and the sets.
6. Go back and look at a meditating horse stance, left over right (is THAT symmetrical?) and the rest of what you were taught and practiced.

These are all very fine things to do, no matter your rank or time in the art, adherence to the fundamentals is very important.
But it's not all.
I think it's the IKKA Green Belt manual, which Mr. Parker put forward for instruction, that says that we should practice to perfect the execution of our art on both sides, the "on" and the "off" sides.
This IS the art that Mr. Parker left us.

I have NO idea what the meditating horse stance has to do with executing on one side or both sides. No, it's not "symetrical". So, what's the point?

Your Brother
John

 

[mj-hi-yah]

Have not heard of it. What is the attack and basic sum of the technique. I'm not asking you to post your instructors technique from step 1 until completion but basic idea of the tech. :asian:

Jason the tech is against a step through right and is an extension of Windmill Guard. After the roundhouse kick you pivot and do an added right back kick. You pull to extend their right arm down on a 45 degree angle at the wrist with your right hand as you deliver the kick. If you don't know Windmill Guard let me know and I'll give you the whole shebang.

Well sir, with all due respect. I believe we are embarking on one of those trivial threads where everyone will say why or why not we should train both sides of the techniques, forms, and sets. :asian:

I can only say that I sincerely hope that that is not the case. :asian: This thread is intended to be an idea exchange for suggestions on how to accomplish mirroring techniques more effectively. As stated in the first post of this thread such a debate on the necessity, or lack there of, took place quite thoroughly on an existing thread and if anyone has more to add to the argument against mirroring techniques here's the link: http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/sh...&highlight=left
I respectfully request that this thread continue to focus on suggestions from instructors or students who utilize this training method. :asian:

 

[jfarnsworth]

I don't know of those 2 techniques.

 

[Rob Broad]

I don't know of those 2 techniques.

Windmill Guard and Returning Viper are Tracy's techniques. Windmill Guard is found in Purple Belt and Returning Viper in the Blue Belt

 

[rmcrobertson]

Sigh.

When you're in a meditating horse stance, facing an instructor--is she, or he, doing exactly what you're doing?

For that matter, are you doing with your left hand what you're doing with your right?

Looks like mirroring, but asymmetry, to me.

Some of my response is based on the fact that I simply don't understand why one would, "do techniques on both sides," as something special, when the forms already do precisely this.

Nor, I might add, do I think that the techniques are exactly the same on both sides. Right side stong but dumb; left side "weak," but wise. Right side tiger, left side dragon; right side brown belt, left side black belt, yes?

I have to note, too, that what I'm reading here looks like aspirations to short cuts to me.

Why not just learn the system that Mr. Parker left?