Kung Fu San Soo

[Damian Mavis]

I keep wanting to post on these threads but I never do because I want to stay out of it but I might as well get it over with since I keep wanting to say this and it's driving me nuts....

You Yiliquan guys do come off as insulting. I respect alot of what you say but every time I see you guys post it's in an insulting way and it often seems you 2 never even notice that you come off that way. I'm not defending Chiduce, but I honestly didn't understand where his aggression was coming from until I realised he too has been reading your posts and was probably in a defensive state of mind when it comes to you guys. God knows I don't want you 2 posting in my threads, I don't need the stress. I might over react too just because of what I have seen in your other posts.

I'm trying to be honest here, not attack you. My opinion doesn't count for squat.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[chufeng]

Mr. Mavis & Chiduce,

Where, exactly, have I insulted anyone?
Where have I called names?
Where have I threatened?

It seems if I use a one-word response, I'm criticized.
If I explain myself, I'm condescending.
If I offer advice, I'm a know-it-all.
If I ask a question, the motivation behind it is called into question.

So much for "friendly" discussion of the martial arts...



chufeng

 

[Damian Mavis]

Well my discussion is actually friendly, I'm not angry or anything, just telling you that you guys often come off as abrassive. But I honestly do respect you and the information you have. In this particular thread Chufeng you are actually being great, even when insulted you arent reacting negatively. But we know you and Yiliquan are kind of a team so if there's a fight with one it will often include the other. I just think alot of people might respond negatively to one or the other just out of paranoia after reading your other posts.

You are probably right, people might be misinterpreting your posts. But that's what I'm talking about right? Perception? If several people are misinterpreting your posts than there must be a problem. That's all I said, your posts come off as insulting whether you meant them to be or not.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[Matt Stone]

Mr. Mavis -

Chiduce's aggression toward me stems from my support of RyuShiKan, a dear friend of mine, who had words with Chiduce regarding the nature of Chiduce's background.

I emailed Chiduce myself and let him know my thoughts on the subject. Chiduce replied, and we agreed to let each other be. I still have the emails.

I have replied to some of Chiduce's posts in support of his comments. He can, at times, be very informative. What I take exception to is his nearly unintelligible writing style.

I admit that my first reply to him was less than cordial. But I made no personal attacks, and even stated flatly that I wasn't going to rip into his writing with my questions. Then he attacked.

I will allow a great degree of commentary about myself. Sometimes I deserve it, sometimes it is true. I am mature enough to admit my own wrong doing and accept the punishment that comes hand in hand. However, Chiduce got his panties in a bunch because I called his comments contradictory. When Chufeng posted similarly, though less stiffly than I did, Chiduce managed to clarify himself.

Chiduce's problem is with me personally. I have problems with him and his background admittedly, but I have avoided bringing it up since our email exchange quite a while back. If he makes a comment I don't understand, I ask questions. If he posts information I disagree with, I respond. That is the nature of a "discussion" forum and publicly posted comments.

If he doesn't want to learn to write better and make himself better understood, that's his decision. If he thinks he can say what he likes and no one will criticize him for it, he would be incorrect.

I invite discussion and commentary on the things I post. If someone disagrees with me and asks questions, I am ready and eager to explain myself. If someone gets snippy, I get snippy right back at 'em. I have been involved in several "discussions" that got a little nasty, but I try to maintain a polite bearing while so involved. I can be polite without being friendly.

Sorry to hear you think we are a bunch of insulting a$$holes. Really, we aren't. But I don't sit by while people make blatantly contradictory, foolhardy, erroneous, incorrect, comments, either. If I said something stupid, I would hope there would be someone to try to correct me. If I am so stupid that, when shown that my statement was stupid, I hold onto my own ignorance, then I deserve the beatings I get...

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[Matt Stone]

Originally posted by Damian Mavis

Well my discussion is actually friendly, I'm not angry or anything, just telling you that you guys often come off as abrassive.

I suppose rubbing someone's nose in the fact that they were wrong could be viewed that way... You are the first person that I have not been in direct opposition to that has said something. I will try to appear to be less "abrasive," but I would ask how would you handle comments aimed at you the likes of which Chiduce leveled at me upthread? I think I have avoided being as abrasive as I think would be warranted in this particular situation...

If by abrasive you are referring to the fact that I don't back down when I am asking someone to clarify their position, well, that is something I doubt I will polish to everyone's level of satisfaction. When I read comments made by someone presenting themselves as an expert, and those comments are at best incomplete if not bold faced falsehood, I dive right in and call the person posting them out to defend their position. I would expect everyone to do the same to me. It hasn't happened to me (yet), but then I make sure what I post is accurate (to the best of my knowledge; if I am unsure I ask others for their input), I proof read what I write, and try to make sure the whole thing can be understood by the reader.

But I honestly do respect you and the information you have. In this particular thread Chufeng you are actually being great, even when insulted you arent reacting negatively.

He's good at that... 20 years in the Army teaches you to maintain your cool, I think...

But we know you and Yiliquan are kind of a team so if there's a fight with one it will often include the other.

No, Chufeng is a big boy and can take care of himself. I post to post on my own behalf, not because I am trying to defend Chufeng. He is capable of that on his own.

He is like family to me, though, so if someone goes after him he has other folks to contend with as well... Sorry, but that's the way it is with me - I stand behind my friends.

I just think alot of people might respond negatively to one or the other just out of paranoia after reading your other posts.

Definitely not what I want to happen. I had hoped that calling people out to accept responsibility for what they are doing or saying would encourage people to examine themselves and be sure they are being true to themselves, their art, their teacher, and the Truth.

That's all I said, your posts come off as insulting whether you meant them to be or not.

Sorry you feel that way, Mr. Mavis. Certainly not my intention.

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[Damian Mavis]

Wow great post.

"I admit that my first reply to him was less than cordial. But I made no personal attacks"

Ya that's all I meant, I figured there was history here but I have seen you fight in other threads with others as well. Chufeng reacted badly with personal attacks that made no sense. Like I said, not defending him, just thought maybe he was ready to fight just from reading your other posts.

Again, good post.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[Damian Mavis]

"I had hoped that calling people out to accept responsibility for what they are doing or saying would encourage people to examine themselves and be sure they are being true to themselves, their art, their teacher, and the Truth."

Heh, ok I got to say something about that too.

You can't expect people to examine themselves and better themsleves from posts. Peoples ego's, especially the male ego is a force to be reckoned with and it would take a huge man to listen to contradictory statements and back down and change their ways. I have seen people be totally proven wrong and forced to see the truth...only to come back with a different angle and totally disregard the past arguments and pretend they never felt a certain way or ignore the truth all together.

That is why I don't like arguing on forums, even though I do and regret it each and every time.

(warning - unpolitically correct joke incoming)

Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics, even if you win... you are still retarded.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[Matt Stone]

Mr. Mavis -

Beyond Chiduce, who have I "fought" with? I know I have gotten into some heated discussions with Kirk in the past, and the infamous Naihanchi thread was locked after ongoing discussions with DKIGirl asking her to clarify certain things (which she never really did), but I can't recall other instances that were nearly as bad as with Chiduce.

As far as my dealings with Chiduce go, I have no real axe to grind. While I take issue with his alleged training experiences, and I have problems with the associations he belongs to, if he died tomorrow I would neither jump for joy nor dance on his grave. I don't know him well enough to do either. If I get abrasive with him (I like that word now! ), I do so based on the content of his post. I try to limit my abrasiveness to the issue at hand. Sure, I know in the back of my mind what the source of the comments is (i.e. Chiduce's background), but I try to stay away from that, and I certainly don't make personal comments based on assumptions that I have absolutely no way of verifying (e.g. my ability to do push ups, or the fact that I am now alleged to have a drinking problem... ).

I like this forum. I enjoy posting here, meeting people and exchanging info. I try to stay friendly, as long as friendly is warranted.

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[arnisador]

Originally posted by Yiliquan1

I try to stay friendly, as long as friendly is warranted.

Friendly is always warranted on the forum, by definition ("...friendly discussion of the martial arts..."). Everything else should be taken to PM/e-mail.

This is not directed at Yiliquan1 or any other particular individual. I just thought it best to clarify this matter.

-Arnisador
-MT Admin-

 

[Matt Stone]

Originally posted by Damian Mavis

You can't expect people to examine themselves and better themsleves from posts. Peoples ego's, especially the male ego is a force to be reckoned with and it would take a huge man to listen to contradictory statements and back down and change their ways. I have seen people be totally proven wrong and forced to see the truth...only to come back with a different angle and totally disregard the past arguments and pretend they never felt a certain way or ignore the truth all together.

Ah, but I don't care if Chiduce changes or not... His actions, especially the negative ones, serve as examples to other people of what not to do... In fact, Chiduce serves as a much better teaching tool if he doesn't change.

Thanks for your candor.

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[Matt Stone]

Originally posted by arnisador

Friendly is always warranted on the forum, by definition ("...friendly discussion of the martial arts..."). Everything else should be taken to PM/e-mail.

This is not directed at Yiliquan1 or any other particular individual. I just thought it best to clarify this matter.

-Arnisador
-MT Admin-

I hear and I obey, oh most powerful Mod God...

Not gonna "go there" with this no more...

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[Damian Mavis]

No no I didn't even think you were referring to Chiduce. You made a general statement about what you hope happens and I was just saying it would be nice but like I said, it would take a huge man (bigger than me) to listen to others and change.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

 

[Matt Stone]

Gotcha.

No worries. I agree that it takes a big person (don't want to offend the ladies unduly) to come face to face with their shortcomings and change. But I have done it, I have seen others do it (there is even an ongoing thread on E-budo about a person once affiliated with the infamous Juko-kai who has renounced his bogus and fraudulently obtained soke status and gone legit...), so I know it can be done.

Thanks again for your open and honest comments. I'm gonna try to play nice now...

 

[Chiduce]

You Know, it seems to be amazing that you cannot just stop this crazy conversation. But here again, it proves that some people just can't get the message. Quan, so i mispelled the term fathom; big deal. Now you have feelings, emotions, and the like. Just can the conversation and go on with your life. I have not been to this forum for quite some time; and when i get back there is always chaos. I don't have to get along with what you believe, say, and what you think is my proper grammer. You should have been an english teacher. Ryushikan even sent me the e-mail about the debate on the e-budo forum. Clogging up everyone's mailbox with chaotic mess. You guys really need some help from a qualifed mental and social health professional. Just, for the record; my english professors were harvard graduates. You know, my sifu's teacher said that this type of thing would happen between clans and individuals? If you want to take over the martial arts world or forums; at least announce it. People will at least know your intent. You, calling my words 50 cent words also shows that you can't admit your denial of being screwed up in the head. Like it always has been. If you can't take the heat; get out of the fire! As far as your feelings about me, well i did not ask your permission to become a martial artist or anything else. So, i don't need your help, advice, input, output, or anything else to get along in the world today under any circumstances. How i feel about you does not matter, nor should it. You, and no one else can stop Gods Work or His Will. I personally, have nothing more to say to you or anyone else on this matter. Just wanted to set the record straight!
Later;
Chiduce!

 

[chufeng]

Gosh Mr. Mavis, I come back to this web Board to see the following posted by you:

"Chufeng reacted badly with personal attacks that made no sense"

Was this a typo?
Or are we talking two completely different languages?


chufeng

 

[chufeng]

Chiduce posted the following:

"You, and no one else can stop Gods Work or His Will."

Again, I agree with him...but I didn't realize that God advocated name-calling, out of control anger, and personal attacks. I guess we read different books.

...and I don't see what that post has to do with SanSoo.

Remember, this is a thread on SanSoo...can we get back on topic?

:asian:
chufeng

 

[Damian Mavis]

Yes sorry that was a typo, I tried so hard not to confuse your names but I failed.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD