Twin Fist
Grandmaster
uh....no
Just curious...
- Thread starter Touch Of Death
- Start date
Absolutely untrue. My mother-in-law just moved out of a one-bedroom apartment which was $800. Up until two years ago, I rented a two-bedroom condo for $1,200. I also purchased a home just outside of L.A. County (3,374 sq. ft., 5 bedroom, 3 full baths, office) for $2,500. Although more expensive then where my ex-wife lives in Ohio, where she can rent a two-bedroom house for about $500, it isn't as high as you say.
However, the median income of a Los Angeles resident according to the U.S. Census Bureau (2008) was $55,428. So the average teacher salary is almost 150% of the median income of a Los Angeles resident.
I don't doubt that their are regional differences in income amongst teachers. I just wanted to provide some counterpoint to statement of "trying to sell the public on teachers making $50,000."
And, for clarification, I am not saying that teacher, in general, don't deserve to be well paid for their jobs.
I'm not sure where you are going with this. Salary comparisons would be a relatively simple thing to do in terms of dollar amounts. If you are refering to trying to compare it to the cost of living in a given area, sure, it would be more difficult. But the actual comparisons would be pretty straight forward.
WC_lun
Senior Master
What I find interesting is that teachers are one of the biggest positive influences on children in thier entire lives. In many cases teachers do more to help children prepare for the future than thier own parents. However, instead of being treated as the heroes many of these men and women are, they are villified and told they make too much money or are lazy because they don't work the entire year through. These men and women have enough trust of the public for the public to entrust thier greatest treasure to them, but not enough trust to let them have collective bargaining when it comes to thier pay. Ridiculous.
Yeah? My sister-in-law can't find deals like this. Please private message me - she is on the verge of being homeless because of the economy and saturated market. She is renting A ROOM for $800/month.
Either you mean $2.5M, $250K or your mortgage pmt is $2,500. If either the first or the latter, you've proven my point - real estate in California *IS* abominable. We sold my mother's home, in need of serious repair and update, back on '02 for $395K. That's in Fountain Valley near the Santa Ana and Garden Grove borders, just off of Harbor and Edinger. Other homes on that block sold in the high $800k. They are three bedroom ranches.
If you meant $250k, that's still more than any of my houses are worth. We pull in a little more than the average teacher's salary per year and if it weren't for rental income from our other mortgage-free rentals, we could not pay the mortgage on our residence on his salary alone.
Oh yeah, and he's UNION!!!!! :fart:
Unions ended sweatshop conditions and 18 hour work days.
Quite honestly, it's my wife who finds all this stuff. I just go along for the ride.
I meant that my monthly mortgage payment is $2,500 a month for my house. The initial mortgage amount was $356K, which isn't bad at all given the size of the house. The backyard is a little small for my tastes, but what are ya gonna do.
Now, to be fair, I am a police sergeant and my wife is a deputy sheriff, so its not like we don't make decent money. But since we are talking union stuff, in my department we just passed our contract, union negotiated, and took a 10% cut in pay and benefits, and that includes the Chief of Police. And most of us did it without too much griping about it. Why? Because we knew we had to. We did it to avoid layoffs. (Though to be honest, I would much rather have demoted some people and/or laid people off, but I'm mercenary like that. Quite frankly, we do a lot more work then surrounding cities who make more money.)
In terms of schools, the school board in my city just had an emergency budget session open to the public last night. They currently are running a $12 Million deficit, projected to be $32 Million next year, and $56 Million in the 2012 - 2013 fiscal year. They are deciding to lay off about 194 people in order to help close the budget gap. Of course, people are complaining, but what are they supposed to do (assuming that they are being financially competent with the money, which none of us believe is the case).
So, while I get that teachers are not the "bad guys", I just don't get why they should be exempt from the pains that others are having to deal with, including those in the private sector. This argument is somewhat simplistic, I understand, if you consider issues of graft, corruption, etc., but that will always be the case in government entities, in my opinion.
Bruno@MT
Senior Master
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"These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland ... They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost." --Ronald Reagan, Labor Day Address at Liberty State Park, 1980
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
100 years ago
for the LAST 100 years, all they do is buy elections and politicians and fleece thier members
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
he wasnt referring to PUBLIC workers Bruno. WHich i am pretty sure you know.
he FIRED public workers that tried striking as i recall...
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
this right here is the entire issue.
that and YOU CANNOT SPEND WHAT YOU DO NOT HAVE.
if the state cannot afford this benefit plans, they have to go.
Bruno@MT
Senior Master
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Public workers don't deserve rights?
Imo they have every right to bargain collectively, just like people in the private sector.
Just because you don't like it does not mean that what they are doing is wrong.
Eh, semantics....I suppose a worker in a stae owned steel plant or ship yard qualifies as public, no?
But it's kind of fun that he supports those he has not on his pay list...
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
cops, firefighter, air traffic controllers, teachers, etc
currently
currently
Dude ... if you can afford $2500 per month for a mortgage payment ... you need to realize that the amount of your payment alone is likely what some very lucky people right now are clearing per month AFTER taxes. Hell, I think with my husband's job (when he's working, and he's in layoff mode right now) we *might* get that net. So by blue collar (or, apparently to the folks who protect people who make more than $250k per year, RICH :barf: ) YOU are RICHER. I guess you think this means your market is not abominable. I lived in LA. I left it. I've visited So. Cal. a few times in the last 15 years. The real estate market is NOT AFFORDABLE for anyone to buy anything if they make less than $85k per year ... unless they want to live in the barrios.
LEOs and firefighters here took a cut in pay so that we didn't have to lose any workers. Guess what? They cut staffing anyway about a year later. We have people getting into injury accidents who don't even get a police response anymore. And they're going to cut more.
Are people really so blind that they can't see what's going on here?
No no no no no.
The superintendent in our school district is one of the highest paid public service administrators in the country. He makes more than $150k per year and gets bonuses.
Bonuses.
When they're overspending.
I'm sorry.
If I overspend ... I DON'T GET A ****ING BONUS!!!!
And neither should they.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
This says you don’t understand statistics
Let’s make this simple,
I get the mean of all salaries in the state and I compare it to the median of all teacher salaries in the state.
Or I get the Median of all gas station attendants in the state and I compare it to the median of all teacher salaries in the state
Both give you wonderful numbers to compare but are those comparisons worth anything.
You need the data behind them and the formulas used to reach that date for it to mean anything at all
Now not all the following formulas apply but without knowing which one was used or that data behind that you get a really great number that can be easily manipulated to fit your needs but in reality is pretty much meaningless, but it looks really cool and gets people to follow what you say withuot thought because... I mean...wow... the guy said "the statsitics show"
■Population mean = μ = ( Σ Xi ) / N
■Population standard deviation = σ = sqrt [ Σ ( Xi - μ )2 / N ]
■Population variance = σ2 = Σ ( Xi - μ )2 / N
■Variance of population proportion = σP2 = PQ / n
■Standardized score = Z = (X - μ
/ σ ■Population correlation coefficient = ρ = [ 1 / N ] * Σ { [ (Xi - μX) / σx ] * [ (Yi - μY) / σy ] }
■Sample mean = x = ( Σ xi ) / n
■Sample standard deviation = s = sqrt [ Σ ( xi - x )2 / ( n - 1 ) ]
■Sample variance = s2 = Σ ( xi - x )2 / ( n - 1 )
■Variance of sample proportion = sp2 = pq / (n - 1)
■Pooled sample proportion = p = (p1 * n1 + p2 * n2) / (n1 + n2)
■Pooled sample standard deviation = sp = sqrt [ (n1 - 1) * s12 + (n2 - 1) * s22 ] / (n1 + n2 - 2) ]
■Sample correlation coefficient = r = [ 1 / (n - 1) ] * Σ { [ (xi - x) / sx ] * [ (yi - y) / sy ] }
Correlation
■Pearson product-moment correlation = r = Σ (xy) / sqrt [ ( Σ x2 ) * ( Σ y2 ) ]
■Linear correlation (sample data) = r = [ 1 / (n - 1) ] * Σ { [ (xi - x) / sx ] * [ (yi - y) / sy ] }
■Linear correlation (population data) = ρ = [ 1 / N ] * Σ { [ (Xi - μX) / σx ] * [ (Yi - μY) / σy ] }
Simple Linear Regression
■Simple linear regression line: ŷ = b0 + b1x
■Regression coefficient = b1 = Σ [ (xi - x) (yi - y) ] / Σ [ (xi - x)2]
■Regression slope intercept = b0 = y - b1 * x
■Regression coefficient = b1 = r * (sy / sx)
■Standard error of regression slope = sb1 = sqrt [ Σ(yi - ŷi)2 / (n - 2) ] / sqrt [ Σ(xi - x)2 ]
Counting
■n factorial: n! = n * (n-1) * (n - 2) * . . . * 3 * 2 * 1. By convention, 0! = 1.
■Permutations of n things, taken r at a time: nCr = n! / (n - r)!
■Combinations of n things, taken r at a time: nCr = n! / r!(n - r)! = nPr / r!
Probability
■Rule of addition: P(A ∪ B) = P(A) + P(B) - P(A ∩ B)
■Rule of multiplication: P(A ∩ B) = P(A) P(B|A)
■Rule of subtraction: P(A') = 1 - P(A)
■Expected value of X = E(X) = μx = Σ [ xi * P(xi) ]
■Variance of X = Var(X) = σ2 = Σ [ xi - E(x) ]2 * P(xi) = Σ [ xi - μx ]2 * P(xi)
■Normal random variable = z-score = z = (X - μ
/σ■Chi-square statistic = Χ2 = [ ( n - 1 ) * s2 ] / σ2
■f statistic = f = [ s12/σ12 ] / [ s22/σ22 ]
■Expected value of sum of random variables = E(X + Y) = E(X) + E(Y)
■Expected value of difference between random variables = E(X - Y) = E(X) - E(Y)
■Variance of the sum of independent random variables = Var(X + Y) = Var(X) + Var(Y)
■Variance of the difference between independent random variables = Var(X - Y) = E(X) + E(Y)
Sampling Distributions
■Mean of sampling distribution of the mean = μx = μ
■Mean of sampling distribution of the proportion = μp = P
■Standard deviation of proportion = σp = sqrt[ P * (1 - P)/n ] = sqrt( PQ / n )
■Standard deviation of the mean = σx = σ/sqrt(n)
■Standard deviation of difference of sample means = σd = sqrt[ (σ12 / n1) + (σ22 / n2) ]
■Standard deviation of difference of sample proportions = σd = sqrt{ [P1(1 - P1) / n1] + [P2(1 - P2) / n2] }
Standard Error
■Standard error of proportion = SEp = sp = sqrt[ p * (1 - p)/n ] = sqrt( pq / n )
■Standard error of difference for proportions = SEp = sp = sqrt{ p * ( 1 - p ) * [ (1/n1) + (1/n2) ] }
■Standard error of the mean = SEx = sx = s/sqrt(n)
■Standard error of difference of sample means = SEd = sd = sqrt[ (s12 / n1) + (s22 / n2) ]
■Standard error of difference of paired sample means = SEd = sd = { sqrt [ (Σ(di - d)2 / (n - 1) ] } / sqrt(n)
■Pooled sample standard error = spooled = sqrt [ (n1 - 1) * s12 + (n2 - 1) * s22 ] / (n1 + n2 - 2) ]
■Standard error of difference of sample proportions = sd = sqrt{ [p1(1 - p1) / n1] + [p2(1 - p2) / n2] }
Discrete Probability Distributions
■Binomial formula: P(X = x) = b(x; n, P) = nCx * Px * (1 - P)n - x = nCx * Px * Qn - x
■Mean of binomial distribution = μx = n * P
■Variance of binomial distribution = σx2 = n * P * ( 1 - P )
■Negative Binomial formula: P(X = x) = b*(x; r, P) = x-1Cr-1 * Pr * (1 - P)x - r
■Mean of negative binomial distribution = μx = rQ / P
■Variance of negative binomial distribution = σx2 = r * Q / P2
■Geometric formula: P(X = x) = g(x; P) = P * Qx - 1
■Mean of geometric distribution = μx = Q / P
■Variance of geometric distribution = σx2 = Q / P2
■Hypergeometric formula: P(X = x) = h(x; N, n, k) = [ kCx ] [ N-kCn-x ] / [ NCn ]
■Mean of hypergeometric distribution = μx = n * k / N
■Variance of hypergeometric distribution = σx2 = n * k * ( N - k ) * ( N - n ) / [ N2 * ( N - 1 ) ]
■Poisson formula: P(x; μ
= (e-μ (μx) / x!■Mean of Poisson distribution = μx = μ
■Variance of Poisson distribution = σx2 = μ
■Multinomial formula: P = [ n! / ( n1! * n2! * ... nk! ) ] * ( p1n1 * p2n2 * . . . * pknk )
■Mean of a linear transformation = E(Y) = Y = aX + b.
■Variance of a linear transformation = Var(Y) = a2 * Var(X).
■Standardized score = z = (x - μx) / σx.
■t-score = t = (x - μx) / [ s/sqrt(n) ].
Estimation
■Confidence interval: Sample statistic + Critical value * Standard error of statistic
■Margin of error = (Critical value) * (Standard deviation of statistic)
■Margin of error = (Critical value) * (Standard error of statistic)
Hypothesis Testing
■Standardized test statistic = (Statistic - Parameter) / (Standard deviation of statistic)
■One-sample z-test for proportions: z-score = z = (p - P0) / sqrt( p * q / n )
■Two-sample z-test for proportions: z-score = z = z = [ (p1 - p2) - d ] / SE
■One-sample t-test for means: t-score = t = (x - μ
/ SE■Two-sample t-test for means: t-score = t = [ (x1 - x2) - d ] / SE
■Matched-sample t-test for means: t-score = t = [ (x1 - x2) - D ] / SE = (d - D) / SE
■Chi-square test statistic = Χ2 = Σ[ (Observed - Expected)2 / Expected ]
■One-sample t-test: DF = n - 1
■Two-sample t-test: DF = (s12/n1 + s22/n2)2 / { [ (s12 / n1)2 / (n1 - 1) ] + [ (s22 / n2)2 / (n2 - 1) ] }
■Two-sample t-test, pooled standard error: DF = n1 + n2 - 2
■Simple linear regression, test slope: DF = n - 2
■Chi-square goodness of fit test: DF = k - 1
■Chi-square test for homogeneity: DF = (r - 1) * (c - 1)
■Chi-square test for independence: DF = (r - 1) * (c - 1)
■Mean (simple random sampling): n = { z2 * σ2 * [ N / (N - 1) ] } / { ME2 + [ z2 * σ2 / (N - 1) ] }
■Proportion (simple random sampling): n = [ ( z2 * p * q ) + ME2 ] / [ ME2 + z2 * p * q / N ]
■Proportionate stratified sampling: nh = ( Nh / N ) * n
■Neyman allocation (stratified sampling): nh = n * ( Nh * σh ) / [ Σ ( Ni * σi ) ]
■Optimum allocation (stratified sampling):
nh = n * [ ( Nh * σh ) / sqrt( ch ) ] / [ Σ ( Ni * σi ) / sqrt( ci ) ]
Now do you know where i'm going with this?
Have you seen some of these children that go school? A three month break may be necessary for the mental welfare of teachers!
Besides, the Chamber of Commerce in many states would never go for not having the extended business supporting summer vacation time. Here, in Michigan, a law was passed in 2005 requiring schools to start after the labor day break to encourage more intrastate tourism.
Also, more people hate teachers than you know. In fact, anyone that doesn't think public school teachers should be paid at least $500,000 a year hates teachers.
Twin Fist
Grandmaster
if the educational stats were getting BETTER i dont think anyone would be complaining... but again, you cannot spend what you do not have
you don't want the stats to get better, but the education....
Stats only means they have been gramming for the SATs...and believe me, that happens a LOT!
Blade96
Senior Master
Don't believe in school year round. First more is not always better. If the quality sucks how much are they learning really? second, let kids be kids. They'll have to know about work and work a lot when they get older.
I prefer the breaks to be spread out a bit more. 3 month is along time...
(though around here we are down to 2...not too bad, a week in spring, a week in fall...)
