Ill. soldier's family says pictures aren't porn

[Bob Hubbard]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/15/AR2010011503868.html

CHAMPAIGN, Ill. -- The family of an Illinois National Guard soldier said Friday that he's been charged with possession of child pornography in Afghanistan over innocent snapshots of a 4-year-old relative in a swimsuit.

The U.S. Army has charged Spec. Billy Miller of Galesburg, Ill., with possession of child pornography and a related charge of failure to obey an order that troops in Afghanistan not possess pornography.

...

Miller's father, Rodney, said the Army won't discuss the case with the family. But he said his son has told him the charges stem from a handful of photos of the girl that the soldier's mother e-mailed to ease his homesickness.

...

The pictures show the girl in a swimsuit playing in a pool and sitting on Billy Miler's pickup truck, according to the family. A small portion of one of the girl's buttocks is visible in one, Rodney Miller said.

...

The Millers say their son became close to the little girl after she was diagnosed with a serious illness while her own father was away for military training. The pictures were taken by Terri Miller and the girl's mother at the girl's birthday party last summer, Rodney Miller said.

...

 

[Bob Hubbard]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...ssion-child-porn-afghanistan/?test=latestnews

 

[Bruno@MT]

Good thing that people in the US don't overreact when it comes to sexuality or the exposure of skin....

My wife had a pic of our kids in bath as her desktop image.
Sometime ago she went to the US for work purposes. Before she left I took her laptop and removed that pic from her desktop, the folder in which it was, and the local cache.

She really thought I was being paranoid, but I told her that if her laptop was inspected upon entry to the US, or if the wrong person saw that pic in her company, she was in for a lot of trouble. She grumbled a bit, using the word 'stupid' but at least she gave in.

 

[Bruno@MT]

Actually I am wondering: with Americans being this paranoid, how can e.g. daycare parents do their job without fear for being accused of indecent things?
Or the instructors of the swimming team if a kid has to go to the toilet?
Or any of the other dozen professions where people sometimes come in contact with kids that are less that fully covered from ankle to neck?

 

[Sukerkin]

Mentalism of the highest order. No doubt born from good intentions (tho more likely self-serving ones if the impetous for the law came form a politician) but stupidity nontheless.

 

[Ken Morgan]

What the old army saying? "Kill them all and let god sort them out"

You're all guilty until proven otherwise.

What did that article say? No porn for soldiers?? Come on a swimsuit model photo in a barracks is like water in a lake. WTF?

 

[MA-Caver]

What the old army saying? "Kill them all and let god sort them out"

You're all guilty until proven otherwise.

What did that article say? No porn for soldiers?? Come on a swimsuit model photo in a barracks is like water in a lake. WTF?

That's because she's wearing a swimsuit and covering her naughty bits... not like a playboy/penthouse/hustler centerfold where her naughties are exposed, thus covered it's photography, uncovered it's PORN!

Having pictures of children... now it's illegal. Especially if they're swimming to bathing or just gosh awful cute running around the house nekkid after a bath and one just HAD to get a picture because it was adorable... not SEXY just adorable.
Can you prove that?

We're currently discussing this on another thread... looks like a merger might be needed soon enough.

 

[crushing]

That's because she's wearing a swimsuit and covering her naughty bits... not like a playboy/penthouse/hustler centerfold where her naughties are exposed, thus covered it's photography, uncovered it's PORN!

Having pictures of children... now it's illegal. Especially if they're swimming to bathing or just gosh awful cute running around the house nekkid after a bath and one just HAD to get a picture because it was adorable... not SEXY just adorable.
Can you prove that?

We're currently discussing this on another thread... looks like a merger might be needed soon enough.

There are no naughty bits on the human body. The naughty bits are in people's heads.

 

[Tez3]

Of course there's another way to look at this. A soldier accused of having kiddie porn isn't going to admit to his family that he has so he's going to say 'well all I had was some photos of a family member and the army is picking on me, poor me'. The family convinced of his innocence goes to the media who all report it it as a case of the army being over zealous, the army of course won't comment because it would compromise any legal/court martial proceedings.
Don't be so quick to judge because you've only got one side of the story here.

 

[MA-Caver]

There are no naughty bits on the human body. The naughty bits are in people's heads.

Exactly... so it's the people who are saying THAT'S PORN and that's adorable.
So the idiot that saw the pictures of the soldiers' niece said that it was porn and thus has the problem. Eliminate the self-made porn czar of the military and you get rid of a lot of problems.

 

[Cryozombie]

What did that article say? No porn for soldiers?? Come on a swimsuit model photo in a barracks is like water in a lake. WTF?

hey man, we have to be SENSITIVE to the enemy. No Dogs, No Pork, no Women, no Alcohol...

*rolls eyes*

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Of course there's another way to look at this. A soldier accused of having kiddie porn isn't going to admit to his family that he has so he's going to say 'well all I had was some photos of a family member and the army is picking on me, poor me'. The family convinced of his innocence goes to the media who all report it it as a case of the army being over zealous, the army of course won't comment because it would compromise any legal/court martial proceedings.
Don't be so quick to judge because you've only got one side of the story here.

Bears repeating.

 

[Ken Morgan]

Of course there's another way to look at this. A soldier accused of having kiddie porn isn't going to admit to his family that he has so he's going to say 'well all I had was some photos of a family member and the army is picking on me, poor me'. The family convinced of his innocence goes to the media who all report it it as a case of the army being over zealous, the army of course won't comment because it would compromise any legal/court martial proceedings.
Don't be so quick to judge because you've only got one side of the story here.

Agreed.
But, he didn't bring the photo's with him, he didn't download them, his Mom sent them to him!

 

[grydth]

What we don't yet know is whether the family photos are in fact the pictures that he is being prosecuted for.... and if so, what those pictures show.

To get a felony level prosecution in the Army after an arrest, there has to be referral through the chain of command to general officer level, and consultation with and action by the Judge Advocates office.

While I can see an occasional screwball thinking its wise to persecute, er prosecute, a soldier for innocent family pics, here we are supposed to believe there are at least 6 or more nutty officers all in one unit.

I'm thinking Tez is on the right track here.... we need to see and hear more to have a rational opinion.

 

[Tez3]

Agreed.
But, he didn't bring the photo's with him, he didn't download them, his Mom sent them to him!

We don't know if that's the photos he's been charged with having though, we only have his relative's word for it and they will be campaigning to have him off the charges.
I can't see the American chain of command being much different from ours tbh so I doubt that it would go all the way to what I assume will be a court martial just because of some family photos.
I think perhaps he's being done for 'proper' kiddy porn and had to tell his family something not thinking that they would leap to his defence (and props to them for doing it, it's what families are for). It's only his family that are saying the photos are of his niece, we really ought to wait and see what the charges refer to.

 

[TKDHomeSchooler]

Why the hell are we allowing this crap to go on in our military. We are about to try 3 SEALs in Iraq for splitting a man's lip, another Ranger is going to court marshal for killing an insurgent in self defense. We are railroading this Soldier for a picture of a little girl he got know know as a friend, that was taken by her Mom.

We get fired upon from inside a friggin mosque but are not allowed to do anything about it. We are bringing the war criminals who don't fight under a country's banner back to the US for civilian trials with US rights.

We apparently want to get beheaded on our own soil, we have become panty waisted sloths! I fear for America, I love America but am afraid we are loosing who we were.

We need to fight this war the way we did in WWII, to win and not to appease the world. Did the French complain then when we killed thousands of Nazis liberating them? Did Russia say we were jumping in to places we don't belong (nope, they chipped in some blood and guts too).

 

[Tez3]

Why the hell are we allowing this crap to go on in our military. We are about to try 3 SEALs in Iraq for splitting a man's lip, another Ranger is going to court marshal for killing an insurgent in self defense. We are railroading this Soldier for a picture of a little girl he got know know as a friend, that was taken by her Mom.

We get fired upon from inside a friggin mosque but are not allowed to do anything about it. We are bringing the war criminals who don't fight under a country's banner back to the US for civilian trials with US rights.

We apparently want to get beheaded on our own soil, we have become panty waisted sloths! I fear for America, I love America but am afraid we are loosing who we were.

We need to fight this war the way we did in WWII, to win and not to appease the world. Did the French complain then when we killed thousands of Nazis liberating them? Did Russia say we were jumping in to places we don't belong (nope, they chipped in some blood and guts too).

So you know for certain beyond all possible doubt this soldier isn't a paedophile then and he's not lying? That the photos he's saying he's been done for are the ones and not the other kiddie porn he may have? And you know without any possible doubts because you were there and eyewitnessed every single event that you are quoting thats what happened in the other cases?
You would lynch people on the basis of a newpaper report of what someone else is saying? Someone with a vested interest in believeing their relative is telling the truth because to think he's guilty is unimaginable?

Take a deep breath and sit down and think over things. What appears to be the truth very often isn't, I don't know the other cases you mentioned but before I make any judgement about anyone or anything I want to hear from all sides and see how things fit together.

We don't know what photos he's been charged with having, we can't make any worthwhile comments until we do. Unless you are there, unless you have read all the statements and unless you understand how things are in a war situation, you really can't rant, rave and retain anyones respect for your views.

As for bringing people to trial, it's the civilised thing to do, the correct thing to show our enemies that we are actually better than they are, that we have morals and we allow all people to have fair representation in courts. It shows we are not murdering terrorist bastards who kill indiscriminately, we believe in the rule of law and will behave like decent human beings even when all around don't. To kill them out of hand makes us as bad as them.

It may make you feel better to rant and froth at the mouth but it really doesn't read well.

 

[TKDHomeSchooler]

Tez3, I'll agree that all sides need to be heard and a proper trial. I still feel the Navy SEALs should not be standing trial, nor should the US Ranger.

I have thought, and will continue to think, that we need to fight this war the way we did during WWII and Korea. The politicians need to sit down, shut up, and let the military do what they do best; win.

I admit my previous post was a bit of a rant, I just hate what the current US Administration is doing to my country, and it's heroes in uniform (Military, Border Patrol, etc.). The country I served, my family served, and I have friends who have died in her service.

 

[Tez3]

No man should be above the law and the military aren't above the law. You can't say that people should get away with things they would be punished for in civvy street just because they are military and the person they injured is not an American. Besides I doubt a soldier would be discplined for killing someone in self defence so again it suggests there is more to the story than just senior officers or politicians getting involved. Soldiers fight outside times they are supposed to as I know very well, if someone is injured because they have been fighting yes the guilty should be disciplined. The military are perhaps held to account far more than civilians, that's maybe fair or not, probably it's another discussion but they are as human as anyone so you really need to see more than yet another governmental plot to take over the world everytime.

Fighting the war the way it was in the last and the Korean war is not the way to go. This war isn't just about armies facing off against each other, it's far more involved in that and our troops are doing far more than just fighting. There is a perception that military leaders are complete idiots and pick on soldiers but while, as in all walks of life, there are idiots the majority know their jobs and I doubt the situations you have quoted are what they seem to you. I have interviewed many soldiers and attended in various forms ( but not as the accused!) many court martials.


These days wars seem to be treated as sports games, everyone thinks they know how to run one and how they would deal with it, the truth is unless you've been there or are in the military/work with them, the chances are you have little idea of modern warfare other than that gleaned off television or films.

 

[TKDHomeSchooler]

I don't totally disagree with you. I just think that our rules of engagement set forth by politicians who don't know what it is like to face an opponent in battle are unrealistic.

Oh, BTW, I was an Army Combat Engineer and I still associate with many active duty and former Soldiers, Airmen, and Marines with the occasional Sailor.