I really enjoyed this one.

[JowGaWolf]

These techniques, plus the karate we all are familiar with, give a hint

When I ask people outside of Jow Ga about Jow Ga Techniques, I'm looking for hints. They may or may not have the same techniques, but I first try to get hints to help me understand what I know versus looking for a straight-out answer. I do this because I don't know if the Jow Ga technique is a variation of the same technique. For example, a side kick is a side kick but there are variations of how to do the side kick. I want to know if it's a variation if that's the reality. Sometimes people throw away the variation and say, "Oh I was doing it wrong; I should be doing it like this." But the reality is that it could be a variation

I don't know any of the systems that my Muay Thai sparring partner knows but sometimes he sees me do an application and he say "Oh that's how that works." It's not a specific answer to how to do something in one of the systems he trains, it's just an insight or approach that he didn't think of before his system without having to change anything about the technique in his system. He would still have to use the mechanics in the system he trains in order to know if it makes sense.

 

[JowGaWolf]

And you can achieve a better result than this?

The answer is yes unless you are talking about it from that position. There are lots of ways to break the arm but from that specific position, that's an effective way to do it. His opponent should have had that arm locked and he could have avoided that. He should have been working to lock Shinya Aoki's arm, but he extends his arms as if he was more worried about knees.

This is one of the reasons I don't like seeing MA as a sport, because it's somehow not naturally a sport.

The fact that most TMA systems have weapons should make it clear to anyone what the original focus was and it's not this. .

But blades, hammers, and trees don't make good sporting equipment. The intent is clear

The same thing which makes the technique dangerous (relying on ballistic application rather than steady control of the position which would allow for tapping before injury) also makes it hard for fighters to develop the necessary skill to reliably execute it against a skilled, resisting opponent. After all, fighters would rapidly run out of training partners if they applied the break that way while sparring in the gym.

I think fighters in general aren't out to cause permanent damage. I'm sure there are some that fall into that category, but for the most part, fighters typically respect each other as rivals and not enemies.

I don't think there would be an MMA if they all saw each other as enemies. From a traditional point of view for Martial Arts as a sport, sport was created so the village wouldn't lose their warrior's while training. If Martial Talk is a village of warriors then, it would be counter productive for Tony to break everyone's ankle as if they were enemies. Any serious injury would mean that the village would be down a warrior.

 

[wab25]

No it is not banned in MMA. It was a perfectly legal technique in that match.

Perhaps if injuries like that happened more often, then rules would be put in place to try preventing them. But it's a relatively rare occurrence. The same thing which makes the technique dangerous (relying on ballistic application rather than steady control of the position which would allow for tapping before injury) also makes it hard for fighters to develop the necessary skill to reliably execute it against a skilled, resisting opponent. After all, fighters would rapidly run out of training partners if they applied the break that way while sparring in the gym.

We have all seen these type of techniques:

When asked why the other guy goes flying through the air, we are told that it is to protect his wrist from getting broken. We do a bunch of these in Danzan Ryu... and we even use that same explanation. However, personally, I take a different view. If, I can snatch the wrist and get the technique right, such that it would cause the other guy to need to flip over to protect his wrist... then I can break his wrist before he can get his body over. Every time you do one of these techniques, you get to a point where you have to wait for uke to catch up. When you see that point, and realize how long you are waiting for uke to catch up, you realize, that if you had wanted to break it, you could have broken it long before he got over.

My personal belief is that these types of drills are to take another step in the direction of applying in a dynamic situation, while maintaining control and safety. As uke gets better at taking the sutemi (flipping over the top) tori can move quicker and further. Because uke will be doing the sutemi, tori can take the lock at speed past the point where the break would occur, if uke were not able (or allowed) to sutemi. Theoretically, we should be able to use this type of training and these types of drills to help gain the necessary skill to pull the move off against a resisting opponent.

Unfortunately, over the years, we have come to look at the pretty sutemi over the top, as the goal of the technique. We have come to think that when we work together with uke, and cause him to take a nice sutemi for us, that we have succeeded. Rather, we should be looking to apply this in a dynamic and resisting situation. These drills then become preparation and conditioning for sparring sessions. These sessions start slow and light, with people doing sutemi when caught.... speed and resistance can slowly be built up, as the skill of both increase. But, we should always remember, the goal is the broken arm or dislocated joint of a fully resisting opponent like in the Aoki video above.... not the pretty sutemi done by uke.... that is a step on the way.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

And you can achieve a better result than this?

There is a difference between to force your opponent to release his hold and to break his arm. As people have said you don't want to break your opponent's arm in sport. You just want him to give up his attack.

The reason I think this method is better because you force your opponent to extend his arm. This can prevent him from changing waist wrap into under hook to counter you (under hook require arm bending).

If you can force your opponent

- not to bend his elbow, you have taken his counter away.
- to move into one direction, you can take advantage on it.