How to recover from this position

[Jens]

I'll say it, the way Bong Sao is done in what I've seen in the Yip Man line isn't very good. It can't absorb pressure well and isn't that great as a tool in general. I know quite a few people that ended up with shoulder problems due to it.

The people you know that ended up with shoulder problems obviously are not performing the technique correctly. If they did it correctly, there would be zero undue stress of the shoulder joints or rotator cuff tendons.

The only people in that line I've found who have made it work tend to shorten the tool to more of a Laan and use it as a bit of a battering ram.

I wouldn't say bong sau has to shorten to more of a Laan, nor used as a bit of a battering ram to make it work. However it should be performed with more of a compact structure, in what I would describe as a spiraling motion rather than a "a battering ram". The late grandmaster Wong Sheung Leung does a fantastic job demoing exactly how I believe it should be done in this clip. Most Wing chunners I've seen perform their bong sau way too extended lacking structure which places alot of undue stress on the supraspinatus tendon of their shoulder joint causing wear and tear and eventually leading to injury to that tendon.

 

[Argus]

I'll say it, the way Bong Sao is done in what I've seen in the Yip Man line isn't very good. It can't absorb pressure well and isn't that great as a tool in general. I know quite a few people that ended up with shoulder problems due to it. The only people in that line I've found who have made it work tend to shorten the tool to more of a Laan and use it as a bit of a battering ram.

I'm curious, how do you do bong sao?

Sounds like you're missing the cue to flip to a Tahn Sao. In YM's version of WC, Bong Sao should only exist for a pulse before flipping back to Tahn or opening to Biu. If you keep the shape after the pulse, you're going to allow the opponent to cling to you. This is a bad habit that opens you for wrestling. Alternatively if you're from one of the more body turning types of YM's WC you can try to absorb by turning into the tahn, this usually means you have to cover with the center with a chop. This is one way of using the pressing energy against him.

HFY uses the eagle Bong Sao in 2-handed chi sao, so I can't really comment from that perspective since we're playing a different game.

I think that you hit the nail on the head, and this is what I was starting to think about as well.
If I had noticed earlier that my bong was not in a good position and went to tan, I could actually shift left (not right) into tan-da and use the opponent's pressure to my advantage. And if I am late and do turn, I needed to do something about my fuk sao position, either disengaging entirely, or switching to the inside some how.

 

[Eric_H]

The people you know that ended up with shoulder problems obviously are not performing the technique correctly. If they did it correctly, there would be zero undue stress of the shoulder joints or rotator cuff tendons.

Or it just doesn't work very well. I've got enough of a sample size to make the conclusion across several YM branches. YMMV. I'm just glad I'm not doing it anymore.

 

[geezer]

Or it just doesn't work very well. I've got enough of a sample size to make the conclusion across several YM branches. YMMV. I'm just glad I'm not doing it anymore.

Well, I found the once you develop rotator cuff problems you won't do any style of bong anymore. Ironically, my rotator cuff issues stemmed from an unrelated injury during a period when I wasn't doing Wing Chun, and then years later I re-injured it doing some ill-considered conditioning movements with a staff, again not related to WC. The end result is limited range of movement and shoulder pain that makes my left bong pretty useless. I may end up getting surgery.

Meanwhile, I'm using bong a lot less overall and using it in a very soft, yielding way when I do. It's actually a better approach IMO - with or without the injury.

 

[Callen]

Or it just doesn't work very well. I've got enough of a sample size to make the conclusion across several YM branches.

That's a pretty broad opinion. Can you elaborate?