How NOT to use your training
- Thread starter Flea
- Start date
As part of your training program do you have to go through any type of Crisis Prevention/De-Escalation training like CPI or SCIP?
I believe that our member "BlueKey88" actually works for the Institute that originated CPI. It's better to hear it from the source, than from me.
Where I work, New York State requires that all of our Direct Care and Clinical employees be re-certified annually in a program like CPI or SCIP; and they check and double-check and then triple-check that training requirements/certifications are met.
Hitting a consumer of our services is an extremely serious offense and unless proper protocol is used, even in the administration of CPI, will lead to immediate termination and referral to law enforcement.
If your Employer (or the State Licensing Board) doesn't require a program like this, maybe you could mention it to them; to see the feasibility of bringing something like this into the training curriculum?
Just a suggestion
I believe that our member "BlueKey88" actually works for the Institute that originated CPI. It's better to hear it from the source, than from me.
Where I work, New York State requires that all of our Direct Care and Clinical employees be re-certified annually in a program like CPI or SCIP; and they check and double-check and then triple-check that training requirements/certifications are met.
Hitting a consumer of our services is an extremely serious offense and unless proper protocol is used, even in the administration of CPI, will lead to immediate termination and referral to law enforcement.
If your Employer (or the State Licensing Board) doesn't require a program like this, maybe you could mention it to them; to see the feasibility of bringing something like this into the training curriculum?
Just a suggestion
OP
- Joined
- Nov 22, 2008
- Messages
- 2,005
- Reaction score
- 97
- Thread Starter
- #23
Yes! And I had a learning experience yesterday when a client went off on a third party. I didn't handle it to my own satisfaction, and sadly I lost a fair amount of sleep over-analyzing. But it's okay - it's experience, and that's what I came to this job for. I probably won't have another chance to get it right for a while as I expect this client to be banned from the 'stablishment. Of course for the time being he'll be asking me to help him get un-banned ... again.
Dirty Dog, does your ER administration know you're applying joint locks and such? What's their policy on that?
OP
- Joined
- Nov 22, 2008
- Messages
- 2,005
- Reaction score
- 97
- Thread Starter
- #24
Catalyst, that's exactly what I'm talking about. In hindsight I should have worded the thread title as "How to NOT use your training" because that's my goal. I think it's totally reprehensible, but body memory is what it is. I'm looking for ways to circumvent that in order to remain compassionate and completely professional.
StudentCarl
3rd Black Belt
I think one of the first things you need to think through is your responsibilities in the situation. If you are only responsible for your own safety, it's different from when you represent an employer. It also matters whether you have responsibility for the safety of others, including protecting people from hurting themselves.
Your first and best defense is de-escalation and distance. Verbal Judo is a good book on verbal skills. Physically, your first priorities should be to preserve distance and monitor for the presence of possible weapons. As mentioned above, if caught by surprise you are actually in a decent legal position as long as you don't use more force than is justified. I work in a high school. The basic rule is that you don't strike people if you represent an employer or have responsibility for the safety of others. People tend to consider that a counterattack rather than defense, though I disagree.
I find awareness and verbal skills most important, with secondary emphasis on releases, deflections and footwork. I suggest you incorporate such situations into your training, including threat evaluation and verbal skills. If your martial arts trainer doesn't do this you should hunt up some supplemental training or at least video such as The Missing Link (available through Paladin).
Your first and best defense is de-escalation and distance. Verbal Judo is a good book on verbal skills. Physically, your first priorities should be to preserve distance and monitor for the presence of possible weapons. As mentioned above, if caught by surprise you are actually in a decent legal position as long as you don't use more force than is justified. I work in a high school. The basic rule is that you don't strike people if you represent an employer or have responsibility for the safety of others. People tend to consider that a counterattack rather than defense, though I disagree.
I find awareness and verbal skills most important, with secondary emphasis on releases, deflections and footwork. I suggest you incorporate such situations into your training, including threat evaluation and verbal skills. If your martial arts trainer doesn't do this you should hunt up some supplemental training or at least video such as The Missing Link (available through Paladin).
That was bad. LOL
chinto
Senior Master
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2007
- Messages
- 2,026
- Reaction score
- 39
ya it does happen. I hope she learned a real lesson there. I know it was a bit traumatic for you, provably worse for you then her. I also hope that after that she refrained from such horse play, because in this day and age, one or both of you could get arrested if some one saw it and called the cops thinking it was an actual assault and not joking around. All the schools in my state have a "zero tolerance policy for any violance." I understand in some of the schools that kind of joking will get you arrested!! insane but apparently their policy.
personally I hate that stupid PSA I hear on the radio.. the one about "teaching your son to hit a base ball but that you need to teach him not to hit girls" ..... and " all violance against women is wrong".. NO, all violence that is not in self defense is USUALLY WRONG!
there are women and girls out there who will attack you, and even kill you! I say if they lay hands on you, treat them like any other attacker... but ya, I bet that was a bad moment when your training took over. but it does happen.
( no I don't go around hitting girls, or any one else for that matter with out huge cause!! But, for 40 years I have been told to treat them like men...sheesh..)
I say self defense is always right... and that joking around making movements to hit some one can be a very bad idea.
personally I hate that stupid PSA I hear on the radio.. the one about "teaching your son to hit a base ball but that you need to teach him not to hit girls" ..... and " all violance against women is wrong".. NO, all violence that is not in self defense is USUALLY WRONG!
there are women and girls out there who will attack you, and even kill you! I say if they lay hands on you, treat them like any other attacker... but ya, I bet that was a bad moment when your training took over. but it does happen.
( no I don't go around hitting girls, or any one else for that matter with out huge cause!! But, for 40 years I have been told to treat them like men...sheesh..)
I say self defense is always right... and that joking around making movements to hit some one can be a very bad idea.
Bruno@MT
Senior Master
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2009
- Messages
- 3,399
- Reaction score
- 74
A recent new member in our dojo works in the emergency admittance ward of the local psychiatric hospital. Getting attacked out of the blue (no warning signs at all) is a daily occurrence for her.
I noticed something different about her when she didn't shy away when I grabbed her throat in a general self defense partner drill. Most women who are new to MA are very awkward about close physical contact like grabbing a throat with both hands. She wasn't. To her it was all in a days work, and she finally decided on taking MA classes so sh would learn to cope with physical violence.
I asked her about what you said, and she said it really didn't apply to her job. If you get attacked by a mental patient, you use whatever force necessarry to subdue them if you are in immediate danger. Those people are generally very strong if they 'flip out' (my apologies for the term). In case of such violence, breaking a thumb or kneeing someone in the groin is perfectly acceptable. Rule number 1: your own saftey comes first.
Bruno@MT
Senior Master
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2009
- Messages
- 3,399
- Reaction score
- 74
So (example from a dojo member who works in the emergency admittance ward of a psychiatric ward) a teen has a psychotic episode, grabs you by the throat and starts squeezing.
At that moment, you take out your checklist, triple check that you are acting according to policy, ask a colleague to doublecheck, and upon confirmation you administer the approved counter technique for that situation, provided you are still concious at the time?
WC_lun
Senior Master
Martial arts training should include more than what hapens after the point of contact. Generally speaking, if contact has happened then there have been some failures already. Of course, every situation is different, but an altercation starts before physical contact is made.
The "fence" reference is to getting your hands up and between you and your target. It helps you keep your space, which in turn gives you more time to do whatever you need to do.
The "fence" reference is to getting your hands up and between you and your target. It helps you keep your space, which in turn gives you more time to do whatever you need to do.
I think You can't accidentally injure children, women, or the men. This needs a enthusiasm to get strike without requiring to retaliate, a little attaching hands (chi sau), and some grappling. In short, the more command you have the better.
I know this thread is a wee bit old (and I did not read all the responses)
But I think it's unlikely that you are in dabger of hurting anybody on the job.
I am guessing here (projecting from me, of course) you would be in a company mindset, not in your private 'walking down the road' one.
plus working with a person, you read them and know what to expect. Which is different than not paying attention to the other person in a casual meeting.
But I think it's unlikely that you are in dabger of hurting anybody on the job.
I am guessing here (projecting from me, of course) you would be in a company mindset, not in your private 'walking down the road' one.
plus working with a person, you read them and know what to expect. Which is different than not paying attention to the other person in a casual meeting.
Lee Mainprize
Orange Belt
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2011
- Messages
- 69
- Reaction score
- 0
enjoy visiting GT stuff again - did something with Jamie Clubb recently who's a GT and Mo Teague Instructor.
I hope you aren't assuming that the mentally ill woman isn't going to do too much harm if she hits him. Domestic violence and mental illness runs in my Dad's family. I'd hate to see the original poster get hurt allowing this woman to hit him. She could knock him out cold. I don't have advice other than: "Don't let mentally ill people hit you." I've seen exactly what kind of damage can happen.
Yes.
Im inclined to Agree.
The Chemical and Physical Reactions a Psychiatric Outburst can cause are not very nice.
And the Issue isnt even that She could Knock him out. Its that under the Circumstances, Shed probably beat his Unconscious Body.
I used to know a Manic Individual. Completely Swell, until he was Upset with something.
It is actually rather Remarkable.
Similar threads
