How do you know if Tai Chi isn't for you?

[Xue Sheng]

I was not referring to power, because power can be generated in many ways. I meant the way power is generated. I am convinced that power in Tai Chi and power in kung fu comes from different "roots".

Depends on the Kung Fu.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I can say without any doubt that Bu Di Zhen Tai Chi is very effective for self-defense. The one drawback would be that it would take months for most without prior martial arts training to be completly competent, which is why a secondary hard martial art is essential to this end.

Is Bu Di Zhen Tai Chi Gao style?

I have been in Tai Chi for many years, mostly Yang with some Chen, and although I will agree it does take longer to be able to use Tai Chi as a martial art than say a Shaolin style it is not necessary to take a secondary hard style in order to be effective in Tai Chi.

As a matter of fact a secondary hard style would be counter productive to learning Tai Chi as a martial art, they are fundamentally different.

 

[Goldendawn8]

Is Bu Di Zhen Tai Chi Gao style?

I have been in Tai Chi for many years, mostly Yang with some Chen, and although I will agree it does take longer to be able to use Tai Chi as a martial art than say a Shaolin style it is not necessary to take a secondary hard style in order to be effective in Tai Chi.

As a matter of fact a secondary hard style would be counter productive to learning Tai Chi as a martial art, they are fundamentally different.

Yes, it is Gao Style. Yang style would never be effective in combat alone unlike Bu Di Zhen which is more similar to Chen style.
The Wudang monks themselves teach Qigong, Tai Chi, and Kung fu in harmony with eachother. This comes from first hand experience while training in China. Plus Tai Chi has it's roots on Wudang mountain.

 

[charyuop]

Here you keep talking about hard MAs, but I don't see Aikido as a hard MA.

At this point I have a question.
Tai Chi is based on Chi and Aikido is based on Ki (same as Chi). Both are soft Arts, or maybe Aikido more closer to a soft-hard, but definetly not hard.
So why is it that to be able to use Tai Chi in combat it takes years, while Aikido no?

 

[Xue Sheng]

Yes, it is Gao Style. Yang style would never be effective in combat alone unlike Bu Di Zhen which is more similar to Chen style.
The Wudang monks themselves teach Qigong, Tai Chi, and Kung fu in harmony with eachother. This comes from first hand experience while training in China. Plus Tai Chi has it's roots on Wudang mountain.

I have been down this road before waaaaaay to many times but I do not agree.

True Yang style by itself if trained correctly is very effective as a martial art. The real problem with Yang style is that there are so few real teachers out there teaching it and a whole lot of people calling what they do Yang style when it is in effect not or not traditional or neutered of its Martial arts roots. Or worse you get someone that has trained a hard style and combines it with Yang and calls it Yang style martial arts. I have seen this too and it is way to tense and not anywhere near as relaxed as it should be.

I have trained Yang for 12 years and I know it is effective, most unfortunately I have also had to use it as a martial art out in the real world. I have also trained other styles but the most recent and the longest is Yang and I will admit it is not my favorite Tai Chi style, Chen is but I have to say real Yang style is very effective all by itself as a martial art.

If you are lucky enough to find a true Yang style sifu, believe me it is very effective, I have had 2 throw me around like a rag doll and one almost rip me in two pieces over the years. My sifu is from China and he was a student of Tung Ying Chieh. Also Cheng Manching style as taught by William CC Chen is very effective, by itself as a martial art.

As to Tai Chi roots on Wudang Mountain, it depends on whom you talk to; there are at least 3 or 4 roots and or lineages thrown around. According to the Chen family it has its roots with them and the Wudang mountain story is a myth. The only connection to Wudang is the Chen family founder also studied Taoism.

Also you must take into account that Yang comes directly from Chen and it was very effective then and all the way up to Yang Chengfu and his students and his students students who now teach some of us, if we're lucky.

As to training in China, I have been there as well and I will say what I saw of Yang style was rather badly done but what I saw was 24 form. Most unfortunately the only traditional I saw was 3 older gentlemen as they finished the very last 3 postures. I also saw Wu style, Sun Style and Chen done very very well.

If I may ask, how long did you train at Wudang?

 

[Xue Sheng]

Here you keep talking about hard MAs, but I don't see Aikido as a hard MA.

At this point I have a question.
Tai Chi is based on Chi and Aikido is based on Ki (same as Chi). Both are soft Arts, or maybe Aikido more closer to a soft-hard, but definetly not hard.
So why is it that to be able to use Tai Chi in combat it takes years, while Aikido no?

I do not consider Aikido a hard style and I have not trained Aikido, but I have spared a few and I felt I was softer and more relaxed then they were. Also the fact that I would adhere and follow so well seemed to be a problem. However it is possible that the Aikido people I spared would not be considered the best by aikido standards that I do not know.

One of them did slam me pretty hard though so I do not doubt the effectiveness of Aikido at all, I am just saying that I feel Tai Chi is more internal by nature and more relax in application.

And now that every Aikido person out there wants to kick my but, I will respectfully shut my yap and go hide under a rock in an undisclosed location.

 

[dmax999]

I had always thought Akido was developed by a Karataka master that went to China for a couple years and learned Tai Chi (This is a theory I had heard before). The creator of Akido did travel in China for three years and then develop Akido, but it is not know what he did there.

Tai Chi has direct strikes, puches and kicks, done with FaJing, which when done correctly is the hardest your body will be able to strike. I did not think Akido had the same type of strikes in its system.

Movements between styles have been brought up as a difference, but Tai Chi has no defined set of movements, it is more like a set of principles with the suggested movements in the forms. It should be possible to perform Akido following Tai Chi principles and then claim that you used either MA to defend yourself.

I always considered Akido another offshoot of Tai Chi, or a combination of Judo and Tai Chi.