Hook Kicks

[chinto]

I am with zero. My Chito-ryu is very Okinawan, though it is typically considered Japanese and we use the hook I described.

like i said before, I know the kick, have used it once in a while sparring and such, but would not use it high at least on the street. For a lot of the situations you might use that kick a cressent kick might just work better and I perfer that kick to the hook kick really. but we are tought the hook kick and like any other technique it can work well, I just do not advicate kicks above the pubic sinthisis, well at least not for self defence. but then I am a student. there are others who know more then I do

 

[Em MacIntosh]

Definitely a matter of preference. I almost always do a crescent kick with the left leg and hook kicks with my right. Gotta love hip injuries. I've gotten better with my left though.

 

[chinto]

Chinto - interesting comment; my karate is goju ryu okinawan and the hook kick as described by Em MacIntosh is a favourite of one of our senseis and a kick which most in the club train to execute and use in both sport and full contact.

oh we know the hook kick, and it is done like em MacIntosh said, but not one I use a lot and not one that our kata teaches really. I personaly do not really like most spinning kicks, and well a hook kick is a tool that has its place, but I prefer a front snap kick and other low line kicks myself.

 

[chinto]

Definitely a matter of preference. I almost always do a crescent kick with the left leg and hook kicks with my right. Gotta love hip injuries. I've gotten better with my left though.

ya , I know there are some kicks that I do better with one foot then the other... not so much injury as just plain for some reason easer for me on one side then the other ...

hip injurys are very nasty with out a doubt.. I bet that is a major consideration for some things for you.

 

[Em MacIntosh]

Well, I injured a growth plate doing shoulder rolls while I was about 9 years old. I just stretch it out good, try to train to be ambidextrous and know what I'm better at if it comes down to it. I know the snap-hook to the head is one of my favs for point sparring.

 

[chinto]

Well, I injured a growth plate doing shoulder rolls while I was about 9 years old. I just stretch it out good, try to train to be ambidextrous and know what I'm better at if it comes down to it. I know the snap-hook to the head is one of my favs for point sparring.

sounds like you got a pretty good way of dealing with the injury.
I understand how that would be a good one for point sparring.

I dont really train for sparring but for self defence myself, and so I like to keep the mainly to low line kicks... but a hook kick to the groin or knee or even ankle are things that can be very nice options.

 

[Em MacIntosh]

I haven't been to a tourney forever... Keep in mind the heavy bag has more resistance than someone's head. There's a lot of what ifs and I'm no fan of kicking to the head but it carries plenty of power and can take someone out in one quick shot, especially with the heel.

 

[chinto]

I haven't been to a tourney forever... Keep in mind the heavy bag has more resistance than someone's head. There's a lot of what ifs and I'm no fan of kicking to the head but it carries plenty of power and can take someone out in one quick shot, especially with the heel.

OHH HELL YA.. if it lands .. especialy say wearing steel toed work boots,, YIKES.. that would be a KO minumum. ( actualy a solid one landed with heavy foot gear could easily couse a fataility!) its only in the movies where hard objects strike skulls hard and they just jump up and walk away in a few minutes.

 

[Martin h]

you just cant get enough power into hook kicks.
Spinning hook kicks have power to spare no mater what hight they are done at (remember Andy Hugs "tornado kick" KO vs Mike Bernardo´s leg in the 1996 k-1 final?), but then you got all the problems of spinning techniques instead.

Ordinary hook kicks are much to light to do any real damage. If you use it you have to hit with the heel to the head. using the sole of the foot (like is common in point tournaments) is useless, and hitting the body is more or less useless using either heel or sole.
And if you hit, and dont KO the opponent with a perfect hit to the temple, you are probably left standing more or less with your back facing the opponent. the instant drawback is not as easy if you tries to put followthrough into the hit.

It has its uses, but it is a very low % effect technique.
Bill Wallace was good at it

 

[Brandon Fisher]

I can kick pretty hard with it but I was lucky enough to have mine corrected by Bill Wallace who spent some time really critiqueing mine and kicking me with his Ouch

 

[chinto]

you just cant get enough power into hook kicks.
Spinning hook kicks have power to spare no mater what hight they are done at (remember Andy Hugs "tornado kick" KO vs Mike Bernardo´s leg in the 1996 k-1 final?), but then you got all the problems of spinning techniques instead.

Ordinary hook kicks are much to light to do any real damage. If you use it you have to hit with the heel to the head. using the sole of the foot (like is common in point tournaments) is useless, and hitting the body is more or less useless using either heel or sole.
And if you hit, and dont KO the opponent with a perfect hit to the temple, you are probably left standing more or less with your back facing the opponent. the instant drawback is not as easy if you tries to put followthrough into the hit.

It has its uses, but it is a very low % effect technique.
Bill Wallace was good at it

like i said before... target, and how you hit with it. that heal of a boot agenst say the temple with his head down and say a good controle on his arm so he can not 'ride it' at all... very posibly leathal ... not my favorite kick for use in most situations... but there are people who can make it work very well ... especialy lower down.

 

[searcher]

What do you consider not enough power Martin h? I have enough snap to generate plenty of power. I can break a concrete paver with my straight hook. Is that not enough?

I have had the great fortune of having some Bushidokan Karate BBs help me with mine. I think they are the best(even over Wallace), IMO.

 

[Martin h]

What do you consider not enough power Martin h? I have enough snap to generate plenty of power. I can break a concrete paver with my straight hook. Is that not enough?

I have had the great fortune of having some Bushidokan Karate BBs help me with mine. I think they are the best(even over Wallace), IMO.

No offense, but breaking bricks is not a adequate test. The brick does not move and you have plenty of time and space to set the kick up. and ofcourse you do not need to worry about telegraphing your intent.
The real question, is if you can generate enough power in sparring to knock a uncompliant opponent out.

But ofcourse it is not impossible to knock someone out with it. Bill Wallace frequently did. There are always people that can get a technique to work, but that is despite the nature of the technique.
It is it is week compared to most other techniques. it is usually easy to see it coming. If it does not generate a KO, it puts you in a very dangerous position. In short it, is a very ineffective technique.

I love it in WKF rules sparring. I would never do it in knockdown.

 

[searcher]

I have been fighting knockdown and other various types of "full contact" for several years and I have used the hook kick quite well. If I had to take make an estimate of the number of fights I ended with a hook kick, I would say it is around 30%. Not the highest number, but I still feel it is respectable. IMO.

 

[Zero]

It is it is week compared to most other techniques. it is usually easy to see it coming. If it does not generate a KO, it puts you in a very dangerous position. In short it, is a very ineffective technique.

Martin, I gotta disagree with you man. I have used the hook kick in full contact fights for years with success. It is not a week technique at all - if you use the heel as the contact point against the jaw - it is actually devastating and works just like a hook punch and is definitely a knock-out technique. If you are able to use it from a position that initially looks like a front foot mawashi it is also deceiving as it lands on the opposite side to that which the opponent often anticipates.

I have said somewhere else that I have also used this in a street fight,actually on a patio at a party in a fight and knocked the guy down after first throwing a couple of punches - but how you fight in the street (if this has to happen) is your call. Of course when fighting mma you can be picked up for a slam if this kick is read or if it doesn't land - but this is with most high kicks and the trade-off is something you take.

To wrap up, I feel the hook kick is an effective technique and if done correctly (or should I say, in the manner I was trained) is not easy to see coming at you.

 

[searcher]

I want to add a little bit here. I will admit that the hook kick is not for everybody. It is not an easy technique to master and some are not capable of using it effectively. But to dismiss it totally is a great underestimation of it capability.

 

[chinto]

I want to add a little bit here. I will admit that the hook kick is not for everybody. It is not an easy technique to master and some are not capable of using it effectively. But to dismiss it totally is a great underestimation of it capability.

I personaly would not dismiss it at all, just prefer other techniques usualy... but then I prefer the low line kick and do not train for turnement or cage fighting etc, but for self defence and just the enjoyment of training.

 

[searcher]

I personaly would not dismiss it at all, just prefer other techniques usualy... but then I prefer the low line kick and do not train for turnement or cage fighting etc, but for self defence and just the enjoyment of training.

That clears up a lot for me. I don't train for "cage fighting" or point style tourneys, but I do still work my knockdown and other types of heavy contact fighting. I can easily understand your limited use of the hook in a street type confrontation. I have always looked at the ips as being my high kicks on the street. As I stated in another thread, I believe the rush of adrenaline mixed with other aspects of the fight make it very dangerous to kick the head. You can't really go pulling techniques in a less than life-or-death situation and the risk of overdoing it is just to high. Nothing worse at ruining your day like killing someone.