hey!

[Gfreak]

Hey y'all. New here, posted a few times. but missed this section of the forums, so figured i"d pop in and introduce myself.

Name's Garrison. I'm 24 years old and I"m an instructor a bit south of Houston, Texas.

I've been training in BJJ for a little over 7 years now, which is my main art. But rhoughout those 7 years I've also trained in Muay Thai, Boxing (primarily these 2) Judo, wrestling, and JKD.

I've also been doing Kuk Sool for a little over 3 years now, and am a Dan-bo belt, hoping to get my 1st degree in about a year or so.

Love everything martial arts, and am hoping to make it a life long career as well.

That's pretty much it, like the forum so far. So if y'all have any questions feel free to ask em!

 

[kuniggety]

Great, another BJJ guy. There goes the forum...

Kidding. There's several of us ranging from white belts to black belts here. You said you're an instructor. Are you a BJJ instructor?

Welcome aboard

 

[Gfreak]

Haha, I do know BJJ guys tend to have...offputting views of older traditional arts many times. But I"ve trained in both enough to know much if it isn't true.

And yes, I'm an instructor of both BJJ and kuk sool. (primarily kids, for kuk sool). I'm a purple belt in BJJ Under James markle who is under Jorge Patino. However I started under a Royce Gracie black belt (was with him for the first 4 years or so)

 

[Buka]

Welcome aboard, bro.

 

[Tames D]

Welcome.

 

[kuniggety]

Haha, I do know BJJ guys tend to have...offputting views of older traditional arts many times. But I"ve trained in both enough to know much if it isn't true.

We do have a reputation actually, most of us here are like you and have studied other arts and aren't too bad.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Welcome to the site!
Out of curiosity, what is your rank in BJJ? Doesn't matter too much, but it seems odd for that to be your main art since you think after black belt is where the work begins...from what I've come to understand, a black belt in BJJ implies a certain level of mastery. I've got a whole month of experience with BJJ though, so I could very easily be wrong.

 

[kuniggety]

He mentioned in his Second post that he's a purple. A black belt has a degree of mastery in that they should have a completely sound game in offense, defense, no matter the position, etc. But what happens when you pit one black belt against another? One is going to lose and that is because there are still nuances to uncover. That's where the real mastery comes in. BJJ, unlike some of the other arts, is also still very much in an evolutionary stage. People are still taking it further and further.

 

[Jenna]

Welcome aboard, is good to have you posting here!

Haha, I do know BJJ guys tend to have...offputting views of older traditional arts many times

Being some one who has trained both, what do you reckon is going on with that?

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Welcome to MT!

 

[Gfreak]

Welcome to the site!
Out of curiosity, what is your rank in BJJ? Doesn't matter too much, but it seems odd for that to be your main art since you think after black belt is where the work begins...from what I've come to understand, a black belt in BJJ implies a certain level of mastery. I've got a whole month of experience with BJJ though, so I could very easily be wrong.

Thanks!

BJJ is one of the "exceptions" to that in my opinion. As yes, a black belt is much closer to "mastery" than many other martial arts 1st degrees. And so I wouldn't tell most people that the bulk of their learning begins AFTER black belt. However, You still have your black belt longer than any other belt. It's at that point, that it's more up to yourself as to where to take your game, and how to evolve it. You have less guidance and now is the time where you can really make the art YOURS.

Also for ME, since i'm an instructor, after black belt very well might be the most work in a different way. As learning how to teach effectively is an entire art on it's own.

 

[Gfreak]

Welcome aboard, is good to have you posting here!


Being some one who has trained both, what do you reckon is going on with that?

Thanks!

Honestly I believe it's 3 fold.

1.) The Gracie's "brainwash" style marketing when they came to the states. Basically viliffied other martial arts (atleast that's what it seems like to me) in order to make BJJ look like the best. Which led to every one taking a purely practical stance on martial arts, which is why things like krav maga, Jeet Kun Do, BJJ and MMA started growing in popularity (along with the UFC helping that along).

2.) The Belt system in BJJ, is much more closely aligned with a western view point on belts... I.e. Black belt = mastery. Which is why you'll hear people say "oh he got his black belt in 3 or 4 years? pssh must not be a real black belt". When their definition of a "real" black belt, is mastery. So they see anyone who hands it out in a shorter time period to be "mcdojo's" or not "real"

3.) This part is my own experience as well, as I was guilty of thinking this way in the past. The majority of demos (and this is mainly looking at Aikido, Japanese Jujitsu, and things of that nature) It's pretty obvious that the uke is being hyper compliant. which makes it look almost fake, as they're simulating over the top pain or falling when the tori has barely done anything to them.

I still to some degree, believe that it is easier to get to a base level of proficiency in BJJ than many other martial arts in terms of APPLICATION. And this is just because of the nature how it's taught. Every single class, you're going to do free sparring in which you are trying to apply the techniques you learned that day.

Many martial art schools (maybe this is just in america though, no experience with overseas). Only practice their techniques with a cooperative partner, or very rarely practice applying it under pressure. And this then leads to many people who know a "technique" but then can't apply it properly. And so it comes down to the individual skill of the student to practice that, but many students without the instructors guidance, won't think about that and they get a sense of false confidence in their techniques.

I'm lucky enough to have had a couple of instructors in Kuk Sool, who very much believed that you needed to be able to apply the techniques, don't just memorize them. (one of them was also well trained in Wing Chun, and Muay Thai). And so from Day 1 as a white belt, I was learning how to MAKE someone fall with the techniques, instead of them just going down.

 

[Jenna]

Thanks!

Honestly I believe it's 3 fold.

1.) The Gracie's "brainwash" style marketing when they came to the states. Basically viliffied other martial arts (atleast that's what it seems like to me) in order to make BJJ look like the best. Which led to every one taking a purely practical stance on martial arts, which is why things like krav maga, Jeet Kun Do, BJJ and MMA started growing in popularity (along with the UFC helping that along).

2.) The Belt system in BJJ, is much more closely aligned with a western view point on belts... I.e. Black belt = mastery. Which is why you'll hear people say "oh he got his black belt in 3 or 4 years? pssh must not be a real black belt". When their definition of a "real" black belt, is mastery. So they see anyone who hands it out in a shorter time period to be "mcdojo's" or not "real"

3.) This part is my own experience as well, as I was guilty of thinking this way in the past. The majority of demos (and this is mainly looking at Aikido, Japanese Jujitsu, and things of that nature) It's pretty obvious that the uke is being hyper compliant. which makes it look almost fake, as they're simulating over the top pain or falling when the tori has barely done anything to them.

I still to some degree, believe that it is easier to get to a base level of proficiency in BJJ than many other martial arts in terms of APPLICATION. And this is just because of the nature how it's taught. Every single class, you're going to do free sparring in which you are trying to apply the techniques you learned that day.

Many martial art schools (maybe this is just in america though, no experience with overseas). Only practice their techniques with a cooperative partner, or very rarely practice applying it under pressure. And this then leads to many people who know a "technique" but then can't apply it properly. And so it comes down to the individual skill of the student to practice that, but many students without the instructors guidance, won't think about that and they get a sense of false confidence in their techniques.

I'm lucky enough to have had a couple of instructors in Kuk Sool, who very much believed that you needed to be able to apply the techniques, don't just memorize them. (one of them was also well trained in Wing Chun, and Muay Thai). And so from Day 1 as a white belt, I was learning how to MAKE someone fall with the techniques, instead of them just going down.

Thank you for this.. I have learned some thing from reading what you have written. I was not aware of what you outline in #1 Beside your own experience, would you know any like citation or some thing that would corroborate this having happened?

And yes of course, it is almost a meme of the over compliant uke in Aikido.. yet we know he only is making effort to save his self pain by untwisting out of a technique.. still.. it surely does look well dodgy thank you again, good to have you here.

 

[Gfreak]

Thank you for this.. I have learned some thing from reading what you have written. I was not aware of what you outline in #1 Beside your own experience, would you know any like citation or some thing that would corroborate this having happened?

And yes of course, it is almost a meme of the over compliant uke in Aikido.. yet we know he only is making effort to save his self pain by untwisting out of a technique.. still.. it surely does look well dodgy thank you again, good to have you here.

I'll see what I can dig up on it. much of it has just been my personal experience, as the first 4 years were under a Royce Gracie blackbelt. And so I heard a lot of "Gracie JJ is the best martial art for self defense hands down" "none of those other martial arts are effective cause they don't train real grappling" etc...


And yep! Thanks again for the welcome!

Edit: Part of the marketing I forgot about, was how only BJJ allows someone smaller to overcome someone bigger with technique. Helio marketed as this frail thing that couldn't use strength or speed because of his frail physique, which is absolute ******** honestly lol (see below picture.)

And that he "invented" BJJ because the techniques that Carlos taught him (through Mayeda) weren't plausible because he wasn't big and strong. Which i'm sure everyone knows here, that the thought of Judo/Kano Jujitsu needing you to be big and strong is just plain wrong, at best lol.

And so much of it stems from that. There are people who still believe that BJJ/GJJ is the only martial art really designed for someone smaller to beat someone bigger/stronger.


The first couple UFC's as well, they hand-selected Royce's opponents for people that didn't really know grappling. In order to make GJJ look better and market it as the superior martial art over others that were in the first ufc's (kenpo, boxing, kuk sool, karate, etc..)


https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/...YKu0EI-b1c_KIl3KsmJ9ec4Mf7M91aQctJJrLr_BGtnhM


found this link as well, which has a lot of sources already Cited. I didn't go too deep into it, so i can't say that everything cited is authentic sources however. Top 30 Myths and Misconceptions about Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

 

[Jenna]

I'll see what I can dig up on it. much of it has just been my personal experience, as the first 4 years were under a Royce Gracie blackbelt. And so I heard a lot of "Gracie JJ is the best martial art for self defense hands down" "none of those other martial arts are effective cause they don't train real grappling" etc...


And yep! Thanks again for the welcome!

Edit: Part of the marketing I forgot about, was how only BJJ allows someone smaller to overcome someone bigger with technique. Helio marketed as this frail thing that couldn't use strength or speed because of his frail physique, which is absolute ******** honestly lol (see below picture.)

And that he "invented" BJJ because the techniques that Carlos taught him (through Mayeda) weren't plausible because he wasn't big and strong. Which i'm sure everyone knows here, that the thought of Judo/Kano Jujitsu needing you to be big and strong is just plain wrong, at best lol.

And so much of it stems from that. There are people who still believe that BJJ/GJJ is the only martial art really designed for someone smaller to beat someone bigger/stronger.


The first couple UFC's as well, they hand-selected Royce's opponents for people that didn't really know grappling. In order to make GJJ look better and market it as the superior martial art over others that were in the first ufc's (kenpo, boxing, kuk sool, karate, etc..)


https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/...YKu0EI-b1c_KIl3KsmJ9ec4Mf7M91aQctJJrLr_BGtnhM


found this link as well, which has a lot of sources already Cited. I didn't go too deep into it, so i can't say that everything cited is authentic sources however. Top 30 Myths and Misconceptions about Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

That is interesting thank you for this information and for finding this online.. I wonder there are people who might call heresy on this article? eeek.. Still to be armed with variety of information is an assuring thing.. thank you so much again xo

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Welcome to MartialTalk!

 

[wingchun100]

Get ready for some fun discussions!

 

[Xue Sheng]

Welcome to MT

 

[Steve]

Welcome to the site.

 

[Gfreak]

thanks for the welcomes y'all!