Drop the personal shots.
Gitmo detainee murders after his release....
- Thread starter billc
- Start date
Empty Hands
Senior Master
It wasn't meant to be. Such a conclusion is so alien to the facts at hand that I literally don't understand it.
Good grief we didn't sell you the Teletubbies did we? My sincere apologies! Still might be a fair swap for Sponge Bob
.
Big Don
Sr. Grandmaster
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
I liked the Teletubbies
I suppose that if I could smoke pot, I'd like them too. :lfao:
(I would not let that get around, if I were you...:lfao: )
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
Here's the bottom line.
Not all those who went through Gitmo were captured on battlefields. Some were picked up inside the US, while trying to get on an airplane. Some of those folks ended up in 'special' places in the hands of the nice questioners in Syria, and other nations where they were tortured. Some of them weren't US citizens, 1 at least was a Canadian. Most of these were deemed innocent or harmless and released.
The majority of those put through Gitmo were deemed harmless or innocent and released.
The majority.
The few who were seen to either be a further threat, or guilty are still locked up.
Of those released, a small number remained dangerous and in fact did more harm.
However the % is a smaller % than those who are repeat DWI, or in fact most armed crimes.
Those numbers are available on the FBI's website for anyone interested.
Unless you mandate execution for all captured, you'll always have the risk of some repeat.
Unless you have perfect universal surveillance, you'll always have the risk of incarcerating an innocent.
Until we have the ability to tap into the mind and play it like a VCR, there will always be doubt.
It's easy to say things like 'better 100 free guilty than 1 locked up innocent', until such time as you are a victim.
It's easy to say 'better 100 locked up free than 1 guilty', until you're the one locked up.
At the end of the day, someone released this POS, and he became a danger again. That will remain the risk as long as we at least attempt to honor the law, and the ideals that our nation once stood for. Innocent until proven Guilty. Right to a fair and speedy trial. and so on.
At the end of the day though, someone released a lot more people, and they haven't been a problem since. Doesn't that count, or is it only the failures that should be measured?
Not all those who went through Gitmo were captured on battlefields. Some were picked up inside the US, while trying to get on an airplane. Some of those folks ended up in 'special' places in the hands of the nice questioners in Syria, and other nations where they were tortured. Some of them weren't US citizens, 1 at least was a Canadian. Most of these were deemed innocent or harmless and released.
The majority of those put through Gitmo were deemed harmless or innocent and released.
The majority.
The few who were seen to either be a further threat, or guilty are still locked up.
Of those released, a small number remained dangerous and in fact did more harm.
However the % is a smaller % than those who are repeat DWI, or in fact most armed crimes.
Those numbers are available on the FBI's website for anyone interested.
Unless you mandate execution for all captured, you'll always have the risk of some repeat.
Unless you have perfect universal surveillance, you'll always have the risk of incarcerating an innocent.
Until we have the ability to tap into the mind and play it like a VCR, there will always be doubt.
It's easy to say things like 'better 100 free guilty than 1 locked up innocent', until such time as you are a victim.
It's easy to say 'better 100 locked up free than 1 guilty', until you're the one locked up.
At the end of the day, someone released this POS, and he became a danger again. That will remain the risk as long as we at least attempt to honor the law, and the ideals that our nation once stood for. Innocent until proven Guilty. Right to a fair and speedy trial. and so on.
At the end of the day though, someone released a lot more people, and they haven't been a problem since. Doesn't that count, or is it only the failures that should be measured?
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
Well, the motto was more like 'better lock up 100 innocent than letting one possibly guilty go'
Not exactly how the legal system is supposed to work.
Innocent until assumed terrorist....
Doll, you know I love you, right? :smile:
I love Beanie and Cecil, a gift from the subersive mind of Bob Clampett-father of Porky Pig-but, let's face it: it's a cartoon about a little blonde boy whose best friend is a giant phallus. :lfao:
I love musical theater, which-let's face it-is kinda gay. Crazy about Guys and Dolls, cry at the end of West Side Story, really always wanted to play Judas in Jesus Christ Superstar.
Really like opera-not going to get into it....
You like the Teletubbies-I get it-and some would think my revelations about my entertainment tastes to be an even bigger indictment.
To each his own.......(Teletubbies, though?-I had you figured for Heckle and Jeckle, or the Flintstones-love,love,LOVE the Flintstones :lfao: )
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
It is better to put those who it is felt have charges to answer to on trial for a number of reasons. It shows that the Allies believe in justice, law and order. It stops all of us looking like we are saying to people 'do as I say not do as I do' and it shows terrorists we aren't afraid. The last is important, even if they do scare us, if we can no longer go about our daily lives, if we have to change the way we do things, if our security becomes so tight we ourselves are stifled then the terrorists have won. Put them on trial, if they are innocent let them be shown to be, if they are guilty it's even more important that they be shown to be guilty, show the world the evidence, show them what we are fighting. some countries won't believe of course as they assume everyone has their standards but openness is the best thing all round in this situation. It says look we release the innocent and we punish the guilty just the same as we do to our own. Standards..ours must be higher than theirs, if we turn into 'them' we've lost.
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
Especially the 'showing the evidence'
Germany had to let one guy go, they knew they did it, but they did not have the evidence - and the US did not share what hey had....I am sure there were enough people pointing fingers at the mean Germans for not putting the guy away....(the judges shrugged 'we want to but can't based on what we got')
If the evidence isn't there you can't convict, it's fine saying well it's terrorists but it sets a precedent, the next person to be convicted without evidence could be anyone, you or me. We simply can't go down the road of imprisoning people without the legal processes being correct, it's to safeguard us not the terrorists. Play with the law, bend it, work around it and it will be all of us who suffer in the end.
Empty Hands
Senior Master
Sadly, I don't think we really do as a nation. I hope you guys are better at it.
Not in this case as our governments has allowed the terrorist suspects to be taken and haven't protested at all not even when the suspects were British citizens. We shouldn't turn our citizens over to any country without the proper legal steps being taken to ensure a fair trial etc.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/feb/21/ciarendition.usa
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/26/guantamano-files-britain-knew-torture
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/01/released-guantanamo-british-detainees
This guy didn't make it to gitmo because we let the Iraqi's have him...and they let him go...
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/...-Freed-Because-Obama-Would-Not-Bring-to-Gitmo
I wonder how this a*****e is going to celebrate his release. Perhaps he will have meditated on the course of his life in prison and will change his ways to the ways of peace and reconciliation...yeah right.
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/...-Freed-Because-Obama-Would-Not-Bring-to-Gitmo
I wonder how this a*****e is going to celebrate his release. Perhaps he will have meditated on the course of his life in prison and will change his ways to the ways of peace and reconciliation...yeah right.
