Over several decades, I've been associated with a few different martial arts associations. During this time some fierce rivalries emerged, usually ending in an acrimonious split yielding rival organizations. I have friends in other styles that have had similar experiences. And often, when there are splits, association members are told not to associate with old friends who are on the other side of the divide. I'm sure a lot of you can relate. So have any of you ever been told not to even post on forums like this... especially if you are a a senior member or an instructor who, to some degree, is felt to "represent" your organization. Or, to put it another way, have any of you ever been threatend by anything like a "gag order" from your association "superiors" for frankly expressing your views in public?
Ever had a "Gag Order" Placed on you???
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Omar B
Senior Master
Well working in the journalism and publishing field there are certain unsaid rules about what you can and cannot say. Musicians who are supposedly clean out of rehab that you've seen smoking up but claim to be living a righteous existence after some life changing event and going to rehab. Stuff about the sexual conduct of certain people that would hurt their reputation and sales if it ever got out. Music recorded by other musicians but released as the product of a certain band/musician.
Or contributing significantly to a work but legally not being able to even mention it. :barf:
Nothing like you have mentioned though, but there are several things I could say that would get me tied up in court for years.
Or contributing significantly to a work but legally not being able to even mention it. :barf:
Nothing like you have mentioned though, but there are several things I could say that would get me tied up in court for years.
Yes.
I operate under a couple NDA's all the time.
I operate under a couple NDA's all the time.
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Yer kidding, right?
Professionally -- yes. Whether it's ongoing investigations or litigation, LE-sensitive info, or just nobody's business... There's a reason that you'd have to work hard to identify exactly where I work. I'm not saying it can't be done -- but it ain't going to be easy.
Personally -- among others, Bob's got me on a NDA as a staff member here.
Martial arts? Not so much. There've been a few topics over the years where the request was simply not to discuss them "in public", and we purposely didn't put a lot out about our style.
Personally -- among others, Bob's got me on a NDA as a staff member here.
Martial arts? Not so much. There've been a few topics over the years where the request was simply not to discuss them "in public", and we purposely didn't put a lot out about our style.
Bruno@MT
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Not formally, but everyone knows that Genbukan en Bujinkan have a history. Of course noone has explicitly told me not to talk about sensitive things, but in order to not cause undue bother for those above me I feel it is best not to talk about certain topics.
Yes, politics always seems to cause problems.
Some years ago the local head of our organisation closed our school without even the courtesy of informing us. The long and short of it was that although we offered to take over the school and continue it under his umbrella, he tried to impose restrictions that made it totally impractical. So, we set up our own school under the head of the Australia wide organisation.
The guy we left tried to stop all the rest of the organisation from having anything to do with us, spread lies about us and generally tried to make life tough.
However, his attempts failed and we thrived. Poetic justice!
OP
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I wish I was. I get so fed up with the "politics" between various MA factions and the restrictions on who is supposed to associate with whom. For example, one former associate/training partner of mine is now the head rep in this area for another faction of one of the MAs I have been involved in. I've known the guy since '79. Even after I left his organization, at the very least, we'd send each other Christmas cards or drop a line once a year. Now he can't or won't even speak to any of us on the other side of the "divide". Similarly, I've been told by "superiors" on my side not to contact certain individuals... including one of my former instructors in another system just because he is a known associate of somebody who runs a rival organization. And I personally have gotten in trouble just for publicly complementing the skills of people from certain other associations. I've also been encouraged to stay off forums like this, but I'm kinda stubborn, I guess. Eventually, I'll probably get the boot for my big mouth. Apparently free speech comes at a price in the martial arts world.
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Sometimes, a nasty split does occur, and as a result, there could very well be attempts by the departing one at poaching students from the school. If the departed one is of this type, then I would certainly sympathize with the school owner, since I consider student poaching unethical.
I've seen one departed individual trying to actively recruit some of the higher ranked folks, in an attempt to bring credibility to his new organization, even though this individual knew that those students were still under contract with us. When the student told him that he was still under contract, his response was "just initiate a stop payment on your debit, and they won't consider it worth their time to come after you."
Not only does that show a poor sense of honor from the departed individual's part, but also shows that this guy is a poisonous influence on people, encouraging them to perform dishonorable acts.
If people asked me about this guy, I would simply tell them that I would discourage them from associating with him. I can't control what someone does, though, and if they want to do so, then they'll make their own decisions. All I can do is hope that they'll see the merits of what we teach, versus what the other guy teaches, and make the right decision.
I've seen one departed individual trying to actively recruit some of the higher ranked folks, in an attempt to bring credibility to his new organization, even though this individual knew that those students were still under contract with us. When the student told him that he was still under contract, his response was "just initiate a stop payment on your debit, and they won't consider it worth their time to come after you."
Not only does that show a poor sense of honor from the departed individual's part, but also shows that this guy is a poisonous influence on people, encouraging them to perform dishonorable acts.
If people asked me about this guy, I would simply tell them that I would discourage them from associating with him. I can't control what someone does, though, and if they want to do so, then they'll make their own decisions. All I can do is hope that they'll see the merits of what we teach, versus what the other guy teaches, and make the right decision.
I think that's the heart of it right there. Even if no one says anything...when relationships go south, there can be a lot of headaches if certain topics or certain people get brought up.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
You have got to be kidding, this freaking ridiculous, just what the hell are they afraid of?
I have something similar where I cannot talk about new programs from work for obvious reasons, but I am also under direction to always reveal that I am an employee of the company I work for so as not to have any misunderstandings if I post on anything vehicle specific or industry specific.
I am also under direction not to comment on the news about a recent IPO for GM, as any comment I could be taken wrong, even though I am not a policy setter nor do I travel in those circles.
I also signed an agreement that anything I invent my company gets first crack at for Patents.
But most of that is just common sense and doing what is ethical.
I am also under a NDA with Bob and Martial Talk. I am no longer a staff member, but the agreement still stands not to talk about anything I might have learned.
I also disclosed while on staff to my manager at work for conflict of interest. That is to say, if I disclose it and make sure that where my Salary comes from is first it should not be an issue. Different industries.
I have heard about NDA's for a few court cases in Martial Arts as well as some who have asked or even had the staff or seniors agree or sign a NDA. But I have no proof of such as this is all verbal second or third hand information.
But it would not surprise me.
Professionally yes... NDA's are common & no issue based on professional topics & such.
Personally ... it's been tried & I just ignore them. I've been bitched & threatened & laughed continuously. There's no MA organization that I've been a part of that is so overriding to my relationships formed that I was willing to sacrifice that over the org. Unless there were very extinuating circumstances (criminal/morally reprehensible acts), the org lost me as a supporting member, if not a paying member. I continued my merry way & if training became intolerable, I left & never looked back.
Friends are hard to come by... MA orgs, like women (or vice versa if a woman, men) are easily replaceable.
Personally ... it's been tried & I just ignore them. I've been bitched & threatened & laughed continuously. There's no MA organization that I've been a part of that is so overriding to my relationships formed that I was willing to sacrifice that over the org. Unless there were very extinuating circumstances (criminal/morally reprehensible acts), the org lost me as a supporting member, if not a paying member. I continued my merry way & if training became intolerable, I left & never looked back.
Friends are hard to come by... MA orgs, like women (or vice versa if a woman, men) are easily replaceable.
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