Duped by deceiful business practice - advice needed

[psyon82]

Back in January my wife and I signed up for a groupon for 16 lessons at a Wing Tsun school here in town. After our two introductory classes, the instructor offered to waive a $800 down payment ($400 for each) if we relinquish our groupon and sign up on the spot. So I signed a 12-month contract. I justified the $187/month tuition on the fact that there were 5 classes offered during the week (3 more added with the intermediate class), he offered to let us both study for the price of one, and I figured that our tuition for the duration of training would remain constant.

At the time of signing the contract, there was no mention of various "upgrade" programs. After the 30-day money back guarantee expired, I found out from another student that we actually have to pay an increased tuition cost to join the intermediate group (aka "black belt club") to learn the advanced material. As I already had a year of previous Wing Tsun training under my belt, I fast-tracked through the first 2 student grades and was ready to join the intermediate group.

Because I had done some intro lessons and promoting for the school (I had to do this to make up for my wife's "free tuition" ...), the instructor let me join the intermediate class without increasing my tuition (I would have to continue doing intro lessons and assist during the beginner classes). However, that night he failed to mention that a 3-year contract is required to join the class. So the following day he drops the contract bomb on me, and I told him I needed to think about it. After much pressuring, I signed the contract a few days ago, but after giving it some thought I decided to back out of the contract yesterday (I was within the 72-hour period).

At that time, he tells me that I can no longer be in the intermediate class because I won't sign a 3-year contract showing my commitment like the rest of the students in that group. I then ask him how am I going to advance after my SG3 test next week. To which he replies: "Well, the beginner program is only designed for student grades 1-3. I guess you could sign up for some private lessons to learn the additional material." Oh now the truth comes out ...

I feel deceived by this teacher because he failed to disclose that I would be forced to sign a 3-year contract after 4 months into my 12-month contract. I'm not going to stop going and give up $187 for the next 7 months (my wife quit after she found out about the "black belt club"), and I'm not going to sign the 3-year contract to join the intermediate group. Now I'm a scorned student back in the beginner group with no hope of learning the material necessary to progress, and I don't know what to do. Any advice would be helpful. Thank you.

PS - to add to my frustration, the beginner class is being taught by a SG3

 

[Vajramusti]

Caveat emptor. Not surprised.

 

[Steve]

What exactly did you sign? I'd take some time to very carefully read everything you put your name on. You've already paid about... what? $800? And you're on the hook through December. Right?

At this point you have a couple of choices. You can just bite the bullet, pay him through December to fulfill the contract. Or you can fight this, which will involve smal claims court and potentially a consultation with a lawyer. Frankly, if it's a little bit of money and a lot about the principle of the matter, I'd spend a few hundred bucks to talk to a lawyer, have him/her review any documents you signed and give you a recommendation. If you have a claim, I'd take this joker to small claims court and see if you can get your dough back, or at least get you out of the remainder of teh contract.

And then in the future, be a little more careful.
Disclaimer, the above is my own opinion based upon my incomplete understanding of your situation, and is only my own description of what I would do in a similar situation. I am not a lawyer.

 

[Argus]

Is there any way you can get out of all contracts with a minimal loss, and go find a better school?

In Martial Arts schools, any time there are contracts involved, I see that as a big red flag. I can't help but feel that anyone who is worth studying under isn't going to feel the need to forcibly retain students by means of a contract...

 

[psyon82]

What exactly did you sign? I'd take some time to very carefully read everything you put your name on. You've already paid about... what? $800? And you're on the hook through December. Right?

At this point you have a couple of choices. You can just bite the bullet, pay him through December to fulfill the contract. Or you can fight this, which will involve smal claims court and potentially a consultation with a lawyer. Frankly, if it's a little bit of money and a lot about the principle of the matter, I'd spend a few hundred bucks to talk to a lawyer, have him/her review any documents you signed and give you a recommendation. If you have a claim, I'd take this joker to small claims court and see if you can get your dough back, or at least get you out of the remainder of teh contract.

And then in the future, be a little more careful.
Disclaimer, the above is my own opinion based upon my incomplete understanding of your situation, and is only my own description of what I would do in a similar situation. I am not a lawyer.

I signed a 12-month contract that began in Feb '15 and lasts until Feb '16. I've paid about $560 so far. I actually read the contract in its entirety - it's a standard martial arts contract. However, neither the contract nor he mentioned anything about the beginner program lasting until SG3. This is definitely a lesson learned, and I may just bite the bullet and keep going to class. I really don't want to go the lawyer route. Thank you for your advice.

 

[psyon82]

Is there any way you can get out of all contracts with a minimal loss, and go find a better school?

In Martial Arts schools, any time there are contracts involved, I see that as a big red flag. I can't help but feel that anyone who is worth studying under isn't going to feel the need to forcibly retain students by means of a contract...

Fortunately, I'm just locked into the 12-month contract. I got out of the 3-year contract. I also agree that contracts are a red-flag. I chose not to sign the 3-year contract because I had the same train of thought: forcing someone into a 3-year contract definitely means something is not right. Also, while justifying the contract he told me that the contract is necessary to "lock in" my tuition rate because he is going to raise the prices as he gets more students to bring more revenue into the school.

edit: grammar/spelling

 

[Argus]

Fortunately, I'm just locked into the 12-month contract. I got out of the 3-year contract. I also agree that contracts are a red-flag. I chose not to sign the 3-year contract because I had the same train of thought: forcing someone into a 3-year contract definitely means something is not right. Also, while justifying the contract he told me that the contract is necessary to "lock in" my tuition rate because he is going to raise the prices as he gets more students to bring more revenue into the school.

edit: grammar/spelling

I would do as Steve suggests and read the fine print, and perhaps talk to a lawyer and see if you have any options that wouldn't cost more than it's worth to pursue.

You may also be able to break off the contract by paying a cancellation fee. If that's an option, you could get out of your obligations and find somewhere better to train.

I personally wouldn't want to stick around that school for another 7 months.

 

[Steve]

Did the 12 month contract you signed mention beginner, student grade 3 or any mention of limitations on the training you are able to attend? Is there a schedule?

Frankly, if you can't get out of the contract you signed, I'd pressure him to fulfill the contract you did sign and are paying for. You didn't sign a contract for beginner classes. did you? If your'e interested in training, I'd try to work it out, but it might be worth your while to be clear and assertive. He's taking advantage of you, but if you signed a contract for training and not specifically for beginner classes, you have a legitimate beef that he's failing to hold up his end of the agreement.

Another avenue to pursue is your State's attorney general and the BBB. If you are not getting what you paid for, there are sometimes legal protections. And even in cases where you are not technically protected, a well written letter to him that is factual, not emotional, and clearly articulates what you want, with a cc to the BBB and to your Texas Attorney General, or whoever in your state heads up consumer protection, will let this joker know that you're serious enough to take action if needed.

 

[mograph]

Did the 12 month contract you signed mention beginner, student grade 3 or any mention of limitations on the training you are able to attend? Is there a schedule?

Yes. What, specifically, does your current contract state you will receive for your fees?

 

[psyon82]

The "contract" I signed and have for record is just a vague membership agreement from a 3rd-party billing company. In my workbook it mentions that the beginner program is 6 months long and students who wish to intensify their training may upgrade out of the beginner course. It seems this is all my fault for not inquiring about this earlier. I don't understand why he would have someone sign a 12-month contract knowing the beginner program is only 6-months long and not mention upgrading. I guess I'm stuck like Chuck.

 

[Andrew Green]

In Martial Arts schools, any time there are contracts involved, I see that as a big red flag. I can't help but feel that anyone who is worth studying under isn't going to feel the need to forcibly retain students by means of a contract...

I think the lack of any sort of contract should be a bigger red flag... I'm quite sure that I am legally required to have a contract of some form saying what services I am providing in exchange for what amount of money. Not having any form of contract shows extremely poor business practices and lack of professionalism.

Personally I do not agree with 36-month contracts, without a exit clause that is too far in the future for most people. But if a gym offers them and someone chooses to sign them it's their choice to do so.

As for the original post, a contract states your obligations as well as the schools. Does the contract specify which classes you are allowed to attend?

 

[mograph]

I'd get legal advice if I didn't want to just go to beginner classes for my buck. I-not-a-lawyer think that the workbook isn't a contract. However, since the membership contract specifies no obligation for the owner to actually offer you classes ... that may be a problem. However ... it may be possible for you to show up to the intermediate classes and practice in the corner, listening, or course, if there is nothing in the contract that says you (a member!) can't do that. But that would set up an antagonistic relationship with the teacher/owner, of course.

I guess you have to establish how far you want to go with this, but as I wrote, I'd get legal advice ... and I'd document all interactions with this group.

 

[Drose427]

The "contract" I signed and have for record is just a vague membership agreement from a 3rd-party billing company. In my workbook it mentions that the beginner program is 6 months long and students who wish to intensify their training may upgrade out of the beginner course. It seems this is all my fault for not inquiring about this earlier. I don't understand why he would have someone sign a 12-month contract knowing the beginner program is only 6-months long and not mention upgrading. I guess I'm stuck like Chuck.

Some people are scammers and some are okay with beong scammed.

One of pur local BJJ schools is like that. The instrcutor claims to have learned from Relson Gracie, students have to pay for extra "programs and packages" such as compeition, no gi, traditonal, etc. All are extra each month, monthly dues are already 100+. Hes been outed a couple times as we have 2 reputable schools in my area, one of which is a relson gracie academy, and students still go to the scammer And recommend him.

People just chalk it up to rival schools fighfing for students instead of preventing shoddy business practices.

Point is, if some folks can trick you into paying more, they will.

 

[Tez3]

Point is, if some folks can trick you into paying more, they will.

There's also that thing that some people have that if you pay more money it must be better, which isn't necessarily true. You can say that you get what you pay for but you do have to check out the quality of the 'competition' as it were because often it's just an inflated price.

 

[geezer]

PS - to add to my frustration, the beginner class is being taught by a SG3

Nobody under SG-8 (in your organization) has any business teaching a class. And even then they should be functioning as an "assistant" and supervized by a senior instructor.

Honestly, you are lucky that you are in San Antonio. You have other groups you can turn to in the same lineage of Wing Chun/Wing Tsun. If you can't get a refund, finish out your time and polish your basics, but don't pay another cent! Then dump that school and find a more ethical instructor. PM me. I was one of the first "WT" instructors in this country and a direct disciple of the head of that organization. I know some great people teaching in Texas.

 

[Stac3y]

I live in Austin, and I'm very curious as to what school this is...

 

[jks9199]

Unfortunately, you've tripped over one of the headaches and blackeyes of the martial arts (and fitness, for that matter) industry...

To keep the doors open, the business needs a steady influx of money. It can get it one of two ways: get more people into the door, or soak the ones you've got for more. (Actually, you can combine them... and then there's the whole fun thing of paying for the "privilege" of learning to teach by teaching classes that other people are paying for...) That's where the whole black belt club, upgraded membership, etc. comes in...

You can talk to a lawyer about it; I'm not sure what result you'll get. You can try small claims court, which generally prohibits attorneys. I'd suggest consulting an attorney before you go to court, since you don't want to waste your time and filing fees, etc. if the contract is "good enough" to get through class.

 

[Steve]

You can talk to a lawyer about it; I'm not sure what result you'll get. You can try small claims court, which generally prohibits attorneys. I'd suggest consulting an attorney before you go to court, since you don't want to waste your time and filing fees, etc. if the contract is "good enough" to get through class.

This is exactly what I was suggesting. It sounds like you could be out another several hundred dollars or more. It might cost you $50 or $100 to consult with an attorney. That's money well spent if you can get some solid legal advice, even if that advice is to suck it up and consider the money a relatively inexpensive (in the grand scheme) life lesson.

Another thing attorneys do really well is write letters that get attention. Even if you have an attorney draft a letter for you, it suggests that you are serious about this and not willing to get taken for a ride.

 

[jezr74]

Don't forget to write a review of the school in Google reviews and yelp. Help out the next person looking for schools in your area.

 

[K-man]

A lot of these people use social media to promote themselves. I would be looking to see if you could start detailing your experiences, in a 'nice way' of course, in such a way that they start to feel uncomfortable.

Some schools have reviews. Suggesting that your will post your experience might give them a wake up call.

I think you have to let them know that you are unhappy and that you are not being offered the training you signed up for. Personally I think the legal route, although obviously the most effective, will be costly and likely end in tears. Unfortunately we have a legal system, not a justice system.