Does TKD make you stiff so you Kungfu looks bad?

[zijin_cheng]

I learned TKD until brown belt when I was 11 and stopped. In grade 10 i started Chinese martial arts.

After about 2 years many of my friends had graceful movements when doing forms, while I didn't and still looked like a block when doing them. (This place I went to emphasized more on beauty than usefulness, they had wing chun for usefullness)

Although I was unmatched in kicking power, no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't be graceful, is it because TKDs movements are very powerful but stiff?

 

[clfsean]

I learned TKD until brown belt when I was 11 and stopped. In grade 10 i started Chinese martial arts.

After about 2 years many of my friends had graceful movements when doing forms, while I didn't and still looked like a block when doing them. (This place I went to emphasized more on beauty than usefulness, they had wing chun for usefullness)

Although I was unmatched in kicking power, no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't be graceful, is it because TKDs movements are very powerful but stiff?

Yeah kinda but not really. TKD can be practiced relaxed, but that's not how it's generally seen, so yeah. You're stiff due to it.

I've got a kid now that is a phenomn but went all the way to his Black belt test & the school closed. He's way stiff so I'm trying to get him to loosen up. It will wake a while. Don't rush the process, but listen to your teacher on how to relax but still be effective. You're used to thinking (most likely) "hard" equals strength & power. Not so much. You do that in CMA & you're fighting your own body.

 

[zijin_cheng]

I actually dropped it end of Grade 11, and that was about 5 years ago, been practicing on and off. I'm not sure why but I find it easier to be graceful when practicing a weapons form such as staff or broadsword.

I just started Wing CHun 2 weeks ago and being relaxed is the hardest thing I can do, it goes against everything I've been taught

 

[rainesr]

I took TSD for several years before Kung Fu, and it took a while to relax.

One thing I did that seemed to help was to completely relax my arms and only perform the foot work for the form. Though my hands were not in the exact position they were supposed to be they were oddly close and with more power than I expected. I tried to keep some of that feeling when I added the hand techniques back and things started to fall into place.

~Rob

 

[J W]

I just started Wing CHun 2 weeks ago and being relaxed is the hardest thing I can do, it goes against everything I've been taught

I studied TKD in high school (oh, about 17 years ago now), and more recently studied a little Kenpo. I've been studying Wing Chun for the past year.

I also found learning to relax fairly difficult when I first started WC (hell, I still struggle with it sometimes). They make it sound so easy - just hold you arm in this awkward position, but stay relaxed. So simple, yeah right.

It will take you some time, just be patient with it and don't let it frustrate you. WC is about a 180 from TKD in this sense, so you will need to forget what you know. It doesn't apply. Also, don't try to perform the punches or anything with any power just yet - power = tension in your TKD mind, so just focus on relaxation in the movements. Power will come later.

That's my little bit of advice for moving from TKD to WC. Good luck with your training.

 

[oaktree]

Might want to try some relaxation exercises,meditation,zhan zhuang,reevaluate things.
take your time really feel your body in the form.
Feel where things are tense sense it relaxing.
Your teacher should be able to help you.

 

[ilhe4e12345]

I took TSD many many years ago (I was around 12-14 years old and only got as high as green belt im currently 27 years old) and I had the same problem when I began studying CMA. It was as if the stiffness followed me ...but my teacher was able to pick it out almost instantly. He taught me how to relax...im going on 6 years with my CMA training and I still find times when I will get a little stiff. One thing I do that helps a lot is to do forms slowly. When I do my Bung Bo form I take each step very very slowly and make sure to stay relaxed and fluid. Also making sure to do each movement corectly of course

When I do my Wing Chun form and Bagua I make sure to pay close attention to being calm and relaxed....no need to rush. The knowledge and ability is there, just need to work at it. You will learn to relax, it will take some time but with a good teacher and you working on it soon enough you will be like water .

Keep up your training and i must say I am very jealous....having powerful legs is always a plus especially in CMA. Powerful legs are my weakness as I have a messed up nerve in my lower right back that I am currently recovering from and it limits what I can do with kicks....but maybe one day ill be where i want. Strecthing and taking it slow...the ebst way to get something done the right way

Happy Training

 

[zijin_cheng]

I'm not doing CMA with a teacher now, just practicing on my own, so I'll have to try and relax on my own.
What form is the best to use while learning to relax? I know:
Changquan wushu form 1 (Not the compulsory one)
Compulsory staff and dao
Tan Tui the super basic one

However, Wing Chun should help me relax.

Also, the kicking strength I possess (at least among my asian friends) is probably also because soccer is my favourte sport, so I'm always using my legs for everything.

Also, what is Zhanzhuang?

 

[oaktree]

I would advise you to see a teacher in Chinese martial arts when you are having a very common beginner problem that can be easily corrected with the right teaching.
However, practicing forms and not having a good root and being tense will carry on when you do find a good teacher making it harder to correct bad habits.

It really doesn't matter what form you practice to learn to relax. It is certain principles and characteristics that tribute to relaxing. Many times our tension is carried in our shoulders and necks that is why you hear the saying:The weight is on my shoulders, you are a pain in my neck, the burden is on my shoulders.
We also carry tension in our chest:My heart is heavy, he clenched his chest in shock,Get something off my chest.
We carry tension in our stomach:Butterflies in the stomach, sick to your stomach, I have a gut feeling.
I call these the four traps. When the neck relaxes the shoulder holds the support, then the shoulders relax causing the chest to hold the support, chest relaxes then the
stomach holds the support, when the stomach relaxes the Kua or legs hold the support. When the legs hold the support the legs become stronger, like a tree you are deeply rooted, unmovable in body and mind.

Zhanzhuang 站桩. I really think it is better you Google it. It is the foundation for Chinese martial arts. If your internal is not good that will manifest in your external movements as well.

 

[clfsean]

I'm not doing CMA with a teacher now, just practicing on my own, so I'll have to try and relax on my own.
What form is the best to use while learning to relax? I know:
Changquan wushu form 1 (Not the compulsory one)
Compulsory staff and dao
Tan Tui the super basic one

However, Wing Chun should help me relax.

Also, the kicking strength I possess (at least among my asian friends) is probably also because soccer is my favourte sport, so I'm always using my legs for everything.

Also, what is Zhanzhuang?

No... stop now.

Go find a teacher & learn correctly. None of those will teach you how to relax & execute properly. You need to be guided.

 

[zijin_cheng]

I can't stop, as I need to continue practicing or I will lose it, and there are no CMA teachers around here, the closest one being 1600km away, only a wing chun teacher.

Im not practicing to be relaxed, I'm practicing to exercise and not lose what I've learned and being relaxed and graceful while doing it would be a nice bonus.

So I don't have a teacher to guide me, what do u guys suggest? Practice zhanzhuang?

Oh and JW, when I first started, the very first wingchun class, I equated relaxed to collapsible. And the difference that mentality brought me! That probably set me back a week or 2 in terms of well badness. The teacher is good, he's been trying to correct me, but its taken me about 2 weeks to actually do a proper bong without collapsing my forearm into my chest.

 

[clfsean]

Where are you? Antarctica??

 

[zijin_cheng]

I'm currently in Thunder bay Canada doing a Co op there, we have about 100k people, predominantly white, and we only have about 12 schools here, almost all karate and TKD, one or 2 lending I think?

I'm not learning wingchun from a school, but under james roller who studied under Ernie barrios and has I think 17 years experience, we usually practice in the park.

So if you're a Californian, then yes I do live in Antarctica . Although originally from Toronto which is where I took CMA

 

[clfsean]

I'm currently in Thunder bay Canada doing a Co op there, we have about 100k people, predominantly white, and we only have about 12 schools here, almost all karate and TKD, one or 2 lending I think?

I'm not learning wingchun from a school, but under james roller who studied under Ernie barrios and has I think 17 years experience, we usually practice in the park.

So if you're a Californian, then yes I do live in Antarctica . Although originally from Toronto which is where I took CMA

Well then practice with the WC guy, put the other stuff away simply because of my previous statements. You need to be guided, regardless of what you already have learned under another teacher. If you're having relaxation issues concerning techniques then you need to practice with somebody hands on so they can help guide you.

When you get back to Toronto & can get to a proper long fist teacher if WC isn't necessarily your bag, do that. But in the meantime you're only reinforcing improper technique by trying by yourself (which is commendable but ill advised) and it will actually hamper your development.

 

[zijin_cheng]

Well then practice with the WC guy, put the other stuff away simply because of my previous statements. You need to be guided, regardless of what you already have learned under another teacher. If you're having relaxation issues concerning techniques then you need to practice with somebody hands on so they can help guide you.

When you get back to Toronto & can get to a proper long fist teacher if WC isn't necessarily your bag, do that. But in the meantime you're only reinforcing improper technique by trying by yourself (which is commendable but ill advised) and it will actually hamper your development.

Right now I love wingchun, so I can just practice that, however, it doesn't help me stay fit. I do 2 things, CMA forms and TKD kicks. If I stop the forms but continue with the kicks will it reinforce my stiffness? Or should I stop altogether? What my WC instructor always said is that if u know another martial art, its good and bad, good because u need something to close the distance to WC range (if u attacking) and bad because their fundamentals probably brought along lots of bad habits.

Oh 1 more thing. If someone practiced WC and CMA at the same time, will the CMA reverse the WC training with regards to stance such as keeping both shoulders to enemy?

 

[clfsean]

Right now I love wingchun, so I can just practice that, however, it doesn't help me stay fit. I do 2 things, CMA forms and TKD kicks. If I stop the forms but continue with the kicks will it reinforce my stiffness? Or should I stop altogether? What my WC instructor always said is that if u know another martial art, its good and bad, good because u need something to close the distance to WC range (if u attacking) and bad because their fundamentals probably brought along lots of bad habits.

Oh 1 more thing. If someone practiced WC and CMA at the same time, will the CMA reverse the WC training with regards to stance such as keeping both shoulders to enemy?

Ummm ... WC is a CMA. It's southern, not northern / modern wushu that you were picking up.

Just practice WC. You have somebody to help. Put the other stuff aside until you have the basics down and solid. By then maybe you'll be back in Toronto.

As far as keeping fit... run, do calesthenics, do CrossFit or P90x or something.

 

[zijin_cheng]

In my opinion, technically WC is CMA because its chinese, but its fundamentals are so different.

Also now I have to ask the question, I know I'm stiff compared to the people I did it with, but is my stiffness at a level so bad that if I continued it would be detrimental? Or hypothetically are my friends so good that my stiffness isn't that stiff at all?

Ill try to find a YouTube video of someone else with my level of stiffness.

 

[clfsean]

In my opinion, technically WC is CMA because its chinese, but its fundamentals are so different.

WC is a CMA because it was developed & founded in China. It's a southern originated art, so yeah the fundimentals are different than northern arts. The whole structure of the art (theory, mechanics, purpose) is totally different than the other stuff you did.

Also now I have to ask the question, I know I'm stiff compared to the people I did it with, but is my stiffness at a level so bad that if I continued it would be detrimental? Or hypothetically are my friends so good that my stiffness isn't that stiff at all?

Ill try to find a YouTube video of someone else with my level of stiffness.

No you're stiff because it sounds like the bulk of your training was in TKD & you haven't had enough exposure to what you want to do (Northern/modern wushu) to compensate for that. Now that you're not able to get to a teacher that can get you through that, so you're focusing on what your having issues with, as opposed to focusing on what you can get help with by training with the WC guy.

I'm not sure what else to tell you.

 

[zijin_cheng]

No you're stiff because it sounds like the bulk of your training was in TKD & you haven't had enough exposure to what you want to do (Northern/modern wushu) to compensate for that. Now that you're not able to get to a teacher that can get you through that, so you're focusing on what your having issues with, as opposed to focusing on what you can get help with by training with the WC guy.

I'm not sure what else to tell you.

Yes I know what you mean, that I'm stiff because the bulk of training is in TKD. What I want to know is has my 2 years in CMA counteracted some of that stiffness so I can continue to practice on my own? I found another video of someone about the same level as me, start at 4:38

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb1-dUm_s8M&feature=relmfu


And about my question whether CMA training will counteract WC training, since they have different structures, will practicing a lot of 1 structure be detrimental to the other structure?

 

[clfsean]

Yes I know what you mean, that I'm stiff because the bulk of training is in TKD. What I want to know is has my 2 years in CMA counteracted some of that stiffness so I can continue to practice on my own? I found another video of someone about the same level as me, start at 4:38

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb1-dUm_s8M&feature=relmfu


And about my question whether CMA training will counteract WC training, since they have different structures, will practicing a lot of 1 structure be detrimental to the other structure?

Seriously... you have no northern/wushu teacher around you to help you train past your perceived issues there. You have somebody to teach you WC where you're located. Seems kinda straight forward to me.

As far as practice a short hand structure versus a long hand structure... they are different. Both are CMA, but are totally different. Is a circle detrimental to a square? No... they're different. You train in one, the other will feel different. You train one long enough & deep enough, the other will be totally new when picked up & kept easily apart. Don't try to blend them. Focus on what you have (coached WC). Put the other on a shelf until you can get to a teacher.

That's about my last thoughts on that.