Do you consider street fighting a martial art

[suicide]

in that case alot of people all over the world learn how street fight effectively %-}

 

[Guardian]

No, a street fighter will hand a MAer his butt every time in their type of fight. I agree with Omar no this one, but right here in the States have some good ones also.

 

[Cirdan]

No, if anything it is the total absence of art.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

the art of street fighting %-}

No. Street fighting means fighting outside of competition in a 'run what you brung' environment under whatever 'rules,' if any, are agreed upon by the participants. Kind of like street racing.

So, a blackbelt in taekwondo could engage in street fighting against an opponent with a boxing background. Their arts would still be taekwondo and boxing.

Street fighting is the venue, not the art. Just as there's no such thing as 'UFC' fighting. UFC is a venue for mixed martial arts competition, not a style or art in and of itself.

Daniel

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

No, a street fighter will hand a MAer his butt every time in their type of fight. I agree with Omar no this one, but right here in the States have some good ones also.

Why? What if the 'MA-er' is a street figher? Having martial training doesn't preclude one from using it to better his or her street fighting.

I do tend to agree that they typical MA hobbyist would be at a severe disadvangage against anyone who has been fighting in real fights for any lenth of time, particularly in a no rules fight, but not all MA practitioners are hobbyists, and some have come out of a lifestyle of street fighting. Some have wartime serious combat experience.

Saying MA-er is as much of a generalization as saying 'street fighter'. They come in all shapes, sizes and backgrounds.

Daniel

 

[punisher73]

Why? What if the 'MA-er' is a street figher? Having martial training doesn't preclude one from using it to better his or her street fighting.

I do tend to agree that they typical MA hobbyist would be at a severe disadvangage against anyone who has been fighting in real fights for any lenth of time, particularly in a no rules fight, but not all MA practitioners are hobbyists, and some have come out of a lifestyle of street fighting. Some have wartime serious combat experience.

Saying MA-er is as much of a generalization as saying 'street fighter'. They come in all shapes, sizes and backgrounds.

Daniel

I agree. The "streetfighter" is always this mythical enigma that can never be defined. What does it mean exactly? Is it someone who has NO training whatsoever? He had to learn it somewhere? Was it from watching boxing, MMA? Most likely, and then he tried it found out what works for him. Is it a drunk lowlife who picks fights at a bar all the time for the fun of it? Is it a criminal who uses violence to rob/steal from people? Is is a gang member, who for some reason doesn't have a weapon on him? It can't be defined.

On the other hand you could say that ALL martial arts are 'streetfighting'. They started off as one man's tactics that worked for him. Then he practiced them and honed them to make them more effective. He talked with someone else and learned their tactics. Eventually, these tactics were put together and codified into a system that became a martial art.

 

[Aiki Lee]

All "dirty" fighting tactics that a street fighter uses can be learned to be done more effectively through martial arts training. I would say a "street fighter" would only have an advatange against a sport martial artist who for some reason would view a fight on the street the same way he would view a match.

On the other hand there are cases of prodigys that may be excellent fighters without training a day in their life, but that means they will likely move like a martial artist even without training, because martial arts teach people how to effectively end a fight.

Some people let their limited amount of training boost their egos to the point when they would believe they could fight when what they should really do is run away. These people would likely get a harsh reality check from a street fighter. But through proper training all martial arts practices should defeat any non-genius street fighter.

 

[chav buster]

yes all ma started out as basic brawling and most have evolved to have tones of useless techniques that were developed in dojo's with no real testing were as everything the streetfight does has been practically tested!

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

yes all ma started out as basic brawling and most have evolved to have tones of useless techniques that were developed in dojo's with no real testing

You'd have a hard time supporting this statement.

were as everything the streetfight does has been practically tested!

So what?

Some people will continually do things that don't work. Either they get beaten consistently and can't figure out why or switch tactics when they realize that they're losing, only to go try the same thing again the next time.

Some people do well with impractical techniques because of unusual strength, pain tollerance, and ability to take hits that they really should have avoided. Or they have a level of athleticism that is such that they can get away with doing something impractical in a fight.

Daniel

 

[JadeDragon3]

No I do not consider street fighting a martial art because there is no techniques and a lot of times no self control. Usually it's people loosing their temper and throwing wild hay maker punches and going bazerk.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Kind of also depends on how you're cagegorizing street fighting.

If by 'street' you mean outside of competition, or a real fight, then...

... do you mean two drunk guys wailing on each other?

Do you mean gangs fighting over turf?

Do you mean guys getting into fights to see who is best in some sort of underground fighting scene?

Or two guys going at it over a fender bender?

All of these qualify as street fights in some sense of the term. They're fights that occur outside of sanctioned competition. Only gang fighting and underground fight circuits imply testing any sort of effectivness of methods by virute of repetative participation, and in the case of gangs, the outcome of gang fights is generally determined by numbers and gunplay, not skill at hand to hand fighting.

Daniel

 

[Aiki Lee]

yes all ma started out as basic brawling and most have evolved to have tones of useless techniques that were developed in dojo's with no real testing were as everything the streetfight does has been practically tested!

This is only true for mcdojos with no serious training. Quality martial arts have been accumulated for years discovering the best methods for protection and combat. If you think a technique is useless it is only because you do not know how to apply it properly.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Might I add that the McDojo is a fairly recent (within the past thirty years) phenomenon.

Also, a McDojo can actually teach very effectively and be a great school. It just has a level of blatant commercialism. On the other hand, a lousy school is a lousy school.

Now, lousy schools tend often to be McDojo's, but the McDojo is actually a business model.

Usually the issue with teaching in the stereotypical McDojo isn't one of learning useless techniques, but one of lackluster training in the basics and rapid promotion.

Daniel

 

[Twin Fist]

no

just no

no wait, not just no

no way, no how

yeah, thats it.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

no

just no

no wait, not just no

no way, no how

yeah, thats it.

Brief and to the point. I like it!

Daniel

 

[Thems Fighting Words]

No. Street fighting means fighting outside of competition in a 'run what you brung' environment under whatever 'rules,' if any, are agreed upon by the participants. Kind of like street racing.

So, a blackbelt in taekwondo could engage in street fighting against an opponent with a boxing background. Their arts would still be taekwondo and boxing.

Street fighting is the venue, not the art. Just as there's no such thing as 'UFC' fighting. UFC is a venue for mixed martial arts competition, not a style or art in and of itself.

Daniel

Yup, that's pretty much the truth of street fighting in a nutshell. It's a setting for combat not a style itself.

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

Interesting, some of the replies I have read so far.

I do not know If I would say that street fighting is necessarily an art, but my own background came as a street fighter for many years before I started martial arts. I credit Street fighting, and my experience in it as to why I am a great fighter, but I credit Martial Arts with saving me from either Prison, or Death, or both.

I, and many street fighters I knew, would love when we got to square off against a "Black Belt" they were generally too predictable, too "Honorable", and too naive. To this day there are very few trained "Black Belt" Martial Artists I know of that actually can fight as well as many of the street fighters I knew, and still know.

I know we did not necessarily have an outline, or curriculum, but the experience more then made up for that in practicality, and many combos/moves/theories that were proven in street fights, I have discovered to be included in martial arts I have since studied.

There are plenty of people who street fight, I would not call them street fighters, just like there are plenty of people who go to a MMA school and screw around with it for a few months, I would not call them Mixed Martial Artists, or Ultimate Fighters as seems to be the term so many naive fans like to use. There are however people who street fight as a way of life, just like some make martial arts a way of life. I have known people to be addicted to it like a drug, make a living off it like any 9-5 job, and just accept it as a way of life in the lifestyle they have chosen. Those are the people that might be the closest to actually be considered a street fighting martial art.

 

[just2kicku]

no

just no

no wait, not just no

no way, no how

yeah, thats it.

A man of few words, but your point is made

. By the way TF, is your website down?

 

[Andy Moynihan]

I would call them seperate entities but perhaps part of a whole experience.

Martial arts are just that. Arts. Refinement of what exists over and above the basic level of understanding that the average Joe Sixpack would have, to the point of creating one's own responses( hence the "art").

Streetfighting is just the "applied science" part of it, the Darwinian laboratory of sorts "Where the metal meets the meat".

 

[Guardian]

Why? What if the 'MA-er' is a street figher? Having martial training doesn't preclude one from using it to better his or her street fighting.

I do tend to agree that they typical MA hobbyist would be at a severe disadvangage against anyone who has been fighting in real fights for any lenth of time, particularly in a no rules fight, but not all MA practitioners are hobbyists, and some have come out of a lifestyle of street fighting. Some have wartime serious combat experience.

Saying MA-er is as much of a generalization as saying 'street fighter'. They come in all shapes, sizes and backgrounds.

Daniel

Ok Daniel, you could have a point there, though I personally in my 48 years and experiences never met any MAer who was a streetfighter first, but I'll grant you there could be some out there. I've met some street fighters turned MAers after joining the military, but then again, wouldn't they be SF's first or MA's second.

Sorry, no disrespect intended, but the word MAer is just short for Martial Artist, I generalized for Martial Arts are Martial Arts.