Confessions of a security guy

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

It so happens that for roughly the last eight years, I've been working in the retail security business.That is, I've primarily made my living catching thieves.

The reactions to my having mentioned this to other people, online and IRL, have been varied, to say the least. Some have said that people like me are failed cops or "mall ninjas", some have said that I lack a conscience, some have said that I'm a bragging wannabe commando a.k.a. Internet Tough Guy, and some have asked me why I've chosen a potentially hazardous profession when it's glaringly obvious that my nerves don't stand up to it.

The possibility that I'm simply venting myself out after more than a few strange and unexpected occurrences, has apparently never been considered. There are no words for that in macho lingo, it seems. Of course, I honestly never expected anyone to label an episode in which I had to witness a Bulgarian refugee take a leak in an empty Coke bottle as "bragging". I honestly don't know if that says more about me or the other guy I relaid the information to.

It's also happened a few times that people with experience of working within either the British or American system of justice have assumed that the legal standards to which they're accustomed apply to my own current condition as well. I can understand perfectly well that when you've spent a considerable amount of time operating within a given framework, you don't always respond well to being presented with scenarios in which what you previously thought to be applicable, no longer is.

The fact of the matter, however, is that I live in a part of the world with a long tradition of people being supportive of the government, and having distrust in market capitalism - whereas I realize that for most of you native speakers of English, the situation is the direct opposite.

I figured that before I continue, I should round up the a few of the facts you should keep in mind as to where I'm coming from:

- civil law instead of common law applies

- lawyers can't charge percentages, and there's no responding concept of "punitive damages", which is why you can't sue people right and left

- lay judges instead of juries

- if you lose a legal dispute, you pay the lawyer's fees of BOTH parties

- no weapons may be carried by civilians for self-defense with *EXTREMELY* few exceptions, most of which involve women, vengeful husbands and mace

- "stand your ground" only applies to your own area of residence

- police can't carry tazers or side-handle batons

- police very rarely drive squad cars alone

- the density of police personnel is comparatively speaking very low, which means that you may have to wait for hours for them to show up, even if the nearest station is literally next door

- crime provocation is illegal, whereas "evidence provocation" is technically allowed but still something of a gray area

- pretty much the only thing that will keep you in prison for the rest of your life is serial killing and/or murdering a politician's relative, and even that's no sure bet

- prison sentences are EXTREMELY mild compared to the US

- prosecutors will regularly drop minor charges in favor of those leading to harsher sentences

- the age of consent is significantly lower than most other places on this planet

- universities are free

- considerably higher tax rates

- Christmas presents are handed out on Christmas evening.


I suppose I could just have said that by reading further than this, you'll have to accept that you're not in Kansas anymore. Thing is, I've been accused of being way too unclear about these issues in the past, so I thought I might as well rectify it.

More to follow...

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

I probably started out like many others. Having just finished high school without having any idea as to what I wanted to do in life, other than the fact that I didn’t want to continue going to school with the same people I’d put up with for the last twelve years, I spoke to a training partner working in the security business. Before you knew it, I’d gone through a certification course and been hired by a small company geared towards loss prevention. And while I can’t say I regret it looking back, there have been a few times when I’ve thought that I’d gone crazy. Though to be fair, I’ve wondered the same thing about others a lot more.

It is, for all intents and purposes, a dirty business, even though the standards are very high on a global level. There’s a lot of dirty money, shady characters, profit-driven manipulative psychopaths, greed, violence, fear, anger, drugs, loneliness, racism, misogyny, homophobia, prejudice, close-mindedness, red-tapism, big egos, prestige, cynicism and operating in grey areas of the law. And in the middle of it all – myself (no pun intended), who’ve struggled throughout my life with the problem (if you might call it that) that I tend to absorb the feelings and sentiments of people around me.

More than once, I’ve come home angry at the point of tears over the injustices I’ve seen being committed against myself as well as others, but I’ve also come home with a genuine sense of pride over having stood up to someone who really needed standing up to (on both sides of the law, I might add), having listened to someone who really needed being listened to, or having someone intent on imposing his will on others change his mind, if only for a short while.
And though they’ve been considerably fewer - knock on wood – I’ve also come home with bruises and/or my adrenaline pumping, like the times when Somali winos take issue with being looked straight in the eye and offer up headbutts as a reward, or when the Denis Leary-looking meth head pulled a syringe on me and my colleague last summer. Or when a group of maybe seven or eight Chechens appeared and took up overwatch positions with nearly military precision as their buddy went to work on the video games lockers with a demagnetizer. (How about implementing some changes in those open border policies right about now?)

Not to mention all those times when the well-meaning public have failed to realize what’s going on due to your plainclothes outfit, and proceeded to either physically intervene or call the police identifying YOU as the aggressor (this can be especially tiresome if the civilian in question happens to be the acting Minister of Justice, who has made a point out of not being ”soft on crime”). Or when store personnel take issue with your ”urban” clothes and dark complexion, and believe YOU to be the criminal – either confronting you at the exact moment the suspect you’re tailing is about to fill his bag or disable the alarms, or simply sending their male colleagues ordering you to leave the area. My personal ”favorite” episode has to be the time when I was thoroughly insulted and permanently banned from the premises by a store owner who objected to my calling the police instead of releasing a seven year-old African boy who didn’t know his family name. He (the store owner) also took the time out to write down my name – not really sure as to why – but guess what, asshat? I wrote down your name too. And I won’t feel the least bit sorry the day either the police or the criminal-minded parents of the kid in question take issue with your methods. Frankly, I think the latter would be a far more entertaining sight to see.

I’m giving you all this information as an attempt to paint some kind of a picture of how things work in the broken machine that is the security industry in a country that’s only been air-bombed once, and by accident. Because believe it or not, it does contain a fair amount of good people, who sometimes get threatened, yelled at, beaten and spat on by everyone from the police to the general public to representatives of the judiciary system. And even though the certification courses are becoming increasingly geared towards arrests and physical intervention, I refuse to see myself as anything that might be called a police officer. My next post in this thread will serve to differentiate between various types of security personnel. Stay tuned...

 

[K-man]

As a small business owner in a previous life I exercised my option to detain shoplifters reasonably regularly. If they ran, I chased, if they were violent I replied with appropriate force. Potentially I could have been sued by any of them but they probably wouldn't have succeeded in law. One thing we did have was a very effective CCTV security system to back up my actions. The upshot of it was that word went around and our shoplifting losses fell significantly. The police always came and gave the perpetrators a free trip in a real police car but unfortunately they never ended up in court. Just a warning.

Now, when I am in a shopping centre I see people setting off alarms regularly but there is never any action taken by store staff. The arguement is that the stores hand over security video to the police but once the thieves have gone, that's it. Very little follow up to my knowledge.

:asian:

 

[oftheherd1]

...

My next post in this thread will serve to differentiate between various types of security personnel. Stay tuned...

I await with bated breath. Sounds like security work where you are isn't too different from other places I know. The specifics may be different, but there are usually more frustrations than rewards.

 

[Transk53]

I await with bated breath. Sounds like security work where you are isn't too different from other places I know. The specifics may be different, but there are usually more frustrations than rewards.

Me too. I will be interested to know about the UK as there are only seven types of SIA licence. Unless the list will include private contracting or something?

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

A lot of things has happened since I last wrote anything here, to say the least. I've gone through a new four-year certification course, helped send more than just a couple of Georgians back home, had three court hearings cancelled and/or postponed, been slandered and racially profiled by more than a few female blonde 20something store employees, and - as luck would have it - been banned from working in yet another store. Though to be fair, the feeling was mutual when they asked me to go to hell.
With a job that, at least to a certain extent, depends on people not being able to recognize my face, it can be insanely frustrating at times to not be able to inform the media of some of the crazy things we see, do and have to endure. On the other hand, if I were to go public with all of my exploits, I'd have both famous and infamous people coming after me. Hence, I suppose you need an outlet of sorts. This being one of them, for me at least.

(Usually this is where some arrogant Yank comes along and says that I sound like a James Bond movie. Well, remind me not to tell you of how my parents smuggled peanut butter and banned literature into the Soviet Union in the 70's.)

Anyway, back to the topic at hand.

As I've said before, I live in a part of the world where most people place a good deal of faith in the idea of "The Benevolent State". Giving the state a heapload of our tax money and allowing it to handle things like daycare, health care, infrastructure etc etc has, contrary to the beliefs of neo-liberal ideologies and the like, yielded some pretty good results for us. It's what allowed us to change from being one of the world's poorest countries, into becoming one of the world's most prosperous countries in about a century's time (and also, it means you can watch HBO shows on state-sponsored television). HOWEVER, as you may expect, there IS a price to pay for this - one of them being the fact that they make your drinking habits and public conduct their business.

There are two basic guard types that people will usually encounter. For simplicity's sake, I'm going to refer to them as Type 1 and Type 2 - guards and peace officers respectively, or PO's for short. There's also a type three, whose authority under certain circumstances takes precedence over that of the police, a type four working at airports, a type five which is what most of you would call Correctional Officers in prisons, and so on. However, that is beyond the scope of this thread and, to be honest, not really my area of expertise. Thus, I'm going to focus on the first two categories. What you should keep in mind, is that people in general are unable to tell them apart. That goes for regular joes to cops, lawyers, prosecutors, judges and politicians. I wish I was making this up. I went so far as to look through the official state court glossary in English - even it doesn't distinguish thoroughly between the two. Generally, the public tends to confuse type 2 with type 1. The police and the criminal justice system, however, usually confuses type 1 with type 2.

More to follow in a bit...

 

[Transk53]

A lot of things has happened since I last wrote anything here, to say the least. I've gone through a new four-year certification course, helped send more than just a couple of Georgians back home, had three court hearings cancelled and/or postponed, been slandered and racially profiled by more than a few female blonde 20something store employees, and - as luck would have it - been banned from working in yet another store. Though to be fair, the feeling was mutual when they asked me to go to hell.
With a job that, at least to a certain extent, depends on people not being able to recognize my face, it can be insanely frustrating at times to not be able to inform the media of some of the crazy things we see, do and have to endure. On the other hand, if I were to go public with all of my exploits, I'd have both famous and infamous people coming after me. Hence, I suppose you need an outlet of sorts. This being one of them, for me at least.

(Usually this is where some arrogant Yank comes along and says that I sound like a James Bond movie. Well, remind me not to tell you of how my parents smuggled peanut butter and banned literature into the Soviet Union in the 70's.)

Anyway, back to the topic at hand.

As I've said before, I live in a part of the world where most people place a good deal of faith in the idea of "The Benevolent State". Giving the state a heapload of our tax money and allowing it to handle things like daycare, health care, infrastructure etc etc has, contrary to the beliefs of neo-liberal ideologies and the like, yielded some pretty good results for us. It's what allowed us to change from being one of the world's poorest countries, into becoming one of the world's most prosperous countries in about a century's time (and also, it means you can watch HBO shows on state-sponsored television). HOWEVER, as you may expect, there IS a price to pay for this - one of them being the fact that they make your drinking habits and public conduct their business.

There are two basic guard types that people will usually encounter. For simplicity's sake, I'm going to refer to them as Type 1 and Type 2 - guards and peace officers respectively, or PO's for short. There's also a type three, whose authority under certain circumstances takes precedence over that of the police, a type four working at airports, a type five which is what most of you would call Correctional Officers in prisons, and so on. However, that is beyond the scope of this thread and, to be honest, not really my area of expertise. Thus, I'm going to focus on the first two categories. What you should keep in mind, is that people in general are unable to tell them apart. That goes for regular joes to cops, lawyers, prosecutors, judges and politicians. I wish I was making this up. I went so far as to look through the official state court glossary in English - even it doesn't distinguish thoroughly between the two. Generally, the public tends to confuse type 2 with type 1. The police and the criminal justice system, however, usually confuses type 1 with type 2.

More to follow in a bit...

I am wondering about Type 3. It is very vague, that I can appreciate. I could be way off here, but the sentiment translates.

 

[aedrasteia]

Are you among the Scandehoovians? just trying to figure out where you are; if you'd rather not be open about that - its not a problem but can you provide a general suggestion about the region/area?
and thanks for some interesting reading.

 

[Transk53]

Are you among the Scandehoovians? just trying to figure out where you are; if you'd rather not be open about that - its not a problem but can you provide a general suggestion about the region/area?
and thanks for some interesting reading.

What I was thinking regarding Type 3 did not translate. Under criminal law there is no precedence for security to overrule a police officer and that would global, unless say for example a corrupt Middle East country (loose example). Privately yes and on private land with specific local by laws. For example where I work a police officer can demand whatever action (Usually CCTV) if a crime has been reported. If something civil and no crime reported, we are within rights to refuse access, which I have personally done more than once. It does piss some of them off, but if the police do not follow rules then that is a bad situation, hence the likes of Afgan.

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

What I was thinking regarding Type 3 did not translate. Under criminal law there is no precedence for security to overrule a police officer and that would global, unless say for example a corrupt Middle East country (loose example). Privately yes and on private land with specific local by laws. For example where I work a police officer can demand whatever action (Usually CCTV) if a crime has been reported. If something civil and no crime reported, we are within rights to refuse access, which I have personally done more than once. It does piss some of them off, but if the police do not follow rules then that is a bad situation, hence the likes of Afgan.

The short version of it is, the Protection Act takes precedence over the Police Act. Hence, Special Protection guards (no official translation of the job title exists) have the right to deny people access to the areas they're assigned to protect, should they deem it necessary. And that includes police officers. They also have the right to arrest people on mere suspicion of espionage, sabotage and/or terrorism. Like I said, you're not in Kansas anymore, but I'd like to think that everyone reading this also understands that the aforementioned scenario doesn't occur very often.

Anyways...

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

There once was an old man who was standing at a streetcorner, looking very miserable. He retained his balance using a supportive cane, and when people walked by, he held out a ragged baseball cap and looked at them imploringly. As a means to drive the point about his squalid living conditions home even further, he kept one of his pant legs rolled up all the way to the knee, giving passers-by a clear look of a pus-ridden wound on his calf. No one could resist handing him a few coins, and his gratitude was always endless. You couldn't help but give him a few more coins the next time you saw him as well, and he was just as grateful then. But after some time, people stopped giving him money.

It wasn't just the fact that his wound never healed. His gratitude was overwhelming to say the least, even to those who gave him a mere pittance, and soon you couldn't help but feel superfluous. Also, the city soon became infested with violently limping young men with crutches. After a while, there was nary a street where you could avoid being confronted with a severe crutch-bearing spastic, and it became increasingly difficult to distribute one's charity amongst all the needy. The strange thing was that as soon as these young men had collected a certain sum of money, a miracle occurred. A few blocks away, they could be observed carrying their crutches over their shoulders, walking the streets with a youthful splendor of near biblical proportions, before they were picked up by black BMW's with tinted windows. Sitting in one of these cars was the old man, barking orders at the younglings. This seemed to counteract the previously observed miracles, for the following day, the young men showed up walking with the aid of crutches once more, in their ongoing quest for a mere bit of "human decency".

The fact that this was all an elaborate form of street theater should be obvious to anyone. He who chooses to pay does so by his own purposeful choice - or due to his own ignorance. Someone of good intentions might classify this form of organized hustling as a result of societal failures. Personally, I think these phenomena require an analysis far beyond the scope of this thread. However, deliberate exploitation of people's inherent will to help their fellow man can only be described as a form of societal parasiting, and in the end, those who are truly in need are the ones who'll suffer from it.

There is, however, a deep-seated tendency amongst people nowadays, to simply refuse to believe the simple fact that others may take advantage of their generosity and good faith, either by lying, stealing or other fraudulent behaviour. From a political standpoint, it's a PR suicide to even allude to the fact that these things happen. But the elephant in the room grows larger and larger with each passing day. I'm not sure I want to know what happens the day when it's existence can no longer be denied. For now, however, I suppose I'll have to make do with gathering anecdotal evidence. Perhaps the grandkids will be amused at least.

But I digress.

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

Are you among the Scandehoovians? just trying to figure out where you are; if you'd rather not be open about that - its not a problem but can you provide a general suggestion about the region/area?
and thanks for some interesting reading.

I too am curious. I'm thinking with the references to the benevolent state, Chechens & Georgians a former Soviet state in that general area. Not Russia, but one of the others.

 

[Transk53]

I too am curious. I'm thinking with the references to the benevolent state, Chechens & Georgians a former Soviet state in that general area. Not Russia, but one of the others.

One of the others being??

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

I too am curious. I'm thinking with the references to the benevolent state, Chechens & Georgians a former Soviet state in that general area. Not Russia, but one of the others.

You ignored the part about Christmas and the lenient criminal justice system. In the former Soviet states, even the rats get tuberculosis in jail.

 

[Tez3]

It so happens that for roughly the last eight years, I've been working in the retail security business.That is, I've primarily made my living catching thieves.

The reactions to my having mentioned this to other people, online and IRL, have been varied, to say the least. Some have said that people like me are failed cops or "mall ninjas", some have said that I lack a conscience, some have said that I'm a bragging wannabe commando a.k.a. Internet Tough Guy, and some have asked me why I've chosen a potentially hazardous profession when it's glaringly obvious that my nerves don't stand up to it.

The possibility that I'm simply venting myself out after more than a few strange and unexpected occurrences, has apparently never been considered. There are no words for that in macho lingo, it seems. Of course, I honestly never expected anyone to label an episode in which I had to witness a Bulgarian refugee take a leak in an empty Coke bottle as "bragging". I honestly don't know if that says more about me or the other guy I relaid the information to.

It's also happened a few times that people with experience of working within either the British or American system of justice have assumed that the legal standards to which they're accustomed apply to my own current condition as well. I can understand perfectly well that when you've spent a considerable amount of time operating within a given framework, you don't always respond well to being presented with scenarios in which what you previously thought to be applicable, no longer is.

The fact of the matter, however, is that I live in a part of the world with a long tradition of people being supportive of the government, and having distrust in market capitalism - whereas I realize that for most of you native speakers of English, the situation is the direct opposite.

Sorry but I'm laughing very hard at the idea that the British people have a tradition of supporting the government. We tolerate governments.

I figured that before I continue, I should round up the a few of the facts you should keep in mind as to where I'm coming from:

- civil law instead of common law applies

- lawyers can't charge percentages, and there's no responding concept of "punitive damages", which is why you can't sue people right and left

- lay judges instead of juries

We have magistrates here who are lay people

- if you lose a legal dispute, you pay the lawyer's fees of BOTH parties

That happens here too.

- no weapons may be carried by civilians for self-defense with *EXTREMELY* few exceptions, most of which involve women, vengeful husbands and mace

We don't or at least aren't supposed to carry weapons either.

- "stand your ground" only applies to your own area of residence

we don't have 'stand your ground as such'

- police can't carry tazers or side-handle batons

We don't carry side side-handle batons, but extendable ones

- police very rarely drive squad cars alone

Ours don't nearly always two.

- the density of police personnel is comparatively speaking very low, which means that you may have to wait for hours for them to show up, even if the nearest station is literally next door

- crime provocation is illegal, whereas "evidence provocation" is technically allowed but still something of a gray area

- pretty much the only thing that will keep you in prison for the rest of your life is serial killing and/or murdering a politician's relative, and even that's no sure bet

- prison sentences are EXTREMELY mild compared to the US

- prosecutors will regularly drop minor charges in favor of those leading to harsher sentences

- the age of consent is significantly lower than most other places on this planet

- universities are free

- considerably higher tax rates

- Christmas presents are handed out on Christmas evening.


I suppose I could just have said that by reading further than this, you'll have to accept that you're not in Kansas anymore. Thing is, I've been accused of being way too unclear about these issues in the past, so I thought I might as well rectify it.

More to follow...

People here are very suspicious of beggars and anyone wanting money from them, begging here is illegal anyway.
Retail security, in fact all security work here is minimum wage and very long hours at least 60 odd hours a week. It is low status and not thought of highly on the whole.

 

[Transk53]

People here are very suspicious of beggars and anyone wanting money from them, begging here is illegal anyway.
Retail security, in fact all security work here is minimum wage and very long hours at least 60 odd hours a week. It is low status and not thought of highly on the whole.

Not quite, but yeah I would agree that the retail boys should get paid more. I am rostered for 42 hours, but regularly exceed that with overtime. Would agree with the low status. That notion was reinforced for me when I started working the doors many moons ago.

 

[Tez3]

Not quite, but yeah I would agree that the retail boys should get paid more. I am rostered for 42 hours, but regularly exceed that with overtime. Would agree with the low status. That notion was reinforced for me when I started working the doors many moons ago.

Up here in the North East 60 hours is the norm. There's little enough work here as it is so they can get away with that and paying minimum wage. You could go down south to earn more but the cost of lodgings and the general higher cost of living negates anything extra you'd earn.

 

[Transk53]

Up here in the North East 60 hours is the norm. There's little enough work here as it is so they can get away with that and paying minimum wage. You could go down south to earn more but the cost of lodgings and the general higher cost of living negates anything extra you'd earn.

Yeah here ya on that one. Any body who came down to the South coast like I did years ago, now pretty much have to pay London prices with non London wages/salaries. If I had a driving licence, I could see myself living in VW van.

 

[Buka]

Here in the U.S there's different levels of security jobs. I've worked most of them at one time or another and they can all be a pain in the ***. There's unarmed and armed security, with respective pay levels. Most of the armed security require a law enforcement background. Some are boring and some exciting. Personally, I always preferred the boring. There's also different required training, some in depth and some a five minute explanation by the guy training you. But that seems to be changing - probably with liability in mind.

My first gig was in retail security, and looking back, it was a lot of fun. It was in an Anderson and Little clothing store, we made a buck sixty an hour. A customer used to come in, a heavy set guy, probably close to three hundred pounds, always dressed to the nines in a nice suit and tie. He was friendly, had a twinkle in his eye and always spoke with all who worked there. He used to come every other month or so and buy socks, ties, maybe a shirt. Somebody saw him do something that didn't make sense. Come to find out he was really closer to 180 pounds, had a wire cage attached to his body, under his lovely suit, with a side opening under his arm. When they caught him, he had four expensive suits in that wire cage. The cops were called. I have to hand it to him, he was just as charming, polite and friendly while caught and taken away as he always was. Didn't seem to rattle him one little bit. And to this day, some forty years later, I kind of admire the guy. He was a thief, yes, but he had ingenuity and a certain amount of class.

 

[Transk53]

Here in the U.S there's different levels of security jobs. I've worked most of them at one time or another and they can all be a pain in the ***. There's unarmed and armed security, with respective pay levels. Most of the armed security require a law enforcement background. Some are boring and some exciting. Personally, I always preferred the boring. There's also different required training, some in depth and some a five minute explanation by the guy training you. But that seems to be changing - probably with liability in mind.

My first gig was in retail security, and looking back, it was a lot of fun. It was in an Anderson and Little clothing store, we made a buck sixty an hour. A customer used to come in, a heavy set guy, probably close to three hundred pounds, always dressed to the nines in a nice suit and tie. He was friendly, had a twinkle in his eye and always spoke with all who worked there. He used to come every other month or so and buy socks, ties, maybe a shirt. Somebody saw him do something that didn't make sense. Come to find out he was really closer to 180 pounds, had a wire cage attached to his body, under his lovely suit, with a side opening under his arm. When they caught him, he had four expensive suits in that wire cage. The cops were called. I have to hand it to him, he was just as charming, polite and friendly while caught and taken away as he always was. Didn't seem to rattle him one little bit. And to this day, some forty years later, I kind of admire the guy. He was a thief, yes, but he had ingenuity and a certain amount of class.

I would have to agree with you, a gentleman thief. The thieves that myself and the guys have to deal with, usually want to stick something up something that would be quite painful. Usually I point out that anatomically, it would be impossible to stick that something up that something. Usual response "you taking the piss init". I have to rely on the fact that street talk has deteriorated to the point that you just stand there and think, what a moron with every encounter. Thankfully the majority still suffer the rabbit in the head lights. Absolutely boring, but safer.