Concealed Carry Shorts

[Andy Moynihan]

www.smartcarry.com

 

[Gordon Nore]

lol....well you would be suprised. The most liberal kids at the University I attend are the ones who never had a job and their parents pay for EVERYTHING they do. It is actually quite annoying to be told about what I should do with my money when they have no concept of what it is to actually WORK for my money lol. If you have a job your already better than the people I am talking about. These are the kids that think Carl Marx had some good points.

You might be confusing "liberal" with "spoiled." Admittedly, it's easier to be liberal on someone else's dime, but there are a few of us lefties who work for a living. Left or right, people who are sitting around waiting for their parents to die are a pain. I wonder if Karl Marx wrote anything about that.

 

[stonewall1350]

You might be confusing "liberal" with "spoiled." Admittedly, it's easier to be liberal on someone else's dime, but there are a few of us lefties who work for a living. Left or right, people who are sitting around waiting for their parents to die are a pain. I wonder if Karl Marx wrote anything about that.

lol i misspell his name on purpose....did i not put carl marcks? But I am only throwing the stereotype from my university. No offense intended to you if you have a job lol. My best friend is a democrat and a Marine who has already been overseas. I would say he has done more for a living than i ever will lol.

 

[Flea]

Now why can the special concealed carry pants that like blackhawk makes be made into shorts? Cargo shorts and tac pants are almost identical down to the knees.

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[Bill Mattocks]

Now why can the special concealed carry pants that like blackhawk makes be made into shorts? Cargo shorts and tac pants are almost identical down to the knees.

Because men wearing shorts look like sissies.

 

[stonewall1350]

Because men wearing shorts look like sissies.

I like how the guy from Michigan says this. The guy with no concept of what 100% humidity in Florida actually feels like lol. Tell that to Brandon Spikes and see what he thinks of it (yea i saw him on campus not to long ago...that is one big dude).

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I like how the guy from Michigan says this. The guy with no concept of what 100% humidity in Florida actually feels like lol. Tell that to Brandon Spikes and see what he thinks of it (yea i saw him on campus not to long ago...that is one big dude).

I'm not 'from' Michigan, I just live here now. And I've been stationed in Okinawa and the Philippines, so yes, I know what heat and humidity are like. Shorts are for sissy-boys, unless you're out doing exercise or fighting in a ring.

 

[Tames D]

Shorts are for sissy-boys.

I'd like to introduce you to some of my sissy friends.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I'd like to introduce you to some of my sissy friends.

If they're wearing shorts, I don't want to see them. Icky.

 

[dbell]

Having just left Florida (Ft. Lauderdale area) myself, and having lived in deserts on and off all my life, I have to agree with Bill, shorts isn't the best way to go... If you move to Saudi, you will see people there fully clothed, because it is cooler.... Even with humidity, it is cooler to wear long pants. Keeps a coolness close to your body.

Although, that said, I'm not sure I'd call a person wearing shorts a sissy either...... Just not smart with their body....

 

[thardey]

So . . . all the fashion suggestions aside. (I never wear shorts anyore, but I live in Oregon, so I'll keep my mouth shut.)

Other than ankle holsters, what can't you do with shorts that you can do with pants?

(Assuming you're not wearing something with a drawstring, but something with belt loops.)

Shorts lend themselves easily to the "untucked shirt" style, which covers a multitude of fun toys.

It also helps to know what size gun you're trying to hide.

 

[stonewall1350]

Having just left Florida (Ft. Lauderdale area) myself, and having lived in deserts on and off all my life, I have to agree with Bill, shorts isn't the best way to go... If you move to Saudi, you will see people there fully clothed, because it is cooler.... Even with humidity, it is cooler to wear long pants. Keeps a coolness close to your body.

Although, that said, I'm not sure I'd call a person wearing shorts a sissy either...... Just not smart with their body....

as much as I am on the boat....and as much as I do have to walk around buildings and stuff now I would say I cool off MUCH quicker in shorts. Plus the comfort level lol. I noticed on 5-11 that htey have tac shorts. Alot of guys like them too. Plus it would be very out of character in florida for a guy to be seen wearing long pants in the middle of the summer heat. I like the concealed part of ccw lol.

 

[stonewall1350]

So . . . all the fashion suggestions aside. (I never wear shorts anyore, but I live in Oregon, so I'll keep my mouth shut.)

Other than ankle holsters, what can't you do with shorts that you can do with pants?

(Assuming you're not wearing something with a drawstring, but something with belt loops.)

Shorts lend themselves easily to the "untucked shirt" style, which covers a multitude of fun toys.

It also helps to know what size gun you're trying to hide.

A decision I am still trying to make. I might settle with a cheap revolver if I can find the right .357 mag that is small enough. But if not I will probably look at maybe a small 1911. Tho now that my cousin has purchased this newer S&W 9mm that is very easy to break down and clean and very small. I might look at it. I have never been a big fan of 9mm. I like .45 acp because I can control the recoil and I know that if I hit someone in the chest 1 will be sufficient and 2 is going to be overkill(which is what I believe in...the 1 extra principle).

 

[thardey]

A decision I am still trying to make. I might settle with a cheap revolver if I can find the right .357 mag that is small enough. But if not I will probably look at maybe a small 1911. Tho now that my cousin has purchased this newer S&W 9mm that is very easy to break down and clean and very small. I might look at it. I have never been a big fan of 9mm. I like .45 acp because I can control the recoil and I know that if I hit someone in the chest 1 will be sufficient and 2 is going to be overkill(which is what I believe in...the 1 extra principle).

I hear ya -- just to throw in my experiences.

My dad carries a .38 S&W airweight with Crimson trace grips, in his front pocket of the 5.11 cargo pants, and he really likes that. He's a dyed-in-the-wool .357 devotee, but with the right hollowpoints, (Supers, I believe) he feels good about the .38.

Me, I like the option for the extra magazine, so I carry the .40 Kahr CW40. (I don't recommend the PM40) It's got nearly a full-length handle, but in a slim package, so I can also carry it in the front pocket. I usually wear Dockers, but it hides very well in cargo shorts or pants. It's got a strong punch on the recoil, but little muzzle flip, and if you can handle the .45, it's not much worse.

Of course, unless you wear very baggy jeans, it's hard to conceal in the front pocket of those, so I have a IWB holster for jean days.

I have a full-sized Glock .45 (Model 21) that I can conceal IWB under a baggy t-shirt, or a coat, but not much else.

 

[KenpoTex]

A decision I am still trying to make. I might settle with a cheap revolver if I can find the right .357 mag that is small enough. But if not I will probably look at maybe a small 1911. Tho now that my cousin has purchased this newer S&W 9mm that is very easy to break down and clean and very small. I might look at it.

Personally, I think one is usually better served with a compact-sized polymer gun (e.g. Glock 19/23/etc., S&W M&P compact, etc.). Lighter, higher capacity, faster reloads, still easy to conceal.

I have never been a big fan of 9mm. I like .45 acp because I can control the recoil and I know that if I hit someone in the chest 1 will be sufficient and 2 is going to be overkill(which is what I believe in...the 1 extra principle).

No offense but the idea that any common handgun round will consistently deliver a "one shot stop" is a load of crap. Just as there are plenty of stories of one shot stops with all calibers, there are numerous stories about all calibers (9, .40, .45, etc.) failing to put the person down even after multiple rounds. "Stopping power" results from hits to very specific areas, not from a .10" difference in diameter.
When you look at the performance of the rounds you will find that there is really not a huge difference between them given the use of modern, high quality ammunition. The notion that an insignificant difference in ballistic performance will yield a significant difference in effect on target is something I find laughable.

 

[dbell]

I have never been a big fan of 9mm. I like .45 acp because I can control the recoil and I know that if I hit someone in the chest 1 will be sufficient and 2 is going to be overkill(which is what I believe in...the 1 extra principle).

When I was an active SF Medic on an active "A" Team, we used 9mm weapons (MP5 and a hand gun, both of 9mm capacity). I was, 95% of the time, able to get a kill shot with one round from the hand gun, so I'm not sure why it is talked so badly about. Depends on WHERE in the chest you place your "one round".

That said, in all my training in handguns, I have been taught to "double tap" the bad guy. If you are well practiced with your weapons, the first round open the person up, the second round makes sure the job is done... With the MP5 we did three round trigger burst. (Even had competition to on how many times we would get exactly three rounds per burst, not 2, not 4, etc.)

I'm not sure why you are set on a single round?

 

[stonewall1350]

When I was an active SF Medic on an active "A" Team, we used 9mm weapons (MP5 and a hand gun, both of 9mm capacity). I was, 95% of the time, able to get a kill shot with one round from the hand gun, so I'm not sure why it is talked so badly about. Depends on WHERE in the chest you place your "one round".

That said, in all my training in handguns, I have been taught to "double tap" the bad guy. If you are well practiced with your weapons, the first round open the person up, the second round makes sure the job is done... With the MP5 we did three round trigger burst. (Even had competition to on how many times we would get exactly three rounds per burst, not 2, not 4, etc.)

I'm not sure why you are set on a single round?

The 1 bullet comment was reffering to the trauma caused by a .45ACP. A 9mm...if I am not mistaken...is a high velocity pentration round? I want the trauma round. Plus I LIKE .45acp. It is FAR more utilitarian than a 9mm can ever hope to be. If I own a handgun I will not only carry it in ccw, but I would also have it when I hog or deer hunt. A .45 is barely enough on deer and a 9mm is totally worthless. I dont have the money for multiple pistols so my first gun needs to be a utility gun.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Personally, I think one is usually better served with a compact-sized polymer gun (e.g. Glock 19/23/etc., S&W M&P compact, etc.). Lighter, higher capacity, faster reloads, still easy to conceal.


No offense but the idea that any common handgun round will consistently deliver a "one shot stop" is a load of crap. Just as there are plenty of stories of one shot stops with all calibers, there are numerous stories about all calibers (9, .40, .45, etc.) failing to put the person down even after multiple rounds. "Stopping power" results from hits to very specific areas, not from a .10" difference in diameter.
When you look at the performance of the rounds you will find that there is really not a huge difference between them given the use of modern, high quality ammunition. The notion that an insignificant difference in ballistic performance will yield a significant difference in effect on target is something I find laughable.

There is much wisdom in Matt's post.

I will be going back this month to a full size .45 (Sig P220).

But the caliber was not what caused me to select it, that was just a bonus.

It just happened that While I love 1911's I don't trust one for carry(Not because of cocked and locked, but because of what I now Know regarding the effects of adrenaline on fine motor control and the dangers that can present with a Single action only trigger) and I'm just having no damn luck with the polymers( I don't care for Glocks, I LOVE Smith M&Ps, but they don't like me--got rid of my fullsize M&P because that goddamned beavertail kept pointing the muzzle down when I pointed straight, will be ditching my M&P compact because it is TOO compact--I learned the expensive way that picking it up from a counter is different than trying to draw it from IWB--I *HAVE* to have a grip as large as ALL my fingers ot it won't work consistently), It happened that the P220 just EXACTLY met my grip requirements with nothing sticking out below my pinky, AND with the right rig was still slim enough to go IWB with a large t shirt (the other runner up , the P226/229, failed this requirement owing to its wide double stack grip). What actually drew me to the SIG (the other product under investigation was a Para Ordnance LDA) was that there are readily available .22 caliber conversion kits which in this time of ammo crunches is a godsend.

Also, the .45 does have an advantage, but it isn't the one everyone thinks, in that its (relatively) slow speed means that even as FMJ/ball ammo it's not as much of a risk to overpenetrate and endanger innocents or lose kinetic energy transfer as a result. And even without hollowpoints or +P ( though given a choice i'd still prefer them) it's still right near generating that minimum 500 ft. lbs of force that creates the hydrostatic shock so vital to a one round stop (The other calibers do this, too, absolutely, but need the JHP design to cut out the attending overpenetration risk)

What all that means is that in this day and age of way overpriced ammo, if I don't wanna pay out the nose for +P JHPs in the future, I can carry ball and not lose confidence in the weapon or create any unnecessary risk to the innocent.

 

[KenpoTex]

The 1 bullet comment was reffering to the trauma caused by a .45ACP. A 9mm...if I am not mistaken...is a high velocity pentration round? I want the trauma round. Plus I LIKE .45acp. It is FAR more utilitarian than a 9mm can ever hope to be. If I own a handgun I will not only carry it in ccw, but I would also have it when I hog or deer hunt. A .45 is barely enough on deer and a 9mm is totally worthless. I dont have the money for multiple pistols so my first gun needs to be a utility gun.

"Penetration round" and "trauma round?"
They both poke a hole...and that's about the only trauma you can consistently expect a pistol round to inflict. You're not going to see the large temporary wound cavity/stretch cavity, and the resulting tissue damage, that you get with a high-velocity rifle round.
I've seen a number of posts/articles by ER doctors who say that they can't tell the difference, based on the wound, between the common handgun rounds (9, .40, .45, whatever), guys like Jim Cirillo (someone who shot quite a few people and watched quite a few autopsies in his time) also mention this.

 

[jks9199]

A couple of different issues going on here.

First, you can absolutely find shorts that you can carry a gun in. You'll probably need jean shorts, cargo shorts with a belt, or something similar. I've carried a paddle holster with drawstring shorts... It'll work, but you have to tie them TIGHT. With a knot that won't slip. I never meant to say that you can't -- only that choosing to carry a gun will effect the clothing choices you can make.

Second, on shorts. If you want to be taken seriously, if you're not hanging with your buds, you probably need to wear long pants unless shorts are justified by the activity. For example -- I do wear shorts biking, and in bike uniform, when the weather is appropriate I wear shorts. But as a general rule -- if you're doing adult stuff, you probably need to dress like an adult. Years ago, IBM had a corporate policy that they would wear suits for all business activity. Didn't matter where you were, you would be wearing a suit. (And a white shirt, and conservative tie.) They discovered when they were in the Middle East that their people were taken more seriously than some competitors who, in recognition of the temperatures, went to what amounts to modern business casual (collared shirt, slacks, not jeans).

Finally... "Stopping power." There simply ain't no such thing. Most of the agencies in my area carry a .40, usually 165 grain Hydrashock or similar. I know of two carrying .45. I believe (not certain) that the feds are still in 9 mm camp, though I know that they've at least expressed enough interest that several manufacturers have come out with 10 mm guns. A .22 will do the job -- if you place the round accurately. And a 50 mm won't do more than scare the bejeezus out of you if it's a miss. I've read plenty of accounts of people taking shots that should by all rights have killed them -- and fighting on. (Like a guy who took a point blank shot in the throat and walked several hundred yards to his own car. Or Sgt Marcus Young, Ukiah (CA) PD.) And others of people taking shots that had no business being fatal, and giving up.

You're trying to make one gun do too many jobs. You can't make one car do every job, from hauling freight to fuel efficient stop & go commuting to NASCAR. One gun can't do a good job as a hunting back up, and a concealed self defense gun. But a decent self defense gun can be a marginally adequate backup, if you select the right gun.