shesulsa said:
I It's a freakin' symbol, for cryin' out loud, for the body of the Christ - or, as Paul stated, the transubstanation of Christ. What, we're not actually imbibing in plasma or consuming human flesh, here - we are SYMBOLICALLY partaking of bread (body) and wine (blood) to keep the covenant of rememberance of Him.
Peace.
Just wanted to make a correction on this. Other faiths believe in the bread in wine as a symbol of Christs body/blood, but Catholics and Orthodox believe that it is ACTUALLY Christs body and blood that we are eating, but that it only appears to be bread and wine, hence the word "Transubstanation." The best scriptural reference is John 6 (read all of it so you have the reference):
http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/john/john6.htm The summerized version is Jesus has a bunch of followers outside of the 12 who had witnessed his good works and such, but then Jesus says, "Amen, Amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you."[Jn 6:53] Everyone was like WTF? So..."As a result of this, many (of) his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him."[Jn 6:66] The original 12 stayed, and the rest is history. The arguement behind this doctrine is that Jesus didn't stop the "many" of his disciples who said "Datz screwed up, I'm not going to eat someones flesh!" and left. He didn't say, "wait, don't go, I ment eat my flesh symbolically....come back!" So, the belief is that at the communion, we ACTUALLY are eating flesh and drinking blood. This is one of the "great mysteries" of Catholic faith...this idea of transubstanation.
Now, other denominations have different beliefs on this, so please keep in mind that I am not posting this so that we can argue over whether or not that interpretation of scripture is right or wrong. I am only stating this so you all have a point of reference on what the Catholic belief is on the Eucharist, or Communion. Realizing this, because the idea of Eucharist is beyond "just a symbol," this is pretty serious biznatch in Catholicism, hence why I really feel for this little girl.
Now, this all being said, yes, the Eucharist is very important...basically the belief IS that it is the ultamite acceptance of Christ, and therefore IS nessicary to get into heaven. However...that is also another "mystery" of the Catholic faith. Catholics DO NOT believe that just because someone doesn't or can't recieve the Eucharist on earth that they are going to hell. Just like Catholics do not know how transubstanation "works" but believe its true, we don't profess to know how this "works" either. In other words, one could be an aethiest on earth but lived a good life, die, go to purgatory or something to learn more about what's what, recieve the Eucharist on that different plane of existance, then go to heaven. This little girl could never recieve the Eucharist on earth (although I believe that she has), die, and recieve it at the gates upon entering. I mention this because it is important to note that NO ONE knows who is going to hell or heaven but God, and this is Catholic doctrine, so NO ONE would have the right to tell this girl or you or anyone that they are "going to hell."
Now, back to the subject at hand, there is no good historical, scriptural, or traditional reference to the idea that "The bread must be made of wheat!" prior to Thomas Aquinas, who lived from 1225-1274....1,200 years after Christ!?!? Like I said, this wasn't put forth as "Doctrine," but this tradition made its way into the rulebook, and bingo-bango, now this tradition is a rule that some church authority figures can't step outside of the idiot rulebook to recognize how/why it's there. If they would look at things from a logical perspective, even within their own doctrine and beliefs they would see that allowing bread not made of wheat into the mix jeoprodizes nothing.
On a final note....don't give me this piffle that "This is Da reason why Catholics suck" or "Dis is why I'm not religious" because similar, dumb, and often times far worse mistakes happened in every religion. When you deal with the metaphysical...stuff that we cannot prove or see with our worldly senses, added to the error of human beings, things are bound to get screwy. It just so happens when that the bigger the church (and the Catholic Church is the largest Christian Church), the bigger the target and the more media attention it recieves. I like the Catholic Church because of the wealth of knowledge that is contained within the faith. Virtually every Christian Church out there relies on the Catholics because they are the ones who have maintained historical artifacts and records going back as far back as one could go...so the wealth of knowledge and Scholarly study that has gone into the beliefs is second to none in my opinion. However, the misinterpretation of rules, and the mistakes by the Human beings within the church are what makes it hard to accept. I try not to take that stuff too seriously, and I keep an open mind, and I keep in mind that even as a Catholic, my religion belongs to ME not a hierarchy of men, and my relationship with God is MINE and no one elses. That, coupled with the open-mindedness to discover "truths" in other religions and ways of thought all help me cope with the nonsense. Example is lately I have been searching and discovering more and more about "Tribal" cultures and beliefs and ways of thought...particularly native american. Why? Because I feel that aspects of western culture are flawed, so I like another perspective thrown into the mix. Did someone mention that "Pagan" religions and "Catholicism" has a lot of similarities? I'll tell you right now that is true more then you realize...and guess what, that's just fine with me. It just reinfoces my belief that Truth can be found in many places, and that there are many roads to a destination.
Sorry for the rant....on a final note:
This is not directed at anyone in particular, however as a reminder, let's not use this thread as an outlet to bash the Catholic faith. I do not believe that was the intent of the original post, and too many will find that to be an offensive activity.
Thanks Flatlander, and thanks all of you. You guys have kept it pretty well behaved, which I know is difficult given the circumstance. Not all Catholics, nor is the faith itself supposed to be, as dumb as this story represents. Thanks for keeping it on the topic rather then a slam-fest on the Catholic religion.
Yours,
Paul
) do something positive about this affair. 
