charachters

[progressivetactics]

Are the korean charachters ( writing) the same as Chinese characters, but some with different meanings? Do the Koreans have their own written language or is it just slightly varied from Chinese?

 

[Galvatron]

Korean (Hangul) is a completely different language than Chinese.
I believe that thousands of years ago the roots of it were based on a dialect of chinese, but it bears minimal (if any) resemblance to chinese now.
I think that "Kodanjaclay" on this board is pretty familiar with Hangul and is probably more qualified to go into detail on it.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I know almost nothing on the subject; however, I do know some Korean dude invented the writting style and is still revered as one of Korea's greatest scholars to this day. If I only knew his name off the top of my head I might sound like I know what I'm talking about.

 

[Kodanjaclay]

I believe the name you are looking for is King SeJong. There is some dispute as to whether he created Hangul or whether he commissioned its creation, if memory serves. It is important to note that to truly be able to read Korean one needs to be familiar with Chinese as a combination of the two may be seen readily. In fact old style certificates, prior to the 1960's tended to be in Hwangul, not Hangul. My ChungDoKwan certificate is in both, and it came from Kim, Jong Song from Jung Il Jae Oh Kwan near Seoul.

 

[progressivetactics]

Master Clay... Are you saying that The charachters are similar but different to chinese characthers? Or a combination of 2 different sets?

Or are the charachters unique to the korean people all together?

 

[Kodanjaclay]

Master Barker,

Hangul is not a set of characters but an actual alphabet of sounds, not unlike English. Hwangul, and there is another name used for this set as well, but for the life of me I can't remember what it is, are the Chinese characters which are sometimes still used. I am not quite sure why this is to be honest. I asked Dr. Richard Hackworth about this once, but don't remember the answer. (Dr. Hackworth, although controversial in some circles was a Korean linguist for the US Army on the DMZ among other places, and an excellent resource.)

Hangul is unique to the Korean people. Maybe I should see if I can find something that I know the meaning of the Chinese characters and see if it means the same thing in Chinese. If you come across something, Craig Marks speaks some Chinese and studies it in college.

 

[progressivetactics]

Thanks Master Clay.
My understanding was that Hungul was the spoken language, while the charachters were still chinese. That is where i found confusion.

 

[Chris from CT]

Ok, so I guess I've been away for some time.

Welcome aboard Master Clay.

I am by means no expert on Korean nor Chinese, but I figured hopefully I can help.

The Korean language is written phonetically much like English. So that when you see a "b" in an English word you know what it sounds like much like a Korean word. You can sound out a word in English or Korean (even if you have never seen it before) as long as you know what sound each character has and the rules that apply. In the past I had done a page on understanding the basic structure of Korean hangul. It's at...
http://lmaa.bravepages.com/korean.htm
There are links at the bottom where people can get more info on the Korean language.

Chinese is different from Korean and English in that it is more pictograhical and you may only have a basic idea of the sound if you have never been introduced to it before. (Also the 4-tones is a major departure from both English and Korean)

In Chinese, if a character has more than one character, one of them is the "radical" while the additional character can add meaning to the character’s idea or is used only for their sound in pronunciation.

For example of when character adds meaning...
the character "ming" (using the 2nd tone) is made up of two characters. The first character is the radical for "white" and the other character is the character for "moon." Together they create the meaning "bright."

For example of when character is added for pronunciation...
The character "jiu" (using the 3rd tone) is made up of two characters. The first character is the radical for "fire" and the other character is the character for "extended period of time." The second character is where the pronunciation comes from. Together they create the meaning "moxibustion."

When comparing Korean and/or English to Chinese, for example, let's take a word you have never seen or heard before...
In English or Korean: You would be able you sound it out and say it, but may not have any idea of what the word means.

In Chinese: You may not be able know the pronunciation, but you may have a decent idea on what it means.

I feel Chinese gets very confusing at times. Without the use of graphics, I hope I didn't make it even more confusing for anyone else.

Take care.

 

[Kodanjaclay]

Thanks Chris. You bring up a good point. Ma can be horse, mother, a profanity or an indicator of a question depending on intornation in spoken Chinese (Mandarin). I didn't even think to mention how important the sounds, and null, could be.

 

[Chris from CT]

Originally posted by Kodanjaclay
Ma can be horse, mother,...

You would definitely want to watch what you were saying. Imagine calling your mom a horse!? :erg: That would happen ONCE... just once.

Take care.

 

[Kodanjaclay]

Or better yet a profanity. I can see the headline now:

"Martial Arts Expert murdered by Mom" (lol)

 

[Shadow Hunter]

Some people have said some really great things before this, but I think their jargon and such may be a bit much for someone with no experience with the language. Here is a simple explination.

Originally, the Koreans did not have a written language of their own. They had to write in Chinese. This did not work too great. Chinese charecters are symbols for words, not sounds.

So later the Koreans came up with their own alphabet called hangul so that they could sound out the words. Just like we are doing in English.

Chinese charecters are still used, but they seem to be getting rarer every year. Whenever a surge of nationalism sweeps the country, Hangul starts becoming more common.

 

[Hwarang]

Just to add to that -
One of the reasons why Chinese characters (Hanja) are still used, is that they provide clarification when two words are homophones (sound-alike).

For instance this says "Hwa Rang Do", first in Korean letters, and then in Chinese letters:

and this also says "Hwa Rang Do":

If you look closely, the first 3 characters in Korean are the same, eventhough the last Chinese character is different. So if you only have the Korean (or 'English') letters the two words appear identical, but if you know the Chinese character, the meaning is very different... The first "Hwa Rang Do" means "Way of the Hwarang", the second means "Hwarang Groups"

 

[DennisBreene]

Another challenge for those of us who's primary language is English is that while Hangul is most like a phonetic alphabet, word construction sometimes seems to follow the development of a character. English places each letter in linear form and Hangul seems to be arranged in a pattern that resembles blocks. As I'm trying to learn Korean with Rosetta Stone I've found that searching for the "letter" is often challenging for my English wired brain.
Dennis

Just to add to that -
One of the reasons why Chinese characters (Hanja) are still used, is that they provide clarification when two words are homophones (sound-alike).

For instance this says "Hwa Rang Do", first in Korean letters, and then in Chinese letters:

and this also says "Hwa Rang Do":

If you look closely, the first 3 characters in Korean are the same, eventhough the last Chinese character is different. So if you only have the Korean (or 'English') letters the two words appear identical, but if you know the Chinese character, the meaning is very different... The first "Hwa Rang Do" means "Way of the Hwarang", the second means "Hwarang Groups"