Blocks

[rmcrobertson]

While I see your point, no.

 

[distalero]

And, to raise that level of "soup" up just a bit, google for 'nightstick fracture'. Do a little light extrapolation and I would imagine that all will want to get to the sophisticated application pretty quick.

 

[Mekosho]

"THE KAI"

I totally agree with you on the fact there has always been a motion that served to block an incoming kick or punch in the martial arts, whether it was intinded to be a block or a strike to cause pain to the arm or leg of the opponent, and just happened to block it as well is what I am questioning...
What my instructor is saying basically is that people trained and fought alot different than we do now days, and for a lot different reasons...while we may train to defend ourselves in the event of an attack that may never come, those people trained to stay alive at times...some were attacked daily!
Is kinda like the whole cornered dog scenario, he will come out fighting, he is gonna bite your arm, your leg, whatever is sent at him, and that will prob. cause you to recoil...was it a block?
Another thing I was curious about was that he (my instructor) said that there really was no word or kanji for the word block in old text...while there are many for strikes and kicks...

 

[The Kai]

Different Block serve different purposes. Some are there to save your hide, some are able to actually sting the attacking arm. One of the reasons blocks don't work? Attempting to check (block) a minor motion (jab) with a Major Motion (Hard Block)! Many a martial artist has lost to a lesser skilled opponetent, when that opponant does'nt wind up and overly committ to each punch that is thrown. Thinking that you can consistenetly and constantly cross the center and hit you attacker is a tad pollyannic, put some sparring gear on and give it a go!

A dog's anatomy and fighting strategy are vasrly different from a human. A dog's mouth serves as a "hand" for grasping and carrying objects, tactile information. Dog's can't block by definition thier attacking simultaneously carries thier weapons (teeth) along with the vitals (Eye's, throat) to the targets. As a Human we stand upright, have hands and don't lick our own nuts. So our vital targets and attacking agents are seperate. We have a choice A.) Protect your Vitals B.) Attacker thier Vitals C.) Try to simultaneously attack thier Vitals whilse keeping a protective check up to guard your vitals

People have always fought, and fought hard - it is not the times that change that context.

 

[The Kai]

agree that the whole blocking idea is new but I think it came about as a result pushing the defensive aspect to American parents over the years.


I think the idea of defensive blocking comes from a misunderstanding and mis application of the Shotokan Maxium "There is no first strike in Karate"

 

[kenposikh]

In simple terms a block is also a strike.

Just look at defensive offence and offensive defence.

If someone is threatening you then you have the option of trying to react to their action and use a block which should still deliver pain or simply us a block strike for instance an inward block applied with correct structure and alignment can be devastating and can be used on an opponents head face nose, collar bone shoulder arm etc. It's your intent that makes the difference.

 

[The Kai]

When you spar with a "newbie", one of the hardest things is getting them to keep thier guard up, instead of chasing your arms all over the place trying hard to "block" you. So in the course of sparring you Block hard when you can cover when you need to use slaps and parries for those inbetween times. Now I think of blocks or blocking as that which prevents you from getting hit. Parries are redirections not "hits"

 

[Touch Of Death]

When you spar with a "newbie", one of the hardest things is getting them to keep thier guard up, instead of chasing your arms all over the place trying hard to "block" you. So in the course of sparring you Block hard when you can cover when you need to use slaps and parries for those inbetween times. Now I think of blocks or blocking as that which prevents you from getting hit. Parries are redirections not "hits"

A strike + an angle change = a parry.
Sean

 

[The Kai]

Do you Mean
Strike to the opponant's body
+
Evasion Footwork (tai saki)
=
Evasion

I would agree

 

[Touch Of Death]

your evasion plus two objects clashing while traveling on different projectories will result in a change in both trajectories; hence, a parry.
Sean

 

[Bill Lear]

Originally from Ed Parker's Encyclopedia Of Kenpo:

Block(s) - A defensive maneuver used to hinder or check an attack; all defensive moves employing physical contact to check, cushion, deflect, redirect, or stop an offensive move.

Parry - Redirecting a blow or kick by riding or going with the force.

A strike + an angle change does not = a parry.

I would say that Parries are a sub catagory of Blocking.

 

[The Kai]

your evasion plus two objects clashing while traveling on different projectories will result in a change in both trajectories; hence, a parry.
Sean

A Strike to stop or change the opponant (Stop hit) is not a parry, in the series infinite insights parries are leg, or arm maneauvers. You are not waiting on the arm (or leg) to come to you, you are stopping or changing the motion at the base

 

[The Kai]

"and that in old text, there really is not even a term for block!"

Actually looking at a Japanese Language Guide, and I hope anyone knowledgeable in the language would jump on me

Cho = is a block, or a T-shaped section of paths
Shi= To stop
Sesu=to cut
Oyoko=a cross bar
Shu=to protect
Bugai=obstruction
Setsu=Contact
Boei=to defend
Jukan=Traversing
Even Kyushu means crossing hands

So weather you mean block by manner of motion or the idea of defending I think that the idea is covered

Which is good because in my rationale mind I picture Sammy Samurai seeing his good friend Stan Samurai. Just then Nick Ninja creeps out from behind a bush, swinging a sharp sword at unsuspecting head. Knowing that Stan only has a fraction of a second to defend himself and save his life, Sammy opens his mouth and screams "HELLO". Cuz of course there is no word meaning to block.

 

[BlackCatBonz]

i think it would go against human nature not to block. let's say an inanimate object is flying at your face, you either a) get out of the way if you have enough time or b) put your hand up to block it from hitting your face. do you strike out at the inanimate object to hurt it and let it know never to hit your face again? its natural to protect.......so wouldnt it make sense to train your natural "blocking" reflex to make it natural? your body flinching is an involuntary reflexive block.

 

[The Kai]

It's to bad the Japanese did not come up with a word for that natural, and one supposes common occurance!!

 

[BlackCatBonz]

It's to bad the Japanese did not come up with a word for that natural, and one supposes common occurance!!

now i could be wrong.......but i think the term uke (which we use for the word block) means to receive.
the japanese language use a bunch of other words to describe things that we think they have no word for.
its like some people think......well the japanese dont have a word for it, so they must pretend its not there or not happening.
i think i will leave this one for RRouuselot to answer.

 

[The Kai]

Perhaps the fact that Karate teachers were a little more flexible in thier teaching of things that we consider set in stone, like Kata (how versions of Bassai Dai exist?). Perhaps you recieved the punch and blocked in the manner you chooose?

Of course the odd thing is there seems to be plenty of terms to cover what we refer to as blocking, or defending.

 

[Zoran]

"and that in old text, there really is not even a term for block!"

Actually looking at a Japanese Language Guide, and I hope anyone knowledgeable in the language would jump on me

Cho = is a block, or a T-shaped section of paths
Shi= To stop
Sesu=to cut
Oyoko=a cross bar
Shu=to protect
Bugai=obstruction
Setsu=Contact
Boei=to defend
Jukan=Traversing
Even Kyushu means crossing hands

So weather you mean block by manner of motion or the idea of defending I think that the idea is covered

Which is good because in my rationale mind I picture Sammy Samurai seeing his good friend Stan Samurai. Just then Nick Ninja creeps out from behind a bush, swinging a sharp sword at unsuspecting head. Knowing that Stan only has a fraction of a second to defend himself and save his life, Sammy opens his mouth and screams "HELLO". Cuz of course there is no word meaning to block.

Hmm, Karate and Kenpo where originally an Okinawan system. I do believe that the people may have had their own language and dialect then. But I'm just guessing here.

Also, if you are empty handed, how would you block a sword as they usually had to defend against the samurai. So who knows, maybe they didn't have a term for block when it came to empty handed defense.

Just a lot of guessing on my part.:idunno:

 

[The Kai]

I think the problem is something gets misunderstood, and then passed on as a fact. I tried to show that there are many japanese words meaning the same as "to block, or defend" (BTW my source was like a grade school primer). Blocking is a natural and life extending idea, Why would there be no word for it? That would make the japanese language kind of incomplete, would it not?
Hell I even found a word for riposet(sp?).

 

[Bill Lear]

i think it would go against human nature not to block. let's say an inanimate object is flying at your face, you either a) get out of the way if you have enough time or b) put your hand up to block it from hitting your face. do you strike out at the inanimate object to hurt it and let it know never to hit your face again? its natural to protect.......so wouldnt it make sense to train your natural "blocking" reflex to make it natural? your body flinching is an involuntary reflexive block.

If an object is "flying" it is no longer considered an inanimate object, but rather an "animated" object. I don't mean to be a nerd by splitting hairs, but you have a little bit of an oxymoron going on there...

:redeme: