Best Throw/Locks/Groundwork Martial Art

[Mikkel]

Hey

I am looking for a martial art that focuses equally much on standing throws/locks, the transition from that to groundwork, and the groundwork itself..
Reason for this is that i would like to get a better selfdefense in the throws, locks, and groundwork area.

Which martial art is the best in difference to these requirements in your opinion?

I am open to ideas on Martial arts that focuses more on the standing throws/locks or the groundwork. Would be nice to find one that features them both though + transitioning.

Hope you can help me

Thanks in advance!

 

[Christopher Adamchek]

Thats tough, equally as much on each would probably be a krav, or taijutsu program. Granted you wont get super indepth in either area but they should be well balanced. Otherwise you should study judo and bjj (as you might have already thought). But if you want it for self-defense then a krav program or similar would be better to give you multiple areas of self defense than just the grappling.

 

[drop bear]

Wrestling while not really containing standing locks and ground work is still probably the best single art to understand their mechanics from a self defense point of view.

Basically you will have a better chance if you understand the timing and entries needed to make those moves work. Rather than a technical expertise at the locks themselves.

From a self defense point of view because staying on top and getting back up are generally seen as higher percentage options in self defence.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

standing throws/locks, the transition from that to groundwork,

Here are some Combat Shuai Chiao (Chinese wrestling) approach.

Shoulder lock -> kneeling hold

Hip throw -> arm bar

Leg seize, inner hook -> knee drop into groin

Front cut -> throat choke, knee drop on chest

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Judo, Sambo, and BJJ cover all three areas. However most BJJ schools tend to focus much more heavily on the groundwork and most Judo schools tend to focus more on throws. If you can find a BJJ school that devotes consistent time to standup or a Judo school that devotes consistent time to groundwork, that would be a good option. Alternately, you might find a school that offers classes in both arts. They complement each other very well.

I don't have enough experience with Sambo to know how well the typical school balances those different focuses.

MMA does a good job of balancing standup (striking, clinching, and takedowns) + groundwork + transitions, but you'll typically get less in-depth exploration of each area.

Catch wrestling has a good balance in those areas, but is hard to find. Other common forms of wrestling (freestyle, folkstyle, Greco) don't have the joint locks.

There are many other westernized forms of jujutsu (ex - Danzan ryu, Shingitai, etc) that cover those different areas and some of them have a fairly balanced approach. However there's a significant range of quality you may encounter in these styles (from decent to terrible) and I don't believe they have the talent pool that you can find in Judo/BJJ/Sambo/MMA/Wrestling.

 

[Mikkel]

Christopher:
I have bad experience with Krav Maga though, so i am not to keen on that. Mostly cause the gyms in my area or generally my country(Denmark) of what i know, isnt practicing original Krav Maga, but bits of it mashed together(meaning that it only can be applied in few specific situations).. If it had been original, i would have been more keen towards it..
But you are right about the Judo and Bjj.. Judo is mostly throws and locks focused, whereas Bjj is groundwork.. I think i am going with Bjj, if i have to choose though

Thanks!

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Id recommend sambo, but you might have trouble finding a school, depending on where you live (i have no idea how common it is in denmark)

 

[Mikkel]

Kung fu wang:
Thanks! Have seen them before, but i dont know how perform them properly, so i think i should attend classes to learn em

Tony:
True what you say about Judo and Bjj.. I think i will attend Bjj, if i have to choose, because controlling your opponent once on the ground is the better way i would reckon.
I also heard about Sambo, which should be good.. Not sure if there is a gym in my area though.
But it sounds like you think i should focus on either Judo, Bjj, MMA, or wrestling.. I will look into it! Thank you

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Id recommend sambo, but you might have trouble finding a school, depending on where you live (i have no idea how common it is in denmark)

If not, my recommendation would be catch wrestling, but that might have the same issue

 

[Mikkel]

Kempodisciple:
I am not sure.. Looks like there is neither a Sambo dojo or catch wrestling in my area. But i have heard about an unofficial Sambo Dojo nearby(Meaning no webside, or references to location of it). I am looking into it
Thanks

 

[Mikkel]

Drop Bear:
True enough.. I have been referenced to Wrestling by a couple of people, but i am not sure if it the martial art for me(I am tall and skinny).. I am thinking more in the way of Bjj/Judo/sambo and alike
Thanks

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Kung fu wang:
Thanks! Have seen them before, but i dont know how perform them properly, so i think i should attend classes to learn em

You should not take your opponent down and then start to play the ground game. Before you taking your opponent down, you should plan your ground game ahead of time.

The simple strategies are to control your opponent's

- leading arm -> apply your throw -> turn your leading arm control into arm bar.
- leading leg -> apply your throw -> turn your leading leg control into leg bar, knee twist, or knee drop into groin.
- head lock -> apply your throw -> turn your head lock into side mount.
- ...

Arm wrap, head lock -> side mount, arm bar, or head squeeze.

 

[Mikkel]

Kung Fu Wang:
That looks impressive, that looks like a good way to get your opponent to the ground. So i should be focusing on the groundwork aswell before taking him down. Seems like a good strategy! Thanks

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Here is the simple logic. If you can control your opponent's head, after taking him down, you can continue that head control into the ground game. This mean that besides single leg and double leg take down, you will need to develop other take downs by controlling your opponent's head, arm, leg, ...

IMO, the kick, punch, lock, throw, ground game integration should follow a "plan".

You use

- kick to set up punch.
- punch to set up clinch.
- clinch to set up throw.
- throw to set up ground game.

 

[Steve]

Have you looked into ninjutsu? I hear it is very effective on the street.

 

[Mikkel]

Kung Fu Wang:
Allright, it sounds simple enough in theory. But the chance of it going according to the plan(Kick>Punch>Clinch>Throw>Ground game) when defending yourself against an, lets just say a random person, is very low, in my experience.. Everybody reacts differently you know. But what you are saying is that i should get a fair amount of training in both Judo and Bjj maybe?

Steve:
Havent heard of it, but i will definitely look into it! Thank you

 

[Hanshi]

Hey

I am looking for a martial art that focuses equally much on standing throws/locks, the transition from that to groundwork, and the groundwork itself..
Reason for this is that i would like to get a better selfdefense in the throws, locks, and groundwork area.

Which martial art is the best in difference to these requirements in your opinion?

I am open to ideas on Martial arts that focuses more on the standing throws/locks or the groundwork. Would be nice to find one that features them both though + transitioning.

Hope you can help me

Thanks in advance!

Judo, hapkido and jujutsu generally cover those areas. I have no knowledge of the Chinese arts that may overlap nor any experience with ninjutsu. Whatever you choose, look for a school that teaches a well rounded curriculum.

 

[drop bear]

Drop Bear:
True enough.. I have been referenced to Wrestling by a couple of people, but i am not sure if it the martial art for me(I am tall and skinny).. I am thinking more in the way of Bjj/Judo/sambo and alike
Thanks

For self defense who cares about body shape?

Tall and skinny might have some relevance in a weight class.

 

[Danny T]

If you are looking for a system that does such take a look at Erik Paulson's CSW Combat Submission Wrestling if there is a coach in your area.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Kung Fu Wang:
Allright, it sounds simple enough in theory. But the chance of it going according to the plan(Kick>Punch>Clinch>Throw>Ground game) when defending yourself against an, lets just say a random person, is very low, in my experience.

Theory? Low chance?

In the following clip, within 15 second, This guy made his combo to work twice in a role back to back.

- roundhouse, side kick to close the distance.
- punch to set up clinch.
- clinch to take his opponent down (no ground game in Sanda rule set).

This clip can prove that the sequence kick, punch, clinch, take down "plan" is not just a "theory". It does work.