Basics of Hapkido

S

streetlight488

Guest
I'm new to this forum and to the Hapkido style in general, but what little I have heard has seemed quite interesting to me. I would like to more about what the basic techniques are and how they are done, as well as tenents like concentration, speed over strength etc. Any help you guys can give me would be much appreciated.

SL
 
Other than this post, what sorts of things have you done to get this information on your own? The topic itself is absolutely huge, so it would help me (to help you) to know what direction you are moving in. For instance, what art do you practice now? What do you know about Hapkido in general? What part would the Hapkido arts play in your life? Are you more interested in traditions or in the physical part of the arts? Need a little help here....

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
It has actually been quite a while since i stopped my study of karate and I had heard about how practical hapkido can be in a physical sense. I have also heard someone tell me that sometimes it emphasizes speed over strength, which for someone of my body structure would be very helpful. If any of these things are incorrect please correct them, and also let me know anything else you might be able to tell about this style and its basic techniques or how they compare to karate. Thank you. (I hope this cleared up my question a little bit).

SL
 
"........................

Hapkido ("Way of Coordinated Power") identifies a Korean method of combat utilizing hand strikes, kicks, joint-locks, throws, restraints and chokes. In its most specific use the term Hapkido identifies that art transmitted to Han Jae Ji by Yong Sul Choi between 1953 and 1957.
In a broader sense, though, the term Hapkido has also come to identify Korean martial arts which incorporate both strikes and grappling according to the three guiding principles of Hapkido, and derive from, or are heavily influenced by, the Japanese martial art Daito-ryu aiki-jujitsu. Into this category fall a wide range of organizations (kwans) including, but not limited to, Mu Sul Kwan, Yon Mu Kwan, Hapki Yu Sool, and Jung Ki Kwan. There are also various federations and associations the most notable of which are the World Kido Federation, the International Hapkido Federation and the Korean Hapkido Federation.
In its widest usage Hapkido also identifies organizations and arts which seek a greater representation of the Korean Martial tradition. These organizations' heritage may derive in some part from either the teachings of Yong Sul Choi, or his students. However, the way the body is used in these arts may, as much, reflect the strong Chinese and Buddhist heritage of the Korean culture. This category includes the arts of Kuk Sool Won, HanMuDo, Hwarangdo, Han Pul, Mu Yei 24 Ban (Kyong Dang), as well as the martial training practices of the Sun Monasteries.
The modern art we know as Hapkido is the product of more than 2000 years of martial tradition which can be subdivided into 5 major cultural infusions and many lesser cultural influences. The first of these are the ancient tribal techniques (Sado Mu Sool) which are thought to have incorporated combat techniques best accomplished from horseback and would have included archery, lance, stone sword and knife as well as the brand of wrestling common to across most of central Asia. Practiced by the migrating tribes of the steppes of northeastern Asia, these martial skills formed the foundation for Korean martial tradition.
The Second and Third Infusions to Hapkido were the introduction of Buddhist and Confucian belief systems to Korean culture as well as the attendant martial and administrative traditions from China during the 4th and 5th century.
The introduction of Buddhist beliefs is reflected in the establishment of various codes which were established to guide the warriors' efforts in meeting his responsibilities to his community and country. Buddhist tradition pressed an accomplished warrior to submit to a code based on patriotism (Ch'ung), filial piety, (Hyo), fraternity (Shin) Justice (Yong) and Benevolence (Im). In this way the role of Buddhist thought for the Korean warrior was not unlike that of the Christian church in Western Europe with the development of Chivalry. From a fighting sense the addition of a code to the warrior’s training helped to dissuade the warrior from misusing his skill by abusing members of his family and community.
The Confucian system, for its part, advocated a reverence for governmental authority and supported this through a hierarchy of levels, examinations, and offices. Such a strict hierarchical system readily lent itself to affirming the rigid class system comprised of the aristocracy, bureaucracy, farmers and slaves as well as the supremacy of the king. In a manner of speaking, then, if Buddhism indicated to the warrior what he was not to do and whom he was not to act against, Confucianism indicated the proper focus for the warriors’ skills in terms of government and superior authority.
In addition to their respective religious and administrative influences, Buddhism and Confucianism were also avenues for the introduction of many cultural and martial traditions from the Chinese culture. Among these contributions are varieties of weapons and martial skills, strategies, tactics and order of battle, history, science, medicine and literature. These twin forces guided and supported Korean martial tradition but also contributed to it’s decline as well. As much as one might think well of the influence of the Buddhist faith, its power and influence in the Korean government soon was seen as a threat to the kings' ruling authority. The decline of the influence of Buddhism left an opportunity for Confucianism to make its influence felt.
With steady support from various factions throughout the Yi dynasty (1390 to 1910) military tradition in Korean was seen as little more than a necessary evil which was continually minimized at every turn. Even those occasions which required a military defense such as the Japanese Invasion of 1592 by Toyotomi was not enough to stop the decline. The occupation by the Japanese in 1910 finally brought the Yi dynasty to an end.
Initially more bureaucratic, the Japanese occupation experienced steadily growing resistance by the Korean people until harsh repressive measures were instituted in the 1930-s by the Japanese that outlawed nearly the whole of Korean culture and demanded the adoption of Japanese cultural counterparts. Japanese nationals were brought to Korea to dominate the agricultural and industrial base of that country and bringing with them such martial art traditions as Judo, jujitsu, Karate, Aikido, Kendo and Kyudo. Korean nationals were relocated to Japan to service the needs of the Japanese industry, farming and domestic service. The Fourth Infusion to the Korean martial tradition is best represented in the personal experiences of Yong Sul Choi whose teachings subsequently set the foundation for much of modern Hapkido.
At the age of 8, Choi was reportedly taken to Japan from Korea, later abandoned and subsequently taken into the household of Sokaku Takeda, teacher of Daito-ryu Aiki-jujitsu. Choi states that he remained in Takedas' employ for some thirty years, before being repatriated to Korea at the end of the Second World War. To date, no documentation has been found to support Choi's statements regarding either his residence with the Takeda family, or his instruction in the art of Daito-ryu. However, it remains that Choi along with a very limited number of other Korean nationals such as Mok Jang In, and General Hong Hi Choi returned to Korea to add the martial skills they had experienced in Japan to those arts of the Korean culture as had survived, or had been introduced from Japan by the occupation.
In 1948 Choi began teaching his art, yu sool, to Bok-sub Suh a Yudo black belt and president of a brewery. The name "yu sool" itself suggests that the arts' techniques included joint locks and throws. However, following an incident in 1954 in which Choi's student Suh used a sidekick in an altercation, the name was changed to "yu kwon sool", indicating that the art utilized kicks and punches as well. As a student Han Jae Ji had begun to train with Choi in 1953. Working with the head instructor of the school, Woo-woong Kim, Ji had begun to organize the kicking repertoire that would be identified with yu kwon sool. This introduction of various kicking techniques by Won-woong Kim and Han Jae Ji to the yu sool curriculum constitutes the Fifth and latest infusion of techniques. As with the martial sport of TaeKwonDo, the source for this kicking material was the historic national past-time of taek kyon and su bahk both kicking arts of long standing in the Korean culture.
On beginning his own school in 1957 as a 3rd degree Black Belt, Ji is attributed with changing the name of the art to its present form, "hapki do" from "hapki yu sool." In this way, Ji is thought to have emphasized Hapkido as a "do" or "way of living" rather than merely a collection of techniques ("sool"). In this way, whatever principals may be examined on a physical plane such as motion, balance, leverage, timing and focus may also be regarded on an intellectual, emotional and spiritual plane as well. The result is that the art of Hapkido is as much a method of character development as a martial endeavor.
Many Hapkido practitioners can trace their instruction back to Ji, or to Yong Sul Choi through Ji. Among the most notable personalities who have trained with Choi directly, or with Choi through Ji are Joo Bang Lee (HwaRangDo), Jae-nam Myung (International Hapkido Federation), Kwang Sik Myung (World Hapkido Federation), and Bong Soo Han (International Hapkido Federation). The members and cadre that descend from these lines support to Ji's reputation as the "father of modern Hapkido." There are also large networks of contemporaries to Ji who have sought to introduce innovation to the Hapkido teaching each in their own way. These include In Hyuk Suh (Kuk Sool Won), Kwan-wha Won (Moo Sool Kwan) and Hyun Su Lim (Jung Ki Kwan).
In examining Daito-ryu, Hapkido and Aikido, another Daito ryu derivation, it is not surprising that one is able identify a number of similarities. All three arts support practice in both unarmed techniques as well as the use of weapons. Though curriculums vary from organization to organization, all three arts hold to the position that techniques remain biomechanically the same whether a weapon is incorporated into the movements or not.
The weapons themselves continue to reflect a certain consistency in biomechanics, despite cultural variations. The Japanese iron fan or iron truncheon (jutte) is represented in Korean by the short stick, or dan bong. The Korean cane approximates the Japanese jo, or stick.. Sword, knife and staff techniques are often comparable in either Japanese or Korean culture though the Korean biomechanics more often bespeak their Chinese influences in circular rather than linear motion. To a lesser degree Hapkido practitioners continue to incorporate rope or belt techniques as well as the larger Chinese fans on occasion
A second connection among Daito-ryu aiki-jujitsu, Hapkido and Aikido are their operation under of the same three principles whether on the physical, intellectual, emotional or spiritual plane. These are the Water Principle, Point and Circle Principle and Economy of Energy Principle.
The Water Principle bespeaks adaptation to circumstances and a readiness to adjust an action or response with ease. Sometimes characterized as "tenacity" or "relentless" for the penetrating qualities of the liquid, the Water Principle is better represented by the manner in which water adapts to the shape of the container that holds it. In this way the Hapkido practitioner accepts whatever is given them to work with and makes the most of it.
The Point and Circle Principle acknowledges that "all things are a cycle" and as such can be much easier to understand in cause and effect. A punch, thrown, does not remain extended, but is "recycled" to become perhaps a block, another strike or a grab. The same can be said for a kick, or a throw, perhaps walking, eating—in fact any activity. Actions occur and are recycled to become other actions as thoughts recycle to become other thoughts. In combat application, the interception and management of an attack is open to a greater number of options along the track of an arc rather than a straight line. An appreciation of the cyclical nature of events also allows for anticipation according to a variety of options and an execution of a particular option in a tangential rather than confrontive manner.
The Economy of Motion Principle encourages the practitioner to identify the most efficient, least wasteful way of accomplishing ones' goals, and admonishes the student to avoid "working harder than ones' opponent" In this way, whatever is learned is under constant pressure to be done more accurately, efficiently and effectively. In this way a Hapkido practitioner learns to "work smarter, not harder" in dealing with conflicts.
A third connection among Daito-ryu, Hapkido and Aikido is their reliance on a subtle hierarchy of sophistication which guides the practitioner to identify increasing levels of efficiency and effectiveness in their arts. For the Japanese arts the first level of expertise is identified as gentle technique (ju jitsu) which is approximated as 'soft technique" (yu sool) in the Korean tradition. Essentially an art based on strength; leverage and speed this level of expertise often includes a degree of pain compliance for the successful execution of the technique. Though the least sophisticated of the three levels, this skill level is perhaps the most widely exhibited among Hapkido practitioners and contributes to its reputation as a no-nonsense form of self-defense.
The second level of sophistication is identified in the Daito-ryu tradition as aiki-jujitsu or "hapki yu sool" in the Korean tradition. Aikido for its part speaks of "blending" with ones' partner. All three states indicate the ability to use the nature of the attackers' own physical structure against them. Disrupting the attackers' foundation, balance. direction, timing or focus allows for the defender to optimize his assets in a confrontation with an individual of greater size or ability. Well-known among Aikido and Daito-ryu practitioners, this level is less well-known in the Hapkido community with the exception perhaps of the practitioners in Korea itself.
The highest level of expertise is designated "aiki-jitsu" (lit: "spirit techniques") and is the subject of much debate within both the Aikido and Daito-ryu aiki-jujitsu community. This level of training allows the practitioner to exploit the biomechanical responses of the attackers' own body against him such as "conditioned responses," and "reflexes". In such cases the defender, then, is able not only to engage the enemy, unbalance them and use their strength against them, but incorporate the volition of the partners' own action in defeating the attack as well. Such practices are often attributed to cosmic forces loosely termed “Ki” (energy), but the fact remains that only sound training practices done over and over again seem to consistently produce this sort of “magic”.
The organization of a typical Hapkido school reflects many of the accepted organizational practices common to most martial arts in both Korea and Japan. A director (kwang jang ) attends to the managing affairs of the school while an instructor (sabum) oversees regular instruction. Nearly all Hapkido organizations have adopted a hierarchy of ascending student (guep) ranks numbering ten through one and usually assign a belt color to indicate rank. Individuals committed to continued study, following completion of the student ranks, are assigned a rank of one through seven indicating various levels of competence and designated by a black belt. Ranks eight, nine and ten are essentially administrative positions. Consistent with the use of a Confucian educational model, criteria for advancement, testing policies, certification and licensure vary greatly from organization to organization and are regularly a source of negotiation and discussion in the Hapkido community regarding significance and relative merit.
The art itself is an extraordinary inter-relationship among kicks, strikes, throws, joint-locks, chokes and projections all of which abide by the three principles of Hapkido. Though occasionally practitioners of the art will participate in competitions, the art of Hapkido, itself is not competitive. It is easy to see that for an art whose intent is to stop the fight, asking a practitioner to participate in a competition designed to extend a confrontation for even a few rounds does not make a lot of sense. Instead, Hapkido practitioners honor the Korean martial tradition that asks the warrior to serve his country, his family and his community by only coming out of the best part of himself to further the good of everyone.

Bibliography -

Kim, S.H (2000) The Comprehensive Illustrated Manual of Martial arts of Ancient Korea,
Turtle Press, Hartford, CT.

Kimm, H.Y. (1991) Hapkido; Hapkido II; Philosophy of Masters;
Andrew Jackson College Press, Baton Rouge, La.

Lee, J.B. (1979) The Ancient Martial Art of HwaRangDo (Vol. 1-3),
Ohara Publications, Burbank, Ca.

Lee, K.B. (1984) A New History of Korea, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, Ma.

Lee, P.H. (1993) Sources of Korean Civilization – Vol. 1&2, Columbia University Press, N.Y.

Myung, K.S. (1982) Hapkido – Ancient Art of Masters, World Hapkido Federation, Seoul, Korea

Omiya, S (1992) The Hidden Roots of Aikido, Kodansha International Ltd., Tokyo, Japan

Suh, I.H. (1987) Kuk Sool

Yang, J.M. (1992) Analysis of Shaolin Chin Na, YMAA Publication Center, Jamaica Plains, Ma.

.............................."

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
Hello all,

The previous post contains several errors. Please refer to previous threads for correct details.
 
A second connection among Daito-ryu aiki-jujitsu, Hapkido and Aikido are their operation under of the same three principles whether on the physical, intellectual, emotional or spiritual plane. These are the Water Principle, Point and Circle Principle and Economy of Energy Principle.

The Korean terms for the three principles are:

Wha - Harmony

Won - Circle or complete

Yu - Dynamic or flowing

The Founder taught these three principles in this order.
 
Actually, if we come right down to it, we don't know that Choi Yong Sul, himself, taught these principles.

We know that some of Choi's students incorporated these principles into their teachings just the same as some of Takeda Sokakus' students incorporated these principles into THEIR teachings. The assumption is made that Takeda taught these principles as part and parcel of his instruction but there is no actual evidence that this is true. There is a very strong possibility that later practitioners of both Hapkido and Aikido may have reflected on the strength of these principles and atributed their origins to their teachers. If this is true than a likely pathway for this would have been across second-generation instructors such as Ueyshiba in Aikido and Myong Jae Nam in Hapkido. Ueyshiba was skilled and licensed in other traditions and there was considerable exchange of information across the Eastern Sea between factions of Myong in Korea and the Aikido community in Japan.

I think that it is also very important to remember that while these principles certainly bind together the material of the Hapkido arts very neatly, and while they can be applicable to a range of arts in the Orient, the application argueably derives from the "aiki" rather than the "yawara" side of the arts. Had Choi actually transmitted or originated these principles one would naturally expected these principles to be more closely attuned to the "yawara" nature of Hapkido. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
Master Todd Miller said:
A second connection among Daito-ryu aiki-jujitsu, Hapkido and Aikido are their operation under of the same three principles whether on the physical, intellectual, emotional or spiritual plane. These are the Water Principle, Point and Circle Principle and Economy of Energy Principle.

The Korean terms for the three principles are:

Wha - Harmony

Won - Circle or complete

Yu - Dynamic or flowing

The Founder taught these three principles in this order.
Click to expand...

Hello all,

Master Miller, You are ABSOLUTELY correct. Of course these are the cornerstones of Hapkido, we know that Dojuinim Choi taught these from his earliest student, Master Suh, Bok Sub throught the three men whom he made 9th dans, Dojunim Chang, Chin Il, Grandmaster Lim Hyun Soo, and Grandmaster Kim, Yun Sang.

In fact, Dojunim Choi's curriculum stayed remarkably consistant throught his lifetime. This is again evidenced through his early students and later students who teach virtually the same techniques in the same order.

Good post Master Miller, nice to bring the focus back where it should be; on the teachings of the man that founded Hapkido, Dojunim Choi, Yong Sul.
 
And, of course, this brings us right back to the original difference that underpins many of these discussions--- that of the difference between claims and the faith one puts in those claims as compared to facts as documented. I think this is an excellent example of the principle.

Chang Chin Il may well teach this material. And I may attend his class and experience his teachings. He may well say that he was taught these principles by Choi. I can say that I KNOW Chang teaches these bits because I have experienced it. I have not experienced Choi teaching Chang so I must accept that on faith until I can find documentation.

There is nothing wrong with acting on faith. People do it all the time. An alternative path is to ask for substantiation, evidence and so forth. I believe the term used today is "smoking gun". Absent that people are given the choice of Faith versus Knowledge. Not an altogether bad choice, that. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
Greetings

Interesting so far, but in this months TKD times GM Lim says, as interveiwed by Todd Miller. "Choi did'nt say anything in theory" and the interveiw implies he only taught technique and how the techs. work.
 
In fairness this would not be the first time that a teacher shared information one way, and the student in organizing material to teach in his own right stumbles across a teaching model that does a little better way of representing how things might fit together. To validate that "new" model the student might ascribe it to HIS teacher rather than attempt to suffer through criticism for exceeding his place in the hierarchy. Afterall how many times do people represent something to the world as a "pure" art knowing full-well that they have added this or that, and when questioned invoke their teacher as the person who made this modification rather than themselves, yes? FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
Interesting so far, but in this months TKD times GM Lim says, as interveiwed by Todd Miller. "Choi did'nt say anything in theory" and the interveiw implies he only taught technique and how the techs. work.

GM Lim has stated that DJN Choi taught three principles in Hapkido/Hapki Yu sool, Wha - Harmony, Won - Circle or completeness, Yu - Dynamic or flowing.

Stuart: You misunderstood what GM Lim was saying.

Take care,
 
Stuart,

The quote that you used was taken out of context because the part you quoted was about DJN Choi's philosophy not teaching theory of technique.
 
Hollywood1340 said:
And they would be....and could be found...where?
Click to expand...

Hello James,

This will take some time, so I will write it this afternoon and get it to the net tonight.
 
"......GM Lim has stated that DJN Choi taught three principles in Hapkido/Hapki Yu sool, Wha - Harmony, Won - Circle or completeness, Yu - Dynamic or flowing......"

Of course, I have no way of know "what" GM Lim may or may not have said. I have no idea of what he may or may not have learned from Choi Yong Sul. There are, however, some interesting patterns that come up as one reviews the literature.

On the DRAJJ side there is a book by the current leader of the DR AIKI-BUDO which is probably the most direct line of the Takeda tradition coming as it does through Takedas' son to Kondo. In his book Kondo identifies 7 principles for the execution of DRAJJ. Oddly, these principles have quite a bit to do with Ju-jutsu and practically nothing to do with Aikido. I have sought to identify any theoretical principles as taught by Takeda Sokaku and have not been able to locate any. Perhaps there were some, I don't know. All I am saying is I can't find any. Nor can I find any in Yanagi-Ryu, Shorinji-ryu Kempo, Hakko-Ryu or Shorinji Kempo or ANY of the other DRAJJ spin-offs. I am not saying that they don't exist just that in reviewing the literature for the last 50 years or so I have found nothing written which is curious considering how dilligent these respective arts have been about telling their story otherwise.

Then one looks at Aikido as presented by Ueyshibas' Son, Kisshumaru, by Saito and by Ratti and there are varied representations of the same three Principles albeit tweaked slightly in different directions. Earlier practiioners such as Yamada and Tohei mention the role of "Ki" in execution. But the three principles model for pedagogy seems to come later as a fullfillment of Ueyshibas experience with the Omote Religion. At least each piece of literature makes mention of them. I can't lay my hands on Shioda at the moment but it would be interesting to know what his take on this might have been. Not too surprising since the role of "Ki" as a martial premise only found expression in the late 1800-s of Shinto Japan and was virtually un-mentioned in materials before then, nor do I find mention of "Ki" in Kondo's book nor in any of five or six other books I have on "yawara" either in English or in Japanese. Certainly it crops up in the terms of Oriental medicine, but not as a martial premise.

In fact, as I have mentioned before the whole idea of teaching Hapkido as a defensive (Ai-Ki) art as opposed to a more pro-active or pre-emptive (Ki-Ai) art is at odds with Choi's own report. Choi himself is reported to have stated quite clearly that he taught "yawara" which is actually the opposite of "ai-ki". I can't shake the feeling that we are looking at a very fundamental combat art presented by a teacher which was then retrofitted with later pedagogy to separate it from its checkered past and more combative roots. FWIW.

Drawing a conclusion, I would say this is another case where individuals found an interesting method of communicating information and have attributed it to a teacher to give it greater authority. My guess is that this model has worked its way into Hapkido traditions sometime between 1947 when Choi Yong Sul started teaching, and 1976 when GM Myung first postulated the Principles in HAPKIDO ART OF MASTERS. That would be about a 30 year period during which the influence of Aikido might have spilled into the Hapkido experience. But don't feel too bad. There are a number of things, like hyung, that have been added and Hapkido has not suffered because of it. Lets just quit pretending that Choi taught all of what we have today from his early start in the 1940-s. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce
 
Bruce,


I will have to agree with you on this. I have always thought there might be more of a "Ai ki", or maybe even Aikido influence in Hapkido. After looking at DRAJJ, from Kondo's teaching which is supposedly the closest link to what Takeda taught. It definetely more "Ki Ai" than "Ai Ki" . Especially considering the reference of the 3 principles taught by Choi. These 3 principles obviously come from an Aiki source, not DRAJJ. Especially WHA, an Won. Let's take Won for example. Circle, not just half circle from what I have seen at some Hapkido schools, but (full circle wholeness). Which is definetely a Aiki concept. yes DRAJJ, uses full circle techniques, but I believe they use alot more entering techniques, or Ki Ai than what I would consider to be full circle wholeness. What I'm wondering is this. If Choi taught these principles, which looks to me are more of Aiki basis. Where would this influence have come from in Choi's teaching?
 
Master Todd Miller said:
Stuart,

The quote that you used was taken out of context because the part you quoted was about DJN Choi's philosophy not teaching theory of technique.
Click to expand...
I see!
 
glad2bhere said:
"......GM Lim has stated that DJN Choi taught three principles in Hapkido/Hapki Yu sool, Wha - Harmony, Won - Circle or completeness, Yu - Dynamic or flowing......"

Of course, I have no way of know "what" GM Lim may or may not have said. I have no idea of what he may or may not have learned from Choi Yong Sul. There are, however, some interesting patterns that come up as one reviews the literature.

On the DRAJJ side there is a book by the current leader of the DR AIKI-BUDO which is probably the most direct line of the Takeda tradition coming as it does through Takedas' son to Kondo. In his book Kondo identifies 7 principles for the execution of DRAJJ. Oddly, these principles have quite a bit to do with Ju-jutsu and practically nothing to do with Aikido. I have sought to identify any theoretical principles as taught by Takeda Sokaku and have not been able to locate any. Perhaps there were some, I don't know. All I am saying is I can't find any. Nor can I find any in Yanagi-Ryu, Shorinji-ryu Kempo, Hakko-Ryu or Shorinji Kempo or ANY of the other DRAJJ spin-offs. I am not saying that they don't exist just that in reviewing the literature for the last 50 years or so I have found nothing written which is curious considering how dilligent these respective arts have been about telling their story otherwise.

Then one looks at Aikido as presented by Ueyshibas' Son, Kisshumaru, by Saito and by Ratti and there are varied representations of the same three Principles albeit tweaked slightly in different directions. Earlier practiioners such as Yamada and Tohei mention the role of "Ki" in execution. But the three principles model for pedagogy seems to come later as a fullfillment of Ueyshibas experience with the Omote Religion. At least each piece of literature makes mention of them. I can't lay my hands on Shioda at the moment but it would be interesting to know what his take on this might have been. Not too surprising since the role of "Ki" as a martial premise only found expression in the late 1800-s of Shinto Japan and was virtually un-mentioned in materials before then, nor do I find mention of "Ki" in Kondo's book nor in any of five or six other books I have on "yawara" either in English or in Japanese. Certainly it crops up in the terms of Oriental medicine, but not as a martial premise.

In fact, as I have mentioned before the whole idea of teaching Hapkido as a defensive (Ai-Ki) art as opposed to a more pro-active or pre-emptive (Ki-Ai) art is at odds with Choi's own report. Choi himself is reported to have stated quite clearly that he taught "yawara" which is actually the opposite of "ai-ki". I can't shake the feeling that we are looking at a very fundamental combat art presented by a teacher which was then retrofitted with later pedagogy to separate it from its checkered past and more combative roots. FWIW.

Drawing a conclusion, I would say this is another case where individuals found an interesting method of communicating information and have attributed it to a teacher to give it greater authority. My guess is that this model has worked its way into Hapkido traditions sometime between 1947 when Choi Yong Sul started teaching, and 1976 when GM Myung first postulated the Principles in HAPKIDO ART OF MASTERS. That would be about a 30 year period during which the influence of Aikido might have spilled into the Hapkido experience. But don't feel too bad. There are a number of things, like hyung, that have been added and Hapkido has not suffered because of it. Lets just quit pretending that Choi taught all of what we have today from his early start in the 1940-s. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce
Click to expand...
I may agree to a large extent, even training with Doju Ji his techs are not that cirular compared to Aikido or some other Kwans of HKD, they are very straight foward.

However in the Daito Ryu book "Hidden roots of Aikido" you can see many of Hapkido tech & priciples. Also the book describes 3 levels of Aiki-Jutsu the lowest (if you will) being a jujutsu system, then Aiki-Jujutsu and finally Aiki-No-jujutsu.

Maybe the type of HKD we train in the level of jujutsu with some Aiki-jujutsu.

I've not really seen any high level display of Aiki No Jujutsu from any Hapkido Masters. This realm of tech is closer to Aikido then HKD IMO



I hope that made sense?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

May Teakwondo Times

Previous Thread

Bong Soo Han's Videos

Next Thread

Similar threads

Ceicei
Hapkido = a blend?
2 3
Replies
58
Views
7K
matt.m
matt.m
D
Combat hapkido system vs. traditional hapkido systems
5 6 7
Replies
136
Views
40K
dortiz
D
ronodebono
Names of basic kicks and punches
Replies
1
Views
5K
Shaderon
Shaderon
P
Hapkido credentials and certifications
Replies
6
Views
4K
oftheherd1
O
S
Origins of hapkido?
Replies
5
Views
2K
spatulahunter
S

Latest Discussions

Back
Top