Are martial artist warriors?

[Zenjael]

You have to have actually gone to war, in my opinion to be a warrior. There are very few civilian pursuits I consider would classify one as a warrior.

And for the record, I don't believe the term, "warrior", is a lofty one. Merely a factual one.

I like that classification, and I think the same. I try not to glorify something which oft leads to misery.

However, it does beg the question of what kind of wars. World Wars were far more intense than today's more hair-raising IED hunting. I might argue the wars of the Iron and Middle Ages were even more intense because of how personal they are. I wouldn't consider the person piloting a drone a warrior, but I might the private taking part in Sayyd Alma Kalay.

 

[StudentCarl]

In my book Martial Artists, at most, are fighters.

What would you call a martial artist with the skill to prevail without fighting or to prevent it?

If by fighter you mean honing the spirit and body, then I think it's worthy of respect. If you mean someone who seeks conflict, not so much.

 

[Steve]

What would you call a martial artist with the skill to prevail without fighting or to prevent it?

That's called diplomacy, and people who are good at it are diplomatic.

If by fighter you mean honing the spirit and body, then I think it's worthy of respect. If you mean someone who seeks conflict, not so much.

Does a cop seek conflict? What about a bouncer?

The catch 22 here is that anyone who can legitimately claim to be a warrior must by definition be in the thick of conflict often enough to hone these skills.

A person who is skilled enough in diplomacy (or conflict resolution or whatever else you might call it) could be a warrior, but not necessarily. The two skill sets are distinct.

I would also recommend distinguishing between being a warrior and having a warrior spirit. Some people are game. They may not be skilled and may not be involved in conflict, but when it happens, they are in it. It seems to me that some of the people posting in this thread are confusing a warrior with someone who is game or has spirit.

 

[ATC]

Warriors are warriors. Some warriors just happen to be Martial Artist. But simply being a Martial Artist dose not make you a warrior.

 

[seasoned]

Can martial arts practitioners be considered warriors, of one type or another?

Come on guy's work with me. Would the above one type or another cover "warrior spirit"

 

[Manny]

I don't consider myself a "warrior" just because I practice the martial arts.

I do too. I am just a martial arts guy, who do TKD amoung other things, I am not a warrior ot fighter either... however I like to adhere to the Bushi-Do code.

Manny

 

[msmitht]

I am a life long martial artist. When I was an infantry marine I was a warrior. I was trained to kill and was ready to at a moments notice. I do not believe that most martial artists are warriors. Even mma is controlled with rules and a referee. Combat sport martiaL artists are closer to warriors than the rest(judo, bjj, tkd fighters, muay thai, boxing, wrestling and mma). It also depends on your definition of the term "warrior".

 

[mook jong man]

I'm not particularly worried If I am not a warrior.

Because to dwell on it too much , would mean that I was a worrier rather than a warrior.

 

[StudentCarl]

A person who is skilled enough in diplomacy (or conflict resolution or whatever else you might call it) could be a warrior, but not necessarily. The two skill sets are distinct.

They may be distinct in a war where you are a uniformed combatant; otherwise they both matter because failure to take reasonable measures to avoid conflict will put you in jail/prison/lawsuit. I have little respect for a "warrior" who fights without legitimate need; it goes against every value and more we teach. Funakoshi Sensei's writings are just one source related to this.

I would also recommend distinguishing between being a warrior and having a warrior spirit. Some people are game. They may not be skilled and may not be involved in conflict, but when it happens, they are in it. It seems to me that some of the people posting in this thread are confusing a warrior with someone who is game or has spirit.

I'm fine with that distinction. I think having warrior spirit is a great goal for a civilian and a martial artist. I think that people who want to be warriors seldom have a clue what that really means.

 

[StudentCarl]

Come on guy's work with me. Would the above one type or another cover "warrior spirit"

Yes; that's what I'm saying.

 

[Blindside]

Come on guy's work with me. Would the above one type or another cover "warrior spirit"

I don't think so, warriors are people who ENGAGE in war, seeking to emulate the "warrior spirit" may be valuable and even achievable, but it won't make you (or me) a warrior of any type.

 

[Steve]

They may be distinct in a war where you are a uniformed combatant; otherwise they both matter because failure to take reasonable measures to avoid conflict will put you in jail/prison/lawsuit.

They are always distinct. They may both be necessary. Being a diplomat and being a warrior are like salt and pepper. Two great seasonings that are often mentioned as a single entity, but they remain distinct.

 

[mastercole]

Come on guy's work with me. Would the above one type or another cover "warrior spirit"

It can be whatever a warrior means to you.

 

[Buka]

The majority of the people I've trained are Martial Artists and cops. (some were both) Some of the guys were Anti-crime units, Anti-gang units and Violent Fugitive Arrest squads. Some of the guys were shot (all lived, thank God) and some have shot people in turn. A few had more than one instance. Although that's not war, I guess it's kind of close. Does that make them a warrior? If it does.....were they a warrior on the day before they were shot? Or before they had to shoot somebody? Or did the act itself make them a warrior?

And what about the people they trained with, day in and day out, the ones who helped them prepare for survival and victory? Some of those people were luckier, they never had the misfortune to kill, or to be shot. Are they warriors?

Damned if I know.

 

[Cyriacus]

The majority of the people I've trained are Martial Artists and cops. (some were both) Some of the guys were Anti-crime units, Anti-gang units and Violent Fugitive Arrest squads. Some of the guys were shot (all lived, thank God) and some have shot people in turn. A few had more than one instance. Although that's not war, I guess it's kind of close. Does that make them a warrior? If it does.....were they a warrior on the day before they were shot? Or before they had to shoot somebody? Or did the act itself make them a warrior?

Id say it did, orelse Deserters and New Recruits may as well automagically be Warriors.

And what about the people they trained with, day in and day out, the ones who helped them prepare for survival and victory? Some of those people were luckier, they never had the misfortune to kill, or to be shot. Are they warriors?

Have They engaged in Combat or War?

Damned if I know.

As has been said, it comes down to how You define it.
I go with the dictionary.
But others, like Jenna, allow it to be disambiguated.

This is a pretty good Thread Id say.

 

[mastercole]

Two different definitions

1. One who is engaged in or experienced in battle.
2. One who is engaged aggressively or energetically in an activity, cause, or conflict:

 

[Zenjael]

I think it could, but that is my 2 cents.

A person able to triumph over conflict with resolution is something I think many warriors seek to attain. Though I will be going into the military, more than likely as infantry... I can't help but envy the medic. There is a very dear person to me who I have known since before even really remembering, who I recall challenging me to a fight in a middle school bathroom... who is now a successful rei ki healer. I envy those who can help others, and I hope someday I might be able to practice martial arts in such a way to help heal... but lofty goals are just that.

I think many know that there are things they could do if they sought it, but for me, something just tells me medicine isn't what I'm meant to do. That was my father's role, who is a doctor. Mine is the opposite in a sense, though with the tempering of knowing when to use it. When I study the body, my first analyzation is how it can be used to damage, or control, and though I abhor that part of me, I know it is something I am not terrible at... and maybe someday might even excel at. I'm young, so there's a long way to go, and a lot of moral cleanup I've got to do before I even consider myself really ready, or worthy to open the doors to any school of my own. But... someday.

It is hard to ask people what a warrior is, without asking what it is that makes them a warrior. All warriors are fighters... but the inverse is not always true. But there is an in-between of sort, a fine line of spirituality I've found many people, who truly care about the martial arts, possess. I don't say Martial Arts is my religion because it is something I go to a temple of pray over- it is a way of life I've found to have vastly improved my own. Something I know can, and has saved my life before, and I know I can use to help others.

So to me, a warrior spirit is less about fighting, and moreso the powerful will, and confidence has in oneself, and their abilities. To know when to fight, and when they do, with everything they have.

I try to help others- and most martial arts tends to favor the moral side of good. Oddly, I do not think, necessarily that martial arts has a particularly moral slant- and hence is how it can be abused to hurt.

I think there may be a lot of warriors in today's armies who do not possess warrior spirit, no matter how you define it. Which might give the martial artist the advantage.

And even then... all this still begs the question of how 'honor' plays a role. There are a lot of philosophical questions to ask, and seek answer for, before really being able to determine what a warrior is, and whether martial artists not only can be categorized, but should. And that last might just be decided by what a warrior spirit is, and how it is a part of martial arts.

Apologies for the verboseness.

 

[mastercole]

I don't like Mao, but I think his saying was very telling.

"Politics is war without bloodshed, while war is politics with bloodshed" ~ Mao Tse Tung

 

[Chris Parker]

Personally, I like to take it to the Warrior's Creed, written by Robert L Humphrey, United States Marine and developer of the Dual Life Value philosophy. If this can be applied to you, and you feel it is accurate enough as a description of the mindset of a warrior (to my mind, a civilian form, implying vigilance for your safety and those of your loved ones, as well as others who may be around you):

Wherever I go, everyone is a little bit safer because I am there.
Whenever I return hom, everyone is happy that I am there.
Wherever I am, anyone in need has a friend.
It's a good life.

I do too. I am just a martial arts guy, who do TKD amoung other things, I am not a warrior ot fighter either... however I like to adhere to the Bushi-Do code.

Manny

Out of interest, Manny, what is the Bushido code in your understanding?

 

[Aiki Lee]

Of course a martial artists could be considered a warrior. Not all of them obviously, but those with the correct attitude and competence are no different than any other warrior other than the fact they many not be training against any specific enemy.