Aikido in an Mma gym

[WingChunChick]

Guys it's a fake video chill out. Go to his channel, he uploaded a sequel video explaining that this was a hoax

 

[JowGaWolf]

Then show it done live.

lol...reminds me of my first few months on this site.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Guys it's a fake video chill out. Go to his channel, he uploaded a sequel video explaining that this was a hoax

That's a shame. I really don't like when people do stuff like that. Especially when they say stuff like "we did it to check your critical thinking" Makes me want to learn the technique and pull it off on these guys. Things he got wrong:

You have to be some super hero to regularly catch punches
TRUTH: I don't know anyone who does martial arts application that has the mind set that you "regularly do something." You take what you can get. If you think you can get it then you go for it. Even BJJ doesn't "regularly do techniques." To think that you can catch a punch 50% -%90 of the time just by doing the technique just isn't realistic. But the better you get at spotting the right time the better your success rate will get.

TRUTH: You can catch punches and there is 2 keys to doing it.

• You catch a punch by grinding it, which slows it down
  
• You catch a punch by it's weakest points. before it gets back or before it arrives (advanced method which includes lots of other stuff. If you can parry a punch then you have what it takes to grab a punch provided that you have the necessary grip strength.

People can do this stuff, but have to be superhuman to catch a punch? Seems like a low bar considering all of the other amazing stuff humans do.

Then at the end really kills me. When he throws the punch knowing that other guy is trying to catch the punch as if that's proof that you can't catch a punch lol.
The problem with doing stuff like this, is that the commitment isn't hit. The commitment is "don't let him grab my arm" and Ironically during the same demo he actually is able to grab the arm but doesn't have the grip strength nor movement to hold on.

I'll put this one on my list of things to prove possible.

 

[drop bear]

lol...reminds me of my first few months on this site.

I can't believe people are still trying to defend this move.

Either make it work or don't. It is simple as that.

 

[jobo]

Well, yes and no. There are some "highly trained" people that couldn't beat a ten year old, and some completely 'untrained' people that will eat your face in under a minute. That doesn't really address the question though. If a systems stated purpose is to give you fighting skill(a huge if mind you), and YOU don't believe..you..the one spending your time and money to train..you don't believe it will work on anyone if they are good at fighting, or even sober...

I dunno. It seems like an odd choice to me, if you at the same time acknowledge there is training that requires similar investments that will impart tools to deal with the drunks AND maybe stand a chance against the sober guy that knows how to box..

At this point wouldn't sticking with the former be placing an intentional handicap upon yourself?(again, assuming training is for function)

your making a really polarised, judgemental distinction, between can and can't fight, you can't train anybody to be a good fighter, if they don't have the natural attributes for it, you can only make them a better fighter. and if they had the potential that will make them good or even outstanding or just adequate for day to day issues. just as only a few people can be good gymnasts or good soccer players. to pretend that every one who does boxing or bjj ends up as " can fight" is nonsense. its a relative term, that you need define.

my art, karate has good mechanics and a few techniques that I think are fancy full, but my potential is such that I'm never going to be a good fighter, if that means I can beat up people who are younger, stronger faster than I am, certainly not people who have also trained,that's would be equally true no matter what I learn,

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Yeah it is a weird concept.

if the guy is a dud then the system must work.

I've never seen anyone make that argument.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Nope. And for the reason the video was made in the first place.

So, ignoring for the moment that this was a hoax, you don't take any input from anyone? See, for me, I'll take that input and then try to figure out how valuable it is based on what else I can find, rather than just toss it out because it happened off-camera.

I was surprised (before I saw the rest of the video) this was happening in an MMA gym, but assumed it must have been during pretty light sparring, probably with someone making the mistake of punching from a bit too far away (so the punch wasn't compact enough). But I was willing to take it as input and give new thought to whether this might have more application/availability than I'd thought. It would be new information for me to consider.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Or it working anywhere ever.

It does work...when it's available. I don't really think it's often available on a punch (more likely to have a grip on the arm in response to a grip or shove), and rarely turns into a nice throw. If movement goes behind the plane of the body, there's actually time to reverse (you're pivoting while they have to make a big turn, so more time) and set their weight. It's not something I'd want to use if they are still balanced at all, because at the end of the pivot they have that other arm available to punch. Off-balance, that punch isn't such a threat. Frankly, I prefer the movement without the attempt to use the wrist, as a set for other finishes.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Then show it done live.

I'd love to, but I've only ever run into it a few times (off a punch) in all my sparring. So I'd have to video many, many, many sessions for the chance to maybe catch it once. That was my point, which I don't think I made clear, when I said I'd managed it a few times. You're more likely to get to use those principles when a grab or push is used to set up a punch (so, not likely to happen much in a sparring situation).

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I can't believe people are still trying to defend this move.

Either make it work or don't. It is simple as that.

Agreed (except for the "make it work", but I don't think you mean what I'd mean by that). I've pulled this off in some limited situations. It's enough to help me understand the limitations of the technique, as well as where it is useful.

I think the biggest problem people have in training techniques like this - and you've pointed this out before - is they keep leaving the arm out there in training. That's okay when you first learn the movement and need a few beats to get yourself and your hands where they belong. But that arm has to start retracting, at a pace in line with the movement of the attack and the technique, to see where the technique does and doesn't work. And follow-up attacks (that left hook) have to occur to learn where the technique is a bad idea. Leave those two steps out, and you get folks who think the technique is easy to get to on a regular basis.

 

[Martial D]

TRUTH: You can catch punches and there is 2 keys to doing it.

• You catch a punch by grinding it, which slows it down
  
• You catch a punch by it's weakest points. before it gets back or before it arrives (advanced method which includes lots of other stuff. If you can parry a punch then you have what it takes to grab a punch provided that you have the necessary grip strength.

The fact that there's no evidence of this ever happening, anywhere, is inconsequential I guess.

 

[Martial D]

your making a really polarised, judgemental distinction, between can and can't fight, you can't train anybody to be a good fighter, if they don't have the natural attributes for it, you can only make them a better fighter. and if they had the potential that will make them good or even outstanding or just adequate for day to day issues. just as only a few people can be good gymnasts or good soccer players. to pretend that every one who does boxing or bjj ends up as " can fight" is nonsense. its a relative term, that you need define.

my art, karate has good mechanics and a few techniques that I think are fancy full, but my potential is such that I'm never going to be a good fighter, if that means I can beat up people who are younger, stronger faster than I am, certainly not people who have also trained,that's would be equally true no matter what I learn,

Proper tools are important. The world's best carpenter still can't do much without a good hammer.

At the same time natural speed and strength are severely lessened lacking the tools to deliver. All tools are certainly not, by your own admission, equal.

If you are happy with a tool you believe isn't actually the best tool for the job, fine. It's your time and your training. It just seems weird.

It's like. Here's a Ferrari, there's a Ford tempo. Same price. Ya. I'll take the tempo.

 

[jobo]

Proper tools are important. The world's best carpenter still can't do much without a good hammer.

At the same time natural speed and strength are severely lessened lacking the tools to deliver. All tools are certainly not, by your own admission, equal.

If you are happy with a tool you believe isn't actually the best tool for the job, fine. It's your time and your training. It just seems weird.

It's like. Here's a Ferrari, there's a Ford tempo. Same price. Ya. I'll take the tempo.

and a good hammer can't turn you into a carpenter, I know this as I own several good hammers, nor would I take on a Ferrari for commuting .

I'm not interested in a daft analogy discussion, have you got a meaning definition of can and can't fight that we can consider

 

[Martial D]

and a good hammer can't turn you into a carpenter, I know this as I own several good hammers, nor would I take on a Ferrari for commuting .

I'm not interested in a daft analogy discussion, have you got a meaning definition of can and can't fight that we can consider

Sure. Someone that is willing and able to deliver damage to another human being that is fighting backat a higher than average level of competency.

 

[jobo]

Sure. Someone that is willing and able to deliver damage to another human being that is fighting backat a higher than average level of competency.

ok, what's the average level of competency, and is this age/ or gender related or just an absolute

it seems as most people don't train to fight, in fact most people aren't very fit at all, then the average level will be quite low ?

 

[JowGaWolf]

I can't believe people are still trying to defend this move.

Either make it work or don't. It is simple as that.

I don't disagree with you lol. But seriously I agree with you. For me personally it's not even defending that it works or not. People who do Hoaxes aren't trying to figure out how it works in the first place. So they make it look like it works with the intention to deceive.

Either show why you (general) can't get it to work or show how you get it to work. There's no need to do hoax

 

[JowGaWolf]

So, ignoring for the moment that this was a hoax, you don't take any input from anyone? See, for me, I'll take that input and then try to figure out how valuable it is based on what else I can find, rather than just toss it out because it happened off-camera.

I was surprised (before I saw the rest of the video) this was happening in an MMA gym, but assumed it must have been during pretty light sparring, probably with someone making the mistake of punching from a bit too far away (so the punch wasn't compact enough). But I was willing to take it as input and give new thought to whether this might have more application/availability than I'd thought. It would be new information for me to consider.

I did the same but now I have to start all over because of bad info. The input is bad because it was done to deceive. To try that same approach now would be foolish as it isn't based on any reality of applying the technique.

 

[Martial D]

ok, what's the average level of competency, and is this age/ or gender related or just an absolute

it seems as most people don't train to fight, in fact most people aren't very fit at all, then the average level will be quite low ?

You seem to have overlooked the word 'willing'. You don't see a lot of old/infirm/meek/women/etc involved in bar fights.

Also 'fitness' isn't always a factor. Plenty of lardos that can and will use their tremendous weight to knock you to Tokyo.

 

[JowGaWolf]

The fact that there's no evidence of this ever happening, anywhere, is inconsequential I guess.

There wasn't any evidence that Jow Ga techniques work before I posted me doing the techniques. You can still look today and you won't see people doing those techniques that I do.

Are those techniques only valid because I showed they are or were they already valid and I just had to figure out it really works?

 

[jobo]

You seem to have overlooked the word 'willing'. You don't see a lot of old/infirm/meek/women/etc involved in bar fights.

Also 'fitness' isn't always a factor. Plenty of lardos that can and will use their tremendous weight to knock you to Tokyo.

most people are willing to defend themselves ( if they can) and more than willing to inflict damage on people if they could. im unwilling to get into bar fights, does that automatically mean I cant fight, if I had to ?

you need to think this through

so again, what this average competency at fighting,of which you speak